July 5, 2025 • 33 mins
The tween and teen years can feel like emotional whiplash — one minute you're managing mood swings, the next you're untangling tech rules or talking boundaries.
In this episode of the Where Parents Talk podcast, host Lianne Castelino interview Bailey Gaddis — certified parenting coach, doula, hypnotherapist, and mom of two — to help bring calm, confidence, and customization to the parenting journey.
The discussion unpacks how to:
- Create parenting plans tailored to your child
- Support emotional growth through hormonal changes and screen time stress
- Foster independence, build trust, and open the lines of communication
- Handle bullying, teach consent, and nurture real-world relationships
Rooted in real life and backed by research, Gaddis discusses how parents can lead with flexibility, intention, and heart.
Links referenced in this episode:
This podcast is for parents, guardians, teachers and caregivers to learn proven strategies and trusted tips on raising kids, teens and young adults based on science, evidenced and lived experience.
You’ll learn the latest on topics like managing bullying, consent, fostering healthy relationships, and the interconnectedness of mental, emotional and physical health.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Foreign.
Welcome to the Where ParentsTalk podcast. We help grow better
parents through science,evidence, and the lived experience
of other parents. Learn how tobetter navigate the mental and physical
health of your tween teen oryoung adult through proven expert
(00:21):
advice. Here's your host,Lianne Castelino.
What if parenting didn't haveto feel like guesswork? What if you
could create a clear, flexibleparenting plan tailored to your child's
unique needs and your family'svalues? Welcome to Where Parents
Talk. My name is LianneCastelino. Our guest today is a certified
(00:43):
birthing doula and a certifiedparenting coach. Bailey Gaddis is
also a certifiedhypnotherapist and an authority.
Her latest book is calledCustomized Creating Easy Intuitive
Parenting Plans for EvolvingFamilies. Bailey is also a mother
of two, and she joins us todayfrom Ojai, California. Welcome, Bailey,
(01:05):
and thank you for being here.
Hello. Thank you for having me.
You work with many parents asboth a coach and a doula. Curious
as to what patterns andchallenges are you noticing that
led to this idea of creatingcustomized parenting plans?
Yeah, so the, the, you know,there's many. But the biggest thing
(01:26):
was so many parents, you know,clients, friends, myself being so
concerned about the rules, youknow, it's like, oh, I'm, you know,
really tempted to co. Sleepwith my child, for example, you know,
but the. The rule is you'renot supposed to or, you know, with
(01:47):
disciplining. You know, mymother says that this is the way
it's supposed to go, but I'm,you know, really Dr. On to doing
it another way and sorealizing that so many of us, granted,
like, we're not all operatingby the same rules. You know, our.
Our culture, our family oforigin. You know, there's so many
factors that influence therules that, you know, we're parenting
(02:09):
by, but realizing that in somany ways, they were preventing us
from parenting in a way thatfelt really authentic, really intuitive,
and parenting in a way thatfelt you the best for our family.
And each family is unique.Each parent, each child is unique.
(02:31):
So those rules was the firststep towards thinking, huh? You know,
I wonder. I wonder if wecleared the slate of all the rules
even. I mean, some might begreat, some might be good. We might
add some of them back in. Youknow, it's not that we're operating
from all these horrible, youknow, ideas about parenting, but
(02:52):
just clearing that slate.Slate. Connecting with that intuition
and then building upon thatclean slate, you know, what really
felt right for us andrealizing that it's okay if it's
different from the way thatyour mom, your sister, your friend,
that parenting author. It'sokay if it's different than, you
(03:16):
know, how they're doing it.
So let's break that down alittle bit. In what ways then, Bailey,
would you say specificallythat creating a parenting plan addresses
is what you just describedwith those rules?
Yeah. So in the book, again,like I said, we go through the process
of clearing that slate in thebeginning, really tuning into what
(03:39):
is intuition. It's a wordthat's thrown around a lot, but there's
a whole chapter going into thescience of intuition because it's
such a fascinating topic.There has been more research on it.
So really digging into whatthat is, how we connect to it, how
we can trust it, and thengoing into nine different components
(04:02):
of parenting. For example,communication. All right, so let's
look at the research that'sout there about communication. I
have different prompts likewhat would it look like your ideal
conversation between you andyour child? For example, if you were
discussing something with athree year old, that is a more challenging
(04:26):
discussion about I want thispopsicle for breakfast and you maybe
are feeling like that'sprobably not the healthiest choice.
You know, looking at how youwant that communication to go and
really finding a plan againfor the different components of communication
that feels good for you. Andknowing that a lot of it's trial
(04:48):
and error. Right. It's notjust that we figure out a plan and
it works perfectly andeverything is so easy and we don't
have to worry about it. Again,disciplining, you know, boundaries.
Eating, of course, you know,which is not just an issue in those
early years. You know, my 12year old, for example, he has more
(05:09):
autonomy now with what he eatsand it is mainly chips and ramen
noodles. So there's still alot to be done there. Yeah. So I
try to provide a balance of alot of research based information
because there is a wealth of,of knowledge out there, you know,
(05:30):
about, you know, for example,corporal punishment, that is. I really
tried to not be prescriptivein the book, but that is the one
thing where I say all theresearch shows we don't want to hit
our kids. Right. You know, sosharing research about that, but
(05:52):
you know, about communication,discipline, all the things. I think
I read a total of a littleover 250 research based papers for
this book and it. Which wasfascinating, very time consuming,
but I wanted to offer that toparents. Like, look, here is somewhat
(06:13):
subjective. You know, anyscience, any study is, has some subjective
nature to it. But offeringthat. Offering stories of, you know,
different ways to do it.Always reminding the parent that,
look, some of my opinions areprobably going to come out if you
(06:34):
don't agree with them. Great.Tune into that notice. Why don't
you agree with whatever thetechnique is that I'm talking about?
What would the opposite ofthat look like? So, always staying
in that space of curiosity,inquiry, and throughout the process
of the book and then thewriting aspects of it, because I
(06:57):
give parents a template tofill in for each aspect of the parenting
plan. Again with thecommunication, with eating, with
all of it. Very specificquestions to fill in. And the idea
is at the end that you havethis fully formed parenting plan
to jump off from. Right. Youknow, because like I said, we're
(07:19):
always evolving and we'realways changing, and this will be
like a living document that ischanging and growing with you. But,
yeah, to, like, really createsomething, you know, if you have
a partner with your partner,if your children are old enough to
discuss it, creating it withyour children as well, and hopefully
(07:43):
creating this. This plan, eventhis, like, family ethos that really
connects with everyone in thefamily, and then hopefully is something
that everybody is motivatedto. To work, you know, work the system
that you're. You're creating.So, and it's something that I did
as I was writing the book. Youknow, I'm like, I can't tell other
(08:04):
people to try these things, toanswer these questions unless I'm
actually doing it, which iswhy it took me. I've been working
on this book for almost fiveyears, maybe more. You know, thinking
about the initial idea of it,because I really wanted to try it
(08:24):
out, try the ideas out with myown families, my poor family. They
were my guinea pigs. But Ithink overall, it was a really positive
experience for us.
So along those lines, clearlya lot of passion and inspiration
for you to go down this road,devote five years of your time, involve
your family and all of that.When you think about the amount of
(08:48):
stuff that families have gonethrough, certainly in the last several
years with COVID 19, you know,understanding and seeing their kids
maybe in different ways. Theworld we live in today, is there
an ideal age when thiscustomized parenting plan should
be crafted? How old should thekids be? Should there be more than
(09:09):
one type of plan? That is tosay, when you first become a parent,
as an example, and then maybeolder, when you're. When your kids
are a bit older than they canparticipate in the crafting of the
plan.
Yeah, that's a great question.So when I first conceived of the
idea it was that you wouldstart creating this plan when your
(09:30):
child was about two or three,you know, in that first year, the
baby year. You know, it's moreabout that postpartum phase, right,
which you know, I write aboutin my, in my last books. But this
is more geared towards, okay,when did those parenting plans start
coming into effect? When doyou start needing them? And again,
(09:51):
look, looking at two andbeyond. So that was the initial idea
is starting it in those, inthose toddler, toddler days, you
know. And so each chapter,many of the ideas, you know, can
be geared towards that. But asthe book evolved, and again, as my
(10:11):
own family evolved, myself, myeditor, were like, we really want
this to be something that iseffective for parents of older children,
you know, because again, youknow, like my 12 year old, I hadn't
done all of the stuff that I'mtalking about in the book with him.
And like through accident, we,we had found, you know, parenting
(10:36):
plans for him that did workwell. But there were a lot of gaping
holes in how my husband and Iwere parenting him that we really
wanted to fix. So that becamea new focus. You know, how can we
create a book that is helpfulfor parents of all ages? And obviously,
(10:59):
you know, there's going to besome information that is more geared
towards a three or four yearold. Right. But then we try to balance
it out, you know, in the samesection, you know, with. Okay, but
now let's look at the sametopic. But if you have like a preteen,
an early, you know, earlyteen, and I would say it probably
(11:19):
goes up to like 15, 16, youknow, beyond that, you start to get
into, you know, youngadulthood and it's a whole other,
whole other bag of worms thatyou're dealing with. So I would say
up to like, yeah, 15, 16 isfrom like three to 16 is what we're
really focusing on. But yeah,you know, my hope is that it is,
(11:44):
that's really helpful for thatbig range of ages.
Along those lines, you talkedabout this idea that parenting in
your view is a livingdocument. What does that mean? How
would you go about definingthat? You talked about it a little
bit, but what's the definitionof that in your view? And why is
(12:04):
it particularly important inthe adolescent years?
Right. We are all changingconstantly. You know, as parents,
hopefully we're learning,we're growing. You know, you hear
so many parents talk about howtheir children are their teachers.
I find that to be so true. Butchildren especially, they are changing
(12:28):
rapid fire, you know, betweenthe ages That I mentioned, you know,
3, 16, there's so much change,not just mentally, but physically
as well. I write about that inthe book because I didn't know a
lot about what exactly,exactly are the changes that are
happening in their mind, intheir body. So I really wanted to
figure that out. But sorealizing that again, what like the
(12:54):
plan that you come up withwhen your child is four, even like
six months from then you mightrealize, oh, wow, my child has changed
in so many different ways.I've learned new things about myself
and my child that are shiftinghow I feel about communication or
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boundaries. And so I want togo back, you know, to this document
and any volvet to allow it togrow with myself, with my family.
And getting out of that ideathat if something in your plan isn't
working or needs to bechanged, it's not at all about failure
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or oh, I didn't do it right,or oh, like, I just, I just don't
know what I'm doing. But no,like, you're evolving, your child's
evolving, you're changing. Andso let the, the editing, the evolution
of your parenting plan be asuccess. You know, you are recognizing
(14:01):
those changes and reallytuning in to how they impact yourself
and your family. And you'regetting creative about how you can,
how you can shift that. Thatliving document.
You talked about intuitionearlier and your book really is rooted
in the idea that intuition,family values, and research based
(14:23):
insights are foundational toeffective parenting. How would you
go about describing how thosethree concepts intersect?
Right. So I feel like, youknow, the intuition is really like
your authentic self. It's whoyou really are. It's also, of course,
(14:47):
a combination of everythingthat you've experienced and learned
throughout your whole life.You know, science has shown, studies
have shown that that is a hugepiece of the intuition. You know,
everything that is up in yoursubconscious mind mostly. So a lot
of times when we're using ourintuition to help make a decision,
(15:09):
we're not consciously awareoften of all of the information that
our brain is processing tohelp us come to a conclusion. It's,
you know, all those memories,experiences inside the subconscious
mind. And with those values,they are also deeply connected to
the same thing, right? To allof your past experiences, beliefs,
(15:33):
everything that you havelearned, they've all shaped what
you most value, you know, inyour life. And, you know, thinking
about the rules that Imentioned so often, that intuition,
those authentic values that wehave can get really like muddied
(15:57):
as we, you know, go throughbeing influenced by TV by a book
by people in our life, youknow, by, you know, the rules at
our child's school, you know,for better or worse, and can push
us away from those values,from connecting with the intuition.
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And so I really believe. Andthat's, you know, I was very intentional
with, you know, how Iorganized the book and had intuition
at the very beginning, becauseI'm like, we need to connect with
that first. We need to figureout how to really tune into the intuition,
and then after that, tuninginto those values, you know, so those
(16:44):
are the two of the main thingsthat I wanted to really bring together,
to really awaken in the parentbefore we got more into the specifics
of, you know, the ninedifferent realms of parenting so
they could really guide us. Ikeep saying the word authentic, but
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that's just keep. Keeps comingto mind, you know, to guide us in
a way that is authentic forwho we are. Because when you're parenting
from that really authenticplace, when you're living right,
from an authentic place,things just start to get a little
bit easier. You know, youstart to feel a little bit lighter,
(17:27):
a little bit happier. Youknow, when you're, like, living in
your. Your authenticity, whichthen becomes living more, like, in
your sense of purpose. Right.You know, things just start to feel
a little bit better, a littlebit easier. So that was a really
important piece for me andsomething that, you know, took me
(17:50):
a long time to tune into, likein my 20s, my authenticity, you know,
intuition, they were justsorely underutilized. So once I,
you know, just as anindividual, connected with those
things, and then, especiallywhen I became a parent, it. For me,
(18:10):
it just became apparent thatthey're just crucial, crucial to
everything, but especially parenting.
And I think it's such animportant point that you're making
because a lot of parents canrelate to that because there is so
much noise, there are so manydistractions. There's so many things
that can, you know, infiltrateyour own confidence, your own ability
(18:33):
to be confident in yourparenting and your parenting style.
So it is certainly somethingthat a lot of people can relate to.
Bailey, when we talk about theresearch that you did for this book,
you talked about, you know,extensively researching and pouring
over papers and things likethat. Is there anything in the research
that struck you in particular?
(18:55):
Oh, that's a good question.Well, the first thing that comes
to mind was how much researchthere actually was about intuition.
I really wasn't expecting tofind that much. I was expecting that
chapter to be mainly aboutkind my own experiences, my own beliefs
about it. But I Was reallysurprised that there was so, so much
(19:21):
solid research about it. Youknow, for example, one of the. The
papers I read was aboutdentists and about when they did
not have time, you know, whenthey had to make a quick decision,
you know, about the health ofa patient, for example, if they were,
like, removing wisdom teeth orsomething like that, you know, so
(19:45):
often they made a much betterdecision, you know, and. And they
also looked at situationswhere they needed to make a quick
decision, but, like, they did.It wasn't an emergency, right? So
they had some time where theycould have gone and, like, done a
little bit of research and,you know, really used their, like,
(20:06):
analytical mind to try tofigure out, like, okay, well, what
is. What do my peers. What dothey say I should do? So if they
do that versus theirintuition, that more often than not,
when they just allow theirintuition, which, of course, in this
setting is obviously informedby extensive education, right? Like,
(20:27):
it's not just somebody off thestreet making this decision. It is
highly qualified, you know,dentists making this decision. But
that more often than not, thedecision that they made when it was
that gut instinct had betterresults than when they went and got
into the analytical mind. Andthen they started questioning themselves
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and weren't really sure, youknow, what should I do with this
particular situation? So Ithought that was really interesting
that they even looked in themedical field at all for information
about intuition that so manyother studies. And I'm trying to
think, you know, with. Withthe discipline as well. There were
(21:13):
a lot of really interestingpapers that I read, and. And I enjoyed
it because, you know, mypersonal parenting style probably,
you know, gears more towardskind of the, like, attachment parenting,
(21:34):
which, like I said earlier,you know, like, I admit in the book,
but I also try to not, like,make this, like, an undercover book
about, like, attachmentparenting being, like, the best.
But in all the research, youknow, my assumption was that, oh,
well, I'm sure most of thisresearch is going to, you know, back
up the beliefs I already have.And there were plenty, right? You
(21:59):
know, because there's. There'splenty to be said about attachment
parenting. But it was greatbecause there were plenty of studies
I read that that I don't wantto say, like, refuted parts of attachment
parenting, but showed somereally positive results from other
styles of parenting thatworked really well. And it allowed
(22:22):
me to really see that, like,okay, all of these different styles
of parenting, like tigerparenting, helicopter parenting,
there's something to be saidfor pieces of all of them, right?
You know, so nobody's Wrong,you know, in the style of parenting
(22:43):
that they're, you know,connected to. And again, the whole
thing with the book isrealizing that you don't have to
subscribe to just likeattachment parenting or helicopter
parent. You know, you can takewhat you want from all of those different
styles, again, make up yourown style, piece it together to have
something unique. But that wasreally helpful for me to be challenged
(23:04):
in a lot of preconceivednotions I had about parenting and
to feel that initialdefensiveness, like, well, surely
that can't be right. And itreally helped me develop a more open
mind, like an authenticallyopen mind. Not just like, yes, I'm
(23:26):
very open minded about thesetopics, but like, it really challenged
me. And so that, you know, wasfascinating for me. Surprising. And
yeah, just really, really helpful.
Did it end up in any wayinfluencing how you parent?
Yes, yes, I would sayspecifically, you know, with my,
(23:50):
my daughter, she's three and ahalf. She has a very strong personality.
She's so different than how myson was. And you know, she, if something's
happening that she does notlike, she will scream. And I mean,
my son never had liketantrums, but this girl, like, she
(24:15):
lets loose. And for so long Iwas trying, you know, more gentle
ways to help her work throughit. And like, nothing worked. And
so a lot of this research, youknow, offering ideas that were a
little bit more strict, youknow, things that at first I felt
(24:37):
like, oh, well, that justfeels too hard. Like not, not hard
and that it'd be hard to do,but just, just like too hard of a
line to have with her. Andlike, I don't know if I can do it,
but the research pushed me to,to try, you know. And like, for example,
you know, when she would bejust having a meltdown, I'd be trying
(24:59):
to like, talk to her and likereason with her. And I'd be asking
like soft questions, which I'msure with some children that works
great, but for her it wasn't.And so having that harder line, like,
you know, I can't understandwhat you're saying, you're hurting
my ears. You know, I, or insome cases like, you're trying to
(25:19):
hit me and hurt me and I can'tallow that to happen. And I'm going
to stand in either anotherpart of the room or in the next room
until you feel like you canactually like speak to me. And, and
at first I was feeling like,oh, well, that's like neglectful
or you know, I had all ofthese all this chatter in my mind,
(25:42):
but it worked great. You know,her realizing that I can't hold my
parent captive by screamingand yelling, you know, she, even
if I'm still in the same room,but I just disengage from the whole
dance of anger. It would likeget her out of it. So again, it was
(26:02):
very cool to see, see how allright. There's so many different
ways to do it and each child,you know, needs, needs something
different in, in many cases.
Another really relatableexample and I think it's such an
interesting one that you, thatyou point out and the fact that you
saw the research, were able toapply it in your own home and saw
(26:26):
the results is, is really sointeresting. When you talk about
the nine essential sort ofparenting elements that you talk
about in your book. There areseveral obviously that are, you know,
important to adolescents inparticular. When we talk about communication,
for example, that is, youknow, always important becomes, you
(26:46):
could argue, very tricky inthe adolescent years and in the development
years. How would you say, likewhat do you. Which could you offer
as tips and advice for parentsof kids in that age group, especially
in the age of texting and alack of face to face dialogue these
days.
(27:08):
Yeah, for, for us. And thisis, you know, what I tried to, you
know, convey in the book.Number one, you know, having these
family meetings that at firstlike, especially like the 12 year
old is like I don't want tolet sounds so boring but requiring
(27:30):
for us it was, it's once aweek having to like sit down as a
family and, and letting himknow as well. Like look, you can
bring your like own concernsto the table. If you feel like there's
rules or whatnot that areplaced on you that you don't feel
like are fair, bring them. Youknow, we're going to discuss it.
(27:52):
And so that started to, toopen up more commun. Communication.
Writing letters was alsohelpful because my son, he would
say I feel like I'm justrailroaded when I try to talk to
you or dad about screen time,for example. And he was right in
(28:16):
many ways. We would kind of,despite our best efforts, just jump
in with like, well this is whyyou already watch too much screen
time and these video games aretoo violent and and we wouldn't really
let him fully move through,you know, his thought process. So
we would start doing lettersas well. Sometimes like emails when
(28:38):
he started to want to likelearn how to type and whatnot. That
and then car time. I valuethat so much now with my son and,
and I'M taking advantage ofthat now. Right. Because once he
gets his driver's license,he's never going to want me to drive
him anywhere. But when yourchild is still needing you to drive
(29:02):
them around, really, reallyutilizing that car, time to try to,
you know, pull someconversation out of them. And, and
I also, a huge thing is notjust allowing conversations to be
about, like, my agenda orabout fixing something that's wrong,
(29:22):
you know, like, okay, great,now that I have you in the car, let's
talk about, you know, thatviolent video game that you downloaded
and how that's not okay. Butthinking about, you know, his interests
and really trying to engagehim in discussions about that. Sometimes
we, like, listen to a podcastthat he's really interested in and
then we talk about it, youknow, so letting him see that I'm
(29:47):
not just, like, thisdisciplinarian, you know, I also
authentically care about whatyou're interested in, and it helps
us, again, build thatrelationship beyond just me telling
him what to do, which I knowit can easily feel like that when
you're busy. Right? You know,you get home from school, it's like,
(30:07):
okay, unpack your lunchbox, doyour homework. Now it's time to get
ready for bed, blah, blah,blah. You know, we don't have a lot
of time to connect. So reallybeing intentional with creating that
space, even finding games thathe likes, I usually have to force
him at first to sit down anddo a board game or whatever it is.
But if it's a game that I knowhe enjoys, then he'll usually open
(30:30):
up. So it takes a little bitof pushing. But the more we started
to do this, and especially themore that I started to engage him
in topics that he actuallyenjoyed, it's easier now to. To get
him to open up and he's like,even, like, sharing, like, class
gossip and, like, who's dating who.
(30:54):
You've made a lot of progress,it sounds like.
Yeah, yeah, no, Very, veryexciting. And he doesn't shut down
as much. So, yeah, those are,you know, a few things that have
been helpful again, at leastfor, you know, this preteen stage.
For parents who may beinterested in crafting their own
parenting plan, what would yousay is one small step that they could
(31:17):
take today to make that happen?
Yeah, you know, I would saystart to make a list of what you're
doing as a parent that youfeel like is working and what you
feel like isn't working,because that is going to give you
(31:37):
a great jumping off point intofiguring out you know, what is it
that we want to change?Obviously, buying my book, that'll
help so much. But, yeah,really looking at what's working,
what's not working. And thenagain from there, you know, so many
(32:03):
questions, like, in a good waywill start to come up, like, okay,
this isn't working. What aresome ways we can change that? You
know, to get to that spacewhere, again, we're coming up with
an authentic parenting plan.
If there's one message thatyou want readers of Customized Parenting
to leave with Bailey, whatwould that be?
(32:24):
Yeah, I would say, number one,you are not a bad parent. Even if
you feel like at times certainparenting strategies are, like, failing,
you truly are. I reallybelieve that almost all parents,
we are doing our best all thetime. We are doing our best. We love
(32:47):
our kids, and we are trying.And by just, you know, just continue
to ask yourself questions,just be curious, Try to use parenting
as an avenue for creativityand just stay open to change. You
know, staying open to changeis such a huge one. Like, it's okay
for you to change and tochange your plans to. To roll with
(33:10):
your kids changes. You know,it's one of the most exciting parts
about life.
Lots of really interestingfood for thought. Bailey Gaddis,
author of Customized ParentingCreating Easy, Intuitive Parenting
Plans for Evolving Families.Really appreciate your time and your
perspective today. Thank youso much.
Thank you, Leanne. Iappreciate it. To learn more about
(33:32):
today's podcast guest andtopic, as well as other parenting
themes, visit whereparentstalk.com.
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parents through science,evidence, and the lived experience
of other parents. Learn how tobetter navigate the mental and physical
health of your tween teen oryoung adult through proven expert
(00:21):
advice. Here's your host,Lianne Castelino.
What if parenting didn't haveto feel like guesswork? What if you
could create a clear, flexibleparenting plan tailored to your child's
unique needs and your family'svalues? Welcome to Where Parents
Talk. My name is LianneCastelino. Our guest today is a certified
(00:43):
birthing doula and a certifiedparenting coach. Bailey Gaddis is
also a certifiedhypnotherapist and an authority.
Her latest book is calledCustomized Creating Easy Intuitive
Parenting Plans for EvolvingFamilies. Bailey is also a mother
of two, and she joins us todayfrom Ojai, California. Welcome, Bailey,
(01:05):
and thank you for being here.
Hello. Thank you for having me.
You work with many parents asboth a coach and a doula. Curious
as to what patterns andchallenges are you noticing that
led to this idea of creatingcustomized parenting plans?
Yeah, so the, the, you know,there's many. But the biggest thing
(01:26):
was so many parents, you know,clients, friends, myself being so
concerned about the rules, youknow, it's like, oh, I'm, you know,
really tempted to co. Sleepwith my child, for example, you know,
but the. The rule is you'renot supposed to or, you know, with
(01:47):
disciplining. You know, mymother says that this is the way
it's supposed to go, but I'm,you know, really Dr. On to doing
it another way and sorealizing that so many of us, granted,
like, we're not all operatingby the same rules. You know, our.
Our culture, our family oforigin. You know, there's so many
factors that influence therules that, you know, we're parenting
(02:09):
by, but realizing that in somany ways, they were preventing us
from parenting in a way thatfelt really authentic, really intuitive,
and parenting in a way thatfelt you the best for our family.
And each family is unique.Each parent, each child is unique.
(02:31):
So those rules was the firststep towards thinking, huh? You know,
I wonder. I wonder if wecleared the slate of all the rules
even. I mean, some might begreat, some might be good. We might
add some of them back in. Youknow, it's not that we're operating
from all these horrible, youknow, ideas about parenting, but
(02:52):
just clearing that slate.Slate. Connecting with that intuition
and then building upon thatclean slate, you know, what really
felt right for us andrealizing that it's okay if it's
different from the way thatyour mom, your sister, your friend,
that parenting author. It'sokay if it's different than, you
(03:16):
know, how they're doing it.
So let's break that down alittle bit. In what ways then, Bailey,
would you say specificallythat creating a parenting plan addresses
is what you just describedwith those rules?
Yeah. So in the book, again,like I said, we go through the process
of clearing that slate in thebeginning, really tuning into what
(03:39):
is intuition. It's a wordthat's thrown around a lot, but there's
a whole chapter going into thescience of intuition because it's
such a fascinating topic.There has been more research on it.
So really digging into whatthat is, how we connect to it, how
we can trust it, and thengoing into nine different components
(04:02):
of parenting. For example,communication. All right, so let's
look at the research that'sout there about communication. I
have different prompts likewhat would it look like your ideal
conversation between you andyour child? For example, if you were
discussing something with athree year old, that is a more challenging
(04:26):
discussion about I want thispopsicle for breakfast and you maybe
are feeling like that'sprobably not the healthiest choice.
You know, looking at how youwant that communication to go and
really finding a plan againfor the different components of communication
that feels good for you. Andknowing that a lot of it's trial
(04:48):
and error. Right. It's notjust that we figure out a plan and
it works perfectly andeverything is so easy and we don't
have to worry about it. Again,disciplining, you know, boundaries.
Eating, of course, you know,which is not just an issue in those
early years. You know, my 12year old, for example, he has more
(05:09):
autonomy now with what he eatsand it is mainly chips and ramen
noodles. So there's still alot to be done there. Yeah. So I
try to provide a balance of alot of research based information
because there is a wealth of,of knowledge out there, you know,
(05:30):
about, you know, for example,corporal punishment, that is. I really
tried to not be prescriptivein the book, but that is the one
thing where I say all theresearch shows we don't want to hit
our kids. Right. You know, sosharing research about that, but
(05:52):
you know, about communication,discipline, all the things. I think
I read a total of a littleover 250 research based papers for
this book and it. Which wasfascinating, very time consuming,
but I wanted to offer that toparents. Like, look, here is somewhat
(06:13):
subjective. You know, anyscience, any study is, has some subjective
nature to it. But offeringthat. Offering stories of, you know,
different ways to do it.Always reminding the parent that,
look, some of my opinions areprobably going to come out if you
(06:34):
don't agree with them. Great.Tune into that notice. Why don't
you agree with whatever thetechnique is that I'm talking about?
What would the opposite ofthat look like? So, always staying
in that space of curiosity,inquiry, and throughout the process
of the book and then thewriting aspects of it, because I
(06:57):
give parents a template tofill in for each aspect of the parenting
plan. Again with thecommunication, with eating, with
all of it. Very specificquestions to fill in. And the idea
is at the end that you havethis fully formed parenting plan
to jump off from. Right. Youknow, because like I said, we're
(07:19):
always evolving and we'realways changing, and this will be
like a living document that ischanging and growing with you. But,
yeah, to, like, really createsomething, you know, if you have
a partner with your partner,if your children are old enough to
discuss it, creating it withyour children as well, and hopefully
(07:43):
creating this. This plan, eventhis, like, family ethos that really
connects with everyone in thefamily, and then hopefully is something
that everybody is motivatedto. To work, you know, work the system
that you're. You're creating.So, and it's something that I did
as I was writing the book. Youknow, I'm like, I can't tell other
(08:04):
people to try these things, toanswer these questions unless I'm
actually doing it, which iswhy it took me. I've been working
on this book for almost fiveyears, maybe more. You know, thinking
about the initial idea of it,because I really wanted to try it
(08:24):
out, try the ideas out with myown families, my poor family. They
were my guinea pigs. But Ithink overall, it was a really positive
experience for us.
So along those lines, clearlya lot of passion and inspiration
for you to go down this road,devote five years of your time, involve
your family and all of that.When you think about the amount of
(08:48):
stuff that families have gonethrough, certainly in the last several
years with COVID 19, you know,understanding and seeing their kids
maybe in different ways. Theworld we live in today, is there
an ideal age when thiscustomized parenting plan should
be crafted? How old should thekids be? Should there be more than
(09:09):
one type of plan? That is tosay, when you first become a parent,
as an example, and then maybeolder, when you're. When your kids
are a bit older than they canparticipate in the crafting of the
plan.
Yeah, that's a great question.So when I first conceived of the
idea it was that you wouldstart creating this plan when your
(09:30):
child was about two or three,you know, in that first year, the
baby year. You know, it's moreabout that postpartum phase, right,
which you know, I write aboutin my, in my last books. But this
is more geared towards, okay,when did those parenting plans start
coming into effect? When doyou start needing them? And again,
(09:51):
look, looking at two andbeyond. So that was the initial idea
is starting it in those, inthose toddler, toddler days, you
know. And so each chapter,many of the ideas, you know, can
be geared towards that. But asthe book evolved, and again, as my
(10:11):
own family evolved, myself, myeditor, were like, we really want
this to be something that iseffective for parents of older children,
you know, because again, youknow, like my 12 year old, I hadn't
done all of the stuff that I'mtalking about in the book with him.
And like through accident, we,we had found, you know, parenting
(10:36):
plans for him that did workwell. But there were a lot of gaping
holes in how my husband and Iwere parenting him that we really
wanted to fix. So that becamea new focus. You know, how can we
create a book that is helpfulfor parents of all ages? And obviously,
(10:59):
you know, there's going to besome information that is more geared
towards a three or four yearold. Right. But then we try to balance
it out, you know, in the samesection, you know, with. Okay, but
now let's look at the sametopic. But if you have like a preteen,
an early, you know, earlyteen, and I would say it probably
(11:19):
goes up to like 15, 16, youknow, beyond that, you start to get
into, you know, youngadulthood and it's a whole other,
whole other bag of worms thatyou're dealing with. So I would say
up to like, yeah, 15, 16 isfrom like three to 16 is what we're
really focusing on. But yeah,you know, my hope is that it is,
(11:44):
that's really helpful for thatbig range of ages.
Along those lines, you talkedabout this idea that parenting in
your view is a livingdocument. What does that mean? How
would you go about definingthat? You talked about it a little
bit, but what's the definitionof that in your view? And why is
(12:04):
it particularly important inthe adolescent years?
Right. We are all changingconstantly. You know, as parents,
hopefully we're learning,we're growing. You know, you hear
so many parents talk about howtheir children are their teachers.
I find that to be so true. Butchildren especially, they are changing
(12:28):
rapid fire, you know, betweenthe ages That I mentioned, you know,
3, 16, there's so much change,not just mentally, but physically
as well. I write about that inthe book because I didn't know a
lot about what exactly,exactly are the changes that are
happening in their mind, intheir body. So I really wanted to
figure that out. But sorealizing that again, what like the
(12:54):
plan that you come up withwhen your child is four, even like
six months from then you mightrealize, oh, wow, my child has changed
in so many different ways.I've learned new things about myself
and my child that are shiftinghow I feel about communication or
(13:16):
boundaries. And so I want togo back, you know, to this document
and any volvet to allow it togrow with myself, with my family.
And getting out of that ideathat if something in your plan isn't
working or needs to bechanged, it's not at all about failure
(13:40):
or oh, I didn't do it right,or oh, like, I just, I just don't
know what I'm doing. But no,like, you're evolving, your child's
evolving, you're changing. Andso let the, the editing, the evolution
of your parenting plan be asuccess. You know, you are recognizing
(14:01):
those changes and reallytuning in to how they impact yourself
and your family. And you'regetting creative about how you can,
how you can shift that. Thatliving document.
You talked about intuitionearlier and your book really is rooted
in the idea that intuition,family values, and research based
(14:23):
insights are foundational toeffective parenting. How would you
go about describing how thosethree concepts intersect?
Right. So I feel like, youknow, the intuition is really like
your authentic self. It's whoyou really are. It's also, of course,
(14:47):
a combination of everythingthat you've experienced and learned
throughout your whole life.You know, science has shown, studies
have shown that that is a hugepiece of the intuition. You know,
everything that is up in yoursubconscious mind mostly. So a lot
of times when we're using ourintuition to help make a decision,
(15:09):
we're not consciously awareoften of all of the information that
our brain is processing tohelp us come to a conclusion. It's,
you know, all those memories,experiences inside the subconscious
mind. And with those values,they are also deeply connected to
the same thing, right? To allof your past experiences, beliefs,
(15:33):
everything that you havelearned, they've all shaped what
you most value, you know, inyour life. And, you know, thinking
about the rules that Imentioned so often, that intuition,
those authentic values that wehave can get really like muddied
(15:57):
as we, you know, go throughbeing influenced by TV by a book
by people in our life, youknow, by, you know, the rules at
our child's school, you know,for better or worse, and can push
us away from those values,from connecting with the intuition.
(16:22):
And so I really believe. Andthat's, you know, I was very intentional
with, you know, how Iorganized the book and had intuition
at the very beginning, becauseI'm like, we need to connect with
that first. We need to figureout how to really tune into the intuition,
and then after that, tuninginto those values, you know, so those
(16:44):
are the two of the main thingsthat I wanted to really bring together,
to really awaken in the parentbefore we got more into the specifics
of, you know, the ninedifferent realms of parenting so
they could really guide us. Ikeep saying the word authentic, but
(17:05):
that's just keep. Keeps comingto mind, you know, to guide us in
a way that is authentic forwho we are. Because when you're parenting
from that really authenticplace, when you're living right,
from an authentic place,things just start to get a little
bit easier. You know, youstart to feel a little bit lighter,
(17:27):
a little bit happier. Youknow, when you're, like, living in
your. Your authenticity, whichthen becomes living more, like, in
your sense of purpose. Right.You know, things just start to feel
a little bit better, a littlebit easier. So that was a really
important piece for me andsomething that, you know, took me
(17:50):
a long time to tune into, likein my 20s, my authenticity, you know,
intuition, they were justsorely underutilized. So once I,
you know, just as anindividual, connected with those
things, and then, especiallywhen I became a parent, it. For me,
(18:10):
it just became apparent thatthey're just crucial, crucial to
everything, but especially parenting.
And I think it's such animportant point that you're making
because a lot of parents canrelate to that because there is so
much noise, there are so manydistractions. There's so many things
that can, you know, infiltrateyour own confidence, your own ability
(18:33):
to be confident in yourparenting and your parenting style.
So it is certainly somethingthat a lot of people can relate to.
Bailey, when we talk about theresearch that you did for this book,
you talked about, you know,extensively researching and pouring
over papers and things likethat. Is there anything in the research
that struck you in particular?
(18:55):
Oh, that's a good question.Well, the first thing that comes
to mind was how much researchthere actually was about intuition.
I really wasn't expecting tofind that much. I was expecting that
chapter to be mainly aboutkind my own experiences, my own beliefs
about it. But I Was reallysurprised that there was so, so much
(19:21):
solid research about it. Youknow, for example, one of the. The
papers I read was aboutdentists and about when they did
not have time, you know, whenthey had to make a quick decision,
you know, about the health ofa patient, for example, if they were,
like, removing wisdom teeth orsomething like that, you know, so
(19:45):
often they made a much betterdecision, you know, and. And they
also looked at situationswhere they needed to make a quick
decision, but, like, they did.It wasn't an emergency, right? So
they had some time where theycould have gone and, like, done a
little bit of research and,you know, really used their, like,
(20:06):
analytical mind to try tofigure out, like, okay, well, what
is. What do my peers. What dothey say I should do? So if they
do that versus theirintuition, that more often than not,
when they just allow theirintuition, which, of course, in this
setting is obviously informedby extensive education, right? Like,
(20:27):
it's not just somebody off thestreet making this decision. It is
highly qualified, you know,dentists making this decision. But
that more often than not, thedecision that they made when it was
that gut instinct had betterresults than when they went and got
into the analytical mind. Andthen they started questioning themselves
(20:48):
and weren't really sure, youknow, what should I do with this
particular situation? So Ithought that was really interesting
that they even looked in themedical field at all for information
about intuition that so manyother studies. And I'm trying to
think, you know, with. Withthe discipline as well. There were
(21:13):
a lot of really interestingpapers that I read, and. And I enjoyed
it because, you know, mypersonal parenting style probably,
you know, gears more towardskind of the, like, attachment parenting,
(21:34):
which, like I said earlier,you know, like, I admit in the book,
but I also try to not, like,make this, like, an undercover book
about, like, attachmentparenting being, like, the best.
But in all the research, youknow, my assumption was that, oh,
well, I'm sure most of thisresearch is going to, you know, back
up the beliefs I already have.And there were plenty, right? You
(21:59):
know, because there's. There'splenty to be said about attachment
parenting. But it was greatbecause there were plenty of studies
I read that that I don't wantto say, like, refuted parts of attachment
parenting, but showed somereally positive results from other
styles of parenting thatworked really well. And it allowed
(22:22):
me to really see that, like,okay, all of these different styles
of parenting, like tigerparenting, helicopter parenting,
there's something to be saidfor pieces of all of them, right?
You know, so nobody's Wrong,you know, in the style of parenting
(22:43):
that they're, you know,connected to. And again, the whole
thing with the book isrealizing that you don't have to
subscribe to just likeattachment parenting or helicopter
parent. You know, you can takewhat you want from all of those different
styles, again, make up yourown style, piece it together to have
something unique. But that wasreally helpful for me to be challenged
(23:04):
in a lot of preconceivednotions I had about parenting and
to feel that initialdefensiveness, like, well, surely
that can't be right. And itreally helped me develop a more open
mind, like an authenticallyopen mind. Not just like, yes, I'm
(23:26):
very open minded about thesetopics, but like, it really challenged
me. And so that, you know, wasfascinating for me. Surprising. And
yeah, just really, really helpful.
Did it end up in any wayinfluencing how you parent?
Yes, yes, I would sayspecifically, you know, with my,
(23:50):
my daughter, she's three and ahalf. She has a very strong personality.
She's so different than how myson was. And you know, she, if something's
happening that she does notlike, she will scream. And I mean,
my son never had liketantrums, but this girl, like, she
(24:15):
lets loose. And for so long Iwas trying, you know, more gentle
ways to help her work throughit. And like, nothing worked. And
so a lot of this research, youknow, offering ideas that were a
little bit more strict, youknow, things that at first I felt
(24:37):
like, oh, well, that justfeels too hard. Like not, not hard
and that it'd be hard to do,but just, just like too hard of a
line to have with her. Andlike, I don't know if I can do it,
but the research pushed me to,to try, you know. And like, for example,
you know, when she would bejust having a meltdown, I'd be trying
(24:59):
to like, talk to her and likereason with her. And I'd be asking
like soft questions, which I'msure with some children that works
great, but for her it wasn't.And so having that harder line, like,
you know, I can't understandwhat you're saying, you're hurting
my ears. You know, I, or insome cases like, you're trying to
(25:19):
hit me and hurt me and I can'tallow that to happen. And I'm going
to stand in either anotherpart of the room or in the next room
until you feel like you canactually like speak to me. And, and
at first I was feeling like,oh, well, that's like neglectful
or you know, I had all ofthese all this chatter in my mind,
(25:42):
but it worked great. You know,her realizing that I can't hold my
parent captive by screamingand yelling, you know, she, even
if I'm still in the same room,but I just disengage from the whole
dance of anger. It would likeget her out of it. So again, it was
(26:02):
very cool to see, see how allright. There's so many different
ways to do it and each child,you know, needs, needs something
different in, in many cases.
Another really relatableexample and I think it's such an
interesting one that you, thatyou point out and the fact that you
saw the research, were able toapply it in your own home and saw
(26:26):
the results is, is really sointeresting. When you talk about
the nine essential sort ofparenting elements that you talk
about in your book. There areseveral obviously that are, you know,
important to adolescents inparticular. When we talk about communication,
for example, that is, youknow, always important becomes, you
(26:46):
could argue, very tricky inthe adolescent years and in the development
years. How would you say, likewhat do you. Which could you offer
as tips and advice for parentsof kids in that age group, especially
in the age of texting and alack of face to face dialogue these
days.
(27:08):
Yeah, for, for us. And thisis, you know, what I tried to, you
know, convey in the book.Number one, you know, having these
family meetings that at firstlike, especially like the 12 year
old is like I don't want tolet sounds so boring but requiring
(27:30):
for us it was, it's once aweek having to like sit down as a
family and, and letting himknow as well. Like look, you can
bring your like own concernsto the table. If you feel like there's
rules or whatnot that areplaced on you that you don't feel
like are fair, bring them. Youknow, we're going to discuss it.
(27:52):
And so that started to, toopen up more commun. Communication.
Writing letters was alsohelpful because my son, he would
say I feel like I'm justrailroaded when I try to talk to
you or dad about screen time,for example. And he was right in
(28:16):
many ways. We would kind of,despite our best efforts, just jump
in with like, well this is whyyou already watch too much screen
time and these video games aretoo violent and and we wouldn't really
let him fully move through,you know, his thought process. So
we would start doing lettersas well. Sometimes like emails when
(28:38):
he started to want to likelearn how to type and whatnot. That
and then car time. I valuethat so much now with my son and,
and I'M taking advantage ofthat now. Right. Because once he
gets his driver's license,he's never going to want me to drive
him anywhere. But when yourchild is still needing you to drive
(29:02):
them around, really, reallyutilizing that car, time to try to,
you know, pull someconversation out of them. And, and
I also, a huge thing is notjust allowing conversations to be
about, like, my agenda orabout fixing something that's wrong,
(29:22):
you know, like, okay, great,now that I have you in the car, let's
talk about, you know, thatviolent video game that you downloaded
and how that's not okay. Butthinking about, you know, his interests
and really trying to engagehim in discussions about that. Sometimes
we, like, listen to a podcastthat he's really interested in and
then we talk about it, youknow, so letting him see that I'm
(29:47):
not just, like, thisdisciplinarian, you know, I also
authentically care about whatyou're interested in, and it helps
us, again, build thatrelationship beyond just me telling
him what to do, which I knowit can easily feel like that when
you're busy. Right? You know,you get home from school, it's like,
(30:07):
okay, unpack your lunchbox, doyour homework. Now it's time to get
ready for bed, blah, blah,blah. You know, we don't have a lot
of time to connect. So reallybeing intentional with creating that
space, even finding games thathe likes, I usually have to force
him at first to sit down anddo a board game or whatever it is.
But if it's a game that I knowhe enjoys, then he'll usually open
(30:30):
up. So it takes a little bitof pushing. But the more we started
to do this, and especially themore that I started to engage him
in topics that he actuallyenjoyed, it's easier now to. To get
him to open up and he's like,even, like, sharing, like, class
gossip and, like, who's dating who.
(30:54):
You've made a lot of progress,it sounds like.
Yeah, yeah, no, Very, veryexciting. And he doesn't shut down
as much. So, yeah, those are,you know, a few things that have
been helpful again, at leastfor, you know, this preteen stage.
For parents who may beinterested in crafting their own
parenting plan, what would yousay is one small step that they could
(31:17):
take today to make that happen?
Yeah, you know, I would saystart to make a list of what you're
doing as a parent that youfeel like is working and what you
feel like isn't working,because that is going to give you
(31:37):
a great jumping off point intofiguring out you know, what is it
that we want to change?Obviously, buying my book, that'll
help so much. But, yeah,really looking at what's working,
what's not working. And thenagain from there, you know, so many
(32:03):
questions, like, in a good waywill start to come up, like, okay,
this isn't working. What aresome ways we can change that? You
know, to get to that spacewhere, again, we're coming up with
an authentic parenting plan.
If there's one message thatyou want readers of Customized Parenting
to leave with Bailey, whatwould that be?
(32:24):
Yeah, I would say, number one,you are not a bad parent. Even if
you feel like at times certainparenting strategies are, like, failing,
you truly are. I reallybelieve that almost all parents,
we are doing our best all thetime. We are doing our best. We love
(32:47):
our kids, and we are trying.And by just, you know, just continue
to ask yourself questions,just be curious, Try to use parenting
as an avenue for creativityand just stay open to change. You
know, staying open to changeis such a huge one. Like, it's okay
for you to change and tochange your plans to. To roll with
(33:10):
your kids changes. You know,it's one of the most exciting parts
about life.
Lots of really interestingfood for thought. Bailey Gaddis,
author of Customized ParentingCreating Easy, Intuitive Parenting
Plans for Evolving Families.Really appreciate your time and your
perspective today. Thank youso much.
Thank you, Leanne. Iappreciate it. To learn more about
(33:32):
today's podcast guest andtopic, as well as other parenting
themes, visit whereparentstalk.com.
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I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!