January 23, 2025 • 34 mins
Thanks to Author Natalia Williams for joining me to talk about her latest release, Two to Tango.
Natalia's Books:
- Two to Tango (available on KU)
- Taking the Cake (available on KU)
Follow Natalia:
For links to the books discussed in this episode, click the link here to take you to the Google Doc to view the list.
For episode feedback, future reading and author recommendations, you can text the podcast by clicking the "Send us a message button" above.
For more, follow along on Instagram @whereileftoffpod.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
welcome back.
I'm krista balls and you'relistening to where I left off, a
bookish podcast, and today I amjoined again by the author of
taking the cake, nataliawilliams, and we are talking
about her latest release,tootatango.
Thank, thank you for comingback, natalia.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Oh, thank you for having me, I love being here.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
Oh, I'm so glad you got to come back.
I can't wait to talk about Twoto Tango.
Oh man, I just just finished it, so it's fresh, it's super
fresh.
So, first, what are youcurrently reading?
And if you're not reallyreading a lot right now, because
you're kind of writing, uh,which authors inspire you?
Speaker 2 (00:53):
this question is so hard.
I feel like since I've startedwriting, reading has become so
tricky.
I it's, it's like the worst.
Um, when I finished Tutu Tangoand then I, like you know it was
out, I thought I would givemyself a couple months of a
break and just like readeverything that I've been
wanting to read and I've donelike none of it, which is just
(01:16):
it's been so hard.
Um, I am like halfway throughthe Other Side of Disappearing
by Kate Claiborne.
I don't know if you've read ituh-uh, I haven't read it um
podcast like related, but it'sand I started this like I don't
even know, like a month ago.
At this point it's very good.
(01:37):
It's not the book, it's me.
I'm like halfway through andit's just been sitting there and
I've been so busy that Ihaven't been able to pick it
back up.
Um.
And then I've also like just tokind of read some stuff.
I've been doing the um, likethe kindle short stories, like
those collections.
You know those, yes, yeah.
So I did like the murdermystery ones.
They were super cute.
And then I've been doing someof like the christmasy ones
(02:00):
which I'm like halfway through,one of those like I can't even
get through that, like that'show insane it's been.
So I've been doing that.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
That's what I've been reading sometimes you just have
to kind of be in the middle ofa bunch of different books at
once.
I know that, yeah, that's you.
Speaker 2 (02:16):
That is not.
I am such a like one book at atime person, but lately it's
like my attention span is allover the place, that I've just
been doing a couple things at atime, which is okay, but not my,
not ideal welcome to the darkside, where we read a bunch of
two is the max.
(02:36):
Two is the max, that's it.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
I I'm not reading six anymore.
I think I'm down to like four,maybe four.
So you know I'm getting.
I'm getting down to Okay Upprogress.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
I mean, what's your method?
Do you like alternate days?
Do you do like pay like achapter of each book a day?
Like what's the method?
Speaker 1 (02:59):
Okay, this is going to really probably stress you
out, but yeah well, okay, sobasically what I'll do is I have
books normally that are like myfocus, you know, and they're
what I'm really working on, andthen some that are kind of in
the back burner, like I startedthem and for some reason
something else came up that Ineeded to start library book arc
(03:22):
.
What have you?
Whatever the reason is, theseare now my focus.
So what I'll do is I'll takeall the books that are my quote
unquote focus and I will readlike a couple chapters a day,
like I will set alarms.
If I go to read and let's say Ihave 30 minutes, I'll set like
15 minutes for one book and thenI have to put it down when the
(03:42):
15 minutes is up and then pickup the other one for the other
15 minutes, and so you know what?
Speaker 2 (03:47):
maybe that's what I should try a little more yeah
yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
so then it's like you're reading little bits at a
time and then you instantly kindof switch to another one.
But it helps keep your focusbecause all of that like I
cannot do this.
If they were all the same genre, so I have like fantasy,
thriller, romance.
And if they're like the samegenre, so I have like fantasy,
thriller, romance.
And if they're like I have twofantasies but one's dark
academia and one's urban fantasy, or like the romance, one super
(04:12):
happy rom-com and one's alittle bit more heartfelt and
deep.
So they can't be like similarplot lines or the same thing.
They have to be completelydifferent, otherwise my brain
could not differentiate all ofthose at once.
Yeah Right, I mean, that wasgoing to be completely different
, otherwise my brain could notdifferentiate all of those at
once.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
Yeah, right, I mean that was going to be my question
like if you're reading threethrillers like that's, that's a
hard.
Yeah, you can't do that.
Everything would get mixed up,okay yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:35):
so it has to be different genre and also kind of
different sub-genre to keep upwith it.
And yeah, I literally will justswitch between and pick up
multiple books and I have themall sitting right next to me and
I just read a couple, read acouple, but but maybe that's the
answer.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
Maybe that's the answer I mean.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
I mean now.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
Now we're just going to like sidetrack into like all
this stuff.
But you know, there's all thesearticles that have come out
about like how our attentionspan is so awful, just you know
social media and doom scrollingand all these things, and so I
feel like that has been an issuewith like my reading too.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
But if I, you know, read eight books at a time, it
works Exactly and it's like onceyou start doing it it's really
hard to stop.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
So I've had to tell myself now that I'm down to four
, said no, you are not pickingup another book until you clear
these out and then you can start, you know I mean maybe that's
picking up a couple right andthen the library holds, come in
and then I mean I can't tell youhow many I've just like renewed
and then have to return.
I'm like I can't read thisright now, but maybe I should.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
Yeah, exactly.
And you go there and you'relike hey, this looks really good
.
What if, on the off chance, Icould read it?
I should just go ahead andcheck it out anyway.
And then it just stares at you.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
Right, I know, and then it just sits there.
I'm like I'm so sorry, but youknow, but at least checking it
out helps, right.
Speaker 1 (06:00):
Exactly.
Yeah, it helps the library,helps the librarian, helps the
author.
So, yeah, I mean it all works.
Yeah, exactly, you still win,even though you're not reading
it.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
Yeah, I know, oh, that's.
I mean maybe Not like you haveto read a certain book, kind of
book club.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
And the theme of it was us going yeah, that's on my
TBR.
Yeah, I want to read that.
Yeah, I haven't read that andit would be like a really
popular book.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Yeah, I heard that's good.
Oh my God, that's it, that's me, oh geez.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
Yep, oh, geez, yep.
And then half of us were justlike, yeah, no, I haven't.
I haven't yet, but it's on mylist.
It was like one person broughtthe second book in ACOTAR and
half of us were like, yeah,that's on our list, but we
haven't read it.
We know, we know that we should.
And then another was like Allthe Light, we.
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Cannot See and we're like, yeah, yeah, we've heard a
lot about that.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
We still haven't read it, but it's there so, yeah,
yeah, there were a lot that yep.
It was all of us just doingthat.
Speaker 2 (07:10):
That's the common theme.
I love that.
That's the book club for me.
Yeah, I know.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
I know, yeah, so it's not just us.
It's not just us at all.
Just pop on down to Texas andyou can.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
oh my, gosh, I love that.
Yeah, that's so funny sorealistically.
That's what happened oh, it'sjust, it's so hard, it's so yeah
, I don't know.
I don't know if life's gettingbusier, or I mean, yes, but or
it's just.
You know that, like withwriting, like it's, it's, it's
(07:47):
hard I'm sure trying to market.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
Right, plot the next one.
Read books that are already out.
Right, check the market.
All that is, yeah, on top oflike a job and a family and
everything else, yeah it's, yeah, it's a lot, it's a lot that's
why, whenever two to tango cameout, I was like I've gotta read
that.
And and whenever you said, hey,I want to come back on, I was
(08:10):
like, yes, then it gives me evenmore reason to read it quicker.
So now I'm really excited.
So, with two to tango.
So is this book one in theseries or is it a standalone?
Speaker 2 (08:24):
So, yes, it will be book.
It's book one in a series.
It's going to be three booksand they're going to be like
interconnected interconnectedstandalones, and it's going to
follow the three cousins.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
Okay, that's what I was just about to ask.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
Yeah, I mean we'll have, I like in my mind, thought
about like offshoots and likemaybe novellas here and there.
Yes, will it happen?
I don't know, I don't want, youknow, I don't want to like talk
about something and then not doit, but um, it's going to be
three books, so that I know forsure is t's book gonna be with
(09:04):
who we think that it's going tobe with after reading Tuna Tango
, okay, probably.
Yes, so she will be book two andit was going to be like
workplace romance rivals.
She can't stand him to, loverskind of thing Not set in a dance
(09:28):
world.
So each book will kind of youknow it's titled the Tango
series all because it sort oflinks back to the grandmother
but really, like the first bookis the only one that's got like
the main dance component.
All the other ones will haveother things.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
It's really exciting, yay, okay, now I'm even more
excited than I already was, butnot rushing you in any way,
because it takes forever to geteverything written.
So no rush, but I'm reallyexcited.
Okay, so, talking a little bitmore about Two to Tango.
So did you find any differencesin your approach to writing the
(10:05):
second novel compared to debut?
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Yeah, I mean, you know the second book is is so
much harder, and I think a lotof authors will say that the
second book is so much harder.
You know, the first one, Iwrote it without any expectation
at all.
You, I had no set timeline, Ihad I wrote it in in a span of
several years really.
And the second one, I don'tknow if I would say it has, I
(10:29):
mean, like a certain amount ofexpectation.
I guess.
You know, you don't really knowif it's going to do well, you
don't know if it's going tocompletely fail.
You, you don't know how it'sgoing to go.
And for me personally, like Idon't want to set any sort of
expectation, just because that'sa hard thing to, you know, to
navigate, but it's, it was veryhard writing it and I think part
(10:50):
of me sort of setting myself upfor expectations was maybe was
what had me stuck for some of it, because there was a brief
period where I was really stuckwriting it.
I also had a set deadline,which I was not, which moved
several times, like I had tokeep re moving, you know, like
moving the deadline, but therewas a deadline that I was
(11:13):
working with.
So it was, it was verydifferent, a lot more stressful.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
I can see how that would happen.
And you know not to compare youto Jessica Joyce, but I feel
like your writing not to compareyou to Jessica Joyce, but I
feel like your writing stylejust really reminds me of
Jessica Joyce, so I have topoint that out.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
Which is like the utmost compliment.
Speaker 1 (11:33):
Yeah, and it's kind of funny because I feel like
both okay, so both of yourdebuts if you look at you With A
View and Taking the Cake,they're maybe a little.
I mean they have a lot of depth.
They both have a lot of depthand they both have a lot of
character development, but byand large they're a little bit
happier, a little bit more, youknow like joyful.
(11:54):
And then both of your secondbooks, the X-Files and two to
tango, are a little bit deeperand a little bit like darker,
are a little bit deeper and alittle bit like darker, but
still have a lot of fun elements.
But they're maybe not as likehappy, joyful on the surface
because there's so much going onunderneath.
So anyway, I it reminds me ofthe exile, kind of.
(12:15):
As I was reading it I was likeoh, I, I'm really really, really
enjoying this.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
I'm.
I mean, I've heard so many goodthings.
It's literally on my shelf Like.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
You have to really focus on it, though, because
it's one of those that, yeah,like there's a lot that you have
to grapple with.
So, yeah, that one's definitelya like wait till you can really
focus and then and then you'll,um, you'll, enjoy it.
But yeah, I saw a lot ofsimilarities, just kind of an
overall feeling, of tuto tangoand the x-files the best
(12:50):
compliment.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
You know, I didn't.
Um, when I set out to write it,I knew that, that the first one
was probably going to be theheaviest of the series.
Um, the third, the third mightbe as well and, and so I didn't
know how readers were going toreact to it.
You know, like it's the firstbook in a series and like people
might either pick it up and belike I'm not reading any more of
this or they might enjoy it soit was certainly a risk in it,
(13:14):
but it it was the characters andand it just kind of the
storyline you know.
So it was a hard thing to to.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
I didn't want to have to change it and it's more
realistic of, I feel like, whatpeople would actually go through
yeah, and you know there was aum, it might have been a review
that I was tagged in.
Speaker 2 (13:31):
Actually, so to say, I don't normally like read
reviews, but I was.
It might have been one that Iwas tagged in and they had made
a comment that you know, hercharacter is very like stoic or
very like closed off orsomething which, no, which is
was not like didn't offend me inany way.
I see your face.
You're just like no, it didn't.
I'm just I'm glad that thatthey saw that where she was,
(13:52):
she's maybe not just veryserious, right like this, isn't?
Speaker 1 (13:56):
she's not like this very fun, yeah I kind of get
like maybe a little bit jaded,like jaded by her events.
Speaker 2 (14:02):
Yeah over yeah right, she's, I mean she's exhausted
and she's over it.
It's, you know, and there'scertainly like fun and happy
elements within her.
I just think it takes a minuteto get there and that's why she
needs logan, because he helpsbring us out that's true it's
true, and there's still like funmoments like the uncrustables.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
That was just my favorite.
It was so good.
Speaker 2 (14:28):
It was so good uh you know, and we talked about it I
was like, when I was re writingthis, I was like this is just so
cute.
But, um, you know, from thebeginning I knew, I knew that I
wanted to do this like grocerystore scene and it worked out,
and I like how you incorporatedfood still within it to relate a
(14:50):
little bit more to yourbackground, like the food at the
bar and then the uncrustablesand yeah.
The food is never going toleave.
I know, the food will always bethere.
I mean, it's a it's animportant part of my life, like
it's.
I've been around food like foryou know such a big part of my
(15:10):
life, but I think it's a big,it's a very big part of
relationships and how weinteract with others.
You know, even as something assimple as like friends going out
for coffee or going out todinner on like a first date,
there's so much about food thatI think sort of is encompasses a
(15:31):
lot of relationships, and so Ithink it's always important and
it's a set time for them to gettogether, whether it's the
cousins eating appetizers at thebar right he's working or you
know.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
Yeah, like you said, a date or anything like that, or
a family dinner, or a familydinner, yep family dinner too so
how would you describe thechemistry between logan and
julie, and was it fun or was itreally challenging to write
their progression?
Speaker 2 (16:01):
I don't know that it was hard to write.
I think Logan took a little bitof time for me to figure out,
but once I figured him out, hehe sort of worked a little bit
easier.
But even as I was figuring himout, when I had the two of them
on the page, it always worked sowell Like the two of them
together on a page.
(16:22):
Scenes always worked reallywell and so I think they
gravitate towards each other alot and I think their chemistry
is very palpable.
Maybe that's a strong of a word, but it's.
It was even as I was writing it.
Like the two of them togetherit was very strong.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
And you refer to them as magnets, like pulling to
each other, yeah, yeah, and bothdance, and, of course, off the
dance floor as well, so thatthat makes sense.
So what is the scene betweenLogan and Julie that you think
perfectly illustrates theirrelationship?
Speaker 2 (16:57):
The first time they go to dance at the milonga.
You know she's nervous.
He hasn't really been in thisscene in a very long time.
He's been very sort ofdisillusioned by it.
So I think when he gets backinto it with her, I think that's
really important because shesort of has struggled with a lot
of her culture and shestruggled with sort of finding
(17:19):
something that she loves.
Here she finds something thatshe loves and she even makes a
comment, you know, like thisfeels like I've got a place here
right, like I feel like I'mhome here.
And he kind of mimics it bysaying you know I've always,
this community has always beenhome to me, and so I think that
sort of encapsulates a lot ofhow they feel, I mean, as they
(17:39):
grow throughout the book,separately and then together,
right, finding their ways backhome figuratively and then
essentially to each other aswell.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
And overall this book has a really strong, of course,
tango focus and what reallydrew you to the dance world,
kind of as a backdrop, and howdid you go about researching it?
Speaker 2 (18:01):
Um, so I have, I have this ongoing list of like book
ideas, and one of the thingsthat I just wrote on there was
just like tango, like in caps,um and so, and because, like I
mean, this is just like the mostridiculous list of like words
and random things, whatever, um,and, and I would think about it
.
I mean so is just like the mostridiculous list of like words
(18:21):
and random things, whatever, and, and I would think about it.
I mean so.
I'm from Argentina and I wouldthink, you know God, I can't
remember the last time, if ever,I read a book that had like
tango in it.
Right, that was like such a bigfocus of it and I knew that I
didn't want it to be like asnippet.
I wanted it to be a lot of myculture and just a lot of the
(18:42):
tango aspect of it.
There was a tango show in mycity and I went to see it and I
loved it.
And I think at the time I waslike just starting to outline
the book, so I had reached outto the it was like the director,
whoever had put it on it's fromthe they're from the Miami
Tango Show, because I actuallyhad put it on um it's from the
they're from the miami tangoshow, because I actually had
like put them in theacknowledgence as well.
(19:02):
And so I reached out to him andI said, hey, you know, would I
be able to talk to you and likeask you some questions?
And so I did, and I was able tosit down with him for like
probably about half hour hourand we talked about, um, a lot
about like the tango culture,tang tango community.
He talks sort of about thecreative aspect of it, how hard
it can be to kind of navigatethrough that as well, and so I
(19:25):
talked to him, I did a lot ofresearch online, I did a lot of
like YouTube instructionalvideos, looking at stuff too,
you know, and so, yeah, therewas definitely a lot that got
included in there because, like,as far as tango knowledge, it
was very like bare minimum.
Um, I have a cousin who'sactually a tango dj, funny
(19:46):
enough.
Oh, that's cool complicated, wedon't talk much so I didn't like
really talk to him a whole lotabout it, but I did did talk to
the, the tango instructor whohad done the show.
So, yeah, so there there was alot, a lot that I like really
looked at and tried to tonavigate as much as I could.
(20:07):
There's also, are you familiarwith Kelsey Painter?
Yep, so I also talked to her,only because she, if it was, it
must've been like a thread orsomething that she put out once.
And she said you know, oh God,every time I read a book with
like ballroom dancing andeverything's always incorrect.
And I said, oh my God, I said,can I DM you please, Like let me
ask you some questions?
And so we talked Um, and I alsoasked her a lot of like very
(20:30):
random questions, a lot of um,cause this really doesn't focus
so much on ballroom dancing.
Ballroom dancing and tangodancing are like very different
actually, like like argentineand ballroom tango are different
, but I I asked her somequestions as well and talked to
her, and she read the book too.
She said I didn't, everythingseemed fine, I don't know, but
um, so she was kind enough totalk to me too, so I did.
I reached out to a lot of people, I talked to a lot of people
(20:52):
about the, the whole dancingaspect to really get it, um, as,
as I could, so I've actuallyheard from a lot of author
friends that like they've hadtrouble trying to find people to
reach out to whenever they needto like research something.
Speaker 1 (21:06):
So how did you go about?
Like, how did you talk to thetango instructor?
Did you say, hey, I'm writingthis romance novel.
Or did you say, hey, I'm justwriting a book, can I talk to
you about it?
Speaker 2 (21:14):
I um, I sent an email and I was like you know I mean
worst thing he says is no likeit is you know, um, and so I
sent an email and I said, listen, I'm writing this book.
I don't know when it's going tobe out, but I I'm in the process
of writing it and I would loveto ask you some questions, um,
and he responded and he said,yeah, well, I didn't hear from
him for like a week and theneventually responded and he said
(21:36):
yes, and then I was likefreaking out.
I was like, oh god, he said yes, like I don't know, this is
such a terrible idea, um, but hewas, he was very courteous and
he was able to give me his timeand it was very nice, um, so
yeah, and then I really a lot ofit has been just like dming
people and some people have beenso kind, which is, which is,
you know, always makes it mucheasier.
(21:56):
You, you know, a much easierprocess.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
Yeah, and it only takes a couple of the right
people to take their time andtake a look at it.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
And then, you've got your research, it's true.
I mean, I will say that I didemail um and let him know when
the book was out.
I was like, hey, the book isout now and I never heard back.
Speaker 1 (22:17):
So you know that's okay, but but yeah, it was, he
was very, he was very kind.
That's cool, yeah, because I'msure it's hard to find the exact
people like.
Luckily with you you had thetango show and you were able to
also see that other post onthreads, that kind of like
spurred, oh hey, these are thepeople I can talk to, versus
just like cold going.
Okay, how do I figure out whoI'm gonna talk to so that but
(22:38):
you know, sometimes, sometimesthat's, that's the way to do it
too.
Speaker 2 (22:41):
Yeah, it's, I've, I've sort of um, you know, I
don't know if it's.
Obviously social media is sovast right there, and sometimes
you sort of run in the samecircles with certain people, and
sometimes there are people thatyou just have never even
crossed your algorithm Right,and so I've gotten a little bit
(23:01):
better about navigating andfinding people, which has been
nice, but there is there's, sothere's a lot out there.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
It's, it's a lot, but yeah, Well, cool, I can
definitely tell in, like thedescriptions of the steps and
how you know.
It's not just like and we wentto class and we danced and we
were done.
It's like no, here are thesteps, here's what we're doing,
can you tell?
I've read a lot of books thatare like we're playing
basketball, but we just got backfrom practice.
Or oh, we're dancing, but man,that lesson was great.
(23:29):
Okay, time to get water.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
And you're like wait well, you know, because, because
the tango was such a big partof it, I really did want to
focus a lot on the steps.
Speaker 1 (23:42):
Was it overkill, maybe, but I mean no, I think it
worked yes, it was all withinwithin their lessons and I like
the idea of inheriting the tangoshoes, like having a tangible
object to kind of guide usthrough.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
I'll be honest, a lot of my thoughts come when I'm
like brainstorming, walking mydog, so I just all these things
I just envisioned walking my dogand I was like, oh um, I knew I
wanted some sort of likecatalyst for it and and I think
that that was a really big thing.
And then it sort of it's.
It grew into a series where itcould all be tied together by
this one grandparent and that'show it sort of snowballed from
(24:20):
there yeah, so how does thesetting contribute to the
character's journeys andromantic tension?
tango is such a sensual dancethat it's.
It was very easy to kind ofincorporate that um, but I think
when it comes to tension, a lotof it comes from what I call
(24:44):
like the little things right,like the little glances and the
little touches and the feelingand and the build.
And so I knew that tango wasgoing to create a very good
environment for that and I knewthat private lessons were going
to create a very goodenvironment for that, and I knew
that private lessons were goingto create a very good
environment for that.
Move out of the way, ethan.
No, ethan, you suck loser.
(25:07):
So, um, right and but alsoright.
But then you know, here comesthis guy like oh, what a loser,
but that's OK, he showed himselfout, he was fine.
And so the proximity I thinkreally helped the nature of the
dance.
I think really helped the waythat it sort of escalated, the
(25:29):
way that it sort of left thedance studio and they found
themselves at, like the dive bar.
I think all of those thingssort of contributed to it.
Speaker 1 (25:37):
You know I can tell it definitely seemed very
natural, like a naturalprogression.
So okay, hypothetical situationwhich of julie's cousins,
delphi or t, would be mostlikely to win a dance-off, and
why?
Speaker 2 (25:57):
um, who would win the dance now?
Are we talking like dance-off?
Are we talking like a ballroomcompetition?
Speaker 1 (26:03):
oh, that's a good point.
Hmm, it could be either one.
It could be either one.
I don't know though, becauseyou know gavin was saying um was
making fun of t's dance move,yeah, something about her
flailing her arms, so so I don'tknow, it could really.
It could be either.
Speaker 2 (26:23):
I think T would absolutely win the dance off,
but I think if it came to like aballroom competition, I think
Delphina would probably be thewinner in that.
Maybe not, maybe not, but Ithink I think she probably would
be.
That's true.
That's true.
Oh, that's very true okay.
Speaker 1 (26:47):
So if you could step into the world of your book for
a day, what scene would you wantto experience firsthand?
Speaker 2 (26:54):
only because I've never been a part of it.
I would love to experience thecompetition aspect.
She like went and did the dance, um, I can't say that's
something that I've ever been apart of, you know, but I think
that would be nice to toexperience, um, so I would say
that yep, I, I agree, it's hardto pick one one spot in one
(27:21):
scene.
Speaker 1 (27:21):
What?
What's your answer?
I don't know.
I think maybe I would just liketo be a fly on the wall during
one of, like, their privatelessons, just because it was so,
it was so cute and it's likethe way like I would like to see
see them dance.
But you know, when it's in likea competition or something like
(27:42):
that, it's a little bit morepolished.
So like, maybe if I just sawtheir practice and I could kind
of see more of like them as acouple, where they don't have to
be so like okay, we're on andwe're performing this, I feel
like I would want to see, yeah,just their practice and how they
interact, because they interactso well with each other.
But it's so cute, but yeah, Ilike that answer.
Speaker 2 (28:03):
I like that but they're both.
Speaker 1 (28:06):
they're both good and of course the competition will
be fun, because then you get tosee the actual dance and, like
the costume and the, you knowwhen the adrenaline's going and
everything's a little bit morepolished and fancy and you know
you have a cheering audiencewatching you.
Okay, I'm trying to think ofwhat I would even say for one
(28:32):
piece of advice.
Speaker 2 (28:36):
Logan would.
I feel like Logan would be theeasier one to go, or maybe, you
know, I think I think the thingwith Julie is she's very quick
to give advice and not so quickto take it right.
So I think with her, it wouldbe more about taking risks in
life and allowing yourself to beopen to people and allowing
(28:59):
yourself to be loved andallowing yourself to be taken
care of.
I think that's a big thing forher, and the same could be said
for Logan, but maybe in adifferent way.
You know, he's the youngerbrother who had to deal with the
divorce, right, and who had theolder brother taking care of
(29:20):
him, um, but then he sort ofturns that around and becomes
the one taking care of her, in away.
Um, but yeah, what were you?
What?
What's your?
What were you gonna say aboutlogan?
Speaker 1 (29:37):
yeah, a kind of similar vein.
So, on logan, I feel like hewould say something to the
effect of because he tells Juliethis several times you just
have to let yourself have it,like, let yourself have this,
let yourself have this, and Ithink that it you know, that's
something that I feel likeyou're always questioning it,
especially now with, like allthe dating apps and craziness.
You're like is this right?
(29:58):
And you almost overanalyze tothe point of frustration, which
I feel like Julie tends to do,and she gets in her head a lot,
and so that's when you needsomeone like Logan to say just
just let yourself have this,just kind of let yourself be in
the moment and stop likeoveranalyzing everything and
just be where it goes, withoutalways thinking of everything
else that you have to do or beor whatever emails are pinging
(30:19):
on your phone, julie or you'reright.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
You're right and you know you to understand that
you're deserving of thehappiness.
Right, because that's the guiltis, like, always been the big
thing with her.
Speaker 1 (30:31):
So yeah yeah, I mean easier said than done, but yeah
true, definitely easier saidthan done, but you know're
characters, so they're justgiving us some great advice.
Hopefully we take it.
I don't know, yeah, so one lastquestion is there anything else
that you would like readers toknow about two to tango or the
(30:53):
series as a whole?
Speaker 2 (30:55):
this is a very personal book and I knew going
into it that it would work forsome readers and it probably
wouldn't work for others, whichis fair, um, but I think it's a
really important book and Ithink it's a book about letting
yourself have joy and lettingyourself feel deserving of
(31:18):
things.
I think a lot of it is going toresonate, probably with, like,
immigrant kids and you know, Ihad a couple of friends who are
immigrant kids themselves readthis too and because I think the
parent guilt, parental guilt,is very heavy with immigrant
kids.
So that's not to say that it'snot heavy otherwise, because it
(31:40):
can be regardless, but I thinkit's such a big thing when it
comes to moving to a new countryand trying to navigate a new
country and trying to succeed ina new country, right, and maybe
that's the part that won'tresonate with a lot of readers,
or maybe it will, but I thinkthat's an important part of the
(32:00):
story and I think it's somethingthat needs to be, maybe needs
be, but you know, um, I wantedto write about, let's say that
so, um, but there's also likehot dancing, so and uncrustables
and, like you know this, likereally fun um, group of
(32:20):
characters.
Um, and the next book is goingto have a really crazy group of
characters, and so, um, the nextbook will be a little bit more
fun as well.
I will say that.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
You know, I think we started on like a somber note,
but I think the second one isgoing to be, um, a little bit
more fun but I'm looking forwardto like the bar interactions
and because there anything couldhappen, like if you think about
literally and I'm sure probablyanything does happen yeah, so,
um, it's going to be this likerestaurant setting.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
It's going to be fast paced and nuts and um, and like
banter is probably going to beall over the place, but it's
going to be fun, it's going tobe fun.
Speaker 1 (33:07):
And I was going to say one last thing on um, where
you were talking about theimmigrant kid situation, even
though obviously, like, I can'trelate to that.
But when I was reading it, Imean I couldn't relate to it
firsthand, but as I was readingit I realized like, oh my gosh,
there's so many things that youdon't think about.
Like you're pointing out thelegalities and how it's just a
constant fight and how muchmoney it is and how long it goes
(33:29):
on, and you kind of have thatuneasy feeling going forward and
that's just something that Inever would have thought about
unless I had read, you know, abook like this.
That puts it kind of in more ofa personal perspective.
So I feel like, even if youcan't relate to it first hand,
it puts it into a little bitmore of a relatable perspective
to where you go oh wow I neverwould have thought of it that
(33:50):
way yeahbut it was a joy.
It was a joy to talk to you, itwas a joy to read your book and
obviously I'm going to belooking forward to the next
books.
You're on my auto by authorlist, so yeah, oh, thank you.
That's it for today.
Thanks for listening to where Ileft off a bookish podcast.
(34:11):
You can visit Natalia's site,follow her and on social media
and, of course, purchase hernovels through the links in the
show notes, and you can alwaysfind them on kindle, unlimited.
Thank you.
welcome back.
I'm krista balls and you'relistening to where I left off, a
bookish podcast, and today I amjoined again by the author of
taking the cake, nataliawilliams, and we are talking
about her latest release,tootatango.
Thank, thank you for comingback, natalia.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
Oh, thank you for having me, I love being here.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
Oh, I'm so glad you got to come back.
I can't wait to talk about Twoto Tango.
Oh man, I just just finished it, so it's fresh, it's super
fresh.
So, first, what are youcurrently reading?
And if you're not reallyreading a lot right now, because
you're kind of writing, uh,which authors inspire you?
Speaker 2 (00:53):
this question is so hard.
I feel like since I've startedwriting, reading has become so
tricky.
I it's, it's like the worst.
Um, when I finished Tutu Tangoand then I, like you know it was
out, I thought I would givemyself a couple months of a
break and just like readeverything that I've been
wanting to read and I've donelike none of it, which is just
(01:16):
it's been so hard.
Um, I am like halfway throughthe Other Side of Disappearing
by Kate Claiborne.
I don't know if you've read ituh-uh, I haven't read it um
podcast like related, but it'sand I started this like I don't
even know, like a month ago.
At this point it's very good.
(01:37):
It's not the book, it's me.
I'm like halfway through andit's just been sitting there and
I've been so busy that Ihaven't been able to pick it
back up.
Um.
And then I've also like just tokind of read some stuff.
I've been doing the um, likethe kindle short stories, like
those collections.
You know those, yes, yeah.
So I did like the murdermystery ones.
They were super cute.
And then I've been doing someof like the christmasy ones
(02:00):
which I'm like halfway through,one of those like I can't even
get through that, like that'show insane it's been.
So I've been doing that.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
That's what I've been reading sometimes you just have
to kind of be in the middle ofa bunch of different books at
once.
I know that, yeah, that's you.
Speaker 2 (02:16):
That is not.
I am such a like one book at atime person, but lately it's
like my attention span is allover the place, that I've just
been doing a couple things at atime, which is okay, but not my,
not ideal welcome to the darkside, where we read a bunch of
two is the max.
(02:36):
Two is the max, that's it.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
I I'm not reading six anymore.
I think I'm down to like four,maybe four.
So you know I'm getting.
I'm getting down to Okay Upprogress.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
I mean, what's your method?
Do you like alternate days?
Do you do like pay like achapter of each book a day?
Like what's the method?
Speaker 1 (02:59):
Okay, this is going to really probably stress you
out, but yeah well, okay, sobasically what I'll do is I have
books normally that are like myfocus, you know, and they're
what I'm really working on, andthen some that are kind of in
the back burner, like I startedthem and for some reason
something else came up that Ineeded to start library book arc
(03:22):
.
What have you?
Whatever the reason is, theseare now my focus.
So what I'll do is I'll takeall the books that are my quote
unquote focus and I will readlike a couple chapters a day,
like I will set alarms.
If I go to read and let's say Ihave 30 minutes, I'll set like
15 minutes for one book and thenI have to put it down when the
(03:42):
15 minutes is up and then pickup the other one for the other
15 minutes, and so you know what?
Speaker 2 (03:47):
maybe that's what I should try a little more yeah
yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
so then it's like you're reading little bits at a
time and then you instantly kindof switch to another one.
But it helps keep your focusbecause all of that like I
cannot do this.
If they were all the same genre, so I have like fantasy,
thriller, romance.
And if they're like the samegenre, so I have like fantasy,
thriller, romance.
And if they're like I have twofantasies but one's dark
academia and one's urban fantasy, or like the romance, one super
(04:12):
happy rom-com and one's alittle bit more heartfelt and
deep.
So they can't be like similarplot lines or the same thing.
They have to be completelydifferent, otherwise my brain
could not differentiate all ofthose at once.
Yeah Right, I mean, that wasgoing to be completely different
, otherwise my brain could notdifferentiate all of those at
once.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
Yeah, right, I mean that was going to be my question
like if you're reading threethrillers like that's, that's a
hard.
Yeah, you can't do that.
Everything would get mixed up,okay yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:35):
so it has to be different genre and also kind of
different sub-genre to keep upwith it.
And yeah, I literally will justswitch between and pick up
multiple books and I have themall sitting right next to me and
I just read a couple, read acouple, but but maybe that's the
answer.
Speaker 2 (04:51):
Maybe that's the answer I mean.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
I mean now.
Speaker 2 (04:54):
Now we're just going to like sidetrack into like all
this stuff.
But you know, there's all thesearticles that have come out
about like how our attentionspan is so awful, just you know
social media and doom scrollingand all these things, and so I
feel like that has been an issuewith like my reading too.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
But if I, you know, read eight books at a time, it
works Exactly and it's like onceyou start doing it it's really
hard to stop.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
So I've had to tell myself now that I'm down to four
, said no, you are not pickingup another book until you clear
these out and then you can start, you know I mean maybe that's
picking up a couple right andthen the library holds, come in
and then I mean I can't tell youhow many I've just like renewed
and then have to return.
I'm like I can't read thisright now, but maybe I should.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
Yeah, exactly.
And you go there and you'relike hey, this looks really good
.
What if, on the off chance, Icould read it?
I should just go ahead andcheck it out anyway.
And then it just stares at you.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
Right, I know, and then it just sits there.
I'm like I'm so sorry, but youknow, but at least checking it
out helps, right.
Speaker 1 (06:00):
Exactly.
Yeah, it helps the library,helps the librarian, helps the
author.
So, yeah, I mean it all works.
Yeah, exactly, you still win,even though you're not reading
it.
Speaker 2 (06:11):
Yeah, I know, oh, that's.
I mean maybe Not like you haveto read a certain book, kind of
book club.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
And the theme of it was us going yeah, that's on my
TBR.
Yeah, I want to read that.
Yeah, I haven't read that andit would be like a really
popular book.
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Yeah, I heard that's good.
Oh my God, that's it, that's me, oh geez.
Speaker 1 (06:41):
Yep, oh, geez, yep.
And then half of us were justlike, yeah, no, I haven't.
I haven't yet, but it's on mylist.
It was like one person broughtthe second book in ACOTAR and
half of us were like, yeah,that's on our list, but we
haven't read it.
We know, we know that we should.
And then another was like Allthe Light, we.
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Cannot See and we're like, yeah, yeah, we've heard a
lot about that.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
We still haven't read it, but it's there so, yeah,
yeah, there were a lot that yep.
It was all of us just doingthat.
Speaker 2 (07:10):
That's the common theme.
I love that.
That's the book club for me.
Yeah, I know.
Speaker 1 (07:18):
I know, yeah, so it's not just us.
It's not just us at all.
Just pop on down to Texas andyou can.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
oh my, gosh, I love that.
Yeah, that's so funny sorealistically.
That's what happened oh, it'sjust, it's so hard, it's so yeah
, I don't know.
I don't know if life's gettingbusier, or I mean, yes, but or
it's just.
You know that, like withwriting, like it's, it's, it's
(07:47):
hard I'm sure trying to market.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
Right, plot the next one.
Read books that are already out.
Right, check the market.
All that is, yeah, on top oflike a job and a family and
everything else, yeah it's, yeah, it's a lot, it's a lot that's
why, whenever two to tango cameout, I was like I've gotta read
that.
And and whenever you said, hey,I want to come back on, I was
(08:10):
like, yes, then it gives me evenmore reason to read it quicker.
So now I'm really excited.
So, with two to tango.
So is this book one in theseries or is it a standalone?
Speaker 2 (08:24):
So, yes, it will be book.
It's book one in a series.
It's going to be three booksand they're going to be like
interconnected interconnectedstandalones, and it's going to
follow the three cousins.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
Okay, that's what I was just about to ask.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
Yeah, I mean we'll have, I like in my mind, thought
about like offshoots and likemaybe novellas here and there.
Yes, will it happen?
I don't know, I don't want, youknow, I don't want to like talk
about something and then not doit, but um, it's going to be
three books, so that I know forsure is t's book gonna be with
(09:04):
who we think that it's going tobe with after reading Tuna Tango
, okay, probably.
Yes, so she will be book two andit was going to be like
workplace romance rivals.
She can't stand him to, loverskind of thing Not set in a dance
(09:28):
world.
So each book will kind of youknow it's titled the Tango
series all because it sort oflinks back to the grandmother
but really, like the first bookis the only one that's got like
the main dance component.
All the other ones will haveother things.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
It's really exciting, yay, okay, now I'm even more
excited than I already was, butnot rushing you in any way,
because it takes forever to geteverything written.
So no rush, but I'm reallyexcited.
Okay, so, talking a little bitmore about Two to Tango.
So did you find any differencesin your approach to writing the
(10:05):
second novel compared to debut?
Speaker 2 (10:08):
Yeah, I mean, you know the second book is is so
much harder, and I think a lotof authors will say that the
second book is so much harder.
You know, the first one, Iwrote it without any expectation
at all.
You, I had no set timeline, Ihad I wrote it in in a span of
several years really.
And the second one, I don'tknow if I would say it has, I
(10:29):
mean, like a certain amount ofexpectation.
I guess.
You know, you don't really knowif it's going to do well, you
don't know if it's going tocompletely fail.
You, you don't know how it'sgoing to go.
And for me personally, like Idon't want to set any sort of
expectation, just because that'sa hard thing to, you know, to
navigate, but it's, it was veryhard writing it and I think part
(10:50):
of me sort of setting myself upfor expectations was maybe was
what had me stuck for some of it, because there was a brief
period where I was really stuckwriting it.
I also had a set deadline,which I was not, which moved
several times, like I had tokeep re moving, you know, like
moving the deadline, but therewas a deadline that I was
(11:13):
working with.
So it was, it was verydifferent, a lot more stressful.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
I can see how that would happen.
And you know not to compare youto Jessica Joyce, but I feel
like your writing not to compareyou to Jessica Joyce, but I
feel like your writing stylejust really reminds me of
Jessica Joyce, so I have topoint that out.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
Which is like the utmost compliment.
Speaker 1 (11:33):
Yeah, and it's kind of funny because I feel like
both okay, so both of yourdebuts if you look at you With A
View and Taking the Cake,they're maybe a little.
I mean they have a lot of depth.
They both have a lot of depthand they both have a lot of
character development, but byand large they're a little bit
happier, a little bit more, youknow like joyful.
(11:54):
And then both of your secondbooks, the X-Files and two to
tango, are a little bit deeperand a little bit like darker,
are a little bit deeper and alittle bit like darker, but
still have a lot of fun elements.
But they're maybe not as likehappy, joyful on the surface
because there's so much going onunderneath.
So anyway, I it reminds me ofthe exile, kind of.
(12:15):
As I was reading it I was likeoh, I, I'm really really, really
enjoying this.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
I'm.
I mean, I've heard so many goodthings.
It's literally on my shelf Like.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
You have to really focus on it, though, because
it's one of those that, yeah,like there's a lot that you have
to grapple with.
So, yeah, that one's definitelya like wait till you can really
focus and then and then you'll,um, you'll, enjoy it.
But yeah, I saw a lot ofsimilarities, just kind of an
overall feeling, of tuto tangoand the x-files the best
(12:50):
compliment.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
You know, I didn't.
Um, when I set out to write it,I knew that, that the first one
was probably going to be theheaviest of the series.
Um, the third, the third mightbe as well and, and so I didn't
know how readers were going toreact to it.
You know, like it's the firstbook in a series and like people
might either pick it up and belike I'm not reading any more of
this or they might enjoy it soit was certainly a risk in it,
(13:14):
but it it was the characters andand it just kind of the
storyline you know.
So it was a hard thing to to.
Speaker 1 (13:21):
I didn't want to have to change it and it's more
realistic of, I feel like, whatpeople would actually go through
yeah, and you know there was aum, it might have been a review
that I was tagged in.
Speaker 2 (13:31):
Actually, so to say, I don't normally like read
reviews, but I was.
It might have been one that Iwas tagged in and they had made
a comment that you know, hercharacter is very like stoic or
very like closed off orsomething which, no, which is
was not like didn't offend me inany way.
I see your face.
You're just like no, it didn't.
I'm just I'm glad that thatthey saw that where she was,
(13:52):
she's maybe not just veryserious, right like this, isn't?
Speaker 1 (13:56):
she's not like this very fun, yeah I kind of get
like maybe a little bit jaded,like jaded by her events.
Speaker 2 (14:02):
Yeah over yeah right, she's, I mean she's exhausted
and she's over it.
It's, you know, and there'scertainly like fun and happy
elements within her.
I just think it takes a minuteto get there and that's why she
needs logan, because he helpsbring us out that's true it's
true, and there's still like funmoments like the uncrustables.
Speaker 1 (14:25):
That was just my favorite.
It was so good.
Speaker 2 (14:28):
It was so good uh you know, and we talked about it I
was like, when I was re writingthis, I was like this is just so
cute.
But, um, you know, from thebeginning I knew, I knew that I
wanted to do this like grocerystore scene and it worked out,
and I like how you incorporatedfood still within it to relate a
(14:50):
little bit more to yourbackground, like the food at the
bar and then the uncrustablesand yeah.
The food is never going toleave.
I know, the food will always bethere.
I mean, it's a it's animportant part of my life, like
it's.
I've been around food like foryou know such a big part of my
(15:10):
life, but I think it's a big,it's a very big part of
relationships and how weinteract with others.
You know, even as something assimple as like friends going out
for coffee or going out todinner on like a first date,
there's so much about food thatI think sort of is encompasses a
(15:31):
lot of relationships, and so Ithink it's always important and
it's a set time for them to gettogether, whether it's the
cousins eating appetizers at thebar right he's working or you
know.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
Yeah, like you said, a date or anything like that, or
a family dinner, or a familydinner, yep family dinner too so
how would you describe thechemistry between logan and
julie, and was it fun or was itreally challenging to write
their progression?
Speaker 2 (16:01):
I don't know that it was hard to write.
I think Logan took a little bitof time for me to figure out,
but once I figured him out, hehe sort of worked a little bit
easier.
But even as I was figuring himout, when I had the two of them
on the page, it always worked sowell Like the two of them
together on a page.
(16:22):
Scenes always worked reallywell and so I think they
gravitate towards each other alot and I think their chemistry
is very palpable.
Maybe that's a strong of a word, but it's.
It was even as I was writing it.
Like the two of them togetherit was very strong.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
And you refer to them as magnets, like pulling to
each other, yeah, yeah, and bothdance, and, of course, off the
dance floor as well, so thatthat makes sense.
So what is the scene betweenLogan and Julie that you think
perfectly illustrates theirrelationship?
Speaker 2 (16:57):
The first time they go to dance at the milonga.
You know she's nervous.
He hasn't really been in thisscene in a very long time.
He's been very sort ofdisillusioned by it.
So I think when he gets backinto it with her, I think that's
really important because shesort of has struggled with a lot
of her culture and shestruggled with sort of finding
(17:19):
something that she loves.
Here she finds something thatshe loves and she even makes a
comment, you know, like thisfeels like I've got a place here
right, like I feel like I'mhome here.
And he kind of mimics it bysaying you know I've always,
this community has always beenhome to me, and so I think that
sort of encapsulates a lot ofhow they feel, I mean, as they
(17:39):
grow throughout the book,separately and then together,
right, finding their ways backhome figuratively and then
essentially to each other aswell.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
And overall this book has a really strong, of course,
tango focus and what reallydrew you to the dance world,
kind of as a backdrop, and howdid you go about researching it?
Speaker 2 (18:01):
Um, so I have, I have this ongoing list of like book
ideas, and one of the thingsthat I just wrote on there was
just like tango, like in caps,um and so, and because, like I
mean, this is just like the mostridiculous list of like words
and random things, whatever, um,and, and I would think about it
.
I mean so is just like the mostridiculous list of like words
(18:21):
and random things, whatever, and, and I would think about it.
I mean so.
I'm from Argentina and I wouldthink, you know God, I can't
remember the last time, if ever,I read a book that had like
tango in it.
Right, that was like such a bigfocus of it and I knew that I
didn't want it to be like asnippet.
I wanted it to be a lot of myculture and just a lot of the
(18:42):
tango aspect of it.
There was a tango show in mycity and I went to see it and I
loved it.
And I think at the time I waslike just starting to outline
the book, so I had reached outto the it was like the director,
whoever had put it on it's fromthe they're from the Miami
Tango Show, because I actuallyhad put it on um it's from the
they're from the miami tangoshow, because I actually had
like put them in theacknowledgence as well.
(19:02):
And so I reached out to him andI said, hey, you know, would I
be able to talk to you and likeask you some questions?
And so I did, and I was able tosit down with him for like
probably about half hour hourand we talked about, um, a lot
about like the tango culture,tang tango community.
He talks sort of about thecreative aspect of it, how hard
it can be to kind of navigatethrough that as well, and so I
(19:25):
talked to him, I did a lot ofresearch online, I did a lot of
like YouTube instructionalvideos, looking at stuff too,
you know, and so, yeah, therewas definitely a lot that got
included in there because, like,as far as tango knowledge, it
was very like bare minimum.
Um, I have a cousin who'sactually a tango dj, funny
(19:46):
enough.
Oh, that's cool complicated, wedon't talk much so I didn't like
really talk to him a whole lotabout it, but I did did talk to
the, the tango instructor whohad done the show.
So, yeah, so there there was alot, a lot that I like really
looked at and tried to tonavigate as much as I could.
(20:07):
There's also, are you familiarwith Kelsey Painter?
Yep, so I also talked to her,only because she, if it was, it
must've been like a thread orsomething that she put out once.
And she said you know, oh God,every time I read a book with
like ballroom dancing andeverything's always incorrect.
And I said, oh my God, I said,can I DM you please, Like let me
ask you some questions?
And so we talked Um, and I alsoasked her a lot of like very
(20:30):
random questions, a lot of um,cause this really doesn't focus
so much on ballroom dancing.
Ballroom dancing and tangodancing are like very different
actually, like like argentineand ballroom tango are different
, but I I asked her somequestions as well and talked to
her, and she read the book too.
She said I didn't, everythingseemed fine, I don't know, but
um, so she was kind enough totalk to me too, so I did.
I reached out to a lot of people, I talked to a lot of people
(20:52):
about the, the whole dancingaspect to really get it, um, as,
as I could, so I've actuallyheard from a lot of author
friends that like they've hadtrouble trying to find people to
reach out to whenever they needto like research something.
Speaker 1 (21:06):
So how did you go about?
Like, how did you talk to thetango instructor?
Did you say, hey, I'm writingthis romance novel.
Or did you say, hey, I'm justwriting a book, can I talk to
you about it?
Speaker 2 (21:14):
I um, I sent an email and I was like you know I mean
worst thing he says is no likeit is you know, um, and so I
sent an email and I said, listen, I'm writing this book.
I don't know when it's going tobe out, but I I'm in the process
of writing it and I would loveto ask you some questions, um,
and he responded and he said,yeah, well, I didn't hear from
him for like a week and theneventually responded and he said
(21:36):
yes, and then I was likefreaking out.
I was like, oh god, he said yes, like I don't know, this is
such a terrible idea, um, but hewas, he was very courteous and
he was able to give me his timeand it was very nice, um, so
yeah, and then I really a lot ofit has been just like dming
people and some people have beenso kind, which is, which is,
you know, always makes it mucheasier.
(21:56):
You, you know, a much easierprocess.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
Yeah, and it only takes a couple of the right
people to take their time andtake a look at it.
Speaker 2 (22:10):
And then, you've got your research, it's true.
I mean, I will say that I didemail um and let him know when
the book was out.
I was like, hey, the book isout now and I never heard back.
Speaker 1 (22:17):
So you know that's okay, but but yeah, it was, he
was very, he was very kind.
That's cool, yeah, because I'msure it's hard to find the exact
people like.
Luckily with you you had thetango show and you were able to
also see that other post onthreads, that kind of like
spurred, oh hey, these are thepeople I can talk to, versus
just like cold going.
Okay, how do I figure out whoI'm gonna talk to so that but
(22:38):
you know, sometimes, sometimesthat's, that's the way to do it
too.
Speaker 2 (22:41):
Yeah, it's, I've, I've sort of um, you know, I
don't know if it's.
Obviously social media is sovast right there, and sometimes
you sort of run in the samecircles with certain people, and
sometimes there are people thatyou just have never even
crossed your algorithm Right,and so I've gotten a little bit
(23:01):
better about navigating andfinding people, which has been
nice, but there is there's, sothere's a lot out there.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
It's, it's a lot, but yeah, Well, cool, I can
definitely tell in, like thedescriptions of the steps and
how you know.
It's not just like and we wentto class and we danced and we
were done.
It's like no, here are thesteps, here's what we're doing,
can you tell?
I've read a lot of books thatare like we're playing
basketball, but we just got backfrom practice.
Or oh, we're dancing, but man,that lesson was great.
(23:29):
Okay, time to get water.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
And you're like wait well, you know, because, because
the tango was such a big partof it, I really did want to
focus a lot on the steps.
Speaker 1 (23:42):
Was it overkill, maybe, but I mean no, I think it
worked yes, it was all withinwithin their lessons and I like
the idea of inheriting the tangoshoes, like having a tangible
object to kind of guide usthrough.
Speaker 2 (23:56):
I'll be honest, a lot of my thoughts come when I'm
like brainstorming, walking mydog, so I just all these things
I just envisioned walking my dogand I was like, oh um, I knew I
wanted some sort of likecatalyst for it and and I think
that that was a really big thing.
And then it sort of it's.
It grew into a series where itcould all be tied together by
this one grandparent and that'show it sort of snowballed from
(24:20):
there yeah, so how does thesetting contribute to the
character's journeys andromantic tension?
tango is such a sensual dancethat it's.
It was very easy to kind ofincorporate that um, but I think
when it comes to tension, a lotof it comes from what I call
(24:44):
like the little things right,like the little glances and the
little touches and the feelingand and the build.
And so I knew that tango wasgoing to create a very good
environment for that and I knewthat private lessons were going
to create a very goodenvironment for that, and I knew
that private lessons were goingto create a very good
environment for that.
Move out of the way, ethan.
No, ethan, you suck loser.
(25:07):
So, um, right and but alsoright.
But then you know, here comesthis guy like oh, what a loser,
but that's OK, he showed himselfout, he was fine.
And so the proximity I thinkreally helped the nature of the
dance.
I think really helped the waythat it sort of escalated, the
(25:29):
way that it sort of left thedance studio and they found
themselves at, like the dive bar.
I think all of those thingssort of contributed to it.
Speaker 1 (25:37):
You know I can tell it definitely seemed very
natural, like a naturalprogression.
So okay, hypothetical situationwhich of julie's cousins,
delphi or t, would be mostlikely to win a dance-off, and
why?
Speaker 2 (25:57):
um, who would win the dance now?
Are we talking like dance-off?
Are we talking like a ballroomcompetition?
Speaker 1 (26:03):
oh, that's a good point.
Hmm, it could be either one.
It could be either one.
I don't know though, becauseyou know gavin was saying um was
making fun of t's dance move,yeah, something about her
flailing her arms, so so I don'tknow, it could really.
It could be either.
Speaker 2 (26:23):
I think T would absolutely win the dance off,
but I think if it came to like aballroom competition, I think
Delphina would probably be thewinner in that.
Maybe not, maybe not, but Ithink I think she probably would
be.
That's true.
That's true.
Oh, that's very true okay.
Speaker 1 (26:47):
So if you could step into the world of your book for
a day, what scene would you wantto experience firsthand?
Speaker 2 (26:54):
only because I've never been a part of it.
I would love to experience thecompetition aspect.
She like went and did the dance, um, I can't say that's
something that I've ever been apart of, you know, but I think
that would be nice to toexperience, um, so I would say
that yep, I, I agree, it's hardto pick one one spot in one
(27:21):
scene.
Speaker 1 (27:21):
What?
What's your answer?
I don't know.
I think maybe I would just liketo be a fly on the wall during
one of, like, their privatelessons, just because it was so,
it was so cute and it's likethe way like I would like to see
see them dance.
But you know, when it's in likea competition or something like
(27:42):
that, it's a little bit morepolished.
So like, maybe if I just sawtheir practice and I could kind
of see more of like them as acouple, where they don't have to
be so like okay, we're on andwe're performing this, I feel
like I would want to see, yeah,just their practice and how they
interact, because they interactso well with each other.
But it's so cute, but yeah, Ilike that answer.
Speaker 2 (28:03):
I like that but they're both.
Speaker 1 (28:06):
they're both good and of course the competition will
be fun, because then you get tosee the actual dance and, like
the costume and the, you knowwhen the adrenaline's going and
everything's a little bit morepolished and fancy and you know
you have a cheering audiencewatching you.
Okay, I'm trying to think ofwhat I would even say for one
(28:32):
piece of advice.
Speaker 2 (28:36):
Logan would.
I feel like Logan would be theeasier one to go, or maybe, you
know, I think I think the thingwith Julie is she's very quick
to give advice and not so quickto take it right.
So I think with her, it wouldbe more about taking risks in
life and allowing yourself to beopen to people and allowing
(28:59):
yourself to be loved andallowing yourself to be taken
care of.
I think that's a big thing forher, and the same could be said
for Logan, but maybe in adifferent way.
You know, he's the youngerbrother who had to deal with the
divorce, right, and who had theolder brother taking care of
(29:20):
him, um, but then he sort ofturns that around and becomes
the one taking care of her, in away.
Um, but yeah, what were you?
What?
What's your?
What were you gonna say aboutlogan?
Speaker 1 (29:37):
yeah, a kind of similar vein.
So, on logan, I feel like hewould say something to the
effect of because he tells Juliethis several times you just
have to let yourself have it,like, let yourself have this,
let yourself have this, and Ithink that it you know, that's
something that I feel likeyou're always questioning it,
especially now with, like allthe dating apps and craziness.
You're like is this right?
(29:58):
And you almost overanalyze tothe point of frustration, which
I feel like Julie tends to do,and she gets in her head a lot,
and so that's when you needsomeone like Logan to say just
just let yourself have this,just kind of let yourself be in
the moment and stop likeoveranalyzing everything and
just be where it goes, withoutalways thinking of everything
else that you have to do or beor whatever emails are pinging
(30:19):
on your phone, julie or you'reright.
Speaker 2 (30:21):
You're right and you know you to understand that
you're deserving of thehappiness.
Right, because that's the guiltis, like, always been the big
thing with her.
Speaker 1 (30:31):
So yeah yeah, I mean easier said than done, but yeah
true, definitely easier saidthan done, but you know're
characters, so they're justgiving us some great advice.
Hopefully we take it.
I don't know, yeah, so one lastquestion is there anything else
that you would like readers toknow about two to tango or the
(30:53):
series as a whole?
Speaker 2 (30:55):
this is a very personal book and I knew going
into it that it would work forsome readers and it probably
wouldn't work for others, whichis fair, um, but I think it's a
really important book and Ithink it's a book about letting
yourself have joy and lettingyourself feel deserving of
(31:18):
things.
I think a lot of it is going toresonate, probably with, like,
immigrant kids and you know, Ihad a couple of friends who are
immigrant kids themselves readthis too and because I think the
parent guilt, parental guilt,is very heavy with immigrant
kids.
So that's not to say that it'snot heavy otherwise, because it
(31:40):
can be regardless, but I thinkit's such a big thing when it
comes to moving to a new countryand trying to navigate a new
country and trying to succeed ina new country, right, and maybe
that's the part that won'tresonate with a lot of readers,
or maybe it will, but I thinkthat's an important part of the
(32:00):
story and I think it's somethingthat needs to be, maybe needs
be, but you know, um, I wantedto write about, let's say that
so, um, but there's also likehot dancing, so and uncrustables
and, like you know this, likereally fun um, group of
(32:20):
characters.
Um, and the next book is goingto have a really crazy group of
characters, and so, um, the nextbook will be a little bit more
fun as well.
I will say that.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
You know, I think we started on like a somber note,
but I think the second one isgoing to be, um, a little bit
more fun but I'm looking forwardto like the bar interactions
and because there anything couldhappen, like if you think about
literally and I'm sure probablyanything does happen yeah, so,
um, it's going to be this likerestaurant setting.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
It's going to be fast paced and nuts and um, and like
banter is probably going to beall over the place, but it's
going to be fun, it's going tobe fun.
Speaker 1 (33:07):
And I was going to say one last thing on um, where
you were talking about theimmigrant kid situation, even
though obviously, like, I can'trelate to that.
But when I was reading it, Imean I couldn't relate to it
firsthand, but as I was readingit I realized like, oh my gosh,
there's so many things that youdon't think about.
Like you're pointing out thelegalities and how it's just a
constant fight and how muchmoney it is and how long it goes
(33:29):
on, and you kind of have thatuneasy feeling going forward and
that's just something that Inever would have thought about
unless I had read, you know, abook like this.
That puts it kind of in more ofa personal perspective.
So I feel like, even if youcan't relate to it first hand,
it puts it into a little bitmore of a relatable perspective
to where you go oh wow I neverwould have thought of it that
(33:50):
way yeahbut it was a joy.
It was a joy to talk to you, itwas a joy to read your book and
obviously I'm going to belooking forward to the next
books.
You're on my auto by authorlist, so yeah, oh, thank you.
That's it for today.
Thanks for listening to where Ileft off a bookish podcast.
(34:11):
You can visit Natalia's site,follow her and on social media
and, of course, purchase hernovels through the links in the
show notes, and you can alwaysfind them on kindle, unlimited.
Thank you.
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