April 26, 2025 • 32 mins
What if influencer marketing could disrupt traditional advertising just like Uber did with transportation? Join us as we explore this fascinating industry with the trailblazing Sandeep Asdhir, founder of Influenergy. Sandeep's journey from Toronto's financial arena to the bustling entrepreneurial landscape of Silicon Valley is nothing short of inspiring. His insights reveal how he transitioned from handling venture debt to unlocking the immense potential of influencer marketing and user-generated content. We unpack the unique dynamics of connecting brands with micro-creators and the powerful shift from conventional marketing to authentic engagement on platforms like TikTok and Facebook.
As influencer marketing becomes a force to reckon with, we delve into the nuances of the field, likening influencers to film stars and user-generated content creators to the indispensable crew behind the scenes. Through Sandeep's personal experiences, we explore the democratization of content creation, where passion-driven individuals can rise as influential voices, regardless of their backgrounds. This conversation reveals the entrepreneurial challenge of expanding an influencer network and connecting it with brands, echoing the Uber model of matching drivers with passengers. Sandeep shares his initial strategy focused on niche markets, which laid the groundwork for Influenergy's success.
But the conversation doesn't stop there. We also unravel the transformative impact of AI in branding and marketing. AI tools such as ChatGPT are highlighted for their ability to enhance efficiency and foster genuine connections between creators and brands. From overcoming the pitfalls of vanity metrics to emphasizing data-driven strategies for positive ROI, this discussion offers a fresh perspective on maintaining authenticity in social media marketing. Whether you're an entrepreneur, a marketer, or just someone interested in the future of digital influence, this episode provides valuable insights into the evolving landscape of influencer marketing.
ABOUT SANDEEP
Sandeep Asdhir was born and raised in Toronto, Canada before moving to California five years ago. Most of his time has been spent in Silicon Valley, where he's come to appreciate the beauty of the American dream. It was a profound experience for him to use his Apple iPhone while eating an Apple, knowing both were produced within a few hours' drive. This proximity of innovative technology and agriculture inspired him to create something himself and give back.
His career has mainly been in Finance and Venture capital, focusing on portfolio management and credit. On the side, he's tried various ventures like real estate, creating YouTube content, and starting clothing brands, driven by his desire to produce something for his new country.
Over time, he's realized his passion lies in connecting with people, leading to his new goal: helping people worldwide create and share content, facilitating global connections and showcasing diverse cultural perspectives.
LINKS & RESOURCES
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hey, what is up?
Welcome to this episode of theEntrepreneur to Entrepreneur
podcast.
As always, I'm your host, brianLoFermento, and I am so very
excited about today's episodebecause this is a topic that for
sure, in over 1,100 episodes,we've definitely not talked
about enough, but I've noticedas a consumer that this is a
rising trend.
This is one way to really standout with your marketing efforts
(00:22):
, and that, of course, isinfluencer marketing.
It's a scary world for so manyof us who haven't gone there,
but that's why we've brought inan incredible guest and a fellow
entrepreneur to navigate thosewaters with us.
So let me introduce you totoday's guest.
His name is Sandeep Azdir.
Sandeep is the founder ofInfluenergy, which and a fun
thing about him is I alreadyknow this guy has such great
(00:44):
energy and he's an amazingentrepreneur, and that is
epitomized in the fact that he'snot afraid to roll up his
sleeves and get things done,whether it's automating YouTube
channels, designing clothes oranalyzing multi-million dollar
deals in the venture world.
He's a passionate entrepreneurwith a knack for content
creation, a keen eye for trendsand a sharp financial mind.
This diverse experience fuelshis fire to make his company a
(01:08):
game changer, which, just totell you a little bit about his
marketing company.
It's a social media marketingcompany specializing in
influencer brand collaborations,particularly on social media.
The company focuses onconnecting AI, consumer apps and
tech brands with micro creators.
We're definitely going to talkabout that micro part in today's
conversation ensuring authenticengagement and maximizing ad
(01:30):
performance.
I'm super excited to learn fromthis guest here today, so I'm
not going to say anything else.
Let's dive straight into myinterview with Sandeep Azadir.
All right, sandeep, I am sovery excited that you're here
with us today.
First things first.
Welcome to the show.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
Thank you for having me, Brian.
Thank you for that warmintroduction.
I'm sort of blushing right now.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
Heck, yeah.
Well, I'll tell you what.
It's my job, because you aregoing to shine here today for
our listeners, and so it's myjob to bring that genius out of
you, because there's so much inthere.
But we're going gonna kickthings off.
I will put the onus entirely onyou to take us beyond the bio.
Who's sandeep?
How'd you start doing all thesecool things?
Speaker 2 (02:12):
thank you appreciate the question.
Um, where can I start?
So, just to start off, I guessI'll connect my personal story
and get the genesis there andtied to how I got to this seat
and speaking to you on thisamazing podcast.
I was born and raised inToronto, canada, and pretty much
my entire life I kind of spentworking in the financial world,
(02:33):
whether that was like portfoliomanagement, venture debt,
project management, riskenterprise.
I worked for pretty bigcompanies.
I moved five years ago toSilicon Valley.
I was pretty much in the heartand bowels of Silicon Valley and
I pretty much worked as aportfolio manager for a
hyperlocal bank called FremontBank and in Fremont Bank I
(02:54):
analyzed over 2,600 loans.
I managed a $2 billioncommercial real estate portfolio
.
It was there where I sort ofgraduated and moved on towards
Citigroup or Citibank, which isa pretty big multinational bank
as we know.
I was working for theirenterprise risk team and sort of
managing risk, you know, forall of the divisions, whether it
was strategy, marketing,trading, and in doing so, you
(03:16):
know I kind of tied these twoaspects together.
So that led me actually intoventure debt.
Where I was working for at thetime probably now is number one,
the second biggest or secondlargest venture debt company,
and that was right before thecrash of Silicon Valley Bank
Signal Signature, first Republicand so forth.
So I had, like this really goodknack and experience to like
(03:38):
analyze data, work in financialbanks, analyze P&Ls of venture
debt companies.
But throughout my life living inCanada, then moving to the US,
you get this entrepreneurialspirit that is undeniable almost
in the US, and I trieddifferent ventures on the side.
I had tried things like YouTubeautomation, as you mentioned.
(03:59):
I had tried clothing brandswhere I got in touch with, like,
a very famous rapper that hasover 15 million followers, so I
got to collaborate with him.
I got to work in real estate,but I always kept trying and
trying things.
But it wasn't until YouTubeautomation where I decided to
take a step away from what I wasdoing as an employee and deep
(04:20):
dive more into influencermarketing and UGC marketing,
which is user-generatedmarketing, and it's that where I
started connecting with peopleand started talking to creators
from all over the world andcurrently, at this point, I'm
talking to over 25, sorry, 400creators in 25 different
countries, 25 plus differentcountries.
That goes from India, australia, nigeria, finland, italy, usa,
(04:45):
mexico, canada and more and Ireally picked their mind,
learned and it seemed to me thatwe were really at this fork in
the road moment from traditionalmarketing to influencer
marketing, where you couldconnect and speak to people and
really get this true sense ofauthentic marketing.
At the end of the day, likebillions of people are using
(05:06):
social media daily I think theactive monthly active users for
TikTok and Facebook exceedbillions weekly so to me, it
made a lot of sense that thissort of form of marketing was
attracting so many people,getting to so many lives and
just a matter of a few clicksyou could just order something,
subscribe to something, buysomething.
So, with that being said, itmade a lot of sense for me to
(05:28):
get into this.
I think what I really enjoyabout it the most is connecting
with people, working with peoplein all different sorts of
backgrounds, speaking tofounders, bringing them together
, bridging the gap, and it'ssuper amazing to see the results
they can achieve when they putthis social media marketing,
which is a true form ofauthentic reach and allows
(05:49):
people to be enticed, intopurchasing or viewing or, you
know, bringing vanity metricssuch as impressions, shares and
likes, and it allows for them toreally understand a product and
trust what's out there and sofar it's been so super good.
Initially in my journey, Istarted working with CPG fashion
(06:10):
, beauty, makeup hygiene, butmost recently, in the last four
to five months, I've switched tomore of an AI consumer app and
tech app approach and what I cantell you that what I've
accomplished in almost a year infashion, beauty, makeup hygiene
I've done in one third of thetime in the AI consumer world.
So I've been working withplenty of creators.
(06:31):
I'm an advocate for AI.
I'm definitely excited tocombine those two worlds and I
think AI, as we know, is growingat a, you know, very hot rate,
is growing in, maybe, you know,greater than 100% year over year
, and you want that sort ofgrowth rate in a business.
You want to be.
You want to be in the middle ofthe Venn diagram between
(06:52):
influencer marketing, which hasa category of 30% year over year
over the next decade, and youwant to be in the middle of that
influencer marketing and AImarketing, which both have
greater than double digit growth.
So it's a great place to be.
I'm learning a lot and the bestpart about it is, in addition
to being like the latest buzz inthe news.
It feels like we're in thefirst minute of a soccer match.
(07:13):
It's just starting, so that'sthe best part about it.
You know you get latestbreakthroughs, like DeepSea
against Stargate, so it's day today You're getting all this new
information, so it's superexciting and that's where I'm at
right now.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
Yeah, for sure I love that overview for so many
reasons.
You're taking us to differentintersections that we're for
sure going to explore in today'sconversation.
But I really want to start outwith the fact that we've
probably all seen influencermarketing in action without
realizing it, and you actuallymade me realize, even in that
overview that you gave, thatmaybe there's some interesting
(07:46):
ways that we're all usingterminology differently, because
you made me you're the firstone to ever make me realize is
UGC the same as influencermarketing?
Has it evolved?
Is that the broader umbrella?
Talk to listeners about whatUGC is, how you view influencer
marketing.
Are they one in the same or arethere different ways that we
deliver that in the marketplace?
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Brian, that's a great question and I can get a lot of
trouble if I answer this wrong.
So I'm going to do my best,because UGC and influencer
marketing are two separatethings, but they sort of fall
under the umbrella of digital orsocial media marketing.
Let's start with influencermarketing, which is a simpler
one to understand.
Influencer marketing is when anindividual on social media uses
(08:30):
their audience to attractpeople to their platform to sell
them a good service.
At the same time, they don'teven need to sell them a good
service.
It's something that can fittheir image.
So, for instance, if there'ssomeone who has, you know, x
demograph at Y age from thiscountry, they don't really get
to choose their audience, butthey do get to choose what they
(08:50):
present to their audiencebecause they want to ensure the
audience continues to followthem.
So you can look at influencermarketing as sort of a celebrity
in a movie.
We're going to that movie forthat celebrity, to see what they
have and how they can skew ourviews.
Ugc is an acronym foruser-generated content.
The analogy I like to make isinfluencer marketing is a person
(09:13):
who's a star of the film, butUGC user-generated content.
They don't necessarily need afollowing, but they'll create
small individual films or reelsas we call them in the social
media world, which can be undera minute, and they will use or
reels, as we call them in thesocial media world, which can be
under a minute, and they willuse those reels and produce them
on behalf of a brand.
So they're actually producingcontent for the brand, for the
(09:34):
brand to reproduce and repost ontheir social media outlets to
show that they have everydaypeople like you and I using
their products.
Influencers have a largefollowing and they try to
leverage their audience.
So again, influencers are thestars.
In the movie, ugc is the personsort of behind the camera.
Think of it as someone who's anindependent film.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
Yeah, that's a really good analogy and you got me
thinking so.
A few years ago I moved from LosAngeles to right here in
beautiful and sunny Tampa.
Florida ago, I moved from LosAngeles to right here in
beautiful and sunny Tampa,florida, and so when I moved
here I didn't know all of thelocal spots, like I had all my
spots in LA, and so here inTampa I could follow 500
different local Tampa coffeeshops, restaurants, all these
(10:16):
other things, but I'm just goingto get their marketing from
them, whereas what I found isthat there are some Tampa micro
influencers not huge followeraccounts maybe 5,000, maybe up
to 10,000, but those peopleessentially became my curators
and my guide to the city wherethey would check out coffee
shops, and that's so valuable tome as a consumer and in turn,
(10:37):
when I hit those spots up, it'ssuper valuable for those
restaurants.
So I've seen it in action,without understanding the
mechanics of how it works behindthe scenes.
You're at that intersection.
You're working with thecreators, you're working with
the brands.
Walk us through.
How's this stuff actually happen?
How's this content get made andthen get into the world and
push to people?
Speaker 2 (10:58):
Yeah, it's a really good question.
I would say a lot of the peoplewho are working on this
definitely follow a passion ofseveral different niches.
It could be acting, it could beediting, it could be something
in the media world or it couldjust be someone who just enjoys
exploration and creativity.
There's no necessary formula toget from an influencer or UGC
(11:19):
UGC generated content person toproduce that content for you.
Also, what's really interestingis a lot of these creators.
They fall into different niches.
So, for myself, I work withmostly AI and tech creators, and
those people review AI and techapps.
So they're not necessarily alleditors or people who are very
(11:40):
good with software, but theymight be people who are
interested in technology or AIand in that passion.
What they found is they likeposting about it and then,
furthermore, they startdeveloping the following and
then, sooner than later, they'rean influencer because they're
actually swaying people to usecertain AI consumer apps or
certain technology or certainhardware or phones or whatever
(12:04):
it may be, whatever product orconsumer product it may be on
Amazon.
So there's really no singularorigin or genesis of these
creators.
It really comes down to justrecording, editing and I think
the best part about this.
It's so democratized thatanyone can do it.
You don't necessarily need tobe someone who could be perhaps
(12:26):
in the modeling world and have alarge following count.
You could just be a person whojust takes your phone, puts it
on your face and speaks about aproduct and sooner or later, if
you do it consistently enough,people will respect that and
follow it, because they do valueyour opinion yeah, it's true,
I'll tell you I'll pile, pileonto that point as a podcaster
that anyone can start a podcast,but when you start doing it
(12:48):
consistently, you know, Itangibly noticed something
changed.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
When I hit episode 50 , especially when I hit episode
100, 250, all of thesemilestones, people started
realizing, oh, this is here tostay and he's continuing to give
great value on the air.
Let me subscribe, let me followalong, let him serve me along
my own journey, and so it'sincredibly valuable.
Sandeep, and I love the factthat you recognize that
(13:12):
opportunity from a businessperspective, because I know that
you love entrepreneurship andbusinesses just as much as I do.
What I'm really fascinated byis businesses that have kind of
two sides to the coin.
You simultaneously need to growyour influencer network while
also getting in touch with thebrands that you aim to serve,
and I'm fascinated by which onedo you go after?
First, the Uber case study offinding drivers and finding
(13:35):
passengers.
It's super important.
How'd you navigate that withregards to launching your
company?
Speaker 2 (13:42):
That's a fantastic question.
I always call it a left side,right side equation, so I like
the fact that you put both handsup there like that, because
that's typically what I do.
Initially, when I first started, I went after the creators, and
the reason I went after thecreators?
Because they were the onesagain which I was working with
(14:02):
in the fashion, beauty, makeup,hygiene world world, who didn't
necessarily have a lot offollowers, but they had produced
a lot of UGC videos.
So it was more of a saturatedfeel and I felt like it would.
They were more approachable tospeak to, which was made it very
interesting because I wouldtalk to someone be totally
intimidated by their followercount, but in the UGC world they
(14:24):
don't typically have a lot offollowers and that doesn't mean
that they can't be intimidatingor sharp, but they're actually
quite on their game and verywell versed in what to do in
terms of marketing.
So when I got to them, Iactually really understood in
deep dive and these are creatorsall over the world, as I had
mentioned.
I really understood in deepdive and started asking them
questions that really pickedtheir brains and I think when I
(14:46):
found out what they do, whatthey price their work, at how
they do it, why they do it, whatmakes them good.
I started seeing and recognizingpatterns between what is a good
UGC creator and what's not andit's not a super deep formula in
terms of what separates thegood from the great, but in
doing so, I was able to speakwith enough of them to present
(15:08):
it to the brands, and Iinitially presented myself as a
bespoke agency.
So I was like I'm a founder-ledagency in marketing.
I work with a bespoke set ofcreators that I have personally
vetted, and the reason Ipersonally vetted them initially
was because I actually wantedto present myself as someone who
is doing a more manual process.
I wanted to stay away from AIchatbots.
(15:30):
I wanted to stay away from amapping algorithm, and the
reason I wanted to stay withthat sorry, stay away from that
is because I wanted to reallylearn from them and truly pick
the best creators for the bestbrands, and I think what kept me
doing this sort of founder-ledface-to-face approach on video
and speaking to creators was thefact that it was so validating
(15:52):
when you speak to them.
It's very rare that a companyfounder or entrepreneur will
pick up the phone and give uptheir most valuable thing, which
is their time, and speak tosomeone and really pick their
brain and talk to them.
Obviously, the busier andbusier I get, the more difficult
that it's becoming, and nowthat I'm working more towards
the AI world, I am sort offavoring those automation
processes.
(16:12):
But it was such a crucial partfor me to start, and starting
with the creators really helpedme understand the business.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
Yeah, all right, sandeep, you took us there, so
I'm just going to follow yourlead.
Once you introduce AI to theconversation, I always love
hearing the different ways thatpeople view it.
So, of course, you not onlywork with AI brands, but I would
imagine behind the scenesthere's a lot of AI that powers
the way that you operate.
So what's your perspective onAI?
Where we are, where we're goingand how we can best use it?
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Right.
I think initially my impressionof AI was just.
I was just like you andeveryone else.
My mind was completely blown.
I couldn't believe I couldgenerate, you know, a nursery
rhyme or a story by just givingit a few prompts, Like, hey,
create a story between Sandeepand Brian on a podcast on a nice
LA Tuesday morning and it wouldjust spit out this result that
(17:03):
just blew my mind, that I hadwished I had had during my
earlier years of education, myformative years of life.
So obviously initially I wasvery blown away.
But it got to the point where Iwas thinking you know this sort
of doomsday scenario where isthis going to be a law of
diminishing returns where itgets so good?
It gets so good that it startsforcing people out of employment
.
I think we're still ways awayfrom that.
(17:24):
I still think we're in theseminal formative moments, like
I mentioned, like the firstminute of a soccer match.
And I do think AI right now isat the point where it's limited
by the physical power, but wecan still use it to help and
benefit us.
And knowing that 300 millionpeople are using ChatGPT Weekly
shows me that you know the cat'sout of the bag.
(17:46):
We're using it.
It's an assistant, it's helpingus and you can use it in
whatever way you'd like to.
You can use it as a personaltutor, as a resource, as a guide
.
I think it's a very useful tool.
I know for myself.
I only have so much time on myhands, so automating those
processes in terms of nowmatching creators to to brands
(18:07):
becomes a much more easier thingand much more accurate thing,
and also because it's soubiquitous in the world.
I do believe brands, creatorsand other people do appreciate
when you use this technology,because they're probably
thinking why are you, why wouldyou not use it?
So I do think it's like veryimportant.
I do think it's proliferated inthe business world, but I do
(18:28):
think we're still at thatseminal moment.
We're far away from thesedoomsday scenarios at this point
.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
Yeah, Sandeep, I love the fact that you call that out
.
I'll transparently add on tothat is when some vendors I get
pitched a lot as a podcast owner, as the owner of a few
different companies, and it'skind of become a bragging point.
It seems to me a lot ofcompanies that say we don't use
AI and as an end consumer, Ithink to myself well, I wish
that you would, because youcould probably get so much more
(18:54):
done at an even more affordablerate.
And so I love the fact that youopenly acknowledge no, we do
bake this in and this is how weare able to more accurately line
you up with the people who youwant to get in touch with.
So, thinking about thoseclients that you serve and the
brands who obviously they're init not for just vanity metrics,
not for those likes and views,but of course they want that
(19:14):
positive ROI.
Talk to me about that side ofthe world of influencer
marketing.
How the heck are you doingattribution tracking?
How are you paying attention tothe metrics that drive the
needle?
I'm so interested in hearingmore about that.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
Right.
So it is a data driven approach.
It's funny you do ask thatbecause in influencer marketing
you can get up to a certainpoint and do well, and those are
with vanity metrics, those arewith likes, shares, comments,
clicks.
Those things help and theydefinitely bring eyes to your
brand and I do think a lot ofbrands appreciate that.
(19:50):
As I mentioned, I'm workingwith AI consumer brands, so a
lot of these brands are usingchat, gpt integrations to build
on their products and they needa little bit of marketing to
differentiate themselves,because at some point there
could be a lot of similaritiesbetween video editing company
one video editing company, twovideo editing company number
three with a little bit ofvariance between them.
(20:12):
But they need to trulyunderstand what's going on in
real time, identifying patterns,looking at vast data sets,
using data-driven predictions tobetter lead decision making in
areas like business.
So so I think the best metricand this was something that I
had learned from an entrepreneurthe best metric that someone
can initially give is what isyour ROI and simply just explain
(20:34):
that just in a couple of lines,and I think what's how this is
captured best in marketing iswhat is your click through rate?
How many people are viewingthis, clicking through and
checking your website and thenalso doing that final step,
which is the purchase.
So you know creating that start, go to market and inception
(20:55):
sorry and you know purchase.
So getting from point A topoint B, how do we get to that?
Of course, the other metricsmatter and I think that's
important to get eyes on yourproduct, but I think, at the end
of the day, you do want to knowhow many people are buying, how
many people are clickingthrough, how many people are
subscribing to what you'resaying, and I think those
metrics matter just as much andis why people are attracted to
(21:18):
the set of data.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
And, like they say, data is the oil right, so
everyone wants to know.
Yeah, with that in mind, I mean, you talk about clicks and
obviously that's so important.
I think, sandeep, truth be told, that's probably one of my
beefs with social media.
Everyone knows I'm not veryactive on social media and part
of it is because social mediacompanies, their incentives, are
to keep people doom scrolling.
They want us to scroll all daylong, and so I have
(21:42):
traditionally found and I'm notthe most astute at this, but
I've traditionally found thatlinks aren't always the best
call to action on social mediaplatforms.
Of course they do work and I,on the consumer side, I've
clicked many links from socialmedia.
But talk to us about those callto actions, talk to us about
that bridge that we can buildfrom that social media content,
(22:03):
especially with influencermarketing, to getting that
traffic in those conversionsright.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
I I think the call to action sort of the end point.
I think that's super important,but I think what's equally as
important is the start point,which I don't want to overlook,
and sometimes to get people tothe end, it's really just how
many times you appear to them inthe starting.
So I've worked with people who,you know, own their own
sunscreen brands or AI founders,and really the initial step to
(22:33):
get to that call to action, inmy opinion, is to try different
forms of marketing.
I think that's why the data isimportant, because you really
get to capture in real timewhat's working and what's not.
So you might have a certainhook that's working, a certain
image is working, or look, thislook working, or maybe something
provocative or entertainingthat really attracts a crowd.
You don't really almost everget to choose who your audience
(22:55):
is, and that's why I thinkinfluencing is very interesting
and influencers are very pickywith what they advertise because
they don't want to upset thepeople following them.
But in terms of the call toaction itself, there's different
ways, like you know.
There can be very blatant andforward ways of, you know,
encouraging people watching thevideo to subscribe.
There could be deal-based,there could be affiliate
(23:16):
marketing.
A lot of the times what they dotry to get you to do is get to
the website and take it fromthere, and usually they have
offer promos and try todistinguish themselves in some
sort of way.
But I would say most of thetime call to actions are super
important and getting peoplefrom step one to step two is
super important.
But that step call to action tothe final step, it could take
(23:40):
many different attempts.
On goal, it's really about howmuch face time you have
initially in front of theconsumer itself.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
Yeah, asandeep, I'm here today.
For all the soccer analogies,I'm all about it, so keep them
coming.
And, with regards to that, whenwe talk about social media, any
conversation about social media, even external, from marketing,
just social media a word wehear a lot and I'll throw
branding in here as well isauthenticity.
Obviously, that's a core partof why ugc works so well.
(24:09):
It's a core part of whyinfluencer marketing works well.
It's worked for thousands ofyears.
If our friends tell us hey, Iwent to this really amazing
korean barbecue spot in la, well, now more likely to go there
because I trust that person'sopinion on korean barbecue and
so that has been the way thatwe've made decisions for
literally thousands of years.
Talk to us about maintainingthat authenticity, because some
(24:31):
people have some crazy views onthe way that capitalism and
commerce and transactions andrelationships work and they
think that you lose thatauthenticity if there's some
sort of agreement even if it'san affiliate marketing agreement
, like you introduced us to Talkto us about that authenticity
and how we maintain it.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
Right, there's a term I came across and forgive me
because I don't remember where Isaw it, but they said UGCs
actually should be called trueGC, which I really enjoyed
because UGC produces thatauthenticity.
And, truthfully, I didn'tunderstand this step initially,
because, when I was working withbrands, I would try to find
those creators that I felt weregood matches, but those creators
(25:12):
were educating me that theiraudience were telling them
otherwise.
So, for instance, I was workingwith a male skincare creator,
which is, you know, not ascommon as maybe a female
skincare creator, but I hadfound an AI app for this person
to work with and I said, hey,can you advertise this one?
And this skincare creator wasvery adamant.
(25:33):
They didn't want to do it, andI truly didn't understand why.
I said, hey, you advertise thisone?
And this skincare creator hadwas very adamant.
They didn't want to do it, andI truly didn't understand why.
I said, hey, you have like 71000 plus followers, you have
great views, like, people loveyou, they comment, they like
they buy stuff.
We tried it, we experimented.
It did not work, and the reasonit did not work is because,
again, they didn't choose theiraudience.
So now it's.
It's very, very important toknow who the audience is, what
(25:54):
the demographic is, what thecountry is, what the age group
is and more, because you don'twant to bring that valuable
piece of marketing to the wrongplace.
It's like going fishing in apond with no fish.
You're not going to catchanything, so you can throw the
reel out all day.
Nothing's going to get attachedto that hook or bait.
So, with that being said, um,I've had creators and
(26:17):
influencers when I first started, and this is a great, valuable
lesson.
This is why it was important towork with them first, actually
turn down gigs.
They have told me like we don'twant to work with this brand
because it doesn't fit our image.
It doesn't.
It's not what our audience isfollowing us for.
So it's super important to getthat true marketing, because
those creators and influencersalso value their audience as
(26:38):
well.
It's not just a simpletransaction, and it took me like
a few lessons to learn that youreally have to deep dive and
understand what the creator isvouching for, who they are and
why they're advertising, whothey're advertising to, and they
don't want to give up theirmorals, and I really I'm an
advocate for that too.
I think that makes a lot ofsense because the success hinges
(26:59):
on them liking it and theiraudience responding to it.
So it makes a lot of sense toreally make the marketing
authentic as possible and Ialways tell people if you don't
like the product and thecreators are very open with this
they will be very candid.
They'll like I, I don't like it, I can review it and say that,
or we can just leave it andthat's totally fine.
(27:20):
That's that's acceptable.
That's not everyone's gonnalike everything and I think
that's what makes this marketingso special.
It's not just some smoke andmirrors.
It's true people showing whatthey use in their daily life,
and we never got that beforebecause we never had access to,
maybe, a celebrity like a TaylorSwift or a Steph Curry or
Beyonce, who are just one clickaway.
(27:41):
You could technically DM any ofthese people.
Will they respond?
That's a different thing, butyou can see what they're doing
in their day-to-day time, likewhile they're sitting with their
families, watching TV, whilethey're driving to their
profession, what kind of carthey have, what kind of clothes
they wear, what kind of foodthey eat.
So this is very impactful andpeople want to stay authentic to
who their audience is.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Yeah, I can absolutely vouch for that.
As a podcaster and a contentcreator myself, I'm very
protective of our show, of ouraudience, of what we've built,
because that's ultimately, truthbe told, it literally is all we
have is our audience.
Otherwise, it's just you and Isitting here talking together
into microphones and even nobodyon the other side.
So we're super protective ofthat, which is why, truth be
told, less than 5% ofentrepreneurs that we engage
(28:24):
with ever make it onto the air,because we're so selective about
that, and I think that that'sso important for people to
understand, which I love thatterm that you just introduced us
to True GC.
I've never heard of that, butit's so clever.
I really appreciate that and,sandeep, I appreciate you for
the things that you do, but alsothat entrepreneurial mind,
which is why I'm so excited toask you this final question that
(28:46):
I ask at the end of everyepisode.
It's super broad.
You can take it in anydirection you want, and that is
what's your best piece of adviceWith your entrepreneurial hat
on.
I always remind listenersyou're one of us and you know
that our listeners are at alldifferent stages of their own
entrepreneurial journeys.
So what's that one piece ofentrepreneurial advice that you
want to leave them with today.
Speaker 2 (29:09):
This is how I would approach entrepreneurship and I
think this is how it would makesense to me and to someone who
might want to look at facts.
At the end of the day, if youlook at the S&P 500, there's a
high percentage of thosecompanies which are backed by
venture-based companies.
Those venture-based companieswill take bets on entrepreneurs
and not all of them will fly.
(29:30):
Let's give a random stat.
Let's just say one in 10 willfly.
That means, as an entrepreneuror someone who wants to do it,
you're going to have to takemany shots on goal and you're
going to have to reiterate whenyou shoot.
You might have to kick left,kick right, shoot forward, kick
with your heel, kick with yourtoe.
You're going to have to keeptrying and trying in different
ways.
So my ultimate advice to anyoneout there who's seeking
(29:53):
entrepreneurship is to begin assoon as you can there's no
perfect moment and keep trying.
Just like myself, I had tried todo clothing brand real estate.
I was employment, I had a goodjob.
I could have continued workingdown that path, but something
kept drawing me to wanting to dosomething for myself and to
sort of take the knowledge I hadlearned and expand it and pass
it on to others and create amyriad of network.
(30:14):
So I think, personally, keeptrying.
It's never going to be aperfect process.
It's going to be more like anup and down ebb and flow, but as
long as you're moving forwardand moving forward by like 0.01%
day to day I think you're onthe right path and you should
continue to do what you're doing.
Don't worry about the result,just keep pushing forward.
Continue to do what you'redoing.
Don't worry about the results,just keep pushing forward.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
Boom.
That is incredibly importantadvice, no matter where we are
in our entrepreneurial journey,and it's advice that we can't
just hear once.
It's advice that we need toremind ourselves of again and
again, and again, and I soappreciate the fact that you've
learned and grown through all ofyour peaks and troughs and all
of the challenges and pivotsthat come along the way, because
that's ultimately theentrepreneurial journey.
(30:55):
So, sandeep, you have been awealth of knowledge in sharing
your experiences, your subjectmatter expertise.
You've got to drop those linkson us.
I love your website.
The brand that you've built,how you showcase all the
different brands that you workwith, different types of
influencers that you work with,the global network that you have
built, is incredibly impressive.
So drop those links on us.
(31:15):
Where can listeners find yourbusiness and all the great stuff
that you're up to?
Speaker 2 (31:20):
Awesome.
Please visit us at our websiteat influenergyco and check out
our Instagram page atInfluenergy.
Thank you very much.
Speaker 1 (31:28):
Yes, and, listeners, you already know the drill.
We're making it as easy aspossible for you to find those
links.
You don't have to remember them, especially if you're on the
drill.
We're making it as easy aspossible for you to find those
links.
You don't have to remember them, especially if you're on the go
.
Just check the show notes.
You can click right on throughfrom wherever it is that you're
tuning into today's episode.
Otherwise, sandeep, on behalfof myself and all the listeners
worldwide, thanks so much forcoming on the show today.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
Thank you so much, Brian.
It was such a fun experience.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
Hey, it's Brian here, and thanks for tuning in to yet
another episode of theWantrepreneur to Entrepreneur
podcast.
If you haven't checked us outonline, there's so much good
stuff there.
Check out the show's websiteand all the show notes that we
talked about in today's episodeat thewantrepreneurshowcom, and
I just want to give a shout outto our amazing guests.
There's a reason why we are adfreefree and have produced so
(32:12):
many incredible episodes fivedays a week for you, and it's
because our guests step up tothe plate.
These are not sponsored episodes.
These are not infomercials.
Our guests help us cover thecosts of our productions.
They so deeply believe in thepower of getting their message
out in front of you, awesomeentrepreneurs and entrepreneurs,
that they contribute to help usmake these productions possible
(32:35):
.
So thank you to not onlytoday's guests, but all of our
guests in general, and I justwant to invite you check out our
website because you can send usa voicemail there.
We also have live chat.
If you want to interactdirectly with me, go to
thewantrepreneurshowcom.
Initiate a live chat.
It's for real me, and I'mexcited because I'll see you, as
always every monday, wednesday,friday, saturday and sunday
(32:59):
here on the entrepreneur toentrepreneur podcast.
Hey, what is up?
Welcome to this episode of theEntrepreneur to Entrepreneur
podcast.
As always, I'm your host, brianLoFermento, and I am so very
excited about today's episodebecause this is a topic that for
sure, in over 1,100 episodes,we've definitely not talked
about enough, but I've noticedas a consumer that this is a
rising trend.
This is one way to really standout with your marketing efforts
(00:22):
, and that, of course, isinfluencer marketing.
It's a scary world for so manyof us who haven't gone there,
but that's why we've brought inan incredible guest and a fellow
entrepreneur to navigate thosewaters with us.
So let me introduce you totoday's guest.
His name is Sandeep Azdir.
Sandeep is the founder ofInfluenergy, which and a fun
thing about him is I alreadyknow this guy has such great
(00:44):
energy and he's an amazingentrepreneur, and that is
epitomized in the fact that he'snot afraid to roll up his
sleeves and get things done,whether it's automating YouTube
channels, designing clothes oranalyzing multi-million dollar
deals in the venture world.
He's a passionate entrepreneurwith a knack for content
creation, a keen eye for trendsand a sharp financial mind.
This diverse experience fuelshis fire to make his company a
(01:08):
game changer, which, just totell you a little bit about his
marketing company.
It's a social media marketingcompany specializing in
influencer brand collaborations,particularly on social media.
The company focuses onconnecting AI, consumer apps and
tech brands with micro creators.
We're definitely going to talkabout that micro part in today's
conversation ensuring authenticengagement and maximizing ad
(01:30):
performance.
I'm super excited to learn fromthis guest here today, so I'm
not going to say anything else.
Let's dive straight into myinterview with Sandeep Azadir.
All right, sandeep, I am sovery excited that you're here
with us today.
First things first.
Welcome to the show.
Speaker 2 (01:47):
Thank you for having me, Brian.
Thank you for that warmintroduction.
I'm sort of blushing right now.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
Heck, yeah.
Well, I'll tell you what.
It's my job, because you aregoing to shine here today for
our listeners, and so it's myjob to bring that genius out of
you, because there's so much inthere.
But we're going gonna kickthings off.
I will put the onus entirely onyou to take us beyond the bio.
Who's sandeep?
How'd you start doing all thesecool things?
Speaker 2 (02:12):
thank you appreciate the question.
Um, where can I start?
So, just to start off, I guessI'll connect my personal story
and get the genesis there andtied to how I got to this seat
and speaking to you on thisamazing podcast.
I was born and raised inToronto, canada, and pretty much
my entire life I kind of spentworking in the financial world,
(02:33):
whether that was like portfoliomanagement, venture debt,
project management, riskenterprise.
I worked for pretty bigcompanies.
I moved five years ago toSilicon Valley.
I was pretty much in the heartand bowels of Silicon Valley and
I pretty much worked as aportfolio manager for a
hyperlocal bank called FremontBank and in Fremont Bank I
(02:54):
analyzed over 2,600 loans.
I managed a $2 billioncommercial real estate portfolio
.
It was there where I sort ofgraduated and moved on towards
Citigroup or Citibank, which isa pretty big multinational bank
as we know.
I was working for theirenterprise risk team and sort of
managing risk, you know, forall of the divisions, whether it
was strategy, marketing,trading, and in doing so, you
(03:16):
know I kind of tied these twoaspects together.
So that led me actually intoventure debt.
Where I was working for at thetime probably now is number one,
the second biggest or secondlargest venture debt company,
and that was right before thecrash of Silicon Valley Bank
Signal Signature, first Republicand so forth.
So I had, like this really goodknack and experience to like
(03:38):
analyze data, work in financialbanks, analyze P&Ls of venture
debt companies.
But throughout my life living inCanada, then moving to the US,
you get this entrepreneurialspirit that is undeniable almost
in the US, and I trieddifferent ventures on the side.
I had tried things like YouTubeautomation, as you mentioned.
(03:59):
I had tried clothing brandswhere I got in touch with, like,
a very famous rapper that hasover 15 million followers, so I
got to collaborate with him.
I got to work in real estate,but I always kept trying and
trying things.
But it wasn't until YouTubeautomation where I decided to
take a step away from what I wasdoing as an employee and deep
(04:20):
dive more into influencermarketing and UGC marketing,
which is user-generatedmarketing, and it's that where I
started connecting with peopleand started talking to creators
from all over the world andcurrently, at this point, I'm
talking to over 25, sorry, 400creators in 25 different
countries, 25 plus differentcountries.
That goes from India, australia, nigeria, finland, italy, usa,
(04:45):
mexico, canada and more and Ireally picked their mind,
learned and it seemed to me thatwe were really at this fork in
the road moment from traditionalmarketing to influencer
marketing, where you couldconnect and speak to people and
really get this true sense ofauthentic marketing.
At the end of the day, likebillions of people are using
(05:06):
social media daily I think theactive monthly active users for
TikTok and Facebook exceedbillions weekly so to me, it
made a lot of sense that thissort of form of marketing was
attracting so many people,getting to so many lives and
just a matter of a few clicksyou could just order something,
subscribe to something, buysomething.
So, with that being said, itmade a lot of sense for me to
(05:28):
get into this.
I think what I really enjoyabout it the most is connecting
with people, working with peoplein all different sorts of
backgrounds, speaking tofounders, bringing them together
, bridging the gap, and it'ssuper amazing to see the results
they can achieve when they putthis social media marketing,
which is a true form ofauthentic reach and allows
(05:49):
people to be enticed, intopurchasing or viewing or, you
know, bringing vanity metricssuch as impressions, shares and
likes, and it allows for them toreally understand a product and
trust what's out there and sofar it's been so super good.
Initially in my journey, Istarted working with CPG fashion
(06:10):
, beauty, makeup hygiene, butmost recently, in the last four
to five months, I've switched tomore of an AI consumer app and
tech app approach and what I cantell you that what I've
accomplished in almost a year infashion, beauty, makeup hygiene
I've done in one third of thetime in the AI consumer world.
So I've been working withplenty of creators.
(06:31):
I'm an advocate for AI.
I'm definitely excited tocombine those two worlds and I
think AI, as we know, is growingat a, you know, very hot rate,
is growing in, maybe, you know,greater than 100% year over year
, and you want that sort ofgrowth rate in a business.
You want to be.
You want to be in the middle ofthe Venn diagram between
(06:52):
influencer marketing, which hasa category of 30% year over year
over the next decade, and youwant to be in the middle of that
influencer marketing and AImarketing, which both have
greater than double digit growth.
So it's a great place to be.
I'm learning a lot and the bestpart about it is, in addition
to being like the latest buzz inthe news.
It feels like we're in thefirst minute of a soccer match.
(07:13):
It's just starting, so that'sthe best part about it.
You know you get latestbreakthroughs, like DeepSea
against Stargate, so it's day today You're getting all this new
information, so it's superexciting and that's where I'm at
right now.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
Yeah, for sure I love that overview for so many
reasons.
You're taking us to differentintersections that we're for
sure going to explore in today'sconversation.
But I really want to start outwith the fact that we've
probably all seen influencermarketing in action without
realizing it, and you actuallymade me realize, even in that
overview that you gave, thatmaybe there's some interesting
(07:46):
ways that we're all usingterminology differently, because
you made me you're the firstone to ever make me realize is
UGC the same as influencermarketing?
Has it evolved?
Is that the broader umbrella?
Talk to listeners about whatUGC is, how you view influencer
marketing.
Are they one in the same or arethere different ways that we
deliver that in the marketplace?
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Brian, that's a great question and I can get a lot of
trouble if I answer this wrong.
So I'm going to do my best,because UGC and influencer
marketing are two separatethings, but they sort of fall
under the umbrella of digital orsocial media marketing.
Let's start with influencermarketing, which is a simpler
one to understand.
Influencer marketing is when anindividual on social media uses
(08:30):
their audience to attractpeople to their platform to sell
them a good service.
At the same time, they don'teven need to sell them a good
service.
It's something that can fittheir image.
So, for instance, if there'ssomeone who has, you know, x
demograph at Y age from thiscountry, they don't really get
to choose their audience, butthey do get to choose what they
(08:50):
present to their audiencebecause they want to ensure the
audience continues to followthem.
So you can look at influencermarketing as sort of a celebrity
in a movie.
We're going to that movie forthat celebrity, to see what they
have and how they can skew ourviews.
Ugc is an acronym foruser-generated content.
The analogy I like to make isinfluencer marketing is a person
(09:13):
who's a star of the film, butUGC user-generated content.
They don't necessarily need afollowing, but they'll create
small individual films or reelsas we call them in the social
media world, which can be undera minute, and they will use or
reels, as we call them in thesocial media world, which can be
under a minute, and they willuse those reels and produce them
on behalf of a brand.
So they're actually producingcontent for the brand, for the
(09:34):
brand to reproduce and repost ontheir social media outlets to
show that they have everydaypeople like you and I using
their products.
Influencers have a largefollowing and they try to
leverage their audience.
So again, influencers are thestars.
In the movie, ugc is the personsort of behind the camera.
Think of it as someone who's anindependent film.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
Yeah, that's a really good analogy and you got me
thinking so.
A few years ago I moved from LosAngeles to right here in
beautiful and sunny Tampa.
Florida ago, I moved from LosAngeles to right here in
beautiful and sunny Tampa,florida, and so when I moved
here I didn't know all of thelocal spots, like I had all my
spots in LA, and so here inTampa I could follow 500
different local Tampa coffeeshops, restaurants, all these
(10:16):
other things, but I'm just goingto get their marketing from
them, whereas what I found isthat there are some Tampa micro
influencers not huge followeraccounts maybe 5,000, maybe up
to 10,000, but those peopleessentially became my curators
and my guide to the city wherethey would check out coffee
shops, and that's so valuable tome as a consumer and in turn,
(10:37):
when I hit those spots up, it'ssuper valuable for those
restaurants.
So I've seen it in action,without understanding the
mechanics of how it works behindthe scenes.
You're at that intersection.
You're working with thecreators, you're working with
the brands.
Walk us through.
How's this stuff actually happen?
How's this content get made andthen get into the world and
push to people?
Speaker 2 (10:58):
Yeah, it's a really good question.
I would say a lot of the peoplewho are working on this
definitely follow a passion ofseveral different niches.
It could be acting, it could beediting, it could be something
in the media world or it couldjust be someone who just enjoys
exploration and creativity.
There's no necessary formula toget from an influencer or UGC
(11:19):
UGC generated content person toproduce that content for you.
Also, what's really interestingis a lot of these creators.
They fall into different niches.
So, for myself, I work withmostly AI and tech creators, and
those people review AI and techapps.
So they're not necessarily alleditors or people who are very
(11:40):
good with software, but theymight be people who are
interested in technology or AIand in that passion.
What they found is they likeposting about it and then,
furthermore, they startdeveloping the following and
then, sooner than later, they'rean influencer because they're
actually swaying people to usecertain AI consumer apps or
certain technology or certainhardware or phones or whatever
(12:04):
it may be, whatever product orconsumer product it may be on
Amazon.
So there's really no singularorigin or genesis of these
creators.
It really comes down to justrecording, editing and I think
the best part about this.
It's so democratized thatanyone can do it.
You don't necessarily need tobe someone who could be perhaps
(12:26):
in the modeling world and have alarge following count.
You could just be a person whojust takes your phone, puts it
on your face and speaks about aproduct and sooner or later, if
you do it consistently enough,people will respect that and
follow it, because they do valueyour opinion yeah, it's true,
I'll tell you I'll pile, pileonto that point as a podcaster
that anyone can start a podcast,but when you start doing it
(12:48):
consistently, you know, Itangibly noticed something
changed.
Speaker 1 (12:51):
When I hit episode 50 , especially when I hit episode
100, 250, all of thesemilestones, people started
realizing, oh, this is here tostay and he's continuing to give
great value on the air.
Let me subscribe, let me followalong, let him serve me along
my own journey, and so it'sincredibly valuable.
Sandeep, and I love the factthat you recognize that
(13:12):
opportunity from a businessperspective, because I know that
you love entrepreneurship andbusinesses just as much as I do.
What I'm really fascinated byis businesses that have kind of
two sides to the coin.
You simultaneously need to growyour influencer network while
also getting in touch with thebrands that you aim to serve,
and I'm fascinated by which onedo you go after?
First, the Uber case study offinding drivers and finding
(13:35):
passengers.
It's super important.
How'd you navigate that withregards to launching your
company?
Speaker 2 (13:42):
That's a fantastic question.
I always call it a left side,right side equation, so I like
the fact that you put both handsup there like that, because
that's typically what I do.
Initially, when I first started, I went after the creators, and
the reason I went after thecreators?
Because they were the onesagain which I was working with
(14:02):
in the fashion, beauty, makeup,hygiene world world, who didn't
necessarily have a lot offollowers, but they had produced
a lot of UGC videos.
So it was more of a saturatedfeel and I felt like it would.
They were more approachable tospeak to, which was made it very
interesting because I wouldtalk to someone be totally
intimidated by their followercount, but in the UGC world they
(14:24):
don't typically have a lot offollowers and that doesn't mean
that they can't be intimidatingor sharp, but they're actually
quite on their game and verywell versed in what to do in
terms of marketing.
So when I got to them, Iactually really understood in
deep dive and these are creatorsall over the world, as I had
mentioned.
I really understood in deepdive and started asking them
questions that really pickedtheir brains and I think when I
(14:46):
found out what they do, whatthey price their work, at how
they do it, why they do it, whatmakes them good.
I started seeing and recognizingpatterns between what is a good
UGC creator and what's not andit's not a super deep formula in
terms of what separates thegood from the great, but in
doing so, I was able to speakwith enough of them to present
(15:08):
it to the brands, and Iinitially presented myself as a
bespoke agency.
So I was like I'm a founder-ledagency in marketing.
I work with a bespoke set ofcreators that I have personally
vetted, and the reason Ipersonally vetted them initially
was because I actually wantedto present myself as someone who
is doing a more manual process.
I wanted to stay away from AIchatbots.
(15:30):
I wanted to stay away from amapping algorithm, and the
reason I wanted to stay withthat sorry, stay away from that
is because I wanted to reallylearn from them and truly pick
the best creators for the bestbrands, and I think what kept me
doing this sort of founder-ledface-to-face approach on video
and speaking to creators was thefact that it was so validating
(15:52):
when you speak to them.
It's very rare that a companyfounder or entrepreneur will
pick up the phone and give uptheir most valuable thing, which
is their time, and speak tosomeone and really pick their
brain and talk to them.
Obviously, the busier andbusier I get, the more difficult
that it's becoming, and nowthat I'm working more towards
the AI world, I am sort offavoring those automation
processes.
(16:12):
But it was such a crucial partfor me to start, and starting
with the creators really helpedme understand the business.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
Yeah, all right, sandeep, you took us there, so
I'm just going to follow yourlead.
Once you introduce AI to theconversation, I always love
hearing the different ways thatpeople view it.
So, of course, you not onlywork with AI brands, but I would
imagine behind the scenesthere's a lot of AI that powers
the way that you operate.
So what's your perspective onAI?
Where we are, where we're goingand how we can best use it?
Speaker 2 (16:42):
Right.
I think initially my impressionof AI was just.
I was just like you andeveryone else.
My mind was completely blown.
I couldn't believe I couldgenerate, you know, a nursery
rhyme or a story by just givingit a few prompts, Like, hey,
create a story between Sandeepand Brian on a podcast on a nice
LA Tuesday morning and it wouldjust spit out this result that
(17:03):
just blew my mind, that I hadwished I had had during my
earlier years of education, myformative years of life.
So obviously initially I wasvery blown away.
But it got to the point where Iwas thinking you know this sort
of doomsday scenario where isthis going to be a law of
diminishing returns where itgets so good?
It gets so good that it startsforcing people out of employment
.
I think we're still ways awayfrom that.
(17:24):
I still think we're in theseminal formative moments, like
I mentioned, like the firstminute of a soccer match.
And I do think AI right now isat the point where it's limited
by the physical power, but wecan still use it to help and
benefit us.
And knowing that 300 millionpeople are using ChatGPT Weekly
shows me that you know the cat'sout of the bag.
(17:46):
We're using it.
It's an assistant, it's helpingus and you can use it in
whatever way you'd like to.
You can use it as a personaltutor, as a resource, as a guide
.
I think it's a very useful tool.
I know for myself.
I only have so much time on myhands, so automating those
processes in terms of nowmatching creators to to brands
(18:07):
becomes a much more easier thingand much more accurate thing,
and also because it's soubiquitous in the world.
I do believe brands, creatorsand other people do appreciate
when you use this technology,because they're probably
thinking why are you, why wouldyou not use it?
So I do think it's like veryimportant.
I do think it's proliferated inthe business world, but I do
(18:28):
think we're still at thatseminal moment.
We're far away from thesedoomsday scenarios at this point
.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
Yeah, Sandeep, I love the fact that you call that out
.
I'll transparently add on tothat is when some vendors I get
pitched a lot as a podcast owner, as the owner of a few
different companies, and it'skind of become a bragging point.
It seems to me a lot ofcompanies that say we don't use
AI and as an end consumer, Ithink to myself well, I wish
that you would, because youcould probably get so much more
(18:54):
done at an even more affordablerate.
And so I love the fact that youopenly acknowledge no, we do
bake this in and this is how weare able to more accurately line
you up with the people who youwant to get in touch with.
So, thinking about thoseclients that you serve and the
brands who obviously they're init not for just vanity metrics,
not for those likes and views,but of course they want that
(19:14):
positive ROI.
Talk to me about that side ofthe world of influencer
marketing.
How the heck are you doingattribution tracking?
How are you paying attention tothe metrics that drive the
needle?
I'm so interested in hearingmore about that.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
Right.
So it is a data driven approach.
It's funny you do ask thatbecause in influencer marketing
you can get up to a certainpoint and do well, and those are
with vanity metrics, those arewith likes, shares, comments,
clicks.
Those things help and theydefinitely bring eyes to your
brand and I do think a lot ofbrands appreciate that.
(19:50):
As I mentioned, I'm workingwith AI consumer brands, so a
lot of these brands are usingchat, gpt integrations to build
on their products and they needa little bit of marketing to
differentiate themselves,because at some point there
could be a lot of similaritiesbetween video editing company
one video editing company, twovideo editing company number
three with a little bit ofvariance between them.
(20:12):
But they need to trulyunderstand what's going on in
real time, identifying patterns,looking at vast data sets,
using data-driven predictions tobetter lead decision making in
areas like business.
So so I think the best metricand this was something that I
had learned from an entrepreneurthe best metric that someone
can initially give is what isyour ROI and simply just explain
(20:34):
that just in a couple of lines,and I think what's how this is
captured best in marketing iswhat is your click through rate?
How many people are viewingthis, clicking through and
checking your website and thenalso doing that final step,
which is the purchase.
So you know creating that start, go to market and inception
(20:55):
sorry and you know purchase.
So getting from point A topoint B, how do we get to that?
Of course, the other metricsmatter and I think that's
important to get eyes on yourproduct, but I think, at the end
of the day, you do want to knowhow many people are buying, how
many people are clickingthrough, how many people are
subscribing to what you'resaying, and I think those
metrics matter just as much andis why people are attracted to
(21:18):
the set of data.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
And, like they say, data is the oil right, so
everyone wants to know.
Yeah, with that in mind, I mean, you talk about clicks and
obviously that's so important.
I think, sandeep, truth be told, that's probably one of my
beefs with social media.
Everyone knows I'm not veryactive on social media and part
of it is because social mediacompanies, their incentives, are
to keep people doom scrolling.
They want us to scroll all daylong, and so I have
(21:42):
traditionally found and I'm notthe most astute at this, but
I've traditionally found thatlinks aren't always the best
call to action on social mediaplatforms.
Of course they do work and I,on the consumer side, I've
clicked many links from socialmedia.
But talk to us about those callto actions, talk to us about
that bridge that we can buildfrom that social media content,
(22:03):
especially with influencermarketing, to getting that
traffic in those conversionsright.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
I I think the call to action sort of the end point.
I think that's super important,but I think what's equally as
important is the start point,which I don't want to overlook,
and sometimes to get people tothe end, it's really just how
many times you appear to them inthe starting.
So I've worked with people who,you know, own their own
sunscreen brands or AI founders,and really the initial step to
(22:33):
get to that call to action, inmy opinion, is to try different
forms of marketing.
I think that's why the data isimportant, because you really
get to capture in real timewhat's working and what's not.
So you might have a certainhook that's working, a certain
image is working, or look, thislook working, or maybe something
provocative or entertainingthat really attracts a crowd.
You don't really almost everget to choose who your audience
(22:55):
is, and that's why I thinkinfluencing is very interesting
and influencers are very pickywith what they advertise because
they don't want to upset thepeople following them.
But in terms of the call toaction itself, there's different
ways, like you know.
There can be very blatant andforward ways of, you know,
encouraging people watching thevideo to subscribe.
There could be deal-based,there could be affiliate
(23:16):
marketing.
A lot of the times what they dotry to get you to do is get to
the website and take it fromthere, and usually they have
offer promos and try todistinguish themselves in some
sort of way.
But I would say most of thetime call to actions are super
important and getting peoplefrom step one to step two is
super important.
But that step call to action tothe final step, it could take
(23:40):
many different attempts.
On goal, it's really about howmuch face time you have
initially in front of theconsumer itself.
Speaker 1 (23:47):
Yeah, asandeep, I'm here today.
For all the soccer analogies,I'm all about it, so keep them
coming.
And, with regards to that, whenwe talk about social media, any
conversation about social media, even external, from marketing,
just social media a word wehear a lot and I'll throw
branding in here as well isauthenticity.
Obviously, that's a core partof why ugc works so well.
(24:09):
It's a core part of whyinfluencer marketing works well.
It's worked for thousands ofyears.
If our friends tell us hey, Iwent to this really amazing
korean barbecue spot in la, well, now more likely to go there
because I trust that person'sopinion on korean barbecue and
so that has been the way thatwe've made decisions for
literally thousands of years.
Talk to us about maintainingthat authenticity, because some
(24:31):
people have some crazy views onthe way that capitalism and
commerce and transactions andrelationships work and they
think that you lose thatauthenticity if there's some
sort of agreement even if it'san affiliate marketing agreement
, like you introduced us to Talkto us about that authenticity
and how we maintain it.
Speaker 2 (24:49):
Right, there's a term I came across and forgive me
because I don't remember where Isaw it, but they said UGCs
actually should be called trueGC, which I really enjoyed
because UGC produces thatauthenticity.
And, truthfully, I didn'tunderstand this step initially,
because, when I was working withbrands, I would try to find
those creators that I felt weregood matches, but those creators
(25:12):
were educating me that theiraudience were telling them
otherwise.
So, for instance, I was workingwith a male skincare creator,
which is, you know, not ascommon as maybe a female
skincare creator, but I hadfound an AI app for this person
to work with and I said, hey,can you advertise this one?
And this skincare creator wasvery adamant.
(25:33):
They didn't want to do it, andI truly didn't understand why.
I said, hey, you advertise thisone?
And this skincare creator hadwas very adamant.
They didn't want to do it, andI truly didn't understand why.
I said, hey, you have like 71000 plus followers, you have
great views, like, people loveyou, they comment, they like
they buy stuff.
We tried it, we experimented.
It did not work, and the reasonit did not work is because,
again, they didn't choose theiraudience.
So now it's.
It's very, very important toknow who the audience is, what
(25:54):
the demographic is, what thecountry is, what the age group
is and more, because you don'twant to bring that valuable
piece of marketing to the wrongplace.
It's like going fishing in apond with no fish.
You're not going to catchanything, so you can throw the
reel out all day.
Nothing's going to get attachedto that hook or bait.
So, with that being said, um,I've had creators and
(26:17):
influencers when I first started, and this is a great, valuable
lesson.
This is why it was important towork with them first, actually
turn down gigs.
They have told me like we don'twant to work with this brand
because it doesn't fit our image.
It doesn't.
It's not what our audience isfollowing us for.
So it's super important to getthat true marketing, because
those creators and influencersalso value their audience as
(26:38):
well.
It's not just a simpletransaction, and it took me like
a few lessons to learn that youreally have to deep dive and
understand what the creator isvouching for, who they are and
why they're advertising, whothey're advertising to, and they
don't want to give up theirmorals, and I really I'm an
advocate for that too.
I think that makes a lot ofsense because the success hinges
(26:59):
on them liking it and theiraudience responding to it.
So it makes a lot of sense toreally make the marketing
authentic as possible and Ialways tell people if you don't
like the product and thecreators are very open with this
they will be very candid.
They'll like I, I don't like it, I can review it and say that,
or we can just leave it andthat's totally fine.
(27:20):
That's that's acceptable.
That's not everyone's gonnalike everything and I think
that's what makes this marketingso special.
It's not just some smoke andmirrors.
It's true people showing whatthey use in their daily life,
and we never got that beforebecause we never had access to,
maybe, a celebrity like a TaylorSwift or a Steph Curry or
Beyonce, who are just one clickaway.
(27:41):
You could technically DM any ofthese people.
Will they respond?
That's a different thing, butyou can see what they're doing
in their day-to-day time, likewhile they're sitting with their
families, watching TV, whilethey're driving to their
profession, what kind of carthey have, what kind of clothes
they wear, what kind of foodthey eat.
So this is very impactful andpeople want to stay authentic to
who their audience is.
Speaker 1 (28:01):
Yeah, I can absolutely vouch for that.
As a podcaster and a contentcreator myself, I'm very
protective of our show, of ouraudience, of what we've built,
because that's ultimately, truthbe told, it literally is all we
have is our audience.
Otherwise, it's just you and Isitting here talking together
into microphones and even nobodyon the other side.
So we're super protective ofthat, which is why, truth be
told, less than 5% ofentrepreneurs that we engage
(28:24):
with ever make it onto the air,because we're so selective about
that, and I think that that'sso important for people to
understand, which I love thatterm that you just introduced us
to True GC.
I've never heard of that, butit's so clever.
I really appreciate that and,sandeep, I appreciate you for
the things that you do, but alsothat entrepreneurial mind,
which is why I'm so excited toask you this final question that
(28:46):
I ask at the end of everyepisode.
It's super broad.
You can take it in anydirection you want, and that is
what's your best piece of adviceWith your entrepreneurial hat
on.
I always remind listenersyou're one of us and you know
that our listeners are at alldifferent stages of their own
entrepreneurial journeys.
So what's that one piece ofentrepreneurial advice that you
want to leave them with today.
Speaker 2 (29:09):
This is how I would approach entrepreneurship and I
think this is how it would makesense to me and to someone who
might want to look at facts.
At the end of the day, if youlook at the S&P 500, there's a
high percentage of thosecompanies which are backed by
venture-based companies.
Those venture-based companieswill take bets on entrepreneurs
and not all of them will fly.
(29:30):
Let's give a random stat.
Let's just say one in 10 willfly.
That means, as an entrepreneuror someone who wants to do it,
you're going to have to takemany shots on goal and you're
going to have to reiterate whenyou shoot.
You might have to kick left,kick right, shoot forward, kick
with your heel, kick with yourtoe.
You're going to have to keeptrying and trying in different
ways.
So my ultimate advice to anyoneout there who's seeking
(29:53):
entrepreneurship is to begin assoon as you can there's no
perfect moment and keep trying.
Just like myself, I had tried todo clothing brand real estate.
I was employment, I had a goodjob.
I could have continued workingdown that path, but something
kept drawing me to wanting to dosomething for myself and to
sort of take the knowledge I hadlearned and expand it and pass
it on to others and create amyriad of network.
(30:14):
So I think, personally, keeptrying.
It's never going to be aperfect process.
It's going to be more like anup and down ebb and flow, but as
long as you're moving forwardand moving forward by like 0.01%
day to day I think you're onthe right path and you should
continue to do what you're doing.
Don't worry about the result,just keep pushing forward.
Continue to do what you'redoing.
Don't worry about the results,just keep pushing forward.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
Boom.
That is incredibly importantadvice, no matter where we are
in our entrepreneurial journey,and it's advice that we can't
just hear once.
It's advice that we need toremind ourselves of again and
again, and again, and I soappreciate the fact that you've
learned and grown through all ofyour peaks and troughs and all
of the challenges and pivotsthat come along the way, because
that's ultimately theentrepreneurial journey.
(30:55):
So, sandeep, you have been awealth of knowledge in sharing
your experiences, your subjectmatter expertise.
You've got to drop those linkson us.
I love your website.
The brand that you've built,how you showcase all the
different brands that you workwith, different types of
influencers that you work with,the global network that you have
built, is incredibly impressive.
So drop those links on us.
(31:15):
Where can listeners find yourbusiness and all the great stuff
that you're up to?
Speaker 2 (31:20):
Awesome.
Please visit us at our websiteat influenergyco and check out
our Instagram page atInfluenergy.
Thank you very much.
Speaker 1 (31:28):
Yes, and, listeners, you already know the drill.
We're making it as easy aspossible for you to find those
links.
You don't have to remember them, especially if you're on the
drill.
We're making it as easy aspossible for you to find those
links.
You don't have to remember them, especially if you're on the go
.
Just check the show notes.
You can click right on throughfrom wherever it is that you're
tuning into today's episode.
Otherwise, sandeep, on behalfof myself and all the listeners
worldwide, thanks so much forcoming on the show today.
Speaker 2 (31:45):
Thank you so much, Brian.
It was such a fun experience.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
Hey, it's Brian here, and thanks for tuning in to yet
another episode of theWantrepreneur to Entrepreneur
podcast.
If you haven't checked us outonline, there's so much good
stuff there.
Check out the show's websiteand all the show notes that we
talked about in today's episodeat thewantrepreneurshowcom, and
I just want to give a shout outto our amazing guests.
There's a reason why we are adfreefree and have produced so
(32:12):
many incredible episodes fivedays a week for you, and it's
because our guests step up tothe plate.
These are not sponsored episodes.
These are not infomercials.
Our guests help us cover thecosts of our productions.
They so deeply believe in thepower of getting their message
out in front of you, awesomeentrepreneurs and entrepreneurs,
that they contribute to help usmake these productions possible
(32:35):
.
So thank you to not onlytoday's guests, but all of our
guests in general, and I justwant to invite you check out our
website because you can send usa voicemail there.
We also have live chat.
If you want to interactdirectly with me, go to
thewantrepreneurshowcom.
Initiate a live chat.
It's for real me, and I'mexcited because I'll see you, as
always every monday, wednesday,friday, saturday and sunday
(32:59):
here on the entrepreneur toentrepreneur podcast.
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