April 17, 2024 • 30 mins
Interest in "tiny living" is getting bigger. But what is it, really--what are the benefits, and what do you sacrifice by "going small"? Tiny house enthusiast Laura Lynch shares what inspired her to trade in her 2300-square-foot house for a home about one-fifth that size; the process of downsizing ("do you own your stuff, or does your stuff own you?"); and the wonderfully supportive "tiny" community (of people living in not just small homes, but also vans, schoolies, RVs, and more). Laura also is a financial planner and helps others with the practical matters involved in transitioning their lifestyles. Going tiny gave Laura the freedom and opportunities to follow her passions--which she never would have had if she'd been locked in to paying off her big house for years and years. Laura is the host of a podcast called "Less House, More Moola."
In this episode:
02:06--What is tiny living?
05:21--The benefits of having less space
07:46--The process of downsizing: why do I get value out of these things?
11:55--Reasons why people "go tiny": finances, sustainability, simplicity, lifestyle, the housing shortage
14:43--Luxury elements included some tiny homes
15:36--Legalization of building tiny homes
18:50--People of all ages are going tiny
21:12--Focus on your values: what is really important to you?
25:03--Traits common to most tiny living enthusiasts
26:41--What Laura misses from her big house; comparing living in her big house to her tiny house
Want to know more about Laura?
- Check out her website: https://www.thetinyhouseadviser.com/
- Find her on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/thetinyhouseadviser/
- Touch base on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lesshousemoremoolapod/
- Link up on Linked In: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tinyhouseadviser/
- Listen to her podcast: https://www.youtube.com/@lesshousemoremoolapod
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:08):
I call it concentric circles ofchange.
When you are going tiny, it'sprobably not just your house.
You're probably not moving intoa tiny house across town.
You're probably doing it to dosome travel or to live in a
different place.
And so you've got to figure outwhat you're doing with your
career.
What you're doing with yourfamily, like all of those layers
are involved.
(00:32):
Hello, and welcome to"What It'sLike To...," the podcast that
lets you walk in someone else'sshoes and live vicariously
through their uniqueexperiences.
I'm your host, journalistElizabeth Pearson Garr, and each
episode, I'll be asking a newinterviewee all the what, why,
when, and where's of how they dowhat they do.
If they can do it, so can you.
(00:57):
A lot of us have heard thiscliche of the American dream:
Get a good education so you canget a good job.
Make enough money so you can buya house and afford everything
you want to buy.
Work hard and eventually buy abigger house.
Buy more things.
On and on and on.
But not everyone finds thisscenario so dreamy.
Some people actually choose togo the other way.
(01:18):
My guest today, Laura Lynch,left a six figure salary and a
2300 square foot house on tenacres for a tiny house, and now
runs a firm that helps otherpeople seek financial freedom
through downsizing.
Laura welcome to my podcast.
Hey, it's so good to be here,Elizabeth.
I'm super thrilled.
(01:38):
Thanks for having me.
Oh, I'm so excited to talk toyou.
And I'd like to just start outgetting your definition of what
a tiny house is.
I mean, I lived in New York Cityfor a couple of years and I had
a tiny apartment, a studioapartment, but that wasn't
necessarily by choice.
That was by what I could afford.
is a tiny house?
How big are we talking?
(01:59):
I think that's a great question.
And I think it really depends onwho you ask or who you're
talking to.
In my mind, tiny is more mindsetreally than square footage.
And it's really just thinkingabout your space in a way that
suits your needs and your valuesrather than kind of defaulting
(02:20):
to that American dream that youjust were talking about.
And so I think a good definitionis generally somewhere in the
neighborhood of 400 square feet.
But I really think about tinyhouses as being those people
that are in van life--that areliving as digital nomads, from
their converted vans, peoplethat are living in schoolies,
(02:41):
which are bus conversions.
There are people doing thedigital nomad lifestyle through
Airbnb or even house sitting.
So there's just a lot of ways tosort of think about your home in
a whole different manner thesedays.
And so I really think of all ofthat as kind of a tiny house.
So it's not just literallyliving in small quarters.
(03:04):
More of a lifestyle?
Yeah I think that most peoplewould define it as 400 square
feet or less, but I think of itmore as the way people are
approaching their roof.
Okay.
And what is it that appealed toyou about changing up your
lifestyle and downsizingeverything?
So my tiny house actually juststarted as sort of a
(03:26):
recreational thing.
My husband and I bought someland out west.
I had lived in Nevada when I wasattached with the Air Force.
And I fell in love with the openspaces of the West.
And so at one point I got very,sort of itchy to have a little
bit of wide open skies.
And so my husband and I boughtsome land out West and then we
(03:47):
were like, well, what are wegoing to do with it?
Because we don't have time tocome here on our two weeks of
vacation a year and build ahouse.
So we decided to build our tinyhouse.
And to take it out to our land,that way we could hang out there
a couple of times a year, maybeon our vacations.
Cause where were you living?
Were you living on the EastCoast?
In Florida.
(04:07):
Okay.
And so then what happened wasthat we had this epiphany
through the pandemic as so manypeople did about why are we
spending so much of our livesand our energy focused on paying
for this big house that we havewhen we have a space that's
perfectly comfortable for us ina place where we would rather
(04:30):
live, frankly.
And so how do we kind of put thesteps in place to get to that
tiny house full time?
So the tiny house really startedout, not as a, Hey, we're going
to go tiny, but really just aplace to stay.
And then it turned into a dreamto downsize out of our larger
space in order to have thelifestyle freedom.
(04:52):
So I imagine a lot of peoplehear this and think part of it
sounds appealing and part of itsounds, really constricting.
You know, my stuff feelscomforting or my space feels,
almost freeing too.
I mean, I have two teenagers andit's sometimes nice to have a
little more space.
Like everyone needs their roomin the house sometimes to have a
(05:13):
little quiet or space from oneanother.
Can you talk about what isappealing about having less
space?
So less space in and of itselfcomes with a couple of benefits.
Obviously, it's a little biteasier to take care of and
maintain.
And that's why we see a lot ofwomen that are past the age
(05:35):
where their kids have flown thecoop and moved on with their
lives, and so women kind of intheir late fifties, the average
tiny home owner is a 55 year oldwoman, and she is using this
sort of downsizing to have lessupkeep, and less maintenance
costs and perhaps if she'smoving her tiny house around
(05:56):
having flexibility of geography.
So maybe instead of having tobuy a condo in the town where
your kids are havinggrandchildren, maybe you have
that opportunity to travel withyour tiny living arrangement.
There is a lot to the sort ofmental health aspects too, of
having less stuff because allthe stuff that we acquire has to
(06:18):
have some level of attentionpaid to it, even if it's just
dusting, but for a lot of ourtech stuff or our hobby stuff or
whatever, there's a lot of maybestanding in line at the Apple
store, you know, whatever it is.
And so sometimes I like to say,do you own the stuff or does the
stuff own you?
(06:39):
And so I think there is for alot of people who choose this
lifestyle, really a simplicitybenefit to just having less
stuff to have to keep track ofand maintain.
What was the process like foryou when you were going through
your bigger house and gettingrid of things?
Was there some emotional tug of,Oh, I have to get rid of, I
(07:00):
don't know, my high schoolyearbooks or this shirt that had
a logo on it that meantsomething from that concert, or
I don't know, these things thatpeople hang on to for emotional,
sentimental reasons.
Sure.
And you know, I think it'simportant to say that tiny
living isn't for everybody.
So let's just point that out.
There are people that derive alot of value from their stuff
(07:22):
and it's really important tothem.
I was in the Air Force.
So I think I learned throughthat process about not getting
too attached to things as youmove around more frequently.
And I just want to clarifybecause I talk about my
transition in the past tense andwe're literally still in it
right now because I have to waitfor my stepson to finish high
(07:44):
school this year.
So I am in an iterativedownsizing process because it's
really difficult to do it justall in one fell swoop.
So I think that's why if you gotiny, to do it in phases and
give yourself time to go throughthings is really helpful because
maybe you go through all thepictures you've collected over
the decades at one time and yousay, Oh, I've got this big box
(08:07):
of stuff that I have to keep.
And then maybe you come back to'em a few months later and say,
maybe I only need these.
And so it's really an iterativeprocess.
But I think that it's importanttoo, to understand that some
things do actually generateimportant value.
And my husband is not so much ofa minimalist as I am.
And so we are actually havingkind of a long process getting
(08:29):
moved across the country becausewe're having to move a lot of
his things that are going to beuseful for his business.
Heavy equipment basically iswhat we're having to get across
the country.
So where maybe it's a little biteasier for me to downsize all my
inherited sets of China to liketwo pieces of each thing.
(08:50):
For him, he gets a lot of valueout of his tools and his ability
to make money with those things.
And so those things are going.
It really is interesting.
I think it's a valuable processto go through and think about
why do I get value out of thesethings?
And is this thing trulyimportant to me?
Or is it just sort of areflexive, I've just always had
(09:13):
it, so therefore, it must beimportant to me.
Sometimes I think, well, youinherited that entire set of
China, therefore, I have to haveit.
But maybe just having a fewpieces, is fine.
And that's what will remind youof your grandma or something, or
maybe taking a photo of the setof China.
I remember when my husband and Igot married and then we moved
the first time.
(09:33):
He had like 300 t-shirts orsomething and all these trophies
from high school.
And someone gave us that advice.
If you're not displaying thetrophies somewhere, if they're
sitting in an attic, maybe theyaren't really that valuable to
you.
You could take photos of themand still have that memory to
look at.
And so sometimes I think we needjust that exercise of going
(09:54):
through things and processing itourselves to think about how
valuable is this thing truly tome.
Yeah.
And I think you make a goodpoint that things do trigger
memories, but so do scents andso do songs, and those things we
don't carry around in physicalform.
We hear them on the radio and wego back to that moment in high
(10:15):
school where we were victoriousin that game or whatever.
And so remembering that thememories live within us
actually, and they don'tactually live within the objects
I think is maybe a differentperspective.
So you said you're doing itlittle by little.
Do you think that that's kind ofa common process or do people in
the tiny house community do thisin all different ways?
(10:37):
Do some people just do it in onefell swoop?
Like kind of say, I'm done withmy larger house.
I'm just downsizing.
You have a podcast.
I'm sure you've talked to peopleof all different experiences?
Yes.
I would say that there are somepeople who maybe just haven't
inherited any stuff that has anyreal significance to them yet.
Younger people maybe.
And so, for them kind of goingfrom their starter home or,
(11:00):
their attempt at a starter homeand straight into like a
schoolie conversion andtraveling around the country is
maybe less of a process from adownsizing perspective.
I'm of course, middle aged,right?
So I've acquired some stuff overthe years.
And so it's been a little bit ofa process for me, but it's also
been pacing our ability to makeall the things happen because I
(11:22):
call it concentric circles ofchange.
When you are going tiny, it'sprobably not just your house.
You're probably not moving intoa tiny house across town.
You're probably doing it to dosome travel or to live in a
different place.
And so you've got to figure outwhat you're doing with your
career what you're doing withyour family, all of those layers
are involved.
(11:42):
And so getting all of that sortof smoothed out so you can get
to that transition successfullyis a little bit more complicated
than just selling my house overhere and buying a house across
town.
Yeah.
There are many reasons thatpeople do this.
It's not like you say just (11:58):
I want less space.
If I just wanted less space,you'd mentioned earlier, you
might just go from your house toa condo across town.
This is a lifestyle.
This is often a financialdecision or sometimes people
want less of an environmentalfootprint.
What are the contributingfactors that somebody will
become a tiny house enthusiast,I guess we would call it?
(12:21):
I think you mentioned a numberof important ones.
Sustainability is something onfolks' mind.
The simplicity that I mentionedearlier, the travel opportunity,
the lifestyle shift, thefinancial benefits.
I think in this moment of thisreally critical housing
situation that we have withhousing being so expensive and
(12:43):
interest rates being what theyare, and there's just too little
supply for demand.
It's creating an opportunity forpeople to reconsider what home
looks like.
And so that gives them anopportunity to reconsider
whether or not they want tohave, you know, a 30-year
mortgage lease.
To control the flexibility thatthey want to have in their
(13:04):
lives.
And so I think a lot of it isabout the affordability crisis
and a lot of it is about thedesire to travel or to be less
tied down in some way.
So definitely just a shift thatwe're seeing, largely created by
just what's going on in housingat the moment.
And of course, HGTV has had ahuge impact too.
(13:29):
Is that true?
Just the exposure fromtelevision.
And there's a number of reallyfantastic tiny house festivals
that go on.
And so people get theopportunity to see them and walk
through them and get the senseof, hey, could I live like this?
So it's definitely been agrowing movement, but the media
exposure and sort of theidealistic tiny homes that we
(13:51):
see on YouTube hasn't hurt.
That's so interesting.
We were talking before aboutdownsizing.
What are some of the essentialelements you need, though?
We don't need so many things,but certainly there are a few
things that we always need.
What are those?
I'm sure that this is a littlebit different for every person.
(14:12):
But obviously you have to haveclothes that fit the climate
where you're going to be and ifyou're going to be traveling
with your tiny house, whetherthat's a van or a tow-behind
tiny house or what have you, youhave to be prepared for where
you're going to be going.
So there's that piece.
I have a lot of focus aroundcooking healthy food.
So my kitchen was reallyimportant to me when we were
(14:35):
building our tiny house.
And so making sure that I'mkeeping the important tools in
my kitchen has been reallyimportant to me.
Different tiny homes havedifferent luxury elements.
Custom tiny home builders aredoing a great job of focusing on
the goals and the lifestyle oftheir clients when they're
building their homes.
So for example, I really enjoymy jetted tub in my tiny house
(15:00):
as well as my heated floorsbecause my tiny house is out in
New Mexico and it does get snowyout there.
And so the radiant floor heat isthe best.
So that's unexpected.
I love it.
But you put in your priorities.
That's great.
Yes.
So typically, do people just buya property and build a tiny
(15:22):
house on it?
I'm just trying to think of howthis actually works in the real
world.
Sure.
So, when we talk about tinyhouses specifically, as opposed
to like the van life, theschoolie or the other ideas
there, tiny homes are in themidst of a really grassroots
legalization effort.
(15:43):
I volunteer with the Tiny HomeIndustry Association that is
doing a great job of helpingdifferent municipalities write
in the legislation or the countycode or what have you to allow
tiny houses.
And very often what we're seeinghappening in more urban areas is
tiny houses being added as ADUsor accessory dwelling units.
(16:07):
So allowing a homeowner to put atiny house on their property in
their backyard to allow foraffordable housing.
So going back to that housingcrisis again.
There are lots of tiny homedwellers though that do want
land and they want their ownprivacy and space.
And so they do go buy propertyand oftentimes it's easier to do
(16:28):
tiny in a more rural, just froma legalization standpoint, but
it really varies by everymunicipality.
So it's important to do yourresearch.
And when it comes to challenges,this is the hardest part,
figuring out the legalizationpiece.
When I refer to the tiny homecommunity, I'm really talking
about the nationwide and maybeeven global circle of people who
(16:53):
are choosing this lifestylebecause it's been really
interesting to interact withpeople in different sets within
the tiny living community andhear their stories about how
helpful and mutually supportiveother people are.
So those folks in the buses, theschoolies, they have schoolie
(17:14):
swarm where they go and if youshow up and you're in the middle
of your bus build out and youhaven't got your plumbing in
yet, people come in and theyhelp you do that stuff.
And within this sort of new wayof thinking people are just so
excited when other people aredoing it and they're just so
helpful to each other and sosupportive and so I've really
(17:35):
enjoyed getting to knoweverybody because everyone is so
friendly and excited.
I think that's probably the caseanytime something is kind of new
and on the edge.
Everybody in that sort of nicheis kind of all excited about
everybody else that's in there.
Yeah, I interviewed a woman whosold her house and lives in her
(17:55):
RV and travels constantly andfinds that community as well.
And she organizes meetups andtrips and finds that everybody
is so helpful.
If someone has a flat tire orsame thing, it's just this
wonderful community of people.
Yeah, I think that the singlefamily home has become in some
ways, and not everywhere, butfor people that live in places
(18:17):
where there's a lot of movementaround new people coming in,
people going, it's become kindof isolating.
People don't know theirneighbors and they're not
engaging in neighborhoods in theway that they did decades ago.
And so it's good to see thatresurgence of a sense of
community and neighborlinesshappening in the tiny living
space.
(18:37):
You mentioned that the numberone demographic is women over
55, but does it also span?
There's also young people whoare doing this?
You said young marrieds orsomething who don't have much
stuff.
So there's people of all ageswho are doing this?
For sure.
Yes.
So definitely this is ofinterest to the first-time home
(18:58):
buyers who can't afford theaverage home, so the average
home currently in the UnitedStates sits around 430,000.
And so when you're first out ofcollege, 430,000 is kind of a
steep price tag, especially atyou know, seven percent interest
on a 30-year mortgage.
So, lots of young people lookingat this.
Young people in particular arevery used to this sort of
(19:19):
sharing economy.
So rather than own a car, youUber.
So the idea of having less spaceand more community space and
that sort of thing, I think ispretty attractive.
Then a lot of retirees like todownsize and minimize the
maintenance that they have ontheir home and often retirement
comes with those goals of traveland so tiny living can enable
(19:40):
that too.
And so I think probably thegeneration that maybe is a
little stuck right now is mygeneration because they're kind
of in prime career years, primechild raising years and prime
years to be caring for parents.
And so it's kind of a time oflife where you get kind of
stuck.
Yeah.
And I know that you also are afinancial consultant and that
(20:01):
seems like that would be a keyelement to all of this, because
people would think, Oh, thissounds really great.
And I would love to do this andthat, but then so much comes
down to money.
And how is this all really goingto work practically?
And you've got taxes and, youthink this is going to save
money, but what about this?
And what about that?
Yeah, the money part, I think isa place where people get stuck,
(20:23):
which is why I really want tocontinue to focus on this area.
Cause you can watch all theYouTube videos and figure out
how to build your tiny house.
Or, you can do your research onbuilders and whatever.
But when it comes down to themoney part, how do I make the
money part work?
That's probably a place wheresome people get hung up.
Also with work, I guess afterthe pandemic, so much more work
(20:43):
is done remotely, but it doesfeel like, how are you going to
actually put this life together?
It sounds kind of romantic andwonderful, but realistically for
some people, I wonder how itcould work.
I mean, it depends which ofthese aspects you're going to
do.
Are you going to be travelingaround?
Are you going to be sedentary ina place?
(21:04):
And also what stage of lifeyou're in.
If you have kids and they needto be in school-- you know,
there's so many differentfactors to this whole thing.
Yeah.
And I think what just bringseverybody together is the notion
of, Hey, maybe this stuff isn'tthe most important thing to me.
So let me figure out what is themost important thing to me,
which is why I talk so muchabout values and helping people
(21:25):
figure out what their corevalues are and designing a life
around that.
Because the reality is that formost of us, you can't have
everything.
You can't have a lot of traveland a lot of freedom and a big
house with a big mortgage.
So just figuring out how youdesign your life around what is
most important to you.
And maybe the big house isn'twhat's most important to you.
(21:48):
And if not, how do you design alife around what is.
Yeah, I really appreciate that.
And I feel like it kind of getsdown to something that I end up
talking a lot about in thispodcast with people from all
different stories, which is,what is your passion-- and how
do you go about finding it andmaking it a part of your life?
And it goes down to your valuesand implementing them in your
(22:10):
life.
And I think you need to reflecton those things, rather than
just sort of robotically gothrough what you think people
have told you or what you thinkis expected of you.
You know, there's a lot of,especially younger kids, maybe
teenagers, college kids, 20somethings.
I think this is what I should bedoing for a job or a career or
something and then feelingmiserable about it.
(22:31):
No, but what do you want to do?
What makes you happy?
What's your passion?
What are your true values?
And, you know, it doesn't haveto be because this is what
everyone is doing tech thesedays or something.
We don't need more of that.
We need how you were built thatyou're special.
Those are the gifts we need inthe world.
And so I really appreciate thiskind of thinking.
(22:52):
It's out of the box thinking.
There's not just one way to livein the world.
That you have to do this.
And then you have to find yourtown to live in and buy your
house and...
There's a lot of ways to be anda lot of ways to interact with
the world.
And also you can change, you canbe doing something one way.
And then at some stage of yourlife, you can say, actually, now
(23:12):
I'd like to do somethingdifferent.
Now I'm going to buy a bus andtravel around.
That's pretty cool.
And freeing.
Yes, it is amazing.
I sometimes say that I changedirections to cover more ground
and over a lifetime, I'vepivoted numerous times trying to
find that thing that reallylights me up.
(23:34):
And, having progressed my careerthrough various different
changes.
Really it was that pandemic andthat Brene Brown worksheet that
helped me explore my values thathelped me understand, Hey,
independence and exploration arereally important to me.
And I don't feel independent inmy career path right now.
(23:56):
And so how do I get to beindependent and how do I get to
explore more things?
And so that really helped me tosolidify the idea of changing
everything, again, in order tochase down those two things that
I've always known wereimportant, but didn't ever
really put the framework aroundthem.
(24:16):
I need to build a life based onthese two values and that will
make me feel congruent withmyself.
So it has been a journey for me,and it's a journey for
everybody, I think.
Yeah, that's a great way to putit because then when you have
your sort of core values at thetop, when you know you're making
other sacrifices, then yourealize, well, they're kind of
(24:37):
worth it because they're forthis purpose rather than just
feel like you're kind of flipflopping around and thinking,
well, this isn't quite workingand that's not quite working and
everything feels a little bitlike it's being sacrificed, but
no, there's a reason becausethese are the things I'm working
for.
Yes, for sure.
Are there certain traits thatyou feel people who choose to
(25:00):
live in a tiny house communityhave in common?
Yes, I think that people thatchoose this lifestyle have to be
independent thinkers.
Because it's too easy to followthe expectations that we see on
TV, that we hear from ourfamily, that our friends tell
us, it is so expected to followthe default American dream path.
(25:22):
And so you have to be a littlebit almost rebellious, and kind
of independent in your mindsetin order to make this choice or
have someone who, you know, isin your life that can help make
you think independently.
There's some grit involvedbecause as I mentioned, the
legalization is still underway.
There are lots of resources outthere for figuring that out.
(25:44):
I'm working with the Tiny HomeIndustry Association on a
resource map where you click onyour state and you can see what
is going on with legislation inyour state.
But still lots of research maybe involved because it's not as
easy as selling your house andbuying another or moving, you
know, from your apartment into ahouse.
The entire mortgage and homebuilder industry is designed to
(26:08):
make the process easy, goinginto a tiny house is not as
easy.
So a little bit of grit isrequired.
And I think there's a lot ofintention.
People that live in tiny livingare thoughtful about how they're
designing their life because itis a choice that is not kind of
the standard run of the millchoice and so they've done it
intentionally for specificreasons and so that would be
(26:30):
another quality that I see.
That must make it nice when youtalk to people, you already have
common values.
You're of similar types.
Yes, a hundred percent.
Are there any things that youfeel like you miss from your
bigger house, that you thinkabout on kind of a daily or
weekly basis?
Like, Oh, that would still benice.
(26:51):
So one of the things that's hasbeen super enjoyable in my
larger house has been myscreened-in porch.
We do get to spend a lot of timeoutside at our tiny house.
And so I think we'll be addingsome additional outdoor spaces,
maybe, screened in porch elementto just be able to spend more
time outdoors.
Cause this is really importantto me.
(27:13):
I don't know if this is an easything to do, but if there's a
way that you could kind ofcompare a day in the life of
your big house to your tinyhouse, what would be the biggest
difference of living in the twohouses?
I will definitely answer thatquestion.
When you were starting to askthe question, it occurred to me
that one thing that should bementioned is that you can try
(27:33):
this out, that there's lots oftiny houses on Airbnb and other
rental communities.
So you're curious about it, youcan go try it out.
Um, I think the biggestdifference, for me is, the less
walking, just doing the laundryand doing the normal routines in
the kitchen and stuff, I feellike I just am walking all the
(27:55):
time.
And in the tiny house,everything is very compact.
You know, the laundry is veryclose to the kitchen.
And so it's, not kind of likeI'm wandering.
You know how you walk from roomto room and you forget why you
went in that other roomsometimes?
I don't have that happening asmuch because everything is a
little bit more compact.
But really the deep differenceis the fact that moving to tiny
(28:18):
living has enabled me to launchmy podcast, to launch my firm.
It is all tied together.
Without doing the tiny livingthing, I would have been paying
for my big house for another 25years.
And I would not have had thecourage to step out on my own
and become my independent,self-employed person.
And so I'm literally so gratefulfor this opportunity that we
(28:42):
created without even knowingwhat we were doing at the time
that I get to become my truestself, through this change.
And so it is just hugelyimpactful for me.
That is fantastic.
It's so much more than just achange of an address.
It sure is.
Well, thank you, Laura.
I've learned so much and Ireally appreciate all of your
(29:04):
knowledge about this.
You're truly such a well-versedspokesperson in this topic.
So thank you.
Well, thank you for having me,Elizabeth.
It's been a great pleasure.
It was inspiring to meet Laura,someone who's changing her life
to align with her passions.
Here are some of my takeawaysfrom our conversation.
Number one (29:25):
Having less stuff doesn't just mean less to keep
track of, clean, and maintain.
It also means less mentalstrain.
Do you own your stuff or doesyour stuff own you?
Two (29:36):
If you're having trouble getting rid of a certain item,
you can ask yourself, is thisthing truly important to me, or
am I just attached to it,because have had it for a long
time?
Memories live within us, notwithin objects.
Three (29:50):
Rather than just doing what you think is expected of
you, live with intention.
Figure out your core values anddesign your life around them.
Four (29:59):
Don't try to fit yourself into some pre-designed mold.
The world needs each of us withour unique talents and passions
and gifts.
And finally, number five (30:07):
You can always change your mind
about what you want to do.
As Laura said, she changesdirections to cover more ground.
I'd like to thank Laura Lynchfor teaching me so much about
tiny living.
If you'd like to learn moreabout it or get in touch with
Laura, go to the show notes forthis episode.
We have links to Laura's websiteand lots of information there.
(30:28):
If you want to listen to moreconversations about living with
less, check out episode 34 withDeanna Yates, a minimalist, and
episode 70 with Jenell Jones,who traded in her house for an
RV.
If you haven't yet subscribed tothis podcast, please do, and
please tell a few friends aboutit too.
I'm Elizabeth Pearson Garr.
Thanks for being curious aboutwhat it's like.
I call it concentric circles ofchange.
When you are going tiny, it'sprobably not just your house.
You're probably not moving intoa tiny house across town.
You're probably doing it to dosome travel or to live in a
different place.
And so you've got to figure outwhat you're doing with your
career.
What you're doing with yourfamily, like all of those layers
are involved.
(00:32):
Hello, and welcome to"What It'sLike To...," the podcast that
lets you walk in someone else'sshoes and live vicariously
through their uniqueexperiences.
I'm your host, journalistElizabeth Pearson Garr, and each
episode, I'll be asking a newinterviewee all the what, why,
when, and where's of how they dowhat they do.
If they can do it, so can you.
(00:57):
A lot of us have heard thiscliche of the American dream:
Get a good education so you canget a good job.
Make enough money so you can buya house and afford everything
you want to buy.
Work hard and eventually buy abigger house.
Buy more things.
On and on and on.
But not everyone finds thisscenario so dreamy.
Some people actually choose togo the other way.
(01:18):
My guest today, Laura Lynch,left a six figure salary and a
2300 square foot house on tenacres for a tiny house, and now
runs a firm that helps otherpeople seek financial freedom
through downsizing.
Laura welcome to my podcast.
Hey, it's so good to be here,Elizabeth.
I'm super thrilled.
(01:38):
Thanks for having me.
Oh, I'm so excited to talk toyou.
And I'd like to just start outgetting your definition of what
a tiny house is.
I mean, I lived in New York Cityfor a couple of years and I had
a tiny apartment, a studioapartment, but that wasn't
necessarily by choice.
That was by what I could afford.
is a tiny house?
How big are we talking?
(01:59):
I think that's a great question.
And I think it really depends onwho you ask or who you're
talking to.
In my mind, tiny is more mindsetreally than square footage.
And it's really just thinkingabout your space in a way that
suits your needs and your valuesrather than kind of defaulting
(02:20):
to that American dream that youjust were talking about.
And so I think a good definitionis generally somewhere in the
neighborhood of 400 square feet.
But I really think about tinyhouses as being those people
that are in van life--that areliving as digital nomads, from
their converted vans, peoplethat are living in schoolies,
(02:41):
which are bus conversions.
There are people doing thedigital nomad lifestyle through
Airbnb or even house sitting.
So there's just a lot of ways tosort of think about your home in
a whole different manner thesedays.
And so I really think of all ofthat as kind of a tiny house.
So it's not just literallyliving in small quarters.
(03:04):
More of a lifestyle?
Yeah I think that most peoplewould define it as 400 square
feet or less, but I think of itmore as the way people are
approaching their roof.
Okay.
And what is it that appealed toyou about changing up your
lifestyle and downsizingeverything?
So my tiny house actually juststarted as sort of a
(03:26):
recreational thing.
My husband and I bought someland out west.
I had lived in Nevada when I wasattached with the Air Force.
And I fell in love with the openspaces of the West.
And so at one point I got very,sort of itchy to have a little
bit of wide open skies.
And so my husband and I boughtsome land out West and then we
(03:47):
were like, well, what are wegoing to do with it?
Because we don't have time tocome here on our two weeks of
vacation a year and build ahouse.
So we decided to build our tinyhouse.
And to take it out to our land,that way we could hang out there
a couple of times a year, maybeon our vacations.
Cause where were you living?
Were you living on the EastCoast?
In Florida.
(04:07):
Okay.
And so then what happened wasthat we had this epiphany
through the pandemic as so manypeople did about why are we
spending so much of our livesand our energy focused on paying
for this big house that we havewhen we have a space that's
perfectly comfortable for us ina place where we would rather
(04:30):
live, frankly.
And so how do we kind of put thesteps in place to get to that
tiny house full time?
So the tiny house really startedout, not as a, Hey, we're going
to go tiny, but really just aplace to stay.
And then it turned into a dreamto downsize out of our larger
space in order to have thelifestyle freedom.
(04:52):
So I imagine a lot of peoplehear this and think part of it
sounds appealing and part of itsounds, really constricting.
You know, my stuff feelscomforting or my space feels,
almost freeing too.
I mean, I have two teenagers andit's sometimes nice to have a
little more space.
Like everyone needs their roomin the house sometimes to have a
(05:13):
little quiet or space from oneanother.
Can you talk about what isappealing about having less
space?
So less space in and of itselfcomes with a couple of benefits.
Obviously, it's a little biteasier to take care of and
maintain.
And that's why we see a lot ofwomen that are past the age
(05:35):
where their kids have flown thecoop and moved on with their
lives, and so women kind of intheir late fifties, the average
tiny home owner is a 55 year oldwoman, and she is using this
sort of downsizing to have lessupkeep, and less maintenance
costs and perhaps if she'smoving her tiny house around
(05:56):
having flexibility of geography.
So maybe instead of having tobuy a condo in the town where
your kids are havinggrandchildren, maybe you have
that opportunity to travel withyour tiny living arrangement.
There is a lot to the sort ofmental health aspects too, of
having less stuff because allthe stuff that we acquire has to
(06:18):
have some level of attentionpaid to it, even if it's just
dusting, but for a lot of ourtech stuff or our hobby stuff or
whatever, there's a lot of maybestanding in line at the Apple
store, you know, whatever it is.
And so sometimes I like to say,do you own the stuff or does the
stuff own you?
(06:39):
And so I think there is for alot of people who choose this
lifestyle, really a simplicitybenefit to just having less
stuff to have to keep track ofand maintain.
What was the process like foryou when you were going through
your bigger house and gettingrid of things?
Was there some emotional tug of,Oh, I have to get rid of, I
(07:00):
don't know, my high schoolyearbooks or this shirt that had
a logo on it that meantsomething from that concert, or
I don't know, these things thatpeople hang on to for emotional,
sentimental reasons.
Sure.
And you know, I think it'simportant to say that tiny
living isn't for everybody.
So let's just point that out.
There are people that derive alot of value from their stuff
(07:22):
and it's really important tothem.
I was in the Air Force.
So I think I learned throughthat process about not getting
too attached to things as youmove around more frequently.
And I just want to clarifybecause I talk about my
transition in the past tense andwe're literally still in it
right now because I have to waitfor my stepson to finish high
(07:44):
school this year.
So I am in an iterativedownsizing process because it's
really difficult to do it justall in one fell swoop.
So I think that's why if you gotiny, to do it in phases and
give yourself time to go throughthings is really helpful because
maybe you go through all thepictures you've collected over
the decades at one time and yousay, Oh, I've got this big box
(08:07):
of stuff that I have to keep.
And then maybe you come back to'em a few months later and say,
maybe I only need these.
And so it's really an iterativeprocess.
But I think that it's importanttoo, to understand that some
things do actually generateimportant value.
And my husband is not so much ofa minimalist as I am.
And so we are actually havingkind of a long process getting
(08:29):
moved across the country becausewe're having to move a lot of
his things that are going to beuseful for his business.
Heavy equipment basically iswhat we're having to get across
the country.
So where maybe it's a little biteasier for me to downsize all my
inherited sets of China to liketwo pieces of each thing.
(08:50):
For him, he gets a lot of valueout of his tools and his ability
to make money with those things.
And so those things are going.
It really is interesting.
I think it's a valuable processto go through and think about
why do I get value out of thesethings?
And is this thing trulyimportant to me?
Or is it just sort of areflexive, I've just always had
(09:13):
it, so therefore, it must beimportant to me.
Sometimes I think, well, youinherited that entire set of
China, therefore, I have to haveit.
But maybe just having a fewpieces, is fine.
And that's what will remind youof your grandma or something, or
maybe taking a photo of the setof China.
I remember when my husband and Igot married and then we moved
the first time.
(09:33):
He had like 300 t-shirts orsomething and all these trophies
from high school.
And someone gave us that advice.
If you're not displaying thetrophies somewhere, if they're
sitting in an attic, maybe theyaren't really that valuable to
you.
You could take photos of themand still have that memory to
look at.
And so sometimes I think we needjust that exercise of going
(09:54):
through things and processing itourselves to think about how
valuable is this thing truly tome.
Yeah.
And I think you make a goodpoint that things do trigger
memories, but so do scents andso do songs, and those things we
don't carry around in physicalform.
We hear them on the radio and wego back to that moment in high
(10:15):
school where we were victoriousin that game or whatever.
And so remembering that thememories live within us
actually, and they don'tactually live within the objects
I think is maybe a differentperspective.
So you said you're doing itlittle by little.
Do you think that that's kind ofa common process or do people in
the tiny house community do thisin all different ways?
(10:37):
Do some people just do it in onefell swoop?
Like kind of say, I'm done withmy larger house.
I'm just downsizing.
You have a podcast.
I'm sure you've talked to peopleof all different experiences?
Yes.
I would say that there are somepeople who maybe just haven't
inherited any stuff that has anyreal significance to them yet.
Younger people maybe.
And so, for them kind of goingfrom their starter home or,
(11:00):
their attempt at a starter homeand straight into like a
schoolie conversion andtraveling around the country is
maybe less of a process from adownsizing perspective.
I'm of course, middle aged,right?
So I've acquired some stuff overthe years.
And so it's been a little bit ofa process for me, but it's also
been pacing our ability to makeall the things happen because I
(11:22):
call it concentric circles ofchange.
When you are going tiny, it'sprobably not just your house.
You're probably not moving intoa tiny house across town.
You're probably doing it to dosome travel or to live in a
different place.
And so you've got to figure outwhat you're doing with your
career what you're doing withyour family, all of those layers
are involved.
(11:42):
And so getting all of that sortof smoothed out so you can get
to that transition successfullyis a little bit more complicated
than just selling my house overhere and buying a house across
town.
Yeah.
There are many reasons thatpeople do this.
It's not like you say just (11:58):
I want less space.
If I just wanted less space,you'd mentioned earlier, you
might just go from your house toa condo across town.
This is a lifestyle.
This is often a financialdecision or sometimes people
want less of an environmentalfootprint.
What are the contributingfactors that somebody will
become a tiny house enthusiast,I guess we would call it?
(12:21):
I think you mentioned a numberof important ones.
Sustainability is something onfolks' mind.
The simplicity that I mentionedearlier, the travel opportunity,
the lifestyle shift, thefinancial benefits.
I think in this moment of thisreally critical housing
situation that we have withhousing being so expensive and
(12:43):
interest rates being what theyare, and there's just too little
supply for demand.
It's creating an opportunity forpeople to reconsider what home
looks like.
And so that gives them anopportunity to reconsider
whether or not they want tohave, you know, a 30-year
mortgage lease.
To control the flexibility thatthey want to have in their
(13:04):
lives.
And so I think a lot of it isabout the affordability crisis
and a lot of it is about thedesire to travel or to be less
tied down in some way.
So definitely just a shift thatwe're seeing, largely created by
just what's going on in housingat the moment.
And of course, HGTV has had ahuge impact too.
(13:29):
Is that true?
Just the exposure fromtelevision.
And there's a number of reallyfantastic tiny house festivals
that go on.
And so people get theopportunity to see them and walk
through them and get the senseof, hey, could I live like this?
So it's definitely been agrowing movement, but the media
exposure and sort of theidealistic tiny homes that we
(13:51):
see on YouTube hasn't hurt.
That's so interesting.
We were talking before aboutdownsizing.
What are some of the essentialelements you need, though?
We don't need so many things,but certainly there are a few
things that we always need.
What are those?
I'm sure that this is a littlebit different for every person.
(14:12):
But obviously you have to haveclothes that fit the climate
where you're going to be and ifyou're going to be traveling
with your tiny house, whetherthat's a van or a tow-behind
tiny house or what have you, youhave to be prepared for where
you're going to be going.
So there's that piece.
I have a lot of focus aroundcooking healthy food.
So my kitchen was reallyimportant to me when we were
(14:35):
building our tiny house.
And so making sure that I'mkeeping the important tools in
my kitchen has been reallyimportant to me.
Different tiny homes havedifferent luxury elements.
Custom tiny home builders aredoing a great job of focusing on
the goals and the lifestyle oftheir clients when they're
building their homes.
So for example, I really enjoymy jetted tub in my tiny house
(15:00):
as well as my heated floorsbecause my tiny house is out in
New Mexico and it does get snowyout there.
And so the radiant floor heat isthe best.
So that's unexpected.
I love it.
But you put in your priorities.
That's great.
Yes.
So typically, do people just buya property and build a tiny
(15:22):
house on it?
I'm just trying to think of howthis actually works in the real
world.
Sure.
So, when we talk about tinyhouses specifically, as opposed
to like the van life, theschoolie or the other ideas
there, tiny homes are in themidst of a really grassroots
legalization effort.
(15:43):
I volunteer with the Tiny HomeIndustry Association that is
doing a great job of helpingdifferent municipalities write
in the legislation or the countycode or what have you to allow
tiny houses.
And very often what we're seeinghappening in more urban areas is
tiny houses being added as ADUsor accessory dwelling units.
(16:07):
So allowing a homeowner to put atiny house on their property in
their backyard to allow foraffordable housing.
So going back to that housingcrisis again.
There are lots of tiny homedwellers though that do want
land and they want their ownprivacy and space.
And so they do go buy propertyand oftentimes it's easier to do
(16:28):
tiny in a more rural, just froma legalization standpoint, but
it really varies by everymunicipality.
So it's important to do yourresearch.
And when it comes to challenges,this is the hardest part,
figuring out the legalizationpiece.
When I refer to the tiny homecommunity, I'm really talking
about the nationwide and maybeeven global circle of people who
(16:53):
are choosing this lifestylebecause it's been really
interesting to interact withpeople in different sets within
the tiny living community andhear their stories about how
helpful and mutually supportiveother people are.
So those folks in the buses, theschoolies, they have schoolie
(17:14):
swarm where they go and if youshow up and you're in the middle
of your bus build out and youhaven't got your plumbing in
yet, people come in and theyhelp you do that stuff.
And within this sort of new wayof thinking people are just so
excited when other people aredoing it and they're just so
helpful to each other and sosupportive and so I've really
(17:35):
enjoyed getting to knoweverybody because everyone is so
friendly and excited.
I think that's probably the caseanytime something is kind of new
and on the edge.
Everybody in that sort of nicheis kind of all excited about
everybody else that's in there.
Yeah, I interviewed a woman whosold her house and lives in her
(17:55):
RV and travels constantly andfinds that community as well.
And she organizes meetups andtrips and finds that everybody
is so helpful.
If someone has a flat tire orsame thing, it's just this
wonderful community of people.
Yeah, I think that the singlefamily home has become in some
ways, and not everywhere, butfor people that live in places
(18:17):
where there's a lot of movementaround new people coming in,
people going, it's become kindof isolating.
People don't know theirneighbors and they're not
engaging in neighborhoods in theway that they did decades ago.
And so it's good to see thatresurgence of a sense of
community and neighborlinesshappening in the tiny living
space.
(18:37):
You mentioned that the numberone demographic is women over
55, but does it also span?
There's also young people whoare doing this?
You said young marrieds orsomething who don't have much
stuff.
So there's people of all ageswho are doing this?
For sure.
Yes.
So definitely this is ofinterest to the first-time home
(18:58):
buyers who can't afford theaverage home, so the average
home currently in the UnitedStates sits around 430,000.
And so when you're first out ofcollege, 430,000 is kind of a
steep price tag, especially atyou know, seven percent interest
on a 30-year mortgage.
So, lots of young people lookingat this.
Young people in particular arevery used to this sort of
(19:19):
sharing economy.
So rather than own a car, youUber.
So the idea of having less spaceand more community space and
that sort of thing, I think ispretty attractive.
Then a lot of retirees like todownsize and minimize the
maintenance that they have ontheir home and often retirement
comes with those goals of traveland so tiny living can enable
(19:40):
that too.
And so I think probably thegeneration that maybe is a
little stuck right now is mygeneration because they're kind
of in prime career years, primechild raising years and prime
years to be caring for parents.
And so it's kind of a time oflife where you get kind of
stuck.
Yeah.
And I know that you also are afinancial consultant and that
(20:01):
seems like that would be a keyelement to all of this, because
people would think, Oh, thissounds really great.
And I would love to do this andthat, but then so much comes
down to money.
And how is this all really goingto work practically?
And you've got taxes and, youthink this is going to save
money, but what about this?
And what about that?
Yeah, the money part, I think isa place where people get stuck,
(20:23):
which is why I really want tocontinue to focus on this area.
Cause you can watch all theYouTube videos and figure out
how to build your tiny house.
Or, you can do your research onbuilders and whatever.
But when it comes down to themoney part, how do I make the
money part work?
That's probably a place wheresome people get hung up.
Also with work, I guess afterthe pandemic, so much more work
(20:43):
is done remotely, but it doesfeel like, how are you going to
actually put this life together?
It sounds kind of romantic andwonderful, but realistically for
some people, I wonder how itcould work.
I mean, it depends which ofthese aspects you're going to
do.
Are you going to be travelingaround?
Are you going to be sedentary ina place?
(21:04):
And also what stage of lifeyou're in.
If you have kids and they needto be in school-- you know,
there's so many differentfactors to this whole thing.
Yeah.
And I think what just bringseverybody together is the notion
of, Hey, maybe this stuff isn'tthe most important thing to me.
So let me figure out what is themost important thing to me,
which is why I talk so muchabout values and helping people
(21:25):
figure out what their corevalues are and designing a life
around that.
Because the reality is that formost of us, you can't have
everything.
You can't have a lot of traveland a lot of freedom and a big
house with a big mortgage.
So just figuring out how youdesign your life around what is
most important to you.
And maybe the big house isn'twhat's most important to you.
(21:48):
And if not, how do you design alife around what is.
Yeah, I really appreciate that.
And I feel like it kind of getsdown to something that I end up
talking a lot about in thispodcast with people from all
different stories, which is,what is your passion-- and how
do you go about finding it andmaking it a part of your life?
And it goes down to your valuesand implementing them in your
(22:10):
life.
And I think you need to reflecton those things, rather than
just sort of robotically gothrough what you think people
have told you or what you thinkis expected of you.
You know, there's a lot of,especially younger kids, maybe
teenagers, college kids, 20somethings.
I think this is what I should bedoing for a job or a career or
something and then feelingmiserable about it.
(22:31):
No, but what do you want to do?
What makes you happy?
What's your passion?
What are your true values?
And, you know, it doesn't haveto be because this is what
everyone is doing tech thesedays or something.
We don't need more of that.
We need how you were built thatyou're special.
Those are the gifts we need inthe world.
And so I really appreciate thiskind of thinking.
(22:52):
It's out of the box thinking.
There's not just one way to livein the world.
That you have to do this.
And then you have to find yourtown to live in and buy your
house and...
There's a lot of ways to be anda lot of ways to interact with
the world.
And also you can change, you canbe doing something one way.
And then at some stage of yourlife, you can say, actually, now
(23:12):
I'd like to do somethingdifferent.
Now I'm going to buy a bus andtravel around.
That's pretty cool.
And freeing.
Yes, it is amazing.
I sometimes say that I changedirections to cover more ground
and over a lifetime, I'vepivoted numerous times trying to
find that thing that reallylights me up.
(23:34):
And, having progressed my careerthrough various different
changes.
Really it was that pandemic andthat Brene Brown worksheet that
helped me explore my values thathelped me understand, Hey,
independence and exploration arereally important to me.
And I don't feel independent inmy career path right now.
(23:56):
And so how do I get to beindependent and how do I get to
explore more things?
And so that really helped me tosolidify the idea of changing
everything, again, in order tochase down those two things that
I've always known wereimportant, but didn't ever
really put the framework aroundthem.
(24:16):
I need to build a life based onthese two values and that will
make me feel congruent withmyself.
So it has been a journey for me,and it's a journey for
everybody, I think.
Yeah, that's a great way to putit because then when you have
your sort of core values at thetop, when you know you're making
other sacrifices, then yourealize, well, they're kind of
(24:37):
worth it because they're forthis purpose rather than just
feel like you're kind of flipflopping around and thinking,
well, this isn't quite workingand that's not quite working and
everything feels a little bitlike it's being sacrificed, but
no, there's a reason becausethese are the things I'm working
for.
Yes, for sure.
Are there certain traits thatyou feel people who choose to
(25:00):
live in a tiny house communityhave in common?
Yes, I think that people thatchoose this lifestyle have to be
independent thinkers.
Because it's too easy to followthe expectations that we see on
TV, that we hear from ourfamily, that our friends tell
us, it is so expected to followthe default American dream path.
(25:22):
And so you have to be a littlebit almost rebellious, and kind
of independent in your mindsetin order to make this choice or
have someone who, you know, isin your life that can help make
you think independently.
There's some grit involvedbecause as I mentioned, the
legalization is still underway.
There are lots of resources outthere for figuring that out.
(25:44):
I'm working with the Tiny HomeIndustry Association on a
resource map where you click onyour state and you can see what
is going on with legislation inyour state.
But still lots of research maybe involved because it's not as
easy as selling your house andbuying another or moving, you
know, from your apartment into ahouse.
The entire mortgage and homebuilder industry is designed to
(26:08):
make the process easy, goinginto a tiny house is not as
easy.
So a little bit of grit isrequired.
And I think there's a lot ofintention.
People that live in tiny livingare thoughtful about how they're
designing their life because itis a choice that is not kind of
the standard run of the millchoice and so they've done it
intentionally for specificreasons and so that would be
(26:30):
another quality that I see.
That must make it nice when youtalk to people, you already have
common values.
You're of similar types.
Yes, a hundred percent.
Are there any things that youfeel like you miss from your
bigger house, that you thinkabout on kind of a daily or
weekly basis?
Like, Oh, that would still benice.
(26:51):
So one of the things that's hasbeen super enjoyable in my
larger house has been myscreened-in porch.
We do get to spend a lot of timeoutside at our tiny house.
And so I think we'll be addingsome additional outdoor spaces,
maybe, screened in porch elementto just be able to spend more
time outdoors.
Cause this is really importantto me.
(27:13):
I don't know if this is an easything to do, but if there's a
way that you could kind ofcompare a day in the life of
your big house to your tinyhouse, what would be the biggest
difference of living in the twohouses?
I will definitely answer thatquestion.
When you were starting to askthe question, it occurred to me
that one thing that should bementioned is that you can try
(27:33):
this out, that there's lots oftiny houses on Airbnb and other
rental communities.
So you're curious about it, youcan go try it out.
Um, I think the biggestdifference, for me is, the less
walking, just doing the laundryand doing the normal routines in
the kitchen and stuff, I feellike I just am walking all the
(27:55):
time.
And in the tiny house,everything is very compact.
You know, the laundry is veryclose to the kitchen.
And so it's, not kind of likeI'm wandering.
You know how you walk from roomto room and you forget why you
went in that other roomsometimes?
I don't have that happening asmuch because everything is a
little bit more compact.
But really the deep differenceis the fact that moving to tiny
(28:18):
living has enabled me to launchmy podcast, to launch my firm.
It is all tied together.
Without doing the tiny livingthing, I would have been paying
for my big house for another 25years.
And I would not have had thecourage to step out on my own
and become my independent,self-employed person.
And so I'm literally so gratefulfor this opportunity that we
(28:42):
created without even knowingwhat we were doing at the time
that I get to become my truestself, through this change.
And so it is just hugelyimpactful for me.
That is fantastic.
It's so much more than just achange of an address.
It sure is.
Well, thank you, Laura.
I've learned so much and Ireally appreciate all of your
(29:04):
knowledge about this.
You're truly such a well-versedspokesperson in this topic.
So thank you.
Well, thank you for having me,Elizabeth.
It's been a great pleasure.
It was inspiring to meet Laura,someone who's changing her life
to align with her passions.
Here are some of my takeawaysfrom our conversation.
Number one (29:25):
Having less stuff doesn't just mean less to keep
track of, clean, and maintain.
It also means less mentalstrain.
Do you own your stuff or doesyour stuff own you?
Two (29:36):
If you're having trouble getting rid of a certain item,
you can ask yourself, is thisthing truly important to me, or
am I just attached to it,because have had it for a long
time?
Memories live within us, notwithin objects.
Three (29:50):
Rather than just doing what you think is expected of
you, live with intention.
Figure out your core values anddesign your life around them.
Four (29:59):
Don't try to fit yourself into some pre-designed mold.
The world needs each of us withour unique talents and passions
and gifts.
And finally, number five (30:07):
You can always change your mind
about what you want to do.
As Laura said, she changesdirections to cover more ground.
I'd like to thank Laura Lynchfor teaching me so much about
tiny living.
If you'd like to learn moreabout it or get in touch with
Laura, go to the show notes forthis episode.
We have links to Laura's websiteand lots of information there.
(30:28):
If you want to listen to moreconversations about living with
less, check out episode 34 withDeanna Yates, a minimalist, and
episode 70 with Jenell Jones,who traded in her house for an
RV.
If you haven't yet subscribed tothis podcast, please do, and
please tell a few friends aboutit too.
I'm Elizabeth Pearson Garr.
Thanks for being curious aboutwhat it's like.
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