September 12, 2022 • 39 mins
The IDEAL National Championship is a chance for Electricians from all over to go head-to-head to take home major bragging rights and win over $600,000 in cash and prizes.
On this episode we are joined by Grahame Brown of IDEAL Industries and Paul Hannania former competitor and owner of Panel Upgrade Experts.
Grahame discusses the scope and importance of this event, while giving us an inside look at what makes IDEAL Industries such a titan of the industry when it comes to electrical tools.
Paul digs into what it was like to compete at the National Competition in Florida providing that inside perspective on what it takes to win it all!
Check out IDEAL Industries website to find out more info and a qualifying event near you!
https://www.idealind.com/us/en/nationals-home-page/event-locator.html
Connect with us on Instagram or Facebook - @wattsthewordpodcast
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jason Cox (00:00):
Hello, and welcome to Watt's the Word, an electrical
industry Podcast. I'm Jason Cox,and along with my co host, Zack
Hartle, we're having relevantconversations with people in the
electrical industry. On thisepisode we are talking about
ideal industries and theirskills competitions. Ideal runs
(00:21):
a series of competitions,eligible for apprentices and
certified journey peoplethroughout North America and I
believe throughout the world. Totalk about this today we're
joined by previous competitorPaul had an IO Paul's with
paddle upgrade experts. Andwe're joined by Graham brown,
(00:42):
gray and brown is the WesternRegional Manager for ideal
industrial. So let's get to thisepisode and see if you have what
it takes to compete at the idealnational championships.
Zack Hartle (00:55):
Starting off today, we're joined by Graham Brown,
Brown Welcome to Watt's the Wordpodcast.
Grahame Brown (01:01):
Thanks very much, guys. I really appreciate you
inviting me today. And I'mlooking forward to it.
Zack Hartle (01:08):
Absolutely. So I mean, before we get into ideal
and before we get into thenational competition, maybe just
tell us briefly how you got intothe position you're at now and
just a little bit of yourbackground in the industry.
Grahame Brown (01:22):
Well, just a little bit of background. I,
when I was growing up, back inthe late 1800s, I had a neighbor
there was an electrician, andreally as a teenager from 1415.
I started doing a lot of oddjobs with him as he was doing
odd jobs around Edmonton. I grewup just outside Edmonton. So I
(01:43):
did that for three or four yearsas as a teenager. And that's how
I raised money to go to school.
And then when I was finished,Nate, a good friend of mine
owned his own contractingoutfit. And he was looking for
somebody to set up a, a bidsystem for him on the computer.
And it was a temporary thingthat lasted about six, seven
(02:03):
years, and started with him. Andthen after that kind of closed
down, I went to a distributor inEdmonton company named Arielle
bruise and son, back whenBruzzone are the family still
owned the company. So worked forthem for about 10 years. And
then I switched to themanufacturing sales side of
(02:27):
things and took over as a salesmanager with another really
large manufacturer and workedfor them for about 1314 years.
And then since then, I've workedfor a couple of different
manufacturers over the years.
And basically, I've run WesternCanada over the over the last
(02:48):
probably 20 to 25 years in thisindustry. So had a bit of
experience. And
Jason Cox (02:54):
that sounds like a lot of experience to be honest
with you definitely know whatyou're talking about.
Grahame Brown (03:00):
You're calling me old Jason, is that what you're
doing?
Jason Cox (03:03):
I think I think you and I are from the same vintage
gram, same vintage. So like afine bottle of wine.
Grahame Brown (03:11):
Yeah, I mean, it's been great experience,
because I never expected reallyto be involved in the electrical
industry. That's not what I wentto school for. But once you get
in, and once you get working,and it's been a great industry
is treated, you know, it'streated me very, very well.
Jason Cox (03:30):
That's the thing that I'm always curious about when
people are in our industry, ninetimes out of 10 They've got into
it through someone they knewwhether it was in your case,
like a neighbor, or more often afamily member. There's not a lot
of people that well, there'sthat rare few that decide from
(03:50):
day one, I want to be anelectrician so so it's always
interesting to hear the story ofhow people get and stay in the
industry. Turning to the idealindustry side here. Maybe tell
us a little bit about what idealhas been doing over the last few
years to keep up with changes inthe industry.
Grahame Brown (04:09):
Well, really over the last three or four years,
you know which COVID is takenprobably three, three quarters
of is we actually have a reallyrobust marketing and a research
and development team. Based outof the US we're still a family
owned business. They're fifthgeneration family now. So they
(04:33):
spend a lot of money on r&d. Andwe actually have a department
run by a gentleman who's workedfor several different business
entities within the family. Andhe really had a great roadmap
over the last three or fouryears and we've released
probably knew more new productsin the last three years than we
would have over the last 10 andthe roadmap still looks very
(04:57):
robust for the remainder of thisyear and So the next couple of
years so the gentleman who leadsour r&d team right now is hold
several patents for the family.
And he does a tremendous jobabout creating a great road path
forward.
Zack Hartle (05:13):
Not to put you on the spot too much. But can you
give us an example of some ofyour recent releases of products
that are maybe winners? I guess?
Grahame Brown (05:21):
Yeah. So one of our most recent releases would
be what we call a dead eyeseries. And it's made for you
know, it's a holesaw. Group. Andalso going to expand that same
thing into the drilling andtapping and but really, what
that is, is the ability to drillinto harder metals, and
(05:43):
stainless steel. several,several of our competitors and
ourselves previous of, you know,we have something similar that
does really well in mild steel,but nothing that really does
very well on the heart metal endof things. So we've created a
whole new lineup of cutting thatwill be called Dead Eye, and
(06:04):
it's made for the heavier metaldrilling and tapping and then
hole saws too. So perfect.
Jason Cox (06:12):
I'm just looking at your website right now. And the
Deadeye collection is definitelyfeatured prominently on the
website. And I mean, yeah, anyany improvement in technology
for that kind of tool isdefinitely appreciated by
electricians for sure.
Grahame Brown (06:30):
Well, that's kind of where I think that ideal has
been very strong over the years.
Like I say, it's a familybusiness. It's been around since
the early 1900s, and eight, andthey really have been quite
adept at adding products,tweaking products, that sort of
thing. And that that mattressstill holds today that you
(06:50):
continue to do that.
Unknown (06:56):
So into the ideal, and you're maybe, maybe just tell me
exactly what it's called, but
Zack Hartle (07:01):
is it the ideal national championship? Is that
what it's called?
Grahame Brown (07:05):
Yeah, exactly.
It's National Championshipsstarted about six or seven years
ago for us. And it started inthe States first, again, being a
US based company. And really,they given an opportunity to,
they were looking for a way to,to approach the business a
(07:26):
little bit differently than justthrough the normal sales
channels. And looking really to,to talk to and in, be influenced
by apprentices and journeymanelectricians that were actually
using the equipment that we wemanufacture. And probably the
most direct way to do that wasto interact with, you know, the
(07:48):
end user. So this championshipallows us to put on competitions
across Canada, US, Australia,and so on and have lots interact
directly with the people usingthe equipment on a daily basis,
having them use our stuff at thecompetition level. And then give
(08:08):
us feedback on what they likewhat they don't like. And then
it's really taken those commentsare taken back. And And again,
we have the ability to tweak,tweak things and make
adjustments, hopefully for thebetter of the electricians using
the product, right.
Zack Hartle (08:28):
Yeah, it's cool to take something like a
competition and it hits so manyof those things that you're
trying to accomplish, or you getthat instant feedback from
competitors. You also get alittle bit of I'm sure there's
media involved in somemarketing, going along with it.
And just getting the name outthere, right. So on that's
something that is important fordeveloping new products and
bringing things out.
Grahame Brown (08:50):
Well, these competitions over the years, I
mean, they're there they are onTV in the US, they're on ESPN,
one of the ESPN channels, andthe finals are on TV at that
point in time. And it is it's areally big event right there.
Because there's winners from thelast one that Canada was
(09:11):
involved because we weren't tooinvolved in the last couple of
duty COVID Of course, but thelast one Canadians were involved
there was competitors fromChina, Australia, the US and
Canada. And, you know, again, itgives us the opportunity to meet
with people from around theworld that are using our
equipment and our tools on aregular basis and, and having a
(09:33):
fun and friendly competition tosee who can who can do best sort
of thing and, and the prizemoney for this. This event is
live the files it's to me it'sit's absolutely incredible. For
a couple of years, a journeymanwinner was, you know in around
the $75,000 us for first place.
This year's competition, a firstor a journeyman prize is $60,000
(09:56):
us so Oh, there's some fabulousprize money that that you can
win for, for winning thecompetition?
Jason Cox (10:08):
Well, as it like, I'm kind of going back to the tools
and to the competition. How neatis it that you get to use a
tool, give your feedback to onthe tool to the company, and the
actual patent owner of the toolis going to actually see your,
your impact your review. And Imean, you might indirectly be
(10:30):
responsible for a subtle changein improving a tool. That's
pretty cool.
Grahame Brown (10:35):
Well, really, we leave that you know exactly what
you're saying, we leave that upto the the electricians, because
everybody has a little bitdifferent way of doing things.
And, and, you know, when youtalk to some people that you
know, whether they've been onthe tools for 40 years, or where
they had been on the tools formonths, something that they
suggest it sometimes it's thatkeep it simple, stupid thing
(10:57):
where you just go, well, that'sso brilliant, it's simple, why
don't we incorporate that right?
And, and then, because ideal hasthe ability to control
everything internal, is we canmake those changes and redesign
certain things or tweaksomething and then release it to
the former, excuse me to themarketplace, which really,
(11:18):
large, large public companiesjust don't have that ability to
maneuver as quickly within thespace today. So ideally, is
unique in that area where we'reable to take that feedback. The
r&d department can take a lookat it and see if it, you know,
can be done on a on a biggerscale. And if it is, they still
have that ability to tweak andrelease it to the market and a
(11:41):
fairly quick period of time.
Jason Cox (11:45):
Yeah, and having people with different levels of
experience is always a goodthing. You got dinosaurs like
me, that would take a tool andgo on and on. It's always been
like this. Whereas someonethat's new new to the industry
would say, well, wouldn't it bejust easy if we could do this?
And and people like me that havethese habits of years and years
and years? We go? Actually,that's a really good idea. So
(12:06):
yeah, I think it's an incredibleplatform. For so many reasons.
Yeah.
Grahame Brown (12:12):
Yeah. Well, I look to we've had two recent
tools. Over the last threemonths, one's kind of a forge
plier. So it's a combination ofa linesman and a pair of
strippers. And really, itcombines two tools into one,
which is not always great, butyou know, when you talk to
people that are working onlifts, or are trucking and a
(12:35):
bunch of tools to a site, andthen they put two or three that
they you know, essentials intotheir their pocket to go do some
work? Well, this helps alleviatesome of that, that problem right
with having to carry too manytools, and it does a really good
job on both ends, whether it'sstripping or using it as
linesman pliers. So it's quite,it's quite unique. And it's it
(12:57):
comes from feedback right fromthe market.
Jason Cox (13:01):
versity versatility is something that every
electrician definitely valueswhen you're up on that ladder,
or up on that lift, and you've,you've lost one tool, so you're
defaulting to a second or athird tool. So if you had a tool
that was very versatile, I thinkit would be appreciated. And
then myself, I kind of when Iwas still in industry, or still
(13:22):
pulling wire, etc, I was on theservice side of the industry. So
so often I would be dealing withcustomers carrying a lot of
distance through the day,monitoring jobs, etc. And I'd
always want to have like two orthree tools in my pocket. So
that when I was dealing with mystaff, and then dealing with a
(13:43):
client, it would be a quick 123kinds of things. So So once
again, there's a there'sdefinitely a need for tools like
that.
Grahame Brown (13:50):
I think combining a couple of essentials into one
tool, you know, really does makesense, especially nowadays,
right? Where we're time and timereally is money.
Jason Cox (14:01):
Yeah, it seems to be a theme in many of the episodes
we're talking about now. It'sit's that time factor and how
can we become more efficient?
And with the skills competitionthat you guys are doing? Time is
definitely featured in thoseideal competitions?
Grahame Brown (14:18):
Yeah, exactly.
Time becomes extremelyimportant. And for us, it's just
a way of gauging, you know, whowe're going to send on to the,
to the national or not thenational sorry, but it helps us
determine who the Canadianwinners are, so that we send
them to the to the US for theglobal competition. So quality
of work is still extremelyimportant. But time gives us
(14:39):
that basis to allow forelimination and ascending on to
the next level. So you're
Zack Hartle (14:49):
touching on a little bit but so just maybe
speaking to the structure of thecompetition, there would be
battle of schools then anational Little Canadian
championship and then that wouldprogress to the global or am I
missing a step in theresomewhere,
Grahame Brown (15:05):
there is a little step in there because we, we use
these events to get out to, youknow, our distributors, and our
distributor partners then bringin the customers to, to their
facility. So it helps themagain, show some of the newer
ideal equipment and tools. Andthen we also do contractor only
(15:28):
events where I am actually inEdmonton next week to work with
the agent who covers Alberta,and directly at the contractors
facility, and they're going tohave 30 to 40 electricians go
through the competition. So theway it really works is there's
local events throughout Canada.
We did some in Yellowknife thisweek. We've had some on the
(15:52):
island this week. We've had acouple in Alberta this week, and
all the way out to the eastcoast. So those events are more
local. And those times they'reall combined. We have a
leadership board on our websitethat names the leaders. And then
we do as you said, Zack, we havea battle schools in early
spring, typically. And then wehave a battle of schools in the
(16:14):
fall, which is more focusedtowards the apprentice, because
the way the competition works isthere is a there's a winner in
the West for both journeyman andfor apprentice the fastest times
by mid September. I think thecutoff is around September 15.
Just after battle schoolsactually. So that the top time
(16:37):
for a journeyman and the toptime for an apprentice then
would be the Westernrepresentative for Canada, and
then they would go compete inthe US this year, it's back in
Florida last few years last twoor three years has been in
Nashville. So the winner gets togo down there. And then there's
(16:57):
a winner for Ontario. And thenthere's a winner for Quebec in
the Maritimes both again, in thejourneyman and the apprentice
side of things.
Jason Cox (17:08):
In this competition, the National Championships, like
you said, it's in Tampa. Andit's going to be November 4 to
sixth of this year. So whilethis is going to be a busy, busy
time for you for the next fewmonths,
Grahame Brown (17:20):
yeah, you know what has been great, because we
haven't had to have or wehaven't been able to have one
account letter for the last twoyears. And, you know, for
myself, I spent a tremendousamount of time, while actually
on a plane flying to differentdifferent areas of western
Canada. And this gives me it'swords given me already a great
(17:40):
opportunity to get back and meetwith distributors that have been
seen for a couple of years. Andcontractors that you know, you
basically lost touch with overthe last two or three. So for
instance I just did two weeksago, I did a show in Lethbridge.
And then the next day inMedicine Hat and then the day
after that I was in SwiftCurrent so really had a chance
to go, you know, across southernAlberta and Saskatchewan, and
(18:04):
spent a lot of money on gas, butalso had a great opportunity to
meet a ton of distributors andtheir people and their sales
reps and then end users toeveryone. So that to me, it was
a great way to once you know,kind of the gloves came off, so
to speak with COVID is beingable to get right back out in
(18:25):
the field, and just talk withpeople again. And that, that
people that I believe havereally, really missed that
personal interaction.
Jason Cox (18:34):
You know, we that that's something that that comes
up, we've been doing our podcastnow this is I think we're close
to our one year anniversary.
And, and of course naturallyCOVID has been such a big part
of everyone's lives that and wefeatured it on previous
episodes. So So yeah, I thinkjust for people to get back out
there again and actually talk toyou in person and see the tools
(18:56):
and try things out what I mean,that's that's the kind of stuff
that we need.
Grahame Brown (19:03):
Yeah, and it really is a touchy feely
industry, right? I mean, these,these electricians are working
with the equipment every day,and it really does have to feel
right. And, you know, size ofhand the, the cushioning on the
on the pliers, everything takes,you know, that sense? It really
interacts with the customer withthe end user and the installer
(19:26):
and unless they're able to tryit out, feel it get a sense for
how it works for them. You know,you're not really you're not
really helping them right. Andreally at the end of the day,
our job as a manufacturer is tomake their job easier. And with
less fatigue because they'reworking a lot of time long
(19:50):
hours, especially in WesternCanada where, you know, a lot of
times in winter weather doesobviously become a factor. The
days are shorter so they're notworking as long but certain
right now where you're getting12 and 14 hours of daylight, how
that that tool feels in yourhand and, and the the results on
(20:10):
your body at the end of the day,right? If the if it doesn't work
for you properly, you're you'regonna have all sorts of hand
fatigue or arm fatigue. Andthat's just not good, right in
the long term that's not healthyfor anybody. So you need that
immediate touch, that immediatefeedback to help develop
equipment that works foreverybody.
Zack Hartle (20:32):
Yeah, it's such a cool way to get that feedback,
like you say, and then also kindof give back to the community
with prizes and opportunities.
And the one thing that is reallycool about this competition, I
think, to me, is just howaccessible it is, right? You're
you just listed off, you know,15 places you've been in the
last couple months. And sothere's an opportunity for in
every city everywhere forapprentice or journeyman to get
(20:53):
involved and compete. So I amassuming all that information
can be found on the website, ifanyone's interested in going and
trying their hand at getting onthe leaderboard.
Grahame Brown (21:04):
Yeah, exactly Zack on on our website, you can
go to the events section, andyou can type in your postal
code. And it'll give you theclosest event to you that
particular day. It'll also giveyou a kind of a, you know, a
generic, look at when I did ityesterday, for instance, there
was nothing I don't I don'tthink going on in Calgary
(21:26):
yesterday. But we did have onein Yellowknife. And there was
one on the island. And then itdoes show some of the different
events in the US too. So soreally, and certainly where we
have some real populationdensity, you know, for instance,
in the GTA area, we haveelectricians and contractors
that that actively go show toshow the show to try to get the
(21:49):
best time. Because you can it'snot just one and done sort of
thing. Okay, you can, you can goto you know, so using Calgary as
an example, you could go to adistributor and in the north end
of Calgary on a on a Tuesdaycompete, do fairly well. But
then on Wednesday, if it's on adifferent area of Calgary or a
different distributor, you cango in and participate in that
(22:10):
event. And you can do it as manytimes as you can fit in between
now and the cut off in Septemberto get the lowest time. And
really that's, you know, some ofthe excitement we've seen in
previous years was we haveexactly that. And you mentioned,
Paul, that you've interviewedfor your podcast. Also, I know
(22:31):
Paul, when he was therepresentative and went down to
I believe he went to DisneyWorld was where he competed. But
he probably did five or sixdifferent events throughout
Calgary to get to the time heneeded to get there. So it's not
just one and done. Like I sayyou can do different events
(22:51):
within your within yourprovince. So if you're a
tradesman registered withinAlberta, you can compete in any
of the Alberta ones. Very cool.
Jason Cox (23:01):
Graham, thanks so much for being on the show
today. Tons of information. I'msure we could talk about tools
and competitions and industryfor hours. So we really
appreciate your time. Thanks forcoming on the show today.
Grahame Brown (23:13):
Thanks again, guys. I appreciate you reaching
out to us. And it was great tomeet you both. And thanks again
for letting ideas speak a littlebit about her competition, a
little bit about our equipmentand real happy to be here.
Thanks again,
Zack Hartle (23:26):
for sure. Up next on the show. We're just gonna
sit down with Paul had Nanea.
He's a previous nationalcompetition competitor who
competed down in Floridarepresenting Canada. So we'll
get into that now. With us nowwe have Paul Hanna nya. He is a
previous ideal nationalcompetition competitor. And he's
(23:47):
here to tell us a story aboutthat. Paul, welcome. If you
could take a couple of minutesmaybe before we get into the
ideal competition, just tell usa little bit about your
electrical career.
Paul Hannania (24:00):
Yeah, that's certainly thanks for having me.
So yeah, I started when I was17. I started my apprenticeship
with my father in England. So Idid 10 years worth of work over
there. Construction light, lightcommercial. I came to Canada in
2008. reset my certificate andgot qualified over here. And
(24:22):
then I was doing some commercialwork over here in Calgary. And
then in 2013, I set up my owncompany, panel, upgrade experts,
we specialize in electricalpanel upgrades so that that's
kind of what I've been workingon since since 2013.
Jason Cox (24:40):
How did you get involved with ideal skills
championships?
Paul Hannania (24:46):
Yeah, so the the company where I buy my
materials, they let me know thatthere was a competition coming
up, which was the qualifiers. Sothat's 2018 so did Few of them
got really interested in enjoyedit. And then was lucky enough to
win it, which was which was a,which was great, obviously. And
(25:10):
then went down to Florida in the2018. National Championship. And
yeah, really got hooked on atthat point. So so the next year,
I was obviously super interestedto qualify and put a lot more
time into practicing for it,practicing for the qualifier and
then managed to get down about2019. The second year, so yeah,
(25:31):
it was a lot of fun.
Zack Hartle (25:33):
Yeah, very cool. So I guess more than national
competition are the qualifiershere? What does that competition
look like? I actually haven'tactually seen one. So you walk
into a room what's in front ofyou? What's the goal of the
competition?
Paul Hannania (25:45):
Yeah, certainly set a qualifier. It's basically
as a small scale electricalinstallation, it's, it's a
board, a two foot by two footboard, there's a couple of boxes
mounted on it, you've got to doa little bit of wiring wires
which Wye are like a test it sopretty simple. The first year, I
(26:07):
remember there was a coax andeveryone would get tripped up on
the coax, could you try to go asfast as you are as fast as you
can collect? It can be a finickything to stress if you don't
quite strip it, right. Or yourstripping is grim. Right? So
yeah, the the qualifiers were alot of fun, because they would
generally be like the open houseto the, to the supplier. So
(26:28):
it's, so it's that kind of alittle bit of a festival
atmosphere. It's got burgers,and they've got, they've got
games and stuff going on at thispart of it. So the qualifiers
are really fun, like no pressurethere with people you know, and
you kind of get to know the guysrunning it. So yeah, the
qualifiers a real good time forthe summer as well. So
Zack Hartle (26:50):
see, you're looking at this board, two feet by two
feet in front of you a coupleswitches, couple lights, what is
the like, how much time are youtalking for? Like, what were
your times like on that? Ah,
Paul Hannania (27:02):
I think the time I qualified with on the first
year was like a minute for whatyou it takes time of practicing
and going to an event and havinga goal, we've got an event for
them to go. And you start offwith a two three minute time.
And then you kind of shave thatdown a little bit and you shave
that down a little bit. So yeah,I think the guys I think the
(27:26):
fastest guys in the whole thingwere they were in the low 50s.
Which was incredible, becauseI'm doing a one minute for I
don't know how you can shave 10seconds off that, like, So what
they're doing some fast guys outthere.
Jason Cox (27:42):
Truly a Speed Competition, then obviously,
whatever your your wiring, thetask has to be functional, but
it's a Speed Competition.
Paul Hannania (27:50):
Definitely, definitely the qualifier. Once
you get into the championshipitself, there's a bit more
quality involved. But thequalifier I think it's the
parameter, there's theparameters you gotta meet. But
then everything else is all it'sall speed.
Jason Cox (28:08):
And then so talk to us a little bit about the
national championships, maybewhere it took place, and just
some of the differences from theregional competition.
Paul Hannania (28:17):
Yeah, so the the couple of years I went, it was
Orlando, Florida. And thedifferences. It we're getting
into that real electricalinstalls now. So there was
conduit involved, there wasgetting wire switches and lights
and stuff like that. But on abigger scale, the board instead
(28:38):
of being a two foot by two footboard was more like a 10 foot by
10 foot wall. And there's anelectrical panel, and there's,
there's Where's painted, whereyou've got to land your boxes.
So you kinda got to be fairlyaccurate to land on the boxes,
sets, etc. So you've got to beable to do locks off sets and
three points, titles, etc. Andthen wiring through the boxes to
(29:02):
the lights. And yeah, so alittle bit more what you would
expect to do on a on acommercial job rather than the
board being just like apractice.
Zack Hartle (29:12):
And before that national competition, or you
presented the projectbeforehand, so you can practice
set it up, get some training, oryou show up and it's a complete
surprise what it is.
Paul Hannania (29:21):
Yeah, completely.
So what they did is they splityou into two groups. So one
group will go into the meetingroom and I like that explain it.
So that's it. That's that'sfirst thing in the morning,
seven o'clock in the morning,you start the explain, they give
you a video and they give you asheet of a rundown. And then you
go out and you do it. So there'sthat nerves that you don't know
(29:43):
what's going to come up. And youmight have been practicing
conduit and you just hoping todo some condoms on there or
there's hoping it's somethingthat you're good at. And then
the second group, they would goand sit in another meeting room
and then wait for the firstgroup to do the competition. And
then they take it all downthough obviously the mark
everything that just yet, andthen they strip it down. So
(30:04):
yeah, I mean, if you're in thefirst group, it's ideal because
then you, you, you actually getto watch the second group, the
first group don't get the secondgroup. So I don't get to watch
the first group, because itgives them an idea of what's
going on. So yeah, that's thethat's really the biggest thing.
You don't know what you're goinginto. Yeah, that's,
Zack Hartle (30:23):
that's an interesting perspective. For
sure. Yeah. Like you say, youdon't know what the practice you
don't know what to get into. Imean, caught exact splicing
seems like a pretty smart thingto practice. But you never know.
Right? That's exactly. Yeah.
Jason Cox (30:36):
Just a question here.
So I'm watching this on YouTube.
And I believe it was the 2019International. Well, the
competition was national andinternational, I believe. So
you're on ESPN? Yeah. How muchwas that the TV crew and their
production, impacting thecompetition.
Paul Hannania (30:59):
From my point of view, it didn't really bother
me. Once that I kind of felt thepressure was off once we'd gone
through a couple of the novelstages the competition, and I
already got knocked out. There'sbefore on the North American,
though, ended up getting intothe, into the international
(31:22):
because I was the fastestCanadian. And then, and I was
kind of I was kind of relaxed.
So it was it was more fun. Thatwas the most fun. I've had
competing, seeing that thepressure was off. Just gonna go
that do my best. And yeah, itwas great. I got an ISBN which
was fun.
Jason Cox (31:43):
Yeah, well, it looked like some of the competitors. I
watched a few of the videos. Andwhen it was over, it was like,
it's almost like a whole bunchof like, you built a bunch of
new relationships there, too.
There's a lot of people werehappy with watching other people
succeed.
Paul Hannania (31:59):
Totally. The camaraderie was great. And
especially with the Canadians,because we, we kind of went on,
we were all new on the 2018. Sowe everyone kind of gets to know
each other a little bit more,because there's so many people
there who were that previousyear, and they've already got
their relationships. So they'rethe Canadians, we've definitely
(32:20):
formed a bit of a bond betweenour group and then the second
year, a lot of same guys wentback. So it was great to see
everyone again. But yeah, thecamaraderie on is is fantastic.
So more than I was expecting,really, I mean, it's a
competition. You're trying tobeat these guys. But you're also
become really friendly withthem. So
Zack Hartle (32:40):
it's company, competitors, where they're from
Canada.
Paul Hannania (32:45):
The first year, that which we look in 2018. That
was two electricians and twoapprentices. So it was split
east to west.
Zack Hartle (32:54):
Okay, so, journeyman two apprentices.
Paul Hannania (32:56):
Exactly, yeah.
And then there was I think, oneteam, and I think they were from
Ontario. On the 2019, theyopened it up a little bit more.
So was maybe eight electriciansand a apprentices. Yeah, it was
nice. It was nice. A few more.
Jason Cox (33:16):
So this is ideal tools, national and
international competitions. Ijust I have to ask here, Paul.
Is there an ideal tool that islike one of your favorites? Or
do you have a favorite idealtool, the best
Paul Hannania (33:33):
tool of use from ideal all the all the coax
stripper and crimper. So thecoax stripper that you would use
in whether we used in aqualifier? 2018 I ended up
buying it under under crimper.
Because I liked him so much. Soit was it made a sale out of it.
But so yeah, great, great tool.
Jason Cox (33:56):
There's lots of electricians I know that always
struggle with coax. It's funny.
You mentioned that earlier. Andthen the takeaway for you is
actually that's the tool thatyou bought so interesting. Yeah.
Zack Hartle (34:10):
What are the other takeaways you have from the
competition? What did you learnwhile you were competing, that
maybe now you use at work andyour your company?
Paul Hannania (34:19):
The systematic approach is how you shave that
time down. You just you do yourwire and then everything strip,
you strip every single box, andthen you twist them all you know
what I mean? So you can't begoing back and forth. I think
the premise was talking to theother guys, when you get there
as like, you only want to betouching the tool once. You
(34:41):
can't be you can't be takenalignments. Twist in, put it
down, pick it up, put it down.
It's your when you're done withthat tool is gone.
Zack Hartle (34:49):
You get into that too, and commercial and
residential, you know, you'realways trying to teach your
apprentice you know, you don'twant to go up a ladder down a
ladder up or down a ladder.
Ladder, right? But it's so muchmore fine to And, and on us like
a smaller scale when you're justtalking about a two foot by two
foot board right?
Paul Hannania (35:05):
Completely. And we, we kind of do this with a
panels when when the guys thatnew guys don't show up, it's I
kind of do one slide and nextslide. But otherwise go in one
after another, and then youstrip them all and then you
straighten them all. It's, it'sstep by step, and you do the
whole thing, then you terminateall your grounds, and then your
(35:27):
terminal your neutrals. So it'sdefinitely a, it's a process.
And I like that's, that's kindof why I specialize in panels. I
like the fact that it's aprocess that we can refine, and
then you can get pretty quick atit. So and it's repeatable. And
then another guy can get a glassdoor, and I can teach you that
process. And then he can do thepanels exactly like I do them.
(35:49):
Because I take them we take alot of pride in how it looks as
well as how it functions.
Jason Cox (35:56):
Okay, so getting back to our, our ideal competition
here. Do you have any advice toapprentices or journey persons,
if they'd like to compete inthis competition in the future?
Yeah, definitely.
Paul Hannania (36:09):
I mean, you've got to put some time in on the
qualifiers, if you want to getthere with it. So that's, that's
step one. And then the secondstep, ah, I mean, we're lucky
that the practice is all work,we get, we get to practice as
we're doing it. So I find wherethe mistakes are maybe made on
(36:34):
the last year when I tried toget too fast. And my quality
suffered. So, and I didn't, theydidn't get me as far as I wanted
to, as I thought it might. So Ifeel you've got to be fast, and
you've got to be consistent, andhe's got to be quality. So
realistically to, to ensureyou're going to progress. You
(36:56):
got to be able to do everythingis not just a Speed Competition
anymore. And it's not just aquality competition. It's you've
got to be able to do everything.
So make sure you can bank on toit, because kind of has been
very prevalent in thecompetitions. I mean, wiring, we
should all get a wire, thereshouldn't be too much doubt on
being able to wire basiccircuit, but conduit is, I think
(37:19):
the one that most people gettripped upon, if they can't
bend.
Jason Cox (37:25):
Right. Alright.
Anything else? Zack? No,
Zack Hartle (37:28):
I think that is everything. Paul, anything else
you want to add? Or?
Paul Hannania (37:34):
I think I'm not really I mean, I'm, I'm happy
that ideal have opened it up tothe Canadian competitors again
this year. So just waiting forsome of them events in Calgary
be organized. So I'm lookingforward to that. And hopefully
make it hopefully make it forthe 2020s too.
Zack Hartle (37:51):
Yeah, I know. COVID has thrown a little bit of a
wrench in their system. Butyeah, you do plan to attempt
here to compete again.
Paul Hannania (37:59):
I'd give it a go to get you qualified to go see
what happens. Nice. Awesome.
Zack Hartle (38:04):
Well, thank you so much for joining us today. We
really appreciated having you onthe show and a little bit of
insight into the competition.
Paul Hannania (38:11):
Thank you. It's been great being here. Thank
you.
Zack Hartle (38:14):
And with all that, make sure you check out the
ideal industries website to finda national championship
qualifying event near you. Thisepisode, of course, coming out
middle of September now. And wehave lots of events coming up in
Alberta, Calgary and all overCanada, including battle of the
schools where apprentices willhave the opportunity to compete
(38:36):
at their technical institute. Socheck out the website. We'll
link it down below in thedescription as well. As always,
thank you so much for listeningto Watt's the Word podcast.
Jason and I are thrilled to haveyou here. Make sure you
subscribe wherever you listen topodcasts, Apple, Spotify,
Google, anchor anywhere else toget the latest episodes or you
(38:56):
can check us out on YouTube.
Stay in touch with us on all oursocial media which you will link
down below as well. Thank you somuch. Keep yourself safe out
there and if you can someoneelse to
Hello, and welcome to Watt's the Word, an electrical
industry Podcast. I'm Jason Cox,and along with my co host, Zack
Hartle, we're having relevantconversations with people in the
electrical industry. On thisepisode we are talking about
ideal industries and theirskills competitions. Ideal runs
(00:21):
a series of competitions,eligible for apprentices and
certified journey peoplethroughout North America and I
believe throughout the world. Totalk about this today we're
joined by previous competitorPaul had an IO Paul's with
paddle upgrade experts. Andwe're joined by Graham brown,
(00:42):
gray and brown is the WesternRegional Manager for ideal
industrial. So let's get to thisepisode and see if you have what
it takes to compete at the idealnational championships.
Zack Hartle (00:55):
Starting off today, we're joined by Graham Brown,
Brown Welcome to Watt's the Wordpodcast.
Grahame Brown (01:01):
Thanks very much, guys. I really appreciate you
inviting me today. And I'mlooking forward to it.
Zack Hartle (01:08):
Absolutely. So I mean, before we get into ideal
and before we get into thenational competition, maybe just
tell us briefly how you got intothe position you're at now and
just a little bit of yourbackground in the industry.
Grahame Brown (01:22):
Well, just a little bit of background. I,
when I was growing up, back inthe late 1800s, I had a neighbor
there was an electrician, andreally as a teenager from 1415.
I started doing a lot of oddjobs with him as he was doing
odd jobs around Edmonton. I grewup just outside Edmonton. So I
(01:43):
did that for three or four yearsas as a teenager. And that's how
I raised money to go to school.
And then when I was finished,Nate, a good friend of mine
owned his own contractingoutfit. And he was looking for
somebody to set up a, a bidsystem for him on the computer.
And it was a temporary thingthat lasted about six, seven
(02:03):
years, and started with him. Andthen after that kind of closed
down, I went to a distributor inEdmonton company named Arielle
bruise and son, back whenBruzzone are the family still
owned the company. So worked forthem for about 10 years. And
then I switched to themanufacturing sales side of
(02:27):
things and took over as a salesmanager with another really
large manufacturer and workedfor them for about 1314 years.
And then since then, I've workedfor a couple of different
manufacturers over the years.
And basically, I've run WesternCanada over the over the last
(02:48):
probably 20 to 25 years in thisindustry. So had a bit of
experience. And
Jason Cox (02:54):
that sounds like a lot of experience to be honest
with you definitely know whatyou're talking about.
Grahame Brown (03:00):
You're calling me old Jason, is that what you're
doing?
Jason Cox (03:03):
I think I think you and I are from the same vintage
gram, same vintage. So like afine bottle of wine.
Grahame Brown (03:11):
Yeah, I mean, it's been great experience,
because I never expected reallyto be involved in the electrical
industry. That's not what I wentto school for. But once you get
in, and once you get working,and it's been a great industry
is treated, you know, it'streated me very, very well.
Jason Cox (03:30):
That's the thing that I'm always curious about when
people are in our industry, ninetimes out of 10 They've got into
it through someone they knewwhether it was in your case,
like a neighbor, or more often afamily member. There's not a lot
of people that well, there'sthat rare few that decide from
(03:50):
day one, I want to be anelectrician so so it's always
interesting to hear the story ofhow people get and stay in the
industry. Turning to the idealindustry side here. Maybe tell
us a little bit about what idealhas been doing over the last few
years to keep up with changes inthe industry.
Grahame Brown (04:09):
Well, really over the last three or four years,
you know which COVID is takenprobably three, three quarters
of is we actually have a reallyrobust marketing and a research
and development team. Based outof the US we're still a family
owned business. They're fifthgeneration family now. So they
(04:33):
spend a lot of money on r&d. Andwe actually have a department
run by a gentleman who's workedfor several different business
entities within the family. Andhe really had a great roadmap
over the last three or fouryears and we've released
probably knew more new productsin the last three years than we
would have over the last 10 andthe roadmap still looks very
(04:57):
robust for the remainder of thisyear and So the next couple of
years so the gentleman who leadsour r&d team right now is hold
several patents for the family.
And he does a tremendous jobabout creating a great road path
forward.
Zack Hartle (05:13):
Not to put you on the spot too much. But can you
give us an example of some ofyour recent releases of products
that are maybe winners? I guess?
Grahame Brown (05:21):
Yeah. So one of our most recent releases would
be what we call a dead eyeseries. And it's made for you
know, it's a holesaw. Group. Andalso going to expand that same
thing into the drilling andtapping and but really, what
that is, is the ability to drillinto harder metals, and
(05:43):
stainless steel. several,several of our competitors and
ourselves previous of, you know,we have something similar that
does really well in mild steel,but nothing that really does
very well on the heart metal endof things. So we've created a
whole new lineup of cutting thatwill be called Dead Eye, and
(06:04):
it's made for the heavier metaldrilling and tapping and then
hole saws too. So perfect.
Jason Cox (06:12):
I'm just looking at your website right now. And the
Deadeye collection is definitelyfeatured prominently on the
website. And I mean, yeah, anyany improvement in technology
for that kind of tool isdefinitely appreciated by
electricians for sure.
Grahame Brown (06:30):
Well, that's kind of where I think that ideal has
been very strong over the years.
Like I say, it's a familybusiness. It's been around since
the early 1900s, and eight, andthey really have been quite
adept at adding products,tweaking products, that sort of
thing. And that that mattressstill holds today that you
(06:50):
continue to do that.
Unknown (06:56):
So into the ideal, and you're maybe, maybe just tell me
exactly what it's called, but
Zack Hartle (07:01):
is it the ideal national championship? Is that
what it's called?
Grahame Brown (07:05):
Yeah, exactly.
It's National Championshipsstarted about six or seven years
ago for us. And it started inthe States first, again, being a
US based company. And really,they given an opportunity to,
they were looking for a way to,to approach the business a
(07:26):
little bit differently than justthrough the normal sales
channels. And looking really to,to talk to and in, be influenced
by apprentices and journeymanelectricians that were actually
using the equipment that we wemanufacture. And probably the
most direct way to do that wasto interact with, you know, the
(07:48):
end user. So this championshipallows us to put on competitions
across Canada, US, Australia,and so on and have lots interact
directly with the people usingthe equipment on a daily basis,
having them use our stuff at thecompetition level. And then give
(08:08):
us feedback on what they likewhat they don't like. And then
it's really taken those commentsare taken back. And And again,
we have the ability to tweak,tweak things and make
adjustments, hopefully for thebetter of the electricians using
the product, right.
Zack Hartle (08:28):
Yeah, it's cool to take something like a
competition and it hits so manyof those things that you're
trying to accomplish, or you getthat instant feedback from
competitors. You also get alittle bit of I'm sure there's
media involved in somemarketing, going along with it.
And just getting the name outthere, right. So on that's
something that is important fordeveloping new products and
bringing things out.
Grahame Brown (08:50):
Well, these competitions over the years, I
mean, they're there they are onTV in the US, they're on ESPN,
one of the ESPN channels, andthe finals are on TV at that
point in time. And it is it's areally big event right there.
Because there's winners from thelast one that Canada was
(09:11):
involved because we weren't tooinvolved in the last couple of
duty COVID Of course, but thelast one Canadians were involved
there was competitors fromChina, Australia, the US and
Canada. And, you know, again, itgives us the opportunity to meet
with people from around theworld that are using our
equipment and our tools on aregular basis and, and having a
(09:33):
fun and friendly competition tosee who can who can do best sort
of thing and, and the prizemoney for this. This event is
live the files it's to me it'sit's absolutely incredible. For
a couple of years, a journeymanwinner was, you know in around
the $75,000 us for first place.
This year's competition, a firstor a journeyman prize is $60,000
(09:56):
us so Oh, there's some fabulousprize money that that you can
win for, for winning thecompetition?
Jason Cox (10:08):
Well, as it like, I'm kind of going back to the tools
and to the competition. How neatis it that you get to use a
tool, give your feedback to onthe tool to the company, and the
actual patent owner of the toolis going to actually see your,
your impact your review. And Imean, you might indirectly be
(10:30):
responsible for a subtle changein improving a tool. That's
pretty cool.
Grahame Brown (10:35):
Well, really, we leave that you know exactly what
you're saying, we leave that upto the the electricians, because
everybody has a little bitdifferent way of doing things.
And, and, you know, when youtalk to some people that you
know, whether they've been onthe tools for 40 years, or where
they had been on the tools formonths, something that they
suggest it sometimes it's thatkeep it simple, stupid thing
(10:57):
where you just go, well, that'sso brilliant, it's simple, why
don't we incorporate that right?
And, and then, because ideal hasthe ability to control
everything internal, is we canmake those changes and redesign
certain things or tweaksomething and then release it to
the former, excuse me to themarketplace, which really,
(11:18):
large, large public companiesjust don't have that ability to
maneuver as quickly within thespace today. So ideally, is
unique in that area where we'reable to take that feedback. The
r&d department can take a lookat it and see if it, you know,
can be done on a on a biggerscale. And if it is, they still
have that ability to tweak andrelease it to the market and a
(11:41):
fairly quick period of time.
Jason Cox (11:45):
Yeah, and having people with different levels of
experience is always a goodthing. You got dinosaurs like
me, that would take a tool andgo on and on. It's always been
like this. Whereas someonethat's new new to the industry
would say, well, wouldn't it bejust easy if we could do this?
And and people like me that havethese habits of years and years
and years? We go? Actually,that's a really good idea. So
(12:06):
yeah, I think it's an incredibleplatform. For so many reasons.
Yeah.
Grahame Brown (12:12):
Yeah. Well, I look to we've had two recent
tools. Over the last threemonths, one's kind of a forge
plier. So it's a combination ofa linesman and a pair of
strippers. And really, itcombines two tools into one,
which is not always great, butyou know, when you talk to
people that are working onlifts, or are trucking and a
(12:35):
bunch of tools to a site, andthen they put two or three that
they you know, essentials intotheir their pocket to go do some
work? Well, this helps alleviatesome of that, that problem right
with having to carry too manytools, and it does a really good
job on both ends, whether it'sstripping or using it as
linesman pliers. So it's quite,it's quite unique. And it's it
(12:57):
comes from feedback right fromthe market.
Jason Cox (13:01):
versity versatility is something that every
electrician definitely valueswhen you're up on that ladder,
or up on that lift, and you've,you've lost one tool, so you're
defaulting to a second or athird tool. So if you had a tool
that was very versatile, I thinkit would be appreciated. And
then myself, I kind of when Iwas still in industry, or still
(13:22):
pulling wire, etc, I was on theservice side of the industry. So
so often I would be dealing withcustomers carrying a lot of
distance through the day,monitoring jobs, etc. And I'd
always want to have like two orthree tools in my pocket. So
that when I was dealing with mystaff, and then dealing with a
(13:43):
client, it would be a quick 123kinds of things. So So once
again, there's a there'sdefinitely a need for tools like
that.
Grahame Brown (13:50):
I think combining a couple of essentials into one
tool, you know, really does makesense, especially nowadays,
right? Where we're time and timereally is money.
Jason Cox (14:01):
Yeah, it seems to be a theme in many of the episodes
we're talking about now. It'sit's that time factor and how
can we become more efficient?
And with the skills competitionthat you guys are doing? Time is
definitely featured in thoseideal competitions?
Grahame Brown (14:18):
Yeah, exactly.
Time becomes extremelyimportant. And for us, it's just
a way of gauging, you know, whowe're going to send on to the,
to the national or not thenational sorry, but it helps us
determine who the Canadianwinners are, so that we send
them to the to the US for theglobal competition. So quality
of work is still extremelyimportant. But time gives us
(14:39):
that basis to allow forelimination and ascending on to
the next level. So you're
Zack Hartle (14:49):
touching on a little bit but so just maybe
speaking to the structure of thecompetition, there would be
battle of schools then anational Little Canadian
championship and then that wouldprogress to the global or am I
missing a step in theresomewhere,
Grahame Brown (15:05):
there is a little step in there because we, we use
these events to get out to, youknow, our distributors, and our
distributor partners then bringin the customers to, to their
facility. So it helps themagain, show some of the newer
ideal equipment and tools. Andthen we also do contractor only
(15:28):
events where I am actually inEdmonton next week to work with
the agent who covers Alberta,and directly at the contractors
facility, and they're going tohave 30 to 40 electricians go
through the competition. So theway it really works is there's
local events throughout Canada.
We did some in Yellowknife thisweek. We've had some on the
(15:52):
island this week. We've had acouple in Alberta this week, and
all the way out to the eastcoast. So those events are more
local. And those times they'reall combined. We have a
leadership board on our websitethat names the leaders. And then
we do as you said, Zack, we havea battle schools in early
spring, typically. And then wehave a battle of schools in the
(16:14):
fall, which is more focusedtowards the apprentice, because
the way the competition works isthere is a there's a winner in
the West for both journeyman andfor apprentice the fastest times
by mid September. I think thecutoff is around September 15.
Just after battle schoolsactually. So that the top time
(16:37):
for a journeyman and the toptime for an apprentice then
would be the Westernrepresentative for Canada, and
then they would go compete inthe US this year, it's back in
Florida last few years last twoor three years has been in
Nashville. So the winner gets togo down there. And then there's
(16:57):
a winner for Ontario. And thenthere's a winner for Quebec in
the Maritimes both again, in thejourneyman and the apprentice
side of things.
Jason Cox (17:08):
In this competition, the National Championships, like
you said, it's in Tampa. Andit's going to be November 4 to
sixth of this year. So whilethis is going to be a busy, busy
time for you for the next fewmonths,
Grahame Brown (17:20):
yeah, you know what has been great, because we
haven't had to have or wehaven't been able to have one
account letter for the last twoyears. And, you know, for
myself, I spent a tremendousamount of time, while actually
on a plane flying to differentdifferent areas of western
Canada. And this gives me it'swords given me already a great
(17:40):
opportunity to get back and meetwith distributors that have been
seen for a couple of years. Andcontractors that you know, you
basically lost touch with overthe last two or three. So for
instance I just did two weeksago, I did a show in Lethbridge.
And then the next day inMedicine Hat and then the day
after that I was in SwiftCurrent so really had a chance
to go, you know, across southernAlberta and Saskatchewan, and
(18:04):
spent a lot of money on gas, butalso had a great opportunity to
meet a ton of distributors andtheir people and their sales
reps and then end users toeveryone. So that to me, it was
a great way to once you know,kind of the gloves came off, so
to speak with COVID is beingable to get right back out in
(18:25):
the field, and just talk withpeople again. And that, that
people that I believe havereally, really missed that
personal interaction.
Jason Cox (18:34):
You know, we that that's something that that comes
up, we've been doing our podcastnow this is I think we're close
to our one year anniversary.
And, and of course naturallyCOVID has been such a big part
of everyone's lives that and wefeatured it on previous
episodes. So So yeah, I thinkjust for people to get back out
there again and actually talk toyou in person and see the tools
(18:56):
and try things out what I mean,that's that's the kind of stuff
that we need.
Grahame Brown (19:03):
Yeah, and it really is a touchy feely
industry, right? I mean, these,these electricians are working
with the equipment every day,and it really does have to feel
right. And, you know, size ofhand the, the cushioning on the
on the pliers, everything takes,you know, that sense? It really
interacts with the customer withthe end user and the installer
(19:26):
and unless they're able to tryit out, feel it get a sense for
how it works for them. You know,you're not really you're not
really helping them right. Andreally at the end of the day,
our job as a manufacturer is tomake their job easier. And with
less fatigue because they'reworking a lot of time long
(19:50):
hours, especially in WesternCanada where, you know, a lot of
times in winter weather doesobviously become a factor. The
days are shorter so they're notworking as long but certain
right now where you're getting12 and 14 hours of daylight, how
that that tool feels in yourhand and, and the the results on
(20:10):
your body at the end of the day,right? If the if it doesn't work
for you properly, you're you'regonna have all sorts of hand
fatigue or arm fatigue. Andthat's just not good, right in
the long term that's not healthyfor anybody. So you need that
immediate touch, that immediatefeedback to help develop
equipment that works foreverybody.
Zack Hartle (20:32):
Yeah, it's such a cool way to get that feedback,
like you say, and then also kindof give back to the community
with prizes and opportunities.
And the one thing that is reallycool about this competition, I
think, to me, is just howaccessible it is, right? You're
you just listed off, you know,15 places you've been in the
last couple months. And sothere's an opportunity for in
every city everywhere forapprentice or journeyman to get
(20:53):
involved and compete. So I amassuming all that information
can be found on the website, ifanyone's interested in going and
trying their hand at getting onthe leaderboard.
Grahame Brown (21:04):
Yeah, exactly Zack on on our website, you can
go to the events section, andyou can type in your postal
code. And it'll give you theclosest event to you that
particular day. It'll also giveyou a kind of a, you know, a
generic, look at when I did ityesterday, for instance, there
was nothing I don't I don'tthink going on in Calgary
(21:26):
yesterday. But we did have onein Yellowknife. And there was
one on the island. And then itdoes show some of the different
events in the US too. So soreally, and certainly where we
have some real populationdensity, you know, for instance,
in the GTA area, we haveelectricians and contractors
that that actively go show toshow the show to try to get the
(21:49):
best time. Because you can it'snot just one and done sort of
thing. Okay, you can, you can goto you know, so using Calgary as
an example, you could go to adistributor and in the north end
of Calgary on a on a Tuesdaycompete, do fairly well. But
then on Wednesday, if it's on adifferent area of Calgary or a
different distributor, you cango in and participate in that
(22:10):
event. And you can do it as manytimes as you can fit in between
now and the cut off in Septemberto get the lowest time. And
really that's, you know, some ofthe excitement we've seen in
previous years was we haveexactly that. And you mentioned,
Paul, that you've interviewedfor your podcast. Also, I know
(22:31):
Paul, when he was therepresentative and went down to
I believe he went to DisneyWorld was where he competed. But
he probably did five or sixdifferent events throughout
Calgary to get to the time heneeded to get there. So it's not
just one and done. Like I sayyou can do different events
(22:51):
within your within yourprovince. So if you're a
tradesman registered withinAlberta, you can compete in any
of the Alberta ones. Very cool.
Jason Cox (23:01):
Graham, thanks so much for being on the show
today. Tons of information. I'msure we could talk about tools
and competitions and industryfor hours. So we really
appreciate your time. Thanks forcoming on the show today.
Grahame Brown (23:13):
Thanks again, guys. I appreciate you reaching
out to us. And it was great tomeet you both. And thanks again
for letting ideas speak a littlebit about her competition, a
little bit about our equipmentand real happy to be here.
Thanks again,
Zack Hartle (23:26):
for sure. Up next on the show. We're just gonna
sit down with Paul had Nanea.
He's a previous nationalcompetition competitor who
competed down in Floridarepresenting Canada. So we'll
get into that now. With us nowwe have Paul Hanna nya. He is a
previous ideal nationalcompetition competitor. And he's
(23:47):
here to tell us a story aboutthat. Paul, welcome. If you
could take a couple of minutesmaybe before we get into the
ideal competition, just tell usa little bit about your
electrical career.
Paul Hannania (24:00):
Yeah, that's certainly thanks for having me.
So yeah, I started when I was17. I started my apprenticeship
with my father in England. So Idid 10 years worth of work over
there. Construction light, lightcommercial. I came to Canada in
2008. reset my certificate andgot qualified over here. And
(24:22):
then I was doing some commercialwork over here in Calgary. And
then in 2013, I set up my owncompany, panel, upgrade experts,
we specialize in electricalpanel upgrades so that that's
kind of what I've been workingon since since 2013.
Jason Cox (24:40):
How did you get involved with ideal skills
championships?
Paul Hannania (24:46):
Yeah, so the the company where I buy my
materials, they let me know thatthere was a competition coming
up, which was the qualifiers. Sothat's 2018 so did Few of them
got really interested in enjoyedit. And then was lucky enough to
win it, which was which was a,which was great, obviously. And
(25:10):
then went down to Florida in the2018. National Championship. And
yeah, really got hooked on atthat point. So so the next year,
I was obviously super interestedto qualify and put a lot more
time into practicing for it,practicing for the qualifier and
then managed to get down about2019. The second year, so yeah,
(25:31):
it was a lot of fun.
Zack Hartle (25:33):
Yeah, very cool. So I guess more than national
competition are the qualifiershere? What does that competition
look like? I actually haven'tactually seen one. So you walk
into a room what's in front ofyou? What's the goal of the
competition?
Paul Hannania (25:45):
Yeah, certainly set a qualifier. It's basically
as a small scale electricalinstallation, it's, it's a
board, a two foot by two footboard, there's a couple of boxes
mounted on it, you've got to doa little bit of wiring wires
which Wye are like a test it sopretty simple. The first year, I
(26:07):
remember there was a coax andeveryone would get tripped up on
the coax, could you try to go asfast as you are as fast as you
can collect? It can be a finickything to stress if you don't
quite strip it, right. Or yourstripping is grim. Right? So
yeah, the the qualifiers were alot of fun, because they would
generally be like the open houseto the, to the supplier. So
(26:28):
it's, so it's that kind of alittle bit of a festival
atmosphere. It's got burgers,and they've got, they've got
games and stuff going on at thispart of it. So the qualifiers
are really fun, like no pressurethere with people you know, and
you kind of get to know the guysrunning it. So yeah, the
qualifiers a real good time forthe summer as well. So
Zack Hartle (26:50):
see, you're looking at this board, two feet by two
feet in front of you a coupleswitches, couple lights, what is
the like, how much time are youtalking for? Like, what were
your times like on that? Ah,
Paul Hannania (27:02):
I think the time I qualified with on the first
year was like a minute for whatyou it takes time of practicing
and going to an event and havinga goal, we've got an event for
them to go. And you start offwith a two three minute time.
And then you kind of shave thatdown a little bit and you shave
that down a little bit. So yeah,I think the guys I think the
(27:26):
fastest guys in the whole thingwere they were in the low 50s.
Which was incredible, becauseI'm doing a one minute for I
don't know how you can shave 10seconds off that, like, So what
they're doing some fast guys outthere.
Jason Cox (27:42):
Truly a Speed Competition, then obviously,
whatever your your wiring, thetask has to be functional, but
it's a Speed Competition.
Paul Hannania (27:50):
Definitely, definitely the qualifier. Once
you get into the championshipitself, there's a bit more
quality involved. But thequalifier I think it's the
parameter, there's theparameters you gotta meet. But
then everything else is all it'sall speed.
Jason Cox (28:08):
And then so talk to us a little bit about the
national championships, maybewhere it took place, and just
some of the differences from theregional competition.
Paul Hannania (28:17):
Yeah, so the the couple of years I went, it was
Orlando, Florida. And thedifferences. It we're getting
into that real electricalinstalls now. So there was
conduit involved, there wasgetting wire switches and lights
and stuff like that. But on abigger scale, the board instead
(28:38):
of being a two foot by two footboard was more like a 10 foot by
10 foot wall. And there's anelectrical panel, and there's,
there's Where's painted, whereyou've got to land your boxes.
So you kinda got to be fairlyaccurate to land on the boxes,
sets, etc. So you've got to beable to do locks off sets and
three points, titles, etc. Andthen wiring through the boxes to
(29:02):
the lights. And yeah, so alittle bit more what you would
expect to do on a on acommercial job rather than the
board being just like apractice.
Zack Hartle (29:12):
And before that national competition, or you
presented the projectbeforehand, so you can practice
set it up, get some training, oryou show up and it's a complete
surprise what it is.
Paul Hannania (29:21):
Yeah, completely.
So what they did is they splityou into two groups. So one
group will go into the meetingroom and I like that explain it.
So that's it. That's that'sfirst thing in the morning,
seven o'clock in the morning,you start the explain, they give
you a video and they give you asheet of a rundown. And then you
go out and you do it. So there'sthat nerves that you don't know
(29:43):
what's going to come up. And youmight have been practicing
conduit and you just hoping todo some condoms on there or
there's hoping it's somethingthat you're good at. And then
the second group, they would goand sit in another meeting room
and then wait for the firstgroup to do the competition. And
then they take it all downthough obviously the mark
everything that just yet, andthen they strip it down. So
(30:04):
yeah, I mean, if you're in thefirst group, it's ideal because
then you, you, you actually getto watch the second group, the
first group don't get the secondgroup. So I don't get to watch
the first group, because itgives them an idea of what's
going on. So yeah, that's thethat's really the biggest thing.
You don't know what you're goinginto. Yeah, that's,
Zack Hartle (30:23):
that's an interesting perspective. For
sure. Yeah. Like you say, youdon't know what the practice you
don't know what to get into. Imean, caught exact splicing
seems like a pretty smart thingto practice. But you never know.
Right? That's exactly. Yeah.
Jason Cox (30:36):
Just a question here.
So I'm watching this on YouTube.
And I believe it was the 2019International. Well, the
competition was national andinternational, I believe. So
you're on ESPN? Yeah. How muchwas that the TV crew and their
production, impacting thecompetition.
Paul Hannania (30:59):
From my point of view, it didn't really bother
me. Once that I kind of felt thepressure was off once we'd gone
through a couple of the novelstages the competition, and I
already got knocked out. There'sbefore on the North American,
though, ended up getting intothe, into the international
(31:22):
because I was the fastestCanadian. And then, and I was
kind of I was kind of relaxed.
So it was it was more fun. Thatwas the most fun. I've had
competing, seeing that thepressure was off. Just gonna go
that do my best. And yeah, itwas great. I got an ISBN which
was fun.
Jason Cox (31:43):
Yeah, well, it looked like some of the competitors. I
watched a few of the videos. Andwhen it was over, it was like,
it's almost like a whole bunchof like, you built a bunch of
new relationships there, too.
There's a lot of people werehappy with watching other people
succeed.
Paul Hannania (31:59):
Totally. The camaraderie was great. And
especially with the Canadians,because we, we kind of went on,
we were all new on the 2018. Sowe everyone kind of gets to know
each other a little bit more,because there's so many people
there who were that previousyear, and they've already got
their relationships. So they'rethe Canadians, we've definitely
(32:20):
formed a bit of a bond betweenour group and then the second
year, a lot of same guys wentback. So it was great to see
everyone again. But yeah, thecamaraderie on is is fantastic.
So more than I was expecting,really, I mean, it's a
competition. You're trying tobeat these guys. But you're also
become really friendly withthem. So
Zack Hartle (32:40):
it's company, competitors, where they're from
Canada.
Paul Hannania (32:45):
The first year, that which we look in 2018. That
was two electricians and twoapprentices. So it was split
east to west.
Zack Hartle (32:54):
Okay, so, journeyman two apprentices.
Paul Hannania (32:56):
Exactly, yeah.
And then there was I think, oneteam, and I think they were from
Ontario. On the 2019, theyopened it up a little bit more.
So was maybe eight electriciansand a apprentices. Yeah, it was
nice. It was nice. A few more.
Jason Cox (33:16):
So this is ideal tools, national and
international competitions. Ijust I have to ask here, Paul.
Is there an ideal tool that islike one of your favorites? Or
do you have a favorite idealtool, the best
Paul Hannania (33:33):
tool of use from ideal all the all the coax
stripper and crimper. So thecoax stripper that you would use
in whether we used in aqualifier? 2018 I ended up
buying it under under crimper.
Because I liked him so much. Soit was it made a sale out of it.
But so yeah, great, great tool.
Jason Cox (33:56):
There's lots of electricians I know that always
struggle with coax. It's funny.
You mentioned that earlier. Andthen the takeaway for you is
actually that's the tool thatyou bought so interesting. Yeah.
Zack Hartle (34:10):
What are the other takeaways you have from the
competition? What did you learnwhile you were competing, that
maybe now you use at work andyour your company?
Paul Hannania (34:19):
The systematic approach is how you shave that
time down. You just you do yourwire and then everything strip,
you strip every single box, andthen you twist them all you know
what I mean? So you can't begoing back and forth. I think
the premise was talking to theother guys, when you get there
as like, you only want to betouching the tool once. You
(34:41):
can't be you can't be takenalignments. Twist in, put it
down, pick it up, put it down.
It's your when you're done withthat tool is gone.
Zack Hartle (34:49):
You get into that too, and commercial and
residential, you know, you'realways trying to teach your
apprentice you know, you don'twant to go up a ladder down a
ladder up or down a ladder.
Ladder, right? But it's so muchmore fine to And, and on us like
a smaller scale when you're justtalking about a two foot by two
foot board right?
Paul Hannania (35:05):
Completely. And we, we kind of do this with a
panels when when the guys thatnew guys don't show up, it's I
kind of do one slide and nextslide. But otherwise go in one
after another, and then youstrip them all and then you
straighten them all. It's, it'sstep by step, and you do the
whole thing, then you terminateall your grounds, and then your
(35:27):
terminal your neutrals. So it'sdefinitely a, it's a process.
And I like that's, that's kindof why I specialize in panels. I
like the fact that it's aprocess that we can refine, and
then you can get pretty quick atit. So and it's repeatable. And
then another guy can get a glassdoor, and I can teach you that
process. And then he can do thepanels exactly like I do them.
(35:49):
Because I take them we take alot of pride in how it looks as
well as how it functions.
Jason Cox (35:56):
Okay, so getting back to our, our ideal competition
here. Do you have any advice toapprentices or journey persons,
if they'd like to compete inthis competition in the future?
Yeah, definitely.
Paul Hannania (36:09):
I mean, you've got to put some time in on the
qualifiers, if you want to getthere with it. So that's, that's
step one. And then the secondstep, ah, I mean, we're lucky
that the practice is all work,we get, we get to practice as
we're doing it. So I find wherethe mistakes are maybe made on
(36:34):
the last year when I tried toget too fast. And my quality
suffered. So, and I didn't, theydidn't get me as far as I wanted
to, as I thought it might. So Ifeel you've got to be fast, and
you've got to be consistent, andhe's got to be quality. So
realistically to, to ensureyou're going to progress. You
(36:56):
got to be able to do everythingis not just a Speed Competition
anymore. And it's not just aquality competition. It's you've
got to be able to do everything.
So make sure you can bank on toit, because kind of has been
very prevalent in thecompetitions. I mean, wiring, we
should all get a wire, thereshouldn't be too much doubt on
being able to wire basiccircuit, but conduit is, I think
(37:19):
the one that most people gettripped upon, if they can't
bend.
Jason Cox (37:25):
Right. Alright.
Anything else? Zack? No,
Zack Hartle (37:28):
I think that is everything. Paul, anything else
you want to add? Or?
Paul Hannania (37:34):
I think I'm not really I mean, I'm, I'm happy
that ideal have opened it up tothe Canadian competitors again
this year. So just waiting forsome of them events in Calgary
be organized. So I'm lookingforward to that. And hopefully
make it hopefully make it forthe 2020s too.
Zack Hartle (37:51):
Yeah, I know. COVID has thrown a little bit of a
wrench in their system. Butyeah, you do plan to attempt
here to compete again.
Paul Hannania (37:59):
I'd give it a go to get you qualified to go see
what happens. Nice. Awesome.
Zack Hartle (38:04):
Well, thank you so much for joining us today. We
really appreciated having you onthe show and a little bit of
insight into the competition.
Paul Hannania (38:11):
Thank you. It's been great being here. Thank
you.
Zack Hartle (38:14):
And with all that, make sure you check out the
ideal industries website to finda national championship
qualifying event near you. Thisepisode, of course, coming out
middle of September now. And wehave lots of events coming up in
Alberta, Calgary and all overCanada, including battle of the
schools where apprentices willhave the opportunity to compete
(38:36):
at their technical institute. Socheck out the website. We'll
link it down below in thedescription as well. As always,
thank you so much for listeningto Watt's the Word podcast.
Jason and I are thrilled to haveyou here. Make sure you
subscribe wherever you listen topodcasts, Apple, Spotify,
Google, anchor anywhere else toget the latest episodes or you
(38:56):
can check us out on YouTube.
Stay in touch with us on all oursocial media which you will link
down below as well. Thank you somuch. Keep yourself safe out
there and if you can someoneelse to
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