May 19, 2025 • 28 mins
A profound connection exists between traumatized warriors and rescued horses. Both have experienced hardship, both carry invisible scars, and both possess remarkable resilience. This powerful relationship forms the foundation of the life-changing work happening at Lifeline Horse Rescue in Gaithersburg, Maryland.
Executive Director Leila Hertzberg brings her expertise as an EGALA-certified equine specialist with military designation to create transformative experiences for veterans battling PTS, moral injury, and trauma. Through their LETS (Lifeline Equine Therapy Services) program, service members experience ground-based interactions with horses that create unique pathways to healing that traditional therapy often can't reach.
What makes this approach particularly effective is how it sidesteps direct confrontation of trauma. Veterans observe horses interacting in the pasture, projecting their own experiences onto what they witness. A horse standing alone might trigger recognition of personal isolation; fences become metaphors for boundaries. As Hertzberg explains, "We don't ask them what they feel... we say, 'What's going on out there?' So it's not pressure on them." Through these metaphorical conversations, warriors begin articulating their experiences in ways that feel safe.
The horses themselves come from challenging backgrounds - ex-racehorses worth hundreds of thousands of dollars before injury made them "worthless" to owners, former Amish working horses with broken bodies from years of hard labor. These animals intuitively connect with veterans, often singling out the warrior in a family group, sensing a kindred spirit who understands trauma and loss.
Lifeline offers these services free to veterans, active duty personnel, and their families, partnering with Walter Reed, Fort Belvoir's Soldier Recovery Unit, and other military organizations. Despite facing funding challenges, its mission remains clear: "No suicide—that's the bottom line."
Want to support this vital work? Visit lifelinehorserescue.org to donate or volunteer. If you're struggling with combat-related trauma, reach out today – healing connections await between you and a horse who understands without judgment.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Larry Zilliox (00:00):
Good morning.
I'm your host, larry Zilliox,Director of Culinary Services
here at the Warrior Retreat atBull Run, and this week our
guest is Leila Hertzberg.
She's the Executive Director ofan organization in Gaithersburg
called Lifeline Horse Rescueand I wanted to ask her to come
(00:20):
on because they have a programover there that helps veterans
and active duty soldiers withPTS.
It's just a wonderful programand they've partnered now with a
soldier recovery unit at FortBelvoir, which all of our
listeners know.
We are very close to CaptainWooten and the whole team at the
(00:40):
soldier recovery unit there.
In fact, we're looking forwardto the care coordinators from
there and Walter Reed coming outfor a barbecue lunch next month
.
So, Leila, welcome to thepodcast.
Leila Hertzberg (00:54):
Thank you so much, Larry.
I'm really honored to be here,really looking forward to our
conversation.
Larry Zilliox (01:00):
I'm looking over your biography and it says
you're an Igala-certified equinespecialist with military
designation.
I've never heard of that.
What is it?
Leila Hertzberg (01:10):
EGALA model of equine-assisted services right,
equine-assisted psychotherapyand you will find.
(01:32):
If you Google it, you'll findmany EGALA organizations around
the US and globally.
So what does the militarydesignation mean?
So recently EGALA startedworking more with the military
veteran population because ofthe prevalence of PTSD and
veteran suicide.
(01:52):
Military designation shows thatthe individuals and program are
both military competent right.
So we've had experience andtraining so that we understand.
Larry Zilliox (02:08):
So this is a program developed by an
organization, and then peoplewho work with horses and therapy
can take this we'll call it acourse and then be certified in
this and offer it to theirclients around the country, and
then, in addition to thatcertification, then it sounds as
(02:32):
though there's there's a extratraining that you get to get
that military designation.
Is that, am I saying that right?
Leila Hertzberg (02:38):
yes, that is yes, that's correct, larry.
So it's not just anyone cansign up to become what they call
an ES or MH, an equinespecialist or a mental health
specialist.
The equine specialist needs toalready have a lot of experience
, because we would not want tohave that person who is
(03:00):
responsible for the safetyemotional and physical safety of
the team and the client, tohave just taken a little course
on equine assisted therapy andthen set them loose.
They have to really understandhorses, horse behavior, right.
Larry Zilliox (03:17):
So there's a minimum amount of knowledge
that's required to just even toenroll in the course, which is
good To me as an outsider, thatsounds as though they're very
interested in providing thisservice and not so much charging
and finding a way to make moneyoffering this.
I really I think that's great.
I think more things should beoffered like that and just not
(03:43):
oh, you showed up and you took atest, now you're good, yeah.
And especially when you'reworking around horses, they are
very big and very heavy animalsand you really do need to know
what you're doing.
I went out years ago to ProjectHorse and they put me on the
(04:03):
biggest horse that they had, andthis horse was huge.
It had to have been like almost20 feet tall.
It was the biggest horse I'dever seen.
Anyway, I didn't stay on itvery long because I was really
afraid that it would startwalking away and that would be
the last you see of me.
But talk a little bit about now.
You've been involved in thiscareer field for many years.
(04:26):
How did you get interested inthis?
Leila Hertzberg (04:30):
Okay, good question.
So I have always been one ofthose horse crazy girls.
For as long as I can remember,and even before I started my
nonprofit Lifeline Horse Rescueabout seven years ago, I was
always the one people would senda horse to Like Lila, could you
please take this horse?
(04:51):
I just can't do anything withit anymore.
I'm having a problem gettingdivorced.
Whatever the problem was right.
I finally started the nonprofit, which enabled me to help more
horses and in the process wewanted to serve the community
horses and in the process wewanted to serve the community.
So I've always been very drawnto veterans, service members and
(05:13):
first responders.
And I saw a documentary fromPlatoon 22, which is a great
local nonprofit, by the way, inMaryland, who we partner with,
and it was a documentary aboutveteran suicide and I
immediately knew that my missionfor that helping and giving
back to the community would beto partner these rescued horses
(05:35):
with those warriors and familymembers in need.
Larry Zilliox (05:40):
So that's how I got started with that, and so
let's talk a little bit aboutthe horses.
So it sounds like you've beenin the rescue horse business for
quite some time, that it wasn'tuntil about seven years ago
that that whole activity wasformalized into a nonprofit,
which is a good thing to do,because then you can get
(06:01):
donations and you don't have tofoot the bill entirely.
But when you say a rescuedhorse, are they, are they.
They're not necessarily likeall abused.
They just could be some wheresomebody just has to give up the
horse because of lifecircumstances.
(06:21):
But how would you characterizethe majority of your animals?
Are they had a hard life orabuse, or what would you say?
Leila Hertzberg (06:30):
So that's a good question.
They come from all kinds ofsituations, okay?
So we very commonly getex-racehorses.
So, for instance, we've hadhorses that were very good
racehorses one quarter of amillion dollars but they were
injured and they just couldn'tdo it anymore.
Right?
So people don't want it anymore.
(06:52):
It's very expensive to maintaina horse.
So we get requests to take thathorse, right?
So we have to rehab it, we haveto let it rest, we have to
retrain it.
Most people don't really wantor can even manage a horse that
has been taught to run as fastas it can.
So we need to work with that tobring that horse down to a job
(07:13):
that it can do.
Larry Zilliox (07:15):
Is that something that they do when you get them?
Do they run around crazy allthe time?
Well, I mean, from point A topoint B, if the horse and the
horses said I want to go acrossthe pasture there, most horses
just kind of walk on over Dothey naturally run on to the
other side?
Leila Hertzberg (07:30):
So when they first start getting turned out,
yes, they run around like littlecrazies and they've got the
zoomies and we have to watchthat they don't hurt themselves
or the other horses.
Yeah, they don't tend to beaggressive, except in the very
beginning because a lot of timesor the other horses Amish
horses, so ex-Amish horses, whocan be very beat up, abused, bad
eyes, big old knee broken down,big saggy ankles and have a lot
(08:11):
of problems.
And what we do with thosehorses is first just let them be
a horse right.
So personality starts to comeout.
They're very stoic at first andfinally they get to the place
where they can shake their headand maybe roll in the pasture
and oh my God, take a treat fromyour hand because they have not
had that experience before andthey become wonderful companions
(08:33):
.
If they're sound enough theycould have some light riding,
but they're wonderful.
Therapy horses, wow.
Larry Zilliox (08:40):
How many horses do you have at the facility?
Leila Hertzberg (08:43):
So right.
So we tend to have around 15.
They're not all part of therescue, but every horse.
So either my horses one or twoboarders or they're owned by
Lifeline.
Lifeline has limited funds.
We have to turn away some ownerrequests, which is very sad.
We hate to do that but we're ona very small property.
But every horse on the propertyis used in some capacity in the
(09:08):
therapy program, regardless ofits personality, right?
Larry Zilliox (09:13):
And tell us a little bit about the therapy
program itself how it worked.
I know from my own experienceof when Project Horse was around
.
We took all the guest statecoordinators up there and kind
of ran them through the paces sothey understood what the
warriors were going through.
When it comes to abused horses,there was a direct correlation
(09:38):
between their post-traumaticstress and the warrior's
post-traumatic stress and almostvery relatable, between the
animal and the warrior.
And we know and I'm sure a lotof our listeners know that
horses are very intuitiveanimals and they can pick up.
In fact we've seen warriors goout with their family and I've
(10:02):
seen horses single out thewarrior from the rest of the
family.
They knew which one was thewarrior and was akin to them in
that they had issues with PTS,maybe TBI, but the horse could
very quickly pick them out andrelate to them, and the warrior
(10:27):
as well.
Once the warrior recognizedthat the horse was coming up to
them, they bonded very quickly.
I was really, really impressedwith the horse's ability to
recognize what was going on, andso I think these programs are
amazing.
What does your program looklike there at Lifeline Horse
(10:51):
Rescue?
Leila Hertzberg (10:51):
Thanks for asking, larry.
So at Lifeline our program iscalled LETS it's Lifeline Equine
Therapy Services and we offersubsidized therapy,
psychotherapy, life coaching,trauma-informed yoga and a
little bit of therapeuticrecreational riding.
So the EGAL model is allground-based.
It's not about riding horses.
(11:12):
The interaction is all on theground, usually with a loose
horse or horses.
And to start, people call, wedo a little screening to see
what's going on, what they need,how we can help them, and we
usually suggest they start withat least 12 weeks and again
they're not paying for this forveteran service members and
their immediate family weeks andagain they're not paying for
this, and for veteran servicemembers and their immediate
(11:33):
family members.
And so they'll come out andfill out some forms and we'll
sit down.
We'll do a little intro talkhorse safety.
A lot of people have never beenup close and personal with
horses.
Some have used horses back inthe day, at the farm or in a
military way.
So it's a real mixed bag, right.
So to start out, we'll go intospace with the horses.
(11:55):
We have a team, we have thetherapist, the equine specialist
, the client and horse or horses.
So we'll go out into the spaceand we start with really an
observe what is going on.
Because this is an experientialtherapy, it's an alternative
therapy.
It is not like sitting in anoffice talking with a therapist
about your life story.
(12:16):
Doesn't work like that right andthat's one of the beauties,
because we're out in nature.
There might be a hawk goingoverhead.
The barn cats come over, thehorses are are either grazing or
walking or interacting witheach other.
They're, they're moving.
So it's a real life, a reallife situation happening.
The wind might be blowing, soit's more than one horse then.
Larry Zilliox (12:41):
So then do you have some sort of herd dynamic
at play as well?
Leila Hertzberg (12:46):
Yes, that's very important.
So, really, what is the goal isfor the veteran not only just
to relate to a particular horse,which very often happens, but
we tend to not tell them thestory of the horse unless it's
relevant.
We don't even tell them thename, the gender, because it's
more about what the veteran orservice member needs to get and
(13:08):
tell their story and see theirstory.
So they need to see theinteractions, the relationships
between the horses.
So if we have somebody, forinstance, who's struggling with
loneliness, they might look inthe pasture and we say what do
you see out there?
Oh well, I see two, two, two.
They all have somebody.
Huh, unlike me, I have nobodyRight, and so they might we.
(13:33):
So we're looking at and wedon't ask them what do you feel,
what do you, et cetera.
Right, we say what's going onout there?
So it's not a pressure on them.
So what happens is they usemetaphors, what the horses are
doing and interacting with eachother or the environment to
(13:53):
figure out what's going on intheir head.
So very common props would begates, fences, right for
boundaries, horse manure, a bigfat pile on the ground right.
Well, that sums up my life,right there, right, or different
obstacles in the arena, ormounting blocks or things that
(14:14):
they see, and then that's howthey're able to start tell their
story.
Well, we don't create it forthem, it has to come from them.
Larry Zilliox (14:21):
Wow, yeah.
And is this a group therapy oris this one-on-one, or can it be
both?
Leila Hertzberg (14:29):
So we offer both.
We have individual couples,family and groups.
So we tend to have monthlythemed groups and we also have
groups that come fromorganizations.
For instance, we see WalterReed recreational therapy groups
about once a month when theweather's nice.
We have SRU from Fort Belvoircomes.
(14:52):
We have a group from FortDetrick coming, sos, our
survivors group.
So we have a lot of differentgroups.
We're also holding a MarylandNational Guard child and youth
program.
This summer we're going to havea week-long camp that we're
offering at no cost to theNational Guard youth.
Larry Zilliox (15:10):
Wow.
Leila Hertzberg (15:10):
And we're going to very sneakily teach them
resilience and build theirconfidence and teamwork right,
working together by using thehorses and some other activities
at the farm.
Larry Zilliox (15:23):
Well, I'm glad you mentioned it was no cost and
, to be clear, I want ourlisteners to understand that no
cost means to the veteran, theservice member or a family
member.
It doesn't mean that thesethings don't cost Lifeline Horse
Rescue a lot of money.
(15:45):
So the webpage islifelinehorserescueorg.
I want all our listeners to goto the webpage, take a look,
look at all the differentprograms and services they offer
.
Now, this is not specifically aveteran service organization,
so you're not going to find thatdonate button up in the
(16:08):
right-hand corner like you dowith all other VSOs, but it's
there.
There's a row of buttons.
It's in the top row, it's thethird one over.
I want everybody to bang on itand make a donation, whatever
you can a dollar, $5, $100,$1,000.
This is an organization thatneeds your help, and every
(16:31):
dollar goes towards helpingtheir clients.
Now, I'm sure that you do workwith other people than just
veterans.
You know, I think, everybody.
There are a lot of people inthe community that can benefit
from this kind of therapy, forsure, and so please go to the
(16:52):
web page, lifelinehorserescueorg, check it out.
And if you're a veteran who'sin Maryland they're located in
Gaithersburg and you'restruggling with post-traumatic
stress, tbi anger issues, tbianger issues, loneliness.
(17:16):
Check out this program.
I guarantee you that it willeither help you or it won't, but
it won't hurt you.
So there's no reason you can'tsign up for this program or at
least give them a call, talk tothem about it, tell them what
your situation is, and Iguarantee you they're going to
go.
Eh, we've we've had plenty ofveterans like you in here and
(17:37):
you're not all that special.
To be honest with you, there'sa lot of guys and gals out there
that have the same issues youdo and they are reaching out to
organizations just like LifelineHorse Rescue, and they're
getting the help that they need,and there's no reason why you
can't get that help as well.
And while you're on the webpage,look for that Donate button.
(17:59):
It's on the top row, numberthree from the left.
Hit that button and make adonation.
Donate whatever you can.
There's no amount is is notneeded.
Let me tell you when does yourfunding come from?
Is it mostly donations or doyou have any grants that are
coming in?
How much does the communitysupport you?
Leila Hertzberg (18:21):
Well, that's a good question, Larry.
So we've been.
We do have.
We have some support from a fewdonors.
For instance, one racehorsebreeder who's a very kind person
, who gives us a small donationevery year.
We have a private individualwho is military connected, who
(18:42):
is very kind and wants to helpthe horses and the military.
It costs a lot of money tosupport these horses.
We have vet bills sometimes andso.
So basically, a lot of the workis done on a volunteer basis,
but I have to pay my staff oftherapists and equine
(19:03):
specialists, right.
So we have reached out to a lotof grant opportunities and we've
had some state funding.
We have had some federalopportunity, which have been
slashed this year.
So we're definitely in a tightspot, unfortunately, but we're
(19:23):
not going to give up.
We are going to provide service.
We're just going to whatever ittakes, hell or high water,
we're going to make sure wecontinue because we know that
what we do works and our missionis no suicide, right?
That's the bottom line.
So, whether the person hasmoral injury, pts, substance use
, disorder because of all thosethings, military sexual trauma,
(19:48):
whatever it is, we're going tohelp them.
Yes, we could absolutely usedonations.
We probably don't go out thereand say that enough.
Larry Zilliox (19:57):
I'll say it for you LifelineRescueorg, hit that
donate button.
You know, one thing you justmentioned that really hit me was
your vet bills.
So those of our listeners whohave dogs or cats and take your
dog or your cat to the vet,think about the bill that you
get from your dog and cat Now.
(20:19):
Multiply that by the size of ahorse and think of how much
money they need just to stayoperational.
And they take extremely goodcare of these animals.
These are abused animals.
They need a lot of care andthey're providing them with a
(20:40):
quality of life that many ofthese animals had not seen
before.
And so that takes money, ittakes volunteers, it takes time.
Let's talk about volunteers.
A nonprofit needs volunteers.
They're the lifeblood.
I know how it is here.
We have a small staff, buteverything else is done by
(21:01):
volunteers.
If we didn't have volunteers,we wouldn't be in business.
So how can people volunteer andhelp Lifeline Rescue?
Leila Hertzberg (21:11):
Thank you for asking, larry.
We are fortunate.
We have a number of volunteers.
By the way, many happen to beveterans, so whether they were
formerly enlisted or they'reofficers, it doesn't matter.
Everyone is kind of the same atthe farm and everyone who comes
is willing to roll up theirsleeves and sling manure, help
(21:34):
feed horses, carry hay, unloadfeed.
Some have more physicallimitations due to injuries,
sure, so they might help at anoutreach event or they might
locate a funding opportunity.
They might help run our.
In fact, we have an open housecoming up Saturday, may 17th.
(21:56):
So, they might help One for thekids' tables and activities,
something like that.
We can always use volunteers.
Yes, absolutely.
We couldn't do it without them.
Yeah, so true, yeah.
Larry Zilliox (22:08):
And how do volunteers reach out to you?
Leila Hertzberg (22:10):
We have a contact form on the website.
Larry Zilliox (22:13):
Okay.
Leila Hertzberg (22:13):
So that would be the best way and I would be
the one answering, because Iwear a lot of hats.
We only have so much help, soat the moment I'm juggling those
hats like crazy and we'rereally scrambling with the
funding crisis going on rightnow.
But, like I said, we're goingto find a way to make it happen.
But if anyone out there is agrant writer, or has connections
(22:38):
, please let us know.
We're trying to get onto alarger farm one of these days
and in the meantime, we're justtrying to keep our heads above
water and keep offering servicesfor our veterans, service
members and their families.
It's very sad, but we havechildren and spouses who also
are suffering from suicidalideation and we need to serve
(23:02):
them as well.
We need to serve the caregivers.
Caregivers are often overlookedand they're very important.
So, for instance, we have achaplain group coming out.
We're going to serve them.
So we have to look out for thewhole community.
You want to help a veteran,then you need to help the people
around that veteran.
It's very important.
Larry Zilliox (23:21):
The families serve too.
They do, and it sounds likewhat you need is a volunteer to
be a volunteer coordinator.
That'd be amazing.
So there's plenty of roles forvolunteers there, and I want to
specify, too, that it's not allabout carrying big hay bales.
(23:42):
There's people need tocorrespond, answer phones, do
thank you cards, make calls,find grants.
If you're going to donate and Ihope everyone does think about
if your company matchesdonations let them know who
you're donating to.
If you know of a grantsituation where your company is
(24:05):
looking for something to fundespecially if you're employed in
Maryland and you're a Marylandcompany tell them to think about
Lifeline Horse Rescue, becausethis is such a vital service,
and there are 47,000 veteranservice organizations in this
(24:25):
country and many of them aredoing incredible work.
I would categorize yourorganization as one of those,
because what you do saves livesthere's just absolutely no doubt
about it and as a byproduct,you're also saving lives of
horses, which you know next tomonkeys.
(24:49):
Everybody loves horses, monkeys, everybody loves horses, so I
really think this is such agreat organization.
Again, the webpage islifelinehorserescueorg.
Check it out, recommend it, sendthat link to others, to people
(25:10):
that you know.
You got a cousin who lives inMaryland and just got out of the
service, maybe having someissues, send them that link and
say, hey, check this out.
Or you've got some relativeswho live in Maryland near
Gaithersburg and they've gothigh school kids and they've got
to do mandatory volunteerservice.
(25:31):
There's a place that they cando it.
All they got to do is bring theletter and they'll sign off on
it.
And you know, there's so manydifferent ways that you can help
, and so I don't want that to beoverlooked.
But let me ask you this, as wesort of wrap this up what's the
one thing you want our listenersto know, the most important
(25:53):
thing you want them to knowabout Lifeline Horse Rescue?
Leila Hertzberg (25:57):
Thank you, larry.
The most important thing I wantour listeners to know is that
if you're hurting, please reachout for help.
Please don't stay isolated.
Don't think you're the only onesuffering from moral injury or
maybe you don't even know whatmoral injury is, but you can get
help.
You can get better.
(26:18):
If you're in our area, we wouldlove to help you.
Just give us a call.
It couldn't be easier.
We're there for you.
We are a solid community and avery quiet farm.
We can help you.
And don't be afraid to ask forhelp.
It's never too late.
You've got substance use thingsgoing on.
(26:39):
Reach out for help.
We want to help you.
There are people in this worldwho need you.
There is a purpose out therefor you.
So God bless, please, please,don't realize that.
Don't think that there's nohope.
There is hope, and thank you.
Larry Zilliox (26:58):
Well, thank you so much for joining us.
This has been just a great,great episode.
I really appreciate it.
Thank you, larry.
I really appreciate theopportunity.
So, for our listeners, we'llhave another episode next Monday
morning at 0500.
For those of you who'd like toget up bright and early and
listen to podcasts, you can findus on most podcast platforms,
(27:19):
also on YouTube and on WreathsAcross America Radio.
Thanks for listening.
Good morning.
I'm your host, larry Zilliox,Director of Culinary Services
here at the Warrior Retreat atBull Run, and this week our
guest is Leila Hertzberg.
She's the Executive Director ofan organization in Gaithersburg
called Lifeline Horse Rescueand I wanted to ask her to come
(00:20):
on because they have a programover there that helps veterans
and active duty soldiers withPTS.
It's just a wonderful programand they've partnered now with a
soldier recovery unit at FortBelvoir, which all of our
listeners know.
We are very close to CaptainWooten and the whole team at the
(00:40):
soldier recovery unit there.
In fact, we're looking forwardto the care coordinators from
there and Walter Reed coming outfor a barbecue lunch next month
.
So, Leila, welcome to thepodcast.
Leila Hertzberg (00:54):
Thank you so much, Larry.
I'm really honored to be here,really looking forward to our
conversation.
Larry Zilliox (01:00):
I'm looking over your biography and it says
you're an Igala-certified equinespecialist with military
designation.
I've never heard of that.
What is it?
Leila Hertzberg (01:10):
EGALA model of equine-assisted services right,
equine-assisted psychotherapyand you will find.
(01:32):
If you Google it, you'll findmany EGALA organizations around
the US and globally.
So what does the militarydesignation mean?
So recently EGALA startedworking more with the military
veteran population because ofthe prevalence of PTSD and
veteran suicide.
(01:52):
Military designation shows thatthe individuals and program are
both military competent right.
So we've had experience andtraining so that we understand.
Larry Zilliox (02:08):
So this is a program developed by an
organization, and then peoplewho work with horses and therapy
can take this we'll call it acourse and then be certified in
this and offer it to theirclients around the country, and
then, in addition to thatcertification, then it sounds as
(02:32):
though there's there's a extratraining that you get to get
that military designation.
Is that, am I saying that right?
Leila Hertzberg (02:38):
yes, that is yes, that's correct, larry.
So it's not just anyone cansign up to become what they call
an ES or MH, an equinespecialist or a mental health
specialist.
The equine specialist needs toalready have a lot of experience
, because we would not want tohave that person who is
(03:00):
responsible for the safetyemotional and physical safety of
the team and the client, tohave just taken a little course
on equine assisted therapy andthen set them loose.
They have to really understandhorses, horse behavior, right.
Larry Zilliox (03:17):
So there's a minimum amount of knowledge
that's required to just even toenroll in the course, which is
good To me as an outsider, thatsounds as though they're very
interested in providing thisservice and not so much charging
and finding a way to make moneyoffering this.
I really I think that's great.
I think more things should beoffered like that and just not
(03:43):
oh, you showed up and you took atest, now you're good, yeah.
And especially when you'reworking around horses, they are
very big and very heavy animalsand you really do need to know
what you're doing.
I went out years ago to ProjectHorse and they put me on the
(04:03):
biggest horse that they had, andthis horse was huge.
It had to have been like almost20 feet tall.
It was the biggest horse I'dever seen.
Anyway, I didn't stay on itvery long because I was really
afraid that it would startwalking away and that would be
the last you see of me.
But talk a little bit about now.
You've been involved in thiscareer field for many years.
(04:26):
How did you get interested inthis?
Leila Hertzberg (04:30):
Okay, good question.
So I have always been one ofthose horse crazy girls.
For as long as I can remember,and even before I started my
nonprofit Lifeline Horse Rescueabout seven years ago, I was
always the one people would senda horse to Like Lila, could you
please take this horse?
(04:51):
I just can't do anything withit anymore.
I'm having a problem gettingdivorced.
Whatever the problem was right.
I finally started the nonprofit, which enabled me to help more
horses and in the process wewanted to serve the community
horses and in the process wewanted to serve the community.
So I've always been very drawnto veterans, service members and
(05:13):
first responders.
And I saw a documentary fromPlatoon 22, which is a great
local nonprofit, by the way, inMaryland, who we partner with,
and it was a documentary aboutveteran suicide and I
immediately knew that my missionfor that helping and giving
back to the community would beto partner these rescued horses
(05:35):
with those warriors and familymembers in need.
Larry Zilliox (05:40):
So that's how I got started with that, and so
let's talk a little bit aboutthe horses.
So it sounds like you've beenin the rescue horse business for
quite some time, that it wasn'tuntil about seven years ago
that that whole activity wasformalized into a nonprofit,
which is a good thing to do,because then you can get
(06:01):
donations and you don't have tofoot the bill entirely.
But when you say a rescuedhorse, are they, are they.
They're not necessarily likeall abused.
They just could be some wheresomebody just has to give up the
horse because of lifecircumstances.
(06:21):
But how would you characterizethe majority of your animals?
Are they had a hard life orabuse, or what would you say?
Leila Hertzberg (06:30):
So that's a good question.
They come from all kinds ofsituations, okay?
So we very commonly getex-racehorses.
So, for instance, we've hadhorses that were very good
racehorses one quarter of amillion dollars but they were
injured and they just couldn'tdo it anymore.
Right?
So people don't want it anymore.
(06:52):
It's very expensive to maintaina horse.
So we get requests to take thathorse, right?
So we have to rehab it, we haveto let it rest, we have to
retrain it.
Most people don't really wantor can even manage a horse that
has been taught to run as fastas it can.
So we need to work with that tobring that horse down to a job
(07:13):
that it can do.
Larry Zilliox (07:15):
Is that something that they do when you get them?
Do they run around crazy allthe time?
Well, I mean, from point A topoint B, if the horse and the
horses said I want to go acrossthe pasture there, most horses
just kind of walk on over Dothey naturally run on to the
other side?
Leila Hertzberg (07:30):
So when they first start getting turned out,
yes, they run around like littlecrazies and they've got the
zoomies and we have to watchthat they don't hurt themselves
or the other horses.
Yeah, they don't tend to beaggressive, except in the very
beginning because a lot of timesor the other horses Amish
horses, so ex-Amish horses, whocan be very beat up, abused, bad
eyes, big old knee broken down,big saggy ankles and have a lot
(08:11):
of problems.
And what we do with thosehorses is first just let them be
a horse right.
So personality starts to comeout.
They're very stoic at first andfinally they get to the place
where they can shake their headand maybe roll in the pasture
and oh my God, take a treat fromyour hand because they have not
had that experience before andthey become wonderful companions
(08:33):
.
If they're sound enough theycould have some light riding,
but they're wonderful.
Therapy horses, wow.
Larry Zilliox (08:40):
How many horses do you have at the facility?
Leila Hertzberg (08:43):
So right.
So we tend to have around 15.
They're not all part of therescue, but every horse.
So either my horses one or twoboarders or they're owned by
Lifeline.
Lifeline has limited funds.
We have to turn away some ownerrequests, which is very sad.
We hate to do that but we're ona very small property.
But every horse on the propertyis used in some capacity in the
(09:08):
therapy program, regardless ofits personality, right?
Larry Zilliox (09:13):
And tell us a little bit about the therapy
program itself how it worked.
I know from my own experienceof when Project Horse was around
.
We took all the guest statecoordinators up there and kind
of ran them through the paces sothey understood what the
warriors were going through.
When it comes to abused horses,there was a direct correlation
(09:38):
between their post-traumaticstress and the warrior's
post-traumatic stress and almostvery relatable, between the
animal and the warrior.
And we know and I'm sure a lotof our listeners know that
horses are very intuitiveanimals and they can pick up.
In fact we've seen warriors goout with their family and I've
(10:02):
seen horses single out thewarrior from the rest of the
family.
They knew which one was thewarrior and was akin to them in
that they had issues with PTS,maybe TBI, but the horse could
very quickly pick them out andrelate to them, and the warrior
(10:27):
as well.
Once the warrior recognizedthat the horse was coming up to
them, they bonded very quickly.
I was really, really impressedwith the horse's ability to
recognize what was going on, andso I think these programs are
amazing.
What does your program looklike there at Lifeline Horse
(10:51):
Rescue?
Leila Hertzberg (10:51):
Thanks for asking, larry.
So at Lifeline our program iscalled LETS it's Lifeline Equine
Therapy Services and we offersubsidized therapy,
psychotherapy, life coaching,trauma-informed yoga and a
little bit of therapeuticrecreational riding.
So the EGAL model is allground-based.
It's not about riding horses.
(11:12):
The interaction is all on theground, usually with a loose
horse or horses.
And to start, people call, wedo a little screening to see
what's going on, what they need,how we can help them, and we
usually suggest they start withat least 12 weeks and again
they're not paying for this forveteran service members and
their immediate family weeks andagain they're not paying for
this, and for veteran servicemembers and their immediate
(11:33):
family members.
And so they'll come out andfill out some forms and we'll
sit down.
We'll do a little intro talkhorse safety.
A lot of people have never beenup close and personal with
horses.
Some have used horses back inthe day, at the farm or in a
military way.
So it's a real mixed bag, right.
So to start out, we'll go intospace with the horses.
(11:55):
We have a team, we have thetherapist, the equine specialist
, the client and horse or horses.
So we'll go out into the spaceand we start with really an
observe what is going on.
Because this is an experientialtherapy, it's an alternative
therapy.
It is not like sitting in anoffice talking with a therapist
about your life story.
(12:16):
Doesn't work like that right andthat's one of the beauties,
because we're out in nature.
There might be a hawk goingoverhead.
The barn cats come over, thehorses are are either grazing or
walking or interacting witheach other.
They're, they're moving.
So it's a real life, a reallife situation happening.
The wind might be blowing, soit's more than one horse then.
Larry Zilliox (12:41):
So then do you have some sort of herd dynamic
at play as well?
Leila Hertzberg (12:46):
Yes, that's very important.
So, really, what is the goal isfor the veteran not only just
to relate to a particular horse,which very often happens, but
we tend to not tell them thestory of the horse unless it's
relevant.
We don't even tell them thename, the gender, because it's
more about what the veteran orservice member needs to get and
(13:08):
tell their story and see theirstory.
So they need to see theinteractions, the relationships
between the horses.
So if we have somebody, forinstance, who's struggling with
loneliness, they might look inthe pasture and we say what do
you see out there?
Oh well, I see two, two, two.
They all have somebody.
Huh, unlike me, I have nobodyRight, and so they might we.
(13:33):
So we're looking at and wedon't ask them what do you feel,
what do you, et cetera.
Right, we say what's going onout there?
So it's not a pressure on them.
So what happens is they usemetaphors, what the horses are
doing and interacting with eachother or the environment to
(13:53):
figure out what's going on intheir head.
So very common props would begates, fences, right for
boundaries, horse manure, a bigfat pile on the ground right.
Well, that sums up my life,right there, right, or different
obstacles in the arena, ormounting blocks or things that
(14:14):
they see, and then that's howthey're able to start tell their
story.
Well, we don't create it forthem, it has to come from them.
Larry Zilliox (14:21):
Wow, yeah.
And is this a group therapy oris this one-on-one, or can it be
both?
Leila Hertzberg (14:29):
So we offer both.
We have individual couples,family and groups.
So we tend to have monthlythemed groups and we also have
groups that come fromorganizations.
For instance, we see WalterReed recreational therapy groups
about once a month when theweather's nice.
We have SRU from Fort Belvoircomes.
(14:52):
We have a group from FortDetrick coming, sos, our
survivors group.
So we have a lot of differentgroups.
We're also holding a MarylandNational Guard child and youth
program.
This summer we're going to havea week-long camp that we're
offering at no cost to theNational Guard youth.
Larry Zilliox (15:10):
Wow.
Leila Hertzberg (15:10):
And we're going to very sneakily teach them
resilience and build theirconfidence and teamwork right,
working together by using thehorses and some other activities
at the farm.
Larry Zilliox (15:23):
Well, I'm glad you mentioned it was no cost and
, to be clear, I want ourlisteners to understand that no
cost means to the veteran, theservice member or a family
member.
It doesn't mean that thesethings don't cost Lifeline Horse
Rescue a lot of money.
(15:45):
So the webpage islifelinehorserescueorg.
I want all our listeners to goto the webpage, take a look,
look at all the differentprograms and services they offer
.
Now, this is not specifically aveteran service organization,
so you're not going to find thatdonate button up in the
(16:08):
right-hand corner like you dowith all other VSOs, but it's
there.
There's a row of buttons.
It's in the top row, it's thethird one over.
I want everybody to bang on itand make a donation, whatever
you can a dollar, $5, $100,$1,000.
This is an organization thatneeds your help, and every
(16:31):
dollar goes towards helpingtheir clients.
Now, I'm sure that you do workwith other people than just
veterans.
You know, I think, everybody.
There are a lot of people inthe community that can benefit
from this kind of therapy, forsure, and so please go to the
(16:52):
web page, lifelinehorserescueorg, check it out.
And if you're a veteran who'sin Maryland they're located in
Gaithersburg and you'restruggling with post-traumatic
stress, tbi anger issues, tbianger issues, loneliness.
(17:16):
Check out this program.
I guarantee you that it willeither help you or it won't, but
it won't hurt you.
So there's no reason you can'tsign up for this program or at
least give them a call, talk tothem about it, tell them what
your situation is, and Iguarantee you they're going to
go.
Eh, we've we've had plenty ofveterans like you in here and
(17:37):
you're not all that special.
To be honest with you, there'sa lot of guys and gals out there
that have the same issues youdo and they are reaching out to
organizations just like LifelineHorse Rescue, and they're
getting the help that they need,and there's no reason why you
can't get that help as well.
And while you're on the webpage,look for that Donate button.
(17:59):
It's on the top row, numberthree from the left.
Hit that button and make adonation.
Donate whatever you can.
There's no amount is is notneeded.
Let me tell you when does yourfunding come from?
Is it mostly donations or doyou have any grants that are
coming in?
How much does the communitysupport you?
Leila Hertzberg (18:21):
Well, that's a good question, Larry.
So we've been.
We do have.
We have some support from a fewdonors.
For instance, one racehorsebreeder who's a very kind person
, who gives us a small donationevery year.
We have a private individualwho is military connected, who
(18:42):
is very kind and wants to helpthe horses and the military.
It costs a lot of money tosupport these horses.
We have vet bills sometimes andso.
So basically, a lot of the workis done on a volunteer basis,
but I have to pay my staff oftherapists and equine
(19:03):
specialists, right.
So we have reached out to a lotof grant opportunities and we've
had some state funding.
We have had some federalopportunity, which have been
slashed this year.
So we're definitely in a tightspot, unfortunately, but we're
(19:23):
not going to give up.
We are going to provide service.
We're just going to whatever ittakes, hell or high water,
we're going to make sure wecontinue because we know that
what we do works and our missionis no suicide, right?
That's the bottom line.
So, whether the person hasmoral injury, pts, substance use
, disorder because of all thosethings, military sexual trauma,
(19:48):
whatever it is, we're going tohelp them.
Yes, we could absolutely usedonations.
We probably don't go out thereand say that enough.
Larry Zilliox (19:57):
I'll say it for you LifelineRescueorg, hit that
donate button.
You know, one thing you justmentioned that really hit me was
your vet bills.
So those of our listeners whohave dogs or cats and take your
dog or your cat to the vet,think about the bill that you
get from your dog and cat Now.
(20:19):
Multiply that by the size of ahorse and think of how much
money they need just to stayoperational.
And they take extremely goodcare of these animals.
These are abused animals.
They need a lot of care andthey're providing them with a
(20:40):
quality of life that many ofthese animals had not seen
before.
And so that takes money, ittakes volunteers, it takes time.
Let's talk about volunteers.
A nonprofit needs volunteers.
They're the lifeblood.
I know how it is here.
We have a small staff, buteverything else is done by
(21:01):
volunteers.
If we didn't have volunteers,we wouldn't be in business.
So how can people volunteer andhelp Lifeline Rescue?
Leila Hertzberg (21:11):
Thank you for asking, larry.
We are fortunate.
We have a number of volunteers.
By the way, many happen to beveterans, so whether they were
formerly enlisted or they'reofficers, it doesn't matter.
Everyone is kind of the same atthe farm and everyone who comes
is willing to roll up theirsleeves and sling manure, help
(21:34):
feed horses, carry hay, unloadfeed.
Some have more physicallimitations due to injuries,
sure, so they might help at anoutreach event or they might
locate a funding opportunity.
They might help run our.
In fact, we have an open housecoming up Saturday, may 17th.
(21:56):
So, they might help One for thekids' tables and activities,
something like that.
We can always use volunteers.
Yes, absolutely.
We couldn't do it without them.
Yeah, so true, yeah.
Larry Zilliox (22:08):
And how do volunteers reach out to you?
Leila Hertzberg (22:10):
We have a contact form on the website.
Larry Zilliox (22:13):
Okay.
Leila Hertzberg (22:13):
So that would be the best way and I would be
the one answering, because Iwear a lot of hats.
We only have so much help, soat the moment I'm juggling those
hats like crazy and we'rereally scrambling with the
funding crisis going on rightnow.
But, like I said, we're goingto find a way to make it happen.
But if anyone out there is agrant writer, or has connections
(22:38):
, please let us know.
We're trying to get onto alarger farm one of these days
and in the meantime, we're justtrying to keep our heads above
water and keep offering servicesfor our veterans, service
members and their families.
It's very sad, but we havechildren and spouses who also
are suffering from suicidalideation and we need to serve
(23:02):
them as well.
We need to serve the caregivers.
Caregivers are often overlookedand they're very important.
So, for instance, we have achaplain group coming out.
We're going to serve them.
So we have to look out for thewhole community.
You want to help a veteran,then you need to help the people
around that veteran.
It's very important.
Larry Zilliox (23:21):
The families serve too.
They do, and it sounds likewhat you need is a volunteer to
be a volunteer coordinator.
That'd be amazing.
So there's plenty of roles forvolunteers there, and I want to
specify, too, that it's not allabout carrying big hay bales.
(23:42):
There's people need tocorrespond, answer phones, do
thank you cards, make calls,find grants.
If you're going to donate and Ihope everyone does think about
if your company matchesdonations let them know who
you're donating to.
If you know of a grantsituation where your company is
(24:05):
looking for something to fundespecially if you're employed in
Maryland and you're a Marylandcompany tell them to think about
Lifeline Horse Rescue, becausethis is such a vital service,
and there are 47,000 veteranservice organizations in this
(24:25):
country and many of them aredoing incredible work.
I would categorize yourorganization as one of those,
because what you do saves livesthere's just absolutely no doubt
about it and as a byproduct,you're also saving lives of
horses, which you know next tomonkeys.
(24:49):
Everybody loves horses, monkeys, everybody loves horses, so I
really think this is such agreat organization.
Again, the webpage islifelinehorserescueorg.
Check it out, recommend it, sendthat link to others, to people
(25:10):
that you know.
You got a cousin who lives inMaryland and just got out of the
service, maybe having someissues, send them that link and
say, hey, check this out.
Or you've got some relativeswho live in Maryland near
Gaithersburg and they've gothigh school kids and they've got
to do mandatory volunteerservice.
(25:31):
There's a place that they cando it.
All they got to do is bring theletter and they'll sign off on
it.
And you know, there's so manydifferent ways that you can help
, and so I don't want that to beoverlooked.
But let me ask you this, as wesort of wrap this up what's the
one thing you want our listenersto know, the most important
(25:53):
thing you want them to knowabout Lifeline Horse Rescue?
Leila Hertzberg (25:57):
Thank you, larry.
The most important thing I wantour listeners to know is that
if you're hurting, please reachout for help.
Please don't stay isolated.
Don't think you're the only onesuffering from moral injury or
maybe you don't even know whatmoral injury is, but you can get
help.
You can get better.
(26:18):
If you're in our area, we wouldlove to help you.
Just give us a call.
It couldn't be easier.
We're there for you.
We are a solid community and avery quiet farm.
We can help you.
And don't be afraid to ask forhelp.
It's never too late.
You've got substance use thingsgoing on.
(26:39):
Reach out for help.
We want to help you.
There are people in this worldwho need you.
There is a purpose out therefor you.
So God bless, please, please,don't realize that.
Don't think that there's nohope.
There is hope, and thank you.
Larry Zilliox (26:58):
Well, thank you so much for joining us.
This has been just a great,great episode.
I really appreciate it.
Thank you, larry.
I really appreciate theopportunity.
So, for our listeners, we'llhave another episode next Monday
morning at 0500.
For those of you who'd like toget up bright and early and
listen to podcasts, you can findus on most podcast platforms,
(27:19):
also on YouTube and on WreathsAcross America Radio.
Thanks for listening.
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