April 17, 2023 • 23 mins
“I tell all my buddies, if you tried VA 10 years ago like I did, try us again.” Is the VA a waste of time? Can it really provide the services and care you need? John Boerstler, Chief Veterans Experience Officer at the U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs, joins the podcast to share just how much the VA has expanded, evolved, and modernized post-9/11 to better listen to veterans and respond to meet their unique needs.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Yeah, I tell all my buddies, if he tried VA 10 years ago, like I did try us again.
(00:08):
You're listening to the Justice for Vets podcast when thank you is not enough.
Hosted by retired Major General Butch Tate, this podcast is made possible with funding
from the Bureau of Justice Assistance.
Hi, this is Butch Tate.
I'm the Chief Counsel for the National Association of Drug Court Professionals.
(00:28):
Justice for Vets is one of the divisions of our organization.
I'm pleased to be your host for this episode of our podcast when thank you is not enough.
In this episode entitled Sharing our Lived Experience, we're going to explore the various
resources and services available from the VA to support our veterans who may find themselves
(00:49):
in need of either services or support.
We had the pleasure of speaking with Laura Felton, who's the director of the Milwaukee
Vet Center, and I'll turn this over to John Borsler in a minute, our current guest.
But I just got to tell you, Laura did a great job of explaining what a Vet Center is, what
she does, how the services are made available.
(01:09):
It couldn't have been better.
And I have the same high expectation of today's guest, which is Mr. John Borsler, who is the
Chief Veterans Experience Officer.
I'm going to let John talk about his background in a minute.
And although it's a really fancy title, quite appropriate for a guy in his position, I described
(01:32):
John Borsler as just a good dude who's the right person in the right place.
And I've said that the audience is before, and maybe that resonates more than just the
fancy title that the government has given him, but he's a good dude who has committed
his professional life to the service of his fellow veterans.
John, welcome to the podcast.
(01:53):
We're grateful to have you.
And I'd like you just to share a little bit about your background so that the listeners
know who they're hearing from.
No, thanks so much for having me, butch.
It's awesome to be on.
And hopefully I don't embarrass you too much or spoil the reputation of this great podcast
over there.
But it is great to be on.
(02:15):
And I appreciate also the good dude title.
I like that one better than any.
And I think it does resonate with me and I think it resembles you too.
It's great to be with you again.
But I joined the Marine Corps like a lot of us.
I joined the military at a very young age and served in the Marine Corps for about eight
(02:37):
years, both active in reserve time.
Went overseas a few times from the years of 1999 to 2007 and really, I think, benefited
from that experience and in many different ways.
Like many folks, I didn't know exactly what I wanted to do when I got out because I planned
to make the Marine Corps career, but due to some physical limitations that were impressed
(03:02):
upon me by that combat service and harder, more difficult infantry service, I was given
the distinct opportunity to not continue my service by the Marine Corps, which is very
cut and dry about these types of things, as we all know.
And instead given an opportunity to serve as a staffer on a member of Congress staff,
(03:24):
so a congressional staff.
And from there, I had to really see the gaps in all the different services, both at the
state, federal, local levels, and really better understood the systems approach to how we
serve veterans not only here at the national level, but down in the communities they return
to.
As you mentioned, that really kicked off the rest of my career at the various points of
(03:49):
local government.
I worked for the two mayors of Houston, helping them design their reintegration strategies
as one of the biggest destinations for Iraq and Afghanistan.
But in the last 20 years, and then helped start a couple of different organizations
that really acted as the funnel for not only Houston, but the whole state of Texas eventually
(04:10):
and created a technology platform to connect these returning service members and their
families to the social determinants of help that help make their lives much more successful
when they reintegrate.
And then found myself being reached out to by the Biden-Harris administration when they
were about to take office here about two years ago and gave me the opportunity to interview.
(04:35):
And over the next two months and nine interviews later, I was given the opportunity to serve
as the third chief veterans experience officer here as the leader of the Veterans Experience
Office here at the Department of Veterans Affairs.
And so now I've been here almost two years.
This whole thing started about two years ago.
And it's been an incredible experience just being able to connect with guys like Butch
(04:59):
and other leaders, subject matter experts in the field.
Thanks, John.
So you certainly have the street cred for the job, but having the cred and living up
to it is kind of another thing.
And I'm going to ask you to sort of go into some detail, if you would, please, on what
your current job involves and then kind of what surprised you most about the role you've
(05:25):
been given to take on.
Yeah.
So we cover down on quite a lot.
We are what you call a staff office here at VA.
So the way that VA is broken up is like you have the three administrations, the health
administration, the benefits administration, and the cemetery administration.
And then you have a number of staff offices.
So all three of those administrations are led by undersecretaries.
(05:46):
Then you have a number of staff offices that are led by assistant secretaries.
And they are really the kind of supportive glue in between the administrations at the
enterprise level.
So the Veterans Experience Office is one of those staff offices, but we're charged with
really taking the voice of the customer, the voice of the veteran and their families via
(06:06):
a ton of different modalities.
And I can go through a lot of the different customer channels that we use to deliver that
voice to the customer, to really serve as the insights engine for the secretary and
other senior leaders to make strategic level decisions that impact the millions of veterans
that we serve every year.
And so that's really our charge.
(06:26):
We do that in a variety of ways, whether that's understanding the quantitative and the qualitative
data.
So quantitative data, lots of survey data on measuring the experience, whether that's
an outpatient visit at one of our hospitals or a vet center.
And you mentioned vet centers earlier, a visit to one of our vet centers.
Or you're experiencing getting a home loan guarantee or education benefits, most of
(06:49):
them in GI Bill, for example.
Just trying to measure all of that information or all those experiences and then relay in
order to improve the way that these programs are delivered and improve the way that veterans
experience them.
On the qualitative side is we're interviewing veterans.
So like one-on-one, like we're doing right now, but I'm asking you about your experience
(07:11):
interacting with VA along your customer journey and you're giving me the pain points, the
bright spots, the moments that matter, that really can reveal a lot of different insights
about how to improve these different programs that a quantitative survey would never reveal.
So it's pretty neat that we have a pretty robust human center design practice here,
(07:31):
largest in federal government.
And I think it's shown in the way that we've improved in the last seven years.
We also have the ability to improve the digital and the mobile experience.
And we work at our partners in the IT section of VA to build mobile applications, improve
the digital experience when navigating programs and services on VA.gov, our single front door
(07:52):
for the digital side.
We also own and operate a 1-800-MIA411, which is the telephonic single front door and access
to the enterprise.
So we measure the voice of the customer in a variety of different ways, a variety of
different channels through partnerships or the rest of the administration and are continuing
(08:14):
to grow based on the incredible demand placed on us by the administration's and staff offices
that serve veterans and their families every day.
So in terms of what surprised me the most or what I think what has been one of the greatest
learning opportunities for me is not the scale.
(08:35):
I think I had a good idea of like what the scale was here at VA, but just the incredible
amount of talent that this department has at its disposal and how much progress has
been really been made in the last seven years.
And it really made me think back to when I first saw that first journey map in 2015
(08:57):
when it was published under Secretary McDonald, to where we are now with 50 plus other different
iterations of that, basically measuring each experience with each different business line
and seeing the trust scores go up in concert over the last seven years.
It's pretty incredible what VA has accomplished and not just at the enterprise level, but
(09:18):
down to the medical center and the clinic and the vet center, the cemetery and the regional
office level in the field at 1200, 1500 different locations across the country.
So I think that was one of the biggest surprises to me is just how effective this place really
is given the sheer scale that it operates in every day.
(09:40):
And I think you and I both realize that those increased scores, those high numbers are the
result of a whole lot of work.
It just doesn't happen, which kind of leads me to sort of my first question that I think
relates to the space I'm working in now.
And so let's say I'm that veteran sitting at home and I hear you what you're saying
(10:02):
to me, how do I get my experience to you?
I know you're on the road all the time, but you can't be everywhere at the same time.
How can I get my experience to you to let you then act upon it to affect change?
Yeah, I would say take your service.
I mean, the service or the the single, I think best way to relay how you feel about
(10:30):
your experience at the local facility level, that those facility leaders are looking at
day in and day out and then making adjustments, following up on the comments left in the free
text boxes, making sure that veterans do have a world class experience.
And if they're not, let us know.
But I do every facility I've been to really uses that modality essentially to track and
(10:57):
better understand the needs of their customers.
So that's really important to know that those surveys, we get them all the time, whether
it's a shopping experience, whether it's a dining experience, car rental, I can't go
on a trip without, you know, getting half a dozen emails afterwards.
And I just don't take the time because I'm not confident anybody will look.
I think it's important to hear that.
Yeah, there's a person on the other end of that survey, reviewing what the veteran has
(11:21):
input to the system.
I appreciate you sharing that with everyone.
Absolutely.
And what it certainly is at least one person, maybe many people reading that feedback and
understanding that feedback and then taking it and improving using it to improve the process.
There are also many other different listening channels we have, whether that's getting involved
in your local community veteran engagement board, which really serves as kind of the
(11:45):
community voice at the local level that partnered up with the VA medical centers and the regional
offices to give to give them those insights.
We have VetXL Q&A town halls hosted every month.
And those can range from hundreds of thousands of people tuning in to just a few hundred,
depending on the customer personas we're trying to reach out to, whether that's women veterans
(12:07):
or LGBTQ plus veterans or minority veterans or, you know, Vietnam veterans or Gulf War
veterans, veterans that are impacted by the PACT Act and the benefits and care that they're
now afforded under the 23 new presented commit conditions.
There's something always going on, so you can check out va.gov slash vet resources,
join our e-newsletter, give us feedback on that as well, but stay tuned to all the different
(12:31):
ways that you can interact with VA on a weekly basis.
Thanks, John.
You know, and I've got three other areas I want to ask your thoughts on before I let
you go back to the greatness of Washington, DC.
As you know, the VJO program, Veterans Justice Outreach Program, is a project near and dear
to me because I think it's one of the highlights of the VA and is so important to ensuring
(12:56):
veterans treatment courts deliver what they need to deliver, which is full spectrum support
to the veterans recovery.
Could you share a little bit about how the VA supports veterans treatment courts, certainly
through the VJO program and any other thoughts you might have on how the VA is part of making
those courts work?
Yeah, I think it is truly one of the best programs, as you mentioned.
(13:19):
There's always opportunity for additional help and resources for a lot of these, the
VJO teammates that are out in the field because not every county has the benefit of starting
a treatment court or a veterans treatment court.
So those that do, of course, they're now integrated with VA.
(13:40):
And so throughout that customer journey was in itself as its own journey map when a veteran
engages in the criminal justice system and has the good fortune of being invited into
one of these veteran treatment courts, they are in tandem working with our caseworkers,
social workers, clinicians at the VA medical center in that area or the community-based
(14:07):
outclout patient clinic in that area.
And then those individuals dedicated to that veteran success and not only reducing the
recidivism of that case, but also making sure that they're connected into the broad range
of VA health and mental health services in addition to the social determinants of health
and what's outside the four walls of VA, whether they need additional and legal or employment
(14:31):
or food or transportation resources, they really thrive, I think, in addressing a lot
of those health-related social needs that many other programs haven't really figured
out yet.
So I really kind of think that in terms of how VA can take a page out of the VJO success
story and the broader success story of veteran treatment courts across the country is that
(14:56):
we need to do more to better arm our clinicians and our staff with the ability to connect
veterans that far before they get engaged in the criminal justice system or get into
trouble and make sure that we're preventing a lot of these negative health and economic
outcomes from occurring by ensuring that they're enrolled in healthcare, by ensuring that they
(15:17):
have access to their earned benefits and care, by ensuring that we can connect them to community
resources and social services that get them to the next appointment so that they can prevent
that from ever happening.
But when it does, and if it does, which in many cases it does not, but in the cases that
we're talking about, the VJO program really, really excels at making sure that these veterans
(15:40):
have a wonderful customer experience and are focused on the rest of their lives.
And I know the VJOs are on your radar screen.
I know for a fact that they're on the secretary's radar screen.
And while it's kind of a plug for that program and for the men and women who are in it, my
question really was a plug for all the veterans who understand there's somebody there in that
(16:04):
courtroom who will connect them to all the other VA services and sometimes even to community
services.
So thanks for your comments on that.
I hope I can ask you two more areas here to get your thoughts on.
This is kind of a thought question here and not something off the website.
But I really want to appeal to our veterans who haven't made that step yet to reach out
(16:29):
for support.
But I also want to talk to the vets who are in a position to help that veteran who might
be reluctant.
So any thoughts you could share on what vets can do to help others who might be reluctant
to reach out to the VA for help?
Yeah, I tell all my buddies, if you tried VA 10 years ago, like I did try this again.
(16:50):
I've been a customer for many years now, but now I'm a full-time patient.
So I don't have any private sector health insurance anymore.
I only use VA by choice because it is incredibly convenient.
They understand my needs.
I think I have had better health outcomes with the VA system than I have on the outside,
(17:16):
to be honest with you, because of that cultural competency around military service and around
veteran, what ails us, particularly us, broken infantrymen that need to go to the physical
therapists more often than not these days.
But I would say that the Lance Corporal Underground and the E4 Mafia, we need to really engage
(17:37):
that population and what we call the untethered veterans that are not yet connected to their
care and benefits that they have earned, particularly because of the signing into law of the PACT
Act, the promise to address comprehensive toxics.
So anyone who has been exposed to toxic toxins like Agent Orange or Burn Pits or depleted
(18:02):
uranium or other different toxins, whether you're served in Vietnam, the Gulf War, or
Iraq and Afghanistan, could come to VA, get a screening done.
It only takes five minutes out of your day, and then you can get connected to benefits
and care that you have earned that previously we were not eligible for.
And so if you go to va.gov.com, you can see all the different presumptive conditions now
(18:25):
that you may have and you may have symptoms for, and I would really encourage a lot of
veterans to re-engage with us at that point, because it is a world-class experience.
And I really answered my, what was going to be my final question as well, which is for
that, for that vet, I think you know that my father was a Vietnam veteran to combat
(18:45):
tours generation, he went on to serve a career, but a lot of soldiers around him, we just
didn't trust the VA, wouldn't file for their benefits because they couldn't trust where
the records are going.
And so, you know, I guess I'll go ahead and ask it anyway, John, but because I think you'll
have some good thoughts on it.
It's just that idea that, look, I know what my uncle told me, my father told me about
(19:06):
the VA, so I just don't trust those guys, but help me reach that veteran who might still
be working under that old notion that don't waste your time.
And I mean, I love your comment about, if you tried us 10 years ago, try us again.
That's powerful.
I'm thinking about getting some t-shirts made for you and me to show that slogan off.
(19:28):
But any other thoughts you could offer to encourage that veteran who just give us a chance to
trust us?
Absolutely.
And I think the, with the pandemic, you know, really ramped up the capabilities around
telehealth and video health.
So if you're, you know, a working family or you have trouble accessing during working
(19:50):
hours in particular, you can use that option.
I've taken many appointments from this office that I'm in currently here at VA Central Office
to make sure that I'm addressing the care that I need and not having to go in every
single time.
But for only those instances where it requires a one-on-one with my clinician or with the
staff that I need to meet with, for the many women veterans that are, which are women veterans
(20:15):
are our fastest growing population of customers right now.
And I think that that is because of the incredible efforts of that our women's clinics have
made in making sure that they have a wonderful experience coming into the facility through
the women's clinic entrances and then utilizing telehealth and virtual health to make sure
(20:37):
that we meet their needs.
And we've seen the levels of trust really go up in the last few years, particularly around
telecare and telehealth care and virtual care because it's so much more convenient for women
veterans and their families.
For other, you know, for minority veterans, for LGBTQ plus veterans, we are, we hear you,
(20:58):
we are redesigning a lot of our services based around the pain points that you have relayed
to us, similarly on the rural veterans and Native American veterans in particular that
have a tremendous amount of difficulty accessing some of our facilities just due to the sheer
distance away from you.
We are, we are, we are thinking about new ways to bring those services closer to you
(21:22):
on making sure you're better connected into the VA system so that you can get the care
and the benefits that you have so rightly earned.
So that's, you know, the numbers don't lie, but you mean, do you look at 2015 or 2016,
we did our first kind of quarterly VA trust survey, we're at 55% trust across the board.
(21:46):
Today we're at 77%, which is, if you think about net promoter scores in the private sector,
USAA is at a 78% you know, point, you know, net promoter score.
So if we think about trust in a very similar way, we're doing pretty good.
We have a long way to go, we have a lot of improvements to make, but we can only do that
if we have folks enrolling that aren't enrolled and giving us that feedback on how to improve
(22:11):
the process and the programs for them and better understanding and addressing their
needs.
Hey John, thanks very much.
You never disappoint and you never disappoint not just by what you say, but the actions
that you take as a follow on to that.
So I thank you for being a part of our podcast.
I hope I've given you the opportunity to demonstrate to others why I believe you to be a good dude
(22:34):
who's in the right place at the right time making a difference.
So I encourage our vets take to heart what John said.
If nothing else you take from this, that there are people at the other end of these surveys,
there are people who respond to the inquiries, there are people whose job, but more importantly
their passion is to make a difference in the life of our veterans.
So take that to heart.
(22:56):
Take John Borsler heart because he's making a difference.
John, thanks to you for your time today.
Thanks to your VA team.
Thanks for all the impact you're having on our veterans and I appreciate you being with
us.
Thanks.
Thanks very much Butch.
I appreciate it too.
This has been the Justice for Vets podcast when thank you is not enough.
Hosted by retired Major General Butch Tate.
(23:18):
This podcast is made possible with funding from the Bureau of Justice Assistance.
Thanks for listening.
Yeah, I tell all my buddies, if he tried VA 10 years ago, like I did try us again.
(00:08):
You're listening to the Justice for Vets podcast when thank you is not enough.
Hosted by retired Major General Butch Tate, this podcast is made possible with funding
from the Bureau of Justice Assistance.
Hi, this is Butch Tate.
I'm the Chief Counsel for the National Association of Drug Court Professionals.
(00:28):
Justice for Vets is one of the divisions of our organization.
I'm pleased to be your host for this episode of our podcast when thank you is not enough.
In this episode entitled Sharing our Lived Experience, we're going to explore the various
resources and services available from the VA to support our veterans who may find themselves
(00:49):
in need of either services or support.
We had the pleasure of speaking with Laura Felton, who's the director of the Milwaukee
Vet Center, and I'll turn this over to John Borsler in a minute, our current guest.
But I just got to tell you, Laura did a great job of explaining what a Vet Center is, what
she does, how the services are made available.
(01:09):
It couldn't have been better.
And I have the same high expectation of today's guest, which is Mr. John Borsler, who is the
Chief Veterans Experience Officer.
I'm going to let John talk about his background in a minute.
And although it's a really fancy title, quite appropriate for a guy in his position, I described
(01:32):
John Borsler as just a good dude who's the right person in the right place.
And I've said that the audience is before, and maybe that resonates more than just the
fancy title that the government has given him, but he's a good dude who has committed
his professional life to the service of his fellow veterans.
John, welcome to the podcast.
(01:53):
We're grateful to have you.
And I'd like you just to share a little bit about your background so that the listeners
know who they're hearing from.
No, thanks so much for having me, butch.
It's awesome to be on.
And hopefully I don't embarrass you too much or spoil the reputation of this great podcast
over there.
But it is great to be on.
(02:15):
And I appreciate also the good dude title.
I like that one better than any.
And I think it does resonate with me and I think it resembles you too.
It's great to be with you again.
But I joined the Marine Corps like a lot of us.
I joined the military at a very young age and served in the Marine Corps for about eight
(02:37):
years, both active in reserve time.
Went overseas a few times from the years of 1999 to 2007 and really, I think, benefited
from that experience and in many different ways.
Like many folks, I didn't know exactly what I wanted to do when I got out because I planned
to make the Marine Corps career, but due to some physical limitations that were impressed
(03:02):
upon me by that combat service and harder, more difficult infantry service, I was given
the distinct opportunity to not continue my service by the Marine Corps, which is very
cut and dry about these types of things, as we all know.
And instead given an opportunity to serve as a staffer on a member of Congress staff,
(03:24):
so a congressional staff.
And from there, I had to really see the gaps in all the different services, both at the
state, federal, local levels, and really better understood the systems approach to how we
serve veterans not only here at the national level, but down in the communities they return
to.
As you mentioned, that really kicked off the rest of my career at the various points of
(03:49):
local government.
I worked for the two mayors of Houston, helping them design their reintegration strategies
as one of the biggest destinations for Iraq and Afghanistan.
But in the last 20 years, and then helped start a couple of different organizations
that really acted as the funnel for not only Houston, but the whole state of Texas eventually
(04:10):
and created a technology platform to connect these returning service members and their
families to the social determinants of help that help make their lives much more successful
when they reintegrate.
And then found myself being reached out to by the Biden-Harris administration when they
were about to take office here about two years ago and gave me the opportunity to interview.
(04:35):
And over the next two months and nine interviews later, I was given the opportunity to serve
as the third chief veterans experience officer here as the leader of the Veterans Experience
Office here at the Department of Veterans Affairs.
And so now I've been here almost two years.
This whole thing started about two years ago.
And it's been an incredible experience just being able to connect with guys like Butch
(04:59):
and other leaders, subject matter experts in the field.
Thanks, John.
So you certainly have the street cred for the job, but having the cred and living up
to it is kind of another thing.
And I'm going to ask you to sort of go into some detail, if you would, please, on what
your current job involves and then kind of what surprised you most about the role you've
(05:25):
been given to take on.
Yeah.
So we cover down on quite a lot.
We are what you call a staff office here at VA.
So the way that VA is broken up is like you have the three administrations, the health
administration, the benefits administration, and the cemetery administration.
And then you have a number of staff offices.
So all three of those administrations are led by undersecretaries.
(05:46):
Then you have a number of staff offices that are led by assistant secretaries.
And they are really the kind of supportive glue in between the administrations at the
enterprise level.
So the Veterans Experience Office is one of those staff offices, but we're charged with
really taking the voice of the customer, the voice of the veteran and their families via
(06:06):
a ton of different modalities.
And I can go through a lot of the different customer channels that we use to deliver that
voice to the customer, to really serve as the insights engine for the secretary and
other senior leaders to make strategic level decisions that impact the millions of veterans
that we serve every year.
And so that's really our charge.
(06:26):
We do that in a variety of ways, whether that's understanding the quantitative and the qualitative
data.
So quantitative data, lots of survey data on measuring the experience, whether that's
an outpatient visit at one of our hospitals or a vet center.
And you mentioned vet centers earlier, a visit to one of our vet centers.
Or you're experiencing getting a home loan guarantee or education benefits, most of
(06:49):
them in GI Bill, for example.
Just trying to measure all of that information or all those experiences and then relay in
order to improve the way that these programs are delivered and improve the way that veterans
experience them.
On the qualitative side is we're interviewing veterans.
So like one-on-one, like we're doing right now, but I'm asking you about your experience
(07:11):
interacting with VA along your customer journey and you're giving me the pain points, the
bright spots, the moments that matter, that really can reveal a lot of different insights
about how to improve these different programs that a quantitative survey would never reveal.
So it's pretty neat that we have a pretty robust human center design practice here,
(07:31):
largest in federal government.
And I think it's shown in the way that we've improved in the last seven years.
We also have the ability to improve the digital and the mobile experience.
And we work at our partners in the IT section of VA to build mobile applications, improve
the digital experience when navigating programs and services on VA.gov, our single front door
(07:52):
for the digital side.
We also own and operate a 1-800-MIA411, which is the telephonic single front door and access
to the enterprise.
So we measure the voice of the customer in a variety of different ways, a variety of
different channels through partnerships or the rest of the administration and are continuing
(08:14):
to grow based on the incredible demand placed on us by the administration's and staff offices
that serve veterans and their families every day.
So in terms of what surprised me the most or what I think what has been one of the greatest
learning opportunities for me is not the scale.
(08:35):
I think I had a good idea of like what the scale was here at VA, but just the incredible
amount of talent that this department has at its disposal and how much progress has
been really been made in the last seven years.
And it really made me think back to when I first saw that first journey map in 2015
(08:57):
when it was published under Secretary McDonald, to where we are now with 50 plus other different
iterations of that, basically measuring each experience with each different business line
and seeing the trust scores go up in concert over the last seven years.
It's pretty incredible what VA has accomplished and not just at the enterprise level, but
(09:18):
down to the medical center and the clinic and the vet center, the cemetery and the regional
office level in the field at 1200, 1500 different locations across the country.
So I think that was one of the biggest surprises to me is just how effective this place really
is given the sheer scale that it operates in every day.
(09:40):
And I think you and I both realize that those increased scores, those high numbers are the
result of a whole lot of work.
It just doesn't happen, which kind of leads me to sort of my first question that I think
relates to the space I'm working in now.
And so let's say I'm that veteran sitting at home and I hear you what you're saying
(10:02):
to me, how do I get my experience to you?
I know you're on the road all the time, but you can't be everywhere at the same time.
How can I get my experience to you to let you then act upon it to affect change?
Yeah, I would say take your service.
I mean, the service or the the single, I think best way to relay how you feel about
(10:30):
your experience at the local facility level, that those facility leaders are looking at
day in and day out and then making adjustments, following up on the comments left in the free
text boxes, making sure that veterans do have a world class experience.
And if they're not, let us know.
But I do every facility I've been to really uses that modality essentially to track and
(10:57):
better understand the needs of their customers.
So that's really important to know that those surveys, we get them all the time, whether
it's a shopping experience, whether it's a dining experience, car rental, I can't go
on a trip without, you know, getting half a dozen emails afterwards.
And I just don't take the time because I'm not confident anybody will look.
I think it's important to hear that.
Yeah, there's a person on the other end of that survey, reviewing what the veteran has
(11:21):
input to the system.
I appreciate you sharing that with everyone.
Absolutely.
And what it certainly is at least one person, maybe many people reading that feedback and
understanding that feedback and then taking it and improving using it to improve the process.
There are also many other different listening channels we have, whether that's getting involved
in your local community veteran engagement board, which really serves as kind of the
(11:45):
community voice at the local level that partnered up with the VA medical centers and the regional
offices to give to give them those insights.
We have VetXL Q&A town halls hosted every month.
And those can range from hundreds of thousands of people tuning in to just a few hundred,
depending on the customer personas we're trying to reach out to, whether that's women veterans
(12:07):
or LGBTQ plus veterans or minority veterans or, you know, Vietnam veterans or Gulf War
veterans, veterans that are impacted by the PACT Act and the benefits and care that they're
now afforded under the 23 new presented commit conditions.
There's something always going on, so you can check out va.gov slash vet resources,
join our e-newsletter, give us feedback on that as well, but stay tuned to all the different
(12:31):
ways that you can interact with VA on a weekly basis.
Thanks, John.
You know, and I've got three other areas I want to ask your thoughts on before I let
you go back to the greatness of Washington, DC.
As you know, the VJO program, Veterans Justice Outreach Program, is a project near and dear
to me because I think it's one of the highlights of the VA and is so important to ensuring
(12:56):
veterans treatment courts deliver what they need to deliver, which is full spectrum support
to the veterans recovery.
Could you share a little bit about how the VA supports veterans treatment courts, certainly
through the VJO program and any other thoughts you might have on how the VA is part of making
those courts work?
Yeah, I think it is truly one of the best programs, as you mentioned.
(13:19):
There's always opportunity for additional help and resources for a lot of these, the
VJO teammates that are out in the field because not every county has the benefit of starting
a treatment court or a veterans treatment court.
So those that do, of course, they're now integrated with VA.
(13:40):
And so throughout that customer journey was in itself as its own journey map when a veteran
engages in the criminal justice system and has the good fortune of being invited into
one of these veteran treatment courts, they are in tandem working with our caseworkers,
social workers, clinicians at the VA medical center in that area or the community-based
(14:07):
outclout patient clinic in that area.
And then those individuals dedicated to that veteran success and not only reducing the
recidivism of that case, but also making sure that they're connected into the broad range
of VA health and mental health services in addition to the social determinants of health
and what's outside the four walls of VA, whether they need additional and legal or employment
(14:31):
or food or transportation resources, they really thrive, I think, in addressing a lot
of those health-related social needs that many other programs haven't really figured
out yet.
So I really kind of think that in terms of how VA can take a page out of the VJO success
story and the broader success story of veteran treatment courts across the country is that
(14:56):
we need to do more to better arm our clinicians and our staff with the ability to connect
veterans that far before they get engaged in the criminal justice system or get into
trouble and make sure that we're preventing a lot of these negative health and economic
outcomes from occurring by ensuring that they're enrolled in healthcare, by ensuring that they
(15:17):
have access to their earned benefits and care, by ensuring that we can connect them to community
resources and social services that get them to the next appointment so that they can prevent
that from ever happening.
But when it does, and if it does, which in many cases it does not, but in the cases that
we're talking about, the VJO program really, really excels at making sure that these veterans
(15:40):
have a wonderful customer experience and are focused on the rest of their lives.
And I know the VJOs are on your radar screen.
I know for a fact that they're on the secretary's radar screen.
And while it's kind of a plug for that program and for the men and women who are in it, my
question really was a plug for all the veterans who understand there's somebody there in that
(16:04):
courtroom who will connect them to all the other VA services and sometimes even to community
services.
So thanks for your comments on that.
I hope I can ask you two more areas here to get your thoughts on.
This is kind of a thought question here and not something off the website.
But I really want to appeal to our veterans who haven't made that step yet to reach out
(16:29):
for support.
But I also want to talk to the vets who are in a position to help that veteran who might
be reluctant.
So any thoughts you could share on what vets can do to help others who might be reluctant
to reach out to the VA for help?
Yeah, I tell all my buddies, if you tried VA 10 years ago, like I did try this again.
(16:50):
I've been a customer for many years now, but now I'm a full-time patient.
So I don't have any private sector health insurance anymore.
I only use VA by choice because it is incredibly convenient.
They understand my needs.
I think I have had better health outcomes with the VA system than I have on the outside,
(17:16):
to be honest with you, because of that cultural competency around military service and around
veteran, what ails us, particularly us, broken infantrymen that need to go to the physical
therapists more often than not these days.
But I would say that the Lance Corporal Underground and the E4 Mafia, we need to really engage
(17:37):
that population and what we call the untethered veterans that are not yet connected to their
care and benefits that they have earned, particularly because of the signing into law of the PACT
Act, the promise to address comprehensive toxics.
So anyone who has been exposed to toxic toxins like Agent Orange or Burn Pits or depleted
(18:02):
uranium or other different toxins, whether you're served in Vietnam, the Gulf War, or
Iraq and Afghanistan, could come to VA, get a screening done.
It only takes five minutes out of your day, and then you can get connected to benefits
and care that you have earned that previously we were not eligible for.
And so if you go to va.gov.com, you can see all the different presumptive conditions now
(18:25):
that you may have and you may have symptoms for, and I would really encourage a lot of
veterans to re-engage with us at that point, because it is a world-class experience.
And I really answered my, what was going to be my final question as well, which is for
that, for that vet, I think you know that my father was a Vietnam veteran to combat
(18:45):
tours generation, he went on to serve a career, but a lot of soldiers around him, we just
didn't trust the VA, wouldn't file for their benefits because they couldn't trust where
the records are going.
And so, you know, I guess I'll go ahead and ask it anyway, John, but because I think you'll
have some good thoughts on it.
It's just that idea that, look, I know what my uncle told me, my father told me about
(19:06):
the VA, so I just don't trust those guys, but help me reach that veteran who might still
be working under that old notion that don't waste your time.
And I mean, I love your comment about, if you tried us 10 years ago, try us again.
That's powerful.
I'm thinking about getting some t-shirts made for you and me to show that slogan off.
(19:28):
But any other thoughts you could offer to encourage that veteran who just give us a chance to
trust us?
Absolutely.
And I think the, with the pandemic, you know, really ramped up the capabilities around
telehealth and video health.
So if you're, you know, a working family or you have trouble accessing during working
(19:50):
hours in particular, you can use that option.
I've taken many appointments from this office that I'm in currently here at VA Central Office
to make sure that I'm addressing the care that I need and not having to go in every
single time.
But for only those instances where it requires a one-on-one with my clinician or with the
staff that I need to meet with, for the many women veterans that are, which are women veterans
(20:15):
are our fastest growing population of customers right now.
And I think that that is because of the incredible efforts of that our women's clinics have
made in making sure that they have a wonderful experience coming into the facility through
the women's clinic entrances and then utilizing telehealth and virtual health to make sure
(20:37):
that we meet their needs.
And we've seen the levels of trust really go up in the last few years, particularly around
telecare and telehealth care and virtual care because it's so much more convenient for women
veterans and their families.
For other, you know, for minority veterans, for LGBTQ plus veterans, we are, we hear you,
(20:58):
we are redesigning a lot of our services based around the pain points that you have relayed
to us, similarly on the rural veterans and Native American veterans in particular that
have a tremendous amount of difficulty accessing some of our facilities just due to the sheer
distance away from you.
We are, we are, we are thinking about new ways to bring those services closer to you
(21:22):
on making sure you're better connected into the VA system so that you can get the care
and the benefits that you have so rightly earned.
So that's, you know, the numbers don't lie, but you mean, do you look at 2015 or 2016,
we did our first kind of quarterly VA trust survey, we're at 55% trust across the board.
(21:46):
Today we're at 77%, which is, if you think about net promoter scores in the private sector,
USAA is at a 78% you know, point, you know, net promoter score.
So if we think about trust in a very similar way, we're doing pretty good.
We have a long way to go, we have a lot of improvements to make, but we can only do that
if we have folks enrolling that aren't enrolled and giving us that feedback on how to improve
(22:11):
the process and the programs for them and better understanding and addressing their
needs.
Hey John, thanks very much.
You never disappoint and you never disappoint not just by what you say, but the actions
that you take as a follow on to that.
So I thank you for being a part of our podcast.
I hope I've given you the opportunity to demonstrate to others why I believe you to be a good dude
(22:34):
who's in the right place at the right time making a difference.
So I encourage our vets take to heart what John said.
If nothing else you take from this, that there are people at the other end of these surveys,
there are people who respond to the inquiries, there are people whose job, but more importantly
their passion is to make a difference in the life of our veterans.
So take that to heart.
(22:56):
Take John Borsler heart because he's making a difference.
John, thanks to you for your time today.
Thanks to your VA team.
Thanks for all the impact you're having on our veterans and I appreciate you being with
us.
Thanks.
Thanks very much Butch.
I appreciate it too.
This has been the Justice for Vets podcast when thank you is not enough.
Hosted by retired Major General Butch Tate.
(23:18):
This podcast is made possible with funding from the Bureau of Justice Assistance.
Thanks for listening.
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