October 21, 2024 • 34 mins
Welcome to the When Grief Comes Home podcast. We're glad you're here. This podcast supports parents who are grieving a spouse, partner, or child while helping their children who are living through the loss of a parent or sibling. With personal grief stories and professional guidance, we offer parents practical tips for supporting their child who is grieving while caring for their own grief.
In this episode, we explore grief during the changing seasons of fall and the power of listening to your body in grief. We discuss the necessity of noticing fragility and giving yourself permission to cancel plans at the last minute if needed.
As Halloween and the winter holidays approach, we explore the changes grieving families face. We touch on matching children's enthusiasm during the holidays while expressing how you miss the person who died.
Please subscribe to the When Grief Comes Home podcast and leave us a review. The more stars, reviews, and downloads the show receives, the more parents and families in grief can find support.
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For more information on Jessica’s House or for additional resources, please go to jessicashouse.org
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Gary Shriver (00:00):
Hello and welcome to when Grief Comes Home, a
podcast dedicated to parentsliving through loss while
supporting their child.
Let's meet the team.
Erin Nelson (00:11):
I'm Erin Nelson, founding executive director at
Jessica's House.
Colleen Montague (00:15):
Hi, I'm Colleen Montague, program
director for Jessica's House anda licensed marriage and family
therapist.
Brad Quillen (00:21):
Hi, I'm Brad Quillen and I'm the host of when
Grief Comes Home.
Gary Shriver (00:25):
Now, through this podcast, they'll share grief
resources and coping skills,heartfelt stories and insights
to support parents as they raisechildren who are grieving.
Together
Brad Quillen (00:47):
Hello, hello, it's Brad from Jessica's house.
Today we're talking about thechanging seasons as we move from
summer into fall and how thatcan affect your grieving process
.
Sometimes we don't even thinkfrom moving from one season to
another we'll have that big ofan impact.
But between shorter days andcooler weather and the
approaching holiday season, thiscan be a really difficult time
for you and your children.
It can bring up a variety offeelings that you never even saw
(01:10):
coming.
So right now let's dive in Erinand and Colleen.
We noticed that the days aregetting shorter, there's a
little bit of change in theweather, and that's all a part
of seasons changing in grief andthat's all a part of seasons
changing in grief.
Erin Nelson (01:24):
Yeah, I think something that we've heard so
much is that sometimes thosedarker longer, those darker days
, longer nights can be reallytough when you're grieving.
Brad Quillen (01:35):
Yeah, it's almost like people naturally enter back
into isolation because they'renot out as long the neighbors
aren't out, the sportingpractices are less and some of
those things, but it's like theloneliness and isolation come
back.
Erin Nelson (01:52):
Kind of an invitation a little bit to be
more present to your grief,because there aren't maybe as
many distractions and sometimesthat's a tough place to be.
Brad Quillen (02:04):
And some of those natural supports change.
That happened to be becausethere's more daylight and light
and sun and all those thingsgoing on outside.
Erin Nelson (02:13):
Yeah, I remember that after Tyler died, just you
know, we kind of had a naturallyjust like a neighborhood where
kids were just running aroundoutside and when we hit kind of
that mid-October-ish time thatpeople just naturally went
inside and they started justkind of being with their family
(02:34):
and we had such a kind of I feltlike more of a fractured family
.
It just wasn't the same andjust feeling just it was a lot
harder just to be there and nothave that natural support and
community around.
Brad Quillen (02:49):
And and as those things change, you start to feel
some of the firsts come on Um,and one of the stories you tell
often around Jessica's house isthat you didn't realize Tyler
was your fire builder Would youshare a bit about that.
Erin Nelson (03:04):
Yeah, so I just remember, as it was October
actually, and we went out tojust go to a horse arena, the
kids wanted to go ride horsesand we had friends who had a
horse, and so the kids were justin with our friends and they
were riding horses around and Iwas just sitting outside the
arena.
(03:26):
They were riding horses aroundand I was just sitting outside
the arena, and I'll never forgetjust being just noticing that I
don't think I had been outsideso much.
You know, just when it startedgetting dark and the sun kind of
just dipped below the trees andI felt that kind of chill in
the air, it was enough where Iwas like, oh, I should have
brought a jacket, and justthinking we could have our first
fire of the season, you know,and it really just like took my
(03:50):
breath away because I was like,oh my gosh, like Tyler always
built the fires.
I mean, that was just kind of,you know, you have these natural
roles when you're married,right, and he always built the
first fire of the season, forsure, and I just remember that
scene so well, and just himbuilding the fire and us just
kind of enjoying the kids in thefamily room, and you know it
(04:14):
was just another part of himthat we lost.
Brad Quillen (04:17):
Yeah, and there's so many of those firsts.
It might not be for someone thefire building thing, but they
resonate with oh my goodness,it's so true.
I didn't realize that until Idon't have it now.
Erin Nelson (04:28):
Yeah, exactly, I mean, we've had even just kind
of fall losses.
You know just those, whetherthat's you know someone who
enjoyed college football, or youknow just you know, sometimes
people just have hobbies thatare more in the fall and it's
like you know, just not havingthose natural activities.
And just the change of theseasons it changes our grief too
(04:50):
.
Brad Quillen (04:51):
I'm glad you brought up sports because
Colleen was talking a littlewhile ago about the whole sport
thing in fall and how that's ahuge piece of schools with
football or basketball in thewinter or you know different
sports that happen in the fall,and even in our culture that the
NFL and college football isthere and so that's a huge thing
in our world.
Colleen Montague (05:12):
Yeah, and I never forget this little girl at
Jessica's house who drew apicture of her family before the
loss and then after, and therewas a football in the before but
not in the after, because herdad loved football and it just
it wasn't the same without himanymore.
And so those are going to beconversations to be had with
your kiddos, especially if it'srec leagues that you used to
(05:36):
play, maybe soccer teams or flagfootball or football teams.
But having those conversationsnow of what that looks like as a
family, and I would imaginegiving kids a choice if they
want to continue it or not, andmaybe they want to pass for a
year or maybe it's a nice anchorfor them and they want to
continue doing it.
Erin Nelson (05:57):
Yeah, Just having that community.
And you know, for our familieswho've lost a child, you know
that can be really hard to havetheir child's sports team
continue to go on into anotherseason when your child's no
longer here.
Brad Quillen (06:12):
But maybe you have another child who's also
playing, and just how hard thatcan be for some that are going
to attend something in the, asthe season changes and that
sport comes around or play orwhatever.
That might be just the feelingsthat come up on the drive there
, walking into the building,being there, and some of those
(06:37):
emotions that just come out ofwhat feels like nowhere and it
just is unsettling, you know,and and just brings a lot of
emotion and that's okay andthat's a that's a piece of grief
.
Erin Nelson (06:50):
You don't know until you get there.
Right, you show up and it's anew season and you haven't been
there for a year.
Colleen Montague (06:57):
And then you get there and you're like I
wasn't expecting this Oftentimesour bodies remember before we
do, and so, true, our bodyremembers smells of the fall
like we're talking about, orsounds of the fall, and so we
may not even realize we're thereyet, but our body is sending us
(07:19):
cues that here we go, this,this is the season, and so
really leaning in to thosesmells or other sensory
reminders of the season thatyou're in.
Erin Nelson (07:31):
Yeah, and all the memories that they bring too,
because so much of the timewe'll have just natural memories
of the person who died andwe've had families teach us that
they just have to kind of bracethemselves for the new season
because it doesn't feel the sameanymore.
Brad Quillen (07:48):
I'm curious to hear your guys' thoughts on
something that I've heard fromfamilies and when that first
season of entering back intosome of those things, it's
almost like families have to setup a code word for kiddos when
they're just overwhelmed withsome emotion, to where they can
have an exit.
And some one family taught memany, many years ago it was
(08:11):
chocolate dipped strawberriesLike that was their code phrase
to get out of something of hey,I need to leave, Like it's just
too much.
Erin Nelson (08:18):
I need to.
Brad Quillen (08:19):
I need to go ahead and you know we need to vacate
and get back home.
You know we need to vacate andget back home.
Have you guys heard anyfamilies talk about that?
Or kiddos or what?
Would you tell parents to helpthem give their kids a way to
get out when it's just too much?
Erin Nelson (08:32):
I think that's a good idea.
Just code words, and this isthe time that you have new kinds
of gatherings.
You're not doing the summergatherings anymore, right, and
so you know this may be a timethat you have kind of just
different fall activities andyou know you're really in a lot
of ways anticipating theholidays and sometimes it's good
(08:52):
to start talking about thatbecause, what we're hearing from
families just in during thistime is that they're starting to
kind of feel this sense ofdread the longer you know nights
, and they're starting to thinkabout the holidays and having a
code word.
That's a really good idea tothink about, like how are we
(09:13):
going to really anticipate?
Like hey, we may need to leaveearly and we'll have that
conversation and then what doesthat look like?
And really talk about it?
Colleen Montague (09:23):
Yeah, Holding plans loosely and knowing that
before going into it is soempowering for you and your
family, and a code word that afamily taught me once was theirs
was I left something in the car, and so they knew they could
say that to each other if itjust didn't feel right anymore
(09:45):
and they needed to go.
Brad Quillen (09:48):
And you don't have to accept the invite.
You don't have to go.
Colleen Montague (09:51):
Or you can accept it when you think you're
ready for it and you can bailthe night of when it just does
not feel like you can do it.
Brad Quillen (09:58):
Because there's the worry of I'm letting them
down you know, know, I'm goingto put myself in a really hard
position and we don't have theenergy sometimes for that, so
it's okay to not and maybe whenyou accept the invite it can be
very tentative, correct?
Colleen Montague (10:13):
thanks for the invite.
That sounds like a lot of fun.
We're a yes for now, but justknow the day of I never know how
things might be going, so wemay have to bail, but as of
right now, I think we'll be ableto come.
Erin Nelson (10:24):
Yeah, and I think just this is another time
without we get to really listento your body and, like you said,
it's like as you sense, likehow you're feeling.
Sometimes you don't know untilyou get there, until you're in
the car, and you're just like,okay, no, this doesn't feel
right, giving yourselfpermission and see what it feels
(10:44):
like to really listen andchange your plans and go do
something that does fill you,like what do you really need
right now?
Do you need that group ofpeople?
Do you need to show up with acostume on?
What do you need right now andjust asking yourself that and
really listening to that.
This is a time that everyonewill understand.
(11:07):
When you say no and you changeyour plans, you have to teach
people what you need.
So putting it out there,letting them know what you need,
and it's unapologetic, likethis is where you are right now
and in order to heal, you haveto be present to what you need.
Brad Quillen (11:27):
And what do you say for those folks that are
hearing from others?
Well, you need to push throughit, because I hear that in group
.
Erin Nelson (11:36):
I think that's pretty bad advice.
Brad Quillen (11:38):
Truly Just at baseline.
Erin Nelson (11:40):
Just at baseline, I mean pushing through.
It means you're going againstyour true self.
Brad Quillen (11:45):
Right.
Erin Nelson (11:46):
And you're going against what you know will
benefit your healing.
Yeah, and that is never a placethat's beneficial.
Brad Quillen (11:58):
Because I'm imagining the listener that's
sitting there thinking I wasdriving to such and such and I
knew it was going to be reallyhard to be there.
I could feel the pit in mystomach.
The closer I get I startedsweating the steering wheel is
getting wet between my hands thecloser I get I started sweating
.
You know the the steering wheelis.
It's getting wet between myhands and the steering wheel and
that's your body saying it'stime to turn around.
Erin Nelson (12:20):
It's time to turn around.
What do I need in this moment?
Brad Quillen (12:24):
Don't push through .
Erin Nelson (12:25):
No, no, truly.
Brad Quillen (12:28):
And that's almost a cultural piece too, of you
have to push through.
Erin Nelson (12:34):
Yeah, we're really good at that in our culture,
right, kind of just pullourselves up by our bootstraps,
bootstraps, right.
And then we're getting thosebackup messages from others,
like you're tough and you know,the more someone tells you
you're strong, the more youcan't show up in your fragility.
Right, because grief breaks youopen.
(12:56):
A loss like what we're talkingabout we're talking about losing
your child or your spouse orpartner that breaks you open and
you know, showing up in yourfragility is showing up in your
true self and where you are andyou won't always be there,
correct, you know, because timeand just as you heal, as you
(13:19):
integrate, but just beingwherever you are and letting,
letting that just guide you.
Colleen Montague (13:25):
I like how you said, Erin, you won't always be
there, and so now is the time.
If you're fresh in your loss,where you can you can turn the
car around.
You cannot show up.
You can cancel last minute, butknow that eventually you won't
be in that same spot.
You'll be in a place where youfeel like you can try for a
(13:47):
little bit of time and getthrough it, and then retreat
back and then in more time, youcan maybe make it a little bit
longer, if we're talking aboutthis party scene as our example.
And so just know that you couldget to that someday, but you
don't have to do it today.
Erin Nelson (14:04):
Right, you're retreating, you're engaging and
retreating and it's just thattitration, just kind of that
back and forth, and you know, inthe future you still may have
something and some reason.
You're still living in yourfragility and and just the deep
sense of loss.
But yes, I just think you knowwe've talked so much about waves
.
It's like those sets of waves.
(14:24):
They are a little bit furtherapart, right, and so maybe we're
not feeling just the intensityand you know that you do in
early loss.
Brad Quillen (14:35):
And I think we forget that essential piece of
rest in those first seasons.
Erin Nelson (14:41):
Which winter, you know, really invites you
naturally into that.
I mean just in nature, right?
Brad Quillen (14:46):
That hibernation.
We're watching that.
Erin Nelson (14:48):
Yeah, we see that out our windows, we can
experience that, and maybethat's a natural invitation to
rest a little bit more thanbefore.
Brad Quillen (14:57):
It's so true, it's natural, and the other natural
thing is to take care ofourselves, and we don't have to
live up to everyone else'sexpectation.
Erin Nelson (15:04):
No, we don't need to, and this is a time when we
need to self-preserve right.
Preserve ourself, especially asparents and caregivers.
Preserving yourself means thatyou will have the energy that
they need from you.
Brad Quillen (15:23):
Yeah, and with that we're going to go ahead and
take a little bit of break, butas we come back, we're going to
talk a little bit aboutHalloween and the seasons to
come.
Gary Shriver (15:32):
Jessica's House is a children's bereavement center
located in California's CentralValley since 2012.
Jessica's House provides freepeer support for children, teens
, young adults and theirfamilies grieving a loss.
If you need grief-relatedsupport, please visit
jessicashouseorg to download ourfree resources and be sure to
(15:54):
follow Jessica's House on socialmedia and, if you have any
questions or topics you'd likeus to explore, in a future
episode, just send us an emailat info at jessicashouseorg.
Brad Quillen (16:08):
Just before the break we were talking about
seasons.
Erin, in your story, Fall is apart of your story with when
your son Carter died.
He died in September and thenyou turn the corner a few weeks
later into Halloween and all thedecor and decorations, and can
you just take a few minutes.
Erin Nelson (16:27):
I think that can surprise you a little bit.
Just, maybe you've never thoughtabout Halloween as much before
and some of what I experiencedis that, yeah, Carter died
towards the end of September andthen we quickly hopped into
spooky season and I didn't evenrealize that people were turning
(16:49):
their yards into cemeteries andthere was like blood and gore
and I was like, oh my goodness,just driving was kind of
traumatizing in some ways justto go to the grocery store and
it was tough, like I, I just itwas.
It was hard to see all of thatand it was just something that I
had never noticed.
(17:09):
And so then that's beensomething that our families have
really talked about, and justhow hard it is to see those
images, and especially whensomeone died from, you know,
violence or an accident orsomething like that.
You know even justtrick-or-treating, you know like
, especially for our siblingloss families, for you know,
(17:32):
when they've lost a child thatwas younger, that they looked
forward to every year, justletting them pick out their
costume and taking themtrick-or-treating.
And now kids they're friends,you know, kids are knocking on
their door and their child's nolonger here, and it's a
surprising holiday, I think, forfamilies who are in grief
(17:54):
because you think of the biggies, like more of the winter
holidays, like Christmas andThanksgiving, and yeah, I think
it can take you a little offguard.
Brad Quillen (18:04):
And Colleen, I know you and I have worked adult
groups and we've heard the yarddecorations is a lot.
Decorations is a lot.
It's as if we change the lensin front of our eye of how we
see those things now as we'redriving around town or walking
kids to school and every thirdor fifth house has all kinds of
decorations out there and it'sjust so different.
(18:24):
But it's so normal.
We've learned as we've listenedto adults.
Colleen Montague (18:31):
So many have shared that feeling.
A lot of moms mention is howthey found new walking routes or
new driving routes.
There are certain houses thatare just too hard for them to go
by anymore during Halloween,and so they've shifted their
travel around, and I thinkthat's a great little solution
if you can do it, just kind ofwhat can you have control in
around it?
Brad Quillen (18:53):
Yeah, because those reminders are around.
You turn a street corner andit's like boom, you know, there
it is, it's right in front ofyou and that wave of emotions
that we talk about often isright back there and the tears
and the feelings, and it's rightback into it.
Colleen Montague (19:08):
I wish our society as a whole could know
this, because I never thoughtabout this until I started
hearing the stories of others.
I wish that we could know thisso that we could be more
sensitive to it, butunfortunately it's just kind of
a very popular holiday, if youwant to call it that, for our
culture.
Brad Quillen (19:28):
And it's almost as if every time we turn the
corner and we see thosedecorations, it's a reminder
that they're gone, they're nolonger with us.
Erin Nelson (19:48):
It's true, mexico, which is the Day of the Dead and
where our kids that are here atJessica's house are taking that
time to remember the person whodied.
And just I know that some ofour families, like they, have an
altar where they put photos andthey really take this time to
(20:08):
remember, and I think they'vefound it so helpful and it's
something that is so ingrainedinto their kind of fall
traditions and it brings them alot of comfort.
So I just I really, like youknow, thinking about that, and I
know we've been trying toincorporate that more into
(20:29):
Jessica's house.
Colleen Montague (20:31):
I like this shift in perspective and you
know we can get caught up onHalloween and the hardness, but
with the Dia de los Muertoscelebration it's a shift in
perspective of what you're goingto put your energy into and so
shifting that back into yourperson and honoring and
remembering them.
And you may not be in a placelike that your first year or two
(20:53):
, but if and when you are,that's one suggestion to lean
into, maybe and test and see howthat feels.
Erin Nelson (21:01):
Yeah, and then that's, you know, around
November 1st and 2nd, and then Ifeel like naturally, you're
starting to just think aboutthose bigger holidays and you're
starting to kind of lookforward a little bit.
And I know families are tellingus that you're starting to kind
of look forward a little bitand I know families are telling
us that they're starting to feelthat, you know, they're
starting to be a little worriedand their kids are getting
worried about the approachingholiday season and that really
(21:25):
can intensify the grief thatyou're carrying already.
And so you know I know we'vetalked a lot about that with
just that feeling of dread.
Brad Quillen (21:36):
For some of you, your kids can't wait for
Halloween to get here and you'reyou could be dreading it or you
could be looking forward tothat time as well, but I know
for some, some kiddos are readyto jump right into it, but it
feels like a lot.
Erin Nelson (21:49):
Yeah, and I know you know we talk so much about
just matching your kids energyand some of you know their,
their words, and if they areexcited, asking yourself like do
I have the capacity to jump inand really match that with them
and be excited with them and isthis something that we can do
together?
And but maybe it's that there'sa friend that they can join you
(22:14):
know their family and they cango trick or treating with them
or maybe they can help them pickout a costume or something like
that.
And so just kind of walkingthrough this, first kind of
holiday of the holiday season.
Colleen Montague (22:33):
It might be a little clunky, but just getting
through it together.
Yeah, this might be the time tooutsource for some help.
You've had so many offers ofhow can I help from others.
You may have received someoffers from others on how they
can help you.
This could be one time, youknow, can they take your kids
trick-or-treating, or can yourkids join the neighbor kids with
trick-or-treating?
Maybe you just need to stayhome, turn the lights off, not
(22:57):
have to run into anybody out andabout, but your kids could
still go out.
Brad Quillen (23:02):
And as Halloween is around the corner, we also
start thinking of as you said aminute ago, aaron that the
Thanksgiving and Christmas andNew Year's isn't far behind that
, and you're already thinkingand thinking about how am I
going to plan for this?
It's going to be very different, or it might be year two, and
boy, this really is permanent.
Colleen Montague (23:23):
Yes, this loss is permanent, this change to
your family is permanent.
But the plans around it canshift.
So what you choose to do thisyear, it can be different next
year.
Sure, what you've always donebefore you can keep doing, or
you can try something else.
So what can be fluid among thispermanence you're living
(23:46):
through now?
Brad Quillen (23:48):
And asking kids to what?
What might they?
They want to be a part, and youknow it's okay that.
Do we have to do this?
Colleen Montague (23:58):
Yes, I love that, Brad.
Let them be a part of it, apart of the discussion.
Again, back to that idea of somuch control has been stripped
away, right, so where can wegive them some?
Let them be a part of theseconversations when it's
appropriate.
Erin Nelson (24:15):
Right, yeah, as they're thinking, as you're all
kind of thinking, and we'regoing into November and you're
thinking about maybe some ofthose holidays like Thanksgiving
or Christmas and some of thetraditions that you had before,
this is a good time to juststart talking about that and
what it might look like, what isimportant to each person in the
family, really listening toyour children about what's
(24:39):
important to them, because maybeyou've done those holidays the
same for many years and so nowit's like let's just start to
think about and explore whatthat looks like.
Brad Quillen (24:51):
And it all doesn't have to be solved in the first
conversation, but just evenstarting with the
acknowledgement that hey, I'mfeeling more intense emotion
right now as the holidays areapproaching.
Acknowledge that with yourkiddos and then coming back
later with more conversation.
Erin Nelson (25:06):
I know and it's just something that's really
helped me, just as I'm grievingis just like this will be over,
just like sometimes you justhave to get through it.
You know and just like, okay,january's coming, we will get
there.
You know, and just like, okay,january's coming, we will get
there.
And just kind of sometimes youjust hang on and you just get
(25:30):
through it.
You know, and I think too, itjust reminds me too of so many
of those days that are.
You know, we know that maybeyou know there's a death
anniversary or a birthday orwhatever it is that we're
encountering.
You know, remember, brad, whenwe heard the story about a
culture that when someone dies,everybody in the village moves
(25:54):
their furniture around.
Brad Quillen (25:55):
So it's never the same again.
Erin Nelson (25:57):
It's never the same again and I think, as a griever
kind of what you're looking forsometimes is that, when your
whole life has changed and yourholidays have changed, that
there's some kind ofacknowledgement with other
people, and sometimes you haveto put that out there just to
say, hey, would you just join mein, like, lighting a candle in
(26:18):
memory of this person, just bewith me, just send me a little
photo of that, or maybe you cango visit the grave together or
you know, whatever it is, Ithink knowing someone is holding
this experience with you, thenewness of facing a holiday
without your person, how thatcan feel, just having others
(26:39):
with you and really reaching outfor extra support, is really
important as you face these days.
Brad Quillen (26:45):
The holidays add hypervigilance to that.
There's other seasons that wefeel that too, like around the
death date and those things too.
Erin Nelson (26:54):
Or I've had adults tell me, you know, April 1st to
the middle of May, you know, isreally hard and so I need extra
help and support and to takepeople up on those offers and
those seasons too extra supportis sometimes really needed and
just to have someone you knowyou can call on or somebody that
will come sit with you, orsomebody if you are wrapping a
(27:15):
gift, they're going to just comespend that time with you.
So you just don't feel theburden of it alone.
And you know so much of thetime you know the parents are
the ones that have to make themagic happen.
That can feel really heavy ifyou're doing that without your
child or you have an emptystocking or your spouse or
partner is no longer here.
(27:36):
It can just feel like a lot.
So as you look towards thatfuture, first of all just
knowing like you will getthrough it.
Right, you're going to getthrough it.
It won't always feel the way itdoes right now, like we kind of
talked about, but just knowthat you'll get through it
breath by breath.
Brad Quillen (27:55):
Yeah, back to that minute by minute.
Erin Nelson (27:57):
15 minute segment hour by hour, day by day, but
spring will come Spring willcome, spring will come, spring
will come.
Brad Quillen (28:05):
We say something often around Jessica's house and
it's that idea of trust yourinner gut with your family.
Erin Nelson (28:13):
Just that inner wisdom that we have, yeah, that,
even if we don't know right now, today, as we're kind of
thinking of being in thisOctober season, that we will
have the wisdom that we need aswe go along into these longer
nights, these shorter days, theholidays, whatever it is, that
(28:36):
we have the capacity to heal,that we can continue to do this
and that we will find what weneed.
Brad Quillen (28:44):
And there's the reality of the days get shorter
and it's darker out, and forsome the holidays are
metaphorically a darker time.
Erin Nelson (28:53):
Yeah.
Brad Quillen (28:53):
And you've talked about that in previous episodes
of the dark will hold you.
Erin Nelson (28:58):
Yeah, Just feeling that.
You know, I mentioned beforeabout just texting a friend
after the loss of Carter, whohad my friend had also lost her
daughter and just saying I feellike I'm just falling into the
abyss.
And she texted back veryquickly the darkness will hold
you.
And when I think about thatpicture, I think about just kind
(29:20):
of being down.
I did spend some time doingsome dives like scuba diving,
and I just think about like whenyou're down there, you're in
the deep but you have this likelittle kind of glimmer of like
the sun is like coming throughthere's like a beam coming
through, there's like a beam,yeah, and just trusting that, as
you're down there, that youwill.
(29:42):
You have the light.
There is a place that we canjust hang on to, that you can
trust will get you through andthat you'll be able to come back
up to the surface again.
Brad Quillen (29:55):
And sometimes it feels very, very slow coming up
to the surface.
Yeah it does To that beam.
Erin Nelson (30:02):
Especially during the surface.
Yeah, it does To that beam,especially during the holidays.
Brad Quillen (30:04):
Yeah, and there are some ways that that we can
add some beams of light in thedark and calling.
I know we've talked about thisbefore, but just some of those
fall comforts, like we'refoodies around Jessica's house
and that's one of them, and I'mnot going to give the others
away and take your thunder, butwhat are some of those other
ones that you think of, orthings that families have taught
(30:25):
you over the years of ways wecan add comfort when it feels
like we're in that dark?
Colleen Montague (30:31):
For me personally, I love candles.
I love the flicker of the lightand the warmth that it gives
off, but during the spring andsummer I don't really light them
around the house.
It's too hot and you don'tactually notice the flame among
the light.
Brad Quillen (30:44):
It's too bright in the house.
Colleen Montague (30:45):
It's too bright All those things yeah.
And so in the fall and winter Iget very excited and light all
the candles and so that justbrings me comfort.
It's such a small little way.
It also just anchors me tobeing home.
It's what I do right when I gethome is light candles and then
get in those comfies, get outthat big warm blanket.
(31:10):
Like you mentioned, making agood stew or stopping by the
store and buying it and thenjust putting it in your pot at
home and and enjoying the smellsand the comforts it brings.
But just what little comfortscan you bring into your home and
to yourself during those darkwinter months that maybe aren't
there or aren't as helpful inthe other seasons?
What would you add, erin?
Erin Nelson (31:30):
I just like this idea.
It's, you know, because we knowgrief has a way of slowing us
down.
It's really kind of matchingour natural rhythm of being, of
grieving.
It's kind of that winteringidea, and sometimes it invites
us and then we can just, yeah,add those little lights.
And I know we heard about aparent who, just like, put
little fairy lights around theirchildren's bed and just added
(31:53):
little lights here and there,little lamps in the corner, and
that's what they needed.
Brad Quillen (31:58):
And so, listening to what you need, yeah, I've
heard fireplace, you know, I'veheard the crock pot is like the
go-to, that home stew kind ofwarm meal, music, but yeah, a
lot of candles and the warmdrinks in the winter.
That kind of bring that comfortfor families over the years.
(32:19):
Well, erin and Colleen, thankyou for today and thank you that
are listening for being here.
If you have any questions orfuture ideas for us, you can
email us at info atjessicashouseorg, or for more
resources.
You can find those on ourwebsite at jessicashouseorg.
Be sure to join us next timefor another episode of when
(32:39):
Grief Comes Home, where we'lldiscuss ceremonies and funerals.
Until then, we wish you well.
Gary Shriver (32:48):
Jessica's House is a children's bereavement center
located in California's CentralValley since 2012.
We provide free peer supportfor children, teens, young
adults and their familiesgrieving a loss.
If you need grief-relatedsupport, please visit
jessicashouseorg to download ourfree resources and be sure to
(33:09):
follow Jessica's House on socialmedia, and if you have any
questions or topics you'd likefor us to explore in future
episodes, just send us an emailto jessicashouseorg.
Thank you for joining us andwe'll see you next time, for
when Grief Comes Home.
Hello and welcome to when Grief Comes Home, a
podcast dedicated to parentsliving through loss while
supporting their child.
Let's meet the team.
Erin Nelson (00:11):
I'm Erin Nelson, founding executive director at
Jessica's House.
Colleen Montague (00:15):
Hi, I'm Colleen Montague, program
director for Jessica's House anda licensed marriage and family
therapist.
Brad Quillen (00:21):
Hi, I'm Brad Quillen and I'm the host of when
Grief Comes Home.
Gary Shriver (00:25):
Now, through this podcast, they'll share grief
resources and coping skills,heartfelt stories and insights
to support parents as they raisechildren who are grieving.
Together
Brad Quillen (00:47):
Hello, hello, it's Brad from Jessica's house.
Today we're talking about thechanging seasons as we move from
summer into fall and how thatcan affect your grieving process
.
Sometimes we don't even thinkfrom moving from one season to
another we'll have that big ofan impact.
But between shorter days andcooler weather and the
approaching holiday season, thiscan be a really difficult time
for you and your children.
It can bring up a variety offeelings that you never even saw
(01:10):
coming.
So right now let's dive in Erinand and Colleen.
We noticed that the days aregetting shorter, there's a
little bit of change in theweather, and that's all a part
of seasons changing in grief andthat's all a part of seasons
changing in grief.
Erin Nelson (01:24):
Yeah, I think something that we've heard so
much is that sometimes thosedarker longer, those darker days
, longer nights can be reallytough when you're grieving.
Brad Quillen (01:35):
Yeah, it's almost like people naturally enter back
into isolation because they'renot out as long the neighbors
aren't out, the sportingpractices are less and some of
those things, but it's like theloneliness and isolation come
back.
Erin Nelson (01:52):
Kind of an invitation a little bit to be
more present to your grief,because there aren't maybe as
many distractions and sometimesthat's a tough place to be.
Brad Quillen (02:04):
And some of those natural supports change.
That happened to be becausethere's more daylight and light
and sun and all those thingsgoing on outside.
Erin Nelson (02:13):
Yeah, I remember that after Tyler died, just you
know, we kind of had a naturallyjust like a neighborhood where
kids were just running aroundoutside and when we hit kind of
that mid-October-ish time thatpeople just naturally went
inside and they started justkind of being with their family
(02:34):
and we had such a kind of I feltlike more of a fractured family
.
It just wasn't the same andjust feeling just it was a lot
harder just to be there and nothave that natural support and
community around.
Brad Quillen (02:49):
And and as those things change, you start to feel
some of the firsts come on Um,and one of the stories you tell
often around Jessica's house isthat you didn't realize Tyler
was your fire builder Would youshare a bit about that.
Erin Nelson (03:04):
Yeah, so I just remember, as it was October
actually, and we went out tojust go to a horse arena, the
kids wanted to go ride horsesand we had friends who had a
horse, and so the kids were justin with our friends and they
were riding horses around and Iwas just sitting outside the
arena.
(03:26):
They were riding horses aroundand I was just sitting outside
the arena, and I'll never forgetjust being just noticing that I
don't think I had been outsideso much.
You know, just when it startedgetting dark and the sun kind of
just dipped below the trees andI felt that kind of chill in
the air, it was enough where Iwas like, oh, I should have
brought a jacket, and justthinking we could have our first
fire of the season, you know,and it really just like took my
(03:50):
breath away because I was like,oh my gosh, like Tyler always
built the fires.
I mean, that was just kind of,you know, you have these natural
roles when you're married,right, and he always built the
first fire of the season, forsure, and I just remember that
scene so well, and just himbuilding the fire and us just
kind of enjoying the kids in thefamily room, and you know it
(04:14):
was just another part of himthat we lost.
Brad Quillen (04:17):
Yeah, and there's so many of those firsts.
It might not be for someone thefire building thing, but they
resonate with oh my goodness,it's so true.
I didn't realize that until Idon't have it now.
Erin Nelson (04:28):
Yeah, exactly, I mean, we've had even just kind
of fall losses.
You know just those, whetherthat's you know someone who
enjoyed college football, or youknow just you know, sometimes
people just have hobbies thatare more in the fall and it's
like you know, just not havingthose natural activities.
And just the change of theseasons it changes our grief too
(04:50):
.
Brad Quillen (04:51):
I'm glad you brought up sports because
Colleen was talking a littlewhile ago about the whole sport
thing in fall and how that's ahuge piece of schools with
football or basketball in thewinter or you know different
sports that happen in the fall,and even in our culture that the
NFL and college football isthere and so that's a huge thing
in our world.
Colleen Montague (05:12):
Yeah, and I never forget this little girl at
Jessica's house who drew apicture of her family before the
loss and then after, and therewas a football in the before but
not in the after, because herdad loved football and it just
it wasn't the same without himanymore.
And so those are going to beconversations to be had with
your kiddos, especially if it'srec leagues that you used to
(05:36):
play, maybe soccer teams or flagfootball or football teams.
But having those conversationsnow of what that looks like as a
family, and I would imaginegiving kids a choice if they
want to continue it or not, andmaybe they want to pass for a
year or maybe it's a nice anchorfor them and they want to
continue doing it.
Erin Nelson (05:57):
Yeah, Just having that community.
And you know, for our familieswho've lost a child, you know
that can be really hard to havetheir child's sports team
continue to go on into anotherseason when your child's no
longer here.
Brad Quillen (06:12):
But maybe you have another child who's also
playing, and just how hard thatcan be for some that are going
to attend something in the, asthe season changes and that
sport comes around or play orwhatever.
That might be just the feelingsthat come up on the drive there
, walking into the building,being there, and some of those
(06:37):
emotions that just come out ofwhat feels like nowhere and it
just is unsettling, you know,and and just brings a lot of
emotion and that's okay andthat's a that's a piece of grief
.
Erin Nelson (06:50):
You don't know until you get there.
Right, you show up and it's anew season and you haven't been
there for a year.
Colleen Montague (06:57):
And then you get there and you're like I
wasn't expecting this Oftentimesour bodies remember before we
do, and so, true, our bodyremembers smells of the fall
like we're talking about, orsounds of the fall, and so we
may not even realize we're thereyet, but our body is sending us
(07:19):
cues that here we go, this,this is the season, and so
really leaning in to thosesmells or other sensory
reminders of the season thatyou're in.
Erin Nelson (07:31):
Yeah, and all the memories that they bring too,
because so much of the timewe'll have just natural memories
of the person who died andwe've had families teach us that
they just have to kind of bracethemselves for the new season
because it doesn't feel the sameanymore.
Brad Quillen (07:48):
I'm curious to hear your guys' thoughts on
something that I've heard fromfamilies and when that first
season of entering back intosome of those things, it's
almost like families have to setup a code word for kiddos when
they're just overwhelmed withsome emotion, to where they can
have an exit.
And some one family taught memany, many years ago it was
(08:11):
chocolate dipped strawberriesLike that was their code phrase
to get out of something of hey,I need to leave, Like it's just
too much.
Erin Nelson (08:18):
I need to.
Brad Quillen (08:19):
I need to go ahead and you know we need to vacate
and get back home.
You know we need to vacate andget back home.
Have you guys heard anyfamilies talk about that?
Or kiddos or what?
Would you tell parents to helpthem give their kids a way to
get out when it's just too much?
Erin Nelson (08:32):
I think that's a good idea.
Just code words, and this isthe time that you have new kinds
of gatherings.
You're not doing the summergatherings anymore, right, and
so you know this may be a timethat you have kind of just
different fall activities andyou know you're really in a lot
of ways anticipating theholidays and sometimes it's good
(08:52):
to start talking about thatbecause, what we're hearing from
families just in during thistime is that they're starting to
kind of feel this sense ofdread the longer you know nights
, and they're starting to thinkabout the holidays and having a
code word.
That's a really good idea tothink about, like how are we
(09:13):
going to really anticipate?
Like hey, we may need to leaveearly and we'll have that
conversation and then what doesthat look like?
And really talk about it?
Colleen Montague (09:23):
Yeah, Holding plans loosely and knowing that
before going into it is soempowering for you and your
family, and a code word that afamily taught me once was theirs
was I left something in the car, and so they knew they could
say that to each other if itjust didn't feel right anymore
(09:45):
and they needed to go.
Brad Quillen (09:48):
And you don't have to accept the invite.
You don't have to go.
Colleen Montague (09:51):
Or you can accept it when you think you're
ready for it and you can bailthe night of when it just does
not feel like you can do it.
Brad Quillen (09:58):
Because there's the worry of I'm letting them
down you know, know, I'm goingto put myself in a really hard
position and we don't have theenergy sometimes for that, so
it's okay to not and maybe whenyou accept the invite it can be
very tentative, correct?
Colleen Montague (10:13):
thanks for the invite.
That sounds like a lot of fun.
We're a yes for now, but justknow the day of I never know how
things might be going, so wemay have to bail, but as of
right now, I think we'll be ableto come.
Erin Nelson (10:24):
Yeah, and I think just this is another time
without we get to really listento your body and, like you said,
it's like as you sense, likehow you're feeling.
Sometimes you don't know untilyou get there, until you're in
the car, and you're just like,okay, no, this doesn't feel
right, giving yourselfpermission and see what it feels
(10:44):
like to really listen andchange your plans and go do
something that does fill you,like what do you really need
right now?
Do you need that group ofpeople?
Do you need to show up with acostume on?
What do you need right now andjust asking yourself that and
really listening to that.
This is a time that everyonewill understand.
(11:07):
When you say no and you changeyour plans, you have to teach
people what you need.
So putting it out there,letting them know what you need,
and it's unapologetic, likethis is where you are right now
and in order to heal, you haveto be present to what you need.
Brad Quillen (11:27):
And what do you say for those folks that are
hearing from others?
Well, you need to push throughit, because I hear that in group
.
Erin Nelson (11:36):
I think that's pretty bad advice.
Brad Quillen (11:38):
Truly Just at baseline.
Erin Nelson (11:40):
Just at baseline, I mean pushing through.
It means you're going againstyour true self.
Brad Quillen (11:45):
Right.
Erin Nelson (11:46):
And you're going against what you know will
benefit your healing.
Yeah, and that is never a placethat's beneficial.
Brad Quillen (11:58):
Because I'm imagining the listener that's
sitting there thinking I wasdriving to such and such and I
knew it was going to be reallyhard to be there.
I could feel the pit in mystomach.
The closer I get I startedsweating the steering wheel is
getting wet between my hands thecloser I get I started sweating
.
You know the the steering wheelis.
It's getting wet between myhands and the steering wheel and
that's your body saying it'stime to turn around.
Erin Nelson (12:20):
It's time to turn around.
What do I need in this moment?
Brad Quillen (12:24):
Don't push through .
Erin Nelson (12:25):
No, no, truly.
Brad Quillen (12:28):
And that's almost a cultural piece too, of you
have to push through.
Erin Nelson (12:34):
Yeah, we're really good at that in our culture,
right, kind of just pullourselves up by our bootstraps,
bootstraps, right.
And then we're getting thosebackup messages from others,
like you're tough and you know,the more someone tells you
you're strong, the more youcan't show up in your fragility.
Right, because grief breaks youopen.
(12:56):
A loss like what we're talkingabout we're talking about losing
your child or your spouse orpartner that breaks you open and
you know, showing up in yourfragility is showing up in your
true self and where you are andyou won't always be there,
correct, you know, because timeand just as you heal, as you
(13:19):
integrate, but just beingwherever you are and letting,
letting that just guide you.
Colleen Montague (13:25):
I like how you said, Erin, you won't always be
there, and so now is the time.
If you're fresh in your loss,where you can you can turn the
car around.
You cannot show up.
You can cancel last minute, butknow that eventually you won't
be in that same spot.
You'll be in a place where youfeel like you can try for a
(13:47):
little bit of time and getthrough it, and then retreat
back and then in more time, youcan maybe make it a little bit
longer, if we're talking aboutthis party scene as our example.
And so just know that you couldget to that someday, but you
don't have to do it today.
Erin Nelson (14:04):
Right, you're retreating, you're engaging and
retreating and it's just thattitration, just kind of that
back and forth, and you know, inthe future you still may have
something and some reason.
You're still living in yourfragility and and just the deep
sense of loss.
But yes, I just think you knowwe've talked so much about waves
.
It's like those sets of waves.
(14:24):
They are a little bit furtherapart, right, and so maybe we're
not feeling just the intensityand you know that you do in
early loss.
Brad Quillen (14:35):
And I think we forget that essential piece of
rest in those first seasons.
Erin Nelson (14:41):
Which winter, you know, really invites you
naturally into that.
I mean just in nature, right?
Brad Quillen (14:46):
That hibernation.
We're watching that.
Erin Nelson (14:48):
Yeah, we see that out our windows, we can
experience that, and maybethat's a natural invitation to
rest a little bit more thanbefore.
Brad Quillen (14:57):
It's so true, it's natural, and the other natural
thing is to take care ofourselves, and we don't have to
live up to everyone else'sexpectation.
Erin Nelson (15:04):
No, we don't need to, and this is a time when we
need to self-preserve right.
Preserve ourself, especially asparents and caregivers.
Preserving yourself means thatyou will have the energy that
they need from you.
Brad Quillen (15:23):
Yeah, and with that we're going to go ahead and
take a little bit of break, butas we come back, we're going to
talk a little bit aboutHalloween and the seasons to
come.
Gary Shriver (15:32):
Jessica's House is a children's bereavement center
located in California's CentralValley since 2012.
Jessica's House provides freepeer support for children, teens
, young adults and theirfamilies grieving a loss.
If you need grief-relatedsupport, please visit
jessicashouseorg to download ourfree resources and be sure to
(15:54):
follow Jessica's House on socialmedia and, if you have any
questions or topics you'd likeus to explore, in a future
episode, just send us an emailat info at jessicashouseorg.
Brad Quillen (16:08):
Just before the break we were talking about
seasons.
Erin, in your story, Fall is apart of your story with when
your son Carter died.
He died in September and thenyou turn the corner a few weeks
later into Halloween and all thedecor and decorations, and can
you just take a few minutes.
Erin Nelson (16:27):
I think that can surprise you a little bit.
Just, maybe you've never thoughtabout Halloween as much before
and some of what I experiencedis that, yeah, Carter died
towards the end of September andthen we quickly hopped into
spooky season and I didn't evenrealize that people were turning
(16:49):
their yards into cemeteries andthere was like blood and gore
and I was like, oh my goodness,just driving was kind of
traumatizing in some ways justto go to the grocery store and
it was tough, like I, I just itwas.
It was hard to see all of thatand it was just something that I
had never noticed.
(17:09):
And so then that's beensomething that our families have
really talked about, and justhow hard it is to see those
images, and especially whensomeone died from, you know,
violence or an accident orsomething like that.
You know even justtrick-or-treating, you know like
, especially for our siblingloss families, for you know,
(17:32):
when they've lost a child thatwas younger, that they looked
forward to every year, justletting them pick out their
costume and taking themtrick-or-treating.
And now kids they're friends,you know, kids are knocking on
their door and their child's nolonger here, and it's a
surprising holiday, I think, forfamilies who are in grief
(17:54):
because you think of the biggies, like more of the winter
holidays, like Christmas andThanksgiving, and yeah, I think
it can take you a little offguard.
Brad Quillen (18:04):
And Colleen, I know you and I have worked adult
groups and we've heard the yarddecorations is a lot.
Decorations is a lot.
It's as if we change the lensin front of our eye of how we
see those things now as we'redriving around town or walking
kids to school and every thirdor fifth house has all kinds of
decorations out there and it'sjust so different.
(18:24):
But it's so normal.
We've learned as we've listenedto adults.
Colleen Montague (18:31):
So many have shared that feeling.
A lot of moms mention is howthey found new walking routes or
new driving routes.
There are certain houses thatare just too hard for them to go
by anymore during Halloween,and so they've shifted their
travel around, and I thinkthat's a great little solution
if you can do it, just kind ofwhat can you have control in
around it?
Brad Quillen (18:53):
Yeah, because those reminders are around.
You turn a street corner andit's like boom, you know, there
it is, it's right in front ofyou and that wave of emotions
that we talk about often isright back there and the tears
and the feelings, and it's rightback into it.
Colleen Montague (19:08):
I wish our society as a whole could know
this, because I never thoughtabout this until I started
hearing the stories of others.
I wish that we could know thisso that we could be more
sensitive to it, butunfortunately it's just kind of
a very popular holiday, if youwant to call it that, for our
culture.
Brad Quillen (19:28):
And it's almost as if every time we turn the
corner and we see thosedecorations, it's a reminder
that they're gone, they're nolonger with us.
Erin Nelson (19:48):
It's true, mexico, which is the Day of the Dead and
where our kids that are here atJessica's house are taking that
time to remember the person whodied.
And just I know that some ofour families, like they, have an
altar where they put photos andthey really take this time to
(20:08):
remember, and I think they'vefound it so helpful and it's
something that is so ingrainedinto their kind of fall
traditions and it brings them alot of comfort.
So I just I really, like youknow, thinking about that, and I
know we've been trying toincorporate that more into
(20:29):
Jessica's house.
Colleen Montague (20:31):
I like this shift in perspective and you
know we can get caught up onHalloween and the hardness, but
with the Dia de los Muertoscelebration it's a shift in
perspective of what you're goingto put your energy into and so
shifting that back into yourperson and honoring and
remembering them.
And you may not be in a placelike that your first year or two
(20:53):
, but if and when you are,that's one suggestion to lean
into, maybe and test and see howthat feels.
Erin Nelson (21:01):
Yeah, and then that's, you know, around
November 1st and 2nd, and then Ifeel like naturally, you're
starting to just think aboutthose bigger holidays and you're
starting to kind of lookforward a little bit.
And I know families are tellingus that you're starting to kind
of look forward a little bitand I know families are telling
us that they're starting to feelthat, you know, they're
starting to be a little worriedand their kids are getting
worried about the approachingholiday season and that really
(21:25):
can intensify the grief thatyou're carrying already.
And so you know I know we'vetalked a lot about that with
just that feeling of dread.
Brad Quillen (21:36):
For some of you, your kids can't wait for
Halloween to get here and you'reyou could be dreading it or you
could be looking forward tothat time as well, but I know
for some, some kiddos are readyto jump right into it, but it
feels like a lot.
Erin Nelson (21:49):
Yeah, and I know you know we talk so much about
just matching your kids energyand some of you know their,
their words, and if they areexcited, asking yourself like do
I have the capacity to jump inand really match that with them
and be excited with them and isthis something that we can do
together?
And but maybe it's that there'sa friend that they can join you
(22:14):
know their family and they cango trick or treating with them
or maybe they can help them pickout a costume or something like
that.
And so just kind of walkingthrough this, first kind of
holiday of the holiday season.
Colleen Montague (22:33):
It might be a little clunky, but just getting
through it together.
Yeah, this might be the time tooutsource for some help.
You've had so many offers ofhow can I help from others.
You may have received someoffers from others on how they
can help you.
This could be one time, youknow, can they take your kids
trick-or-treating, or can yourkids join the neighbor kids with
trick-or-treating?
Maybe you just need to stayhome, turn the lights off, not
(22:57):
have to run into anybody out andabout, but your kids could
still go out.
Brad Quillen (23:02):
And as Halloween is around the corner, we also
start thinking of as you said aminute ago, aaron that the
Thanksgiving and Christmas andNew Year's isn't far behind that
, and you're already thinkingand thinking about how am I
going to plan for this?
It's going to be very different, or it might be year two, and
boy, this really is permanent.
Colleen Montague (23:23):
Yes, this loss is permanent, this change to
your family is permanent.
But the plans around it canshift.
So what you choose to do thisyear, it can be different next
year.
Sure, what you've always donebefore you can keep doing, or
you can try something else.
So what can be fluid among thispermanence you're living
(23:46):
through now?
Brad Quillen (23:48):
And asking kids to what?
What might they?
They want to be a part, and youknow it's okay that.
Do we have to do this?
Colleen Montague (23:58):
Yes, I love that, Brad.
Let them be a part of it, apart of the discussion.
Again, back to that idea of somuch control has been stripped
away, right, so where can wegive them some?
Let them be a part of theseconversations when it's
appropriate.
Erin Nelson (24:15):
Right, yeah, as they're thinking, as you're all
kind of thinking, and we'regoing into November and you're
thinking about maybe some ofthose holidays like Thanksgiving
or Christmas and some of thetraditions that you had before,
this is a good time to juststart talking about that and
what it might look like, what isimportant to each person in the
family, really listening toyour children about what's
(24:39):
important to them, because maybeyou've done those holidays the
same for many years and so nowit's like let's just start to
think about and explore whatthat looks like.
Brad Quillen (24:51):
And it all doesn't have to be solved in the first
conversation, but just evenstarting with the
acknowledgement that hey, I'mfeeling more intense emotion
right now as the holidays areapproaching.
Acknowledge that with yourkiddos and then coming back
later with more conversation.
Erin Nelson (25:06):
I know and it's just something that's really
helped me, just as I'm grievingis just like this will be over,
just like sometimes you justhave to get through it.
You know and just like, okay,january's coming, we will get
there.
You know, and just like, okay,january's coming, we will get
there.
And just kind of sometimes youjust hang on and you just get
(25:30):
through it.
You know, and I think too, itjust reminds me too of so many
of those days that are.
You know, we know that maybeyou know there's a death
anniversary or a birthday orwhatever it is that we're
encountering.
You know, remember, brad, whenwe heard the story about a
culture that when someone dies,everybody in the village moves
(25:54):
their furniture around.
Brad Quillen (25:55):
So it's never the same again.
Erin Nelson (25:57):
It's never the same again and I think, as a griever
kind of what you're looking forsometimes is that, when your
whole life has changed and yourholidays have changed, that
there's some kind ofacknowledgement with other
people, and sometimes you haveto put that out there just to
say, hey, would you just join mein, like, lighting a candle in
(26:18):
memory of this person, just bewith me, just send me a little
photo of that, or maybe you cango visit the grave together or
you know, whatever it is, Ithink knowing someone is holding
this experience with you, thenewness of facing a holiday
without your person, how thatcan feel, just having others
(26:39):
with you and really reaching outfor extra support, is really
important as you face these days.
Brad Quillen (26:45):
The holidays add hypervigilance to that.
There's other seasons that wefeel that too, like around the
death date and those things too.
Erin Nelson (26:54):
Or I've had adults tell me, you know, April 1st to
the middle of May, you know, isreally hard and so I need extra
help and support and to takepeople up on those offers and
those seasons too extra supportis sometimes really needed and
just to have someone you knowyou can call on or somebody that
will come sit with you, orsomebody if you are wrapping a
(27:15):
gift, they're going to just comespend that time with you.
So you just don't feel theburden of it alone.
And you know so much of thetime you know the parents are
the ones that have to make themagic happen.
That can feel really heavy ifyou're doing that without your
child or you have an emptystocking or your spouse or
partner is no longer here.
(27:36):
It can just feel like a lot.
So as you look towards thatfuture, first of all just
knowing like you will getthrough it.
Right, you're going to getthrough it.
It won't always feel the way itdoes right now, like we kind of
talked about, but just knowthat you'll get through it
breath by breath.
Brad Quillen (27:55):
Yeah, back to that minute by minute.
Erin Nelson (27:57):
15 minute segment hour by hour, day by day, but
spring will come Spring willcome, spring will come, spring
will come.
Brad Quillen (28:05):
We say something often around Jessica's house and
it's that idea of trust yourinner gut with your family.
Erin Nelson (28:13):
Just that inner wisdom that we have, yeah, that,
even if we don't know right now, today, as we're kind of
thinking of being in thisOctober season, that we will
have the wisdom that we need aswe go along into these longer
nights, these shorter days, theholidays, whatever it is, that
(28:36):
we have the capacity to heal,that we can continue to do this
and that we will find what weneed.
Brad Quillen (28:44):
And there's the reality of the days get shorter
and it's darker out, and forsome the holidays are
metaphorically a darker time.
Erin Nelson (28:53):
Yeah.
Brad Quillen (28:53):
And you've talked about that in previous episodes
of the dark will hold you.
Erin Nelson (28:58):
Yeah, Just feeling that.
You know, I mentioned beforeabout just texting a friend
after the loss of Carter, whohad my friend had also lost her
daughter and just saying I feellike I'm just falling into the
abyss.
And she texted back veryquickly the darkness will hold
you.
And when I think about thatpicture, I think about just kind
(29:20):
of being down.
I did spend some time doingsome dives like scuba diving,
and I just think about like whenyou're down there, you're in
the deep but you have this likelittle kind of glimmer of like
the sun is like coming throughthere's like a beam coming
through, there's like a beam,yeah, and just trusting that, as
you're down there, that youwill.
(29:42):
You have the light.
There is a place that we canjust hang on to, that you can
trust will get you through andthat you'll be able to come back
up to the surface again.
Brad Quillen (29:55):
And sometimes it feels very, very slow coming up
to the surface.
Yeah it does To that beam.
Erin Nelson (30:02):
Especially during the surface.
Yeah, it does To that beam,especially during the holidays.
Brad Quillen (30:04):
Yeah, and there are some ways that that we can
add some beams of light in thedark and calling.
I know we've talked about thisbefore, but just some of those
fall comforts, like we'refoodies around Jessica's house
and that's one of them, and I'mnot going to give the others
away and take your thunder, butwhat are some of those other
ones that you think of, orthings that families have taught
(30:25):
you over the years of ways wecan add comfort when it feels
like we're in that dark?
Colleen Montague (30:31):
For me personally, I love candles.
I love the flicker of the lightand the warmth that it gives
off, but during the spring andsummer I don't really light them
around the house.
It's too hot and you don'tactually notice the flame among
the light.
Brad Quillen (30:44):
It's too bright in the house.
Colleen Montague (30:45):
It's too bright All those things yeah.
And so in the fall and winter Iget very excited and light all
the candles and so that justbrings me comfort.
It's such a small little way.
It also just anchors me tobeing home.
It's what I do right when I gethome is light candles and then
get in those comfies, get outthat big warm blanket.
(31:10):
Like you mentioned, making agood stew or stopping by the
store and buying it and thenjust putting it in your pot at
home and and enjoying the smellsand the comforts it brings.
But just what little comfortscan you bring into your home and
to yourself during those darkwinter months that maybe aren't
there or aren't as helpful inthe other seasons?
What would you add, erin?
Erin Nelson (31:30):
I just like this idea.
It's, you know, because we knowgrief has a way of slowing us
down.
It's really kind of matchingour natural rhythm of being, of
grieving.
It's kind of that winteringidea, and sometimes it invites
us and then we can just, yeah,add those little lights.
And I know we heard about aparent who, just like, put
little fairy lights around theirchildren's bed and just added
(31:53):
little lights here and there,little lamps in the corner, and
that's what they needed.
Brad Quillen (31:58):
And so, listening to what you need, yeah, I've
heard fireplace, you know, I'veheard the crock pot is like the
go-to, that home stew kind ofwarm meal, music, but yeah, a
lot of candles and the warmdrinks in the winter.
That kind of bring that comfortfor families over the years.
(32:19):
Well, erin and Colleen, thankyou for today and thank you that
are listening for being here.
If you have any questions orfuture ideas for us, you can
email us at info atjessicashouseorg, or for more
resources.
You can find those on ourwebsite at jessicashouseorg.
Be sure to join us next timefor another episode of when
(32:39):
Grief Comes Home, where we'lldiscuss ceremonies and funerals.
Until then, we wish you well.
Gary Shriver (32:48):
Jessica's House is a children's bereavement center
located in California's CentralValley since 2012.
We provide free peer supportfor children, teens, young
adults and their familiesgrieving a loss.
If you need grief-relatedsupport, please visit
jessicashouseorg to download ourfree resources and be sure to
(33:09):
follow Jessica's House on socialmedia, and if you have any
questions or topics you'd likefor us to explore in future
episodes, just send us an emailto jessicashouseorg.
Thank you for joining us andwe'll see you next time, for
when Grief Comes Home.
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