Wes Craven's New Nightmare

Episode Transcript
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(02:42):
Hi, everyone.
I'm Em, and welcome to VerbalDiorama, episode 316, Wes Craven's
New Nightmare. This is thepodcast that's all about the history
and legacy of movies you know,and movies you don't. That thought
she'd killed Freddie off, butthe fans are clamorclamouringingformore.Soevilneverdies,right?Welcometo

(03:02):
Verbal Diorama. Whether you'rea brandnebrand-newwlistenertothispodcast,whetheryou're
aregularreturning listener,thank you for finding this podcast,
thank you for listening tothis podcast, and thank you for choosing
to be here with this podcast.As always, I'm so happy to have you
here for the history andlegacy of Wes Craven's new nightmare.
And just a big thank you, ifyou are a regular returning listener,

(03:22):
for coming back to thispodcast and choosing to continue
to listen to and support thispodcast. Because by listening, you
are actively supporting thispodcast. I'm so very grateful. Thank
you for your support. Itgenuinely means so Much to an indie
podcaster who does literallyeverything by herself and therefore
316 episodes of doingeverything by herself as the traditional

(03:46):
spooky season on verbaldiorama sucks. Launched with the
Devil's Advocate, it launchedfor real last week with Candyman
and this movie, Wes Craven'sNew Nightmare, or just New Nightmare.
I decided that I wanted to dothis movie last October for many
reasons, but mostly to givethis movie its dues. Freddy Krueger,

(04:08):
of course, started life in1984 as a terrifying child murderer,
but ended his Route 6appearances as a comedic character,
quipping to his victims andgetting his own plushy toys and appearing
on lunchboxes. There wasalways something deeply unnerving
about putting Kruger on apedestal, and no one thought it more

(04:28):
than his creator, Wes Craven.Here's the trailer for Wes Craven's
New Nightmare.

(07:06):
Actress Heather Langenkamp,the final girl in the first Nightmare
on Elm street, has been livingher life away from the horror series
and now has a husband in thespecial effects industry and a young
son, Dylan. Ten years afterthe release of the first movie, Heather
starts getting nightmaresfeaturing Freddy Krueger and mysterious
phone calls are recitingFreddy's iconic lines. Earthquakes

(07:28):
are ravaging the neighborhood.And as to the nightmare in which
her husband's fingers are cut,she notices they're cut for real.
Robert Shaye, the producer andfounder of New Line Cinema, invites
Heather to the New Lineoffices to tell her that Wes Craven
has been writing a new scriptand that Freddy is going to return.
And he wants Heather to returntoo. But life is starting to imitate

(07:52):
art. Let's run through thecast of this movie. We have Heather
Langenkamp as HeatherLangenkamp and Nancy Thompson. Robert
Englund as Robert Englund,Miko Hughes as Dylan Porter, John
Saxon as John Saxon and DonaldThompson Tracy Middendorf as Julie,

(08:13):
David Newsome as Chase Porter,Fran Bennett as Dr. Christine Hefner
Wes Craven as Wes Craven,Robert Shaye as Robert Shaye and
Freddy Krueger as himself. WesCraven's New Nightmare was written
and directed by Wes Craven. ANightmare on Elm street was a huge

(08:34):
success for New Line Cinema,the brainchild of Wes Craven, a slasher
that brought scares as well asgory special effects based on the
real stories of immigrants whohad experienced the killing fields
in Cambodia and had literallynightmared themselves to death. If
you want a more in depthhistory on A Nightmare on Elm Street,
I did episode 275 on it lastOctober. And in many ways this is

(08:59):
why I'm back again doing this.But unlike my usual rules to do all
of the sequels, I'm choosingto bypass them and go straight from
one to seven. Because whilethe first movie is the best, this
one is the smartest and mostinteresting. But it isn't the movie
that most millennials thinkof. When they think of meta horror,

(09:19):
they think of the movie WesCraven did next. Scream and Scream
defined a generation of horrorlovers wanting slasher gore with
the intelligence to wink tothe genre's cliches. Scream was a
blockbuster unlike any otherhorror movie had been. And even today,
its multitude of sequels stillwill never match the original. Screams,

(09:41):
scares, humor and metacommentary lovingly mocking a toy,
a genre. Most directors arelucky to get one franchise to their
names, let alone one genredefining horror franchise. Craven
has two. Greedy bugger back toA Nightmare on Elm street, though.
The original came out in 1984and was blessed slash cursed with

(10:03):
five sequels before we got toNew Nightmare. So let's just go into
those sequels briefly. WesCraven didn't want to direct a sequel
and he didn't have any ongoingfinancial or contractual participation
in sequels. And so Bob Shayein New Line Cinema went ahead with
the Nightmare on Elm Street 2Freddy's Revenge, without Craven's

(10:24):
participation. Freddy'sRevenge is often cited as an unintentionally
gay horror movie, with themovie's homoerotic subtext being
denied by the writer DavidChaskin for years. And it seriously
affected the main actor, MarkPatton, who was himself a young closeted
gay man at the time. In the2010 documentary film Never Sleep

(10:45):
the Elm Street Legacy,Chasking finally admitted that the
gay themes were intentional,something he had denied up until
that point. Craven wouldreturn to the franchise along with
Heather Langenkamp in 1987 forA Nightmare on Elm Street 3 Dream
warriors, with a coscreenwriting and co story credit.
But the movie would bedirected by Chuck Russell, but because

(11:09):
Craven had signed away hisrights and therefore signed away
his rights to any furthercompensation for sequels or merchandising.
Three further sequels, ANightmare on Elm Street 4 The Dream
Master, A Nightmare on ElmStreet 5 The Dream Child and Freddy's
The Final Nightmare followedin 1988, 1989 and 1991 respectively.

(11:31):
Fred Instead, the FinalNightmare was always intended to
be the big finale. The day ofrelease was declared Freddy Krueger
Day in Los Angeles and therewas even a mock public funeral held
at the Hollywood ForeverCemetery for the final death of the
character. But Freddy's Deadalso had Freddy at his least serious
and menacing, turning hisvictims into pizza toppings and video

(11:54):
game characters with cameosfrom previous Elm street victim.
Now movie star Johnny Depp,credited as Oprah Noodlemantra with
the infamous this is yourbrain on drugs also featured cameos
from Roseanne Barr and TomArnold. Of all people. The end of
Freddie really was supposed tobe the end, and it was certainly
the end of the character'sserious horror credibility. As with

(12:17):
many horror stories,maintaining genuine scares had become
difficult across multiplesequels. And humor seemed to be the
way to keep audiences engagedwhen pure terror was hard to achieve.
But everyone knows that nocharacter ever stays truly dead.
And plans for another movie inthe franchise after Freddy's the
Not so Final Nightmare startedpretty quickly after that movie became

(12:41):
a critical failure. New Linewas the house that Freddy built,
and it was also the house thatused a massive defibrillator on Freddie
and didn't stop saying cleartill Freddie came back to life. Sort
of different to how he wasbefore. It's no secret that Wes Craven
wasn't happy with the growingfatigue surrounding the franchise
and the comedic angle thecharacter had taken over. The sequels.

(13:04):
The Nightmare films were nevermeant to be seen by children. And
yet they started merchandisingFreddie quite quickly. With children's
toys and costumes available,it's something new Nightmare comments
on openly with the characterof Heather's son Dylan having his
episodes blamed on hismother's horror career and his father's
visual effects career. This isa kid who openly visits film sets

(13:29):
we see in Nightmares at least,but with two parents working in the
industry, it's not outside ofthe realm of possibility that Dylan
has grown up on the movie'sversions of the Nightmare on Elm
street series sets. It's alsono secret that Craven felt like the
series had peaked with his owninvolvements the original and then
co writing A Nightmare on ElmStreet 3 Dream warriors, which was

(13:51):
originally going to be fairlysimilar to New Nightmare until the
studio rejected the idea. Theyhad a cash cow to milk after all.
Though Freddy's Dead wapanned critically, it was modestly
successful at the box office,more so than A Nightmare on El Street
5 the Dream Child had been.While New Line genuinely intended

(14:12):
to end the series, recognizingthat the franchise had become creatively
exhausted, the financial sidemeant there was still commercial
value in the character.Despite the declining quality, they
realized they'd killed Freddietoo soon. New Line apparently came
to realize that ending thefranchise with such a poorly received,
campy film was a mistake thatdidn't actually honor the character

(14:36):
that had built their studio.They wanted to resurrect Freddy Krueger
without actually resurrectinghim, and to give Freddy his dues
and the fans theirs. Theycould only call One Man. Ten years
after A Nightmare on ElmStreet, Bob Shaye called Wes Craven,
offering to make one moreFreddy film, even though the previous

(14:59):
sequel was literally supposedto be the final Nightmare. That meeting
was to talk about Wes Craven'snew Nightmare, which was originally
titled A Nightmare on ElmStreet 7 the Ascension and finally
Craven was offered a cut ofthe merchandising and sequels retroactively.
Craven would say about theidea of bringing Freddy back again,

(15:19):
quote, I always felt thatunder wonderful circumstances I'd
love to get my hands on thefranchise one more time. When I realized
it would be the 10thanniversary and the seventh film,
it was attractive to come backfrom a position of strength and do
it. So we agreed that's BobShaye, Sarah Risher, Mike DeLuca,
the creative heads at New Lineand myself and my producer Marianne

(15:42):
Maddelena, that unless wecould bring Freddie back in a way
that wasn't farcical, likesaying it was all a dream and Freddie
isn't really dead. We wouldn'tdo it. If we couldn't do it in some
way that was justified, thenwe wouldn't do it at all. Unquote.
With the financial issuessorted, Craven got down to developing
his new script, which includedreferences to the previous movies,

(16:04):
to the diminishing returns ofnot only the Nightmare on Elm street
series, but horror in general,and to the fairy tales of old like
Hansel and Gretel that becamesanitized over time. But mostly he
was writing a script aboutwriting a script, and he would have
lunch with both HeatherLangenkamp and Robert Englund to
find out how the movies hadchanged their lives and most importantly,

(16:27):
would they be interested incoming back to do something like
this? Turns out they both did.He presented his idea to New Line
Cinema's CEO Robert Shea andincluded him in the script, which
he liked. This was a brandnew, unique take on the horror genre,
but not the first attempt atmetafictional horror, which is usually

(16:48):
cited as 1960s Peeping Tom byMichael Powell about Mark Lewis,
a photographer and filmmakerwho murders women while recording
their deaths with his camera.It was an uncomfortable watch. Powell's
camera positions us directlybehind Mark and his spectators so
that we become his unwillingaccomplices. The audience watches

(17:09):
Mark watching his films. Thefilm destroyed Powell's career upon
release because of the harshcritical reception, only to be later
recognized as a masterpiecethat anticipated many themes horror
cinema would explore decadeslater. Peeping Tom imagines the relationship
between filmmaker, film andaudience in ways that wouldn't be

(17:30):
fully explored again untilfilms like New Nightmare and later
Scream brought meta horrorinto the mainstream. While New Nightmare
was more explicitly about thehorror film industry and featured
real people playingthemselves, Peeping Tom was the first
to make the act of watchinghorror films itself part of the horror.

(17:51):
New Nightmare doesn'texplicitly belittle the Nightmare
on Elm street series. Cravenis smart enough to subtly mention
Heather Langenkamp hasn't beentoo affected by the series, as she's
moved on to other things asshe was only in parts one and three,
coincidentally the same oneshe himself was involved in. But while
the movie version of Heatheris written by Craven to be highly

(18:11):
strong and damaged by herassociation with Freddy as soon as
his nightmares start, the reallife Heather is much more laid back,
but her real life issues wouldactually make it into the movie because
we don't actually think aboutthe real life issues that might come
from starring in a horrormovie. Especially for children and
young people who might be moreimpressionable, horror movies are

(18:34):
the movies kids really want towatch because they're not allowed
to. Heather Langenkamp was 19when she first starred as Nancy Thompson,
and many people in her lifewarned her about starring in a horror
movie, that she might becometypecast or it might affect future
acting jobs. And while shedidn't do much in the way of movies
during the 80s, she did becomea household name on TV, starring

(18:57):
in Just the 10 of Us, a spinoff of the popular sitcom Growing
Pains, which aired from 1988to 1990. It was from the cancellation
of Just the Ten of Us thatLangenkamp did have her own stalker,
who, just like in the movie,harassed her with phone calls and
letters. Upset that the sitcomhad been taken off air, as if that's

(19:19):
the lead actor's fault.Langenkamp gave Craven permission
to use her real experience toadd a layer of real life horror to
the movie version of Heather'slife. But this wouldn't be the real
Heather. It would be aheightened version, slightly damaged
and eager to escape theNightmare on Elm street specter that
had followed her fictionalcareer. It was more fun for Langenkamp

(19:41):
to play Heather that way thanjust to play herself. And she focused
on the central conflict. WasHeather really going crazy or was
Freddy Krueger reallytormenting her in the real world?
Langenkamp's husband, reallife husband, makeup effects artist
David Leroy Anderson, declinedto play himself in the movie. He

(20:02):
actually proposed to her onthe set of Pet Symmetry, which coincidentally
starred the young Miko Hughes.One of the reasons Wes Craven specifically
gave the movie version ofHeather a child was to ask the question,
what are horror films doing toour children? Are we damaging their
innocent minds? And what doesit mean when your young child sees

(20:23):
your horror movie work? MikoHughes career had started with Pet
Sematary when he was justthree years old. He'd also been in
Kindergarten Cop when he wasfour. So starring in New Nightmare
when he was seven was nothingnew for him. And he knew who Freddy
Krueger was at 7 years old,further highlighting that New Line's

(20:44):
merchandising department hadworked their magic at promoting the
character to children. Theproduction had heard of Hughes, but
because of the child's age,they also had to consider twins.
They put out an open castingcall for children in Nevada and California,
all the while hoping to notlose Miko Hughes to another film.
But Hughes wowed them in hisaudition and he got the part. Craven

(21:08):
began the complicated task ofreuniting franchise cast members,
including Langenkamp, RobertEnglund as well as smaller roles
for John Saxon, Jisoo Garcia,also known as Nick Corey, and Tuesday
Night as themselves. He wantedto ask Johnny Depp to return, but
he didn't. When they metafterwards, Depp said that he would

(21:28):
have done it in a heartbeat.And this would be a new version of
Freddie, once again played byRobert Englund, but also less comical
than the previous iterations.The entity manifests itself as Kruger,
now free from the shackles ofthe previous movies. Craven would
change the character's look,giving him a long trench coat and

(21:48):
a green hat. The signatureglove was redesigned to look more
like the glove on the firstNightmare on Elm street poster. An
actual hand rather than aglove with muscles and bony fingers.
Freddie's makeup looked morelike ripped skin compared to the
burned look fans had been usedto. There was a lot in the original
script for Englund that neveractually got filmed, including a

(22:10):
scene of where Englund himselfhas a nightmare of himself trapped
in the role of Freddy, withEnglund trapped in a spider's web
being cocooned by a giantblack widow. And on the underbelly
of the black widow are red andgreen stripes, the same as Freddy's
sweater. It was never shot dueto the production running out of
money. It also helps toexplain where the character of Robert

(22:34):
Englund disappears to. Englundwould always say that this movie
was his favorite sequel of theentire franchise because of how smart
and self aware it is. Craven'sappearance too was remarkably different
to the original script. In oneof the early drafts of A Nightmare
on Elm street, the Ascension,Wes Craven was supposed to arrive

(22:54):
in a van driven by thecharacter Pluto from the Hills have
Eyes. Craven would have beenon the run from Freddy Krueger with
his only chance of escape towrite the script for the new Nightmare
movie, even going as far ascutting off his own eyelids to stay
awake. In the final cut of thefilm, Craven still plays himself,
but instead of living out of avan and going insane and cutting

(23:16):
off his own eyelids, he livesrelatively comfortably in his mansion
in the Hollywood Hills, whichis apparently not his real mansion.
But whoever's mansion it is,it's a very nice mansion. One way
that Freddy manifests himselfinto the real world is the earthquakes,
which usually happen after thenightmares. Here in the uk, we don't
know really what earthquakesfeel like. We do have them, but they're

(23:40):
usually undetectable. Iremember we had one locally in 2008.
It was the middle of thenight. It was apparently a 5.2 on
the Richter scale, and Iremember it and I remember how scary
it was, but I honestly can'timagine living in a quake zone. But
as this is a movie wherefiction and reality blend, maybe

(24:00):
there was some sort of evilentity that decided to also ensure
earthquakes happened in thereal world. And on 17 January 1994,
the Northridge earthquake hitthe greater Los Angeles area. 57
people died and more than9,000 were injured. The earthquake
happened just before the endof filming and immediately New Line

(24:21):
wanted to utilize some of thedisaster scenes, arguably not in
good taste because lives hadbeen lost and the financial burden
to the city was massive. Butthey still put together a unit with
a double for HeatherLangenkamp to drive around various
places in the city where youcan clearly see building and road
damage. It adds to the realismof a movie that's supposed to be

(24:45):
based in the real world. Weeven visit the real New Line Cinema
offices, which were onRobertson Boulevard in Los Angeles
and featuring cameos from BobShaye and Sara Risher as themselves,
with Shaye's office filledwith Freddie memorabilia. And when
production began in lateOctober 1993, the filming schedule

(25:06):
was on time and withoutissues. And then the earthquakes
happened. Several crew memberslost their homes too, and it set
the production back two days.The freeway sequence, which in the
original script had Freddyshow up in a car with claws called
the Freddie Mobile to kidnapDylan, was scrapped again due to
financial reasons. Instead,the scene would show Dylan sleepwalking

(25:29):
across the busy road. Theproduction had to close down portions
of the freeway east of LA.Over 100 cars were used in the scene
and the scene took almost aweek to film. A crane 30ft off the
ground was used to pluck Dylanoff the road to accomplish the look
of real jeopardy for a sevenyear old boy. They used blue screen,

(25:51):
front projection, mattecomposition and morphing to make
the sequence look as real aspossible. The whole sequence took
two to three months to createvisual effects. Director William
Mesa would say that MikoHughes was very good at taking direction.
Langenkamp, along with Hughesand Englund, spent the last several
weeks of the shooting on anelaborate set constructed to represent

(26:14):
Freddy's Netherworld.Production designer Cynthia Charette
and her team of craftspeopleand decorators worked for over two
months with carpenters andplasterers to create the eerie 100
foot set that represented thehistory of hell. Starting with Dante's
Inferno and the writings ofthe Roman poet Virgil. Charette created

(26:35):
a room with seven openings,each leading into a lower, more vile
part of the underworld. Tocreate the grim surroundings of The
Netherworld, seven differentwall textures resembling stone, earth
and mortar were made frommould. These moulds were layered
on top of one another and thensections were stripped away to give
a look of deterioration androtting over the centuries. A water

(26:58):
dripping system was alsoinstalled to give the sets a damp,
dank appearance. But speakingof Dante's Inferno, let's segue into
the obligatory Keanu referenceof this episode. And if you're new
here and you don't know whatthat is, it's where I try and link
the movie that I'm featuringwith Keanu Reeves. This movie has

(27:19):
visuals based on Dante'sInferno, also partially based on
Dante's Inferno, the Devil'sAdvocate from two episodes ago, which
also starred Keanu Reeves. In1991, Freddie died and New Line Cinema
said Freddy is dead for real.And so for fans, another movie would

(27:41):
have probably seemed a littlebit confusing, especially a movie
that came out only three yearsafter Freddy's death. And so New
Nightmare faced a uniquemarketing challenge because it was
both a Nightmare on Elm streetsequel and also something completely
different. And the marketinghad the task of communicating the

(28:02):
metafictional concept withoutconfusing audiences who might be
expecting a traditionalNightmare on Elm street movie. The
movie was marketed as WesCraven's New Nightmare, putting the
creator's name front andcenter to signal that this was a
return to the originalcreator's vision, not another campy
sequel. But by not having theNightmare on Elm street name in the

(28:26):
title, most people didn'tactually click that this was anything
to do with Freddy Krueger. Andthis might go some way to explain
what happened when the moviewas released, because New Nightmare
is the only Nightmare on Elmstreet film to be released in the
traditional horror month ofOctober, and it was released on 14th
October 1994, the same week asPulp Fiction. And Pulp Fiction's

(28:51):
overwhelming success wasblamed somewhat for New Nightmare's
slightly lesser success.Despite New Nightmare opening third
at the domestic box office, itstruggled to find an audience and
would only stay in the top 10for three weeks. And so that 12 hit
of pulp Fiction coming out thesame week, and also audiences not

(29:12):
really being sure what WesCraven's New Nightmare was supposed
to be, the movie struggledfinancially at the box office. Now,
it's worth noting here thatafter Scream came out, Wes Craven's
New Nightmare becamesuccessful on dvd. Fans returned
to it. People's love forScream opened the door for how to
watch Wes Craven's NewNightmare, how to get the most out

(29:34):
of it, and how to appreciateit and a lot of the love for Wes
Craven's New Nightmare hascome in the decades after Scream.
But despite being resurrectedby the original creator, starring
its original stars andliterally reinventing the horror
genre, New Nightmare is thelowest grossing movie in the entire

(29:54):
Nightmare on Elm streetfranchise, grossing $18 million domestically
and $1.7 millioninternationally, giving it a total
of $19.7 million worldwide onits $8 million budget. New nightmare
truly was a movie that cameout way before its time because,
as I said, it is nowconsidered one of the fan favorites

(30:18):
of the franchise. Butcritically is where New Nightmare
did resurrect the seriesbecause it got some of the best reviews
since the original movie in1984 with a 77% of Rotten Tomatoes,
where the consensus of WesCraven's new nightmare adds an unexpectedly
satisfying, not to mentionintelligent, meta layer to a horror

(30:39):
franchise that had long sincelost its way. Retrospectively, it's
also seen as a highlight inthe series and as a prelude to Scream.
New Nightmare received fournominations at the 1995 Fangoria
Chainsaw Awards for BestStudio Big Budget Film, best Actress
for Heather Langenkamp, BestSupporting Actor for Miko Hughes

(31:02):
and Best Screenplay. It wontwo awards, Best Actress and Best
Screenplay. Langenkamp wasalso inducted into the Fangoria hall
of Fame that year. It was alsonominated for Best film at the 10
Independent Spirit Awards.Now, of course, sequels wise. Freddy
Krueger would return in Freddyvs. Jason in 2003 and again in the

(31:24):
reboot in 2010. The rights tothe A Nightmare on Elm street franchise
and Freddy Krueger reverted toWes Craven's estate in 2019. New
Line Cinema is still keen tobring Freddie back in some way, but
rights are complicated.Craven's estate would still need
to find a US Distributor andmake a deal with New Line for the

(31:45):
international release, as theyretain the international rights.
Craven's estate has takenpitches for a New Nightmare movie,
but Robert Englund, who's beenplaying the character in live action
for 40 years now, apart fromthat one Jackie Earle Haley performance,
has said he's too old toreturn to the iconic character, but
that he'd love to return in acameo. Wes Craven took what New Nightmare

(32:08):
did, or attempted to do at thevery least, and two years later collaborated
with Kevin Williamson onScream, which took the metafictional
idea and enhanced it. Cravenwould always say that Scream improved
upon the ideas established byNew Nightmare. Dylan's New Nightmare,
a fan film starring MikoHughes reprising his role as Dylan

(32:31):
porter, is on YouTube and isactually well worth the watch. I
actually really enjoyed it.It's only about half an hour long
and when it finished Iactually wanted it to go on for longer
than it did. Miko Hughes isgreat. There's no Robert Englund
as Freddie, but Freddie doesmake an appearance and is as disturbing
as you would expect him to be.As I mentioned, there's also a four

(32:54):
hour documentary on the entireA Nightmare on Elm street film series
called Never Sleep Again whichcame out in 2010. Unfortunately,
I did not have four hoursspare to watch that documentary.
However, I have heard it's avery good documentary so if you come
across it, it is well worthyour time. The early 80s slasher
boom would quickly fade asdiminishing returns affected the

(33:18):
Halloween Friday the 13th andNightmare on Elm street series. With
the decade finishing on aslasher slump, the 90s still gave
us classics like Child's Playand Candyman, both previous episodes
of this podcast. But thefranchises struggled and critics
and fans were bemoaning thedeath of the franchise slasher. This

(33:39):
is where Wes Craven said holdmy beer. Just like the fans in New
Nightmare who gather in a chatshow audience for England's appearance,
this Kruger to chant his nameand scream how much they love him.
We too secretly wanted to seemore of this horrifying and fascinating
character. Freddy Krueger,despite his child murdering past,

(34:01):
is adored and revered byhorror fans. Freddy is synonymous
with this franchise, as isRobert Englund playing him. But Freddy
was the monster of the 80s,the evil child killer. It makes sense
that the entity would take hisform and the most frightening version
of that form. In NewNightmare, Craven isn't simply aware

(34:21):
of the tropes and trappings ofthe franchise. This is literally
a movie about the people whomade the movie. There are layered
callbacks to specific momentsin the original film, but much more
than that, it's so centered onthe pop culture status that Freddie
has amassed in that 10 yeartime period. He set the standard
for a tired franchise that hadkilled its villain. Don't bring him

(34:43):
back, just resurrect the ideain a smart, self aware way. New Nightmare
was ahead of its time in somany ways and remains one of the
more memorable outings in theseries for everyone. If anything,
Craven just sharpened hisskills for Scream, which took everything
New Nightmare attempted andimproved on it. New Nightmare can
be a little convolutedsometimes, but Scream was a simple

(35:06):
small town being terrorized bya mass the killer who done it. New
Nightmare needed someknowledge of the series to completely
understand it, but Scream justneeded a basic knowledge of horror
tropes. Scream deconstructedthe slasher tropes, and then Cabin
in the woods came along anddissected it. Craven would say in
later interviews that NewNightmare was full of experiments

(35:28):
that some worked and somedidn't, but Scream ultimately improved
on the ideas that NewNightmare started. New Nightmare
makes subtle and not so subtlenods to previous movies, including
a fantastic opening scenepaying homage to the intro of the
1984 original showing Freddycreating his knifed glove, which
turns out to be a nightmare,but also to fairy tales in general,

(35:50):
namely Hansel and Gretel,fairy tales that have also been modernized
and sanitized over time, wherethe villains have become less menacing
than the original stories andthe children now always seem to live
at the end. Dark fairy taleswere used as warning tools for children,
but are now just bedtimestories. Heather reads Dylan, Hansel

(36:11):
and Gretel, and Dylan leavessleeping pills for his mother to
follow him, just like Hanseland Gretel, leaving breadcrumbs.
Freddy also meets his untimelyend in a furnace, just like the witch
in Hansel and Gretel, andCraven cleverly compares the sanitization
of fairy tales over time tothe sanitization of Freddy over the
previous decade. This is amovie that speaks of the dangers

(36:33):
scary movies pose to children,and how stopping children from watching
movies like this actuallymakes them want to watch them more.
Also commenting on ourtendency to criticise media consumption
as the cause of anypsychological or behavioral problems
children are having. The firstNightmare on Elm street was a group
of parents misguided attemptto protect their children, which

(36:55):
then put a target on thosechildren. Heather tries to protect
Dylan, which just makes theentity in the guise of Freddy want
to go for Dylan even more,kidnapping him into his realm, and
the only way Heather can savehim is to once again become Nancy.
Heather is governed by herfear and anxiety throughout the movie,
as well as the grief andtrauma she goes through with its

(37:17):
lack of kills. There's onlyfour, only four, she says. More of
a focus on the psychologicaland lack of gore. New Nightmare is
firmly rooted in the realworld, and maybe that wasn't what
Nightmare on Elm street fanswanted in the mid-90s. To me, this
is the most fascinating of allthe Nightmare on Elm street movies.
This was the one I saw firstbefore any others, and it was instantly

(37:42):
memorable. The scene whereFreddy's animatronic claw goes around
killing people on a film setmight just be a bad dream, but it
cements this movie assomething different. Me now. I would
have loved to have seen moreof Robert Shea and New Line Cinema
and more about how theyactually feel about bringing Freddie
back in this way. And maybethen commenting on how strange it

(38:04):
is the Wes Craven script isexactly what they're saying in real
life. I'd have liked more reallife Heather, Robert Englund, Robert
Shea and Wes Craven thanDylan. I understand why Dylan is
there to have the conflictthey need to give to Heather, but
the premise deserves more metathan it actually gives us. Just like
the last episode on Candyman,as soon as you stop telling the stories,

(38:27):
the Urban Legends need them tosurvive. New nightmare is 100% an
appreciation for the mind andstorytelling ability of the late
Wes Craven. A master of horrorin so many ways, he knew about the
effects of censorship on artand so he honored the classic and
it led to a movie being atrailblazer for how horror would

(38:48):
evolve. Wes Craven said thatScream was a movie for people who
watch horror movies and NewNightmare was a movie for people
who make horror movies. Screammay be credited for refreshing the
slasher, but we all know NewNightmare is Wes Craven's real life
meta horror masterpiece. Thankyou for listening. As always, I would

(39:09):
love to hear your thoughts onWes Craven's New Nightmare and thank
you for your continued supportof this podcast. If you want to get
involved and you want to helpthis podcast grow and reach more
people, you could leave arating or review wherever you found
this podcast. You can find meand follow me across social media.
I'm at verbaldiorama, whereyou can like post, comment on posts,

(39:31):
share posts. It all helps withthe visibility of this podcast and
you can also tell your friendsand family, especially if they are
a huge Freddy Krueger fan, butmaybe not so much the children. If
you like this episode on WesCraven's New Nightmare, you may also
enjoy the episodes that I havedone. Back in the day. Episode 64

(39:53):
was on screen. That was a veryearly episode of this podcast, and
then episode 275 on theoriginal A Nightmare on Elm Street.
Please let me know if you dolisten to those episodes what you
think of those episodes, andhopefully you will enjoy them as
much as you enjoyed this one.So the next episode of the podcast,

(40:13):
we're kind of stepping backfrom the real genuine horror scares
to something that is a littlebit more aimed at children. In fact,
it is definitely aimed atchildren because it's on Disney plus
and it is a Disney movie andit's a Disney movie that a lot of
parents put on at Halloweenbecause kids really love the movie.

(40:33):
I remember absolutely adoringthis movie when it first came out.
I would watch it all the time.It's only really as an adult that
I can actually see that maybethis movie isn't the greatest Halloween
movie ever made, but back whenI was a kid I absolutely loved the
movie Hocus Pocus and I findHocus Pocus so interesting when we
talk about the history andlegacy of movies in that when Hocus

(40:56):
Pocus came out it was not ahit at all, but over the years it's
become a genuine Halloweenclassic that people do put on every
year. It recently had a sequelwhich is not as good, but the original
retains a lot of that reallycampy, classic Halloween fun. And

(41:17):
unlike Wes Craven's newnightmare, it is very suitable for
children. And so I wanted togive you all this spooky season for
October on Verbal Diorama amix of stuff for Halloween. So you've
got your scary movies andyou've also got something that is
very suitable for children.Please join me next week for the
history and legacy of HocusPocus. Now, if you enjoy what I do

(41:40):
for this podcast or you simplyjust want to support an indie podcaster
who does literally everythingon her own, if you have some spare
change, you can financiallycontribute to the upkeep of this
podcast. If you have the meansto, you're under no obligation because
this podcast is free and italways will be. However, if you do
want to help, I would beincredibly grateful. You can make

(42:02):
a one offdonation@verbaldiorama.com tips or
you can subscribe to thepatreon@verbaldiorama.com patreon
and all money made goes backinto this podcast by paying for things
like software subscriptions,website hosting or new equipment.
Because unfortunatelypodcasting is not free. I am very

(42:22):
grateful to the people who doregularly support this podcast. Simon,
Laurel, Derek, Kat, Andy,Mike, Luke, Michael, Scott, Brendan,
Ian, Lisa, Sam, Jack, Dave,Stuart, Nicholas so Kev, Heather,
Danny, Stu, Brett, Philip M.Xenos, Sean, Rhino, Philip K, Adam,

(42:43):
Elaine, Kyle, Aaron, andConnor. If you want to get in touch,
you can emailverbaldiorama@gmail.com you can also
go to the websiteverbaldiorama.com and fill out the
little contact form that's onthere. You can say hi. You can give
feedback, you can givesuggestions, and every single episode
of Verbal Diorama is alsoavailable on the website too if you

(43:03):
would like to listen that way.Alternatively, your podcast app is
probably your best bet, butthey are all available on the website
as well. And if you'velistened to an episode recently and
you'd like to get in touch, oryou'd like to ask a question, or
you'd like to know something,as always, please feel free to give
me a message on email oralternatively, if you follow me on

(43:24):
social media, you can give mea DM as well. And finally,

(44:29):
Bye.

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