How Dyslexia Led Maui Singer Lily Meola to chart topping Songwriting: Her Inspiring Life Story

Singer Lily Meola opens up about her powerful journey from small town Maui to America's Got Talent. Lily shares how she overcame dyslexia, discovered the magic of songwriting in Nashville, and coped with the sudden loss of her mother to cancer.

In a deeply personal conversation, Lily reflects on the signs her mom still sends, especially through butterflies, and how music, horses, and her dream of creating horseback riding therapy are helping her heal. It’s a raw, heartfelt story of resilience, creativity, and the quiet ways love stays with us.

01:30 Touring and Life on the Road

05:00 Growing Up in Hawaii

06:32 Struggles with Dyslexia

09:53 Creative Process and Discipline

23:55 Dealing with Loss, reading signs

39:10 Reflections on Life and Loss

41:50 Struggles with Depression and Anxiety

44:38 Finding Solace in Horses

58:34 The Power of Music

#survivorstory

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
How did that road lead to America's Got Talent?
Good question. There's a little gal.
From Maui, her and I have a a new song out together about a
nice hand for Lily Meola from Maui.
Like, yeah, I want you to come to Nashville and write.
I was like, oh, you know, I'm dyslexic.
I don't write. Like I, you know, it's just
always had this like block up when it comes to letters.

(00:23):
I ended up in Nashville for three weeks falling madly in
love with songwriting. I was like, Oh my gosh.
Like I can say what is on my mind and in my heart and
melodies that come out of my brain.
It just like completely changed the entire world for me.
Got my mom back to Maui because she was at the City of Hope in
LA. She had lung cancer and I was

(00:44):
sitting there with her and I wasjust like, how am I going to
know you're going to visit me? Throughout my life, we raised
butterflies. My mom would always bring
milkweed home and we'd watch them.
And it was like a sweet little thing.
When I turned around to make that call, we took her last
breath and this was within 10 minutes of the butterfly
hatching. And I was like, wow, like that
was her transitioning. Did you feel her?

(01:06):
Oh, a million percent. I mean, the picture is crazy and
the butterfly's just on my face.We didn't talk about you at all.
You have questions? Well, I mean, I didn't come
prepared. This is hilarious.
I'm the interviewer now. Thanks.

(01:30):
For having. Me tearing your butt off?
I respect that. What is that like?
You don't look tired, you look rested.
Oh, I'm so tired. It's you're really touring.
This is just the beginning of itthough.
It's only our third or fourth. I think it's our our 4th venue
tomorrow. We went to the Hollywood Bowl
last night, but we didn't have aset there.

(01:51):
And how long does it go on? We end, I think the 26th, OK.
Yeah. Not too bad.
This is a quick little in and out, but they're long drives.
Yeah, you're going up. Yeah.
And it's not like you can lay down right and take naps.
And so you're. Well, we're in a van that has or

(02:12):
a sprinter band, which is nice, and some of the seats recline
all the way and there's like a little bed in the back.
But I'm like, I want you to be buckled.
I second. That's right.
You, you said you, you like to do things square, right straight
ahead, like keep everything above board.
I mean kind of where do you? Get wild that's.
A good question. I love riding horses.

(02:34):
OK, I feel like that can be sketch.
That can be sketchy and I I crave it.
I just I want to ride all the time.
I'm looking into a place maybe tomorrow.
Is it like a connection with thehorse, or the actual event, or
the danger element, or just all of it?
I think all of it, it gives you a moment to really be free and
have no control. I mean, you can control a horse

(02:57):
to an extent, right? But they really.
Yeah, well, I mean, what are youreally?
Gonna do at any moment, you know?
So there's kind of this, like, fleeting thing, but I don't
know, there's just something about going fast.
And my friend Melissa Fuller says flying without wings.
I like that, yeah. Did you ride them in Hawaii

(03:19):
growing up? I did.
I honestly, back then I was a lot more afraid of them.
I took lessons. My best friends were ranch
girls, so I grew up going to their barn and riding their
horses. But I always had this, like,
timid side, you know, I didn't fully embrace it.
I guess my dad would be like, oh, my friend.

(03:42):
He told me this story one time about how his friend's horse bit
his nose off. Off.
Off. That's awful and that scared me
so. Bad and.
So I always like had, you know, a little bit of distance
between, but I loved it so much.But I had this like, scared
thing at that. That's totally gone.
That's so cool. My sister grew up loving horses

(04:03):
and my parents, I think they gother one and they let her board
it somewhere. She was there all day, every day
for years. And she said there's a different
kind of connection that happens between like the the
consciousness of a person and a horse that's different than any
other connection anywhere. And she's like, no, they have
personalities. They have full feelings, they
get mad, they get grumpy, they show affection.

(04:24):
I didn't know that, I thought it.
Was so amazing. Big dumb mammal, but that is not
the case. My parents were going to get me
one and got cold feet. I was so bummed.
It was. His name was.
Coco was. It going to be on your property
or somewhere else. At that point we moved a lot, so
I'm not sure if it was going to probably be on our property, I'm
guessing. But we went and I like got to go

(04:46):
and see it and everything. And then they're like, never
mind. And I I was so bummed.
Yeah, like legit bummed that's. Like a little kid thinking
you're getting a horsey would have changed my life.
Did you like growing up in Hawaii?
Love it, silly. Question.
Oh, I mean, there's no place like it.
It's so special. And the community there, the

(05:09):
nature, just being able to grow up in literally the bushes, it
was so amazing. And there's nothing that can
kill you other than sharks or whatever.
Yeah, falling off pretty rare, though.
But there's no snakes. There's no.
Oh there's no snakes on Maui? I thought that was just a kawhi
thing. Wow.
Yeah, no, no, none of the islands, No snakes, huh?

(05:31):
That great? How?
Have they kept that off for? I mean, you would think people
would like want to sneak them intheir pocket just to be Dicks or
so. I don't know.
There's been stories of that, you know, there's even a story
about AI. Think it's a Panther, Mountain
Lion, something. There's this.
Something that shouldn't be there, that you don't want
there. I saw it.
Chickens and deers and pigs and you.
Know like that? What was your social life like

(05:52):
there growing up? It was great.
Yeah, yeah. I mean, the community's so
awesome. I have a lot of amazing friends.
I mean, there's definitely a time where I had like a rough go
at school. I got held back.
And they? Were made fun of it.
I was headed first grade twice, and so I think during that

(06:14):
period of my life I kind of feltpretty uncomfortable just 'cause
I. In what way?
I don't know. It's like made fun of, really.
Yeah. I didn't think I was smart
enough. And kids would kind of.
Why did they hold you back? 'Cause I was dyslexic and they
didn't know it yet and so I wasn't progressing like the

(06:37):
other kid. And it's not a big deal talking
about it now. But you know, even if you're if
I had to think of something thatwasn't.
Yeah, yeah. What were the symptoms like back
then? I mean dyslexia can manifest in
so many different ways and it's your brain just processes

(06:57):
information differently. Maybe I'll be reading a sign and
the sign says something that gets all jumbled up for me and I
can't read it. OK, there's that side of
dyslexia or, or numbers or backwards or whatever.
That's kind of like the most common.
Either 1 is not conducive to learning for sure.
Yeah, not great. And then what else?

(07:20):
Like even I, I feel it even in aspects of my making music.
Like writing lyrics and stuff and.
Just no, not writing lyrics likethe way that my like sometimes.
Let's see, gosh, I'm trying to think of how do I describe it
that like other people understand.

(07:42):
Is it OK? So if like if you were looking
at a sign and you're reading letters, are they floating
around? Are they blurring together?
They kind of blur. Together or they're, they just
look like a different word, likeI'll process it for a word that
kind of looks like that. OK, really annoying.
Yeah, yeah, that would be. And so if you slow down and
reread. Sometimes, Sometimes the

(08:04):
comprehension aspect was really hard for me.
Like reading a page, I'd have toread it 15 times and then maybe
have someone else read it to me and then explain what happened
because it would just be like turn into mush, which is
frustrating. So like with my music, I'll have

(08:24):
to, sometimes I have to have like at least one foot sitting
on something, like leaning on something so that I can focus
and then have maybe sometimes I'll like sing a rough guide in

(08:46):
and then I have to have it in one ear.
What's a rough guide in? Like a rough a rough take of the
song and then have it in one earso that I can.
It's just a weird thing. That's cool you figured out the
hacks. Yeah, I figured out the hacks.
I figured out what works and it's great.
You know, that's just the thing with dyslexia.
Your brain processes informationdifferent like I said and so I

(09:06):
just. I wonder what the like the
evolutionary gift of that would be like, why is that here?
Like I said, I have ADD and I can totally see how I'd be good
at hunting or I'd be good at multitasking or war or something
like that. Reaction time and
distractibility or impulsiveness.
Like go kill the lion, like dyslexia.

(09:27):
I wonder what that would, because it's here for a reason,
you know, like I always think about that when people have
brains that are different. I'm like, what would be the
benefit of that? How would a society be set up to
where that would be a benefit? And I don't know if you ever
thought about that, but. No, I haven't.
I mean, I've, I've heard that a lot of people who are creative
have dyslexia. I don't know if it has some sort

(09:47):
of correlation with that side ofyour brain.
Hey, you've you've found a way through it.
I found a way through it. Do you think of melodies first?
Like how do you make your songs?Does you wake up and you're
like, Oh my, because this was inmy dream, let me get a voice
recorder. Or does it start with words?
Or is it scientific process? Like what does that look like?
Every day is different. Wow, I.

(10:07):
Mean there's a lot of days that are similar but every day is
different. Sometimes you'll write a song to
a bass line. Sometimes I write a little poem
and I bring that into the studioand I'm like what do you guys
think of this? Sometimes I'm like, I have this
melody that's like, and then we figure out what words we hear on

(10:27):
that. You know, it's really just
depends on what is flowing that day.
And sometimes it ain't flowing and you're like.
Really. Do you push through it?
And write a song. What am I gonna say?
And it's like, oh, but yeah, I mean, every, most of the time
the success rate is pretty good.Yeah.
I I rarely leave the studio without a song.

(10:49):
That's sick. And so you can go in maybe not
creative in the OR feeling the creative mode, but you do
something that elicits elicits aprocess like with discipline and
stuff. Yeah, I hear that from
creatives. I did not know that.
I thought that I, I thought people just walk around and like
something comes to them and now they have a song.

(11:09):
And first guy that told me that his name is David Garibaldi.
And he does these paintings where he'll do upside down
paintings at halftime shows. And it doesn't look like
anything. You're like, what's going on?
And he flips it over and it's like Abe Lincoln or something.
And he said the creative processstarts with discipline.
You get to the studio and you show up at 9:00 and you start
the process and then it unfolds.You don't wait for the

(11:30):
inspiration. And that was the first I'd heard
of that. I think that's like the
difference between, you know, people that are creative and
then people who make the creativeness their job too, you
know, because. The discipline factor.
Potentially, you know, because it's really hard to make it as a

(11:50):
creative person if you don't have that because I could be
doing a a different job, but I'dstill have this desire to be
creative constantly. But there wouldn't be any
pressure or preconceived notionsor anything that like I had to
do it. So you do feel pressure to
create at times. Some days, yeah, I mean, if I

(12:11):
get to the studio and I'm just not feeling it or I'm sick or,
you know. Still got to come up with
something. You still got to come up with
something. Or if I've already been writing
every day that week and I was like, oh God, I don't have
anything to say. What am I going to say?
And then you start talking to your collaborators and it's
like, wow. How old were you when you
realized that you have a vocal gift?

(12:32):
You know, I never realized it. I just loved singing and you
know, my mom, she's a little biased, but you know, she's my
mom. I think she was right though.
Well, I don't know. I, I look back at videos and I'm
like, why did anybody let me on that stage?
What was what were they thinking?
But yeah, I grew up in going to my friend's dad's studio, Bob

(12:59):
Rock. He lives on Maui as well.
He's a Canadian producer and my best friends were his daughters.
They were the ones who had the horses too.
So I grew up watching him recordall these amazing artists that
would come to the island to workwith him.
And it was just the most amazingthing to witness.
And also sometimes he would haveus come and sing like background

(13:23):
vocals or like really silly little things.
And I just loved it. And I, I don't remember any
timelines or anything, but at one point he told my mom that
like, I'm gonna record her one day.
And my mom always would make me like dinner parties or whatever
she'd make me. Oh, Lily, can you sing a tiska

(13:43):
to Taska or can you sing, you know, I don't know what song?
All sorts of stuff. Then I got the lead in a School
Musical. After that, my mom got me vocal
lessons and she realized that I really liked doing it.
And I think since I was having difficulties in school and I was

(14:06):
frustrated and embarrassed and all these different things and
just wasn't working out in that aspect, she saw that I had this
outlet that really brought me joy.
And she just fed that. And she did that with my brother
too, and my dad too. They just were so, so
supportive. Is your brothers the surfing?
Is that? Yeah.
That's cool. Yeah.

(14:26):
And so she just started getting me gigs.
She's like, oh, that you have this weekly Tuesday night cafe
gig we're going to how about at this, you know, Stella Blues
Bar? Oh, my friend's having a party,
come, come play at this, all sorts of stuff.
And I just haven't stopped. That's awesome, yeah.

(14:46):
How did that road lead to America's Got Talent?
Good question. I I don't even know.
I've always thought those shows were really interesting.
I didn't know if they would be right for me because I don't
like the judging aspect of art. It seems harsh.

(15:07):
You know, well, not even like harsh on me, but just harsh in
general. I guess it's just weird, like
who's this person to tell you that you're not good enough to
like do this? It's just maybe not their
flavor. And then it like bums these
people out who are really good and just doing their own thing,
you know, And it's a discouraging thing sometimes as

(15:29):
much as it is an uplifting thing.
So I kind of there was a moment where there was a possibility of
American Idol, like how many years ago, like 1314 years ago.
And I just, I didn't feel right about it.
So I didn't pursue it. And I put out an EP.

(15:52):
This is Fast forward. 1010 years.
Ago. Fast, fast board, 10 years.
Yeah, I mean, I don't know if you want me to go into the whole
story. But yeah, I definitely do if you
want. Yeah, I mean, OK, so said no to
that. And then I was at the time I was
working with Bob Rock, I'm pretty sure.

(16:13):
And oh, what do I think I was? I think I was already touring
with Willie Nelson. He had me on his duets album and
then he took me out on the road like an absolute Angel.
And so I I was doing that. Gosh, you know, I'm really

(16:35):
roundabouting this. It's me, like I said, I I put
you here, I put you there. Well, America's Got Talent is so
far over here, and there's like a whole.
Let's let's just push the talent.
I want to hear the. The whole story.
OK, so it all starts with Bob Rock recording me.

(16:56):
We got a development deal with Verve Records with David Foster,
and I was pretty young at the time and didn't know what any of
that meant. And Bob was also producing
Michael Bublé at the time, and Ithink some other people.
So he was really busy and he would, you know, get some studio
time and we'd work on stuff hereand there.
And it just took a while. And Bob and I were working on

(17:18):
the project. I was at a cafe gig that I did
weekly and half It isn't me Tuesday night.
And Willie Nelson was there. He came with his wife, Annie,
who's friends with my mom, and he sat in and we sang crazy
together. And at the end of the night, he
handed me a napkin that said a few songs on it.

(17:39):
And he handed me it. And it was like, if you'd like
to record any of these, let me know.
I was like, Oh my gosh, like, ofcourse.
Are you kidding? So then Bob and I went into this
other studio, not his studio, and recorded a bunch of songs
that day with him and I've neverheard any of it.

(17:59):
The sound board or something happened to where it all got
corrupt. So I've never heard any of it.
I don't think they've heard any of it.
And so we're going to be like, oh, you want to come back and do
that again? And so Fast forward couple
years, at this point, I think Willie invites me to be on the

(18:21):
duets album. And so then ended up going on
the road with him for that. And he was like, you need
something to sell at these theseconcerts.
I didn't have anything. I didn't have a record out.
I didn't have anything, you know, done.
And so he was like, I, I want myson to record it.
And so Micah Nelson started producing a record for me.

(18:43):
And Micah, in the middle of that, got asked to be on in Neil
Young's band. And so he went out on tour with
Neil Young. And my friend Eric Helmkamp
helped finish the record. And during that time, I had
never written a song. And so by the time we finished
that project, I had kind of feltdisconnected to it because maybe

(19:09):
like, I don't know, maybe it waslike a couple months before I
put it out, I got a call from this woman, Leslie Depiro.
And Leslie had seen a video of me on YouTube and was like, I
want you to come to Nashville and write.
Well, what was the video? I don't know.
It was like it was, I think it was actually of me and Jamie

(19:30):
Johnson singing at Farm 8 or something.
And she's like, yeah, I want youto come to Nashville and write.
And I was like, oh, you know, I'm dyslexic.
I don't write like I, you know, it's just always had this like
block up when it comes to letters and numbers and words.
And she's like, no, I really like, I think you should come.
And she convinced me. And I ended up in Nashville for

(19:52):
three weeks falling madly in love with songwriting.
I was like, oh, my gosh. Like, I can say what is on my
mind and in my heart and melodies that come out of my
brain. It just, like, completely
changed the entire world for me.You know, I'd already been doing
music. I was 10 or 11, my first gig.
And this was maybe I was. 2021, I think I was 20 years old, so

(20:17):
I'd already been doing it for solong and then all of a sudden it
was just like. Unlocked a whole different
element. Yeah.
And then I had this record of songs I didn't write, and we put
out the project, and I just was like, you know what this is?
This isn't fair. You know, I didn't write this.
And then I ended up doing a couple songwriting sessions in

(20:39):
LA with this producer, Scott Stevens.
He's wonderful. And Scott and I wrote a couple
songs and these were like the first real like they felt like
me songs. Super solid, I guess, and in the
right direction and everything. And those got sent around to the

(21:02):
labels and I was like, I don't think I was ready at the time
potentially because I first of all, didn't know what that
meant. I was a little Hawaii girl.
Didn't know what that meant. I I was in these meetings with
like A&R, so I don't even know what ANR stands for.
And then ended up signing with Interscope Records and yeah, and

(21:25):
I was with them for like 4 years.
I didn't know that. Yeah, and never put anything
out. I was writing and writing and I
went to where did I go? Went to London and wrote with
people. LA, Nashville, all over.
Where is it going if it's not coming out?

(21:46):
Well, that's a good question. I mean, I don't know if I, I
don't know, that's it. I don't know.
I don't know if I ever felt likeanything was ready and the stuff
that was kind of being pushed tobe ready was maybe a little more
pop than I wanted. You weren't connecting with.
It and I wasn't connecting with it.
And so then my mom got sick and it was not great, but like, I

(22:13):
got dropped by Interscope. So that part was great, that I
could spend time with her and take care of her and all that
stuff because it was hard to kind of try and juggle that.
Yeah, yeah. I mean, it was definitely
heartbreaking. And she was devastated when I
got dropped. She was just like.
She need to make sure I was goodin that aspect.

(22:33):
So she was pretty disappointed and that was really hard to see
her disappointed, but it wasn't working there.
So it it you know, it was a blessing in disguise.
And the guy that signed me left the company and so I wasn't I
loved him. He was so amazing and it.
But now you don't know anyone. Yeah, now I was like, I met the

(22:54):
person who replaced him one timeand it wasn't the flow wasn't
there. So yeah, like I said, it was
devastating because I never knewI would get another chance like
that again. But also, I didn't really want
to be there in the 1st place, soblah, blah, blah.
Just grateful to be there. Don't take me wrong.
But sometimes, you know, life just makes things change for a

(23:16):
reason. And I was taking care of my mom
and, you know, not really focusing on music at all.
She would be like, please, please go to the studio.
Please, you know, and I'd just be.
Like so she was wanting to have you keep.
Yes, Oh, for sure. And I was like, I'm tired, you
know, it's, it's like, you know,it's, it's really tough thing to

(23:38):
take care of someone in that position.
And just to even see them like that is exhausting.
You know, it's so heartbreaking and the heartbreak, it hurts.
And then the world shut down. The Dang world shut down.
And I got my mom back to Maui because she was at the City of
Hope in LA for her treatment. She's like, I need to go home.

(24:02):
Like, I don't want to get stuck in LA.
We went home and finished her treatment and she, yeah,
obviously did not make it. And what was it?
She had lung cancer. Oh.
It was, yeah, like tumors and stuff.
She had a mass in her chest and then some of her lymph nodes
here. So when she was diagnosed it was

(24:23):
limited stage, which is great. Still scary 'cause lung cancer
is a very scary 1 to get. Awful.
Yeah, yeah. Super scary.
But we thought that she was in remission.
There was kind of a a mix up with her last scan they didn't
did. You let your guard down and
stuff a little bit. And no, we didn't really let our

(24:43):
guard down because she still hadmore stuff to do with treatment.
But we got so excited. It was like this amazing thing,
like, Oh my, are you kidding me?Like I can't.
I still remember that day. Just I've never been that more
relieved in my entire life. And they didn't realize that it

(25:06):
it, it was in her bones, in thatskin, but it was out of her
chest. So it was interesting.
But this? Wow.
The cancer is better. Yeah.
Her bones. OK.
And so Fast forward, she ended up on treatment again and the
treatment wasn't working. And there was this other
treatment coming in the mail andit just, it didn't get there in

(25:27):
time. And she just.
Yeah, I, I honestly didn't. I never, we never talked about
death. We never even considered it an
option because I wasn't going tolet that happen, you know?
And obviously you fear it in those moments, right?

(25:50):
But I was just like, you have tostay hopeful.
You do. Hope is like the most powerful
thing and so anytime anything would Robin like it's not an
option, not an option, not even going to go there.
And there's parts to me that's like, I wish that we would have
maybe planned a little bit so I would have known, you know, more

(26:11):
and maybe had her, you know, write me some letters, write my
kids letters or just taking morevideos or something.
You know, there's a part of me that wishes I did that.
And like, if anybody's going through it, like, I hope that
inspires them to do that, You know, regardless of what the
outcome is, you. Can keep the hope and still do

(26:32):
those things like that. Yeah, so.
How long was that process from when you found out she had
cancer? Can I?
Sorry. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
To when she passed away. So it's like I said, I'm not
very good with time. I she was sick.
I think it was like a year and some change.

(26:55):
Oh, wow. So really quick.
Yeah. Oh my gosh.
Wow. OK, well no wonder there wasn't
a chance to plan and. Yeah, I mean, it was so
confusing how fast it went. I can't even fathom that.
That's like a blink. So if you hadn't prepped for it,
like what was that like when shepassed?

(27:16):
Like, were you in denial? I don't know how deep you get on
these. As deep as.
Yeah, yeah. I mean, I it was to the point
where she took her last breath and I was trying to get her CPR.
That that's how in denial I was,that that was the reality of
that moment. Were there other people around
you? Yeah, it was actually like,
regardless of how traumatizing it was, it was a really

(27:37):
beautiful moment. And I mean, I can tell you the
story about butterfly if you want.
I would love to do that. So at this point, she was really
sick and needed a blood transfusion.
And we were on Maui. It was during COVID, and I
wasn't allowed in the hospital with her.
And we didn't really spend much time apart.

(27:58):
And so it was tough because blood transfusions take a long
time, and she needed 2. And so I dropped her off at the
hospital. And I was like, you know, like,
what do I do now? And my dad was like, let's,
let's go get some fresh air. And he was going to go look at
this piece of property up country, Maui.
We drove up there, and there wasa whole field of milkweed, which

(28:24):
is the plant that hosts the butterfly or the Caterpillar.
OK. Yeah, and throughout my life, we
raised butterflies. My mom would always bring
milkweed home and we'd watch them and it was like a sweet
little thing. And so when I saw the milkweed,
I'm like, great, something I canbring home.
She'll be so excited. And so she came home from the

(28:46):
hospital. We had the milkweed and we
watched it every day. The caterpillars are growing and
the 1st 2:00 turned into cocoonsand then they turned black.
It was really strange. And they never hatched.
I was like, that's really weird,I've never seen that before.

(29:06):
And then there were other littleeggs that were on there, so the
other caterpillars slowly were turning into cocoons and doing
their thing. And there was this one night
where she slept through the night and it was really out of

(29:28):
the ordinary because she's pretty anxious at this point and
not sleeping. And I was always, she always
told me that her mom would say, like, when you rest is when you
can heal. And so I was all stressed out,
you know, like you really need to sleep to get better, you
know, and she so much pain all night, horrible.

(29:49):
And so this one night, she finally fell asleep, thank
goodness I slept by her and wokeup the next morning.
She's still sleeping. Oh my gosh, she's still
sleeping. Like, this is amazing.
And I noticed she was like, kindof breathing a little funny.

(30:11):
And so I wheeled her bed out onto the front porch to get some
fresh air. She's still sleeping.
And I turn over and I see the first butterfly it hatched.
And I was like, Oh my gosh, are you kidding me?
Like the butterfly's here. And I got so excited and I pick
up the butterfly and I like, I'mtrying to tell her through her
sleep. And she had had good days and

(30:34):
bad days. And one day she kind of stopped
talking. It was really strange.
And. Temporarily.
Yeah, temporarily. She stopped talking and was
really, like, really lethargic. And at that moment, I got really
afraid of her passing away. I was like, oh, no, I like, kind

(30:57):
of panicked a little bit. And I was sitting there with
her, and I was just like, like, how am I going to know you're
going to visit me? You know, if you go, how am I
going to know it's you? And at the time this fluff flew
into the room, I was like, oh, that's funny.
Like, maybe she's going to be a dandelion.
You know, I was like, oh, maybe that's what it was.

(31:19):
So I didn't think much about it.And the next day she woke up and
was like, hey guys. And everything was fine.
And I'm like, oh, just a moment.It was so interesting.
The Fast forward to the butterfly hatching.
I what? Do you think?
Do you think like might sound weird, but do you think she
might have been somewhere else in that time and she was working

(31:41):
on something in the universe andmaybe she was the I mean, do you
ever, I don't know if you think about metaphysical stuff.
Oh. Well, so it comes back to the
fluff. I'll come back to the fluff.
So I pick up the butterfly and Ibring it to her and I'm like
kind of talking to her while she's sleeping with the
butterflies here, you know? And it flies off OK.

(32:02):
And then I wheel her back inside, 'cause she was getting
kind of hot in the sun. And my brother comes in, was
playing some songs next to her bed.
And a couple of my friends had come over and I had called her
nurse because of her breathing was a little, she's breathing
out of her mouth. And I had the oxygen in her
nose. And I was like, should I put it
in her mouth? Like, you know, this weird

(32:24):
rhythm. It was a weirder rhythm than I
had seen. She's like, oh, I'm on my way.
I'll come check it out when I get there.
And I call her again, I'm like, oh, you know, like, are you
almost here? Like asking about the oxygen.
And when I turned around to makethat call, she took her last
breath. And this was within 10 minutes

(32:45):
of the butterfly hatching. Oh my.
God, in that moment. And I was like, wow, like that
was her transitioning. I think.
So 1,000,000% and yeah, so so special and.
That's really beautiful. Yeah, it was so, so sweet.
And we actually, I know this might sound weird for the rest

(33:09):
of you, but. Not on this podcast.
The audience of this podcast. There's no weird, I promise.
We had her body overnight, whichsounds crazy to some people, but
Hospice came and they they, theygive a lavender bath and it's
this ritual. And since it was COVID, a lot of
people couldn't come and see herbecause she had lung cancer and

(33:32):
it was she was really susceptible.
And so, you know, some people would come and see her outside
or whatever. But a lot of people came and
said their goodbyes after she passed.
And everyone brought flowers andjust her entire body was covered
in flowers. It was the most beautiful thing.
And I suggest it to anybody. Like if you get the chance to do

(33:53):
that with your loved one when they pass, it is just, it was so
helpful for people in their grieving process.
And yeah, it was just, it was a really beautiful way.
I mean, it was heart broke heartbreaking, but it was really
beautiful. And so after that, the next
morning they came to get her andobviously really heartbreaking.

(34:17):
We flew all through all the flowers in the ocean and a bunch
of my friends came over and her friends and woke up the next
morning and the next butterfly had hatched and the butterfly
stayed with my brother and I forhours.
Yeah, I'll, I'll show you a picture when we're done.
But it was so beautiful and did.You feel her.

(34:42):
Oh, a million percent. I mean, the picture is crazy.
It's literally him and I standing there and the butterfly
just on my face. Come.
On yeah, it's come on. It's wild.
Million percent. That's her.
And I, I have a very fragile brain.
And I think that if I didn't have something like that, some

(35:03):
sort of sign that felt so tangible and real, I would have
had a really hard time grieving.And I already did have a really
hard time. But that that got me through.
I mean I was able to like. Taking care of you, she knew.
What you did? Yeah, exactly.
That's awesome. And I'm just so grateful for
that butterfly do. You still see him.

(35:25):
Oh, all the time, All the time. Yeah.
And do you feel her as well whenyou?
That's so cool. It's.
Really special, and sometimes it'll happen in moments where
I'm talking about her or if I'm talking about something where I
need a sign. Yeah.
And Even so, coming back to the fluff KK.
So on the milkweed plant there is a seed pod and when the seed

(35:48):
pod opens up there are these little fluffs and so it was one
of the milkweeds fluffs that flew in the room.
Oh, from. From the plant that hosts the
butterfly. You can't make that stuff.
Up. No, you can't.
It's crazy. Wow.
And and so even was it today, yesterday driving, I was talking

(36:14):
to Hadley, who's playing with meon this show, and she's also
tour managing and driving. She's an absolute amazing woman.
Wow. Yeah, Savage.
Yeah, OK. So amazing and she has perfect
pitch and she's so cool. So Hadley and I were kind of
talking about lost. She lost her grandma recently.

(36:36):
And I was like, yeah, you know, I, I was telling her how about
the signs? And I was like, you know, if I
didn't have these signs and I'd be kind of lost and.
What kind of comfort do they give you?
Is it like you're on the right path or you just feel safe?
What is? It it just depends.
It depends on whatever the situation was and I even I I'm

(36:58):
saying to her about this sign and how it's helped me, like no,
I'm on the right path or no whatever.
You know, in a freaking fluff onthe freeway flies in front of
our car. Wow dude, that's really going
on. Like all yours is butterflies
and fluff and your mom and stuff, but this stuff is

(37:19):
happening all the time and I think you're either open to it
and you're letting that help youguide you through life, or
you're not. And.
You're missing. You're making life a lot harder
on yourself. That's super cool.
And then I say to her, I'm like,that is crazy.
And she's like, yeah, that's crazy.
And I'm like, it just goes to show you really know what it's
aside. And another one goes by the

(37:41):
freeway on the freeway. Dude that's so cool.
It was amazing. I had one, my wife and I, we
have this thing with egrets, like the white egret bird.
Oh, yeah, they're all over Hawaii.
You know what I'm talking. About I have a thing with egrets
too. OK.
OK. So whenever her and I are in
that, like that flow, like that frequency, we're just one, you

(38:01):
know what I'm saying? We're our chemistry's right?
We're doing something fun. We see an egret, and I didn't
believe it at first. She would say, there it is
again. I'm like, OK, cool.
So we're in the backyard and she's like, OK, we're whatever.
Like this is we're going to testit.
And she goes send one. And this is ridiculous.
It's almost like funny to tell the story, but an egret flies

(38:25):
over us and I'm like, OK, cool, cool little party trick or
whatever, but not good enough. And so she's like, all right,
just give it a few minutes. The thing flies like 5 feet from
us and there's no, you saw our backyard.
There's no flight path for an egret.
It like dips down and I'm like, OK, so that's really happening.
So now when I see grits, it's like you're a butterfly.

(38:47):
I love that. I love that my dad lost the
first love of his life. He told me when he was a kid.
She passed away from cancer and at her funeral there were a
bunch of egrets. And so he always said, you know,
when I see an egret, I think of Ruby.
And so every time I see an egret, I think of Ruby.
And I didn't even know Ruby, butyeah.

(39:10):
What was the most beautiful partbesides that of that whole
process? I I should say, what good do you
think came from that your mom passing, participating in the
end? Yeah, the the record label
dropping and just that whole that's pretty intense that.
Whole it is intense, it's reallyintense and I mean there are
beautiful moments throughout it all and the most heartbreaking

(39:32):
moments without the dark, you can't really see the light.
Makes you appreciate things a lot more.
Definitely gave me a whole new perspective on life.
Did it? Yeah.
How did it? What did it shift just.
How bleeding it is and also how precious it is and how the

(39:53):
things that we get so worked up on mean nothing, you know?
And I have this song that I wrote recently and it I think
it's going to be the title trackof my album.
It's called Lucky to Be. And it's just all about the

(40:14):
good, the bad, the ugly. Everything that we go through,
we're just lucky to be experiencing it.
The chances of us are being bornare one in 400 trillion.
Wow, isn't that crazy? I didn't know that.
One in 400 trillion. Really feel like you're here for
a reason, right? Yeah.
I mean, you're either here for Yeah, here for a reason, but
that it's short. It's really short.

(40:37):
What do you think about it? Yeah.
Do you? Are you religious at all?
I'm not, but I'm really open to things.
You know, like I, I didn't grow up religious.
My mom was Jewish, but not a practicing Jew.
And my dad, I think grew up Catholic, but he, neither of
them practiced anything. They always were like, be kind,

(41:01):
you know, our, our, our relig, our religion was the golden
rule. Do unto others as you wish
others to do unto you. That's always what my mom would
say. And I mean, we would celebrate
Hanukkah and Christmas and stufflike that.
You know, we still had aspects of it in our life, but nothing
was a strong, even though our family, our families had
stronger ties in it. But I'm open to everything.

(41:29):
That's cool. But I guess I'm not seeking
anything. Does that make sense?
You're just in the moment. I'm, yeah, I, I've, I've said
for the last few years I'm just taking things a minute at a time
or a second at a time, you know,1 foot in front of the other.
That's cool. Yeah, it's hard.

(41:50):
I mean, I, I got really depressed after my mom died.
Yeah, super, super depressed. And I already struggled with
anxiety pretty bad before that so it just kind of like took
over me. Anxiety and depression.
Yeah, yeah. And kind of got to a pretty dark

(42:11):
place. And I mean, just getting up to
do my laundry was like a chore and.
So just catatonic. Yeah, and the relationship I was
in, they didn't understand that and had never felt that before
at the time. And so they didn't have the
understanding and patience I needed since done the work and

(42:37):
totally are incredible. But yeah, it was it was really
rare. How long did it go on for?
I still struggle with it. Do you?
Yeah. It comes and goes.
There's moments like back in during the holidays, I got
really sad. And, you know, sometimes it
lasts a while, sometimes it's just a few days, sometimes it's

(42:58):
a few hours. You know, it really just
depends. What does that feel like for
you? Is it like that?
That heavy kind of wet blanket? The heart?
You feel like gravity's heavier.Your thoughts are not good.
Yeah, yeah, the wet blanket is perfect.
I always say like a weighted blanket, like you're carrying
around a weighted. Blanket feels like that.
And just like lifting your, it'sjust like, it's so weird.

(43:20):
It hurts, but in such a dull way.
It's hard too 'cause, you know, like, alright, I should
exercise, I should move. You can't.
No, you can't. It's impossible.
Your legs like 80 lbs, just one foot on the ground.
Just, you know, and. Then you got the.
Thoughts like I do Yeah, I do. It's really annoying.

(43:41):
It's, yeah, it doesn't, Yeah, no, it's, it's not fun.
And I get, there's been times it's so bad that I can't get out
of bed. And that's, I never had that
till like, my adult life. That's a very bizarre thing,
'cause there's like a really sick comfort in it in a way.
I don't know how to describe it.Like it's, you can, yeah, you

(44:01):
can put on music and really go into it.
Like if you're, you know, I don't, I don't know what I'm
saying, but. No, I get it.
I mean, I have gotten to a pointwhere I I try and control it.
It's hard to like, even just like last week I was feeling
like it might be coming on. Oh my gosh.
Like, what can I do that can bring me out of it?
And I shield myself from it a lot.

(44:23):
Like, I won't watch sad movies because I don't want it to
trigger it. I've, I feel things really
deeply when I see them. I guess it'll affect me for a
while if I see a sad movie, you know, I'll get down in the
dumps. What has been my saving grace?
Like think it saved my life? His horses.
That's awesome. Yeah, so, I mean, there was a

(44:47):
moment where I had to go to this, a wedding in Jackson Hole.
I mean, it sounds so amazing, right To me.
That day. I would have rather gouged my
eyes out than get on that plane and get out of bed.
I was like, I can't do it. I can't go.
I can't go. My boyfriend was like, you got

(45:10):
to do it. Like it'll be fine.
It's so beautiful there, the fresh air, like it's going to be
great. I can't.
I'm so sorry. Dragged me out of bed.
We went and his family was like,oh, do you want to do anything
on the day off? We can go fly fishing, you know,
maybe we'll go bike riding. And I'm just still like, OK,

(45:31):
like, oh God, buckle up, My you got this.
And I was like, well, what if wego try and find a trail ride
riding at that point, you know, I wasn't going to the ranch
anymore. I, it was more like when I had
time off or when I'd go on vacation, you know, I'd got to

(45:52):
go riding. And I was like, you know, this
feels kind of like a vacation moment.
Would you guys want to go on trail ride?
And so we found this place, Heart 6 Ranch.
It's outside of Jackson and I. We were riding and you know, his
family doesn't want to go fast or anything, but it was the most
beautiful view. It was so, so pretty.

(46:15):
And actually during that trip there were like thousands of
dandelions everywhere. So there is fluff in the air
just like it looked like it was snowing fluff.
So we're on the ride and I'm talking to the guide and I'm
trying and she could tell I wanted to pick it up a little
bit. So when we got back to the barn,
she, she told the other instructors that I dropped my

(46:39):
phone and that we had to go and get it.
OK. And so her and I, she took me
through the forest and we just flew and it lit me up so
heavily. Oh, pull.
Exactly. That's so.
Cool. It sparked joy for the first
time in years. I mean, it was for the first

(47:02):
time probably since my mom beingdiagnosed.
And you know, you can laugh through things, you can have a
good time, you can still like experience joy and stuff, but
there's always that like loomingthing happening.
And until you really spark it, it's so hard to get out of it.

(47:23):
You know, there's something to that.
And I'm, you know, kind of working on some sort of equine
therapy project at the at the moment, which is still in like
the beginning works, but. Like a possible horse related
antidepressant therapy for otherpeople to try as well.
Yeah, dude, that's awesome. Yeah.
Wow. It's I mean what?

(47:44):
Are you gonna do with it? I mean, yeah.
But I mean, I don't quite know yet.
I mean, my, my goal right now, Imean, I'd love to eventually
have a ranch where I, I have people come and I host something
like that. But obviously I tour a lot, I
don't have time for that or a ranch so can't do that.

(48:04):
But I'm trying to think of a waywhere I can partner with a bunch
of equine therapy places starting out in the US where I
schedule maybe a monthly trail ride for people who are
struggling and I make it super easy for them to sign up and
free for them. And so it just cause getting

(48:29):
yourself the help like that is really hard, you know,
especially when you're down and,you know, and it's not a trail
ride because they're not ready. Like they can just go and be
with the horses or have like a, you know, there's all sorts of
forms of equine therapy. But it's a real thing.
And it's, it's so cool. And I just want to share that
with people because of how incredible it was for me.

(48:50):
Yeah. Barking that joy, popping that
bubble like it's, it's a thing. My brother, I don't know if he
would admit it, but he struggleda lot after my mom passed as
well and he went to Baldface. Have you heard of Baldface?
It's a mountain in I think Canada.

(49:11):
And he went powder snowboarding and he hadn't been in years,
like I think 710 years he hadn'tbeen snowboarding.
But he's really good on boards. And same thing happened with
him. I mean, I hadn't seen him smile
like that in so long. It sparked it for him again.

(49:32):
And now he like, wants to go do this all the time.
He's like seeking. He's like, how, how can I do
this every year? I need to do this every year.
And he came home from that trip.He stopped in San Diego to visit
me. I I just couldn't believe it.
The smile on his face. And he was just watching videos
over and over again. And the videos of him, I'll have

(49:53):
to show you these. They're so funny.
He's going down the mountain screaming.
Oh, my gosh. And it's, it's emotional and
it's so sweet and it's so genuine.
And he'd be crying at the end ofthe run.
Just like, I can't believe that was real.
That was the best thing ever. That's so cool.

(50:14):
And so, yeah, there's really something to it.
And I got where like, I wish that I was like a doctor or
something where I could like study that and figure it out
because it's, it's real. Like you got to go on intuition,
you know, there's some things that can't be studied, you can't
solve. Them, but you can just.
Feel it. That's true.
Do. You use your intuition at all.

(50:35):
Yeah, I do. How do you use?
I think so. I don't know, like that doesn't
feel right. Yeah.
You get the, you get the squeezethere when you didn't.
Yeah. Doesn't feel right.
I probably should. Do that.
That's like a a sense we're supposed to be using.
Yeah, I think we're not trained on it in Western society, but we
all have that and there's a purpose for it, you know?

(50:58):
I wonder, I mean, I've never thought about this, but I wonder
if, you know, all the things that we're doing, our phones,
the constant, you know, entertainment that our short
attention span. Like, I wonder if that kind of
dims the light of our intuition.We can't quite feel it because
we don't know what is bringing us these emotions.
Isn't that sad video I just watched?

(51:19):
Is it? You know, am I all pepped up
because I watched a funny video?You know, it's like all these.
Different mean from the Yeah, for sure.
It's definitely a distraction. I mean, if you're constantly
consuming other people's content, you can't align with
yourself to know like what you can create or what you want to
consume. Even so, I I think so.
I think, I don't think there's much good coming from endless

(51:40):
scrolling, you know? Yeah, no, just.
Spiritual junk food? In a way, yeah.
I mean, I have moments where I'mon my phone all the time and
then moments where I haven't looked at my phone all day and
I'm like, oh, sorry, I'm going to get fired, but I just can't.
I can't let it rule me. I really can't.
And I especially when I'm like stressed or having a hard time,

(52:02):
I just have to put that away andI have to put on the turn on the
button that is like we're floating on a rock.
Just. Let it be for a minute.
Nothing, nothing bad's going to happen.
Just go have some fresh air and lay in the sun and get your face
wet. Any story you want to tell?
Anything you want to share whileyou're here?

(52:23):
Personal stories. And I've I've talked your ear
off him. So I went around about.
No, no, no, that's exactly what this is for.
Yeah. Oh, yeah.
Now this is a personal. I did one earlier today.
And so I'm I'm in the position you are where pull it on the
juices. Like, wait, what was I saying?
But yeah, no, this is, this is ashow to, you know, for people to
express themselves. Yeah, we didn't talk about you

(52:45):
at all. You have questions?
Well, I mean, shit, I think I'm prepared.
OK, so I know where you're from.This is hilarious.
I'm the interviewer now. Yeah, hey, no, I'm, I'm good
with it. This will be the first on this
podcast. I mean, what triggered you
having issues with depression doyou know?
I don't know I had I got thrown out of every school I was ever

(53:08):
in. I was constantly in trouble,
constantly told I was bad, I wasshitty, you know evil like just
I had I could not control myselflike severe ADDI think a lot of
like. I hate even saying that 'cause
that term is so thrown around that people can use it to like
get an Adderall script or like they say it as a joke, but

(53:31):
whatever that is, that set of symptoms, I have a very extreme
version to this day. It greatly affects my life.
So what it looked like as a kid is almost 0 ability to say no to
myself, including the thoughts that turn into words or actions.
Like I'd be in class and I have a cup and I'm like, I wonder
what would happen if a cup goes through that window and the

(53:51):
cup's through the window. Middle of class stuff like that
burnt down my school bathroom. And so I absorbed full time
negativity like my whole growingup.
And I think that that took a toll.
And so the first time I felt that I was like 16 and I just
felt this heavy feeling, you know, where your feels like your

(54:12):
heart's heavy and your stomach'sheavy and there's no motivation
and your, your thoughts aren't working right and you don't want
to get up. I, I was like, what is this?
And there was this song on. I'll never forget the song.
It was Sarah McLachlan, 80I do believe I fit.
Yeah. And I just was like, really
deeply connecting with that. But it didn't feel good.

(54:32):
And this is my first little glimpse of depression.
And since then, yeah, it kind ofcomes in waves.
It can be triggered, but it's. I haven't.
Like, the weirdest thing is whenit hits, I know what to do.
OK, let's do exercise. Let's do a cold plunge.
Get out, get in the sun. But two things are going on.

(54:54):
One, it's so like I said, there's a sick comfort in it, so
I don't really want it to go away, as odd as that is.
And then two, I can't push through that heavy blanket.
So I just kind of like wait until, I mean, it can go on for
days or like a couple weeks or whatever.
And yeah, but luckily certain things like trigger it, like if

(55:18):
there's a lot of stress at work or if I'm not getting behind on
sleep, I know, hey, I'm super susceptible.
So I haven't thought about limiting my media, like keeping
sad stuff away or keeping down movies away, which makes perfect
sense, especially when you know you're on the edge.
But yeah, I haven't. I I know people that have never
been depressed and they're just,I, I talked to him too.

(55:42):
Like how were you born like this?
I just, there's a, my favorite coffee shop, the owner
consistent personality all the time.
I am not a consistent personality.
I can't believe I can do this because I, I never know like
what mood I'm gonna be in day-to-day.
But this guy is just level. And I asked him like, do you try
to be that positive? Are you trying to be and he

(56:03):
goes, Nah, man, I was just Born This Way.
No bad days. And I'm like, so it is like I
there really is. And so like that it gives me
empathy and compassion for otherpeople that I would think like,
dude, pull in whatever situationyou can do better.
It's like you don't know that you don't know their brain just

(56:24):
like that endlessly happy dude telling me to just snap out of
it. You don't know what you're
talking about, you know, And so kind of what you were like
alluding to earlier, going through hard times, you have to
experience the dark to see the light.
And I think to truly like, love and appreciate and have
compassion for people, you have to suffer like you do.

(56:46):
And it removes any ability when you have a weakness in yourself
that is hurting you and halting your life, it kind of removes
the ability to judge other people in a way.
And so there's a lot of beauty in that's.
So true. That's my depression, right?
I know it's wild that to know that people live without it.

(57:08):
I mean, I obviously experienced it heavily after my mom, but I
had I had little moments of it. I think when I was struggling at
school. And then the first time I really
felt it, I was traveling in California, him to visit, I
think my aunt or something. And I saw someone begging for
food. And I, it affected me so heavily

(57:32):
to the point where I was like, Idon't think I can live on a
planet like this. Like, it made me sick, like,
sick thing. I just felt so bad for this
person. And I was like, how can I live
on knowing that that is all overhere, you know?
Yeah, my boyfriend still says that he's never never been

(57:52):
depressed, never really experienced anxiety.
Well, good for you. You picked the right.
Well, I'm like we kind of balance each other out, you
know, because if I, I don't know, I don't know what we would
do. We both were.
Yeah, spin it out. Ride it out I guess My wife's
I'm impulsive with my actions, words, thoughts, emotions.

(58:13):
So up and down. My wife's just cool, like calm
Danish and. Cucumber.
Yeah, you gotta, you gotta pick the opposite.
When's your album coming out? I don't know, it's in the works.
I'm like in the works, OK, Some of it is starting to come out,
like the new one just dropped a couple days ago and yeah, it's

(58:33):
coming. What's your favorite song of
yours? They all stem from such
different emotions. Oh.
Wow, it's hard to think about itthat way.
I mean, I think from a a standpoint of message, I like to
share the message of Daydream because I caught, I got kind of

(58:55):
addicted to what that song can do to somebody.
Explain that a little bit. Sounds crazy saying addicted.
I get messages daily about how that song has affected people.
That's so cool. And it is so cool.
It's so beyond me as an artist, you know?

(59:15):
It's more important than me, youknow what I mean?
Like that message of that song and like this, I tell this story
sometimes this one guy because it really affected me hearing
how it affected him. He heard my song I think maybe
saw the audition I'm not sure. Called his realtor when he

(59:36):
finished watching it, put his house up for sale and now owns a
boat and was went sailing like living in his boat.
That's incredible. He went for it.
I totally botched that story, but yeah, yeah, he went for it
and it was that song that made him do that.

(59:56):
And I'm like, wow, this song is so powerful.
Ineffable in that song, and especially when you hit like the
out of money and power. It's like, Oh, I'm not waiting
for that. It I I love that song and it's
your one of your most popular so.
A lot of people do so. Isn't that cool to produce a
piece of art that impacts someone?

(01:00:18):
Specifically music like that? I've said it on the show before,
but it blows my mind that somebody can use their body as
an instrument and produce a sound, record it, and when it
hits someone else's brain anywhere, it produces chemicals
like it. Serotonin and oxytocin,
sometimes even dopamine. What a gift.
Like what a gift. I'm glad you developed it 'cause

(01:00:38):
it takes work. You can have the gift, but you
better put the work into. It's therapy to me, writing the
songs, you know, when I write itfor myself.
And I sometimes have, you know, in my ear, like, oh, like, I
want the listener to feel heard or seen, you know?

(01:01:00):
No, I don't. That's deep.
And, you know, obviously I can make it a million percent about
myself, and sometimes people still connect with it on their
thing. But yeah, overall, like the fact
that it's connected with people,like, that's just crazy to me.
What else was I going to say? There's something else with
that. Butterfly.

(01:01:26):
Oh, butterfly too, yeah. Is that hard to sing like it is?
OK, it's got to be. I can't believe you did that on
that audition. That's crazy.
I did not make it through the song.
Well, they played a montage behind me and I had in ear
monitors in and I had just written the song and tested out

(01:01:48):
like multiple different keys of the song.
So it was like all jumbled up myhead.
So they have this montage and they're telling the story about
it and I'm hearing it and all ofa sudden it goes and I start
singing. And so I had to hear the whole
story about why I wrote it. And so the Band-Aid had just
ripped off and I start crying. And so I'm trying to sing the

(01:02:13):
song while cry while while crying while trying not to cry
in front of 37 million people onlive television.
It was crazy. How?
OK, so when we watch that, it's like 2 or 3 to 5 minutes, right?
How long were you on stage? Like what is that?
Well. Not, no, Not long.
Because it's live. It's all live.

(01:02:34):
Oh, it is. Yeah.
OK. So they're not messing around
with it. That's live.
That's live. So I'm sitting there and it
plays the montage and all of a sudden it cues me to start and
I'm like, I start crying. I'm like, Oh my gosh.
Then I start. I have to try and sing it.
The frog. You know, like when you get a
lump in your throat you crushed about trying to hit the Oh no, I

(01:02:56):
didn't. I completely bombed.
I barely hit the right note the entire song.
And then I after that I was like, Oh my gosh.
But then you know what? I woke up the next day and I was
like, I'm fine. I don't care that I just messed
up. Who cares?
I'll survive. That was a good test in life,
you know, like you can survive. Oh, I was thinking about the

(01:03:19):
Golden Buzzer. Audition.
Oh, no, the golden buzzer. Yeah.
So I'm like, no, I'm just sayingbutterfly.
OK, yes, yes, yes, OK 'cause. They're telling you know the.
Golden butter is Daydream, so this is the butterfly.
Audition. Yeah.
Boy, that's. An I survived that is that
story, yeah, no so bad so but. Whatever kind of mean a.

(01:03:41):
We all have bad moments, but noteven bad.
It's just human. We're all human.
Did it mess with your confidenceat all or did you just take it
all this gangster? And at first I was like, oh God,
I ruined my chances of singing again, but I didn't want to win.
What did you want? Just to sing another song.

(01:04:02):
It was fun to sing. What do you want to do with
your? Career.
I guess I'm already doing it. I am obsessed with every part of
what I do. I love writing, I love
recording. I love performing and connecting
with people. The only part I don't like is

(01:04:22):
the business side. I'm not very business savvy.
So when it comes to like contracts and things like that,
I'm like, look, you can handle that.
But yeah, everything else I'm just, I'm so in love with it and
I, I need it. I need it.
I mean, each song I write is it helps me through something.
And I just feel so lucky every day that I have, I have that as

(01:04:46):
an outlet too. I like, I don't know if you
journal or anything, but being able to write about what you're
going through, good stuff, bad stuff, like it's just so.
Healing. Yeah, I've been kind of feeling
the nudge to do that. I use music like I have.
I love music like I love consuming it.
I'm not, I'm not great at it, but it that's how I process my

(01:05:07):
emotion. Like I'll, I'll go drive and
I'll put certain songs on or I'll put shuffle on or songs
that I know like make me feel happy or songs that I know help
me process that emotion. I'll cry like I'll get pumped
up, roll the windows down. And so that's kind of my
therapy. But writing's cool too it.
Is cool. Just getting something out of
your brain and off your chest isimportant.

(01:05:30):
If no one reads it, that's fine too.
And even if no one ever heard mymusic, that'd be fine too.
You know, just being able to express it and get it out is
like what, You know, you got to get that stuff out.
You do. Let it you can.
No it makes you sick for sure. You got it.
We all have to get our get our emotions out.
I, I made this little like website where people can go and

(01:05:55):
write a postcard to heaven and so that they can go and like
write to people and just get it out and have somewhere to send
it and let it go. That's cool because I I felt
like that was really helpful forme and like the.
What's the What's the website? It's just, it might be attached
to my website, but like, yeah, probably on lilynola.com.

(01:06:17):
I don't know, cool. But it's I didn't.
I didn't create it myself. Yeah, I didn't create the
website myself. Someone made it for me.
But yeah, that's the you get. You just go and you you write it
out. Cool, this was fun, thank.
You. Thank you.
Sorry, I keep talking. No, that's, that's what, that's

(01:06:39):
what this is. So it's fun.
It just kind of goes wherever itgoes.
Yeah, I had a thought. You wanna go horseback riding
tomorrow? Let's do it.
Yeah, I do. I do.
You never know, it could be yournew your new thing.
And we were gonna podcast tomorrow, so I'm free.
Oh, you were. Oh, oh, true.
True, I'm free. OK, well, let me see if this

(01:07:00):
place can take us, OK? Cool, we're going to end it on
that note. I love.
It.