September 13, 2024 • 60 mins
Ever wondered how private cellular networks are reshaping the wireless landscape? In this captivating episode, we bring in special guest Mark Houtz, a network engineer with deep expertise in cellular and cell technologies, to explore the latest advancements and trends. We celebrate a milestone achievement of reaching 1,000 YouTube subscribers and take you on a trip down memory lane, reminiscing about WiMAX, LTE, and CBRS. Mark shares fascinating insights from his recent projects, including the complexities of testing Wi-Fi performance in challenging environments like high school football fields.
Shifting our focus to the CBRS spectrum, we dive into the real-world challenges and performance aspects of deploying this technology. From the intricacies of spectrum allocation services (SAS) to practical scenarios involving service outages at major companies like Amazon and Google, we provide invaluable insights into the deployment of CBRS in both urban and rural settings. Our discussion also covers the pros and cons of using CBRS for outdoor connectivity in spaces such as parks and stadiums, all backed by experiences from testing at the Bonneville Salt Flats.
But that's not all—current industry trends and future innovations are also on the agenda. We discuss the anticipated impact of Wi-Fi 7 with the new iPhone 16, the evolving role of tech influencers, and the exciting developments coming out of Mobility Field Day. From the potential pitfalls of user-mounted devices to groundbreaking technologies like an electromagnetic vortex cannon, this episode is packed with information that will keep you informed and entertained. Plus, get a sneak peek into upcoming events and projects, including an ambitious engineering venture in Alaska. Don't miss out on this treasure trove of networking wisdom and entertaining anecdotes!
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
you well.
Hello.
Good morning, what's up, dude.
How's it going, mark?
Great how you doing, man,fantastic.
Welcome everybody.
My name is drew lenz, I'm thewireless nerd and today I've got
my special buddy mark on withus.
You know, I figured every weekright, I just sit here and I
crank out the little podcast.
I have fun talking to myselfand and it's okay, you know.
(00:21):
But then it's like, why notinvite someone else?
Whoa look at that?
Why not invite?
someone else to come join thejoin the fun.
Especially.
I feel like I've been talking alot about 5g and cbrs and lte
and all those things.
I was like dude, you postedtrim this light down a bit.
You posted something this pastweek out, like with fernet or
(00:44):
something on a one wheel, and Iwas like dude, what the hell
anyway?
Uh, welcome everybody.
Thanks again for tuning in ahuge celebratory week for me.
Crossed a thousand subscriberson youtube and like cue the
applause.
I, you know I gotta get mystuff together and like figure
out little but bit of the noise.
(01:04):
Anyone who knows me, uh, whohas listened to the podcast or
seen me you know be obnoxiouswherever it is knows that I had
a bet with my wife and she saidif you can cross a thousand
subscribers on YouTube, I willbuy you a trip to Mexico.
So Mexico, here I come.
I told her this weekend I waslike there you go, babe, we're
going to mexico.
So, uh, I'm gonna post wavesfrom the waves.
(01:26):
I think I'm gonna do cancun.
I think that's anyway nice.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
So lots of fun stuff to cover this week.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
But first mark, I want you to introduce yourself
to anyone who does, who may notknow you.
Who are you, what do you do,where you're from, etc.
Etc.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
Etc everything about mark house.
Um, uh, I am a network engineerfor a bunch of school districts
up here in utah um, that's howI know for nay and keith um, I
live about an hour from both ofthem, so, but I have gotten
heavily into the privatecellular world.
Um, that's where I've got a lotof my followers is in the
(01:59):
private cellular world, but I amalso cwne 500.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
That was pretty yeah, it shows on your little uh, on
your little LinkedIn badge thereit says CW and E five.
Love it, man.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
So I I've been in the , I've been doing the wifi thing
for since about 2007.
So I've been in wifi for a lotlonger than private.
So there, obviously, but we gotsome, I got started in private,
so there it in private cellularbefore cbrs was really a thing.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
So you know, and playing with all the waves dude
for real and you know it's, Ifind that.
I find that there's people whowho have been playing in the
space as long as we have and youknow, we, we do a lot in wi-fi
right, and so every day I feellike we're just surrounded by
wi-fi people talking about Wi-Fistuff and there's so much more
out there.
My background, in case anyonecares, or whatever, is I started
(02:51):
building Internet serviceproviders and then started doing
wireless Internet serviceproviders and doing
point-to-multipoint and WiMAX.
And I got to mention a wordthat I hadn't used in years the
other day on a phone call.
I was talking about Navini andour deployment of Navini down in
South Texas.
So when you talk about WiMAXand LTE and all that, it's so
much fun.
And then Wi-Fi is just like thistiny little piece that
(03:11):
everybody uses.
But there's so much more outthere and I think, as we see,
you know, as we see, theconvergence actually now finally
really starting to happen.
It's so intriguing to mebecause I I'm seeing two worlds
come together right, and cbrsdid a lot with that.
I mean they, there was a lot todo with, with opening up those
(03:33):
frequency bands, opening up band48, figuring out how to onboard
devices you know into, in, youknow onto the infrastructure.
But now I mean I love the idea.
I don't think we'll ever see asingle device that does
everything.
I mean we probably won't see aWi-Fi device that does CBRS, but
we'll probably see a CBRSdevice that does Wi-Fi.
I would imagine that would comefirst.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Well, this in your pocket does both.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
Well, I mean like a base station or an access point
I'm like there's clients outthere.
So, real quick, there are somethings I want to talk about that
are happening this week.
But first, look, so I'm using,I'm using, I like restream, I
always use restream.
So if you're listening restream, feel free to give me a free
subscription because it'sexpensive but it's totally worth
(04:19):
it.
But so I'm trying to figure outthe little studio thing, what.
I'm going to jump on yourLinkedIn real quick and I want
to show what it is that.
Let me see that I was lookingat from you.
Let's see, all right, where wasit?
You show all posts.
Let's see if I can find outwhat's going on with you here.
(04:39):
Where is that picture there,there?
Okay, I've got brought up.
I don't you know.
Hopefully anyone who's watchingcan see that.
Dude, tell me, what the hellwere you doing like?
What tell me about?
Tell me about this set ofpictures what is this cow and uh
and what is this spectrum?
Speaker 2 (04:59):
tell me, tell me what's going on in these photos,
man, so so back about two yearsago, fernay and Keith kind of
got me onto this whole idea.
They were doing some Wi-Fisurveys at a high school
football field here in Utah inthe Salt Lake Valley and they
(05:20):
were just wanting to test somedifferent things and they kept
getting reflections off thebleachers and off buildings and
stuff, some different things.
And they kept gettingreflections off the bleachers
and off buildings and stuff, andso they they kind of had they.
They didn't get a real greatcoverage of how far an AP went.
So they came up with this ideato take it out to the salt flats
, which the great salt lake, um,just West of salt lake city, um
, if you keep going West of that, just before you reach, uh,
(05:44):
nevada, wendover, nevada,there's a big flat uh lake bed
that they call the Bonnevillesalt flats.
Around the world there'smultiple salt flats that are
very similar, some bigger onesin other countries, but um but
um but uh, so the salt flats arejust a big flat area of salt.
(06:07):
It's miles and miles and milesof just flat.
So for name, keith test severalyears ago tested out wifi and
then about two years ago Ichatted with for name, we went
back and we're testing wifi thenand but after that.
But at the same time I was like, let's test CBRS out there as
well.
And so a buddy of mine inInfernae and his kids and some
(06:33):
other friends, we went out thereand did some testing with CBRS.
We had the radio about 15 feetoff the ground, so the Fresnel
zone was getting was hitting theground.
Not a great setup, but wedidn't have.
It was a last minute planplanning and things, so we we
didn't get very far.
We got about two miles out ofthis radio.
It was crazy.
On our drive back we have aschool district that has one on
(06:55):
top of it.
We got about 12 miles out ofthat one, which is we're like,
how do it was crazy.
But uh, we wanted to go back andtest and so we had this has
been two years in planning abuddy of mine at Murray School
District A lot of people in theprivate cellular world know him,
but he bought this trailer thathas a 60-foot map.
(07:19):
Oh, that's the cow, that's thecow.
And so we're like this willhelp us set things up quicker.
We'll be able to set it upquicker instead of cause last
time it took us like all dayjust to get the thing set up.
We had like two hours to justdo any testing.
This time we had it up and hada lot more time to be able to
(07:40):
test, but so we stuck to CBSradios on there.
We were going to test band 41as well.
We have a license for band 41for the area Um, but we didn't
get to that.
We ran out of time for that.
But we were able to test twoCBS radios, I think they were
both by cells.
One might've been Nokia, Ican't remember Um, but we got
four miles out of those acrossthat salt flats.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
So, man, and what?
So?
What was the client device thatyou guys were using when you
were testing these out?
Speaker 2 (08:12):
So we had a Nokia phone.
It's basically a big Androidphone but it was pretty.
It was actually a pretty ruggedeyes, really nice device.
We were we were testing 5g.
One of the radios was 5g, theother one was LTE, so we were
testing 5g.
One of the radios was 5g, theother one was lte, so we were
testing both um, but this devicewas 5g.
We had some other devices we'regoing to test, but we they
(08:34):
didn't end up working in themoment, so we had issues with
them, but I I took the um, uh,spectran v6, the the device.
So I captured, I that.
In that that one of thosepictures, it's me.
They're holding this, theSpectran V6.
Yeah, let me see as I'm drivingalong, as my buddy's driving
(08:56):
along, the side by side, so I'mholding it, and so I captured
for five miles, um, the spectrum, that's awesome, as the signal
slowly decreased, decreased,decreased, decreased, decreased,
until it was barely visible.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
How far do you think?
What was the maximum amountthat you got out of it?
Like speeds, no, no, no.
Distance, oh distance.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
So just past four miles is where it kind of
started to drop.
Is it usable, though?
Just past four miles is wherewhere it kind of started to drop
.
We, we, we had.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
Is it usable?
Speaker 2 (09:29):
Four miles was usable .
Yeah, we were doing speed testsat four miles and it was usable
and that's 30.
Speaker 1 (09:34):
That was CBRS bands 3,600, 3,650 CBRS bands Wow.
We have five miles an iPhone,but it was not usable.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
So flat surface, yeah , five miles An iPhone still had
signal, but it was not usable.
Speaker 1 (09:45):
Flat surface.
15 feet, though, is what yousaid.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Huh, this time it's 60.
60 feet off the ground.
Speaker 1 (09:51):
Oh, okay, all right.
Wow 15 feet, we got two miles.
Man, that's awesome.
And I think when I've used itobviously not in that
environment, but when I look atthe environments I've put it in
where it's like in cities orschool districts or whatever we
see, maybe with a, with a, buysales like a four, 36, I think
(10:13):
we'll and a and a standard UElike a standard phone, we'll see
, maybe, you know, maybe a mileyou throw some trees in there,
it's like half a mile, somethinglike that.
So we draw a cell size about amile from edge to edge.
You know, but yeah, I can'timagine.
And I live in South Texas,right, so flat but lots of trees
and lots of low brush.
(10:33):
So you know, it shows you howmuch not interference, but how
much physical structure makes adifference and things like that.
What were some of the lessonslearned?
Okay, was there anythingsurprising about that test?
Because I mean it's.
It's very rare that you get achance to just go out and spend
a day just messing with stuffand having a good time.
Was there anything that youbrought back from that?
And you're like dude, that'slike I.
(10:54):
I'm so glad I did it, becausethe I mean in the erronea
product you're using.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
That's awesome height definitely helps.
Um, the antennas higher, yeah,um, that is, that is a big thing
.
Getting it 15 feet off theground, going to 60, you can
double your distance.
Wow, that's a big thing.
So get it high as possible.
Um, I other the thing aboutprivate cellular, if you're
(11:20):
trying to reach kids at home orthings like that.
Um, the reason they have towersso high on the the carrier side
, um is you're trying to gothrough the roof, not through
the side of the wall.
A little more.
You're trying to get it throughthe roof because it's a little
less.
Speaker 1 (11:40):
Um, yeah, there's not great.
There's not brick up there.
Maybe it's well, it depends.
I mean, it depends on the, thematerial.
Now here's another question.
Jeremy's asking on on the chatwhat was the noise floor there
versus downtown slc?
Speaker 2 (11:52):
uh, I mean on the flats was neg 105, I think I
remember right awesome was thenoise floor.
It was like great.
Nothing, no signals any,anything at all.
Speaker 1 (12:04):
So yeah, oh, he also I'm sure it's much much lower.
Yeah, man, you know, we saw,when I deployed cbrs here in in
mcallen, we put up 24 baystations of cambia and we did a
thousand street lights, uh, withsubscriber units on them and
our noise floor is in three.
(12:25):
In the cbrs spectrum was in thenight, you know, in the high
90s, um it was, you know it waslike 90, I mean 94 to 96, I
would say was pretty average.
We did have some areas, uh,where it dipped, where it
changed a little bit.
You know, 89 to 94, um, not nota lot of traffic.
We would see it as we gotcloser to the border we'd see
more traffic, more bleed overtraffic from what was happening
in mexico, because I'm, you know, 89 to 94, um, not not a lot of
traffic.
We would see it as we gotcloser to the border we'd see
(12:46):
more traffic, more bleed overtraffic from what was happening
in mexico, because I'm, you know, I'm 10 minutes away, five
minutes away, but even at that,uh, it always you know the
conversation about how well doesspectrum allocation services
work, right, how well does theSaaS work?
And I, the only problems that weexperienced after running that
(13:06):
network for two years and andhaving it fully deployed didn't
have anything to do withspectrum.
It had to do with when Amazonhad the outage, when federated
had the outage, you know, whenGoogle had the outage.
It was like that was.
The problem is, all of a sudden, no frequencies were getting
allocated, all the equipmentstarted freaking out.
The problem is, all of a sudden, no frequencies were getting
(13:26):
allocated, all the equipmentstarted freaking out.
So hopefully that's been.
You know there's a path toresolution there, but did you
see?
You know, did you see anything?
Anything that was concerningother than you know?
You talked about the happy part, but did you see anything
concerning where?
You're like ooh, I got to watchfor that.
Also, I need to get these cupsprinted, so my logo is on the on
the other side.
When I drink, I'm like, yeah,you do oh things sorry.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
What was the question ?
Speaker 1 (13:52):
did you see anything?
First, it just made me think ofa talk show, so I need to send
you a mug now that you've been aguest.
Since I have mugs, I'm going tosend you a mug.
Um, did you see anythingconcerning where you're like?
Oh, that's something Idefinitely have to watch out for
, where next time you deploy,what's going to pop into your
head.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
Going back to your original thing there with SAS.
Sas is really there to protectincumbents.
It's not really there toprotect the GAA people.
It is a little bit but notreally.
And so, as I've learned andplayed with this stuff over the
last four years, it's.
It's kind of, if you're doingga, it may take you some time to
(14:33):
get a grant but you most likelywill get at least some of a
grant, especially with howlimited private sellers cbrs
still is deployed.
Um, in a lot of areas likebigger cities it's deployed a
lot more.
But in smaller rural areas likewhere I live in these areas
there's nothing in that band andso the SAS is kind of not.
(14:54):
There is more there to protectincumbents and so you're kind of
guaranteed not guaranteed, buthave a better opportunity to get
a chance to get Spectrum.
Have a better opportunity toget a chance to get spectrum.
Um.
Beyond that, things we learnedout there, um, um.
It works great at speed.
Um, you can keep things goingsuper fast.
(15:14):
That's one of the benefits ofthis is you get distance and
speed.
Um, the salt flats is known forspeed records.
Yeah, I saw a Bonneville saltflats salt flats man, the good
year.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
What was the name of that car it's.
I was a guinness book of worldrecords nerd when I was a kid
and it was like the good year.
It was the fastest vehicle evermade and it was done on the
bonneville salt flats, likethat's where people test, where
they test the racy cars, youknow.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
But the week.
Last weekend, before we wentout there, they uh had a local
group out there doing some speedtests.
They came and picked up theporta potties and the garbage
bins and all that stuff whilewe're sitting there.
But uh, so it's it's.
Speaker 1 (15:55):
It's definitely a good place to test speed 763
miles per hour set by thrust sCin 1997.
Yep.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
That's where I was, was that place, so forget about
it.
If you need, if you need speed,so there's a way to go.
Wifi absolutely can't, can'tkeep up because you have to hop,
hop, hop, hop, hop.
Yeah, well, okay.
Speaker 1 (16:21):
So for that, okay.
So in small, in close proximity, though, if you're not at
Bonneville Salt Flats, if you'rein an office space and you've
deployed less 5G than you haveWi-Fi, for example, one device
for every five or ten orwhatever your magic formula is.
There is no magic formula.
Sorry, if anyone was lookingfor that magic formula.
(16:42):
There's no magic formula.
Use cases vary.
But if you have less deployedand you're trying to do more
with less, that's where I wouldsay, well, I don't know, it
depends on what your deploymenttechnique is.
Let me ask you another question,because I got asked this this
week and I didn't want to answer.
I tried to dodge the questionbecause I didn't just didn't
(17:04):
want to say, I didn't just wantto flat out say no.
Deploying CBRS for UEconnectivity outdoors.
What are your thoughts withthat?
Where it's and what I mean bythat is and I'm sure you know,
you know.
But for anyone who doesn't knowwhat I mean by that deploying a
CBRS outdoor base station toconnect to mobile phone devices,
(17:24):
outdoor base station to connectto mobile phone devices, uh,
what are your thoughts of ofdoing that, like in a park or in
an outside area or a stadium,or to cover a courtyard or
something like that, somethingto do or something to stay the
hell away from um, if you're, itall depends on if you have
control over the ues.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
If it's just general public, neutral, host is still.
It's it, as you talked aboutlast week, it's, it's coming,
yeah, but it's.
Speaker 1 (17:48):
Let's say that neutral host is there.
Let's say that there is anequipment, that the equipment
does support neutral host and Ican walk outside and and this is
leading into questions I havefor you about helium and x net
is helium outdoor deploying abicell space station, turning it
on?
X net just announced that theirpartnership with a carrier.
And then you scroll back andyou see everything says AT&T on
(18:10):
their website or on theirTwitter.
But you deploy XNet outside andit's in your neighborhood and
now you've got people walking inyour neighborhood using AT&T
over CBRS offloaded to XNet.
I am not a fan of that model.
Um, I think that there's toomuch.
There's just a lot there, man,and and I'm a little, I'm a
(18:33):
little curious how that's goingto work out.
Is that something you would door is that something you stay
away from?
And also, do you have anyexperience?
Speaker 2 (18:40):
I've been approached by the xNet guys to design
something in downtown Salt Lakewith Jeremy there.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
Him and I were approached.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
I turned it down for that kind of reason.
The issue.
So, Paul and Mobile was anotherbig kick.
One of these guys Ah, I forgotabout them that were very, very
heavy did a lot of stuff.
We're really trying to pushthis and build this off the
crypto wave and then theypartnered with T-Mobile.
How they partnered withT-Mobile, devices could join
(19:18):
T-Mobile or could join you, soif you're in an area that has
T-Mobile coverage, the device isnever going to join you at that
point, and so once thathappened, everybody dumped their
base stations onto eBay.
I bought a bunch of them offeBay.
Yeah, they were off eBay Becauseall of a sudden, they were
making this crypto that had verylittle value and suddenly they
(19:40):
weren't getting their money back, and so I'm not saying X net's
going to have the same issue.
Um, these guys are tryingtrying to avoid following the
same path, but, as they part thebenefit, if they partner with
at&t and you have these basestations in areas where at&t has
(20:00):
coverage, you're definitelygoing to potentially have some
issues with that.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
Yeah and that.
So that raises the questionright.
And and there's, there's somuch that has to be done from a
coordination perspective.
And I I remember the first someof the first reasons I got
involved in doing this were toset it up and to see how
difficult is it to set up, andalso, as someone who's deployed
a bunch of CBRS, understandingall of the things that are
involved to do that, I was likewhat is the process for setting
(20:28):
it up and how are theyprotecting that?
Like, if I'm setting up a CBRSbase station and I have to say
this is where it's installed,and lock in the GPS and take
three pictures and an azimuthand a picture with a calculator
or a compass or whatever it is,they make you do all these
things to deploy it.
You know then and that's great,but the guardrails are then
(20:50):
that you have said that this iswhere it's deployed.
But what if the local holidayparade happens down the street
for me and I go hey, here's agreat opportunity for me to earn
some token.
I'm just going to stick thatthing in the trunk of my car and
drive down to the holidayparade and light it up, and sure
as shit, everybody jumps onlineand then someone makes a 911
call and then what?
(21:13):
And so I look at what they'redoing and I look at what.
And kudos to them.
I'm not trying to naysay, Imean I love it.
I'm an early adopter, love it,think it's a great idea.
I just see that there's so manythings that have to happen for
that to work successfully thatit's fascinating.
(21:33):
And then you look at whatHelium's doing, and again with
XNet, where they essentially youset up a base station and in
XNet's case you have to buytheir equipment.
Right, doesn't work on anyoneelse's equipment yet except for
theirs.
So you purchase their equipment, you turn it on, you activate
it and the more people that useyour network they give you money
in the form of their token, sothat you earn token, the more
(21:55):
people that use your stuff andit gives you a certain rate.
You know, I don't know whatit's at right now, but they pay
you at a certain rate worth oftheir token, something,
apparently, somewhere.
And that's a way that you cansay hey, I can justify deploying
all this equipment because nowI'm earning money for the people
(22:16):
that are using this stuff.
But is that?
I mean, how?
How far will it go.
I wrote down two things on aphone call I was talking about,
you know.
One of them is is who's got theliability for e911 when someone
moves their base station?
Right, because keep in mindthat people are gonna going to
be deploying tens of thousandsof these things, hundreds of
(22:36):
thousands of these things.
There's going to be people thatjust move it.
There's going to be, especiallyif they see a chance,
inevitable, yeah.
And then I have no idea what Iwrote.
I don't know what letters theseare.
I can't read my own handwriting, but you know, oh, traction, it
says traction.
But what do you think thetraction is going to be?
As things, now that at&t andx-net have talked, or now x-net
(23:00):
has talked about having apartnership that we're assuming
is at&t, do you think, how welldo you think that that's going
to take off?
Any ideas?
Speaker 2 (23:07):
thoughts on those guys indoors.
As jr put a good, good commentthere.
He said outdoor isn't the playwith seabreast, in his opinion.
I, yep, I agree.
It depends, your use casedepends.
I'm like private seller, nonoutdoor absolutely yeah, neutral
host outdoor is not your playcarriers, unless you're in a
(23:29):
rural area where there's nocoverage of anybody or your
specific carrier, then maybe.
But he says macro networks arenot the problem.
Indoor is the problem Indoor?
If you have a building wherecoverage does not penetrate down
the basement or something, abasement or something.
(23:55):
This absolutely, as you said,as you talked about last week,
with um neutral host andreplacing your um dashes
absolutely this could be a bigplay for those sites at scale in
a big stadium or somethingabsolutely go with a dash.
Speaker 1 (24:06):
Still, because you're using carrier spectrum, you
don't have as much spectrum withcbrs, but with cbrs in a small
building or in a basement orsomething, this absolutely could
be a good partnership with at&tto help provide coverage yeah,
and I think and I love what, uh,I love what mr ali was saying
here, where he says I've beensuccessful on the wi-fi side
(24:28):
with at&t and timo waiting onthis uh, other vendor just to be
holding out, you know, andthat's the same thing i've've.
It works great right now on thewifi side.
The Passpoint stuff that we'redoing, the Passpoint stuff that
Ameriband is doing, that we'redoing with Signal Roam, we're
having such a good time withthat.
You know, I've been fieldingphone calls and emails left and
right since I pushed that videoabout Ubiquity.
It's like, dude, I've beenstacking up and it's really,
(24:50):
really cool.
I'll have to throw in a.
I'll have to throw in a signalroom sticker for you and your
coffee mug, but, yes, I'll throwin an ap.
So yeah, I've been playing withit too, so it's so cool, it's
just so cool and so easy, youknow, and I look at, I look at
the three tiers, this and thisis what I talked a little bit
about last week where you've gotdaz, you know, as you mentioned
(25:12):
, fantastic, get the signals,bring them back in, but the
expense that's involved withthat is so, so high, you know.
And then you look at whatprivate cellular offers and you
look at how that ties to neutralhosting.
There's a really to me that wasthat's really the promise of
on-go and they're having theirmeeting next week.
So lots of cool news is goingto come from that.
(25:34):
Case studies and whatnot arecoming from the OnGo Alliance
meeting next week in Dallas.
It's going to be really neat tosee how that's progressing.
I'm super excited because Iremember laying eyeballs on this
thing when I was at Facebookand seeing it work on the
Facebook campuses, going oh myGod, you're doing this with
Airspan equipment and infinityand this is awesome and Joel has
(25:55):
continued to push that anddoing incredible things with it.
And now you know I was superexcited.
You know, I think I went backand watched.
I had to go back and watch thevideo cause I didn't want to
screw something up in aconversation.
I went back and watched ourvideo from a Billy field day and
and it was when, uh, memet fromsalona started talking about
moxon and about, you know,neutral host and what they're
(26:18):
doing and it's going to comesoon and whatever, I was like,
yes, finally, like so, you know,it's so cool to see the
traction happening in theindustry and I'm super, super,
super excited for it.
But I, you know the way I seethe pieces of the puzzle, right,
is you've got Cisco and Merakidoing the Cisco Meraki thing and
not a clearly defined play forprivate cellular, private 4G,
(26:42):
private 5G, they have things,but you know whatever.
And then you have Juniper, right, and you know I feel like I'm
talking at the WLPC crowd right,you have Juniper, where Bob
shows up and has a great timeand says everything that he does
.
And then you see thispartnership forming with Salona
and Juniper and you're like, ohman, that's, that could be
something.
And then all of a sudden, hpepops out and you know they had
(27:04):
this deal where they, wherethere was the uh, you could
purchase Salona on the Arubaparts list.
We're like, oh, okay, well,maybe that's happening.
And then they're like Athonetand you're like, whoa, what?
Okay, here comes Athonet andyou're like, all right, that's
happening here.
Cisco still hasn't figured outwhat they're doing there yet.
And then you've got Juniper andyou're like, okay, well, maybe
(27:25):
Juniper is going to get intothat.
And then it's.
There's so many thingshappening in that space where
I'm looking at it right now andI'm going, man, there's, I see
so many moves happening whereit's like Wi-Fi, it's like, yeah
, wi-fi seven.
But I'm looking over here andI'm going, what's, what's all
that activity happening on theother, on the other side?
So what's your take on on kindof the state of the industry
(27:47):
right now coming from from the5G side?
Speaker 2 (27:52):
Oh, it's, it's definitely in flux.
Um, we're still early days withprivate solar.
Um, we're four years in fromsince cbrs was released, right
before covid, and I'vedefinitely been oh, I'm excited.
Everything's been going to beawesome, amazing, we're going to
make millions.
And then, oh, I don't know ifthis is going to actually happen
, and it's.
It's just been this back andforth, back and forth it's been.
(28:14):
I have a buddy, um, he's asales guy for for um, somebody,
somebody, one of these companies, and I've chatted with him many
times and they're like, yeah,cbrs is kind of like this, it's
you know, there's like there'sbumps in it.
You know it's like little bumps,but it's, it's it's not this
big growth yet.
And so it's like know there's,like there's bumps in it.
You know it's like little bumps, but it's, it's, it's not this
(28:35):
big growth yet.
And so it's like is this goingto be a big industry?
And then ai came in and tookall the fun, a lot of the
funding and and different things, and so it's like this is gonna
this, it's, it's growing.
It's definitely on the incline.
Um, the last few, the last fewmonths have definitely had some
big bumps that have helped itkind of grow a lot more.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
Yeah, um, there's, I would agree there's, and I think
that there's there's been someuptick in, there's been some
press releases and announcementsthat go out, where some
universities have adopted it,different organizations have
adopted it.
You know, verizon made theirannouncement with cummins saying
hey, we can, we can do it, youknow, and if you want Verizon,
you have to buy Verizon andwe'll throw in AT&T and T-Mobile
(29:16):
, but Verizon still.
No one has been able to pinVerizon down on neutral host for
any other product yet.
So it's like all right, when'sthat going to happen?
And as soon as we get thatthree carrier load in the US,
that's going to be great.
What about international,though?
I mean the amount of email thatI have gotten from people
asking me about Signal Roaminternationally has been insane,
(29:38):
and it's great.
Australia, new Zealand, germany, uk, spain.
They're like when can you dothis with what we have?
I'm curious.
You're not working on anythinginternational, though, right?
Speaker 2 (29:51):
I'm not international , but I've been watching
international.
My first talk at WLPC Prague.
Speaker 1 (29:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
Back in the day I talked about what Salona was
kind of doing internationally.
There's a couple options.
Salona had a big graph.
Good one there, jr.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
It's true, wi-fi will never be accepted.
Wait a minute, I guess.
But the question is are wethere yet, right, or how?
How close are we?
Because I'm, I'm.
The problem is, uh, is that Iget?
Is this the force through thetrees mentality, because I'm
looking at it right now.
Is it just like, oh my God,everything's going great?
Or are we really looking atthis from an industry going,
(30:40):
it's coming, it's closer thancoming?
And I love the HPE announcementabout Athonet and about bringing
it together under Central,because for the first time it
seemed like single pane of glassto do everything.
And if you take that a stepfurther and you look at hp aruba
(31:02):
and then you know, not noofficial word, right?
This is the beauty of of notworking for anyone right now
except for myself is that I cansay stuff like this and and it's
not tied to a vendor.
It's like you look at hp arubaand the juniper thing and you go
well, dude, if you guys can usemarvis to tie all of this stuff
together, that would be sobadass, like, like, bring it all
(31:23):
in everybody like four yearsago.
Speaker 2 (31:25):
Four years ago I was chatting with bob friday I was
in a customer advisory call and,um, I randomly threw out cbrs.
Bob called me like has calledme so many times like I would.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
I'm like you need to bring private seller into marvis
, and so hopefully finally we'regetting that with hpe well, oh,
yeah, okay, hopefully finallywe're getting that in two years
when everything's done, assuming, regulate ah, damn it, damn it,
like you're so close.
So you know, and I look at thatand and uh, there's I just
(32:00):
there's things that.
There's things I'm aware ofthat I can't talk about, that, I
shouldn't talk about, that, Iwon't talk about.
But there's also things thatare happening in the industry,
where, where people are makingbig moves.
So I would encourage anyonewho's interested in seeing how
these come together to just golook at the companies you're
interested in, especially in theWi-Fi space, and see who's
hiring who, because if you lookat that, it's very easy to see
(32:23):
wait a minute, why is thisperson, this person's moving
over here, this person's moving,what's going on?
So I think that, looking atthat and understanding where it
is, there's so many great thingsthat are that are moving along
in the in the industry.
Oh my God, okay.
So that went way longer than Ithought.
I try and keep the podcast like20 minutes and here we are at 45
(32:43):
or whatever it is.
Um, let's jump.
Look, I want your opinion onsome of these things.
So I've got you know.
I, I appreciate, I know thatyou listen to the podcast.
I do appreciate that.
You know one out of 999listeners, apparently, but so
let's see what's going on thisweek.
Man, you know I've got allthese browser tabs open and
(33:04):
eventually I will.
If I can start monetizingYouTube, then maybe I can
finally buy a teleprompter.
Like Keith Parsons keeps tellingme.
He's like you gotta look at thescreen, drew, you're dumb, you
look weird.
You didn't tell me I'm dumb,but he's like you keep looking
off to the side.
He's like why don't you look atthe screen?
So, keith, someday, my friend,okay, first thing, I got on the
news.
You ready for this?
This from linkedin three.
(33:26):
Uk's embrace of 5g fixedwireless access for broadband
continues to deepen as itlaunches the market's first 5G
outdoor hub solution.
So this was 3UK was talkingabout their outdoor hub.
It can be wall-mounted,pole-mounted, window-mounted or
placed in a temporary stand, andI'll share this on the screen
If you hadn't seen this.
This is what I'm looking at.
(33:48):
That's still you, let me Yay.
Speaker 2 (33:56):
Hold on, let me at, that's still you.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
let me uh, yeah, hold on, let me find the right.
Keep sharing that stuff with me, right?
Yeah, right, let me see.
I'm trying to figure out alearn use this for the first
time.
Hang on, let's replace thatwith uh.
Let's see screen share.
And let's go over here to thispost on linkedin.
Here you go.
So I saw this.
I was man.
That's kind of cool.
You know, the ability to have a5G device that can be stuck on
(34:19):
your window or attached to apole mount.
I love the mounting options ofthis.
But it said either side of theAtlantic to sell FWO's
comprehensive home broadbandsolution continuous drain.
Start with US Champions,verizon, t-mobile, bundlingling
extensive content subscriptionsand other perks.
But from a cpe perspective,this is so terrifying to me,
(34:40):
having worked in the industry,having worked in the industry
for so long, and giving givingend users the option to mount
things in different locations tome is always like oh god, why
would you do that?
Because the second you do that,they're going to mount it in
the place that it's least likelyto work.
Speaker 2 (34:56):
Um, so I saw that basement yeah, yeah you know,
this goes back to that.
Speaker 1 (35:02):
This goes back to that ye old rule that I always
use with wi-fi.
People ask me where do you getgood wi-fi?
And I'm like, think about itlike a light bulb and imagine
your room is dark or your houseis dark.
Where would you put that lightbulb to make sure you have
enough light?
And they're like in the closet,in the utility closet, where
the guy ran all the cables forthe internet.
I just put it in there and it'slike that's never going to work
.
In the garage, in the garage, ohmy God.
(35:24):
Okay, hey, do you want to getinto some high-stakes drama?
Oh, sure, to get into some somehigh-stakes drama?
Oh sure, okay, so not drama,but something that I really look
, you can see who I was lookingat.
Uh, high-stakes drama of, of,uh, of this man.
Let's just, let's just jumpinto it.
(35:45):
Oh, yeah, yeah, yes, yes, Ithink she's live right now.
Also, I think she's doing a, adeal.
Yeah, she's doing a how tonavigate, being laid off.
Yes, uh, sorry, alexis, she'stalking right now, it looks like
, and she has way more viewersthan we do.
Oh, yeah, but holy moly, um, youknow my drama man look, you're
(36:10):
right I you know, I worked atcisco one time and I'm not the
biggest influencer in the worldI don't have nearly as many
people as she does and even inthat role I was like, well, if
you're gonna lay me off, I meanlike I, at least look for a
media job, or you know?
it's like dude, are you likeleverage this group of people?
(36:32):
I have, and I didn't take anyoffense to it because, whatever
I mean, I totally understand thelayoffs and whatnot, and I
understand her position as well,where you know, apparently she
was, she moved in and and shewas told, hey, you have to find
something else because thisposition terminates on the state
.
She didn't find anything elseand that was terminated.
But, holy moly, you know our,our dear friend, alexis, uh, is
(36:53):
now on the open market.
Oh my god, who's gonna snap herup first?
Speaker 2 (36:58):
that's the question yeah, it's crazy the people on
the market right now, so there'sa lot of opportunity to get
some high quality talent outthere right now we may be few,
but we're damn pretty yes yeah,that's great.
Speaker 1 (37:21):
Yeah, well, I tagged that because it's my question
around.
This is it has influencermarketing reached a point that
no one cares anymore?
That's my, that's my question,because if cisco is willing to
let go of probably arguably thenumber one tech influencer in
(37:42):
the industry period, number twobehind uh lexi yeah, I think
lexi's gotta be listen, ifalexis starts licking stuff, I'm
going to be very upset.
But you know, either way, top 10influencers, top five
influencers and Cisco's like hey, that's cool has influencer
(38:03):
marketing reached a point whereit's just irrelevant in the tech
industry?
And you know I struggled withthis when we were doing the, you
know, when I did some of thestuff with with HPE and we did
their influencer marketing andand with Cisco, and you know we
still do the Cisco championsthing and that's cool.
But it got to a point where itwas like I don't know what value
and you know, I don't know whatvalue I'm bringing to the table
(38:27):
other than I open it up to theaudience.
But I don't know how manypeople have actually purchased
an Aruba access point becauseDrew was like, hey, man, this
thing's pretty cool, you know?
Um, so I don't.
I don't know how that fares, butwhen you see something, yeah,
when you see something like thatfrom someone that we know, that
(38:47):
we respect, that we actuallylike that's fun and outgoing and
easy to communicate with andtells a good story, and it's
like that's, in my opinion,that's fun and outgoing and easy
to communicate with and tells agood story, and it's like
that's, in my opinion, that'sexactly what the industry needed
was someone sharing thatmessage.
You know I'm too old to to doit.
Clearly, I don't.
You know, I need to startsaying you know like you talk
about my sigma access points,right, but it's.
(39:08):
It was such a.
It was such a letdown, I feel,for all influencers of any way,
shape or form, to see whathappened to alexis, because it
was like wow, they just reallydidn't give a shit, like just
bye, you know, yep and they'relike good luck.
Yeah, how do you do that?
(39:28):
How do you, how do you do that?
I just don't, I don'tunderstand that.
So I thought that that was.
I at least want to talk aboutit.
Um, you know, I would say, youknow, the best of luck and all
those wonderful things for, butI don't think she needs it.
I think she's going to be able.
She's doing such a tremendousjob creating content.
That it's you know.
I'm just excited to see whereshe goes next.
Speaker 2 (39:49):
So she's not going to go into one little thing.
Speaker 1 (39:51):
She's got options galore yeah, and I mean I sent
her a message asking hersomething and she pops up and
she says she's like man, I'm sosorry I haven't responded, I'm
just inundated with stuff.
I was like that's so cool, youknow, and then her car got
stolen like three days later.
It's like dude, oh well, anyway, what else do we have going on
(40:12):
here?
Let's see Wi-Fi 7 on the newiPhone 16.
What are your thoughts on that,mr Mark?
Speaker 2 (40:22):
Ooh, I'm like this iPhone 15.
Speaker 1 (40:25):
Pro, I'm debating.
Bye.
Oh no, I've been debating.
I got to go get a new one.
Speaker 2 (40:29):
Wi-Fi 7 was the one thing I was like.
If they don't have Wi-Fi 7,absolutely not, I'm not buying a
new one.
They put Wi-Fi 7 in it and soI'm like damn On all models.
Speaker 1 (40:39):
I thought I was really happy to see that it was
across the board and I'minterested to see how that fares
into the amount of utilizationthat is had on these devices and
what we're going to see onnetworks that is had on these
devices and what we're going tosee on networks.
When we deployed Signal Roam oras my kids call it, sigma Roam
(40:59):
just for all the gats out there,for all the little kids, little
freaking brain rot generation,I love it when we deployed Sigma
Roam at a local school district, everything was working great
and all of a sudden I get thisphone call and they're like hey,
we had to turn it off.
And I said, oh dude, why?
What happened?
Was it not working?
They're like nah, man, justeveryone jumped on this one AP.
(41:20):
We weren't expecting it and wedidn't have any balancing across
the network and limited numberof devices connected and we
hadn't really done our homeworkon on leveling out the network.
And then we just deployedpasspoint for t-mobile and at&t
and, like, all of a sudden, apsget inundated you join the first
ap.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
They walk past when they enter the building right
yeah.
Speaker 1 (41:42):
So I'm wondering I'm happy to see wi-fi 7 on that
note.
Some some cool stats.
Check this out.
I saw that one this morningskyrocketing usage data from uh,
from our friends over at rcr,wireless news intelligence on
all things wireless, miss misskatherine nin says.
According to the cti report,americans use more than 100
trillion megabytes of wirelessdata in 2023.
(42:03):
The cti found the demand forwireless data in the us has
skyrocketed, with americansusing more than 100 trillion
megabytes per second or no, notmegabytes per second.
Meg or no, not megabytes persecond megabytes total
representing the largestsingle-year increase ever
recorded.
For reference, 2023 saw a 36%increase to 26 trillion
megabytes, an increase over 22,and now over 100 trillion
(42:28):
megabytes of wireless data.
Man, and that's CTIAti right,so that's over the carrier
networks.
I wonder, does that includewi-fi offload?
I wonder maybe well, I mean, arethey counting?
Let's see, 5g is increasinglyembedded into the way americans
live and work.
Nearly 40 of all wirelessdevices have a 5g connection.
Okay, 34 over increase over2022.
(42:51):
Total number of wirelessconnections of 558 million, more
than 1.6 wireless connectionsfor every american.
Wow, yeah, so lots, lots goingon there, man.
So cti with some, with somegreat numbers for everyone.
Um, what do you think?
You think wi-fi 7 is going toincrease the number of people to
connect to networks?
(43:11):
Got?
Speaker 2 (43:15):
to have Wi-Fi 7 AP.
Got to have Wi-Fi 7 client.
Speaker 1 (43:20):
It's going to take a few years.
It's coming, so check this out.
On another note, look at thisthing.
Look, that's still.
I got to figure out thoselittle screens, man, hold on.
I think I almost got it.
Let's see if I go replace andthen I click on here.
This is the part that I have toedit out from the audio version
of the podcast drew not knowinghow to screen share properly on
(43:42):
a presentation.
Dude, check this.
Did you see this?
This week, chinese scientistsget out of here have developed
an electromagnetic vortex cannon.
What, what's up?
Yeah, man, look at this thing.
I don't know what's going on inthe corner over here.
Vortex rings in air andelectromagnetic waves are
fascinating structures.
Okay, this is like if you eversmoked a cigar or a cigarette
(44:04):
and you blow smoke rings.
So this is the same thing.
So I've got one of those bigair cannons Like you can pull
back and shoot and it likeshoots invisible air, yeah, so
it took me a second to figureout why this was important.
I'm not going to lie.
I was like what the hell arethese guys talking about?
Dude, are you, have you readabout this?
I have not.
(44:25):
It's the first time I'm hearingthis.
Vortex rings blah, blah, blah,blah, blah, blah, blah.
They wirelize those vortexrings, a mysterious and
fascinating natural phenomenon,displayed breathtaking
structures.
But the key here is Hold on Isthe word that I don't know how
to pronounce God.
I wish there was someone whocould help me out with this.
Okay, so, there's an air cannon,here's an electromagnetic
(44:46):
cannon, and they they're notcalled sky rims, what are they
called?
They're called something else,but they use these vortex pulses
to do this, and the idea, is itdisruption?
Yeah, no, no, no, no, no.
Higher levels of modulation,okay, oh, wow, because now
(45:07):
you're not just modulating on anXY axis, right, you're
modulating on a rotating XYyaxis.
So, yeah, so check it out.
So let's see if I get thisright.
So they shoot this, this, thiselect this.
Yeah, I'm imagining a smokering, right, they shoot the
smoke ring and it's no longerjust vertically and horizontally
(45:29):
polarized, it's rotating,vertically and horizontally
polarized.
So if, if you can stack bitsper Hertz, not just like this,
but as it moves, now you havethe ability to crank more data
out of it.
It's, it's not I forgot whatit's called, it's not Skyrim.
Hold on, it's in here somewhere, electromagnetic vortex cannon.
(45:51):
You know, these are the thingsyou find only on the waves.
Wireless podcast generates aninstantaneous, instantaneous
pressure difference.
It forms vortex rings whichmaintain their shape and energy
over long distances.
So imagine this, this infinitesmoke ring cruising, and imagine
you have a way to modulate onthat electromagnetic pulses with
(46:11):
complex topological features.
There, there it is skyrims.
He says skirmions, skirmions.
I I've never heard anyone usethis word, dude.
Someone give me a, someone giveme a uh, a pronunciation on
this.
But they make these things thatshowcase remarkable resilience
(46:32):
and self-healing propertiesduring propagation vast and
exciting high capacitycommunication systems.
These vortex pulses couldrevolutionize how we transmit
information by operatingefficient, robust methods of
data encoding.
The unique spectral andpolarization characteristics of
the vortex rings allow them tocarry more information compared
to today, compared totraditional waves, making them
(46:52):
ideal candidates for nextgeneration Dude, and they
maintain structural integrity inthe presence of environmental
disturbances.
It's a valuable tool in remotesensing and targeting detection.
Speaker 2 (47:08):
Like I'm blown away with this just because the
picture was like that lookspretty cool, Anyway.
Speaker 1 (47:14):
So yeah.
So now, how do we get so who'sgoing to be the first
manufacturer?
We've got wi-fi 7 that does mlo.
We've got wi-fi 8 that doesmulti-ap and ml, mlo on multiple
aps.
How do we get an ap that doesmlo, multi-frequency
electromagnetic vortexaggregation, so that, like when
(47:35):
the two vortex you send it hereand it meets right there, right
where you need it, when you needit let's go, man, let's go.
Oh my gosh yeah it sounds stupidthat we're laughing at it.
Look, reference this podcast inyou know uh, 9, 13, 20, 31 and
tell me how dumb it sounds then.
Anyway, I thought that waspretty cool, dude, that was a
(47:57):
much more complex.
Yeah, yeah, I think those werethe main stories that I had this
week.
I don't know if you know, but Ido want to end a little bit on
a sad note the passing ofsomeone named Jim Hong and I
don't know if you ever got achance to work with Jim, but Jim
Hong was.
I met him when he was withOrthogon Systems before their
(48:20):
acquisition by Cambium Networks,and Jim was one of the smartest
people I ever knew and one ofthe best people I ever got to
work with, and I'll never forget.
He always had three things thatyou could find with Jim Hong,
and anyone who knows him knowswhat they are, and I'm not even
sure that I should say them.
So if you remember Jim, justremember the three things that
he always used to carry with him, and I always thought that that
(48:41):
was hilarious.
So condolences to his family.
There is a memorial servicegoing on for him, and another
person I found out had recentlypassed away, which is Mr Drew
Mooney, who I met at Motorolaalso.
So Drew Mooney and Jim Hong,there's a memorial service
planned for them at Wispapaloozathis year.
(49:02):
So if you're going and you wantto spend some time reliving
some great memories about theHonger and Mr Mooney.
Drew Mooney was like I rememberone time funny story about Drew
Mooney.
I remember one time I wasapplying for a job and going
through the whole process and Ifound out that the person that I
was talking to didn't know theywere talking to Drew Lentz.
They thought they were talkingto Drew Mooney and they're like
man, I love you and we'reinterviewing this other guy and
(49:25):
I think he's got the same name,but we really like you and
you're the candidate we want togo with.
I was like, oh, that's great.
And I found out later that itwas meant for mooney and I was
like son of a bitch, like I waslike wait a minute, I don't have
any experience working atalcatel, lucent or wherever it
was, and so, uh, unfortunatelysad, sad to know that those two
(49:46):
guys are gone, but glad I got tospend some time with them.
So, um, shout out yeah, totalbummer man.
Speaker 2 (49:51):
But he was over.
Speaker 1 (49:52):
Yeah good guys.
Anyway, hey, I reallyappreciate you joining me, mark.
I know we had a great time atMobility Field Day and it's
great to catch up.
I mean, you got anything goingon.
Anything you want to chit-chatabout?
Speaker 2 (50:05):
I will be at Edge Field Day next week.
Oh nice, yeah, I got invited tothat one with those guys.
Speaker 1 (50:11):
Sweet.
Speaker 2 (50:11):
Nice, yeah, I got invited to that one with those
guys, with Steven.
So, talking about edge stuff,less wireless, more wired yeah,
there is.
There is possibility with likeprivate cellular stuff with some
edge things so well yeah, yeah,that's a.
Speaker 1 (50:28):
that is an interesting I don't know who's
presenting at that, I haven't, Ihaven't looked it up, but I
know that, if you look at thething that that piqued my
interest a couple of weeks Iguess months back now is the new
700 series from aruba and beingable to run container uh,
containerized applications and,and you know, cisco falling suit
with some of their 9100s andyou know, I think that's, I
(50:50):
think that was something thatthey had mentioned is being able
to run edge services on thosedevices and what the benefit to
it is, not just from an AIperspective, because everyone
can build AI into whatever thehell they want, but like from a
real world operationsperspective.
You know, is uh, any, is thereanyone presenting in that does
wireless also?
(51:10):
Um, no, that I, not that I knowof that.
Speaker 2 (51:12):
does wireless also?
No, not that I know of.
Speaker 1 (51:14):
So Zendaya, Damn it Hollingsworth.
I know right, Get your shittogether.
Speaker 2 (51:18):
I went to Edgefield day one and they had a network
company.
Speaker 1 (51:21):
They weren't wireless yeah they got you right there,
right, and then they justdropped it.
They just terrible joke.
Speaker 2 (51:28):
But I'm like I'm hoping I'm going to push and see
they're more of the data centercontrolling the Kubernetes and
the Dockers containers and stuff.
They could work with the Wi-Fior the cellular people or
whoever, but they're morefocused on that side.
We'll see how that goes.
(51:49):
Nice, after that is MeterUp.
I will be there with you.
Speaker 1 (51:54):
Yes yes, meter up.
I have high expectations formeter up.
Um, it's gonna be, it's gonnabe great to be around uh, around
you all and around a bunch ofbunch of other fun folks.
Um, if you don't know whatmeter up is, go, look at, go to
metercom, look, look for theirevents called MeterUp.
It's happening October 2nd inSan Francisco and it's there's
(52:17):
an open invite that's out there.
You have to apply, you, you,you ask for a seat and if they
give you a seat, then you comejoin us.
But that's going to show us theentire world of meter in one
day which I've seen with and itblew my mind and it I was, so I
was so blown away.
So I don't know if you noticed,but I went there the day before
(52:38):
mobility field day.
Speaker 2 (52:39):
Yeah, I remember that .
Speaker 1 (52:41):
And I was like everything you guys are showing
me sucks Compared to what I justsaw.
Like this is like M and M liketell me something about me, I
don't know already you know.
And so I walked in with thiscompletely jaded mentality.
That's not true.
I walked in being exposed tosome things that I was like wow,
it really put life in adifferent perspective.
(53:02):
And now that Command has comeout, now you can understand why.
I was just like okay, tie thisto three years from now.
So it was great.
It's going to be great to seeMeter doing that.
Speaker 2 (53:18):
And then WLpc.
Are you going to prague?
Speaker 1 (53:19):
I am supposed to, I'm still figuring a few things out
, that's.
I'm like, I'm like, I'mpresenting, so I better go right
.
Yeah, well, I'm looking to go.
I, I have a.
I have a request out forsomeone to sponsor the waves
podcast at wlpc prague.
If you know anyone who wants tosponsor the waves podcast,
either at at WLPC Prague oranywhere else, drop me a line.
Uh, that's what I'm doing rightnow.
I'm actually dude.
I'm doing some sick stuff.
You, if you happen to findyourself in Alaska next week,
(53:40):
I'm going to Alaska to uh, to dosome engineering and design for
a port in Alaska, forcommunications, for wifi.
No-transcript minute.
(54:25):
It's a tablet.
The tablet isn't the fun part.
It's got a cool little case onit.
It's not the tablet that makesmakes it fun, it's this little
guy right here.
There it is, and so there, myZoom's all messed up.
So shout out to my peeps at IBWave.
This is actually a really easyto use device.
It's a lot easier than Ithought it was going to be.
(54:46):
I've got a full review of itcoming up soon.
It works really well to show mewhat's going on in the cell
spectrum and the cbrs spectrum,and they have been very patient
because they sent that and Isaid well, I want to use it on
my trip to alaska and they said,all right, fine, we'll wait.
So shout out to the team at ivywave for being patient.
Um, and then, what else?
(55:06):
Ces is coming up?
Um, the things conference.
I, I tweet and retweet andrepost about the things
Conference that's coming up andI think that it's.
When is that?
Oh man, it's probably this week.
I can look it up.
It's.
Let me see.
The Things Conference.
I want to go to this thing sobad and I've always wanted to go
(55:28):
to it ever since I learnedabout it.
The Things Conference is thishuge Laura, when it's a 2526
September, so it's in 12 daysit's in Amsterdam and it's all
things IoT and Laura when, andit is like it is so much fun to
watch what they do there, allthe postings that pop up.
So if you don't know about it,just look for the hashtag the
(55:50):
things conference and if youhave any interest in IoT or any
interest in Laura when, that isdefinitely the spot to be at
it's.
There's such a good group ofpeople and they always have the
coolest toys.
And then what else we gotcoming up?
Um, wlpc February, ces inJanuary.
I love CES.
Um, I don't know, man, busy,busy calendars, busy schedules.
Speaker 2 (56:12):
WLPC is open for presentation.
Call for presentation.
Speaker 1 (56:16):
Yes, WLPC Phoenix is open for presentation.
The call for papers is outright now.
If you have always wanted topresent at WLPC and you didn't
know how, this is the first step.
You submit an abstract.
You go on the website, go toWLPC and look up WLPC and find
it, and you submit your abstractand then they turn on community
voting and people vote for thepresentations that they want to
(56:36):
see.
So if there's something thatinterests you, it probably
interests someone else.
Get online, post about it,don't be scared.
It's not scary, it's scary tothink about.
And then you get there andyou're just like these are all
my friends, like these are allpeople I know, or these are all
people that I've seen online, orthese are all people that are
genuinely interested, because bythe time you make it to the
stage, you got to realize thateveryone has already told you
(56:59):
how much they want to see youpresent.
So there's nothing to beterrified about.
Speaker 2 (57:03):
Yep exactly how it goes.
And then you become more wellknown, you get your name out
there and then you get end up onthe waves podcast here, yeah,
there you go, speaking of ifanyone wants to join.
Speaker 1 (57:14):
Uh, yeah, I'll start bringing on some guests here and
there, but I think, uh, I think, mr muhammad's gonna be the
next one.
I think, you know he, he chimesin enough.
But if anyone wants to join thewaves podcast, let me know.
I think that's it.
That's for this week.
Man, is this an hour and seven?
It's the longest waves I thinkI've done, but we're gonna go
ahead and push it and have somefun with it.
We've had, we've we've held onto about 100 viewers this whole
time, which is great.
(57:34):
So I appreciate everyonelistening and tuning in.
I've tried to answer all thequestions in the little chat
overlay.
It's been very busy.
Uh, let's see, there ain't lastwords on there that I didn't,
that I didn't post up, butthat's it, man.
That's all I got.
Have a wonderful weekend.
Mark dude, thank you forjoining.
Great to catch up, man umawesome yeah, pay attention,
(57:55):
dude, you've got, you've gotsocial media stuff, right, yeah,
I got markoutscom.
Speaker 2 (57:59):
so my blog is where I post most of my stuff and
linkedin and you do you do writesome you do a very, very good
job blog.
Speaker 1 (58:06):
I really enjoy reading your articles and and if
no one's following you onlinkedin, please go follow.
Follow mark on linkedin as well.
Okay, that's it.
That's all I got.
I hope everybody has awonderful week.
From everyone, the WavesPodcast, which is me, and Mark,
have a wonderful week and wewill see you all next time.
Bye.
you well.
Hello.
Good morning, what's up, dude.
How's it going, mark?
Great how you doing, man,fantastic.
Welcome everybody.
My name is drew lenz, I'm thewireless nerd and today I've got
my special buddy mark on withus.
You know, I figured every weekright, I just sit here and I
crank out the little podcast.
I have fun talking to myselfand and it's okay, you know.
(00:21):
But then it's like, why notinvite someone else?
Whoa look at that?
Why not invite?
someone else to come join thejoin the fun.
Especially.
I feel like I've been talking alot about 5g and cbrs and lte
and all those things.
I was like dude, you postedtrim this light down a bit.
You posted something this pastweek out, like with fernet or
(00:44):
something on a one wheel, and Iwas like dude, what the hell
anyway?
Uh, welcome everybody.
Thanks again for tuning in ahuge celebratory week for me.
Crossed a thousand subscriberson youtube and like cue the
applause.
I, you know I gotta get mystuff together and like figure
out little but bit of the noise.
(01:04):
Anyone who knows me, uh, whohas listened to the podcast or
seen me you know be obnoxiouswherever it is knows that I had
a bet with my wife and she saidif you can cross a thousand
subscribers on YouTube, I willbuy you a trip to Mexico.
So Mexico, here I come.
I told her this weekend I waslike there you go, babe, we're
going to mexico.
So, uh, I'm gonna post wavesfrom the waves.
(01:26):
I think I'm gonna do cancun.
I think that's anyway nice.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
So lots of fun stuff to cover this week.
Speaker 1 (01:32):
But first mark, I want you to introduce yourself
to anyone who does, who may notknow you.
Who are you, what do you do,where you're from, etc.
Etc.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
Etc everything about mark house.
Um, uh, I am a network engineerfor a bunch of school districts
up here in utah um, that's howI know for nay and keith um, I
live about an hour from both ofthem, so, but I have gotten
heavily into the privatecellular world.
Um, that's where I've got a lotof my followers is in the
(01:59):
private cellular world, but I amalso cwne 500.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
That was pretty yeah, it shows on your little uh, on
your little LinkedIn badge thereit says CW and E five.
Love it, man.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
So I I've been in the , I've been doing the wifi thing
for since about 2007.
So I've been in wifi for a lotlonger than private.
So there, obviously, but we gotsome, I got started in private,
so there it in private cellularbefore cbrs was really a thing.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
So you know, and playing with all the waves dude
for real and you know it's, Ifind that.
I find that there's people whowho have been playing in the
space as long as we have and youknow, we, we do a lot in wi-fi
right, and so every day I feellike we're just surrounded by
wi-fi people talking about Wi-Fistuff and there's so much more
out there.
My background, in case anyonecares, or whatever, is I started
(02:51):
building Internet serviceproviders and then started doing
wireless Internet serviceproviders and doing
point-to-multipoint and WiMAX.
And I got to mention a wordthat I hadn't used in years the
other day on a phone call.
I was talking about Navini andour deployment of Navini down in
South Texas.
So when you talk about WiMAXand LTE and all that, it's so
much fun.
And then Wi-Fi is just like thistiny little piece that
(03:11):
everybody uses.
But there's so much more outthere and I think, as we see,
you know, as we see, theconvergence actually now finally
really starting to happen.
It's so intriguing to mebecause I I'm seeing two worlds
come together right, and cbrsdid a lot with that.
I mean they, there was a lot todo with, with opening up those
(03:33):
frequency bands, opening up band48, figuring out how to onboard
devices you know into, in, youknow onto the infrastructure.
But now I mean I love the idea.
I don't think we'll ever see asingle device that does
everything.
I mean we probably won't see aWi-Fi device that does CBRS, but
we'll probably see a CBRSdevice that does Wi-Fi.
I would imagine that would comefirst.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Well, this in your pocket does both.
Speaker 1 (03:57):
Well, I mean like a base station or an access point
I'm like there's clients outthere.
So, real quick, there are somethings I want to talk about that
are happening this week.
But first, look, so I'm using,I'm using, I like restream, I
always use restream.
So if you're listening restream, feel free to give me a free
subscription because it'sexpensive but it's totally worth
(04:19):
it.
But so I'm trying to figure outthe little studio thing, what.
I'm going to jump on yourLinkedIn real quick and I want
to show what it is that.
Let me see that I was lookingat from you.
Let's see, all right, where wasit?
You show all posts.
Let's see if I can find outwhat's going on with you here.
(04:39):
Where is that picture there,there?
Okay, I've got brought up.
I don't you know.
Hopefully anyone who's watchingcan see that.
Dude, tell me, what the hellwere you doing like?
What tell me about?
Tell me about this set ofpictures what is this cow and uh
and what is this spectrum?
Speaker 2 (04:59):
tell me, tell me what's going on in these photos,
man, so so back about two yearsago, fernay and Keith kind of
got me onto this whole idea.
They were doing some Wi-Fisurveys at a high school
football field here in Utah inthe Salt Lake Valley and they
(05:20):
were just wanting to test somedifferent things and they kept
getting reflections off thebleachers and off buildings and
stuff, some different things.
And they kept gettingreflections off the bleachers
and off buildings and stuff, andso they they kind of had they.
They didn't get a real greatcoverage of how far an AP went.
So they came up with this ideato take it out to the salt flats
, which the great salt lake, um,just West of salt lake city, um
, if you keep going West of that, just before you reach, uh,
(05:44):
nevada, wendover, nevada,there's a big flat uh lake bed
that they call the Bonnevillesalt flats.
Around the world there'smultiple salt flats that are
very similar, some bigger onesin other countries, but um but
um but uh, so the salt flats arejust a big flat area of salt.
(06:07):
It's miles and miles and milesof just flat.
So for name, keith test severalyears ago tested out wifi and
then about two years ago Ichatted with for name, we went
back and we're testing wifi thenand but after that.
But at the same time I was like, let's test CBRS out there as
well.
And so a buddy of mine inInfernae and his kids and some
(06:33):
other friends, we went out thereand did some testing with CBRS.
We had the radio about 15 feetoff the ground, so the Fresnel
zone was getting was hitting theground.
Not a great setup, but wedidn't have.
It was a last minute planplanning and things, so we we
didn't get very far.
We got about two miles out ofthis radio.
It was crazy.
On our drive back we have aschool district that has one on
(06:55):
top of it.
We got about 12 miles out ofthat one, which is we're like,
how do it was crazy.
But uh, we wanted to go back andtest and so we had this has
been two years in planning abuddy of mine at Murray School
District A lot of people in theprivate cellular world know him,
but he bought this trailer thathas a 60-foot map.
(07:19):
Oh, that's the cow, that's thecow.
And so we're like this willhelp us set things up quicker.
We'll be able to set it upquicker instead of cause last
time it took us like all dayjust to get the thing set up.
We had like two hours to justdo any testing.
This time we had it up and hada lot more time to be able to
(07:40):
test, but so we stuck to CBSradios on there.
We were going to test band 41as well.
We have a license for band 41for the area Um, but we didn't
get to that.
We ran out of time for that.
But we were able to test twoCBS radios, I think they were
both by cells.
One might've been Nokia, Ican't remember Um, but we got
four miles out of those acrossthat salt flats.
Speaker 1 (08:06):
So, man, and what?
So?
What was the client device thatyou guys were using when you
were testing these out?
Speaker 2 (08:12):
So we had a Nokia phone.
It's basically a big Androidphone but it was pretty.
It was actually a pretty ruggedeyes, really nice device.
We were we were testing 5g.
One of the radios was 5g, theother one was LTE, so we were
testing 5g.
One of the radios was 5g, theother one was lte, so we were
testing both um, but this devicewas 5g.
We had some other devices we'regoing to test, but we they
(08:34):
didn't end up working in themoment, so we had issues with
them, but I I took the um, uh,spectran v6, the the device.
So I captured, I that.
In that that one of thosepictures, it's me.
They're holding this, theSpectran V6.
Yeah, let me see as I'm drivingalong, as my buddy's driving
(08:56):
along, the side by side, so I'mholding it, and so I captured
for five miles, um, the spectrum, that's awesome, as the signal
slowly decreased, decreased,decreased, decreased, decreased,
until it was barely visible.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
How far do you think?
What was the maximum amountthat you got out of it?
Like speeds, no, no, no.
Distance, oh distance.
Speaker 2 (09:19):
So just past four miles is where it kind of
started to drop.
Is it usable, though?
Just past four miles is wherewhere it kind of started to drop
.
We, we, we had.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
Is it usable?
Speaker 2 (09:29):
Four miles was usable .
Yeah, we were doing speed testsat four miles and it was usable
and that's 30.
Speaker 1 (09:34):
That was CBRS bands 3,600, 3,650 CBRS bands Wow.
We have five miles an iPhone,but it was not usable.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
So flat surface, yeah , five miles An iPhone still had
signal, but it was not usable.
Speaker 1 (09:45):
Flat surface.
15 feet, though, is what yousaid.
Speaker 2 (09:47):
Huh, this time it's 60.
60 feet off the ground.
Speaker 1 (09:51):
Oh, okay, all right.
Wow 15 feet, we got two miles.
Man, that's awesome.
And I think when I've used itobviously not in that
environment, but when I look atthe environments I've put it in
where it's like in cities orschool districts or whatever we
see, maybe with a, with a, buysales like a four, 36, I think
(10:13):
we'll and a and a standard UElike a standard phone, we'll see
, maybe, you know, maybe a mileyou throw some trees in there,
it's like half a mile, somethinglike that.
So we draw a cell size about amile from edge to edge.
You know, but yeah, I can'timagine.
And I live in South Texas,right, so flat but lots of trees
and lots of low brush.
(10:33):
So you know, it shows you howmuch not interference, but how
much physical structure makes adifference and things like that.
What were some of the lessonslearned?
Okay, was there anythingsurprising about that test?
Because I mean it's.
It's very rare that you get achance to just go out and spend
a day just messing with stuffand having a good time.
Was there anything that youbrought back from that?
And you're like dude, that'slike I.
(10:54):
I'm so glad I did it, becausethe I mean in the erronea
product you're using.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
That's awesome height definitely helps.
Um, the antennas higher, yeah,um, that is, that is a big thing
.
Getting it 15 feet off theground, going to 60, you can
double your distance.
Wow, that's a big thing.
So get it high as possible.
Um, I other the thing aboutprivate cellular, if you're
(11:20):
trying to reach kids at home orthings like that.
Um, the reason they have towersso high on the the carrier side
, um is you're trying to gothrough the roof, not through
the side of the wall.
A little more.
You're trying to get it throughthe roof because it's a little
less.
Speaker 1 (11:40):
Um, yeah, there's not great.
There's not brick up there.
Maybe it's well, it depends.
I mean, it depends on the, thematerial.
Now here's another question.
Jeremy's asking on on the chatwhat was the noise floor there
versus downtown slc?
Speaker 2 (11:52):
uh, I mean on the flats was neg 105, I think I
remember right awesome was thenoise floor.
It was like great.
Nothing, no signals any,anything at all.
Speaker 1 (12:04):
So yeah, oh, he also I'm sure it's much much lower.
Yeah, man, you know, we saw,when I deployed cbrs here in in
mcallen, we put up 24 baystations of cambia and we did a
thousand street lights, uh, withsubscriber units on them and
our noise floor is in three.
(12:25):
In the cbrs spectrum was in thenight, you know, in the high
90s, um it was, you know it waslike 90, I mean 94 to 96, I
would say was pretty average.
We did have some areas, uh,where it dipped, where it
changed a little bit.
You know, 89 to 94, um, not nota lot of traffic.
We would see it as we gotcloser to the border we'd see
more traffic, more bleed overtraffic from what was happening
in mexico, because I'm, you know, 89 to 94, um, not not a lot of
traffic.
We would see it as we gotcloser to the border we'd see
(12:46):
more traffic, more bleed overtraffic from what was happening
in mexico, because I'm, you know, I'm 10 minutes away, five
minutes away, but even at that,uh, it always you know the
conversation about how well doesspectrum allocation services
work, right, how well does theSaaS work?
And I, the only problems that weexperienced after running that
(13:06):
network for two years and andhaving it fully deployed didn't
have anything to do withspectrum.
It had to do with when Amazonhad the outage, when federated
had the outage, you know, whenGoogle had the outage.
It was like that was.
The problem is, all of a sudden, no frequencies were getting
allocated, all the equipmentstarted freaking out.
The problem is, all of a sudden, no frequencies were getting
(13:26):
allocated, all the equipmentstarted freaking out.
So hopefully that's been.
You know there's a path toresolution there, but did you
see?
You know, did you see anything?
Anything that was concerningother than you know?
You talked about the happy part, but did you see anything
concerning where?
You're like ooh, I got to watchfor that.
Also, I need to get these cupsprinted, so my logo is on the on
the other side.
When I drink, I'm like, yeah,you do oh things sorry.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
What was the question ?
Speaker 1 (13:52):
did you see anything?
First, it just made me think ofa talk show, so I need to send
you a mug now that you've been aguest.
Since I have mugs, I'm going tosend you a mug.
Um, did you see anythingconcerning where you're like?
Oh, that's something Idefinitely have to watch out for
, where next time you deploy,what's going to pop into your
head.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
Going back to your original thing there with SAS.
Sas is really there to protectincumbents.
It's not really there toprotect the GAA people.
It is a little bit but notreally.
And so, as I've learned andplayed with this stuff over the
last four years, it's.
It's kind of, if you're doingga, it may take you some time to
(14:33):
get a grant but you most likelywill get at least some of a
grant, especially with howlimited private sellers cbrs
still is deployed.
Um, in a lot of areas likebigger cities it's deployed a
lot more.
But in smaller rural areas likewhere I live in these areas
there's nothing in that band andso the SAS is kind of not.
(14:54):
There is more there to protectincumbents and so you're kind of
guaranteed not guaranteed, buthave a better opportunity to get
a chance to get Spectrum.
Have a better opportunity toget a chance to get spectrum.
Um.
Beyond that, things we learnedout there, um, um.
It works great at speed.
Um, you can keep things goingsuper fast.
(15:14):
That's one of the benefits ofthis is you get distance and
speed.
Um, the salt flats is known forspeed records.
Yeah, I saw a Bonneville saltflats salt flats man, the good
year.
Speaker 1 (15:26):
What was the name of that car it's.
I was a guinness book of worldrecords nerd when I was a kid
and it was like the good year.
It was the fastest vehicle evermade and it was done on the
bonneville salt flats, likethat's where people test, where
they test the racy cars, youknow.
Speaker 2 (15:40):
But the week.
Last weekend, before we wentout there, they uh had a local
group out there doing some speedtests.
They came and picked up theporta potties and the garbage
bins and all that stuff whilewe're sitting there.
But uh, so it's it's.
Speaker 1 (15:55):
It's definitely a good place to test speed 763
miles per hour set by thrust sCin 1997.
Yep.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
That's where I was, was that place, so forget about
it.
If you need, if you need speed,so there's a way to go.
Wifi absolutely can't, can'tkeep up because you have to hop,
hop, hop, hop, hop.
Yeah, well, okay.
Speaker 1 (16:21):
So for that, okay.
So in small, in close proximity, though, if you're not at
Bonneville Salt Flats, if you'rein an office space and you've
deployed less 5G than you haveWi-Fi, for example, one device
for every five or ten orwhatever your magic formula is.
There is no magic formula.
Sorry, if anyone was lookingfor that magic formula.
(16:42):
There's no magic formula.
Use cases vary.
But if you have less deployedand you're trying to do more
with less, that's where I wouldsay, well, I don't know, it
depends on what your deploymenttechnique is.
Let me ask you another question,because I got asked this this
week and I didn't want to answer.
I tried to dodge the questionbecause I didn't just didn't
(17:04):
want to say, I didn't just wantto flat out say no.
Deploying CBRS for UEconnectivity outdoors.
What are your thoughts withthat?
Where it's and what I mean bythat is and I'm sure you know,
you know.
But for anyone who doesn't knowwhat I mean by that deploying a
CBRS outdoor base station toconnect to mobile phone devices,
(17:24):
outdoor base station to connectto mobile phone devices, uh,
what are your thoughts of ofdoing that, like in a park or in
an outside area or a stadium,or to cover a courtyard or
something like that, somethingto do or something to stay the
hell away from um, if you're, itall depends on if you have
control over the ues.
Speaker 2 (17:38):
If it's just general public, neutral, host is still.
It's it, as you talked aboutlast week, it's, it's coming,
yeah, but it's.
Speaker 1 (17:48):
Let's say that neutral host is there.
Let's say that there is anequipment, that the equipment
does support neutral host and Ican walk outside and and this is
leading into questions I havefor you about helium and x net
is helium outdoor deploying abicell space station, turning it
on?
X net just announced that theirpartnership with a carrier.
And then you scroll back andyou see everything says AT&T on
(18:10):
their website or on theirTwitter.
But you deploy XNet outside andit's in your neighborhood and
now you've got people walking inyour neighborhood using AT&T
over CBRS offloaded to XNet.
I am not a fan of that model.
Um, I think that there's toomuch.
There's just a lot there, man,and and I'm a little, I'm a
(18:33):
little curious how that's goingto work out.
Is that something you would door is that something you stay
away from?
And also, do you have anyexperience?
Speaker 2 (18:40):
I've been approached by the xNet guys to design
something in downtown Salt Lakewith Jeremy there.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
Him and I were approached.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
I turned it down for that kind of reason.
The issue.
So, Paul and Mobile was anotherbig kick.
One of these guys Ah, I forgotabout them that were very, very
heavy did a lot of stuff.
We're really trying to pushthis and build this off the
crypto wave and then theypartnered with T-Mobile.
How they partnered withT-Mobile, devices could join
(19:18):
T-Mobile or could join you, soif you're in an area that has
T-Mobile coverage, the device isnever going to join you at that
point, and so once thathappened, everybody dumped their
base stations onto eBay.
I bought a bunch of them offeBay.
Yeah, they were off eBay Becauseall of a sudden, they were
making this crypto that had verylittle value and suddenly they
(19:40):
weren't getting their money back, and so I'm not saying X net's
going to have the same issue.
Um, these guys are tryingtrying to avoid following the
same path, but, as they part thebenefit, if they partner with
at&t and you have these basestations in areas where at&t has
(20:00):
coverage, you're definitelygoing to potentially have some
issues with that.
Speaker 1 (20:06):
Yeah and that.
So that raises the questionright.
And and there's, there's somuch that has to be done from a
coordination perspective.
And I I remember the first someof the first reasons I got
involved in doing this were toset it up and to see how
difficult is it to set up, andalso, as someone who's deployed
a bunch of CBRS, understandingall of the things that are
involved to do that, I was likewhat is the process for setting
(20:28):
it up and how are theyprotecting that?
Like, if I'm setting up a CBRSbase station and I have to say
this is where it's installed,and lock in the GPS and take
three pictures and an azimuthand a picture with a calculator
or a compass or whatever it is,they make you do all these
things to deploy it.
You know then and that's great,but the guardrails are then
(20:50):
that you have said that this iswhere it's deployed.
But what if the local holidayparade happens down the street
for me and I go hey, here's agreat opportunity for me to earn
some token.
I'm just going to stick thatthing in the trunk of my car and
drive down to the holidayparade and light it up, and sure
as shit, everybody jumps onlineand then someone makes a 911
call and then what?
(21:13):
And so I look at what they'redoing and I look at what.
And kudos to them.
I'm not trying to naysay, Imean I love it.
I'm an early adopter, love it,think it's a great idea.
I just see that there's so manythings that have to happen for
that to work successfully thatit's fascinating.
(21:33):
And then you look at whatHelium's doing, and again with
XNet, where they essentially youset up a base station and in
XNet's case you have to buytheir equipment.
Right, doesn't work on anyoneelse's equipment yet except for
theirs.
So you purchase their equipment, you turn it on, you activate
it and the more people that useyour network they give you money
in the form of their token, sothat you earn token, the more
(21:55):
people that use your stuff andit gives you a certain rate.
You know, I don't know whatit's at right now, but they pay
you at a certain rate worth oftheir token, something,
apparently, somewhere.
And that's a way that you cansay hey, I can justify deploying
all this equipment because nowI'm earning money for the people
(22:16):
that are using this stuff.
But is that?
I mean, how?
How far will it go.
I wrote down two things on aphone call I was talking about,
you know.
One of them is is who's got theliability for e911 when someone
moves their base station?
Right, because keep in mindthat people are gonna going to
be deploying tens of thousandsof these things, hundreds of
(22:36):
thousands of these things.
There's going to be people thatjust move it.
There's going to be, especiallyif they see a chance,
inevitable, yeah.
And then I have no idea what Iwrote.
I don't know what letters theseare.
I can't read my own handwriting, but you know, oh, traction, it
says traction.
But what do you think thetraction is going to be?
As things, now that at&t andx-net have talked, or now x-net
(23:00):
has talked about having apartnership that we're assuming
is at&t, do you think, how welldo you think that that's going
to take off?
Any ideas?
Speaker 2 (23:07):
thoughts on those guys indoors.
As jr put a good, good commentthere.
He said outdoor isn't the playwith seabreast, in his opinion.
I, yep, I agree.
It depends, your use casedepends.
I'm like private seller, nonoutdoor absolutely yeah, neutral
host outdoor is not your playcarriers, unless you're in a
(23:29):
rural area where there's nocoverage of anybody or your
specific carrier, then maybe.
But he says macro networks arenot the problem.
Indoor is the problem Indoor?
If you have a building wherecoverage does not penetrate down
the basement or something, abasement or something.
(23:55):
This absolutely, as you said,as you talked about last week,
with um neutral host andreplacing your um dashes
absolutely this could be a bigplay for those sites at scale in
a big stadium or somethingabsolutely go with a dash.
Speaker 1 (24:06):
Still, because you're using carrier spectrum, you
don't have as much spectrum withcbrs, but with cbrs in a small
building or in a basement orsomething, this absolutely could
be a good partnership with at&tto help provide coverage yeah,
and I think and I love what, uh,I love what mr ali was saying
here, where he says I've beensuccessful on the wi-fi side
(24:28):
with at&t and timo waiting onthis uh, other vendor just to be
holding out, you know, andthat's the same thing i've've.
It works great right now on thewifi side.
The Passpoint stuff that we'redoing, the Passpoint stuff that
Ameriband is doing, that we'redoing with Signal Roam, we're
having such a good time withthat.
You know, I've been fieldingphone calls and emails left and
right since I pushed that videoabout Ubiquity.
It's like, dude, I've beenstacking up and it's really,
(24:50):
really cool.
I'll have to throw in a.
I'll have to throw in a signalroom sticker for you and your
coffee mug, but, yes, I'll throwin an ap.
So yeah, I've been playing withit too, so it's so cool, it's
just so cool and so easy, youknow, and I look at, I look at
the three tiers, this and thisis what I talked a little bit
about last week where you've gotdaz, you know, as you mentioned
(25:12):
, fantastic, get the signals,bring them back in, but the
expense that's involved withthat is so, so high, you know.
And then you look at whatprivate cellular offers and you
look at how that ties to neutralhosting.
There's a really to me that wasthat's really the promise of
on-go and they're having theirmeeting next week.
So lots of cool news is goingto come from that.
(25:34):
Case studies and whatnot arecoming from the OnGo Alliance
meeting next week in Dallas.
It's going to be really neat tosee how that's progressing.
I'm super excited because Iremember laying eyeballs on this
thing when I was at Facebookand seeing it work on the
Facebook campuses, going oh myGod, you're doing this with
Airspan equipment and infinityand this is awesome and Joel has
(25:55):
continued to push that anddoing incredible things with it.
And now you know I was superexcited.
You know, I think I went backand watched.
I had to go back and watch thevideo cause I didn't want to
screw something up in aconversation.
I went back and watched ourvideo from a Billy field day and
and it was when, uh, memet fromsalona started talking about
moxon and about, you know,neutral host and what they're
(26:18):
doing and it's going to comesoon and whatever, I was like,
yes, finally, like so, you know,it's so cool to see the
traction happening in theindustry and I'm super, super,
super excited for it.
But I, you know the way I seethe pieces of the puzzle, right,
is you've got Cisco and Merakidoing the Cisco Meraki thing and
not a clearly defined play forprivate cellular, private 4G,
(26:42):
private 5G, they have things,but you know whatever.
And then you have Juniper, right, and you know I feel like I'm
talking at the WLPC crowd right,you have Juniper, where Bob
shows up and has a great timeand says everything that he does
.
And then you see thispartnership forming with Salona
and Juniper and you're like, ohman, that's, that could be
something.
And then all of a sudden, hpepops out and you know they had
(27:04):
this deal where they, wherethere was the uh, you could
purchase Salona on the Arubaparts list.
We're like, oh, okay, well,maybe that's happening.
And then they're like Athonetand you're like, whoa, what?
Okay, here comes Athonet andyou're like, all right, that's
happening here.
Cisco still hasn't figured outwhat they're doing there yet.
And then you've got Juniper andyou're like, okay, well, maybe
(27:25):
Juniper is going to get intothat.
And then it's.
There's so many thingshappening in that space where
I'm looking at it right now andI'm going, man, there's, I see
so many moves happening whereit's like Wi-Fi, it's like, yeah
, wi-fi seven.
But I'm looking over here andI'm going, what's, what's all
that activity happening on theother, on the other side?
So what's your take on on kindof the state of the industry
(27:47):
right now coming from from the5G side?
Speaker 2 (27:52):
Oh, it's, it's definitely in flux.
Um, we're still early days withprivate solar.
Um, we're four years in fromsince cbrs was released, right
before covid, and I'vedefinitely been oh, I'm excited.
Everything's been going to beawesome, amazing, we're going to
make millions.
And then, oh, I don't know ifthis is going to actually happen
, and it's.
It's just been this back andforth, back and forth it's been.
(28:14):
I have a buddy, um, he's asales guy for for um, somebody,
somebody, one of these companies, and I've chatted with him many
times and they're like, yeah,cbrs is kind of like this, it's
you know, there's like there'sbumps in it.
You know it's like little bumps,but it's, it's it's not this
big growth yet.
And so it's like know there's,like there's bumps in it.
You know it's like little bumps, but it's, it's, it's not this
(28:35):
big growth yet.
And so it's like is this goingto be a big industry?
And then ai came in and tookall the fun, a lot of the
funding and and different things, and so it's like this is gonna
this, it's, it's growing.
It's definitely on the incline.
Um, the last few, the last fewmonths have definitely had some
big bumps that have helped itkind of grow a lot more.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
Yeah, um, there's, I would agree there's, and I think
that there's there's been someuptick in, there's been some
press releases and announcementsthat go out, where some
universities have adopted it,different organizations have
adopted it.
You know, verizon made theirannouncement with cummins saying
hey, we can, we can do it, youknow, and if you want Verizon,
you have to buy Verizon andwe'll throw in AT&T and T-Mobile
(29:16):
, but Verizon still.
No one has been able to pinVerizon down on neutral host for
any other product yet.
So it's like all right, when'sthat going to happen?
And as soon as we get thatthree carrier load in the US,
that's going to be great.
What about international,though?
I mean the amount of email thatI have gotten from people
asking me about Signal Roaminternationally has been insane,
(29:38):
and it's great.
Australia, new Zealand, germany, uk, spain.
They're like when can you dothis with what we have?
I'm curious.
You're not working on anythinginternational, though, right?
Speaker 2 (29:51):
I'm not international , but I've been watching
international.
My first talk at WLPC Prague.
Speaker 1 (29:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (29:58):
Back in the day I talked about what Salona was
kind of doing internationally.
There's a couple options.
Salona had a big graph.
Good one there, jr.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
It's true, wi-fi will never be accepted.
Wait a minute, I guess.
But the question is are wethere yet, right, or how?
How close are we?
Because I'm, I'm.
The problem is, uh, is that Iget?
Is this the force through thetrees mentality, because I'm
looking at it right now.
Is it just like, oh my God,everything's going great?
Or are we really looking atthis from an industry going,
(30:40):
it's coming, it's closer thancoming?
And I love the HPE announcementabout Athonet and about bringing
it together under Central,because for the first time it
seemed like single pane of glassto do everything.
And if you take that a stepfurther and you look at hp aruba
(31:02):
and then you know, not noofficial word, right?
This is the beauty of of notworking for anyone right now
except for myself is that I cansay stuff like this and and it's
not tied to a vendor.
It's like you look at hp arubaand the juniper thing and you go
well, dude, if you guys can usemarvis to tie all of this stuff
together, that would be sobadass, like, like, bring it all
(31:23):
in everybody like four yearsago.
Speaker 2 (31:25):
Four years ago I was chatting with bob friday I was
in a customer advisory call and,um, I randomly threw out cbrs.
Bob called me like has calledme so many times like I would.
Speaker 1 (31:38):
I'm like you need to bring private seller into marvis
, and so hopefully finally we'regetting that with hpe well, oh,
yeah, okay, hopefully finallywe're getting that in two years
when everything's done, assuming, regulate ah, damn it, damn it,
like you're so close.
So you know, and I look at thatand and uh, there's I just
(32:00):
there's things that.
There's things I'm aware ofthat I can't talk about, that, I
shouldn't talk about, that, Iwon't talk about.
But there's also things thatare happening in the industry,
where, where people are makingbig moves.
So I would encourage anyonewho's interested in seeing how
these come together to just golook at the companies you're
interested in, especially in theWi-Fi space, and see who's
hiring who, because if you lookat that, it's very easy to see
(32:23):
wait a minute, why is thisperson, this person's moving
over here, this person's moving,what's going on?
So I think that, looking atthat and understanding where it
is, there's so many great thingsthat are that are moving along
in the in the industry.
Oh my God, okay.
So that went way longer than Ithought.
I try and keep the podcast like20 minutes and here we are at 45
(32:43):
or whatever it is.
Um, let's jump.
Look, I want your opinion onsome of these things.
So I've got you know.
I, I appreciate, I know thatyou listen to the podcast.
I do appreciate that.
You know one out of 999listeners, apparently, but so
let's see what's going on thisweek.
Man, you know I've got allthese browser tabs open and
(33:04):
eventually I will.
If I can start monetizingYouTube, then maybe I can
finally buy a teleprompter.
Like Keith Parsons keeps tellingme.
He's like you gotta look at thescreen, drew, you're dumb, you
look weird.
You didn't tell me I'm dumb,but he's like you keep looking
off to the side.
He's like why don't you look atthe screen?
So, keith, someday, my friend,okay, first thing, I got on the
news.
You ready for this?
This from linkedin three.
(33:26):
Uk's embrace of 5g fixedwireless access for broadband
continues to deepen as itlaunches the market's first 5G
outdoor hub solution.
So this was 3UK was talkingabout their outdoor hub.
It can be wall-mounted,pole-mounted, window-mounted or
placed in a temporary stand, andI'll share this on the screen
If you hadn't seen this.
This is what I'm looking at.
(33:48):
That's still you, let me Yay.
Speaker 2 (33:56):
Hold on, let me at, that's still you.
Speaker 1 (33:57):
let me uh, yeah, hold on, let me find the right.
Keep sharing that stuff with me, right?
Yeah, right, let me see.
I'm trying to figure out alearn use this for the first
time.
Hang on, let's replace thatwith uh.
Let's see screen share.
And let's go over here to thispost on linkedin.
Here you go.
So I saw this.
I was man.
That's kind of cool.
You know, the ability to have a5G device that can be stuck on
(34:19):
your window or attached to apole mount.
I love the mounting options ofthis.
But it said either side of theAtlantic to sell FWO's
comprehensive home broadbandsolution continuous drain.
Start with US Champions,verizon, t-mobile, bundlingling
extensive content subscriptionsand other perks.
But from a cpe perspective,this is so terrifying to me,
(34:40):
having worked in the industry,having worked in the industry
for so long, and giving givingend users the option to mount
things in different locations tome is always like oh god, why
would you do that?
Because the second you do that,they're going to mount it in
the place that it's least likelyto work.
Speaker 2 (34:56):
Um, so I saw that basement yeah, yeah you know,
this goes back to that.
Speaker 1 (35:02):
This goes back to that ye old rule that I always
use with wi-fi.
People ask me where do you getgood wi-fi?
And I'm like, think about itlike a light bulb and imagine
your room is dark or your houseis dark.
Where would you put that lightbulb to make sure you have
enough light?
And they're like in the closet,in the utility closet, where
the guy ran all the cables forthe internet.
I just put it in there and it'slike that's never going to work
.
In the garage, in the garage, ohmy God.
(35:24):
Okay, hey, do you want to getinto some high-stakes drama?
Oh, sure, to get into some somehigh-stakes drama?
Oh sure, okay, so not drama,but something that I really look
, you can see who I was lookingat.
Uh, high-stakes drama of, of,uh, of this man.
Let's just, let's just jumpinto it.
(35:45):
Oh, yeah, yeah, yes, yes, Ithink she's live right now.
Also, I think she's doing a, adeal.
Yeah, she's doing a how tonavigate, being laid off.
Yes, uh, sorry, alexis, she'stalking right now, it looks like
, and she has way more viewersthan we do.
Oh, yeah, but holy moly, um, youknow my drama man look, you're
(36:10):
right I you know, I worked atcisco one time and I'm not the
biggest influencer in the worldI don't have nearly as many
people as she does and even inthat role I was like, well, if
you're gonna lay me off, I meanlike I, at least look for a
media job, or you know?
it's like dude, are you likeleverage this group of people?
(36:32):
I have, and I didn't take anyoffense to it because, whatever
I mean, I totally understand thelayoffs and whatnot, and I
understand her position as well,where you know, apparently she
was, she moved in and and shewas told, hey, you have to find
something else because thisposition terminates on the state
.
She didn't find anything elseand that was terminated.
But, holy moly, you know our,our dear friend, alexis, uh, is
(36:53):
now on the open market.
Oh my god, who's gonna snap herup first?
Speaker 2 (36:58):
that's the question yeah, it's crazy the people on
the market right now, so there'sa lot of opportunity to get
some high quality talent outthere right now we may be few,
but we're damn pretty yes yeah,that's great.
Speaker 1 (37:21):
Yeah, well, I tagged that because it's my question
around.
This is it has influencermarketing reached a point that
no one cares anymore?
That's my, that's my question,because if cisco is willing to
let go of probably arguably thenumber one tech influencer in
(37:42):
the industry period, number twobehind uh lexi yeah, I think
lexi's gotta be listen, ifalexis starts licking stuff, I'm
going to be very upset.
But you know, either way, top 10influencers, top five
influencers and Cisco's like hey, that's cool has influencer
(38:03):
marketing reached a point whereit's just irrelevant in the tech
industry?
And you know I struggled withthis when we were doing the, you
know, when I did some of thestuff with with HPE and we did
their influencer marketing andand with Cisco, and you know we
still do the Cisco championsthing and that's cool.
But it got to a point where itwas like I don't know what value
and you know, I don't know whatvalue I'm bringing to the table
(38:27):
other than I open it up to theaudience.
But I don't know how manypeople have actually purchased
an Aruba access point becauseDrew was like, hey, man, this
thing's pretty cool, you know?
Um, so I don't.
I don't know how that fares, butwhen you see something, yeah,
when you see something like thatfrom someone that we know, that
(38:47):
we respect, that we actuallylike that's fun and outgoing and
easy to communicate with andtells a good story, and it's
like that's, in my opinion,that's fun and outgoing and easy
to communicate with and tells agood story, and it's like
that's, in my opinion, that'sexactly what the industry needed
was someone sharing thatmessage.
You know I'm too old to to doit.
Clearly, I don't.
You know, I need to startsaying you know like you talk
about my sigma access points,right, but it's.
(39:08):
It was such a.
It was such a letdown, I feel,for all influencers of any way,
shape or form, to see whathappened to alexis, because it
was like wow, they just reallydidn't give a shit, like just
bye, you know, yep and they'relike good luck.
Yeah, how do you do that?
(39:28):
How do you, how do you do that?
I just don't, I don'tunderstand that.
So I thought that that was.
I at least want to talk aboutit.
Um, you know, I would say, youknow, the best of luck and all
those wonderful things for, butI don't think she needs it.
I think she's going to be able.
She's doing such a tremendousjob creating content.
That it's you know.
I'm just excited to see whereshe goes next.
Speaker 2 (39:49):
So she's not going to go into one little thing.
Speaker 1 (39:51):
She's got options galore yeah, and I mean I sent
her a message asking hersomething and she pops up and
she says she's like man, I'm sosorry I haven't responded, I'm
just inundated with stuff.
I was like that's so cool, youknow, and then her car got
stolen like three days later.
It's like dude, oh well, anyway, what else do we have going on
(40:12):
here?
Let's see Wi-Fi 7 on the newiPhone 16.
What are your thoughts on that,mr Mark?
Speaker 2 (40:22):
Ooh, I'm like this iPhone 15.
Speaker 1 (40:25):
Pro, I'm debating.
Bye.
Oh no, I've been debating.
I got to go get a new one.
Speaker 2 (40:29):
Wi-Fi 7 was the one thing I was like.
If they don't have Wi-Fi 7,absolutely not, I'm not buying a
new one.
They put Wi-Fi 7 in it and soI'm like damn On all models.
Speaker 1 (40:39):
I thought I was really happy to see that it was
across the board and I'minterested to see how that fares
into the amount of utilizationthat is had on these devices and
what we're going to see onnetworks that is had on these
devices and what we're going tosee on networks.
When we deployed Signal Roam oras my kids call it, sigma Roam
(40:59):
just for all the gats out there,for all the little kids, little
freaking brain rot generation,I love it when we deployed Sigma
Roam at a local school district, everything was working great
and all of a sudden I get thisphone call and they're like hey,
we had to turn it off.
And I said, oh dude, why?
What happened?
Was it not working?
They're like nah, man, justeveryone jumped on this one AP.
(41:20):
We weren't expecting it and wedidn't have any balancing across
the network and limited numberof devices connected and we
hadn't really done our homeworkon on leveling out the network.
And then we just deployedpasspoint for t-mobile and at&t
and, like, all of a sudden, apsget inundated you join the first
ap.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
They walk past when they enter the building right
yeah.
Speaker 1 (41:42):
So I'm wondering I'm happy to see wi-fi 7 on that
note.
Some some cool stats.
Check this out.
I saw that one this morningskyrocketing usage data from uh,
from our friends over at rcr,wireless news intelligence on
all things wireless, miss misskatherine nin says.
According to the cti report,americans use more than 100
trillion megabytes of wirelessdata in 2023.
(42:03):
The cti found the demand forwireless data in the us has
skyrocketed, with americansusing more than 100 trillion
megabytes per second or no, notmegabytes per second.
Meg or no, not megabytes persecond megabytes total
representing the largestsingle-year increase ever
recorded.
For reference, 2023 saw a 36%increase to 26 trillion
megabytes, an increase over 22,and now over 100 trillion
(42:28):
megabytes of wireless data.
Man, and that's CTIAti right,so that's over the carrier
networks.
I wonder, does that includewi-fi offload?
I wonder maybe well, I mean, arethey counting?
Let's see, 5g is increasinglyembedded into the way americans
live and work.
Nearly 40 of all wirelessdevices have a 5g connection.
Okay, 34 over increase over2022.
(42:51):
Total number of wirelessconnections of 558 million, more
than 1.6 wireless connectionsfor every american.
Wow, yeah, so lots, lots goingon there, man.
So cti with some, with somegreat numbers for everyone.
Um, what do you think?
You think wi-fi 7 is going toincrease the number of people to
connect to networks?
(43:11):
Got?
Speaker 2 (43:15):
to have Wi-Fi 7 AP.
Got to have Wi-Fi 7 client.
Speaker 1 (43:20):
It's going to take a few years.
It's coming, so check this out.
On another note, look at thisthing.
Look, that's still.
I got to figure out thoselittle screens, man, hold on.
I think I almost got it.
Let's see if I go replace andthen I click on here.
This is the part that I have toedit out from the audio version
of the podcast drew not knowinghow to screen share properly on
(43:42):
a presentation.
Dude, check this.
Did you see this?
This week, chinese scientistsget out of here have developed
an electromagnetic vortex cannon.
What, what's up?
Yeah, man, look at this thing.
I don't know what's going on inthe corner over here.
Vortex rings in air andelectromagnetic waves are
fascinating structures.
Okay, this is like if you eversmoked a cigar or a cigarette
(44:04):
and you blow smoke rings.
So this is the same thing.
So I've got one of those bigair cannons Like you can pull
back and shoot and it likeshoots invisible air, yeah, so
it took me a second to figureout why this was important.
I'm not going to lie.
I was like what the hell arethese guys talking about?
Dude, are you, have you readabout this?
I have not.
(44:25):
It's the first time I'm hearingthis.
Vortex rings blah, blah, blah,blah, blah, blah, blah.
They wirelize those vortexrings, a mysterious and
fascinating natural phenomenon,displayed breathtaking
structures.
But the key here is Hold on Isthe word that I don't know how
to pronounce God.
I wish there was someone whocould help me out with this.
Okay, so, there's an air cannon,here's an electromagnetic
(44:46):
cannon, and they they're notcalled sky rims, what are they
called?
They're called something else,but they use these vortex pulses
to do this, and the idea, is itdisruption?
Yeah, no, no, no, no, no.
Higher levels of modulation,okay, oh, wow, because now
(45:07):
you're not just modulating on anXY axis, right, you're
modulating on a rotating XYyaxis.
So, yeah, so check it out.
So let's see if I get thisright.
So they shoot this, this, thiselect this.
Yeah, I'm imagining a smokering, right, they shoot the
smoke ring and it's no longerjust vertically and horizontally
(45:29):
polarized, it's rotating,vertically and horizontally
polarized.
So if, if you can stack bitsper Hertz, not just like this,
but as it moves, now you havethe ability to crank more data
out of it.
It's, it's not I forgot whatit's called, it's not Skyrim.
Hold on, it's in here somewhere, electromagnetic vortex cannon.
(45:51):
You know, these are the thingsyou find only on the waves.
Wireless podcast generates aninstantaneous, instantaneous
pressure difference.
It forms vortex rings whichmaintain their shape and energy
over long distances.
So imagine this, this infinitesmoke ring cruising, and imagine
you have a way to modulate onthat electromagnetic pulses with
(46:11):
complex topological features.
There, there it is skyrims.
He says skirmions, skirmions.
I I've never heard anyone usethis word, dude.
Someone give me a, someone giveme a uh, a pronunciation on
this.
But they make these things thatshowcase remarkable resilience
(46:32):
and self-healing propertiesduring propagation vast and
exciting high capacitycommunication systems.
These vortex pulses couldrevolutionize how we transmit
information by operatingefficient, robust methods of
data encoding.
The unique spectral andpolarization characteristics of
the vortex rings allow them tocarry more information compared
to today, compared totraditional waves, making them
(46:52):
ideal candidates for nextgeneration Dude, and they
maintain structural integrity inthe presence of environmental
disturbances.
It's a valuable tool in remotesensing and targeting detection.
Speaker 2 (47:08):
Like I'm blown away with this just because the
picture was like that lookspretty cool, Anyway.
Speaker 1 (47:14):
So yeah.
So now, how do we get so who'sgoing to be the first
manufacturer?
We've got wi-fi 7 that does mlo.
We've got wi-fi 8 that doesmulti-ap and ml, mlo on multiple
aps.
How do we get an ap that doesmlo, multi-frequency
electromagnetic vortexaggregation, so that, like when
(47:35):
the two vortex you send it hereand it meets right there, right
where you need it, when you needit let's go, man, let's go.
Oh my gosh yeah it sounds stupidthat we're laughing at it.
Look, reference this podcast inyou know uh, 9, 13, 20, 31 and
tell me how dumb it sounds then.
Anyway, I thought that waspretty cool, dude, that was a
(47:57):
much more complex.
Yeah, yeah, I think those werethe main stories that I had this
week.
I don't know if you know, but Ido want to end a little bit on
a sad note the passing ofsomeone named Jim Hong and I
don't know if you ever got achance to work with Jim, but Jim
Hong was.
I met him when he was withOrthogon Systems before their
(48:20):
acquisition by Cambium Networks,and Jim was one of the smartest
people I ever knew and one ofthe best people I ever got to
work with, and I'll never forget.
He always had three things thatyou could find with Jim Hong,
and anyone who knows him knowswhat they are, and I'm not even
sure that I should say them.
So if you remember Jim, justremember the three things that
he always used to carry with him, and I always thought that that
(48:41):
was hilarious.
So condolences to his family.
There is a memorial servicegoing on for him, and another
person I found out had recentlypassed away, which is Mr Drew
Mooney, who I met at Motorolaalso.
So Drew Mooney and Jim Hong,there's a memorial service
planned for them at Wispapaloozathis year.
(49:02):
So if you're going and you wantto spend some time reliving
some great memories about theHonger and Mr Mooney.
Drew Mooney was like I rememberone time funny story about Drew
Mooney.
I remember one time I wasapplying for a job and going
through the whole process and Ifound out that the person that I
was talking to didn't know theywere talking to Drew Lentz.
They thought they were talkingto Drew Mooney and they're like
man, I love you and we'reinterviewing this other guy and
(49:25):
I think he's got the same name,but we really like you and
you're the candidate we want togo with.
I was like, oh, that's great.
And I found out later that itwas meant for mooney and I was
like son of a bitch, like I waslike wait a minute, I don't have
any experience working atalcatel, lucent or wherever it
was, and so, uh, unfortunatelysad, sad to know that those two
(49:46):
guys are gone, but glad I got tospend some time with them.
So, um, shout out yeah, totalbummer man.
Speaker 2 (49:51):
But he was over.
Speaker 1 (49:52):
Yeah good guys.
Anyway, hey, I reallyappreciate you joining me, mark.
I know we had a great time atMobility Field Day and it's
great to catch up.
I mean, you got anything goingon.
Anything you want to chit-chatabout?
Speaker 2 (50:05):
I will be at Edge Field Day next week.
Oh nice, yeah, I got invited tothat one with those guys.
Speaker 1 (50:11):
Sweet.
Speaker 2 (50:11):
Nice, yeah, I got invited to that one with those
guys, with Steven.
So, talking about edge stuff,less wireless, more wired yeah,
there is.
There is possibility with likeprivate cellular stuff with some
edge things so well yeah, yeah,that's a.
Speaker 1 (50:28):
that is an interesting I don't know who's
presenting at that, I haven't, Ihaven't looked it up, but I
know that, if you look at thething that that piqued my
interest a couple of weeks Iguess months back now is the new
700 series from aruba and beingable to run container uh,
containerized applications and,and you know, cisco falling suit
with some of their 9100s andyou know, I think that's, I
(50:50):
think that was something thatthey had mentioned is being able
to run edge services on thosedevices and what the benefit to
it is, not just from an AIperspective, because everyone
can build AI into whatever thehell they want, but like from a
real world operationsperspective.
You know, is uh, any, is thereanyone presenting in that does
wireless also?
(51:10):
Um, no, that I, not that I knowof that.
Speaker 2 (51:12):
does wireless also?
No, not that I know of.
Speaker 1 (51:14):
So Zendaya, Damn it Hollingsworth.
I know right, Get your shittogether.
Speaker 2 (51:18):
I went to Edgefield day one and they had a network
company.
Speaker 1 (51:21):
They weren't wireless yeah they got you right there,
right, and then they justdropped it.
They just terrible joke.
Speaker 2 (51:28):
But I'm like I'm hoping I'm going to push and see
they're more of the data centercontrolling the Kubernetes and
the Dockers containers and stuff.
They could work with the Wi-Fior the cellular people or
whoever, but they're morefocused on that side.
We'll see how that goes.
(51:49):
Nice, after that is MeterUp.
I will be there with you.
Speaker 1 (51:54):
Yes yes, meter up.
I have high expectations formeter up.
Um, it's gonna be, it's gonnabe great to be around uh, around
you all and around a bunch ofbunch of other fun folks.
Um, if you don't know whatmeter up is, go, look at, go to
metercom, look, look for theirevents called MeterUp.
It's happening October 2nd inSan Francisco and it's there's
(52:17):
an open invite that's out there.
You have to apply, you, you,you ask for a seat and if they
give you a seat, then you comejoin us.
But that's going to show us theentire world of meter in one
day which I've seen with and itblew my mind and it I was, so I
was so blown away.
So I don't know if you noticed,but I went there the day before
(52:38):
mobility field day.
Speaker 2 (52:39):
Yeah, I remember that .
Speaker 1 (52:41):
And I was like everything you guys are showing
me sucks Compared to what I justsaw.
Like this is like M and M liketell me something about me, I
don't know already you know.
And so I walked in with thiscompletely jaded mentality.
That's not true.
I walked in being exposed tosome things that I was like wow,
it really put life in adifferent perspective.
(53:02):
And now that Command has comeout, now you can understand why.
I was just like okay, tie thisto three years from now.
So it was great.
It's going to be great to seeMeter doing that.
Speaker 2 (53:18):
And then WLpc.
Are you going to prague?
Speaker 1 (53:19):
I am supposed to, I'm still figuring a few things out
, that's.
I'm like, I'm like, I'mpresenting, so I better go right
.
Yeah, well, I'm looking to go.
I, I have a.
I have a request out forsomeone to sponsor the waves
podcast at wlpc prague.
If you know anyone who wants tosponsor the waves podcast,
either at at WLPC Prague oranywhere else, drop me a line.
Uh, that's what I'm doing rightnow.
I'm actually dude.
I'm doing some sick stuff.
You, if you happen to findyourself in Alaska next week,
(53:40):
I'm going to Alaska to uh, to dosome engineering and design for
a port in Alaska, forcommunications, for wifi.
No-transcript minute.
(54:25):
It's a tablet.
The tablet isn't the fun part.
It's got a cool little case onit.
It's not the tablet that makesmakes it fun, it's this little
guy right here.
There it is, and so there, myZoom's all messed up.
So shout out to my peeps at IBWave.
This is actually a really easyto use device.
It's a lot easier than Ithought it was going to be.
(54:46):
I've got a full review of itcoming up soon.
It works really well to show mewhat's going on in the cell
spectrum and the cbrs spectrum,and they have been very patient
because they sent that and Isaid well, I want to use it on
my trip to alaska and they said,all right, fine, we'll wait.
So shout out to the team at ivywave for being patient.
Um, and then, what else?
(55:06):
Ces is coming up?
Um, the things conference.
I, I tweet and retweet andrepost about the things
Conference that's coming up andI think that it's.
When is that?
Oh man, it's probably this week.
I can look it up.
It's.
Let me see.
The Things Conference.
I want to go to this thing sobad and I've always wanted to go
(55:28):
to it ever since I learnedabout it.
The Things Conference is thishuge Laura, when it's a 2526
September, so it's in 12 daysit's in Amsterdam and it's all
things IoT and Laura when, andit is like it is so much fun to
watch what they do there, allthe postings that pop up.
So if you don't know about it,just look for the hashtag the
(55:50):
things conference and if youhave any interest in IoT or any
interest in Laura when, that isdefinitely the spot to be at
it's.
There's such a good group ofpeople and they always have the
coolest toys.
And then what else we gotcoming up?
Um, wlpc February, ces inJanuary.
I love CES.
Um, I don't know, man, busy,busy calendars, busy schedules.
Speaker 2 (56:12):
WLPC is open for presentation.
Call for presentation.
Speaker 1 (56:16):
Yes, WLPC Phoenix is open for presentation.
The call for papers is outright now.
If you have always wanted topresent at WLPC and you didn't
know how, this is the first step.
You submit an abstract.
You go on the website, go toWLPC and look up WLPC and find
it, and you submit your abstractand then they turn on community
voting and people vote for thepresentations that they want to
(56:36):
see.
So if there's something thatinterests you, it probably
interests someone else.
Get online, post about it,don't be scared.
It's not scary, it's scary tothink about.
And then you get there andyou're just like these are all
my friends, like these are allpeople I know, or these are all
people that I've seen online, orthese are all people that are
genuinely interested, because bythe time you make it to the
stage, you got to realize thateveryone has already told you
(56:59):
how much they want to see youpresent.
So there's nothing to beterrified about.
Speaker 2 (57:03):
Yep exactly how it goes.
And then you become more wellknown, you get your name out
there and then you get end up onthe waves podcast here, yeah,
there you go, speaking of ifanyone wants to join.
Speaker 1 (57:14):
Uh, yeah, I'll start bringing on some guests here and
there, but I think, uh, I think, mr muhammad's gonna be the
next one.
I think, you know he, he chimesin enough.
But if anyone wants to join thewaves podcast, let me know.
I think that's it.
That's for this week.
Man, is this an hour and seven?
It's the longest waves I thinkI've done, but we're gonna go
ahead and push it and have somefun with it.
We've had, we've we've held onto about 100 viewers this whole
time, which is great.
(57:34):
So I appreciate everyonelistening and tuning in.
I've tried to answer all thequestions in the little chat
overlay.
It's been very busy.
Uh, let's see, there ain't lastwords on there that I didn't,
that I didn't post up, butthat's it, man.
That's all I got.
Have a wonderful weekend.
Mark dude, thank you forjoining.
Great to catch up, man umawesome yeah, pay attention,
(57:55):
dude, you've got, you've gotsocial media stuff, right, yeah,
I got markoutscom.
Speaker 2 (57:59):
so my blog is where I post most of my stuff and
linkedin and you do you do writesome you do a very, very good
job blog.
Speaker 1 (58:06):
I really enjoy reading your articles and and if
no one's following you onlinkedin, please go follow.
Follow mark on linkedin as well.
Okay, that's it.
That's all I got.
I hope everybody has awonderful week.
From everyone, the WavesPodcast, which is me, and Mark,
have a wonderful week and wewill see you all next time.
Bye.
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