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December 15, 2025 31 mins

Ten years can bring about significant healing. We open the doors to the Warrior Retreat at Bull Run and walk through a year where a 37-acre sanctuary, a pair of five-bedroom homes, and a brand-new Grand Lodge came together to serve thousands of wounded warriors, veterans, and families. From the weekly rhythm of guest stays and Wednesday staging to the Saturday beautification days, you’ll hear how logistics and love combine to make rest possible for those who need it most.

We revisit milestones that shaped 2025: Alvey Elementary students raising new service flags alongside American Legion mentors, the Vets for Willing Warriors car show featuring 264 cars and a small army of volunteers, and the Warrior Ride’s medic-supported routes that turned grit into a community. Food anchors the story. Our visiting chef program—comprising 126 chefs, many from elite military kitchens—brings five-star meals, simple techniques, and laughter to the table. We honor the late Jim Cole with a kitchen dedication and relive the Home Away From Home Thanksgiving dinner, where every dish, from the croutons to the main course, was made from scratch for nearly 70 guests.

Programs expanded with a purpose inside the Grand Lodge. Moral injury workshops welcomed soldiers, families, and medical teams, with plans to include first responders next year. Youth found their footing through the 9:57 Project’s Summer Leadership Challenge, and We Signed Up Two’s day of cooking, journaling, and survival skills. An elderly Veterans lunch restored connection for those who rarely get out. Along the way, partners like Home Depot Foundation and Amazon stepped up with flooring, a new mower barn, and a studio grant to bring video to future episodes. At the same time, volunteers pushed tracked hours toward 12,500 and beyond.

We close with gratitude, a nod to our 10th anniversary gala and Visiting Chef of the Year, Navy Chief Dakota Aubry, and a look ahead to season four with Rear Admiral Mike Studeman. If this story moves you, share it with someone who loves service, subscribe on your favorite platform, and leave a review. Want to help directly? Visit willingwarriors.org to volunteer, donate, or ask how you can be part of the next chapter.

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Transcript

Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Larry Zilliox (00:29):
Good morning.
I'm your host, Larry Zilliox,Director of Culinary Services
here at the Warrior Retreat atBull Run.
And this week we're doingsomething a little bit
different.
There's no guests joining me.
I just wanted to go back and doa kind of recap of all things
Warrior Retreat at Bull Run for2025.

(00:50):
Just sort of go over whathappened at the retreat, all the
different awesome events wehad, and kind of give you an
overview of what the year lookedlike for the staff and the
volunteers and the guests whocame to the Warrior Retreat.
So for those of you who are newand have not joined us before,

(01:11):
uh the Warrior Retreat at BullRun is a project of Willing
Warriors, a 501c3 nonprofitbased in Haymarket, Virginia.
Its primary program is theWarrior Retreat at Bull Run.
And the retreat itself is a $6million, 37-acre estate, has
three homes on it.
Two of the homes we use toinvite wounded warriors and

(01:32):
their families out from WalterReed, Fort Belvoir Community
Hospital, or any of the soldierrecovery units around the
country.
Also from various branches, uhsuch as the Navy Safe Harbor
Program, the Marine CorpsSoldier Recovery Unit at Camp
Lejeune, uh Air Force, AF-2, anynumber of uh wounded warriors

(01:56):
are invited to stay for fivenights.
Uh each of our two houses thatwe use to host wounded warriors
and their families, ourfive-bedroom.
So we encourage them to fill itup.
Mom, dad, aunt, and uncle,grandma, grandpa, anybody who
would make their stay moreimpactful.
That could be battle buddies,um, friends, relatives.

(02:19):
And we do about 37 guest days ayear in each house.
The families check in on Fridayand check out on Wednesday.
Then on Wednesday, we havevolunteers who come in and clean
and sanitize.
And then a staging crew thatcomes in and gets the house
ready for the next guests thatwill check in that next Friday.

(02:43):
We have an op tempo that runsthree guest days in a row and
then we take a week off.
During that week off from Marchthrough November, on the
Saturday that we're off, we dowhat we call beautification day,
where from Saturday from 9 tonoon, we have help from the
community.
They sign up to come out andhelp us with a bunch of projects

(03:05):
that we just don't have thebandwidth to do.
So they'll come out and paint,they'll come out and weed, put
down mulch, um, just a wholebunch of projects.
And we typically have anywherefrom 75 to 125 community members
that come out and support us.
It's uh it's a lot of fun, andwe really appreciate uh the

(03:26):
help.
I mentioned three houses.
We have the Lang House, theoriginal house, 11,000 square
feet, 31 rooms, about 9,000square feet is used by the
warrior and their family.
We have about 2,000 square feetfor offices and conference
room.
And it's a five-bedroom home,so up to 10 guests in each

(03:46):
house.
The house was uh we we just hadour 10-year anniversary.
So this last uh um Memorial Daywas our 10th anniversary
celebration.
Um then the second house webrought online, the Lang House,
we started in 2015 hostingWarriors and their families.

(04:07):
And then the Penn Fed house,which is a little bit smaller,
but also five bedrooms, so about4,800 square feet.
That we brought online in 2019.
Uh that was built for us.
Uh, we received a grant fromPenn Fed Foundation, as well as
other the Northern VirginiaHeavy Contractors Association
number of private donors, andthat doubled our capacity, and

(04:29):
we've been running the twohouses ever since.
And then in 2024, May 2024, webrought online the uh third
house on the property, which isthe Grand Lodge.
Again, uh we received a sizabledonation from the Penn Fed
Foundation, about $500,000.
And then we matched that andraised additional funds for

(04:52):
about a $1.3 million GrandLodge, which is six bedrooms,
and we use that to host programsand different events that we
have here on the property.
This year we've we've managedto really touch a lot of
warriors and a lot of families.
Um we've hosted uh 3,233warriors, families, and veterans

(05:15):
for different programs as wellas guest days.
And uh we've been busy, to saythe least.
Um for us, uh the winter, ofcourse, is the slowest time, but
things start to ramp up in thespring.
Really get going um May 1st,which is really one of our fun,
exciting events.

(05:36):
We have a close associationwith uh elementary school
nearby, Alvey Elementary, andthe military children there um
collect donations for us, raisemoney, and purchase service
flags for us.
So on the property, we have auh American flag in our memorial
garden, and then around a uhhorseshoe area in the front yard

(06:00):
are service flags, and we haveum each branch as well as our
our own flag, um, willingwarriors flag.
And we take those down in thewinter because the just the wind
and the weather just rips themapart.
It's very windy up here on thehill.
But then on May 1st, we invitethe kids from Alvey Elementary

(06:22):
to come out and raise the flagsthat they bought for us, and
they come out before schoolstarts, and we pair them up with
um some crusty old guys from myAmerican Legion Post, 1799,
here in Haymarket.
And together they um we have abugler and they raise the flags

(06:45):
uh together.
It's a lot of fun, and the kidsand the families have a great
time, and we really look forwardto that.
And we'll have the flags upthen through the rest of the the
year, um, till right after uhour home away from home dinner
in November and we'll take themback down again for the the
winter.
But in May that we had uh our10th anniversary event, um we

(07:08):
opened our doors uh we had aribbon cutting on the uh uh uh
Langhouse, the original house,July 4th of 2015.
And so this year, um um in May,we had our 10th anniversary uh
event and had a lot of people onthe property.
It was really great to see umpeople we haven't seen in a long

(07:31):
time, uh some former guests whowould come back to uh to
celebrate with us.
One of the exciting things forme as the director of culinary
services is we dedicated thekitchen in the Langhouse to Jim
Cole.
And Jim was my very firstvolunteer sous-chef who would

(07:52):
help our visiting chefs whenthey came to do prep work and
and cook and do whatever wasneeded in the kitchen.
So while the chef came to tomake the warrior a great dinner.
And um unfortunately duringCOVID, Jim lost his battle with
liver disease.
And this year, during our 10thanniversary, we dedicated the

(08:15):
kitchen and the laying house tohim and the Jim Cole kitchen,
and we had a wonderful photo ofhim in there with his apron and
a little plaque.
And um, we unveiled that duringthe uh anniversary ceremony.
His his children came um fromMaine and sister from Washington
stayed and unveiled that, andit was just uh really great day.

(08:39):
We missed Jim a lot.
We definitely do.
We had our Vets for WillingWarriors event in July, and this
is our annual car show that wedo.
Um this year, as big as ever,we had 264 cars.
There were 865 people on theproperty, including our

(09:02):
volunteers and visitors and andpeople showing their cars.
Um, we had 131 volunteersactually for that particular
event.
So our events are um we we relyon our volunteers heavily,
whether they're parking people,uh, whether they're giving
tours, whether they're cleaningup, whether they're setting up,

(09:22):
it takes a lot.
In fact, just that event, whichis really doesn't take as much
as some of the other events, uh,was 646 volunteer hours just to
get that that uh event off theground.
But we also want to give ashout out to the Knights of
Columbus here in Haymarket,Gainesville.
Um, they volunteer to provideall the food, the hot dogs,

(09:47):
hamburgers, and go ahead and uhcook that all up and offer it
for free or donation to uheverybody who comes that day.
So we really appreciate theKnights of Columbus and what
they do for us on uh during theuh uh Vets for Willing Warriors
event.
Now, next year I will note thatwe're moving it from July

(10:08):
because it's just incrediblyhot, and we're gonna move it to
May.
So look for that.
Uh it's gonna be on ourwebpage, and you'll be able to
see the events coming up.
And that one, if you want tocome out for that, it's a lot of
fun.
That one will be in May uh2026.
Then we had our 10th annual, Ibelieve it was our 10th annual

(10:29):
warrior ride, which is abicycling event.
That's not here on theproperty, that actually takes
place at uh a brewery nearby.
But uh this year we had uhthere's three or four different
courses that the riders cantake.
A mountain bike course, there'salso like a 13 mile, a 25 mile,
and then a big 60-plus mileroute.

(10:50):
Uh, we had 277 cyclists.
Uh again, it takes a lot ofvolunteers, 196 volunteers, just
to pull that one-day event off.
Whether they're planning,setting up, moving stuff.
We have volunteers all alongthe route.
Uh, we have three rest stops.
There are volunteers at eachrest stop, there's an ambulance

(11:12):
at each rest stop, there are hamradios at the rest stop and all
along the route to track theriders.
We also have a whole team thatcan go out and pick up the
riders and pick up trucks andbring their bikes back if they
have trouble.
There's um bike shop people atthe start who can tune up bikes.
We have a massage therapist atthe start to tune up riders.

(11:36):
And it's just uh an amazingevent.
We have uh they ride, comeback, they get a ticket for uh a
beer, and uh a mission barbecuelunch.
So it's a great event that's uhSeptember of every year.
We ride and have a lot of fun.
November is our annual gala,and this was our 10th annual

(11:58):
gala, and it was uh wonderful.
It's really an event tocelebrate the the warriors and
what they uh what they do forour country and for us, and uh
it's just another way for thosepeople who like to come to the
gala and donate to see what wedo and to hear firsthand from a

(12:22):
number of different warriors whospoke about their stay.
And um it's really, really afun night.
Uh, we do we also give outduring the gala our visiting
chef of the year award.
In 2025, our visiting chef ofthe year was Navy Chief Dakota
Aubrey.
He is a uh chef for an admiral,and uh he's just a trooper.

(12:46):
He's he's been out to theretreat 10, 11 times to make
dinner this year for differentwarriors and their families.
I should take a minute to tellyou a little bit about the
visiting chef program, which iswhat I manage and oversee.
Um I have about 126 chefs thatvolunteer to come out to the

(13:08):
retreat on either a Saturday orSunday.
We do it a dinner for eachhouse, and the chef comes out,
makes an extraordinary meal forthe family.
And uh 85% of my chefs aremilitary chefs, from the chefs
and the chairman of the JointChiefs residents to the Navy
chefs at Presidential FoodService at the White House, to

(13:30):
the Navy and Coast Guard chefsat the Naval Observatory that
cook for the vice president allthe way down to the Marine Corps
chefs and uh just they love tocome out to the retreat, and
it's a great way for them togive back.
It also is a great programbecause it introduces our our
warriors to food that they mostlikely won't encounter on their

(13:53):
own.
A lot of the restaurant chefsthat come out, the warriors just
can't afford to go and spendthat kind of money to eat in
their restaurant, so we bringthat five-star culinary
experience to them.
Um they almost always say it'sthe best meal they've ever had,
and they have a lot of fun.
We try to get them into thekitchen and show them

(14:14):
techniques, how to cook.
It's uh it's not rocketscience, it's salt, fat, acid,
and heat.
It's good ingredients andsimple techniques, make
wonderful dishes, and uheverybody has a good time.
And it's it's a lot of fun.
It's one of the highlights, Ithink, of the the stay.
And we also have a number ofother things that the families

(14:36):
can do while they're staying atthe retreat.
So there's there's all sorts ofactivities.
A massage therapist can comein.
Each family gets a photo shootwhile they're there at the
retreat, so they have greatmemories of their time at the
retreat.
Each family can pick a numberof different activities.
They can go to a shootingexperience with an original SEAL

(14:57):
Team Six member, they can go toan antique automobile
restoration facility out inWhite Post, they can go
swimming, horseback riding, uhtours, they can go to concerts
at the Hilton Center.
If there's something playingthere at the time they're
staying, we can easily arrangeto get tickets.
So um the guest daycoordinator, which is a

(15:18):
volunteer position that workswith the family to arrange all
this and get an itinerarytogether for them and get
everything squared away with thevendors and so that they have a
place to go and they inspectthem and they everybody has a
good time.
Uh they work with the familiesfor weeks, if not a month out,

(15:38):
to to make sure that they haveuh an amazing stay with us.
And again, that's that's allpart of what the volunteers do.
Here at the Warrior Retreat, wejust have six staff members.
We have one full-time staffmember, our executive director,
and then five of us arepart-time who work full-time.
But uh it's a it's really uh agreat, great job to have, I

(16:02):
gotta say.
I'm not complaining by anymeasure.
It's an amazing place, andwe're just very fortunate that
the community trusts us andgives us the ability to give
this gift back to the warriorsbecause it is, you know,
millions of dollars has goneinto this facility to make it a
very special place for ourwounded warriors and their

(16:25):
families.
Uh rounding out our our events,we've got the after the gala,
we have my favorite event of theyear, which is our home away
from home dinner.
So we have hosted the home awayfrom home dinner for 10 years.
The very first year we did it,it was crazy.
We had about 25 warriors thatwe found at the hospitals and

(16:49):
mostly single guys and ladies.
And we said, come on out theSunday before Thanksgiving, and
we'll we'll have a home cookedThanksgiving dinner.
And that was a bunch ofvolunteers and and myself and
staff who put together dishesand got a turkey and roasted it,
and and it was pretty basic,actually.

(17:11):
And then as we went on, our uhvolunteer executive event chef,
Ken Gardner, put together uh amore substantial meal, and that
grew and grew, and we broughtmore chefs on.
And now that we uh are in theGrand Lodge and we can use the

(17:32):
activities room in the GrandLodge, we were able to host
almost 70 warriors and familymembers this year in November.
And uh we had three days ofcooking and preparing food, and
and then on that Sunday beforeThanksgiving, we hosted that
dinner and uh it was amazing.
We had smoked turkey androasted turkey and ham and about

(17:55):
10 different sides,everything's made some scratch.
We had about 20 chefs in onSaturday, all taking a dish and
knocking it out, and we make thecroutons from scratch, we make
the salad dressing from scratch.
Uh, everything, everything thatwent on that buffet table for
everybody was made from scratch.

(18:16):
And we also want to give a bigshout out to I-66 Express who uh
sponsored the dinner.
They gave us a donation of$5,000 for food, and we used uh
almost all of it, making ascratch dinner for about $100
when you consider the not onlythe volunteers that we feed, but
uh we like to overcook umbecause we want to give

(18:40):
everybody a um take homecontainer so they they can take
it back and either share it withsomebody who couldn't come or
next day's lunch.
You know, uh it's just uh anawesome, awesome dinner and
time.
And uh we had about 30volunteers for that.
Also, we had some great specialguests.

(19:01):
We had um Commissioner ChuckSingler and his wife, gay.
They uh came for the secondyear in a row.
And it's great to have thecommissioner of the Virginia
Department of Veterans Servicesshow up and talk to the veterans
that are there and the activeduty that may become veterans
and want to stay here inVirginia and know that they can

(19:21):
count on the Department ofVeterans Services here for help
if needed.
And uh he makes it a point totalk to everybody, every
soldier, every veteran that'shere.
Um, he really does love to comeout and and really talk to uh
these warriors and find out whattheir needs are.
And uh, we are always so happyto have his support.

(19:45):
Uh, we also had a uh specialguest by the name um uh Whithold
Brick was a World War IIsurvivor, and he was born in
Poland, and he fought in theWausau Uprising and with the
Polish resistance until he wascaptured and interned in a Nazi
uh camp.
And he was 102, and soon to be103, and it was very exciting to

(20:10):
have him there.
He he uh had a great time andhis daughter Michelle um brought
him out.
It was great.
Um, so it was really a fun, funday.
December, we have holidayparties at Walter Reed in Fort
Balfour.
They are a lot of fun, theWalter Reed one, especially.
We give a lot of stuff away.
And then You know, we're wekind of have a little lull in

(20:33):
January where we things slowdown for us and we take a little
bit of a breather and uh andthen get right into the new
year.
Uh we got a host of programs.
The Grand Lodge was built forprograms, for groups to come in
and do events.
And some of the groups thatcome, like Mighty Oaks or the

(20:54):
American Warrior Association,they take up all three houses
where they bring in a number ofveterans for counseling or
different types of programs anduse the Grand Lodge for their
training and for dining,basically.
Uh, we will do um our ownprograms.
Uh we do a moral injury programin 2026.

(21:17):
We're going to expand thatprogram, not only from for
veterans and warriors, but alsoour first responders in the
community.
And we sort of look at that asa way to give back to the
community to say, you know,thank you for your support.
And here is a program that wehave that we feel could benefit
your uh first line firefighters,police, EMS, emergency room

(21:42):
personnel, what I like to referto as the warriors within the
wire.
Um, those that are doing a jobthat is extremely stressful and
dangerous, and many have issueswith moral injury.
And so we're looking forward toexpanding that program in 2026.
But we also do host moralinjury programs by the chaplains

(22:05):
from the Soldier Recovery Unitat Fort Belvoir.
We bring out soldiers for oneweek, a group, and then family
for another, and then cadre orthe medical personnel that work
with the warriors.
And that was a very successfulprogram in the last couple of
years.
Uh, we did an elderly veteranlunch where we hosted an

(22:27):
afternoon of fun and uh food forum about 30 elderly veterans,
many with mobility issues, anddon't get out much.
And so we were able to uh workwith a couple of nonprofit VSOs
in the area to get them to theretreat and have a fun time.

(22:48):
And it was really a great day.
And we're looking forward todoing that again next year.
We partnered with anorganization called We Signed Up
Two, which is a really funnonprofit.
And it was started by twoteenage girls who actually were
guests here in 2018 with theirfather, and they decided that

(23:09):
they needed to create an onlinespace and an organization that
supported children of woundedwarriors.
And it's called We Signed UpTo.
And we hosted them about 10 ofthese young people out for a
day.
Uh, they wanted to have acooking class, a journaling
class, and a survival class.

(23:29):
And we were able to get all ofthose uh for them for that day,
and we're looking forward tohosting them again as well.
And we also did a uh summerleadership challenge for
teenagers when we partnered withthe 957 Project, which is a
nonprofit that has a curriculumthat teaches uh young people

(23:51):
about 9-11 and uh the war onterrorism, and they come out for
a day uh for a week.
It's a day camp, and eachelement of that course is taught
by a veteran.
And the veterans stay in theGrand Lodge, the instructors,
and then the kids come for theday, and uh it's a really,

(24:12):
really great program.
And we had a lot of fun doingthat.
Kids are amazing.
They all have to pick a projectwhere they support their
community, and uh they really doan amazing job just thinking
about it, really.
It's uh it's really it, it'sit's really great to see these
kids and what they come up withas a way to give back.
But we'll uh get again, we'regonna be looking at doing that

(24:36):
again, looking forward to doingthat again in 2026.
We at the retreat reallyunderstand that we couldn't do
what we do without ourvolunteers.
We have a core group ofvolunteers that are absolutely
amazing.
They come, they show up everyweek, they do staging to set the

(24:57):
house up for the next familycoming in.
They do grounds team work.
I mean, we have some amazingveterans who are on our grounds
team, and they're out theremowing the lawn in pretty hot
weather sometimes in the dead ofsummer.
And uh, you know, they they doan amazing job.
We have a team that uh worksthe garden, master gardeners and

(25:19):
volunteers.
We have a huge vegetablegarden.
We can provide all sorts offresh vegetables for the
families while they're here andthe chefs.
We have volunteers that comeand work just events like the
bike ride, like the gala, likethe Corvette show.
We have a volunteer who comestwice a year, just once to set

(25:40):
up Christmas trees in Decemberand again to take them down in
January.
And Maureen, that's all shedoes.
We don't see her for the restof the year.
We have a volunteer who rarelycomes to the retreat, but she
has an amazing pool at her housenearby, just a beautiful pool,
and we call it Bonnie's privatepool.

(26:00):
And during the summer, thefamilies can go over there.
She works from home and theycan swim.
And she invites them over, theyhave a great time, and uh
that's her way of contributing.
And we have hundreds andhundreds of volunteers that uh
really, really uh do the work.
And when you when you thinkabout um this year alone, uh we

(26:25):
are closing in on 12,500volunteer hours that we are able
to track.
There are sometimes people thatcome and volunteer and do
things that we don't get totrack all their hours.
You know, we get a lot ofgroups that come out, companies
that bring their employees outto help us.

(26:46):
Um Home Depot Foundation isone.
Um they bring their people outand do amazing work on the
property.
We're thankful for their umcontribution of the flooring in
the Grand Lodge when it wasbeing built.
They just worked with ToughShed to get us a $25,000 uh

(27:07):
mower shed.
Barn, actually, is what itlooks like to me, um, which we
really needed because we werestoring our mowers in a ratty uh
pole barn that was just comingapart at the seams.
And this uh this really isgonna help us um maintain our
our mowers.
And we our grounds team goesout.

(27:27):
Wow, on a Wednesday, they'reout with four zero turns for
hours mowing the lawn.
We we've got a big property andthey make it look beautiful.
Also, a shout out to Amazon,another of our big donors.
Um, they have uh committed to agrant we'll receive here
shortly to build a uh a smalllittle studio in our offices,

(27:53):
and it's a $20,000 grant for thebuild-out of the construction
as well as equipment to thinkwe'll move from audio only over
to video as well, and put outsome episodes that'll be video,
and you'll be able to see ourguests.
So we're really looking forwardto that coming up in 2026, and

(28:15):
we really appreciate the supportof uh Amazon in that grant,
that's for sure.
Um uh direct everybody to thewebpage to it's
willingwarriors.org or g.
You can see ways to volunteer,ways to donate.
You can see all the differentprograms that we have.

(28:36):
And certainly if you have anyquestions, you can email us
through the webpage or we reallywant to hear from you,
especially if you want tovolunteer.
We can find something for youto do.
There's no no doubt about that.
We need volunteers foreverything, really.
Um, when you think about it, wewe we give out thousands of

(28:58):
cards, handmade cards by churchgroups and kids each year, but
we have to go through all thosecards.
Some of them are notappropriate, and it's not not
that that's done for meanreasons, it's just some of these
younger kids don't understanduh what warriors are going
through and exploding tanks,things like that.

(29:18):
We just kind of weed out.
Um, so everything takes manhours.
Uh, we have a a great team ofum handymen.
One handles everything insidethe houses and one that handles
everything outside the houses.
Um, we have 21 acres ofhardwood with five trails that
need to be maintained.
We also have um a volunteer whomanages all our Eagle Scout

(29:41):
projects.
We're most likely the privateproperty in the country with the
most Eagle Scout projects.
We're sitting right now atabout 74.
And uh so we we have a lot ofuh a lot of support from the
community.
But please, if you'reinterested in donating or
volunteering, reach out to us,go to the webpage

(30:02):
willingwarriors.org, check itout, and if you have any
questions, you can email us orgive us a call.
We're happy to uh to talk toyou about whatever whatever
position you'd like to volunteerfor or whatever any questions
you might have.
That's gonna be it for thisyear.

(30:23):
We're wrapping up and I want tothank all of our listeners.
As crazy as it seems, fivepercent of our listeners are in
Europe, which is a big surpriseto me.
But wherever you are, I reallyappreciate you taking the time
to listen and uh to meet ourguests that we have, and
hopefully we've uh been able tobring some useful information to

(30:45):
you and introduce you all toveteran service organizations
and individuals that are givingback and and uh are contributing
in ways that uh can help.
And hopefully, uh certainly ifyou need help, we've maybe found
a resource for you.
Um season four starts inJanuary, and uh I'm excited to

(31:10):
to say that my guest for seasonfour, first episode is gonna be
uh Rear Admiral Mike Studeman,who is uh retired Navy
intelligence officer, and uh hehas a new book out, it's a great
book, and we'll be talking tohim uh in uh the very first
episode of season four.

(31:31):
So uh until then, we reallythank you for listening.
Uh, you can find us on all themajor podcast platforms.
We're on YouTube and
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