November 12, 2025 • 31 mins
Join John & Joyce as they open up about their own journeys through grief—sharing honest stories of loss, healing, and resilience.
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(00:00):
Well. Hello, hello.
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(01:07):
That's tech fixwkyc.com t e chf I fix.com.
with me and my co-host.
My friend of a long time.
We go way back home to have a goenjoy slogan choice.
Good to see you.Oh, it's always good to see you.
This is my therapy.
Oh, you know, I'mglad that we get to help others
(01:29):
with our positive podcastbecause it helps us to. Yes.
Yeah, it doesbecause it reminds us of what's good.
Yeah.
And there's so many things in the worldthat is good.
But ironically,we are speaking about grief.
We're continuing the talkwe have with, Reverend Frederick Marathi,
and he was about Greekas we all go through it.
(01:49):
And you were sharing a story with me
about your first experience with griefwas your hamster.
Don't laugh.
You think you gone through ittoo? Okay? Yes.
And he was 30 years old.
Oh, so years old. I lost my hamster.
Boy, I mean, you got to be able to laugh.
I know we're talking about grief, butthe thing is, we got to be able to laugh.
(02:10):
It's great therapy.
But, you know, I remember being, like,
three or 4 or 5 years oldand having a hamster.
And the only live, like, two weeks anyway.
Right.
And as for things maybe a little longer,maybe, maybe a month or two.
Take care of it.
But this poor thing just passed away,and I was beside myself.
But to my mom and dad's credit,they, you know, didn't,
you know, make fun of meor try to diminish it.
(02:32):
And they consoled me.
And that meant a lot to me at the timebecause, yeah,
I mean, I've never had children of my own,but I've had a zillion animals
over the years,and every time one of them passes
and goes to animal heaven,I've been, like, beside myself.
Joyce, I know. Yeah, like a baby, right?
I you know, I understand that we shouldnever diminish grief and children.
No, no, you know, like with a petor anything like that,
(02:56):
because there is like a rhythm,I call it to grief.
And we all have our own basicrhythm to that.
And sometimes it's angerinitially or depression and anger.
Then where do you end up?
Well, the good thing is to end upat acceptance. Yes.
And when you acceptedand then you look back on it
(03:19):
and, Reverend, Mourad is brought upa very good point about guilt.
Guilt is the one that is, stickswith a lot of people.
Could I have done?
Did I do this wrong? DidI should I've checked on this.
Should I have gone to the doctoror should I? I know we do that. What.
It could, it should it. Right.
You know, and that's natural.
What shocked me when my mom died
(03:41):
is that I was very close to my mother,
and we did everything together.
And I was with herwhen she had her stroke.
We were planning onwhat we were doing for Thanksgiving.
And then I was making her a sandwichand she wasn't answering me.
It's like, mom,do you want tomato on this? Like mom?
And she was like, right in a stroke.
(04:03):
So that was, a month long journey.
Then, you know, before she passedand I would lay in hospice
bed with her and,and hug her and talk to her and
and the moment she passed, you know,I shocked myself
with the thought of, oh, my gosh,I should have picked her up more.
(04:24):
I drove by and I was going to the store,and I thought
I didn't want to pick her upbecause I didn't want to slow down.
Why didn't I pick myself her up?
You know, why didn't I go there?
I shocked myself with that immediate.
It was like knee jerk reaction that, oh,I should have done this.
I had to really remind myself that, no,
(04:44):
I did a lot, you know,I did all that I could.
I didn't know this was going to happen.
No, dear human, you're you're.
Yeah, but we don't want to live with.
We can't live with always taking careof that one person.
What if they die? What if they die?What do they die?
So you just do the best you can, right?
Yeah. Exactly. Right.
And I think about my mom,who passed away back in 21,
(05:07):
and my mom was my first best friend.
And we,we communicate every day on the phone.
I would call mom.
Guess what have I love to share everysingle life instance with mom, right?
Loved it, loved it, loved it.
I remember when she passed on,I would look at the phone,
you know, and I want to call her.
And then I would call that numberjust to hear her voice.
(05:28):
Yeah.
And thank goodness, Joyce, I still havemany of her messages on my phone.
Still.
Yeah. No, no, no.
And then I might go back and listen to it.
And you know, she would always.
Honey, I love you and I,we just had such a great relationship.
But I would go do the same thing you did.
Maybe I should have visited a little bitmore often.
Was I too busy?
You did this and that, and I just said,come on.
(05:48):
I got to cut myself some slack here. Yeah.
You can't. Yes, I love mom. She knew that.
And she was so supportive.We loved each other.
And mom is is in a great place right now.
You know I found something onlineby anonymous
and I added to it and
it says grief may never fully leave us
(06:10):
but it does transform over time.
And it does.
It transforms into different waysof looking
at it, different ways of, appreciating.
And it's not a place to live forever,but a passage to walk through
when you're ready.
Allow gratitude to child.
They take up that space.
(06:31):
And I love that sentence
because gratitude is what healseverything.
Gratefulthat that person was in your life.
Yes. Grateful that you had a chanceto get to know that person,
even though their life may have been cuta little bit shorter than we like.
You know, God has the final say.
When are they gonna saywhen he's ready to call us home?
(06:51):
We go.
But in the meantime, I think a lessonto be learned in so many ways, Joyce, is
just be the best person you could be,you know, everyday, like,
you know, Reverend Frederick said inthe last episode, I said, any final words?
He said, just be kind.
Just be kind.
It was the best ending ever find. Yes.
Just courtesy of a dear friend of ours,Ken Engelman.
(07:13):
Yeah. Yes. Thank you Ken.
So love never ends.
It simply shifts with time.
The heart learns to hold both the sorrowand the blessing.
And that is it.
When you focus on that,the pain will start to lessen.
(07:33):
But then people get afraid of.
I'll forget them.
What if I forget them?What if I forget the sound of their voice?
What if I forget?
You know what they looked like?
It's like no.
When you get panicky about something,you tend to block things out.
But if you just relax and think about it,
you will hear it.
(07:54):
And even if you don't, you know it.
Now, you.
You lost your husband, Wayne.
Yes, I lost my first wife, Darcy.
What do you remember about Wayne?
Do you do you remember his voice at allor the sound of his voice?
Yes. You do?
Yeah, I do, I usually do because I think
(08:14):
even my sons, you know, remind me.
But he always had a nickname for me,so I can almost hear him, you know,
calling me, and,And I dream about him a lot.
He just shows up sometimes.
He's just sitting in a corner, sometimeshe's driving the car and I'm in the back.
But they're all pleasant.Oh, yeah. Oh, great.
(08:35):
No, they're all.
They're all really right.
Yeah. Really great.
So, I, you know, sometimes I,
I mean, I talk to him,even with laughter, it'll be like.
Wayne, why did you leave me with this?
You know, get back here.
You know, but I don't say it like it.
(08:56):
Oh, why did you leave me?
You know, it's just likewhen I get frustrated about something
that he could have handled,and I just really am.
I'm overloaded.
So I'll just say, get back hereand take care of this.
Why'd you leave me?
And then I have a picture of my motherby her urn.
So when I get just in the morning,I say, you know I love you, mom.
(09:20):
You know, so I, I know they're around.
I know they're not gone, gone, gone.
I just I just feel thateven if I didn't believe.
So, let's say you're not a believer
and let's sayyou don't believe in an afterlife.
Then believe in what they left you. Yes.
You know, believe in the lovethey gave you.
(09:42):
If you miss them, that that deeply,you must have loved them that deeply.
What a gift that is.
That is a gift to be able to love oneso deeply that it hurts.
When they left, how long did it take youto really make the transition from that,
that grief in the beginningto just being okay with it?
(10:04):
And quite frankly,you've thrived, Joyce, in so many ways.
You continue to go out thereand do amazing things in this world.
You work hard, you're a great mom.
You're a great friend to so many people.
You've been a great friend, Nick. Yeah.
But when, when when was thatkind of transition from.
Well, I did have the long goodbye.
Okay.
(10:24):
You know, it was eight years, and I think
when I, when we first got the diagnosis,
I think of Alzheimer's.
And it was, it was,you know, he was in his,
late 60s and he was like,ten years older than me.
And it was,
(10:45):
I don't think he fully comprehended that.
That's when,
it took me to my knees because I knew
I knew what was going to happen,
and he didn't really.
So I had this long goodbye.
And I reached outto some of my doctor recommended,
(11:09):
and it was a wonderful therapistwho dealt in geriatrics.
And I felt if he dealt with geriatrics,then he's gone through
speaking to family membersthat, you know, with Alzheimer's.
And he gave me wonderful tips. Why?
Because there are a lot of thingsI was doing wrong.
And I think many peoplewho are dealing with people
(11:31):
with Alzheimer's in the beginningmay be doing that frustrates
you very hardon the people that are dealing with people
with Alzheimer's and also to, to kind of like expand upon that.
How many times do people call upand ask about that person,
but they never askabout how you are doing?
Yeah, like 99% of the time, right?
(11:53):
Yeah.
That's why it's so, so importantif somebody is going through something,
realizedthey're the caretaker in many cases.
But never
forget to ask how they're doing too,because too many times they're forgotten.
And this right now, the whole focus,the whole focus, you know, was on him.
And I hear people doing that now who aredealing with people with Alzheimer's.
(12:14):
And I'll say tothem, this is what I learned.
Don't keep
saying remember mom or remember dad.
Here's pictures. Remember?
Remember we did.
I just told you that. Don't you remember?
That is not only frustrating on you,
but it's making them very confused.
(12:35):
So they sometimes begin to say yes.
Yes they do.
So John,I would have people, family members
like come over to the houseand say, see, he remembers
me, you know, because we would just nodand you know him.
He was very goodhearted, smiley, good natured person.
So that good nature, thankfully for me,
(12:58):
stayed throughout his last days
and they would almost leave like,I don't know what she's talking about.
He knows everything.
And he would look at me and I would say,wasn't that nice that so-and-so visited?
And he'd say, who's so-and-so?
I said, the person that was just here,he said, I don't know what you mean.
(13:20):
So what?
They didn't knowas soon as they walked out of that room,
he had no idea who they were,
but I, I was getting frustrated
because they weren't getting that.
And they were thinking, Joyce is fine.
He's fine.
He knows.
But he knew nothing.
(13:41):
He didn't know where the bathroom was.
He didn't know how to do anything.
So the the last year when you said thatI really grew from this,
John was the last year of his life.
Now Covid pretty much just began.
And hospice, I did get hospice to come in,
(14:04):
but they came in for two hoursa day, five days a week.
That left me alone with
him for 22 hours a day,
and I rarely got more than three hours
sleep because he had to be cleaned.
And he had to be,you know, get back into bed.
(14:24):
And sometimes even with the railingson the bed,
he jumped over the railingsand then they had a catheter in him.
And then he ripped out the catheterand was standing in the kitchen
the middle of the nightand a puddle of like, blackish blood.
It was.
The last eight months were exhausting,but the last eight months
(14:47):
becameexhilarating for me at the same time
because at my darkest time,
that's when I sat outside.
Even winter time,and my grandson still reminds me of that.
He said, I always thought you were crazysitting out on the snow,
just like talking to God.
(15:08):
And I said I had to or I would break.
And then
it was like the colorof the clouds parted
and as if God were saying to mein my mind,
look up, look up.
And I.
It was like almostseeing the curvature of the earth.
(15:30):
That was athis was a sunny, sunny, blue sky day.
And he said, I've given you all of this
and it and I had these flashbacks
because I used to put myself down,that I was a teenage mother.
I used to put myself down growing up.
There's a lot of things.
And he said, you gave birth.
(15:54):
A lot of women can't give birth.
You raised children you loved deeply.
You've had a great life.
And Wayne was a great husband to.
Are you blessed? Are you blessed?
It was like,I it's hard to put it into words.
(16:16):
It really was an epiphany.
But with that came forgiveness.
And that's where the magic happened.
There were a couple of people in my lifethat I had a very hard time with,
and if I couldn'tjoin in on the negativity
about a couple of people, I joined inbecause it had been very hurtful.
(16:38):
I came in and I sat on my bed
and both those people,I said, I forgive you,
I don't know what your life was like.
I never walked in your shoes,
but I'm going to send you loveand I forgive you.
And 48 hours later, or maybe sooner,
(17:01):
I may have told this story before,but it's still mind blowing to me.
That one person who hadn't been in touch
with us for over three years
sent me an email saying,
I don't know why we don't speak,but it's probably
my faultand I want to know if we can get together.
(17:23):
And I welcome that person into our home.
At Christmas time, we hugged.
We never spoke about the past
and, we're great now.
In fact, if somebody sayssomething negative about them,
it just slides off of me.
There's not an ounce in methat wants to engage like a cleansing.
(17:46):
It has happened with the second person.
Also, during Covid,
they brought me over toiletriesand different things
that I might have seen them in 15 years.
And those were the two peoplethat I asked,
you know, I forgave.
(18:06):
I didn't even ask God for that.
But it was in the momentof being appreciative of my life.
Let's say gratitude is riches.
My goodness, I believe I mean,I believe divine intervention.
It wasit was definitely divine intervention.
And that brought me to a deeper level
of faith, of love, forgiveness, gratitude.
(18:30):
But because I also went through thiswith eight for eight years,
I am so sympathetic to people
going through it on a levelthat I couldn't have been before,
because I have walked in those shoesand now I know I don't.
I don't preach about it like the storiesI'm telling now.
(18:51):
I may not say any of thatto them initially, but I listen
and I offer some advice aboutmaybe what to do for themselves.
And, that's a good ideabecause you want to keep yourself
healthy as well, because you got to putyour oxygen mask on first, right?
If you don't take care of yourself,you can't take care of others.
That's a great analogy.
Yeah. Yeah.
(19:11):
So so that's reallybrought me to a new level of
dealing with
what I'm dealing with at home with my son.
That's in the spectrum.
My grandson that's in the spectrum to be
like many timesI would like to be left alone,
but they're talking to meand they're very animated,
(19:33):
which they're not with the public as much.
And I just remind myself, and I put downwhatever I'm doing,
and I just listen to them,and I remind myself how grateful I am
to have these beautiful souls in my life,
you know, that really do bring me joy.
They bring me a lot of work at timesbecause I'm the only driver in the house,
(19:53):
really, except for my my other son, Jim,who's been very helpful.
But, it just gives you a newunderstanding and what hurts you the most.
You can help other people.
Isn'tthat what we're supposed to be doing?
Take our painand don't live in the pain, though.
Remember the good times.
(20:14):
Don't beat yourself up. Like,
oh, like I
could have said, oh,why didn't I get Wayne diagnosed earlier?
But it wouldn't have changed the outcomeanyway.
You know, it just,
you know, I just accepted it.
how do you think you came out?
What what made you different from theprevious eight years to when you came out?
(20:37):
How did you change as a person after this?
After Wayne, I became very mindful of everything good around me.
I'm very mindful that instead of saying,
I have a house with a mortgage,I said, I have a house,
I have a house.
You know, I have a house to take care of.
(20:59):
Aren't I blessed that I have that?
It made me so aware, John, of,
to look at the blessings of friendsin my life,
to not be critical of people and,
you know, it's hard not to be judgmental.
And, I mean, we all are in some way.
Sure, you may look at what someone'swearing and say that
(21:22):
so I can watch, like all the
reality shows, let's sayThe Housewives of Beverly Hills or that.
And I used used tosome of them would make me really angry.
Now. Right now they would because ofthe way they treat us right, right, right.
And so now I look at itas, like I'm in school
(21:45):
and I'm looking at this like they're
all good people in their own way.
I'm not going to I'm going to watch thiswithout judgment.
I'm going to watch Big Brother andnot root for just this one person to win.
I'm going to rootfor everybody to have a chance.
(22:05):
So it's a very mature attitude.
It expanded me that way.
So I look at everything almost likemy own personal science experience.
Right.
It's like your own petri dish.
Yes, I can I do this can I listen
to this newscastor this person and do this?
And if I can't, I turn it off, right?
Because I, you know, I don't needthat's just something that I'm.
(22:27):
Yeah.You start finding anger or something.
Welling up inside. It's not worth it.
No, I think I just changed my focusbecause I know as a hypnotherapist
and going through hypnotherapybecause of anxiety and all that,
it's only a thought,a way of what you really want.
You can shift your thoughtsfrom, isn't this horrible
(22:50):
to maybe you say, isn't this interesting?
Right? Well,this is challenging right now.
Not like, oh my God, this is so awful.
Now I'm going through a bit of a challenge
and I lovethat we're rather than we have a problem.
Say the challenge. Yeah, right.
Rather than say like,you know, I can't do this.
How can we do this?
Or I, like you said about the house,I have a house.
(23:11):
Yeah, I think about the mortgage, and,I'm not making enough money here.
Well,if you're making over $30,000 a year here
in this country,you're in the top 80% globally, right?
I think about that.
So it's all about perspective.
Mind shiftsfocusing again on gratitude. Yes.
Gratitude. Gratitude.
Gratitude gratitude.
And appreciation for what you do have.
(23:32):
And I don't care if it's just the rugyou like in your house
or a pet or whatever it is.
Focus on that.
Right when I wake up in the morning,
I'm going out and have my coffee,and I look in the back
and I see the morning dovesand the cardinals, and
I just focus and, you know,I just say, wow, I'm just mad.
Just do I love birds?
(23:53):
Yes. And I just focus on nature.
And I look at the treesand I think about if they could talk,
you know,
the things they've been throughover the years with weather
and everything elseand how they're still standing.
Yeah. It's kind of a metaphor for life.
Yeah.
I really sincerity way is and just tryingto be a lot more aware as I get older.
I just have my senses, my senses heightened more.
But again,you have to be intentional about that.
(24:15):
You do.
You do have to be intentional.
And I watch myself like a hawk.
And so if I feel like I'm getting off,
you know, that road drifting,I don't let it go long at all.
I pull myself right back in
and it's easy to get caught in the drama.
(24:35):
Oh my.
Like so much drama out there,especially because of social media.
Even though most of the people I haveand I have a lot of people on Facebook,
I try to handpickthe ones that are very positive.
But if someone shows upand they're not baby, you know?
Right.
Just because I, taking care of myself
(24:56):
and I have to do that and, you know, so
whether they like it or not, it's justI'm not saying anything bad about them.
I'm not going to respond.
You know?
I just let it go. You got you.
You can't please everyone. No matter what.
No matter what you do in life.
And you really just have to just sometimes
let go and let God.
Yes, let go and let God just
(25:18):
let them go. Pray for them.
Right, right. And move on.
So let me give you a little analogy ofwhat of what happened in my life
last night that shows you what happens
when you okay when you're not at ease.
Oh should I even say this.
This is a thing.
So my son, if there's a bug in the house,it could be a wasp.
(25:42):
It could be a spider. Whatever.
He gently gets it out.
He may put a cup on the walland he puts a thin piece of paper.
Oh, boy, that sounds familiar.
And does it? Yes, because.
Because I do the same thing.
I don't want to kill anything. Yeah,and my wife thinks I'm nuts.
She's just getting out of here. This,I think, is I.
(26:03):
I like spiders.
Yeah, well, I like these,and I just don't want them in my bedroom.
That's what somebody says.
Same thing, I don't know,crawling up my nose or my in my ears.
Or if I say, like, a little mouseor something like that,
I'm going to put a cupand I'm going to put it over the mouse
and put them outsideand probably end up coming back in anyway.
But I just, I don't know, I justI can relate to that.
And I've done that too. And
(26:25):
but there was something in my roomlast night
I wasn't sure what it was, but I'm nowI'm speaking I'm looking at my grandson
standing at my doorway, and he says,what's that?
This is what's what he says on your lamp.
And I turned and looked.
It was the ugliest looking.
I don't know what it was.
Well, I know I was sitting therewith the ice pack on my back
(26:49):
because my doctor said three times a day,use the ice pack and
and I'm just sitting there. Come.
I just, you know, I just I got up,
I knocked over the lamp,I knocked over all the books next to me.
It landed on my TV.
I took a towel. I was like, swatting it.
He said, comeon, you're going to break the TV.
(27:12):
My room.
I caught myself on a, I had saidnone of this was documented.
Oh, he said, I wish my my phone were on.
Oh, yeah.
He said, you'reso relaxed in life about things.
So now I'm bleeding from my fingerbecause I punctured it.
Something that was sticking in a mug
(27:32):
where I have pens and pencilsand things like that.
So I put a puncture hole in my finger.
I've got blood everywhere.
I, I this thing is flying around,
and I finally get a toweland I dive on top of it, and I wrap it up
and I throw it out the backand and I'm looking at my room.
(27:54):
My room is trashed.
It sounds like a skit on Saturday NightLive.
Well,you was all right, but had I called my
if I just went to my son's room,think he was sleeping?
And I said to him,could you come in here for a minute?
He would have gently, you know,it's like they know
you know, he won't kill, any kind of bug moth, nothing.
(28:16):
He just gently gets.
I wanted to get it out, but
the way I didn't, you neverwould have experienced all that drama.
Well,that's what I mean. Drama is not good.
No, not good, because I was exhausted.
Then I
had to wash my hand, keptputting Neosporin on it.
Right? Right.
Hoping I didn't get an infection becauseit was like a rusty end of a safety pin.
(28:37):
And it's like what not to do in a crisis.
And that's a whole episode.Maybe we'll have to do that.
What not to do onwhat's good with John and Joyce.
What's not good.
So when somebody even passes,
there are people who react that way,
and maybe it's good to
wail it out, I don't know,
(29:00):
but whatever you need to do, do,but don't get stuck in it.
I think that is the message for today.
Find things you're grateful for.
Be very grateful. They were in your life.
Yes, and kept busy.
Help others.
That's the whole point to themthat is so important.
Whenever you're feeling downor feeling stressed in your life,
(29:21):
go out there and do somethinggood for someone else.
Like we said in the previousepisode, it's amazing how that will uplift
not just them, but upliftyou and your situation as well.
Yes, 100%.
And you'llyou'll see that you'll feel better
and you'll be helping somebody else.
But focus on, you know, appreciateeverything around you, everything.
(29:41):
And don't feel guilty.
Everyone feels guilty.You're not alone with that.
Everyone has those fleeting thoughtswhen something happens and just know that
you you could not control it allunless you murdered the person.
But you couldn't. You couldn't.
You could not.
All right.
You I most things that happenin natural way.
(30:02):
Right. You have no control over that.
And it's being resilient and accepting,
that those two wordsalone will get you through things.
And I know it's easier said than done,because some of you
who are watching right now
might be going through a really toughsituation and said, yeah, okay.
It's I'm not quite there yet,
(30:22):
but everybody handles grief differentand there are different time frames.
And, we just praythat you get the grace you need
and the help you needand the support system around you.
And we want to let you know thatJoyce and I are
and all of us here at What's Good withJohn and Joyce are praying for you
and your family as well.
And we just yes, we do.
And we just we just believe in our hearts.
(30:44):
The better days are ahead.
You'll be the optimist that we are.
Yes. You know, just honor those who werebefore you by the way you live your life.
Yeah, absolutely.
And we'll be back againwith another edition of What's Good
with John and Joyceavailable on all streaming platforms.
We appreciate you.
We appreciate your family and friends,and thank you so much
for making us a part of youryour day, your night.
(31:04):
And, many blessings to you and your family.
Thank you.Till next time. Bye. Love you. Walk.
Well. Hello, hello.
We are back againand thank you so much for joining us.
What's good, John and Joy is availablein all the streaming platforms.
What's Good with Johnny Joyce is sponsoredby woodwinds Wedding and Special Events
Venue in Branford, Connecticutand Silvio's award winning Italian sauces,
which you can buy anytime onlineat silvio's.
Sauces.com that's silvio's sauces.com.
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(01:07):
That's tech fixwkyc.com t e chf I fix.com.
with me and my co-host.
My friend of a long time.
We go way back home to have a goenjoy slogan choice.
Good to see you.Oh, it's always good to see you.
This is my therapy.
Oh, you know, I'mglad that we get to help others
(01:29):
with our positive podcastbecause it helps us to. Yes.
Yeah, it doesbecause it reminds us of what's good.
Yeah.
And there's so many things in the worldthat is good.
But ironically,we are speaking about grief.
We're continuing the talkwe have with, Reverend Frederick Marathi,
and he was about Greekas we all go through it.
(01:49):
And you were sharing a story with me
about your first experience with griefwas your hamster.
Don't laugh.
You think you gone through ittoo? Okay? Yes.
And he was 30 years old.
Oh, so years old. I lost my hamster.
Boy, I mean, you got to be able to laugh.
I know we're talking about grief, butthe thing is, we got to be able to laugh.
(02:10):
It's great therapy.
But, you know, I remember being, like,
three or 4 or 5 years oldand having a hamster.
And the only live, like, two weeks anyway.
Right.
And as for things maybe a little longer,maybe, maybe a month or two.
Take care of it.
But this poor thing just passed away,and I was beside myself.
But to my mom and dad's credit,they, you know, didn't,
you know, make fun of meor try to diminish it.
(02:32):
And they consoled me.
And that meant a lot to me at the timebecause, yeah,
I mean, I've never had children of my own,but I've had a zillion animals
over the years,and every time one of them passes
and goes to animal heaven,I've been, like, beside myself.
Joyce, I know. Yeah, like a baby, right?
I you know, I understand that we shouldnever diminish grief and children.
No, no, you know, like with a petor anything like that,
(02:56):
because there is like a rhythm,I call it to grief.
And we all have our own basicrhythm to that.
And sometimes it's angerinitially or depression and anger.
Then where do you end up?
Well, the good thing is to end upat acceptance. Yes.
And when you acceptedand then you look back on it
(03:19):
and, Reverend, Mourad is brought upa very good point about guilt.
Guilt is the one that is, stickswith a lot of people.
Could I have done?
Did I do this wrong? DidI should I've checked on this.
Should I have gone to the doctoror should I? I know we do that. What.
It could, it should it. Right.
You know, and that's natural.
What shocked me when my mom died
(03:41):
is that I was very close to my mother,
and we did everything together.
And I was with herwhen she had her stroke.
We were planning onwhat we were doing for Thanksgiving.
And then I was making her a sandwichand she wasn't answering me.
It's like, mom,do you want tomato on this? Like mom?
And she was like, right in a stroke.
(04:03):
So that was, a month long journey.
Then, you know, before she passedand I would lay in hospice
bed with her and,and hug her and talk to her and
and the moment she passed, you know,I shocked myself
with the thought of, oh, my gosh,I should have picked her up more.
(04:24):
I drove by and I was going to the store,and I thought
I didn't want to pick her upbecause I didn't want to slow down.
Why didn't I pick myself her up?
You know, why didn't I go there?
I shocked myself with that immediate.
It was like knee jerk reaction that, oh,I should have done this.
I had to really remind myself that, no,
(04:44):
I did a lot, you know,I did all that I could.
I didn't know this was going to happen.
No, dear human, you're you're.
Yeah, but we don't want to live with.
We can't live with always taking careof that one person.
What if they die? What if they die?What do they die?
So you just do the best you can, right?
Yeah. Exactly. Right.
And I think about my mom,who passed away back in 21,
(05:07):
and my mom was my first best friend.
And we,we communicate every day on the phone.
I would call mom.
Guess what have I love to share everysingle life instance with mom, right?
Loved it, loved it, loved it.
I remember when she passed on,I would look at the phone,
you know, and I want to call her.
And then I would call that numberjust to hear her voice.
(05:28):
Yeah.
And thank goodness, Joyce, I still havemany of her messages on my phone.
Still.
Yeah. No, no, no.
And then I might go back and listen to it.
And you know, she would always.
Honey, I love you and I,we just had such a great relationship.
But I would go do the same thing you did.
Maybe I should have visited a little bitmore often.
Was I too busy?
You did this and that, and I just said,come on.
(05:48):
I got to cut myself some slack here. Yeah.
You can't. Yes, I love mom. She knew that.
And she was so supportive.We loved each other.
And mom is is in a great place right now.
You know I found something onlineby anonymous
and I added to it and
it says grief may never fully leave us
(06:10):
but it does transform over time.
And it does.
It transforms into different waysof looking
at it, different ways of, appreciating.
And it's not a place to live forever,but a passage to walk through
when you're ready.
Allow gratitude to child.
They take up that space.
(06:31):
And I love that sentence
because gratitude is what healseverything.
Gratefulthat that person was in your life.
Yes. Grateful that you had a chanceto get to know that person,
even though their life may have been cuta little bit shorter than we like.
You know, God has the final say.
When are they gonna saywhen he's ready to call us home?
(06:51):
We go.
But in the meantime, I think a lessonto be learned in so many ways, Joyce, is
just be the best person you could be,you know, everyday, like,
you know, Reverend Frederick said inthe last episode, I said, any final words?
He said, just be kind.
Just be kind.
It was the best ending ever find. Yes.
Just courtesy of a dear friend of ours,Ken Engelman.
(07:13):
Yeah. Yes. Thank you Ken.
So love never ends.
It simply shifts with time.
The heart learns to hold both the sorrowand the blessing.
And that is it.
When you focus on that,the pain will start to lessen.
(07:33):
But then people get afraid of.
I'll forget them.
What if I forget them?What if I forget the sound of their voice?
What if I forget?
You know what they looked like?
It's like no.
When you get panicky about something,you tend to block things out.
But if you just relax and think about it,
you will hear it.
(07:54):
And even if you don't, you know it.
Now, you.
You lost your husband, Wayne.
Yes, I lost my first wife, Darcy.
What do you remember about Wayne?
Do you do you remember his voice at allor the sound of his voice?
Yes. You do?
Yeah, I do, I usually do because I think
(08:14):
even my sons, you know, remind me.
But he always had a nickname for me,so I can almost hear him, you know,
calling me, and,And I dream about him a lot.
He just shows up sometimes.
He's just sitting in a corner, sometimeshe's driving the car and I'm in the back.
But they're all pleasant.Oh, yeah. Oh, great.
(08:35):
No, they're all.
They're all really right.
Yeah. Really great.
So, I, you know, sometimes I,
I mean, I talk to him,even with laughter, it'll be like.
Wayne, why did you leave me with this?
You know, get back here.
You know, but I don't say it like it.
(08:56):
Oh, why did you leave me?
You know, it's just likewhen I get frustrated about something
that he could have handled,and I just really am.
I'm overloaded.
So I'll just say, get back hereand take care of this.
Why'd you leave me?
And then I have a picture of my motherby her urn.
So when I get just in the morning,I say, you know I love you, mom.
(09:20):
You know, so I, I know they're around.
I know they're not gone, gone, gone.
I just I just feel thateven if I didn't believe.
So, let's say you're not a believer
and let's sayyou don't believe in an afterlife.
Then believe in what they left you. Yes.
You know, believe in the lovethey gave you.
(09:42):
If you miss them, that that deeply,you must have loved them that deeply.
What a gift that is.
That is a gift to be able to love oneso deeply that it hurts.
When they left, how long did it take youto really make the transition from that,
that grief in the beginningto just being okay with it?
(10:04):
And quite frankly,you've thrived, Joyce, in so many ways.
You continue to go out thereand do amazing things in this world.
You work hard, you're a great mom.
You're a great friend to so many people.
You've been a great friend, Nick. Yeah.
But when, when when was thatkind of transition from.
Well, I did have the long goodbye.
Okay.
(10:24):
You know, it was eight years, and I think
when I, when we first got the diagnosis,
I think of Alzheimer's.
And it was, it was,you know, he was in his,
late 60s and he was like,ten years older than me.
And it was,
(10:45):
I don't think he fully comprehended that.
That's when,
it took me to my knees because I knew
I knew what was going to happen,
and he didn't really.
So I had this long goodbye.
And I reached outto some of my doctor recommended,
(11:09):
and it was a wonderful therapistwho dealt in geriatrics.
And I felt if he dealt with geriatrics,then he's gone through
speaking to family membersthat, you know, with Alzheimer's.
And he gave me wonderful tips. Why?
Because there are a lot of thingsI was doing wrong.
And I think many peoplewho are dealing with people
(11:31):
with Alzheimer's in the beginningmay be doing that frustrates
you very hardon the people that are dealing with people
with Alzheimer's and also to, to kind of like expand upon that.
How many times do people call upand ask about that person,
but they never askabout how you are doing?
Yeah, like 99% of the time, right?
(11:53):
Yeah.
That's why it's so, so importantif somebody is going through something,
realizedthey're the caretaker in many cases.
But never
forget to ask how they're doing too,because too many times they're forgotten.
And this right now, the whole focus,the whole focus, you know, was on him.
And I hear people doing that now who aredealing with people with Alzheimer's.
(12:14):
And I'll say tothem, this is what I learned.
Don't keep
saying remember mom or remember dad.
Here's pictures. Remember?
Remember we did.
I just told you that. Don't you remember?
That is not only frustrating on you,
but it's making them very confused.
(12:35):
So they sometimes begin to say yes.
Yes they do.
So John,I would have people, family members
like come over to the houseand say, see, he remembers
me, you know, because we would just nodand you know him.
He was very goodhearted, smiley, good natured person.
So that good nature, thankfully for me,
(12:58):
stayed throughout his last days
and they would almost leave like,I don't know what she's talking about.
He knows everything.
And he would look at me and I would say,wasn't that nice that so-and-so visited?
And he'd say, who's so-and-so?
I said, the person that was just here,he said, I don't know what you mean.
(13:20):
So what?
They didn't knowas soon as they walked out of that room,
he had no idea who they were,
but I, I was getting frustrated
because they weren't getting that.
And they were thinking, Joyce is fine.
He's fine.
He knows.
But he knew nothing.
(13:41):
He didn't know where the bathroom was.
He didn't know how to do anything.
So the the last year when you said thatI really grew from this,
John was the last year of his life.
Now Covid pretty much just began.
And hospice, I did get hospice to come in,
(14:04):
but they came in for two hoursa day, five days a week.
That left me alone with
him for 22 hours a day,
and I rarely got more than three hours
sleep because he had to be cleaned.
And he had to be,you know, get back into bed.
(14:24):
And sometimes even with the railingson the bed,
he jumped over the railingsand then they had a catheter in him.
And then he ripped out the catheterand was standing in the kitchen
the middle of the nightand a puddle of like, blackish blood.
It was.
The last eight months were exhausting,but the last eight months
(14:47):
becameexhilarating for me at the same time
because at my darkest time,
that's when I sat outside.
Even winter time,and my grandson still reminds me of that.
He said, I always thought you were crazysitting out on the snow,
just like talking to God.
(15:08):
And I said I had to or I would break.
And then
it was like the colorof the clouds parted
and as if God were saying to mein my mind,
look up, look up.
And I.
It was like almostseeing the curvature of the earth.
(15:30):
That was athis was a sunny, sunny, blue sky day.
And he said, I've given you all of this
and it and I had these flashbacks
because I used to put myself down,that I was a teenage mother.
I used to put myself down growing up.
There's a lot of things.
And he said, you gave birth.
(15:54):
A lot of women can't give birth.
You raised children you loved deeply.
You've had a great life.
And Wayne was a great husband to.
Are you blessed? Are you blessed?
It was like,I it's hard to put it into words.
(16:16):
It really was an epiphany.
But with that came forgiveness.
And that's where the magic happened.
There were a couple of people in my lifethat I had a very hard time with,
and if I couldn'tjoin in on the negativity
about a couple of people, I joined inbecause it had been very hurtful.
(16:38):
I came in and I sat on my bed
and both those people,I said, I forgive you,
I don't know what your life was like.
I never walked in your shoes,
but I'm going to send you loveand I forgive you.
And 48 hours later, or maybe sooner,
(17:01):
I may have told this story before,but it's still mind blowing to me.
That one person who hadn't been in touch
with us for over three years
sent me an email saying,
I don't know why we don't speak,but it's probably
my faultand I want to know if we can get together.
(17:23):
And I welcome that person into our home.
At Christmas time, we hugged.
We never spoke about the past
and, we're great now.
In fact, if somebody sayssomething negative about them,
it just slides off of me.
There's not an ounce in methat wants to engage like a cleansing.
(17:46):
It has happened with the second person.
Also, during Covid,
they brought me over toiletriesand different things
that I might have seen them in 15 years.
And those were the two peoplethat I asked,
you know, I forgave.
(18:06):
I didn't even ask God for that.
But it was in the momentof being appreciative of my life.
Let's say gratitude is riches.
My goodness, I believe I mean,I believe divine intervention.
It wasit was definitely divine intervention.
And that brought me to a deeper level
of faith, of love, forgiveness, gratitude.
(18:30):
But because I also went through thiswith eight for eight years,
I am so sympathetic to people
going through it on a levelthat I couldn't have been before,
because I have walked in those shoesand now I know I don't.
I don't preach about it like the storiesI'm telling now.
(18:51):
I may not say any of thatto them initially, but I listen
and I offer some advice aboutmaybe what to do for themselves.
And, that's a good ideabecause you want to keep yourself
healthy as well, because you got to putyour oxygen mask on first, right?
If you don't take care of yourself,you can't take care of others.
That's a great analogy.
Yeah. Yeah.
(19:11):
So so that's reallybrought me to a new level of
dealing with
what I'm dealing with at home with my son.
That's in the spectrum.
My grandson that's in the spectrum to be
like many timesI would like to be left alone,
but they're talking to meand they're very animated,
(19:33):
which they're not with the public as much.
And I just remind myself, and I put downwhatever I'm doing,
and I just listen to them,and I remind myself how grateful I am
to have these beautiful souls in my life,
you know, that really do bring me joy.
They bring me a lot of work at timesbecause I'm the only driver in the house,
(19:53):
really, except for my my other son, Jim,who's been very helpful.
But, it just gives you a newunderstanding and what hurts you the most.
You can help other people.
Isn'tthat what we're supposed to be doing?
Take our painand don't live in the pain, though.
Remember the good times.
(20:14):
Don't beat yourself up. Like,
oh, like I
could have said, oh,why didn't I get Wayne diagnosed earlier?
But it wouldn't have changed the outcomeanyway.
You know, it just,
you know, I just accepted it.
how do you think you came out?
What what made you different from theprevious eight years to when you came out?
(20:37):
How did you change as a person after this?
After Wayne, I became very mindful of everything good around me.
I'm very mindful that instead of saying,
I have a house with a mortgage,I said, I have a house,
I have a house.
You know, I have a house to take care of.
(20:59):
Aren't I blessed that I have that?
It made me so aware, John, of,
to look at the blessings of friendsin my life,
to not be critical of people and,
you know, it's hard not to be judgmental.
And, I mean, we all are in some way.
Sure, you may look at what someone'swearing and say that
(21:22):
so I can watch, like all the
reality shows, let's sayThe Housewives of Beverly Hills or that.
And I used used tosome of them would make me really angry.
Now. Right now they would because ofthe way they treat us right, right, right.
And so now I look at itas, like I'm in school
(21:45):
and I'm looking at this like they're
all good people in their own way.
I'm not going to I'm going to watch thiswithout judgment.
I'm going to watch Big Brother andnot root for just this one person to win.
I'm going to rootfor everybody to have a chance.
(22:05):
So it's a very mature attitude.
It expanded me that way.
So I look at everything almost likemy own personal science experience.
Right.
It's like your own petri dish.
Yes, I can I do this can I listen
to this newscastor this person and do this?
And if I can't, I turn it off, right?
Because I, you know, I don't needthat's just something that I'm.
(22:27):
Yeah.You start finding anger or something.
Welling up inside. It's not worth it.
No, I think I just changed my focusbecause I know as a hypnotherapist
and going through hypnotherapybecause of anxiety and all that,
it's only a thought,a way of what you really want.
You can shift your thoughtsfrom, isn't this horrible
(22:50):
to maybe you say, isn't this interesting?
Right? Well,this is challenging right now.
Not like, oh my God, this is so awful.
Now I'm going through a bit of a challenge
and I lovethat we're rather than we have a problem.
Say the challenge. Yeah, right.
Rather than say like,you know, I can't do this.
How can we do this?
Or I, like you said about the house,I have a house.
(23:11):
Yeah, I think about the mortgage, and,I'm not making enough money here.
Well,if you're making over $30,000 a year here
in this country,you're in the top 80% globally, right?
I think about that.
So it's all about perspective.
Mind shiftsfocusing again on gratitude. Yes.
Gratitude. Gratitude.
Gratitude gratitude.
And appreciation for what you do have.
(23:32):
And I don't care if it's just the rugyou like in your house
or a pet or whatever it is.
Focus on that.
Right when I wake up in the morning,
I'm going out and have my coffee,and I look in the back
and I see the morning dovesand the cardinals, and
I just focus and, you know,I just say, wow, I'm just mad.
Just do I love birds?
(23:53):
Yes. And I just focus on nature.
And I look at the treesand I think about if they could talk,
you know,
the things they've been throughover the years with weather
and everything elseand how they're still standing.
Yeah. It's kind of a metaphor for life.
Yeah.
I really sincerity way is and just tryingto be a lot more aware as I get older.
I just have my senses, my senses heightened more.
But again,you have to be intentional about that.
(24:15):
You do.
You do have to be intentional.
And I watch myself like a hawk.
And so if I feel like I'm getting off,
you know, that road drifting,I don't let it go long at all.
I pull myself right back in
and it's easy to get caught in the drama.
(24:35):
Oh my.
Like so much drama out there,especially because of social media.
Even though most of the people I haveand I have a lot of people on Facebook,
I try to handpickthe ones that are very positive.
But if someone shows upand they're not baby, you know?
Right.
Just because I, taking care of myself
(24:56):
and I have to do that and, you know, so
whether they like it or not, it's justI'm not saying anything bad about them.
I'm not going to respond.
You know?
I just let it go. You got you.
You can't please everyone. No matter what.
No matter what you do in life.
And you really just have to just sometimes
let go and let God.
Yes, let go and let God just
(25:18):
let them go. Pray for them.
Right, right. And move on.
So let me give you a little analogy ofwhat of what happened in my life
last night that shows you what happens
when you okay when you're not at ease.
Oh should I even say this.
This is a thing.
So my son, if there's a bug in the house,it could be a wasp.
(25:42):
It could be a spider. Whatever.
He gently gets it out.
He may put a cup on the walland he puts a thin piece of paper.
Oh, boy, that sounds familiar.
And does it? Yes, because.
Because I do the same thing.
I don't want to kill anything. Yeah,and my wife thinks I'm nuts.
She's just getting out of here. This,I think, is I.
(26:03):
I like spiders.
Yeah, well, I like these,and I just don't want them in my bedroom.
That's what somebody says.
Same thing, I don't know,crawling up my nose or my in my ears.
Or if I say, like, a little mouseor something like that,
I'm going to put a cupand I'm going to put it over the mouse
and put them outsideand probably end up coming back in anyway.
But I just, I don't know, I justI can relate to that.
And I've done that too. And
(26:25):
but there was something in my roomlast night
I wasn't sure what it was, but I'm nowI'm speaking I'm looking at my grandson
standing at my doorway, and he says,what's that?
This is what's what he says on your lamp.
And I turned and looked.
It was the ugliest looking.
I don't know what it was.
Well, I know I was sitting therewith the ice pack on my back
(26:49):
because my doctor said three times a day,use the ice pack and
and I'm just sitting there. Come.
I just, you know, I just I got up,
I knocked over the lamp,I knocked over all the books next to me.
It landed on my TV.
I took a towel. I was like, swatting it.
He said, comeon, you're going to break the TV.
(27:12):
My room.
I caught myself on a, I had saidnone of this was documented.
Oh, he said, I wish my my phone were on.
Oh, yeah.
He said, you'reso relaxed in life about things.
So now I'm bleeding from my fingerbecause I punctured it.
Something that was sticking in a mug
(27:32):
where I have pens and pencilsand things like that.
So I put a puncture hole in my finger.
I've got blood everywhere.
I, I this thing is flying around,
and I finally get a toweland I dive on top of it, and I wrap it up
and I throw it out the backand and I'm looking at my room.
(27:54):
My room is trashed.
It sounds like a skit on Saturday NightLive.
Well,you was all right, but had I called my
if I just went to my son's room,think he was sleeping?
And I said to him,could you come in here for a minute?
He would have gently, you know,it's like they know
you know, he won't kill, any kind of bug moth, nothing.
(28:16):
He just gently gets.
I wanted to get it out, but
the way I didn't, you neverwould have experienced all that drama.
Well,that's what I mean. Drama is not good.
No, not good, because I was exhausted.
Then I
had to wash my hand, keptputting Neosporin on it.
Right? Right.
Hoping I didn't get an infection becauseit was like a rusty end of a safety pin.
(28:37):
And it's like what not to do in a crisis.
And that's a whole episode.Maybe we'll have to do that.
What not to do onwhat's good with John and Joyce.
What's not good.
So when somebody even passes,
there are people who react that way,
and maybe it's good to
wail it out, I don't know,
(29:00):
but whatever you need to do, do,but don't get stuck in it.
I think that is the message for today.
Find things you're grateful for.
Be very grateful. They were in your life.
Yes, and kept busy.
Help others.
That's the whole point to themthat is so important.
Whenever you're feeling downor feeling stressed in your life,
(29:21):
go out there and do somethinggood for someone else.
Like we said in the previousepisode, it's amazing how that will uplift
not just them, but upliftyou and your situation as well.
Yes, 100%.
And you'llyou'll see that you'll feel better
and you'll be helping somebody else.
But focus on, you know, appreciateeverything around you, everything.
(29:41):
And don't feel guilty.
Everyone feels guilty.You're not alone with that.
Everyone has those fleeting thoughtswhen something happens and just know that
you you could not control it allunless you murdered the person.
But you couldn't. You couldn't.
You could not.
All right.
You I most things that happenin natural way.
(30:02):
Right. You have no control over that.
And it's being resilient and accepting,
that those two wordsalone will get you through things.
And I know it's easier said than done,because some of you
who are watching right now
might be going through a really toughsituation and said, yeah, okay.
It's I'm not quite there yet,
(30:22):
but everybody handles grief differentand there are different time frames.
And, we just praythat you get the grace you need
and the help you needand the support system around you.
And we want to let you know thatJoyce and I are
and all of us here at What's Good withJohn and Joyce are praying for you
and your family as well.
And we just yes, we do.
And we just we just believe in our hearts.
(30:44):
The better days are ahead.
You'll be the optimist that we are.
Yes. You know, just honor those who werebefore you by the way you live your life.
Yeah, absolutely.
And we'll be back againwith another edition of What's Good
with John and Joyceavailable on all streaming platforms.
We appreciate you.
We appreciate your family and friends,and thank you so much
for making us a part of youryour day, your night.
(31:04):
And, many blessings to you and your family.
Thank you.Till next time. Bye. Love you. Walk.
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