March 25, 2025 • 34 mins
What’s stopping your business growth?
In this episode, Corwin Smith unpacks the following:
- The biggest challenges leaders face, from team alignment to psychological safety.
- Why setting BHAGs (Big Hairy Audacious Goals), fostering open communication, and embracing long-term strategies are essential for business success.
- How coaching, leadership vision, and company culture shape the future of organizations.
From BHAGs to team alignment, this episode is packed with essential strategies for any leader. Start listening today to learn how to cultivate a powerful company culture and achieve long-term success.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome back Rockstars.
Today's guest is Corwin Smith,and guys, I'm telling you this
is going to be an emotional onefor me.
I didn't cry during the episode.
I might cry during the intro.
I always film these thingsafterwards.
Corwin was one of my favoritecoaches.
He did some very special thingswith our team.
He's responsible in a big wayfor unifying our company.
The time that we spent with himI'll say it in the episode was
(00:26):
sacred.
And that sounds like overlydramatic and cheesy, and I get
that, but it is what it is.
When you suffer as much as youdo as a business owner,
especially in private practice,you hold on to those times where
it all becomes worth it.
His efforts and the way that hewas able to work with our team
(00:49):
is something that he's going totalk about in today's episode.
So listen closely to thepitfalls as to why some
companies never becomesuccessful or stay stuck.
Listen very closely to hisexperience as a coach, of how he
invests in people and how hetalks about coaching in general,
because it's such a genericterm, right Like?
I don't know about you, but Iget sick and tired of just
hearing about coaching this andcoaching that, even though I am
a coach.
It's just a very broad term,and so he gives some specificity
(01:10):
to that term for you to helpyou understand, at least from
his perspective, what mattersand not.
But what's cool is I get toshare my experience of exiting,
and that's very special to me.
So I'm grateful that I get toshare this moment with you in
today's episode as Corwin stepsin and teaches us all about
business.
Enjoy the show, corwin man.
So listen, this has been a bigquestion for me that I would
(01:34):
love to pick your brain on.
Why do you think companies failto grow?
Speaker 2 (01:46):
it's something I've watched, like you know, from
growing my my previous companyand then I've just clipped over
nine years in a coaching role.
I think there's like two majorconstraints why companies fail
to grow.
So, um, the first constraint itreally comes down to the leader
.
Right, as it goes, the leadergoes to the team and team and
(02:07):
like some of the barriers thatleaders run into, like number
one I've found is like leaderslack proper ambition.
So they commonly, when peoplehear the word ambition, I think
there's kind of a negative bentwith ambition today.
And when I think about ambition,I think about ambition which is
like what's my personal why orpurpose for what I'm doing?
(02:28):
Right.
And so like what I've noticedwith leaders that are just kind
of stuck, like they stagnate.
Maybe they get to some moderatelevel of success, then they
kind of stall.
What I found talking to them iswhen I ask them like what is
the purpose for you working?
Sometimes they have some kindof purpose centered around maybe
(02:49):
doing something positive in theworld, which is cool, but
they're not really clear aboutwhy they're working.
My 25 to 30 years ofunemployment, aka retirement,
wow, yeah, so specific, right?
(03:19):
So so the way I look at it islike I have a really practical
or pragmatic or fundamentalpurpose for working which is
about earning and saving,investing enough, right, like I
have a big, you know, financialgap still to close number one.
And then number two is like acertain level of impact or
difference I want to make in theworld, so like there's that
piece of it which is reallydriven by the founder or the
senior leader of the company isthe reason why companies, I
(03:39):
found, fail to grow.
And then the second thing isthe inability to find, hire and
retain enough of the rightpeople.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
Amen.
Every single PT, ot and SLPowner right now is going.
You can say that again Becausethey're struggling right now to
find talent.
But I love how you simply putthat the barriers to growth are
the individual leader, both interms of clarity on their
purpose as well, as I love thatambition piece like misguided
(04:08):
ambition.
You might have a therapy owner,for example, who loves to treat
and they're ambitious aboutthat, but they're not ambitious
about growing the core businessand then, on the other hand,
it's growing the people and theteam around it.
Totally.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
Yeah, and so what's interesting is I've been
developing this with clients andeven inside of my my own
business here with with the teamI have.
It's like getting clients orbusiness owners first clear on
what their ambition is and thenlike their financial ambition,
which is the simplest, like it'sjust it's a math equation, and
(04:42):
then having them work with atleast their senior leaders on
what the senior leader'sfinancial ambition is.
Because number one, it'sgenerally it's really sobering
from a financial perspectivelike how big the gaps are for
people.
And then number two is likeit's just forefront and in front
of you about how you need towork.
(05:03):
It helps me and helps othersI've noticed orient in the kind
of work they need to be doing.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
I love that when we work together.
One of my favorite things thatyou did using a combination of a
couple of coaching programslike there was the Gazelles
thing that Vern Harnish createdthe author of the book Scaling
Up for those who know, VernHarnish created the author of
the book Scaling Up for thosewho know but then you also have
the Wake Up Warrior kind ofinfluence and you bring together
(05:32):
from your own coachingbackground, having owned and
operated and successfully soldthis massive restoration company
, that you bring these elementsin in a way that engaged my team
.
That's what I remember is I hadfour locations when we started
working together and I don'tknow there was something about
like me developing myself as aleader which you said was the
first constraint with my team,like having them in the room so
(05:54):
that we were all workingtogether towards creating that,
because those were fun days, man.
Speaker 2 (05:59):
It was a blast.
It was so much fun.
I still remember vividly itmight've been our second
strategic planning session whenwe did an evolution with the
one-page life plan with yourteam there and we had a member
of your team that was in more oflike an administrative or
(06:20):
support role and I just rememberthis individual just having
tears, being able to realizethat by them like fulfilling the
commitments inside of theorganization they could actually
fulfill on their life goals andlike their life vision.
It was just.
It was such a, it was such likea watershed moment for me as a
coach.
To like see the impactfirsthand and watch it with the
(06:41):
team is like the team pulledtogether and it's like, hey,
this is about more than justlike a J-O-B or earning money.
This is like, yeah, like we'regoing to do the money thing and
like I can also develop myselfas a human being.
It's really extraordinary.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Yeah, I you know, and it was so powerful because,
like you, were impacted.
It was a watershed moment foryou, but it was for me as well.
I will say that those days thatwe spent because we would meet
with you every quarter, wereally leaned into it.
Like our team would take thattime off.
We'd go to dinner the nightbefore, we'd meet with you.
But those days in retrospectnow, Corwin, are sacred for me.
(07:17):
They're sacred moments of timewhen I went from being a
business owner who was justrunning around trying to make
things work and being tired andbeing victimized, to being this
member of this community in myown company.
And it was so cool because Ithink again, I developed in real
(07:38):
time as I was developing myleaders with the right coaching.
And there was a lot of tacticalstuff in those meetings.
There was the whole financialpieces, but there was an art to
it as well.
I felt like and I feel likethis is true for business
there's an art and a science toit, and that's why I think
having that quarterly touchpoint with you every single
three months was so vital,because we would be, we would be
(08:01):
reminded of our purpose, butwe'd also set some financial
targets and then we'd completecycles.
I always wanted to ask you howdid you know how to guide our
group?
Because you would help us pullout priorities, You'd help us
find the bigger rocks to move,but you would include everyone
and we never landed on.
Like you know what I mean.
(08:22):
Sometimes people are just wrong.
There was many ideas that cameup that were not great.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
Just awful Mine included.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
Yeah, but no one ever felt negated or invalidated
either.
Like how do you?
I always wanted to ask you, howdid you do that through those
meetings?
That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
Good question.
It's an opportunity for me toreflect and think about that.
Hmm, yeah, I think there's twothings going in the background,
like from a, from a coach'sperspective, and kind of what
I'm thinking about is likethere's an interesting dynamic
at place, because the firstdynamic at place is, like I see
(08:58):
what's possible for theorganization and the team right,
like I see what they couldaccomplish.
The problem is is, if it's myvision right and it's my goals,
it's mine.
So, like there's a, there's areally fine balance between,
like me seeing what's possiblefor this team and for the
(09:21):
organization, based on, like,who they are and what the
marketplace looks like andeverything I can see there.
Balancing that with like whatdo they actually want and what
the marketplace looks like andeverything I can see there.
Balancing that with like whatdo they actually want and what
can they see?
Speaker 1 (09:33):
I see, so you have this ability to see a vision of
where to go, and so much so that, like the entrepreneur in you,
almost wants to like guide themthere.
Yeah, I want to tell them.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
I want to tell them like, hey guys, go here Like
this looks like a massiveopportunity, but then it'd be
mine.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
Yeah, I've done that mistake in coaching since then.
It's hard not to hey, look what.
And then they give you all thiscredit, like, oh my gosh,
you're so amazing, you seesomething in me that I never
would.
And then you get thattraditional coaching
relationship where they're themaster and you're the ever.
You know you're theundeveloping sensei.
Versus helping people becometheir own master, right, yeah?
(10:11):
and that's interesting that youdid that.
So you were able to.
You were able to pull back, andthen let people kind of see
where people were coming ontheir own yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
So like I'd say, like that's number one.
And then the second piece islike owning.
Owning that, the process oflike identifying like where do
we need to go strategically, isa messy process and so giving
everyone psychological spacebecause it's an evolving, it's
an evolving process, like, uh,it's a process of evolution and
(10:40):
evolution of thinking, and so,like what I've noticed is if uh,
people feel like, hey, my ideawas dumb or it wasn't useful, it
was bad or something like theyhave any negative judgments
about it, it just totally shutsdown their moods and it shuts
down their ability to thinkcompetitively.
Wow.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
Yeah, so that's how you guide it.
You give them that space tojust be there.
You try not to push them toofar yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
What have you?
You know you've coached so manycompanies over the years.
Now we were just talking,before the hit record, about one
of your companies that hittheir 10-year goal in like three
years.
Yeah, three and a half years,yeah, and you just celebrated
that.
What do companies like thathave that other companies don't?
Speaker 2 (11:22):
So what was interesting about this company
is we kicked off in late 2019.
And the founder of the companywas in a place where he was in,
like, I'd say, a little bit ofpersonal turmoil.
So this is where, like, theleader comes in and that he
couldn't really land on a clearvision himself or clear b hag,
because he needed to settle somestuff, like in his personal
space.
So, like, he got the stuffsettled in his personal space
(11:45):
that he needed to and got likegrounding there and and then
from there he was like reallyclear, like hey, um, and so 19,
and then it was um late 2020.
He, finally, he's like hey,like this is the vision where I
can see us going, cause there's,there's a piece of the vision
that number one, like the owneror CEO, whoever's in charge, has
to own it yeah, that's right.
(12:08):
So like they've got to own itand like the team has to be
bought in and say, hey, likethat energizes me, that lights
me up, let's go do this together.
So he got to a place where hecould own it.
So number one is like we'dalready started to build some
momentum with the team through,you know, roughly a year and a
half of coaching together, solike we'd started to build
momentum.
So I don't want to ignore that.
But number two, what happenedwas is it really just shaped
(12:31):
like the executive team and themid managers like, oh okay,
that's the goal, like that'swhere we're going?
Their BHAG was roughly two anda half two and a half times
growth.
Now, this is a mature companythey had.
They had when we first startedthe process.
They had like maybe a hundred105 employees and, yeah, they
achieved their BHAG in justunder yeah, just under three
(12:54):
years.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
So, rock stars, as you're listening, BHAG stands
for Big, Hairy, Audacious Goal.
It's like the ultimate visionyou could say yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
And so what was interesting was this company's
revenue had been flat for thetwo or three years prior.
So like doubling the company in10 years and it's already a
significant company was like man, that's a big goal.
But what's fascinating, likeyeah, it got everyone aligned
around, like how do we fulfillon this vision?
Number one, it got the owner,the CEO, zoomed out and thinking
(13:23):
a lot bigger, from aperspective of like, oh, is
there acquisitions we can bringin?
Like he wasn't looking at thatnecessarily before.
Are there new markets we canplay and that we aren't playing
in before?
Like that.
But they also started to hirepeople differently.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
Wow, yeah, you know, having been through the
transformation myself.
It's a collective effort.
I think the hard thing aboutcoaches is oftentimes when
they're doing their job rightand they're not the guy or girl
who's like, hey, this is whereyou could go, and they're the
master sensei all the time.
The best coaches are the onesthat help their clients feel
like it's coming from within.
(14:01):
It's like they help them tapinto themselves.
But I'm really grateful thatI'm smart enough to know that,
like we wouldn't have done thatwithout you, and I mean this
I'll.
I won't say it on this, I'llprobably do it more in the
introduction, but we, our PTpractice, we ended up exiting at
this record, industry record,multiple given our size.
(14:22):
Like you know, breakthrough manit was crazy, and you were there
for all of it, you wouldn, andyou were there for all of it and
you wouldn't have done itwithout you.
I think the main thing that youguys can and I mean this more
for my rock stars who arelistening is that there's so
many different types of coachingand I would like to hear from
you in a minute, like how youwould qualify or not qualify,
how you would describe yourcoaching as what it is, because
I've had so many coaches Whilewe were working with you.
(14:43):
We had other types of coaches,but your coaching was this team,
unifying, big picture, creation, safe place.
Where do you remember when wewere talking about the concerns
of selling, like it was anenvironment where, because of
your conversational domain thatyou created in that coaching
space that one day of recorderthat we're like let's talk about
(15:04):
Will's offer that's coming tosell, and one girl was like yeah
, I think it's a huge mistake.
Remember, yeah, I remembervividly, yeah.
And one girl was like yeah, Ithink it's a huge mistake.
Remember, yeah, I remembervividly.
Speaker 2 (15:11):
Yeah, oh, it was so crazy.
What are you doing?
Yeah, but man, what a gift thatshe felt safe to speak that,
and that was a gift that youdelivered as a leader for her to
like bring that level of, youknow, rigor and I would even say
healthy conflict.
You know it was like well I,you know she didn't say it this
(15:33):
way, but well, I think this isdumb.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
Yeah, that was really , and she did it very tactfully,
but it was so concrete, but itwasn't done because she felt
safe.
She didn't do it in a way thatcould have been so much more
painful, like if she was in adirector's meeting offsite, it's
like, and then all of heranxiety was coming across in
judgment and it freaked otherpeople out.
Because she wasn't freaked out,it was like no, I think this is
a mistake.
What we've got here is special.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
Yeah, yeah, totally, totally, and it was special, it
was amazing.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
I still look back at that and I still can't believe
like I said, when I say sacred,I want the rock stars to hear
that I mean it.
It was holy, it was special, itwas spiritual and I didn't know
it at the time into that degree.
But you knew while you weredoing it like, hey, this doesn't
feel like work.
This feels like I'm creatingsomething bigger than me and I
(16:22):
love these people with me, evenif it's just a professional
connection.
And here we are, and then everyquarter you'd see the evolution
and dude, what an evolution.
So how would you describe yourcoaching?
Because, dude, that's the otherthing I worry about when I'm
always talking Every episode.
I'm always like everyone needsa coach, but there's so many
different types of coaches I'mactually leery on recommending
(16:43):
coaches.
That's why I wanted to bringone of my favorites on.
So how would you describe whatyou do?
Speaker 2 (16:47):
Yeah, it's a great question, what you do?
Speaker 1 (16:49):
Yeah, because how do you, how do you put language to
it?
Speaker 2 (16:53):
Yeah.
So, like typically, whathappens is I help business
owners and entrepreneurs thatknow they're after an exit, but
specifically like it's not anexit in like a year or two, like
I'm not a broker, I don't doany of that, but what they're
looking for is they're lookingto scale their business value
significantly, right?
So two years ago I finally dida project with one of my
(17:16):
assistants to track like weactually went through and
captured the financial data Likewhat's the actual verifiable
results that our clients producethat work with us?
Was it us?
No, it wasn't us.
Space was created, we hadconversations, we coached, they
developed strategic plans andthen you know, whatever happened
happened on average, doubledtheir net operating income in
(17:37):
two to three years of workingwith us.
Like on average, some werebigger, some were smaller.
Um, enterprise values growanywhere from 500 to 800%.
Right, that mean enterprisevalue uh, business value Sorry,
that's a fancy term.
Yeah, so just like my companywas worth.
Yeah, yeah, like for sale, itbecame worth that much more 500
(17:59):
times, 500 times or 800 timeswhat it was worth when they
started.
We track this stuff rigorouslynow and then.
What's less tangible is thequality of life for the owner,
because we only partner withbusiness owners that really
deeply care about their peopleand making a contribution deeply
(18:19):
care about their people andmaking a contribution Because
everything we do is about givingpeople their brains back and
empowering people and holdingthem accountable at the same
time.
And, like, this system onlyworks if it's an owner that,
like, actually cares aboutpeople and elevating their team.
If their only concern is likeabout what can I extract from my
people?
Speaker 1 (18:45):
How do I you know, no one says this outright, but how
do I take advantage ofcustomers or trick them, or
deceive them or anything likethat?
What's the trick or theshortcut to maximizing?
Speaker 2 (18:51):
profitability.
It's not there.
It's not there.
We don't do that.
I can't believe.
I've never worked with privateequity firms.
I don't know if I could,because I'm probably wrong.
I haven't encountered any yet,though, that have similar time
horizons and values.
Orientation around the best andhighest way to grow companies,
(19:15):
and financial results prove itfor itself, right highest way to
grow companies.
And, like, financial results,prove it for itself, right.
But, yeah, like, makinglong-term decisions and doing
the right thing by people isfundamentally what works.
And so, yeah, we work togetherthrough a series of strategic
planning sessions.
You know, typically we meetquarterly and like, I think,
where what I have two businesspartners now, but, like, what we
(19:39):
do differently than many othercompanies, is like, some
companies will train you on newconcepts or procedures or things
like that, and it's like hey,here's the training, go out and
do it.
Good luck with implementationand integration of the key
(20:01):
concepts and tools that, like.
The only way you fail with,like the coaching and the
concepts and the principles thatwe train on, is you do nothing?
Yeah, you don't.
They can just throw your handsup.
Yeah, like.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
And so what we've built is like a methodology
that's literally fail-proof well, and it's funny because people
hearing that are like, wow,that's a bold statement, it's
like I lived it, I got to see it.
It was unreal.
And it's funny because peoplehearing that are like, wow,
that's a bold statement, it'slike I lived it, I got to see it
, it was unreal.
And what's cool about it isthat it's not complicated.
It's very, you know, it's at agradient level that I think
anyone, regardless of where theyare in their business, could
benefit from it.
But I do think people have to bebought in.
(20:33):
I think the one thing, like yousaid, not do anything.
Having gotten into coaching andthen gotten out of it after a
few years, I realized that therewas no success that I could
have that wasn't completelydependent upon their buying in
and going all in.
Again, they don't have to beperfect.
I'm not saying that they it'slike a weight loss coach, it's
(20:53):
not like they don't have to makemistakes, but they're not
trying to track and not tryingto put the effort in.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
They got to want it and they got to be willing to
stick with it is probably whatI'd say Like, so the so the
client that hit the BHAG in liketwo and a half years, like
they'd already had momentumbuildup.
And so you know, some of thecore concepts or principles that
we work with companies on comefrom Jim Collins and his book
Good to Great, oh the best andGreat by Choice, and so he talks
about this buildup tobreakthrough and that's really
(21:29):
what our clients experience islike the willingness to kind of
sit in the organizational change, the willingness to have your
frontline people or your midmanagers say like I don't know
why we're doing meetings thisway, I don't know why we're
meeting.
I don't know why we're doingmeetings this way.
I don't know why we're meeting.
I don't know why we're talkingabout Corvette, like they're
going to push back and likethey're going to test you along
the way, and just trust is likethis is going on and sometimes
you're going to face resistancefrom the team Could be your
(21:49):
executive team, could be frontlines people that what we're
going through is we're goingthrough this buildup where it
literally looks like nothing'shappening and it's trackable
with my clients.
It looks like nothing'shappening and all of a sudden
they just hockey stick, hockeystick, yeah.
And then you know like profits,hockey stick, revenue, growth,
hockey sticks.
And it's like, well, whathappened?
And it's like no, no, no, likeyou missed this whole buildup
process, that happened, yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:11):
Yeah, there's foundational growth that
oftentimes can be exhausting asan entrepreneur because you're
looking for greater freedom,greater profits, but you can
still sense it.
I mean, you don't.
I think you'd have to be prettyblind to not feel the shift of
energy that's occurring, because, even though those things
haven't occurred yet, you stillcan sense wow, this is a good
action, wow, that there's lessof the drama shift.
Speaker 2 (22:34):
That I think is immediate Less drama, greater
communication, greater cohesion.
Yeah, like there's definitelyresults like that, like
communication results for sure.
Immediate results, but like thebig, dramatic financial results
, they take a little time,because it's kind of like we're
doing like an orthodonticadjustment on the organization,
(22:56):
so to speak, and like you don'tmove teeth overnight, like it
takes a little time, but, gosh,your smile's beautiful and it's
like, well, this took threeyears, like yeah, yeah, like I
had braces on for three yearsand it was kind of uncomfortable
.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
And now it's actually a really good analogy because,
like you put the braces on,everything looks a little bit
worse, right, because you havebraces on and then all of a
sudden the braces come off andthere is short-term pain, for
sure with the coaching.
Speaker 2 (23:18):
And the only pain that comes is like we've got to
change some of our habits.
Like I used to not do dailyhuddles and now I got to be in a
daily huddle four days a weekand show up with my team.
I used to just hire people kindof willy-nilly off the cuff and
now I follow top gradingpractices to hire people and it
takes more time and it takesmore rigor.
But, gosh Corwin, like how didwe get these people on our team?
(23:43):
And I'm like, yeah, like it'sslower, it's a bit more painful,
but the results are worth it.
Speaker 1 (23:49):
And then they start compounding.
I think that's the thing thatwe forget is you know when we're
acting out of reactivity androck stars.
I want you to know.
I lived in this space where,where it was like I was in so
much pain I needed to hiresomeone for it.
Hiring is a great example.
I was in so much pain I justneeded somebody to fill in
because I was dying Like.
I mean it felt like I was, butI really believe I was.
No one should work 60 hours aweek with that kind of intense
(24:12):
patient interaction.
And so it makes it to where theidea of hiring a coach and
taking hours out of your day,which are already strapped in
with poor profits, seems insane.
But there's a snowballingeffect and the transformation.
I remember at the end, justrealizing that I was
(24:37):
experiencing something rare andthat it wasn't something that
I'm a big proponent of.
Like if I can do it literallyanyone can, but that doesn't
mean it's easy either.
And like having that idea oflike, it was such a special,
sacred moment.
And then, when we exited theway, that felt like putting
first of all all the stress andsacrifice worth it, all the pain
, all the effort worth it.
(24:57):
You and I both know, havingsuccessfully sold that doesn't
mean there's not another chapterto start over, and that's a big
awakening.
Money doesn't solve allproblems.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
I remember talking about this with you and I said,
will?
I said watch it, because ithappened for me and I've
witnessed it with other peoplethat had exited.
It's like you're going to haveabout one good month.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:18):
And then a whole new reality sets in and, like you,
have a new set of problems.
Speaker 1 (25:22):
And it's true, more money, more problems, you know
and you do like you have a wholeset of problems and you do have
a new set of problems, like forum entrepreneurs that I've
coached.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
Like one of the things that shows up is like a
big identity shift.
Like who am I now?
Yeah, 100%.
Like I don't have this companyand all these employees and like
these accomplishments, likesure I did, but today like
that's gone.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
So who am I.
It's especially true forhealthcare companies, because
we're not just business owners.
We are physical therapists, weare medical doctors, we are
healers.
Speaker 2 (25:59):
You're medical doctors.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
We are healers, you're healers, we're healers.
And the title, our job title,is synonymous with our last name
.
Like Will Humphrey's PT isstill in my mind to some degree.
Who I am?
Yeah, so when I sell that andI'm no longer treating who am I?
You know, and man, it wasdisruptive, even though I didn't
have to work, for If I investedcorrectly, I never had to work
(26:23):
again.
But, dude, there's a reason whythese super hyper-successful
people keep working.
It's because money is only onething.
Speaker 2 (26:29):
It's only one thing.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's.
Yeah.
I think we're meant to work bythe sweat of my brow.
You know, right out of the uhbeginning of of the Bible there.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
Yeah, by the sweat of your brow, yeah.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
Your brow, you're going to eat and it's like all
right, like love or hateChristianity, love or hate God,
and whatever.
It's like look like there'ssome diamond truth in the Bible
there.
Um and uh, you know, that'sbeen the truth for me Like
there's a certain gratificationand being anxiously engaged in
doing good and busy and doinggood and like, yeah, like you
(27:07):
get too much time on your handsand it's not good.
Speaker 1 (27:10):
So let me ask you this I've always wanted to ask
you.
You've helped so many companiesand it's so cool to me that you
have physical therapy specificexperience, because I don't
think that's very common for alot of coaches who are not
specific to PT.
Finally, our industry isgetting some PT-specific coaches
, which is fantastic, but it isnice that, like I will say that
(27:30):
overall not all there's somePT-specific coaches who are the
best but, like, ultimately, thebetter coaching is outside.
Still, in my opinion, what wasit like for you when I sold or
this company hit their 10-yeargoal in two and a half, three or
three and a half years?
You've done that type ofaccomplishment repeatedly.
What's that like for you?
I've never asked.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
Before I got into coaching, I had a mentor that
was a senior partner withDeloitte Consulting.
Deloitte's one of the largestconsulting firms in the world.
A man by the name of Bert and Iwas talking to Bert and Bert
said hey, corwin, cool, you wantto get into coaching and
consulting?
He said I just would have youconsider he's a really wise dude
, very accomplished.
(28:13):
He said I'd have you considerthat when you're a consultant
rather than an operator, you'rea stage mom and so like just
asking yourself are you okay?
Speaker 1 (28:21):
being a stage mom.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
I'm like huh, like what might that mean to be a
stage mom?
And so what's interesting, likewhen you look at like stage
moms, so to speak, or soccer momor whatever soccer dad or
whatever the thing is like theyput in a lot of work, they put
in a lot of the sweat and thetears and like there's not a lot
of like outward facing glory,yeah, yeah, and I looked at that
(28:45):
and I was like I'm totally okaywith that because, like, when I
looked at like my my drivers,like motivators, set another way
and like this is one of theassessments we use in helping
our clients hire right, it'slike what motivates people at
work and we have a very rigidassessment for it and my top
four drivers is not highcommanding, which is like really
(29:06):
driven by identity.
It's just not so.
I was like I'm totally okayInternally, knowing and
celebrating with the team andthe owner their accomplishments,
and like I'm not on stage, I'mtotally at peace with that.
Yeah, and it's just cool.
Like it's just stage.
I'm totally at peace with that.
Yeah, and it's just cool.
Like it's just it's amazing tosee, to see like the harvest and
see everything come togetherand to see these clients win in
(29:27):
such a big way and the teamcelebrates such a big win.
And then there's a small partof me, like, for instance, when
Rise sold my physical therapypractice Rise Rehab yeah.
Like and it transitioned intothe new thing.
There was a little bit ofsadness too, because like it's
it's candidly it's never thesame, no, it's not.
And so, like it's a, it's abittersweet in a way, mostly
sweet, and there's a little bitof bitter.
(29:48):
And like the thing changes,like the team is going to change
, it's going to evolve, it'sgoing to go their separate ways,
completion and almost like Ithink I may have told you this?
like there almost needs to belike a funeral service for what
was and like just like.
Not like a weird thing, butlike a celebration of like what
was and a gratitude andappreciation and a process of
(30:10):
closure, Because, yeah, you'removing into a totally different
phase.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
You actually suggested that, that we should
have a funeral for Rise yeah,which is totally weird.
Well, no, what's really weird,too, is my.
So I love that you shared allthat.
Thanks for sharing, Cause I Ikind of get that and I I'm
willing to bet that some ownersare willing to to look back like
a, like a stage kid, look overtheir shoulder and say, thanks,
mom.
Speaker 2 (30:33):
And some don't Right.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
But it's interesting because afterwards it took.
Maybe that sell happened sevenyears ago, six years ago.
It probably took three or fouryears of people.
Stop talking about the old days.
I would see I'd run intoemployees who were still working
at the new company.
They're like how's it going?
No, not as good as Rise.
They just start bashing on theold ways and start almost
(31:01):
hyper-glorifying the old ways.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
It wasn't that good guys.
I promise High school wasn'tthat cool Totally.
It's kind of like being a starhigh school student, like it's
cool, but like is it really?
Speaker 1 (31:11):
that cool when you're 40 and you're remembering it
like over and over again.
So I really appreciate yousaying that, because there was a
legitimate phase.
What I've learned is this andyou really helped me see this,
corwin is that it's all hard.
Building it and beingsuccessful is hard.
Selling is hard.
Being eaten with a lot of moneybeing on the back end of it,
(31:32):
starting new without any of theold headaches is hard.
It's just different, but we getto pick our hard.
Is it just different?
But we get to pick our hard,and I'm always going to pick a
hard.
That is going to create momentslike I got to be with you on
where we're in a room withleaders and always that sense of
everything's against you kindof feel, because you're just a
(31:53):
bunch of regular people tryingto make a difference and then
you start making a differenceand the magic of those moments
for me make the hard worthwhileand I think it just wouldn't
have been the same without you.
So listen, corman, I want to bewith a grateful stage kid and
(32:14):
look over my shoulder and saythank you publicly for what you
did for us because it's not asmall thing.
I honestly am trying not to getchoked up right now, because
that time was so special and youcreated that for us and so
obviously, with your PTexperience, I'm going to highly
validate and recommend anyonewho's like you know what I might
(32:34):
want to work with a coach andyou're their guy.
How do people get a hold of youif they just want to ask
questions about today's episode?
Or if they want to learn moreabout working with you.
Speaker 2 (32:44):
Yeah, yeah, you can find me on wwwculture2cash
culture2cashcom.
Speaker 1 (32:50):
Culture2cash I didn't know that that's a new website.
That's so cool.
Speaker 2 (32:53):
Yeah, and it was really intentional because, like
, what we're after is likehelping connect, like powerful,
healthy company culture thatelevates people to bottom line
profits, so culture to cashcom.
Um, you can find me on LinkedIn.
I don't really post anything,but I'm on there and, uh, I
don't know.
However, you want to reach meand, yeah, glad to connect and
(33:15):
just even have a conversationLike you're in a jam.
You got a question happy tohelp how I can.
Like a big piece of this isabout um, like personal mission
and contribution too.
So, yeah, like really honoredto help how I can, and
especially, you know those inthe healing professions like we
need our healers to be healthy.
Speaker 1 (33:33):
really, yeah, he gets it right.
Guys, rock stars, healers, tobe healthy.
Who's looking out for us?
Right, right, that's worthevery penny we ever spend
investing in that.
Makes everything else go right.
Amen, all right, well, corwin,thank you so much for being on
the show, buddy, it was so greatbeing with you.
Speaker 2 (33:51):
Thanks for having me on buddy.
Speaker 1 (33:53):
Guys, thank you for taking time to listen to today's
episode.
If you found today'sinformation to be useful, could
you take a minute and help me?
I would love it if you couldleave a podcast review in your
app so that other people who arelooking for this information
can find it.
Plus, my dream is to have thelargest network of medical
entrepreneurs and leaders in theworld so that together, we can
change healthcare to make itbetter for all.
(34:14):
So, in addition, if you canthink of anyone that you can
send this to, not only wouldthat mean a lot to me personally
, but it would build thisnetwork so that we can make
healthcare the way that we wantit.
Welcome back Rockstars.
Today's guest is Corwin Smith,and guys, I'm telling you this
is going to be an emotional onefor me.
I didn't cry during the episode.
I might cry during the intro.
I always film these thingsafterwards.
Corwin was one of my favoritecoaches.
He did some very special thingswith our team.
He's responsible in a big wayfor unifying our company.
The time that we spent with himI'll say it in the episode was
(00:26):
sacred.
And that sounds like overlydramatic and cheesy, and I get
that, but it is what it is.
When you suffer as much as youdo as a business owner,
especially in private practice,you hold on to those times where
it all becomes worth it.
His efforts and the way that hewas able to work with our team
(00:49):
is something that he's going totalk about in today's episode.
So listen closely to thepitfalls as to why some
companies never becomesuccessful or stay stuck.
Listen very closely to hisexperience as a coach, of how he
invests in people and how hetalks about coaching in general,
because it's such a genericterm, right Like?
I don't know about you, but Iget sick and tired of just
hearing about coaching this andcoaching that, even though I am
a coach.
It's just a very broad term,and so he gives some specificity
(01:10):
to that term for you to helpyou understand, at least from
his perspective, what mattersand not.
But what's cool is I get toshare my experience of exiting,
and that's very special to me.
So I'm grateful that I get toshare this moment with you in
today's episode as Corwin stepsin and teaches us all about
business.
Enjoy the show, corwin man.
So listen, this has been a bigquestion for me that I would
(01:34):
love to pick your brain on.
Why do you think companies failto grow?
Speaker 2 (01:46):
it's something I've watched, like you know, from
growing my my previous companyand then I've just clipped over
nine years in a coaching role.
I think there's like two majorconstraints why companies fail
to grow.
So, um, the first constraint itreally comes down to the leader
.
Right, as it goes, the leadergoes to the team and team and
(02:07):
like some of the barriers thatleaders run into, like number
one I've found is like leaderslack proper ambition.
So they commonly, when peoplehear the word ambition, I think
there's kind of a negative bentwith ambition today.
And when I think about ambition,I think about ambition which is
like what's my personal why orpurpose for what I'm doing?
(02:28):
Right.
And so like what I've noticedwith leaders that are just kind
of stuck, like they stagnate.
Maybe they get to some moderatelevel of success, then they
kind of stall.
What I found talking to them iswhen I ask them like what is
the purpose for you working?
Sometimes they have some kindof purpose centered around maybe
(02:49):
doing something positive in theworld, which is cool, but
they're not really clear aboutwhy they're working.
My 25 to 30 years ofunemployment, aka retirement,
wow, yeah, so specific, right?
(03:19):
So so the way I look at it islike I have a really practical
or pragmatic or fundamentalpurpose for working which is
about earning and saving,investing enough, right, like I
have a big, you know, financialgap still to close number one.
And then number two is like acertain level of impact or
difference I want to make in theworld, so like there's that
piece of it which is reallydriven by the founder or the
senior leader of the company isthe reason why companies, I
(03:39):
found, fail to grow.
And then the second thing isthe inability to find, hire and
retain enough of the rightpeople.
Speaker 1 (03:47):
Amen.
Every single PT, ot and SLPowner right now is going.
You can say that again Becausethey're struggling right now to
find talent.
But I love how you simply putthat the barriers to growth are
the individual leader, both interms of clarity on their
purpose as well, as I love thatambition piece like misguided
(04:08):
ambition.
You might have a therapy owner,for example, who loves to treat
and they're ambitious aboutthat, but they're not ambitious
about growing the core businessand then, on the other hand,
it's growing the people and theteam around it.
Totally.
Speaker 2 (04:20):
Yeah, and so what's interesting is I've been
developing this with clients andeven inside of my my own
business here with with the teamI have.
It's like getting clients orbusiness owners first clear on
what their ambition is and thenlike their financial ambition,
which is the simplest, like it'sjust it's a math equation, and
(04:42):
then having them work with atleast their senior leaders on
what the senior leader'sfinancial ambition is.
Because number one, it'sgenerally it's really sobering
from a financial perspectivelike how big the gaps are for
people.
And then number two is likeit's just forefront and in front
of you about how you need towork.
(05:03):
It helps me and helps othersI've noticed orient in the kind
of work they need to be doing.
Speaker 1 (05:09):
I love that when we work together.
One of my favorite things thatyou did using a combination of a
couple of coaching programslike there was the Gazelles
thing that Vern Harnish createdthe author of the book Scaling
Up for those who know, VernHarnish created the author of
the book Scaling Up for thosewho know but then you also have
the Wake Up Warrior kind ofinfluence and you bring together
(05:32):
from your own coachingbackground, having owned and
operated and successfully soldthis massive restoration company
, that you bring these elementsin in a way that engaged my team
.
That's what I remember is I hadfour locations when we started
working together and I don'tknow there was something about
like me developing myself as aleader which you said was the
first constraint with my team,like having them in the room so
(05:54):
that we were all workingtogether towards creating that,
because those were fun days, man.
Speaker 2 (05:59):
It was a blast.
It was so much fun.
I still remember vividly itmight've been our second
strategic planning session whenwe did an evolution with the
one-page life plan with yourteam there and we had a member
of your team that was in more oflike an administrative or
(06:20):
support role and I just rememberthis individual just having
tears, being able to realizethat by them like fulfilling the
commitments inside of theorganization they could actually
fulfill on their life goals andlike their life vision.
It was just.
It was such a, it was such likea watershed moment for me as a
coach.
To like see the impactfirsthand and watch it with the
(06:41):
team is like the team pulledtogether and it's like, hey,
this is about more than justlike a J-O-B or earning money.
This is like, yeah, like we'regoing to do the money thing and
like I can also develop myselfas a human being.
It's really extraordinary.
Speaker 1 (06:54):
Yeah, I you know, and it was so powerful because,
like you, were impacted.
It was a watershed moment foryou, but it was for me as well.
I will say that those days thatwe spent because we would meet
with you every quarter, wereally leaned into it.
Like our team would take thattime off.
We'd go to dinner the nightbefore, we'd meet with you.
But those days in retrospectnow, Corwin, are sacred for me.
(07:17):
They're sacred moments of timewhen I went from being a
business owner who was justrunning around trying to make
things work and being tired andbeing victimized, to being this
member of this community in myown company.
And it was so cool because Ithink again, I developed in real
(07:38):
time as I was developing myleaders with the right coaching.
And there was a lot of tacticalstuff in those meetings.
There was the whole financialpieces, but there was an art to
it as well.
I felt like and I feel likethis is true for business
there's an art and a science toit, and that's why I think
having that quarterly touchpoint with you every single
three months was so vital,because we would be, we would be
(08:01):
reminded of our purpose, butwe'd also set some financial
targets and then we'd completecycles.
I always wanted to ask you howdid you know how to guide our
group?
Because you would help us pullout priorities, You'd help us
find the bigger rocks to move,but you would include everyone
and we never landed on.
Like you know what I mean.
(08:22):
Sometimes people are just wrong.
There was many ideas that cameup that were not great.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
Just awful Mine included.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
Yeah, but no one ever felt negated or invalidated
either.
Like how do you?
I always wanted to ask you, howdid you do that through those
meetings?
That's interesting.
Speaker 2 (08:37):
Good question.
It's an opportunity for me toreflect and think about that.
Hmm, yeah, I think there's twothings going in the background,
like from a, from a coach'sperspective, and kind of what
I'm thinking about is likethere's an interesting dynamic
at place, because the firstdynamic at place is, like I see
(08:58):
what's possible for theorganization and the team right,
like I see what they couldaccomplish.
The problem is is, if it's myvision right and it's my goals,
it's mine.
So, like there's a, there's areally fine balance between,
like me seeing what's possiblefor this team and for the
(09:21):
organization, based on, like,who they are and what the
marketplace looks like andeverything I can see there.
Balancing that with like whatdo they actually want and what
the marketplace looks like andeverything I can see there.
Balancing that with like whatdo they actually want and what
can they see?
Speaker 1 (09:33):
I see, so you have this ability to see a vision of
where to go, and so much so that, like the entrepreneur in you,
almost wants to like guide themthere.
Yeah, I want to tell them.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
I want to tell them like, hey guys, go here Like
this looks like a massiveopportunity, but then it'd be
mine.
Speaker 1 (09:48):
Yeah, I've done that mistake in coaching since then.
It's hard not to hey, look what.
And then they give you all thiscredit, like, oh my gosh,
you're so amazing, you seesomething in me that I never
would.
And then you get thattraditional coaching
relationship where they're themaster and you're the ever.
You know you're theundeveloping sensei.
Versus helping people becometheir own master, right, yeah?
(10:11):
and that's interesting that youdid that.
So you were able to.
You were able to pull back, andthen let people kind of see
where people were coming ontheir own yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:18):
So like I'd say, like that's number one.
And then the second piece islike owning.
Owning that, the process oflike identifying like where do
we need to go strategically, isa messy process and so giving
everyone psychological spacebecause it's an evolving, it's
an evolving process, like, uh,it's a process of evolution and
(10:40):
evolution of thinking, and so,like what I've noticed is if uh,
people feel like, hey, my ideawas dumb or it wasn't useful, it
was bad or something like theyhave any negative judgments
about it, it just totally shutsdown their moods and it shuts
down their ability to thinkcompetitively.
Wow.
Speaker 1 (10:58):
Yeah, so that's how you guide it.
You give them that space tojust be there.
You try not to push them toofar yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (11:05):
What have you?
You know you've coached so manycompanies over the years.
Now we were just talking,before the hit record, about one
of your companies that hittheir 10-year goal in like three
years.
Yeah, three and a half years,yeah, and you just celebrated
that.
What do companies like thathave that other companies don't?
Speaker 2 (11:22):
So what was interesting about this company
is we kicked off in late 2019.
And the founder of the companywas in a place where he was in,
like, I'd say, a little bit ofpersonal turmoil.
So this is where, like, theleader comes in and that he
couldn't really land on a clearvision himself or clear b hag,
because he needed to settle somestuff, like in his personal
space.
So, like, he got the stuffsettled in his personal space
(11:45):
that he needed to and got likegrounding there and and then
from there he was like reallyclear, like hey, um, and so 19,
and then it was um late 2020.
He, finally, he's like hey,like this is the vision where I
can see us going, cause there's,there's a piece of the vision
that number one, like the owneror CEO, whoever's in charge, has
to own it yeah, that's right.
(12:08):
So like they've got to own itand like the team has to be
bought in and say, hey, likethat energizes me, that lights
me up, let's go do this together.
So he got to a place where hecould own it.
So number one is like we'dalready started to build some
momentum with the team through,you know, roughly a year and a
half of coaching together, solike we'd started to build
momentum.
So I don't want to ignore that.
But number two, what happenedwas is it really just shaped
(12:31):
like the executive team and themid managers like, oh okay,
that's the goal, like that'swhere we're going?
Their BHAG was roughly two anda half two and a half times
growth.
Now, this is a mature companythey had.
They had when we first startedthe process.
They had like maybe a hundred105 employees and, yeah, they
achieved their BHAG in justunder yeah, just under three
(12:54):
years.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
So, rock stars, as you're listening, BHAG stands
for Big, Hairy, Audacious Goal.
It's like the ultimate visionyou could say yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
And so what was interesting was this company's
revenue had been flat for thetwo or three years prior.
So like doubling the company in10 years and it's already a
significant company was like man, that's a big goal.
But what's fascinating, likeyeah, it got everyone aligned
around, like how do we fulfillon this vision?
Number one, it got the owner,the CEO, zoomed out and thinking
(13:23):
a lot bigger, from aperspective of like, oh, is
there acquisitions we can bringin?
Like he wasn't looking at thatnecessarily before.
Are there new markets we canplay and that we aren't playing
in before?
Like that.
But they also started to hirepeople differently.
Speaker 1 (13:39):
Wow, yeah, you know, having been through the
transformation myself.
It's a collective effort.
I think the hard thing aboutcoaches is oftentimes when
they're doing their job rightand they're not the guy or girl
who's like, hey, this is whereyou could go, and they're the
master sensei all the time.
The best coaches are the onesthat help their clients feel
like it's coming from within.
(14:01):
It's like they help them tapinto themselves.
But I'm really grateful thatI'm smart enough to know that,
like we wouldn't have done thatwithout you, and I mean this
I'll.
I won't say it on this, I'llprobably do it more in the
introduction, but we, our PTpractice, we ended up exiting at
this record, industry record,multiple given our size.
(14:22):
Like you know, breakthrough manit was crazy, and you were there
for all of it, you wouldn, andyou were there for all of it and
you wouldn't have done itwithout you.
I think the main thing that youguys can and I mean this more
for my rock stars who arelistening is that there's so
many different types of coachingand I would like to hear from
you in a minute, like how youwould qualify or not qualify,
how you would describe yourcoaching as what it is, because
I've had so many coaches Whilewe were working with you.
(14:43):
We had other types of coaches,but your coaching was this team,
unifying, big picture, creation, safe place.
Where do you remember when wewere talking about the concerns
of selling, like it was anenvironment where, because of
your conversational domain thatyou created in that coaching
space that one day of recorderthat we're like let's talk about
(15:04):
Will's offer that's coming tosell, and one girl was like yeah
, I think it's a huge mistake.
Remember, yeah, I remembervividly, yeah.
And one girl was like yeah, Ithink it's a huge mistake.
Remember, yeah, I remembervividly.
Speaker 2 (15:11):
Yeah, oh, it was so crazy.
What are you doing?
Yeah, but man, what a gift thatshe felt safe to speak that,
and that was a gift that youdelivered as a leader for her to
like bring that level of, youknow, rigor and I would even say
healthy conflict.
You know it was like well I,you know she didn't say it this
(15:33):
way, but well, I think this isdumb.
Speaker 1 (15:35):
Yeah, that was really , and she did it very tactfully,
but it was so concrete, but itwasn't done because she felt
safe.
She didn't do it in a way thatcould have been so much more
painful, like if she was in adirector's meeting offsite, it's
like, and then all of heranxiety was coming across in
judgment and it freaked otherpeople out.
Because she wasn't freaked out,it was like no, I think this is
a mistake.
What we've got here is special.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
Yeah, yeah, totally, totally, and it was special, it
was amazing.
Speaker 1 (16:00):
I still look back at that and I still can't believe
like I said, when I say sacred,I want the rock stars to hear
that I mean it.
It was holy, it was special, itwas spiritual and I didn't know
it at the time into that degree.
But you knew while you weredoing it like, hey, this doesn't
feel like work.
This feels like I'm creatingsomething bigger than me and I
(16:22):
love these people with me, evenif it's just a professional
connection.
And here we are, and then everyquarter you'd see the evolution
and dude, what an evolution.
So how would you describe yourcoaching?
Because, dude, that's the otherthing I worry about when I'm
always talking Every episode.
I'm always like everyone needsa coach, but there's so many
different types of coaches I'mactually leery on recommending
(16:43):
coaches.
That's why I wanted to bringone of my favorites on.
So how would you describe whatyou do?
Speaker 2 (16:47):
Yeah, it's a great question, what you do?
Speaker 1 (16:49):
Yeah, because how do you, how do you put language to
it?
Speaker 2 (16:53):
Yeah.
So, like typically, whathappens is I help business
owners and entrepreneurs thatknow they're after an exit, but
specifically like it's not anexit in like a year or two, like
I'm not a broker, I don't doany of that, but what they're
looking for is they're lookingto scale their business value
significantly, right?
So two years ago I finally dida project with one of my
(17:16):
assistants to track like weactually went through and
captured the financial data Likewhat's the actual verifiable
results that our clients producethat work with us?
Was it us?
No, it wasn't us.
Space was created, we hadconversations, we coached, they
developed strategic plans andthen you know, whatever happened
happened on average, doubledtheir net operating income in
(17:37):
two to three years of workingwith us.
Like on average, some werebigger, some were smaller.
Um, enterprise values growanywhere from 500 to 800%.
Right, that mean enterprisevalue uh, business value Sorry,
that's a fancy term.
Yeah, so just like my companywas worth.
Yeah, yeah, like for sale, itbecame worth that much more 500
(17:59):
times, 500 times or 800 timeswhat it was worth when they
started.
We track this stuff rigorouslynow and then.
What's less tangible is thequality of life for the owner,
because we only partner withbusiness owners that really
deeply care about their peopleand making a contribution deeply
(18:19):
care about their people andmaking a contribution Because
everything we do is about givingpeople their brains back and
empowering people and holdingthem accountable at the same
time.
And, like, this system onlyworks if it's an owner that,
like, actually cares aboutpeople and elevating their team.
If their only concern is likeabout what can I extract from my
people?
Speaker 1 (18:45):
How do I you know, no one says this outright, but how
do I take advantage ofcustomers or trick them, or
deceive them or anything likethat?
What's the trick or theshortcut to maximizing?
Speaker 2 (18:51):
profitability.
It's not there.
It's not there.
We don't do that.
I can't believe.
I've never worked with privateequity firms.
I don't know if I could,because I'm probably wrong.
I haven't encountered any yet,though, that have similar time
horizons and values.
Orientation around the best andhighest way to grow companies,
(19:15):
and financial results prove itfor itself, right highest way to
grow companies.
And, like, financial results,prove it for itself, right.
But, yeah, like, makinglong-term decisions and doing
the right thing by people isfundamentally what works.
And so, yeah, we work togetherthrough a series of strategic
planning sessions.
You know, typically we meetquarterly and like, I think,
where what I have two businesspartners now, but, like, what we
(19:39):
do differently than many othercompanies, is like, some
companies will train you on newconcepts or procedures or things
like that, and it's like hey,here's the training, go out and
do it.
Good luck with implementationand integration of the key
(20:01):
concepts and tools that, like.
The only way you fail with,like the coaching and the
concepts and the principles thatwe train on, is you do nothing?
Yeah, you don't.
They can just throw your handsup.
Yeah, like.
Speaker 1 (20:11):
And so what we've built is like a methodology
that's literally fail-proof well, and it's funny because people
hearing that are like, wow,that's a bold statement, it's
like I lived it, I got to see it.
It was unreal.
And it's funny because peoplehearing that are like, wow,
that's a bold statement, it'slike I lived it, I got to see it
, it was unreal.
And what's cool about it isthat it's not complicated.
It's very, you know, it's at agradient level that I think
anyone, regardless of where theyare in their business, could
benefit from it.
But I do think people have to bebought in.
(20:33):
I think the one thing, like yousaid, not do anything.
Having gotten into coaching andthen gotten out of it after a
few years, I realized that therewas no success that I could
have that wasn't completelydependent upon their buying in
and going all in.
Again, they don't have to beperfect.
I'm not saying that they it'slike a weight loss coach, it's
(20:53):
not like they don't have to makemistakes, but they're not
trying to track and not tryingto put the effort in.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
They got to want it and they got to be willing to
stick with it is probably whatI'd say Like, so the so the
client that hit the BHAG in liketwo and a half years, like
they'd already had momentumbuildup.
And so you know, some of thecore concepts or principles that
we work with companies on comefrom Jim Collins and his book
Good to Great, oh the best andGreat by Choice, and so he talks
about this buildup tobreakthrough and that's really
(21:29):
what our clients experience islike the willingness to kind of
sit in the organizational change, the willingness to have your
frontline people or your midmanagers say like I don't know
why we're doing meetings thisway, I don't know why we're
meeting.
I don't know why we're doingmeetings this way.
I don't know why we're meeting.
I don't know why we're talkingabout Corvette, like they're
going to push back and likethey're going to test you along
the way, and just trust is likethis is going on and sometimes
you're going to face resistancefrom the team Could be your
(21:49):
executive team, could be frontlines people that what we're
going through is we're goingthrough this buildup where it
literally looks like nothing'shappening and it's trackable
with my clients.
It looks like nothing'shappening and all of a sudden
they just hockey stick, hockeystick, yeah.
And then you know like profits,hockey stick, revenue, growth,
hockey sticks.
And it's like, well, whathappened?
And it's like no, no, no, likeyou missed this whole buildup
process, that happened, yeah.
Speaker 1 (22:11):
Yeah, there's foundational growth that
oftentimes can be exhausting asan entrepreneur because you're
looking for greater freedom,greater profits, but you can
still sense it.
I mean, you don't.
I think you'd have to be prettyblind to not feel the shift of
energy that's occurring, because, even though those things
haven't occurred yet, you stillcan sense wow, this is a good
action, wow, that there's lessof the drama shift.
Speaker 2 (22:34):
That I think is immediate Less drama, greater
communication, greater cohesion.
Yeah, like there's definitelyresults like that, like
communication results for sure.
Immediate results, but like thebig, dramatic financial results
, they take a little time,because it's kind of like we're
doing like an orthodonticadjustment on the organization,
(22:56):
so to speak, and like you don'tmove teeth overnight, like it
takes a little time, but, gosh,your smile's beautiful and it's
like, well, this took threeyears, like yeah, yeah, like I
had braces on for three yearsand it was kind of uncomfortable
.
Speaker 1 (23:08):
And now it's actually a really good analogy because,
like you put the braces on,everything looks a little bit
worse, right, because you havebraces on and then all of a
sudden the braces come off andthere is short-term pain, for
sure with the coaching.
Speaker 2 (23:18):
And the only pain that comes is like we've got to
change some of our habits.
Like I used to not do dailyhuddles and now I got to be in a
daily huddle four days a weekand show up with my team.
I used to just hire people kindof willy-nilly off the cuff and
now I follow top gradingpractices to hire people and it
takes more time and it takesmore rigor.
But, gosh Corwin, like how didwe get these people on our team?
(23:43):
And I'm like, yeah, like it'sslower, it's a bit more painful,
but the results are worth it.
Speaker 1 (23:49):
And then they start compounding.
I think that's the thing thatwe forget is you know when we're
acting out of reactivity androck stars.
I want you to know.
I lived in this space where,where it was like I was in so
much pain I needed to hiresomeone for it.
Hiring is a great example.
I was in so much pain I justneeded somebody to fill in
because I was dying Like.
I mean it felt like I was, butI really believe I was.
No one should work 60 hours aweek with that kind of intense
(24:12):
patient interaction.
And so it makes it to where theidea of hiring a coach and
taking hours out of your day,which are already strapped in
with poor profits, seems insane.
But there's a snowballingeffect and the transformation.
I remember at the end, justrealizing that I was
(24:37):
experiencing something rare andthat it wasn't something that
I'm a big proponent of.
Like if I can do it literallyanyone can, but that doesn't
mean it's easy either.
And like having that idea oflike, it was such a special,
sacred moment.
And then, when we exited theway, that felt like putting
first of all all the stress andsacrifice worth it, all the pain
, all the effort worth it.
(24:57):
You and I both know, havingsuccessfully sold that doesn't
mean there's not another chapterto start over, and that's a big
awakening.
Money doesn't solve allproblems.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
I remember talking about this with you and I said,
will?
I said watch it, because ithappened for me and I've
witnessed it with other peoplethat had exited.
It's like you're going to haveabout one good month.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (25:18):
And then a whole new reality sets in and, like you,
have a new set of problems.
Speaker 1 (25:22):
And it's true, more money, more problems, you know
and you do like you have a wholeset of problems and you do have
a new set of problems, like forum entrepreneurs that I've
coached.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
Like one of the things that shows up is like a
big identity shift.
Like who am I now?
Yeah, 100%.
Like I don't have this companyand all these employees and like
these accomplishments, likesure I did, but today like
that's gone.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
So who am I.
It's especially true forhealthcare companies, because
we're not just business owners.
We are physical therapists, weare medical doctors, we are
healers.
Speaker 2 (25:59):
You're medical doctors.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
We are healers, you're healers, we're healers.
And the title, our job title,is synonymous with our last name
.
Like Will Humphrey's PT isstill in my mind to some degree.
Who I am?
Yeah, so when I sell that andI'm no longer treating who am I?
You know, and man, it wasdisruptive, even though I didn't
have to work, for If I investedcorrectly, I never had to work
(26:23):
again.
But, dude, there's a reason whythese super hyper-successful
people keep working.
It's because money is only onething.
Speaker 2 (26:29):
It's only one thing.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's.
Yeah.
I think we're meant to work bythe sweat of my brow.
You know, right out of the uhbeginning of of the Bible there.
Speaker 1 (26:43):
Yeah, by the sweat of your brow, yeah.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
Your brow, you're going to eat and it's like all
right, like love or hateChristianity, love or hate God,
and whatever.
It's like look like there'ssome diamond truth in the Bible
there.
Um and uh, you know, that'sbeen the truth for me Like
there's a certain gratificationand being anxiously engaged in
doing good and busy and doinggood and like, yeah, like you
(27:07):
get too much time on your handsand it's not good.
Speaker 1 (27:10):
So let me ask you this I've always wanted to ask
you.
You've helped so many companiesand it's so cool to me that you
have physical therapy specificexperience, because I don't
think that's very common for alot of coaches who are not
specific to PT.
Finally, our industry isgetting some PT-specific coaches
, which is fantastic, but it isnice that, like I will say that
(27:30):
overall not all there's somePT-specific coaches who are the
best but, like, ultimately, thebetter coaching is outside.
Still, in my opinion, what wasit like for you when I sold or
this company hit their 10-yeargoal in two and a half, three or
three and a half years?
You've done that type ofaccomplishment repeatedly.
What's that like for you?
I've never asked.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
Before I got into coaching, I had a mentor that
was a senior partner withDeloitte Consulting.
Deloitte's one of the largestconsulting firms in the world.
A man by the name of Bert and Iwas talking to Bert and Bert
said hey, corwin, cool, you wantto get into coaching and
consulting?
He said I just would have youconsider he's a really wise dude
, very accomplished.
(28:13):
He said I'd have you considerthat when you're a consultant
rather than an operator, you'rea stage mom and so like just
asking yourself are you okay?
Speaker 1 (28:21):
being a stage mom.
Speaker 2 (28:23):
I'm like huh, like what might that mean to be a
stage mom?
And so what's interesting, likewhen you look at like stage
moms, so to speak, or soccer momor whatever soccer dad or
whatever the thing is like theyput in a lot of work, they put
in a lot of the sweat and thetears and like there's not a lot
of like outward facing glory,yeah, yeah, and I looked at that
(28:45):
and I was like I'm totally okaywith that because, like, when I
looked at like my my drivers,like motivators, set another way
and like this is one of theassessments we use in helping
our clients hire right, it'slike what motivates people at
work and we have a very rigidassessment for it and my top
four drivers is not highcommanding, which is like really
(29:06):
driven by identity.
It's just not so.
I was like I'm totally okayInternally, knowing and
celebrating with the team andthe owner their accomplishments,
and like I'm not on stage, I'mtotally at peace with that.
Yeah, and it's just cool.
Like it's just stage.
I'm totally at peace with that.
Yeah, and it's just cool.
Like it's just it's amazing tosee, to see like the harvest and
see everything come togetherand to see these clients win in
(29:27):
such a big way and the teamcelebrates such a big win.
And then there's a small partof me, like, for instance, when
Rise sold my physical therapypractice Rise Rehab yeah.
Like and it transitioned intothe new thing.
There was a little bit ofsadness too, because like it's
it's candidly it's never thesame, no, it's not.
And so, like it's a, it's abittersweet in a way, mostly
sweet, and there's a little bitof bitter.
(29:48):
And like the thing changes,like the team is going to change
, it's going to evolve, it'sgoing to go their separate ways,
completion and almost like Ithink I may have told you this?
like there almost needs to belike a funeral service for what
was and like just like.
Not like a weird thing, butlike a celebration of like what
was and a gratitude andappreciation and a process of
(30:10):
closure, Because, yeah, you'removing into a totally different
phase.
Speaker 1 (30:13):
You actually suggested that, that we should
have a funeral for Rise yeah,which is totally weird.
Well, no, what's really weird,too, is my.
So I love that you shared allthat.
Thanks for sharing, Cause I Ikind of get that and I I'm
willing to bet that some ownersare willing to to look back like
a, like a stage kid, look overtheir shoulder and say, thanks,
mom.
Speaker 2 (30:33):
And some don't Right.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
But it's interesting because afterwards it took.
Maybe that sell happened sevenyears ago, six years ago.
It probably took three or fouryears of people.
Stop talking about the old days.
I would see I'd run intoemployees who were still working
at the new company.
They're like how's it going?
No, not as good as Rise.
They just start bashing on theold ways and start almost
(31:01):
hyper-glorifying the old ways.
Speaker 2 (31:03):
It wasn't that good guys.
I promise High school wasn'tthat cool Totally.
It's kind of like being a starhigh school student, like it's
cool, but like is it really?
Speaker 1 (31:11):
that cool when you're 40 and you're remembering it
like over and over again.
So I really appreciate yousaying that, because there was a
legitimate phase.
What I've learned is this andyou really helped me see this,
corwin is that it's all hard.
Building it and beingsuccessful is hard.
Selling is hard.
Being eaten with a lot of moneybeing on the back end of it,
(31:32):
starting new without any of theold headaches is hard.
It's just different, but we getto pick our hard.
Is it just different?
But we get to pick our hard,and I'm always going to pick a
hard.
That is going to create momentslike I got to be with you on
where we're in a room withleaders and always that sense of
everything's against you kindof feel, because you're just a
(31:53):
bunch of regular people tryingto make a difference and then
you start making a differenceand the magic of those moments
for me make the hard worthwhileand I think it just wouldn't
have been the same without you.
So listen, corman, I want to bewith a grateful stage kid and
(32:14):
look over my shoulder and saythank you publicly for what you
did for us because it's not asmall thing.
I honestly am trying not to getchoked up right now, because
that time was so special and youcreated that for us and so
obviously, with your PTexperience, I'm going to highly
validate and recommend anyonewho's like you know what I might
(32:34):
want to work with a coach andyou're their guy.
How do people get a hold of youif they just want to ask
questions about today's episode?
Or if they want to learn moreabout working with you.
Speaker 2 (32:44):
Yeah, yeah, you can find me on wwwculture2cash
culture2cashcom.
Speaker 1 (32:50):
Culture2cash I didn't know that that's a new website.
That's so cool.
Speaker 2 (32:53):
Yeah, and it was really intentional because, like
, what we're after is likehelping connect, like powerful,
healthy company culture thatelevates people to bottom line
profits, so culture to cashcom.
Um, you can find me on LinkedIn.
I don't really post anything,but I'm on there and, uh, I
don't know.
However, you want to reach meand, yeah, glad to connect and
(33:15):
just even have a conversationLike you're in a jam.
You got a question happy tohelp how I can.
Like a big piece of this isabout um, like personal mission
and contribution too.
So, yeah, like really honoredto help how I can, and
especially, you know those inthe healing professions like we
need our healers to be healthy.
Speaker 1 (33:33):
really, yeah, he gets it right.
Guys, rock stars, healers, tobe healthy.
Who's looking out for us?
Right, right, that's worthevery penny we ever spend
investing in that.
Makes everything else go right.
Amen, all right, well, corwin,thank you so much for being on
the show, buddy, it was so greatbeing with you.
Speaker 2 (33:51):
Thanks for having me on buddy.
Speaker 1 (33:53):
Guys, thank you for taking time to listen to today's
episode.
If you found today'sinformation to be useful, could
you take a minute and help me?
I would love it if you couldleave a podcast review in your
app so that other people who arelooking for this information
can find it.
Plus, my dream is to have thelargest network of medical
entrepreneurs and leaders in theworld so that together, we can
change healthcare to make itbetter for all.
(34:14):
So, in addition, if you canthink of anyone that you can
send this to, not only wouldthat mean a lot to me personally
, but it would build thisnetwork so that we can make
healthcare the way that we wantit.
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