May 5, 2025 • 47 mins
Today on What's My Frame I'm joined by Actor & Poet, Paul Mabon. A Chicago native and son of an accomplished actor, Paul grew up having a front row seat to some of the best theater the city had to offer.
Today we chat about Paul's journey in LA. From Progressive to The Pitt; Paul shares insight into the classes, mentors and mindset that have supportive his career along with his favorite audition story.
Outside of acting, Paul is also an avid poet and has appeared on Season V of Russell Simmons presents Def Poetry. One of his most meaningful accomplishments was earning a lifetime membership to The Actors Studio.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:03):
Hi everyone, today and what's myframe?
I'm joined by actor and poet Paul Maiden, the Chicago native
and son of an accomplished actor.
Paul grew up having a front row seat, some of the best theater
the city had to offer. Today we chat about Pauls
journey in Los Angeles, from hisextensive partnership with
Progressive to working on one ofthis season's top shows, The
Pit. Paula shares insight into the
(00:25):
classes, mentors, and mindset that have supported his career,
along with his favorite auditionstory.
Now let's get to the conversation.
Hey Paul, welcome to What's My Frame?
How? Are you?
Thanks for having me. How are you?
I'm excited to have you on the show I got.
I I knew your work prior. I had seen you on my TV both
(00:47):
theatrically and commercially. But we got to meet through the
SAG after Foundation, which was a very dear place in my heart.
And you did. A great job.
Thank you. We will link that panel so
everybody can can listen to it again if they want to.
But it was so nice to see someone with such exuberance
towards the work and the craft. And when I met you, it was just,
(01:09):
well, as a fellow theater child and nerd, I kind of like, I saw
a familiarity of that, like the the geekiness towards the craft.
And I really wanted to have you on the pod.
But for anyone who isn't familiar with your creative
journey and your back story, do you mind sharing a little bit of
what drew you to the arts? I know you do have a a family
(01:31):
history in the business. Sure, I'm a theater baby.
My father's an actor by the samename.
I generally grew up in Chicago going to see him do plays and
basically just being influenced by seeing my father play so many
different characters. He played at the Steppenwolf
(01:51):
Theatre, at the Goodman Theatre.You know, he, he did a lot of
work in community theatres and the, the impact was just
undeniable because, you know, one small little cameo here led
to another one there. And you know, I was heavily
influenced when I got to high school.
However, I didn't go into acting, I guess because I was a
(02:13):
late bloomer, so I didn't start acting in theatre in a more
adult setting until college. I did write poetry in high
school, so I kind of combined the two.
But in in college I was in a lotof theatrical productions and
(02:35):
not being a theater major. So it was just kind of ironic to
me. And I guess the the theater, the
theater community there that youknow, who's this guy?
You know, how come he gets to bein place?
He's not a theatre major. But I was just kind of doing
what came natural do. And I left college and went to
grad school for poetry and I just got into the real world in
(03:00):
terms of television production. I guess with acting, it's just
like you get the stigma of your parents saying, OK, you're going
to fall back on what are you really going to do?
My dad was all supportive for it, but my mom was like, you got
to get a job, you know? So, so Long story short, I, I
went back to theater while I worked in TV as a promotions
(03:25):
producer. And eventually I had the
opportunity to move to Los Angeles because I had an aunt
who was about to move to Memphis.
And she was like, well, if you want to take the leap, you
better do it now because we're leaving in four months.
And I was just like, but I'm notready, you know, it's just like,
you better get it ready. So I just, I packed up
(03:45):
everything. I, I moved to Fairfield, CA and
four months later I drove down to Los Angeles, rented a car,
didn't have a car for like 2 years.
And I just worked temp jobs. I had to start completely over,
like you know, it was like $11.00 an hour back in 2004.
(04:05):
And my first, first I guess studio apartment was $610,
utilities included. And I did a lot of borrowing
just to keep that. I didn't really didn't start
acting until like 2007 and 2008 when I just started doing
background work to get into the SAG union.
So basically you want to get your 3 vouchers.
(04:26):
You know, everybody has a story,which is the catch 22.
And even then, you know, there was like around the writers
strike the first one. And, you know, I basically just
kind of worked my way up with the, you know, introductory
agents or agents that were just like, maybe I guess taking
anybody that they can throw against the wall.
(04:47):
You know, there was no audition specifically for my type or
whatever. They would just, and I just kind
of went up the ladder. You know, the more, the more
costars I booked one after the other until and during that
whole time I was, I was still doing theater here.
I did a couple of plays here in Los Angeles And, and it's helped
(05:07):
tremendously because it's, it teaches you, it teaches you the
live performance aspect of, of what it's like because it's so
different from the audition to the call back to actually being
on set. You know, those are three
different things that you have to wrap your head around.
You know, 'cause it's nothing like the other one is nothing
(05:28):
like the other. But after years and years of,
of, of, of doing Co stars and having three different jobs to,
to, to pay that $610, I used to,I used to DJI used to, I have
been to more bar mitzvahs than probably you.
And I taught kids poetry at a organization.
(05:53):
So it's, it was a lot. But the one day came where it
was in April. As a matter of fact, it was just
like my year to date for all of my jobs, you know, was kind of
matched by my acting career. And I was like looking at the
checks. I was like, today's the last
day. So yeah, that happened in 2018
(06:14):
and which is right around where I started working with
Progressive Insurance And you know, one commercial led to
another. And, and like you were saying, I
think we were talking about before, the commercial side
helps the theatrical side because of the visibility, you
know what I mean? The familiarity.
It's a lot easier to book a job if you look familiar and then
(06:35):
people hire you based on, oh, ifhe or she did that, then they
can do this. Don't we want that?
We can get that. They're literally buying what
they already saw. Yep, I'm very curious because
there there is this, I feel a misconception about those that
come from theater being too big.And I know, you know, there's
there's currently like a meme that's floating around about
(06:56):
commercial editions like just dous just do nothing, like
absolutely nothing. That's what they want,
absolutely nothing. And I do I, I, I think that is
true, but I'm curious if you gota lot of those notes about being
too big or was it really? That note is actually more
designed for it. It's not filled.
It's not grounded. Well, no, it's it's definitely
some truth to it. Like I said, it's like you have
(07:18):
to learn how to adapt for different environments, just
like we had to learn to do self tapes all back.
Sounds like I'm looking at the camera.
I'm not looking at you. If I was looking at you, I'd be
doing this, you know, and then on camera, it looks like, why is
he looking down? You know, So with like regular
auditions, it's like you have toknow that you have to be
(07:41):
extremely conversational, like you're just talking to a person,
you know, and you have to forgetthat there's this wall of people
and equipments right there or behind you, you know, and, and
you have to like be able to connect with this actor, even
though you're living under theseimaginary circumstances.
And it's and that's just the theend game.
(08:04):
But the very beginning, it's just like you're just you and a
intern and a camera and or a, you know, a camera operator.
And you have to create this world that increasingly gets
bigger the more you do, you know, callbacks, more people,
the casting directors there, youknow, a lot more people are
watching. And it's like, and then when you
(08:25):
finally get to set, you know, you have to, you can't use your
theater voice. What's wrong with you?
Yeah. But it took, it took me a while
to adapt because it's, it's likenobody tells you that, you know,
they don't say it's the they. It's just something I had to
learn. And I kind of took it for
(08:45):
granted because I was learning it and I just didn't write it
down. I just kind of picked up on the
fact that, oh, nobody else is screaming, you know, nobody else
is. You know what I mean?
Else is projecting to double M. Exactly.
Yeah, exactly. I know you.
You're a lifetime member of the Actors Studio with a beautiful
creative home to be a part of. How did you how did you become a
(09:08):
part of the Actors Studio? Well, while doing theater out
here, Martin Landau, when he wasstill alive, he he attended a a
play that I did and the studio, the studio was frequently
producing plays at the Greenway Court Theatre on Fairfax and no
rolls. And they would hold like
(09:30):
greetings and and things like that.
And he saw me doing a play that actually Barry Primus is an
actor and producer, director Barry Primus saw me and kind of
put his arm around me and say, hey, you gotta gotta get this
kid to audition. And I was like, yeah, yeah.
So. So I didn't know what it was or
what it meant or anything, but I, I, I auditioned for the
(09:52):
Actors Studio with a friend of mine and it took us two years.
Because there's different levels.
There's like an observer, which means you can just come and
watch and then you could be a working observer and then
there's like a finalist. And all during that time you get
the privilege of like hearing the commentary and, and going to
(10:13):
classes and, and basically kind of learning what the studio is
about. The studio is a place where you
go, it's like more about the process of rehearsing and it's
not about the finished product. So I, I, I was very fortunate
enough to after two years being being accepted into the actors.
They give you a card and everything, like you're an actor
(10:34):
is like, they give you a nice little letter.
And, and then you get to put up scenes on Tuesdays and Fridays
and you get to go to different classes for like relaxation and,
and movement and, you know, justdifferent aspects of acting
that, that help you, that help you develop your, your, your
voice. And it's, it's like a lot of
(10:58):
it's just, it's just where you go to, I hate to say it, but
it's just where you go to like fail, where you just kind of go
to experience other people's processes.
You know, how do they work? Because it's easy to point
somebody out, say that's wrong, that's wrong, that's wrong.
Look, that doesn't look right. But then when you're there, you
have to humble yourself. And what's the most interesting
thing about it is after you do your scene, you know, you, you
(11:19):
have to sit in a chair and then you just have to take the notes
and you just listen to what people say.
And it's like that's where you learn who you are in terms of
like, don't get defensive, you know, 'cause this, it's like the
temptation is to explain what you did or defend your choice
and stuff like that, you know, but it's not about that.
(11:41):
It's just about being an artist and humbling yourself, you know,
'cause it's, it's, it's a good place to be.
I am such a huge proponent of continuing education, be a
lifelong learner because I thinkas our industry changes and
evolves, it's the most results driven and bottom line that I
have ever seen it currently. And I think it's going to only
(12:03):
continue to go in that direction.
And you have to have a space to create with people that you
trust and a place to explore. And.
Right. Yeah, but.
Yeah, and, and, and, and to keepyour, your instruments sharp,
like I still do poetry, you know, I still, I still get in
front of people live, you know, because like we were saying
earlier, with the different aspects of auditions and
(12:25):
callbacks being on set, you know, there's the winning of the
room. You know, they have to just like
you, they have to know that if we pick this, if we pick her,
you know, is this going to be a good eight hours or whatever it
is? You know what I mean?
It's like you, you want to you want to channel all your
explosive, beautiful personalityinto a manageable interview.
(12:48):
Exactly. And it's even changing with
commercials in the room. Like I've had a couple of
callbacks where the first one threw me because I heard the
voices and then walked in and everybody was on Zoom.
It was just the session runner and I like that's what I love is
like in the room for callbacks of like, Hey, how are you like
chatting with like the couch, like I turn into my little
(13:09):
comedian self. And I was like expecting like,
hey. So.
Like, sorry to be disappointed to see just you, Todd.
But we're all the people. He's like, they're on the
screen. It's fine.
So now I just like ask, I'm like, are there people in the
room or is that? You have to.
All right, for a SEC, 'cause we're gonna cover, we're gonna
(13:30):
cover We've already talked abouttheater, but we're gonna cover
commercials. We're gonna have a theatrical,
we're gonna cover your poetry. You are one of those very
diversified creatives. And I, I love that cause like, I
think when you have a lot of creativity, you just gotta get
it out. But I really want to talk about
the pit because you worked on one of this season's biggest
runaway hits and you had this beautiful scene with your your
(13:54):
father character and and it justwhat was the experience like?
What was the audition process like?
How, how was yourself taped? I'm sure.
Wow, Well, you know what, it's like I was just talking to
another actress friend of mine today about how we downplay our
our talent. You know, 'cause it was like,
(14:16):
this is how it happened. This is a lot.
I thought how it happened. It happened because I'm talented
and I'm a great actor and blah, blah, blah.
But I did a play reading. It was a it was stage reading
with Richard Broadhurst. And Richard knew Noah Weil and
(14:39):
he was part of the stage readingwith like another famous actor.
So it's just like three of us, right?
And so I get in there and I didn't, you know, I looked him
up, but I really didn't know know who I was reading with.
And as soon as I walk in the door, Noah Weil goes, you and I
was like me, you know, So he says, Yeah, I auditioned for
(15:04):
downsizing. And Downsizing was a movie with
Matt Damon. Yeah, I.
Remember, they shrunk him. Right.
Exactly. Yeah.
I'm in or something. Right.
I had a scene in there and he said, Noah said that he
auditioned to be in that Alexander Payne movie because
who wouldn't want to be in Alexander Payne?
And he auditioned for my role. It was a small role, but it was
(15:25):
an Alexander Payne movie. So he was like, oh, man, It's
like, wow. OK.
Yeah. And I was like, oh, nice to meet
you, you know, So then we do it,right?
And it was a reading. But I come from the theater.
So, you know, from the theater, you are giving it up.
And these, these other, you know, they.
I don't. I guess it was just they were
(15:46):
just reading. But I was like, really living
it. And I was raising their stakes.
And after it was over, they werelike, man, you were really, you
know, you raised the bar, you made us, you know, I was like,
oh, well, thank you, you know. And so after that, the pit
audition came up and next thing I know, I said, wait a minute,
that's the guy. That's Noah Weil is the guy that
(16:08):
I did the thing with stuff. And I was like, oh, wow.
And so I had no way of contactedhim or anything like that, But
I, I did the audition and it wasa self tape.
And then I think there was a call.
No, there wasn't. I just did the self take and
next thing you know, I got the part.
And then when I finally got on set, it was like, you know, you
(16:31):
you always meet everybody in themakeup room and he comes in
there and I'm like, hey, there'smy friend.
And and this was like in the throes of the 8th episode and
everybody didn't know that I knew him from the thing.
And it was just like, he's the star of the show when you're
talking to him normally. And I'll get you.
What are you doing? I think it's my come here.
No, it's like, yeah, you know. And so he was like, yeah, I
(16:54):
wanted to say that you got the part, but I didn't want to jinx
it or anything, you know, I was really rude before and I was
like, oh wow. So in my mind I was like, oh,
OK, I only got it because I did the play reading.
But then again, I wouldn't have got it at all if I wasn't, you
know, we always downplay and andmake it some other reason why we
did it, you know what I mean? Oh, it's because of who you
(17:15):
know. And I only knew him because no,
it all came from your talent, you know.
But it was an interesting time on that set because the Dodgers
were winning. And it was like, they control
the screens of the hospital. And in between takes of children
dying and people crying, I'm running.
(17:40):
And it was like, they were so used to going in and out of
these traumatic scenes. And I was just like, there's
blood everywhere else. But I, you know, Noah didn't
allow like you can't have your script on you or whatever.
You have to know your lines. You know, that was the first.
It was just like you you're so used to referring to.
(18:01):
It was good though, to because it really kind of made me
sharper. But I spent most of my time in
my my trailer. Usually I try to watch the other
people's scenes, but it was so real, you know, it was so real
and it was just such a big responsibility of not messing
up, you know, I didn't want to be the one because it's like
shot like it shot Scorsese style.
(18:24):
One shot 4 scenes and you betternot be the one that misses to
another. Exactly.
Exactly. So, you know, I was just so
excited to to be a part of that experience because it was just
like all these young actors who have been doing this for months
and, and here I am, you know, just trying to fit in, you know,
(18:45):
but that's what happened with the pit.
Yeah, you bring up an excellent point, and I think it's
something worth digging into a little bit deeper of.
As the guest cast, you're cominginto someone else's homework
environment where they set the tempo, they set the tone, and
you need to figure out how to calibrate yourself to do your
(19:05):
best work in that environment. Do you have any kind of rituals
or ways that you ground yourselfor or stay in your creative
space regardless of which set you're on?
Well, that's where the the training comes in because no
matter what, I was trying to just be conversational.
So that just means that to me, that just means just saying the
(19:29):
words. That's what my coach would
always say. Just say the words.
Just say the freaking words. All right?
Don't think about it, you know, because first I was like, I lost
it because I was like, OK, my dad is dying and the doctor's
coming to me. I have to be on the verge of
tears because everybody else is crying.
And I got to cry. And it was just like, that scene
(19:50):
wasn't about that in the in the whole episode, we all play a
different part. And my part was the the telling
of this black history moment of the first paramedics that were
responsible for. Ambulance care in Philadelphia.
And I had to have a lot of pride, even though my dad was
(20:11):
like twiddling with his pacemaker.
And it was, you know, it wasn't a sad situation.
It was like, oh, wow, we get to learn from this old guy and his
son, you know? And so I just said the words.
I just said the word I just because when you look at the
final product, you realize Noah just came from trying to save a
(20:35):
child and all these other thingsare happening.
So and so is on drugs and this and that.
And it's just like I'm responsible for a lighter
moment. You know, that's all I had to
think about. You know, I had to block
everything out. So what's helped me is just
being conversational, just talking.
It's like doing nothing, you know, like, you know, even
commercial, even commercial thatthey say, it's like you're not
(20:58):
even doing anything. It's like you're just talking.
I know. That's do even less.
I don't feel like I'm doing anything either.
And they're like, but the camerasees it all.
Like if you think they see it. And you know, I think it's, it's
so important for actors to to see others auditioning because I
think there's a lot of power in like, because like, I grew up
(21:18):
when we could still be readers in offices.
And I think it's so beneficial to be able to see other people
work and see just how much the camera does see in that audition
process. The other thing you brought up
really great, which stuck just struck a nerve in me physically
when you're talking about like the stress of like the scene and
it moving through and like not wanting to mess up because I've,
(21:39):
I've worked not on the pit, but I've worked on medical shows.
And like you do, there's like somuch going on and you're running
the Gurney and the whole thing and you're just like, don't be
the one that messes it up, don'tI?
But I I will tell on myself, I've definitely put that Gurney
in reverse and I'm like going again.
Oh my God. Then it just.
Yeah, you know what, it it, it, it happens to everybody.
(22:00):
You know it happens. It happened to me.
I had. And I'm not going to tell
anybody else this, but quick. It was listening.
It's fine. I did Insecure this old show on
HBO with Issa Rae and my scene was with Issa Rae that.
Smile in the business, that girl.
I know, but I was the first episode of the fourth season and
(22:23):
I played an investor and she wastrying to like have investors
for this block party. So she was like insecure about
asking me for money and I was the big shot person when in
reality, I was insecure about this role and she was the big
shot person. And to see her go from, you
(22:46):
know, she's literally directing and, you know, writing notes and
and I blew that line. Did the script supervisor come
over and show you your line at that?
We did it over and over again asa rehearsal and then they said,
great, we got it, OK, let's go. And it was just like, wait,
what? And they recorded the rehearsal.
(23:07):
I was so thrown off because, youknow, the preparation that I
usually do, you know what I mean?
I just kind of threw it away. I was like, ah, it's just one
line, whatever. But the I built it up so much in
my head that by the time we shotit, it was like I was dressed in
the same suit for three days andanticipation built up.
I didn't see myself saying the line.
(23:29):
I just saw myself messing it up,you know?
But I, I, I got through it. I got through it and I never, I
never made the Gurney go back again.
You know, I think this is a great segue because I, I believe
there's a big difference betweenbeing busy and productive in an
actor's career. And I'm curious how you would
(23:50):
maybe share advice and lessons learned from your career of how
you have been productive towardshelping your future self.
Well, I was someone told Who wasthat?
Someone told me that you have todo something for your career
every day. And, you know, you don't just
wake up and say, oh, what am I going to do today?
(24:10):
For me, it was just basically, it's all based off of, you know,
the love of acting, the love of performing, the love of, you
know, doing what I wanted to do all my life.
So I just found myself just kindof clocking, oh, I did that.
I guess that was towards my career, you know, and that
includes mental health. You know, that includes for me,
you know, going to a movie by myself, you know, walking, going
(24:34):
to the beach or, or really just,you know, doing things that
aren't tangible but but definitely help you because, you
know, how you feel is everything.
How you feel is everything because we're taught to live in
the moment. But if you got some stuff going
on, you know, it's really hard to live in the moment because
(24:56):
casting directors and directors are trained to see if you're,
you know, being truthful, you'reliving truthfully under these
imaginary circumstances. So I find that it, it's, it's
important to, to do anything andeverything that helps that
process. I do go to a lot of live shows
(25:17):
and perform a lot, you know, So it, it's like that helps me too,
because it gives you an appreciation and you want to be
like that person, you know, So. Yeah.
It's, it's so much more than having like 2 monologues in your
pocket. It is so much more than that.
And when we start treating this is a, a 360 approach to creative
(25:37):
business and mental health. I think it it's it's such a game
changer and belong. To it's all connected.
Who are some of the influential mentors or teachers that you
worked with that encouraged you to to just be your authentic
self and empower that that voiceand creativity?
(25:57):
The validation of that is, is iswhen I really started to listen
like, you know, working with, you know, the progressive crew,
it's like it was very intimidating because they came
from improv and I just came fromlive performance, you know,
theater and poetry. And it was some improv in what I
did, but I didn't like go to Groundlings or anything like
(26:18):
that. And it's like after them
instilling in me that what I brought to the table was
extremely valuable and it helpedeveryone, you know, really
encouraged me to to be comfortable in doing what I did,
you know, and it was like that validation kind of like is what
(26:41):
an actor needs. We all say you can only validate
yourself. Bull.
You need somebody to just say, Hey, you're good, you know what
I mean? But when it comes from someone
who, and, and again, it comes from booking roles and things
like that, that's the the validation.
But when it comes from people who are like your mentors and
who you admire, you know, it'd be Noah Weil or or Stephanie
(27:04):
Courtney or Jim Cashman or or Mike Epps, you know, those are
just the recent people that I'veworked with.
And it's like, even if they don't say it, you're there, you
know what I mean? And it's just like, you can look
back and say, yeah, I know what I'm doing, you know?
Yeah, Yeah. Well, let's talk about
(27:25):
progressive for a second becauseyou've been playing Alan.
You said 2018 is when that started, right?
That's true. What was that audition process
like? What?
How was Alan the character you were initially auditioning for?
Did they start building the character around you?
How did that come about? They were looking for what's it
(27:47):
called? Ethnic.
An ethnic crew member to wear the apron.
I didn't know that because I auditioned for a commercial with
Progressive that I was supposed to be a plumber.
And this was like with all of the casting directors and all of
the people were there and they were like looking to cast the
plumber commercial, but they're also looking for this, you know,
(28:08):
ethnic person. And so I did the plumber
audition and they said, OK, well, look, here's another
script do this. And it was, you know, with the
with the progressive crew. And I was like, OK, and I didn't
have anything to lose because I was like, well, I can't study,
so I can just do it. So I just kind of like, you
know, said the lines and I got that and I didn't have a name.
(28:32):
It started out with me having lines, but my lines got cut.
And it was so interesting because there were so many
different minorities at the in the scene and they shot it so
that they could cut out each one, whoever they didn't pick or
whatever. But at the end of the day, I
made the cut visually. And then that turned into facial
(28:55):
expressions. Oh, you used to make such good
facial expressions to saying a word, you know, to saying a
sentence, to having a name, to having your own commercial about
you, your character being developed and then just having
fun. And it was like, I didn't know
(29:17):
that that's what was supposed tohappen until they kind of told,
I brought my mom the set and they told her, you know, we were
looking for Alan. And over 300 people later, we
found your son. And I was like, what, you know,
I'm 301, you know, so I had no idea at all.
(29:37):
It just one commercial just kindof turned into another.
And how many commercials have you done with Progressive now?
I would say I have been blessed to do like maybe 30 ish ish.
That's a lot. That's a lot of that's a lot of
(29:57):
Donuts. Such a blessing.
You know, it's like it's a family.
You know what they do whenever we end the round where they like
shoot 3 or 4 commercials and it's not necessarily you know,
with me, but you know, they're shooting all kinds of stuff with
different members of the team. At the end of the rounds, they
show the commercials from the last round and the director who
gives a speech about how lucky we all are to be part of this
(30:20):
thing that's been happening for so long.
Yeah. But I'm very, very lucky.
And to be a part of that, it's, it's, it's been a great, it's
been a great run. Yeah, you have an incredible
attitude about it. And I also, I clocked at least
once, I think twice You you commented about it being a
family, that group that you get to work with.
You know, that's obviously that's like the goal, that's the
dream to be a part of a campaignand be something that it is
(30:42):
going to continue to evolve and grow and have opportunities for
you down the road. I would love to talk about reps
because I think it is so important and I'll die on this
hill that no reps is better thanthe wrong reps for you.
And I think, you know, you shared that like early on in
your career, you were with agencies that were taking in
(31:04):
anybody and throw in spaghetti against the wall.
And how did you grow in your career and find, because I got
to meet one of the members of your team at the foundation and,
and they were just so lovely andclearly they respected you and
what you brought to the table creatively and also just as a
person. And I think that's always like
the dream as an actor is to havea teammate that's like that.
(31:27):
How did your journey with wraps evolve and how did you find the
people that aligned with your vision of what you wanted for
your career future? Well, when it, when I first
started out, you just wanted an agent, you know, I didn't care
who it was all I just need to actually, I want to be able to
say I got an agent. I don't know where they are but
(31:48):
I've got 1. In there, yeah.
And it's like you, you just not going out, you know, you're not
getting auditions. And it's just like, but I have
an agent, you know, and then it's just went from that to, OK,
well, let me try another agent. And then what I realized is that
I had to research agents. I, I didn't know that they were
different tiers, like like mid level introductory agents, you
(32:12):
know, boutique agents, you know,all the way up to the CA, as you
know. So it's like, where do I fit in?
And so I went to backstage West and I kind of did some research
and learned the different tiers of agencies and where I was
within that, you know, first, because it was like before I was
non union. So I had to find out who were
the non union agents and then I had to find out the different
(32:36):
levels of people that they carryand were they looking for my
type. And once I did my research, I
found that OK, I kind of fit with this one, that one and this
one and that one. And then I looked at their
submission processes and everything's different now.
But at the time I looked at their submission processes, you
(32:58):
know, this was like right when Iguess headshots started to end
because, you know, you would go bring your headshot and you put
it in the envelope and then it'sjust like, all right, any day
now, you know? We put our agenda out of
business when we stopped Brenton.
OK, those days are gone. So so I just was very strategic
in submitting myself. There was an old book called The
(33:21):
Actors, Actor or the Actor's agent at the Samuel French
Bookstore and they had like a monthly catalog of agencies and
what the types that they were accepting, you know.
So basically they did the work for you and I just went down the
alphabet in terms of the agencies that fit my mid level
(33:41):
status because I wasn't new. I just didn't have like a bunch
of serious regulars, you know, And I got all the way to O
commercially, which is the Osburgh Agency.
And then I got to J, which was JLA, which is now the Park
agency theatrically. And basically I submitted to a
(34:02):
bunch of them, but those are theones that kind of called me in
and I had to meet with the entire staff, you know, and, and
it fit, but before them, you, you, you're that spaghetti
against the wall. You know, it was like I was
signed across the board to one agency and I was like, I'm
(34:22):
signed across the board. And then when I got dropped, I'm
dropped across the board. So that means, you know, no
theatrical, no commercial, no print, nothing.
You are not representing. You might as well just submit
yourself you. Know how old?
Yeah. So it was like for a person that
(34:43):
kind of thrives on developing relationships, I realized that
some agencies are just like in it to just play the dozens.
You know, they just want to makeas much money as they can of
anybody who's booking and then constantly get a new influx of
people 'cause I got dropped fromone commercial agent that was
non union and I still know his name, but I booked my first like
(35:05):
it was a national non union commercial, if such a thing
exists. I got a drop letter in the mail.
This is when they mailed you stuff.
You know, they, they said thank you, but no thank you.
You know where it's time to moveon.
And then I was like, I just booked this and I got this
letter and then they were like, Oh well, don't worry about that.
I was like, but, but I am, you know, you know, it's like it was
(35:30):
such a business. You know, that's why I say
family. You know, when I mention family
and stuff, I, I know it's a business deep down inside, but
what works for me is that I really care.
And whether you know, the opportunities that I have ended
tomorrow or not, at least I knowthat, you know, I cared about
(35:50):
what I did enough to know that Iwasn't just an actor.
Just trying to get the most I can out of this agent and leave
them high and dry in an e-mail. Thank you.
But I moved on, you know what I mean?
It goes both ways. Oh, absolutely.
There's definitely people that leapfrog from from 1 from 1
office to the next, but when youfind your teammate, that's
(36:12):
there's such value in that. Yeah.
Well, I'm curious, as your career developed and you worked
more and you found the projects that you like, loved and and
loved working on, like either beit the type of show or the type
of characters, how did you communicate that with your team
of what you really wanted to pursue?
I would visit them like maybe like once a year I would say,
(36:35):
hey, it's time for our annual lunch, you know, and if I really
enjoyed an audition, I was like,I really enjoyed that.
That was that was me. And you know, it takes a long
time because like they have a roster of God knows how many
people. But, you know, to me, that's my
only agent, you know what I mean?
And if I feel like I know them, then maybe they feel like they
(36:56):
know me. And that is more strategic in
the auditions that I get, 'causeit's like, you know, you're not
in a room with a bunch of different people.
You're in a room with a bunch ofpeople that kind of look like
you, you know what I mean? Or, or, or, or have your
similar, similar wheelhouse of skills.
So it, it, it helps to develop again, develop those
(37:18):
relationships. And it takes a long time to
develop a relationship, you know, with anybody, you know,
because it's the trust. Like even with the progressive
crew, it's like we're 4 strangers in these commercials.
But they get better as the yearsgo on because we know each other
(37:38):
more. And then the writers know us a
little bit more, you know, and the director knows us a little
bit more. And it's like you see, you see
everyone growing in terms of thefinished product.
Yeah. Do you have commercially or
theatrically self taper in person?
Floor is yours? Do you have a favorite audition
story? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
(38:01):
Well, this is 1. So I auditioned for NCIS and
this was when we were going in the going in the in the studios.
I was coming from another audition and this is when you
had to call your agent, say, canyou tell him I'm going to be
late? I'm I'm literally going from,
you know, Paramount to Santa Monica.
(38:23):
No, I came from Santa Monica to Paramount.
I was going from it was a commercial agency on in Santa
Monica. Like I forgot her name, but, and
I had to go all the way to Paramount for this big NCIS
audition, right? So I, there was a commercial
audition for Halos and I want, Igot it right.
I didn't know I got it at the time, but I had to wear like a
(38:46):
dad. I was a dad.
So I was in the dad stuff, gym shoes or whatever.
And then I had to go all the wayto Paramount for this NCIS, and
I was also a dad, but I was like, serious, you know?
Not the fun, dad. Yeah, right.
So I had to switch clothes and and then I had dress shoes and,
and my dress. She was a loafer.
(39:08):
And when you're in a rush, you know, and you got like a room
full of this is like the, this is like when they put everybody
in the room. And so I finally, and I was the
last one. I was like, Oh my God, hey, come
on in, come right in. I walk in a room and all these
people are there and they're like, hey, how you doing?
(39:28):
And I was like, I feel so bad. No, no, no, I was OK.
All right, OK, well, let's just do it once.
And then before we do it, I was like, OK, what?
And they looked down at me and I'm like, what?
And I had on two different shoes.
I had on the gym shoe from the dumbbell audition and the dress
(39:50):
shoe from this one. And it was, they busted up
laughing and it was a serious scene.
So I had to come clean and say what happened.
You know what I'm saying? OK, this is what happened.
All right. I'm in Santa Monica and I'm
trying to drive and not. And so it was just like a Co *1
(40:11):
liner. By the time I was done with that
audition. It didn't.
I didn't. As long as I could just say the
word, they were going to give methat part and I booked the both
of them I booked. Two bookings in a day.
But it wasn't. It had nothing to do with the
other. I mean, it had, yes, I'm the
talent, whatever, but it was just me, you know what I mean?
(40:31):
Anybody can say the words you know.
Yeah, it's who says them in the way they want to hear them, and
who do they want to hang out with on set?
Absolutely. Yeah, I believe it's so
important to have creative outlets and we've touched on
this a little bit, but I would love to talk about your poetry
and how how you have continued to cultivate and and support
(40:56):
that artistic element of yourself even when there's so
much going on in the world creatively already around you.
Well, poetry allows you to hold the mirror to yourself.
You know, cathartically it's, it's just basically your, your
therapy, you know, aside from performing it, you know, you
(41:19):
write it for yourself 1st and you kind of get to look at
yourself objectively. So what I've been able to do is
I've been successful in poetry too, by being on a couple of
different TV shows. But I was more interested in
kind of sharing what I've learned by producing shows and,
and kind of feeling the joy of seeing other people feel how I
(41:42):
felt. So for the past couple of years,
I've been producing poetry showsand also in conjunction with the
Pan African Film Festival, whichis like this huge Film Festival
in Los Angeles that also does like a poetry component in their
yearly festival. And I've been lucky enough to be
the producer of that and just kind of provide opportunities
(42:05):
for poets in Los Angeles to be apart of the big show.
And it's evolved into not only just having people just read
poems in a once a year poetry event, but also I've evolved
into like telling the stories of, of, of certain features
featured poets and people. Because it's one thing to like
(42:26):
hear somebody say a poem, but it's another one to hear their
voice and say how they grew up, you know, and, and, and the,
the, the journey of their life. You know, a lot of, a lot of
the, everybody has a story. You know, everybody's going
through stuff. I'm going through stuff, you're
going through stuff. Just dove into the storytelling
aspect of these people who are, you know, they may be teenagers,
(42:50):
they may be elders, but you know, it's the human interest
side of, of, of life that that is linked through poetry that I
was that I was interested in. And like I said, I've been
through the process of, of performing and doing it.
But the joy of telling other people's stories is, is what I
was, you know, more interested in in the last couple of years.
(43:12):
When does the the yearly event happen here in?
LA that's in, it's in February, but I also do, you know, shows
with my, my group diverse versusLA.
And basically we just, we put onpoetry shows that feature like 4
poets and we have fancy hors d'oeuvres And you know, there's,
(43:32):
there's like, it's, it's an affair.
It's like it's one of the only poetry readings where you get to
dress up, you know, because it'sprofessional photographers and
you get to watch the little fouror five minute videos on the
poet's lives. They invite their families over
and, you know, we kind of honor two of them with a, a plaque
over their work, you know, just something to make it more than
just you read napalm out of a book, You know, you really get
(43:56):
to see your eulogy read in frontof you, you know, and well, I've
not read in front of you, but onscreen, you know, 'cause we, we
do a big there's like, you know,you get to see a video of your
life and, and it's like when they bought into it, I started
interviewing their family members and started, you know,
getting pictures from people so that you can see how they
(44:17):
actually got into spoken word orpoetry and what's LED them to
where they are. And then the more I did
research, the more they gave like, you know, it's the life
and death. You know, there's couple of
poets who've had children pass away, a couple of poets who who,
who just experienced a lot of tragedy.
(44:39):
But but, but I've learned to persevere and you get to see
that journey and I feel blessed that they are open.
They were, they were open enoughto trust me telling their story
because the first time they see it is on the night of the show,
you know, and it's just like, you know, it's such an honor
for, for me and an honor for them to see their story told in
(44:59):
front of everybody, you know, And those stories are actually
on the Instagram, you know, after the show is done, I'll
post a video of their, of their life story.
And it's, it's, it's for, it's timeless, you know, so it's a
lot of fun. Paul, unfortunately, our time is
up. No, we just got here an hour
ago. I.
(45:19):
Know, I know only an hour ago. We close every episode the same
way. What is one thing you wish you
could go back and tell your younger self?
The one thing I could go back and tell my younger self, it's
(45:39):
going to be all right. Yes it will.
It's. Going to be all right, you know,
it's it's a being an artist is not easy, You know, it's it's
not easy. It's like the more successful
that you get, the, the more you have to deal with more money,
more problem, but the more, the more stuff you have to deal with
(46:00):
in terms of like, you know, it, it, it's, it's, it's, it's
dealing with the fact that you're changing, you know, and
people look at you differently and you just can't be open and
honest with everybody because everybody is like, you know,
different. Everybody's not happy.
(46:22):
And you know, for the most part people are.
But, you know, I've learned to be more, more aware and my
younger self, I would say that it's going to be OK, but you got
to be, you know, definitely moreaware of your journey and how
you impact the world. Paul, it has been an absolute
(46:45):
blast to chat with you. I am, I am such a fan of your
creativity, but also you, the person that you bring to the
work. Thank you so much for joining
the podcast. Thank.
You, Laura, I appreciate you. Thank you so much.
This is great. My first podcast, but I know,
right? I know, right.
(47:05):
So thank you so much. Hi everyone, thanks for
listening and being the absolutebest part of our creative
community here at What's My Frame?
If you'd like to learn more about our guests, please check
out the show notes and please join us on socials at What's My
Frame? To stay in the know for upcoming
events, I'm your host, Laura Linda Bradley.
We'll see you next Monday.
Hi everyone, today and what's myframe?
I'm joined by actor and poet Paul Maiden, the Chicago native
and son of an accomplished actor.
Paul grew up having a front row seat, some of the best theater
the city had to offer. Today we chat about Pauls
journey in Los Angeles, from hisextensive partnership with
Progressive to working on one ofthis season's top shows, The
Pit. Paula shares insight into the
(00:25):
classes, mentors, and mindset that have supported his career,
along with his favorite auditionstory.
Now let's get to the conversation.
Hey Paul, welcome to What's My Frame?
How? Are you?
Thanks for having me. How are you?
I'm excited to have you on the show I got.
I I knew your work prior. I had seen you on my TV both
(00:47):
theatrically and commercially. But we got to meet through the
SAG after Foundation, which was a very dear place in my heart.
And you did. A great job.
Thank you. We will link that panel so
everybody can can listen to it again if they want to.
But it was so nice to see someone with such exuberance
towards the work and the craft. And when I met you, it was just,
(01:09):
well, as a fellow theater child and nerd, I kind of like, I saw
a familiarity of that, like the the geekiness towards the craft.
And I really wanted to have you on the pod.
But for anyone who isn't familiar with your creative
journey and your back story, do you mind sharing a little bit of
what drew you to the arts? I know you do have a a family
(01:31):
history in the business. Sure, I'm a theater baby.
My father's an actor by the samename.
I generally grew up in Chicago going to see him do plays and
basically just being influenced by seeing my father play so many
different characters. He played at the Steppenwolf
(01:51):
Theatre, at the Goodman Theatre.You know, he, he did a lot of
work in community theatres and the, the impact was just
undeniable because, you know, one small little cameo here led
to another one there. And you know, I was heavily
influenced when I got to high school.
However, I didn't go into acting, I guess because I was a
(02:13):
late bloomer, so I didn't start acting in theatre in a more
adult setting until college. I did write poetry in high
school, so I kind of combined the two.
But in in college I was in a lotof theatrical productions and
(02:35):
not being a theater major. So it was just kind of ironic to
me. And I guess the the theater, the
theater community there that youknow, who's this guy?
You know, how come he gets to bein place?
He's not a theatre major. But I was just kind of doing
what came natural do. And I left college and went to
grad school for poetry and I just got into the real world in
(03:00):
terms of television production. I guess with acting, it's just
like you get the stigma of your parents saying, OK, you're going
to fall back on what are you really going to do?
My dad was all supportive for it, but my mom was like, you got
to get a job, you know? So, so Long story short, I, I
went back to theater while I worked in TV as a promotions
(03:25):
producer. And eventually I had the
opportunity to move to Los Angeles because I had an aunt
who was about to move to Memphis.
And she was like, well, if you want to take the leap, you
better do it now because we're leaving in four months.
And I was just like, but I'm notready, you know, it's just like,
you better get it ready. So I just, I packed up
(03:45):
everything. I, I moved to Fairfield, CA and
four months later I drove down to Los Angeles, rented a car,
didn't have a car for like 2 years.
And I just worked temp jobs. I had to start completely over,
like you know, it was like $11.00 an hour back in 2004.
(04:05):
And my first, first I guess studio apartment was $610,
utilities included. And I did a lot of borrowing
just to keep that. I didn't really didn't start
acting until like 2007 and 2008 when I just started doing
background work to get into the SAG union.
So basically you want to get your 3 vouchers.
(04:26):
You know, everybody has a story,which is the catch 22.
And even then, you know, there was like around the writers
strike the first one. And, you know, I basically just
kind of worked my way up with the, you know, introductory
agents or agents that were just like, maybe I guess taking
anybody that they can throw against the wall.
(04:47):
You know, there was no audition specifically for my type or
whatever. They would just, and I just kind
of went up the ladder. You know, the more, the more
costars I booked one after the other until and during that
whole time I was, I was still doing theater here.
I did a couple of plays here in Los Angeles And, and it's helped
(05:07):
tremendously because it's, it teaches you, it teaches you the
live performance aspect of, of what it's like because it's so
different from the audition to the call back to actually being
on set. You know, those are three
different things that you have to wrap your head around.
You know, 'cause it's nothing like the other one is nothing
(05:28):
like the other. But after years and years of,
of, of, of doing Co stars and having three different jobs to,
to, to pay that $610, I used to,I used to DJI used to, I have
been to more bar mitzvahs than probably you.
And I taught kids poetry at a organization.
(05:53):
So it's, it was a lot. But the one day came where it
was in April. As a matter of fact, it was just
like my year to date for all of my jobs, you know, was kind of
matched by my acting career. And I was like looking at the
checks. I was like, today's the last
day. So yeah, that happened in 2018
(06:14):
and which is right around where I started working with
Progressive Insurance And you know, one commercial led to
another. And, and like you were saying, I
think we were talking about before, the commercial side
helps the theatrical side because of the visibility, you
know what I mean? The familiarity.
It's a lot easier to book a job if you look familiar and then
(06:35):
people hire you based on, oh, ifhe or she did that, then they
can do this. Don't we want that?
We can get that. They're literally buying what
they already saw. Yep, I'm very curious because
there there is this, I feel a misconception about those that
come from theater being too big.And I know, you know, there's
there's currently like a meme that's floating around about
(06:56):
commercial editions like just dous just do nothing, like
absolutely nothing. That's what they want,
absolutely nothing. And I do I, I, I think that is
true, but I'm curious if you gota lot of those notes about being
too big or was it really? That note is actually more
designed for it. It's not filled.
It's not grounded. Well, no, it's it's definitely
some truth to it. Like I said, it's like you have
(07:18):
to learn how to adapt for different environments, just
like we had to learn to do self tapes all back.
Sounds like I'm looking at the camera.
I'm not looking at you. If I was looking at you, I'd be
doing this, you know, and then on camera, it looks like, why is
he looking down? You know, So with like regular
auditions, it's like you have toknow that you have to be
(07:41):
extremely conversational, like you're just talking to a person,
you know, and you have to forgetthat there's this wall of people
and equipments right there or behind you, you know, and, and
you have to like be able to connect with this actor, even
though you're living under theseimaginary circumstances.
And it's and that's just the theend game.
(08:04):
But the very beginning, it's just like you're just you and a
intern and a camera and or a, you know, a camera operator.
And you have to create this world that increasingly gets
bigger the more you do, you know, callbacks, more people,
the casting directors there, youknow, a lot more people are
watching. And it's like, and then when you
(08:25):
finally get to set, you know, you have to, you can't use your
theater voice. What's wrong with you?
Yeah. But it took, it took me a while
to adapt because it's, it's likenobody tells you that, you know,
they don't say it's the they. It's just something I had to
learn. And I kind of took it for
(08:45):
granted because I was learning it and I just didn't write it
down. I just kind of picked up on the
fact that, oh, nobody else is screaming, you know, nobody else
is. You know what I mean?
Else is projecting to double M. Exactly.
Yeah, exactly. I know you.
You're a lifetime member of the Actors Studio with a beautiful
creative home to be a part of. How did you how did you become a
(09:08):
part of the Actors Studio? Well, while doing theater out
here, Martin Landau, when he wasstill alive, he he attended a a
play that I did and the studio, the studio was frequently
producing plays at the Greenway Court Theatre on Fairfax and no
rolls. And they would hold like
(09:30):
greetings and and things like that.
And he saw me doing a play that actually Barry Primus is an
actor and producer, director Barry Primus saw me and kind of
put his arm around me and say, hey, you gotta gotta get this
kid to audition. And I was like, yeah, yeah.
So. So I didn't know what it was or
what it meant or anything, but I, I, I auditioned for the
(09:52):
Actors Studio with a friend of mine and it took us two years.
Because there's different levels.
There's like an observer, which means you can just come and
watch and then you could be a working observer and then
there's like a finalist. And all during that time you get
the privilege of like hearing the commentary and, and going to
(10:13):
classes and, and basically kind of learning what the studio is
about. The studio is a place where you
go, it's like more about the process of rehearsing and it's
not about the finished product. So I, I, I was very fortunate
enough to after two years being being accepted into the actors.
They give you a card and everything, like you're an actor
(10:34):
is like, they give you a nice little letter.
And, and then you get to put up scenes on Tuesdays and Fridays
and you get to go to different classes for like relaxation and,
and movement and, you know, justdifferent aspects of acting
that, that help you, that help you develop your, your, your
voice. And it's, it's like a lot of
(10:58):
it's just, it's just where you go to, I hate to say it, but
it's just where you go to like fail, where you just kind of go
to experience other people's processes.
You know, how do they work? Because it's easy to point
somebody out, say that's wrong, that's wrong, that's wrong.
Look, that doesn't look right. But then when you're there, you
have to humble yourself. And what's the most interesting
thing about it is after you do your scene, you know, you, you
(11:19):
have to sit in a chair and then you just have to take the notes
and you just listen to what people say.
And it's like that's where you learn who you are in terms of
like, don't get defensive, you know, 'cause this, it's like the
temptation is to explain what you did or defend your choice
and stuff like that, you know, but it's not about that.
(11:41):
It's just about being an artist and humbling yourself, you know,
'cause it's, it's, it's a good place to be.
I am such a huge proponent of continuing education, be a
lifelong learner because I thinkas our industry changes and
evolves, it's the most results driven and bottom line that I
have ever seen it currently. And I think it's going to only
(12:03):
continue to go in that direction.
And you have to have a space to create with people that you
trust and a place to explore. And.
Right. Yeah, but.
Yeah, and, and, and, and to keepyour, your instruments sharp,
like I still do poetry, you know, I still, I still get in
front of people live, you know, because like we were saying
earlier, with the different aspects of auditions and
(12:25):
callbacks being on set, you know, there's the winning of the
room. You know, they have to just like
you, they have to know that if we pick this, if we pick her,
you know, is this going to be a good eight hours or whatever it
is? You know what I mean?
It's like you, you want to you want to channel all your
explosive, beautiful personalityinto a manageable interview.
(12:48):
Exactly. And it's even changing with
commercials in the room. Like I've had a couple of
callbacks where the first one threw me because I heard the
voices and then walked in and everybody was on Zoom.
It was just the session runner and I like that's what I love is
like in the room for callbacks of like, Hey, how are you like
chatting with like the couch, like I turn into my little
(13:09):
comedian self. And I was like expecting like,
hey. So.
Like, sorry to be disappointed to see just you, Todd.
But we're all the people. He's like, they're on the
screen. It's fine.
So now I just like ask, I'm like, are there people in the
room or is that? You have to.
All right, for a SEC, 'cause we're gonna cover, we're gonna
(13:30):
cover We've already talked abouttheater, but we're gonna cover
commercials. We're gonna have a theatrical,
we're gonna cover your poetry. You are one of those very
diversified creatives. And I, I love that cause like, I
think when you have a lot of creativity, you just gotta get
it out. But I really want to talk about
the pit because you worked on one of this season's biggest
runaway hits and you had this beautiful scene with your your
(13:54):
father character and and it justwhat was the experience like?
What was the audition process like?
How, how was yourself taped? I'm sure.
Wow, Well, you know what, it's like I was just talking to
another actress friend of mine today about how we downplay our
our talent. You know, 'cause it was like,
(14:16):
this is how it happened. This is a lot.
I thought how it happened. It happened because I'm talented
and I'm a great actor and blah, blah, blah.
But I did a play reading. It was a it was stage reading
with Richard Broadhurst. And Richard knew Noah Weil and
(14:39):
he was part of the stage readingwith like another famous actor.
So it's just like three of us, right?
And so I get in there and I didn't, you know, I looked him
up, but I really didn't know know who I was reading with.
And as soon as I walk in the door, Noah Weil goes, you and I
was like me, you know, So he says, Yeah, I auditioned for
(15:04):
downsizing. And Downsizing was a movie with
Matt Damon. Yeah, I.
Remember, they shrunk him. Right.
Exactly. Yeah.
I'm in or something. Right.
I had a scene in there and he said, Noah said that he
auditioned to be in that Alexander Payne movie because
who wouldn't want to be in Alexander Payne?
And he auditioned for my role. It was a small role, but it was
(15:25):
an Alexander Payne movie. So he was like, oh, man, It's
like, wow. OK.
Yeah. And I was like, oh, nice to meet
you, you know, So then we do it,right?
And it was a reading. But I come from the theater.
So, you know, from the theater, you are giving it up.
And these, these other, you know, they.
I don't. I guess it was just they were
(15:46):
just reading. But I was like, really living
it. And I was raising their stakes.
And after it was over, they werelike, man, you were really, you
know, you raised the bar, you made us, you know, I was like,
oh, well, thank you, you know. And so after that, the pit
audition came up and next thing I know, I said, wait a minute,
that's the guy. That's Noah Weil is the guy that
(16:08):
I did the thing with stuff. And I was like, oh, wow.
And so I had no way of contactedhim or anything like that, But
I, I did the audition and it wasa self tape.
And then I think there was a call.
No, there wasn't. I just did the self take and
next thing you know, I got the part.
And then when I finally got on set, it was like, you know, you
(16:31):
you always meet everybody in themakeup room and he comes in
there and I'm like, hey, there'smy friend.
And and this was like in the throes of the 8th episode and
everybody didn't know that I knew him from the thing.
And it was just like, he's the star of the show when you're
talking to him normally. And I'll get you.
What are you doing? I think it's my come here.
No, it's like, yeah, you know. And so he was like, yeah, I
(16:54):
wanted to say that you got the part, but I didn't want to jinx
it or anything, you know, I was really rude before and I was
like, oh wow. So in my mind I was like, oh,
OK, I only got it because I did the play reading.
But then again, I wouldn't have got it at all if I wasn't, you
know, we always downplay and andmake it some other reason why we
did it, you know what I mean? Oh, it's because of who you
(17:15):
know. And I only knew him because no,
it all came from your talent, you know.
But it was an interesting time on that set because the Dodgers
were winning. And it was like, they control
the screens of the hospital. And in between takes of children
dying and people crying, I'm running.
(17:40):
And it was like, they were so used to going in and out of
these traumatic scenes. And I was just like, there's
blood everywhere else. But I, you know, Noah didn't
allow like you can't have your script on you or whatever.
You have to know your lines. You know, that was the first.
It was just like you you're so used to referring to.
(18:01):
It was good though, to because it really kind of made me
sharper. But I spent most of my time in
my my trailer. Usually I try to watch the other
people's scenes, but it was so real, you know, it was so real
and it was just such a big responsibility of not messing
up, you know, I didn't want to be the one because it's like
shot like it shot Scorsese style.
(18:24):
One shot 4 scenes and you betternot be the one that misses to
another. Exactly.
Exactly. So, you know, I was just so
excited to to be a part of that experience because it was just
like all these young actors who have been doing this for months
and, and here I am, you know, just trying to fit in, you know,
(18:45):
but that's what happened with the pit.
Yeah, you bring up an excellent point, and I think it's
something worth digging into a little bit deeper of.
As the guest cast, you're cominginto someone else's homework
environment where they set the tempo, they set the tone, and
you need to figure out how to calibrate yourself to do your
(19:05):
best work in that environment. Do you have any kind of rituals
or ways that you ground yourselfor or stay in your creative
space regardless of which set you're on?
Well, that's where the the training comes in because no
matter what, I was trying to just be conversational.
So that just means that to me, that just means just saying the
(19:29):
words. That's what my coach would
always say. Just say the words.
Just say the freaking words. All right?
Don't think about it, you know, because first I was like, I lost
it because I was like, OK, my dad is dying and the doctor's
coming to me. I have to be on the verge of
tears because everybody else is crying.
And I got to cry. And it was just like, that scene
(19:50):
wasn't about that in the in the whole episode, we all play a
different part. And my part was the the telling
of this black history moment of the first paramedics that were
responsible for. Ambulance care in Philadelphia.
And I had to have a lot of pride, even though my dad was
(20:11):
like twiddling with his pacemaker.
And it was, you know, it wasn't a sad situation.
It was like, oh, wow, we get to learn from this old guy and his
son, you know? And so I just said the words.
I just said the word I just because when you look at the
final product, you realize Noah just came from trying to save a
(20:35):
child and all these other thingsare happening.
So and so is on drugs and this and that.
And it's just like I'm responsible for a lighter
moment. You know, that's all I had to
think about. You know, I had to block
everything out. So what's helped me is just
being conversational, just talking.
It's like doing nothing, you know, like, you know, even
commercial, even commercial thatthey say, it's like you're not
(20:58):
even doing anything. It's like you're just talking.
I know. That's do even less.
I don't feel like I'm doing anything either.
And they're like, but the camerasees it all.
Like if you think they see it. And you know, I think it's, it's
so important for actors to to see others auditioning because I
think there's a lot of power in like, because like, I grew up
(21:18):
when we could still be readers in offices.
And I think it's so beneficial to be able to see other people
work and see just how much the camera does see in that audition
process. The other thing you brought up
really great, which stuck just struck a nerve in me physically
when you're talking about like the stress of like the scene and
it moving through and like not wanting to mess up because I've,
(21:39):
I've worked not on the pit, but I've worked on medical shows.
And like you do, there's like somuch going on and you're running
the Gurney and the whole thing and you're just like, don't be
the one that messes it up, don'tI?
But I I will tell on myself, I've definitely put that Gurney
in reverse and I'm like going again.
Oh my God. Then it just.
Yeah, you know what, it it, it, it happens to everybody.
(22:00):
You know it happens. It happened to me.
I had. And I'm not going to tell
anybody else this, but quick. It was listening.
It's fine. I did Insecure this old show on
HBO with Issa Rae and my scene was with Issa Rae that.
Smile in the business, that girl.
I know, but I was the first episode of the fourth season and
(22:23):
I played an investor and she wastrying to like have investors
for this block party. So she was like insecure about
asking me for money and I was the big shot person when in
reality, I was insecure about this role and she was the big
shot person. And to see her go from, you
(22:46):
know, she's literally directing and, you know, writing notes and
and I blew that line. Did the script supervisor come
over and show you your line at that?
We did it over and over again asa rehearsal and then they said,
great, we got it, OK, let's go. And it was just like, wait,
what? And they recorded the rehearsal.
(23:07):
I was so thrown off because, youknow, the preparation that I
usually do, you know what I mean?
I just kind of threw it away. I was like, ah, it's just one
line, whatever. But the I built it up so much in
my head that by the time we shotit, it was like I was dressed in
the same suit for three days andanticipation built up.
I didn't see myself saying the line.
(23:29):
I just saw myself messing it up,you know?
But I, I, I got through it. I got through it and I never, I
never made the Gurney go back again.
You know, I think this is a great segue because I, I believe
there's a big difference betweenbeing busy and productive in an
actor's career. And I'm curious how you would
(23:50):
maybe share advice and lessons learned from your career of how
you have been productive towardshelping your future self.
Well, I was someone told Who wasthat?
Someone told me that you have todo something for your career
every day. And, you know, you don't just
wake up and say, oh, what am I going to do today?
(24:10):
For me, it was just basically, it's all based off of, you know,
the love of acting, the love of performing, the love of, you
know, doing what I wanted to do all my life.
So I just found myself just kindof clocking, oh, I did that.
I guess that was towards my career, you know, and that
includes mental health. You know, that includes for me,
you know, going to a movie by myself, you know, walking, going
(24:34):
to the beach or, or really just,you know, doing things that
aren't tangible but but definitely help you because, you
know, how you feel is everything.
How you feel is everything because we're taught to live in
the moment. But if you got some stuff going
on, you know, it's really hard to live in the moment because
(24:56):
casting directors and directors are trained to see if you're,
you know, being truthful, you'reliving truthfully under these
imaginary circumstances. So I find that it, it's, it's
important to, to do anything andeverything that helps that
process. I do go to a lot of live shows
(25:17):
and perform a lot, you know, So it, it's like that helps me too,
because it gives you an appreciation and you want to be
like that person, you know, So. Yeah.
It's, it's so much more than having like 2 monologues in your
pocket. It is so much more than that.
And when we start treating this is a, a 360 approach to creative
(25:37):
business and mental health. I think it it's it's such a game
changer and belong. To it's all connected.
Who are some of the influential mentors or teachers that you
worked with that encouraged you to to just be your authentic
self and empower that that voiceand creativity?
(25:57):
The validation of that is, is iswhen I really started to listen
like, you know, working with, you know, the progressive crew,
it's like it was very intimidating because they came
from improv and I just came fromlive performance, you know,
theater and poetry. And it was some improv in what I
did, but I didn't like go to Groundlings or anything like
(26:18):
that. And it's like after them
instilling in me that what I brought to the table was
extremely valuable and it helpedeveryone, you know, really
encouraged me to to be comfortable in doing what I did,
you know, and it was like that validation kind of like is what
(26:41):
an actor needs. We all say you can only validate
yourself. Bull.
You need somebody to just say, Hey, you're good, you know what
I mean? But when it comes from someone
who, and, and again, it comes from booking roles and things
like that, that's the the validation.
But when it comes from people who are like your mentors and
who you admire, you know, it'd be Noah Weil or or Stephanie
(27:04):
Courtney or Jim Cashman or or Mike Epps, you know, those are
just the recent people that I'veworked with.
And it's like, even if they don't say it, you're there, you
know what I mean? And it's just like, you can look
back and say, yeah, I know what I'm doing, you know?
Yeah, Yeah. Well, let's talk about
(27:25):
progressive for a second becauseyou've been playing Alan.
You said 2018 is when that started, right?
That's true. What was that audition process
like? What?
How was Alan the character you were initially auditioning for?
Did they start building the character around you?
How did that come about? They were looking for what's it
(27:47):
called? Ethnic.
An ethnic crew member to wear the apron.
I didn't know that because I auditioned for a commercial with
Progressive that I was supposed to be a plumber.
And this was like with all of the casting directors and all of
the people were there and they were like looking to cast the
plumber commercial, but they're also looking for this, you know,
(28:08):
ethnic person. And so I did the plumber
audition and they said, OK, well, look, here's another
script do this. And it was, you know, with the
with the progressive crew. And I was like, OK, and I didn't
have anything to lose because I was like, well, I can't study,
so I can just do it. So I just kind of like, you
know, said the lines and I got that and I didn't have a name.
(28:32):
It started out with me having lines, but my lines got cut.
And it was so interesting because there were so many
different minorities at the in the scene and they shot it so
that they could cut out each one, whoever they didn't pick or
whatever. But at the end of the day, I
made the cut visually. And then that turned into facial
(28:55):
expressions. Oh, you used to make such good
facial expressions to saying a word, you know, to saying a
sentence, to having a name, to having your own commercial about
you, your character being developed and then just having
fun. And it was like, I didn't know
(29:17):
that that's what was supposed tohappen until they kind of told,
I brought my mom the set and they told her, you know, we were
looking for Alan. And over 300 people later, we
found your son. And I was like, what, you know,
I'm 301, you know, so I had no idea at all.
(29:37):
It just one commercial just kindof turned into another.
And how many commercials have you done with Progressive now?
I would say I have been blessed to do like maybe 30 ish ish.
That's a lot. That's a lot of that's a lot of
(29:57):
Donuts. Such a blessing.
You know, it's like it's a family.
You know what they do whenever we end the round where they like
shoot 3 or 4 commercials and it's not necessarily you know,
with me, but you know, they're shooting all kinds of stuff with
different members of the team. At the end of the rounds, they
show the commercials from the last round and the director who
gives a speech about how lucky we all are to be part of this
(30:20):
thing that's been happening for so long.
Yeah. But I'm very, very lucky.
And to be a part of that, it's, it's, it's been a great, it's
been a great run. Yeah, you have an incredible
attitude about it. And I also, I clocked at least
once, I think twice You you commented about it being a
family, that group that you get to work with.
You know, that's obviously that's like the goal, that's the
dream to be a part of a campaignand be something that it is
(30:42):
going to continue to evolve and grow and have opportunities for
you down the road. I would love to talk about reps
because I think it is so important and I'll die on this
hill that no reps is better thanthe wrong reps for you.
And I think, you know, you shared that like early on in
your career, you were with agencies that were taking in
(31:04):
anybody and throw in spaghetti against the wall.
And how did you grow in your career and find, because I got
to meet one of the members of your team at the foundation and,
and they were just so lovely andclearly they respected you and
what you brought to the table creatively and also just as a
person. And I think that's always like
the dream as an actor is to havea teammate that's like that.
(31:27):
How did your journey with wraps evolve and how did you find the
people that aligned with your vision of what you wanted for
your career future? Well, when it, when I first
started out, you just wanted an agent, you know, I didn't care
who it was all I just need to actually, I want to be able to
say I got an agent. I don't know where they are but
(31:48):
I've got 1. In there, yeah.
And it's like you, you just not going out, you know, you're not
getting auditions. And it's just like, but I have
an agent, you know, and then it's just went from that to, OK,
well, let me try another agent. And then what I realized is that
I had to research agents. I, I didn't know that they were
different tiers, like like mid level introductory agents, you
(32:12):
know, boutique agents, you know,all the way up to the CA, as you
know. So it's like, where do I fit in?
And so I went to backstage West and I kind of did some research
and learned the different tiers of agencies and where I was
within that, you know, first, because it was like before I was
non union. So I had to find out who were
the non union agents and then I had to find out the different
(32:36):
levels of people that they carryand were they looking for my
type. And once I did my research, I
found that OK, I kind of fit with this one, that one and this
one and that one. And then I looked at their
submission processes and everything's different now.
But at the time I looked at their submission processes, you
(32:58):
know, this was like right when Iguess headshots started to end
because, you know, you would go bring your headshot and you put
it in the envelope and then it'sjust like, all right, any day
now, you know? We put our agenda out of
business when we stopped Brenton.
OK, those days are gone. So so I just was very strategic
in submitting myself. There was an old book called The
(33:21):
Actors, Actor or the Actor's agent at the Samuel French
Bookstore and they had like a monthly catalog of agencies and
what the types that they were accepting, you know.
So basically they did the work for you and I just went down the
alphabet in terms of the agencies that fit my mid level
(33:41):
status because I wasn't new. I just didn't have like a bunch
of serious regulars, you know, And I got all the way to O
commercially, which is the Osburgh Agency.
And then I got to J, which was JLA, which is now the Park
agency theatrically. And basically I submitted to a
(34:02):
bunch of them, but those are theones that kind of called me in
and I had to meet with the entire staff, you know, and, and
it fit, but before them, you, you, you're that spaghetti
against the wall. You know, it was like I was
signed across the board to one agency and I was like, I'm
(34:22):
signed across the board. And then when I got dropped, I'm
dropped across the board. So that means, you know, no
theatrical, no commercial, no print, nothing.
You are not representing. You might as well just submit
yourself you. Know how old?
Yeah. So it was like for a person that
(34:43):
kind of thrives on developing relationships, I realized that
some agencies are just like in it to just play the dozens.
You know, they just want to makeas much money as they can of
anybody who's booking and then constantly get a new influx of
people 'cause I got dropped fromone commercial agent that was
non union and I still know his name, but I booked my first like
(35:05):
it was a national non union commercial, if such a thing
exists. I got a drop letter in the mail.
This is when they mailed you stuff.
You know, they, they said thank you, but no thank you.
You know where it's time to moveon.
And then I was like, I just booked this and I got this
letter and then they were like, Oh well, don't worry about that.
I was like, but, but I am, you know, you know, it's like it was
(35:30):
such a business. You know, that's why I say
family. You know, when I mention family
and stuff, I, I know it's a business deep down inside, but
what works for me is that I really care.
And whether you know, the opportunities that I have ended
tomorrow or not, at least I knowthat, you know, I cared about
(35:50):
what I did enough to know that Iwasn't just an actor.
Just trying to get the most I can out of this agent and leave
them high and dry in an e-mail. Thank you.
But I moved on, you know what I mean?
It goes both ways. Oh, absolutely.
There's definitely people that leapfrog from from 1 from 1
office to the next, but when youfind your teammate, that's
(36:12):
there's such value in that. Yeah.
Well, I'm curious, as your career developed and you worked
more and you found the projects that you like, loved and and
loved working on, like either beit the type of show or the type
of characters, how did you communicate that with your team
of what you really wanted to pursue?
I would visit them like maybe like once a year I would say,
(36:35):
hey, it's time for our annual lunch, you know, and if I really
enjoyed an audition, I was like,I really enjoyed that.
That was that was me. And you know, it takes a long
time because like they have a roster of God knows how many
people. But, you know, to me, that's my
only agent, you know what I mean?
And if I feel like I know them, then maybe they feel like they
(36:56):
know me. And that is more strategic in
the auditions that I get, 'causeit's like, you know, you're not
in a room with a bunch of different people.
You're in a room with a bunch ofpeople that kind of look like
you, you know what I mean? Or, or, or, or have your
similar, similar wheelhouse of skills.
So it, it, it helps to develop again, develop those
(37:18):
relationships. And it takes a long time to
develop a relationship, you know, with anybody, you know,
because it's the trust. Like even with the progressive
crew, it's like we're 4 strangers in these commercials.
But they get better as the yearsgo on because we know each other
(37:38):
more. And then the writers know us a
little bit more, you know, and the director knows us a little
bit more. And it's like you see, you see
everyone growing in terms of thefinished product.
Yeah. Do you have commercially or
theatrically self taper in person?
Floor is yours? Do you have a favorite audition
story? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
(38:01):
Well, this is 1. So I auditioned for NCIS and
this was when we were going in the going in the in the studios.
I was coming from another audition and this is when you
had to call your agent, say, canyou tell him I'm going to be
late? I'm I'm literally going from,
you know, Paramount to Santa Monica.
(38:23):
No, I came from Santa Monica to Paramount.
I was going from it was a commercial agency on in Santa
Monica. Like I forgot her name, but, and
I had to go all the way to Paramount for this big NCIS
audition, right? So I, there was a commercial
audition for Halos and I want, Igot it right.
I didn't know I got it at the time, but I had to wear like a
(38:46):
dad. I was a dad.
So I was in the dad stuff, gym shoes or whatever.
And then I had to go all the wayto Paramount for this NCIS, and
I was also a dad, but I was like, serious, you know?
Not the fun, dad. Yeah, right.
So I had to switch clothes and and then I had dress shoes and,
and my dress. She was a loafer.
(39:08):
And when you're in a rush, you know, and you got like a room
full of this is like the, this is like when they put everybody
in the room. And so I finally, and I was the
last one. I was like, Oh my God, hey, come
on in, come right in. I walk in a room and all these
people are there and they're like, hey, how you doing?
(39:28):
And I was like, I feel so bad. No, no, no, I was OK.
All right, OK, well, let's just do it once.
And then before we do it, I was like, OK, what?
And they looked down at me and I'm like, what?
And I had on two different shoes.
I had on the gym shoe from the dumbbell audition and the dress
(39:50):
shoe from this one. And it was, they busted up
laughing and it was a serious scene.
So I had to come clean and say what happened.
You know what I'm saying? OK, this is what happened.
All right. I'm in Santa Monica and I'm
trying to drive and not. And so it was just like a Co *1
(40:11):
liner. By the time I was done with that
audition. It didn't.
I didn't. As long as I could just say the
word, they were going to give methat part and I booked the both
of them I booked. Two bookings in a day.
But it wasn't. It had nothing to do with the
other. I mean, it had, yes, I'm the
talent, whatever, but it was just me, you know what I mean?
(40:31):
Anybody can say the words you know.
Yeah, it's who says them in the way they want to hear them, and
who do they want to hang out with on set?
Absolutely. Yeah, I believe it's so
important to have creative outlets and we've touched on
this a little bit, but I would love to talk about your poetry
and how how you have continued to cultivate and and support
(40:56):
that artistic element of yourself even when there's so
much going on in the world creatively already around you.
Well, poetry allows you to hold the mirror to yourself.
You know, cathartically it's, it's just basically your, your
therapy, you know, aside from performing it, you know, you
(41:19):
write it for yourself 1st and you kind of get to look at
yourself objectively. So what I've been able to do is
I've been successful in poetry too, by being on a couple of
different TV shows. But I was more interested in
kind of sharing what I've learned by producing shows and,
and kind of feeling the joy of seeing other people feel how I
(41:42):
felt. So for the past couple of years,
I've been producing poetry showsand also in conjunction with the
Pan African Film Festival, whichis like this huge Film Festival
in Los Angeles that also does like a poetry component in their
yearly festival. And I've been lucky enough to be
the producer of that and just kind of provide opportunities
(42:05):
for poets in Los Angeles to be apart of the big show.
And it's evolved into not only just having people just read
poems in a once a year poetry event, but also I've evolved
into like telling the stories of, of, of certain features
featured poets and people. Because it's one thing to like
(42:26):
hear somebody say a poem, but it's another one to hear their
voice and say how they grew up, you know, and, and, and the,
the, the journey of their life. You know, a lot of, a lot of
the, everybody has a story. You know, everybody's going
through stuff. I'm going through stuff, you're
going through stuff. Just dove into the storytelling
aspect of these people who are, you know, they may be teenagers,
(42:50):
they may be elders, but you know, it's the human interest
side of, of, of life that that is linked through poetry that I
was that I was interested in. And like I said, I've been
through the process of, of performing and doing it.
But the joy of telling other people's stories is, is what I
was, you know, more interested in in the last couple of years.
(43:12):
When does the the yearly event happen here in?
LA that's in, it's in February, but I also do, you know, shows
with my, my group diverse versusLA.
And basically we just, we put onpoetry shows that feature like 4
poets and we have fancy hors d'oeuvres And you know, there's,
(43:32):
there's like, it's, it's an affair.
It's like it's one of the only poetry readings where you get to
dress up, you know, because it'sprofessional photographers and
you get to watch the little fouror five minute videos on the
poet's lives. They invite their families over
and, you know, we kind of honor two of them with a, a plaque
over their work, you know, just something to make it more than
just you read napalm out of a book, You know, you really get
(43:56):
to see your eulogy read in frontof you, you know, and well, I've
not read in front of you, but onscreen, you know, 'cause we, we
do a big there's like, you know,you get to see a video of your
life and, and it's like when they bought into it, I started
interviewing their family members and started, you know,
getting pictures from people so that you can see how they
(44:17):
actually got into spoken word orpoetry and what's LED them to
where they are. And then the more I did
research, the more they gave like, you know, it's the life
and death. You know, there's couple of
poets who've had children pass away, a couple of poets who who,
who just experienced a lot of tragedy.
(44:39):
But but, but I've learned to persevere and you get to see
that journey and I feel blessed that they are open.
They were, they were open enoughto trust me telling their story
because the first time they see it is on the night of the show,
you know, and it's just like, you know, it's such an honor
for, for me and an honor for them to see their story told in
(44:59):
front of everybody, you know, And those stories are actually
on the Instagram, you know, after the show is done, I'll
post a video of their, of their life story.
And it's, it's, it's for, it's timeless, you know, so it's a
lot of fun. Paul, unfortunately, our time is
up. No, we just got here an hour
ago. I.
(45:19):
Know, I know only an hour ago. We close every episode the same
way. What is one thing you wish you
could go back and tell your younger self?
The one thing I could go back and tell my younger self, it's
(45:39):
going to be all right. Yes it will.
It's. Going to be all right, you know,
it's it's a being an artist is not easy, You know, it's it's
not easy. It's like the more successful
that you get, the, the more you have to deal with more money,
more problem, but the more, the more stuff you have to deal with
(46:00):
in terms of like, you know, it, it, it's, it's, it's, it's
dealing with the fact that you're changing, you know, and
people look at you differently and you just can't be open and
honest with everybody because everybody is like, you know,
different. Everybody's not happy.
(46:22):
And you know, for the most part people are.
But, you know, I've learned to be more, more aware and my
younger self, I would say that it's going to be OK, but you got
to be, you know, definitely moreaware of your journey and how
you impact the world. Paul, it has been an absolute
(46:45):
blast to chat with you. I am, I am such a fan of your
creativity, but also you, the person that you bring to the
work. Thank you so much for joining
the podcast. Thank.
You, Laura, I appreciate you. Thank you so much.
This is great. My first podcast, but I know,
right? I know, right.
(47:05):
So thank you so much. Hi everyone, thanks for
listening and being the absolutebest part of our creative
community here at What's My Frame?
If you'd like to learn more about our guests, please check
out the show notes and please join us on socials at What's My
Frame? To stay in the know for upcoming
events, I'm your host, Laura Linda Bradley.
We'll see you next Monday.
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