February 18, 2025 • 41 mins
Chef Matthew Beaudin explores the intersection of culinary innovation and sustainability while advocating for responsible seafood sourcing. His discussion sheds light on global sourcing practices, community engagement, and the vital role of consumer awareness in conservation efforts.
• Chef Matthew’s diverse culinary background and its effect on his approach
• Importance of the Seafood Watch program in guiding sustainable choices
• Building meaningful partnerships with farmers and fishermen
• Creating innovative dining experiences in cultural attractions
• Collaborations with chocolate producers to elevate sustainable sourcing
• Emphasizing mentorship and ongoing learning in the culinary industry
• Inspiring consumers to consider the environmental impact of their food choices
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Hello Food Fam.
This is the Walk Talk Podcastwhere you will find the perfect
blend of food fun and cookingknowledge.
I'm your host, carl Fiodini.
Welcome to the number one foodpodcast in the country.
We're recording on-site at IbisImages Studios, where food
photography comes alive and Iget to eat it.
Here's a humble request to givea follow on Instagram at
(00:31):
walkandtalkshow.
That's a big please and thankyou.
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(00:53):
risk-free trials.
Here's an update we're going tobe with our friends chefs Nick
and Polly Barrington at the NAFMshow up in Atlanta next week
covering the US Culinary Opencooking competition.
We'll be at booth 6614.
That's 6614.
Come by and say hello.
Maybe we'll put you on camera.
I don't know.
We'll see how I'm feeling thatday.
So today we're joined byMatthew Bowden, the Corporate
(01:18):
Director of Culinary Innovationfor SSA Group and Culinary
Director at the Monterey BayAquarium.
With experience spanningkitchens from Hong Kong to
Rwanda, matthew is a leader incrafting innovative dining
experiences that prioritizeenvironmental stewardship.
His tenure at multiplefive-star properties has
solidified his reputation forexcellence and creativity in the
(01:39):
culinary world.
Join us as we discuss howMatthew is redefining
sustainable dining and inspiringocean conservation through his
culinary vision.
Get ready for an insightfulconversation that promises to
enrich your perspective on foodand the environment.
Chef Matthew, welcome to theprogram.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
What's going on, man?
Thanks for having me Reallyappreciate it.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
You know, I tell you what, I tell you what, I tell
you what.
It was really great how we met,which I just want to give a
shout out to LinkedIn we werejust talking about it off air
man.
People come together on thatplatform.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
Heck yeah, you're a hard man to track down.
I'm glad I finally got sometime with you here.
Speaker 1 (02:17):
Me or you, dude, you're jet setting across the
globe looking for, like you know, I don't know shrimp.
I don't know.
Where are you going?
Where are you going right now?
Where are you?
You're heading off somewhere.
Where are you heading out to?
I am?
Speaker 2 (02:28):
actually headed to Vietnam and then over to
Thailand, and so I'm going to golook for some cool, sustainable
shrimp options that are seafoodwatch green best choice.
Speaker 1 (02:39):
See, I told you it was shrimp, I knew it was.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
It's a pretty awesome job to have.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
How did you actually come into this gig?
Speaker 2 (02:44):
So a buddy of mine was the corporate executive chef
at the time and he said, hey,listen, I have this opportunity
in California.
Would you be willing to give ita go?
He said we have a partnershipout there and we're trying to
find just the right person.
Would you give me about a year?
I said yeah, absolutely noproblem.
So I kind of packed it up, wentto california and it's it's
(03:07):
been 10 years and the companyitself is called the ssa group,
based out of denver, colorado,family-owned company, and we
literally just focus on zoos,aquariums and museums.
Right, it's the core of ourbusiness.
And so cultural attractions andwhen you work with those people
like their soul is conservation, sustainability, and so being
able to wake up every single dayand focus on those things from
(03:29):
a food perspective is wild dudeand it never gets old.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
Well, you've been in some diverse kitchens around the
globe.
How have those experiences kindof put your culinary direction
into play?
Speaker 2 (03:41):
Diverse kitchens, I think is a broad statement.
Right, being in the places I'vebeen in across the globe has
really challenged my perspectiveon what a kitchen is.
And so when I was in Rwanda,for example, our kitchen was
outside and it was a grill.
And then we had an old seedmill and it was like this drum
that we threw a grate across thetop and that's where we baked
(04:03):
our bread.
The kitchen has really kind oftaken on a new form for me in
regards to like what it means tohave a kitchen, and for me
that's a place to bring peopletogether and a place to tell
stories and to meld traditionand sustainability really took
heart in Africa.
Right, I've built my the latterpart of my career here.
(04:24):
I say that at the ripe old ageof 41, the latter part of my
career here.
I say that at the ripe old ageof 41.
The latter part of my career onsustainability.
But sustainability there was awhole different story.
It was where does my water comefrom?
Where does my next meal comefrom?
Sustainability wasn't about theingredient itself as much as
the lifestyle, what I've takenand what's kind of shaped my
(04:44):
story has been whatsustainability truly means and
what it really feels like, andit's not always just the
ingredient, it's the impacts ofthat ingredient where they're
coming from.
You know what the impact thereis in truly taking a holistic
approach to it.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
You're kind of like the culinary Indiana Jones, okay
, because when I say diversekitchens, what I really mean is
you're traversing rivers andyou're landing on mountaintops
and you're doing things.
That it's adventure, it's anodyssey.
Everywhere you go, it isn'tjust like oh, I'm going to hang
out at the Hilton Hotel, you'regoing to remote places and these
(05:22):
kitchens are actually notkitchens.
It's open fire pits and whatnot.
I think that's fascinating.
I, I think you're one of these,like I think you're one of
these guys that if you, you havea bull whip and a fedora hat, I
think you're.
You know, I think you're goodto go.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Dude, you know what I'm saying yeah, but like when
you think about it, bro, likethat's where our food comes from
, right, and I think that'sthat's been my hope, right.
So at SSA group, we've leanedin a lot on like, hey, we have
some of the best food out there,there's nobody that doesn't
like us, and we put effort intoreshaping the dynamic of what a
culinary experience is andcultural attraction.
But the one piece we dive intoalso is where our food actually
(05:59):
comes from.
It's not like, oh, we get itfrom just US foods or we get it
from this broad line.
It's like where does that foodcome from?
Giving people the ability toconnect has been my biggest joy,
and so, whether it's onLinkedIn, sharing a story
through there, or whether it'smy ability to then take these
stories and sit down and sharethem over a meal or whatever it
(06:20):
is, it's the ability to sharewith people where their food
actually comes from.
I mean, it is those remotevillages, man, it is those out
there places.
The adventure is on your plateand I'm just trying to connect
you with it.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
You talked about shrimp, Chef.
You're talking about shrimpfrom Vietnam.
What is it that is the draw?
To take this trip to do theOdyssey to look for that product
?
Speaker 2 (06:49):
take this trip to do the odyssey to look for that
product.
Man, I'll tell you the theseafood watch program.
You know they, they kind ofrate, a kind of they.
They rate shrimp or any seafoodon this kind of stoplight scale
.
So it's green is best choice,yellow is a good alternative and
red is a void.
So green is like you can eat it, we can indulge in that yellow
being a good alternative and redis a void.
So green is like you can eat it, we can indulge in that.
Yellow being a good alternativeis like yeah, try it, but like
let's not eat it every night.
(07:10):
You know, this is somethingthat still has the opportunity
to become red if we're notcareful.
And red is like stay away fromit.
So when I'm looking at products, we always want to start and
say, hey, where are our optionsfor green and can we find
something that's green?
Best choice?
First, what that is like.
All the boxes have been checked, whether it's environmental
(07:31):
impact, the feed, the feed ratio, whether it's farmed or wild.
You know the catch method,whether you're trolling it,
making sure that you're notaffecting the bottom of the
ocean and the bottom of therivers, whatever you're fishing,
it really goes into everything,but what these things are.
Seafood Watch at its core.
It's a science-based program.
Right, you have marinebiologists and scientists that
(07:53):
are looking at all these thingsand it's absolutely incredible
to see and look at the work thatgoes into these things.
I just sat on the InternationalTuna Coalition meeting,
probably three weeks ago, as anobserver, who say that I didn't
understand what was going onwould be a massive
understatement, because the thethings they were talking about
and the data they were goingover was just insane to me.
(08:15):
But all of that data only worksif the consumer is engaged and
if the consumer asks questionsand if the consumer wants to
know.
What I'm looking for when I goover to Vietnam is to engage the
consumer.
I want to be able to tie themto the story and for them to go.
Hey, we understand where thisis coming from and we know that
(08:37):
these farms are approved bySeafood Watch as doing things
the right way.
They're certified and so weknow that when we make these
purchases, we are doing so withnot only the intent to have a
great meal, but to leave theworld a better place and to
support people that are doing itthe right way, because when it
comes to farm seafood.
(08:57):
There's a lot of intensiveshrimp farming that goes on.
There's a lot of intensivesalmon farming that goes on, and
as an average consumer, wedon't necessarily know what that
means.
But what it boils down to isthose intensive farms.
They're going to ruin theenvironment, right.
They're crushing the mangroveand the mangrove systems, their
escapes and inoculations in thesalmon population that are
(09:19):
getting into the localpopulations, and those are
dangerous.
We want to support the peoplewho are doing it responsibly and
making sure the ecosystem thatsurrounds what they're doing is
positive as well.
Speaker 1 (09:30):
It's a great job.
What you're doing right now isadmirable.
Thank you, Appreciate it.
There's another part to thisand that is you're changing the
lives of the farmers that you'reencountering.
These are, I presume, in manycases very rural areas, not a
lot of money and SSA is a pretty.
(09:51):
Ssa Group is a pretty largeorganization, even though it's a
family-run operation.
That's a lot of product to bebuying or purchasing.
Putting these deals togetherfor these farms, You're changing
the lives of those people.
That's got to feel terrific.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
Yeah, it feels incredible, but I think that's
one of the things that's kind ofthe core of who we are right is
our people are the power, andso our people doesn't stop at
the people who are our team, youknow, or the SSA family, it's
these partners.
And I go so far out of my wayto not say vendor right, because
a vendor is just a relationship.
(10:31):
It's just hey, I'm going to buythis from you for this amount
of money, and that's it.
What we do is we form thesebonds right and they become part
of our family and they are partof the SSA group.
And so when we look at thesefarmers, it's not, hey, give me
a shrimp at X price, see youlater.
Like it's hey, how are youdoing?
How can we help you?
(10:52):
How can we better get you tomarket?
And that's the desire here is toimpact lives right.
At the end of the day, it's ashrimp like the amount of shrimp
cocktail you can see in a year,I'm sure is astronomical.
And the, the people that areinvolved in this process, are
what's so important.
And whether their son or theirdaughter becomes the next shrimp
(11:14):
farmer who then owns the nextshrimp company but then becomes
the biggest shrimp operator inthe entire world, and they go
hey, hey, my grandfather did itright, I followed the seafood
watch guide.
Now we're going to as well Likethe impacts are so far reaching
, and so, at the very best, youhope that you can impact the
(11:34):
next person who's going to bethe person that changes the
world, and I think a lot oftimes we underestimate that as
people like that.
Speaker 1 (11:40):
The impact of one is massive, think a lot of times we
underestimate that, as peoplelike that, the impact of one is
massive.
Speaker 2 (11:51):
How many countries have you been to for SSA group
and how many friends have youmade I'd say a handful with SSA?
I've been really fortunate man.
This, this job, has been soincredible to me and you know,
the core of what we do everysingle day is in the United
States and it's within theborders of the United States,
and our partners are here and wehave nearly 100 incredible
partnerships and zoos andaquariums and museums across the
United States and chances arethere's there's one next to
(12:13):
every single person who'slistening, and I would encourage
you to go support them, becausewhen you think about getting a
meal there, that's supportingconservation.
You know there are partners andand we are walking hand-in-hand
with them You'll never see anSSA group logo because we assume
the identity of our partners,because we truly believe in the
mission, but the friends areendless, right?
(12:35):
I think it's such a small worldwhen you get out there and I
think as a kid, you look at itand you're like man, I don't
even know how to get down thestreet, I have no idea how to
get to the next city over, andif I did, I wouldn't know where
to go.
But when you start connectingthe dots, it's like that there's
a six degrees of separation,whatever it is, and you start to
realize that these impacts thefriendships you have, the
(12:56):
relationships you make.
They're so important and youknow I'm beyond thankful for
that?
Speaker 1 (13:02):
Has your life ever been in danger when you're going
to one of these remotelocations?
Speaker 2 (13:05):
I don't think so.
You know, maybe that's justblind bliss to me, to me, to me.
You know I don't think so.
Yeah, I'd like to hope not.
There's a lot of hype, right.
You know, in one of the safestplaces I've ever been to in my
life that I feel like I was themost afraid to go was Rwanda.
There was a massive conflictthere at one time and I got
(13:27):
there and people were so niceand I say to this day one day
I'll retire to the hills ofRwanda because it is so peaceful
and so quiet and so nice andeveryone is so hospitable.
Same thing in Mexico.
You hear a lot of things, butMexico, when I go to mexico the
mexico I know, I love it is sofull of culture, in diversity,
and just history and steep in,just people's, people's
(13:53):
grandparents, handing thingsdown and handed things down you
just, you have this amazingcommunity that is built on
tradition and I just, just, Ilove it.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
Let's talk chocolate, let's talk Ghana and let's talk
to Florida Aquarium here inTampa.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
We are.
We actually had a partnershipSSA has with Cho Chocolate out
in Berkeley, california, for, Iwant to say, the better part of
two years now and this, thischocolate partnership, is just
organic, right, I had seen showchocolate one day I reached out
to the guys and I was like, heyman, what would it take to to
work with you guys?
Like I don't know what therelationship looks like, I just
(14:30):
love what you're doing.
I think it's really really cooland I love your story.
Fast forward.
I started talking to the chiefchocolatier his name is brad
kinsinger and the folks at showand they came up with their
first collaboration bar with us,and so it was called deep, dark
and salty, and we started atthe Monterey Bay Aquarium.
We took our seaweed, which isgrown locally, we dried it out,
(14:52):
we took salt from big sourcesalts over Monterey as well and
we mixed that with darkchocolate and the bar made it in
the New York Times.
It was this epic collaborationand we realized there was
something to that partnership.
Since then have come up with abar for the oakland zoo called
the grizzly bar, we came up withone for the museum of pop
culture and then we have onecoming out for the florida
(15:15):
aquarium.
Uh, that'll be out end of thissummer, so it's going to be epic
.
That being said, in order to beable to tell this story, uh, we
really wanted to kind of open upthe book for the florida
aquarium bar, and so I'm goingto head to ghana with cho and
kind of do the whole, the wholegamut.
We're going to go pick thecocoa, harvest it, process it
(15:38):
into raw cocoa in ghana, comeback to Berkeley, process that
into a chocolate bar, and thenwe'll bring that down to Tampa.
And so, in true SSA form,following the ingredient from
harvest to the plate, is reallyimportant to us and knowing the
people in between, and I'mextremely pumped to be able to
go do that with them.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
When you're putting together a program like this,
there's so much that has to beaccounted for.
What sort of challenges do yourun into in putting these
programs together?
Speaker 2 (16:06):
I think the challenge is more on the logistics side.
When you look at it for anyoneout there who's an operator in a
restaurant, you start lookingat getting things from point A
to point B or purchasing thingsin bulk or making sure they're
going to sell.
There's a large what if inthese things, right.
So you go all the way to Ghana,you procure this cocoa, you
(16:28):
bring it back to California, youprocess it and then you hope
that people are going to engagewith it.
I think when you look at apartnership like we have with
Cho, it's so incredible becausethey are a vegan chocolate and
so they have a cool story.
They source cocoa responsibly,right.
(16:48):
Obviously, that's a huge piecefor us making sure it's
responsibly sourced, and so thestory's there.
And then when you couple thatwith a conservation based
organization like the FloridaAquarium, it's a perfect recipe
for success.
No pun intended, our goal is tobring the story to life in
these things, and not just thestory this is a cool chocolate
(17:11):
bar for conservation but thestory that you said earlier of
the people and the partnersthemselves.
The challenge is firstlogistics and the second is
conveying that story and gettingpeople to understand when
you're holding this chocolatebar in your hand.
What does that mean?
Where did that come?
Come from?
Who made that?
I think and the story is is thehardest piece to tell sometimes
you bring up a great point.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
You have the entire world at your fingertips in
terms of culinary direction.
Let's say here on the stateside that have to put together a
menu.
At the end of the day, you'refeeding people at a museum or at
an aquarium and the food has tobe good.
Where does the inspiration comefrom to see this thing through?
Speaker 2 (17:53):
It comes from anywhere, and I think that's
that's what I love most is likeI'm the guy.
Yeah, but is it a round table?
Speaker 1 (18:00):
Is it a round table thing?
Is it?
Is how many people are involvedin putting a menu together that
you have to go and traverse theglobe, and locally too,
domestically too, but you're outthere.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
How many people are involved in that?
I mean, for us it's our wholeteam, right?
So we have over 100 executivechefs in our group and so we're
constantly working together tocome up with ideas.
I literally after after talkingto you today, I'm getting on a
call with all of them.
We're at a quarterly call wherewe do exactly that.
We sit down, we talk about coolstuff, you know, we talk about
(18:36):
who's doing what, what's new,what's fresh, like any crazy
ideas you have, like that'swhere they come from.
I'm the dude who sleeps with anotebook next to my bed, bro,
for real, and it's literallyjust like I wake up in the
middle of the night and go whatif?
And I write it down and that'swhere these things come from.
We have some of the most epicpartnerships that just come via
the connections you know fromfrom one person to another.
(18:58):
Uh, one of of my, my favoriteconnections right now is happy
himalayan water, and we startedtalking to these guys, I'd say
about six, eight months ago, andthey said we have a canned
water, aluminum canned water,and we, we wanna, we want to
sell the aquarium.
I said cool, tell me more aboutit.
They said it's got himalayansea salt in it for hydration, he
(19:20):
said, because when I perform Iwant to be hydrated.
What do you mean when youperform?
He said, oh, I'm a countrymusic singer, who?
He said, oh, nico Moon.
I said you got to be kidding me.
And so I look it up and it'sthis country music megastar and
he started a water company wherehe's selling canned water now.
(19:43):
Yeah, so over the past sixmonths we've really dialed this
thing in.
So there's there's no plastic onit.
The entire can is made ofaluminum and we're even moving
to, like the, the beer can stylewhere you pop it.
So underneath the cap of mostaluminum bottles is a piece of
plastic for freshness and safety.
But if you have just the beercan pop top, they don't even
(20:05):
need that.
Additionally, this can it'staken so long to kind of
fabricate because on the outsideit has this color change,
because a huge part of who notonly Nika Moon, but Happy
Himalayan is about mental health.
He found that if you could makethe cans change color, it would
(20:26):
encourage kids to get outsidein the sun so they can watch the
can turn color.
Everybody knows when you getsun you're a little bit happier.
This can has a color-changinglabel.
Additionally, the aluminum ispopped up on the outside.
It's like a fidget label.
And so really finding partners,man, that, like they're, they're
(20:47):
totally invested, like we are,and they believe in the mission,
I think, like I said earlier tome, it's not a vendor, we don't
do the vendor piece becauseit's a partner.
The partner is something somuch bigger.
It's somebody who believes innot only our mission, but it's
somebody whose mission we canbelieve in and totally buy into.
Like this is this is somethingwe can get behind, right?
It's not just hey, send me abox and I'll open the box and
(21:08):
we'll cook some food.
It's what's your story.
You know, how are you doingstuff that's going to make the
world a better place?
And I think that's the questionwe ask every single time, like
what are you doing that's goingto make the world a better place
?
Speaker 1 (21:30):
Matt, you've been on the Food five-star hotels and
establishments.
Speaker 2 (21:33):
How much of that prepared you for this particular
leg of your career.
The piece for me that I usedmost from that part of my life
is how to redefine this marketsegment right.
And so when you look atcultural attractions in general,
it's usually like you get yourhamburger, you know, your
cracker jacks, your popcorn,whatever it is.
You get this like cannedexperience almost um, for lack
(21:56):
of a better word.
And so, coming from that worldof higher end dining and you
know luxury and the show, Ithink has given me the
opportunity to translate that tothis world and say how do we
redefine this world?
How do we do somethingdifferent?
(22:16):
For example, we startedprobably four years ago.
I was talking to one of theteam members at one of our units
and I said what are we missing?
I said you talk to people morethan I do.
You see people every single day.
You are out here as the brief.
I said chef, we need lemonade.
I said lemonade.
I said that's silly.
I said what else?
(22:37):
He said we're missing lemonade.
I said I'll give it a shot.
So we went back, made a coupleof gallons of lemonade.
20 minutes later he comes in,he goes.
We're out of lemonade.
I said you gotta be kidding me.
So I made some more lemonade.
He comes back.
He says chef, we're out.
I said what?
So we started this lemonadeprogram.
(23:00):
Lemonade became our biggestseller last summer.
I said this is wild to me.
I said I don't understand it.
But how can we make it better?
I refuse to just give peoplethe regular lemonade experience.
And so we bought these bigglass carafts and we lined the
insides with fruit.
You could come up and get thisfresh glass jar of lemonade,
(23:20):
because we're not doing singleuse.
And so you get the glass jar totake with you and you take it.
It's like a mason jar, reallycool experience.
And this year I said that's,that's cool, and all but people
are starting to catch on.
How do we make it better?
And so we bought the sugar cane.
Uh, press, so what if we tookfresh sugar cane and we ground a
cane over some some crushed ice?
(23:43):
And then we took fresh lemons,squeezed them in there, oh yeah.
And then a piece of mint, right,and.
And then you, right, you cantaste it, right.
And then you get this like thisfresh squeezed lemonade with
cane sugar and mint, and liketalk about the most refreshing
thing, but it's a memory too.
Like think about when you wentto like fairs as a kid or you
(24:04):
know you went to the zoo, likethere's, there's things that
stick with you, and I just feellike as a kid or you know you
went to the zoo, like there'sthings that stick with you, and
I just feel like as a kid,walking up and being like I
watched them grind this sugarcane over crushed ice and then
squeeze the fresh lemon and thewhole lemon gets put in the ice
and then there's this mint andlike that's a memory.
And so I think creating thesecore memories for people of
doing things differently is soepic and that's what we're
(24:27):
trying to do.
Speaker 1 (24:28):
It's a core memory, but it's also the right way of
making the product.
You didn't cut corners on thequality of it.
It's not processed, it'ssomething, it's fresh and I
think that's the story.
That's beautiful and that leadsme to say your colleagues, the
other chefs, everyone that'spart of the SSA group experience
(24:49):
with your chefs across thecompany.
Are there learning curves?
Because these are cats thatcome from the food industry and
obviously they need to put outgood food, and food cost is a
thing, but it seems to me whatyou guys are trying to actually
execute is an experience, alongwith the sustainability part of
(25:11):
this.
What's the process there?
Speaker 2 (25:13):
Yes, there's a learning curve, but we also hire
outside of that network, right.
So, like we, we know peoplefrom hotels are used to doing
hotel things.
We know people who do and finddining like that's what they're
comfortable with.
And so, like we, we want peopleto come in and redefine and be
uncomfortable with us.
And so I think that, whilethere's a learning curve and
people might look at that as anegative sometimes in life, we
(25:35):
want that.
Like we want the people thatare hungry to reshape the
industry with us.
We want the people that aregoing to break the mold, and I
think that is what sets us apart, right.
So you come into some companies.
It's like here's our box, fitin this box.
And you come work with us andit's like, hey, we're not
building a box, like we'rebuilding a circle and we want
(25:57):
you to help.
And so I think that's the piecewhere you get to come and be
part of it.
You're not necessarily pluggedinto this hole versus required
to help build.
And I think that when you startputting a bunch of culinary
engineers together like that,you come culinary masters that
are like rocking the grill everysingle day and putting out the
(26:30):
hamburgers and the hot dogs andthe most incredible pizzas you
ever have, and so figuring outhow to leverage that experience.
But then you start talkingthousands and thousands of
people who've been in theindustry for 10, 15, 20 years.
You're talking like hundreds ofthousands of years of
experience, tens of thousands ofyears experience over this
organization.
How do you leverage that?
That, for me, is what gets memost excited.
(26:52):
It's like who's the next greatidea going to come from?
Because they're not me.
The ideas come from aconversation that I'm having
with somebody else.
The ideas come from, like youknow, somebody else posted a
picture online.
I'm like, dude, that's crazy.
Like we, we could take that andrun with it.
Like why don't we take this?
And just like, take a left?
(27:13):
Or like let's joke right realquick.
Like, figure out how to takethe cool ideas and then elevate
them in a way that not only theythey create an experience for
people, they're Instagrammable,they're memorable, but that
they're redefining an industryand get other people to want to
follow it.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
Other people in the industry either mimic or try and
change.
What we're doing is so cool,man, because it means we're
being impactful and we're reallymaking a difference On the
chocolate bar, for example.
You're putting that together.
It sounds amazing.
Speaker 2 (27:48):
Is each property going to carry that, or is it
limited to just a handful or one?
So the chocolate bar is kind ofa handful, you know, and we're
working with partnerships acrossour portfolio that are
interested in I think for thechocolate bar.
It's telling the story.
You know, what we're reallyworking on is trying to figure
out a way to turn that into hotchocolate programming, right,
like, how do we take thatpartnership and create a craft,
(28:09):
high-end program where, like,hey, you're hot chocolate.
Yes, we have this cool onethat's that's unique.
But we have this crack hotchocolate and this one tells an
amazing story as well, and so,like it's like in my friend,
there's levels to it, you know.
And so, like, how do we developthese different tiers of of
cool?
We're like, you have the verybasic level that that still
(28:33):
exceeds everyone's expectations.
But then you can, you can grabthis other one that is just so
unique and it's something you'venever seen.
You just got to have it.
That, for me, is what I look forwhen I'm out dining.
When I'm out dining, when I'mout exploring, I look for the
thing that I just got to have,that I know I've never seen that
before.
I'm never going to see it again, but I got to have it, and so I
(28:57):
that's that's what I keep inmind when I'm trying to develop
things and I'm trying to come upwith new ideas is what's that
thing that's going to catch youreye, what's that thing that's
going to inspire you to dosomething different, or inspire
you to think outside the boxyourself?
Speaker 1 (29:13):
It's safe to say and tell me if I'm wrong that the
Monterey Bay Aquarium isprobably the place to be,
because it's probably yourbiggest test kitchen, right?
Speaker 2 (29:22):
The Monterey Bay Aquarium is my biggest test
kitchen the setting alone right.
The monterey bay aquarium is mybiggest test kitchen the the
setting alone right.
I'm in the salinas valley,which is full of the most
incredible humans there is.
So many times that I've beendriving, whether it's the
airport or back and forth to apartner's location, you know, to
go look at their shop or go seewhat they have, or go, you know
(29:44):
, check on the new fish that arecoming in or the the new
produce targets, that I drive bythe fields and you had to stop,
because there's something soincredibly humbling to drive
through the salinas valley andsee how hard people work, and
like that, I think was was oneof the precipice for me to like
(30:05):
get people involved and letpeople know where their food
comes from, because when youdrive through these fields and
you see people picking produce,planting produce, it is it's
life-changing and it's righthere in the united states and so
when I'm, when I'm in monterey,I'm working like that.
That is my place to think anddream, because I have the ocean,
(30:28):
I have the Salinas Valley, Ihave all the ranches.
Like our salt is hand harvestedright down the road, our
seaweed is grown in the largestseaweed Red Bulls production
facility in the country, likefive blocks down the road.
Our abalone is grown a blockdown the road, like you can't
get any closer to the product.
(30:49):
And so I realize how fortunateI am to be immersed in that and
I just want to make sure thatwhen people come they feel the
same way.
When I first moved to Monterey Ihad kind of gone down and
checked out all the localbusinesses and there's chowder
and all these things.
I said when I go to Kansas Cityyou get barbecue.
(31:13):
I always wonder if I'm gettingthe real barbecue, if I'm
getting the tourist barbecue, orif I go to Florida I'm getting
seafood.
Am I getting the localexperience, like the guy that
just caught the grouper, or am Igetting the cod fromouper, or
am I getting, like you know, the, the cod from new England, like
what?
What am I getting?
And so I I kind of committedthat when you come in and dine
(31:33):
in our location like you'regetting the real experience and
you are leaving knowing that theexperience was authentic and
the food was authentic.
And that's one of the mostimportant things to me is to
know that when you dine youexperience locality and you're
not going to get butternutsquash in the summer, you know
(31:53):
you're not going to get tomatoesin the winter.
It's a true experience.
It's the most authentic oneyou're going to get, because
we're true to the seasons, we'retrue to the partners, we're
true to the people that aredoing the work.
Speaker 1 (32:06):
You're speaking my language.
There's nothing worse thangetting watermelons in the
wintertime.
I loathe it so much.
My background is in producedistribution and you know
obviously your clients have aneed, a want and a menu and you
need to source these things andyou know that's where you start.
You know shipping containersfull of fruits and veg that take
(32:29):
a long time to get here and bythe time it arrives, and by the
time it gets to the warehouseand then ultimately delivered
into a kitchen, quality is notgreat, the flavor is not there
because it's terrible, and itleaves a bad mark on the
establishment who's selling it.
So what you're telling me is abreath of fresh air.
You're a leader in thisparticular trend.
(32:49):
Do you see others that aregoing to look to participate in
this with you guys as well?
Speaker 2 (32:54):
You know, for us, when you talk about seasonality
and things like that, like whenwe were at menus, it's not me
saying, hey, here's the menu,right, like here's what we're
going to serve, because this iswhat we want to serve.
And here's the menu, right,like, here's what we're going to
serve, because this is what wewant to serve, and I'm the chef
and this is my will be done.
It's hey, let's sit down withour farmers and let's sit down
with the fishermen and let's sitdown with the ranchers.
(33:15):
And we talked to them and gohey, what, what, what's growing
this year?
You know, what are you going toplant?
(33:41):
What didn't do well last year?
What was a struggle for you?
What did you, you know, have towater too much, that you lost
money and it wasn't, it wasn'tfruitful for you, right, and
have chefs and you know, withthe advent of the Food Network
and all these things, kind ofeverybody learned a little bit
more and got a little more intofood and I think I became a chef
at the right time.
But I also became a chef at achallenging time, when everybody
knows more than they used toknow.
You can fight that or you canembrace it, and I chose to
(34:18):
embrace it and say I am going todouble down and be an educator,
you know, protect the ocean andget people to to really dive
into sustainability andconservation and consider the
choices.
I never would have believed you, but I realize now that there's
so much more to being a chefand there's so many other
(34:38):
avenues and I think that that'sone of the pieces I hope people
take away.
Most is like you.
Speaker 1 (34:44):
you can do something other than just cook food as a
chef and you can still make anamazing difference it must be a
fertile environment when itcomes to mentorship with your
young chefs in thesustainability world that we're
living in it is, and I thinkpeople are so excited to learn
more.
Speaker 2 (35:04):
You and it's not even the young chefs, right Like
young chefs, older chefs, likewe're all kind of inspiring and
mentoring each other indifferent disciplines, if you
will right, some are intosustainability, some are into,
like molecular gastronomy, someare into, you know, whatever it
is, and I think that's one ofthe cool pieces where people
dive so deep into a, into adiscipline or area of focus, and
(35:29):
when you find those people,those diamonds in the rough, you
can kind of latch onto them andlearn from them.
That gets me pumped, man, likeI love finding somebody who
knows something I don't and I'mconstantly trying to teach
myself.
Reading has become one of thebiggest things to me, you know,
trying to find out differentways to speak to people and
different ways to engage withpeople.
(35:50):
And if you look at yourself aslike this, this painting, you
get a lifetime to change thatpainting and it just takes one
brushstroke to change the entiredynamic.
So for me, getting more engagedwith reading and trying to
figure out how do I, how do Ichange myself just enough that I
can reinvent myself, but I cankeep.
(36:12):
I can keep the narrative of thestory but make it a little more
exciting.
So the the ability to teachthat to other people but
continue to learn.
Man like this industry isconstantly changing.
You know you said he came froma, a produce sales background
dude.
Like whoever would have thoughtyou're running the number one
(36:33):
food podcast on Apple Likethat's.
That's wild, stupidly, stupidly.
So the directions are insane.
Man Like you can.
You can literally take itwherever you want to take it and
if you put it out there in theuniverse and you make it yours
like it's there, it's there.
People, people want to learn,everybody wants to learn.
Speaker 1 (36:54):
I feel like this is all like blunt force trauma in
my life.
How it's gone down.
It's just barreling through nofinesse whatsoever.
It's just like banging yourhead on every branch on the way
to falling out of the tree.
Matt man, I got to tell youyou're awesome and I love what
you do, and I mean it when I saythat you are the Indiana Jones
(37:15):
of you know chefs out there.
How do we find you and how dowe find more about SSA Group?
Speaker 2 (37:24):
Man, I'll tell you it's been awesome talking to you
too, and it's probably thefirst time in my life I've been
called Indiana Jones.
I think I was recently calledWolverine in Vietnam, but that's
a whole nother story foranother day.
When you ask how to get engagedand how to get involved, the
best way is to visit your localzoo or aquarium or museum, like
(37:47):
that's the best way.
When you spend your money in it, it goes towards conservation
efforts of those organizations,like there's no better way and
it's a little bit of fun.
The SSA Group probably, again,the most incredible place I've
ever worked in my lifethessagroupcom.
If you're looking to find me, Iam on LinkedIn, and LinkedIn
only.
I'm the only guy rocking a pairof Grundons, throwing a fishing
(38:09):
trap over the edge of a boat.
Speaker 1 (38:11):
I'll see you there.
That is awesome.
Everybody out there, come checkus out in Atlanta at NAFM.
It's going to be a bad ass.
Matt, you are terrific and Iappreciate you being on the show
today.
Stand by, I'm going to catchyou off air.
Hold on.
Hello Food Fam.
This is the Walk Talk Podcastwhere you will find the perfect
blend of food fun and cookingknowledge.
I'm your host, carl Fiodini.
Welcome to the number one foodpodcast in the country.
We're recording on-site at IbisImages Studios, where food
photography comes alive and Iget to eat it.
Here's a humble request to givea follow on Instagram at
(00:31):
walkandtalkshow.
That's a big please and thankyou.
Are you tired of manual fruitcutting?
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It's an automated solution thatcuts 120 citrus wedges per
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With consistent slices and ahygienic design, it enhances
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(00:53):
risk-free trials.
Here's an update we're going tobe with our friends chefs Nick
and Polly Barrington at the NAFMshow up in Atlanta next week
covering the US Culinary Opencooking competition.
We'll be at booth 6614.
That's 6614.
Come by and say hello.
Maybe we'll put you on camera.
I don't know.
We'll see how I'm feeling thatday.
So today we're joined byMatthew Bowden, the Corporate
(01:18):
Director of Culinary Innovationfor SSA Group and Culinary
Director at the Monterey BayAquarium.
With experience spanningkitchens from Hong Kong to
Rwanda, matthew is a leader incrafting innovative dining
experiences that prioritizeenvironmental stewardship.
His tenure at multiplefive-star properties has
solidified his reputation forexcellence and creativity in the
(01:39):
culinary world.
Join us as we discuss howMatthew is redefining
sustainable dining and inspiringocean conservation through his
culinary vision.
Get ready for an insightfulconversation that promises to
enrich your perspective on foodand the environment.
Chef Matthew, welcome to theprogram.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
What's going on, man?
Thanks for having me Reallyappreciate it.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
You know, I tell you what, I tell you what, I tell
you what.
It was really great how we met,which I just want to give a
shout out to LinkedIn we werejust talking about it off air
man.
People come together on thatplatform.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
Heck yeah, you're a hard man to track down.
I'm glad I finally got sometime with you here.
Speaker 1 (02:17):
Me or you, dude, you're jet setting across the
globe looking for, like you know, I don't know shrimp.
I don't know.
Where are you going?
Where are you going right now?
Where are you?
You're heading off somewhere.
Where are you heading out to?
I am?
Speaker 2 (02:28):
actually headed to Vietnam and then over to
Thailand, and so I'm going to golook for some cool, sustainable
shrimp options that are seafoodwatch green best choice.
Speaker 1 (02:39):
See, I told you it was shrimp, I knew it was.
Speaker 2 (02:40):
It's a pretty awesome job to have.
Speaker 1 (02:42):
How did you actually come into this gig?
Speaker 2 (02:44):
So a buddy of mine was the corporate executive chef
at the time and he said, hey,listen, I have this opportunity
in California.
Would you be willing to give ita go?
He said we have a partnershipout there and we're trying to
find just the right person.
Would you give me about a year?
I said yeah, absolutely noproblem.
So I kind of packed it up, wentto california and it's it's
(03:07):
been 10 years and the companyitself is called the ssa group,
based out of denver, colorado,family-owned company, and we
literally just focus on zoos,aquariums and museums.
Right, it's the core of ourbusiness.
And so cultural attractions andwhen you work with those people
like their soul is conservation, sustainability, and so being
able to wake up every single dayand focus on those things from
(03:29):
a food perspective is wild dudeand it never gets old.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
Well, you've been in some diverse kitchens around the
globe.
How have those experiences kindof put your culinary direction
into play?
Speaker 2 (03:41):
Diverse kitchens, I think is a broad statement.
Right, being in the places I'vebeen in across the globe has
really challenged my perspectiveon what a kitchen is.
And so when I was in Rwanda,for example, our kitchen was
outside and it was a grill.
And then we had an old seedmill and it was like this drum
that we threw a grate across thetop and that's where we baked
(04:03):
our bread.
The kitchen has really kind oftaken on a new form for me in
regards to like what it means tohave a kitchen, and for me
that's a place to bring peopletogether and a place to tell
stories and to meld traditionand sustainability really took
heart in Africa.
Right, I've built my the latterpart of my career here.
(04:24):
I say that at the ripe old ageof 41, the latter part of my
career here.
I say that at the ripe old ageof 41.
The latter part of my career onsustainability.
But sustainability there was awhole different story.
It was where does my water comefrom?
Where does my next meal comefrom?
Sustainability wasn't about theingredient itself as much as
the lifestyle, what I've takenand what's kind of shaped my
(04:44):
story has been whatsustainability truly means and
what it really feels like, andit's not always just the
ingredient, it's the impacts ofthat ingredient where they're
coming from.
You know what the impact thereis in truly taking a holistic
approach to it.
Speaker 1 (05:00):
You're kind of like the culinary Indiana Jones, okay
, because when I say diversekitchens, what I really mean is
you're traversing rivers andyou're landing on mountaintops
and you're doing things.
That it's adventure, it's anodyssey.
Everywhere you go, it isn'tjust like oh, I'm going to hang
out at the Hilton Hotel, you'regoing to remote places and these
(05:22):
kitchens are actually notkitchens.
It's open fire pits and whatnot.
I think that's fascinating.
I, I think you're one of these,like I think you're one of
these guys that if you, you havea bull whip and a fedora hat, I
think you're.
You know, I think you're goodto go.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Dude, you know what I'm saying yeah, but like when
you think about it, bro, likethat's where our food comes from
, right, and I think that'sthat's been my hope, right.
So at SSA group, we've leanedin a lot on like, hey, we have
some of the best food out there,there's nobody that doesn't
like us, and we put effort intoreshaping the dynamic of what a
culinary experience is andcultural attraction.
But the one piece we dive intoalso is where our food actually
(05:59):
comes from.
It's not like, oh, we get itfrom just US foods or we get it
from this broad line.
It's like where does that foodcome from?
Giving people the ability toconnect has been my biggest joy,
and so, whether it's onLinkedIn, sharing a story
through there, or whether it'smy ability to then take these
stories and sit down and sharethem over a meal or whatever it
(06:20):
is, it's the ability to sharewith people where their food
actually comes from.
I mean, it is those remotevillages, man, it is those out
there places.
The adventure is on your plateand I'm just trying to connect
you with it.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
You talked about shrimp, Chef.
You're talking about shrimpfrom Vietnam.
What is it that is the draw?
To take this trip to do theOdyssey to look for that product
?
Speaker 2 (06:49):
take this trip to do the odyssey to look for that
product.
Man, I'll tell you the theseafood watch program.
You know they, they kind ofrate, a kind of they.
They rate shrimp or any seafoodon this kind of stoplight scale
.
So it's green is best choice,yellow is a good alternative and
red is a void.
So green is like you can eat it, we can indulge in that yellow
being a good alternative and redis a void.
So green is like you can eat it, we can indulge in that.
Yellow being a good alternativeis like yeah, try it, but like
let's not eat it every night.
(07:10):
You know, this is somethingthat still has the opportunity
to become red if we're notcareful.
And red is like stay away fromit.
So when I'm looking at products, we always want to start and
say, hey, where are our optionsfor green and can we find
something that's green?
Best choice?
First, what that is like.
All the boxes have been checked, whether it's environmental
(07:31):
impact, the feed, the feed ratio, whether it's farmed or wild.
You know the catch method,whether you're trolling it,
making sure that you're notaffecting the bottom of the
ocean and the bottom of therivers, whatever you're fishing,
it really goes into everything,but what these things are.
Seafood Watch at its core.
It's a science-based program.
Right, you have marinebiologists and scientists that
(07:53):
are looking at all these thingsand it's absolutely incredible
to see and look at the work thatgoes into these things.
I just sat on the InternationalTuna Coalition meeting,
probably three weeks ago, as anobserver, who say that I didn't
understand what was going onwould be a massive
understatement, because the thethings they were talking about
and the data they were goingover was just insane to me.
(08:15):
But all of that data only worksif the consumer is engaged and
if the consumer asks questionsand if the consumer wants to
know.
What I'm looking for when I goover to Vietnam is to engage the
consumer.
I want to be able to tie themto the story and for them to go.
Hey, we understand where thisis coming from and we know that
(08:37):
these farms are approved bySeafood Watch as doing things
the right way.
They're certified and so weknow that when we make these
purchases, we are doing so withnot only the intent to have a
great meal, but to leave theworld a better place and to
support people that are doing itthe right way, because when it
comes to farm seafood.
(08:57):
There's a lot of intensiveshrimp farming that goes on.
There's a lot of intensivesalmon farming that goes on, and
as an average consumer, wedon't necessarily know what that
means.
But what it boils down to isthose intensive farms.
They're going to ruin theenvironment, right.
They're crushing the mangroveand the mangrove systems, their
escapes and inoculations in thesalmon population that are
(09:19):
getting into the localpopulations, and those are
dangerous.
We want to support the peoplewho are doing it responsibly and
making sure the ecosystem thatsurrounds what they're doing is
positive as well.
Speaker 1 (09:30):
It's a great job.
What you're doing right now isadmirable.
Thank you, Appreciate it.
There's another part to thisand that is you're changing the
lives of the farmers that you'reencountering.
These are, I presume, in manycases very rural areas, not a
lot of money and SSA is a pretty.
(09:51):
Ssa Group is a pretty largeorganization, even though it's a
family-run operation.
That's a lot of product to bebuying or purchasing.
Putting these deals togetherfor these farms, You're changing
the lives of those people.
That's got to feel terrific.
Speaker 2 (10:10):
Yeah, it feels incredible, but I think that's
one of the things that's kind ofthe core of who we are right is
our people are the power, andso our people doesn't stop at
the people who are our team, youknow, or the SSA family, it's
these partners.
And I go so far out of my wayto not say vendor right, because
a vendor is just a relationship.
(10:31):
It's just hey, I'm going to buythis from you for this amount
of money, and that's it.
What we do is we form thesebonds right and they become part
of our family and they are partof the SSA group.
And so when we look at thesefarmers, it's not, hey, give me
a shrimp at X price, see youlater.
Like it's hey, how are youdoing?
How can we help you?
(10:52):
How can we better get you tomarket?
And that's the desire here is toimpact lives right.
At the end of the day, it's ashrimp like the amount of shrimp
cocktail you can see in a year,I'm sure is astronomical.
And the, the people that areinvolved in this process, are
what's so important.
And whether their son or theirdaughter becomes the next shrimp
(11:14):
farmer who then owns the nextshrimp company but then becomes
the biggest shrimp operator inthe entire world, and they go
hey, hey, my grandfather did itright, I followed the seafood
watch guide.
Now we're going to as well Likethe impacts are so far reaching
, and so, at the very best, youhope that you can impact the
(11:34):
next person who's going to bethe person that changes the
world, and I think a lot oftimes we underestimate that as
people like that.
Speaker 1 (11:40):
The impact of one is massive, think a lot of times we
underestimate that, as peoplelike that, the impact of one is
massive.
Speaker 2 (11:51):
How many countries have you been to for SSA group
and how many friends have youmade I'd say a handful with SSA?
I've been really fortunate man.
This, this job, has been soincredible to me and you know,
the core of what we do everysingle day is in the United
States and it's within theborders of the United States,
and our partners are here and wehave nearly 100 incredible
partnerships and zoos andaquariums and museums across the
United States and chances arethere's there's one next to
(12:13):
every single person who'slistening, and I would encourage
you to go support them, becausewhen you think about getting a
meal there, that's supportingconservation.
You know there are partners andand we are walking hand-in-hand
with them You'll never see anSSA group logo because we assume
the identity of our partners,because we truly believe in the
mission, but the friends areendless, right?
(12:35):
I think it's such a small worldwhen you get out there and I
think as a kid, you look at itand you're like man, I don't
even know how to get down thestreet, I have no idea how to
get to the next city over, andif I did, I wouldn't know where
to go.
But when you start connectingthe dots, it's like that there's
a six degrees of separation,whatever it is, and you start to
realize that these impacts thefriendships you have, the
(12:56):
relationships you make.
They're so important and youknow I'm beyond thankful for
that?
Speaker 1 (13:02):
Has your life ever been in danger when you're going
to one of these remotelocations?
Speaker 2 (13:05):
I don't think so.
You know, maybe that's justblind bliss to me, to me, to me.
You know I don't think so.
Yeah, I'd like to hope not.
There's a lot of hype, right.
You know, in one of the safestplaces I've ever been to in my
life that I feel like I was themost afraid to go was Rwanda.
There was a massive conflictthere at one time and I got
(13:27):
there and people were so niceand I say to this day one day
I'll retire to the hills ofRwanda because it is so peaceful
and so quiet and so nice andeveryone is so hospitable.
Same thing in Mexico.
You hear a lot of things, butMexico, when I go to mexico the
mexico I know, I love it is sofull of culture, in diversity,
and just history and steep in,just people's, people's
(13:53):
grandparents, handing thingsdown and handed things down you
just, you have this amazingcommunity that is built on
tradition and I just, just, Ilove it.
Speaker 1 (14:02):
Let's talk chocolate, let's talk Ghana and let's talk
to Florida Aquarium here inTampa.
Speaker 2 (14:07):
We are.
We actually had a partnershipSSA has with Cho Chocolate out
in Berkeley, california, for, Iwant to say, the better part of
two years now and this, thischocolate partnership, is just
organic, right, I had seen showchocolate one day I reached out
to the guys and I was like, heyman, what would it take to to
work with you guys?
Like I don't know what therelationship looks like, I just
(14:30):
love what you're doing.
I think it's really really cooland I love your story.
Fast forward.
I started talking to the chiefchocolatier his name is brad
kinsinger and the folks at showand they came up with their
first collaboration bar with us,and so it was called deep, dark
and salty, and we started atthe Monterey Bay Aquarium.
We took our seaweed, which isgrown locally, we dried it out,
(14:52):
we took salt from big sourcesalts over Monterey as well and
we mixed that with darkchocolate and the bar made it in
the New York Times.
It was this epic collaborationand we realized there was
something to that partnership.
Since then have come up with abar for the oakland zoo called
the grizzly bar, we came up withone for the museum of pop
culture and then we have onecoming out for the florida
(15:15):
aquarium.
Uh, that'll be out end of thissummer, so it's going to be epic
.
That being said, in order to beable to tell this story, uh, we
really wanted to kind of open upthe book for the florida
aquarium bar, and so I'm goingto head to ghana with cho and
kind of do the whole, the wholegamut.
We're going to go pick thecocoa, harvest it, process it
(15:38):
into raw cocoa in ghana, comeback to Berkeley, process that
into a chocolate bar, and thenwe'll bring that down to Tampa.
And so, in true SSA form,following the ingredient from
harvest to the plate, is reallyimportant to us and knowing the
people in between, and I'mextremely pumped to be able to
go do that with them.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
When you're putting together a program like this,
there's so much that has to beaccounted for.
What sort of challenges do yourun into in putting these
programs together?
Speaker 2 (16:06):
I think the challenge is more on the logistics side.
When you look at it for anyoneout there who's an operator in a
restaurant, you start lookingat getting things from point A
to point B or purchasing thingsin bulk or making sure they're
going to sell.
There's a large what if inthese things, right.
So you go all the way to Ghana,you procure this cocoa, you
(16:28):
bring it back to California, youprocess it and then you hope
that people are going to engagewith it.
I think when you look at apartnership like we have with
Cho, it's so incredible becausethey are a vegan chocolate and
so they have a cool story.
They source cocoa responsibly,right.
(16:48):
Obviously, that's a huge piecefor us making sure it's
responsibly sourced, and so thestory's there.
And then when you couple thatwith a conservation based
organization like the FloridaAquarium, it's a perfect recipe
for success.
No pun intended, our goal is tobring the story to life in
these things, and not just thestory this is a cool chocolate
(17:11):
bar for conservation but thestory that you said earlier of
the people and the partnersthemselves.
The challenge is firstlogistics and the second is
conveying that story and gettingpeople to understand when
you're holding this chocolatebar in your hand.
What does that mean?
Where did that come?
Come from?
Who made that?
I think and the story is is thehardest piece to tell sometimes
you bring up a great point.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
You have the entire world at your fingertips in
terms of culinary direction.
Let's say here on the stateside that have to put together a
menu.
At the end of the day, you'refeeding people at a museum or at
an aquarium and the food has tobe good.
Where does the inspiration comefrom to see this thing through?
Speaker 2 (17:53):
It comes from anywhere, and I think that's
that's what I love most is likeI'm the guy.
Yeah, but is it a round table?
Speaker 1 (18:00):
Is it a round table thing?
Is it?
Is how many people are involvedin putting a menu together that
you have to go and traverse theglobe, and locally too,
domestically too, but you're outthere.
Speaker 2 (18:13):
How many people are involved in that?
I mean, for us it's our wholeteam, right?
So we have over 100 executivechefs in our group and so we're
constantly working together tocome up with ideas.
I literally after after talkingto you today, I'm getting on a
call with all of them.
We're at a quarterly call wherewe do exactly that.
We sit down, we talk about coolstuff, you know, we talk about
(18:36):
who's doing what, what's new,what's fresh, like any crazy
ideas you have, like that'swhere they come from.
I'm the dude who sleeps with anotebook next to my bed, bro,
for real, and it's literallyjust like I wake up in the
middle of the night and go whatif?
And I write it down and that'swhere these things come from.
We have some of the most epicpartnerships that just come via
the connections you know fromfrom one person to another.
(18:58):
Uh, one of of my, my favoriteconnections right now is happy
himalayan water, and we startedtalking to these guys, I'd say
about six, eight months ago, andthey said we have a canned
water, aluminum canned water,and we, we wanna, we want to
sell the aquarium.
I said cool, tell me more aboutit.
They said it's got himalayansea salt in it for hydration, he
(19:20):
said, because when I perform Iwant to be hydrated.
What do you mean when youperform?
He said, oh, I'm a countrymusic singer, who?
He said, oh, nico Moon.
I said you got to be kidding me.
And so I look it up and it'sthis country music megastar and
he started a water company wherehe's selling canned water now.
(19:43):
Yeah, so over the past sixmonths we've really dialed this
thing in.
So there's there's no plastic onit.
The entire can is made ofaluminum and we're even moving
to, like the, the beer can stylewhere you pop it.
So underneath the cap of mostaluminum bottles is a piece of
plastic for freshness and safety.
But if you have just the beercan pop top, they don't even
(20:05):
need that.
Additionally, this can it'staken so long to kind of
fabricate because on the outsideit has this color change,
because a huge part of who notonly Nika Moon, but Happy
Himalayan is about mental health.
He found that if you could makethe cans change color, it would
(20:26):
encourage kids to get outsidein the sun so they can watch the
can turn color.
Everybody knows when you getsun you're a little bit happier.
This can has a color-changinglabel.
Additionally, the aluminum ispopped up on the outside.
It's like a fidget label.
And so really finding partners,man, that, like they're, they're
(20:47):
totally invested, like we are,and they believe in the mission,
I think, like I said earlier tome, it's not a vendor, we don't
do the vendor piece becauseit's a partner.
The partner is something somuch bigger.
It's somebody who believes innot only our mission, but it's
somebody whose mission we canbelieve in and totally buy into.
Like this is this is somethingwe can get behind, right?
It's not just hey, send me abox and I'll open the box and
(21:08):
we'll cook some food.
It's what's your story.
You know, how are you doingstuff that's going to make the
world a better place?
And I think that's the questionwe ask every single time, like
what are you doing that's goingto make the world a better place
?
Speaker 1 (21:30):
Matt, you've been on the Food five-star hotels and
establishments.
Speaker 2 (21:33):
How much of that prepared you for this particular
leg of your career.
The piece for me that I usedmost from that part of my life
is how to redefine this marketsegment right.
And so when you look atcultural attractions in general,
it's usually like you get yourhamburger, you know, your
cracker jacks, your popcorn,whatever it is.
You get this like cannedexperience almost um, for lack
(21:56):
of a better word.
And so, coming from that worldof higher end dining and you
know luxury and the show, Ithink has given me the
opportunity to translate that tothis world and say how do we
redefine this world?
How do we do somethingdifferent?
(22:16):
For example, we startedprobably four years ago.
I was talking to one of theteam members at one of our units
and I said what are we missing?
I said you talk to people morethan I do.
You see people every single day.
You are out here as the brief.
I said chef, we need lemonade.
I said lemonade.
I said that's silly.
I said what else?
(22:37):
He said we're missing lemonade.
I said I'll give it a shot.
So we went back, made a coupleof gallons of lemonade.
20 minutes later he comes in,he goes.
We're out of lemonade.
I said you gotta be kidding me.
So I made some more lemonade.
He comes back.
He says chef, we're out.
I said what?
So we started this lemonadeprogram.
(23:00):
Lemonade became our biggestseller last summer.
I said this is wild to me.
I said I don't understand it.
But how can we make it better?
I refuse to just give peoplethe regular lemonade experience.
And so we bought these bigglass carafts and we lined the
insides with fruit.
You could come up and get thisfresh glass jar of lemonade,
(23:20):
because we're not doing singleuse.
And so you get the glass jar totake with you and you take it.
It's like a mason jar, reallycool experience.
And this year I said that's,that's cool, and all but people
are starting to catch on.
How do we make it better?
And so we bought the sugar cane.
Uh, press, so what if we tookfresh sugar cane and we ground a
cane over some some crushed ice?
(23:43):
And then we took fresh lemons,squeezed them in there, oh yeah.
And then a piece of mint, right,and.
And then you, right, you cantaste it, right.
And then you get this like thisfresh squeezed lemonade with
cane sugar and mint, and liketalk about the most refreshing
thing, but it's a memory too.
Like think about when you wentto like fairs as a kid or you
(24:04):
know you went to the zoo, likethere's, there's things that
stick with you, and I just feellike as a kid or you know you
went to the zoo, like there'sthings that stick with you, and
I just feel like as a kid,walking up and being like I
watched them grind this sugarcane over crushed ice and then
squeeze the fresh lemon and thewhole lemon gets put in the ice
and then there's this mint andlike that's a memory.
And so I think creating thesecore memories for people of
doing things differently is soepic and that's what we're
(24:27):
trying to do.
Speaker 1 (24:28):
It's a core memory, but it's also the right way of
making the product.
You didn't cut corners on thequality of it.
It's not processed, it'ssomething, it's fresh and I
think that's the story.
That's beautiful and that leadsme to say your colleagues, the
other chefs, everyone that'spart of the SSA group experience
(24:49):
with your chefs across thecompany.
Are there learning curves?
Because these are cats thatcome from the food industry and
obviously they need to put outgood food, and food cost is a
thing, but it seems to me whatyou guys are trying to actually
execute is an experience, alongwith the sustainability part of
(25:11):
this.
What's the process there?
Speaker 2 (25:13):
Yes, there's a learning curve, but we also hire
outside of that network, right.
So, like we, we know peoplefrom hotels are used to doing
hotel things.
We know people who do and finddining like that's what they're
comfortable with.
And so, like we, we want peopleto come in and redefine and be
uncomfortable with us.
And so I think that, whilethere's a learning curve and
people might look at that as anegative sometimes in life, we
(25:35):
want that.
Like we want the people thatare hungry to reshape the
industry with us.
We want the people that aregoing to break the mold, and I
think that is what sets us apart, right.
So you come into some companies.
It's like here's our box, fitin this box.
And you come work with us andit's like, hey, we're not
building a box, like we'rebuilding a circle and we want
(25:57):
you to help.
And so I think that's the piecewhere you get to come and be
part of it.
You're not necessarily pluggedinto this hole versus required
to help build.
And I think that when you startputting a bunch of culinary
engineers together like that,you come culinary masters that
are like rocking the grill everysingle day and putting out the
(26:30):
hamburgers and the hot dogs andthe most incredible pizzas you
ever have, and so figuring outhow to leverage that experience.
But then you start talkingthousands and thousands of
people who've been in theindustry for 10, 15, 20 years.
You're talking like hundreds ofthousands of years of
experience, tens of thousands ofyears experience over this
organization.
How do you leverage that?
That, for me, is what gets memost excited.
(26:52):
It's like who's the next greatidea going to come from?
Because they're not me.
The ideas come from aconversation that I'm having
with somebody else.
The ideas come from, like youknow, somebody else posted a
picture online.
I'm like, dude, that's crazy.
Like we, we could take that andrun with it.
Like why don't we take this?
And just like, take a left?
(27:13):
Or like let's joke right realquick.
Like, figure out how to takethe cool ideas and then elevate
them in a way that not only theythey create an experience for
people, they're Instagrammable,they're memorable, but that
they're redefining an industryand get other people to want to
follow it.
Speaker 1 (27:36):
Other people in the industry either mimic or try and
change.
What we're doing is so cool,man, because it means we're
being impactful and we're reallymaking a difference On the
chocolate bar, for example.
You're putting that together.
It sounds amazing.
Speaker 2 (27:48):
Is each property going to carry that, or is it
limited to just a handful or one?
So the chocolate bar is kind ofa handful, you know, and we're
working with partnerships acrossour portfolio that are
interested in I think for thechocolate bar.
It's telling the story.
You know, what we're reallyworking on is trying to figure
out a way to turn that into hotchocolate programming, right,
like, how do we take thatpartnership and create a craft,
(28:09):
high-end program where, like,hey, you're hot chocolate.
Yes, we have this cool onethat's that's unique.
But we have this crack hotchocolate and this one tells an
amazing story as well, and so,like it's like in my friend,
there's levels to it, you know.
And so, like, how do we developthese different tiers of of
cool?
We're like, you have the verybasic level that that still
(28:33):
exceeds everyone's expectations.
But then you can, you can grabthis other one that is just so
unique and it's something you'venever seen.
You just got to have it.
That, for me, is what I look forwhen I'm out dining.
When I'm out dining, when I'mout exploring, I look for the
thing that I just got to have,that I know I've never seen that
before.
I'm never going to see it again, but I got to have it, and so I
(28:57):
that's that's what I keep inmind when I'm trying to develop
things and I'm trying to come upwith new ideas is what's that
thing that's going to catch youreye, what's that thing that's
going to inspire you to dosomething different, or inspire
you to think outside the boxyourself?
Speaker 1 (29:13):
It's safe to say and tell me if I'm wrong that the
Monterey Bay Aquarium isprobably the place to be,
because it's probably yourbiggest test kitchen, right?
Speaker 2 (29:22):
The Monterey Bay Aquarium is my biggest test
kitchen the setting alone right.
The monterey bay aquarium is mybiggest test kitchen the the
setting alone right.
I'm in the salinas valley,which is full of the most
incredible humans there is.
So many times that I've beendriving, whether it's the
airport or back and forth to apartner's location, you know, to
go look at their shop or go seewhat they have, or go, you know
(29:44):
, check on the new fish that arecoming in or the the new
produce targets, that I drive bythe fields and you had to stop,
because there's something soincredibly humbling to drive
through the salinas valley andsee how hard people work, and
like that, I think was was oneof the precipice for me to like
(30:05):
get people involved and letpeople know where their food
comes from, because when youdrive through these fields and
you see people picking produce,planting produce, it is it's
life-changing and it's righthere in the united states and so
when I'm, when I'm in monterey,I'm working like that.
That is my place to think anddream, because I have the ocean,
(30:28):
I have the Salinas Valley, Ihave all the ranches.
Like our salt is hand harvestedright down the road, our
seaweed is grown in the largestseaweed Red Bulls production
facility in the country, likefive blocks down the road.
Our abalone is grown a blockdown the road, like you can't
get any closer to the product.
(30:49):
And so I realize how fortunateI am to be immersed in that and
I just want to make sure thatwhen people come they feel the
same way.
When I first moved to Monterey Ihad kind of gone down and
checked out all the localbusinesses and there's chowder
and all these things.
I said when I go to Kansas Cityyou get barbecue.
(31:13):
I always wonder if I'm gettingthe real barbecue, if I'm
getting the tourist barbecue, orif I go to Florida I'm getting
seafood.
Am I getting the localexperience, like the guy that
just caught the grouper, or am Igetting the cod fromouper, or
am I getting, like you know, the, the cod from new England, like
what?
What am I getting?
And so I I kind of committedthat when you come in and dine
(31:33):
in our location like you'regetting the real experience and
you are leaving knowing that theexperience was authentic and
the food was authentic.
And that's one of the mostimportant things to me is to
know that when you dine youexperience locality and you're
not going to get butternutsquash in the summer, you know
(31:53):
you're not going to get tomatoesin the winter.
It's a true experience.
It's the most authentic oneyou're going to get, because
we're true to the seasons, we'retrue to the partners, we're
true to the people that aredoing the work.
Speaker 1 (32:06):
You're speaking my language.
There's nothing worse thangetting watermelons in the
wintertime.
I loathe it so much.
My background is in producedistribution and you know
obviously your clients have aneed, a want and a menu and you
need to source these things andyou know that's where you start.
You know shipping containersfull of fruits and veg that take
(32:29):
a long time to get here and bythe time it arrives, and by the
time it gets to the warehouseand then ultimately delivered
into a kitchen, quality is notgreat, the flavor is not there
because it's terrible, and itleaves a bad mark on the
establishment who's selling it.
So what you're telling me is abreath of fresh air.
You're a leader in thisparticular trend.
(32:49):
Do you see others that aregoing to look to participate in
this with you guys as well?
Speaker 2 (32:54):
You know, for us, when you talk about seasonality
and things like that, like whenwe were at menus, it's not me
saying, hey, here's the menu,right, like here's what we're
going to serve, because this iswhat we want to serve.
And here's the menu, right,like, here's what we're going to
serve, because this is what wewant to serve, and I'm the chef
and this is my will be done.
It's hey, let's sit down withour farmers and let's sit down
with the fishermen and let's sitdown with the ranchers.
(33:15):
And we talked to them and gohey, what, what, what's growing
this year?
You know, what are you going toplant?
(33:41):
What didn't do well last year?
What was a struggle for you?
What did you, you know, have towater too much, that you lost
money and it wasn't, it wasn'tfruitful for you, right, and
have chefs and you know, withthe advent of the Food Network
and all these things, kind ofeverybody learned a little bit
more and got a little more intofood and I think I became a chef
at the right time.
But I also became a chef at achallenging time, when everybody
knows more than they used toknow.
You can fight that or you canembrace it, and I chose to
(34:18):
embrace it and say I am going todouble down and be an educator,
you know, protect the ocean andget people to to really dive
into sustainability andconservation and consider the
choices.
I never would have believed you, but I realize now that there's
so much more to being a chefand there's so many other
(34:38):
avenues and I think that that'sone of the pieces I hope people
take away.
Most is like you.
Speaker 1 (34:44):
you can do something other than just cook food as a
chef and you can still make anamazing difference it must be a
fertile environment when itcomes to mentorship with your
young chefs in thesustainability world that we're
living in it is, and I thinkpeople are so excited to learn
more.
Speaker 2 (35:04):
You and it's not even the young chefs, right Like
young chefs, older chefs, likewe're all kind of inspiring and
mentoring each other indifferent disciplines, if you
will right, some are intosustainability, some are into,
like molecular gastronomy, someare into, you know, whatever it
is, and I think that's one ofthe cool pieces where people
dive so deep into a, into adiscipline or area of focus, and
(35:29):
when you find those people,those diamonds in the rough, you
can kind of latch onto them andlearn from them.
That gets me pumped, man, likeI love finding somebody who
knows something I don't and I'mconstantly trying to teach
myself.
Reading has become one of thebiggest things to me, you know,
trying to find out differentways to speak to people and
different ways to engage withpeople.
(35:50):
And if you look at yourself aslike this, this painting, you
get a lifetime to change thatpainting and it just takes one
brushstroke to change the entiredynamic.
So for me, getting more engagedwith reading and trying to
figure out how do I, how do Ichange myself just enough that I
can reinvent myself, but I cankeep.
(36:12):
I can keep the narrative of thestory but make it a little more
exciting.
So the the ability to teachthat to other people but
continue to learn.
Man like this industry isconstantly changing.
You know you said he came froma, a produce sales background
dude.
Like whoever would have thoughtyou're running the number one
(36:33):
food podcast on Apple Likethat's.
That's wild, stupidly, stupidly.
So the directions are insane.
Man Like you can.
You can literally take itwherever you want to take it and
if you put it out there in theuniverse and you make it yours
like it's there, it's there.
People, people want to learn,everybody wants to learn.
Speaker 1 (36:54):
I feel like this is all like blunt force trauma in
my life.
How it's gone down.
It's just barreling through nofinesse whatsoever.
It's just like banging yourhead on every branch on the way
to falling out of the tree.
Matt man, I got to tell youyou're awesome and I love what
you do, and I mean it when I saythat you are the Indiana Jones
(37:15):
of you know chefs out there.
How do we find you and how dowe find more about SSA Group?
Speaker 2 (37:24):
Man, I'll tell you it's been awesome talking to you
too, and it's probably thefirst time in my life I've been
called Indiana Jones.
I think I was recently calledWolverine in Vietnam, but that's
a whole nother story foranother day.
When you ask how to get engagedand how to get involved, the
best way is to visit your localzoo or aquarium or museum, like
(37:47):
that's the best way.
When you spend your money in it, it goes towards conservation
efforts of those organizations,like there's no better way and
it's a little bit of fun.
The SSA Group probably, again,the most incredible place I've
ever worked in my lifethessagroupcom.
If you're looking to find me, Iam on LinkedIn, and LinkedIn
only.
I'm the only guy rocking a pairof Grundons, throwing a fishing
(38:09):
trap over the edge of a boat.
Speaker 1 (38:11):
I'll see you there.
That is awesome.
Everybody out there, come checkus out in Atlanta at NAFM.
It's going to be a bad ass.
Matt, you are terrific and Iappreciate you being on the show
today.
Stand by, I'm going to catchyou off air.
Hold on.
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