EP. 7: Skincare Expert, Sabrina Ehlis, Saves Face From Aging, Acne, Air Pollution, Sun & Screens!

On Episode of 7, ‘We’re Not Blowing Hot Air, we face the facts about keeping our faces healthy and looking fresh with Sabrina Elhis – a leading esthetician, educator, and owner of ‘Sabrina Brow and Skin’ in Minneapolis, Minnesota. A powerhouse in the esthetic industry, Sabrina reveals the skincare essentials every human – young and old, male and female – needs to know to protect and care for the health of the face. Citing current research and science – and even examining institutional barriers holding back important, yet little-known truths – Sabrina breaks down four key products you can use for an effective face care regimen. Learn how to combat damage from the sun, pollution and blue light streaming from your screens, so you feel confident facing your world. All this and more about the essentials of skincare for your face, on ‘We’re Not Blowing Hot Air.’

Subscribe to 'We're Not Blowing Hot Air' wherever you podcast, to elevate your IQ with wellness and business stuff we explore in every episode.

About Sabrina Elhis:

As a woman always in pursuit of the extraordinary, Sabrina is an Advanced Practice Esthetician and Head USA Trainer for Brow Secrets International. She started her career at a premier spa in the Twin Cities where she spent 13 years working in areas of anti-aging, rosacea, and acne. She has also worked for Minneapolis Plastic Surgery where she was trained in chemical peels, dermaplaning, and IPL treatments and other advanced modalities. She loves the healing art of Reiki and infuses that touch into all treatments both creative and clinical. Since 2016, she has had the pleasure of owning Sabrina Brow and Skin, which is located in Minneapolis, Minnesota. Driving her 17+ year career is the passion to give women back their beauty and to empower them with self-confidence to face the world each day.

About Sabrina Brow and Skin:

https://sabrinabrowandskin.com 
@sabrinabrowandskin 
https://www.instagram.com/sabrinabrowandskin

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello and welcome to we're not blowing hot air
powered by oxygen plus I'm Scottand I'm Lauren.
And we're here to help elevateyour IQ on wellness and business
stuff.
That's sometimes misunderstood.
Oh,

Speaker 2 (00:12):
Like recreational oxygen.
Yes.
Let's get smarter with thisweek's guest of we're not
blowing hot air.
What kind of dog did you

Speaker 1 (00:25):
Get?
It's an Aussie doodle And theAussie doodle.
Yeah.
Uh, so you can bring them to Oakplus I can, I can bring the dog

Speaker 2 (00:37):
After they're well-trained uh, we have a dog
policy, friends.
Uh, they have to be a dog andthey have,

Speaker 1 (00:46):
Has to be a dog.

Speaker 2 (00:46):
I can't bring a cat.
It can bring up a hypoallergeniccat, but you can bring a
hypoallergenic dog in if theyare really well trained.

Speaker 1 (00:55):
Yeah.
That that's, that's what we gotto work on, but she is.
So she is a, her name is Luluand she's 11 months old.
Her birthday will be in end ofNovember.
I think it's November 26th.
Oh, double-check that?
But pretty sure that's what itis.
And, uh, and yeah, so I, howdid,

Speaker 2 (01:16):
Why did you pick up a dog that was 11 months old
versus like a new newborn puppy?

Speaker 1 (01:22):
Well, I think it was the right combination of the
type of dog.
We wanted a hypoallergenic dogfor, uh, our household there's
some allergies and stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:34):
Right.

Speaker 1 (01:37):
Um, and so it was the right combination of the type of
dog location.
And also, um, so, so the reasonwas the, the family that had the
dog, they got the dog over COVIDand job situations changed and
things like that.
They just weren't able to putthe attention into the dog,

(01:58):
needed a home.
So yeah, essentially the kidsare head over heels in love.
Um, my two kids are head overheels in love with the dog.
Uh, my wife Lindsay is, is veryhappy and I am, uh, I'm, I'm
happier than I thought I wouldbe.

(02:20):
I had very little time to warmup to the idea of getting a dog
and then suddenly have to warmup to the idea of having the dog
in the house

Speaker 2 (02:31):
And flexible.

Speaker 1 (02:33):
Yes.
Yeah.
It's all about, uh, it's allabout what they wanted and I
will accommodate

Speaker 2 (02:40):
Last year, right.
With me here in the studio.
And, um, and she's prettywell-trained I trained her for
one hour every day, the firstyear of her life,

Speaker 1 (02:50):
An hour, every day.

Speaker 2 (02:51):
And a lot of it was the same thing routine.
Uh, we did a lot of just sittingand waiting.
Uh, she can wait up to have heron four or five minutes with a
treat in front of her pot.
Even if I'm not in the room, shewon't go for it.
Um, it's impulse control, butpotty training's big.
It's the first one.

Speaker 1 (03:09):
Yeah, it's a, it's definitely going to be a
learning curve for me.
You know, I I've never, I'venever had my own dog.
I've lived with dogs before thatwere pretty much already
trained.
Okay.
So I've, I've never had to gothrough that, uh, with a dog
anyway.
Well done it with humans.

Speaker 2 (03:26):
I would've never preached about, uh, like for
instance, I don't have children,so I wouldn't give you like
parents advice, but I do havesplash.
I do have a dog.
So I do have some advice Iwanted to share with you and
really in the form of books, um,the first one is called the dog
listener, the

Speaker 1 (03:43):
Dog listener.

Speaker 2 (03:45):
And so this is a book by Jan Fennell, F E N N E L L.
And I read this book, I found itquite helpful.
Okay.
So the subtitle is learn how tocommunicate with your dog for
willing cooperation.
It's really important.
I like to treat splash like ahuman and equal in the sense of
like, I'm not going to demean ortreat her like an object.

(04:06):
I don't think of myself as anowner.
I consider myself her handlerher custodian and, you know, she
brings so much joy and she's awild animal at heart.
So I just always try to keepthat frame of mind on the dog,
along that line.
Um, there's a book called insideof a dog

Speaker 1 (04:26):
Inside of a dog [inaudible]

Speaker 2 (04:31):
And the subtext of the subtitle is let's read that
too.
Cause yeah, that kid a little

Speaker 1 (04:37):
Inside of a dog, what dogs see, smell and know.
Okay.

Speaker 2 (04:42):
We, we, we do know dogs actually don't see in black
and white, they, there arecertain shades they see better.
So they, they do have color intheir vision.
Um, we do know that that theirnoses are stronger scent.
I think it's like 600 or 6,000.
I don't know, more accurate andmore, um, they can, they can
smell way better than we canessentially.

(05:04):
Right.
So, and then, and then hearingis their second strongest, uh,
sensory information processing.
So sight like us, we're reallysight and then hearing.
So when a dog and a human cometogether, there's a lot of ways
of looking at the world that aredifferent.
And, and so I think you're goingto really, that's, that's an

(05:25):
easy read.
It's a good book.
I mean, it mentions like thereare different types of walks you
can even take with your dog.
Like one is where they get tolead.
Just let them choose where theygo.
And they S and dogs are sosmart.
They will process and understandit.
So I think that's really cool.
And by the way, walking youwalking with your dog is the
most important and singular wayto bond with your dog

Speaker 1 (05:49):
Every

Speaker 2 (05:49):
Day walking.
And so even if it's Lindsay'syour wife's dog or your kid's
dog or whatever, if you reallywant to know how to, how to
really own this dog, you walkwith it and then you can learn
how to walk later and healingand all that.
Yeah.
I think the other most importantthing that a lot of people don't
know about dogs is when you feedthem, make sure that you don't

(06:13):
leave the food dog down longerthan 15 minutes in any feeding
time, really?
Because intuitively they want toknow that you're the one, or
they should be able to know thatyou're the one that provides and
they'll have less anxiety.
So if you fit, even if theydon't eat for three days, by the
third day they're going to eat.
And sometimes it helps them geta sense of feeling at peace and

(06:35):
rest.
So food is really important.
Um, the walking is reallyimportant and if there's ever
other behavioral issues likethey're barking or jumping up on
you also, that probably goesback to do they feel secure?
Do they feel safe?
You know?
So, um, that's, I wanted toshare that with you in this
place, because you have tolisten to me here.

Speaker 1 (06:58):
That's true.
Yes.

Speaker 2 (07:00):
On episode seven of war nap blowing hot air, we face
the facts about keeping ourfaces healthy and looking fresh
with Sabrina alias, a leadingesthetician educator and owner
of Sabrina brow and skin inMinneapolis, Minnesota, a
powerhouse in the aestheticindustry.
Sabrina reveals the skincareessentials, every human young
and old male and female needs toknow to protect and care for the

(07:24):
health of the face, savingcurrent research and science,
and even examining institutionalbarriers, holding back
important, yet little knowntruths.
Sabrina breaks down four keyproducts you can use for an
effective face care regimen.
Learn how to combat damage fromthe sun pollution and blue light
streaming from your screens.
So you feel confident facingyour world, all of this and more

(07:47):
about the essentials of skincarefor your face on we're an app
blowing hot air.

Speaker 1 (07:54):
Welcome to the podcast.
We're so happy to have you.
We're excited.
So you're an esthetician.
Am I saying that correctly?
Esthetician.
All right.
Very

Speaker 3 (08:04):
Good.
Great.
Try

Speaker 1 (08:05):
Spelling it.
Uh, no thanks.
So what is an esthetician?
Exactly.
And how do you become one?

Speaker 3 (08:13):
So an esthetician basically specializes in
skincare.
We study, you know, all of thebiology of the skin, how it
functions, and then we move intohow skincare affects it.
And in the state of Minnesota,you know, each state is
regulated differently.
So in the state of Minnesota,you can be an aesthetician or an

(08:34):
AP aesthetician.
So most people who go to schoolnow come typically come out with
their AP.
So you there's, there are hoursadded to your degree now because
so many estheticians are workingwith doctors and lasers, um,
doing advanced modalities, likeIPL treatments, skin pen, which
I do.

(08:54):
Um, if come out now in the stateof Minnesota with just your
aesthetic license, which I cameout with 25 years ago, um, you
really can just do a facial.
You're not licensed to do anysort of deep exfoliation to the
skin.
You would have a career in aspa.
Um, if you're really seriousabout actually having a career,

(09:15):
you get your AP license.
So then you go on to, um, theschooling that teaches you how
to work with, I think, how towork with lasers, but for sure
how to work with things likedermaplaning where we use the
modified surgical scalpel, um,skin pen.
Micro-needling some, some aretaught the HydraFacial just
depending on where you go.
So there are some advancedmodalities that we're able to do

(09:38):
strictly as estheticians.
If you are working for a doctorin a Medi clinic, or if you have
a medical directorship in yourindividual business,

Speaker 2 (09:48):
How did you get interested in this?
When I think our listeners wouldbe interested in now, how, how
you became an AP licensedaesthetician.

Speaker 3 (09:59):
So as far as, um, so that's, so as far as getting
interested in aesthetics, I wasa child of acne.
So, um, most people whoexperienced acne, no, there are
a few different skin.
Well, several skin conditionsthat are really quite
debilitating, both physicallyand mentally, socially, and acne
is one of them, for sure.

(10:19):
So I was a kid of acne.
And, um, when you are a kid ofacne or even an adult of acne,
you find yourself because a lotof adults start experiencing
acne that have never had itbefore.
And suddenly it's like, what'sgoing on?
Um, you really start looking foranswers.
So you spend a lot of time justlooking for answers.

(10:41):
And when I came along, we didn'thave a lot of answers.
We certainly didn't have, um,the category of skincare that we
have now that can addressdifferent needs.
Um, I was just taken to adermatologist.
He took a comi down, which is ametal extractor.
What I had was primarilynon-inflammatory acting, which
is very grainy and sits underthe skin.

(11:02):
I had some inflammatory stuff asI got older through the, like
the hormonal area of your face,but he would take the comedone
and just literally dig out thelesions in my face.

Speaker 2 (11:14):
Wow.
How long was that treatment?

Speaker 3 (11:17):
Oh, you know, it was throughout my childhood, uh,
through, throughout my teenyears.
Uh, probably ages 12 to 16.

Speaker 2 (11:25):
It must've been really hard.
I mean, well easy.

Speaker 3 (11:30):
That's a layer of difficulty.
Um, and you know, things getsaid to you, kids are not, I
don't want to say kids arecruel.
They, I don't think they knowthey're they don't well, they
are, but they don't know.
Sometimes they just don't knowthe effect that certain things
have.
So things stick with you, youknow, just like one sentence
said to you over a course oftime can, can stick with you.

(11:53):
So I feel, I feel for, of courseI love now as I'm older, the
whole anti-aging category, and Ilove helping women feel
confident in their skin as theyget older.
Um, women feel confident intheir skin as they're beginning
to see aging, you know, in theirthirties.
And, um, and then, you know,kids in younger adults that are
struggling with acne.
I mean, I just love being ableto help them.

Speaker 2 (12:14):
What's your mix of clients between kids with acne
and women, maybe, maybe some mentoo, but women who maybe are
fighting the, they are theeffects of aging.

Speaker 3 (12:25):
Um, I would say that the primary, um, part of my
business is 35 to 55 plus, um,really anti-aging, um, kids, you
know, parents have to take thefirst step.
You know, I do a lot of workwith several kids, um, and the,
the parents that have beenreally on board with bringing

(12:46):
them in every two weeks fortheir treatments, um, and really
purchasing their products whenthey need it and really
communicating with me, it's theparents that are really on
board, that we have a lot ofgreat results with the kids, the
parents that aren't and kidshave to be on board too.
Right.
Because you're dealing with, andeven if it's, especially if it's
boys, but a lot of girls too, Ithink, oh, I forgot to do that.

(13:07):
Oh yeah.
You know, I'm not using thatproduct and, you know, face
reality, which I do work withwhen it comes to acne is very
regimented.
I mean, you have to, I mean,literally that is a brand that
is a brand.
Yes.
Yes.
And they have a 92% success ratewith acne.
So that's pretty incredible.

(13:29):
Um, you, you are asked to signagreements, like really, in
order for me to offer you theresults that you see in the
photos, you have to agree to dowhat I tell you to do.
And the kids that, and parentswho really, really do what we
tell them to do are the onesthat have success.
Cool.
Yeah.
That's really cool.

(13:50):
That's really cool.

Speaker 2 (13:52):
The gap here on your experience becoming, becoming an
esthetician yourself, you gotthrough the teen years, you had
treatments that aren't done asmuch today.

Speaker 3 (14:02):
Not as much today because we have a lot, we have a
lot better products, even pharmahave better products, but, um,
with the, with the skincare linethat I work with face reality,
we take you off of all of yourpharma products.
We won't work with you unlessyou take off, you know, get all
of those things off the table.
Yeah.
So then to finish closing thegap, I, um, went to the

(14:24):
university of Maryland,graduated with a marketing
degree, was interested intextiles, did some work after
college sat behind several desksat the time computers were very
boring.
I just did not do very wellsitting behind a desk and was
always kind of reverting backto, you know, what is the best

(14:46):
eye cream or how does that workor climate came on and came on
the scene and they introducedglycolic acid.
And all of a sudden that waslike a new day in the skincare
world.
And so by the time I was 25, Idecided to go back to school and
I had landed in Minneapolis forpersonal reasons and Aveda was
right down the street.
So I went back to Aveda, uh,just prior to having children

(15:09):
and got my licensing in 1995.
Shouldn't actually give out thatdate.
But that was when it was Horstwas still around.
And his ex wife was teaching.
And of course did not know thatwe had enzymes on the treatment
floor.
That was hilarious.
We had learned from him whatthese enzymes, well, he, he was
so into plant essences and, youknow, Aveda was so natural.

(15:33):
The essence is you can't beat.
Um, some of the formulations arequite hard for certain skins
because you can be very reactiveto things that are very, very
live.
Um, and I'm sure Aveda hasprogressed since then.
I, I'm not educated on itanymore, but, um, enzymes, yes,
they've evolved.
Um, but enzymes and acids, likewe know about the alpha hydroxy

(15:57):
acids and beta acids, they wereall coming on something that is
not in his wheelhouse, correct?
Not in his, well, not, not inhis wheelhouse, but certainly
not in his philosophy.
Right.
So we literally had them on thefloor.
They smelled terrible becausethey were in their, you know,
early forms.
We would have to put essentialoils under the notes for the
clients, not to smell them causethey weren't attractive.

(16:18):
Um, but we hid them from him andI could probably get into
trouble for not anymore.
He's gone, God, rest his soul,

Speaker 2 (16:28):
You just were drawn

Speaker 3 (16:29):
To it.
Just drawn to it.

Speaker 2 (16:33):
Also, you were, you're a researcher.
I know that you love learningand things were popping and you
wanted to see how you get.

Speaker 3 (16:43):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And I did have, um, greatfortune to, uh, when I did go
because I had children fastforward few years when I went
back to work, um, they wereyoung, but I got really lucky to
be hired by a premier salon spain the twin cities and just fell
into a place where I gotincredible, um, education and,

(17:07):
um, spent 13 years there beforeI went out on my own.
And so I really credit myoriginal experience to, um, the
evolution of becoming aprofessional rather than it just
because I think the differencebetween the success for women
and men in the aestheticbusiness is really how you view

(17:27):
what you're doing because youcan, it can just be a job
there's kind of a high failurerate, like in massage therapy,
because it's very, verydifficult to create a career
there's so much competition, butif you view it as a career from
the beginning, it's just, youjust find a different path.
Sure.

Speaker 1 (17:45):
Yeah.
No, that makes sense.
That's awesome.
So you mentioned acne and, uh,you, you briefly mentioned like
anti-aging and things like that.
So I think those would be thethings that kind of come up the
most that people think aboutlike skincare is kind of more
like reactive, but like who, whocan really all benefit from some

(18:05):
sort of skincare regimen or, orapproaching it?

Speaker 3 (18:07):
Sure.
Everyone, okay.
Everyone, we all have skin.
That's true.
You know, we all have skin.
It is our largest organ.
It's our first line of defense,uh, for the outside environments
, why we were given it.
Um, and it has a life of itsown.
So it really just depends.
Just basic care is essentialbecause as we get older, it does

(18:33):
break down and as it breaksdown, it does emit a level of
inflammation.
So if you were talking about thebody in general, um, it's just
great to stay hydrated all thetime, especially as you get
older.
And then the question is whatconcerns you, you know, I may
look at someone it's kind oflike going into see, never going

(18:53):
to see a plastic surgeon andsay, what would you do to me?
Because they're going to tellyou a whole bunch of stuff they
would do to you.
And you're going to walk outfeeling like, oh, well I just
like, didn't like this lineright here.
Do you know what I mean?
So never, um, never just goingand ask someone like I might
look at you and think, okay,well this is what I would fix,

(19:14):
but that doesn't matter whatmatters is what you want fixed.
So it's really important.
Even when we have a client landour table to say, what are your
concerns?
Because my concern may not beyour concern.
You know, my concern may be thatyou're significantly dehydrated.
You're looking 10 years olderbecause you are, but your

(19:35):
concern may just be this brownspot that's sitting on your
cheek and that's all you careabout.

Speaker 2 (19:40):
That's very kind approach to the beauty industry.
I really liked that Sabrina.
Um, well you said everybodymeans skincare regimen.
Could we focus on the facetoday?
Sure.
Showing our beautiful faces onour YouTube.
Hi.

Speaker 3 (19:58):
Hello.
We're glowing.

Speaker 2 (20:00):
What's the most basic essential products for the face
that all of us need.

Speaker 3 (20:05):
The most basic essential products are a
cleanser, the vitamin C serum, amoisturizer and a sunscreen.
That's it?
I mean, you can build fromthere.

Speaker 1 (20:15):
Maybe what we could do is just like walk through
each one.
Sure.
Like what are the benefits?
And, and what's the, what's theproper order and all of that.

Speaker 3 (20:22):
Okay.
So I think I set it in theproper order to begin with.
So then you would cleanse, youwould put your vitamin C on
first clean dry skin.
Um, typically a vitamin C is aliquid serum, which means its
molecular weight is smaller andit drives deeper into the skin.
So from a common senseperspective, you wouldn't want

(20:43):
to put a cream on, which is alarger molecular weight and then
try to get something that'ssmaller through it.
So liquids always go on first.
Uh, in some cases you can haveone or more serums that you use,
but your vitamin C always goeson first.
It's the most important then youwould moisturize and then you
would put your sunscreen on.
So sunscreens should go on lastsunscreens, go on last in that

(21:08):
lineup.
After a moisturizer, you reallywant your moisturizer to drive
deep into the skin.
Your sunscreen is really meantto sit on the top of your face.
Some ingredients, depending uponwhether you're dealing with
chemical or physical or absorbedslightly into the skin, but
they're not meant to drivedeeper in and repair the skin,

(21:28):
which is what your moisturizeris meant to do then for women
and men, if that's what youchoose to do.
And we put makeup on, um, thatgoes on absolutely last, right?
Because you, that's more of anaesthetic, uh, application of
something.
It's not a functionalapplication.
Although some foundations havesome functional characteristics.

(21:52):
I typically think of that asjust an aesthetic application.
Okay.

Speaker 2 (21:57):
So, and that's

Speaker 3 (21:57):
For the morning, that's for the morning, night,
night is a lot, is a lot easierif you're not adding any other
types of serums or going downany other avenues, um, for
anti-aging and or treatments.
So you would simply cleanse andmoisturize to pretty easy for

Speaker 2 (22:14):
Things in the morning to at night, correct?

Speaker 3 (22:17):
It's not so bad.

Speaker 2 (22:19):
I timed myself this morning.
Do you know any guesses?
How long it took me?

Speaker 3 (22:24):
Well, did you let your vitamin C absorbed for just
a few minutes?
So then it took less than aminute.
Now it took

Speaker 2 (22:31):
Me four,

Speaker 3 (22:32):
Four minutes.
Oh, cause you cleanse cleansinghas to be okay.

Speaker 2 (22:35):
I cleanse.
And also I had a new washcloththat kinda got filled, like had
a little pills

Speaker 3 (22:39):
Coming off.
So you had a little extra workto do

Speaker 2 (22:42):
So I,

Speaker 3 (22:44):
You should Clint.
I'm glad, actually glad you saidthat, because that reminds me
that you should cleanse for 60seconds, so okay.

Speaker 2 (22:53):
And I want to dig deeper into cleansy.
Sure.
Okay.
That's good.
Let's go.
Okay.
Let's

Speaker 3 (22:58):
Talk about cleansing day and night.

Speaker 1 (23:00):
60 seconds.
What are you doing in that 60seconds?
Doesn't seem like a very longtime, but I think when you're
doing it, it probably,

Speaker 3 (23:06):
It does trust me.
It does because there have beenlike cleansing tools in the
past.
Clarisonic was one that had thelittle soft brushes, which for
whatever reason is no longerwith us and it would lit it
would be timed for 60 seconds.
So it would shut off after 60seconds and it really was.
You're sitting there and look, II'm human too.
It's like, okay, let's can weget this over with, when is it

(23:27):
going to be done?
The reason for cleansing for 60seconds is because if you go in
and just cleanse for a fewseconds and rents, there is so
much microscopic dirt and debrisleft on the skin that you don't
get because you don't know.
So by increasing the time andhaving kind of the standard, um,

(23:48):
of seconds or minutes that youshould be cleansing, you're
giving yourself the opportunityto really remove more dirt and
debris.
And that's just without any likea washcloth or a correct or a
little silicone vibratingcleanser, there are some of
those as well, your fingers andyou just sure.
Massage.
Sure, sure, sure, sure.

(24:10):
Okay.
You want to do your neck to neckconnect to um, so and beards.

Speaker 1 (24:18):
Yeah.
So you can wash your facethrough the beard.
Is that of

Speaker 3 (24:21):
Course.
I mean, you kind of have to getyour fingers in there, not like
fingernails, but you really gotto get in there and do some
massaging because, um, there wasa study that came out and I, I'm
not going to quote any facts.
I'm just going to tell you thatbeards collect bacteria.
That doesn't mean they're notattractive that we don't love
them, but they

Speaker 1 (24:41):
Theory on my face right now.

Speaker 3 (24:43):
Well, it depends on how well you cleanse.
I mean, if you get into theshower and you use, let's say
the, the hair soap that you useis not necessarily good for the
skin of your face, like shampoo,right.
But whatever you're using tocleanse your face with, you need
to really get in there andcleanse your

Speaker 1 (24:57):
Like, if like, if I had a beard shampoo, I should
really just get in there and getafter it with the three day.

Speaker 3 (25:05):
Okay.
Every day.
Ooh.
Is there.
Cause if there's not, let's getto work beard poop.

Speaker 1 (25:13):
I have some somewhere, I think it's a beard
wash.
You know, there's like a, somesort of, I think it's like a
shampoo of some type for, for

Speaker 3 (25:22):
Beards.
For

Speaker 1 (25:23):
Your beer.
Yeah.
Okay.
Bacteria.
That's, that's good to know.
That's very informative andterrifying

Speaker 3 (25:29):
Remove that stuff.
And you are investing in higherquality or even just other
skincare products.
They're not performingeffectively.
The efficacy rate goes down verylow.
If it's trying to get throughdead skin, it's trying to get
through bacteria.
It's trying to get through sweatbum.
It's just not, it's not gettingabsorbed properly to get the

(25:50):
best results from makes sense.
So you would cleanse in the, atnight, let's start with at
night, first you'd cleanse atnight first because the
assumption is made that first ofall, you've left your home,
which didn't actually happenduring COVID.
But indoor pollution is a wholeother category, which we might,
we might, um, top touch.

(26:10):
Um, but you've collectedbacteria.
You've collected dirt, sebumpollution, sweat.
Um, you've put on sunscreenhopefully, which can be clogged,
pore, clogging.
If you don't cleanse it off.
I mean, typically all of us areable to find, um, sunscreens
that work for us and, um, makeupfor gowns or other human beings.

(26:34):
And um, you want to get rid ofthat because if you don't get
rid of that, first of all, it'sgoing to age your skin
exponentially.
Um, I heard this fact once and Iwish I could say this was
absolutely true, but I tend toread these things and they stick
in my mind and I read somewherealong the line that for every,

(26:54):
every night that you don't washyour face, like in particular
for a female, like makeup,everything off of your skin,
your face, your skin ages sevendays.

Speaker 1 (27:05):
That's what, yeah.

Speaker 3 (27:08):
So that explains a lot because you're harboring
well, and it does make sense.

Speaker 1 (27:13):
I don't wash my face at night.

Speaker 3 (27:17):
Well, no, no, no.
This is just in general becauseyou're collecting pollution,
dirt debris, um, exhaust dieselparticulates, you're collecting,
I mean just all kinds of stuffduring the day on your skin.
And so if you aren't cleansingthat off, all of those things
are contributory factors to lossof elasticity, loss of college
and hyperpigmentation, justpremature aging in general.

(27:40):
So cleansing your face at night.
It's very, very important.
Yeah.
So then people will say, andI've read where doctors have
said, you don't have to washyour face in the morning, but
it's interesting because withcomplete respect to all
dermatologists, et cetera outthere, um, they deal a lot with
chronic or acute conditions,right?

(28:00):
Like you come in, something'shappened to your face.
How do I fix it?
And typically they prescribe amedication, you know, and thank
God they have, we havemedications to prescribe if you
need them.
But from the day-to-day workingsof the skin, that's not really
what dermatologists deal with.
So I say, you have to wash yourface in the morning and most, I
don't know, one esthetician thatwouldn't tell you to wash your

(28:22):
face in the morning becauseyou've gone through
detoxification overnight.
Uh, your circadian rhythms, there recharging process of your
body, the repair process of yourbody.
There's excrete, excretion oftoxins.
During that process, bacteriacould collect you're laying on a
pillow where there are dustmites.
I mean, no matter how much youclean, you can't, but we live

(28:44):
with those things.
I try to block them out.
We have a microbiome, you know,we're supposed to be living with
those things.
We just, unless you're allergic,which it can be a big challenge.
Um, but we're living withmicroscopic bacteria all the
time.
And you know, a lot of it isgood and a lot of it is bad, but
you know, if you're going to getup in the morning and put on

(29:04):
your vitamin C serum andproducts that you have spent
good money on, um, whatever yourbudget is, then you want them to
perform properly and they're notgoing to perform properly.
If you don't prime your face,like just forget all of the
other reasons.
If you don't prime your face tothen put on those gorgeous
products in the morning, thenyou're wasting your money.

Speaker 1 (29:28):
Yeah.
Yeah.
That makes sense.
Okay.
So are you convinced Scott?
Um, we're getting there.
Yeah, it's very, yes.

Speaker 3 (29:39):
I mean, we're hearing mustache old wash the upper
two-thirds

Speaker 1 (29:43):
As well.
Go all the way and neck and theneck.
Yeah.
Okay.
Well, so at that, all of that,yeah, it definitely makes sense.
I mean, when you talk about allof those different things we can
accumulate.
So, but how about the thing thatI did not know existed?
The vitamin C serum?
How, what, what benefit doesthat give?

Speaker 3 (30:03):
So vitamin C we know is an antioxidant.
It exists in nature to donateit's electrons anti-oxidants
exist in nature to donate it'stheir electrons to stabilize
free radicals, free radicals arewhat causes cellular damage and
free radicals.
Like we make on a great day.
Like, let's say you have a daywhere you've eaten properly.

(30:26):
You haven't drank coffee, didn'thave your evening wine.
You exercise, you got greatoxygen because you had your
product from OTU.
You're like total, like thepicture of perfect health.
You have still been hit by atleast 10,000 free radicals
because you can't avoid them.

(30:46):
They're in exhausts, they're inpollution.
They're in, when you ignite yourstove to cook free radicals,
come out.
So it doesn't, I mean, that'swhy we have to do all of those
good things because we'reconstantly neutralizing cancers
in our body.
Like constantly just getting ridof them.
Um, so vitamin C, when you, soyou people will say, well, why

(31:08):
don't I just take vitamin C?
I can, I can take it in themorning.
I can go to Walgreens and get asupplement.
Well, a whole other conversationis the quality of your
supplements, right?
So that's for another day.
Um, but you can do that, but youyou're probably getting poor
quality vitamin C like fish oils, very poor quality.
Um, but when you ingestsomething, your skin, even

(31:30):
though it is your largest organand your first line of defense,
it's your last organ of priorityfor your body.
So anything you ingest getsdistributed to other things
before your skin sees it assurvival, correct?
Mindset, not as important,right?
It's not as crucial as yourheart.

(31:51):
It's not, especially if you'renot cut open.
Like if you're like cut open,well, everything, you know, all
hands on deck, right?
Everything's coming forward to,to heal that, but it's not
important if you're not injured.
So even when you're drinkingtons and tons of water, which is
really important, you'reactually just flushing the
system.
You're not necessarily hydratingthe system.

(32:14):
So some meaning for your skin,obviously you're hydrating your
kidneys and you know, your, yourorgans, but it's not getting to
your skin as much.
So vitamin C works, uh, if it'sformulated properly, I mean,
there's a lot of history ofvitamin C.
It took, it took a lot of workto even stabilize vitamin C to
put it into a suspension thatcould then be put on the skin

(32:38):
and actually breach the skincell wall, which is hard to do.
So that's the serum, correct?

Speaker 1 (32:49):
I don't, I don't know.

Speaker 3 (32:53):
Right.
That's what that looks like.
Sure.
So a serum, there's lots ofdifferent types of serums now.
I mean, there's all kinds ofchemistry in serums.
They're encapsulated in lipidzones so that they release
slowly, but typically they'reliquid.
There can be some serums thatlook like creams, but, but the
molecular weight is small.

(33:15):
So they're liquid.
Typically you're either droppingthem on and rubbing them in, or
you do just a pump and kind ofmove it around your face really
quickly.
Um, but there are smallermolecular weight.
They drive deeper into the skinand they typically, depending on
what they are, vitamin C is alittle bit exclusive from this
statement.
But like, let's say it's ahyaluronic acid, or it increases

(33:36):
the efficacy, say of yourmoisturizer by three times
because it takes those sameactive ingredients and drives
them deeper into the skin than acream can get them into the
skin.
Sure.
Okay.
Vitamin C really kind of standsalone in a category all by
itself because it is a freeradical fighter.
And it is in when formulatedproperly, it goes into the skin.

(33:58):
It, it gets past the skin cellwall and it builds up a
reservoir.
So it builds up a reservoir inthe skin cells.
So typically it will take 72hours once you're at a hundred
percent, which takes about threedays, it will slowly metabolize
out of the system as it isthrowing those electrons and
neutralizing free radicals.

(34:19):
So after three days, you're atzero, that does not mean you can
apply your vitamin C every thirdday and save some money.
I mean, that's

Speaker 1 (34:30):
Where my brain would go for three days.

Speaker 3 (34:33):
You can, you can.
I mean, in all fairness you can,but you're never at a hundred
percent, so you're never fullyprotected to the extent that it
can protect you.
So, um, so vitamin C, no matterwhat type of sunscreen you put
on, we talked about this theother day.
Um, you can only block about 55%of the sun's rays.

(34:53):
So even with a great sunscreen,you're still absorbing UV light.
So the UV light that gets pastyour sunscreen can get arrested
by your vitamin C.
So it's like your insurancepolicy.
So technically they worktogether synergistically as, as
partners.
Oh,

Speaker 1 (35:11):
Okay.
Great.
Well, I mean, okay.
Yeah.
So that those, all those twothings being part of the daily,

Speaker 3 (35:18):
So there's a bonus, there's a bonus.
So the reason why, and Iapologize, I started to
interrupt you.
The reason why vitamin C is soessential is number one first
and foremost, it helps toprevent skin cancer.
I'm not saying it prevents skincancer, but it fights that good
fight.
Um, it can also neutralizesunburned skin cells.

(35:38):
So if you find a site you've gota sunburn, you can use your
vitamin C serum to startneutralizing those sunburn cells
that are just screaming becausethey now are in trouble.
Um, but there are anti-agingbenefits.
So it's kind of like, I alwaystell my clients, it's like one
stop shop for anti-aging becauseit lightens hyperpigmentation.
It does over time, reduce finelines.

(36:00):
It evens out tone helps withtexture.
It reinforces capillary wallsfor people say, who have
rosacea, where you have thatflushing, or you have like the
tiny, tiny veins, which we call[inaudible].
Um, and it turns over skin cellsbecause it is, it is an acid.
So it, it does like all of thesethings for you, but it's not,

(36:22):
this is the other thing too,because if you, if you talk
about where to, to start talkingabout Sierra retinol or retinae,
which that's very, very fast,right?
It starts to work very, veryquickly, but your vitamin C is
like the turtle, you know, theturtle and the hair, the turtle
wins in the end.
I mean, it's just like slow andsteady wins the race, you know,
it's great.
And if you, and it's never toosoon to start 20, you can start

(36:45):
vitamin C and, and it's hard toexplain this to someone who's
20, but 10, 15 years down theroad, you're going to appreciate
what your skin looks like,because that is the one thing
you've put your money into allalong.
Yeah.
It does so many things.

Speaker 2 (37:02):
I didn't know most of that.
That's amazing.
Yeah.
That's a lot.
Did it?
Cause you told me to do it now.
I know.
Yeah.
Really cool.
See serum.
Yeah.
Okay.
It's important.
All right.
Well, I want to, I want to getto the other important ones.
Scott, do you remember the thirdone?

(37:25):
Good thing.
I took notes

Speaker 3 (37:27):
Moisturizer.
Yeah.
So moisturizer is, I mean, it'ssuper simple and super
essential.
I mean, moisturizer, there's aplethora of creams out there.
You can pick anything you wantto pick and they all have
different ingredients, but themost important thing is
hydrating the skin and ahydrated skin, actually just
hydrated skin ages,significantly better than a skin

(37:49):
that is never hydrated becausewhen that natural barrier
function of the skin, which isyour natural moisture barrier,
um, is broken down andcompromised.
Everything goes down really?
Yeah.
Flatline show up very, veryquickly.
You open yourself up to, um,environmental damage much, much

(38:12):
quicker.
So moisturizers just simple.
It's like, keep it simple.
Stupid.

Speaker 2 (38:18):
Yeah.
Nice.
Okay.
I remember at one point therewas a moisturizer that you
recommended the head upanti-pollution well, how does
pollution in general affect theface and how does moisturizer
help of any kind or maybe otherkinds of pollution?
Right.

Speaker 3 (38:35):
So when you talk about the category of pollution,
it's there aren't subcategories.
So there's outdoor air pollutionand indoor air pollution.
And in the scientific world,they have actually found that
indoor pollution is actually300% more dangerous than outdoor
pollution.
Doesn't mean they're not both,you know, notable, um, but

(38:57):
indoor air pollution, first ofall, it's compressed, right?
Because you're, you know,typically we're either a seeing
or we're heating depending onwhere you live and you've got,
um, pet dander, you've gotpossibly mold, you've got
chemicals from your, uh,draperies, your carpets, your
furniture you have, when youignite your stove, you have the

(39:20):
gas that comes out from that.
Um, so there's um, um, uh, dustmites, et cetera.
There's just a sea and I mean,considered pollution.
Yes.
Okay.
Yes.
In general.
Well, in general, in general,because every single year there
are in the two separatecategories of indoor and outdoor

(39:41):
pollution, there are a fewmillion premature deaths.
Now, when it comes to outdoorair pollution, the Asian
continent kind of, uh, takes themajority brunt hit of that.
But the indoor air pollution isjust kind of everywhere.
And then, you know, you couldget into the category of radon,
which has become pretty big nowbecause that comes up through

(40:03):
the earth, into your home.
Now it could be a problem ornot.
You have to test for that, butit's considered radiation,
right?
So you're, you know, you'reexposed to all of these things
that are compressed within yourhome and they take a toll and
effect on your skin and show up,uh, the same way premature aging
does, um, hyperpigmentation lossof elastin, loss of collagen

(40:25):
laxity.
Yeah.
You're saying it acceleratesaging and moisturizing your face
make help.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
So, um, vitamin C helps becauseit's that because there are free
radicals, that's what, anytimeyou think about aging, think
free radicals because that's,what's happening.
90% of the aging that happens toyou throughout your lifetime has

(40:50):
historically been from the sun.
Right.
But now we understand theeffects of pollution and we're
beginning to understand theeffects of what's called let's
see, what was it called?
High visible energy AGV, HPE,which is the blue light that
comes from all of your devices.
So it's all like in one, thinkof it like all in one category,

(41:12):
if that makes sense.
Like, and then we have thisgeneration coming up that has
spent so much time on theirdevices, you know, like up to
four hours a day.
And the average is three and ahalf hours a day.
The top 20% is four, four plushours a day on a device.
We check our phones an averageof 150 times a day.
So we're constantly exposed.

(41:35):
Um, now there's an easy fix forthat because you can put a blue
light shield.
You can either put anapplication on your device or
you can get the shields.
So that helps significantly.
But your vitamin C's help withthat because again, they're
fighting free radicals.
Um, moisturizing helps becausewhen the natural moisture
facture factor is deplenish orcompromised, then you're just

(41:56):
opening yourself up.
Um, uh, diet ingesting, a lot ofantioxidants, you know, kind of
the things that we always hearstaying away from sugar, you
know, eating a whole vegetables,whole foods maybe, or maybe not
eating whole grains depending onwhat you choose to do with your
diet.
Um, so a lot of stuff, a lot ofthat stuff helps with like the

(42:19):
indoor air pollutions.
Um, but it helps witheverything.
It's, it's, it's all doing thesame thing.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (42:26):
Wow.
Amazing.
So blue light is bad for yourskin.
We know we hear a lot of howit's bad for your eyes and how
it affects your brain and oursleep and, you know, different
things.

Speaker 3 (42:36):
It penetrates deeper than both UVN, UV lights really
deeper into.
Sure.
Yeah.
Sure, sure.
So there's UVA and there's UVB.
There's also UVC.
UVC causes like kills youimmediately.
And that is that's filtered outby our ozone layer.
UVC is cancer.

(42:58):
That's the word, UVA and UVB.
Um, the UBB burn, they don'tpenetrate as deeply as UVA does
UVA penetrates much deeper intothe skin.
And we now know UVB causesburning UVA causes aging.
UVA also is responsible.

(43:18):
They are, I think that's wherethey came from to be on, as we,
as we figured out what they did,right.
UVB aging, UVB burning.
Right, right, right.
So, uh, UVB does not penetrateas deeply UVA penetrates deeper
penetrates through glass, whichwe did not know at one point, um

(43:41):
, we know now and windows andsuch can be treated for UV
filtration.
Um, UV B is frenetic.
So depending upon the tilt ofthe earth and the season in the
winter, UVB typically is not aspresent.
So you're not as at higher riskto burn in the winter as you are

(44:02):
in the summer, but UVA is stillpresent 60 to 70% year round.
They're not, it's not freneticbecause it has such a longer
reach.
So that's why you should wearsunscreen in the winter.
And on a cloudy day, you thinkyou're not being exposed.
You have the sense of security,but 80% of the UVA rays are

(44:24):
present on a cloudy day.
So it's very, very important towear sunscreen 365 days a year.

Speaker 2 (44:31):
And wow.
And so that's the fourth, that'sthe fourth, that's the fourth

Speaker 3 (44:35):
Regimen.
Correct.

Speaker 1 (44:38):
And I think, you know, I I'm really interested in
the sunscreen part because Ithink maybe I'm wrong on this,
but I think it's the one thingthat most people can, will use.
And, and they think they knowcertain things about sunscreens
may or may not be correct, butit's kind of the one thing that
everybody can kind of relate to.
I think more so than maybe theother three elements.

(45:00):
So why is the sunscreenimportant?

Speaker 3 (45:02):
Well, it's the most important beauty cream in your
skincare cabinet in yourbathroom?
Um, it gets used for all agesstarting quite young.
Um, it helps to absolutelyprevent premature aging and it
helps to prevent skin cancer.
So that's why it's superimportant.

Speaker 2 (45:21):
And everyone, if they had to pick one, would that be
the one?
Yes.

Speaker 3 (45:25):
Okay.
You have to pick one for, well,you should pick four for you
should, you should pick four andyou should put your money.
You should understand that youare going to put the majority of
your money, um, in your vitaminC serum because it has to be
formulated properly to do whatit says it's going to do.

Speaker 2 (45:43):
If I go to the store and buy any, can I, can, I
dependably grab any sunscreenoff the shelf of a random store
and use it for my body is Iguess, different than the phase.
Maybe I can't use sunscreen thaton my body, on my face.

Speaker 3 (45:58):
Well, so the answer to that question is a little bit
complicated because first ofall, you want your sunscreen to
be broad spectrum.
So if your sunscreen meaning itcovers the UVA and UVB spectrum
fully and some don't, well, somedo not.
So there's, there's a little bitof confusion in that area
because you can have an SPF 15,which is low in my opinion, but

(46:22):
it is broad spectrum.
Or you can get an SPF 50, whichis not broad spectrum, and it's
going to give you lessprotection than the SPF 15.
So it's more, it's more alongthe lines of the consumer, just
not, not knowing what to lookfor.
So you really have to look forfirst of all, just on the
labeling, it should say broadspectrum and then a sunscreen

(46:44):
can be physical or chemical.
And physical means typically itis, well, it is titanium dioxide
or zinc, zinc oxide.
Now in the past, both of thosehave been completely inelegant
mean.
You remember lifeguards with thewhite noses?
Yeah.
So what has happened through theyears, skincare companies in

(47:06):
particular, um, likepharmaceutical skincare
companies have developedformulations to micronize it,
which means they make it very,very, very small and they
encapsulate it.
So it sits, it sits on the facekind of microscopically.
So they've made them a lot moreelegant.

(47:27):
Now chemical sunscreens can bemade very elegant because they,
they absorb a little bit intothe skin because zinc one is
that that's not chemical.
Those are physical, those arephysical sun screens.
Okay.
And then you have chemical.
And a lot of times you'll find alittle bit of both in a

(47:49):
formulation.
You can find formulations now.
Um, you just have to read theback of the bottle.
Don't just go and grab asunscreen, read the back of the
bottle.
If you're someone who either hasa sensitivity to chemical
ingredients, because you candevelop sensitivities to the
chemicals that are used, eventhough the FDA has said that

(48:09):
they are safe, um, you would belooking for a physical
sunscreen.
So you would really want to lookat the back of the packaging and
see, okay, this is a sunscreen,that's all physical.
They're a little harder to findif you're, if you're not wanting
to spend a bit of money, becauseyou're looking for those
formulations that are justsimply more expensive to do.

(48:29):
Um, the chemical sunscreenseffectively absorb radiation
into the sow.
So a physical sunscreen bouncesit off your skin.
So it just retracts.
It just bounces it back.
A chemical sunscreen absorbs theenergy into the skin, turns it
into heat and then releases it.

(48:50):
So they just act differently.
And it depends on your level ofcomfort with a chemical because
physical, full physical areoptions.
Um, and it depends on your levelof sensitivity.

Speaker 1 (49:03):
Interesting.

Speaker 3 (49:06):
Both work, both work.

Speaker 1 (49:09):
Am I feel free to tell me I'm doing it wrong?
Sure.
So I am fair-skinned I seem toburn easily.
So I usually stick with like a,at least an SPF 30.
I don't like putting on like anSPF 30 cream sunscreen because
it just takes a long time tokind of like rub it in and have
it not like white and you know,that kind of thing.

(49:32):
So I'm going, and I'm grabbingthat spray, SPF 30.
I'm spraying it on.
I'm doing a quick rub in, isthat, is it working?
Is it okay

Speaker 3 (49:43):
For sure it's working.
I mean, the FDA has deemed themto be effective and safe.
Okay.
I mean, there is some formulate,not formulations, but
modalities, modalities.
I don't know if that's a wordthat I'm looking for, but, um,
they've, they've tried to makelittle towelettes or wipes that
have SPF fifteens or whatever,SPF thirties or fifties in them.
And the FDA hasn't really saidthat that's an effective way of

(50:04):
applying a sunscreen.
So there are some that they havebeen trying to make, but the FDA
has not approved, but like yourgels, your sprays, your creams,
your sticks, the FDA hasapproved all of those.

Speaker 1 (50:16):
So it's effective.
It's

Speaker 3 (50:17):
Effective typically they're chemical based.
Okay.
So it's just important to knowthat.
Okay,

Speaker 1 (50:23):
Got it.
Got it.
So it wouldn't.
So, and if I was listening, it'schemical base, so the sun, the
rays are actually absorbing intothe skin and it's processing and
kicking it out.
Correct.
Rather than bouncing it off,like correct.
Like a zinc oxide would be morelike that cream that really
like, you know, hard to rub in.

Speaker 3 (50:44):
Well, it depends on, it depends on, you know, the
products.
It depends on how, you know, howelegant the products are and,
um, most will rub in.
It's just a little bit of extraeffort.
Just takes a little

Speaker 1 (50:55):
Extra work,

Speaker 3 (50:56):
Get a little help, Get a little help.

Speaker 1 (51:03):
Pardon me?

Speaker 2 (51:06):
Well, I going back to more of the face and sunscreen.
Sure.
What is the typical or thesuggested apple re application?
How many times in the morning Iput it on my,

Speaker 3 (51:18):
Okay.
So, um, first of all, youshould, we should talk about how
much oh yeah, because SPF are.
So in other words, if you're, ifyou're using an SPF 50, it
doesn't mean you're safe for 50minutes.
It means that in the typicalamount of time that it takes you
to burn for some people thatcould be five minutes for some

(51:39):
people that could be 15,whatever 25, depending on your
Fitzpatrick, how dark you are,how much melanin you have in
your skin, how light you are,how much you don't have in your
skin, um, for protectionpurposes.
So it means that that amount oftime, times 50 is how long it
will protect you for typicallyno time.

(52:04):
Right?
So, so that's how SPF istypically or 15, 15 times that
amount of time.
Does that make sense?
So then, but on the other hand,there is the, the idea that the
sunscreen itself is photolabial.
So it will break down in thepresence of UV radio or UV

(52:25):
light.
So which means it's working,right?
It's like putting gas in yourcar.
So you put on your sunscreen,you get it all applied.
You have to wait.
It's 15 minutes before it's eveneffective.
So you have to wait 15 minutes.
So a lot of people go out at thepool and they're applying their
sunscreen.
I've done it.
It's still 15 minutes beforeit's even effective.

(52:47):
Then the recommended amount oftime is two hours for
reapplication.
But estheticians typicallyrecommend 90 minutes because at
two hours you're out of gas.
So if you do 90 minutes, you're,you're covering that gap.
Like you're stopping the gap.
And this is for my morning, facenote, we're going to get there.
We're going to get there.

(53:08):
Yes.
Sorry.
We're going to get there.
All right.
So with your more, it depends onyour level of activity during
the day.
So if you put on your sunscreenthis morning and we're in this
office and you're here all dayand you leave your sunscreen
should still work for youbecause it's not about the time
it's about the level of activityyour sunscreen has had to do.

(53:31):
Like how much gas have you usedwhen you leave here?
Well, none so far, becauseyou're not sitting in front of
UV lights, you could get intoreally extrapolating, um, all of
the information and say, well,but you are sitting in front of
blue light here.
So, so some of you are so right.
So some of your, so some of yoursunscreen is being used because

(53:53):
you're absorbing some UV lights,right.
But you know, it's not as much.
So your sunscreen, when youleave here this afternoon, or if
you pop out for lunch and youcome back, your sunscreen should
still be working for you.
The beautiful thing is that, um,companies have begun to develop,
uh, is clinical mix, a beautifulone, which actually was so

(54:14):
awesome.
It's sold out.
I haven't been able to get itback in and they made it in a
variety of tones.
I didn't get one.
I know.
Right?
Um, it's coming, it's a powder.
So you can during mid day.
So you're not going to wash yourface mid day.
You're not going to redo yourmakeup.
And you certainly don't want toput sunscreen over your makeup.

(54:35):
So midday, you could pull yourpowder out of your purse and you
could shake out some powder and,you know, give yourself a nice
dusting.
And then you're reapplying inSPF 40 I'm in love with.
So that's really cool.
Does it get urines?
So the beautiful thing is thathis beard offers him great UV
protection on that part of hisface.

(54:57):
That's why we have hair otherthan to keep warm as well.
Right.
Because we would probably diefrom melanoma if we had no hair,
no hair.
And we'd also be really cold inthe winter.
Yeah.
Um, yeah.
So your skin has some naturalprotection because you have it
covered with hair.
Great.
But the rest could be coveredwith all

Speaker 1 (55:17):
Going to look real young someday, shave

Speaker 3 (55:20):
It off or wrinkles up here.
Well, I suppose it could, I'venever seen that.
That would be an interestingcase study lifetime of having
I'll check back in with you in40 years.
Hopefully I'll still be around,um, good skincare rights.
Um, so then there's the amount.

(55:40):
Okay.
Real quick.
So for the entire body, it'sabout a shot glass full.
If you think about it as theparts of your body, it's a half
a teaspoon for each part of yourbody for your face.
It includes your face and neck.
So, so here's the, here's thecatch there.
Typically people do not applyenough sunscreen.

(56:02):
Sorry.
So if you haven't applied enoughsunscreen, you're not getting
the true SPF.
That's another reason too, toshorten that gap for the
reapplication time, right?
Because you probably haven'treally applied a 50 and you're
probably not going to take yourelegant sunscreen that we

(56:22):
purchased from a nice company,has a little tint in it and put
on a whole half teaspoon.
That's a lot, you'd be likerubbing, rubbing, rubbing,
rubbing.
So, so you have to be also awareof actually how much have you
put on because that affects theF SPF, the SPF half teaspoon is
the goal for the face.

(56:43):
Yes.
The face and neck.
And you could include thedecolletage in that, like the
chest, your chest here chest.
Yes.
So that could be that's ticket.
That's typically the entireface.
Like when you receive atreatment that that's the face
and then like your arm is a halfa teaspoon and your arm is a
half a teaspoon in your, youknow, your belly is a ha you
know, your legs maybe too.

(57:04):
Cause you're a little bit longerthere.
Yeah.
Um, yeah.
What about, what's this idea ofincremental skin damage?
So, so what you see over theyears, as you slowly, you know,
you turn 35, you look in themirror, you're like, oh, where
did that come from?
Oh, where did that come from?
Well, most of the accumulatedaging, which then shows up

(57:27):
later, like the darker spots,the hyperpigmentation, the fine
lines they're from what's calledaccumulated exposure.
So that's really just your dayto day life like running to the
grocery store or going to thepost office, walking out to your
mailbox, um, going, shoppingoutside and just not thinking
about sunscreen, just tocumulate a damage where you're
not burned.

(57:47):
Right?
So you aren't out long enough tobe burned.
So you don't register damage andit's just accumulated over a
lifetime.
And that accumulation is whatpredominantly causes the aging
process.
So a burn in early childhoodcould very well show up later as

(58:09):
a skin cancer because the damageis there, but the accumulated
exposure over a lifetime is whatends up, what we end up seeing
on our body and face when we're50, 60, 70.
And they're both not good.
Right.
Well, they're both not good, youknow, but you also have to live,

(58:32):
you know, just take someprecautions.
Can I ask you how you feel aboutsome booths?
Is that what they're called?
So, yeah.
They're terrible.
Like a tanning bed.
Yeah.
Tanning beds, tanning beds.
Do they even still exist?
Oh, that's nuts.
Yeah, they do.
How do you feel about, so, um,factually they primarily emit

(58:55):
UVA rays.
So you do the math, correct.
So they're penetrating deeper.
The penetrating DePrince, I'lltell you a story.
This is pretty funny.
When I was in college in collegepark, Maryland had a part-time
job at a tanning salon.
And I would never, I did tanlike before spring break, but I
would never, I mean, it reallyput me off of tanning because I

(59:18):
would see, I mean, it's anaddiction because it feels good.
I mean, it's certainly must readthe release endorphins, you
know, the sun releasesendorphins, you know, if you
feel good.
Um, so I watched people come inhabitually and I was literally
watching them age right beforemy face.
And I was thinking probably likemy, the middle of my junior year

(59:42):
to the end of my senior year intwo years or so people.
Yeah, well, they were cominginto, and three times a week,
those people probably all haveskin cancer because I was quite
young and they were older.
I mean, not much older at thetime when you're young, you
think someone who's 25 is old,but, um, yeah.
Yeah.
And I remember just, I mean, itjust really was like, like a

(01:00:04):
ding, ding, ding, ding, ding.
It's like, I'm, that's whatgoing to happen to me.
I'm not doing that.
It's not worth it.
It's not worth it because ifyou're not someone who's
naturally tan or have like amore olivine skin tone, it goes
away.
So you do all of this damage andthen it's gone or you keep doing
the damage because you've nowbecome addicted and you are

(01:00:25):
damaging your skin.
And so I remember a turningpoint, a real turning point.
I was out of college and welived in Georgetown, in
Washington, DC in a brownstone.
And we used to go upstairs kindof to the roof to lay out.
And I went out and I laid outone day with my girlfriend and I

(01:00:45):
got burned.
And that night I went to anevent where I saw the guy I was
dating and he looked at me andhe said, what did you do to
yourself?
Cause I was burned.
Like it wasn't like I'd messedup my hair.
I made this horrible decisionthat, you know, we were going to
be stuck with for the next twoyears.
But I had really burned my facebadly.

(01:01:07):
And he said, what, what did youdo to yourself?
And I thought to myself, I'mnever doing that again.
And that was just like, like aswitch flipped.
And I never did it again nowoccasionally by accident, you
know, my shoulders and stufflike that.
Or, but I never pursued thatever again.
I just said, you know what?
This is not worth it.

(01:01:28):
My grandfather died of melanoma.
This is not worth it.
It's just not worth it.
I'll go to, um, uh, uh, spraytan place or not really.
I like going to the airbrushingplaces.
There's some great ones in thetwin, a couple of great ones in
the twin cities.
Um, but even that is kind ofscary because you sort of wonder

(01:01:48):
when are they going to say thatthose chemicals you're putting
in your skin to turn color.
So even that I will, like, somepeople are addicted to that and
I just don't think it's good tobe addicted to anything
chemically that you're puttingall over your body.
So I reserve it for like thecation or if I'm going somewhere
and I really want to feel good.
And I got a tan, I feelcomfortable going and doing

(01:02:11):
that, but not on a regular kindof addicted like basis.
Cause I just don't think it'sgood for you.
Well, it's just an opinion.
Obviously we're tapping into the

Speaker 2 (01:02:19):
Ingrained part of our culture that puts beauty above
health and looking back throughthe history of even the SPF and
how that was developed throughcopper tone and, and other
forces of history.
And I mean, there were models.
Um, I think it was ChristieBrinkley who really came out

(01:02:40):
like ha was tan all of a sudden.
And then tanning became a thinglike this is important to have
dark skin, right?
Like, or darker skin is, wasvalue of beauty.

Speaker 1 (01:02:50):
People say that it's like, you look healthier if
you're

Speaker 3 (01:02:54):
Right.
Right.
Right.
Well, what's interesting isthat's what I was going to say.
I was going to say it was CocoChanel because prior to that,
well, she didn't know she wasn'tbeing infallible in all
fairness.
Um, prior to that, it wasinvoked to have very pale
porcelain skin because it wasn'twas a status symbol.

(01:03:17):
Like you didn't work, you didn'thave to work.
You weren't of the workingsociety.
Oh, interesting.
You were of leisure.
And then the tan became thesymbol of leisure because you
had all this time to be, to beleisurely.
You could have a tan, if youwere working, you couldn't, does
that make sense?
Like it's sort of swamp to go tothe

Speaker 1 (01:03:34):
Beach and drink all of that

Speaker 3 (01:03:36):
Because I'm wealthy and I can, I don't have to work.
And so it just, it sort of, forsome reason swapped and that's
interesting, but, butCoppertone, you mentioned that
and I did a little digging onthat.
Not enough to expand on what wewere talking about, but

Speaker 2 (01:03:51):
To say something in that somewhat factual.
Yes.

Speaker 3 (01:03:54):
For sure.
We're not blowing hot air.
You can, you can, you can factcheck this.
Originally.
There was an S there was a goingdown through history, looking at
SPF or even just protection.
There was a re in 1944, therewas a gentleman who developed
and SPF, uh, son, let's just saya sunscreen for, so that there's

(01:04:15):
no arguments or, um, for themilitary.
And it was called red.
It was, I think it was calledred vet pet.
I don't even know what the nameof the meat, the meaning of it,
but it was red and it was likesticky and gooey.
And, but they used it verydifficult as you can imagine to
use.
But then in the 1950s, it washanded off to copper tone and

(01:04:40):
copper tone, moved it into whatwe now know as copper tone.
What was the original, theoriginal product of copper tones
.
Oh, so that's where Coppertonegot the formulation that they
first started with and they thenbrought it in like 1956.
I think they introduced it tothe market.
And then of course, SPF chemo

Speaker 2 (01:05:00):
Or two.
So post-World war II.
These are focused.
And we were wanting to show, Iguess, wealth and happiness

Speaker 3 (01:05:06):
And the media, I suppose.
So, or maybe if I cancer skincancer

Speaker 2 (01:05:11):
Got an epidemic of, of cancers and melanoma and
other skin cancers.
And thankfully there's, you'repainting and paving a different
option.
Good-looking the four basicthings.
Is there anything else you wantto talk about as related to
sunscreen?
I mean, one thing I think isinteresting to me and important
and sunblock doesn't reallyexist, correct.

(01:05:34):
That's not a thing.
Correct.
So,

Speaker 3 (01:05:36):
So the, I mentioned the sunscreen innovation act,
uh, and it actually was signedinto law in 2014 and November of
2014.
And the basic of it was that itwould force the FDA to approve
other more innovativeingredients for sunscreens that
let's say they had been using inEurope for a decade.

(01:05:59):
So to date from what I have seenstill, the FDA has not really
approved since 1999, any newingredients, because there was a
timeframe before this wouldactually be enacted and it would
require them to kind of expediteevaluating these ingredients is
the ingredients and theirefficacies.

(01:06:20):
And then they would need toinform us in a certain amount of
time.
But by 2018, it still hadn'tbeen done by 2019 COVID was
hurdling towards us.
So what I, it's hard to find alot of current updated
information on it, but in 2020it was postponed.
So there are things that theconsumer should know anything

(01:06:45):
above an SPF 50.
And I believe all of this is apart of getting this information
out to consumers through thisact in, um, anything higher than
an SPF 50 is really a moot pointbecause now it has to be broad
spectrum.
That's the key, right?
It doesn't matter what thenumber on the, it could be like
350 SPF.

(01:07:05):
If it's not broad spectrum andSPF 15 is giving you better
protection.
So 50, the difference between a50 and a 70 is less than 1% of
increased protection.
So the kind of the standards arein my mind, like a 30 to a 50
somewhere in there with 30 beingfabulous 50 is maybe maybe 3%

(01:07:29):
more it's between.
It means it lasts a little bitlonger.
Is there a purpose to SPF 15?
I mean, there's fifteens areeverywhere.
Well, fifteens, AR fifteens arekind of where we started.
Like you remember, like therewas an SP oh, the first SPF was
a two, I think the red pepper, Ithink it, I think it was a two,
so 15 minutes in the

Speaker 2 (01:07:51):
Sun.
Right.

Speaker 3 (01:07:52):
Well, see the problem with the SPF 15 is most people
don't reapply.
So only, only 15% of men everymorning in the American culture
apply sunscreen about 30% ofwomen in the morning.
As much as we know aboutskincare, about 30% of women
apply a sunscreen.
And about 10% of teenagers applya sunscreen when they get up in

(01:08:15):
morning.
So, right.
So that's why there's, you know,I don't know what the lineup is,
but skin cancer is right up inthe categories of, you know,
leading skin cancers and peoplejust don't believe it.
I think they just don't and theywon't go in and get yearly
checks.
So they won't, they don't knowthat anything is wrong.

Speaker 1 (01:08:34):
It would be a good ad .
I'm a dad.
So I typically ask questionsabout kids.
Sorry, sorry.
Um, what about for kids though?
Like their morning routine?
Is it a good idea?
Cause like my son goes to schooland they go outside for recess
or, or Fayyad, you know, atdifferent times of the day and
they go outside, like, would itbe a good idea to put sunscreen

(01:08:57):
on the kids in the morning ordoes that yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:09:00):
How could it hurt?
So, and then with regards toskincare for kids, you really, I
mean, it's, it's always good toteach your kids to wash their
face, right?
Because it's a part of personalhygiene.
And when they're very, veryyoung, they have that beautiful
skin, their hormones have notkicked in yet.
Just wash your face, throw somesunscreen on in the morning.
That's a really early ingrainedlesson because eventually

(01:09:24):
they're going to hit puberty andprobably have some sort of skin
challenges.
Maybe just slightly, maybe not,maybe bad, you know?
So you've already gotten themintuned with cleansing their
face and throwing on sunscreen.
So then if you get to a positionwhere they need to add a few
more things in there, they'realready regimented.

(01:09:44):
They already just know it's likebrushing their teeth.
It's super easy.
That's awesome.
Yeah.
And sunscreen can't hurt becauseby the time they get to sun to,
to what's that called where theygo out and play, does that even
happen?

Speaker 1 (01:10:00):
Does happen.
Yeah.
It's still happening

Speaker 3 (01:10:02):
By the time they get to recess, there's still
protection because they've beensitting in doors.
I mean, there's, there's alittle bit of degradation
because of windows, you know,there's the argument that it
comes through windows

Speaker 1 (01:10:15):
And there's, there's more, there's much more, uh,
blue light.
That is

Speaker 3 (01:10:19):
Yeah, because now they're sitting in front of
devices all day in school.
So another statistic that'sreally cool is with regards to
exposure to blue light devicesfor eight hour workdays is
equivalent to 20 minutes at midday sun unprotected like 1:00
PM, just like 20 minutes justsitting there.

(01:10:42):
So we're exposed to a lot, ourYar kids.
And so I'm super lucky.
I always say to my husband, canyou just do this for me?
And he's like, I can't do that.
I'm like, I don't sit behind acomputer.
I'm like taking care of people.
Can you just do this for me?
He usually does, but I'm S Ifeel so fortunate that I don't
sit behind a computer.

(01:11:04):
Well, if you do we wearsunscreen?
Yeah.
Or just get your, get your Irisput on your devices.
Good idea.
Well, there are so

Speaker 2 (01:11:13):
Products on the market.
Uh, we, we kind of talked aboutearlier before the podcast, like
how we can make this accessibleto as many people as possible.
So they do have to be goodquality products, especially, do
you know which one, the vitaminC

Speaker 3 (01:11:27):
Vitamin C serum

Speaker 2 (01:11:30):
Has to be properly formatted, correct that, right?
Yes.
Okay.
So, um, but, and, and we lookedat like, so higher budget using
is, is clinical.
Yes.
Um, would be around 370 to 300.

Speaker 3 (01:11:44):
Yeah.
So keep in mind with hisclinical.
So of course, they're myfavorite.
Everyone has their favoriteskincare product line.
Um, I love his clinical becausethey're pharmaceutical grade.
So every ingredient, everyingredient possible, which is
the majority of ingredients comewith a certificate of analysis,
which means what they say is init is what's in it, period.

(01:12:05):
Um, they are a small company.
They are still owned by theirCEO and developer.
They're developing chemist,which is very rare these days.
Um, they're constantlyinnovating and they have a
really big footprint at the MayoInstitute for cancer care.
So they have a whole cancer careprogram.

(01:12:25):
So I love, and the reviews arestellar.
They're just always stellarpeople.
As soon as they run out, they'reback into replace it.
So results, they are moreexpensive.
They are a medicalpharmaceutical grade line that
has merged that pharmaceuticalgrade.
Pardon me with luxury.

(01:12:46):
So a lot of skincare lines thatI've worked with that are
pharmaceutical grade have gotthose incredible treatment
products and their skincare justkind of seems like an
afterthought.
It's like, okay, we'veformulated these great treatment
products, but we need to havecleansers and we need to have
creams and we need, and they'rethey're okay.
But, but is clinical has doneboth very well.

Speaker 2 (01:13:08):
Yeah.
And then if you're maybe wantingto, this is monthly budget, if
you want, if you're on the lowerend of the budget, quality, not
compromised, you're going tospend around$228 using a blend
of his clinical and face realitycorrectly.
Acne treatment lines alsomentioned,

Speaker 3 (01:13:24):
Correct.
Great line.
It is an acne treatment line,but they, but their skincare is
wonderful.
So when you separate out theiractive products for actually
fighting acne, there are otherskincare products are fantastic
and any skin can use them.
Yeah.
So I do want to correct.
One thing you did say monthly,this is not a monthly.
So typically, um, skincare, the,the average amount of time is

(01:13:47):
around three months.
I shouldn't say average on thehigh end.
So some of the face realityproducts are formulated smaller
because when we're working withacne clients, we want to be able
to change them around if we needto, like, we don't want the skin
to get used to what it's doing,because then you can kind of
plateau and not have success.
So you might go through the facereality products a little

(01:14:11):
faster, but they're very,cost-effective on the clinical
side.
You typically want to expectaround three months out of your,
and maybe a little bit longerout of the, the serums.
So,

Speaker 2 (01:14:25):
So you divide that by three.
So it's like 118 a month for thehigher end budget and under a
hundred, just under a hundredfor the liberal word, but
correct.
Correct.
And this will, again, help youfight pollution, fight this, the
pollution from the sun, correct.
And blue lights coming from myiPad, correct?
Correct.

(01:14:45):
You've given science and factbased reasons that there's four
products that are essential tothe skin.
Correct.
Are there any reasons that weshouldn't have it?
We shouldn't take care of ourface?

Speaker 3 (01:14:58):
No.
I can't think of a reason whyyou shouldn't take care of your
face.

Speaker 2 (01:15:04):
What do you think?
Other barriers we've alreadytried to help with the budget
issue as well?
What other barriers mightsomebody have to get over beyond
educating themselves to make itpart of their daily life?

Speaker 3 (01:15:17):
That's a really good question.
Um, I can't really think of anyother barriers, typically it's
education and it's budgetrelated.

Speaker 2 (01:15:28):
Okay.
So we busted through all that.

Speaker 3 (01:15:31):
Now there's the barriers.
There are no barriers.

Speaker 2 (01:15:34):
Yeah.
Everyone listening to thispodcast or watching us has no
reason now to not get four good

Speaker 3 (01:15:40):
The board.
I mean, if nothing else, let'ssay you find a barrier.
If nothing else get a greatsunscreen.
Okay.

Speaker 2 (01:15:46):
That's easy.
And vitamin C

Speaker 3 (01:15:48):
And vitamin C serum

Speaker 2 (01:15:51):
[inaudible] and of course there's fans do to our
skin to help repair aging anddamage from pollution.
For sure.
Um, do you want to say a wordabout that?

Speaker 3 (01:16:04):
Well, it opens up a big can of worms.
Um, but I will tell you that thegold standard in anti-aging,
which is really awesome becauseit's never really changed is a
little bit of vitamin C in themorning and a little bit of
vitamin a in the evening.
And vitamin a most people arefamiliar with, um, retinae,
which is more of a, a brandedterm, but it's tretinoin an acid

(01:16:27):
and it can be very difficult touse because it causes excessive
peeling.
It can cause excessiveirritation.
So there are lots of newformulations now, like retinols,
which are derivatives.
So when you put on a retinol, itshould transform into vitamin a,
in your skin.
So it should lead to lessirritation.

(01:16:49):
Um, is, has a serum called, uh,active serum, which is a
botanically derived non-caringanalytic vitamin a, which means
you're not going to peel.
It's super easy to use.
All skin types can use it andit, and it will change your
skin.
So vitamin a is really the oneother essential you want to add

(01:17:10):
to that list that we did nottalk about.

Speaker 2 (01:17:13):
Awesome.
Well, Sabrina, I wish everyonewas in the twin cities, so they
could have a chance to get,become a client.
And, um, maybe Scott, you thinkyou're interested in maybe
getting,

Speaker 1 (01:17:26):
Um, let's, let's start with me doing the daily
regimen first and we'll seewhere we get.
No, that's really interesting.
Uh, it, it's interestingbecause, you know, uh, for me, I
haven't had throughout thecourse of my life, I haven't had
like that much of a dailyroutine.
Sure.
I've gone in and out of, youknow, some, some various things.

(01:17:48):
Um, but I'm to the point nowwhere I noticed more, you know,
with my age, I'm, I'm noticingmore what my face looks like.
And, uh, so I've got, you know,I've got crow's feet, I've got
smile lines and all of thatstuff.
And I think there's a lot ofproducts out there that are
available that are kind of likeanti-aging wrinkle reducing and

(01:18:11):
all that kind of stuff.
So I think it's, I think it'sjust good to, for us to know,
like what really can helpprevent it in the future also.
But then if there are any, like,like you mentioned, vitamin C
the, the combination of vitaminC and vitamin a could actually
be something easy enough to, totry and approach it rather than
just kind of shotgunningproducts or,

Speaker 3 (01:18:32):
And then again, to come full circle, it really only
matters what's important to you.
Yeah.
And in the end, the only realthing that's important is
preventing any sort of terminalillness from melanoma.
I mean, that's the only thingthat's really important.
You may not.
I mean, I've been at places withmy daughters and, you know, a
woman has chosen not to takecare of her upper lip and I'm

(01:18:54):
like, mom, give her your card.
She's perfectly happy, likegiving her my card because it
doesn't matter what makes herhappy.
Yeah.
It depends on what you want, butat least prevent cancer
melanoma.

Speaker 2 (01:19:11):
We can have all of you all the time for everyone,
but you do have some greatarticles written on your
website.
You blog, you also, um, you havea background in marketing and so
you know how to get the word outthere on your own sites and
you're on Instagram.
Could you share what your, howpeople can get?
Sure,

Speaker 3 (01:19:30):
Sure.
So, um, yeah, so it's my name,Sabrina brown skin.
Uh, my website is Sabrina brown,skin.com.
I'm on Instagram at Sabrinabrown skin.
Um, yeah, that's it.
Facebook Sabrina, brown skin CZ

Speaker 2 (01:19:50):
Go rate and review.
We're not blowing hot air.
So more people are aware ofwellness and business stuff that
deserves more oxygen andsubscribe to our podcast.
So you never missed an excitingepisode.

Speaker 1 (01:20:02):
We hope you enjoyed our interview with skincare
experts, Sabrina alias.
During this segment of our we'vebeen featuring songs by
Minnesota based music artists.
Now we're calling all musicartists from around the globe.
If you have music that you wouldlike featured on, we're not
blowing hot air, [e-mail].

(01:20:22):
We're excited to hear from you.