February 21, 2024 • 38 mins
Todd Jones has crashed into walls, been punched in the face, flown through the air, tumbled down stairs, and fallen off high buildings, numerous times--willingly. He is a professional stuntman for movies and television shows. Todd also is a strongman: among other things, he holds a Guinness World Record for "hearting" horseshoes (bending steel with his hands). Think all of this sounds almost impossible? Todd says he's not superhuman--he has simply worked hard and not given up: the secret to his success is perseverance.
In this episode:
01:56--How and why Todd transitioned from acting to stunt work
02:39--What he learned at "stunt school"--including getting set on fire
04:35--How to land correctly from a fall
06:28--Todd's first stunt gig
08:10--His role on "The Newsroom" that kick-started his career
10:53--A typical day on set
12:30--The two biggest stunts Todd has ever done on screen
17:29--The qualities needed to be a stunt person
21:08--What his family thinks watching him on screen
22:26--How Todd got started bending steel
25:29--The process of setting a Guinness World Record for "hearting" horseshoes
27:33--The power of perseverance: how and why Todd came to believe this so deeply
32:46--As you reach your goals, keep setting the bar higher: what else can I do?
33:24--How Todd stays in shape
34:38--The work schedule of a professional stunt person: "consistently inconsistent"
As promised in the episode, here is a link to the episode of "The Newsroom" in which Todd appeared with Jeff Daniels: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm2052565/?ref_=nm_rvi_nm_i_1
Want to know more about Todd?
- Find him on TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@toddryanjones
- Watch him on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/ToddRJones
- Follow him in Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/toddryanjones/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Todd (00:08):
You really just have to accept what is going to happen
and hope for the best.
You got to have at least somekind of pain tolerance to be in
the business.
It's gonna hurt, but you'reworking with really high level
professionals and you have apretty good idea that the least
level of damage possible isgoing to happen, whatever that
(00:30):
level is.
Elizabeth (00:34):
Hello, and welcome to "What It's Like To..." The
podcast that lets you walk insomeone else's shoes and live
vicariously through their uniqueexperiences.
I'm your host, formerjournalist.
Elizabeth Pearson Garr.
And each episode, I'll be askinga new interviewee all the what,
why, when, and wheres of howthey do what they do.
(00:54):
If they can do it, so can you.
We're all impressed when we'rewatching a movie or a TV show
and someone goes tumbling offthe side of a building or jumps
a motorcycle over a ravine orsomething like that.
But we also know it's notusually the A-list actor who's
doing that work.
(01:15):
It's a stuntman or a stuntwoman.
Todd Jones has been aprofessional actor, stuntman,
and he also happens to be astrongman.
He holds the world record forbending horseshoes.
We'll find out all about thattoo.
So Todd, welcome to my podcast.
Todd (01:30):
Thank you.
Thank you for having me.
Elizabeth (01:31):
I'm so glad to have you here.
I think these are all suchinteresting things that you do
and definitely fall into mycategory of unusual and
intriguing things that most ofus will never do in our lives.
Todd (01:42):
I have been called unusual.
Yes.
Elizabeth (01:46):
In the best of ways, in the best of ways.
How did you, get into such,unusual, let's just keep with
that word line of work.
You started as an actor?
Todd (01:55):
Yeah, yeah, I started as a struggling actor.
I couldn't sing or dance oranything good like that to get
myself hired.
So I had to figure out a way tomake myself stand out.
I had a martial arts background,so I used to get beat up all the
time.
I figured I had a good paintolerance, like I'll go to stunt
school and I'll make myselfstand out by being an actor who
(02:17):
can really for real do his ownstunts.
Elizabeth (02:20):
So there's actual school that you go to?
There are, yeah, not many andeven the one that I went to
closed up shop a long time ago,so.
I would say most stunt peopledon't go that route, but some of
us did, and, it worked.
One of the best decisions Imade.
What kinds of things do theyteach you there?
Todd (02:39):
Uh, pretty much what you would expect.
You get set on fire safely.
Obviously.
Learn how to fall down a bigflight of stairs, which was
actually my first kind of bigjob that I got hired for
afterwards.
So that was gold right there.
Um, fighting for film, prettymuch typical high falls, you
know, how to fall off ofbuildings safely and stuff like
(03:01):
that.
Any kind of typical stunt thatyou can do.
Elizabeth (03:04):
Typical everyday run of the mill.
So can you pull back the curtainon a couple of these things?
Like how do you get lit on firesafely?
Or how do you fall down thestairs safely?
Todd (03:14):
Oh, getting set on fire?
It's an involved process.
You need teams of, the highestlevel professionals, which I'm
fortunate to be friends with.
It involves a lot of fireretardant clothing and, gel,
basically, and, there's layersupon layers and ways you do it
and, everything's done to theutmost.
(03:35):
I mean, that gel goes ineverywhere and it's usually
freezing cold and, any stuntperson that's been lit on fire
will tell you that by the timeyou're ready to go, you're
shivering and shaking.
So you're like, just, justplease set me on fire again.
You know, you just want to getwarmed up somehow.
Elizabeth (03:52):
You only do it once I assume, or do you have to do
multiple takes of these things?
Not necessarily.
it's such an involved anddangerous thing that that's the
goal.
You definitely only want to doit once.
But you know, if they didn't getthe take and everybody's okay,
which is how it should be, thenyou know, you might have to do
it again.
Producers definitely don't wantto do it again because I get
(04:15):
paid every single time I get liton fire.
So, they try to make absolutelysure that, uh, once and done.
So then the falling down thestairs, falling off a tall
building, something like that,falling off a train, are those
all similar skill sets?
Todd (04:30):
Um, I've never fallen off a train.
Um, yes and no.
There's a certain way that youhave to fall from like a
building, a high fall.
Basically, the most importantthing is you want to land
properly.
When you're at that height, evenwhen you're hitting whatever
you're hitting, the airbag orwhatever, if you land
(04:50):
improperly,
Elizabeth (04:51):
You hurt your spine.
Todd (04:53):
It's dangerous.
Yeah, your spine, your head,whichever.
Yeah, exactly.
You're falling from a highplace, just like any other.
Elizabeth (04:59):
Yeah.
Todd (04:59):
The stairfalls, I say safely, you're pretty much just
falling down the stairs.
Basically, you want to go into aroll.
You're going down pretty fast.
So, hopefully, less of your bodyactually makes contact with
every single stair.
But you pad up as much as youpossibly can and you just kind
of, and you go for it.
Elizabeth (05:20):
But you are wearing a lot of padding as if you're like
in sporting event?
Todd (05:23):
If you can.
It depends on what the scenecall for like, uh, women.
Hats off to them ever since thebeginning of movies, you know,
you're wearing skirts andsleeveless stuff.
And they pretty much typicallyhave a lot less, uh, you know,
their outfits don't allow themto put on a lot of padding a lot
of times.
So.
A lot of times they just gottagrit their teeth and do it, you
(05:47):
know?
Elizabeth (05:47):
Do they sometimes try to shoot it at certain angles?
So they're not seeing the facesas much so they can match the
actor?
Todd (05:55):
Yeah they do.
And we all inherently like tryto hide our faces as best we can
usually.
That also depends on if you'redoubling somebody.
If you're doubling somebody,then you definitely don't want
to have your face seen.
But, you also get a lot of jobswhere you're not doubling
somebody and I'll be some guyfalling down and I don't have to
(06:15):
necessarily hide it.
Elizabeth (06:16):
So let's go back.
You mentioned that your firstpart as a stunt man was falling
down stairs.
Do you remember getting thatpart, what it felt like to get
the call and then to actually doit?
What was that like?
Todd (06:28):
It was awesome.
It was on a soap opera back whensoap operas were still a thing.
I had worked on it some bitparts before I got into stunts.
Elizabeth (06:39):
So you had acted on it.
Todd (06:40):
Yeah, So I knew the casting director and once I did
get into stunts, you know, I'mtrying to do whatever I can to
get myself out there.
So I contacted that castingdirector.
I was like, Hey, I know it's asoap opera.
It's not like a action movie,but I was like, Hey, if anything
comes up, I'm into stunts now,here you go.
And it was just fortuitoustiming.
(07:01):
He was like, as a matter offact, we got something, we might
be able to use you for.
One of the actors was doing astair fall down the stairs and
they needed somebody to do it.
So I just happened to, dumbluck, get my name in there at
the right time.
And, the coordinator at the timewas a guy named BH Barry, who is
very well known in the Broadwayworld.
(07:22):
He does a lot of fightchoreography for, Broadway shows
and stuff like that.
And yeah, he was like, cool, Idid it, got the job, did the
stair fall, which was way morepleasant than the stairs that I
had actually trained and learnedon.
They were these horrible ricketysharp stairs, so I just assumed
that's what stairs felt like.
(07:43):
These were these nice smoothmetal, so it actually went off
without a hitch.
I got up and got a round ofapplause from the entire crew
and everything.
I was like, yes, okay, this is.
Elizabeth (07:52):
Great.
I can do this.
Yeah, and so that got it rollingso to speak that got the stunt
career going.
Todd (07:59):
Sort of.
You want to know the one thatkind of really got it Rolling?
Yeah.
That was on"The Newsroom." Didyou ever watch"The Newsroom"
with Jeff Daniels?
Elizabeth (08:08):
I saw your clip.
I watched it.
Todd (08:10):
That was kind of the one.
A part had come up where theywanted an actor who could share
the screen with Jeff Daniels,but who could also really do his
own stunts.
Like I got my material in there.
And yeah, I got that part.
That was kind of the one thatgot me because, the coordinator
for that show did other shows inNew York.
(08:32):
So, B.H Barry, the guy I justtold you about, he's more a
theater guy, so he didn't reallydo any other TV stuff.
This was a TV show, andcoordinator from that show hired
me for other shows where I metthis person after, so that was
really kind of the one thatstarted snowballing into my
career as it is today.
And Terry Crews was in that too?
(08:53):
Yeah.
Am I right?
So anyone who watches"America'sGot Talent." one of my favourite
people, To this day, one of myfavorite people I've ever worked
with, Terry Crews is awesome.
Elizabeth (09:03):
But it's a rough scene.
I mean, it really looks likeyou're getting really beat up.
It's tough.
I don't know how people who careabout you can watch these
things.
It's pretty incredible to see.
Are you really hurt at the endof these things?
I know,
Todd (09:16):
That one, I took a beating on that one.
Elizabeth (09:18):
I'm going to post a link to that clip in the show
notes so people can watch.
Cause it's really impressivewhat you go through.
Todd (09:25):
Thank you.
That was an intense day becauseI had a lot of lines and stuff
and we're out in the middle ofManhattan.
Noisy, I can't hear.
I think I spoke over JeffDaniels a couple of times
unintentionally, which he didnot appreciate.
But, you know, we got throughit.
So I'm all jazzed up.
Here I am with these stars andI'm like, Aah.
(09:45):
Trying to remember my lines andhit my marks so that everything
goes smoothly while I'm about toeat a pain sandwich.
So I had a lot going on thatday.
Elizabeth (09:57):
And you said you were pretty bruised up at the end.
Todd (09:59):
That one, yes.
For anybody that watches theclip, I do, I go BAM and I hit
the cement really hard.
We did that a lot of times.
I remember they had me smokingclove cigarettes cause I didn't
want to smoke a real cigarettecause I hate smoking, but it's
like, I'll do a clove, whatever.
And in the scene, I snuffed thebutt out right there.
(10:19):
And I knew how many times we didit,'cause all the butts were
right there.
Elizabeth (10:23):
Oh!
Todd (10:23):
In the
Elizabeth (10:24):
beginning.
Todd (10:24):
It was a lot.
It was like over 10 times I hadto do that.
Wow!
Elizabeth (10:28):
Head into the cement.
Todd (10:30):
Yeah,
Elizabeth (10:31):
Wow.
Todd (10:31):
but I did it, and, I'm still working now, so I guess I
did okay.
Elizabeth (10:35):
Yeah! So, can you take us into kind of your head
space before a shoot like that?
If you're backstage or in adressing room or something?
How do you get yourself preparedmentally and physically, for
these roles and for thesestunts.
Todd (10:50):
Usually you don't, to be honest.
I'll tell you what almost alwayshappens.
They'll call you in for somestunt.
Hours and hours and hours beforeyou actually do it, so you know,
an entire day goes by and you'rejust sitting in your trailer or
whatever, and you start gettingtired and relaxed.
(11:11):
And then when it's time, like,okay, go, go, go, like, come on,
get them and you, got to go outand you're just...
So you really just have toaccept what is going to happen
and hope for the best.
And like I said, you got to haveat least some kind of pain
tolerance to be in the business.
It's gonna hurt, but you'reworking with really high level
(11:31):
professionals and you have apretty good idea that the least
level of damage possible isgoing to happen, whatever that
level is.
Elizabeth (11:41):
Have you ever turned down a job because it sounds
like it's too, I hate to use theword, scary to someone who's...
Todd (11:48):
No, it's okay.
No, not really.
Not that I can think of.
Elizabeth (11:52):
Hmm.
You'll just take it on.
Whatever they ask for, you'llprep for.
Todd (11:56):
Yeah, because usually, almost all the time, the
coordinator that's going to hireyou knows you, so he has a
pretty good idea of what you'recapable of.
And for the most part acoordinator is not going to hire
you for something that theythemselves wouldn't do.
To be a stunt professional inthe first place, why are you in
(12:17):
it if you're going to turnsomething down.
Elizabeth (12:19):
Can you give me an example of one of the most
intricate or involved stuntsthat you've done on screen?
Todd (12:27):
Uh, there's two that come to mind.
One that most people say, yeah,that's the one: getting set on
fire.
If you do call it a full burn,you know, from head to toe,
you're just completely engulfedin flames.
That's one of the most dangerousstunts you can do period.
Elizabeth (12:43):
Wow.
That was just part of the story?
The character was in a fire.
And so
Todd (12:48):
Uh, yeah, the biggest one I ever did was on"The Blacklist"
and, the character Liz shoots aguy with a flare gun.
So he goes, I mean, I was told Ihad 15 foot flames coming off me
from the top of my head.
It was a pretty cool one.
And a little more recently, Iwas on a show called"Evil" with
Mike Cotter and I'm playing apriest and we're trying to
(13:11):
subdue this guy who's possessedby this demon, but of course
he's got superhuman strength.
We're on a bed and he goes POW!And he kicks me off and I fly 20
feet through the air into awall.
Elizabeth (13:23):
How did that work?
How do you?
Todd (13:25):
Uh, it's a wire gag, so I had a harness on with a wire
attached that actually went upthrough the ceiling next to the
wall.
Like, the wire was here, and thewall was here.
And a couple of guys are on theother side of the wall, and when
action calls, they jump off aladder.
I go, pew! I'm not a huge guy,but I'm not a small guy.
(13:46):
I'm about 210 pounds.
And they launched me like I wasnothing.
And, that was a pretty crazyone.
You get paid for every time youdo a stunt.
So, as a stunt person, you wantto do things as much as your
body can take.
But, I was glad that I only didthat once.
That was a pretty good thumper.
Elizabeth (14:05):
You thumped right into the wall.
Todd (14:07):
I thumped right into the wall and it was a reinforced
wall because during the, uh,rehearsal I actually broke the
wall.
Elizabeth (14:14):
Oh my gosh, Todd.
Todd (14:18):
And fixed it up so that wouldn't happen anymore.
It was slightly hard.
Yeah.
Elizabeth (14:23):
So you do have rehearsals on these things.
Todd (14:25):
Sometimes, oftentimes you don't, for something like that
you do, because you know,there's rigging involved and a
lot of stuff you have to workout, but a stunt person's bread
and butter for a lot of us is,you know, we'll be, cop number
one or bad guy number one orwhatever and we get shot we fall
down or we get punched and wefall down etc etc so a lot of
(14:46):
times you don't rehearse forthat stuff because it's pretty
simple and as a professionalit's expected that you can at
least do something simple likethat without rehearsal.
Elizabeth (14:56):
So is it as competitive as it is in the
acting world to get the stuntjobs?
Todd (15:02):
Competitive yes but it's also a lot smaller, it's way,
way, way smaller.
So if you do get in, you know,the odds of making a career are
lot better than in the actingworld for sure.
Elizabeth (15:16):
And is it similar to acting that you have an agent
who goes and sends you out onauditions or you--
Todd (15:21):
No, no, you get hired directly by the coordinator
usually.
Elizabeth (15:26):
Oh Okay.
Todd (15:27):
It's a pretty tight knit community.
Especially in the specifictowns.
Like I usually work in New York.
So if you work in New York, youpretty much know the entire
stunt community of New York,Atlanta, Georgia is another one.
And then out in LA, so there'scertain kinds of hubs.
That's where the stuntcommunities live.
Elizabeth (15:46):
So you wouldn't fly to a movie set or something like
that?
Todd (15:50):
I do on occasion.
Sometimes that does happen.
Yeah.
But, more often than not, likesolid 95 percent of my work is
New York or the surroundingareas out there, Jersey.
I live in Pennsylvania.
So sometimes I work inPennsylvania.
Elizabeth (16:05):
I spent some time on some sets.
I lived in LA..
twice in my, life.
And, I worked for E!Entertainment News.
And so we did like behind thescenes stories.
And I even worked as an extrasometimes on some shows.
And it's just incredible whenyou're on those sets to see how
many people are involved to makeTV and movies work.
And so, you really get anappreciation for how many
(16:28):
directors, producers, crew and,craft services and costume
people.
I mean, there's so many peoplethat are involved to make these
shows work.
Todd (16:37):
Yeah, totally.
I always recommend if anybody'strying to get into the business,
working at least a few times asa background as an extra because
it not only gives you thatperspective, just, gives you a
pretty good taste of, whether ornot you might really like it,
you know, the realities of beingon a set and stuff like that.
Elizabeth (16:57):
Like you mentioned earlier, there's a lot of
downtime, you're not justgetting called, and then all of
a sudden you're on.
You might have a whole day whereyou're not working and then
they're calling you the next dayor something you have to really
enjoy set time and be ready togo when they need you.
I know that you're an actoralso, but let's just stick on
the stuntman side of things.
What are other qualities thatsomeone needs?
(17:19):
Obviously, physicality and asense of being willing to go for
it.
But are there other things thatyou think if someone were
interested in this line of work,what would they need?
Todd (17:28):
Uh...
Professionalism big time.
Anything that you are in controlof, being responsive, being on
time, all that stuff.
Huge.
So so important.
You cannot slack in those areasat all.
Word will get around and that'sreally bad.
Elizabeth (17:47):
Great tip.
Todd (17:48):
And, believe it or not, just being, if not cool to be
around, being tolerable to bearound, you know, don't, don't
be always talking.
Like we were just saying, thedays are long.
Twelve, 14 hour days, that's notout of the question at all.
That's very normal.
So, do you think a coordinatorwants to hire somebody that's
(18:10):
going to annoy them all day?
Like, no, you gotta makeyourself be cool to be around
for 12 to 14 hours at a shot.
That's huge.
Elizabeth (18:19):
Yeah.
Or ask, When is this day goingto be over?
When are we up?
No! Be patient!
Todd (18:25):
Oh, yeah.
Yeah, for sure.
I think, honestly, that'sprobably one of my stronger
qualities.
There's a lot of more talentedstunt people than I am that
might not get the job becausethe coordinator doesn't like
being around them for that long.
So, anything that you arepersonally in control of, be in
control of it and make yourselfsomebody that somebody wants to
(18:48):
hire.
Elizabeth (18:49):
That's such great advice that someone could use in
whatever they're doing.
My kids are both in high schoolnow, and I sometimes think,
There is a lot of course thatyou can learn in a classroom and
that will apply to whatever youdo in real life.
But there's so many other thingsthat are just life skills and
things like you're saying, beingon time, being respectful, being
(19:09):
kind to people, those are thesesort of soft skills that are
going to apply to everything youdo, your work life, your
personal life, your social life,being in a grocery store, like
these are all things that aregoing to help you just be a
better citizen and a betterperson in life.
And by the way, they're going tohelp you in your career, even if
you're not trying to use them,you know, in a manipulative way,
(19:34):
but you really need to work onthese things.
They all matter.
Todd (19:38):
I agree.
Show'em you care.
Show them that you want it andyou're not taking it for
granted.
Elizabeth (19:43):
Anything.
Yeah.
Is it hard though?
Because it's hard on your body,this job.
Is there a shelf life?
Is there a time that stuntpeople tend to say, I can't keep
doing this any longer.
This is kind of a youngerperson's game.
Todd (19:56):
Yes and no.
I think it depends on people'spersonal aspirations.
A lot of people will try to getinto the stunt coordinating
Elizabeth (20:05):
field.
Todd (20:06):
That's kind of a natural next step for a lot of people.
A lot of people do think, I'mgetting too old for this, but I
know a lot of people that don't.
I know guys in their 50s and 60sthat are still doing it and they
have no intention of stopping.
It's pretty much the individual.
But yeah, there's the obviousrealities.
I'm only in my 40s and hittingthe ground now is not the same
(20:27):
as it was when I was in my 20s.
Elizabeth (20:29):
What's your hope?
Do you want to just keep doingit as long as you can?
Todd (20:32):
As long as I can, yes.
And I also just wrote my firstscript, my first screenplay.
So there's some activity goingon with that right now, believe
it or not.
Elizabeth (20:43):
How exciting.
Congratulations.
Todd (20:46):
Thank you.
Elizabeth (20:47):
Do you watch the things that you perform in?
Todd (20:49):
If I did something cool in it, yeah, I'll try to check it
out and see how it turned out,if I did some kind of cool
stunt.
Elizabeth (20:56):
What do you think when you see it?
Is it a totally differentexperience than it was for you
being in it?
Todd (21:01):
No, not usually, not at this point.
It's usually the same.
Elizabeth (21:05):
What does your wife or your kids think when they see
you?
Todd (21:08):
My kids are 16 now.
I've been a stuntman their wholelife.
So that doesn't even phase themanymore.
They'll acknowledge that it'scool and then they will quickly
go back to whatever it was theywere doing.
Yeah.
Yeah, it's interesting with mystrongman stuff, you know, I'm
bending steel and all this crazystuff that does not faze them at
all.
They're like, yes, we know youcan do that.
(21:29):
They don't care.
My fiancé, we've only beenengaged for a little over a
year, so I'm not sure if she'sstill impressed by anything or
not.
Elizabeth (21:38):
Does she get worried though?
Todd (21:40):
Yeah.
Yeah, she does.
And I'm up front with her too,like that one that I told you
about where I got launchedacross the room into the wall.
I was honest with her.
I'm like.
This one might hurt.
Might get hurt on this one.
So maybe I won't do thatanymore, but yeah, she gets
worried.
Elizabeth (21:57):
Yeah, I guess just like professional athletes.
You got to take the bumps andbruises and come home and do
some ice baths.
Todd (22:04):
Sometimes it seems like it doesn't register with people
when they know I'm a stuntmanand then I tell them what I'm
doing.
They're like, Oh, they reactlike, like, are you crazy?
You know, you know what I do,right?
That is the job.
Elizabeth (22:19):
So you mentioned the strongman work and the bending
steel.
This is what I read and I justcan't believe it.
See, I, you need to describe it,but you set a Guinness world
record for taking horseshoes andbending them.
Todd (22:31):
Yeah.
Elizabeth (22:31):
Bending them into hearts?
Todd (22:33):
Yeah.
It's called hearting ahorseshoe.
Yeah.
It's a specific move that you dowith it.
Most hearted horseshoes in oneminute for the Guinness world
record.
Yep.
Actually, I was recently on apodcast and I did one for him.
So there's one.
Elizabeth (22:48):
Oh my goodness.
All right.
So it's really, it's mindblowing how you can just do this
stuff.
So take me back.
How did all this get started?
I mean, clearly you're strong.
How did you decide, all right, Iwant to start bending steel.
What was the inspiration here?
Todd (23:05):
So I'm no stronger than anybody else.
I think everybody in the worldis way stronger than they think
they are.
I just, purposely tapped intoit, but it all started.
You familiar with kettlebells,you know what kettlebells are?
are.
Elizabeth (23:21):
Yes.
Todd (23:21):
Kettlebells are actually very old, but they fell out of
favor and there was a resurgencein like the late 90s early
2000s.
So the guy that kind ofspearheaded that is a guy named
Pavel Tsatsouline who has abunch of books really great
training manuals that I used toread and in his books he's
always referencing these oldtime strongmen from the late
(23:43):
1800s and early 1900s, and yousaid the word mind blowing.
That's exactly the word I used.
You read about what these guyswere doing.
You're like, Holy smokes!They're bending steel and
breaking chains and all thesecrazy feats of strength and I
don't know, I think maybe it wasbecause I grew up as a comic
(24:03):
book geek.
I always liked superheroes orsomething.
These guys just seemed likeborderline superhuman.
So I don't know.
It just clicked.
A lot of people see pictures ofSchwarzenegger or whatever, and
that's what inspires them totrain.
I saw pictures of these guysdoing that stuff, and I just
wanted to learn how to do it.
I thought that was awesome.
It took me a long time trying tofigure things out myself,
(24:25):
reading all these old manualsfrom the 1800s and stuff.
Finally found a coach, one ofthe best guys in the world at
that kind of stuff.
Started training under him andnow I can do a lot of that stuff
that I would read about.
Elizabeth (24:39):
Is it a lot of hand and finger strength?
Todd (24:42):
Yeah,
Elizabeth (24:43):
To be able to do this?
Todd (24:44):
Yeah, it's really everything.
Not even just physical.
You have to go there mentallyand not think about any kind of
limitations and get in the rightmindset and believe that you can
and really try.
Yeah, yeah, it's pretty mucheverything.
A lot of the training isisometric.
So say a horseshoe, if you'regoing to try to bend it, you
(25:05):
take one that's currentlyslightly above your
capabilities, that's not goingto move and you try your
absolute hardest to move thisthing and you just give it
everything you got pushing andpulling and that's pretty much
how you train for all thatstuff.
You'd be surprised how quicklyyour strength shoots up when you
(25:28):
train like that.
Elizabeth (25:29):
And then what inspired you to go for the
Guinness World Record?
You just figured you starteddoing this and you found it.
Todd (25:37):
Yeah, it was actually a pre existing one already.
That's pretty much how ithappened.
I was like, if you want toestablish yourself as a strong
man, there's no strong manschool, you can't get a degree
in strongmanism.
So you gotta build up some kindof credentials somehow.
So I figured that might be agood way.
Elizabeth (25:55):
And what was the record prior to your--
Todd (25:58):
It was empty.
Nobody had it, but it was there.
So I took it.
Elizabeth (26:01):
Wow.
What was that process then?
You invite a judge to come watchyou?
Todd (26:07):
Guinness is pretty involved.
Their process is not light.
It's very, very rigid, verydetailed.
I actually did it at the YorkBarbell Company in York,
Pennsylvania, which is a veryprominent company in the history
of bodybuilding andweightlifting and strongman
(26:27):
stuff.
So it was super, super cool thatI was able to do it there.
But, I think I had to have fivepeople that were not related to
me, that weren't biased towardsme.
Yeah.
And, I had to bend it withinvery specific measurements,
that's what really made itdifficult.
Cause if I was just bending iton my own in front of an
(26:48):
audience, probably could havedone more.
They wanted it specific.
So it took a lot more time andit was very involved.
Everything needs to be recordedand right down to the very
finest detail.
And it's pretty involved.
Really weeds out a lot of peoplethat might want to just take a
shot at it.
Elizabeth (27:06):
So how many did you do in a minute?
What was your record?
I did three.
And I'm going to beat it.
Oh, so no one has challengedyou?
No one has beaten it?
Todd (27:15):
No, not yet.
I usually don't publicize it toomuch.
I don't want anybody getting anyideas.
Elizabeth (27:22):
That is so awesome.
It must feel great to have aworld record.
Todd (27:26):
It's pretty cool.
Elizabeth (27:27):
So what else does it mean to be a strongman?
What else do you do with it?
You're a public speaker, right?
Todd (27:32):
In a public speaking capacity, I usually talk about
perseverance and the importanceof it.
Cause I think that's easily oneof the most important traits a
person can possibly have.
So, I'll use the feats asphysical examples to illustrate
what I'm talking about and thepower of perseverance.
A lot of people think bendingsteel is almost impossible or
(27:55):
impossible and I can do it.
And I didn't just pick up apiece of steel and bend it like
it was no big deal.
It took me really long time,seemingly no progress
whatsoever.
And, I use that as an example ofevery time you perseverance and
keep going, do not stop nomatter what.
And a lot of times you're notgoing to see progress.
(28:17):
If you have a really worthwhilegoal, you're probably not going
to see progress for a while, butdon't stop.
Keep going.
That's the way it's supposed tobe.
That's the way any kind ofworthwhile goal is going to be.
Elizabeth (28:30):
When you say a long time, how long did it take you
before you started to see anyprogress in
Todd (28:34):
bending steel?
It depends on where you'restarting from.
If you're starting from when Ipersonally started trying to do
it, talking years.
Years.
Wow! Yeah.
Once I found my coach that couldreally get me to hone in and do
it, probably about like half ayear of consistent every day
(28:55):
picking up a piece of steel andjust trying my hardest to bend
it and not bending it.
About probably a good half ayear.
Elizabeth (29:02):
But that's incredible that you would stick, any person
would stick with something for afew years without seeing
physical signs of progress.
I mean, that really shows acommitment and a determination.
I don't think most people wouldstick with anything a few weeks
without seeing something.
So that says something aboutyou.
Todd (29:22):
That's the one thing that I__ perseverance, just don't
stop.
I've read a lot of books tryingto get where I am and a lot of
autobiographies aboutsignificant people, famous
people and for a long time Itried to figure out if maybe
there was one thing that all ofthese successful people had in
(29:45):
common that they cite as being abig part of their success.
I kid you not all of them, everysingle person I ever read about,
perseverance, they would citeperseverance.
So just don't stop.
That might not get you to thevery top of what you're trying
to do, but perseverance alone,just not stopping when many
(30:06):
other people might, that's goingto get you somewhere.
Elizabeth (30:09):
It's so interesting you say that because I hear that
over and over again on thispodcast because I talk to people
who have done these reallyinteresting, unique things.
And the common theme how theygot there is they didn't give
up.
And clearly many of them maybehad a innate talent, you know,
the guy who won an Olympicmedal.
But these people accomplishedtheir thing because they hit the
(30:31):
wall, they found something thatwas hard but they still kept
going.
So it is that perseverance.
That is the thing.
Todd (30:38):
I swear by it.
And my career in stunts is proofof that as well.
I'm not the most elite levelstunt person in the world.
I'm not.
I'll be the first to admit that.
I just didn't stop.
And along the way, I saw otherpeople that were probably way
more talented than I am, butit's hard and it's long and it's
a hard road and they gave up.
(30:59):
It's the only reason I'm outdoing it, and they're not.
Elizabeth (31:01):
You have to want it, whatever the it is, and you have
to believe in yourself and youhave to not give up.
Todd (31:08):
Not give up.
Yeah.
And, uh, if you're not in yourideal space in life, don't look
at it like you're screwing upright now because you're not
there.
It's all part of it.
Don't look at it in a negativelight that you are not exactly
where you want to be.
Just keep trying.
That's all.
Elizabeth (31:27):
Yes.
I was just talking about thatwith someone else.
I think sometimes there's thisexpectation, especially when
you're younger, maybe yourteenage years or in your
twenties, that somehow there'sthis thing, you need to get the
thing, like get into the certaincollege, get the certain job.
And then your life is going tobe...
I don't know, you've made it andyou're like at this plateau as
opposed to the reality is thatlife is ups and downs, these
(31:50):
swirls, ups and downs.
That's the reality that youshould come to expect.
And then you won't bedisappointed when it starts
having these peaks and valleysbecause that's everybody's life.
It's not just this like plateauof, Oh, I've made it to this
promised land of, my happy placebecause you're going to have
some challenges and that's howit goes.
Todd (32:10):
It doesn't go away.
Even if you do accomplisheverything you've ever wanted to
accomplish, the hard times don'tgo away.
So don't worry about it.
Just expect it to be there anddeal with it as it comes.
Elizabeth (32:23):
And then you usually find other things that you want
to do.
Now you have a successful careerin stunt work and you wrote a
screenplay.
That's another thing that cameto you that you want to do.
We kind of create new thingsthat we want to do.
Like that's the beauty of beinghuman, right?
We find new things to reach for.
Todd (32:40):
Absolutely.
That's another thing I use inthe feats of strength for in my
public speaking engagements.
Once you accomplish this onecrazy goal that maybe you once
thought was impossible, or atleast really hard, and all of a
sudden you do it, and that justkind of sets the bar for where
you are in life, and you'relike, oh, okay.
What else can I do?
(33:00):
And then, pull out the biggeriron steel bar or something like
that.
Something different than what Ijust did.
Once you set the bar forsomething that you once thought
was impossible, it totally opensyou up to an entire world of
possibilities.
And you start wondering, cool,what else can I do?
Elizabeth (33:17):
So are you physically training kind of every day, like
weightlifting and stuff likethat, to keep in shape for the
work?
Todd (33:24):
Yeah, I don't really lift weights in the traditional
sense.
I have to work specifically onthe strong man stuff, so I'll
bend the bars and do all thespecific feats that I do in
front of people, but for my ownoverall athleticism and stuff
like that, I generally stick tobody weight kind of stuff.
A lot of pushups, squats, thatkind of stuff.
(33:45):
Calisthenics.
I always gravitate back to thatstuff.
You don't need any equipment.
There's no excuses.
You don't have to go to the gym.
You don't need any piece ofequipment at all.
The floor is right there.
You just get to work.
The sky's the limit with thatkind of stuff that you can do.
So even when I start working onother stuff for a while,
inevitably, I always come backto the body weight workouts.
Elizabeth (34:07):
You can do that when you're waiting in a trailer for
12 hours.
Todd (34:11):
Yup, absolutely.
Talking about the isometricstuff, pushing and pulling
against stuff, that's not goingto move.
I'll do that sometimes in mytrailer.
I'll grab ahold of my doorhandle or something, you know,
really give it what's forwithout ripping the door off or
anything.
Make sure it's sturdy first.
Elizabeth (34:29):
They'll be like, Oh, that Todd's here again.
There went the wall, now thedoor just went down.
Todd (34:34):
How did that happen?
Elizabeth (34:37):
Do you tend to work like a couple of times a week,
or does it just totally vary?
Todd (34:42):
It varies.
It's all over the place.
I might be busy for months onend.
Might not do anything for acouple weeks, everything in
between.
The only consistency with thework is that there's no
scheduling at all.
Anything could happen.
I'm used to it.
Elizabeth (34:58):
Don't plan for the weekend because you might be
working that weekend and thenyou'll have a few weeks off.
Todd (35:04):
People don't understand that I can't, you know, they
want me to commit, like, Oh, I'mhaving a party in three weeks.
can tell you that I'm coming,and that means kind of nothing,
because I might be gone in threeweeks.
Like, I have no idea.
People get mad at me for that,but I promise it's not because
I'm being a jerk.
I just don't know.
Elizabeth (35:24):
It's the life of, what do actors sometimes say?
We live in the circus orsomething?
You just have to go with theflow.
Todd (35:30):
I wish I lived in the circus.
That would be awesome.
Elizabeth (35:34):
That's your next career.
Add it to your list of work.
Todd (35:37):
We'll see.
Elizabeth (35:38):
The strongman in the circus.
I can see it.
Yeah, used to be more of athing.
Not quite as much anymore.
Yeah.
Well, thank you so much.
It's been really interesting andfun and, appreciate all your
time, Todd.
Thank you.
Todd (35:52):
Likewise.
Thank you for having me.
I appreciate it.
Elizabeth (35:58):
One thing I really appreciate about doing these
interviews is that so often theconversations take these
unexpected, delightful turns.
Here I was talking to a stuntmanstrongman and we end up talking
about perseverance and shiftinglife goals.
People are amazing.
Here are some of my takeawaysfrom my conversation with Todd
Jones.
Number one (36:18):
If there's something you want to do, go for it.
Make yourself visible.
Contact the casting agent.
Tell people you're available.
You'll never get the dream jobjust sitting on your couch.
Two (36:29):
In any profession, focus on the things you can control.
Being on time, being kind, beingresponsible, being someone
others like to be around.
Show people you care and thatyou're not taking the job for
granted.
Three (36:43):
the first step to doing anything, including bending
steel with your bare hands, ismental.
Believe you can, and get rid oflimitations.
Four (36:52):
the next step to achieving anything is perseverance.
Most people will give up, so bethe anomaly who keeps going,
even with the inevitablehardships.
And finally, number five: there's no mountaintop of (37:02):
undefined
success to reach.
Continue to raise the bar, so tospeak, to keep life challenging
and interesting.
My thanks to Todd Jones forsharing his experiences and his
inspiration with me.
For more information about Todd,check out the show notes for
this episode.
If you want to listen to moreinterviews with people who work
in the entertainment industry,check out episode 23 with Ken
(37:25):
Fuchs, the director of"TheBachelor" and"The Bachelorette,"
as well as"Shark Tank,""FamilyFeud," and other shows.
And episode 15 with AcademyAward-winning documentary
filmmaker, Dan Sturman.
You can find these episodes onour website, whatitsliketo.net
and anywhere you get podcasts.
Oh, and we have a YouTubechannel now too, if you'd prefer
to watch this podcast withcaptions, It's
(37:47):
WhatItsLikeTo2023.
If you're not alreadysubscribing to this podcast,
please do.
And please tell a few friendsabout it too.
I'm Elizabeth Pearson Garr.
Thank you for being curiousabout what it's like.
You really just have to accept what is going to happen
and hope for the best.
You got to have at least somekind of pain tolerance to be in
the business.
It's gonna hurt, but you'reworking with really high level
professionals and you have apretty good idea that the least
level of damage possible isgoing to happen, whatever that
(00:30):
level is.
Elizabeth (00:34):
Hello, and welcome to "What It's Like To..." The
podcast that lets you walk insomeone else's shoes and live
vicariously through their uniqueexperiences.
I'm your host, formerjournalist.
Elizabeth Pearson Garr.
And each episode, I'll be askinga new interviewee all the what,
why, when, and wheres of howthey do what they do.
(00:54):
If they can do it, so can you.
We're all impressed when we'rewatching a movie or a TV show
and someone goes tumbling offthe side of a building or jumps
a motorcycle over a ravine orsomething like that.
But we also know it's notusually the A-list actor who's
doing that work.
(01:15):
It's a stuntman or a stuntwoman.
Todd Jones has been aprofessional actor, stuntman,
and he also happens to be astrongman.
He holds the world record forbending horseshoes.
We'll find out all about thattoo.
So Todd, welcome to my podcast.
Todd (01:30):
Thank you.
Thank you for having me.
Elizabeth (01:31):
I'm so glad to have you here.
I think these are all suchinteresting things that you do
and definitely fall into mycategory of unusual and
intriguing things that most ofus will never do in our lives.
Todd (01:42):
I have been called unusual.
Yes.
Elizabeth (01:46):
In the best of ways, in the best of ways.
How did you, get into such,unusual, let's just keep with
that word line of work.
You started as an actor?
Todd (01:55):
Yeah, yeah, I started as a struggling actor.
I couldn't sing or dance oranything good like that to get
myself hired.
So I had to figure out a way tomake myself stand out.
I had a martial arts background,so I used to get beat up all the
time.
I figured I had a good paintolerance, like I'll go to stunt
school and I'll make myselfstand out by being an actor who
(02:17):
can really for real do his ownstunts.
Elizabeth (02:20):
So there's actual school that you go to?
There are, yeah, not many andeven the one that I went to
closed up shop a long time ago,so.
I would say most stunt peopledon't go that route, but some of
us did, and, it worked.
One of the best decisions Imade.
What kinds of things do theyteach you there?
Todd (02:39):
Uh, pretty much what you would expect.
You get set on fire safely.
Obviously.
Learn how to fall down a bigflight of stairs, which was
actually my first kind of bigjob that I got hired for
afterwards.
So that was gold right there.
Um, fighting for film, prettymuch typical high falls, you
know, how to fall off ofbuildings safely and stuff like
(03:01):
that.
Any kind of typical stunt thatyou can do.
Elizabeth (03:04):
Typical everyday run of the mill.
So can you pull back the curtainon a couple of these things?
Like how do you get lit on firesafely?
Or how do you fall down thestairs safely?
Todd (03:14):
Oh, getting set on fire?
It's an involved process.
You need teams of, the highestlevel professionals, which I'm
fortunate to be friends with.
It involves a lot of fireretardant clothing and, gel,
basically, and, there's layersupon layers and ways you do it
and, everything's done to theutmost.
(03:35):
I mean, that gel goes ineverywhere and it's usually
freezing cold and, any stuntperson that's been lit on fire
will tell you that by the timeyou're ready to go, you're
shivering and shaking.
So you're like, just, justplease set me on fire again.
You know, you just want to getwarmed up somehow.
Elizabeth (03:52):
You only do it once I assume, or do you have to do
multiple takes of these things?
Not necessarily.
it's such an involved anddangerous thing that that's the
goal.
You definitely only want to doit once.
But you know, if they didn't getthe take and everybody's okay,
which is how it should be, thenyou know, you might have to do
it again.
Producers definitely don't wantto do it again because I get
(04:15):
paid every single time I get liton fire.
So, they try to make absolutelysure that, uh, once and done.
So then the falling down thestairs, falling off a tall
building, something like that,falling off a train, are those
all similar skill sets?
Todd (04:30):
Um, I've never fallen off a train.
Um, yes and no.
There's a certain way that youhave to fall from like a
building, a high fall.
Basically, the most importantthing is you want to land
properly.
When you're at that height, evenwhen you're hitting whatever
you're hitting, the airbag orwhatever, if you land
(04:50):
improperly,
Elizabeth (04:51):
You hurt your spine.
Todd (04:53):
It's dangerous.
Yeah, your spine, your head,whichever.
Yeah, exactly.
You're falling from a highplace, just like any other.
Elizabeth (04:59):
Yeah.
Todd (04:59):
The stairfalls, I say safely, you're pretty much just
falling down the stairs.
Basically, you want to go into aroll.
You're going down pretty fast.
So, hopefully, less of your bodyactually makes contact with
every single stair.
But you pad up as much as youpossibly can and you just kind
of, and you go for it.
Elizabeth (05:20):
But you are wearing a lot of padding as if you're like
in sporting event?
Todd (05:23):
If you can.
It depends on what the scenecall for like, uh, women.
Hats off to them ever since thebeginning of movies, you know,
you're wearing skirts andsleeveless stuff.
And they pretty much typicallyhave a lot less, uh, you know,
their outfits don't allow themto put on a lot of padding a lot
of times.
So.
A lot of times they just gottagrit their teeth and do it, you
(05:47):
know?
Elizabeth (05:47):
Do they sometimes try to shoot it at certain angles?
So they're not seeing the facesas much so they can match the
actor?
Todd (05:55):
Yeah they do.
And we all inherently like tryto hide our faces as best we can
usually.
That also depends on if you'redoubling somebody.
If you're doubling somebody,then you definitely don't want
to have your face seen.
But, you also get a lot of jobswhere you're not doubling
somebody and I'll be some guyfalling down and I don't have to
(06:15):
necessarily hide it.
Elizabeth (06:16):
So let's go back.
You mentioned that your firstpart as a stunt man was falling
down stairs.
Do you remember getting thatpart, what it felt like to get
the call and then to actually doit?
What was that like?
Todd (06:28):
It was awesome.
It was on a soap opera back whensoap operas were still a thing.
I had worked on it some bitparts before I got into stunts.
Elizabeth (06:39):
So you had acted on it.
Todd (06:40):
Yeah, So I knew the casting director and once I did
get into stunts, you know, I'mtrying to do whatever I can to
get myself out there.
So I contacted that castingdirector.
I was like, Hey, I know it's asoap opera.
It's not like a action movie,but I was like, Hey, if anything
comes up, I'm into stunts now,here you go.
And it was just fortuitoustiming.
(07:01):
He was like, as a matter offact, we got something, we might
be able to use you for.
One of the actors was doing astair fall down the stairs and
they needed somebody to do it.
So I just happened to, dumbluck, get my name in there at
the right time.
And, the coordinator at the timewas a guy named BH Barry, who is
very well known in the Broadwayworld.
(07:22):
He does a lot of fightchoreography for, Broadway shows
and stuff like that.
And yeah, he was like, cool, Idid it, got the job, did the
stair fall, which was way morepleasant than the stairs that I
had actually trained and learnedon.
They were these horrible ricketysharp stairs, so I just assumed
that's what stairs felt like.
(07:43):
These were these nice smoothmetal, so it actually went off
without a hitch.
I got up and got a round ofapplause from the entire crew
and everything.
I was like, yes, okay, this is.
Elizabeth (07:52):
Great.
I can do this.
Yeah, and so that got it rollingso to speak that got the stunt
career going.
Todd (07:59):
Sort of.
You want to know the one thatkind of really got it Rolling?
Yeah.
That was on"The Newsroom." Didyou ever watch"The Newsroom"
with Jeff Daniels?
Elizabeth (08:08):
I saw your clip.
I watched it.
Todd (08:10):
That was kind of the one.
A part had come up where theywanted an actor who could share
the screen with Jeff Daniels,but who could also really do his
own stunts.
Like I got my material in there.
And yeah, I got that part.
That was kind of the one thatgot me because, the coordinator
for that show did other shows inNew York.
(08:32):
So, B.H Barry, the guy I justtold you about, he's more a
theater guy, so he didn't reallydo any other TV stuff.
This was a TV show, andcoordinator from that show hired
me for other shows where I metthis person after, so that was
really kind of the one thatstarted snowballing into my
career as it is today.
And Terry Crews was in that too?
(08:53):
Yeah.
Am I right?
So anyone who watches"America'sGot Talent." one of my favourite
people, To this day, one of myfavorite people I've ever worked
with, Terry Crews is awesome.
Elizabeth (09:03):
But it's a rough scene.
I mean, it really looks likeyou're getting really beat up.
It's tough.
I don't know how people who careabout you can watch these
things.
It's pretty incredible to see.
Are you really hurt at the endof these things?
I know,
Todd (09:16):
That one, I took a beating on that one.
Elizabeth (09:18):
I'm going to post a link to that clip in the show
notes so people can watch.
Cause it's really impressivewhat you go through.
Todd (09:25):
Thank you.
That was an intense day becauseI had a lot of lines and stuff
and we're out in the middle ofManhattan.
Noisy, I can't hear.
I think I spoke over JeffDaniels a couple of times
unintentionally, which he didnot appreciate.
But, you know, we got throughit.
So I'm all jazzed up.
Here I am with these stars andI'm like, Aah.
(09:45):
Trying to remember my lines andhit my marks so that everything
goes smoothly while I'm about toeat a pain sandwich.
So I had a lot going on thatday.
Elizabeth (09:57):
And you said you were pretty bruised up at the end.
Todd (09:59):
That one, yes.
For anybody that watches theclip, I do, I go BAM and I hit
the cement really hard.
We did that a lot of times.
I remember they had me smokingclove cigarettes cause I didn't
want to smoke a real cigarettecause I hate smoking, but it's
like, I'll do a clove, whatever.
And in the scene, I snuffed thebutt out right there.
(10:19):
And I knew how many times we didit,'cause all the butts were
right there.
Elizabeth (10:23):
Oh!
Todd (10:23):
In the
Elizabeth (10:24):
beginning.
Todd (10:24):
It was a lot.
It was like over 10 times I hadto do that.
Wow!
Elizabeth (10:28):
Head into the cement.
Todd (10:30):
Yeah,
Elizabeth (10:31):
Wow.
Todd (10:31):
but I did it, and, I'm still working now, so I guess I
did okay.
Elizabeth (10:35):
Yeah! So, can you take us into kind of your head
space before a shoot like that?
If you're backstage or in adressing room or something?
How do you get yourself preparedmentally and physically, for
these roles and for thesestunts.
Todd (10:50):
Usually you don't, to be honest.
I'll tell you what almost alwayshappens.
They'll call you in for somestunt.
Hours and hours and hours beforeyou actually do it, so you know,
an entire day goes by and you'rejust sitting in your trailer or
whatever, and you start gettingtired and relaxed.
(11:11):
And then when it's time, like,okay, go, go, go, like, come on,
get them and you, got to go outand you're just...
So you really just have toaccept what is going to happen
and hope for the best.
And like I said, you got to haveat least some kind of pain
tolerance to be in the business.
It's gonna hurt, but you'reworking with really high level
(11:31):
professionals and you have apretty good idea that the least
level of damage possible isgoing to happen, whatever that
level is.
Elizabeth (11:41):
Have you ever turned down a job because it sounds
like it's too, I hate to use theword, scary to someone who's...
Todd (11:48):
No, it's okay.
No, not really.
Not that I can think of.
Elizabeth (11:52):
Hmm.
You'll just take it on.
Whatever they ask for, you'llprep for.
Todd (11:56):
Yeah, because usually, almost all the time, the
coordinator that's going to hireyou knows you, so he has a
pretty good idea of what you'recapable of.
And for the most part acoordinator is not going to hire
you for something that theythemselves wouldn't do.
To be a stunt professional inthe first place, why are you in
(12:17):
it if you're going to turnsomething down.
Elizabeth (12:19):
Can you give me an example of one of the most
intricate or involved stuntsthat you've done on screen?
Todd (12:27):
Uh, there's two that come to mind.
One that most people say, yeah,that's the one: getting set on
fire.
If you do call it a full burn,you know, from head to toe,
you're just completely engulfedin flames.
That's one of the most dangerousstunts you can do period.
Elizabeth (12:43):
Wow.
That was just part of the story?
The character was in a fire.
And so
Todd (12:48):
Uh, yeah, the biggest one I ever did was on"The Blacklist"
and, the character Liz shoots aguy with a flare gun.
So he goes, I mean, I was told Ihad 15 foot flames coming off me
from the top of my head.
It was a pretty cool one.
And a little more recently, Iwas on a show called"Evil" with
Mike Cotter and I'm playing apriest and we're trying to
(13:11):
subdue this guy who's possessedby this demon, but of course
he's got superhuman strength.
We're on a bed and he goes POW!And he kicks me off and I fly 20
feet through the air into awall.
Elizabeth (13:23):
How did that work?
How do you?
Todd (13:25):
Uh, it's a wire gag, so I had a harness on with a wire
attached that actually went upthrough the ceiling next to the
wall.
Like, the wire was here, and thewall was here.
And a couple of guys are on theother side of the wall, and when
action calls, they jump off aladder.
I go, pew! I'm not a huge guy,but I'm not a small guy.
(13:46):
I'm about 210 pounds.
And they launched me like I wasnothing.
And, that was a pretty crazyone.
You get paid for every time youdo a stunt.
So, as a stunt person, you wantto do things as much as your
body can take.
But, I was glad that I only didthat once.
That was a pretty good thumper.
Elizabeth (14:05):
You thumped right into the wall.
Todd (14:07):
I thumped right into the wall and it was a reinforced
wall because during the, uh,rehearsal I actually broke the
wall.
Elizabeth (14:14):
Oh my gosh, Todd.
Todd (14:18):
And fixed it up so that wouldn't happen anymore.
It was slightly hard.
Yeah.
Elizabeth (14:23):
So you do have rehearsals on these things.
Todd (14:25):
Sometimes, oftentimes you don't, for something like that
you do, because you know,there's rigging involved and a
lot of stuff you have to workout, but a stunt person's bread
and butter for a lot of us is,you know, we'll be, cop number
one or bad guy number one orwhatever and we get shot we fall
down or we get punched and wefall down etc etc so a lot of
(14:46):
times you don't rehearse forthat stuff because it's pretty
simple and as a professionalit's expected that you can at
least do something simple likethat without rehearsal.
Elizabeth (14:56):
So is it as competitive as it is in the
acting world to get the stuntjobs?
Todd (15:02):
Competitive yes but it's also a lot smaller, it's way,
way, way smaller.
So if you do get in, you know,the odds of making a career are
lot better than in the actingworld for sure.
Elizabeth (15:16):
And is it similar to acting that you have an agent
who goes and sends you out onauditions or you--
Todd (15:21):
No, no, you get hired directly by the coordinator
usually.
Elizabeth (15:26):
Oh Okay.
Todd (15:27):
It's a pretty tight knit community.
Especially in the specifictowns.
Like I usually work in New York.
So if you work in New York, youpretty much know the entire
stunt community of New York,Atlanta, Georgia is another one.
And then out in LA, so there'scertain kinds of hubs.
That's where the stuntcommunities live.
Elizabeth (15:46):
So you wouldn't fly to a movie set or something like
that?
Todd (15:50):
I do on occasion.
Sometimes that does happen.
Yeah.
But, more often than not, likesolid 95 percent of my work is
New York or the surroundingareas out there, Jersey.
I live in Pennsylvania.
So sometimes I work inPennsylvania.
Elizabeth (16:05):
I spent some time on some sets.
I lived in LA..
twice in my, life.
And, I worked for E!Entertainment News.
And so we did like behind thescenes stories.
And I even worked as an extrasometimes on some shows.
And it's just incredible whenyou're on those sets to see how
many people are involved to makeTV and movies work.
And so, you really get anappreciation for how many
(16:28):
directors, producers, crew and,craft services and costume
people.
I mean, there's so many peoplethat are involved to make these
shows work.
Todd (16:37):
Yeah, totally.
I always recommend if anybody'strying to get into the business,
working at least a few times asa background as an extra because
it not only gives you thatperspective, just, gives you a
pretty good taste of, whether ornot you might really like it,
you know, the realities of beingon a set and stuff like that.
Elizabeth (16:57):
Like you mentioned earlier, there's a lot of
downtime, you're not justgetting called, and then all of
a sudden you're on.
You might have a whole day whereyou're not working and then
they're calling you the next dayor something you have to really
enjoy set time and be ready togo when they need you.
I know that you're an actoralso, but let's just stick on
the stuntman side of things.
What are other qualities thatsomeone needs?
(17:19):
Obviously, physicality and asense of being willing to go for
it.
But are there other things thatyou think if someone were
interested in this line of work,what would they need?
Todd (17:28):
Uh...
Professionalism big time.
Anything that you are in controlof, being responsive, being on
time, all that stuff.
Huge.
So so important.
You cannot slack in those areasat all.
Word will get around and that'sreally bad.
Elizabeth (17:47):
Great tip.
Todd (17:48):
And, believe it or not, just being, if not cool to be
around, being tolerable to bearound, you know, don't, don't
be always talking.
Like we were just saying, thedays are long.
Twelve, 14 hour days, that's notout of the question at all.
That's very normal.
So, do you think a coordinatorwants to hire somebody that's
(18:10):
going to annoy them all day?
Like, no, you gotta makeyourself be cool to be around
for 12 to 14 hours at a shot.
That's huge.
Elizabeth (18:19):
Yeah.
Or ask, When is this day goingto be over?
When are we up?
No! Be patient!
Todd (18:25):
Oh, yeah.
Yeah, for sure.
I think, honestly, that'sprobably one of my stronger
qualities.
There's a lot of more talentedstunt people than I am that
might not get the job becausethe coordinator doesn't like
being around them for that long.
So, anything that you arepersonally in control of, be in
control of it and make yourselfsomebody that somebody wants to
(18:48):
hire.
Elizabeth (18:49):
That's such great advice that someone could use in
whatever they're doing.
My kids are both in high schoolnow, and I sometimes think,
There is a lot of course thatyou can learn in a classroom and
that will apply to whatever youdo in real life.
But there's so many other thingsthat are just life skills and
things like you're saying, beingon time, being respectful, being
(19:09):
kind to people, those are thesesort of soft skills that are
going to apply to everything youdo, your work life, your
personal life, your social life,being in a grocery store, like
these are all things that aregoing to help you just be a
better citizen and a betterperson in life.
And by the way, they're going tohelp you in your career, even if
you're not trying to use them,you know, in a manipulative way,
(19:34):
but you really need to work onthese things.
They all matter.
Todd (19:38):
I agree.
Show'em you care.
Show them that you want it andyou're not taking it for
granted.
Elizabeth (19:43):
Anything.
Yeah.
Is it hard though?
Because it's hard on your body,this job.
Is there a shelf life?
Is there a time that stuntpeople tend to say, I can't keep
doing this any longer.
This is kind of a youngerperson's game.
Todd (19:56):
Yes and no.
I think it depends on people'spersonal aspirations.
A lot of people will try to getinto the stunt coordinating
Elizabeth (20:05):
field.
Todd (20:06):
That's kind of a natural next step for a lot of people.
A lot of people do think, I'mgetting too old for this, but I
know a lot of people that don't.
I know guys in their 50s and 60sthat are still doing it and they
have no intention of stopping.
It's pretty much the individual.
But yeah, there's the obviousrealities.
I'm only in my 40s and hittingthe ground now is not the same
(20:27):
as it was when I was in my 20s.
Elizabeth (20:29):
What's your hope?
Do you want to just keep doingit as long as you can?
Todd (20:32):
As long as I can, yes.
And I also just wrote my firstscript, my first screenplay.
So there's some activity goingon with that right now, believe
it or not.
Elizabeth (20:43):
How exciting.
Congratulations.
Todd (20:46):
Thank you.
Elizabeth (20:47):
Do you watch the things that you perform in?
Todd (20:49):
If I did something cool in it, yeah, I'll try to check it
out and see how it turned out,if I did some kind of cool
stunt.
Elizabeth (20:56):
What do you think when you see it?
Is it a totally differentexperience than it was for you
being in it?
Todd (21:01):
No, not usually, not at this point.
It's usually the same.
Elizabeth (21:05):
What does your wife or your kids think when they see
you?
Todd (21:08):
My kids are 16 now.
I've been a stuntman their wholelife.
So that doesn't even phase themanymore.
They'll acknowledge that it'scool and then they will quickly
go back to whatever it was theywere doing.
Yeah.
Yeah, it's interesting with mystrongman stuff, you know, I'm
bending steel and all this crazystuff that does not faze them at
all.
They're like, yes, we know youcan do that.
(21:29):
They don't care.
My fiancé, we've only beenengaged for a little over a
year, so I'm not sure if she'sstill impressed by anything or
not.
Elizabeth (21:38):
Does she get worried though?
Todd (21:40):
Yeah.
Yeah, she does.
And I'm up front with her too,like that one that I told you
about where I got launchedacross the room into the wall.
I was honest with her.
I'm like.
This one might hurt.
Might get hurt on this one.
So maybe I won't do thatanymore, but yeah, she gets
worried.
Elizabeth (21:57):
Yeah, I guess just like professional athletes.
You got to take the bumps andbruises and come home and do
some ice baths.
Todd (22:04):
Sometimes it seems like it doesn't register with people
when they know I'm a stuntmanand then I tell them what I'm
doing.
They're like, Oh, they reactlike, like, are you crazy?
You know, you know what I do,right?
That is the job.
Elizabeth (22:19):
So you mentioned the strongman work and the bending
steel.
This is what I read and I justcan't believe it.
See, I, you need to describe it,but you set a Guinness world
record for taking horseshoes andbending them.
Todd (22:31):
Yeah.
Elizabeth (22:31):
Bending them into hearts?
Todd (22:33):
Yeah.
It's called hearting ahorseshoe.
Yeah.
It's a specific move that you dowith it.
Most hearted horseshoes in oneminute for the Guinness world
record.
Yep.
Actually, I was recently on apodcast and I did one for him.
So there's one.
Elizabeth (22:48):
Oh my goodness.
All right.
So it's really, it's mindblowing how you can just do this
stuff.
So take me back.
How did all this get started?
I mean, clearly you're strong.
How did you decide, all right, Iwant to start bending steel.
What was the inspiration here?
Todd (23:05):
So I'm no stronger than anybody else.
I think everybody in the worldis way stronger than they think
they are.
I just, purposely tapped intoit, but it all started.
You familiar with kettlebells,you know what kettlebells are?
are.
Elizabeth (23:21):
Yes.
Todd (23:21):
Kettlebells are actually very old, but they fell out of
favor and there was a resurgencein like the late 90s early
2000s.
So the guy that kind ofspearheaded that is a guy named
Pavel Tsatsouline who has abunch of books really great
training manuals that I used toread and in his books he's
always referencing these oldtime strongmen from the late
(23:43):
1800s and early 1900s, and yousaid the word mind blowing.
That's exactly the word I used.
You read about what these guyswere doing.
You're like, Holy smokes!They're bending steel and
breaking chains and all thesecrazy feats of strength and I
don't know, I think maybe it wasbecause I grew up as a comic
(24:03):
book geek.
I always liked superheroes orsomething.
These guys just seemed likeborderline superhuman.
So I don't know.
It just clicked.
A lot of people see pictures ofSchwarzenegger or whatever, and
that's what inspires them totrain.
I saw pictures of these guysdoing that stuff, and I just
wanted to learn how to do it.
I thought that was awesome.
It took me a long time trying tofigure things out myself,
(24:25):
reading all these old manualsfrom the 1800s and stuff.
Finally found a coach, one ofthe best guys in the world at
that kind of stuff.
Started training under him andnow I can do a lot of that stuff
that I would read about.
Elizabeth (24:39):
Is it a lot of hand and finger strength?
Todd (24:42):
Yeah,
Elizabeth (24:43):
To be able to do this?
Todd (24:44):
Yeah, it's really everything.
Not even just physical.
You have to go there mentallyand not think about any kind of
limitations and get in the rightmindset and believe that you can
and really try.
Yeah, yeah, it's pretty mucheverything.
A lot of the training isisometric.
So say a horseshoe, if you'regoing to try to bend it, you
(25:05):
take one that's currentlyslightly above your
capabilities, that's not goingto move and you try your
absolute hardest to move thisthing and you just give it
everything you got pushing andpulling and that's pretty much
how you train for all thatstuff.
You'd be surprised how quicklyyour strength shoots up when you
(25:28):
train like that.
Elizabeth (25:29):
And then what inspired you to go for the
Guinness World Record?
You just figured you starteddoing this and you found it.
Todd (25:37):
Yeah, it was actually a pre existing one already.
That's pretty much how ithappened.
I was like, if you want toestablish yourself as a strong
man, there's no strong manschool, you can't get a degree
in strongmanism.
So you gotta build up some kindof credentials somehow.
So I figured that might be agood way.
Elizabeth (25:55):
And what was the record prior to your--
Todd (25:58):
It was empty.
Nobody had it, but it was there.
So I took it.
Elizabeth (26:01):
Wow.
What was that process then?
You invite a judge to come watchyou?
Todd (26:07):
Guinness is pretty involved.
Their process is not light.
It's very, very rigid, verydetailed.
I actually did it at the YorkBarbell Company in York,
Pennsylvania, which is a veryprominent company in the history
of bodybuilding andweightlifting and strongman
(26:27):
stuff.
So it was super, super cool thatI was able to do it there.
But, I think I had to have fivepeople that were not related to
me, that weren't biased towardsme.
Yeah.
And, I had to bend it withinvery specific measurements,
that's what really made itdifficult.
Cause if I was just bending iton my own in front of an
(26:48):
audience, probably could havedone more.
They wanted it specific.
So it took a lot more time andit was very involved.
Everything needs to be recordedand right down to the very
finest detail.
And it's pretty involved.
Really weeds out a lot of peoplethat might want to just take a
shot at it.
Elizabeth (27:06):
So how many did you do in a minute?
What was your record?
I did three.
And I'm going to beat it.
Oh, so no one has challengedyou?
No one has beaten it?
Todd (27:15):
No, not yet.
I usually don't publicize it toomuch.
I don't want anybody getting anyideas.
Elizabeth (27:22):
That is so awesome.
It must feel great to have aworld record.
Todd (27:26):
It's pretty cool.
Elizabeth (27:27):
So what else does it mean to be a strongman?
What else do you do with it?
You're a public speaker, right?
Todd (27:32):
In a public speaking capacity, I usually talk about
perseverance and the importanceof it.
Cause I think that's easily oneof the most important traits a
person can possibly have.
So, I'll use the feats asphysical examples to illustrate
what I'm talking about and thepower of perseverance.
A lot of people think bendingsteel is almost impossible or
(27:55):
impossible and I can do it.
And I didn't just pick up apiece of steel and bend it like
it was no big deal.
It took me really long time,seemingly no progress
whatsoever.
And, I use that as an example ofevery time you perseverance and
keep going, do not stop nomatter what.
And a lot of times you're notgoing to see progress.
(28:17):
If you have a really worthwhilegoal, you're probably not going
to see progress for a while, butdon't stop.
Keep going.
That's the way it's supposed tobe.
That's the way any kind ofworthwhile goal is going to be.
Elizabeth (28:30):
When you say a long time, how long did it take you
before you started to see anyprogress in
Todd (28:34):
bending steel?
It depends on where you'restarting from.
If you're starting from when Ipersonally started trying to do
it, talking years.
Years.
Wow! Yeah.
Once I found my coach that couldreally get me to hone in and do
it, probably about like half ayear of consistent every day
(28:55):
picking up a piece of steel andjust trying my hardest to bend
it and not bending it.
About probably a good half ayear.
Elizabeth (29:02):
But that's incredible that you would stick, any person
would stick with something for afew years without seeing
physical signs of progress.
I mean, that really shows acommitment and a determination.
I don't think most people wouldstick with anything a few weeks
without seeing something.
So that says something aboutyou.
Todd (29:22):
That's the one thing that I__ perseverance, just don't
stop.
I've read a lot of books tryingto get where I am and a lot of
autobiographies aboutsignificant people, famous
people and for a long time Itried to figure out if maybe
there was one thing that all ofthese successful people had in
(29:45):
common that they cite as being abig part of their success.
I kid you not all of them, everysingle person I ever read about,
perseverance, they would citeperseverance.
So just don't stop.
That might not get you to thevery top of what you're trying
to do, but perseverance alone,just not stopping when many
(30:06):
other people might, that's goingto get you somewhere.
Elizabeth (30:09):
It's so interesting you say that because I hear that
over and over again on thispodcast because I talk to people
who have done these reallyinteresting, unique things.
And the common theme how theygot there is they didn't give
up.
And clearly many of them maybehad a innate talent, you know,
the guy who won an Olympicmedal.
But these people accomplishedtheir thing because they hit the
(30:31):
wall, they found something thatwas hard but they still kept
going.
So it is that perseverance.
That is the thing.
Todd (30:38):
I swear by it.
And my career in stunts is proofof that as well.
I'm not the most elite levelstunt person in the world.
I'm not.
I'll be the first to admit that.
I just didn't stop.
And along the way, I saw otherpeople that were probably way
more talented than I am, butit's hard and it's long and it's
a hard road and they gave up.
(30:59):
It's the only reason I'm outdoing it, and they're not.
Elizabeth (31:01):
You have to want it, whatever the it is, and you have
to believe in yourself and youhave to not give up.
Todd (31:08):
Not give up.
Yeah.
And, uh, if you're not in yourideal space in life, don't look
at it like you're screwing upright now because you're not
there.
It's all part of it.
Don't look at it in a negativelight that you are not exactly
where you want to be.
Just keep trying.
That's all.
Elizabeth (31:27):
Yes.
I was just talking about thatwith someone else.
I think sometimes there's thisexpectation, especially when
you're younger, maybe yourteenage years or in your
twenties, that somehow there'sthis thing, you need to get the
thing, like get into the certaincollege, get the certain job.
And then your life is going tobe...
I don't know, you've made it andyou're like at this plateau as
opposed to the reality is thatlife is ups and downs, these
(31:50):
swirls, ups and downs.
That's the reality that youshould come to expect.
And then you won't bedisappointed when it starts
having these peaks and valleysbecause that's everybody's life.
It's not just this like plateauof, Oh, I've made it to this
promised land of, my happy placebecause you're going to have
some challenges and that's howit goes.
Todd (32:10):
It doesn't go away.
Even if you do accomplisheverything you've ever wanted to
accomplish, the hard times don'tgo away.
So don't worry about it.
Just expect it to be there anddeal with it as it comes.
Elizabeth (32:23):
And then you usually find other things that you want
to do.
Now you have a successful careerin stunt work and you wrote a
screenplay.
That's another thing that cameto you that you want to do.
We kind of create new thingsthat we want to do.
Like that's the beauty of beinghuman, right?
We find new things to reach for.
Todd (32:40):
Absolutely.
That's another thing I use inthe feats of strength for in my
public speaking engagements.
Once you accomplish this onecrazy goal that maybe you once
thought was impossible, or atleast really hard, and all of a
sudden you do it, and that justkind of sets the bar for where
you are in life, and you'relike, oh, okay.
What else can I do?
(33:00):
And then, pull out the biggeriron steel bar or something like
that.
Something different than what Ijust did.
Once you set the bar forsomething that you once thought
was impossible, it totally opensyou up to an entire world of
possibilities.
And you start wondering, cool,what else can I do?
Elizabeth (33:17):
So are you physically training kind of every day, like
weightlifting and stuff likethat, to keep in shape for the
work?
Todd (33:24):
Yeah, I don't really lift weights in the traditional
sense.
I have to work specifically onthe strong man stuff, so I'll
bend the bars and do all thespecific feats that I do in
front of people, but for my ownoverall athleticism and stuff
like that, I generally stick tobody weight kind of stuff.
A lot of pushups, squats, thatkind of stuff.
(33:45):
Calisthenics.
I always gravitate back to thatstuff.
You don't need any equipment.
There's no excuses.
You don't have to go to the gym.
You don't need any piece ofequipment at all.
The floor is right there.
You just get to work.
The sky's the limit with thatkind of stuff that you can do.
So even when I start working onother stuff for a while,
inevitably, I always come backto the body weight workouts.
Elizabeth (34:07):
You can do that when you're waiting in a trailer for
12 hours.
Todd (34:11):
Yup, absolutely.
Talking about the isometricstuff, pushing and pulling
against stuff, that's not goingto move.
I'll do that sometimes in mytrailer.
I'll grab ahold of my doorhandle or something, you know,
really give it what's forwithout ripping the door off or
anything.
Make sure it's sturdy first.
Elizabeth (34:29):
They'll be like, Oh, that Todd's here again.
There went the wall, now thedoor just went down.
Todd (34:34):
How did that happen?
Elizabeth (34:37):
Do you tend to work like a couple of times a week,
or does it just totally vary?
Todd (34:42):
It varies.
It's all over the place.
I might be busy for months onend.
Might not do anything for acouple weeks, everything in
between.
The only consistency with thework is that there's no
scheduling at all.
Anything could happen.
I'm used to it.
Elizabeth (34:58):
Don't plan for the weekend because you might be
working that weekend and thenyou'll have a few weeks off.
Todd (35:04):
People don't understand that I can't, you know, they
want me to commit, like, Oh, I'mhaving a party in three weeks.
can tell you that I'm coming,and that means kind of nothing,
because I might be gone in threeweeks.
Like, I have no idea.
People get mad at me for that,but I promise it's not because
I'm being a jerk.
I just don't know.
Elizabeth (35:24):
It's the life of, what do actors sometimes say?
We live in the circus orsomething?
You just have to go with theflow.
Todd (35:30):
I wish I lived in the circus.
That would be awesome.
Elizabeth (35:34):
That's your next career.
Add it to your list of work.
Todd (35:37):
We'll see.
Elizabeth (35:38):
The strongman in the circus.
I can see it.
Yeah, used to be more of athing.
Not quite as much anymore.
Yeah.
Well, thank you so much.
It's been really interesting andfun and, appreciate all your
time, Todd.
Thank you.
Todd (35:52):
Likewise.
Thank you for having me.
I appreciate it.
Elizabeth (35:58):
One thing I really appreciate about doing these
interviews is that so often theconversations take these
unexpected, delightful turns.
Here I was talking to a stuntmanstrongman and we end up talking
about perseverance and shiftinglife goals.
People are amazing.
Here are some of my takeawaysfrom my conversation with Todd
Jones.
Number one (36:18):
If there's something you want to do, go for it.
Make yourself visible.
Contact the casting agent.
Tell people you're available.
You'll never get the dream jobjust sitting on your couch.
Two (36:29):
In any profession, focus on the things you can control.
Being on time, being kind, beingresponsible, being someone
others like to be around.
Show people you care and thatyou're not taking the job for
granted.
Three (36:43):
the first step to doing anything, including bending
steel with your bare hands, ismental.
Believe you can, and get rid oflimitations.
Four (36:52):
the next step to achieving anything is perseverance.
Most people will give up, so bethe anomaly who keeps going,
even with the inevitablehardships.
And finally, number five: there's no mountaintop of (37:02):
undefined
success to reach.
Continue to raise the bar, so tospeak, to keep life challenging
and interesting.
My thanks to Todd Jones forsharing his experiences and his
inspiration with me.
For more information about Todd,check out the show notes for
this episode.
If you want to listen to moreinterviews with people who work
in the entertainment industry,check out episode 23 with Ken
(37:25):
Fuchs, the director of"TheBachelor" and"The Bachelorette,"
as well as"Shark Tank,""FamilyFeud," and other shows.
And episode 15 with AcademyAward-winning documentary
filmmaker, Dan Sturman.
You can find these episodes onour website, whatitsliketo.net
and anywhere you get podcasts.
Oh, and we have a YouTubechannel now too, if you'd prefer
to watch this podcast withcaptions, It's
(37:47):
WhatItsLikeTo2023.
If you're not alreadysubscribing to this podcast,
please do.
And please tell a few friendsabout it too.
I'm Elizabeth Pearson Garr.
Thank you for being curiousabout what it's like.
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