September 27, 2021 • 37 mins
This week instead of having a guest in the show we decided to dig a little deeper into your co-host Jason Cox.
Listen as Zack Hartle asks about his entry into the trade, dual-ticket, education, and career as an Electrical Trades Instructor.
Plus hear some inside looks at how the podcast started, how it's going, and our vision for the future.
Connect with us on Instagram or Facebook - @wattsthewordpodcast
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Zack Hartle (00:00):
Hello, and welcome to this week's episode of Watt's
(00:02):
the Word podcast. We got a veryspecial episode for you today
here on episode number six. Asyou know, the show is all about
connecting with the electricalindustry having relevant
conversations with members fromthroughout the industry, just to
learn a little bit more.
However, you're always herelistening to me and Jason, talk
to guests, I figured today wewould have Jason Cox on, and he
can talk about why he's here onthe show and his background. And
(00:25):
we'll go from there. So I'mreally glad today to be talking
to my co host normally, JasonCox.
Jason Cox (00:35):
Well, thanks for inviting me, Zack, I'm probably
going to smile more in thisepisode than any one we'll ever
do.
Zack Hartle (00:41):
Obviously, Jason, we started this podcast, and
we've got five episodes downalready. And we've had tons of
fun. We've got a lot of goodguests lined up are in the
works. But I want to know alittle bit more about you. And I
think our guests might want toknow a little bit more about
you. And of course, we'll do anepisode where you can ask me
some questions later on. So whydon't you tell me about your
(01:04):
pathway into the trade how yougot into the trade? And we'll
start with that.
Jason Cox (01:10):
All right. So and we say so when we ask the
questions, and I'm starting witha so how I got into the trade. I
like most people my age in theearly 90s. Society was sending
(01:30):
all of us to university when wegraduated from high school. A
lot of times we didn't know whywe were going we that was just a
career path that we weresupposed to follow. And so I had
no idea what to take university.
And so I was really, it reallywas difficult for me to jump on
(01:50):
board and go in that directionand not have an idea of why it
was going so so I took a yearoff, which is very similar to a
lot of people we we've heardfrom and I took a year off
hoping that some some epiphanywould come it never did. I did
end up attending two and a halfyears of Mount Royal College in
(02:12):
Calgary, which is now a MountRoyal University. And I was
working on a degree. However,the trouble I had getting into
university not knowing what Iwas doing, plagued me through
that whole time at Mount Royalto a point where I just I
finally had to tap out and say Ican't do this anymore. I'm I'm
(02:33):
not, I have no desire to behere. So I decided to take a
break from university orcollege. And I knew I had to get
a job. But I thought you knowwhat, why don't I get a job that
has this crazy, our landline isringing? Why don't I get a job
(02:55):
where I can actually, like buildsomething and make more money
than just the bottom end? Entrylevel? Minimum Wage stuff,
right? So so I actually droppedout of university or I like to
say I completed a semester andthen left. So when people say
(03:16):
dropout, kinda always bugs me,but And so eventually I, I
phoned my uncle who is anelectrician, and I said, Hey,
I'm gonna, I'm gonna look atgetting a trade. What do you
think? And like allelectricians, he said, Oh, well,
come see me. And I wasn'tlooking to be an electrician. I
(03:37):
just wanted to talk to a tradesperson. But he said, Well, come
see me. And we'll get you. We'llget you out of the trade real
quick. But it didn't happen. Andhere I am still today. So that's
kind of how I got into thetrade.
Zack Hartle (03:52):
No, and like you say, that's a story we hear from
so many people, right? It'sthey're not quite sure what to
do. So they almost fall intoelectrical stumble into
electrical. And I mean, ofcourse, all of our guests are
still involved in the industry,but it's a good stepping stone
into other paths. So once yougot in, where's that taken you
over you set early 90s. So Imean, not to put a number on it.
(04:15):
But in the last three decades,where has that taken me to?
Jason Cox (04:19):
Well, we're not quite at three decades yet. But so I
kind of stumbled on this in oneof our previous podcasts, and
people probably didn't pick upon it, but I was actually
indentured twice. So I startedmy apprenticeship in British
Columbia. And I worked there formy uncle and he was a single
(04:41):
owner, single employee company.
I was the only ever pardon meemployee with the company. And I
worked for him for about sixmonths in the acute nice and I
enjoyed what I was doing. Butbeing a young adult in the coot
knees it was quite isolated. AndI decided, after a period of
(05:02):
time of doing a lot ofresidential and actually a
little bit of diversity, it wasa beautiful area to live, but I
needed to move back to Alberta.
And, and work in in the Calgaryarea. And so, needless to say,
and actually, to be honest, Ididn't mention this earlier. But
(05:24):
I did initially look at joiningthe union out of, well, when I
first started this thisadventure, my uncle said, I
don't know if when the union CFLput you to work, but there was
no work in Alberta. And so myuncle said, well come out work
for me. So it worked for him forover six months, six or eight
months. I don't really recallhow many months but and then
(05:46):
moved to Alberta. Still no workin Alberta. But I got a job. But
it was in industrial. So Ididn't know what that was. So I
just said sure electricalselectrical, and went and did
some industrial for a year and abit. decided I didn't want to do
that and then spent the bulk ofmy career in electrical, working
(06:10):
for a larger commercial companyin Calgary. So I did that for a
while since I mean, obviously,yeah, that I think that was that
was my last employer before mymy education career took off.
Zack Hartle (06:26):
Nice, very cool.
And I want to get to youreducation career because it's I
don't know, how we met and whyyou're here and along the way,
you got a second ticket, youpicked up your data
communication, wireless,something technician, you tell
us what that is.
Jason Cox (06:45):
So it's very interesting, this multiple
ticket phenomena or whatever wewant to call it now is becoming
very common. You and I both knowseveral people that hold more
than one ticket. So the companyI was working for, had the
opportunity to start trainingapprentices or in or in, so So
(07:08):
was a electrical contractor, butthey also would now have the
ability to train communication,electricians, so I indentured in
that apprenticeship afterreceiving my red seal,
journeyman ticket. I think Iworked as a journeyman for one
year, maybe it was a long timeago, worked as a journeyman for
(07:30):
a year and then looked at thatopportunity to do the data
apprenticeship. And so Iindentured into a program called
the communication electrician,network craft so so that
apprenticeship was split intotwo different sections, the
network craft, and then theconstruction craft. So the
construction craft would beactually mounting the poles and
(07:54):
running the telephone and dataand fiber lines and all the
underground stuff. And I wasmore interested in the
interconnection stuff. So Istarted in that apprenticeship.
And actually, our company couldonly indenture in the network
craft that because we were inthat we were in that skill set.
So I decided to do that likemany other people that we will
(08:15):
probably talk to and have talkedto because you more training
equals more job security. Andone of the things that's lost in
our trade over the last probablydecade is the fact that working
in the trade, especially in theelectrical trade, it wasn't
(08:37):
always a guaranteed thing thatyou would work 40 hours a week,
full time all the year, right.
There was times when I wasalways looking to see what the
next job would be, hey, whereare we going next? What's going
on? What's going on? What'sgoing on? And there were there
were times in my experience inindustrial and commercial where
you'd have to wait a couple ofdays for a job to start up. And
(08:58):
my experience with with ourcompany in Calgary was that the
more skills I had, the longerI'd be working. So that's why I
looked into a secondapprenticeship. That's why I did
it.
Zack Hartle (09:15):
So this electrician communication, network craft
apprenticeship that you did. Isthis still an option? Is this
still a ticket that's availablein Alberta? And do you recommend
that other journeymanelectricians look into it as a
viable second path?
Jason Cox (09:34):
Well, something interesting about that is first
of all, our listeners willunderstand that the electrician
trade in Alberta is a red sealtrade. My second ticket is
actually not a red seal trade,which I find amazing, but it's a
(09:59):
moot point. me because I alreadyhave one red seal. So who cares.
However, that apprenticeshipactually changed while I was in
it. And so initially, it wascalled a communication
electrician in the networkcraft. And then they just
changed that apprenticeship tobe called now a communication
(10:19):
technician. So that changed inthe, in the actual name of the
apprenticeship annoyed a fewpeople because they wanted to be
called a journeyman and whenthat when it finished, and very
similar to Chelsea, in our lastepisode, there was both men and
women that said, I want to becalled a journeyman. I'm a
journeyman. And I agreed withwhat they were with, with what
(10:41):
they were what they were saying.
But I, once again, I wasfortunate because I was already
a red seal electrician. Now, isthat trade still available? When
I indentured in that trade? Theproblem was that that trade was
predominantly for members ofTELUS or members that worked at
AGT. So AGT and TELUS so it wasa TELUS basic, basically, like
(11:04):
there was three of us in ourapprenticeship that were not
tell us employees. And and soNate and st did the training for
that it was a new trainingprogram for sate. And when I
indentured, I had to wait a verylong time to actually get the
schooling in Calgary, there wasjust a delay and in demand, and
(11:28):
there wasn't enough students toput it on in Calgary. So. So to
answer that question, now, isthat apprenticeship still
available? I believe it is. Itis not available. If you would
like to train in Calgary, Ibelieve that training is being
(11:48):
done in Edmonton. But I do notknow if that training is being
done by Nate or if it's beingdone in house by TELUS. So if
people are interested in thattrade, I definitely would talk
to them about it, I would givethem my opinion about it. The
funny thing is that the theoryand the training in the
(12:13):
communication apprenticeship washarder than in the electrical
apprenticeship. So as a personwith two tickets and
communications and in powerelectrician, whatever we call
it, I was an electrician. I wasalways kind of like the go
between, right between, rightthe, the stereotypes of the
(12:35):
electrician and the data guy,right? So I'd always kind of
talk back and forth to bothsides, because many times, you
would be on sites where therewould be a contractor for the
power on the site, and thenanother contractor for the, the
voice and data communication. Soit'd be funny because I one
side, I could be the power guy,the next site, I could be the
(12:58):
data guy. And on some sites, Iwas both and I am proud that I
was the first to ticketjourneyman or the person with
two tickets at my company inCalgary is the first one ever in
their company. So So yeah, talkto me more if you're looking at
communication apprenticeship,and we'd probably both have to
look it up together.
Zack Hartle (13:19):
Nice, very cool. So with that double ticket, and
communications and electricianswhat kind of doors that open for
you in the field.
Jason Cox (13:30):
Well, it's funny, because when we first talked
about in a previous episode, Italked about not wanting to be
the ditch digger. And because Iwas a laborer, and then I wanted
to become the apprentice. Sowe'd get I was too good for
digging the ditch. Right. So Iwas a little naive with that. So
I kind of thought that once Iwas a journeyman electrician now
(13:52):
and now I was the now asindentured in a apprenticeship
and communication now that I'dbe off of all the hard, hard
rough stuff of the, of theelectrician job, right. But it
turned out that no, I wasexploited for both positions. So
So I did run around Alberta, andI ran a bunch of rigid steel
conduit, and I pulled in a lotof fiber. So so that was, that
(14:15):
was kind of a neat experience.
So, I mean, there's not a lot ofdata guys that are running rigid
steel, right. So that was kindof cool. I was lucky over my
years in the trade. I was inresidential, commercial,
industrial, lots of differentexperiences. And yeah, overall,
lots of really neat, neatplaces, neat buildings. I had no
(14:38):
criminal record and I stilldon't so I was able to get some
pretty high security forelectrical installs and went to
some really interestingbuildings and sites in Alberta
running fiber for the Albertagovernment so slow Pretty cool.
(14:58):
So, so did lots of stuff.
Zack Hartle (15:04):
So after all this, these experiences in the field,
you found yourself landed intoan electrical trades instructor
teaching in the apprenticeshipprogram. How did that transition
go? And why did you make theswitch?
Jason Cox (15:20):
Well, if I go back to that time when I was like
blindly entering into MountRoyal, and they said, What do
you want to do for a career, Iwas like, I don't know. I
thought I want to be apolitician. I would like to be a
lawyer, or maybe a teacher. So Istarted a degree in Canadian
(15:42):
history, but way back then,right. So then I kind of threw
all that away, and did theapprenticeship. And like Chelsea
said in the last episode, when Igot to secondary training or
technical training here inCalgary, technical training for
me was great. I was invested inthe program. I liked learning.
(16:05):
And I enjoyed it, and I wassuccessful. And so I, so school
was a very positive experiencefor me. And I worked in a cohort
with about, oh, five or sixother apprentices. We did all of
our apprenticeship together. Sowe we work together, we learn
together, we taught each otherstuff. And then also, over the
(16:27):
apprenticeship, I spent a lot oftime learning from people from
my, from my journeyman and fromother apprentices. And then of
course, I was starting to alsoteach other people. So I enjoy
teaching people, I enjoyedseeing them be successful. I had
a positive experience. When Iwent to sate for the electrical,
I had a very positive experiencewhen I went to Sage and Nate for
(16:51):
the communicationapprenticeship. And I was very
fortunate that at the time, myteaching opportunity became
available in Calgary. There wasalready a handful of people that
I'd worked with in the tradethat we're now teaching
electrical apprenticeship. Soand they they continually
(17:14):
through the years encouraged meto come and try and become an
apprenticeship instructor. Andso I just, I, the opportunity
was there. And ironically, twoof my former apprentices had
also applied for the sameposition. That year, we hired 10
Plus instructors. So, so I wasactually hired with two of my
(17:38):
former apprentices. And that was15 years ago. So I've been
teaching for 15 years. And, andyou know what, it's lots of fun.
So in the trades, there was alot of hard work, and some fun
days, but with my teaching jobnow, it's we try and have fun
(18:00):
every day.
Zack Hartle (18:02):
That's very cool that you've been, like, you
know, in that role now for 15years, seeing as things have
changed over the years, I mean,COVID aside the last 18 months
aside, I'm sure there's been aton of change in that education
field for apprenticeships, whathave you seen changed? For
apprentices coming to school?
What's the experience like forthem? How's it different? Now
(18:24):
from 10 years ago,
Jason Cox (18:28):
I probably look at it more from the perspective of how
is it different now than when Iwas an apprentice, because you
kind of remember that stuffversus 10 years ago today. But
So back when I was anapprentice, we didn't have the
ILM. So basically, it was somenote packs pre manufactured by
(18:49):
the instructors, and intextbooks. And so now now today,
the ILM frameworks in place,which what are the ILM? So I
believe those are calledindependent learning modules.
And so for each year of theapprenticeship, there's
different subjects as you know,and like code would have a, a
(19:13):
module on section 10 forgrounding and bonding. So back
in the day, we probably wrotemore notes. But now today, the
students have those reads thosepaper resources in front of
them. We also back in the day tohave very limited or archaic
computer systems to do onlinequizzes. That of course, is
(19:35):
changed over the last monthsince I started in the trade.
And now of course, students cannow do their online quizzes and
some of their online assignmentson their phones. So So the big
thing that's changed since Istarted working in the education
field and where we are today isof course technology. When I
(19:55):
first started, if you could getcolor overheads for your Last
night, you were like, you weregiving the primo presentation.
Whereas now, I mean,everything's done. I mean, now
we have the internet and on.
That's another thing too, when Idid my apprenticeship, we did
not have the internet. So now asan instructor with the internet,
(20:17):
you can there's so manyresources online, to help you
supplement your information andto help the students. So yeah,
so technology has changed somuch. And then obviously now,
using products like zoom andMicrosoft Office, we're able to
still present the coursematerial to the students
(20:38):
virtually,
Zack Hartle (20:40):
yes, and there's definitely been no quicker pace
of change and technology thanwhat we've actually seen in the
last 20 months since the startof the pandemic. So to hear
about everything going online,and what students are going
through now, I think is a it'ssuch a cool tool and a learning
experience for the students aswell to learn in a different
environment and learn some extrazoom and Microsoft Office,
(21:02):
right, it's just another skillset that those students can even
add to their bag of tricks thatthey have right when they're out
in the workforce looking.
Unknown (21:12):
What I want to know is you you came
Zack Hartle (21:14):
in and became an instructor you've been there 15
years you sound passionate aboutit, you sound like you like it,
how have you kept that passiongoing? And what makes it? What
makes it the right job for you?
And what have you done to keepup your teaching skills over the
years?
Jason Cox (21:30):
Well, I'm having fun.
So that's, that's a big thing,too, right? We've all been in
positions where we've had jobsthat we didn't like our jobs,
right? So. So until somebodypays me to be a recreational
golfer, right, I mean, I I'mhaving fun teaching now. I'm
very fortunate to because I'veworked with a lot of really good
people. And I have a few, a fewcolleagues that that kind of
(21:56):
were at the front of the line,and were ahead of me and paving,
paving some new directions. Andso teaching at the very
beginning, I mean, you're justtrying to survive and and, and
be successful for your students.
So you're, you're you're pullingout your hair freaking out
thinking that you have to knoweverything, right? When, when
(22:19):
really a lot of education andlearning happens collaboratively
with everyone. So you don't.
When I first started out, Iprobably thought I needed to
know all the answers. But Imean, now I realized that it's
there's it's okay to learn withwith your class and learn
together. I mean, obviously, youshould have an understanding of
what you're doing, right. Butover the years, I I also wanted
(22:40):
to make sure that I was not justan electrician that was that was
teaching ILM because I wanted toactually improve my own skill
set. So I enrolled in aprovincial instructor diploma
program, through VancouverCommunity College, and kind of
learn some of the foundationsabout teaching. And it was very
(23:04):
helpful for us to build materialthat was valid, right? So
everyone's told stories in theirlife about that multiple choice
exam where all the answers wereseized, and you change one
answer because you thought thiscan't be right. So so I did the
the provincial instructordiploma to make sure that what I
(23:25):
was doing was valid, I wanted tomake sure I was doing the right
job. So I did that. And it wasvery beneficial. I really
enjoyed it was very fortunatethat all my courses in that
program were in person, Irealized that that's changed a
little bit now. And now it's alot more online as everything's
online. And then a few yearslater, my colleagues started
(23:48):
master's programs and at thetime, I just giggled, I thought
there's no way I'd ever look atdoing a master's degree. And,
and so I watched a fewcolleagues go through and do
that. And it was nice, because Isaw people that I'd worked with
(24:09):
for years and, and I gave me theconfidence that if they could do
a master's degree, I could so soI did, within the last five
years complete a master's degreein adult education. And that was
really good for me because oneof the things I've discovered
through my experience over thelast 25 years is how society
(24:32):
looks at trades people and howsociety looks at people with
degrees. So now I'm a tradesperson with a degree so and, and
I think that that's been prettybeneficial for myself, and I'm
hoping that it's been beneficialfor my students.
Zack Hartle (24:54):
Yeah, and hopefully that's something that the
industry as a whole can addressis that you know, stay Come on
towards tradespeople, right. Imean, I think everyone in the
trade can think back to a timein your in your work clothes and
you get on an elevator and abuilding downtown. And I don't
know there's just that almoststigma associated with it. So I
think trying to drive theindustry away from that is
(25:15):
obviously beneficial foreveryone involved.
Jason Cox (25:19):
Yeah, and that stigma exists and I'm guilty of it as
well. Where I went to highschool we had a it was called
trades and services back in theday. vocational learning where
you could have learned aboutwoodworking, automotives
welding. And I mean, like Isaid, I was I was brought up in
a society where we were expectedto go to university. So we just
(25:40):
scoff at the students that wouldgo down to the automotive wing
and work on cars and come backto social studies with their
fingers all covered in oil,frickin Neanderthal or whatever,
right? And I mean, we're justyoung kids stupid. We didn't
know what was going on. So itwas interesting. I was thinking
about that this morning. Thatwas the first time I was like, I
(26:01):
was guilty of the stigma. Andwhen I decided to do an
apprenticeship, I didn't look atmyself as a university dropout.
Like I, I had made a decisionthat I was going to leave
university and I needed toobviously needed to take care of
myself. And so when I enteredthe trades, I did run into the
stigma that you're talking aboutwhen I I worked in, in buildings
(26:24):
where you were a second classcitizen, because you had drywall
dust or, or something on you,right? I mean, there was times
where we're occupants ofbuildings looked at you as like
a tool, they throw in a broomcloset. And then there was other
people that you work with, too,that were just delighted that
you were there to help them so.
So kind of turning that allaround. It was very interesting.
(26:45):
i The stigma, stigma is huge.
And I was guilty of thinkingabout thinking down about people
back when I was in high schoolthat were taking automotives.
And I mean, they were the onesthat can change the oil in their
car. And I mean, they're theones now that laugh at everyone
that spends 150 bucks to gettheir oil changes in their car.
(27:09):
But then, when I got into thetrade, yet, the rate the tables
were turned in now I was the theNeanderthal trades person,
right? And then I was and it wasone of those things where it's
like, oh, well, you're auniversity dropout. And it
always kind of bothered me, andand so for my own self
(27:30):
gratification, I was very happy.
And I'm very proud that I wasable to, to get a university
degree. And I mean, it's amaster's degree. And it was, it
was two years of hell. But I'mvery proud that I got it. And in
that program, one of thequestions you asked is, like,
what are you doing for yourstudents? Well, the program I
was in was a research basedcourse. And the final project I
(27:54):
had in the program, it was afinal term paper that I worked
on for months. It's kind of likea capstone project if people are
familiar with that term, but itwas a it wasn't a paper that was
publishable. I just chose not topublish but and so the term for
my paper was what are thebarriers impeding academic
(28:15):
success for our electricalapprentices. And so I did a huge
research project on that, andthe project narrows in on
electricians or in theelectrical apprentices. Because
of the scope of the project,they were concerned that our
apprentices in general was toovast, and I need needed to
narrow it out. However, when Ilook at the barriers to academic
(28:39):
success, stigmas on their lackof mentoring, funding, numeracy
and literacy, so problems withreading and writing, and
problems with math, problemswith job security, problems with
time management, and then theother huge one is learning
disabilities. So learningdisabilities are obviously
(29:00):
throughout all of society. Butthe numbers of students with
learning disabilities in thetrades is massive. So going
through and doing all thatresearch, validated a lot of the
problems I'd run into as aninstructor, and it gave me more
information about why mystudents weren't succeeding. So
(29:21):
my concern for students is Iwant them to succeed. I want
them to be successful, and Iwant them to be satisfied. And a
lot of times I have to tellthem, Look, I want you to be
satisfied. Realize that I don'tmake the curriculum, right.
However, I want you to besatisfied that we were able to
get through the curriculumtogether.
Zack Hartle (29:45):
Now that's very interesting. And I think, I
mean, obviously that programsgiven you a broader view on
adult education and then to beable to do that Capstone and
narrow in very specifically toyour day to day job. office. I
don't know, such a cool learningexperience. And I, you're
obviously a lifelong learner asI am myself. And I think just
(30:08):
keeping that going is how youcan still keep progressing in
the trade right even after 15years in the same job, right? So
Jason Cox (30:17):
yeah, absolutely.
Yeah. It's, it's, it's lifelonglearning is not a catchphrase.
It's a reality.
Zack Hartle (30:24):
Jason that now brings us to the podcast. It's
your most recent endeavor. Westarted this we this is episode
six. So 12 weeks ago ish. Now.
Why are you here? Why are wemaking this podcast together?
Jason Cox (30:41):
Well, Zack, why don't you tell me why I am here.
Zack Hartle (30:45):
I think you're doing the podcast because I
convinced you to do the podcast,because I knew that you would
like it. And Was I right? Or wasI wrong?
Jason Cox (30:54):
I'm actually really enjoying it. And unfortunately,
I figured out my career pathwhen I turned about 40, which
was a little while ago. And atthat point in time of my life,
I've always been interested inbroadcasting. And I wasn't about
to drop my career and start thismission of starting in
broadcasting. So. So that waspart of the reason I did it. And
(31:18):
I'm really having lots of fun.
And I'm learning lots of stuff,actually, from you. And yeah,
it's been lots of fun. I've, ofcourse, I've got other bigger
answers on why I want to do thepodcast if you want to know
about that, too. Yeah, I
Zack Hartle (31:31):
think that I mean, you're doing it because I pulled
your teeth to get you to agreeto do three pilot episodes. And
I mean, It's tons of fun. Soyeah, why why are we keeping
going with the podcast?
Jason Cox (31:47):
Yeah, it was really funny when I when I think when
we had our conversation, and Isaid I'll do three. And then
we'll, we'll re convene and talkabout it. And we didn't even I
think the third episode that wedid was like we were comfortable
with what we were doing by that.
The reason another reason, Imean, obviously, I want to have
fun, what you said earlier,like, this is fun. But what you
(32:09):
said earlier is totally true.
It's all about lifelonglearning. And so we have the
opportunity to learn a lot aboutour trade in this podcast. And
we have the opportunity to helpothers in our trade, learn more
about our trade. And so that'sexciting. And I've learned a lot
(32:34):
so far.
Zack Hartle (32:35):
What's the most interesting thing that you've
learned so far?
Jason Cox (32:41):
The most interesting thing I've learned so far. Well,
two things. First of all, whenJohn Knoll talked to us about
the symptoms from receiving a,an electrical shock, there were
symptoms there. And results,injuries that I was not aware
(33:06):
of. And so that has beenprobably the most important
thing I've learned through ourpodcast is that we should 100%
Minimize electrical shock. Ialso through through my
experience of going intograduate school and reading
(33:27):
academic papers, I did read someon the effects of shock from
John and then I found someonline and, and yeah, we
definitely need to be careful,we need to be wearing the proper
PPE and then following this theright rule. So so that was
really important so far, andbeen very happy. So far, we've
(33:48):
had two, two guests that I'veknown for a very long time in
the industry. And they were boththey're both on our show. And I
was just so impressed by theirprofessionalism, so, so learning
about shocking and seeing theprofessionalism of people I've
worked with, from the beginningof their career to present day
(34:11):
has been very satisfying.
Zack Hartle (34:13):
I couldn't agree more that we've learned cool
stuff from all of our guests. Imean, the episode with John
Knoll that you're talking aboutis episode number three,
definitely worth checking out ifyou haven't listened yet. And
then, I guess, where do you seeus going? Where do you want to
take this podcast and what doyou want to get out of it?
Jason Cox (34:32):
Well, I'm very impressed with the feedback
we're getting from people. Ithink we're very hard on her.
Everyone's very hard onthemselves. And, and so to get
the positive feedback frompeople has been recharging. It's
really it's really helped. Iwould really like to have
(34:53):
members or listeners contact usand say hey, why don't you do an
episode? On this or why haven'tyou done an episode on that? So
suggestions for topics? orspecial guests? Yeah, like so.
So that's what I'd like to seemoving forward. I mean, as we've
(35:14):
started here, Zach, I mean,we've kind of just mined through
some of the people that we know.
And some of it has, has led toother other guests. But yeah, so
So yeah, more. More, morefeedback from listeners would be
great.
Zack Hartle (35:32):
Yeah, engaging with the electrical community, I
agree would be excellent. Andobviously, for everyone
listening, you can reach out tous on Facebook, at Watt's the
Word podcast, join our pagethere, like our page, you can
send us a message reach out tous if you have any suggestions,
like Jason says, we would loveto hear from you. Other than
(35:56):
that, Jason, I mean, I justwanted to chat with you today
about that, like you're gonna dowith me one day, um, anything
else you'd like to add? Or ifnot, then where can people reach
out to you if they want to chatwith you some more.
Jason Cox (36:10):
They can find me on LinkedIn. It's pretty easy. Just
Jason Cox, LinkedIn. I mean,Calgary electrician, I think is
my title. I think you can findme through there as you know,
Zack Zack smiling here becausewhen it comes to the technical
and the Instagram and theTwitter and the Facebook, all
the social media, all the techstuff, Zach is our he's our
(36:31):
expert on that. And I'm sure ifyou've listened to a few of our
episodes, it's very obvious.
Zack Hartle (36:37):
Thank you everybody for coming and listening today.
I had had a great time chattingwith you, Jason. And even though
we've been you know, friends foryears and talking together for
12 weeks now on the show, I evenlearned quite a bit from you
tonight more system about howyou got to where you are. We
never really discussed yourapprenticeship or anything up
until we met. So it's great tohear that. Everyone who's
(37:00):
listening. Please make sure yousubscribe to the show. So you
get your automatic downloadsevery second Monday when they
come out. Like I mentioned,reach out to us on Facebook or
Instagram at Watt's the Wordpodcast. Yeah, we'd love to hear
from you. We'd love to have yousubscribe, share it with a
friend who you think might beinteresting. And keep yourself
(37:21):
safe out there. And if you cansomeone else too.
Hello, and welcome to this week's episode of Watt's
(00:02):
the Word podcast. We got a veryspecial episode for you today
here on episode number six. Asyou know, the show is all about
connecting with the electricalindustry having relevant
conversations with members fromthroughout the industry, just to
learn a little bit more.
However, you're always herelistening to me and Jason, talk
to guests, I figured today wewould have Jason Cox on, and he
can talk about why he's here onthe show and his background. And
(00:25):
we'll go from there. So I'mreally glad today to be talking
to my co host normally, JasonCox.
Jason Cox (00:35):
Well, thanks for inviting me, Zack, I'm probably
going to smile more in thisepisode than any one we'll ever
do.
Zack Hartle (00:41):
Obviously, Jason, we started this podcast, and
we've got five episodes downalready. And we've had tons of
fun. We've got a lot of goodguests lined up are in the
works. But I want to know alittle bit more about you. And I
think our guests might want toknow a little bit more about
you. And of course, we'll do anepisode where you can ask me
some questions later on. So whydon't you tell me about your
(01:04):
pathway into the trade how yougot into the trade? And we'll
start with that.
Jason Cox (01:10):
All right. So and we say so when we ask the
questions, and I'm starting witha so how I got into the trade. I
like most people my age in theearly 90s. Society was sending
(01:30):
all of us to university when wegraduated from high school. A
lot of times we didn't know whywe were going we that was just a
career path that we weresupposed to follow. And so I had
no idea what to take university.
And so I was really, it reallywas difficult for me to jump on
(01:50):
board and go in that directionand not have an idea of why it
was going so so I took a yearoff, which is very similar to a
lot of people we we've heardfrom and I took a year off
hoping that some some epiphanywould come it never did. I did
end up attending two and a halfyears of Mount Royal College in
(02:12):
Calgary, which is now a MountRoyal University. And I was
working on a degree. However,the trouble I had getting into
university not knowing what Iwas doing, plagued me through
that whole time at Mount Royalto a point where I just I
finally had to tap out and say Ican't do this anymore. I'm I'm
(02:33):
not, I have no desire to behere. So I decided to take a
break from university orcollege. And I knew I had to get
a job. But I thought you knowwhat, why don't I get a job that
has this crazy, our landline isringing? Why don't I get a job
(02:55):
where I can actually, like buildsomething and make more money
than just the bottom end? Entrylevel? Minimum Wage stuff,
right? So so I actually droppedout of university or I like to
say I completed a semester andthen left. So when people say
(03:16):
dropout, kinda always bugs me,but And so eventually I, I
phoned my uncle who is anelectrician, and I said, Hey,
I'm gonna, I'm gonna look atgetting a trade. What do you
think? And like allelectricians, he said, Oh, well,
come see me. And I wasn'tlooking to be an electrician. I
(03:37):
just wanted to talk to a tradesperson. But he said, Well, come
see me. And we'll get you. We'llget you out of the trade real
quick. But it didn't happen. Andhere I am still today. So that's
kind of how I got into thetrade.
Zack Hartle (03:52):
No, and like you say, that's a story we hear from
so many people, right? It'sthey're not quite sure what to
do. So they almost fall intoelectrical stumble into
electrical. And I mean, ofcourse, all of our guests are
still involved in the industry,but it's a good stepping stone
into other paths. So once yougot in, where's that taken you
over you set early 90s. So Imean, not to put a number on it.
(04:15):
But in the last three decades,where has that taken me to?
Jason Cox (04:19):
Well, we're not quite at three decades yet. But so I
kind of stumbled on this in oneof our previous podcasts, and
people probably didn't pick upon it, but I was actually
indentured twice. So I startedmy apprenticeship in British
Columbia. And I worked there formy uncle and he was a single
(04:41):
owner, single employee company.
I was the only ever pardon meemployee with the company. And I
worked for him for about sixmonths in the acute nice and I
enjoyed what I was doing. Butbeing a young adult in the coot
knees it was quite isolated. AndI decided, after a period of
(05:02):
time of doing a lot ofresidential and actually a
little bit of diversity, it wasa beautiful area to live, but I
needed to move back to Alberta.
And, and work in in the Calgaryarea. And so, needless to say,
and actually, to be honest, Ididn't mention this earlier. But
(05:24):
I did initially look at joiningthe union out of, well, when I
first started this thisadventure, my uncle said, I
don't know if when the union CFLput you to work, but there was
no work in Alberta. And so myuncle said, well come out work
for me. So it worked for him forover six months, six or eight
months. I don't really recallhow many months but and then
(05:46):
moved to Alberta. Still no workin Alberta. But I got a job. But
it was in industrial. So Ididn't know what that was. So I
just said sure electricalselectrical, and went and did
some industrial for a year and abit. decided I didn't want to do
that and then spent the bulk ofmy career in electrical, working
(06:10):
for a larger commercial companyin Calgary. So I did that for a
while since I mean, obviously,yeah, that I think that was that
was my last employer before mymy education career took off.
Zack Hartle (06:26):
Nice, very cool.
And I want to get to youreducation career because it's I
don't know, how we met and whyyou're here and along the way,
you got a second ticket, youpicked up your data
communication, wireless,something technician, you tell
us what that is.
Jason Cox (06:45):
So it's very interesting, this multiple
ticket phenomena or whatever wewant to call it now is becoming
very common. You and I both knowseveral people that hold more
than one ticket. So the companyI was working for, had the
opportunity to start trainingapprentices or in or in, so So
(07:08):
was a electrical contractor, butthey also would now have the
ability to train communication,electricians, so I indentured in
that apprenticeship afterreceiving my red seal,
journeyman ticket. I think Iworked as a journeyman for one
year, maybe it was a long timeago, worked as a journeyman for
(07:30):
a year and then looked at thatopportunity to do the data
apprenticeship. And so Iindentured into a program called
the communication electrician,network craft so so that
apprenticeship was split intotwo different sections, the
network craft, and then theconstruction craft. So the
construction craft would beactually mounting the poles and
(07:54):
running the telephone and dataand fiber lines and all the
underground stuff. And I wasmore interested in the
interconnection stuff. So Istarted in that apprenticeship.
And actually, our company couldonly indenture in the network
craft that because we were inthat we were in that skill set.
So I decided to do that likemany other people that we will
(08:15):
probably talk to and have talkedto because you more training
equals more job security. Andone of the things that's lost in
our trade over the last probablydecade is the fact that working
in the trade, especially in theelectrical trade, it wasn't
(08:37):
always a guaranteed thing thatyou would work 40 hours a week,
full time all the year, right.
There was times when I wasalways looking to see what the
next job would be, hey, whereare we going next? What's going
on? What's going on? What'sgoing on? And there were there
were times in my experience inindustrial and commercial where
you'd have to wait a couple ofdays for a job to start up. And
(08:58):
my experience with with ourcompany in Calgary was that the
more skills I had, the longerI'd be working. So that's why I
looked into a secondapprenticeship. That's why I did
it.
Zack Hartle (09:15):
So this electrician communication, network craft
apprenticeship that you did. Isthis still an option? Is this
still a ticket that's availablein Alberta? And do you recommend
that other journeymanelectricians look into it as a
viable second path?
Jason Cox (09:34):
Well, something interesting about that is first
of all, our listeners willunderstand that the electrician
trade in Alberta is a red sealtrade. My second ticket is
actually not a red seal trade,which I find amazing, but it's a
(09:59):
moot point. me because I alreadyhave one red seal. So who cares.
However, that apprenticeshipactually changed while I was in
it. And so initially, it wascalled a communication
electrician in the networkcraft. And then they just
changed that apprenticeship tobe called now a communication
(10:19):
technician. So that changed inthe, in the actual name of the
apprenticeship annoyed a fewpeople because they wanted to be
called a journeyman and whenthat when it finished, and very
similar to Chelsea, in our lastepisode, there was both men and
women that said, I want to becalled a journeyman. I'm a
journeyman. And I agreed withwhat they were with, with what
(10:41):
they were what they were saying.
But I, once again, I wasfortunate because I was already
a red seal electrician. Now, isthat trade still available? When
I indentured in that trade? Theproblem was that that trade was
predominantly for members ofTELUS or members that worked at
AGT. So AGT and TELUS so it wasa TELUS basic, basically, like
(11:04):
there was three of us in ourapprenticeship that were not
tell us employees. And and soNate and st did the training for
that it was a new trainingprogram for sate. And when I
indentured, I had to wait a verylong time to actually get the
schooling in Calgary, there wasjust a delay and in demand, and
(11:28):
there wasn't enough students toput it on in Calgary. So. So to
answer that question, now, isthat apprenticeship still
available? I believe it is. Itis not available. If you would
like to train in Calgary, Ibelieve that training is being
(11:48):
done in Edmonton. But I do notknow if that training is being
done by Nate or if it's beingdone in house by TELUS. So if
people are interested in thattrade, I definitely would talk
to them about it, I would givethem my opinion about it. The
funny thing is that the theoryand the training in the
(12:13):
communication apprenticeship washarder than in the electrical
apprenticeship. So as a personwith two tickets and
communications and in powerelectrician, whatever we call
it, I was an electrician. I wasalways kind of like the go
between, right between, rightthe, the stereotypes of the
(12:35):
electrician and the data guy,right? So I'd always kind of
talk back and forth to bothsides, because many times, you
would be on sites where therewould be a contractor for the
power on the site, and thenanother contractor for the, the
voice and data communication. Soit'd be funny because I one
side, I could be the power guy,the next site, I could be the
(12:58):
data guy. And on some sites, Iwas both and I am proud that I
was the first to ticketjourneyman or the person with
two tickets at my company inCalgary is the first one ever in
their company. So So yeah, talkto me more if you're looking at
communication apprenticeship,and we'd probably both have to
look it up together.
Zack Hartle (13:19):
Nice, very cool. So with that double ticket, and
communications and electricianswhat kind of doors that open for
you in the field.
Jason Cox (13:30):
Well, it's funny, because when we first talked
about in a previous episode, Italked about not wanting to be
the ditch digger. And because Iwas a laborer, and then I wanted
to become the apprentice. Sowe'd get I was too good for
digging the ditch. Right. So Iwas a little naive with that. So
I kind of thought that once Iwas a journeyman electrician now
(13:52):
and now I was the now asindentured in a apprenticeship
and communication now that I'dbe off of all the hard, hard
rough stuff of the, of theelectrician job, right. But it
turned out that no, I wasexploited for both positions. So
So I did run around Alberta, andI ran a bunch of rigid steel
conduit, and I pulled in a lotof fiber. So so that was, that
(14:15):
was kind of a neat experience.
So, I mean, there's not a lot ofdata guys that are running rigid
steel, right. So that was kindof cool. I was lucky over my
years in the trade. I was inresidential, commercial,
industrial, lots of differentexperiences. And yeah, overall,
lots of really neat, neatplaces, neat buildings. I had no
(14:38):
criminal record and I stilldon't so I was able to get some
pretty high security forelectrical installs and went to
some really interestingbuildings and sites in Alberta
running fiber for the Albertagovernment so slow Pretty cool.
(14:58):
So, so did lots of stuff.
Zack Hartle (15:04):
So after all this, these experiences in the field,
you found yourself landed intoan electrical trades instructor
teaching in the apprenticeshipprogram. How did that transition
go? And why did you make theswitch?
Jason Cox (15:20):
Well, if I go back to that time when I was like
blindly entering into MountRoyal, and they said, What do
you want to do for a career, Iwas like, I don't know. I
thought I want to be apolitician. I would like to be a
lawyer, or maybe a teacher. So Istarted a degree in Canadian
(15:42):
history, but way back then,right. So then I kind of threw
all that away, and did theapprenticeship. And like Chelsea
said in the last episode, when Igot to secondary training or
technical training here inCalgary, technical training for
me was great. I was invested inthe program. I liked learning.
(16:05):
And I enjoyed it, and I wassuccessful. And so I, so school
was a very positive experiencefor me. And I worked in a cohort
with about, oh, five or sixother apprentices. We did all of
our apprenticeship together. Sowe we work together, we learn
together, we taught each otherstuff. And then also, over the
(16:27):
apprenticeship, I spent a lot oftime learning from people from
my, from my journeyman and fromother apprentices. And then of
course, I was starting to alsoteach other people. So I enjoy
teaching people, I enjoyedseeing them be successful. I had
a positive experience. When Iwent to sate for the electrical,
I had a very positive experiencewhen I went to Sage and Nate for
(16:51):
the communicationapprenticeship. And I was very
fortunate that at the time, myteaching opportunity became
available in Calgary. There wasalready a handful of people that
I'd worked with in the tradethat we're now teaching
electrical apprenticeship. Soand they they continually
(17:14):
through the years encouraged meto come and try and become an
apprenticeship instructor. Andso I just, I, the opportunity
was there. And ironically, twoof my former apprentices had
also applied for the sameposition. That year, we hired 10
Plus instructors. So, so I wasactually hired with two of my
(17:38):
former apprentices. And that was15 years ago. So I've been
teaching for 15 years. And, andyou know what, it's lots of fun.
So in the trades, there was alot of hard work, and some fun
days, but with my teaching jobnow, it's we try and have fun
(18:00):
every day.
Zack Hartle (18:02):
That's very cool that you've been, like, you
know, in that role now for 15years, seeing as things have
changed over the years, I mean,COVID aside the last 18 months
aside, I'm sure there's been aton of change in that education
field for apprenticeships, whathave you seen changed? For
apprentices coming to school?
What's the experience like forthem? How's it different? Now
(18:24):
from 10 years ago,
Jason Cox (18:28):
I probably look at it more from the perspective of how
is it different now than when Iwas an apprentice, because you
kind of remember that stuffversus 10 years ago today. But
So back when I was anapprentice, we didn't have the
ILM. So basically, it was somenote packs pre manufactured by
(18:49):
the instructors, and intextbooks. And so now now today,
the ILM frameworks in place,which what are the ILM? So I
believe those are calledindependent learning modules.
And so for each year of theapprenticeship, there's
different subjects as you know,and like code would have a, a
(19:13):
module on section 10 forgrounding and bonding. So back
in the day, we probably wrotemore notes. But now today, the
students have those reads thosepaper resources in front of
them. We also back in the day tohave very limited or archaic
computer systems to do onlinequizzes. That of course, is
(19:35):
changed over the last monthsince I started in the trade.
And now of course, students cannow do their online quizzes and
some of their online assignmentson their phones. So So the big
thing that's changed since Istarted working in the education
field and where we are today isof course technology. When I
(19:55):
first started, if you could getcolor overheads for your Last
night, you were like, you weregiving the primo presentation.
Whereas now, I mean,everything's done. I mean, now
we have the internet and on.
That's another thing too, when Idid my apprenticeship, we did
not have the internet. So now asan instructor with the internet,
(20:17):
you can there's so manyresources online, to help you
supplement your information andto help the students. So yeah,
so technology has changed somuch. And then obviously now,
using products like zoom andMicrosoft Office, we're able to
still present the coursematerial to the students
(20:38):
virtually,
Zack Hartle (20:40):
yes, and there's definitely been no quicker pace
of change and technology thanwhat we've actually seen in the
last 20 months since the startof the pandemic. So to hear
about everything going online,and what students are going
through now, I think is a it'ssuch a cool tool and a learning
experience for the students aswell to learn in a different
environment and learn some extrazoom and Microsoft Office,
(21:02):
right, it's just another skillset that those students can even
add to their bag of tricks thatthey have right when they're out
in the workforce looking.
Unknown (21:12):
What I want to know is you you came
Zack Hartle (21:14):
in and became an instructor you've been there 15
years you sound passionate aboutit, you sound like you like it,
how have you kept that passiongoing? And what makes it? What
makes it the right job for you?
And what have you done to keepup your teaching skills over the
years?
Jason Cox (21:30):
Well, I'm having fun.
So that's, that's a big thing,too, right? We've all been in
positions where we've had jobsthat we didn't like our jobs,
right? So. So until somebodypays me to be a recreational
golfer, right, I mean, I I'mhaving fun teaching now. I'm
very fortunate to because I'veworked with a lot of really good
people. And I have a few, a fewcolleagues that that kind of
(21:56):
were at the front of the line,and were ahead of me and paving,
paving some new directions. Andso teaching at the very
beginning, I mean, you're justtrying to survive and and, and
be successful for your students.
So you're, you're you're pullingout your hair freaking out
thinking that you have to knoweverything, right? When, when
(22:19):
really a lot of education andlearning happens collaboratively
with everyone. So you don't.
When I first started out, Iprobably thought I needed to
know all the answers. But Imean, now I realized that it's
there's it's okay to learn withwith your class and learn
together. I mean, obviously, youshould have an understanding of
what you're doing, right. Butover the years, I I also wanted
(22:40):
to make sure that I was not justan electrician that was that was
teaching ILM because I wanted toactually improve my own skill
set. So I enrolled in aprovincial instructor diploma
program, through VancouverCommunity College, and kind of
learn some of the foundationsabout teaching. And it was very
(23:04):
helpful for us to build materialthat was valid, right? So
everyone's told stories in theirlife about that multiple choice
exam where all the answers wereseized, and you change one
answer because you thought thiscan't be right. So so I did the
the provincial instructordiploma to make sure that what I
(23:25):
was doing was valid, I wanted tomake sure I was doing the right
job. So I did that. And it wasvery beneficial. I really
enjoyed it was very fortunatethat all my courses in that
program were in person, Irealized that that's changed a
little bit now. And now it's alot more online as everything's
online. And then a few yearslater, my colleagues started
(23:48):
master's programs and at thetime, I just giggled, I thought
there's no way I'd ever look atdoing a master's degree. And,
and so I watched a fewcolleagues go through and do
that. And it was nice, because Isaw people that I'd worked with
(24:09):
for years and, and I gave me theconfidence that if they could do
a master's degree, I could so soI did, within the last five
years complete a master's degreein adult education. And that was
really good for me because oneof the things I've discovered
through my experience over thelast 25 years is how society
(24:32):
looks at trades people and howsociety looks at people with
degrees. So now I'm a tradesperson with a degree so and, and
I think that that's been prettybeneficial for myself, and I'm
hoping that it's been beneficialfor my students.
Zack Hartle (24:54):
Yeah, and hopefully that's something that the
industry as a whole can addressis that you know, stay Come on
towards tradespeople, right. Imean, I think everyone in the
trade can think back to a timein your in your work clothes and
you get on an elevator and abuilding downtown. And I don't
know there's just that almoststigma associated with it. So I
think trying to drive theindustry away from that is
(25:15):
obviously beneficial foreveryone involved.
Jason Cox (25:19):
Yeah, and that stigma exists and I'm guilty of it as
well. Where I went to highschool we had a it was called
trades and services back in theday. vocational learning where
you could have learned aboutwoodworking, automotives
welding. And I mean, like Isaid, I was I was brought up in
a society where we were expectedto go to university. So we just
(25:40):
scoff at the students that wouldgo down to the automotive wing
and work on cars and come backto social studies with their
fingers all covered in oil,frickin Neanderthal or whatever,
right? And I mean, we're justyoung kids stupid. We didn't
know what was going on. So itwas interesting. I was thinking
about that this morning. Thatwas the first time I was like, I
(26:01):
was guilty of the stigma. Andwhen I decided to do an
apprenticeship, I didn't look atmyself as a university dropout.
Like I, I had made a decisionthat I was going to leave
university and I needed toobviously needed to take care of
myself. And so when I enteredthe trades, I did run into the
stigma that you're talking aboutwhen I I worked in, in buildings
(26:24):
where you were a second classcitizen, because you had drywall
dust or, or something on you,right? I mean, there was times
where we're occupants ofbuildings looked at you as like
a tool, they throw in a broomcloset. And then there was other
people that you work with, too,that were just delighted that
you were there to help them so.
So kind of turning that allaround. It was very interesting.
(26:45):
i The stigma, stigma is huge.
And I was guilty of thinkingabout thinking down about people
back when I was in high schoolthat were taking automotives.
And I mean, they were the onesthat can change the oil in their
car. And I mean, they're theones now that laugh at everyone
that spends 150 bucks to gettheir oil changes in their car.
(27:09):
But then, when I got into thetrade, yet, the rate the tables
were turned in now I was the theNeanderthal trades person,
right? And then I was and it wasone of those things where it's
like, oh, well, you're auniversity dropout. And it
always kind of bothered me, andand so for my own self
(27:30):
gratification, I was very happy.
And I'm very proud that I wasable to, to get a university
degree. And I mean, it's amaster's degree. And it was, it
was two years of hell. But I'mvery proud that I got it. And in
that program, one of thequestions you asked is, like,
what are you doing for yourstudents? Well, the program I
was in was a research basedcourse. And the final project I
(27:54):
had in the program, it was afinal term paper that I worked
on for months. It's kind of likea capstone project if people are
familiar with that term, but itwas a it wasn't a paper that was
publishable. I just chose not topublish but and so the term for
my paper was what are thebarriers impeding academic
(28:15):
success for our electricalapprentices. And so I did a huge
research project on that, andthe project narrows in on
electricians or in theelectrical apprentices. Because
of the scope of the project,they were concerned that our
apprentices in general was toovast, and I need needed to
narrow it out. However, when Ilook at the barriers to academic
(28:39):
success, stigmas on their lackof mentoring, funding, numeracy
and literacy, so problems withreading and writing, and
problems with math, problemswith job security, problems with
time management, and then theother huge one is learning
disabilities. So learningdisabilities are obviously
(29:00):
throughout all of society. Butthe numbers of students with
learning disabilities in thetrades is massive. So going
through and doing all thatresearch, validated a lot of the
problems I'd run into as aninstructor, and it gave me more
information about why mystudents weren't succeeding. So
(29:21):
my concern for students is Iwant them to succeed. I want
them to be successful, and Iwant them to be satisfied. And a
lot of times I have to tellthem, Look, I want you to be
satisfied. Realize that I don'tmake the curriculum, right.
However, I want you to besatisfied that we were able to
get through the curriculumtogether.
Zack Hartle (29:45):
Now that's very interesting. And I think, I
mean, obviously that programsgiven you a broader view on
adult education and then to beable to do that Capstone and
narrow in very specifically toyour day to day job. office. I
don't know, such a cool learningexperience. And I, you're
obviously a lifelong learner asI am myself. And I think just
(30:08):
keeping that going is how youcan still keep progressing in
the trade right even after 15years in the same job, right? So
Jason Cox (30:17):
yeah, absolutely.
Yeah. It's, it's, it's lifelonglearning is not a catchphrase.
It's a reality.
Zack Hartle (30:24):
Jason that now brings us to the podcast. It's
your most recent endeavor. Westarted this we this is episode
six. So 12 weeks ago ish. Now.
Why are you here? Why are wemaking this podcast together?
Jason Cox (30:41):
Well, Zack, why don't you tell me why I am here.
Zack Hartle (30:45):
I think you're doing the podcast because I
convinced you to do the podcast,because I knew that you would
like it. And Was I right? Or wasI wrong?
Jason Cox (30:54):
I'm actually really enjoying it. And unfortunately,
I figured out my career pathwhen I turned about 40, which
was a little while ago. And atthat point in time of my life,
I've always been interested inbroadcasting. And I wasn't about
to drop my career and start thismission of starting in
broadcasting. So. So that waspart of the reason I did it. And
(31:18):
I'm really having lots of fun.
And I'm learning lots of stuff,actually, from you. And yeah,
it's been lots of fun. I've, ofcourse, I've got other bigger
answers on why I want to do thepodcast if you want to know
about that, too. Yeah, I
Zack Hartle (31:31):
think that I mean, you're doing it because I pulled
your teeth to get you to agreeto do three pilot episodes. And
I mean, It's tons of fun. Soyeah, why why are we keeping
going with the podcast?
Jason Cox (31:47):
Yeah, it was really funny when I when I think when
we had our conversation, and Isaid I'll do three. And then
we'll, we'll re convene and talkabout it. And we didn't even I
think the third episode that wedid was like we were comfortable
with what we were doing by that.
The reason another reason, Imean, obviously, I want to have
fun, what you said earlier,like, this is fun. But what you
(32:09):
said earlier is totally true.
It's all about lifelonglearning. And so we have the
opportunity to learn a lot aboutour trade in this podcast. And
we have the opportunity to helpothers in our trade, learn more
about our trade. And so that'sexciting. And I've learned a lot
(32:34):
so far.
Zack Hartle (32:35):
What's the most interesting thing that you've
learned so far?
Jason Cox (32:41):
The most interesting thing I've learned so far. Well,
two things. First of all, whenJohn Knoll talked to us about
the symptoms from receiving a,an electrical shock, there were
symptoms there. And results,injuries that I was not aware
(33:06):
of. And so that has beenprobably the most important
thing I've learned through ourpodcast is that we should 100%
Minimize electrical shock. Ialso through through my
experience of going intograduate school and reading
(33:27):
academic papers, I did read someon the effects of shock from
John and then I found someonline and, and yeah, we
definitely need to be careful,we need to be wearing the proper
PPE and then following this theright rule. So so that was
really important so far, andbeen very happy. So far, we've
(33:48):
had two, two guests that I'veknown for a very long time in
the industry. And they were boththey're both on our show. And I
was just so impressed by theirprofessionalism, so, so learning
about shocking and seeing theprofessionalism of people I've
worked with, from the beginningof their career to present day
(34:11):
has been very satisfying.
Zack Hartle (34:13):
I couldn't agree more that we've learned cool
stuff from all of our guests. Imean, the episode with John
Knoll that you're talking aboutis episode number three,
definitely worth checking out ifyou haven't listened yet. And
then, I guess, where do you seeus going? Where do you want to
take this podcast and what doyou want to get out of it?
Jason Cox (34:32):
Well, I'm very impressed with the feedback
we're getting from people. Ithink we're very hard on her.
Everyone's very hard onthemselves. And, and so to get
the positive feedback frompeople has been recharging. It's
really it's really helped. Iwould really like to have
(34:53):
members or listeners contact usand say hey, why don't you do an
episode? On this or why haven'tyou done an episode on that? So
suggestions for topics? orspecial guests? Yeah, like so.
So that's what I'd like to seemoving forward. I mean, as we've
(35:14):
started here, Zach, I mean,we've kind of just mined through
some of the people that we know.
And some of it has, has led toother other guests. But yeah, so
So yeah, more. More, morefeedback from listeners would be
great.
Zack Hartle (35:32):
Yeah, engaging with the electrical community, I
agree would be excellent. Andobviously, for everyone
listening, you can reach out tous on Facebook, at Watt's the
Word podcast, join our pagethere, like our page, you can
send us a message reach out tous if you have any suggestions,
like Jason says, we would loveto hear from you. Other than
(35:56):
that, Jason, I mean, I justwanted to chat with you today
about that, like you're gonna dowith me one day, um, anything
else you'd like to add? Or ifnot, then where can people reach
out to you if they want to chatwith you some more.
Jason Cox (36:10):
They can find me on LinkedIn. It's pretty easy. Just
Jason Cox, LinkedIn. I mean,Calgary electrician, I think is
my title. I think you can findme through there as you know,
Zack Zack smiling here becausewhen it comes to the technical
and the Instagram and theTwitter and the Facebook, all
the social media, all the techstuff, Zach is our he's our
(36:31):
expert on that. And I'm sure ifyou've listened to a few of our
episodes, it's very obvious.
Zack Hartle (36:37):
Thank you everybody for coming and listening today.
I had had a great time chattingwith you, Jason. And even though
we've been you know, friends foryears and talking together for
12 weeks now on the show, I evenlearned quite a bit from you
tonight more system about howyou got to where you are. We
never really discussed yourapprenticeship or anything up
until we met. So it's great tohear that. Everyone who's
(37:00):
listening. Please make sure yousubscribe to the show. So you
get your automatic downloadsevery second Monday when they
come out. Like I mentioned,reach out to us on Facebook or
Instagram at Watt's the Wordpodcast. Yeah, we'd love to hear
from you. We'd love to have yousubscribe, share it with a
friend who you think might beinteresting. And keep yourself
(37:21):
safe out there. And if you cansomeone else too.
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