March 30, 2024 • 45 mins
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When Lisa DiBella, a sage of human resources, joined me for a conversation, we discovered that kindness isn't just a virtue—it's a leadership strategy. Imagine a workplace where compassion drives success and nurtures a vibrant culture. That's the world Lisa and I envision, and in today's dialogue, we dissect how three decades of her expertise in the field have proven that kindness and leadership are not mutually exclusive but rather a dynamic duo in the corporate landscape.
Transitioning from a storied career at MasterCard and Vice President of Human Resources role at American Portfolios, to heartfelt volunteerism, Lisa witnessed firsthand how the values we cherish off the clock can dramatically inform our professional lives. Lisa and I share personal stories, including her participation in the Miss Senior America pageant, illustrating that recognition of grace and talent transcends age and industry. We traverse the landscape of leadership, examining the traits of those who lead not with an iron fist but with an open heart, and how these qualities shape companies and communities alike, particularly during times of crisis.
Wrapping up, our episode is a homage to the unsung heroes of leadership—those who lead with kindness. Lisa and I believe that the principles of empathy and genuine relationship-building can be the bedrock of successful teams and organizations. So, join us as we share the transformative power of a kind heart in leadership and how it can reshape the future of corporate culture. For those eager to keep the conversation going, connect with Lisa and myself on LinkedIn, follow my journey on Instagram, and become a part of our 'We Are Made for More' podcast community. Here's to leading with love, and leaving a legacy of kindness in every step we take.
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Intro voiceovers by her family: son, Billy Alexander; daughter, Mackenzie Alexander; and husband, Bill Alexander.
Music by Bill Alexander
Produced by Bill Alexander
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Three, two, one, Hello and welcome to.
We Are Made For More.
I'm your host, Megan Alexander,and this is my podcast.
I'm so excited to be here todayfor what is our eighth episode,
and I have a guest today thatI'm really excited to share with
everybody, and her name is LisaDiBella.
(00:20):
So I'm going to tell you all,as normally do, a little bit
about our guests so you knowwhat's to come, and then we'll
jump into it.
But Lisa has been a humanresources professional for 30
years, working in a managementcapacity for such firms as
MasterCard International and theExpo Design Center.
She recently retired with agreat firm on Long Island it was
(00:44):
called American PortfoliosFinancial Systems excuse me
Services, where she was one ofthe executives holding the
position of Vice President ofHuman Resources.
So with that, welcome Lisa.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Thank you so much, megan.
I am so excited to be here.
I can't tell you really I am.
You know, from the first momentI met you and you mentioned we
are made for more, I was soexcited to be here.
I can't tell you really I am.
You know, from the first momentI met you and you mentioned we
are made for more.
I was so impressed and Ithought that you know, you
talked a lot about kindness andI said how can I connect that
with leadership and kindness?
Because being in the corporateworld, leadership and kindness
(01:20):
is has so many good results andso I'm happy to be here.
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
That's wonderful.
I'm thrilled that you're heretoo, and so this is actually a
good place to discuss how weknow each other.
So far, I've known all of theguests that I have on the show.
That's making it easier for meeverybody.
But let's talk about that.
How do we know each other?
Lisa, I'm going to turn it overto you.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
Oh thanks.
Do you remember meeting me?
The first time I met you, megan, I know, was at my godson's
graduation party in my backyard.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
That's right.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
And I said wow, she works for Apple.
For what?
30 years?
Speaker 1 (01:53):
Well, not so much.
Actually just hit 23 years.
23 years, so over two decades.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
So myself being with big companies, I said, oh, we
have a lot in common.
And then you know there is akind way about you that I said I
know that I'm going to reallyenjoy talking to you, so that
was our first meeting.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
Yes and yes.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
And I did mention to my nephew that let's get
together with Megan.
I really like her a lot.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
Thank you for saying that.
I felt the same about you.
I talk a lot on this show abouthow people are drawn to each
other and energy that we put outthere in the universe and
what's returned to you and oneof my episodes recently I had a
guest that talks about your vibeattracts your tribe, and I
(02:36):
definitely felt that with youlike that instant connection of
wow, I like this person, I loveher energy and we had so much in
common.
Like you said, we love talkingabout people and kindness and
leadership and how we like tokind of work in those
environments, how we've liked towork in those environments in
our life.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
Yeah, it certainly makes you feel good.
You know, it's nice to be withlike-minded people and you don't
always connect with people thatway?
No, you don't.
No, you don't always connectwith people that way.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
No, you don't, no, you don't.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
And that's okay too.
And that's okay too.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
Yes, yes you know when you do it, it's, it's great
.
Yeah, absolutely, and then youtune into that right, you tune
into those connections and, um,if you pay attention to it and
you have time for it in yourlife because I know people are
really busy it's so cool tobring people into your circle
and learn from them, right,share learned experiences and
(03:30):
get to know each other better,and it certainly lights me up.
So I'm thrilled to have gottento meet you.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Thank you, and I am as well.
Yeah, you are.
You get.
You just get inspired.
You get so much energy frompeople that you have a lot in
common with, and I love it.
I agree with you.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
And so I'm going to tell everybody a little bit more
about you before we dive intoour topic today.
Actually, what I will say tothe listeners out there is we're
going to do something a littlebit different today.
Up until now, my episodes havereally been about bringing
people on and talking abouttheir life stories, which I will
still continue to do.
Been about bringing people onand talking about their life
stories, which I will stillcontinue to do, because I think
(04:07):
that's really a cool way to getto know about people and how
they navigated their life thechallenges, the successes and
transitions, if you will.
But today, lisa and I are goingto talk about a topic, and
we're going to as she's alreadybeen mentioning kindness and
leadership, and leadership is atopic that's near and dear to my
heart.
I've been in leadership in mycareer for quite a long time
(04:31):
myself spent a long time leadingteams in different retail
organizations, and now, for thepast 18 years, have supported
executive leadership teamsmyself, so it's really important
to me and I'm excited to talkabout it.
Lisa, let's talk a little bitmore about your background,
though, so when people listen in, they kind of can really
(04:52):
translate that into what we'retalking about In your spare time
.
I know you've served as avolunteer trainer for Child
Abuse Prevention Services, alsoknown as CAPS.
You've received certificationfor coursework training from the
University of the State of NewYork and the State Education
Department on sexual harassmentprevention and bully prevention
(05:16):
programs for Nassau and Suffolkcounties here on Long Island.
Tell us a little bit about that.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
You know it was quite .
You know I took a break afterleaving MasterCard.
After being there 20 years withMasterCard, they moved our
division to Kansas City and Iopted to stay in New York.
Great company, I learned somuch from them.
But I'm not the type to sitback.
So I said you know, what can Ido in my spare time?
I had a little time, betweenyou know, looking for jobs.
So I somehow connected it wasyears ago with a program called
(05:45):
Child Abuse Prevention Servicesand I was able to go into
schools and talk about how toprevent bullying, and it was so
rewarding and you know and Itold my own experiences.
I came from an inner city schoolsystem and I know what it's
like to have know being bulliedor and we, we talked about it
(06:05):
and it was.
It was great we're able to helpyoung children in elementary
school and mid school, mid-levelschools, to really understand
that bullying is not okay rightand yeah, and what to do and
reach out to somebody that youmight that might help.
You don't join in, that's themost important thing, don't?
Speaker 1 (06:24):
join in with someone else's bullying because you're
afraid.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
You want help, you don't join in.
That's the most important thing.
Don't join in with someoneelse's bullying because you're
afraid.
You want to.
You know, be in the crowd.
So it was wonderful, I was.
I felt great about it.
I again another thing that Iwas very inspired about and and
uh, and that's how I gotinvolved in that, and I did that
for quite some time.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
So did you ever have um situations, situations?
Where did anybody ever sharebullying stories with you?
Speaker 2 (06:48):
You know they.
There were some children thatactually admitted that there was
a bully in the class and he wassitting in the back of the room
and I'd say to him you know, wereally love you.
You know, tell us why you feellike a bully, but you know it's
a.
It's something that maybe theylearn from home, and not
intentionally, but and it'scontrol.
It is a control thing.
(07:09):
It's funny how sometimesbullies are in corporate America
as well.
It kind of translates.
So that kind of helped me, whenI was in corporate America as
well, to recognize that.
And it's you know.
We have a zero tolerance policy, whether you're in high in
schools or at work, uh, so yeah,I never really witnessed
(07:30):
anything.
I myself was bullied and I toldstories about it, and I
remember telling a story that Ihad a girl that was a twin and
I'm a twin, oh right, yeah.
And she I a girl kept pullingmy hair every day in school and
then she finally stood up for me.
And she went and she said youknow, please don't ever do that
again, or maybe not with thosechoice of words, but she said it
(07:53):
a little stronger, so shehelped me out.
So you tell stories and kidswere able to connect.
They really did love that and Iwas very happy to be part of
that.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Yeah, I can imagine Team you was.
I was very happy to be part ofthat.
Yeah, I can imagine Um.
You know I have to cause.
My kids are teenagers now andthroughout their growing up in
their school district you knowwe've heard a lot of the
different like bullying programsthat they have, and I wish they
had that when I went to school,like they didn't have that back
in the day.
And let's face it, like youjust said, there there's bullies
everywhere.
There's bullies in corporateAmerica, but there's bullies it
(08:24):
doesn't matter where you go inlife and exactly it's how was
that person traumatized or whatare they going through in their
life that's making them act thatway?
There's a lot of psychology toit and maybe that could be an
episode we do another time onitself.
I think we could probably could,because that's a really
important topic.
So I love that you've done workin that space.
(08:45):
So another thing I wanted totransition to is something
that's just a neat fun factabout you, which is you
participated in oh, there goesmy screen.
You participated in a pageantcalled Age of Elegance.
I guess it was the New YorkAmerica pageant, is that correct
(09:05):
?
Am I saying?
Speaker 2 (09:06):
that the right way.
Yeah, yes, miss, senior Americapageant, that's what it is,
miss.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
Senior America pageant.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:14):
And this pageant is the world's first and foremost
pageant to emphasize and givehonor to women who can share
their personal and professionalachievements and their positive
outlooks on life, whiledemonstrating their
extraordinary talents.
I love that, yeah.
So what made you do this?
It?
Speaker 2 (09:31):
was a neat program.
I I was actually shopping oneday and a woman and I began
talking at the jewelry counterand she mentioned that she was
participating in this programand she said that.
well, I said, oh, that'sinteresting because when I was
younger my mom worked for theItalian organization and they
(09:53):
had luncheons at the Plaza Hoteland the Waldorf Astoria and I
always did some fashion shows,volunteered, and I was
mentioning that to her.
She said, well, we need someoneto participate in this, we need
another candidate.
And I said she said, do youhave a talent?
And I said, well, not really,but I could sing a little.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
So she asked me to come and audition for it.
It was in 2019 and I did and itwas.
It was again another wonderfulprogram.
I met professional women andit's not about all beauty.
And actually they have anelegance about them.
A lot of professional women.
We had to do a story about yourlife on stage and we had a gown
(10:40):
walk and we were judged by areal Miss America pageant
contestant.
Were you nervous at all?
You know I was.
The most part that I wasnervous was was the singing.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
Okay, because I don't .
I don't think I sing great, butI got through it, you got
through it I got through and itwas, it was.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
It was rewarding.
It certainly stretches yourcapabilities.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
You know.
Good for you.
I think it's really courageousthat you did that here.
You just ran into someone.
They asked you and you're likeI'm going to go for this, and I
love when people tell storiesabout their life and something
that they decided to try thatwas maybe not the norm for them.
Is it okay if I read a littlebit of what your statement was?
(11:23):
As a pageant contestant, thiswas part of I'm not gonna read
the whole thing, but part ofLisa's statement that she shared
as a contestant.
I believe that possessing aninfectious positive attitude
keeps negative behavior fromshaping who you are.
This helps build character.
With that in mind, I try to bethe best person I can, always
pushing the boundaries a littleharder.
It's the reason why I'm heretoday.
(11:44):
I listen to my heart withcompassion, kindness and honesty
.
If I believe in somethingstrongly, I will stand up and
fight for it.
And, knowing there is both joyand sorrow in life, with lessons
learned, the journey willinevitably lead us all to a
better place.
Okay, I lied.
I read the whole thing.
That was fantastic.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
I had to read it.
Speaker 1 (12:04):
So that's beautiful.
It shares a lot about who youare and and about your heart.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
So I appreciate it.
It really did give me anopportunity to meet such
wonderful people too.
Speaker 1 (12:14):
And I am still participating.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
I go to luncheons with all the pageant women and
you know there are differentevents that we are participating
in.
So it was, it's a greatopportunity.
Great opportunity to keepactive in the community.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
Well, that's fantastic, lisa, and I also
chose to talk about that heretoday because, as we said, our
topic today is kindness andleadership, and that talked a
little bit about yourself andyou kind of just made a
statement about kindness andwhat it means to you.
So is it okay if we kick in andget to that part of the?
Speaker 2 (12:46):
conversation yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:48):
So you wanted to talk about kindness and leadership
today.
Let's start with what drove youto being so interested in
leadership to begin with.
Speaker 2 (12:57):
Well, first of all, I wanted to give you a compliment
.
Okay, because I wanted to saythat, wow, I'll take it.
I tell my friends about.
We Are Made For More and theyto say that, wow, I tell my
friends about we Are Made ForMore, and then they're like gosh
, what's that about?
I said you know, listen to herpodcast, because they're about
kindness and again thatconnection and that's what drove
me actually to talk to youabout this and kindness and
leadership.
Speaker 1 (13:16):
So okay, but yeah, thank you for that.
Well, thank you, and actually,yeah, I'll take the plug right
now.
Everybody, Please feel free tofollow this podcast on any major
podcast platforms, such asApple or Spotify, etc.
But we appreciate that.
Thanks for saying that, Lisa.
It means a lot.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
Yeah, what led me to this?
What was it?
Why was it interesting?
You know it goes back to myearly careers career.
And when I used to look at ourCEO on stage and I love the way
they communicated, theyconnected with people.
They just had this ability toremember people's names and I
(13:55):
was so impressed by that.
They made a conscious effortand they were great storytellers
.
Yes, yeah, and I said, you know, I clearly was inspired,
spellbound by them, charmed, andI wanted, I was encouraged, to
be like them.
You know, it's difficult to bea leader.
It really isn't easy.
You get a pat on the back whenthings go well, you know, and
(14:18):
you're held accountable whenthings aren't going well.
I think that Simon Sinek saidit greatly.
He said that there'sdiversified personalities but it
takes courage and integrity tobe a leader.
That's key.
But at the same time, they havea subtle approach and they're
(14:39):
able to share one common vision,which I think is kindness.
And those are the ones that arereally successful, that have the
empathy or, you know, effectivecommunicators love them
absolutely I agree with you.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
As I said earlier, myself included, I've always
just personally felt that it wasnatural for me to want to be a
kind leader.
Okay, but but I don't thinkthat necessarily comes naturally
to everybody.
I think we'll get to that laterin this conversation.
Yeah, because there are manydifferent styles of leadership
out there, let's face it, andit's important to have
(15:14):
situational leadership indifferent situations.
Right, it depends on thescenario.
How you lean in and how youdirect and lead people is
important, but we're here totalk about why kindness matters.
So there's a connection withleadership, kindness and how
kind leaders consistently getgreat results.
Would you agree?
Speaker 2 (15:33):
Oh, absolutely A hundred percent.
I mean, I read a book byWilliam Baker and Michael
O'Malley, phds, and theyidentified surprisingly great
attributes that unequivocallykind leaders share, and that is
the integrity, the humanqualities, that becomes the
(15:56):
golden standard for excellence.
And that's where results comein, because really, you know, we
have the ability to leadpositively.
We know great leaders that leadpositively and they get great
results.
And we've seen leaders thatlead negatively and although
they may have followers, we'veseen that they don't get the
(16:19):
results.
In the end it never does.
The performance may rise alittle quicker, but it doesn't
stay.
The performance may rise alittle quicker but it doesn't
stay so certainly with kindnessand empathy and integrity and a
moral compass it works.
I mean leaders motivateemployees.
(16:39):
They know how to motivatecommittee members, board members
, clients.
They recognize unique talentsand they're able to be great
mentors, Haven't you?
Speaker 1 (16:53):
had great mentors in your career, Of course, and
those are the people that youthink of like.
What would that person do?
I have moments of you know,maybe, when you don't have
clarity in what to do and youmight think of what does that
leader that has been a mentor tome, what would they do here?
And that's who you think of.
You do.
Speaker 2 (17:12):
I think I told you a story that I was working at
MasterCard and I loved to justhelping someone everyone not
someone, just everyone in thedepartment was very helpful and
there was a senior leader thatrecognized me.
He said you know, we need aperson in HR and that's how my
HR career started actuallyReally me.
He said, you know we need aperson in HR and that's how my
HR career started, actuallyReally yeah.
He said get Lisa trained gether into HR.
(17:33):
She's good.
She's good with people, she haspatience, and senior leaders do
that.
They recognize talent andthey're able to mentor them and
give them the ability to be selfmotivated, and it works.
It works.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
I agree with you.
I could think of a couple timesin my career where that
happened as well, where Ithought I was going on a certain
path and a leader pulled measide and said, hey, have you
ever thought about you know?
One example that comes to mindis when I was in college and I
had someone pull me aside andsay, have you ever thought about
being in management?
And I'm like, well, no, I mean,I think I was 19 years old, so
(18:14):
I hadn't thought about that yet.
And that's how my retail careerstarted, to be honest with you,
and I was made a supervisor.
But because somebody sawcapability in me and they said,
hey, have you thought about this?
So, and you just shared anexample of when it happened for
you.
And I think those are greatleaders too that can recognize
in people some gift, skills andtalents that maybe they don't
even see in themselves.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
And they and they take the time to do that Right.
That's where kindness comes in.
Speaker 1 (18:40):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Because there's not everyone that will.
They may just ignore it, orthey're, you know, interested in
their own.
They have an own, their ownagenda.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:50):
And so it's great when you do see that and people
care enough you know and alsogreat leaders are.
They have the ability toinfluence change in
organizations, which againcreate great results.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
Very true, yeah.
So, lisa, how do you lead withkindness?
I know that you've given manypresentations in your life.
I'm sure that you could sharesome things with us about the
how like our leaders, born withthis talent.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
So I want to start with that.
Oh, they would.
I was convinced that they hadthis DNA.
They were charismatic andthat's just the way they were
born.
They were fortunate enough tohave that, that talent.
But then, in time, after I didmy research paper and my
master's degree, my thesis paper, I did a little research and on
leadership and what was itcalled?
Leadership in corporations,leadership in the corporate
(19:54):
world?
Okay, yes, and I certainlyfound that people who had a
desire to learn and they couldlearn through social influence
it and it certainly can benurtured.
So, yeah, that's how you know,so I know that it can be.
You have to have a sincere umdesire to want to be a great
(20:19):
leader.
Speaker 1 (20:19):
Okay, so starts with desire.
The desire is, is for sure,important.
You have to want to be a greatleader, not for the ego part of
it, not because of um the boss.
Right, yeah, it's have to wantto be a great leader, not for
the ego part of it, not becauseI'm the boss right, yeah.
It's because you want toinspire and build great teams.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
Yeah, yeah, and you do.
And I'll tell you another storythat Lon, that was our CEO at
American Portfolios.
He was, he was.
He demonstrates empathy andkindness always and you know,
people admire him.
He's just that way.
And I'm not just saying that,he really is.
And one day when I was doing apresentation I was new there I
(20:56):
was a little nervous and youknow, he and I had a
conversation afterwards.
He said you know what, lisa?
You know why people like youwhen you do your presentations
is because you're honest.
Yes, and when you asked thequestion, what makes a great
leader?
And those are those littleglimpses that you get, that you
know someone says something toyou that kind of changed my
(21:18):
whole way of doing presentations.
Yes, I felt so good about it andI said you know, he's right.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
I think that's fantastic.
Speaker 2 (21:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
Reminds me of.
I do some Instagram reels,sometimes on my Instagram page,
which, by the way, is calledMegan Alexander, being real, if
anyone out there wants to checkit out but one of them recently
was about that about being yourauthentic self, trying to show
up as who you really are at workand in scenarios any scenario,
whether it's a meeting, whetherit's the one-on-one
(21:49):
conversations that happen at thewater cooler, whether it's
you're giving feedback to afellow employee it's about being
who you are.
You just nailed it when peoplecould feel authenticity in
somebody, they connect with youand they respect you because
they know who you really are.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
Yeah, and they trust you.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
And they trust you.
You're right, that's the keyword.
Speaker 2 (22:12):
We always said it.
I think it takes trust, respectand loyalty.
And with that combination itworks.
Whether you're in a personalrelationship or a professional
one, when you have those threecomponents, it really does work.
And I knew that he meant well.
Yes, yeah, he meant well.
And I lit up, I was like okay,and from then on I love doing
(22:32):
presentation.
This is a different style, bythe way.
Speaker 1 (22:35):
Okay, yeah, yeah, I'm always Tell me yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
I'm used to, you know , standing on stage and being
able to walk around, and so youkind of own the stage and I'm
enjoying this.
This is kind of almost like aninterview.
Speaker 1 (22:48):
Yes, in some ways, and it's really great.
Thanks again, sitting in astudio environment a little
different, like you said.
So what about the power ofkindness and leadership?
We just talked a little bitabout authenticity, but what are
your thoughts about the powerthat kindness and leadership can
have?
Speaker 2 (23:06):
Well, you know leaders are able to share a
vision.
You ever go to a company wherethey don't understand the vision
.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
Oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
Yeah, yeah.
And so again, there was a storythat was really impactful in
our firm, American Portfolios,where we would do surveys every
year of get the pulse of how thepeople are feeling.
Isn't it important tounderstand how they feel?
What's going on, Are they happywith management?
(23:38):
And it was a third partyadministrator and it was
completely anonymous.
But it came back every year fora couple of years that people
didn't understand the vision.
So I spoke to my CEO and I saidyou know, Lon, it comes back
that they don't understand thevision of the firm.
And he said how could that be?
(23:58):
Lisa, you know, I get up, I dothe state of the firm every year
, every quarter, and I talkabout it and said, yeah, quarter
.
And I talk about it and said,yeah, well people respond more
to what they see than what wethey hear, so we created an
infographic.
It was so cool, megan.
Why what was?
This infographic was athree-year roadmap and it talked
(24:20):
about these are the importantthing on our roadmap that we
have to concentrate and this isour vision.
This is where we're going andhow we're going to get there.
Okay, it was about the peopleand the culture and how we train
.
Do they have product knowledge?
Do they have customer service?
Speaker 1 (24:34):
training.
Speaker 2 (24:34):
Do we give them performance feedback?
Are we creating opportunitiesfor growth and advancement?
Next bucket innovation.
Isn't technology the way to go?
Sure, yeah, I mean technology,especially you being with Apple.
Technology is are we beinginnovative?
Are we making it seamless forour customers?
(24:55):
Constantly looking at that?
Then we brought in a qualityassurance guy.
Great guy had a master blackbelt in a Six Sigma training
where he looked at processes inthe company.
Oh, that's interesting, yeah,and he was able to identify.
You know, people like to dothings the old way, don't they?
Six Sigma training, where helooked at processes in the
company.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
Oh, that's interesting, yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:08):
And he was able to identify.
You know, people like to dothings the old way, don't they?
You know, oh, I don't want tochange that process but it's not
effective.
So this individual was able tolook at the processes in the
firm and make changes, and sothat was one real big piece
process and quality assurance.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
That's an interesting idea.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
Customer service.
Don't you want to look at whatthe customers think of?
Speaker 1 (25:34):
us.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
Are they happy?
We did surveys Promoters?
No, I'm not going to saybecause I don't remember the
term, but they were a surveythat we measured how they were
feeling about us.
Of course, we looked at thefinancials.
Yeah, the financials wereimportant.
We had a great CFO that gave usthe opportunity to look at
(25:58):
where we're making money.
Of course, that's what we hadto, and then the biggest piece,
which everyone that came in foran interview loved, was
community service.
We did a lot with communityservice.
Our ceo did 110 mile bike ridewith disabled veterans.
That's our company, great,great community service.
(26:19):
So those were the buckets thatwe.
That's the vision.
So when you ask the question,what are the characteristics of
a great leader?
I think that's what you asked.
They're visionaries, but theycommunicate those visions and
they care.
Now we could have said well,you know what, they're not
getting it on the survey, but wedidn't.
(26:40):
We took it a step further andwe created this infographic that
people loved.
Speaker 1 (26:47):
That was what I was just going to ask you.
What was the response fromemployees?
Speaker 2 (26:51):
We had them all over the conference rooms everywhere.
We had them at nationalconferences posted places when
we interviewed.
Actually, people thatinterviewed were very impressed
with the firm and how we hadthis, this outline of this
infographic, a three year plan.
(27:11):
Yeah for sure, yeah so, and sowe were constantly measuring.
So, yeah, it was, it's not easynot easy being a leader.
Leaders are.
It's a difficult job.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
Absolutely.
I think about everything thatyou just shared and, as an
employee, the vision isimportant.
So you know what you're workingtowards and focusing on the
priorities of the company, andthen you know what you're going
to be measured on as well.
You know what's important tothe company, so you're crystal
clear on your goal and whatyou're supposed to be doing at
work, and you know that theycare about you and what you're
(27:47):
supposed to be doing at work andyou know that they care about
you.
Sounds like everything you saidis that you care about and you
care about the community, withthe community service and
volunteering aspect of it, whichI think is so important, and a
lot of corporations are makingthat a focus these days as well.
Speaker 2 (28:00):
Yeah, giving back, yes, and it wasn't only for
public relations.
You know a lot of companies maydo it for those reasons.
No, we generally caredrelations.
You know a lot of companies maydo it for those reasons.
No, we generally cared.
We did a lot with autisticchildren, which was so rewarding
.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
Absolutely Such memories that I have that I'll
never forget.
Yeah, yeah, it is important.
So, um, let's talk about howdoes kindness relate to
leadership and relationships.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Yeah, that's interesting because you know.
Yeah, that's interestingbecause you know.
I'll mention John Maxwell.
Speaker 1 (28:30):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
Yeah, he wrote many books on leadership and he
nailed it on the head.
He said that leaders first ofall have to influence people.
They're no different thanparenting really in some ways
they build trust, they showcompassion, they build great
followers or leaders.
But you have to buildrelationships right.
You can't build a relationshipwith someone you don't know?
(28:54):
Yes, so you have to find outwhat motivates them what drives?
them, how can they becomeself-motivated?
And you don't have to be in aposition of power, but you have
to be in a person of influence.
Speaker 1 (29:09):
And that's what John Maxwell's, isn't that great.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
Don't have to be in a position of power, but you have
to be a person of influence,influencing people and making
them see just like the guy thatsaid, the senior person that
told me Lisa, you know, you'd begreat in HR.
He recognized that he was aperson of influence, you'd be
great in HR.
He recognized that he was aperson of influence.
He was able to influence me.
That was the direction I neededto go in.
Speaker 1 (29:33):
It is yeah and wow how nice was that.
Changed your life.
Speaker 2 (29:37):
Yeah, as you mentioned that someone said to
you and your career kind of wentin that direction for it Isn't
that exciting.
So I think that Kimberly Allen Ibelieve her name was another
motivational speaker that I metat the Society of Human
Resources conference in SanDiego, california, loved her.
(30:02):
She said think of it first ofall what leaders go through,
think of it first of all whatleaders go through their budgets
and succession planning,recruiting, staffing, hiring um
diversity and inclusion.
They're dealing with so muchand everything falls under the
umbrella of leadership.
But she, I loved what she saidhere.
She said if you put a mouse ina maze and you put a piece of
(30:25):
cheese in the maze, it's not thecheese that drives the mouse,
it's the hunger.
So, find out what makes peoplehungry.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
What a quote.
Isn't that great, that'spowerful.
Speaker 2 (30:37):
It was powerful and you know, and Megan, again we
talk about, I talk, we talkabout kindness.
How does that connect withkindness?
It's because people care.
Speaker 1 (30:45):
It's caring, it's caring, that's all it is.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
I mean, we could have you know, and I know we can
have managers that well, youknow what, if they don't care,
they don't try hard then that'son them but it's not.
We are responsible as leadersto find out what makes people
hungry.
Speaker 1 (31:02):
I think all statistics show that the leaders
that care are the ones thatbuild the best teams, the ones
that build, like we talked abouttrust, the ones that build
loyalty with the employee towant to work hard for that
person, even when things gettough.
Right, because, let's face it,work is a four letter word.
It can be tough and it comes in.
(31:24):
It comes in seasons, and so,when the times get tough at work
, if you have a great leaderthat you know believes in you,
you, you like you just talkedabout the hunger like you're
going to work hard anyway,you're still going to be able to
get it done.
You know that you can maybe goto that leader and say what's
going on with your life hey, I'mgoing through this tough time
right now or and they'll be morewilling to work with great
(31:46):
leaders, in my opinion will thenbe more willing to work with
you.
Um, because there's you've got adialogue, you have a relation.
We talked about relationships.
You have a relationship witheach other.
You're a human being.
You're not just someone thatgoes and punches in and you're
doing the work and going home.
You've got stuff going on inyour life yeah, everybody does.
Speaker 2 (32:03):
Yeah, and you're inspired and you feel good about
it yes yeah, yeah, you know,when we 2008, when there was a
market crash, mm-hmm.
Our leader said to everyemployee.
He said we are not gonna letone person go he had to stay to
the firm I brought everyone in.
It was a big deal and peoplewere afraid they were gonna lose
(32:26):
their jobs.
They had mortgages mm-hmm andhe said I will take a salary cut
.
Wow, I would not get any salary.
If so that you, I will not letanyone go.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (32:39):
And that's, that is a wow, isn't it?
Speaker 1 (32:41):
It is a wow.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
And those are the kinds of things, as you
mentioned the honesty, the trust, the loyalty that builds
retention, and we had strongretention.
So you know, I've seen it, yeah, I've witnessed it, yeah.
And you know, I've seen it.
Yeah, I've witnessed it.
Yeah, and you know we we'dalways joke, lon and I, when
we'd say people never terminatethem.
We don't terminate people, wenever did, megan I'll tell you
(33:03):
honestly, really we if it wasinsubordination of course yes,
okay but we gave everybody theopportunity to make a change.
Give them the give them theopportunity to show that they
could change behavior.
Yes, and if they don't, thenthey terminate themselves, don't
they?
Yeah, they do, yeah, yeah, sothat's again building trust and
getting to you know, working fora firm that you really love.
Speaker 1 (33:26):
Leadership is important so this, this sounds
like a great firm.
By the way, I just want to saythis, gentleman lon that you
keep speaking of, I'd love tomeet someday.
So you could let him know thatfor me, yeah, it's so nice to
meet great people like that.
So, lisa, what are someattributes of great leaders?
Speaker 2 (33:44):
Well, you know it's funny, they, the attributes are
just, they're simple.
I know we've mentioned a couple, but they similar to what we're
doing right now.
They smile.
We've mentioned a couple, butthey similar to what we're doing
right now.
They smile right they embracechanges, they acknowledge people
, they show confidence.
Those are great characteristics.
(34:05):
They are, again, great umcommunicators, they celebrate
people's success, um they checkin their mentors.
We that those are greatcharacteristics.
And is that the question youasked me?
Yeah, no, it is, and I'mthinking about it too.
Speaker 1 (34:23):
Integrity.
I'm thinking about it even asyou say it.
You know, I'll give an example.
Years ago and I'm going backhonestly over probably over 20
years ago, but it does stand outin my mind, honestly over,
probably over 20 years ago, butit does stand out in my mind, I
was in a leadership conferenceand I was in a breakout group
with you know, everybody that'sbeen in a breakout group before
you know what I'm talking about.
(34:44):
Okay, everyone, we're gonnabreak out and you're gonna go
with a smaller group of peopleand and do this discussion about
leadership and we I want to saythere may be I don't six people
in the group, so it's prettysmall.
But this one person in thegroup basically came right out
and said and again, this isn't ashow that we're going to name
names or anything like that, butthis is an example of something
(35:07):
that I experienced in my life.
But this person said that theydidn't really care about people
or their problems, that theywere convinced that they were a
great manager and they knew howto drive results.
It was so important to them.
I get great results, I driveresults.
Again, this is a long time ago,so the person was new in their
management career, but Iremember sitting there saying
(35:30):
perplexed how could it be thatyou don't care about the people
that work for you?
That doesn't register for me.
And this person basically wassaying, yeah, it doesn't, it
doesn't really matter.
I mean I'll like so.
Do you listen if somebody comesto you with a problem?
Well, I'll pretend to listen waskind of what this person said
and that really had an effect onme, that I even experienced
(35:51):
this in a breakout group,because, first of all, it's
foreign to me anyway, like howcould you not care about someone
?
And this was one person right,there's millions of people out
there, there's actually billionsof people out there, but that's
the example of what not to dofolks, right?
I'm sure for those listening tothis, to this show, they
probably know that already, butit does exist and that's why I'm
(36:12):
even bringing it up.
It does exist out there thatthere are some people that just
don't care, and I don't thinkthey're going to go far in their
careers, quite frankly, becausethey won't build that trust
with people.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
You know, I'm glad you brought that up, because
they don't go far in theircareers.
I've seen it, and I've seen iteven in this company, where
people have strategies that are,and the behaviors are not of
what we just spoke about allthose great characteristics and
it's a form of bullying.
Speaker 1 (36:43):
It's a form of bullying and what happens.
Speaker 2 (36:46):
People are fearful.
They don't want to talk up.
They clam up, they're afraid,they feel they're nervous,
they're scared.
That's not the kind ofenvironment you want to be in.
So I know you mentioned thatwas a long time ago, it was yeah
, but shame on him.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
Exactly so.
Forgive me everybody that Ibrought that example up, but
let's be honest.
It's important to say thatthere are all types of leaders
out there.
But I think this is we'rereally trying to shine the light
on why kindness is so important, and so I want to also ask you
why is kindness so empowering?
Speaker 2 (37:25):
You know, I think it's just, it's the greatest
strength of an organization.
You know you have to look atwhat.
You know, you have to bevigilant and it's just powerful
because people I think SimonSinek said it just feels good.
People just feel good andthat's what makes it powerful.
(37:46):
They feel good.
And then there's the trust, andwe did so many team building
exercises and read books.
We did in this last formercompany.
And I'll tell you MasterCard,as well as Home Depot, which is
Expo Design Center.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (38:02):
Great on, you know, enforcing the fabric of the firm
and the culture that theybelieve in.
Respect, trust, loyalty andthose are the powerful
attributes that come from agreat leader, great firm.
Speaker 1 (38:16):
It stems from the top right, it does.
Speaker 2 (38:19):
Yeah, and then they try to trickle it down and
that's why they have HR, thatthey keep an eye out on that and
they try to make sure thatpeople are there's fair
practices and policies andthey're continually auditing
that people feel good.
Those are the powerful thingsthat people want to work for a
firm.
Speaker 1 (38:38):
Yeah, yeah.
So you've mentioned, uh, simonSinek a couple of times today,
and that's definitely somebodythat I follow as well.
I, one of his books is, um, Ithink it starts with.
It starts with why, um, my sonis reading that book right now
too.
But you've mentioned a coupleof you know, john Maxwell, a
couple of other great peoplethat folks out there should
(38:59):
check out, and we'll also putthose in the end of this episode
if people want to see the bioof some of the books that you've
mentioned today.
Speaker 2 (39:08):
So thank you.
Speaker 1 (39:09):
I think that's really important.
So, to wrap this up in terms ofthe kindness conversation, is
there anything else that youwould share with the audience
about leadership, kindness oranything that's related to that?
Speaker 2 (39:25):
I just think that people just have to make a
conscious effort to work on it.
Speaker 1 (39:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (39:30):
And we're all human beings and we want to be treated
well, and that all ties intokindness.
I really do believe that.
I mean, if we just could shut.
It's not what you say, it'sjust how you say it.
Speaker 1 (39:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (39:43):
It really is, and you have to be conscientious of
that.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
It's not what you say , it's how you say it.
It's how you say it, I likethat.
Speaker 2 (39:51):
And how you communicate it, do it with
kindness.
It makes you feel great andwonderful.
I know it does me.
Speaker 1 (39:57):
It makes you feel great and it makes the recipient
feel great.
Speaker 2 (40:00):
And the recipient feel great.
Speaker 1 (40:03):
And for anyone out there that's trying to think
about how do you maybe speak upfor yourself at work.
Maybe there's something goingon and you would like to talk
about it.
Don't be afraid.
This is what I would say isdon't be afraid to ask for a
conversation with your leaderand explore having a
(40:25):
conversation about what'simportant to you, and as long as
you're kind.
I think that's the opposite ofit too right.
We're talking about kindnessand leadership today, but also
kindness as an employee.
If you approach things with anopen heart and assuming positive
intent, you could get to, Ithink, a great resolution.
If you have a leader, that's agood recipient also.
Speaker 2 (40:46):
That is so key.
I mean that open communicationmeans a lot and again, it's all
about the caring and it takestime and effort.
It does take time and effort,and if you're a good leader, you
need to take that time andeffort and and it uh a pat on
the back for those who do yeah.
Speaker 1 (41:03):
I agree, I agree, lisa.
Um, thank you for theconversation today.
Is there anything else that, uh, that I haven't asked you, that
you'd want to bring up?
Speaker 2 (41:13):
Um.
Speaker 1 (41:14):
I'm sure there's a lot more we could talk about.
Speaker 2 (41:15):
Oh, yeah, yeah.
I mean, I think in anothersegment we could talk about
maybe what you know.
We talked about kindness andgreat leadership and what is a
toxic environment like?
And why doesn't that work, andso just people can understand
that more.
But yes, we know what works ina great environment with great
leaders and and you know andindividuals that work at it
(41:39):
continuously strive to be better.
But what is it like when it's atoxic environment?
Speaker 1 (41:45):
and what can you do about it?
Speaker 2 (41:46):
yeah, because some people feel strapped in that
environment because they can'tget away from it they feel
trapped and they feel um.
Speaker 1 (41:54):
I guess trapped is is the best word, because you know
if you have bills to pay andyou're not sure how to get out
or what to do but you're right,that's we'll have you come back
for another topic.
Would you be up for that?
Speaker 2 (42:03):
Of course.
Of course, this was great.
Speaker 1 (42:05):
I loved it, this was great, and the time flies when
you're having fun.
I always say that, but um, I, Ican't thank you enough for
coming out and and being part ofthe show today.
I think this topic is such animportant one and, let's face it
, Anybody that's out there inthe world we, we, we want to
talk about kindness and howimportant it is.
(42:26):
So today it was about kindnessand leadership, but you know we
could spend kindness to manyareas of life, so we hope you
all leave with a kind hearttoday and think about that when
you're out there.
So thank you, Lisa, for coming.
Speaker 2 (42:38):
Thank you so much, Megan, All right everybody.
Speaker 1 (42:41):
You could follow Lisa on LinkedIn.
Look for Lisa DiBella onLinkedIn.
If you're in the professionalworld and you want to take a
look and look up her history,please do that.
You could follow me, meganAlexander, being real on
Instagram.
You could also, like I said,take a look at our podcast.
We are made for more and pleasefollow and share.
(43:02):
Maybe you know someone thatwould like to hear this episode,
but we appreciate you, thelistener, for checking us out
today.
That's it, everybody.
Peace out.
Speaker 2 (43:11):
Great.
Three, two, one, Hello and welcome to.
We Are Made For More.
I'm your host, Megan Alexander,and this is my podcast.
I'm so excited to be here todayfor what is our eighth episode,
and I have a guest today thatI'm really excited to share with
everybody, and her name is LisaDiBella.
(00:20):
So I'm going to tell you all,as normally do, a little bit
about our guests so you knowwhat's to come, and then we'll
jump into it.
But Lisa has been a humanresources professional for 30
years, working in a managementcapacity for such firms as
MasterCard International and theExpo Design Center.
She recently retired with agreat firm on Long Island it was
(00:44):
called American PortfoliosFinancial Systems excuse me
Services, where she was one ofthe executives holding the
position of Vice President ofHuman Resources.
So with that, welcome Lisa.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Thank you so much, megan.
I am so excited to be here.
I can't tell you really I am.
You know, from the first momentI met you and you mentioned we
are made for more, I was soexcited to be here.
I can't tell you really I am.
You know, from the first momentI met you and you mentioned we
are made for more.
I was so impressed and Ithought that you know, you
talked a lot about kindness andI said how can I connect that
with leadership and kindness?
Because being in the corporateworld, leadership and kindness
(01:20):
is has so many good results andso I'm happy to be here.
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (01:26):
That's wonderful.
I'm thrilled that you're heretoo, and so this is actually a
good place to discuss how weknow each other.
So far, I've known all of theguests that I have on the show.
That's making it easier for meeverybody.
But let's talk about that.
How do we know each other?
Lisa, I'm going to turn it overto you.
Speaker 2 (01:41):
Oh thanks.
Do you remember meeting me?
The first time I met you, megan, I know, was at my godson's
graduation party in my backyard.
Speaker 1 (01:49):
That's right.
Speaker 2 (01:49):
And I said wow, she works for Apple.
For what?
30 years?
Speaker 1 (01:53):
Well, not so much.
Actually just hit 23 years.
23 years, so over two decades.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
So myself being with big companies, I said, oh, we
have a lot in common.
And then you know there is akind way about you that I said I
know that I'm going to reallyenjoy talking to you, so that
was our first meeting.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
Yes and yes.
Speaker 2 (02:11):
And I did mention to my nephew that let's get
together with Megan.
I really like her a lot.
Speaker 1 (02:16):
Thank you for saying that.
I felt the same about you.
I talk a lot on this show abouthow people are drawn to each
other and energy that we put outthere in the universe and
what's returned to you and oneof my episodes recently I had a
guest that talks about your vibeattracts your tribe, and I
(02:36):
definitely felt that with youlike that instant connection of
wow, I like this person, I loveher energy and we had so much in
common.
Like you said, we love talkingabout people and kindness and
leadership and how we like tokind of work in those
environments, how we've liked towork in those environments in
our life.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
Yeah, it certainly makes you feel good.
You know, it's nice to be withlike-minded people and you don't
always connect with people thatway?
No, you don't.
No, you don't always connectwith people that way.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
No, you don't, no, you don't.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
And that's okay too.
And that's okay too.
Speaker 1 (03:08):
Yes, yes you know when you do it, it's, it's great
.
Yeah, absolutely, and then youtune into that right, you tune
into those connections and, um,if you pay attention to it and
you have time for it in yourlife because I know people are
really busy it's so cool tobring people into your circle
and learn from them, right,share learned experiences and
(03:30):
get to know each other better,and it certainly lights me up.
So I'm thrilled to have gottento meet you.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Thank you, and I am as well.
Yeah, you are.
You get.
You just get inspired.
You get so much energy frompeople that you have a lot in
common with, and I love it.
I agree with you.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
And so I'm going to tell everybody a little bit more
about you before we dive intoour topic today.
Actually, what I will say tothe listeners out there is we're
going to do something a littlebit different today.
Up until now, my episodes havereally been about bringing
people on and talking abouttheir life stories, which I will
still continue to do.
Been about bringing people onand talking about their life
stories, which I will stillcontinue to do, because I think
(04:07):
that's really a cool way to getto know about people and how
they navigated their life thechallenges, the successes and
transitions, if you will.
But today, lisa and I are goingto talk about a topic, and
we're going to as she's alreadybeen mentioning kindness and
leadership, and leadership is atopic that's near and dear to my
heart.
I've been in leadership in mycareer for quite a long time
(04:31):
myself spent a long time leadingteams in different retail
organizations, and now, for thepast 18 years, have supported
executive leadership teamsmyself, so it's really important
to me and I'm excited to talkabout it.
Lisa, let's talk a little bitmore about your background,
though, so when people listen in, they kind of can really
(04:52):
translate that into what we'retalking about In your spare time
.
I know you've served as avolunteer trainer for Child
Abuse Prevention Services, alsoknown as CAPS.
You've received certificationfor coursework training from the
University of the State of NewYork and the State Education
Department on sexual harassmentprevention and bully prevention
(05:16):
programs for Nassau and Suffolkcounties here on Long Island.
Tell us a little bit about that.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
You know it was quite .
You know I took a break afterleaving MasterCard.
After being there 20 years withMasterCard, they moved our
division to Kansas City and Iopted to stay in New York.
Great company, I learned somuch from them.
But I'm not the type to sitback.
So I said you know, what can Ido in my spare time?
I had a little time, betweenyou know, looking for jobs.
So I somehow connected it wasyears ago with a program called
(05:45):
Child Abuse Prevention Servicesand I was able to go into
schools and talk about how toprevent bullying, and it was so
rewarding and you know and Itold my own experiences.
I came from an inner city schoolsystem and I know what it's
like to have know being bulliedor and we, we talked about it
(06:05):
and it was.
It was great we're able to helpyoung children in elementary
school and mid school, mid-levelschools, to really understand
that bullying is not okay rightand yeah, and what to do and
reach out to somebody that youmight that might help.
You don't join in, that's themost important thing, don't?
Speaker 1 (06:24):
join in with someone else's bullying because you're
afraid.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
You want help, you don't join in.
That's the most important thing.
Don't join in with someoneelse's bullying because you're
afraid.
You want to.
You know, be in the crowd.
So it was wonderful, I was.
I felt great about it.
I again another thing that Iwas very inspired about and and
uh, and that's how I gotinvolved in that, and I did that
for quite some time.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
So did you ever have um situations, situations?
Where did anybody ever sharebullying stories with you?
Speaker 2 (06:48):
You know they.
There were some children thatactually admitted that there was
a bully in the class and he wassitting in the back of the room
and I'd say to him you know, wereally love you.
You know, tell us why you feellike a bully, but you know it's
a.
It's something that maybe theylearn from home, and not
intentionally, but and it'scontrol.
It is a control thing.
(07:09):
It's funny how sometimesbullies are in corporate America
as well.
It kind of translates.
So that kind of helped me, whenI was in corporate America as
well, to recognize that.
And it's you know.
We have a zero tolerance policy, whether you're in high in
schools or at work, uh, so yeah,I never really witnessed
(07:30):
anything.
I myself was bullied and I toldstories about it, and I
remember telling a story that Ihad a girl that was a twin and
I'm a twin, oh right, yeah.
And she I a girl kept pullingmy hair every day in school and
then she finally stood up for me.
And she went and she said youknow, please don't ever do that
again, or maybe not with thosechoice of words, but she said it
(07:53):
a little stronger, so shehelped me out.
So you tell stories and kidswere able to connect.
They really did love that and Iwas very happy to be part of
that.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Yeah, I can imagine Team you was.
I was very happy to be part ofthat.
Yeah, I can imagine Um.
You know I have to cause.
My kids are teenagers now andthroughout their growing up in
their school district you knowwe've heard a lot of the
different like bullying programsthat they have, and I wish they
had that when I went to school,like they didn't have that back
in the day.
And let's face it, like youjust said, there there's bullies
everywhere.
There's bullies in corporateAmerica, but there's bullies it
(08:24):
doesn't matter where you go inlife and exactly it's how was
that person traumatized or whatare they going through in their
life that's making them act thatway?
There's a lot of psychology toit and maybe that could be an
episode we do another time onitself.
I think we could probably could,because that's a really
important topic.
So I love that you've done workin that space.
(08:45):
So another thing I wanted totransition to is something
that's just a neat fun factabout you, which is you
participated in oh, there goesmy screen.
You participated in a pageantcalled Age of Elegance.
I guess it was the New YorkAmerica pageant, is that correct
(09:05):
?
Am I saying?
Speaker 2 (09:06):
that the right way.
Yeah, yes, miss, senior Americapageant, that's what it is,
miss.
Speaker 1 (09:11):
Senior America pageant.
Speaker 2 (09:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:14):
And this pageant is the world's first and foremost
pageant to emphasize and givehonor to women who can share
their personal and professionalachievements and their positive
outlooks on life, whiledemonstrating their
extraordinary talents.
I love that, yeah.
So what made you do this?
It?
Speaker 2 (09:31):
was a neat program.
I I was actually shopping oneday and a woman and I began
talking at the jewelry counterand she mentioned that she was
participating in this programand she said that.
well, I said, oh, that'sinteresting because when I was
younger my mom worked for theItalian organization and they
(09:53):
had luncheons at the Plaza Hoteland the Waldorf Astoria and I
always did some fashion shows,volunteered, and I was
mentioning that to her.
She said, well, we need someoneto participate in this, we need
another candidate.
And I said she said, do youhave a talent?
And I said, well, not really,but I could sing a little.
Speaker 1 (10:13):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (10:13):
So she asked me to come and audition for it.
It was in 2019 and I did and itwas.
It was again another wonderfulprogram.
I met professional women andit's not about all beauty.
And actually they have anelegance about them.
A lot of professional women.
We had to do a story about yourlife on stage and we had a gown
(10:40):
walk and we were judged by areal Miss America pageant
contestant.
Were you nervous at all?
You know I was.
The most part that I wasnervous was was the singing.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
Okay, because I don't .
I don't think I sing great, butI got through it, you got
through it I got through and itwas, it was.
Speaker 2 (10:59):
It was rewarding.
It certainly stretches yourcapabilities.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
You know.
Good for you.
I think it's really courageousthat you did that here.
You just ran into someone.
They asked you and you're likeI'm going to go for this, and I
love when people tell storiesabout their life and something
that they decided to try thatwas maybe not the norm for them.
Is it okay if I read a littlebit of what your statement was?
(11:23):
As a pageant contestant, thiswas part of I'm not gonna read
the whole thing, but part ofLisa's statement that she shared
as a contestant.
I believe that possessing aninfectious positive attitude
keeps negative behavior fromshaping who you are.
This helps build character.
With that in mind, I try to bethe best person I can, always
pushing the boundaries a littleharder.
It's the reason why I'm heretoday.
(11:44):
I listen to my heart withcompassion, kindness and honesty
.
If I believe in somethingstrongly, I will stand up and
fight for it.
And, knowing there is both joyand sorrow in life, with lessons
learned, the journey willinevitably lead us all to a
better place.
Okay, I lied.
I read the whole thing.
That was fantastic.
Speaker 2 (12:02):
I had to read it.
Speaker 1 (12:04):
So that's beautiful.
It shares a lot about who youare and and about your heart.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
So I appreciate it.
It really did give me anopportunity to meet such
wonderful people too.
Speaker 1 (12:14):
And I am still participating.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
I go to luncheons with all the pageant women and
you know there are differentevents that we are participating
in.
So it was, it's a greatopportunity.
Great opportunity to keepactive in the community.
Speaker 1 (12:28):
Well, that's fantastic, lisa, and I also
chose to talk about that heretoday because, as we said, our
topic today is kindness andleadership, and that talked a
little bit about yourself andyou kind of just made a
statement about kindness andwhat it means to you.
So is it okay if we kick in andget to that part of the?
Speaker 2 (12:46):
conversation yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:48):
So you wanted to talk about kindness and leadership
today.
Let's start with what drove youto being so interested in
leadership to begin with.
Speaker 2 (12:57):
Well, first of all, I wanted to give you a compliment
.
Okay, because I wanted to saythat, wow, I'll take it.
I tell my friends about.
We Are Made For More and theyto say that, wow, I tell my
friends about we Are Made ForMore, and then they're like gosh
, what's that about?
I said you know, listen to herpodcast, because they're about
kindness and again thatconnection and that's what drove
me actually to talk to youabout this and kindness and
leadership.
Speaker 1 (13:16):
So okay, but yeah, thank you for that.
Well, thank you, and actually,yeah, I'll take the plug right
now.
Everybody, Please feel free tofollow this podcast on any major
podcast platforms, such asApple or Spotify, etc.
But we appreciate that.
Thanks for saying that, Lisa.
It means a lot.
Speaker 2 (13:32):
Yeah, what led me to this?
What was it?
Why was it interesting?
You know it goes back to myearly careers career.
And when I used to look at ourCEO on stage and I love the way
they communicated, theyconnected with people.
They just had this ability toremember people's names and I
(13:55):
was so impressed by that.
They made a conscious effortand they were great storytellers
.
Yes, yeah, and I said, you know, I clearly was inspired,
spellbound by them, charmed, andI wanted, I was encouraged, to
be like them.
You know, it's difficult to bea leader.
It really isn't easy.
You get a pat on the back whenthings go well, you know, and
(14:18):
you're held accountable whenthings aren't going well.
I think that Simon Sinek saidit greatly.
He said that there'sdiversified personalities but it
takes courage and integrity tobe a leader.
That's key.
But at the same time, they havea subtle approach and they're
(14:39):
able to share one common vision,which I think is kindness.
And those are the ones that arereally successful, that have the
empathy or, you know, effectivecommunicators love them
absolutely I agree with you.
Speaker 1 (14:54):
As I said earlier, myself included, I've always
just personally felt that it wasnatural for me to want to be a
kind leader.
Okay, but but I don't thinkthat necessarily comes naturally
to everybody.
I think we'll get to that laterin this conversation.
Yeah, because there are manydifferent styles of leadership
out there, let's face it, andit's important to have
(15:14):
situational leadership indifferent situations.
Right, it depends on thescenario.
How you lean in and how youdirect and lead people is
important, but we're here totalk about why kindness matters.
So there's a connection withleadership, kindness and how
kind leaders consistently getgreat results.
Would you agree?
Speaker 2 (15:33):
Oh, absolutely A hundred percent.
I mean, I read a book byWilliam Baker and Michael
O'Malley, phds, and theyidentified surprisingly great
attributes that unequivocallykind leaders share, and that is
the integrity, the humanqualities, that becomes the
(15:56):
golden standard for excellence.
And that's where results comein, because really, you know, we
have the ability to leadpositively.
We know great leaders that leadpositively and they get great
results.
And we've seen leaders thatlead negatively and although
they may have followers, we'veseen that they don't get the
(16:19):
results.
In the end it never does.
The performance may rise alittle quicker, but it doesn't
stay.
The performance may rise alittle quicker but it doesn't
stay so certainly with kindnessand empathy and integrity and a
moral compass it works.
I mean leaders motivateemployees.
(16:39):
They know how to motivatecommittee members, board members
, clients.
They recognize unique talentsand they're able to be great
mentors, Haven't you?
Speaker 1 (16:53):
had great mentors in your career, Of course, and
those are the people that youthink of like.
What would that person do?
I have moments of you know,maybe, when you don't have
clarity in what to do and youmight think of what does that
leader that has been a mentor tome, what would they do here?
And that's who you think of.
You do.
Speaker 2 (17:12):
I think I told you a story that I was working at
MasterCard and I loved to justhelping someone everyone not
someone, just everyone in thedepartment was very helpful and
there was a senior leader thatrecognized me.
He said you know, we need aperson in HR and that's how my
HR career started actuallyReally me.
He said, you know we need aperson in HR and that's how my
HR career started, actuallyReally yeah.
He said get Lisa trained gether into HR.
(17:33):
She's good.
She's good with people, she haspatience, and senior leaders do
that.
They recognize talent andthey're able to mentor them and
give them the ability to be selfmotivated, and it works.
It works.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
I agree with you.
I could think of a couple timesin my career where that
happened as well, where Ithought I was going on a certain
path and a leader pulled measide and said, hey, have you
ever thought about you know?
One example that comes to mindis when I was in college and I
had someone pull me aside andsay, have you ever thought about
being in management?
And I'm like, well, no, I mean,I think I was 19 years old, so
(18:14):
I hadn't thought about that yet.
And that's how my retail careerstarted, to be honest with you,
and I was made a supervisor.
But because somebody sawcapability in me and they said,
hey, have you thought about this?
So, and you just shared anexample of when it happened for
you.
And I think those are greatleaders too that can recognize
in people some gift, skills andtalents that maybe they don't
even see in themselves.
Speaker 2 (18:35):
And they and they take the time to do that Right.
That's where kindness comes in.
Speaker 1 (18:40):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Because there's not everyone that will.
They may just ignore it, orthey're, you know, interested in
their own.
They have an own, their ownagenda.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (18:50):
And so it's great when you do see that and people
care enough you know and alsogreat leaders are.
They have the ability toinfluence change in
organizations, which againcreate great results.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
Very true, yeah.
So, lisa, how do you lead withkindness?
I know that you've given manypresentations in your life.
I'm sure that you could sharesome things with us about the
how like our leaders, born withthis talent.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
So I want to start with that.
Oh, they would.
I was convinced that they hadthis DNA.
They were charismatic andthat's just the way they were
born.
They were fortunate enough tohave that, that talent.
But then, in time, after I didmy research paper and my
master's degree, my thesis paper, I did a little research and on
leadership and what was itcalled?
Leadership in corporations,leadership in the corporate
(19:54):
world?
Okay, yes, and I certainlyfound that people who had a
desire to learn and they couldlearn through social influence
it and it certainly can benurtured.
So, yeah, that's how you know,so I know that it can be.
You have to have a sincere umdesire to want to be a great
(20:19):
leader.
Speaker 1 (20:19):
Okay, so starts with desire.
The desire is, is for sure,important.
You have to want to be a greatleader, not for the ego part of
it, not because of um the boss.
Right, yeah, it's have to wantto be a great leader, not for
the ego part of it, not becauseI'm the boss right, yeah.
It's because you want toinspire and build great teams.
Speaker 2 (20:34):
Yeah, yeah, and you do.
And I'll tell you another storythat Lon, that was our CEO at
American Portfolios.
He was, he was.
He demonstrates empathy andkindness always and you know,
people admire him.
He's just that way.
And I'm not just saying that,he really is.
And one day when I was doing apresentation I was new there I
(20:56):
was a little nervous and youknow, he and I had a
conversation afterwards.
He said you know what, lisa?
You know why people like youwhen you do your presentations
is because you're honest.
Yes, and when you asked thequestion, what makes a great
leader?
And those are those littleglimpses that you get, that you
know someone says something toyou that kind of changed my
(21:18):
whole way of doing presentations.
Yes, I felt so good about it andI said you know, he's right.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
I think that's fantastic.
Speaker 2 (21:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
Reminds me of.
I do some Instagram reels,sometimes on my Instagram page,
which, by the way, is calledMegan Alexander, being real, if
anyone out there wants to checkit out but one of them recently
was about that about being yourauthentic self, trying to show
up as who you really are at workand in scenarios any scenario,
whether it's a meeting, whetherit's the one-on-one
(21:49):
conversations that happen at thewater cooler, whether it's
you're giving feedback to afellow employee it's about being
who you are.
You just nailed it when peoplecould feel authenticity in
somebody, they connect with youand they respect you because
they know who you really are.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
Yeah, and they trust you.
Speaker 1 (22:09):
And they trust you.
You're right, that's the keyword.
Speaker 2 (22:12):
We always said it.
I think it takes trust, respectand loyalty.
And with that combination itworks.
Whether you're in a personalrelationship or a professional
one, when you have those threecomponents, it really does work.
And I knew that he meant well.
Yes, yeah, he meant well.
And I lit up, I was like okay,and from then on I love doing
(22:32):
presentation.
This is a different style, bythe way.
Speaker 1 (22:35):
Okay, yeah, yeah, I'm always Tell me yeah.
Speaker 2 (22:37):
I'm used to, you know , standing on stage and being
able to walk around, and so youkind of own the stage and I'm
enjoying this.
This is kind of almost like aninterview.
Speaker 1 (22:48):
Yes, in some ways, and it's really great.
Thanks again, sitting in astudio environment a little
different, like you said.
So what about the power ofkindness and leadership?
We just talked a little bitabout authenticity, but what are
your thoughts about the powerthat kindness and leadership can
have?
Speaker 2 (23:06):
Well, you know leaders are able to share a
vision.
You ever go to a company wherethey don't understand the vision
.
Speaker 1 (23:16):
Oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:16):
Yeah, yeah.
And so again, there was a storythat was really impactful in
our firm, American Portfolios,where we would do surveys every
year of get the pulse of how thepeople are feeling.
Isn't it important tounderstand how they feel?
What's going on, Are they happywith management?
(23:38):
And it was a third partyadministrator and it was
completely anonymous.
But it came back every year fora couple of years that people
didn't understand the vision.
So I spoke to my CEO and I saidyou know, Lon, it comes back
that they don't understand thevision of the firm.
And he said how could that be?
(23:58):
Lisa, you know, I get up, I dothe state of the firm every year
, every quarter, and I talkabout it and said, yeah, quarter
.
And I talk about it and said,yeah, well people respond more
to what they see than what wethey hear, so we created an
infographic.
It was so cool, megan.
Why what was?
This infographic was athree-year roadmap and it talked
(24:20):
about these are the importantthing on our roadmap that we
have to concentrate and this isour vision.
This is where we're going andhow we're going to get there.
Okay, it was about the peopleand the culture and how we train
.
Do they have product knowledge?
Do they have customer service?
Speaker 1 (24:34):
training.
Speaker 2 (24:34):
Do we give them performance feedback?
Are we creating opportunitiesfor growth and advancement?
Next bucket innovation.
Isn't technology the way to go?
Sure, yeah, I mean technology,especially you being with Apple.
Technology is are we beinginnovative?
Are we making it seamless forour customers?
(24:55):
Constantly looking at that?
Then we brought in a qualityassurance guy.
Great guy had a master blackbelt in a Six Sigma training
where he looked at processes inthe company.
Oh, that's interesting, yeah,and he was able to identify.
You know, people like to dothings the old way, don't they?
Six Sigma training, where helooked at processes in the
company.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
Oh, that's interesting, yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:08):
And he was able to identify.
You know, people like to dothings the old way, don't they?
You know, oh, I don't want tochange that process but it's not
effective.
So this individual was able tolook at the processes in the
firm and make changes, and sothat was one real big piece
process and quality assurance.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
That's an interesting idea.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
Customer service.
Don't you want to look at whatthe customers think of?
Speaker 1 (25:34):
us.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
Are they happy?
We did surveys Promoters?
No, I'm not going to saybecause I don't remember the
term, but they were a surveythat we measured how they were
feeling about us.
Of course, we looked at thefinancials.
Yeah, the financials wereimportant.
We had a great CFO that gave usthe opportunity to look at
(25:58):
where we're making money.
Of course, that's what we hadto, and then the biggest piece,
which everyone that came in foran interview loved, was
community service.
We did a lot with communityservice.
Our ceo did 110 mile bike ridewith disabled veterans.
That's our company, great,great community service.
(26:19):
So those were the buckets thatwe.
That's the vision.
So when you ask the question,what are the characteristics of
a great leader?
I think that's what you asked.
They're visionaries, but theycommunicate those visions and
they care.
Now we could have said well,you know what, they're not
getting it on the survey, but wedidn't.
(26:40):
We took it a step further andwe created this infographic that
people loved.
Speaker 1 (26:47):
That was what I was just going to ask you.
What was the response fromemployees?
Speaker 2 (26:51):
We had them all over the conference rooms everywhere.
We had them at nationalconferences posted places when
we interviewed.
Actually, people thatinterviewed were very impressed
with the firm and how we hadthis, this outline of this
infographic, a three year plan.
(27:11):
Yeah for sure, yeah so, and sowe were constantly measuring.
So, yeah, it was, it's not easynot easy being a leader.
Leaders are.
It's a difficult job.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
Absolutely.
I think about everything thatyou just shared and, as an
employee, the vision isimportant.
So you know what you're workingtowards and focusing on the
priorities of the company, andthen you know what you're going
to be measured on as well.
You know what's important tothe company, so you're crystal
clear on your goal and whatyou're supposed to be doing at
work, and you know that theycare about you and what you're
(27:47):
supposed to be doing at work andyou know that they care about
you.
Sounds like everything you saidis that you care about and you
care about the community, withthe community service and
volunteering aspect of it, whichI think is so important, and a
lot of corporations are makingthat a focus these days as well.
Speaker 2 (28:00):
Yeah, giving back, yes, and it wasn't only for
public relations.
You know a lot of companies maydo it for those reasons.
No, we generally caredrelations.
You know a lot of companies maydo it for those reasons.
No, we generally cared.
We did a lot with autisticchildren, which was so rewarding
.
Speaker 1 (28:15):
Absolutely Such memories that I have that I'll
never forget.
Yeah, yeah, it is important.
So, um, let's talk about howdoes kindness relate to
leadership and relationships.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
Yeah, that's interesting because you know.
Yeah, that's interestingbecause you know.
I'll mention John Maxwell.
Speaker 1 (28:30):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
Yeah, he wrote many books on leadership and he
nailed it on the head.
He said that leaders first ofall have to influence people.
They're no different thanparenting really in some ways
they build trust, they showcompassion, they build great
followers or leaders.
But you have to buildrelationships right.
You can't build a relationshipwith someone you don't know?
(28:54):
Yes, so you have to find outwhat motivates them what drives?
them, how can they becomeself-motivated?
And you don't have to be in aposition of power, but you have
to be in a person of influence.
Speaker 1 (29:09):
And that's what John Maxwell's, isn't that great.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
Don't have to be in a position of power, but you have
to be a person of influence,influencing people and making
them see just like the guy thatsaid, the senior person that
told me Lisa, you know, you'd begreat in HR.
He recognized that he was aperson of influence, you'd be
great in HR.
He recognized that he was aperson of influence.
He was able to influence me.
That was the direction I neededto go in.
Speaker 1 (29:33):
It is yeah and wow how nice was that.
Changed your life.
Speaker 2 (29:37):
Yeah, as you mentioned that someone said to
you and your career kind of wentin that direction for it Isn't
that exciting.
So I think that Kimberly Allen Ibelieve her name was another
motivational speaker that I metat the Society of Human
Resources conference in SanDiego, california, loved her.
(30:02):
She said think of it first ofall what leaders go through,
think of it first of all whatleaders go through their budgets
and succession planning,recruiting, staffing, hiring um
diversity and inclusion.
They're dealing with so muchand everything falls under the
umbrella of leadership.
But she, I loved what she saidhere.
She said if you put a mouse ina maze and you put a piece of
(30:25):
cheese in the maze, it's not thecheese that drives the mouse,
it's the hunger.
So, find out what makes peoplehungry.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
What a quote.
Isn't that great, that'spowerful.
Speaker 2 (30:37):
It was powerful and you know, and Megan, again we
talk about, I talk, we talkabout kindness.
How does that connect withkindness?
It's because people care.
Speaker 1 (30:45):
It's caring, it's caring, that's all it is.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
I mean, we could have you know, and I know we can
have managers that well, youknow what, if they don't care,
they don't try hard then that'son them but it's not.
We are responsible as leadersto find out what makes people
hungry.
Speaker 1 (31:02):
I think all statistics show that the leaders
that care are the ones thatbuild the best teams, the ones
that build, like we talked abouttrust, the ones that build
loyalty with the employee towant to work hard for that
person, even when things gettough.
Right, because, let's face it,work is a four letter word.
It can be tough and it comes in.
(31:24):
It comes in seasons, and so,when the times get tough at work
, if you have a great leaderthat you know believes in you,
you, you like you just talkedabout the hunger like you're
going to work hard anyway,you're still going to be able to
get it done.
You know that you can maybe goto that leader and say what's
going on with your life hey, I'mgoing through this tough time
right now or and they'll be morewilling to work with great
(31:46):
leaders, in my opinion will thenbe more willing to work with
you.
Um, because there's you've got adialogue, you have a relation.
We talked about relationships.
You have a relationship witheach other.
You're a human being.
You're not just someone thatgoes and punches in and you're
doing the work and going home.
You've got stuff going on inyour life yeah, everybody does.
Speaker 2 (32:03):
Yeah, and you're inspired and you feel good about
it yes yeah, yeah, you know,when we 2008, when there was a
market crash, mm-hmm.
Our leader said to everyemployee.
He said we are not gonna letone person go he had to stay to
the firm I brought everyone in.
It was a big deal and peoplewere afraid they were gonna lose
(32:26):
their jobs.
They had mortgages mm-hmm andhe said I will take a salary cut
.
Wow, I would not get any salary.
If so that you, I will not letanyone go.
Speaker 1 (32:39):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (32:39):
And that's, that is a wow, isn't it?
Speaker 1 (32:41):
It is a wow.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
And those are the kinds of things, as you
mentioned the honesty, the trust, the loyalty that builds
retention, and we had strongretention.
So you know, I've seen it, yeah, I've witnessed it, yeah.
And you know, I've seen it.
Yeah, I've witnessed it.
Yeah, and you know we we'dalways joke, lon and I, when
we'd say people never terminatethem.
We don't terminate people, wenever did, megan I'll tell you
(33:03):
honestly, really we if it wasinsubordination of course yes,
okay but we gave everybody theopportunity to make a change.
Give them the give them theopportunity to show that they
could change behavior.
Yes, and if they don't, thenthey terminate themselves, don't
they?
Yeah, they do, yeah, yeah, sothat's again building trust and
getting to you know, working fora firm that you really love.
Speaker 1 (33:26):
Leadership is important so this, this sounds
like a great firm.
By the way, I just want to saythis, gentleman lon that you
keep speaking of, I'd love tomeet someday.
So you could let him know thatfor me, yeah, it's so nice to
meet great people like that.
So, lisa, what are someattributes of great leaders?
Speaker 2 (33:44):
Well, you know it's funny, they, the attributes are
just, they're simple.
I know we've mentioned a couple, but they similar to what we're
doing right now.
They smile.
We've mentioned a couple, butthey similar to what we're doing
right now.
They smile right they embracechanges, they acknowledge people
, they show confidence.
Those are great characteristics.
(34:05):
They are, again, great umcommunicators, they celebrate
people's success, um they checkin their mentors.
We that those are greatcharacteristics.
And is that the question youasked me?
Yeah, no, it is, and I'mthinking about it too.
Speaker 1 (34:23):
Integrity.
I'm thinking about it even asyou say it.
You know, I'll give an example.
Years ago and I'm going backhonestly over probably over 20
years ago, but it does stand outin my mind, honestly over,
probably over 20 years ago, butit does stand out in my mind, I
was in a leadership conferenceand I was in a breakout group
with you know, everybody that'sbeen in a breakout group before
you know what I'm talking about.
(34:44):
Okay, everyone, we're gonnabreak out and you're gonna go
with a smaller group of peopleand and do this discussion about
leadership and we I want to saythere may be I don't six people
in the group, so it's prettysmall.
But this one person in thegroup basically came right out
and said and again, this isn't ashow that we're going to name
names or anything like that, butthis is an example of something
(35:07):
that I experienced in my life.
But this person said that theydidn't really care about people
or their problems, that theywere convinced that they were a
great manager and they knew howto drive results.
It was so important to them.
I get great results, I driveresults.
Again, this is a long time ago,so the person was new in their
management career, but Iremember sitting there saying
(35:30):
perplexed how could it be thatyou don't care about the people
that work for you?
That doesn't register for me.
And this person basically wassaying, yeah, it doesn't, it
doesn't really matter.
I mean I'll like so.
Do you listen if somebody comesto you with a problem?
Well, I'll pretend to listen waskind of what this person said
and that really had an effect onme, that I even experienced
(35:51):
this in a breakout group,because, first of all, it's
foreign to me anyway, like howcould you not care about someone
?
And this was one person right,there's millions of people out
there, there's actually billionsof people out there, but that's
the example of what not to dofolks, right?
I'm sure for those listening tothis, to this show, they
probably know that already, butit does exist and that's why I'm
(36:12):
even bringing it up.
It does exist out there thatthere are some people that just
don't care, and I don't thinkthey're going to go far in their
careers, quite frankly, becausethey won't build that trust
with people.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
You know, I'm glad you brought that up, because
they don't go far in theircareers.
I've seen it, and I've seen iteven in this company, where
people have strategies that are,and the behaviors are not of
what we just spoke about allthose great characteristics and
it's a form of bullying.
Speaker 1 (36:43):
It's a form of bullying and what happens.
Speaker 2 (36:46):
People are fearful.
They don't want to talk up.
They clam up, they're afraid,they feel they're nervous,
they're scared.
That's not the kind ofenvironment you want to be in.
So I know you mentioned thatwas a long time ago, it was yeah
, but shame on him.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
Exactly so.
Forgive me everybody that Ibrought that example up, but
let's be honest.
It's important to say thatthere are all types of leaders
out there.
But I think this is we'rereally trying to shine the light
on why kindness is so important, and so I want to also ask you
why is kindness so empowering?
Speaker 2 (37:25):
You know, I think it's just, it's the greatest
strength of an organization.
You know you have to look atwhat.
You know, you have to bevigilant and it's just powerful
because people I think SimonSinek said it just feels good.
People just feel good andthat's what makes it powerful.
(37:46):
They feel good.
And then there's the trust, andwe did so many team building
exercises and read books.
We did in this last formercompany.
And I'll tell you MasterCard,as well as Home Depot, which is
Expo Design Center.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (38:02):
Great on, you know, enforcing the fabric of the firm
and the culture that theybelieve in.
Respect, trust, loyalty andthose are the powerful
attributes that come from agreat leader, great firm.
Speaker 1 (38:16):
It stems from the top right, it does.
Speaker 2 (38:19):
Yeah, and then they try to trickle it down and
that's why they have HR, thatthey keep an eye out on that and
they try to make sure thatpeople are there's fair
practices and policies andthey're continually auditing
that people feel good.
Those are the powerful thingsthat people want to work for a
firm.
Speaker 1 (38:38):
Yeah, yeah.
So you've mentioned, uh, simonSinek a couple of times today,
and that's definitely somebodythat I follow as well.
I, one of his books is, um, Ithink it starts with.
It starts with why, um, my sonis reading that book right now
too.
But you've mentioned a coupleof you know, john Maxwell, a
couple of other great peoplethat folks out there should
(38:59):
check out, and we'll also putthose in the end of this episode
if people want to see the bioof some of the books that you've
mentioned today.
Speaker 2 (39:08):
So thank you.
Speaker 1 (39:09):
I think that's really important.
So, to wrap this up in terms ofthe kindness conversation, is
there anything else that youwould share with the audience
about leadership, kindness oranything that's related to that?
Speaker 2 (39:25):
I just think that people just have to make a
conscious effort to work on it.
Speaker 1 (39:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (39:30):
And we're all human beings and we want to be treated
well, and that all ties intokindness.
I really do believe that.
I mean, if we just could shut.
It's not what you say, it'sjust how you say it.
Speaker 1 (39:42):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (39:43):
It really is, and you have to be conscientious of
that.
Speaker 1 (39:46):
It's not what you say , it's how you say it.
It's how you say it, I likethat.
Speaker 2 (39:51):
And how you communicate it, do it with
kindness.
It makes you feel great andwonderful.
I know it does me.
Speaker 1 (39:57):
It makes you feel great and it makes the recipient
feel great.
Speaker 2 (40:00):
And the recipient feel great.
Speaker 1 (40:03):
And for anyone out there that's trying to think
about how do you maybe speak upfor yourself at work.
Maybe there's something goingon and you would like to talk
about it.
Don't be afraid.
This is what I would say isdon't be afraid to ask for a
conversation with your leaderand explore having a
(40:25):
conversation about what'simportant to you, and as long as
you're kind.
I think that's the opposite ofit too right.
We're talking about kindnessand leadership today, but also
kindness as an employee.
If you approach things with anopen heart and assuming positive
intent, you could get to, Ithink, a great resolution.
If you have a leader, that's agood recipient also.
Speaker 2 (40:46):
That is so key.
I mean that open communicationmeans a lot and again, it's all
about the caring and it takestime and effort.
It does take time and effort,and if you're a good leader, you
need to take that time andeffort and and it uh a pat on
the back for those who do yeah.
Speaker 1 (41:03):
I agree, I agree, lisa.
Um, thank you for theconversation today.
Is there anything else that, uh, that I haven't asked you, that
you'd want to bring up?
Speaker 2 (41:13):
Um.
Speaker 1 (41:14):
I'm sure there's a lot more we could talk about.
Speaker 2 (41:15):
Oh, yeah, yeah.
I mean, I think in anothersegment we could talk about
maybe what you know.
We talked about kindness andgreat leadership and what is a
toxic environment like?
And why doesn't that work, andso just people can understand
that more.
But yes, we know what works ina great environment with great
leaders and and you know andindividuals that work at it
(41:39):
continuously strive to be better.
But what is it like when it's atoxic environment?
Speaker 1 (41:45):
and what can you do about it?
Speaker 2 (41:46):
yeah, because some people feel strapped in that
environment because they can'tget away from it they feel
trapped and they feel um.
Speaker 1 (41:54):
I guess trapped is is the best word, because you know
if you have bills to pay andyou're not sure how to get out
or what to do but you're right,that's we'll have you come back
for another topic.
Would you be up for that?
Speaker 2 (42:03):
Of course.
Of course, this was great.
Speaker 1 (42:05):
I loved it, this was great, and the time flies when
you're having fun.
I always say that, but um, I, Ican't thank you enough for
coming out and and being part ofthe show today.
I think this topic is such animportant one and, let's face it
, Anybody that's out there inthe world we, we, we want to
talk about kindness and howimportant it is.
(42:26):
So today it was about kindnessand leadership, but you know we
could spend kindness to manyareas of life, so we hope you
all leave with a kind hearttoday and think about that when
you're out there.
So thank you, Lisa, for coming.
Speaker 2 (42:38):
Thank you so much, Megan, All right everybody.
Speaker 1 (42:41):
You could follow Lisa on LinkedIn.
Look for Lisa DiBella onLinkedIn.
If you're in the professionalworld and you want to take a
look and look up her history,please do that.
You could follow me, meganAlexander, being real on
Instagram.
You could also, like I said,take a look at our podcast.
We are made for more and pleasefollow and share.
(43:02):
Maybe you know someone thatwould like to hear this episode,
but we appreciate you, thelistener, for checking us out
today.
That's it, everybody.
Peace out.
Speaker 2 (43:11):
Great.
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