November 20, 2025 • 51 mins
Grief, love, and lineage shape a rite of passage as our guests recall learnings from storms, stars, mentors, and manta rays at midnight.
Ke'ilii Mcevilly is an environmental scientist with a Masters degree in sustainability. Ke'ili grew up surfing in California, and is now based on the island of Oahu. She is an artist and waterwoman involved in the flourishing of traditional Hawaiian cultural practice, from aloha aina based conservation work, to hula and making kapa under the tutelage of Pūkoʻa Studios.
Artist- surfer- sailor-filmmaker Chris Miyashiro shares his story in-depth here.
Together, they are Ethnomads, two pacific islanders learning how to wayfind.
We get into an unlikely origin story: finding the canoe on Craigslist, and calling in a mentor to teach traditional lashings.
Then the real crossing begins: A compass left unsecured spins uselessly on day one, a phone with charts pops overboard, and the crew leans into mixed navigation: swells, stars, and disciplined watches.
Ke'ili shares what it meant to be the only wahine aboard, from cycle logistics and zero‑waste choices to the mental endurance of being surrounded by water you can't get amongst.
They weathered cold, wet nights under June gloom, feet stuffed into wetsuit tops, and defied a fear list that covered everything from infections to constipation - revealing the gritty side of ocean travel. Along the way, the ocean becomes a classroom—mahi on the lines, journals open, and the sky replacing the newsfeed.
Threaded through the voyage is lineage. Aʻa, the star whose name means 'to burn bright' and 'to dare,' becomes both compass and prayer. We talk kuleana and wayfinding ethics, the quiet authority of mentors, and how culture lives through practice.
The canoe A'a shapes not just their route but their relationship, teaching balance, patience, and mutual care—two hulls moving as o
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Sound + Video Engineer: Ben J Alexander
Theme song: Shannon Sol Carroll
Additional music by Kai Mcgilvray + Ben J Alexander
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_05 (00:00):
I know this little cliff where we could see some
batteries, and she jumps offthis cliff into the abyss with
this little dive light.
I think it was actually like 11o'clock at night.
Yeah.
And I see the little white lightjust like breaststroking to the
horizon.
I was like, oh, like, ah, it'skind of scary.
And this is like deep water,like there's all kinds of sharks
(00:20):
and big creatures, and I had tojump in.
I just followed her and jumpedin, and we were swimming,
swimming, swimming.
All of a sudden she shined thelight down.
This manner just emerges fromthe depth and just does this
super slow backflip and justbarely graces her hand.
And I was just like, what?
SPEAKER_01 (00:41):
Welcome to Water People, a podcast about the
aquatic experiences that shapewho we become back on land.
I'm your host, Lauren Hill,joined by my partner Dave
Rastovich.
Here we get to talk story withsome of the most interesting and
adept water folk on the planet.
We acknowledge the BunjalongNation, the traditional
custodians of the land andwaters where we work and play,
(01:05):
who have cared for this seacountry for tens of thousands of
years.
Respect and gratitude to allFirst Nations people, including
elders, past, present, andemerging.
This season is supported byPatagonia, whose purpose-driven
mission is to use business tosave our home planet.
(01:27):
Today's episode is a companionto our chat with artist, surfer,
and sailor Chris Miyashiro.
Here we pick up where we leftoff in the last episode, diving
into the voyage that inspiredhis latest film, A-A, which
takes a whimsical dance throughthe personal, ancestral
significance of the 2700nautical mile unsupported
journey he took across thePacific Ocean in a double-hauled
(01:50):
canoe, unassisted, with his twobest friends.
One of which joins us here,Kaili McKevale.
She's an environmental scientistwith a master's degree in
sustainability.
Ka'ili grew up in California andis now based on the island of
Oahu.
Ka'ili is an artist andwaterwoman involved in the
flourishing of traditionalHawaiian cultural practice, from
(02:10):
Aloha Aina-based conservationwork to hula and making kappa
under the tutelage of PukoaStudios.
SPEAKER_00 (02:19):
So when we were coming up with the idea for
sailing up the coast from ourriver region to the barrier
reef, one of the reasons Ireached out to you all was
because of your recent voyagefrom California to Hawaii.
And that that was also on a warmand a smaller one.
(02:40):
And so I guess what Lauren and Iwould really love to know is
where the story of Ah began andwho we're sitting here with now.
Because there's another voice inthe room.
And maybe you want to introduceyourself, or maybe brother
Chris, you can introduce alovely lady.
SPEAKER_01 (02:59):
Please introduce, as you say, your wahine.
Her full name.
SPEAKER_00 (03:11):
This is my Wahine.
And the names that you use.
SPEAKER_05 (03:27):
So um, how do I introduce someone?
Like as if I'm introduced to theside.
SPEAKER_00 (03:32):
Oh, who's so who's who's sitting next to you,
brother?
Who who is that on the right?
SPEAKER_02 (03:36):
Who am I?
SPEAKER_05 (03:37):
So in the room right now we have my wahine, Kaili Ely
Maluhia, the peaceful littlepebble, also known to me as
Moing Moing.
Or Boing Moing, or Noing Noing,or Ely Ely.
But most people call her Kaili,which is her name.
SPEAKER_00 (03:55):
Yay, welcome, Kaylee.
Thanks for joining us.
SPEAKER_04 (03:59):
Yeah, thanks for having me.
It's been so fun with you guys.
Really appreciate the time spentwith you guys so far in
Australia.
unknown (04:06):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (04:07):
It's my pleasure.
SPEAKER_00 (04:08):
So you all were where and how did U-A come into
your lives?
SPEAKER_04 (04:14):
We were in California.
We were living out there for abit taking care of my mom.
And I had been following thesegirls, Woman in the Wind, and
they have a worm as well.
And so I was following theirjourney, and it got me really
interested.
And Chris was really interestedin worms as well.
So he was like, let's just lookit up on Craigslist, I think it
(04:37):
was.
And we're like, what are theodds?
Like there's a worm because theyare pretty rare to come across,
as I'm sure you know.
But sure enough, uh-uh had justbeen listed like two days
before, I think.
So we were like, Oh, let's justdrive over.
Like, what are the chances wecould afford it?
It was in really good condition.
And then we found her.
SPEAKER_05 (04:56):
All we could see was the manus, the bow sticking out
from this little canvas, and Ijust knew there's no other
vessel that emulates a Hawaiianvoyaging canoe as well as this
one did.
And there was no words needed tobe said.
I just felt that electric sparklike, whoa, is this a huge
decision we're about to make inour lives right now?
(05:17):
Cause I don't know if I can potpass this up.
And there was a lot going on atthe time because her mom was
sick and we were taking care ofher, and we both didn't really
have jobs or work going for us,so spending money was a little
bit scary, and it was definitelya big leap of faith.
But it turns out in the long runit was all worth it, and it
(05:38):
became the glue to ourrelationship in a way.
SPEAKER_01 (05:40):
Can you talk about that?
Can you talk about Kaylee?
You grew up in California, latermoved back to Hawaii.
I guess I want to start.
Maybe can we start with how youmet?
Sure.
I've heard the story once beforefrom Chris's point of view, but
I've never heard your point ofview.
SPEAKER_04 (05:57):
Can you tell me that?
Sure, yeah.
I was um, I had just actuallymoved back to Hawaii.
I was snowboarding for a seasonin Colorado.
And so I was on the mainland fora bit, and I had just gotten
back and moved into a new place.
And my friend Bethany, uh, wecall her beef, because she's a
vegetarian.
(06:17):
Um and she was in town, andshe's she's a really good surfer
and just a great human and ummatchmaker, apparently, because
she didn't tell me Chris wasgonna be out, but she was good
friends with him as well.
And we both kind of saw eachother and then paddled up to
beef separately, and we're like,Who is that?
(06:39):
How come I've never seen thatbefore?
And she's like, guys, play itcool, like just be normal.
And then we ended up to bothtexting Beef separately, like,
can we all hang out tonight?
And so we had a bonfire atChris's friend's house, and then
pretty much hung out every dayafter that.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (06:56):
I like that when I asked you about that, because we
would we talked about everythingon the recent time on the boat,
and you were sharing the storyof just full respect and like
awe and admiration for Kayleewhen it came to the manta ray
moment you all shared.
Can you sh give us an insightinto that adventure that moment?
(07:19):
Because it was pretty rad to seethe sparkle in your eye and the
like energy in your voice whenyou were recounting that.
SPEAKER_05 (07:25):
From my perspective.
SPEAKER_00 (07:27):
Whoever wants to share.
SPEAKER_05 (07:28):
Well, it could do both, but from my perspective, I
was with this Wahine who's bornand raised in California, but
has her Hawaiian lineage, andjust I thought that I was this
oh, I'm no Hawaii waters, I'mgrew up diving and free diving
and surfing.
We were in Kona at the time, andshe I know this little cliff
where we could see some mannerrays, and she jumps off this
(07:50):
cliff into the abyss with thislittle dive light, and I just
see this little at night, middleof the night.
Like, I think it was actuallylike 11 o'clock at night.
Yeah, and I see the little whitelight just like breaststroking
to the horizon.
I was like, oh, like ah, it'skind of scary.
And this is like deep water,like there's all kinds of sharks
(08:10):
and big creatures, and I had tojump in because there's AD just
aha, I'm gonna go swim outthere.
And I just followed her andjumped in, and we were swimming,
swimming, swimming.
All of a sudden she shined thelight down, and ha halloo as we
call it.
This manner just emerges fromthe depth and just does this
super slow backflip and justbarely graces her hand.
(08:31):
And I was just like, What?
And then they just kept comingby the numbers, and it would
ended up being like what, likean hour or two hours?
These manneres are just swimmingwith us.
SPEAKER_04 (08:43):
They were probably out there till like two in the
morning, and it was the mostmanneres I'd seen in my life.
How did you know about thatspot?
Secrets?
So we my friends had taken methere before.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (08:56):
That's so wonderful.
SPEAKER_04 (08:57):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (08:58):
What was happening for you when you did that with
him?
Were you was there part of youthat was like, I'll show this
guy what I can do?
Or were you just like head overheels for going out to the
mantis?
Or like what's the the feelingthat you had in your belly when
you're doing that?
SPEAKER_04 (09:12):
I just love sharing magical moments like that with
people I care about and creatingmemories and yeah, just going
for it and not really thinkingabout sharks or whatever fears
are in our head, but it was aspecial place to me and I knew I
wanted to share it with them.
SPEAKER_00 (09:29):
Is that a similar story then when you think of
that moment finding A-A and youwere thinking or dreaming up
what you would then do?
What was the next step?
So you did you do a lot of workon uh to get that kind of level
of seaworthiness going?
Yeah, how did the the momentsafter the decision to jump in,
(09:51):
how did they look?
SPEAKER_04 (09:52):
That's a good question.
Well you have an answer to that.
SPEAKER_05 (09:56):
So I had sailed a little bit before we got a uh,
did a couple overseas passages,and I definitely had the passion
that this is what I wanted todo, and I wanted to share it
with her because she wasinterested in not only sailing
but the worms and the doublehole canoes and the wahine side
of things after following thewomen in the wind girls.
(10:17):
And I remember when we got uh,it was really real at that
moment because now you have aboat that you can't just trailer
into the thing, you have to putit together, you have to spend
time lashing every single bit,and then you have to put the
mast up, and this isn't justsomething that you're doing a
day sale in.
And I kind of got nervous, so Icalled one of my mentors, Uncle
(10:38):
Kiko from Hilo Side, and I knewthat he was a very passionate
Ho'okele Va canoe umpractitioner, and he had a lot
of experience with warhams.
He like was building them at ayoung age and building models,
and he had probably the onlyother pay I've ever seen that
looks like A-Aw.
The design is pretty similar,and so I called them and I said,
(10:59):
Oh, uncle, like I just got aWarham Pahi 26.
He's like, No way, brother,that's one of a kind.
I like C.
And then I was like, uh, can youjust come out here?
I'll pay for your ticket,please, and you can show me how
to rig it.
And I ended up scavenging up themoney to fly this uncle out, and
he spends two days with usshowing us how to lash her
together.
We put her up, put her in thewater, had a little blessing,
(11:21):
and then this big old like stormwas curdling up on the horizon.
You remember that in theanchorage, and it was super
dark, just impending doom, likethe kind that rolls in all day.
And he was I just remember himbeing, I'm a little old for
this.
I gotta go.
And then he takes the dinghythat he just like gifted me, and
(11:42):
he rows it to shore.
He's like, Have fun, welcome toyour new life.
Thanks, Uncle.
And then Kaylee and I justhunkered down in the holes, and
this storm just whoosh.
Oh, he showed me how to anchor.
He's like, This is how you setup a bridle, you'll be fine.
If you if worst case scenario,just throw this other one over,
you have two anchors out, allgood.
Then, okay, later, uncle, andthen storm hits, and we're just
(12:05):
in this, it's in a protectedanchorage, and the sea is just
foaming.
And that was yeah, that was whenlife began, and you kind of
forced into it at that point,and we didn't know where to go.
We had to figure out the wholemarina thing, how to navigate,
getting a slip, and you justgotta do it, you gotta do what
you gotta do.
SPEAKER_01 (12:24):
Did you have voyaging in mind from the start?
Or was was the aspirationsmaller than that?
SPEAKER_04 (12:29):
I think it was really step by step, kind of
like Chris said.
We didn't really know what wewere going into entirely.
We did on a large scale, but thevoyage to Hawaii was born out of
the realization that we neededit back home and we couldn't
afford to ship it, and we didn'treally want to ship it.
(12:50):
We wanted that experience, andwe knew it was possible, so we
decided there was no other way.
How did you know?
SPEAKER_00 (12:57):
That's what I'd like to know.
SPEAKER_04 (12:59):
Well, Chris, do you want to Yeah?
SPEAKER_05 (13:02):
Um well anything's possible.
SPEAKER_01 (13:04):
But that seems pretty tremendous.
Like if you've never, if you'venever started a voyage like
that.
SPEAKER_05 (13:11):
Humans are incredible and they've done
wonderful things, and there's somany stories like Dove, the kid
that sails around the world, andthose girls that literally
paddled across the Pacific in arowboat, and there's just humans
that have crossed the ocean onridiculous crafts.
SPEAKER_01 (13:28):
And all that doesn't make most people want to do it
though.
SPEAKER_05 (13:32):
It kind of does.
(13:57):
You got them.
You've crossed way bigger oceansand you've done all these
things.
It's just the same thing.
You're just on a tiny littlecraft.
It's the same thing.
So I had the confidence of myteachers behind me, and I had
the the I just could reflect onthem in the hard times when I
was preparing, knowing that theybelieved in me when all the
people in the dock were talkingmad crap on us and telling us
(14:19):
that we didn't need to be outthere doing that stuff.
It just was kind of a hard time.
But yeah, just having the rightinfluences.
SPEAKER_01 (14:27):
You framed that voyage up as sort of a a
practical part of getting backhome.
Was there deeper significance tothe trip as well?
Like from the outside lookingin, you just had a a major
change in your life, and alsoyou're at an age where sort of
rights of passage becomesomething either in cultures
(14:50):
that have rights of passageintact that's introduced into
our lives as young, you know,sort of teens and twenties,
great challenges, or they're thekind of thing that we create for
ourselves to um welcome intransformation.
Was there an element of thatrite of passage for you?
SPEAKER_04 (15:11):
There definitely was, yeah.
So, like right when we hadgotten a uh, like Chris said, my
mom was sick, and thenunfortunately she passed away
from cancer, and it was reallyquick, and it was we didn't have
a lot of time to really prepareprocess, and so the voyage was
kind of a way for me to kind oflike you said, go through that
(15:32):
processing.
And I knew that she had returnedto the ocean, and we all will
one day, and it just felt likereturning to my mom and being
with her, being close to her.
I'm also I have Hawaiianlineage, and my grandma and my
aunt and my cousins all live inHawaii, so it was like me
finishing my chapter inCalifornia, finishing my
(15:55):
kuleana, my responsibility oftaking care of her and doing all
that and returning home toHawaii.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (16:03):
That's a grand gesture.
So deeply symbolic.
SPEAKER_00 (16:08):
You left port, and as far as I can recall from some
of the story time, there was astrong wind.
There was a strong wind by aneight-year-old minnow.
Good timing, but you're probablyyou're probably holding that one
(16:30):
on.
Okay, well done.
Speaking of strong winds, youall leave California and start
travelling westward and youencounter some tricky weather.
Can you walk us through what thestart of the voyage felt like?
What happened to your supercomplex navigational system that
(16:52):
went pear-shaped in the firstday, and yeah, just that first
part of the trip.
You can talk about the weather.
How is that?
That was my high tech.
SPEAKER_04 (17:03):
It's perfectly great.
SPEAKER_00 (17:08):
That's right, yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (17:10):
Yeah, so when we first acquired A-A, we knew that
we had to put her to the testand get comfortable with the
gear and the rigging andeverything, make sure it was all
in order because we did put ittogether with Uncle Kiko as the
main guide and really no otherguidance.
So we'd sailed across the coastof California and up to
(17:30):
Catalina, and then we werefeeling a bit cocky, I guess,
and decided to go north towardsum LA and Malibu, and things got
really hairy really fast.
We were kind of told uh early onthat it wasn't the best time to
go go up that way, but we reallywanted to see the islands up
there, and so we were reallyexcited to see all of the
(17:52):
wildlife and see some friends upthere and share a-a-we with
them, and didn't think of theweather too much, but we started
battling upwind, and then ourengine went down pretty quick in
the middle of the night.
We were in the middle of ashipping lane, so these huge
shipping boats were going pastin the middle of the night.
We didn't have really anyworking lights, so we were like
(18:14):
holding up our lanterns, and wehad basically triple A for
boats.
Is it US boating?
SPEAKER_05 (18:20):
Boat US.
SPEAKER_04 (18:21):
Boat US or something like that, and so we were
decided, like all cowarding andshame, that we were gonna call
them and ask for a rescue, andthey were kind of like, Where
are you?
And we had to figure that out,and they towed us in the middle
of the night back to Venice,Boat Harbor, and we were very
fortunate.
We found some guys that werevery knowledgeable about
(18:42):
engines.
We figured out our first enginetroubles, which was awesome.
So we learned a lot, but it wasa scary experience for sure.
We were bashing up wind in themiddle of the night with big
boats coming through that weknew wouldn't stop for us, so it
was definitely a test.
SPEAKER_00 (19:00):
Okay.
SPEAKER_05 (19:00):
I think he was relating to our voyage home.
SPEAKER_04 (19:02):
Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (19:04):
That's good.
I'm I'm glad to hear thatbecause they're the things that
build your familiarity with yourvessel.
SPEAKER_05 (19:11):
But in that time, our compass was supposed to be
screwed on, and I didn't want todo that because I didn't want to
put any holes in the vessel.
So I just had it sitting like ona little pad, and throughout all
of my preparations from ourvoyage from California to
Hawaii, that was the one thing Inever thought about.
And I did all of our rigging, Idid all of our what I thought
(19:31):
was electronics that failed, andI didn't think about the compass
when we set off from Californiato Hawaii.
Kalani was like, What, Brian?
You want compass I can follow?
I was like, nah, just use thisswell, use this star.
Oh, actually, I do have acompass.
And I dug down below and I wentto grab it and it flipped over.
And I guess the orientation ofit with the magnetic and the
(19:53):
bubbles did something, and itjust started spinning.
And we looked at each other andwe started laughing so hard.
We're like, Are you serious?
We don't have a compass.
And I was like, Well, I mean,you know, you don't really need
one, and that was kind of wherethat whole joke of something
went wrong.
No worries, I go ahead and callthe supervisor because there's
like no one to look out for us,and we were kind of our own
(20:16):
supervisors.
SPEAKER_01 (20:17):
Okay, so you don't have a compass.
How are you navigating?
SPEAKER_05 (20:21):
Well, we did a mix of everything.
We had a we had Navionics,obviously.
I didn't want to be silly outthere with no backup, so we all
had Navionics downloaded on ourphone.
We had little Garmin inreachesso that people could follow us
in case of emergency.
We had those clipped to our umlifelines, and in the middle of
(20:41):
the night, Kalani uh woke up andhe had the go shishi and he he
opened his jacket and it nudgedhis phone out, and boom, that
was the first phone that we wereusing.
So that one was gone and we wereall bums.
He had a bunch of cool music onit.
And then yeah, we ended up justusing like one phone, I think.
Just to check.
But I really wanted to make surethat Kalani and Kaylee had the
(21:04):
time and the space to be able toidentify swells and me too, and
identify stars that lined upwith swells, and hold the canoe
in a way that everything was inone perpetual motion.
And so yeah, I would say 50-50.
SPEAKER_00 (21:20):
So you've gone how many how many miles is it in
total, that journey?
And how far into it did you feellike it started to become like
just different?
Like when you become aquatic,you know, that feeling where
you've like you you've kind offallen out of your land rhythms
of things and thoughts, and youbecome far more of an aquatic
(21:43):
creature.
So, yeah, two parts.
How long is the journey and whendid that sort of change come
where you just felt like you'reone organism?
SPEAKER_05 (21:52):
Well, the journey was 2700 nautical miles or
something around there.
Wow.
I don't know how much it wasunder the keel or under our
hull.
We don't have a keel.
Because if you zoom in at ourtrack, we did a couple
loop-de-doops and zigzags alongthe way.
Cool.
But what was it for you?
How is becoming an offshoresailor for the first time?
SPEAKER_04 (22:14):
Um, it was really interesting because I think your
brain is so used to matching upmemories with a place or some
sort of surroundings andenvironment.
And so I found myself early on,like probably the second or
third day, having dreams ofislands that my brain just made
up in my head.
(22:34):
And it was because it was thesame thing every day 360, which
is blue and most of the timegray, unfortunately.
We had a lot of clouds.
So I think it was early on whereI was having to adapt to that,
and it was quite interesting.
What were the challenges?
Well, luckily, nobody wasseasick.
We were all really, reallynervous.
(22:56):
We'd kind of grown up on boatsand we're all surfers and
comfortable in the ocean, but wewere still nervous we were gonna
get seasick, but none of us did,so that was really good.
I think it was mostly emotionalchallenges or mental challenges
for at me at least, just beingthe only Wahine on board and
being completely surrounded bythe ocean but unable to go in.
(23:18):
I found that really hard.
Yeah.
How about you?
SPEAKER_05 (23:22):
But at the same time, the ocean came to us.
We were so wet the first week ofthe trip.
SPEAKER_01 (23:27):
And cold, right?
And cold.
SPEAKER_05 (23:29):
So Kalani and I, before we left, it was just him
and I in California gettingready, and we made a list of all
the things that could go wrongfrom literally like psychotic
breakdown to someone getting aninfection on their finger.
Wow.
And like trying to find ways tolike at least mentally prepare
for it, but we didn't preparefor how cold and wet we would
be.
SPEAKER_01 (23:48):
Wait, wait, wait, wait.
Wait, wait, wait.
Wet didn't occur to you.
SPEAKER_05 (23:53):
I mean, like, I thought I knew a bit about
sailing, and I was like, oh,it'll be a beam reach, and then
eventually it'll be a broadreach, and then eventually we're
gonna be straight runningdownwind.
It shouldn't be too bad.
And I forgot to take intoaccount that the trade winds
actually happen a lot furtheroff the coast than it looks on a
chart.
And we had that is it calledSanta Ana winds when it goes on
(24:14):
shore?
We had the Santa Ana winds andthe June gloom, so the air was
just super wet, and then it wason shore for a couple days
because we weren't going superfast, and we were sailing
straight into the wind.
And as you know, on Magpie,actually we didn't get too wet,
but on A-Au, you get really wetbecause we don't have that much
(24:34):
hiding spots.
No dream pod, no dream pod, juststraight on the deck in whatever
clothes you brought, and youwould think that you would have
the time to dry off because thesun would come out, but it was
June gloom, so there was no sun,and we were so wet.
And the one thing Patagonia,thank you, Patagonia, gave us
(24:55):
was a couple wetsuit tops, andwe didn't think that we would
use them, but we used them asshoes because our feet were so
cold and wet.
And I never thought that becauseI mean I've sailed to Alaska and
I was barefoot the whole timeand I was fine, but I wasn't wet
the whole time.
And so this time sailing fromthe temperates to the tropics, I
(25:16):
thought, oh no worries, feet arewhatever.
But yeah, our feet were frigid,look like Mordor, or no, look
like uh what's his name?
George Green.
Yeah.
Matt is never worn shoes exceptwhite.
SPEAKER_01 (25:29):
Are you get so you're you're wet and you're
trying to stay warm?
Are you getting like crazyfungal infections?
Somehow no.
Because you think like even likeyour armpits or like you're
trying to keep your body heat,you'd think trapped inside of
warming wet clothes.
SPEAKER_04 (25:47):
Yeah, it might have been because we didn't move
much.
Once we were in our set shifts,so since there were three of us,
we would do three hour shifts.
Four hours four hours, sorry,and one person would be sleeping
in the hole, two people would beon deck, one person would be
half sleeping, also scanning forboats, and the other person
would be hand steering.
(26:08):
And once you were in yourposition, which was usually
laying down and just steering bya star or by the swells, or just
laying down half asleep, orlaying down in the hole, you
didn't really move becausemoving was such a workout, and
also if it was night at least,kind of scary.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_05 (26:27):
Wow.
SPEAKER_04 (26:28):
So I don't maybe that's why we didn't shave.
Do you understand?
SPEAKER_05 (26:31):
I don't know about you, but my butt was red.
I was so shaved up.
Yeah, but no, you didn't have aweird.
I didn't have a molo on thattrip.
Next trip will be different.
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Kaylee, can you talk about someof the unique challenges of
being the only Wahine on theboat?
(29:30):
Yeah.
And the sort of humbling natureof some of those moments.
SPEAKER_04 (29:35):
If you want to talk about that, you don't have to.
I mean, I don't know how howreal we want to get, but all the
way.
All the way to the body.
SPEAKER_05 (29:43):
Give the people what they want.
SPEAKER_04 (29:46):
Well, first thing that comes to everyone's head is
like when you're on your cycle,what happens?
And I actually called up thisother badass sailor girl, Liz
Clark, who I know you've talkedto before.
And she's sailed around theworld and So I was like, please
help me.
What do I do if I get my period?
Because I was so afraid and kindof embarrassed because it was
(30:07):
just me and two guys.
Well, you knew it was gonna be amonth-long journey, kind of.
SPEAKER_01 (30:11):
Three weeks, two months, so you're definitely
gonna get it to happen.
SPEAKER_04 (30:13):
Yeah, it's happening and there's no way to go around
it.
Yeah.
It always happens at the worsttimes, or at least for me.
And she was saying, like periodpanties, and to just rinse them
out on the side of the boat andthen hang them up to dry.
And I was so lucky it didn'train because I didn't think
about that being a possibility,and I would have just been out
of luck.
But yeah, you have to carry allyour trash.
(30:34):
So anything that you're gonnause, even single use, we also
had to think about.
So that was another thing.
I didn't want to create excesswaste, and so that was a really
helpful tip.
But I think that aside again,the mental challenges, just not
having like a female to talk to,the boys were very supportive,
but it is kind of difficult whenyou're going through hormonal
(30:56):
shifts in your body and you needrest, but you can't rest.
Um, and so the guys were reallysupportive in that, and that
they tried to understand andthey gave me breaks when they
could, but they had to rest too.
So yeah, I think those were thetwo main ones was the mental and
the physical.
SPEAKER_01 (31:13):
One thing that we talked about a couple of days
ago was that it was actuallydangerous to use the toilet
unsupervised.
Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (31:27):
That is also true.
That was uncomfortable andawkward for sure being a girl.
And I mean, Chris was okay.
Maybe some people aren't thatcomfortable for all the owners,
but six months into yourrelationship?
SPEAKER_01 (31:39):
That's true.
That's pretty a year.
Okay.
All right, that's still prettyearly for like full-on movement
making.
That's true.
SPEAKER_05 (31:46):
Gotta do what you gotta do.
SPEAKER_01 (31:48):
Yeah, not with Chris.
SPEAKER_04 (31:49):
Yeah.
It's always been supportive ofmaking dirt.
SPEAKER_05 (31:54):
I was pretty adamant about them going number two and
making a dirt because one of myfears on that list is for my
crewmates to get um what is itcalled?
Constipated.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (32:06):
That was on the list, not wet, but constipated.
It was overly eager to giveKalani and I enemas.
SPEAKER_05 (32:12):
Yeah, I was I was threatening them with enemas.
SPEAKER_01 (32:15):
Wow, why did so why did that make the list?
I would never think of it.
SPEAKER_05 (32:17):
Well, it's like because I could imagine I've
never been constipated, but Ican imagine that on a canoe, you
know, you have to go over theside and get into these weird
positions, especially when theweather is really rough.
You have to find a new spot.
Yeah, exactly.
You get anxiety, and I had noproblem because like I've been
on sailing canoes before and Igot it, but they have never gone
on like an open ocean voyage, soI was scared that they were just
(32:40):
gonna try to not go for thefirst couple days.
And I was scared that I mean,obviously, like all health is
taken into consideration andthat it would be painful or
whatever, is they wouldn't beable to handle their
responsibilities if they got allstuck up.
So gotta release some stuff.
SPEAKER_01 (33:02):
How long was the list?
Huge I wish we still had it.
I know.
SPEAKER_05 (33:06):
If Kalani's out there, I'm gonna tell him.
Or if if it's out there, I'mgonna have Kalani find it
because he would have it.
SPEAKER_01 (33:12):
Yeah, on his notebook.
What a great exercise.
SPEAKER_05 (33:14):
It's a great exercise.
SPEAKER_01 (33:15):
Like to really write down all the fear.
SPEAKER_05 (33:18):
Yeah.
We even had it down to liketying someone to the mast kind.
SPEAKER_01 (33:22):
Wow.
SPEAKER_05 (33:23):
Like, what if they're like mutiny?
Yeah.
Or no mutiny, like gentlemutiny.
All right.
Like, if I'm somehow not in mybrain, Kalana, you have to do
something to me to like, I don'tknow.
SPEAKER_01 (33:34):
Restrain me.
Yeah, I don't know.
SPEAKER_05 (33:36):
I don't know what's gonna happen.
SPEAKER_01 (33:37):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_05 (33:38):
We're all fine, but we all never had any issues with
that in the past.
But it was fun to think about.
SPEAKER_01 (33:43):
So how are you passing the days?
Obviously, you have your tasksthat you have to complete all
through the day, except for whenyou're sleeping in the hall.
What what's going on betweenyour ears?
SPEAKER_04 (33:55):
Just thinking, honestly, and trying to stay on
course.
The most breaks we had wasprobably when it was sunny, and
we would instantly set up thesolar and kind of lay out all of
our clothes across the deck.
We were also trying to fish.
We caught two Mahi Mahi, whichwas amazing, or Dorado.
That was yummy.
I had a little Kindle, and I gotChris one too, but unfortunately
(34:17):
it also got wet and brokealongside our compass.
So yeah, that was sad.
So I was reading a bit.
I know Chris and Kalani werejournaling a lot.
SPEAKER_05 (34:26):
Yeah, I feel like voyaging is a great opportunity
for you to use your time in adifferent way because you don't
have the distractions of theoutside world.
So we're we're so used,especially like our generation,
our phones are like our littleescapism portal.
And when you don't have that,suddenly your portal becomes the
sky.
(34:47):
We're suddenly talking about thestars way more, or suddenly
laughing about some trivialthing back on land, or
discussing what we're gonna doif this squall decides to shift
a little bit more west, or whatwe're gonna do if the sun is
covered at this time of day, sowe can't get our bearing, and
blah blah blah.
And I feel like yeah, you justtap into a different type of
human, like we were sayingearlier, and I think it's super
(35:10):
important for everyone toexperience that, no matter if
it's sailing or not.
And that is just a world whereyou're forced into it, which is
cool.
You don't have to really try topractice it, you're just you're
out there, and it actuallythere's never a boring time for
me.
I was never were you bored?
SPEAKER_04 (35:26):
I I was not bored, definitely not bored.
SPEAKER_05 (35:29):
You tap into the caveman brain where suddenly
your book becomes the lines inthe ocean and the sky becomes
your Instagram.
That's pretty cool.
SPEAKER_04 (35:38):
A lot of observation.
SPEAKER_05 (35:40):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (35:40):
Okay, okay, Lee, I got a couple of these words in
this list that I thought of you,and I didn't give them to Chris
because I thought you'd do someyou'd have some riffing on them.
How to be kind.
What comes to your mind when youhear those words?
How to be kind.
SPEAKER_04 (35:59):
For some reason I instantly thought of a garden,
and I don't know why.
Maybe just because you have toput so much in and for not a lot
of return sometimes.
Sometimes you'll get a lot,sometimes you get a little, and
you never know.
But you're just kind of doing itfor the joy of giving back to
the earth, and that's what youalways come back to is and it's
honestly could be like we weretalking about on the boat a
(36:20):
little bit, that it could be oneof the main purposes of being on
earth as humans is taking careof the land and the plants and
even the animals and giving backto others.
SPEAKER_00 (36:30):
Wonderful.
How about our most vibrantselves?
What comes to mind when you hearthat?
SPEAKER_04 (36:37):
I guess I just think of like playing and like having
fun, laughing with friends anddoing what you really enjoy,
like sailing and surfing andswimming and doing things for
the pure joy of it to raise yourfrequencies and your vibrations
higher, and really not for muchelse to come out of that.
It's not like it's gonna giveyou like a reward in it besides
(36:58):
your own joy.
SPEAKER_00 (36:59):
Yeah.
Okay, last one.
Water mythology and symbology.
So water mythology.
What comes to your mind when youthink about maybe the more
mythical aspects of water?
SPEAKER_04 (37:15):
I think of that book, The Messages of Water.
Have you read that book?
SPEAKER_00 (37:19):
Is that the Matsumoto?
SPEAKER_04 (37:22):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (37:22):
Japanese.
SPEAKER_04 (37:33):
So they like did all of the clearing and gave it
positive energy and everythingthat he listed in that book to
make it the purest water.
And that's the water we broughton our voyage from California to
Hawaii, like really last minute.
We thought it was funny becausewe had both just read that book
and we thought it was reallyinspiring because we're so much
water, and seeing how much it'simpacted just by saying, I love
(37:57):
you, or like so you're sobeautiful that it makes it more
pure, and when you say hatefulthings that it can be distorted,
and to think that's going on inour bodies on a cellular level,
like every day when we're havingconversation or listening to
music, watching movies, so yeah,I guess that's what I think
about.
SPEAKER_00 (38:17):
When you think um when you reflect now on RR and
that journey, where has thatjourney led you all to at this
point in time?
And what do you see as potentiallines into the future together
and with R?
SPEAKER_04 (38:34):
Oh, that's a good question.
Um I think it's really importantin a relationship to have
something you learn and dotogether, whether it's surfing
or for my parents it was tandemsurfing.
It was something that they didtogether, and they grew and
excelled at it.
But for Chris and I it'ssailing, and I feel so lucky to
have a partner that I can dothat with.
(38:55):
So I think it's just gonna beour vessel, literally, towards
our relationship and growingtogether as people and learning
together.
But yeah, I think it's importantfor everybody in relationship to
have an activity or a sport orsomething that they like to do
as a pastime.
SPEAKER_00 (39:12):
How about for you, Miss Doss?
SPEAKER_05 (39:14):
How has voyaging, how has a impacted our life
today?
SPEAKER_00 (39:18):
Yeah, and just where you see like just some of the I
don't know, a a kind of a sensefor where the canoe and your
interests together with sailingand voyaging might lead you into
the future.
SPEAKER_05 (39:33):
Well, bouncing off the relationship thing, the
canoe is a double hole va'akolua as we call it.
So each hole has to be balancedproperly, and it definitely
reflects in your relationshiptowards each other.
One can't be heavier or morebuoyant than the other.
You have to be mutually intactto move forward, and that has
(39:54):
really impacted my life andKaylee's where we see it in
everything now, and I think thecanoe serves as a symbol that
carries throughout ourday-to-day life, and it's it's
really cool because people whoyou never get to meet are in
your lives because of the canoe,like you guys.
And I just think it's a reallyimportant thing to keep around,
(40:16):
and it goes back to the idea ofKouleana, which is this canoe
found us, and it is not only ourresponsibility to take what
we've learned and share it, butit's a privilege, and a lot of
people get this opportunity, soto be able to like perpetuate
the canoe culture that we'vekind of just happened to blast
(40:36):
ourselves into is definitely aprivilege we need to cherish
every moment when we have it,but also it's an important
responsibility that to do itwell and to go further and do
things outside of our comfortzones.
And uh uh has really shown thatto me, especially in our last
trip returning from Kauai, justchoosing your window right and
making sure things are in lineand choosing which people to go
(40:59):
with, and yeah, it it itreflects on your life.
Like who do you want to surroundyourself with?
Who do you want to go throughthe hard challenges with
together?
And like, where do you go fromhere with what you got?
So the canoe is definitelyeverything now.
Beautiful.
SPEAKER_00 (41:13):
And can we, for the record, get a definition of uh?
SPEAKER_01 (41:18):
Why is she called a uh, I was gonna pull it from the
film actually, because I lovethe way I love how you go in
there.
SPEAKER_05 (41:24):
There's a little bit of a story behind it, so you can
do both, yeah.
So I remember when I firststarted getting into sailing, my
first sailing vessel I was everon was Hokulea, and it was an
extreme privilege to be there.
And I remember it was a nightsky and I knew nothing about the
stars, and I was sitting next toUncle Ninoa at the time, who
knows everything that I want toknow about the stars, and I
(41:46):
asked him what this bright starthat I saw kind of above the
southwestern horizon, and hetold me his uh uh.
And he said that this man WillKayselka was the one that taught
him a lot about the stars, andhe pretty much told me, Can you
go home and tell me the rightascension, declination, and
(42:07):
azimuth of that star?
And I said, What is that?
And still to this day I can'treally understand everything,
Uncle, but I try, and Aah wasthe one star that kind of was a
spark, the genesis to myunderstanding of the heavens.
And when we had acquired ourcanoe a-a-she didn't have a name
at the time, and I was on asailing adventure from
(42:30):
California down to Tahiti, and Iremember just thinking, like,
what what's like the beginning?
Like, what's the spark for me?
And it was quite literally thestar A-A, which means to burn
brightly, and depending on howyou spell it with all of the
Okinos and Kaha Kos, it couldmean to burn brightly, it could
also mean to dare to dosomething, it could mean a small
(42:51):
rootlet, or it could mean likesharp pokey lava rock.
So there's all these little likeparables and metaphors in it,
but to me it was kind of thisicon, this bright shining star
in the sky that my teacher hadtaught me, and and a was the
first star I ever learned, andso I named her for the first
canoe I ever owned.
And it just so happens that ourpath home to Hawaii was in the
(43:12):
shining, glistening pathway ofA-A on the setting west
southwestern ocean, and it alljust came together, and she was
meant to be named that.
SPEAKER_01 (43:20):
Okay, we didn't get to hear from you.
What was it like arriving homeafter that tremendous voyage?
SPEAKER_04 (43:27):
It was so beautiful.
It was also our first night offull stars right before we had
gotten there.
And we had saved like a specialmeal that my friend had given to
us from Marquesas, MarshallIslands, and it was like this
preserved was it?
Oh yeah, Lau Hala, and it tastedlike rose, but it was something
(43:52):
that they would eat on voyagestraditionally in the Pacific
Islands, and so it was like ourbig cheers moment, and we had
just started to see the islandclouds forming and this huge
arrangement of stars above us.
So it was already a homecominglike the day before, and then
all that day we had seen theisland just keep rising from the
(44:13):
sea, and when we finally got toour dock, my dad paddled out on
uh one man, and his dad and hismom were out in a fishing boat
of his uncle's, so our familywas out to see us first, which
was really sweet.
And then our friend was throwingflowers from the dock, and all
of our friends had a hugearrangement of foods that they
figured we were craving.
(44:34):
Um, so it was really a lot totake in.
It was kind of overwhelming, butit was just so much love.
There's just pure love and allour community and family there.
It was so special.
SPEAKER_01 (44:44):
You all felt like that voyage was possible.
Did you get that sense from yourfamilies and your community as
well?
Or was there skepticism?
SPEAKER_00 (44:55):
You were in big trouble.
SPEAKER_05 (45:01):
To put myself in Uncle's shoes.
Imagine your beloved daughter inthis random brata from Hawaii,
dreaming of all these sailingcanoe adventures, and he's about
to take her over the ocean.
I would be skeptical too.
SPEAKER_04 (45:14):
My dad was really nervous and pretty fearful.
I think rightly so.
Like Chris said, if your kid wasgoing on a voyage like this,
you'd be skeptical and afraidfor their health and safety.
But when it came down to thelast few days, he realized, oh,
they're going no matter what, orhow I feel about it.
So he switched to fullsupporting mode and really
(45:38):
engaged and helped us withwhatever we needed.
He ran to the dock last minuteto give us a bag of medications
that he had thought of that wemight even need, and he let us
use his van and all kinds ofstuff.
So he definitely switched, buthe was very skeptical.
And Chris's parents were reallysupportive.
I know they were a littleafraid, but pretty used to Chris
(46:00):
going on these wild adventuresat this point.
SPEAKER_05 (46:03):
Oh, the satellite.
So during the trip, we had ourlittle garment tracking things,
and there are little dots thatour parents could keep track of
our waypoints.
I think we had set it for everyfour hours, it would have like a
little track so they would knowwhere we are.
And I guess I don't know if thisis true, I have to fact check,
but first worldwide satelliteoutage in the last century,
(46:25):
maybe, or since satellitesstarted being a thing, it was a
big deal where like allsatellite connections for a few
hours were cut off and we didn'tknow.
We were just happily sailingalong singing songs and when was
when it was like halfway throughthe trip, probably in July.
SPEAKER_01 (46:42):
Was it last year?
SPEAKER_05 (46:43):
Yeah, last year.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (46:45):
I feel like people would have experienced no.
I was just thinking thateveryone listening probably
would have experienced somesmall ripple effect.
SPEAKER_05 (46:51):
But my poor parents or our poor parents, our all
three of our dots just wentblip, and they didn't know that
there was a satellite outage.
It's not like you're justgoogling it immediately.
You're just looking at yourphone, like, ah, so yeah, we
scared them pretty hard, but Imean we didn't know.
Thankfully, we were just outthere.
SPEAKER_04 (47:08):
It was cute though, all our parents, me, Chris, and
Kalani, they all had a groupchat and they all became really
good friends because they werejust sharing messages the whole
month.
Um, so that was really sweet.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_05 (47:22):
As far as family goes, I do remember when I first
made landfall from Hawaii toTahiti on one of my adventures.
It was really strange.
But during that time, this wasthe moment in the beginning of
our podcast that I was speakingabout.
I wasn't super tired at all, butI could see my grandma's face
really, really like in the sky,and I wasn't like hallucinating
or anything, it was just in mymind.
(47:43):
And she had passed away the yearbefore, or a couple years
before, but yeah, I never reallythought about why.
But she was born and raised inHilo, which was the port that we
made landfall in.
And I remember telling my dadthat, and he was all emotional
because I was his mom.
But he was telling me as we'remaking our plan to come into the
east side of Oahu, that that waswhere my grandpa was born and
(48:04):
raised, and to always know thathe'll be watching us come in.
And he was like a super big fanof voyaging canoes, he was the
one that had the paintings onthe wall, and so I had that in
my mind of them out there, andthen her mom was out there
looking from the other side inCalifornia, so we felt that
connection.
And Klani, he'll never talkabout this, but he is an
(48:24):
incredible lineage of voyagingcanoes, and I remember him
showing me like where hisancestors were buried, and
there's petroglyphs of Hawaiiancrab claw sails and all of these
heroes of old.
And so, yeah, we just had wejust knew that there was family
on the earthly plane, on theterrestrial plane, but also in
the heavenly plane.
So we're we're we're fine.
You got him.
SPEAKER_01 (48:47):
You've spoken a bit about the personal significance
of the voyage.
What about the significance ofcultural lineage and carrying on
old ways?
How much has that played intoyour interest and devotion to
voyaging?
SPEAKER_04 (49:08):
I mean, just going back, all our ancestors were
voyagers.
You know, the Hawaiians, theIrish, the Japanese, the
Chinese.
So it was pretty amazing tothink we were the first ones in
our family in so manygenerations that were doing this
sort of wayfinding and thisjourneying back to our little
island, especially to Hawaii,which is kind of just a small
(49:31):
dot on a map.
We felt the presence of all ofthose who had come before us,
and it was pretty amazing tothink that they were watching us
do the same trip that they hadmaybe done long ago.
So it was pretty powerful,especially for Kalani, I think.
SPEAKER_05 (49:46):
Yeah, I remember when we did the first little
screening of uh-uh, his grandmawas there, beautiful woman, all
white Hawaiian hair, and she wasexpressing to me how proud she
was that her boy got to do that.
And I feel like that's anotherresponsibility with the canoe is
you never know how many peopleyou take on this canoe and how
(50:09):
many passions it fires up to bea navigator in their own right,
would be breaking that line intheir lineage to do something
different that was an ancientpractice long ago.
And yeah, it could it doesn'thave to be in the ocean at all,
but just knowing that you'regonna make one of your
great-great-grandparents proudin a ways makes it all worth it.
SPEAKER_01 (50:31):
Time is precious.
Thanks for spending some ofyours listening with us today.
Our editor this season is themulti-talented Ben Jake
Alexander.
The soundtrack was composed byShannon Soul Carroll with
additional tunes by Dave andBen.
We'll be continuing today'sconversation on Instagram, where
we're at Water People Podcast.
And you can subscribe to ourvery infrequent newsletter to
(50:52):
get book recommendations,questions we're pondering,
behind the scenes glimpses intorecording the podcast, and more
via our website,waterpeoplepodcast.com.
I know this little cliff where we could see some
batteries, and she jumps offthis cliff into the abyss with
this little dive light.
I think it was actually like 11o'clock at night.
Yeah.
And I see the little white lightjust like breaststroking to the
horizon.
I was like, oh, like, ah, it'skind of scary.
And this is like deep water,like there's all kinds of sharks
(00:20):
and big creatures, and I had tojump in.
I just followed her and jumpedin, and we were swimming,
swimming, swimming.
All of a sudden she shined thelight down.
This manner just emerges fromthe depth and just does this
super slow backflip and justbarely graces her hand.
And I was just like, what?
SPEAKER_01 (00:41):
Welcome to Water People, a podcast about the
aquatic experiences that shapewho we become back on land.
I'm your host, Lauren Hill,joined by my partner Dave
Rastovich.
Here we get to talk story withsome of the most interesting and
adept water folk on the planet.
We acknowledge the BunjalongNation, the traditional
custodians of the land andwaters where we work and play,
(01:05):
who have cared for this seacountry for tens of thousands of
years.
Respect and gratitude to allFirst Nations people, including
elders, past, present, andemerging.
This season is supported byPatagonia, whose purpose-driven
mission is to use business tosave our home planet.
(01:27):
Today's episode is a companionto our chat with artist, surfer,
and sailor Chris Miyashiro.
Here we pick up where we leftoff in the last episode, diving
into the voyage that inspiredhis latest film, A-A, which
takes a whimsical dance throughthe personal, ancestral
significance of the 2700nautical mile unsupported
journey he took across thePacific Ocean in a double-hauled
(01:50):
canoe, unassisted, with his twobest friends.
One of which joins us here,Kaili McKevale.
She's an environmental scientistwith a master's degree in
sustainability.
Ka'ili grew up in California andis now based on the island of
Oahu.
Ka'ili is an artist andwaterwoman involved in the
flourishing of traditionalHawaiian cultural practice, from
(02:10):
Aloha Aina-based conservationwork to hula and making kappa
under the tutelage of PukoaStudios.
SPEAKER_00 (02:19):
So when we were coming up with the idea for
sailing up the coast from ourriver region to the barrier
reef, one of the reasons Ireached out to you all was
because of your recent voyagefrom California to Hawaii.
And that that was also on a warmand a smaller one.
(02:40):
And so I guess what Lauren and Iwould really love to know is
where the story of Ah began andwho we're sitting here with now.
Because there's another voice inthe room.
And maybe you want to introduceyourself, or maybe brother
Chris, you can introduce alovely lady.
SPEAKER_01 (02:59):
Please introduce, as you say, your wahine.
Her full name.
SPEAKER_00 (03:11):
This is my Wahine.
And the names that you use.
SPEAKER_05 (03:27):
So um, how do I introduce someone?
Like as if I'm introduced to theside.
SPEAKER_00 (03:32):
Oh, who's so who's who's sitting next to you,
brother?
Who who is that on the right?
SPEAKER_02 (03:36):
Who am I?
SPEAKER_05 (03:37):
So in the room right now we have my wahine, Kaili Ely
Maluhia, the peaceful littlepebble, also known to me as
Moing Moing.
Or Boing Moing, or Noing Noing,or Ely Ely.
But most people call her Kaili,which is her name.
SPEAKER_00 (03:55):
Yay, welcome, Kaylee.
Thanks for joining us.
SPEAKER_04 (03:59):
Yeah, thanks for having me.
It's been so fun with you guys.
Really appreciate the time spentwith you guys so far in
Australia.
unknown (04:06):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (04:07):
It's my pleasure.
SPEAKER_00 (04:08):
So you all were where and how did U-A come into
your lives?
SPEAKER_04 (04:14):
We were in California.
We were living out there for abit taking care of my mom.
And I had been following thesegirls, Woman in the Wind, and
they have a worm as well.
And so I was following theirjourney, and it got me really
interested.
And Chris was really interestedin worms as well.
So he was like, let's just lookit up on Craigslist, I think it
(04:37):
was.
And we're like, what are theodds?
Like there's a worm because theyare pretty rare to come across,
as I'm sure you know.
But sure enough, uh-uh had justbeen listed like two days
before, I think.
So we were like, Oh, let's justdrive over.
Like, what are the chances wecould afford it?
It was in really good condition.
And then we found her.
SPEAKER_05 (04:56):
All we could see was the manus, the bow sticking out
from this little canvas, and Ijust knew there's no other
vessel that emulates a Hawaiianvoyaging canoe as well as this
one did.
And there was no words needed tobe said.
I just felt that electric sparklike, whoa, is this a huge
decision we're about to make inour lives right now?
(05:17):
Cause I don't know if I can potpass this up.
And there was a lot going on atthe time because her mom was
sick and we were taking care ofher, and we both didn't really
have jobs or work going for us,so spending money was a little
bit scary, and it was definitelya big leap of faith.
But it turns out in the long runit was all worth it, and it
(05:38):
became the glue to ourrelationship in a way.
SPEAKER_01 (05:40):
Can you talk about that?
Can you talk about Kaylee?
You grew up in California, latermoved back to Hawaii.
I guess I want to start.
Maybe can we start with how youmet?
Sure.
I've heard the story once beforefrom Chris's point of view, but
I've never heard your point ofview.
SPEAKER_04 (05:57):
Can you tell me that?
Sure, yeah.
I was um, I had just actuallymoved back to Hawaii.
I was snowboarding for a seasonin Colorado.
And so I was on the mainland fora bit, and I had just gotten
back and moved into a new place.
And my friend Bethany, uh, wecall her beef, because she's a
vegetarian.
(06:17):
Um and she was in town, andshe's she's a really good surfer
and just a great human and ummatchmaker, apparently, because
she didn't tell me Chris wasgonna be out, but she was good
friends with him as well.
And we both kind of saw eachother and then paddled up to
beef separately, and we're like,Who is that?
(06:39):
How come I've never seen thatbefore?
And she's like, guys, play itcool, like just be normal.
And then we ended up to bothtexting Beef separately, like,
can we all hang out tonight?
And so we had a bonfire atChris's friend's house, and then
pretty much hung out every dayafter that.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (06:56):
I like that when I asked you about that, because we
would we talked about everythingon the recent time on the boat,
and you were sharing the storyof just full respect and like
awe and admiration for Kayleewhen it came to the manta ray
moment you all shared.
Can you sh give us an insightinto that adventure that moment?
(07:19):
Because it was pretty rad to seethe sparkle in your eye and the
like energy in your voice whenyou were recounting that.
SPEAKER_05 (07:25):
From my perspective.
SPEAKER_00 (07:27):
Whoever wants to share.
SPEAKER_05 (07:28):
Well, it could do both, but from my perspective, I
was with this Wahine who's bornand raised in California, but
has her Hawaiian lineage, andjust I thought that I was this
oh, I'm no Hawaii waters, I'mgrew up diving and free diving
and surfing.
We were in Kona at the time, andshe I know this little cliff
where we could see some mannerrays, and she jumps off this
(07:50):
cliff into the abyss with thislittle dive light, and I just
see this little at night, middleof the night.
Like, I think it was actuallylike 11 o'clock at night.
Yeah, and I see the little whitelight just like breaststroking
to the horizon.
I was like, oh, like ah, it'skind of scary.
And this is like deep water,like there's all kinds of sharks
(08:10):
and big creatures, and I had tojump in because there's AD just
aha, I'm gonna go swim outthere.
And I just followed her andjumped in, and we were swimming,
swimming, swimming.
All of a sudden she shined thelight down, and ha halloo as we
call it.
This manner just emerges fromthe depth and just does this
super slow backflip and justbarely graces her hand.
(08:31):
And I was just like, What?
And then they just kept comingby the numbers, and it would
ended up being like what, likean hour or two hours?
These manneres are just swimmingwith us.
SPEAKER_04 (08:43):
They were probably out there till like two in the
morning, and it was the mostmanneres I'd seen in my life.
How did you know about thatspot?
Secrets?
So we my friends had taken methere before.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (08:56):
That's so wonderful.
SPEAKER_04 (08:57):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (08:58):
What was happening for you when you did that with
him?
Were you was there part of youthat was like, I'll show this
guy what I can do?
Or were you just like head overheels for going out to the
mantis?
Or like what's the the feelingthat you had in your belly when
you're doing that?
SPEAKER_04 (09:12):
I just love sharing magical moments like that with
people I care about and creatingmemories and yeah, just going
for it and not really thinkingabout sharks or whatever fears
are in our head, but it was aspecial place to me and I knew I
wanted to share it with them.
SPEAKER_00 (09:29):
Is that a similar story then when you think of
that moment finding A-A and youwere thinking or dreaming up
what you would then do?
What was the next step?
So you did you do a lot of workon uh to get that kind of level
of seaworthiness going?
Yeah, how did the the momentsafter the decision to jump in,
(09:51):
how did they look?
SPEAKER_04 (09:52):
That's a good question.
Well you have an answer to that.
SPEAKER_05 (09:56):
So I had sailed a little bit before we got a uh,
did a couple overseas passages,and I definitely had the passion
that this is what I wanted todo, and I wanted to share it
with her because she wasinterested in not only sailing
but the worms and the doublehole canoes and the wahine side
of things after following thewomen in the wind girls.
(10:17):
And I remember when we got uh,it was really real at that
moment because now you have aboat that you can't just trailer
into the thing, you have to putit together, you have to spend
time lashing every single bit,and then you have to put the
mast up, and this isn't justsomething that you're doing a
day sale in.
And I kind of got nervous, so Icalled one of my mentors, Uncle
(10:38):
Kiko from Hilo Side, and I knewthat he was a very passionate
Ho'okele Va canoe umpractitioner, and he had a lot
of experience with warhams.
He like was building them at ayoung age and building models,
and he had probably the onlyother pay I've ever seen that
looks like A-Aw.
The design is pretty similar,and so I called them and I said,
(10:59):
Oh, uncle, like I just got aWarham Pahi 26.
He's like, No way, brother,that's one of a kind.
I like C.
And then I was like, uh, can youjust come out here?
I'll pay for your ticket,please, and you can show me how
to rig it.
And I ended up scavenging up themoney to fly this uncle out, and
he spends two days with usshowing us how to lash her
together.
We put her up, put her in thewater, had a little blessing,
(11:21):
and then this big old like stormwas curdling up on the horizon.
You remember that in theanchorage, and it was super
dark, just impending doom, likethe kind that rolls in all day.
And he was I just remember himbeing, I'm a little old for
this.
I gotta go.
And then he takes the dinghythat he just like gifted me, and
(11:42):
he rows it to shore.
He's like, Have fun, welcome toyour new life.
Thanks, Uncle.
And then Kaylee and I justhunkered down in the holes, and
this storm just whoosh.
Oh, he showed me how to anchor.
He's like, This is how you setup a bridle, you'll be fine.
If you if worst case scenario,just throw this other one over,
you have two anchors out, allgood.
Then, okay, later, uncle, andthen storm hits, and we're just
(12:05):
in this, it's in a protectedanchorage, and the sea is just
foaming.
And that was yeah, that was whenlife began, and you kind of
forced into it at that point,and we didn't know where to go.
We had to figure out the wholemarina thing, how to navigate,
getting a slip, and you justgotta do it, you gotta do what
you gotta do.
SPEAKER_01 (12:24):
Did you have voyaging in mind from the start?
Or was was the aspirationsmaller than that?
SPEAKER_04 (12:29):
I think it was really step by step, kind of
like Chris said.
We didn't really know what wewere going into entirely.
We did on a large scale, but thevoyage to Hawaii was born out of
the realization that we neededit back home and we couldn't
afford to ship it, and we didn'treally want to ship it.
(12:50):
We wanted that experience, andwe knew it was possible, so we
decided there was no other way.
How did you know?
SPEAKER_00 (12:57):
That's what I'd like to know.
SPEAKER_04 (12:59):
Well, Chris, do you want to Yeah?
SPEAKER_05 (13:02):
Um well anything's possible.
SPEAKER_01 (13:04):
But that seems pretty tremendous.
Like if you've never, if you'venever started a voyage like
that.
SPEAKER_05 (13:11):
Humans are incredible and they've done
wonderful things, and there's somany stories like Dove, the kid
that sails around the world, andthose girls that literally
paddled across the Pacific in arowboat, and there's just humans
that have crossed the ocean onridiculous crafts.
SPEAKER_01 (13:28):
And all that doesn't make most people want to do it
though.
SPEAKER_05 (13:32):
It kind of does.
(13:57):
You got them.
You've crossed way bigger oceansand you've done all these
things.
It's just the same thing.
You're just on a tiny littlecraft.
It's the same thing.
So I had the confidence of myteachers behind me, and I had
the the I just could reflect onthem in the hard times when I
was preparing, knowing that theybelieved in me when all the
people in the dock were talkingmad crap on us and telling us
(14:19):
that we didn't need to be outthere doing that stuff.
It just was kind of a hard time.
But yeah, just having the rightinfluences.
SPEAKER_01 (14:27):
You framed that voyage up as sort of a a
practical part of getting backhome.
Was there deeper significance tothe trip as well?
Like from the outside lookingin, you just had a a major
change in your life, and alsoyou're at an age where sort of
rights of passage becomesomething either in cultures
(14:50):
that have rights of passageintact that's introduced into
our lives as young, you know,sort of teens and twenties,
great challenges, or they're thekind of thing that we create for
ourselves to um welcome intransformation.
Was there an element of thatrite of passage for you?
SPEAKER_04 (15:11):
There definitely was, yeah.
So, like right when we hadgotten a uh, like Chris said, my
mom was sick, and thenunfortunately she passed away
from cancer, and it was reallyquick, and it was we didn't have
a lot of time to really prepareprocess, and so the voyage was
kind of a way for me to kind oflike you said, go through that
(15:32):
processing.
And I knew that she had returnedto the ocean, and we all will
one day, and it just felt likereturning to my mom and being
with her, being close to her.
I'm also I have Hawaiianlineage, and my grandma and my
aunt and my cousins all live inHawaii, so it was like me
finishing my chapter inCalifornia, finishing my
(15:55):
kuleana, my responsibility oftaking care of her and doing all
that and returning home toHawaii.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (16:03):
That's a grand gesture.
So deeply symbolic.
SPEAKER_00 (16:08):
You left port, and as far as I can recall from some
of the story time, there was astrong wind.
There was a strong wind by aneight-year-old minnow.
Good timing, but you're probablyyou're probably holding that one
(16:30):
on.
Okay, well done.
Speaking of strong winds, youall leave California and start
travelling westward and youencounter some tricky weather.
Can you walk us through what thestart of the voyage felt like?
What happened to your supercomplex navigational system that
(16:52):
went pear-shaped in the firstday, and yeah, just that first
part of the trip.
You can talk about the weather.
How is that?
That was my high tech.
SPEAKER_04 (17:03):
It's perfectly great.
SPEAKER_00 (17:08):
That's right, yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (17:10):
Yeah, so when we first acquired A-A, we knew that
we had to put her to the testand get comfortable with the
gear and the rigging andeverything, make sure it was all
in order because we did put ittogether with Uncle Kiko as the
main guide and really no otherguidance.
So we'd sailed across the coastof California and up to
(17:30):
Catalina, and then we werefeeling a bit cocky, I guess,
and decided to go north towardsum LA and Malibu, and things got
really hairy really fast.
We were kind of told uh early onthat it wasn't the best time to
go go up that way, but we reallywanted to see the islands up
there, and so we were reallyexcited to see all of the
(17:52):
wildlife and see some friends upthere and share a-a-we with
them, and didn't think of theweather too much, but we started
battling upwind, and then ourengine went down pretty quick in
the middle of the night.
We were in the middle of ashipping lane, so these huge
shipping boats were going pastin the middle of the night.
We didn't have really anyworking lights, so we were like
(18:14):
holding up our lanterns, and wehad basically triple A for
boats.
Is it US boating?
SPEAKER_05 (18:20):
Boat US.
SPEAKER_04 (18:21):
Boat US or something like that, and so we were
decided, like all cowarding andshame, that we were gonna call
them and ask for a rescue, andthey were kind of like, Where
are you?
And we had to figure that out,and they towed us in the middle
of the night back to Venice,Boat Harbor, and we were very
fortunate.
We found some guys that werevery knowledgeable about
(18:42):
engines.
We figured out our first enginetroubles, which was awesome.
So we learned a lot, but it wasa scary experience for sure.
We were bashing up wind in themiddle of the night with big
boats coming through that weknew wouldn't stop for us, so it
was definitely a test.
SPEAKER_00 (19:00):
Okay.
SPEAKER_05 (19:00):
I think he was relating to our voyage home.
SPEAKER_04 (19:02):
Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (19:04):
That's good.
I'm I'm glad to hear thatbecause they're the things that
build your familiarity with yourvessel.
SPEAKER_05 (19:11):
But in that time, our compass was supposed to be
screwed on, and I didn't want todo that because I didn't want to
put any holes in the vessel.
So I just had it sitting like ona little pad, and throughout all
of my preparations from ourvoyage from California to
Hawaii, that was the one thing Inever thought about.
And I did all of our rigging, Idid all of our what I thought
(19:31):
was electronics that failed, andI didn't think about the compass
when we set off from Californiato Hawaii.
Kalani was like, What, Brian?
You want compass I can follow?
I was like, nah, just use thisswell, use this star.
Oh, actually, I do have acompass.
And I dug down below and I wentto grab it and it flipped over.
And I guess the orientation ofit with the magnetic and the
(19:53):
bubbles did something, and itjust started spinning.
And we looked at each other andwe started laughing so hard.
We're like, Are you serious?
We don't have a compass.
And I was like, Well, I mean,you know, you don't really need
one, and that was kind of wherethat whole joke of something
went wrong.
No worries, I go ahead and callthe supervisor because there's
like no one to look out for us,and we were kind of our own
(20:16):
supervisors.
SPEAKER_01 (20:17):
Okay, so you don't have a compass.
How are you navigating?
SPEAKER_05 (20:21):
Well, we did a mix of everything.
We had a we had Navionics,obviously.
I didn't want to be silly outthere with no backup, so we all
had Navionics downloaded on ourphone.
We had little Garmin inreachesso that people could follow us
in case of emergency.
We had those clipped to our umlifelines, and in the middle of
(20:41):
the night, Kalani uh woke up andhe had the go shishi and he he
opened his jacket and it nudgedhis phone out, and boom, that
was the first phone that we wereusing.
So that one was gone and we wereall bums.
He had a bunch of cool music onit.
And then yeah, we ended up justusing like one phone, I think.
Just to check.
But I really wanted to make surethat Kalani and Kaylee had the
(21:04):
time and the space to be able toidentify swells and me too, and
identify stars that lined upwith swells, and hold the canoe
in a way that everything was inone perpetual motion.
And so yeah, I would say 50-50.
SPEAKER_00 (21:20):
So you've gone how many how many miles is it in
total, that journey?
And how far into it did you feellike it started to become like
just different?
Like when you become aquatic,you know, that feeling where
you've like you you've kind offallen out of your land rhythms
of things and thoughts, and youbecome far more of an aquatic
(21:43):
creature.
So, yeah, two parts.
How long is the journey and whendid that sort of change come
where you just felt like you'reone organism?
SPEAKER_05 (21:52):
Well, the journey was 2700 nautical miles or
something around there.
Wow.
I don't know how much it wasunder the keel or under our
hull.
We don't have a keel.
Because if you zoom in at ourtrack, we did a couple
loop-de-doops and zigzags alongthe way.
Cool.
But what was it for you?
How is becoming an offshoresailor for the first time?
SPEAKER_04 (22:14):
Um, it was really interesting because I think your
brain is so used to matching upmemories with a place or some
sort of surroundings andenvironment.
And so I found myself early on,like probably the second or
third day, having dreams ofislands that my brain just made
up in my head.
(22:34):
And it was because it was thesame thing every day 360, which
is blue and most of the timegray, unfortunately.
We had a lot of clouds.
So I think it was early on whereI was having to adapt to that,
and it was quite interesting.
What were the challenges?
Well, luckily, nobody wasseasick.
We were all really, reallynervous.
(22:56):
We'd kind of grown up on boatsand we're all surfers and
comfortable in the ocean, but wewere still nervous we were gonna
get seasick, but none of us did,so that was really good.
I think it was mostly emotionalchallenges or mental challenges
for at me at least, just beingthe only Wahine on board and
being completely surrounded bythe ocean but unable to go in.
(23:18):
I found that really hard.
Yeah.
How about you?
SPEAKER_05 (23:22):
But at the same time, the ocean came to us.
We were so wet the first week ofthe trip.
SPEAKER_01 (23:27):
And cold, right?
And cold.
SPEAKER_05 (23:29):
So Kalani and I, before we left, it was just him
and I in California gettingready, and we made a list of all
the things that could go wrongfrom literally like psychotic
breakdown to someone getting aninfection on their finger.
Wow.
And like trying to find ways tolike at least mentally prepare
for it, but we didn't preparefor how cold and wet we would
be.
SPEAKER_01 (23:48):
Wait, wait, wait, wait.
Wait, wait, wait.
Wet didn't occur to you.
SPEAKER_05 (23:53):
I mean, like, I thought I knew a bit about
sailing, and I was like, oh,it'll be a beam reach, and then
eventually it'll be a broadreach, and then eventually we're
gonna be straight runningdownwind.
It shouldn't be too bad.
And I forgot to take intoaccount that the trade winds
actually happen a lot furtheroff the coast than it looks on a
chart.
And we had that is it calledSanta Ana winds when it goes on
(24:14):
shore?
We had the Santa Ana winds andthe June gloom, so the air was
just super wet, and then it wason shore for a couple days
because we weren't going superfast, and we were sailing
straight into the wind.
And as you know, on Magpie,actually we didn't get too wet,
but on A-Au, you get really wetbecause we don't have that much
(24:34):
hiding spots.
No dream pod, no dream pod, juststraight on the deck in whatever
clothes you brought, and youwould think that you would have
the time to dry off because thesun would come out, but it was
June gloom, so there was no sun,and we were so wet.
And the one thing Patagonia,thank you, Patagonia, gave us
(24:55):
was a couple wetsuit tops, andwe didn't think that we would
use them, but we used them asshoes because our feet were so
cold and wet.
And I never thought that becauseI mean I've sailed to Alaska and
I was barefoot the whole timeand I was fine, but I wasn't wet
the whole time.
And so this time sailing fromthe temperates to the tropics, I
(25:16):
thought, oh no worries, feet arewhatever.
But yeah, our feet were frigid,look like Mordor, or no, look
like uh what's his name?
George Green.
Yeah.
Matt is never worn shoes exceptwhite.
SPEAKER_01 (25:29):
Are you get so you're you're wet and you're
trying to stay warm?
Are you getting like crazyfungal infections?
Somehow no.
Because you think like even likeyour armpits or like you're
trying to keep your body heat,you'd think trapped inside of
warming wet clothes.
SPEAKER_04 (25:47):
Yeah, it might have been because we didn't move
much.
Once we were in our set shifts,so since there were three of us,
we would do three hour shifts.
Four hours four hours, sorry,and one person would be sleeping
in the hole, two people would beon deck, one person would be
half sleeping, also scanning forboats, and the other person
would be hand steering.
(26:08):
And once you were in yourposition, which was usually
laying down and just steering bya star or by the swells, or just
laying down half asleep, orlaying down in the hole, you
didn't really move becausemoving was such a workout, and
also if it was night at least,kind of scary.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_05 (26:27):
Wow.
SPEAKER_04 (26:28):
So I don't maybe that's why we didn't shave.
Do you understand?
SPEAKER_05 (26:31):
I don't know about you, but my butt was red.
I was so shaved up.
Yeah, but no, you didn't have aweird.
I didn't have a molo on thattrip.
Next trip will be different.
SPEAKER_01 (26:45):
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Kaylee, can you talk about someof the unique challenges of
being the only Wahine on theboat?
(29:30):
Yeah.
And the sort of humbling natureof some of those moments.
SPEAKER_04 (29:35):
If you want to talk about that, you don't have to.
I mean, I don't know how howreal we want to get, but all the
way.
All the way to the body.
SPEAKER_05 (29:43):
Give the people what they want.
SPEAKER_04 (29:46):
Well, first thing that comes to everyone's head is
like when you're on your cycle,what happens?
And I actually called up thisother badass sailor girl, Liz
Clark, who I know you've talkedto before.
And she's sailed around theworld and So I was like, please
help me.
What do I do if I get my period?
Because I was so afraid and kindof embarrassed because it was
(30:07):
just me and two guys.
Well, you knew it was gonna be amonth-long journey, kind of.
SPEAKER_01 (30:11):
Three weeks, two months, so you're definitely
gonna get it to happen.
SPEAKER_04 (30:13):
Yeah, it's happening and there's no way to go around
it.
Yeah.
It always happens at the worsttimes, or at least for me.
And she was saying, like periodpanties, and to just rinse them
out on the side of the boat andthen hang them up to dry.
And I was so lucky it didn'train because I didn't think
about that being a possibility,and I would have just been out
of luck.
But yeah, you have to carry allyour trash.
(30:34):
So anything that you're gonnause, even single use, we also
had to think about.
So that was another thing.
I didn't want to create excesswaste, and so that was a really
helpful tip.
But I think that aside again,the mental challenges, just not
having like a female to talk to,the boys were very supportive,
but it is kind of difficult whenyou're going through hormonal
(30:56):
shifts in your body and you needrest, but you can't rest.
Um, and so the guys were reallysupportive in that, and that
they tried to understand andthey gave me breaks when they
could, but they had to rest too.
So yeah, I think those were thetwo main ones was the mental and
the physical.
SPEAKER_01 (31:13):
One thing that we talked about a couple of days
ago was that it was actuallydangerous to use the toilet
unsupervised.
Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (31:27):
That is also true.
That was uncomfortable andawkward for sure being a girl.
And I mean, Chris was okay.
Maybe some people aren't thatcomfortable for all the owners,
but six months into yourrelationship?
SPEAKER_01 (31:39):
That's true.
That's pretty a year.
Okay.
All right, that's still prettyearly for like full-on movement
making.
That's true.
SPEAKER_05 (31:46):
Gotta do what you gotta do.
SPEAKER_01 (31:48):
Yeah, not with Chris.
SPEAKER_04 (31:49):
Yeah.
It's always been supportive ofmaking dirt.
SPEAKER_05 (31:54):
I was pretty adamant about them going number two and
making a dirt because one of myfears on that list is for my
crewmates to get um what is itcalled?
Constipated.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (32:06):
That was on the list, not wet, but constipated.
It was overly eager to giveKalani and I enemas.
SPEAKER_05 (32:12):
Yeah, I was I was threatening them with enemas.
SPEAKER_01 (32:15):
Wow, why did so why did that make the list?
I would never think of it.
SPEAKER_05 (32:17):
Well, it's like because I could imagine I've
never been constipated, but Ican imagine that on a canoe, you
know, you have to go over theside and get into these weird
positions, especially when theweather is really rough.
You have to find a new spot.
Yeah, exactly.
You get anxiety, and I had noproblem because like I've been
on sailing canoes before and Igot it, but they have never gone
on like an open ocean voyage, soI was scared that they were just
(32:40):
gonna try to not go for thefirst couple days.
And I was scared that I mean,obviously, like all health is
taken into consideration andthat it would be painful or
whatever, is they wouldn't beable to handle their
responsibilities if they got allstuck up.
So gotta release some stuff.
SPEAKER_01 (33:02):
How long was the list?
Huge I wish we still had it.
I know.
SPEAKER_05 (33:06):
If Kalani's out there, I'm gonna tell him.
Or if if it's out there, I'mgonna have Kalani find it
because he would have it.
SPEAKER_01 (33:12):
Yeah, on his notebook.
What a great exercise.
SPEAKER_05 (33:14):
It's a great exercise.
SPEAKER_01 (33:15):
Like to really write down all the fear.
SPEAKER_05 (33:18):
Yeah.
We even had it down to liketying someone to the mast kind.
SPEAKER_01 (33:22):
Wow.
SPEAKER_05 (33:23):
Like, what if they're like mutiny?
Yeah.
Or no mutiny, like gentlemutiny.
All right.
Like, if I'm somehow not in mybrain, Kalana, you have to do
something to me to like, I don'tknow.
SPEAKER_01 (33:34):
Restrain me.
Yeah, I don't know.
SPEAKER_05 (33:36):
I don't know what's gonna happen.
SPEAKER_01 (33:37):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_05 (33:38):
We're all fine, but we all never had any issues with
that in the past.
But it was fun to think about.
SPEAKER_01 (33:43):
So how are you passing the days?
Obviously, you have your tasksthat you have to complete all
through the day, except for whenyou're sleeping in the hall.
What what's going on betweenyour ears?
SPEAKER_04 (33:55):
Just thinking, honestly, and trying to stay on
course.
The most breaks we had wasprobably when it was sunny, and
we would instantly set up thesolar and kind of lay out all of
our clothes across the deck.
We were also trying to fish.
We caught two Mahi Mahi, whichwas amazing, or Dorado.
That was yummy.
I had a little Kindle, and I gotChris one too, but unfortunately
(34:17):
it also got wet and brokealongside our compass.
So yeah, that was sad.
So I was reading a bit.
I know Chris and Kalani werejournaling a lot.
SPEAKER_05 (34:26):
Yeah, I feel like voyaging is a great opportunity
for you to use your time in adifferent way because you don't
have the distractions of theoutside world.
So we're we're so used,especially like our generation,
our phones are like our littleescapism portal.
And when you don't have that,suddenly your portal becomes the
sky.
(34:47):
We're suddenly talking about thestars way more, or suddenly
laughing about some trivialthing back on land, or
discussing what we're gonna doif this squall decides to shift
a little bit more west, or whatwe're gonna do if the sun is
covered at this time of day, sowe can't get our bearing, and
blah blah blah.
And I feel like yeah, you justtap into a different type of
human, like we were sayingearlier, and I think it's super
(35:10):
important for everyone toexperience that, no matter if
it's sailing or not.
And that is just a world whereyou're forced into it, which is
cool.
You don't have to really try topractice it, you're just you're
out there, and it actuallythere's never a boring time for
me.
I was never were you bored?
SPEAKER_04 (35:26):
I I was not bored, definitely not bored.
SPEAKER_05 (35:29):
You tap into the caveman brain where suddenly
your book becomes the lines inthe ocean and the sky becomes
your Instagram.
That's pretty cool.
SPEAKER_04 (35:38):
A lot of observation.
SPEAKER_05 (35:40):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (35:40):
Okay, okay, Lee, I got a couple of these words in
this list that I thought of you,and I didn't give them to Chris
because I thought you'd do someyou'd have some riffing on them.
How to be kind.
What comes to your mind when youhear those words?
How to be kind.
SPEAKER_04 (35:59):
For some reason I instantly thought of a garden,
and I don't know why.
Maybe just because you have toput so much in and for not a lot
of return sometimes.
Sometimes you'll get a lot,sometimes you get a little, and
you never know.
But you're just kind of doing itfor the joy of giving back to
the earth, and that's what youalways come back to is and it's
honestly could be like we weretalking about on the boat a
(36:20):
little bit, that it could be oneof the main purposes of being on
earth as humans is taking careof the land and the plants and
even the animals and giving backto others.
SPEAKER_00 (36:30):
Wonderful.
How about our most vibrantselves?
What comes to mind when you hearthat?
SPEAKER_04 (36:37):
I guess I just think of like playing and like having
fun, laughing with friends anddoing what you really enjoy,
like sailing and surfing andswimming and doing things for
the pure joy of it to raise yourfrequencies and your vibrations
higher, and really not for muchelse to come out of that.
It's not like it's gonna giveyou like a reward in it besides
(36:58):
your own joy.
SPEAKER_00 (36:59):
Yeah.
Okay, last one.
Water mythology and symbology.
So water mythology.
What comes to your mind when youthink about maybe the more
mythical aspects of water?
SPEAKER_04 (37:15):
I think of that book, The Messages of Water.
Have you read that book?
SPEAKER_00 (37:19):
Is that the Matsumoto?
SPEAKER_04 (37:22):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (37:22):
Japanese.
SPEAKER_04 (37:33):
So they like did all of the clearing and gave it
positive energy and everythingthat he listed in that book to
make it the purest water.
And that's the water we broughton our voyage from California to
Hawaii, like really last minute.
We thought it was funny becausewe had both just read that book
and we thought it was reallyinspiring because we're so much
water, and seeing how much it'simpacted just by saying, I love
(37:57):
you, or like so you're sobeautiful that it makes it more
pure, and when you say hatefulthings that it can be distorted,
and to think that's going on inour bodies on a cellular level,
like every day when we're havingconversation or listening to
music, watching movies, so yeah,I guess that's what I think
about.
SPEAKER_00 (38:17):
When you think um when you reflect now on RR and
that journey, where has thatjourney led you all to at this
point in time?
And what do you see as potentiallines into the future together
and with R?
SPEAKER_04 (38:34):
Oh, that's a good question.
Um I think it's really importantin a relationship to have
something you learn and dotogether, whether it's surfing
or for my parents it was tandemsurfing.
It was something that they didtogether, and they grew and
excelled at it.
But for Chris and I it'ssailing, and I feel so lucky to
have a partner that I can dothat with.
(38:55):
So I think it's just gonna beour vessel, literally, towards
our relationship and growingtogether as people and learning
together.
But yeah, I think it's importantfor everybody in relationship to
have an activity or a sport orsomething that they like to do
as a pastime.
SPEAKER_00 (39:12):
How about for you, Miss Doss?
SPEAKER_05 (39:14):
How has voyaging, how has a impacted our life
today?
SPEAKER_00 (39:18):
Yeah, and just where you see like just some of the I
don't know, a a kind of a sensefor where the canoe and your
interests together with sailingand voyaging might lead you into
the future.
SPEAKER_05 (39:33):
Well, bouncing off the relationship thing, the
canoe is a double hole va'akolua as we call it.
So each hole has to be balancedproperly, and it definitely
reflects in your relationshiptowards each other.
One can't be heavier or morebuoyant than the other.
You have to be mutually intactto move forward, and that has
(39:54):
really impacted my life andKaylee's where we see it in
everything now, and I think thecanoe serves as a symbol that
carries throughout ourday-to-day life, and it's it's
really cool because people whoyou never get to meet are in
your lives because of the canoe,like you guys.
And I just think it's a reallyimportant thing to keep around,
(40:16):
and it goes back to the idea ofKouleana, which is this canoe
found us, and it is not only ourresponsibility to take what
we've learned and share it, butit's a privilege, and a lot of
people get this opportunity, soto be able to like perpetuate
the canoe culture that we'vekind of just happened to blast
(40:36):
ourselves into is definitely aprivilege we need to cherish
every moment when we have it,but also it's an important
responsibility that to do itwell and to go further and do
things outside of our comfortzones.
And uh uh has really shown thatto me, especially in our last
trip returning from Kauai, justchoosing your window right and
making sure things are in lineand choosing which people to go
(40:59):
with, and yeah, it it itreflects on your life.
Like who do you want to surroundyourself with?
Who do you want to go throughthe hard challenges with
together?
And like, where do you go fromhere with what you got?
So the canoe is definitelyeverything now.
Beautiful.
SPEAKER_00 (41:13):
And can we, for the record, get a definition of uh?
SPEAKER_01 (41:18):
Why is she called a uh, I was gonna pull it from the
film actually, because I lovethe way I love how you go in
there.
SPEAKER_05 (41:24):
There's a little bit of a story behind it, so you can
do both, yeah.
So I remember when I firststarted getting into sailing, my
first sailing vessel I was everon was Hokulea, and it was an
extreme privilege to be there.
And I remember it was a nightsky and I knew nothing about the
stars, and I was sitting next toUncle Ninoa at the time, who
knows everything that I want toknow about the stars, and I
(41:46):
asked him what this bright starthat I saw kind of above the
southwestern horizon, and hetold me his uh uh.
And he said that this man WillKayselka was the one that taught
him a lot about the stars, andhe pretty much told me, Can you
go home and tell me the rightascension, declination, and
(42:07):
azimuth of that star?
And I said, What is that?
And still to this day I can'treally understand everything,
Uncle, but I try, and Aah wasthe one star that kind of was a
spark, the genesis to myunderstanding of the heavens.
And when we had acquired ourcanoe a-a-she didn't have a name
at the time, and I was on asailing adventure from
(42:30):
California down to Tahiti, and Iremember just thinking, like,
what what's like the beginning?
Like, what's the spark for me?
And it was quite literally thestar A-A, which means to burn
brightly, and depending on howyou spell it with all of the
Okinos and Kaha Kos, it couldmean to burn brightly, it could
also mean to dare to dosomething, it could mean a small
(42:51):
rootlet, or it could mean likesharp pokey lava rock.
So there's all these little likeparables and metaphors in it,
but to me it was kind of thisicon, this bright shining star
in the sky that my teacher hadtaught me, and and a was the
first star I ever learned, andso I named her for the first
canoe I ever owned.
And it just so happens that ourpath home to Hawaii was in the
(43:12):
shining, glistening pathway ofA-A on the setting west
southwestern ocean, and it alljust came together, and she was
meant to be named that.
SPEAKER_01 (43:20):
Okay, we didn't get to hear from you.
What was it like arriving homeafter that tremendous voyage?
SPEAKER_04 (43:27):
It was so beautiful.
It was also our first night offull stars right before we had
gotten there.
And we had saved like a specialmeal that my friend had given to
us from Marquesas, MarshallIslands, and it was like this
preserved was it?
Oh yeah, Lau Hala, and it tastedlike rose, but it was something
(43:52):
that they would eat on voyagestraditionally in the Pacific
Islands, and so it was like ourbig cheers moment, and we had
just started to see the islandclouds forming and this huge
arrangement of stars above us.
So it was already a homecominglike the day before, and then
all that day we had seen theisland just keep rising from the
(44:13):
sea, and when we finally got toour dock, my dad paddled out on
uh one man, and his dad and hismom were out in a fishing boat
of his uncle's, so our familywas out to see us first, which
was really sweet.
And then our friend was throwingflowers from the dock, and all
of our friends had a hugearrangement of foods that they
figured we were craving.
(44:34):
Um, so it was really a lot totake in.
It was kind of overwhelming, butit was just so much love.
There's just pure love and allour community and family there.
It was so special.
SPEAKER_01 (44:44):
You all felt like that voyage was possible.
Did you get that sense from yourfamilies and your community as
well?
Or was there skepticism?
SPEAKER_00 (44:55):
You were in big trouble.
SPEAKER_05 (45:01):
To put myself in Uncle's shoes.
Imagine your beloved daughter inthis random brata from Hawaii,
dreaming of all these sailingcanoe adventures, and he's about
to take her over the ocean.
I would be skeptical too.
SPEAKER_04 (45:14):
My dad was really nervous and pretty fearful.
I think rightly so.
Like Chris said, if your kid wasgoing on a voyage like this,
you'd be skeptical and afraidfor their health and safety.
But when it came down to thelast few days, he realized, oh,
they're going no matter what, orhow I feel about it.
So he switched to fullsupporting mode and really
(45:38):
engaged and helped us withwhatever we needed.
He ran to the dock last minuteto give us a bag of medications
that he had thought of that wemight even need, and he let us
use his van and all kinds ofstuff.
So he definitely switched, buthe was very skeptical.
And Chris's parents were reallysupportive.
I know they were a littleafraid, but pretty used to Chris
(46:00):
going on these wild adventuresat this point.
SPEAKER_05 (46:03):
Oh, the satellite.
So during the trip, we had ourlittle garment tracking things,
and there are little dots thatour parents could keep track of
our waypoints.
I think we had set it for everyfour hours, it would have like a
little track so they would knowwhere we are.
And I guess I don't know if thisis true, I have to fact check,
but first worldwide satelliteoutage in the last century,
(46:25):
maybe, or since satellitesstarted being a thing, it was a
big deal where like allsatellite connections for a few
hours were cut off and we didn'tknow.
We were just happily sailingalong singing songs and when was
when it was like halfway throughthe trip, probably in July.
SPEAKER_01 (46:42):
Was it last year?
SPEAKER_05 (46:43):
Yeah, last year.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (46:45):
I feel like people would have experienced no.
I was just thinking thateveryone listening probably
would have experienced somesmall ripple effect.
SPEAKER_05 (46:51):
But my poor parents or our poor parents, our all
three of our dots just wentblip, and they didn't know that
there was a satellite outage.
It's not like you're justgoogling it immediately.
You're just looking at yourphone, like, ah, so yeah, we
scared them pretty hard, but Imean we didn't know.
Thankfully, we were just outthere.
SPEAKER_04 (47:08):
It was cute though, all our parents, me, Chris, and
Kalani, they all had a groupchat and they all became really
good friends because they werejust sharing messages the whole
month.
Um, so that was really sweet.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_05 (47:22):
As far as family goes, I do remember when I first
made landfall from Hawaii toTahiti on one of my adventures.
It was really strange.
But during that time, this wasthe moment in the beginning of
our podcast that I was speakingabout.
I wasn't super tired at all, butI could see my grandma's face
really, really like in the sky,and I wasn't like hallucinating
or anything, it was just in mymind.
(47:43):
And she had passed away the yearbefore, or a couple years
before, but yeah, I never reallythought about why.
But she was born and raised inHilo, which was the port that we
made landfall in.
And I remember telling my dadthat, and he was all emotional
because I was his mom.
But he was telling me as we'remaking our plan to come into the
east side of Oahu, that that waswhere my grandpa was born and
(48:04):
raised, and to always know thathe'll be watching us come in.
And he was like a super big fanof voyaging canoes, he was the
one that had the paintings onthe wall, and so I had that in
my mind of them out there, andthen her mom was out there
looking from the other side inCalifornia, so we felt that
connection.
And Klani, he'll never talkabout this, but he is an
(48:24):
incredible lineage of voyagingcanoes, and I remember him
showing me like where hisancestors were buried, and
there's petroglyphs of Hawaiiancrab claw sails and all of these
heroes of old.
And so, yeah, we just had wejust knew that there was family
on the earthly plane, on theterrestrial plane, but also in
the heavenly plane.
So we're we're we're fine.
You got him.
SPEAKER_01 (48:47):
You've spoken a bit about the personal significance
of the voyage.
What about the significance ofcultural lineage and carrying on
old ways?
How much has that played intoyour interest and devotion to
voyaging?
SPEAKER_04 (49:08):
I mean, just going back, all our ancestors were
voyagers.
You know, the Hawaiians, theIrish, the Japanese, the
Chinese.
So it was pretty amazing tothink we were the first ones in
our family in so manygenerations that were doing this
sort of wayfinding and thisjourneying back to our little
island, especially to Hawaii,which is kind of just a small
(49:31):
dot on a map.
We felt the presence of all ofthose who had come before us,
and it was pretty amazing tothink that they were watching us
do the same trip that they hadmaybe done long ago.
So it was pretty powerful,especially for Kalani, I think.
SPEAKER_05 (49:46):
Yeah, I remember when we did the first little
screening of uh-uh, his grandmawas there, beautiful woman, all
white Hawaiian hair, and she wasexpressing to me how proud she
was that her boy got to do that.
And I feel like that's anotherresponsibility with the canoe is
you never know how many peopleyou take on this canoe and how
(50:09):
many passions it fires up to bea navigator in their own right,
would be breaking that line intheir lineage to do something
different that was an ancientpractice long ago.
And yeah, it could it doesn'thave to be in the ocean at all,
but just knowing that you'regonna make one of your
great-great-grandparents proudin a ways makes it all worth it.
SPEAKER_01 (50:31):
Time is precious.
Thanks for spending some ofyours listening with us today.
Our editor this season is themulti-talented Ben Jake
Alexander.
The soundtrack was composed byShannon Soul Carroll with
additional tunes by Dave andBen.
We'll be continuing today'sconversation on Instagram, where
we're at Water People Podcast.
And you can subscribe to ourvery infrequent newsletter to
(50:52):
get book recommendations,questions we're pondering,
behind the scenes glimpses intorecording the podcast, and more
via our website,waterpeoplepodcast.com.
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The Bobby Bones Show
Listen to 'The Bobby Bones Show' by downloading the daily full replay.