November 12, 2025 • 17 mins
What if quitting drinking isn’t actually the real problem?
In this episode of Wild Sobriety, I share how I stopped making alcohol the center of my life — and started focusing on what actually mattered: learning to handle real life without needing to escape it.
I talk about how changing my relationship with alcohol wasn’t about giving something up, but about raising the quality of my problems — from “how do I stop drinking?” to “how do I create a life that doesn’t need alcohol at all?”
It’s not about perfection. It’s about presence, power, and emotional maturity — the kind that makes you proud of who you’re becoming.
✨ Takeaways:
• The real reason trying to “quit drinking” keeps you stuck
• What I focus on now instead of “not drinking”
• How I learned to see alcohol as a symptom, not the source
• The truth about emotional avoidance and self-abandonment
• The simple question I ask myself that always brings me back to peace
Learn how to say no to alcohol, deprivation free with your wild feminine self.
2026 is the year you stop making rules to break, and finally get to work. Join me in 90 Days To Alcohol-Free Freedom In 2026 - Get a once in a life time bonus when you sign up before 2026 Click HERE to Book Your Clarity Call Today!
Download The Permission Protocol — my free 5-part mini-course — and start practicing the skills that make alcohol irrelevant on your terms.
DISCLAIMER: This podcast and its contents are not a substitute for rehabilitation, medical treatment or advice. It is for educational and inspirational purposes. I am not a therapist or doctor. The views here are expressed a personal opinion and based on first hand experience. Please consult a doctor if your mental or physical health is at risk.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (02:23):
Welcome back to the show, my beautiful warriors of
love.
Welcome to Wild Sobriety.
It's Mary Wagstaff.
I'm thrilled that you're here.
If you're new, welcome.
This is a really great sign thatyou are already starting to
shift your perspective.
This is what's possible for you.
When you start to step intothese new curiosities, I want
(02:45):
you to know that every singletime you look something up about
alcohol, you try to findsomething new about shifting
your perspective, about what'spossible for you and your
pleasure, you are growing yourawareness.
This is what is so powerfulabout you being here.
I have been coaching womenone-on-one and in group settings
for almost six years aroundalcohol coaching, but I've been
(03:07):
doing mindset and mindfulnesswork for 20 years, right
alongside with all of thedrinking I was doing.
And that's no longer my storyanymore.
And I am here to share with youthe powerful, powerful work that
is possible for you throughempowered feminine sobriety here
in our Wild Sobriety Podcast.
So what if I told you thatquitting drinking, just that
(03:29):
statement, is a low-valueproblem to have.
And that if that is what you arepursuing, you are going to stay
stuck in places of obsessing inthat cycle of just being a
drinker or a sober person.
And it's never going to help youget to the other side of it.
So we want to switch what we'recalling a low value problem to a
(03:53):
high value problem.
And we're going to explore thathere on today's show because you
want to have problems.
Problems are where it's going tohelp you grow, but you want to
make sure that the problems thatyou're focusing your energy on
are the ones that are going toserve you and your future.
So today, here's a perspectiveshift.
(04:15):
The low value problem that Icould have is that, oh my gosh,
I have to work and I have a sickkid that's home.
But the high value problem thatI have is that I work from home
and I have the availability tohave my sweet little baby boy
who never ever naps in thedoorway of my office right here.
(04:35):
So a low value problem issomething that keeps you looking
outside of yourself for ansolution.
And what it ends up doing is ittakes your power away.
And I wanted to preface thisconversation with this idea of
low value and high valueproblems, is not a concept that
I created, but I watched acoaching call yesterday with one
(04:55):
of my teachers, Brooke Castilloof the Life Coach School.
And she was talking about howproblems and the quality of
problems and how we really needto know and define very
specifically what our problemsare.
Now, for our example withalcohol, we know the impact of
no longer drinking has rewardsthat are unimaginable to you.
(05:19):
But the reason it's a lowquality problem for you right
now is because part of youdoesn't want to not drink and be
sober.
It's because of the perspectiveof the way that you are looking
at it.
And the other reason that justfocusing on not drinking, I
can't drink, which creates thisfeeling of deprivation and a
lack of control, gives yourpower away.
(05:42):
And alcohol is an externalcircumstance that you can't ever
change.
So one of the traps people getinto is if I could just have
one, this moderation conundrumwhere there's still you're still
outsourcing your power andcentering the change around
alcohol.
Alcohol becomes the center ofchange versus you becoming the
(06:04):
center of change, whereeverything that you do is 100%
in your control.
I really want you to get into aplace of shifting your
perspective from a low-valueproblem to a high value problem
of what you're actually changingand the bigger problem you want
to have, like the good problemthat you want to have on the
(06:27):
other side of alcohol, whatalcohol-free freedom actually
means to you.
You could have one shift ofperspective and take one low
value problem and shift it to ahigh value problem and just
focus on that one thing for allof next year until you have
completely mastered it andchanged the course of your life
(06:48):
forever.
And alcohol is the one thing,even though it's just one spoke
of your life, you're in thecenter of change.
However, because of the natureof alcohol, it kind of leaves
this veil and this film overeverything because we associate
it with so many of these areasof life.
We associate it with the way weshow up with our children, with
(07:11):
our social life, with the energywe have for work and our
perspective.
The question I want you to askyourself right now is do you
want to be the victim or thehero of this journey?
And I know you, and you arealready the hero of your own
life because there are so manyhigh-value problems that you've
created.
And every single thing that youthink is a problem in your life
(07:33):
right now that doesn't feel likea worthy endeavor, you can
reframe that, or you can justdecide that's a problem.
And there is some truth withyes, alcohol is an addictive
chemical.
So the problem can be with justthe drinking in and of itself.
(07:53):
But from my approach, from thefive shifts, the permission
protocol, everything you'lllearn here in Wild Sobriety is
that beliefs are more importantthan the behavior.
And alcohol is the symptom of abigger problem.
Alcohol is the low-value problemof a bigger problem.
And in our case, the biggerproblem is a feeling problem.
(08:16):
The bigger problem is a boredomproblem.
The bigger problem is uh feelingnervous and anxious about being
your authentic self problem orspending time by yourself or
feeling lonely problem.
Everything, every associationthat you have with alcohol has
another emotion behind it.
(08:38):
It might be an excitementproblem.
And how do I feel all thisexcitement in my body?
And can I have fun be fun and beplayful?
Now, when you solve for afeeling problem, well, you are a
human.
So here's the good news is thething that makes you human from
(08:59):
everything else on the planet isyour emotions.
And when you can solve for thoseemotions and you learn how to be
by yourself, you learn how tofeel the sensations of boredom,
and then learn how to shift thatperspective to create a new
(09:20):
intentional emotion on your ownbecause every single emotion
you're numbing, and you learnhow to relax without feeling
guilty, that's a problem worthhaving.
So I want you to look at thehigh value problems that come
when you start to solve theemotions and the sensations.
(09:41):
And I really look at the urgefor alcohol as an emotion
because it shows up just thesame.
Even though there might be alittle bit of a physical
craving, it's kind of hard todifferentiate whether it's an
urge that comes from attachmentjust because it's always what we
do in the habit, or there's areal embody, the body is waiting
for it.
(10:02):
And sometimes it's both.
But there are a lot of timeswhere we don't really want to
drink, but we drink becausewe're not sure what else to do.
And it's because of what we'vealways done.
So that's the place where weexplore, and that's the high
value problem you get to have isgetting to know the honor that
it is to be fully human anduniquely yourself.
(10:25):
Because whether it's one drinkor whether it's 20 drinks, you
are altering your authenticexpression.
So the better problem that youwant to have is not that I need
to stop drinking, is that I needto honor my fullest expression,
is finding freedom in myauthentic self and change the
(10:45):
course of your life because it'sgoing to show up in every single
area.
And you get to be in betweenthis place and discerning what
is for me and what am I maybejust scared of.
So when you chase the alcoholproblem, you're chasing the
problem that you drink too much,that that's the problem.
(11:05):
But when you shift yourperspective to know that I'm
getting to learn more about whoI am on a deeper level, now that
is a problem worth facing everysingle day.
Because this is a high valueproblem.
And this high value problem is100% in your control.
(11:27):
It has nothing to do with thecircumstances outside of you.
It's about how do I embody thesensations?
How do those show up?
What is the actual emotion thatI'm experiencing?
What needs do I have that arebeing met?
What new focus on the alcohol asthe problem itself is keeping
you out of your power.
(11:49):
It's not how do I avoid alcohol,but it's about how do I honor my
authentic feelings.
This is how you start to trustyourself again, too, because
instead of relying on anythingoutside of yourself, you see
that ripple effect in every areaof your life.
So you're the center of thewheel of change.
All of those thoughts that youhad that created the desire to
(12:13):
alter start to fade away becausethey don't have, there's no more
evidence to support that theyare true.
And this is why it's soimportant to evaluate.
It's so important to create aplan and practice and implement
again and again and again forlong enough until that high
value perspective of the changethat you're making actually
(12:35):
sticks.
Okay.
So here are some of the highvalue problems that you also get
to have on the other side ofalcohol.
So first it's about what you'resolving, but most of you don't
believe that things are going tobe better on the other side of
alcohol.
So here are the high valueproblems myself and my clients
(12:55):
have on the other side ofalcohol.
And you get to pick one of thoseto start to work towards.
How do I manage all of thiscognitive fire in my brain?
When I quit drinking, I had somany ideas inside of me that
just started to bubble up.
It was, oh my gosh.
I mean, I started the podcast.
I wanted to, I started writingagain.
I started sharing.
(13:16):
I started teaching.
I started facilitating.
I started gathering.
That's a good problem to have.
I have so many ideas.
I don't know which one to focuson.
How do I channel all this energyI'm waking up with?
I'm waking up at 5 a.m.
What do I do with this energy?
Good problem to have.
What new thing do I want tolearn today?
Because I have so much space inmy mind now and I'm so excited
(13:38):
for possibility.
How do I relax without feeling?
Or now that I can just relax allday, every day, I get to relax
without feeling guilty.
This is a good problem to have.
Should I take another nap today?
Good problem to have.
Which social engagement do Ihave to say no to?
(14:00):
I will tell you, my social lifebecame so much more interesting
because instead of just focusingon things where alcohol was
involved, I was actually goingto like all of the things
because I was my brain was sowrapped up in alcohol.
So it's like there's a lot ofsocial engagements to say no to
when you feel you have moreoptions because alcohol isn't a
(14:20):
problem.
And the list goes on and on.
And for me personally, I want toread to you a message that one
of my clients sent me.
She says, Everything's better.
I'm waking up at five, gettingto the gym before everyone wakes
up.
She's waking up with so muchenergy.
I'm in a good mood.
I'm reading books again.
I have so many books I want toread.
(14:42):
And really, most of the people Iknow have really high value
problems.
And so I want you to think aboutover this next when we say to
ourselves, that's a good problemto have.
It's oh my gosh, I'm so busy.
Okay.
That's a good problem to have.
It's a good problem that you canactually physically, mentally,
(15:05):
emotionally do all of thosethings, just physically.
I'm so healthy, I can do all ofthe things.
Busyness is a good thing.
And if it's not, then you needto shift your perspective
because maybe you're thinking ina low-value problem cycle.
I have so much patience.
People are just walking all overme.
(15:26):
And then she says, it I realizethat it wasn't my relationship
that was the issue.
It was my attitude as a resultof drinking.
I honor my authentic expressionso much that the people around
me don't even know who I amanymore.
I've become such a differentperson.
That's a great problem to havein the best way possible.
(15:48):
I have become such a new versionof myself.
And you are, and then I'm givingpeople permission to do the
same.
And the truth is, is that wegrow and we change.
And some people will fall awayand others will remain.
So the real shift is not askinghow do I stop drinking, but the
(16:08):
shift is asking, who am Ibecoming?
And what is the problem, thehigh value problem that she has.
When you focus on the high valueproblem that you're trying to
solve, the low value problemwill go away all on its own.
You become the woman who honorsher feelings and the one who
steps into her authenticexpression.
(16:30):
This is not shame.
We're not really taught how todo this.
We're learning as we go.
We're all always children.
We're all always studentsbecause you've never lived this
moment in this body here now.
So don't think that I shouldknow how to do this.
Just know that the availabilityfor the tools and the skill set
and the support is available toyou here now, here on the show,
(16:53):
in all of the free resources inthe wild sobriety community.
Every single Wednesday inside ofthe community until January
2026, I will be hosting apermission magic skills and
share.
It will be a call to share,which there's so much power in
having your voice heard,witnessing other people.
It doesn't have to be aboutalcohol, it could be whatever's
(17:14):
present for you and whateverlittle topic I teach on based on
the five shifts and thepermission protocol.
So the link for everything youneed is right here in the
description.
And I can't wait to see youinside the wild sobriety
community.
Welcome back to the show, my beautiful warriors of
love.
Welcome to Wild Sobriety.
It's Mary Wagstaff.
I'm thrilled that you're here.
If you're new, welcome.
This is a really great sign thatyou are already starting to
shift your perspective.
This is what's possible for you.
When you start to step intothese new curiosities, I want
(02:45):
you to know that every singletime you look something up about
alcohol, you try to findsomething new about shifting
your perspective, about what'spossible for you and your
pleasure, you are growing yourawareness.
This is what is so powerfulabout you being here.
I have been coaching womenone-on-one and in group settings
for almost six years aroundalcohol coaching, but I've been
(03:07):
doing mindset and mindfulnesswork for 20 years, right
alongside with all of thedrinking I was doing.
And that's no longer my storyanymore.
And I am here to share with youthe powerful, powerful work that
is possible for you throughempowered feminine sobriety here
in our Wild Sobriety Podcast.
So what if I told you thatquitting drinking, just that
(03:29):
statement, is a low-valueproblem to have.
And that if that is what you arepursuing, you are going to stay
stuck in places of obsessing inthat cycle of just being a
drinker or a sober person.
And it's never going to help youget to the other side of it.
So we want to switch what we'recalling a low value problem to a
(03:53):
high value problem.
And we're going to explore thathere on today's show because you
want to have problems.
Problems are where it's going tohelp you grow, but you want to
make sure that the problems thatyou're focusing your energy on
are the ones that are going toserve you and your future.
So today, here's a perspectiveshift.
(04:15):
The low value problem that Icould have is that, oh my gosh,
I have to work and I have a sickkid that's home.
But the high value problem thatI have is that I work from home
and I have the availability tohave my sweet little baby boy
who never ever naps in thedoorway of my office right here.
(04:35):
So a low value problem issomething that keeps you looking
outside of yourself for ansolution.
And what it ends up doing is ittakes your power away.
And I wanted to preface thisconversation with this idea of
low value and high valueproblems, is not a concept that
I created, but I watched acoaching call yesterday with one
(04:55):
of my teachers, Brooke Castilloof the Life Coach School.
And she was talking about howproblems and the quality of
problems and how we really needto know and define very
specifically what our problemsare.
Now, for our example withalcohol, we know the impact of
no longer drinking has rewardsthat are unimaginable to you.
(05:19):
But the reason it's a lowquality problem for you right
now is because part of youdoesn't want to not drink and be
sober.
It's because of the perspectiveof the way that you are looking
at it.
And the other reason that justfocusing on not drinking, I
can't drink, which creates thisfeeling of deprivation and a
lack of control, gives yourpower away.
(05:42):
And alcohol is an externalcircumstance that you can't ever
change.
So one of the traps people getinto is if I could just have
one, this moderation conundrumwhere there's still you're still
outsourcing your power andcentering the change around
alcohol.
Alcohol becomes the center ofchange versus you becoming the
(06:04):
center of change, whereeverything that you do is 100%
in your control.
I really want you to get into aplace of shifting your
perspective from a low-valueproblem to a high value problem
of what you're actually changingand the bigger problem you want
to have, like the good problemthat you want to have on the
(06:27):
other side of alcohol, whatalcohol-free freedom actually
means to you.
You could have one shift ofperspective and take one low
value problem and shift it to ahigh value problem and just
focus on that one thing for allof next year until you have
completely mastered it andchanged the course of your life
(06:48):
forever.
And alcohol is the one thing,even though it's just one spoke
of your life, you're in thecenter of change.
However, because of the natureof alcohol, it kind of leaves
this veil and this film overeverything because we associate
it with so many of these areasof life.
We associate it with the way weshow up with our children, with
(07:11):
our social life, with the energywe have for work and our
perspective.
The question I want you to askyourself right now is do you
want to be the victim or thehero of this journey?
And I know you, and you arealready the hero of your own
life because there are so manyhigh-value problems that you've
created.
And every single thing that youthink is a problem in your life
(07:33):
right now that doesn't feel likea worthy endeavor, you can
reframe that, or you can justdecide that's a problem.
And there is some truth withyes, alcohol is an addictive
chemical.
So the problem can be with justthe drinking in and of itself.
(07:53):
But from my approach, from thefive shifts, the permission
protocol, everything you'lllearn here in Wild Sobriety is
that beliefs are more importantthan the behavior.
And alcohol is the symptom of abigger problem.
Alcohol is the low-value problemof a bigger problem.
And in our case, the biggerproblem is a feeling problem.
(08:16):
The bigger problem is a boredomproblem.
The bigger problem is uh feelingnervous and anxious about being
your authentic self problem orspending time by yourself or
feeling lonely problem.
Everything, every associationthat you have with alcohol has
another emotion behind it.
(08:38):
It might be an excitementproblem.
And how do I feel all thisexcitement in my body?
And can I have fun be fun and beplayful?
Now, when you solve for afeeling problem, well, you are a
human.
So here's the good news is thething that makes you human from
(08:59):
everything else on the planet isyour emotions.
And when you can solve for thoseemotions and you learn how to be
by yourself, you learn how tofeel the sensations of boredom,
and then learn how to shift thatperspective to create a new
(09:20):
intentional emotion on your ownbecause every single emotion
you're numbing, and you learnhow to relax without feeling
guilty, that's a problem worthhaving.
So I want you to look at thehigh value problems that come
when you start to solve theemotions and the sensations.
(09:41):
And I really look at the urgefor alcohol as an emotion
because it shows up just thesame.
Even though there might be alittle bit of a physical
craving, it's kind of hard todifferentiate whether it's an
urge that comes from attachmentjust because it's always what we
do in the habit, or there's areal embody, the body is waiting
for it.
(10:02):
And sometimes it's both.
But there are a lot of timeswhere we don't really want to
drink, but we drink becausewe're not sure what else to do.
And it's because of what we'vealways done.
So that's the place where weexplore, and that's the high
value problem you get to have isgetting to know the honor that
it is to be fully human anduniquely yourself.
(10:25):
Because whether it's one drinkor whether it's 20 drinks, you
are altering your authenticexpression.
So the better problem that youwant to have is not that I need
to stop drinking, is that I needto honor my fullest expression,
is finding freedom in myauthentic self and change the
(10:45):
course of your life because it'sgoing to show up in every single
area.
And you get to be in betweenthis place and discerning what
is for me and what am I maybejust scared of.
So when you chase the alcoholproblem, you're chasing the
problem that you drink too much,that that's the problem.
(11:05):
But when you shift yourperspective to know that I'm
getting to learn more about whoI am on a deeper level, now that
is a problem worth facing everysingle day.
Because this is a high valueproblem.
And this high value problem is100% in your control.
(11:27):
It has nothing to do with thecircumstances outside of you.
It's about how do I embody thesensations?
How do those show up?
What is the actual emotion thatI'm experiencing?
What needs do I have that arebeing met?
What new focus on the alcohol asthe problem itself is keeping
you out of your power.
(11:49):
It's not how do I avoid alcohol,but it's about how do I honor my
authentic feelings.
This is how you start to trustyourself again, too, because
instead of relying on anythingoutside of yourself, you see
that ripple effect in every areaof your life.
So you're the center of thewheel of change.
All of those thoughts that youhad that created the desire to
(12:13):
alter start to fade away becausethey don't have, there's no more
evidence to support that theyare true.
And this is why it's soimportant to evaluate.
It's so important to create aplan and practice and implement
again and again and again forlong enough until that high
value perspective of the changethat you're making actually
(12:35):
sticks.
Okay.
So here are some of the highvalue problems that you also get
to have on the other side ofalcohol.
So first it's about what you'resolving, but most of you don't
believe that things are going tobe better on the other side of
alcohol.
So here are the high valueproblems myself and my clients
(12:55):
have on the other side ofalcohol.
And you get to pick one of thoseto start to work towards.
How do I manage all of thiscognitive fire in my brain?
When I quit drinking, I had somany ideas inside of me that
just started to bubble up.
It was, oh my gosh.
I mean, I started the podcast.
I wanted to, I started writingagain.
I started sharing.
(13:16):
I started teaching.
I started facilitating.
I started gathering.
That's a good problem to have.
I have so many ideas.
I don't know which one to focuson.
How do I channel all this energyI'm waking up with?
I'm waking up at 5 a.m.
What do I do with this energy?
Good problem to have.
What new thing do I want tolearn today?
Because I have so much space inmy mind now and I'm so excited
(13:38):
for possibility.
How do I relax without feeling?
Or now that I can just relax allday, every day, I get to relax
without feeling guilty.
This is a good problem to have.
Should I take another nap today?
Good problem to have.
Which social engagement do Ihave to say no to?
(14:00):
I will tell you, my social lifebecame so much more interesting
because instead of just focusingon things where alcohol was
involved, I was actually goingto like all of the things
because I was my brain was sowrapped up in alcohol.
So it's like there's a lot ofsocial engagements to say no to
when you feel you have moreoptions because alcohol isn't a
(14:20):
problem.
And the list goes on and on.
And for me personally, I want toread to you a message that one
of my clients sent me.
She says, Everything's better.
I'm waking up at five, gettingto the gym before everyone wakes
up.
She's waking up with so muchenergy.
I'm in a good mood.
I'm reading books again.
I have so many books I want toread.
(14:42):
And really, most of the people Iknow have really high value
problems.
And so I want you to think aboutover this next when we say to
ourselves, that's a good problemto have.
It's oh my gosh, I'm so busy.
Okay.
That's a good problem to have.
It's a good problem that you canactually physically, mentally,
(15:05):
emotionally do all of thosethings, just physically.
I'm so healthy, I can do all ofthe things.
Busyness is a good thing.
And if it's not, then you needto shift your perspective
because maybe you're thinking ina low-value problem cycle.
I have so much patience.
People are just walking all overme.
(15:26):
And then she says, it I realizethat it wasn't my relationship
that was the issue.
It was my attitude as a resultof drinking.
I honor my authentic expressionso much that the people around
me don't even know who I amanymore.
I've become such a differentperson.
That's a great problem to havein the best way possible.
(15:48):
I have become such a new versionof myself.
And you are, and then I'm givingpeople permission to do the
same.
And the truth is, is that wegrow and we change.
And some people will fall awayand others will remain.
So the real shift is not askinghow do I stop drinking, but the
(16:08):
shift is asking, who am Ibecoming?
And what is the problem, thehigh value problem that she has.
When you focus on the high valueproblem that you're trying to
solve, the low value problemwill go away all on its own.
You become the woman who honorsher feelings and the one who
steps into her authenticexpression.
(16:30):
This is not shame.
We're not really taught how todo this.
We're learning as we go.
We're all always children.
We're all always studentsbecause you've never lived this
moment in this body here now.
So don't think that I shouldknow how to do this.
Just know that the availabilityfor the tools and the skill set
and the support is available toyou here now, here on the show,
(16:53):
in all of the free resources inthe wild sobriety community.
Every single Wednesday inside ofthe community until January
2026, I will be hosting apermission magic skills and
share.
It will be a call to share,which there's so much power in
having your voice heard,witnessing other people.
It doesn't have to be aboutalcohol, it could be whatever's
(17:14):
present for you and whateverlittle topic I teach on based on
the five shifts and thepermission protocol.
So the link for everything youneed is right here in the
description.
And I can't wait to see youinside the wild sobriety
community.
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