Food Network’s Winner Of Chopped - Chef Zakari Davila - Walk-In Talk Podcast

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:08):
Hello Food Fam.
This is the Walk Talk Podcastwhere you will find the perfect
blend of food fun and cookingknowledge.
I'm your host, carl Fiorini.
Welcome to the number one foodpodcast in the country.
We're recording on site at IbisImages Studios, where food
photography comes alive and Iget to eat it.
There's a lot to get to today.
First things first.
If you missed the last episodewith food networks spring baking

(00:32):
championship finalist pastrychef nicky boyd, go back and
listen, you won't bedisappointed.
Um, I've got to tell you, thiswhole podcasting thing is a
labor of love.
I slept 0.0% this week and Istill couldn't wait to jump into
this production.
Okay, so the reason is I was ata three-day tornado tour out in

(00:53):
Kansas and Oklahoma.
We visited our friends atCattleman's Choice Feedyard and
Creekstone Farms ProcessingFacility Pictures coming soon.
Our group consisted of our crewover at the peninsula food
service, that would be milan andveronica, plus the culinary
team at oxford commons, ahospitality company with an
amazing portfolio of restaurantshere in tampa.
Man, they're great.

(01:14):
Check out oxcommonscom.
A massive thank you to the teamover at creek stone jim rogers,
our main man, sully, and johnand elzmo.
You guys put on a terrific tourand are a wonderful host.
Giant.
Thanks to Dale Moore, owner ofCattlemen's Choice Feedlot.
It's refreshing to meet peoplewho actually treat animals with
respect that they deserve.

(01:35):
Chefs Richard Anderson, billyZico, alex Hoax and the Myers
boys, joe and Lewis unrelatedthese culinary professionals are
amazing people and it was anhonor to spend this unique and
special moment in time with them.
Also part of this esteemedgroup of chefs is Rachel Bennett
, who will have to make it onthe next trip.

(01:55):
Okay, so today's guest Can throwdown in the kitchen.
He's a French CulinaryInstitute grad who made his
bones on the New York food scene, ie Tom Colicchio's, river Park
and Tao Group's Cathedral.
Zachary is now home in Tampa asthe executive chef of Catering
by the Family, which is ifyou're from the Tampa Bay area.

(02:17):
You have heard of this company.
They're a terrific outfit.
Just a great, great story.
We'll get into that one day.
He's also the most recentwinner of Food Network's Chopped
Chef.
Sakari is on deck Jefferson.
I haven't seen you or John in along time.
It seems like a long time right.
Yeah Well, since IndependenceDay, like we were off, it's the

(02:38):
first time we've taken off in.
I don't know, it feels like ayear.

Speaker 2 (02:41):
It has been.

Speaker 1 (02:41):
Yeah, I am so geeked up on the food today, baby, so
why don't you just jump intopre-shift and let's go?

Speaker 2 (02:47):
Well, I mean, we have conversations and what we're
going to do as far as the foodcontent and what you're going to
eat, and I switched parameters.
I went to John and said what'syour favorite food?
And one of them happens to befranchise.
Well, it happened to.

(03:09):
We got started by it.
But he said in a different way,where it was like the next week
.
And he, I was said, give me alist.
It was Ropa Vieja, thefranchise and two other things.
I'm like okay, we're going todo franchise.
So I don't like doing thingsnormal, as you know.
So I was thinking about whatwe're going to do and I said,
hey, you got some shrimp, that'sgolf shrimp, let's do something
with this.
And I made raviolis with it.
I used uzu marmalade inside it,I did spinach, asparagus,
blanched all that down, put itall together, had the binding of

(03:31):
the shrimp because the way thatyou, if you chop shrimp the
right way, you can actually bindtogether itself, you don't have
to add egg to it Semolina dough, stretched that out and then
made a frangie sauce.
And then I took the shrimpshells because I don't like
wasting anything, and I made ashrimp stock, brought that down
into a shrimp risk and then ithit it with some sherry to give

(03:52):
it some complexity to it.
And then I wanted to treat youguys to something different.
That's why I didn't want to letthe cat out of the bag, but a
plant-based yodo meat that, uh,did sourdough, sourdough pita,
and I wanted to go all out.
So tzatziki was vegan, thecheese was vegan, the bread was
vegan, everything on that platewas vegan, and I just wanted to
have a good experience.

Speaker 1 (04:12):
The only thing that wasn't vegan is you.
That's me, right.
So, real quick, you did reallygood.
On the franchise, thank you.
You know it was actuallyreminiscent.
It reminded me of my dad's, sothat was really cool.
So we were talking off air andmy dad passed last year, right,
so I didn't touch any of thestuff until, you know, just

(04:35):
about a week ago.
So I'm going through all theboxes and things and I found
recipes from my grandmother tomy dad, like just really cool
stuff, and I'm so happy you didthat.
So what we're going to do andbecause I think it was so close
and I did find the franchiserecipe, oh, john just actually
spoke for a minute.

Speaker 2 (04:55):
He was breathing hard .
His mic is actually on, hedidn't shut it down.

Speaker 1 (05:01):
So it's not like you know how he did for you and you
made like a cup and put you knowright, it's, it's actually
written out.
So I want to compare and see wecan do that off air.
It's a, that's a whole nother.
So what's?

Speaker 2 (05:13):
funny is that recipe was actually from my mentor,
Teddy Andreosi and Teddy Falco.
It was an uncle and nephew thatworked at Casa Bella, past the
nosh that's where I learned andactually Dan, who is a chef over
at Shenanigans.
It was so similar when I workedover with Pat Utter in what is
now closed, the West Hollywood,or, yeah, the West Hollywood one
by the TY Park.

(05:34):
Dan used to work for Martha'sso I kind of emulated both the
three of their recipes and justit's something I love to do,
it's just one of those thingsthat's for me, it's something I
grew up with, it's um, you know,when you get sick, it's one of
those comfort foods for me.

Speaker 1 (05:50):
And that's what I wanted.
That, for me, is one of thosethings I can eat, whenever it's
made.

Speaker 2 (05:54):
Marcella salt and bucco.

Speaker 1 (05:55):
I mean all of those are all good, but the franchise
for me is a little bit more youknow, random you know and be at
1130 at night.
Hey, I'm going to make good.

Speaker 3 (06:09):
Okay, pops no problem .

Speaker 1 (06:11):
Yeah, and you know that spice.
That's the sauce that you didthere.
Which one With the scotchbonnet?

Speaker 2 (06:21):
Oh, the foie gras.

Speaker 1 (06:22):
Yeah yeah, the foie gras toculo Right.
Yeah yeah, the foie gras deculo Right yeah.

Speaker 2 (06:25):
Yeah, for you?

Speaker 1 (06:26):
Yeah, it's a good sauce, so let's bottle it Okay.

Speaker 2 (06:31):
What do you say?
I'm down Seriously.
I mean there's, there's noother sauce that's out there.
That's like that and I wantedto have consistency.

(06:57):
So that's when they go to amash and I know that when.
I talked to Steve.
They did that, but it'ssomething I definitely want to
do.
Yeah, it's one of my favoriteones.

Speaker 1 (07:04):
Well, you know, walk Talk Media is slowly getting to
a place where we're going tostart, you know, getting into
some branding and somebehind-the-scenes sort of deals
on food products, and it's veryexciting what's going on.

Speaker 2 (07:19):
Well, the jacket is one of my favorite ones.
It's going to be one of theswags we're going to put out.

Speaker 1 (07:25):
Yeah, don't drop any names.
I'm not dropping any names.
We're putting a portfoliotogether as we speak and we're
going to be going very soon onthat.

Speaker 2 (07:34):
I do want to say one thing that, Grouper Reuben, when
I mentioned it today, thatlittle kid smirk you had I've
never seen you smirk like thatthat generally made me happy.

Speaker 1 (07:46):
No, you smirk like that.
That generally made me happy.
No, I'm telling you, itdefinitely did like no, because,
listen, I can appreciate allsorts of different food, all
types of food.
You know, even if it's notsomething I'm gonna, if it's not
my go-to dish or whatever, orprofile or whatever, I'm gonna
still enjoy it.
I'll find something and I'll belike you know what that was
good about it?
That grouper sandwich, that'sjust like one giant checkbox.
You know, and it's one big checkbecause you know what it was

(08:07):
it's fresh, it was not heavy, ithad all sorts of layers in it
on you know, on on the profile,and damn it, I'll eat that every
day, like I literally eat thatevery single day I'd like I told
you I'm gonna make the ryesourdough and now I'm gonna do
it again.
By the way, speaking of eatingevery day, this, this, this trip
, right it was.
It was from monday, mondaymorning, early, super early, but

(08:30):
crack it on early all the wayto.
You know, two in the morningwhen I got home, you know, last
morning went wednesday, yeah,today, last night, right morning
, whatever.
And man, I gotta tell you Iwent there at 2 14, I'm 220, it
hasn't.
I came home at 220.
I know my wife's not listeningso I can tell you.
But my goodness, but it wasnothing but like dude.

Speaker 2 (08:52):
Six pounds.

Speaker 1 (08:53):
Let me tell you something, yes Of all, like
prime meat?

Speaker 2 (08:58):
You know, I smelled.
I thought it was the lamb thatsmelled.
It's actually you sweating.
You have meat sweats.
It's my new cologne.

Speaker 1 (09:04):
It's awesome.
No, listen, it was nothing butbourbon and beautiful meat.
Oh my God, it was so amazing.
The farm tour was fantastic,like just that whole processing
facility by Creekstone amazing.
Equally as cool was the feedlot, like the ranch which I had
never been to, one of those.
I grew up in South Florida.

(09:24):
Lot like the ranch which I'dnever been to one of those.
You know, we, I grew up inSouth Florida.
Behind me was land you know,similar to where you know we
were in Oklahoma, like it's justthere's open land, acres over
acres over acres and cattle onit, but I never been to it.
You know that wasn't myproperty and, granted, we used
to sneak in there, but I nevergot to see anything.
Long story short, what a great,what a great experience.

(09:45):
I'd like to put a trip togetherfor our team here, walk and talk
and and make it happen.
I think that we were notfighting you.
No, I don't think you would.
No, and I already, kind of like, seeded this, dropped it.
You have to, of course, come on, you know I get down all right,
right enough about that.
We're going to make that happen.
Let's talk, I'm availabletomorrow no I.

Speaker 3 (10:08):
You're not, I'm not, I can't.

Speaker 1 (10:11):
I shouldn't take any blood work right now.
No no, no, they would ban mefrom coming to the show.
Doctors say no more, walk andtalk.
I said okay, let's talk.
Food Network what do you say?

Speaker 2 (10:23):
I think so the guy that, down to my left,
definitely would probably wantto talk about it.
Right, all right, let's, let's.
Isn't that why he's here?

Speaker 1 (10:31):
exactly one of the reasons.
Chef, welcome to the program.
Thank you for having me.
No man, our pleasure.
You know I've been.
I've been telling people aboutthis episode.
You know friends and you knowacquaintances without the people
know acquaintances and whatnotthe people we talk to.
Strangers Like, hey, by the way,you have an interesting
personality, man.
I know you're about 30 or so,31, 32.
, 32.
, 32.

(10:52):
And man, you're just like oneball of energy and a big smile,
and I think when it comes to theindustry, it's needed Because
you still have to command, youstill have to lead your team,
you still have to, you know allthe, you know procurement, the
whole nine yards, and thenexecute what you're, what you're
trying to do.
But you've got such a greatpersonality.

(11:12):
So, first of all, thank you forthat Cause.
You're a good dude.
Yeah, thank you.
Why don't you, why don't youtake, take a minute and give the
airplane view of who you areand where you came from and how
you landed here?

Speaker 3 (11:29):
You know, not born in Tampa, born in Seattle, mainly
raised in Tampa Bay, family'sdeep-rooted in Ybor City 20
years old decided I wanted tocook professionally, so sat down
with my dad.
We went to a bar at 20.
I was getting ready to kind ofsell insurance it's what the
family business was and I'm likeman, I want to be a chef.

(11:53):
I want to do this.
You know not most people pickthis thing to do for the rest of
their life and I'll neverforget it.
We go to Four Greenfields, wesit there and I'm like, hey,
let's take a shot.
Like I got to tell yousomething.
So right, when we go to take ashot, right before he takes it,
I go, I want to be a chef.
And he just slams a glass onthe counter and he looks at me.
He goes all right, well, you'regoing to have to go to New York

(12:15):
.
And I'm like I.
So, 20 years old, culture shock.
Go to new york, start myjourney.
I'm in culinary school nightprogram three days a week and
then start working under tomglickio at um river park.
So, seven days a week, I'm inthe kitchen all the time and

(12:37):
exposed to this city of, likeyou know, coming from tampa bay
to new york is debaucherous.

Speaker 1 (12:44):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (12:49):
The first thing I said when I came with planes
like wow, there's a lot of trashhere.
Nothing has changed.
Yeah, from there you know, justkind of immerse myself in
cooking and the whole journeythere.
It was an experience.

Speaker 1 (13:03):
something that I think I strongly advise to
anybody that kind of goes inthis industry is go out of the
box, go somewhere well, just thetwo, just the two outfits that
you, you know, that youmentioned to us is that's,
that's a, that's, that's a bigdeal, you know?
Yeah, glickios and thecathedral, cathedral, yeah, tal

(13:23):
group.

Speaker 3 (13:23):
I was with la pacora bianca for a while, so you know,
did my rounds, you know, andit's just the city in general.
Just you see the grind and thehustle and then the culinary,
it's just perfection, likethere's no ifs, ands or buts and
kind of came up in the worldbefore hr was a thing.
So there were those chefs werenot easy on you, jeff.

Speaker 1 (13:45):
How, how lucky are we .
There was no cell phones,nothing like.
There's no proof, all it is isrumors that's it.

Speaker 2 (13:52):
Yeah, the 90s never happened, never.
Because there's no, there's no,there's no evidence, no picture
evidence of it.
Let's put it that way.

Speaker 1 (14:00):
I mean, I feel terrible for some of the things
you know, that we used to do.
So you know, I'm from thebusiness too, but not at the
level of anybody here, and I wasalways front of the house.
But my favorite, my funnest, Ishould say job in a restaurant
was at Bennigan's.
Okay, and this was likemid-'90s Bennigan's and it was

(14:24):
just crazy Because I don't know,yeah, you're working it, and
this was like mid-90s Benniganand it was just crazy Because,
yeah, you're working.

Speaker 2 (14:29):
It happened.

Speaker 1 (14:31):
You're probably it literally happened.
Yeah, like you're lit upworking, you know what I mean.

Speaker 2 (14:37):
It was just like a movie.
Any story you heard likeWaiting is the perfect example
of what the restaurant industrywas back in the 90s.

Speaker 1 (14:43):
Yeah, specifically there.

Speaker 2 (14:48):
But then we would end up at like shenanigans.
Well, shenanigans first andthen flicker light, yeah, yeah,
and then we would throw, whichis still around, by the way,
today that we the the day.

Speaker 1 (14:53):
One specific day, there was about 10 of us from
the, from the restaurant, and weended up there and it got a
little crazy.
The drinks were flowing, theshots were just endless, and all
all of a sudden somebody threwa dish in the water and we're
like what the hell are you doing?
What are you doing, man?
And then another dish, and thena chair, and then a table and

(15:14):
another chair, and then you lookdown the Intra Coastal because
this restaurant is right on thewater, literally on the water.
And there's the plastic chairsand the tables are just floating
down the coastal and the platesare.
And you know, I'm like what thehell are you guys doing?
Because of course I would neverdo that, but it was probably
you I might have been, I mighthave.

(15:35):
I'm not admitting to any of that.
But then a buddy of mine whowas the bartender and I can't
even remember his name, but hewas funny as he should have been
a stand-up comedian he gets outto the uh, he gets out to the
dumpster and this guy he's likecome on everybody, and he and
dude, everybody was whacked andthe dumpster went over yeah, it
was yeah, I don't know how wedidn't go to jail that night.
Honest to god, there's a lot oftimes I don't know how I went to

(15:56):
anyway, I just, I just put thisinto the uh, the universe right
of uh, but again I admit tonothing that it was me All right
back to you.

Speaker 3 (16:07):
Enough about the 90s.

Speaker 1 (16:09):
Enough about the 90s, how important was being part of
CHOMP.
Ultimately, you went in thereand you won.
Congratulations, by the way,thank you, thank you.

Speaker 3 (16:18):
It was an accomplishment, right?
I think a bigself-gratification moment.
Right, you went into a kitchen.
You don't know recipes that arewacky, yeah, wacky at best.
Yeah, and a clock, that's veryreal.
Right Before going in I'm likeno way, this time's not real.
No, it's real, it's moving.
And to go through and win andmeet the other competitors and

(16:42):
kind of see their background andsee how they move really opened
your eyes to this wholecompetition realm of even the
production side, to like FoodNetwork and what they do, and it
makes me hungry.
I want more.

Speaker 1 (16:56):
How did they contact you?

Speaker 3 (16:57):
It was on Instagram.
It was a casting agency thatjust reached out to me and we
got on a phone call.
She's like I love you.
Like you're great, let's do aphone call.
She's like I love you.
Like you're great, let's do azoom call.
So we do a zoom call andusually you have to do a couple.
It was just like one and I'mlike oh, they're not going to
call me back.
I get a call.
I'm in Savannah, georgia.
That's where I was working atthe time.
I got a call and they're likehey, can you leave next week to

(17:19):
chow house?
Somebody bailed out.
And I'm like no, I can't, Ican't, I can't.
Just leave my job.
I'm a culinary director.
And they're like all right,well, we'll call you back.
And then, like another twoweeks, it's like hey, we have
you on episode of chop.
This is the day.
And it's like it was like amonth out.
So I was like okay, let me getready to do this competition.

Speaker 1 (17:37):
I mean, they're both great shows but chopped is like.

Speaker 2 (17:45):
I feel like CHOMP is one of the premier.
It is.

Speaker 1 (17:46):
Right, it has become that.

Speaker 2 (17:47):
Yeah, yeah, that's so cool, even though some of the
stuff is like he said is kind ofwacky some of the ingredients.

Speaker 3 (17:51):
Yeah, some of the ingredients get a little like
come on, man.

Speaker 1 (17:55):
Well, what's funny to me, or what's interesting to me
, is the lead up to getting onthe show, like how the
communication happens.
I think that's fast to me.
That's the fascinating part,because the reality is, social
media matters.
You know everybody, we all wantto.
You know, wag a finger at, youknow social media, but in the

(18:17):
end it changes lives potentially.

Speaker 3 (18:20):
Yeah and it's like a lot of it.
You know you can apply to theshow and stuff and most people
I've known that have got on itwas social media, somebody
reaching out, caster agency, andthen once you kind of get in
that world, that like foodnetwork world, now you
continually get kind of You'rein a rotation yeah.
Like they'll continue.
Like hey, what do you thinkabout this show that's coming up
Like yeah, like they'llcontinue.

(18:41):
Like hey, what do you thinkabout this show that's coming up
Like what do you?
And now you're kind of in thatrealm and you can build up in
that realm if you want.

Speaker 1 (18:46):
Yeah, I, it's interesting because, well,
another interesting component ofthis is that what the last two
months, three months something,ish quarter, you know we've had
a fairly decent flow of of foodnetwork folks coming through
here.

Speaker 2 (19:01):
We should have by now that he would have been the
fourth one, more than that, noCause.
We had Robert, we had but thisis Nikki.

Speaker 1 (19:09):
He's the only winner.
No.

Speaker 2 (19:10):
I'm not.
I know that.
What I'm saying is you're thegold star standard.
Steven's going to come on, Iguarantee you, from the spring
show.
I know that Robert's beentalking from the spring show.
I know that Robert's beentalking about it.

Speaker 1 (19:20):
I don't want to talk about it.

Speaker 3 (19:22):
Listen, this man here is our.

Speaker 1 (19:24):
He is the feature.
Oh goodness, can you believe it?
You sure I've got to deal withyou.

Speaker 2 (19:29):
So what about Rosanna , who beat Bobby Flay?

Speaker 1 (19:31):
Okay, yeah, Bobby Flay, you know see, I'm losing
track myself.

Speaker 3 (19:36):
You just need to sleep.

Speaker 1 (19:37):
You've got to bow down to Rosanna.
Yeah that's awesome yeah.

Speaker 3 (19:40):
Do you know who she is?
No, I don't.
You told me, though, recently.
Where does she work here she'sin St Peter.

Speaker 2 (19:47):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (19:48):
Yes, what was the dish she beat Bobby Flay with.

Speaker 2 (19:51):
Oh, empanadas, the empanadas.

Speaker 3 (19:53):
No way.

Speaker 2 (19:53):
He has never won what we were told by her, ever won
an empanada competition, wow.
So she just went right in, andI think that's the only.

Speaker 1 (20:03):
The first was she was the first female right.

Speaker 2 (20:05):
Yeah, I mean, listen, she beat, she battled her
husband to get there yeah, itwas a husband and wife that was
the reason.
Yeah, they were looking forsomething and they were talking
to her and like, oh, myhusband's the chef, he's the
pastry chef, blah blah.
And they're like, oh, you guyswant to go on the show together?
And she thought it was going tobe like a valentine's day thing
and she's like, nope, it wastotally not and it was like
legit and when it was all it wasall three of them.

(20:27):
So she, she battled her husband.
Like the first part, you haveto battle somebody else and then
once you get, once you win thatpart, because you're cooking
what bobby wants, then you cookwhat you want against bobby.
So she beat her husband to getto be.

Speaker 3 (20:41):
Yeah, that's savage.

Speaker 2 (20:44):
Well, in our whole conversation funny enough, the
whole conversation was that hewas over here.
I'm like, so do you guys getalong?
Since he gets to working outand she goes oh no, he's like a
hundred percent, he's just, hereally wanted me to do it and
it's great when you have aperson that you're a partner
with, both in life and inbusiness, that you can have that
, and they are.
They do catering too, and theydo the yeah, but they do so much

(21:08):
together.
It's just.
It's really great to see thathow they kind of gel.

Speaker 1 (21:12):
Let's talk about your dish.
What did you make, oh, today,yes, well, yeah, we're going to
get to that.
I'm not.
We're not done with chopped.

Speaker 3 (21:24):
Oh my dishes.
Yeah, bring it back, oh man.
So the first basket was avanilla milkshake, spicy Cheeto
mac and cheese, a head ofcauliflower and then like smoked
turkey legs, like pre-cookedones that you buy from like a
theme park, like a big oldturkey leg.
So I kind of did, took themilkshake I made and the

(21:47):
cauliflower and did like avanilla cauliflower puree and
put that on the bottom plate.
I made a turkey salad.
I used the packet from theCheeto mac and cheese to season
it but I added, like tarragonchives, just tried to bring some
more flavors a little bit ofred onion.
But I added, like tarragonchives, just tried to bring some
more flavors, a little bit ofred onion and then did like a
radicchio salad on the side.
So that was my first dish.

(22:09):
How long did you have for thatthat?

Speaker 2 (22:10):
was a 20 minute round and you don't find out what the
ingredients are until you openthat basket.

Speaker 3 (22:16):
No, they'll give you the basket and you try to peek
through a little bit, butthey're like blacked out.
You cannot see what's in thosebaskets.

Speaker 2 (22:24):
So you have no idea what we're opening up.

Speaker 3 (22:27):
No idea.
You open it up and then you puteverything in front of you and
then you're like, okay, this iswhat I have to work with.
And the part that doesn'treally register, at least with
me, like right away, was the useof ingredients, right.
So like you can, I guess, withthe mac and cheese, I did.
But you can use as little or asa lot of the ingredients you
want.
So if like the like, forinstance, the vanilla milkshake,

(22:49):
if you just want to use thecherry on top, you can just use
that.
But then you have to deal withis it kind of incorporated in
the dish?
Is it taste, is it?
Did you use it right?
So my kind of whole thing goinginto every round was let me
take two ingredients in thebasket and kind of combine them
together and then from there Iknow I'm using those good, and
then I can move forward.
What's your?

Speaker 1 (23:09):
anxiety level.
Before you get there, right,you're like, okay, chopped,
here's my date, I got to go domy stuff, right, and maybe you
don't even think about itbecause you're still working and
you're, you're fixated on whatyou have to do for your you know
, for your career, for work.
Then you get there, and nowit's like it starts to become a
little bit more real, right, youstart to meet contestants.
You're, you're seeing what'sgoing on Cameras everywhere.

(23:32):
Like all of a sudden you'rethinking to yourself oh, I
actually I got to cook, I got to, I got to represent right.
What's your stress?

Speaker 3 (23:39):
level.
It wasn't high, it was, it camenatural.
It didn't bother me.

Speaker 1 (23:43):
You know I would normally not believe the person
saying that to me, but, like ifyou're looking at your demeanor,
I think it's true.
What do you think?
Okay, john spoke.
Yeah, he did, it's true.

Speaker 3 (23:53):
But yeah, it didn't, it was.
It came very natural.
I just went, I kind of justblocked everything out and
cooked.
I was like I'm just going tocome here and cook.
I'm not going to try to dosomething crazy, go out of the
box and do these things wherepeople are like wrapping beef in
Swiss chard.
That's what one of mycompetitors did and didn't go
well for him.
But I was like I'm just goingto sear a steak, I'm going to

(24:13):
cook it well, I'm going to stickto the basics as basic, but
then use these wacky ingredients, and that was just my plan.
So I'm like, all right if Icook a cook, if somebody cooking
better than me, then they'recooking better than me.
But I was just going to go inthere and give it the cameras
and everything didn't reallybother me.

Speaker 2 (24:30):
I think the other aspect too is I asked him did he
prep for it and then did hepractice for it?

Speaker 3 (24:34):
And your response was I was like I've been practicing
12 years now, which is a greatanswer, right?

Speaker 1 (24:40):
No, you're you're, you're ready for it?
Yeah, see, but that's cool man.
And then if it were me, I wouldjust be, I would have to do it
would be nerves all nerves,nothing but nerves.

Speaker 3 (24:51):
You'd be in the fetal position on the floor.

Speaker 1 (24:53):
No, no no fetal position but.
But I would be nothing butnerves, right, and I would have
to sit there and spend days andI don't know how many.
You know, practice runs doingit, training, train.
Yeah, like I'm talking like1980s you gotta run up.

Speaker 3 (25:11):
Yeah, fly to stairs, flight of stairs, ladle and well
, that might be at 220.

Speaker 2 (25:16):
That might be something dangerous for you
right now.

Speaker 1 (25:18):
You might want to wait, so funny, funny story
we're coming back from.

Speaker 2 (25:22):
We're coming back from from oklahoma city, right
did they ask you to move tobalance the plane all?

Speaker 1 (25:29):
right.
So we, we have a connectionflight in atlanta and, of course
, the plane is delayed, rightand you know, on to to atlanta,
where we're going to catch ourconnecting flight.
Oh so it's even worse.
It's worse.
Harvey, and there's like 10 ofus on this trip and we're just,
you know, to Atlanta, wherewe're going to catch our
connecting flight.
Oh so it's even worse.
It's worse, horrible, andthere's like 10 of us on this
trip and we're just, you know,everybody's going to different
places.
Whatever, I had to run, I wassprinting, okay, yeah, yeah,

(25:54):
yeah.

Speaker 2 (25:55):
Is there footage?

Speaker 1 (25:56):
No, I mean, footage may exist, but I don't think.

Speaker 3 (26:01):
Jackson.

Speaker 1 (26:02):
Hatfield something.
So I had to.
I ran and I was doing therunning and I would hit those
like a walking.
You know, the walk, the walkpeople movers or whatever.
And uh, and as I'm, and I'mstill running on the people
mover, and uh, and I was justthinking to myself, man, when,
when I have to hit the pavement,you know, like when it, when
I'm off that thing, I better becareful because I'm not going to

(26:22):
be the guy that just eats it,you know, because then there's
somebody would have a freakingcamera at that point.
But yeah, no, I ran all the waythere and it was crazy.
I wasn't the only one that thewhole group was doing it.
I was like all right, were youlast?

Speaker 2 (26:34):
No, I've been that dude, I have literally been that
.
It's the worst feeling Runningwith a group of people, oh yeah.

Speaker 1 (26:42):
I have enough healthy vanity to where I don't want to
be like.
You know, I was suffering whenwe got to the thing.
I suffered, there's no questionLike I was not happy and I'm
huffing and puffing, but no, Iwasn't.
I was not the last one Irepresented.
He showed up.
I was mad, sweating from headto toe like it was terrible, you

(27:04):
know, by the way, it was crazyit was.
This was like six in themorning, central time, right.
The day started hit to hit.
You know, hit these uh field.
You know the feed lots and allthat, and I didn't get home till
two in the morning, easterntime.
That was.
The entire day was like justnon-stop.

Speaker 2 (27:24):
I feel like a champion, though, you know until
he gets home later today andcrashes out for a day.
It's gone.
That's gonna happen.
Saturday morning we're gonnaget.
Hey, I just woke up, that'sgonna happen and I embrace that.

Speaker 1 (27:37):
I look forward to it how it feel to so, from a chef's
perspective, what are thedifferences between catering and
restaurants?
I kind of want to go into adifferent direction here.

Speaker 3 (27:46):
Yeah, wow, there's a huge difference.

Speaker 1 (27:48):
Which do you like better?
No, no, no, don't, don't, don'tdo that.
So which one do you like better?

Speaker 3 (27:55):
I mean my heart's with restaurants, right, Like
that's where I came up in,that's that's, that's that's
where I live.
Like restaurants, especiallywhen I started out in
restaurants because river park,especially, was a special place.
You walked in and you can justsee how everyone was competing
against each other, Like youwere there to help each other.

(28:16):
But the talent that was in theroom was a builder, everybody's
building each other up.
Yeah, like you wanted to be asous chef before that guy was
sous chef.
There wasn't like, oh, I'vebeen here for two years now, I
get promoted.
It was like, no, you're goingto show up and you're going to
work.
Catering is a different world,though, and I see, you know, I
was the event chef with TomColicchio, so there was that

(28:36):
sense of like catering.
But it sense of like catering,um, but it was like catering
within our own area.
So we had our own banquet hallsand stuff like that.
We had the kitchen, we had allour firepower that we can do to
get it out.
Now, catering now, what I'mdoing now is a whole different
ball game.
Right, like packing up a truck,making sure hot boxes, not
forgetting anything, bringingstuff on site.
What can we execute in a site?

(28:57):
What it's the best of?
What I said to you guys earlier, when we're talking about the
kitchen, what I tell chefs is isyou have to be a chameleon, you
have to adjust into yourenvironment, because a lot of
restaurant people, you know youcome to that restaurant for two
years, three years.
You know the ins and outs, youknow everything about it.
Catering is gonna throw adifferent ball game at you.
Yeah, you'll learn the venues,you'll learn this here and there

(29:19):
, but you're still gonna have toadjust to things.
So there is that sense of likeadjustment that gets you excited
, keeps you on your toes.
But you know restaurants whereI started.
Maybe down the line I'll likecatering more.

Speaker 1 (29:33):
I still love catering , don't get me wrong it's a
different, it's a differentchallenge, exactly right.
Would you say that catering Ihave three people in front of me
that I'm going to ask for Onedoesn't have a mic.
One without a mic, juan?

Speaker 2 (29:49):
is in the house and he's taking notes.

Speaker 3 (29:51):
Definitely taking notes, sorry, man.

Speaker 1 (29:57):
I mean, you know, the CEO is sitting right here.

Speaker 2 (29:59):
By the way, I didn't set you up for that one because
he's sitting next to me.
Here's my thought process.
I've been I don't know how longin the restaurant industry and
the catering.
Catering to me is a lot easierbecause you know exactly what
you're getting into.

Speaker 3 (30:12):
That is a big thing.
When you go to prep it's likeall right on the line, I'm going
to get hit with.
You know you can look at yourbig hitters or whatever.
But when you come to cateryou're like I know exactly what
I need for the weekend.

Speaker 1 (30:25):
I know exactly what I and there is a little bit of
curve, unless it's a pop-upparty or something that comes up
.

Speaker 3 (30:32):
But most of those, it's not like a thousand person
pop-up party.

Speaker 2 (30:35):
Even if it's a thousand, we have a saying I'm
prepping for one or I'm preppingfor a thousand.
I'm just going to go throughthe motion of whatever I need to
do Is catering the same asbanquets at a hotel.
Yeah, I think there's some.
Yeah, yeah, I think so.
Yeah, I would say yes on that.
There is so one sits.

Speaker 3 (30:54):
I got a three, yeses, two and a half, I think.
Yeah, it is.
I mean, I don't have experiencein the hotel world.
I've seen them and I see thesimilarity of chafing dishes,
the kind of this, I think whatchef said was they had the
firepower when he was at tomcalicchio's.

Speaker 2 (31:07):
He had the firepower there and in a hotel you have
the firepower there when you'redoing catering and you're doing
specifically off-site catering.
You are a macgyver, yeah, likeif you.
If you don't go to the venuefirst to find out what the venue
is and you don't shop the venueand you don't know what you're
going into expect what youexpect.

Speaker 1 (31:25):
A lot of those venues don't have the right equipment
too for you, or even just theplug.
Nor equipment, no equipment.

Speaker 3 (31:31):
You're bringing a hot box and it's shorting out every
five seconds.
You're like what plug can I usehere?

Speaker 2 (31:38):
You don't know the electricity of the place.

Speaker 1 (31:47):
Pull out a lighter and start cooking things.
I don't know who's responsibleto find that that out who's
supposed to do recon.

Speaker 3 (31:50):
Who scouts that?
We, yeah, we have staff.
The salesperson will go thereand check out the venue.
Then we have meetings weeklythat we discuss you know what
they'll bring it.
Hey, this is the layout, thisis what we can do.
A lot of them know like hey, wecan fry on site.
We can't fry on site.
We can do this on site, youknow, here and there, and then
as a chef coming in, like what,what logistically makes sense on

(32:11):
our end, like what can we all?
Right, yeah, we, maybe we cancook this on site.
Now we don't have to worryabout doing that here if we're
going to create a better productthere.
Or do we do it here and thensend it there because you have
nothing to do, but then we'regoing to send it at a later time
to make the product good.
Or maybe we hold it like thisyou don't wrap this because it's
fried, so there is a lot ofelements to it.
Where it's not, you're in arestaurant and you make a dish

(32:33):
and then you send it to theguests.
It's a different world, even onplate ups too.
Like it, like it's, it's just,it's completely different.
And you know, I think anotherbig part of it too is that I
would like to say the type ofpeople that you kind of get in
in those different kinds ofrestaurants, because the
catering lifestyle does add alot better quality of life when

(32:58):
you're in the restaurants,especially the higher you get up
in restaurants, you're soimmersed in it.

Speaker 1 (33:03):
Listen, I binge watched all three seasons of the
Bear.

Speaker 2 (33:08):
I got text messages.
I was texting this guy.
I still haven't gotten throughseason one.

Speaker 1 (33:16):
I only did season two halfway and it was just like it
got away from cooking for meand I'm like, well, hold on, let
me just get into this for asecond, because I think that it
was so well done.
Okay, the whole thing was sowell done.
Obviously, they're looking to.
It seems that they want to drawthis out for a few more seasons
, right, so you have to havesome character development, that

(33:39):
that goes on with it.
And that's where it startsgetting a little bit off of
cooking.
But once you get and there werelike a handful of episodes where
I was like, okay, this isdragging, you know, but, man,
once you get past that and youget back into it, they don't
miss a beat, they don't missanything and for me, there was
so many nuances about being inthe business that I had

(34:00):
forgotten, like, the feelings.
You can look at it and go I'veseen, I know that happens, but
you don't remember the feelingof it.
And I'm sitting here and I'mwatching, I'm eating potato
chips and I'm just like I'msweating, I'm sweating and it's
crazy.
I think it's such a great showand I I did the three seasons in

(34:20):
one week.

Speaker 2 (34:22):
That's insane.
I think the I think one of thebest shows that really emulates
what the restaurant industrygoes through is John Favreau's
chef, like the behind the sceneschef show.

Speaker 1 (34:32):
Oh yeah.

Speaker 2 (34:33):
When he does the makeup of how he went through it
.
And I never knew the trainingthat not only he went through,
but did you see the Josh Roganone that he went?
No, so they're doing it andit's Wolfgang Puck and John
Farvo and Roy Choi and and JoshRogan, and they're talking and
they're like we're going to dochicken and all of a sudden he
picks up a knife, the, and hestarts whacking the chicken and

(34:54):
I'm like holy, he's got skillsand he goes.
Don't you remember I did thatmovie called Chicken Something?
And I'm like I didn't even knowhe did a movie called Chicken.
He goes I had to go ahead andfabricate cases of chicken the
right way, because I have to dothis for my job.

Speaker 1 (35:06):
You can see he's got knife skills Seriously.

Speaker 2 (35:09):
And then John Farvo, when he was working with Chef
Wolf, wolfgang Puck.
As soon as I heard Wolfgang,look I'm getting chills.
As soon as I heard Wolfgang'svoice, it's like I just went.

Speaker 1 (35:18):
I used to work for him.

Speaker 2 (35:19):
And as soon as he slapped, as soon as he slaps
John Fargo and says you wantyour stuff to taste like
silicone, Cause he was using thesilicone spatula, he goes use a
fork and I'm like, oh God, thatjust triggered me.
That's, that's exactly howWolfgang was, but the the way
they went through the process toemulate what really goes on in

(35:40):
the restaurant industry wasBravo.
I mean seriously just fantastic, because it really captures
what we go through on thepersonal level with our family,
especially this particular storywith John Fargo and his
character and Dustin Hoffman,how that whole started out, and
then he went to the food truckand had this son.
It's a beautiful way of likeemulating what we go through in

(36:01):
the restaurant industry.
Bear is too much for me rightnow because it triggered me for
what happened a couple of yearsago.
Will I get over it?
Eventually?
I'll probably end up sittingdown and watching it, but right
now I can't.
There's no way.

Speaker 1 (36:09):
There was a few parts in this, in in there.
My family is not like thefamily there, but some of it was
.
You mean, richie, no, apercentage of the mother, okay,
okay, and I'm just and and itthat freaked me out, richie, you
know, I can identify with thatcharacter a little bit, you know

(36:32):
.
But then he comes, he, he endsup coming around, you know, and
that, and that's the cool partabout it, the characters have
growth.
I think it's super.
Anyway, you know, I can't stoptalking about it.

Speaker 2 (36:43):
I'm just, you know, I'm a huge proponent of this,
this series, man, as long asthey put the limelight on us in
the right way, exactly, yeah.

Speaker 1 (36:53):
I think they're accurate Forget the limelight.
Forget, for I think they'reaccurate, forget the limelight.

Speaker 2 (36:56):
Well, that's what I'm saying, as long as they keep it
to what it really is and theydon't embellish or they don't do
like the menu, for instance,like I mean, oh yeah, we would
all like to do that.

Speaker 3 (37:08):
Yeah, it's a lot of like glorification in this and
you see a lot of you know it'sfunny because I remember when I
was younger in this industry andI come in the kitchen.
A couple of years ago it was 12years, I was 20 years old.
I walk in the kitchen and youknow there's guys in there 30,
35, 40 sous chefs or whateverand you know they're.
They're the real deal, likethey're they're throwing down

(37:30):
and you don't realize.
When you first get in you'relike I want to, I want to create
dishes, I want to do this coolstuff.
You don't realize how muchrepetition it is.
It's not coming in there andlike oh, I'm going to be this
superstar chef and I'm going tocreate a cool dish, or I'm going
to plate this, even at nice,like if you go to a Michelin
star restaurant.
It's repetition, it's doing thesame thing every day.

Speaker 1 (37:53):
Yeah, 300 covers.

Speaker 3 (38:00):
I was brunoise shall thing every day.
It's like 300 cover.
I was brewing wine shallotsevery day and and until I got
good at it and it wasn't, Iwasn't good in a week.
I wasn't good in a month, Iwasn't.
I wasn't good in two months, Iwas good in like a year, two
years, three years.
I'm like, oh wow, I can use myknife really good now.
Like and you get a lot of that,like kind of just people that
don't really understand that,and I think a lot of it comes
from shows and stuff, causethey'll see this.
You know, food network had abig thing.

(38:20):
I, when I was in culinaryschool you had a lot of kids are
like, oh yeah, I'm going to bea chef.
You know what?
Like look at David Chang andBobby Flay and I'm like, yeah,
they still went and got rocked.
It's a hard, hard game.

Speaker 1 (38:36):
It's funny.
I just had this conversationsomewhere I don't remember, but
before food network, and I'm notpro or con on food network.
You know they, they serve apurpose, they do what they do
well, Right Before then, thepeople who ended up in kitchens.
You've you found your way there.

Speaker 2 (38:53):
You know it was because you had a.
Not all of us you had had a.
Some of us were idiots and saidI want to go, yeah, yeah, but
guilty, yeah, hold on thatpercentage.
It's very small oh yeah, verysmall percentage okay so usually
you had a record.

Speaker 1 (39:08):
It was, you know, like last resort, I guess I'll
get out of the kitchen right,exactly so.
But then you had the advent ofyou know these like superstar,
celebrity chefs and culinaryschool, and all of a sudden now
people are going to schoolbecause they see all of the
glitz and the glam, but they'restill.
You still have to learn, youstill have to get, like you said

(39:29):
, get rocked.
You still got to get kicked inthe face.

Speaker 2 (39:32):
Well, that's like when Kurt was, if you don't.

Speaker 1 (39:33):
If you don't get kicked in the face, you'll never
be anything.
You've got to get kicked in theface a lot.

Speaker 2 (39:40):
Well, there's a right way of getting kicked in the
face.
I think there's a way to do itthe right way Back when I was
going in.
I started when I was 12.
Child labor law yeah.

Speaker 1 (39:49):
It wasn't.

Speaker 2 (40:01):
But by the time I got into culinary school and I was
in my externship, I was workingat La Cucina Toscana in Weston
and the chef there was Frenchtrained, loved Italian food and
stuff that we went through.
Even with HR Today, we couldn'tdo that.
There's just no way.
So there's things that we haveto do differently.
But I think when you're talkingabout superstars for me, the
superstar for me and I mentionedthis when we talked to Kurt and
some other episodes I had JuliaChilds, I had Graham Cure.
I had I think Galloping Gourmetis Graham Cure and Jacques Pepin

(40:25):
.
Those were the people I watched.
I didn't watch.
I did watch cartoons, but Ialso when I wanted to watch
something to get my mind off ofschool, or whatever I was doing,
I always gravitated to food andthat was the culture I was
raised in.

Speaker 1 (40:36):
But it was a process Because you went from that first
group right.
And then you started gettinginto, like the Emeralds and all
these people.

Speaker 2 (40:42):
Well, emerald came out when I was in culinary
school and boy, when I first sawEmerald and he was a JWU grad
and he would sit there anddouble dip and taste the food
with his finger and you'd say oh, my God, where's the surf safe?
And you would like you know,cause that's when you were going
through culinary and it's sofunny and you're going to.
He's going to laugh, and so isJuan.
Every time you go through afood service like when the
health inspector comes in forabout what three days you guys

(41:04):
are on your tiptoes and we'regoing to do it this way now, and
then all of a sudden things goback to the way they were and
everybody probably instead ofjust doing it from the get-go,
yeah right, but I think that'sthe difference between what we
do.

Speaker 1 (41:21):
No, oh, you, oh, so you're that guy.

Speaker 2 (41:22):
Yeah, processes matter, processes matter.
Oh, I would 100, but I thinkfor you.
What made you, at 20, go toyour father?

Speaker 3 (41:31):
I want to be chef so a lot of it stemmed from it
started with my grandmother.
So I'm really really close tomy grandparents and my
grandmother loved like, wouldwake up in the middle of the
night to stir a sauce, kind oflike thing, like it's just Cuban
grandmother.

Speaker 1 (41:46):
She was.

Speaker 3 (41:46):
Cuban.
Yeah, so like just big intocooking, but she didn't really
cook like Cuban food she did,but like she cooked kind of.
She was creative, she wouldmake stuff from scratch, like
make her own dishes.
So I always thought that wasintriguing and I remember her
telling me she's like just putwhatever you want in it If you

(42:08):
like it, make it taste good.
So that would kind of spark mycreativity and I started like
cooking here and there.
When I was around 12 my dadstarted cooking heavily, very
into food network, so this isthe food network time and he he
would.
He would get it wine, drinkwine and just had food network
on, play some music maybe, andthen he would just cook dishes

(42:31):
and he's, he's a phenomenal cook, like he's very good.
And being young, I just satthere and watched him, watched
him on the bar, and that was thefirst time in my family,
because you know my mother, mygrand, my both my grandmothers,
but both my good catch baby boygood catch.

(42:52):
But both my grandmothers it wasalways the women that cooked.
So when I saw my dad doing itand like really doing it, like
making pasta from scratch orlike breading beautiful chicken
or whatever he was doing, makingpaella, he did that a lot.
It was like, oh man, guys cancook.
And you know, I didn't evenknow the whole restaurant
industry and it's actually funny.
So I started working with Steve, owner by Caterham Family,

(43:15):
around you know 17 or 18, and Iwas cleaning dishes, cleaning
dishes there.
I never did it.
And then, you know, went to NewYork and Steve always kind of
like would come visit me, causeme and his son's my same age as
me and it's just like a fullcircle.
Now I'm back there and I thinkthat's interesting, but the

(43:36):
whole thing was watching my dadcook, I, and it's just like a
full circle.
Now I'm back there and I thinkthat's interesting, but the
whole thing was watching my dadcook.
I think I was like, oh man, guyscan cook, I'm going to start
cooking and I think I just had anatural work ethic because the
way they drilled me.
So my work ethic was veryhardworking person, my palate
was very quickly like I had one.
A lot of people don'tnecessarily.
Some people never get theirpalate, but my palate was there

(43:58):
and the creativity kind of grew.
But I think it was just theattraction to it.
I played sports growing up soit was almost.
It's a competitive field, rightLike.
You're on your legs, you'rerunning around, you're sweating,
you can't use the bathroombecause you're behind the line
for six hours cooking.
Cornstarch works in a lot ofdifferent ways, so this depends
yeah whoa what?

Speaker 2 (44:22):
okay, that's not if you can't get to the bathroom.
He knows the story.

Speaker 3 (44:29):
Oh, you should have been there, stop it I'm not
going there, stop it, oh my god.
But I think that competitivefield it was just just, it was
very.
You know, I wasn't going to bea professional football player,
baseball player, I knew that.
But I was like man.
You get in this realm and youjust meet some of the coolest
people, man, like some of thefrom all over, like some people
that that you know I don'tnecessarily see or haven't seen

(44:52):
in maybe seven years, but Istill talk to.

Speaker 1 (44:55):
Well, whenever you, when you share time in a
restaurant and you do, you getyour butt kicked and you might
you might be in the back thereand everybody's yelling and you
know daggers at each other andwhatever to put it nicely.
But like when you do that andyou go through that a little a
of time with somebody, even thepeople you didn't like, you end

(45:18):
up kind of buddying up with.
And that's the cool part Ithink about the business is that
you make some really goodfriendships and with people that
you wouldn't have been friendlywith, you know, because you
know who they are and you knowkind of what they do.
But when you bleed togetherlike that man, there's a bond.

Speaker 2 (45:40):
Well it's not only that, it's breaking bread too,
Like when you have a family mealwe've talked about that too,
you sit down, you see,especially if you're the chef or
the leader, you're there withthose people more than you see
your own family.
So they are an extension ofyour family.
So there are going to be timeswhere you're going to argue,
there's times where you're not,but at the end of the day, when
you, when you set yourself upfor success and I'm about to

(46:00):
lead into a question for youit's a great thing.
My question now is taking oversomething has been a heritage
style catering.
How long has it been inbusiness?
Steve's at it for 40 years.

Speaker 3 (46:18):
So 40 years, and you've got line cooks and people
prep cooks that have been therefor how long?
Some of them, I think five, tenyears.

Speaker 2 (46:24):
Tim tim's been there for 20 years, so my question is
like taking over a kitchen wheresomeone's been there that long
which is almost as long asyou've been alive how, how do
you then cater you like thatcater?
How do you cater yourleadership skills to get that
person to then buy into what you?

Speaker 3 (46:45):
want to do.
This is awesome Cause it'sfunny, cause, tim, being 20
years there, he knew me when Iwas a kid at the shop, so he
knew me when I was little comingto the shop and now I'm there.
You know, that's.
It's how I would do anywhere.
Being a leader to me isn'tbarking orders or telling people
what to do and standing over oron top of people, it's getting

(47:07):
down and dirty, right, like yeah, I can cook a pretty dish and
stuff, but I get gritty, likeI'm in there, I'm cleaning, I'm
on my hands and knees and I willdo it with you every day.
There might be some days I getpulled away for a meeting, but
in doing all that you gain thatrespect, right, so that when it
comes time to like, oh, I got toget pulled away to go to a

(47:27):
party or I got to do this andthey're getting slammed, then
they kind of respect that and Ithink that's followed me.
It took me a long time torealize that, because when I
first became a sous chef, I wasjust, I was in a very hostile
place because everyone justbarking orders and we're
lighting people up.
That's what we did andeverything kind of changed and

(47:47):
you had to learn to kind ofadapt and like what do I have to
do as a leader?
What leadership's quality do Ihave to create?
And I think that was the bestway is to create a leader.
Like, to become a leader youhave to do show a team that's
been there for a long time thatlike, hey, I can do it, but I'm
going to do it faster.
I'm there before you, I'll stayafter you, I'm going to clean

(48:10):
longer than you.
And you do this not again, notfor a week, not for a month.
You do this continuously,continuously.
And then you build a team thattrusts you and you don't have a
target on your back and wants tobe by your side and will do
anything they can to help you.
So you know it's just hard work.
And then in doing that, whatI've learned is also another big

(48:34):
trait about a leader iscreating other leaders.
Right, like, necessarily, Idon't want to be the only leader
.
A lot of chefs have thatproblem.
Like you know, power of likeI'm the only leader, I run the
room.
It's not about that Like,because they want all the glory
and you want everyone all eyeson you.
At the end of the day, ifsomebody comes to the room and

(48:54):
all eyes are on my team, my teamis doing well and they've
progressed, then I know that andit's a reflection of me well,
you have to have.

Speaker 1 (49:03):
You have to have the security in yourself in order to
do that, and that's where a lotof people fall in their face
well and we've talked aboutwhat's the difference between a
leader and a boss.

Speaker 2 (49:15):
the boss is the one, like he said it was, barking
orders.
A leader needs to get to rollup the sleeves and get down and
dirty.
I think the attribute to islike the creativity part of it,
like how do you get them as amentor and how do you get your
team to like do you havetastings?
Do you have like you go to a?
Hey, we're going to do tomorrow.
We're going to have you come upwith additional.
You give them enough timewhatever it is Do you do stuff

(49:37):
like that to get them involvedin menu development?

Speaker 3 (49:39):
Not yet.
That's definitely the plan.
That's one of the harder thingsright that I've learned is
spiking people's creativity.
Mine was spiked so young andI'll never forget it.
Shout out to Jesse because Ifucking love him.
So he created a dish and I'llnever forget it.
He kind of brought me to thefront of the table we're doing a
tasting and it was a beautifulSwiss chard pan, purdue Bavette

(50:02):
steak.
It looked like a log, and thencarrots and it looked like a
forest, like the whole dish.
And he looks at me and he goeswhat do you think it needs on it
?
I was like man, maybe if youpickle the Swiss chard stems
it'll be cool.
And I said that and I'm likehe's like that is a good idea.
So he put it on the dish and itwent on the menu and that kind
of like just that little thing.
like he always kept us involvedbut that's a big deal, yeah and

(50:26):
and for him and I've always toldhim that like we're very close
friends, he runs restaurants innew york for, uh, andrew
carmelini.
But that little thing he did tome when I was, you know, 22, it
it did something in my headwhere I was like whoa, like
that's awesome, he like took myadvice and and he was interested
in what I said, he actuallywent through with it.

Speaker 1 (50:48):
So then that made me like want to be involved even
more, like I didn't feel shunnedout yeah, you, you know a lot
of people get a newspaper acrossthe nose when they do stuff
like that, because it's in theface of what I created Exactly,
and how could you know betterthan me?
You know what I mean, andthat's something that should

(51:09):
change.
I mean, that's a.
Thing.

Speaker 2 (51:10):
And one of the biggest changes I've ever seen.
It was Anthony Bourdain, whenhe was in Denmark and he was
with Renee from Noma and afterthe shift, they had all the
cooks there and they were doingit.
It was, like, you know, late atnight, it was, shift was over
and they're literally there wasX amount of chefs or cooks that
were presenting dishes to theentire team and this one kid was

(51:30):
traveling around and going towork and he picked all these
things that he was doing, likeNoma does, and they did the dish
.
And Anthony Bourdain looks atyou know, Renee, and he says
what do you think?
He goes this is fantastic, youdon't need to do anything else.
This is incredible.
Blah, blah, blah.
And then Anthony looked at himlike the normal American chef
and said so is it going to go onyour menu?
And Renee looked at him he goesabsolutely not, this is his

(51:51):
dish.
We're just checking where he'sat and he's perfected what he
needs to do.
And I sat there and ponderedthat for a minute, because you
know that was 2016, 2015, when Isaw that, so I'd already been
in the industry for God knowshow long.
By that point, I'm like, wow,what a thing.
Because most chefs are likethat's mine, you just gave it to

(52:13):
me, it's mine now.
I'm not going to give you thecredit and that, like you said,
Carl, that that needs to changeand what that was.
How poetic.
Renee sat there, the number onechef for four years in a row
for the restaurant, and he saidno, it's him, and that's just
like what he did for you is thathe sparked that creativity for
you to do that.

Speaker 3 (52:38):
And that's awesome.
Yeah, it was, and you know hewas one of the exceptions.
He was really big on that Likehe would bring.
I always remember when I firstcame up it was like all the sous
chefs.
If you were a sous chef, youwere allowed to like, do the
tasting and taste the food andthey would taste over the menu
and they'd bounce ideas off eachother.
And that's kind of when Ilearned I'm like, wow, like it's
not one person that comes upwith the dish, it's like the one
person that comes up with theidea for the dish.
And now all of them arebouncing ideas and they're

(52:59):
perfecting this dish and honingit in.
But that's the camaraderie part.

Speaker 1 (53:04):
Yeah, that's a piece of it anyway, but that's super
important.

Speaker 2 (53:09):
But you have to, like you said, you have to have a
chef that's willing enough to beopened to do that, like when I
was in Keith's and we had to dothat wedding where we had people
that couldn't have onion andgarlic and I'm making barbecue
beans.

Speaker 3 (53:21):
Hello.

Speaker 2 (53:23):
Barbecue beans, gets garlic and onions and I'm sorry
we had to go through these and Ihad to be vegetarian.
So we had to do.
We couldn't do ham hock, wecouldn't have the salt, the
smokiness.
There was five of us in thecatering and we're all going.
One said, hey, there was fiveof us in the catering and we're
all going.
One said, hey, you know whatyou can do.
Take the coconut cream from thecoconut milk and add that for
fat.
Take the plant-based butter andadd that.

(53:44):
Do smoked paprika for the smoke.
By the time it was done peoplewere looking at me and go can
you redo that dish?
I'm like, absolutely not.

Speaker 1 (53:52):
There was five of us.

Speaker 2 (53:56):
Nobody wrote anything down.
But the dish, dish, as thewhole thing culminated.
It was such a great dish.
I wish I would have written itdown, but it was on the fly, we
had to do it.
Yeah right, the macgyver, themacgyver.
I just remember opening up thecan of beans and then going, hey
, isn't it supposed to be?
Like no pork.
As I'm about to pour it out,he's like yeah, the beans have

(54:18):
pork in it as they should wellspeaking of pork and beans?

Speaker 1 (54:26):
not really so.
I saw john.
He took some amazing photostoday.
Obviously, jeff, you had somepretty dishes oh, he had a
pretty dish.

Speaker 2 (54:37):
I think he took the cake today I'm going to quickly
skip.

Speaker 1 (54:39):
I'm glazing over you.
Are you doing a glaze?
I'm glazing over you.
You were just a setup.
You were a stepping stone intowhat I'm getting into here.
Okay, but I did.
I saw some pretty photos.
Why don't you talk about?
You cooked today and I want totalk about it.

Speaker 3 (54:53):
Yeah, I made a very beautiful dish.
So it's a white fennel pureeand I did a lamb kind of like a
lamb rack roulade.
So I took it off the bone,stuffed it with duck cell,
rolled it use a little mougloukeep it all together.
I seared that off and thenrubbed it in garlic confit and

(55:15):
finished it in the oven.

Speaker 2 (55:22):
There was some brown butter crumble there some fennel
fronds and pickled fennel stemsand you had the roasted fennel,
I think right.

Speaker 3 (55:26):
Yeah, I had roasted fennel.
So the big thing about me whenI cook I'm heavy into the
produce side, like I like.
I love vegetables, I loveeverything about them, I love
seasonality, I love it.
I also like using the entirevegetable.
So if I'm making a fennel puree, I'm going to use the stems,

(55:50):
I'm going to pickle them down,I'm going to use the fronds.
Like same thing with the lamb.
Like the bone we made that madethe jus.
Like I'm taking the bones, I'mroasting the bones out Like any
kind of fat fat I can find.
I'm going to use it somewhere.
Like I like to use all theproduct I possibly can.
And that goes back to what Iwas taught in the beginning.
Like we saved every, we compostit and or if we didn't compost
to the farm, it was saved andused for a dish like that.
And that was drilled in meheavily for five years at river

(56:13):
park which kind of stuck with methroughout my whole career.
It's zero weight.

Speaker 2 (56:18):
And that's also about since the CEO is sitting next
to me it's all about ROI andprofitability.
Look at that smile.

Speaker 1 (56:28):
He is.
It's ear to ear, right yeah.

Speaker 2 (56:32):
But Dan Barber, you know, is probably the person
that really put the thing on amap for us and I there's a great
, huge, yeah, yeah he's up inout upstate new york and he's
the one that they did a wholeyoutube thing about food waste
and it was a great video.
It talks about zucchini and howhe comes in with the door, then
it shows a regular zucchini,then he shows a squash blossom

(56:53):
and then squash leaves and thenthe stock and then the root and
you're like holy cow, you canuse the whole thing.
So now I question to thefarmers we work with them like
hey, can you, you know, havethat?
Can you eat this?
Cause cause certain things youcan't like.
I asked one of the farmers canyou eat strawberry leaves?
They're like we don't know.

Speaker 1 (57:10):
I mean yeah.

Speaker 3 (57:11):
I fell in love with the fish.
That was a great thing.
He if you ever watched that,which one but Dan Barber?
I fell in love with the fish.
Oh yeah, it's incredible.
It's incredible.
And just his whole thing aboutit was the what?
The honey nut squash.
He created the honey nut squash.
He went to his farmer.
He's like, yeah, I lovebutternut squash, but there the

(57:39):
honey nut squash created, and Ithink he was also feeding his
chickens, chickens red pepper,so that the yolk was red.
It's awesome.

Speaker 1 (57:43):
That kind of stuff is amazing, yeah.
So how do we?
How do we do that?
Let's do some cool stuff.
Wait for it.
Can we do it in experience,science or something?
Let's get a chicken and startpeanut pepper.
Well, well, we have chickenfarmers.

Speaker 2 (57:55):
We have plenty of chicken farmers.
We can talk to Vicky Nicole.

Speaker 3 (58:00):
Just tell them to start feeding them peppers.

Speaker 2 (58:03):
Is it like a different?
Like red pepper?
I heard it has.

Speaker 3 (58:06):
I mean, I haven't been.
I've had a couple of friends.
They said it has peppery notesto it Because the pepper I think
chickens don't have heatreceptors, like they don't feed,
like you can feed them hotpeppers and they don't.
It doesn't bother them.

Speaker 1 (58:19):
You know who does have heat John, john, yeah, yeah
.

Speaker 2 (58:24):
John didn't try the Fuego.
No, he didn't.
No Fuego, yeah, it wasdelicious.
Yeah, thank you.

Speaker 1 (58:29):
All right, so what?
When's your?

Speaker 2 (58:37):
next?
When's your next like bigproject?
Getting back to work, Cause theCEO is sitting next to me.

Speaker 3 (58:41):
Big projects.
Uh, we've been working on a lotof stuff.
We recently did a wedding thatwas a 30 people and it was we
did a high end menu wine pairing, three courses.
So it was the first time andit's kind of what we're trying
to bring catering the family tois.
Is these high end dinners right?
Like we want to showcase?
And not only are we showcasingthe food, but I'm going out

(59:03):
there and explaining the food tothe guests and talking about it
and being immersed in it, right, giving them a show.
Like you know, a lot of theback of house guys and chefs,
like some of them to these days,don't like to go out and don't
like to talk to people I justshowed one our the dinner collab
we did over in orlando month ora couple months ago yeah, at

(59:25):
the porch is it the same one youshowed me when you came on?
I don't know if it was or not,it could have been the it could
have been the first you showedme one and it was awesome was it
at a farm or was it?
At a market.
It was inside a market, that'sthe market.

Speaker 2 (59:37):
The porch market, that's the one.

Speaker 1 (59:38):
Right.
So I got to show one and, yeah,we should talk about doing some
cool stuff like that.
Oh, I would love that, right, Imean, I think anybody.
Well, I know everyone who wouldbe involved in it.
You know, whoever's showing up,everybody would love that.
Oh, I'd have a blast.

Speaker 2 (59:57):
Well, what's great is and you mentioned it, we've
mentioned it on other shows andyou definitely hit it right on
the nail on the head is that theexperience we lost after COVID
is the experience of going outand dining, having the chef come
out explaining.
People love that because theyhave the sense that they know,
especially if you have thefarmers there, that's next level
.

Speaker 1 (01:00:16):
Yeah, all of this only matters if the person
talking has some character.
You can't send like a you knowBen Stein, even he's, but he'd
be entertaining.

Speaker 2 (01:00:28):
You know what I mean, I'm just talking about the
Ferris.

Speaker 3 (01:00:30):
Bueller.

Speaker 1 (01:00:30):
In its own, yeah, but in its own bizarro world.
You know, execution, that stillwould be entertaining, you know
.
But genuinely dry people.
You can't do that man, you gotto get the right.

Speaker 2 (01:00:42):
We talked about it with Christine because she was
the front of the house.
There normally is a barrier,christine.
There's normally a barrierbetween the wall of the kitchen
and the front of the house andsome chefs are like I'm not
going out there, but that's whya lot of them.

Speaker 1 (01:00:58):
That's why celebrity chefism is a big deal, because
now people who have you know,who are extroverts, now get into
the kitchen and those are theones that go out and talk to
everybody and you know they walkaround with a glass of wine and
you know, do their thing.
That's a whole nother yeahpersonality trait.
You know, do their thing.
That's a whole otherpersonality trait, you know.
But I think that's cool.

(01:01:18):
Anyway, I think that UCAT youknow Juan, included in this, I
think has the….
Culinary chops, the gear, yeah,whoa.
No, the culinary chops arethere.
I'm talking about the gear, youknow.

Speaker 2 (01:01:30):
Well, they have everything.
Yeah, I mean, it's a one-stopshop.
The sparkle, the sparkle, no,it's.
What was that called?

Speaker 3 (01:01:41):
from the rubber, chef , chef rubber.
What were they, chef have?

Speaker 2 (01:01:42):
you seen that stuff?
No, I'll show you after theshow.
It's, it's all baking andpastry and they do a lot of
great stuff.
And the marketing person there,she's wonderful, but she's so
itchy.

Speaker 1 (01:01:54):
Madison Shout out All right.
So thank you for coming on theshow.
Thank you one for coming on inand hanging out.
Your dish was awesome.
I know there's going to bereally cool stuff that we're all
going to do together here.
A hundred percent certain.
How do they find a, how do theyfind the company and how do

(01:02:15):
they find you Find?

Speaker 3 (01:02:16):
the company we're at cateringbythefamilycom.
And then me, I'm zakariaxel, orunderscore axel, on Instagram,
so Z-A-K-A-R-I underscore A-X-Edouble L.
You fit that too.

Speaker 1 (01:02:32):
All right.

Speaker 2 (01:02:33):
You know what, make sure you get some sleep and
thank you for coming today.
We appreciate you.
You know what, make sure youget some sleep and thank you for
coming today.

Speaker 1 (01:02:37):
We appreciate you.
You know what I was almostgoing to be like.
Hey, let me give you the coach.

Speaker 2 (01:02:40):
When I got that, hey, it's 830, or I'll be there at
830.

Speaker 1 (01:02:43):
I wasn't going to let you do all this without me no
you were there for eating.
I was always there for eating,john, as always you both, both

(01:03:09):
chefs here today.
Amazing food, we are out.

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Food Network’s Winner Of Chopped - Chef Zakari Davila

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Food Network’s Winner Of Chopped - Chef Zakari Davila