377 - Lessons from a Web Designers' First Year in Business with Megan Fletcher - Web Design Business with Josh Hall

Episode Transcript
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Megan Fletcher (00:00):
I'm noticing again like I'm getting to the
point where I really need totighten things down and like I
need to focus on making sure,cause it kind of was after my
really big um up that like Iwent down, and so I need to make
sure this time that I'm up thatI'm still looking at marketing
Like I think I've lagged twoweeks.
My goal was, like every singleweek, to do something that I

(00:21):
could check off as a marketingbox, and I think I've lagged for
like two weeks, and so it'slike I need to remember that
first lesson so I don't repeatit again.
Welcome to the Web DesignBusiness Podcast with your host,
josh Hall, helping you build aweb design business that gives
you freedom and a lifestyle youlove.

Josh Hall (00:44):
Oh, my web designer friend, I'm so glad to have you
here in this one.
I'm pumped about this onebecause the last couple of
podcast episodes have been withguests who are a little more
established in their journeys.
A couple episodes back, kristenwas five years into her journey
, most recent episode with Jacob.
He's somebody who has been inthe design world for over almost
two decades, but you can stilllearn so much from folks who are

(01:08):
early in the journey.
And my guest in this one, meganFletcher, is a web designer who
just crossed her first fullyear in business and has learned
so many lessons.
We all know the first year ofbusiness in particular is full
of highs and lows, ups and downs, amazing days, dreadful days

(01:29):
and everything in between.
But Megan has come through itand has so much to share in this
conversation about what she didto push through her first year.
And now, more recently just,she had her biggest revenue
month to date at over $8,000 inone month, which means, if she
gets closer and closer to thatbeing an average, she is now on

(01:50):
track for this next phase at asix figure web design business,
now heading into her second yearin business.
So we're going to talk aboutall that more in this one.
You can check out Megan'swebsite at meganfletchercom.
We'll get into this, but thereis another domain that you might
be able to reach her out aswell.
Some fun stuff ahead and theshow notes for this one are

(02:11):
going to be at joshhallco slash377 for all the links we
mentioned.
But again, first year inbusiness, biggest month to date
a lot to learn from, whether youare brand new in your web
design business or if you'restill early on, or maybe you're
established and want to knowwhat Megan did to get clients
because you can do the same.
All that and more is covered,so let's have some fun.
Here's Megan.

(02:31):
So, megan, so good to have youhere Officially.
Just over a year right, like ayear plus of the business.
Now I figured we kind of diveinto all the lessons, learns,
the ups and downs, the highs andlows, what I?

(02:53):
I have to ask you this becauseyou're you're kind of becoming.
You became a web designer andthen you became you know you're
becoming a business owner.
Now, yeah, what, uh?
Has the range of emotions beenlike expected or unexpected?

So it took like a lot of convincing to finally
take the leap.
You know, I've I've listened tosome of your podcasts before
where you talk about just likethat personality where you're
trying to like make a businessright.
And, like so many things thatI've done in life, I've always
like tried, but how could I sellthis?
Like, how could I make moneyoff this thing?
So I feel like that thatmindset has always been there,

(03:34):
but I've just never nurtured it.
I've always just assumed, likego to college, get my degree and
get the job and all of that.
And so it has been like awhirlwind to to kind of dive
into owning everything on yourown and like being responsible
for, for all the different thefacets of communicating with the

(03:58):
clients and doing the backendand doing the administration,
like everything has just beensuch a learning curve.
But I'm, oh man, like tofeeling like you're failing
imposter syndrome, to like thehighs of like closing out deals
and just feeling like a stud,like just everything.

Josh Hall (04:17):
Yeah, like literally every mix of emotion was in
there.
It is funny, it's so and it'sso cool to to see what you've
done in this first year, becausewe just had a coaching call on
pro and we were joking aboutthis but you went from like I
was so pumped up about yourrecent update because I just
knew I could tell with you ifyou just stuck with it and had

(04:37):
some persistence.
Between that you know a coupleof slow periods and drive client
pipeline periods I was likeyou've got it, you just got,
just got to keep on going.
And then one of your recentupdates is you know, best month
to date, a plus year in thebusiness.
Now you're swamped.
Now you're actually like whatdo?

I do with all this work it can change and
happen so fast.
I know you've always been likethe, the like motivation, like
behind everything.
I remember when I first signedup for pro and I was like if I
could just make a thousanddollars a month, I think we
could survive.
And you're like easy, and I'mlike okay, okay, what, Okay?

(05:14):
So, and then just like gettingto the end of the year and like
through the hard times andyou're just always like it's
going to, like it'll pick backup, like take this slow moment
to kind of work on differentpieces that like you won't be
able to when you're really busyand and you you know it's just
it's hard to like see it whenyou're in it.
But then, like now, like hittingthat one year mark just a

(05:36):
couple of weeks ago, and likehaving some some maintenance
contracts renewing, and likeyou're just like oh shoot, it
really does just like snowballand like get, get easier, as, as
you get like a reputation withpeople you know, people I don't
know are handing out myinformation, like the referrals,
I'm like who who'd you hearabout me from?

(05:57):
And they're like Rebecca, andI'm like I don't know Rebecca,
but awesome, you know.
And so it's just been reallycool to like watch it grow.
And I don't know, rebecca, butawesome, you know, and so it's
just been really cool to likewatch it grow.
And, um, I don't know.
You just like you put your headdown and you keep working and
you're following, like your bestpractices that you're giving us
, and then you're choosing notto listen at times.

(06:18):
You know and and you knowlearning the hard way, but I
think it's all part of theprocess.

Josh Hall (06:24):
I'm grinning from ear to ear just because I feel like
you're a different person nowfrom a year ago.
In a lot of ways it'sinteresting because you've been
really active and pro.
You've been really engaged withour weekly coaching calls and
our hot seats and yeah, we workthrough a lot of this stuff in
the beginning, but I really dosee a confidence and stability

(06:48):
in you.
That is not always the case,even after a year.
I mean, you've had some awesomewins and you're coming off your
best month.
I mean, as you just mentioned,your goal was a thousand a month
and you just had an 8k plusmonth.
Now we're looking at you're ontrack for a six figure business.
So, um, it is really cool tosee like I know we're going to
get into what has led youthrough this year, but to see

(07:09):
where you are right now, megan,I just want to publicly say like
it's freaking awesome.
I'm so pumped for you.

It is really cool to like I don't know you.
Just you look at people whostart businesses and you're
you're just always like I don'tknow if that's me, like I don't
know if I'm strong enough to todo the hard times and say the
hard things.
So that's, that's been part oflike the things that I've had to
learn is, you know, kind ofsetting boundaries with people,
but just like realizing that Ican has been pretty awesome.

Josh Hall (07:37):
So let's back up real quick.
What were you up to rightbefore you got into web design
and decided to take it seriously?
What was your career trajectoryin your life looking like?

Yeah, so I have a degree in computer science and
engineering and so I worked atGeneral Electric as a software
engineer right out of college.
But then I got married andmoved to like a small or like
agricultural town and so findingsoftware engineering jobs was
pretty difficult, especiallywith like the tech stack.

(08:09):
I knew I didn't really know thenewest stuff, so it just it
became really difficult.
That was like my first wake upcall.
Like I thought with a degree insoftware engineering you'd just
be set for life.
But there's definitely likeeven avenues there where people
just want to see like certainlanguages and stuff.
So I ended up in IT and I wasnot even doing engineering in IT

(08:29):
, I was just doing like businessstuff and so I was pretty
miserable.
And then I convinced my boss tosend me to a UX conference and
that was kind of like my firsttaste at designing, because in
college, a little back there, Iwanted to do like 3D modeling

(08:50):
was kind of what I wanted to dowith software engineering.
I wanted to get into gamedesign and stuff and I never did
.
But I always loved art and mathand that was like always
something like when I wrote myscholarships for college.
Like it was always like tryingto play up on like I use my
right and left brain cause Ilove math and I'm good at art
and like things like that Um,and I just kind of lost that and

(09:12):
then eventually, through thislike miserable job, got to go to
this offer off awesomeconference and um, kind of re
explore the idea of like usingmy, my like logical abilities
and my art stuff together and,and so that's kind of where I
started doing that I found amentor who worked at a junior

(09:34):
college in town, kind of gave mesome stuff to look into for web
design and building out again.
So I built my HTML site and justlanded the job at the college
for being their front end webdesigner and that was really fun
for a while but kind of gotcapped out like at a certain
point, cause there's I mean it'sone school there's only you

(09:55):
know you could go redo pages andthings like that, but you're
never like redesigning.
And so my brother-in-lawstarted a business in Alabama
and he was like hey, like canyou build me a website?
And so I I just did theresearch, I landed on Elementor
and WordPress and built him awebsite and I was like that was
awesome viable business insteadof like sewing baby clothes,

(10:25):
which I had done before, whichlike it's fun but like you can't
make a ton of money on them,you know, but like actually a
real business making websites isis feasible.
So that was like the firstlittle.

Josh Hall (10:37):
And when was that?
When you did that website foryour was your brother-in-law.
Is that right?

Yeah, that was back in 2021, I think Okay, so
you had a few years of designingsites and everything and like
learning web design and join theindustry a little bit.
Yeah.
And then my husband was kind oflike believed in me but nervous

(11:03):
.
And so he's like, can you kindof do some work with it part
time to figure out like, canthis be like a real thing?
And so I spent probably sixmonths seriously before um
jumping into full time justspreading the word.
And my husband actually waslike my number one marketing

(11:24):
person, like he he got me a lotof my first clients and then we
just figured, okay, let's do it.
And so it was time and weripped the bandaid off and I
dived in.

Josh Hall (11:34):
Is his name Josh too, is that right?
No, is your husband's name Josh?
Who am I thinking it's Brian,brian, sorry, tamara's husband's
name is Josh, though.
You're the couple pros who havehusbands names Josh.

I know she was like said that earlier and I was
like wait, that's right, yeah,yeah.

Josh Hall (11:50):
Cause I just say listen, you know, gotta have
some quality advice if it'scoming from a Josh.

So Ryan's good too, ryan's good advice.

Josh Hall (11:56):
Though that makes sense.
So when, when did making it alike I'm going to go for it to
when you joined pro, just so Ican have some context of kind of
where you were at?

I was probably in the midst of like we started.
It was like kind of the start.
I found you at the start oflike hey, like come up with a
business plan, like write thingsout and like like actually look
at the numbers and look at likethe feasibility.
And so I started looking forpodcasts and I didn't know what

(12:27):
else to Google.
So I just literally Googled webdesign podcasts and like, yeah,
here we are.
So and I just listened and itwas only like it was in December
because my sister was having ababy, and so I took a four hour
drive when she called and said,like you know, her water broke
and I took four hours,downloaded some podcasts and
yours was one of them.

(12:47):
And and then, like during thatdrive, like I was like this is
awesome, like I need to look atwhat his, his business thing is,
and I think it was like newyear's day or something that I
decided to sign up for it.

Josh Hall (12:57):
So Heck yeah.
So you had.
You know you're at that placewhere you had design, had some
fun with it and, mostimportantly, you enjoyed design.
You got your tool stack.
What other types of jobs hadyou done in between that?
Was it just occasional workwith family, friends and from
your husband and stuff like that?

Yeah, it was probably just referrals from my
husband it was my family memberand then, um, it was actually,
yeah, like a cup, two companiesfrom my husband's um, just his
network.
And then one of them was likefrom a Christmas party that we

(13:36):
had gone to and you know, it wasin the midst of like thinking
about taking it live, and and soI like my business had been
established, probably likeSeptember of of that prior year,
um, and so during that thatbusiness, a Christmas dinner for
one of his um clients I wasjust like, yeah, I do website
design and like we need that,and so like they were one of my

(13:58):
ones, that like I was signing on, just as I was like putting in
my notice to to leave my job.
So like just all that littlestorm.

Josh Hall (14:06):
Did the?
Did the fun of designingwebsites change at all for you
when you like, made it seriousas a business or did you have to
catch that?

I think it's.
It's still like my favoritepart, I know, you know, when the
family goes to bed, like ifI've got a design to work on,
like I can stay up working on itand it doesn't feel like I'm
working at night, Like that'sstill the part that I enjoy the
most.
It's probably just like thecontent gathering content from
people.
That is probably the leastfavorite part now.

Josh Hall (14:39):
Yeah, yeah, that's awesome.
I only ask because I do findwhen somebody commits to it and
then there's pressure behind itand financial any anything, when
you, when you attach money toit, it generally I found you
have to be pretty proactive with, like making sure you still
have fun and enjoy it.
Otherwise the stress of makingit a business can take over

(14:59):
pretty easily.

I would say there is probably a piece of
that, but it comes when, when wehave to go through iterations
of design, when I I would saymost of the time it's like the
first thing, they're done,they're good, we move on.
But it's if I have to like gothrough iterations and I feel
like I can't grasp, like aclient, and I can't just like
hit it out of the park like thefirst try.

(15:21):
That's kind of when my likedread comes in and I start
feeling like, oh, I just can't,I can't do this, I'm not good
enough to do this, so likethings like that.

Josh Hall (15:30):
So time to pass that on to the VA then, or the junior
designer once you get past thefirst stage.
Uh, I think.
By the way, I thinkpsychologically, I think that's
the reason, because at firstit's like the balls in your
court you can just design theway you wanted to, based off of
the requirements and stuff, andthen if the client loves it,
awesome win, win, win.
But if the client doesn't loveit or wants a bunch of changes

(15:51):
or iterations, then it's likeyou're kind of taking their lead
and it feels different thanwhen, like you know, yeah, yeah,
yeah, but hey growing pain, soyeah you had, like you know, you
had your design shop, and thisis important too.
I wanted to make sure we gotsome context on this, because
one year officially in businessdoesn't mean that you just

(16:13):
started building sites.

Never seen it before.
Yeah.

Josh Hall (16:17):
Yeah.
So you already had the craft.
I mean you already, cause Icould tell right out of the gate
.
I was like, okay, this is notlike a.
I mean, when you came into proand I saw your website, you know
V1, I was like, okay, this isnot a two month designer Like.
You've obviously had somedesign experience, you had some
UX experience, but as far as thebusiness goes itself, here's
what's really interesting, andthat is like officially getting

(16:39):
clients and officially marketing.
So what did you do?
I mean, I know some of thisbecause we've been coaching
together for a while, but whatdid you do initially to get like
, as you made, you know, tookthis seriously what was like the
first couple months of gettingclients for you, apart from just
the occasional family referrals?

My husband was a big part of it, just with his
network and stuff sharing it andthen, but also just sharing
that you know I taught youtalked about it in in pro um,
sharing it on Facebook in yourbusiness course, um, so I had
gone through the business courseas I was going through all this
and trying to follow some ofthe steps and tips that you gave

(17:21):
, and so just launching thebusiness, creating all the
social medias and sharing it tofriends and family, like putting
it on my professional one andthen sharing the professional
post on my personal one, andjust a lot of traction from
there and just getting the wordout that way and just a lot of
people excited and supportive ofit.

(17:42):
Tons of my, my friends andfamily shared it.
So it reached like a good chunkof the area and, um, that was
that was like a huge boost atthe beginning was just getting
that information out there.
And then, um, your shirt waswhen I landed um, one of like,
my big client, my best client.

(18:04):
Honestly, like I still want tomake him something for just how
awesome he was like um, somepolo Cause, I did his logo too
and and I flew to Hawaii andlike took photos for his website
and, like it was just, it wasamazing, right.

Josh Hall (18:17):
How did I not know about that?

It was so cool, like he's my vet and he runs a
conference and for veterinariansand I took my dog and wearing
your shirt, like total mess,like you know, hair in a bun.
No man, I was just like, yeah,I can take him on walks more
Cause I run my own business.
He's like web design, like yeah, I might need to talk to you
and then just like one of mybest clients ever so and I got

(18:45):
to go to Hawaii for the firsttime something you never get in,
like a nine to five.

Josh Hall (18:47):
I'm going to put that on the pro swag.
So, for anyone who doesn't know, in Web Designer Pro we have a
bunch of swag.
We have t-shirts, long sleevesand all kinds of stuff and yeah,
I mean I got a lead fromwearing mine.
I mean, you wear a shirt thatsays Web Designer Pro.
People are going to see thatand I'm going to put maybe
you'll end up in hawaii likemegan.
So that's a great sales deal,but that's freaking awesome.

(19:08):
I mean, there are just so manyways to get clients.

I'm like I was so ecstatic when it actually
worked for you too I know I tryand think about it every time I
go to like a doctor's officebecause I'm like I know they've
got the funds to like get awebsite so I'm gonna wear my
shirt today.

Josh Hall (19:21):
There, there you go.
Yeah, yeah, wear a Web DesignApproach shirt at the golf
courses or anywhere that's gotmoney.

You need some polos if we got to take it to
the golf course though.

Josh Hall (19:31):
Do not wear Approach shirt at the fair.
That is not where you want toget your ideal, I don't know.
Yeah Well, that's really cool,but tell me this, megan, am I
remembering this correctly, inthat it's like a roller coaster,
where it like goes up and thenit either goes down or plateaus
for a while.
I do remember a bit of a dryspell after the initial
excitement period.

Yeah, it was.
I was actually, after the bigum, the big client, I think I
got just kind of settled andhappy with the workload I had.
I had a couple websites goingand I just stopped marketing.
I stopped trying to do itbecause it makes me very
uncomfortable.
I don't like asking people orpitching to people, it's just

(20:15):
it's really difficult for me.
It feels like I'm burdeningthem.
So that was a really hardlesson that I just stopped
completely.
I was comfortable with theworkload I had and I was just
working on websites and doingnothing else to further the
business side of it.
I even stopped maintaining thetasks I was working on.

(20:35):
It was just getting up andworking on the website I knew I
had to work on and not reallythinking about all of the little
different pieces and thingslike that.
And so that was what led into,I think, like three months where
I just felt like I hadn't gotany new clients.
Um, and I was just it was.
It was frustrating Cause it'slike I feel like you had said

(20:58):
you know what I need to do.
My husband was even like youneed to work on marketing and
it's just I didn't want to andso I was kind of stubborn about
it, um, but just you know, I hadto slowly put those pieces back
into place and I feel like itjust takes time.
Uh, and I think I didn't havethat lag from the beginning
because I had been working anddoing the marketing and so I

(21:21):
just it always started off withwith clients on board and so I
never like that, the the drypart of starting it was never
there because I was stillworking and like getting a
paycheck, so I didn't notice itwhen, like, I first got the
wheel spinning and then and thenI let it dry up and then I had
to like restart it, which whichjust took time.

Josh Hall (21:42):
I think that's really common, though, especially for
folks.
When you start a business,there is excitement and there's
a buzz, and people can feel thattoo.
And yeah, I mean you didn'tcome out of the gate and it's
like a big salesy mode, but justthe word got out that you were
doing this.
But as soon as you get aworkload built up and as soon as
you start to go intohibernation mode which is not

(22:02):
uncommon for most web designers,because we like to do our work
and we like to have fun and dothe stuff.
Yeah, a lot of introverts.
So it is very common to get tothat point where suddenly you're
just doing the work, but then,as we talked about and I think
now you're on the other side ofthings now to where, like, we're
encouraging other pros and webdesigner pro to be like don't

(22:25):
turn the sales engine off, likeyou can't turn your marketing
off completely because it doescatch up to you pretty quick
until you get to the point where, honestly, you're at now, to
where you have a network that'sbuilt, growing and expanding,
and then referrals start to comein and you can do less like
outbound marketing and just more, like you know, circling back
around with your current networkright and and just more.

like you know, circling back around with your
current network, right and andjust the I don't know serving
everyone.
Well, I feel like trying to goabove and beyond, like this
first year with with everyonethat I have, and just like
really making sure that theylove me and everything that I'm
doing, um has been huge.
That this now, at like the yearmark, people are handing out my

(23:06):
number that I don't even know.
Um, like you mentioned.

Josh Hall (23:10):
You're like who the hell is Rebecca?
I don't know how awesome.

Right.
So, uh, just it's.
It is cool to, but it's just,it's so hard when you can't see
that you're doing something.
And something is happening,like now I'm seeing it from what
I was doing last year, but likelast year I wasn't really
seeing it doing anything and itjust takes time.
So just like to be patient,like would be a piece of advice

(23:38):
I would give.
Just like keep doing it andjust like keep working through.
Even if Tamara and I had areally awesome conversation, who
she's just one of the peopleI've connected with really well
from pro, which is another greatpart of pro is just finding
someone doing what you're doingthat like you can have, like
celebrate the good times withand celebrate the hard times

(23:58):
with and like get advice fromand stuff.
But we kind of have this like Idon't know goal that if we can't
do the little things well, likehow are we ever going to get to
the bigger thing?
So it's like when we're down,like and don't have much going
on, making sure to get up andlike do our laundry.
I know it sounds silly andsimple, but like do our laundry,

(24:19):
do the dishes, like just do thelittle things.
You know, whatever littlebusiness things there are.
Just like trying to explore anddo that, but just making sure
don't like let the depression orthe defeat like get ahold of
you.
Like just keep walking throughthe little things and that's how
you're going to get back tomore of the big things, cause
you know, when you get down inthe dumps you're like, oh, I

(24:41):
just, I can't anymore, and soyou just like stop doing
everything and so just gettingup and like moving just one
little piece at a time, that issuch sage advice.

Josh Hall (24:49):
It's.
There's a lot of benefit withmomentum and things that you can
control, like you can't controlalways if a client is going to
move forward, but you can do allyou can.
But you can control, like youjust mentioned, megan, your
habits, the mundane stuff ofworking on the business, running
your numbers, doing themarketing that you usually do.
Anything I feel like that youcould do on a consistent basis,

(25:13):
week to week.
For me I've talked a lot aboutit.
It's just I showed up to mynetworking group every Friday
7.30am.
Rain or shine, good weeks, badweeks.
I mean I remember when we foundout our daughter was was going
to be a special needs kiddo.
I mean I just like I wanted tojust stop everything for a
little while to process that,but we just just kept on going

(25:33):
like that.
Really, any little bit ofmomentum, that's consistent.
I couldn't agree more.
It really is key because itdoesn't take too long sometimes,
for you do get a win and thenthe wins can start to compound
too, which is, I know, what youeventually got to.
I don't know how long your dryspell was, but, um, I'm trying
to remember because I rememberwe had a coaching call and we

(25:55):
talked about other marketingavenues.
Did you ever do anything inother cities or other towns or
anything?
I?

did a a little bit but, um, I I never nothing
ever came from, not Okay.
So I went one time to thenearest chamber is like 30
minutes away, so I startedattending.
Like I paid to be a member andthey have like the worst
emailing system and they neveremail me when a meeting's coming
up and so every time I rememberto go look like I just missed

(26:24):
it.
So I've been like one time, um,but they did post my business
on their socials and so Iprobably got some visibility
there.
Um, but I have a small group intown that, uh, I go to and it's
really small businesses thatfor for the price of web designs
, that fully custom that we do.

(26:45):
They're not really my idealclients, um, cause they're.
They're really small, just umlittle shops, you know.
So I, but I still keep going andjust to have like the
relationship and the camaraderiewith other business owners in
my town, um, and so I don't knowif Rebecca maybe came to one of

(27:06):
those meetings.
That one maybe that's whereRebecca came from.
I really don't know, uh, causelike random people come in and
out of that.
So it could have been somethinglike that.
But just, even though itdoesn't feel really fruitful.
I still try and make it aneffort to like go.
It's not like BNI, where you'rekind of promised a reward, you
know cause.

(27:27):
That's the whole point of BNIis like working really hard to
to get referrals and givereferrals.
Um, it's more of just like acamaraderie thing that we have
in town.

Josh Hall (27:37):
So how long you know we don't like exact days or
anything, but how long becauseyou had a big buzz when you
started your business, had somevisibility, did marketing in a
way that worked for you withjust getting your name out there
.
You know a lot of familyfriends your husband was a big
part of that Landed an awesomeclient freaking, get to go to
Hawaii, but then that dry spellhappens because of all the

(27:59):
reasons we mentioned.
How long was it before Like,how long did you have to endure
that very painful dip before youhad a win?

I think it was the full third quarter, three
months um, before, yeah, beforeI landed it.
And then it was the fourthquarter that things started to
pick back up and it was partlymaybe because of the client that
I went to Hawaii with because Ihanded my business card out to
the other vet practices there,so I got two clients from him

(28:30):
essentially going to Hawaii andmeeting those other other
clients of mine.
Now, um, but yeah, it was reallysmall stuff.
I finished, um, looking backwhen I did the the year and
recap for you, and I wentthrough each month and saw, put
the numbers together of whathappened, there was really only
one month where all I made wasthe one maintenance plan, that's

(28:51):
on monthly of mine, but therest still had maybe a project
closing where I did have somekind of income, but it just felt
like yuck, like nothing washappening even though like there
was still work happening andclosing.
So that was kind of a coolperspective because, like, for
three months I felt like afailure and but like, looking

(29:12):
back at the end of the year,it's like there was still stuff
happening there and like it wasjust like a bad mindset to like
letting myself think that I wasjust not doing a good job.

Josh Hall (29:27):
I was just not doing a good job, I think to your uh,
your like compass of success,whatever that means, gets skewed
when you're on a high andthings are clicking.
And I found this with pro,because you know I have good
days and good weeks and bad daysand bad weeks with renewals or
subscriptions or signups, and Ifound that when I have a lot of
signups in the period of a weekor two, I'm like it is on,

(29:49):
things are clicking, the proiron is hot right now, but then
the next couple of weeks if justfor whatever reason, there's
less signups or it seems likethat happens, there's less
signups and a few people mayleave or something, and it's
just like I still go throughthose waves too, to where it's
like it just messes.
I think success sometimesmesses with your metric or your
compass of like.
Maybe that's not normal.

(30:10):
Maybe the first couple monthsof your business was not the
normal trajectory.
That would be hard to keep upwith, quite frankly.
So it was actually probablyabove what would be a little
more normal.
So, being that you went belowwhat was normal, I probably felt
even more so like Right Like.
What happened?

Yeah, exactly.

Josh Hall (30:30):
What was the wind?
What was a wind?
Did you land like a big projectheading into Q3?
Do you remember last year?
Do you remember like?
Do you remember feeling like,oh all right, I feel better.
Was there something thathappened?

At that, like right at the start of Q I think
even the start of q4 wasstarting to not do much.
But then I got to go to hawaiiand, like you know, feel that
little buzz of just likeexcitement, um, and we we got to
go on a trip, um, to iceland,me and my husband.
So I think also just gettingthat break to like get away and

(31:02):
just see something, really.
Yeah, I think two vets from theconference got a hold of me and
I did an audit because therewas like a raffle at the
conference and he gave me like abooth.
So I did a free website auditand there were some winners.

(31:25):
I sent out those emails andthen to anyone who was in
attendance, he gave me his emaillist and I sent out like a 50
off of a website audit which Imade up because I didn't
actually have one before then.

Josh Hall (31:39):
So yeah, I have an audit.
Yeah I got a service for youhow much did you quote unquote
charge for your audit?
At that point it just make up,like was like yeah, it was like
250 and so like, to do a halfoff.

One was, like you know, 125 or something, but
you know I got a couple bites onthat, so it's just like little
things.
And then, uh, one of the thelittle wins was from the
newsletter.
You said to kick off anewsletter, which I still don't
do monthly.
Uh, I'm not a newsletter readerand so it's really hard for me

(32:10):
to send out a newsletter becausesometimes, like when people
email me too much, I'm reallytempted to hit unsubscribe.

Josh Hall (32:17):
Quarterly, just like a quarterly pop, like something
a little less.

Yeah, yeah, I think that's.
I need to do that because I didget a small win from one of my
my past clients from anewsletter.
I just I voluntold everyone onmy past clients that they were
now on my newsletter and it wasjust about.
I don't even remember what myfirst one was about, but, um,
and then he just asked for likea small graphic design job for
like a flyer, and so it was justkind of something easy that

(32:43):
helped during that dry spell andjust kind of reminded me that I
think you get.
You know you have your wall ofwins.
I need to build mine now thatI've kind of got some good wins
and some good client stories tolike look at.
Because I think during thatlike low point, you also think
like maybe I'm just not good atthis and you let like that get
to your head.
And then when that guy cameback and like asked for me to do

(33:06):
more work for him, I was like,oh, okay, like I didn't do a bad
job, like they do, they didappreciate what I did.
Like I am, I do have a talent.

Josh Hall (33:15):
I'm so glad you mentioned that.
Yeah, the wall of wins.
I mean I can't recommend enoughthat everybody, even on a
literal, small scale, like ifyou have three testimonials,
print those out or get them, getthem somewhere in vision,
whether it's on a wall or onyour desk.
I mean, a lot of pros, we didthat challenge last year about
creating one.
There was all different typesof them and yeah, I, I mean I'm

(33:36):
looking at it right now.
You're on there.
You're on there, megan, on mywall of wins.
You may be on there twice, I'vegot a couple repeats on there
just because you're atestimonial machine, but it's so
, so, so helpful in those timesI really can't stress enough to
everyone that you know, justeven if you just look at your
testimonials on your websitebecause it's so easy to go to

(33:57):
those dark places when thingsare just not clicking and not
going well.
I mean, I know you've heard metalk about this, but like and
we're going to be meeting inperson here soon at our web
design pro conference I can'twait for that, especially for
people who maybe are in thatdrive spell because, like you
just alluded, alluded to, youget re-energized when you
literally change your state andlike go somewhere and when you

(34:17):
meet colleagues or friends orespecially clients like when I
got to meet web designer promembers sandy and alexis and
lauren and everybody they weretelling me these stories in
april and man austin that I washearing these stories that I
never knew about and that justlike totally reinvigorated me.
I was like okay, it's fine, whatI'm doing works.

(34:38):
I just need to market better, Ijust need to tell more people
about it and be a little morethoughtful.
So yeah, any you know, the nexttime you do experience a dip.
In any regard, I don't thinkit'll be near as bad as what you
went through, because yournetwork is already to a certain
place, but it will help.
So I'm real excited to see whatyours looks like here.

It is funny how our mind can just like so
quickly turn negative.
I like I landed like thebiggest month ever and then the
next month I have two clientsthat are somewhat challenging me
and like and I get another new.
Like I got another new clientwith these other two that are
challenging me and I knock hisout of the park like instantly.

(35:18):
But like these other two, theones that are sticking in my
head, I'd be like I just don'tknow if I could do that Like I'm
just not good at it.
It's just so, even after like ahuge win like I can still go
back to like being like I don'tknow.

Josh Hall (35:28):
Yeah, I feel like the universe has a way to humble
you.
When you get a little bit ofsuccess, it's like biggest month
ever.

By the way, here's a client out of their
boundaries.

Josh Hall (35:40):
Yeah, not uncommon either.
Did you listen to, actually,this week is the podcast that
we're recording?
This that Steve shared abouthow he lost over 6,000 of MRR in
one week.

Yeah, I haven't listened to it yet.

Josh Hall (35:53):
So it's really, it's very it's basically what you
just said.
He had like a mix of likelanding some of his best clients
also losing over six thousand amonth in MRR, and it's just.
You're just like the emotions,the absolute rollercoaster of
emotions.
As a business owner, I will sayit does tend to level out.
I found, as you build your baseand you become more and more

(36:14):
confident, I mean, as I said inthe beginning, like you're like
a different person Now.
Just think about Megan in 26.
You're going to be like version3.0.

It's going to be nuts, you know like there is a
sense of like Castle and themansion in the sky.
I don't know, hey, whateverfloats your boat, you know more.

Josh Hall (36:31):
Iceland in Iceland a castle in Iceland.
Really, but it really does.
It seems like.
It seems like the highs andlows are less drastic at a
certain point, unless there'slike a massive pivot or change
in your business or somethinglike that.
But the average like challengesof client stuff I mean those
just tend to improve as you dialin your systems and and you're

(36:53):
even more, getting more and moreconfident with, like your
boundaries and yourcommunication.
It seems like so, um, yeah, Idon't foresee, you know, like
the exact, uh, dry spell youwent through happening again,
which is good news, but yeah,yeah, it's, it is just.

it grows just organically If you continue to
just work, work at each littlepiece and work on it.
I feel like now I'm noticingagain like I'm getting to the
point where I really need totighten things down and like I
need to focus on making sure,cause it kind of was after my
really big um up that like Iwent down and so I need to make

(37:30):
sure this time that I'm up, thatI'm still looking at marketing,
like I think I've lagged twoweeks.
My goal was, like every singleweek to do something that I
could check off as like amarketing box and and I think
I've lagged for like two weeks,and so it's like I need to
remember that first lesson so Idon't repeat it again and like
keep on doing all the pieces.

Josh Hall (37:50):
No, that's wonderful.
What did you do?
So I mean, it seems like duringthat dry spell you were still
like you mentioned.
At some point you got out ofbed, literally probably, and
like just carried on, did theconsistent stuff.
You had some work, you had somemaintenance plan stuff going on
when the turnaround started tohappen in Q4 of 24, did you do

(38:15):
anything different?
Or was it just a matter of allthe work you had done at that
point just compounded?
And it's not uncommon eitherfor the beginning of the fall to
be a really active month forweb designers, because
businesses are often it's a bigtime for web designers
especially businesses want toget their budgets cleared out by

(38:36):
the end of the year.
So, yeah, what, what was?
In short, what was that?
Like the beginning of therebound?

like yeah, what the heck happened, megan?
What happened?
I wish I knew.
Um, I think it was justcontinuing to network and like
just, I think everyone you'vealways mentioned like everyone
kind of has that one clientthey've had.
That's like really almost likea mentor of a client and just
like, is really awesome.
And so I think that, being my um, my vets, the Hawaii client, uh

(39:01):
, and getting networking thereand getting some more exposure,
and then another client who haddone a website before and they
have a few businesses and I'dkind of messaged throughout the
year as being like hey, likeI've got space if you're ready
to take on another one of thesesites, and they just kind of
never got back to me.
And so you know that, adding tolike oh, maybe they didn't like

(39:23):
what I did, and at the end ofthe year they're like we just
love our website.
You know we're ready to do thenext one, so it's just it's
timing for some people and youtake that as like a they don't
say like we're just not ready tome, where I'm not ready right
now means like we don't like youinstead of like they're really
just not ready yet you know yeah, because not clients aren't

(39:44):
always on our timetables that wemay have room and capacity and
want to land a few more jobs.

Josh Hall (39:48):
But, yeah, clients may be like, yeah, we'd like to
do that, but not right now.
So, but the seeds you and thisis the most important thing, I
think, like the theme of this isthe amount of seeds that you
were planting during that wholeyear, from the outset of it,
with the buzz that you hadstarting the business, making
connections, and even just thethings you were doing, all those
little touches a newsletterhere or there, the reach outs,

(40:12):
occasional social media stuff,the personal reach outs with
current and past clients I meanall those things they do really
compound.
And here we are now.
You're slammed.
So it works, it does work, itjust takes time sometimes.

Yeah, yeah, and I have a plan right now too,
because I had a friend of minewho got me a client from Nevada,
where I grew up, and and theyI'm having a total brain fart.

Josh Hall (40:40):
So their client in Nevada, where you grew up.

Yeah.

Josh Hall (40:43):
Did they?
Did you reach out to them orhow did that?

Oh, my friend.
His message was hey, are youstill doing the web stuff?
On the side?
I'm, like I've been doing itfor a year now, full time man
Like, and I talked to you likeat least once a month, not like
about more, like about videogames and things, nothing like
to.
We don't get into personalstuff all that often, but it was
just kind of reminded me, likewhen I hit my year, like I need
to do another post and share iton my personals to remind, like

(41:09):
friends and family that like,hey, I'm still doing this Cause
I know you had, I think,mentioned.
Sometimes we kind of keep aneye on it and make sure, like is
this going to be a real thing,like are they actually going to
keep doing it?
And so now that, like I have asuccessful year, like I want to
reiterate it to to my, mynetwork again.

Josh Hall (41:27):
Ah, yes, oh my gosh, that's such a great point, yeah,
like well, first of all, beingin a business, being in your own
business or, you know, buildingyour own business for a year,
is a huge milestone.
Most people don't even make itthat far, so that is something
to celebrate and shout off theCalifornia mountaintop for sure,
get it out there and you'retotally.

(41:49):
Yeah, you're totally right.
I mean, it makes sense.
I understand If I was going toinvest several thousand dollars,
maybe tens of thousands ofdollars, and have somebody be my
partner in crime for the webstuff, I would want to make sure
they're going to be around orat the very least, that they
have a network behind them likeWeb Designer Pro, or a plan of

(42:10):
action if they do stop it, sothey don't just ghost and
disappear, which is all toocommon for web designers.
And yeah, it makes total sensethat, like somebody's gonna be,
like yeah, I'm interested, butlet me see if you actually stick
with.
I mean, how many times I'm sureyou've experienced this too
where, like friends from highschool, they're in some new like
mlm program and they're selling?

can we get?

Josh Hall (42:31):
coffee, yeah, can we get.
Oh, you want me to join yourscheme?
Yeah, and then the next yearthey're on a different one.
It's like, I mean, I do thinkthat's important because a lot
of people are seeing that andthey may not make the
distinction between us as a webbusiness owner and somebody like
that who just gets involved inMLM kind of set business setup.

(42:51):
So yeah, for all those reasonsand more Oh's, it's celebration
time.
But for you, megan, like youdon't need to market and say
like hire me, you can just sayfirst year in business, you know
we built this many sites.
These are some of the sites wedid.

Um, yeah, I mean that's, that's like fun
marketing I was joking with mymom because I my brain said it
was in April was going to be myone year, and I went back like
searched like my posts in pro,trying to figure out like when
the heck like I'm sure I saidsomething when I did and it was,
uh, it was this month, march,march 8th, that it was like the
one year.
And it was like two days beforeMarch 8th that I went in Google

(43:29):
like found that and I was likeI had like all these ideas that
I wanted to do.
I was like well, it's two daysaway now and my mom's like just
still post it late and be likeyeah I'm so busy I missed it,
yeah there we go.

Josh Hall (43:40):
That's wonderful marketing.
I was too busy.
I missed my first year.
Yeah, I hope I see that I'mgonna, because I think I follow
your facebook.
Uh, are you?
Where are you active on thesocials?
Is it facebook for you?
Linkedin insta?
Are you a tiktok gal?
Are you on all these videogames streaming services?

that would be.
It would be an interesting wayto market it, huh, but facebook
and instagram, mostly because Ithink it's just easy, like two
birds with one stone.
When I make one thing for theother, it's just it's on both.
Um, I've my gosh LinkedInoccasionally, like I try and um
write something cool forLinkedIn, and so those three are

(44:19):
the ones I focus on.
My tag was too long for Twitterso I didn't even bother, like I
was like if I can't get it, I'mnot going to do it.

Josh Hall (44:27):
Yeah, now definitely not the time to spend time on X
anyway, and it's definitely it'skind of more from what I.
I'm not terribly active on it,but a lot of people I know who
used it for business purposesare, I mean, it's very political
now, so it seems like no matterwhere you are.
Yeah, I think you're fine.
You have plenty enough withFacebook, instagram and some
LinkedIn, for sure.

And I just I know some people have success
with social media, so I'm justtrying I'm like that's going to
be a marketing try One just tounderstand it, because clients
ask a lot about social media andI have right now no intention
of doing that myself because,honestly, it's like draining for
me, it's not something thatbrings me any kind of joy.
And so just to understand it,so I could give any kind of tips

(45:11):
to clients, just because I feellike it's all a part of web
presence and so just being ableto arm myself with more
knowledge to help clients isjust gives me more value.
But I'm just trying to likelearn how to do it in a minimal
way.
That's not like we have a dayof recording videos for a whole
month, like I don't know a wholemonth like I don't know.

Josh Hall (45:40):
Yeah, not alone there .
Uh, what you just mentioned thethe areas of things that give
you joy or drain you like.
What are the areas that do giveyou joy and and they're looking
back at this first year whatare, like, the parts of projects
and the part of being a webbusiness owner that give you joy
?

I love the discovery sessions and like
getting to sit down with abusiness owner and just talk
about their business and thethings that they're needing and
maybe struggling with.
And I think, as web designers,if you're really willing to kind
of put in the work during likethose hard seasons, I don't know

(46:16):
how we can fail, because weliterally sit down with other
business owners and we hearabout like successes and issues
that they're everyone's havingand they're all same in just
different industries, and so weget like exposure to watch
people go through them andovercome them and being able to
apply that Like when I meet withsomeone else, I'm like, well,

(46:37):
have you thought about doingthis?
And and just being able to likewe're like a sponge for like
all sorts of businesses and likewe hold, like we're like the AI
for business.
Ask me a question.
I'll tell you yeah, Use anewsletter.
That sounds good for you, Eventhough I don't really do
newsletters.

(47:02):
Nicely done.
Yeah, use a newsletter.
That sounds good for you, eventhough I don't really do
newsletters.
Nicely done your branding andcopy.
I know I gotta get withmichelle, I can't do copy it's.
That's another area that drainsme and sel they.
They just don't connect in mybrain.
But getting to sit down andtalk about business with someone
and then designing and evenbuilding is is really fun for me
, I can see you like strategydesign, public code development,
the building aspects of things.

Josh Hall (47:25):
And then what about the?
Do you find joy in the results?
Do you find joy with whenthings are live and then, most
importantly, seeing results, ofclients having results.

I?

Josh Hall (47:38):
I probably don't, by the way, because a lot of people
okay, cause a lot of peoplejust want to get things started
and they're like that's all Iwant to do and that's that's
what I'll probably sit and stareat like a finished website for
like way too long and I justlike scroll through and like
click around all the pages somany times.

I do a lot of home renovation projects too,
and it's like the same.
I will literally sit in adoorway and just like stare at
it.
It's like a project that'sfinished.
So it's the same thing with thewebsite.

Josh Hall (48:05):
Hey, that's great, though, Cause a lot of web
designers get it done.
They're like I'm never lookingat that again, I'm done.
That's true.
That's true.
Yeah, it does depend on whatkind of project it is.
I feel that same way when I mowmy lawn.
I'm like I'm that aspiring lawnweenie who's looking at the
lines and I'm just like wow,that was good.

Next time I'll do zigzags.

Josh Hall (48:25):
Yep always, I did buy lawnweeniecom.
I can't believe I did.
I got that domain last year.
I can't believe it wasavailable, just in case I'm
going to hold on to it, cause Idon't know.

I don't know what's going to happen.
Is that like a Midwest term orsomething?
Cause I've never heard itbefore?
Are you not familiar with that?
Is that a?

Josh Hall (48:41):
Midwest thing Lawnweeniecom or Lawnweenie yeah
.

That's what we are.
We west coast is.
I don't know, I'll have to asksome other other what's the west
coast turn on, dad?

Josh Hall (48:56):
I think it's just like yeah I think it's just like
dads hold on.
Let me ask chad gpt real quick.
Let's see is.
Is the term lawn weenienational?
I can't believe.
I just assumed that everyoneknew what lawn.
No wonder that domain wasavailable.

It's probably just popular around here hey,
local seo, you'll, you'll scorebig, you know there we go.

Josh Hall (49:23):
Sam will help me out with really taking lawn weenie
to the local seo.
So, outside of its literaryreference, lawn weenie does not
appear to be commonly used inamerican vernacular tsk tsk.
It will now after this show.
Lawn Weenie does not appear tobe commonly used in American
vernacular Tsk tsk.
It will now after this show.
Therefore, lawn Weenie is notnationally recognized.
Its usage is largely confinedto I guess there's a book series

(49:45):
that talks about it.
This is pish posh.
We're going to make it.
We're going to make it happenAnywho, derailed us.
But that idea of like examiningyour work and, and I think most
importantly, celebrating it,like, have you celebrated either
projects or just your year as awhole?
Have you done anything to,apart from just reflecting like
you did last year, looking atlast year, do you celebrate or

(50:09):
are you just a worker and justlike to get you know, get going?

I think it'd be fun to celebrate it and like do
you think I bought myself stuffLike the business stuff, like a
really nice new camera and, youknow, from earnings different,
you know, hitting differentbudget goals and stuff.
So I've celebrated in that waybut actually like going on like
a fancy dinner or something likea six, not really.
I would love to celebrate someof my favorite clients from last

(50:35):
year by I don't know, gettingthem some kind of like swag or
like shirt made with like anembroidery of I don't know just
theirs, or like something withour stuff together.
I haven't figured it out yet,but I would really love to just
thank some of those people thatput their trust in me in that
first year.
Um, cause it, it got me here,you know.

Josh Hall (50:58):
I love that idea.
Oh my gosh, yeah, as your coach, I mean, get going on that as
soon as you can.
That sounds wonderful.
And then you can really do thataround the same time as a you
know, an official posts on allyour socials and a newsletter
about celebrating the first year.
Um, yeah, I mean even like thefirst year thing.
It's up to you whether you'dwant to talk to clients about

(51:20):
that.

Otherwise, if you don't, if you want to make
people feel like you don't wantthem to know it's your first
year in business, then I knowthat's what I was like, but I
feel like everyone I did workwith knew that I had just
started, cause that was like myhesitation for a while.
I was like, yeah, I want to saylike thanks for trusting me
with my in my first year, andthey're like I'm sorry, what you

(51:43):
know, but I'm pretty sureeveryone knew, cause, like my
vet knew it was a new thing forme and and my husband, pitching
it to like a couple of thosepeople that were really
instrumental all knew that I wasjust starting out, cause they
had like some of what of apersonal relationship, you know,
yeah, and also it's the firstyear of the business.

Josh Hall (51:56):
It's like it's well first of all, you don't say
first year, you say anniversary,like the first anniversary it's
the anniversary of yourbusiness.
It doesn't mean that you didn'tknow what you were doing
leading up to that.
You know you have beendesigning for for quite a while,
but that's a.
That's a different frame.
I think you could probably puton that to just make it like a
fun anniversary and even justanniversary of full-time.

I thought maybe because I've been doing it on
the side for a while and somaybe they won't be like, oh,
she just worked on the side fora long time.
That's true.

Josh Hall (52:23):
So tell me about branding too.
You've branded.
We had some fun in pro withthis recently.
You branded off of your namejust meganfletchercom, but you
had expressed to me interest inlike should I make this a?

business name at some point.
Where are you at with that?
What's your thoughts aboutbranding?
I would love a business name.
I just I don't know MeganFletcher Design.
I can't even put web designerunderneath because it always
says design in it, and sothere's just.
I feel like there's a lot ofrestrictions with what I picked.
It got me my bank accountreally easily because it was
just my name, but now it's justlike trying to do fun stuff with
it.
It just feels like it's lacking.

(53:02):
So I would love to rebrand anddo something that's a little bit
different.
And I listened to that namingpodcast you had like a while
back, and I took the quiz with acouple of mine.

Josh Hall (53:14):
Not the newest idea, but with just shows how
professional we are in pro,because we had a coaching call
and we were thinking about, likeyou know, could you put your
initials there?
And then it became MF or design, which look is memorable.
It is memorable.
And what didn't we look it up?
Isn't it available?

I think I bought it.
It's not now because I boughtit.

Josh Hall (53:34):
You bought it.

Just in case you never know.

Josh Hall (53:37):
You bought MF for designcom.

Only MF are around, you know?
I mean, it's just too good.

Josh Hall (53:43):
Of course, the dad in me is like pumped about the
amount of puns that we couldthrow at this thing, but you
really bought it.
You bought MF for I did.

But then I started thinking like, would a
church then come in and workwith me?

Josh Hall (53:56):
Oh, that's great, they can worry about that.
It's too good.
It's too good not to use, okay.

I don't know what you're talking about.
It's just Megan Fletcher.

Josh Hall (54:04):
Yeah.

Your mind is in the gutter church.

Josh Hall (54:07):
What are you thinking ?
That is awesome, oh, that'sgreat.
Well, the cool thing is I mean,we've talked about this too
it's not something that has tohappen and you're at a place
where you can have some freedomwith that too.
But I think it's more aboutwhat is not anticipated now,
which is, in a few years.
What if you do get to a placewhere you really want to scale,

(54:29):
or you really want to not be atthe forefront of the business,
or you want to sell it, or youwant to?
I mean, all these scenarios canhappen to, where it is nice to
be able to break out of yourname, to have your business
under an entity where you'restill the founder, you're the
creative director, the headhoncho, whatever.
But, um, you know whether wetackle that sooner or later, it

(54:53):
is really no rust, but it is.
It is easier to to tackle thatversus um, you know things being
really established.
But the good news is I'vetalked about this too.
Like most clients didn't knowmy business name, they just knew
me as Josh the web designer.
They're like what's his agent?
Something studios, I don't know, um, so either way, it's like
it's not that big of a deal, butthere's pros and cons to having

(55:15):
, like an official business name.
So, yeah, I wonder for you.

I just don't know how searchable.
Or even when I say design MeganFletcher design, for I feel
like maybe they're going toassume like interior design or
something before, before they go, web design.

Josh Hall (55:32):
Yeah, I don't even think.
I mean, you havemeganfletchercom, so I don't
even know if you necessarilyneed to have the business name,
say design, because you couldalways Like you may With your
interest being in, enjoy, beingin strategy and design and
development you made.
Strategy could be a big part ofit.
So I don't, yeah, I wouldn'tworry about, know, yeah, I

(55:54):
really wouldn't just worry abouttoo much, because design can
cover a multitude of things.
But you are definitely doingmore than just design already.

So yeah, I'd love to to pivot into more of
like just a creative, likestrategy and just helping people
with just the web presence as awhole and like just going
forward, like to build abusiness around that and not
just like the website person.
I think that would be reallylike the, the five-year dream of

(56:22):
like just creating somethingthat's more about building up,
like a doing every, not every.
I don't know, maybe if I scaledum, because I even now I do
logo design and I'm noticing Ilove website design and I think
that's because there's logic andthere's reasons that you put
things the way that you do.
There's accessibility standards, there's always a reason.

(56:44):
It's not just because I like it, and so when I do logo design,
I find that draining for mebecause I can knock it out of
the park and some of my clientsare easy and we're good to're,
good to go.
But, like some people, like Istruggle with and I think I just
don't understand the way thatyou enjoy design and for me it's
just like I don't want to.

(57:06):
I want logic.

Josh Hall (57:08):
I was just going to.
I wanted to take a deep diveinto your services real quick,
Cause I don't know, I don'tremember, have you kicked off
with branding and photographyand logo?
Uh, or those things were addedas as they were needed.
But yeah, I mean I would.
Is that the case where theyjust kind of added because
clients were requesting them?

more, because I would build like a design, a
website, and then I would haveto get iphone photos back that
were terrible.
That that's why photographycame in, and I've always wanted
to do it as a hobby forlandscape and travel photography
, and so it was a way to help mybusiness, give me something fun
, and just also benefit myclients by doing some

(57:50):
web-focused photography for them.
And same with branding If theyhave just terrible branding or
something that's just superoutdated, don't even have like
an SVG of it, just being able tohelp them by like getting them
a little bit.

Josh Hall (58:05):
I knew we were going to get into the coaching
territory because I was lookingat this and mainly because of
what you just said.
You just said like you don'tlove it I definitely need for a
while.
I still think it's reallyvaluable for you because you're
going to get the questions,unless you want to just hire it
off completely or hire somebodyunder you to do it.
But I would probably justreduce those to like a hidden

(58:25):
service and only bring them upif somebody requests it.

That's true.
I don't want someone to come tome just for logo.

Josh Hall (58:33):
Yeah, you don't want to be begging the logo designer
and if somebody sees design andthey see logo, they may think
like maybe that's what you domainly.
But if that's like, no, that'snot my bread and butter, I would
make that clear.
I would probably just make itso when they fill out your
contact form or you talk withthem, initially, you find out
where they're at with theirbranding and if they're
desperate need of it, I wouldjust have it as an add on, like

(58:54):
in your back pocket.
Like, by the way, if we're intothe website, you need a better
logo and we need some photos.
We can do that, but I probablywould take it off your site.
I actually feel like for you,Megan, you're probably at the
point where you could focus alittle more on strategy as one
of your main things.
You've got a year under yourbelt as, like an official
business owner.
You've got a year under yourbelt as an official business

(59:15):
owner.
You've got several years ofdesign experience in web as a
whole.
I feel like you're at the placewhere initial digital strategy
could almost be your otherservice and then, of course,
that's linked in with a websiteproject or you could sell a
strategy session, potentially aspaid discovery, basically where
you do what you love to do.

(59:36):
You can talk with a businessowner, talk for an hour about
their goals and obviously it's apaid service and then that's
where you could link that innext to a website design.
Or if somebody just wants to goright on a website, they get
the strategy session as a partof it.
Get the strategy session as apart of it.
So something to think about,just based off of.
I really just I feel like youdon't need logo and branding

(59:59):
right now as a main service atleast, especially because you
don't love it.

Megan Fletcher (01:00:07):
Yeah, that's true.
And just I just recently spunup all this stuff in Moxie and
so in that proposal that goesout there's like optional
add-ons and so they're in thereand so no one ever comes to me
for just those things.
So I think it would evendeclutter my services list to to
take them, take them down.
But I know some people withwith those want to see your work
.
You know they want to make sureit's you're, you're okay at it

(01:00:29):
before they like pay you to doit.

Josh Hall (01:00:30):
So I don't know, like some hidden, maybe just just
hide the pages and if they askfor it, yeah, just hidden pages,
yeah, but you can still haveyour logo page, still have your
photography, but it's kind ofcool because it's almost like we
reserve this for our clients.
This is not something thepublic gets.
You got to be special to getour photography.
So, yeah, I really wouldprobably have that approach.

(01:00:51):
I do agree, I think it wouldmake more sense for the services
, because you do website design,development, care and support.
And then, yeah, I would havedigital strategy, because
digital strategy is a part ofthe website design, but also
it's something you could sellongoing.

So how would you work Because I use my discovery
session to sell and just getthat trust with a client to get
the project sold.
So would you have a small onewhere you don't get into as much
?
Yeah, there's a big difference.

Josh Hall (01:01:22):
We just talked about this with Shannon on her
training she did in pro aboutpaid discovery, the big light
bulb moment.
I don't know if you've listenedor watched the replay on that
one yet, but the big light bulbmoment for I think a lot of us
was that there's a bigdifference between discovery and
strategy and I think thoselines get blurred often.
But discovery really is justlike hearing about the client

(01:01:45):
where they're at.
You can offer ideas and advice.
But a strategy session is likeI took your ideas.
It would be kind of come afteran initial.
So if you sold a strategysession, there'd probably be
either a 20 to 30 minutediscovery call or a form and
then the strategy sessionhappens.
Because the strategy is a littlemore like okay, you're already

(01:02:07):
doing this with your websites.
We take where you're at, knowyour challenges, what you're
looking to do, where your needsare for the site, and now we're
going to create a plan.
Now we're going to actuallycreate like what's the strategy
for the website?
What's the main call to action?
What's the user experience like?
Where is your traffic comingfrom?
Do we need lead generators?
Are we selling a product?
Do you just want contact formsubmissions?

(01:02:28):
Do you just want to call?
Like?
That's where, like, thestrategy comes into play.
So I think, all that in mind,yeah, your discovery call would
be either before a paid strategysession or before the paid
website consultation.
That is, the strategy is goingto be a part of it, but it's

(01:02:54):
basically you're just bringingthe strategy part out as its own
thing, which is just sovaluable.
Also, it is a perfect upsellfor a website audit, because you
could do a website audit andthen if you do strategy sessions
for, say, $1,000, becausethey're they could be pretty
intense You're really puttingyour, your marketing expertise,
your experience, your heart andsoul and ideas.
You're like your, your IP, youknow it's like that's what

(01:03:14):
people are getting and thenthat's what you can follow up
with as an upsell, and then thatleads to website design.
So I just love strategysessions.
I just that's going to be likethe new big thing I'm going to
start to work in and my stuff inpro and my business course is
really.
I guess what I would do today.
I would.
Strategy sessions would be likethe like the upsell, it would
be the downsell, it would bethat versatile thing that could

(01:03:37):
go in and out of all of thisstuff.

Yeah, I think that's great because the last
discovery session that I justhad like a week ago I think I
spent 30 minutes just likegiving him advice.
It wasn't even related to likehow we get your website going,
because I was just having funtalking about it and sharing
different things that I'd seenwith him.

Josh Hall (01:03:56):
And even what you just said a little bit ago.
You were talking about, like me, you were the AI.
What did you say?

We're the AI of business how to run a business.
I don't remember what I said.

Josh Hall (01:04:05):
We're the AI of online business Like you're
talking about maybe a newsletter, or maybe you should do this,
or if you're active on this, oreven the conference thing, like
you may suggest that clientsconsider doing an in-person
conference and building theirnetwork, like those are all
things that could be done in astrategy session, because the
website is kind of the core ofthat.
So, yeah, I feel like mychallenge for you now is like I

(01:04:27):
would yeah, I would drop from,publicly drop logo design and
branding and photography, havethose specialized specialty
services for current clients butthey need to be a paying client
to get that or it needs to beplanned out.
And then, yeah, I think you'reready for strategy and you're
more, much more confident.
I don't know if I would havehad advised you to do this A

(01:04:48):
year ago, megan.
Yeah, I don't know what youshould do, but version 1.0 Megan
was not rated off for strategy,but version 2.0 is, so I think
you're, I think you got the allclear to make that happen.

Yeah, it's been an awesome year.
It's just so cool, like howmany people do you actually know
that go out and start abusiness and so just to even
have done it is pretty awesome.

Josh Hall (01:05:14):
It's important to remember too.
I'm glad you said that because,like in pro, we're all in this
together and everyone is indifferent stages of their
business.
And you know there's a lot oflike-minded nature with just
being an entrepreneur and beinga web designer.
But the reality is when we'rein there, we've all taken the
leap or we're all working on theside to eventually take the

(01:05:35):
leap.
That's not the case in reallife, I mean in your
neighborhood or in your averagefamily gatherings.
Yeah, you said it.
How many people have taken therisk to start their own business
?
Or, you know, some people maybe business owners, but maybe it
was handed off to them, or theyjoined a business, they rose up
the ranks and then they becamethe ceo, but they didn't maybe

(01:05:57):
start their business fromnothing yeah, and I even talked
with the group, with pro I, justthe people in it have it's like
a little, it's like a supportgroup.

you know, even when you're overwhelmed with
something and you send it outand like people respond and
they're just whether it's like atechnical issue, like a
personal like I just struggling,and like it's just what a group
and like what amazing people.
I remember when you said thatI'd be on the podcast, on the
post, and one of the people wasjust I can't wait to hear Megan.
I was like me, like what do Ihave to say?

(01:06:33):
You know, so it's just I, justit's really cool to to like have
all those people to like kindof cheerlead for you and like
just support you.
So many people have offered tolike sit with like one-on-ones
for like an hour and just liketalk and like share their stuff,
and it's just been everyonejust really cares about everyone
succeeding in there.
So it's just such a special,special place.

Josh Hall (01:06:55):
Oh, that's so awesome , megan, and you just said
something that reminded me,cause I wanted to ask you about
this in DMs, when I invited youto talk about this first year
and the highs and lows you'vegone through and just having
your best month ever.
You, I think you mentioned I'mtrying to remember you mentioned
something like there was nomagic to it.
It was just like persistenceand persistence.

And what did I say?

Josh Hall (01:07:16):
Going through it.
Let me look real quick.
But I was like that is themagic and it really is.
I mean, a lot of people, peoplecrumble, a lot of people don't
make it through the dips.
I am curious what we I guesswe've kind of already talked
about this, but what did get youthrough, like what helped you
persevere through that?

I think pro is super foundational in all of it
because it's the courses toteach you the things that I
don't know what the heck.
I can get advice from my husband, who runs like big plants with
lots of money, and like I canget direction from him, but it's
not what I'm doing exactly andso I can't get advice.

(01:08:01):
That's super specific to me.
He doesn't own the business, sothere's like, yes, he does a
lot of the things, but there'snot too many business owners in
my life that I can consult with.
So, just like the communitysupport, the courses to walk
through, the coaching from youand friendships within there,

(01:08:23):
not just like the community butlike real friendships that are
made in there Um, obviously,family support outside of that
and just believing in yourself alittle bit but then hopefully
having those support groups toto push you forward.
When you stop believing inyourself is and just keep on,
keep on trying those like thatme and Tamara had said.

(01:08:43):
Just like doing those littlethings and making sure to like
get up and do those littlethings every single day, even
when you feel like you'refalling apart.

Josh Hall (01:08:51):
Yes, I just looked.
You said lessons learned inperseverance.

You said I have a standard story.

Josh Hall (01:08:55):
Nothing magical, but I mean it really is.
That's like.
The reality is that and I thinkthis is common in the athletic
world I mean anyone who doessomething legit and awesome.
They've gone through hardships,otherwise it's not a cool story
Like no successful person'slike.
I just started my business,everything was just fine Great.
Every month was up and to theright, no big deal.

(01:09:16):
And then you're like then it'sboring, it doesn't feel real.
Obviously, we know that's notthe case, so it really is I.
Obviously we know that's notthe case, so it really is I just
more and more, from apsychology standpoint, I'm
fascinated more and more aboutpeople who stick with it, which
is why I was so excited to talkto you and to see you on the
other side of this.

It's cool to even just share it and talk
about it, because it did feelkind of like a standard story of
starting a business.
You have some good stuff, yougot some bad stuff and you just
got to keep working through itall.
And I mean, sometimes you seelike the highlights of people
who just like knock somethingout, like get 10K super fast,
and you're just like Holy smokes, you know, and like to take

(01:09:58):
like a whole year to like get toa month, that was really big
and like actually gave me aglimmer of like okay, maybe six
figures isn't like out of thequestion, um, and I it just it
was really great to like finallyget there after just like
having a normal business yearand and just continue to
persevere, like when you, whenyou feel like you're struggling,

(01:10:20):
um, but yeah, having thecommunity support and just
making sure to believe inyourself a little bit, just even
a little bit tell me real quickwhat was your commitment level
when you started?

Josh Hall (01:10:31):
this is another thing that I've seen with people who
make it is.
It's like, whether it'sverbally, whether they're like
shouting affirmations in themirror or whether they're just
like thinking like I am, this is, I'm doing this, it's going at.
Did you have that or did younot have a commitment level?

I think I was cautious.
I think I said I will doCautious commitment, I think.
I even said it to you in thefirst email.
I really want to try this andmaybe learn some JavaScript and
things on the side so I could goback and do software
engineering for website design.
Like if, if I can't make thiswork, like that was like my
first like cautiously optimisticidea, like I will do this, but

(01:11:12):
with like a fallback plan.
Um, but then pretty early on Ithink, uh, ben or Mark joined
just shortly after me and we'relike just like on fire and like
talking about how their goalsand I was like well, shoot, like
my goal is so like pathetic.
Like I said $1,000 a month andlike so, just it kind of shifted

(01:11:34):
a little bit and be like Ireally and something you had
said, um, I wish I couldremember, but it was just oh,
about like joining the group.
Even just as much as you putinto this is what you're going
to get out of it.
So I've always tried toremember, like you know,
connecting with these peopleisn't going to happen without me
posting and and so even likewhen I get busy and don't get in

(01:11:56):
for a little while, like I tryand like when I get like the
time, like to get back in thereand start like responding to
different things and liketalking to people and stuff.
And so I think it's true forpro and it's true for the
business, Like as much as you'regoing to put into it is what
you're going to get back from itman sage advice here Wisdom,
absolute wisdom.

Josh Hall (01:12:17):
So yeah, same with clients too.
Right Like the more you contactthem and follow up with them,
the more.

That was a really hard lesson for me,
because I was so nervous tobother my clients and learning
that it's not.
You said it in your courses.
But I was still like I don'twant to bug them and like, but
now it's like it's reallyimportant at least once a week
that I check in and say likehere's where I am and like they
know, or like hey, did you seethis?
Just making sure to like I'mnot bothering them, they're just

(01:12:43):
everyone is so busy that theymight've seen it and like glazed
by it and like it's still inthe back of their brain and I
just need to bring it backforward.
But like, yeah, putting intothe clients as much as you do
too, I kind of figured for alittle while.
They're like they just give methe stuff, I'll do mine quietly
over here and then I'll give itback to you, but you, really
it's like a partnership withthem.

Josh Hall (01:13:01):
Yeah Well, megan gosh , this has been awesome.
I'm so happy Again.
I can't reiterate enough.
I'm so pumped for you, soawesome Again.
I knew you could do it, youjust had to stick with it.
So to see you stick with it,that's where the magic was.
So excited to meet you heresoon in person.
We're going to have our proevent and even more so.
I mean, we're going to take allthis to the next level as a

(01:13:23):
group to really support eachother in a whole different way.
So, yeah, oh my gosh, it's socool.
I'm kind of curious.
Last question Well, actually,before I ask you, a final
question for those who want tocheck your site out, check your
socials out, where shouldeveryone go?
Does MF4.com?

forward.
I should, I should just forwardit now.
I'll get a lot of very traffic.

Josh Hall (01:13:48):
Where is all this traffic coming from.

So it's meganfletchercom Um the plain
Jane Megan, nothing fancy in it.
And then my socials arefletching creative, which is
like my last name with INGinstead.

Josh Hall (01:14:04):
Got it and we'll have all the all that linked in the
show notes, but so real quick.
I'm kind of curious.
You're in a swamp season rightnow.
We've been talking aboutscaling and you know what to do
in this season, but what is your?
Have you thought about visionat all over the next, like now
that you've passed?
The first year is often thehardest year in most cases, one
of them typically.

(01:14:24):
Have you thought about, like,what you want things to look
like for the next year or two orthree?
Are you just focused on justgetting out of the pile of
projects and work you got going?

right now.
I think from what I've learnedlast year is like you always
have to kind of think about it,even if you feel overwhelmed.
So I think, like yesterday inmy mind, I was like I really
need to tighten things up.
So I think, like yesterday inmy mind, I was like I really
need to tighten things up.
That's my goal right now, andlike still still allegating time
to do all the things, all thebusiness ideas and the

(01:14:55):
roadmapping, and making sure toget back on that, and then it's
probably scaling a little bit,trying to offload some of the
pieces that I don't enjoy doing.
I think I'd love to get like aVA to help me with maybe some of
the admin work and, you know,getting collecting information
from clients or things like thatthat I think that the big fear

(01:15:17):
in there that I need to decouplefrom is loss of profit by
having to pay someone else to dowork.

Josh Hall (01:15:25):
that's where I'm at yeah, well, that's wonderful,
awesome, scale your way time.
I also have a couple resourcesfor vas for you that I'll send
after this um, obviously in thescaling course.
But I have a couple new ones aswell.
I had a call before this withanother pro member who has a.
It's a mom, it's like specificto moms that are vas who can't

(01:15:45):
work or don't want to work anine-to-five as moms, so they
want to work in the evenings andoccasionally like and that's
perfect.
So I'll send you that site um.
But the really cool thing, realquick on the profit thing, it's
like and you're just hitting allthe common struggles at every
stage I was there, everyone'sbeen there what you'll realize
is like you will get backbandwidth, sanity, joy, love.

(01:16:08):
Yes, you'll pay more, butyou'll make a lot more because
you'll have more time back.
And then I think you'll findtoo, from the get-go you joined
Pro, which told me you'reserious about this as a business
and you kind of share.
You were able to share some ofthese burdens in a community,
not saying that you were venting, but when you're in a community
you see other problems and youdon't feel alone.

(01:16:30):
That's what I'm trying to say.
But I think when you addsomebody to your business, even
in a contractor role, you reallyfeel like the weight is lifted
off your shoulders becauseeverything's not on Megan.
It's like now it's on us and itfeels a little like, okay, it
doesn't feel as guilty.

I think it's needed because our family is
actually going through adoption,which I know I had mentioned a
long time ago, um, when Istarted, and you know we're
still in the midst of all likethe unknown timetables and but
we, we are matched with a childand you know we don't know
stories, just everything takesforever, which is just

(01:17:08):
exhausting.
But when I have to go down incountry and I don't know how
long I'm going to be there forlike having someone to like hold
down the fort, a little bit isgoing to be so needed.

Josh Hall (01:17:20):
Good point.
Did you happen to check out therecent podcast with sandy and
alexis?
I did okay that's just a reallygood example of like a scanny.
I mean, it's so funny.
I feel like I'm I'm talking tosandy from two years ago.
It's literally the exact same,this thing, same thing to say,
um, but yeah, you're right, likeyou do need to prepare for that

(01:17:40):
, whether it's a anticipatedfamily change or if someone's
expecting or if there's an illparent that you're taking care
of.
Whatever these things aresometimes anticipated or
unexpected completely and yeah,I can't recommend enough that
you take that to heart, at leastgetting someone going now that
starts to know your business.
I think probably a juniordesigner would be really helpful

(01:18:04):
too.
Sometimes that could be the VAas well, or it may be a junior
designer to help you do thestrategy, the initial design.
They carry on with the ongoingupdates and fulfillment.

That's true.
Subpage design is always myleast favorite.
I'm like I already did the bestone.

Josh Hall (01:18:18):
I'm a homepage guy and then everything else,
somebody else do it.
Yep, totally agree.
Yeah, so well, megan, I'm sopumped for you.
Again, congrats, Awesome.
First year, let's freaking go.
Year two Uh, let's get throughsome of the scaling stuff, firm
up those systems, a little bitof boundary work and
communication work, and then, uh, I can't wait for round two.

(01:18:40):
Let's, uh, let's have you backon, you know, megan, version 3.0
and see where things are at.

She's going to be wild.
She's going to be crazy.

Josh Hall (01:18:49):
Your mic is great, though, by the way, you're
already legit.
You got the little mic wasawesome, that's like a perfect.

It's for.
I got it for all the socialmedia stuff I was attempting so
and it plugs into my camera.
So I I just tried it.
I was like I know it's for myphone and I know it's for my
camera.
I just got the little usb, thenew, the new one usbc.

Josh Hall (01:19:10):
What is that?
What is that mic?

it's the dgi mini and it comes with um.
I got a little case got alittle infomercial here.
It comes with like another mictoo, so you could have two
people on mics and it's superreasonably priced and you don't
have to like when I got thepodcast mic, I didn't realize
you had to have all the otherstuff.
So I thought I'm spending ahundred bucks on this mic for my

(01:19:34):
husband, Like it was gonna beawesome, like, oh, you got to
spend like a couple more hundredto make it work.

Josh Hall (01:19:40):
Oh, my gosh, I might get that for the event because
Jason, we're going to do like amock up, like a mock sales call,
jason's going to like show hissales call process and I'm going
gonna be my lead outfit for ourevent.
But, yeah, like that could beperfect, having the two my okay,

(01:20:09):
thank you, learn somethingtoday myself.
I'm gonna check that out.
All right, megan, well, I'mgonna let you go.
We got stuff to do, but thishas been awesome.
Thank you so much for your timeI know this is gonna help a lot
of folks, so keep at it.

This is cool it was even a confidence boost for
me, like I'm on the podcast.

Josh Hall (01:20:23):
You've made it.
It's all downhill from here.
This is the topic it's now.
I'm speaking right here Pumpfor you, megan, keep at it.
Thank you so much.
So much goodness, so much gold,all wrapped up in less than one
year of building her web designbusiness.
Megan, uh really is done anincredible job.

(01:20:46):
I'm so proud to have her as amember of Web Designer Pro and
oversee her, and to see whatshe's done.
So, year number two, here wecome, on track for a six figure
business.
Let's freaking go, as the kidssay these days.
So a big thanks to Megan forsharing everything she's learned
here.
Hope it helps you Again.
Her website isMeganFletcherchercom, or maybe
mfrcom by the time this comesout.

(01:21:07):
You just have to do that.
It's so good, and you can findthe show notes that we talked
about.
All the links and everything wetalked about are going to be at
the show notes page, which willbe at joshhallco slash 377.
Hope you enjoyed this one.
Friends, leave us a comment,connect with Megan, and I can't
wait to hear how this one helpsyou in your first year in
business or just in your webdesign business in general.

(01:21:27):
Good stuff, all right, guys.
I will see you on the nextepisode.

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377 - Lessons from a Web Designers' First Year in Business with Megan Fletcher

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}377 - Lessons from a Web Designers' First Year in Business with Megan Fletcher