March 5, 2024 • 50 mins
Ever found yourself yearning to break free from the daily grind and build something truly your own? Nikki Sanderson, the owner Capelli Salon Studio, did exactly that, transforming her hairstyling flair into being the owner of the business. Join me, Mackenzie Kilshaw, as I get up close and personal with Nikki to unwrap the layers of her entrepreneurial journey, from taking the helm at the salon to doubling its size amidst a global pandemic's chaos. Her story isn't just about business growth; it's a deep dive into the heart of what it takes to rise above doubts, defy stereotypes, and lead a team to victory.
As the conversation unfolds, Nikki recounts the pivotal conversations with the salon's previous owner that paved the way for a seamless transition. She shares the secrets behind navigating the challenges of salon ownership, from maintaining staff morale to expanding her business against all odds. Her transparency about the emotional labor involved in leadership and her strategic decision-making during uncertain times offers a wealth of insights for anyone with aspirations of steering their own ship in the stormy seas of entrepreneurship.
Nikki demonstrates that the core of a thriving business lies not just in the hands of its owner but also in the collective strength and harmony of its team. Listeners will walk away with a heightened understanding of personal and professional growth, armed with the knowledge that choosing the right people to join your journey is pivotal to crafting an enduring legacy. So, sit tight for an episode brimming with wisdom, inspiration, and the raw truth of what it takes to transition from a dreamer to a doer in the world of business.
Mackenzie Kilshaw Co. offers comprehensive business coaching, and consulting tailored to your needs.
With Mackenzie's award winning entrepreneurial expertise in strategy, leadership, business development, branding, website development, social media management, SEO, sales and customer service training and more, clients receive personalized guidance to drive growth and success.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Shauna Foster (00:06):
Winning is your guide to making it in business.
Join our award-winning host andentrepreneur, Mackenzie Kilshaw
, and special guests in casualconversations that will educate
and inspire you on your businessjourney.
Winning will help you learn thehard lessons the easy way, with
guidance from celebratedentrepreneurs and business
(00:26):
leaders.
It's fun, it's informative,it's Winning.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (00:31):
Hello, welcome to Winning.
I am your host, MackenzieKilshaw, and today's guest is
Nikki Sanderson.
Hi, Nikki, hi, how are you?
Nikki Sanderson (00:38):
I'm really good .
How are you?
I'm so good.
Thank you for having me my veryfirst podcast.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (00:44):
Oh, I love it .
I love hearing that you'regoing to be such a great guest.
If you don't know Nikki she isa dynamic and accomplished
hairstylist whose journey beganin 2014.
She started as an assistant,she moved to a full-time stylist
and she was making over$100,000 a year, which is
amazing.
Her success led her to actuallypurchase the salon.
(01:08):
She became the owner ofCapelli' S Studio in Saskatoon
in 2020.
We're really going to talk alot about her transition from
being an employee at a businessinto being the owner.
Also, something extremely coolshe expanded the business just
eight months into her ownershipand doubled the size of the
(01:29):
salon.
We're going to talk about thattoo.
Thank you so much, Nikki, forbeing here.
Why don't you just give theaudience a little bit of an idea
of more of who we are?
Nikki Sanderson (01:39):
Okay, well, yes , thank you, I'm so excited to
be here.
Yes, my name is Nikki.
I became Nikki when I startedat the salon.
I was known as Nicole.
When I started there, there wasthree Nicolels that worked
there, so we all had to getthese nicknames.
That's kind of how Nikki becameto be.
My family always called me thatgrowing up, but pretty much I
was always Nicole.
My high school girlfriends arestill a little bit weirded out
(02:03):
when they hear Nikki, becausethat's just how everybody knows
me.
Now that's basically my name.
But yes, I'm Nikki.
I'm 31 years old.
I grew up in Medicine Hat inAlberta.
It's a small town well, not atown, it's more of a city of
about 60,000 people.
That's where I graduated highschool.
When I graduated high school, Imoved away.
I could not wait to get out.
(02:24):
I moved to London, Ontario, forjust about a year.
My sister lives out there, so Itried that out for a bit and
then I decided to come back.
I just missed my friends and myfamily and I moved to Calgary
and I lived there for aboutthree years.
I was just kind of figuring outmy life at that point.
I was young 20s, very young 20s.
I always had a passion forscience, like biology and
(02:50):
chemistry.
But even though I failed it inhigh school, I still I really
liked it.
So I did go to the UofC for onesemester.
I took, you know, sciences.
I potentially had a dream ofbecoming a microbiologist or you
know something like that Marinebiologist.
But I really quickly learnedthat that's not at all how I
(03:15):
excel in learning.
I was failing pretty quicklywithin that first semester.
I had always loved doing hair.
When I was younger I had moreof an unhealthy passion with my
hair.
I was coloring it like everyday and you know I would have
mental breakdowns in my bathroomwhen I was a teenager if it
didn't work out good.
But nonetheless I was alwaysbraiding, you know, my friend's
(03:37):
hair, my mom's hair, coloringtheir hair, whatever it was.
So I knew that I always hadthat underlying passion for hair
and the reason that I didn'tpursue it in when I came out of
high school is just being in asmaller city.
There's kind of always thatmentality or stereotype that o
don't make a lot of money, theydon't like their job, they're
just doing it.
(03:58):
You know they're not reallypassionate about it and that I
knew like no matter what I didin life that I didn't want that
to be me.
I mean, it's not bad to say,but I knew I wanted to make
money and be successful and beindependent on my own.
I knew I didn't want to go to ajob every day, that I hated
just kind of all those things,but I didn't think that you
(04:18):
could really do that with hairunless you moved away to like
New York and became somecelebrity stylist or you know,
moved to Toronto and workeddowntown Toronto or something.
I just I didn't think that youreally, you know, made any money
, and this is like 15 years agoas well too.
So I think now, with the riseof Instagram that's obviously
you know the narrative hasbecome quite different regarding
hair.
Like you know, it's an awesomecareer, so, anyway.
(04:41):
So I dropped out of a universityin my first semester I think it
was like December and Iremember telling my dad like I'm
not doing this anymore, likeI'm going to hair school, and
he's like, oh, that's great,like I think that you'll be
really great at that, and hejust automatically kind of knew
that would be a good task for me.
So I decided to work for alittle bit more in Calgary just
to save up some money and do alittle bit of traveling before I
(05:03):
committed to going to hairschool.
And at the time my sister andmy mom had kind of relocated out
to Saskatoon, since I wasliving in Calgary.
And so I decided to come toSaskatoon to go to hair school
because I knew I wouldn't beable to really work at all
because it was a full time kindof you know school schedule.
So I drove out to Saskatoon andI couldn't believe I was now
(05:23):
living in Saskatchewan.
I just was like I'm going toget out of here as soon as I can
, like I'll move back to Calgaryas soon as I can, because I
cannot live in Saskatchewan.
That was terrible.
And then, yeah, I went to hairschool and I absolutely loved
hair school.
Like looking back on it, youknow I would never want to be in
hair school again.
But I just remember I went intoit just bright eyed and I
(05:45):
couldn't wait for my career tohappen.
And so, yeah, I really likedhair school.
And then they told me about asalon owner named Alicia in the
city and she owned a saloncalled Capelli.
I had never even heard of it.
I was almost done school prettymuch, but I had never even
heard of Capelli until theymentioned her and that she had
done New York Fashion Week.
And from that moment, I waslike I have to work for this
(06:05):
woman, like I need to meet her,I need to go to her salon.
And yeah, I reached out and shewas just about to have her
second baby and so, you know, Idon't even know if she was
really hiring or what the kindof deal was, but, yeah, I
basically kind of harassed heruntil she gave me a job there.
And then, you know, even at thatmoment, I was like I'll work
here for a year, I'll become anassistant, I'll get that, you
(06:27):
know, maybe get my journeymanhere or whatever, and then I'll
go back to Calgary to, you know,be a successful stylist there.
But you know, as I got into itat Capelli, I just realized like
this is, this is for me likeAlicia was a great mentor and,
yeah, I just I fit in right awayand I just found my groove
there.
And, yeah, within I trained upin 2015, June to December, and
(06:51):
on my first year, in my firstyear on the floor, in 2016, I
brought in over a hundredthousand in revenue, which, to
me.
I didn't know.
You know, I was just workinghard and I loved it.
I didn't know that that wasquite unheard of, and then it
kind of just went up from there.
So, yeah, I mean, I've beenable to be quite successful as a
stylist pretty quick.
I don't know.
(07:13):
I think that happens whenyou're really passionate about
it and you want to have successfor yourself.
Then I bought it in 2020 as ourowner moved on to her tech
company.
She started an app for the hairsalon community and she had to
go pretty hard into that.
That kind of opportunity cameup for me and I had never even
wanted to be a salon owner.
(07:34):
I thought it would be.
Obviously, Alicia had a greatsalon, but just seeing the
struggles that she went through,I just was like no, I can't
imagine going through that.
It's just so great to wake upevery day and only have to worry
about yourself.
You come and you do clients,you go to bed.
You don't have to worry aboutanything, and that's what I
thought I wanted.
Then the sale of the salon cameup and she had kind of mentioned
(07:57):
it and told me about it.
If it wasn't me that bought it,it was going to be some random
person and I just don't think Icould work for anybody but
Alicia.
I took over and away.
I went two months after Ibought it, six weeks or
something.
We closed down because of COVID.
So that was a huge struggle,but lots of learning happened in
(08:20):
that time as well.
Then we reopened and probablyfour months after that or five
months I expanded.
The restrictions were just toolimiting for us.
Obviously.
They went on for two and a halfyears or something.
We just had no opportunity forgrowth had we stayed in that
(08:41):
smaller space and stuff.
Now I'm here almost four yearslater.
I guess four years time flies.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (08:48):
It does.
Honestly, I want to backtrack alittle bit because, first off,
when you said you went touniversity and then you kind of
failed at that in reality failedif you weren't doing good in
your classes but always had thatpassion for hair, following
what you love doing, look at thepath you're on now, really yeah
(09:13):
.
Also, I hear it all the timejust a hairstylist.
For many of the trades, oh, I'mjust a hairstylist.
People will say that aboutthemselves even.
Or oh, he's just a plumber orjust an electrician or what have
you and the trades I mean yourvery first year as a full-time
stylist, making over $100,000,that is amazing.
(09:35):
And I know it's grown fromthere with the growth of taking
over ownership, expanding andeverything else.
But it just shows you thatthere is no limit.
When you love doing somethingand you're passionate about it,
there's no limit of what yourincome can be.
Nikki Sanderson (09:51):
Absolutely and that, yeah, you can become
anything like you know, you canbe anything and start your own
business at it.
And as long as you have apassion for it or even just an
understanding of business, youjust want to see your business
succeed, then you can honestlydo anything.
And the thing I love abouthairstylists is, sure, there are
just hairstylists Like in anyindustry, there are people who
(10:12):
just do that and they might notbe as passionate about it.
It's just the job.
That's totally fine.
But if you move into that nextlevel of you know it's your
career, it's your passion,you're growing.
All that stuff there, honestly,is no limit to hairstylists.
I have heard of somehairstylists in LA making a
million dollars a year.
Right, their haircuts are$2,500.
Like, the thing with hair thatI love so much about it is that
(10:35):
you can go from zero to 100 soquickly.
There's no like there's norules or limits as to how much
you can make in every year.
And and, yeah, at the end ofthe day, I get that we provide
services but we're artists andwhen you're an artist, you can,
you don't have to cap out atanything.
Like people painters, you knowcharge $20,000 for a painting,
(10:57):
like, if somebody's going to payit, then you can make it.
So I mean, obviously, as longas the quality is there and
everything.
But yeah, that's one thing thatI love about about this
industry as compared to othertrades.
Like a plumber, you can't, youknow, come charge $50,000 to
Change a toilet out.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (11:14):
I mean maybe I don't know, bu n know my
know husband , know, yeah,exactly.
Nikki Sanderson (11:21):
We'd be doing it.
But yeah, with hair, I meanhonestly like if you got that
passion, you built thatclientele, you, you know, have
that brand behind you, then thesky's the limit, so it's really
cool.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (11:33):
Yeah, exactly , we're going to go a lot
through your story about goingfrom being an employee to the
owner.
But I also want to go back toone thing COVID and I know so.
My store I had a physicalclothing store was just down the
I'm forward down or something.
Yeah, yeah from Nikki.
So I mean, we saw each otherall the time.
(11:54):
Of course, I got my hair donethere and you guys shopped with
me and whatnot.
But before we get really intoyour story, I want to talk a
little bit about something yousaid about COVID, where you had
to expand because of therestrictions.
And it's almost like theopposite of what people think,
because most people downsizeduring COVID right, got rid of
(12:17):
their office space or whatnot tosay, but you guys actually, by
expanding, that's what kept yougoing and really now has given
you even more success.
So do you want to talk a littlebit about that?
Totally.
Nikki Sanderson (12:31):
Yeah, absolutely yeah.
So when I bought the salon, itobviously was one day we had 10
stations but we had nineoperating chairs, because one
just wasn't really in a goodspot, yeah.
And then the restrictionshappened.
Our chairs were just a littlebit too close together, so we
could only have every other oneoperating and I think at the
time we maybe had eight stylistsor eight, or nine, or not even
(12:53):
probably.
So, yeah, that was five, fouror five chairs that we could
only use now.
So from nine till three, oneperson stylus came in to use
that chair and then from threeto nine, the next one came in.
So it was almost just likeshift work.
You had to be really, like youknow, tight on your schedule and
I mean, yeah, we could havejust stayed that way as well.
(13:15):
But I just think about, youknow, I don't, if I was a
stylist and I didn't own thesalon at that point, I would not
want to work that way for threeyears, two years, you know just
not even having the ability tolike be able to stay late for a
client because somebody was inthat chair, and you know it.
Just, it was really packed inthere as well.
(13:36):
Also another reason that Idecided to expand was the bay
next to us had been vacant forprobably about a year and, yeah,
at that point I kind of well,yeah, when it did become vacant,
our old owner before she soldit and had the idea to sell it.
She wanted to expand andhopefully take that.
But then she decided to selland then when I took it over, I
was like, oh, maybe one dayit'll still be open and you know
(13:58):
I can have the opportunity toexpand.
But obviously, like I'm justbuying this salon right now, so
it's not a good idea to do itright now.
And then we closed and yeah,when we were really opened, like
obviously we were only open forsix weeks, I only had six weeks
of money as a new business andthe bank account.
And then we closed for twomonths, yeah, and we had no
(14:20):
money.
And then to reopen under thoserestrictions, I just knew that
if that space ever got leasedwhich it honestly probably could
have, because I feel like postCOVID, there was a lot of new
businesses popping up.
Almost, like you know, peoplewere inspired to start these new
businesses and I actually thinkthat somebody was looking at
the space, but I ended upgetting it just because we were
(14:41):
already the tenants there.
But yeah, had that space beentaken, we would have had to move
locations completely.
I probably wouldn't evenbothered expanding right away,
probably wouldn't even expand itat all.
So, yeah, I just saw theopportunity and you know, you
make a little plan, you run thenumbers and if you just, you
just have to hire more peopleand I just figured that would be
(15:03):
the least.
Of my problems, you know, isjust finding people.
So, yeah, we did it and Ihaven't looked back since.
It's not like it's been easyall the time, but it's
definitely something I don'tregret at all.
It just pushes us into thatnext level.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (15:19):
Yeah, that's awesome and really you took a
really bad situation, which wasour people can only work half
time really they're working parttime hours and you took that
into doubling the amount ofstaff you had.
Totally, yeah, which is crazy.
I'm hard to believe.
Nikki Sanderson (15:36):
Yeah, I mean, when those stylists are off for
two months too, and now they'vecome back and now they're so
limited in their schedule, likethat's not fun either.
So I just I had this fear Iguess you could call it that the
people that I had with me,which were awesome people that
eventually, after so long theywould just go find a new job
because they don't wanna worklike that.
And I wouldn't have wanted youeither.
So yeah, I mean, I don't know,the risk is risk, it's all the
(16:01):
same.
I'm kind of learning.
So you know, I don't know, itwas a good choice for sure.
And we ended up yeah, we endedup doubling the space, the
chairs, the revenue.
Like, honestly, we doubled therevenue.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (16:13):
So it worked, I guess yeah, and your expenses
probably didn't double, right,right, yeah.
Nikki Sanderson (16:20):
Increase, but not double.
Yeah, exactly, the rentsobviously doubled, but you know
that's kind of a fixed cost anddoesn't really change.
So I mean the power I don'teven honestly, I don't even know
what the power bill is inmonths.
Maybe that's a bad thing, butit gets paid, so I don't know.
But yeah, it was just.
It was the move for sure.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (16:40):
Yeah, okay, let's go back a little bit risk.
So the former owner is like,hey, hey, nikki, thinking about
like I got to sell my salon, areyou interested?
Are you like absolutely no?
Or are you like, yeah, I mean,you're not risk-inverse?
Clearly, you expand during apandemic.
(17:02):
So where you're just like, yeah, I'm buying this, this is it,
or were you?
Did you have to think about itfor a long time?
Nikki Sanderson (17:08):
How did that go ?
Well, yeah, it's not like oneday she just came to me and
asked me the question flat out,right?
I feel like her and I havealways been really close.
She's always shared businessideas with me, like I feel like
I always kind of knew what washappening at the salon and we
would have these long talks allthe time and I just feel like
for five years she really got meto this point to where it
(17:29):
wasn't so scary anymore.
So, as she's moving along withher other business and the
topics of who's gonna buy it andall that stuff and how she's
gonna move along and all thatstuff, so obviously I just kind
of became the next in line and Ithink at first I definitely
wanted to keep her on almost aslike a co-owner for one to two
years and that was our originalplan.
(17:50):
Was to do that because I justlike the thought of the bank
accounting in my name, likebeing PST.
I was like where do you even goto pay PST?
I don't even know what that islike.
You know, who do I call thefile taxes?
Like I just had no idea.
So, yeah, she was gonna come onas a co-owner and we I think it
was September of 2019.
(18:12):
We went on this retreat togetherand that's where we decided I
would buy the salon and that shewould be co-owner though
December of 2019, we weresigning loans to get funding and
at that point I was just likeno, you know what I can do this.
I don't think that at the endof the day, I have her, no
matter what, she's always thephone call, text and meet up
(18:34):
away.
Yeah, so I didn't feel likethat would even serve any of us
any purpose.
Yeah, and then by February 1st,I owned the salon right out.
So, yeah, there was that periodthat I thought that I would
need somebody to help me, and Ido have her to help me, but,
yeah, you don't need that.
So, unless you know nothingabout the business, you need
(18:55):
somebody to like guide youthrough like the process.
But, like I had said, I feellike for five years she kind of
got me to that point.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (19:02):
So it was good yeah, that's good.
So you were prepared andprobably we're gonna get into
this about transitioning.
But did you think you wereprepared and you weren't really
prepared, or were you preparedcause I feel like, yeah, like I
feel like I was, like I knoweverything that's happening, and
then you start and you're likeholy crap, I don't know anything
(19:23):
that's happening.
Nikki Sanderson (19:25):
Right, I'm almost like the office that I
feel.
Like in your own head you thinkso, not negatively, but I just
how could I do this?
Like I don't know anything,like I've never paid PST, like
how do you make sure that you'regood on payroll, like all that
stuff?
And then you just do it andyou're like okay, like it's not
that bad.
(19:45):
I think you just think thatthis mountain of things that you
have to do, yes, it's veryintimidating, but you just kind
of do it.
It's like anything in life,right, but yeah, yeah.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (19:56):
So yeah, yeah , transitioning.
So you went from being afull-time stylist and I know you
were one of the busiest,probably stylist in the salon so
you go from literally seeingclients all day long to now you
not only have to see clients butyou also have to run the
business right.
So you now are responsible onceyou sign that paper and you're
(20:19):
the owner.
Like you just said, you'reresponsible for paying the taxes
and paying your staff, and Iknow in the hair industry
ordering product right, like youhave to get the color in, you
have to get the retail productsin.
Somehow you have to make surethat your team is all a
community and they're allgetting the education they need
(20:39):
and whatnot.
So how do you make thattransition from being a
full-time stylist to now being astylist and the owner?
Nikki Sanderson (20:49):
Yeah, it was.
Honestly, that's been one ofthe hardest parts, like even
still to this day, because, likeI said, I loved being a stylist
, like knowing that you go towork, you wake up, you go to
work, you do hair and not tomake that sound monotonous but
you just know what your goalsare for the day and you leave
feeling good.
I did this for people.
(21:09):
I made them feel great.
You don't take anything homewith you, really, unless you had
a terrible day at work, whichis far between.
But yeah, it just was easy.
Nobody's calling you for thisand that and whatnot.
If something goes wrong, likethere's a matter for you, right?
So that was always the bestpart about doing hair.
If you wanted to make moremoney, you just go in and you do
that.
You can just take time awaylike no one's gonna need you,
(21:33):
essentially, right, like ifyou're just, if you're a stylist
, like you can just take offwhatever you want and you take
vacation.
Go for two months, yeah, yeah,it's not a big deal, right?
So that was always the bestpart, for sure.
And then I moved into being anowner and now my day is taking
care of all these people which Ido honestly love so much.
But, yeah, it's no longer justabout me.
I'm responsible now foreverybody else's career, which
(21:55):
is like a blessing, for sure,because I'm somebody who needs
to be motivated and I thrive onthat and getting to the next
step and all that stuff.
So the pressure almost ofhaving all these people's career
in my hands is kind of whatkeeps me going almost.
But yeah, my brain almost Ithink I've had the toughest time
(22:19):
with is just as the owner.
You're not behind the chairanymore, so now you have to come
up with things to do in the day, and not that there aren't
enough things, but what am Igonna work on now?
What needs my attention now?
And I have a very hard timelike focusing on that because
I'm constantly gettingdistracted.
It would at home or at thesalon, it's all the same.
(22:40):
But the thing that I love mostabout being behind the chair is
just like you're just doing hair.
You're washing hair, you'reblow drying hair.
Now you're coloring it.
If you made a mistake, youfixed it, whatever, but your
task is right in front of yourface.
And that's what I loved, and Ihave definitely had a challenge
of coming in and prioritizingwhat needs to be done.
And then, if I didn't do 10things today, then I walk away
(23:02):
feeling like a failure, like youknow what I mean Like I didn't
do anything today.
So in reality, that's not thecase.
But, yeah, sometimes I do havestruggles now with you know, if
I have to make content, or, yeah, make a newsletter or something
like that, it's, it's.
I feel like I'm taking foreverto do it.
So, but I'm getting better atit.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (23:22):
So really, your day to day tasks and life
have changed a lot, because it'snot you standing with your
client anymore and doing theirhair.
It is now doing a whole bunchof other things.
Nikki Sanderson (23:35):
Right, exactly, and I definitely have more
flexibility in my day now forsure, like I don't have to be, I
always do try and be present inthe salon.
I think that's a big thing thathelps with the culture and just
helps people feel like I'mthere for them.
Is, you know, I try to be thereTuesday, like I'm not behind
the chair, so I'll be thereTuesday mornings, you know, nine
(23:56):
till three or two or three, butthen I have the option to kind
of you know if I have anappointment or something I can
leave.
Wednesdays has always kind ofbeen my really long day behind
the chair.
I'm there for anywhere fromfall to 13 hours and that day is
kind of just like I'm a stylistright now, you know.
But then when something goeswrong on, it's usually on a
Wednesdays, you know dishwasherbreaks or something goes wrong
(24:18):
and then it's just chaotic.
And then, yeah, Thursdays Iusually you know just up
recently I've been working fromhome a little bit and Fridays
I'm back in the salon, just, youknow, being there and helping
people out, and some Saturdays Igo in and some Saturdays I'm
behind the chair, not too muchanymore.
But yeah, I kind of keep thatday for myself and Sundays for
(24:40):
myself, and then Monday I'm, youknow, doing podcasts but this
type of thing, like you know,maybe meetings or appointments
and stuff Like that.
So I definitely have moreflexibility in my schedule now,
but everything is myresponsibility now, right?
So even if.
I come home.
I'm still working sometimes,which you know it is totally
fine, but it's not like I'm justyou know taking off for the
(25:02):
week or anything like that.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (25:04):
Yeah, exactly I like how you said that
Saturday and Sunday is your time, because, yeah, especially when
you're new I mean, you're now afew years doing this but I
think a lot of times whathappens is we're like, oh, I'm
the owner, now I have to bethere or I have to be working,
and we forget about ourselves,our literally ourselves our
(25:25):
physical health, mental health,relaxation, spending time with
your family and friends and allthose things, because you're so
focused on the business and itis so important to really
schedule yourself that timeright so you can recharge and
rest and relax and everythingelse.
Nikki Sanderson (25:43):
Yeah, and I think that's no matter what
industry you're in.
I think it's super important tohave that time.
You know I'm never notanswering my phone if something
is like falling apart at thesalon.
I'm never going to be like, ohno, it's my time, like figure it
out yourself.
But I think it's very importantthat everybody business owner,
stylist or wherever you workthat you do have those days.
(26:04):
My thing has always been in myexpectations of you know,
employees is like when you'rescheduled to work, you work hard
, like I want your 110%, andthen when you're off, like don't
worry about it, like you takeyour time off, you take
vacations, it's never going tobe a problem.
But yeah, as long as you're,you know, giving it your all and
putting that hard work induring your working hours, you
(26:26):
know if you want to come in onyour day off and do content
totally like that's your choiceto do that.
But yeah, I'm never going toforce somebody.
You know, even with likeclients, like even if it was,
you know, a correction orsomething like I hope that you
get them in during your workinghours and on the very rare
chance that you have to do itoutside of your hours, I guess
that's just part of the industry.
(26:46):
But I would never say tosomebody yeah, you're going to
have to stay, you know, on aSunday and do this like that's
your time.
So, yeah, yeah.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (26:55):
Yeah, and that's a good outlook because
you're showing your team howimportant it is to take care of
themselves.
Nikki Sanderson (27:01):
And for sure.
And yeah, as the owner too, Ifeel like you know, maybe it's
different in another industry,but if the salon falls apart, if
I'm not there for a Saturday orif I take a week of vacation,
the salon is falling apart, likeobviously I didn't hire the
right people, I'm not doing myjob properly, right, like I
should.
I want to be there and I amthere, but if I'm not for some
reason and it things blow uplike what does that say about
(27:24):
the business?
That doesn't function that wellby itself, right?
So yeah, kind of the balancethat I want to have is that I
will be there, I am alwaysavailable in there, but if I'm
not, for some, reason ifsomething comes up, then
everybody's good.
you know it's got a good systemin place, so yeah.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (27:39):
Yeah, that's a great point, because most
people look at success asfinancial, like, oh, we make
money, we make good money, okay,great, but having the right
people on the right proceduresin place, you shouldn't have to
be at your business all day,every day that's.
You shouldn't have to do thatbecause your business should be
able to run without you there.
(28:00):
That, to me, is the real signof success.
Nikki Sanderson (28:04):
Totally, and especially now that I'm not just
doing hair.
I would be there if I was doingclients all day, and now I'm
answering emails, editingcontent, making content, like
doing all these things thatdon't necessarily require me to
be at the salon, and sometimesit's.
You know, our salon has 15chairs now, probably like 14
staff members, and you knowwe've got this big table at the
(28:25):
front and if I sit there andwork, I absolutely love it
because I can be present in thesalon.
But then, you know, thestylists are coming up to talk
to me, which is fine.
You know my clients or otherclients walk in.
They want to chat, like youknow, distributors they're
coming in to chat, like thephone rings, all that stuff.
So it is quite distracting, butI do still want to be there.
But sometimes I just have towork from home to have that
(28:47):
quiet time and, yeah, I thinkthat that's not a bad thing.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (28:51):
No, I agree, I always think it's funny too,
and you probably feel the same.
But when you said that it'skind of distracting, I used to
do that too.
Sometimes I'd be like, oh, I'lljust go to my store and work
for a few hours and all of thatended up happening was my staff
asked me questions and I'm like,if I wasn't here, would you
have texted me that or would youhave just they're like I
probably would have just done it.
I'm like, yeah, like you don'tneed to ask me, then just do
(29:13):
what you think you should do.
And it is good to network withyour, with your client, even if
they're not your client, likethey're coming to your business.
Nikki Sanderson (29:22):
But you're right, there is also that point
where you don't get anythingproductive done because you're
just spending time visiting andanswering and chatting and
answering the phone, you know,and all that stuff, hanging
coats up, like which you knowsounds like, yeah, but I want to
be there.
Somebody walks in andsomebody's not at the front.
(29:43):
Then you got to, you know,greet them, hang their coat up,
which you know is obviouslyexpected, but yeah, then it,
anything I'm working on, like Isaid, my brain gets very
distracted and then I just 30minutes go by and I'm like, oh,
yeah, I was supposed to beworking on that thing, so, and
then it's three o'clock and thenI'm going home.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (29:59):
So, yeah, exactly, oh yeah, hours fly when
you're in your business, likeyou don't realize, like oh, it's
only lunchtime and all of asudden it's four and you're like
, how did that happen?
Nikki Sanderson (30:10):
Yeah, and I accomplished nothing.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (30:12):
Yeah, yeah, exactly yeah.
What has been the mostchallenging thing for you with
this change?
Nikki Sanderson (30:23):
I would probably say, just challenge it.
Yeah, like being nowresponsible for everybody.
You know you got to check in oneverybody and make sure you
know everyone's growing andloving their work, which, at the
end of the day, you know if youdon't, then do something about
(30:44):
it.
You know, it's not like I'mbabysitting or anything, but I
think sometimes that because Imean, I was kind of always
somebody who never needed thatLike I'm just like I had a leash
obviously that inspired me andall that, but I never needed
like I'm feeling something today, like I need like motivation
and you know I just I kind ofmade it for myself and I knew
(31:04):
what I wanted and nothing wasreally going to stop me.
Sometimes it is, you know, alittle, a little hard sometimes
when you have to do that forpeople, but that's just part of
of being the owner and I, yeah,I wouldn't change it for
anything, but I would just kindof say that is feeling with
people's not everybody'spersonality, but just a certain
(31:26):
type for sure.
And, yeah, trying to make surethat everybody's always feeling
good.
And yeah, because sometimes youknow you're not feeling good
and I, yeah, I don't know.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (31:36):
It's true.
And you're taking on everyoneelse's stress kind of as your
own right, like to make surethat everybody's happy.
Everybody's doing what they'resupposed to be doing.
How can you improve things?
There's a problem?
What do you do that?
Even if you don't think aboutit, you're taking on that load
yourself now right.
Where before that wasn't yourproblem.
Nikki Sanderson (31:59):
Yeah, exactly, I would just maybe hear about it
through.
You know what I mean.
I didn't even have to ever dealwith it.
But yeah, and just you know thehardest part, just I don't know
.
There's just you know, somemonths are so great and overall,
overall it's been great.
Some months are very hard andyou know, when you're feeling
down, the team feel like theyfeed off that energy as well.
(32:22):
So it's very hard sometimes tomake sure that you're keeping
like I'm keeping myselfmotivated when I come in.
You know I can't be mopingaround and I don't.
But imagine if your owner justdid that and you're like, oh
okay, well, that's not theenergy I wanted today.
So you know, above everythingthat you go through as an owner,
you always have to rememberthat there's, you know, 10, 15
(32:43):
other people looking at you.
You know who will immediately,like change their behavior based
off how you're acting.
So sometimes that's hard to forsure.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (32:52):
Yeah, do really.
You're putting everybody elsebefore you.
Nikki Sanderson (32:55):
Yeah.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (32:56):
Yeah, you're really under the microscope for
sure when you're the owner,because how you handle
situations, your attitude, allof that, people are looking for
you.
Like you said, Alicia was yourmentor.
You are the mentor now to manyof the stylists there, so
they're looking at you right.
So you have to bring thatpositive energy and
(33:16):
problem-solve and all of thateverything.
Nikki Sanderson (33:18):
Exactly, yeah, be the cheerleader for everybody
.
And I mean honestly, I do loveit.
I love my job so much in thisposition that I've changed into.
But yeah, I think that would be.
The hardest part is justdealing with so many
personalities and you know somany people want different
things and have different workethics.
Not like a bad standard, butyeah, it's just.
(33:40):
You know what you see in oneperson.
You wish you could duplicate itacross the board almost, and
you know, if it doesn't happenthat way, then you're kind of
like okay.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (33:48):
Yeah, yeah for sure.
What has been the best partabout going from an employee to
the owner?
Nikki Sanderson (33:56):
Ooh, that's a good one.
Um, the best part, I would.
Maybe this sounds like a littleselfish, or not even selfish,
but just looking at everythingand being like wow, like I
didn't obviously create that bymyself, like I've got a whole
team of people that have equallyplayed an important role, but
(34:18):
when you look back on it, you'relike wow, I did that, like I
really I think that that's justsuch a cool thing.
And then you know this person'ssuccessful, or going on this to
this class, or you know theirdreams are coming true because
of a part that I played, and youknow I think that that's like
really cool and a huge motive.
Yeah, factor in my motivationthat keeps me going is is seeing
(34:39):
that for sure.
Yeah, it's awesome.
Being the owner is honestlyawesome, like I said, like more
of a flexible schedule to anextent, for sure, but it's more
pressure having everything on me.
But it is cool just to look athow it all comes together and to
be like I did that, like that,you know, with me.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (34:59):
So, yeah, obviously there's a lot of
people that help out, but no,it's something definitely to be
proud of and I can tell you fromsomeone that's started a
business, ran business, sold abusiness, moved on the
relationships that you have withyour team.
Those relationships arelifelong.
Like I still have people thatwork for me now my business.
(35:21):
I opened my business 10 yearsago already.
I have people that worked forme 10 years ago.
I have one staff member I'm notold enough to be her mom, but I
kind of always feel like hermom a little bit because she was
like 18 when she started for me.
N s.
She called the other day hey,would you be a reference for the
?
You know, like you still havethose bonds with people and
(35:43):
seeing what an amazing womanshe's become like that brings me
so much joy.
And it really has nothing to dowith my business, it's just
those connections with your team.
They're life changing for sure.
Yeah.
Nikki Sanderson (35:58):
And your team, honestly, is your biggest.
It's the biggest thing in thebusiness, for sure, because,
yeah, without clients youwouldn't have any revenue, you
wouldn't have a business, but itdoes start with your team.
Like, imagine calling into abusiness and their customer
service department is atrocious,like you would never shop there
, right?
So I think it really boils downto who you keep on your team
and that's one of my biggestthings is who we hire, who we
(36:21):
have to let go if it's notworking.
But yeah, I'm a huge supporterof my team because I honestly
think without them who they werewe would not be where we are
today.
So I will always, you know,stick up for them.
You know, obviously withinreason, but yeah, they're the
person that I fight for andstick up for.
And you know we have policies inplace and you know we've
(36:43):
changed up how we charge forthings and all that, just so it
supports them and betters them.
For sure, because you know, Idon't want them to ever feel
like, you know, I'm just onlythere for the money and I don't
care about them, because that'sit's almost the opposite Like I
care so much about them andtheir success because that's
(37:04):
what I had.
And you would never want tofeel like your boss or whatever
is against you, right, likeyou're going to, you're walking
on eggshells if you know youhave a customer complaint or
customer said this or that orwhatever.
Like yeah, I'm going to, youknow, I'm going to be on their
side, but also on the customerside too, if that makes sense.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (37:22):
But yeah, yeah, I think, too, having the
team that you have also comesback to you, because that's who
you hire and that's who youtrain and that's who you mentor,
right?
So a lot of that is you, whichyou should be really proud of?
Nikki Sanderson (37:39):
Yeah, totally.
And I mean, yeah, it's just whoyou surround yourself with.
Like, I don't want to work withpeople I don't like either.
You know, yes, there'sdifferent personalities you have
to deal with in a day, but Iwant to work with people I like
and I'm sure that they feel thesame and you know they want to
work with people that they like.
So it's kind of like, you know,if we hire somebody new, it's a
mutual decision among the team,Like, do we like this person?
Does everybody get along withthem and see them doing well
(37:59):
here?
And you know, for a couple ofpeople, like, no, not really.
Then okay, that's not a problem.
Like, you know, I don't nottrust their judgment because,
yeah, if you have a good team,you want to make sure that those
people end up liking coming towork and all that stuff.
So, for sure, I think it'simportant to, yeah, as an owner,
support your team the best thatyou can, because that'll end up
coming back into your businessand you'll end up having clients
(38:21):
that love your staff and loveyour business.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (38:24):
So yeah, yeah , and that's the best philosophy
to have, right, because, at theend of the day, your staff is
happier, you're happier, yourbusiness is better.
It's a win across the board,right.
Nikki Sanderson (38:35):
Definitely yeah , and the happier staff that
feels respected and valued and,like they're, you know, have the
potential to earn.
Like a great wage equals happycustomers, because that's the
energy that they're seeing aswell, right?
So if everybody was miserableand hated their life, then the
client would be like I don'twant to be there.
So then it would just be yeah,instantly fall apart.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (38:55):
So yeah, I love that.
Do you have a most importantlesson that you've learned from
going from an employee to theowner?
Nikki Sanderson (39:05):
Yes, that's a good one too.
I don't know how to put it intolike an eloquent phrase, I
guess, but I would probably saythe only person holding you back
is you.
I guess.
If you're probably wonderingwhy things aren't happening for
you, I would think that they'relooking in the mirror, because I
(39:27):
truly believe that good thingscome to people who work hard for
them and have a great attitudeand outlook on life and you know
, they're able to be flexibleand adapt to change and all that
stuff.
I've worked with people whodefinitely no longer work there,
but you know, you'd ask themone little thing and it would be
(39:47):
a fight.
You know those type of people.
But then they're wondering why,you know, why this, why that?
Why am I not busy this?
And I just think it's such afull circle thing like my big,
my thing that I always tellpeople to is you go into any
situation and any job whetheryou honestly like it or not.
If you don't like it, thenleave.
That's your choice, right.
But if you go into a situationand you're just like, what can
(40:11):
this do for me?
What can this person do for me?
I'm only here to you know, takewhat they can give me.
It's not going to be a verylong relationship, I feel like.
But if you go into everyrelationship, work, whatever,
saying how can I add value tothis day, what can I do that's
going to make this person's daybetter or easier, whatever,
(40:31):
honestly, is how I always wentinto work.
Just how can I make the daybetter?
All that stuff when I was astylist and it got me to this
point.
And you know, if I didn't likethe salon then I would have left
.
But I love the salon and I feellike that's because of my
outlook on it.
So yeah, I just I would say,like probably the only person
(40:52):
holding you back is you, and youknow everybody wants and even
if you don't want the thing youstill want to make decent money
and everybody wants to liketheir job right.
But, yeah, sometimes the onlyperson getting in your way is
you.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (41:05):
So, yeah, yeah for sure.
Look at yourself, if you whatwere presented with the
opportunity to buy the store orthe salon and you would have
said, no, I don't think I can doit.
Nikki Sanderson (41:17):
That would have been the end of that right and
like look what you've done yeah,yeah, or just yeah, had a
generally bad attitude or youknow, just push back on
everything.
And you know there's been somehard conversations that the
former owner has had with theteam previous team and, um, some
went good, some didn't, allthat stuff, but I just was.
I remember always being like,yeah, whatever you got to do to
(41:39):
make sure that this place staysopen, I'm fine with, because I
don't want to lose my job, right, but yeah, I left and moved on
somewhere because I didn't likewhat was happening when I
wouldn't have owned it.
And I get that not everybodywants to own.
That's that's what I thought,too, right, and but but not
everybody has that too.
Like you have to be, you know,a certain type of person to want
to take this on for sure.
And um, yeah, I don't thinkthat everybody has that ability
(42:03):
for sure, but I didn't want toown it either, and and now I do
and I don't work at it at all.
So, yeah, sometimes you justhave to be open to the
opportunity and and take them asthey come, because you never
know what one year, two years,five years is gonna look like.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (42:16):
So, for sure is there anything you wish you
had known?
Nikki Sanderson (42:21):
Yeah, definitely like going into it.
I think I was a little naive,for sure.
Um, just regarding, like, whatpeople would say to you and you
know how not everybody's on yourside at the end of the day,
like, even if it appears thatway.
Um, so I wish I just would havenot tried to give so much to
(42:45):
some people just because Ithought, oh, like I am so
desperate to keep them on, youknow.
Um, yeah, I wish I just wouldhave like realized that I want
to keep my team, obviously, butsome, some people you just can't
keep on your team.
They're just it's just tootoxic and it drains you and it's
only going to be bad in thelong run.
So, yeah, if you ever havepeople like this on your team,
(43:07):
just get rid of them.
So I'd be, some advice for sure.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (43:10):
Nikki, I didn't learn that until many
years in.
I call it breaking up withpeople, and it also goes for
clients.
It's okay to break up withclients totally oh my gosh yeah
that is.
Nikki Sanderson (43:22):
That is a huge thing too, is that?
Yes, one thing that I'velearned as well is not
everybody's your client like youdon't need to do the hair of
every single person in the city.
That is not even possible,right, there are some people who
do not get your business.
They don't get the way that youoperate, they don't respect
your policies, and that'sactually like a huge rule that I
have, too is I I believe incustomer service to the 10th
(43:45):
degree, but if you don't respectmy team and the policies that
we've set in place because ofcertain things that have
happened, then they can't haveyou in the salon.
Like that's just, you know, justbecause you're a customer, like
seeking out services doesn'tgive you the right to come here,
like it's a two-way thing,right, so that's a huge thing
that I then we don't fire a lotof clients.
(44:05):
It's maybe one to two a year.
But, yeah, if you don't respecttheir policies, like you don't
agree with them, that's totallyfine, but it's just not going to
be the salon for you.
But we, a business, has to havepolicies in place for a reason,
and and yeah, and that justsupports the salon, it supports
the staff members, it makespeople feel like they have, you
know, like a clear path ofwhat's going to happen and yeah,
(44:26):
so that's a huge thing too.
It is everybody's your clientyeah, not everybody's your
client.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (44:31):
It doesn't matter what your business is.
You are not the place foreveryone and don't try to be.
This is a great way to end here, because you cannot ever be
everything to everyone, so findyour niche, stick to it right,
yeah, and and people, you know,clothing people, some people
don't see the value.
Nikki Sanderson (44:50):
And expensive clothing, yeah, quality clothing
not everybody sees the value injust hair, even just a $30
haircut.
They don't care what it lookslike, right?
So they're not going to likethe $100 haircut, they're not,
certainly not going to like theprice of it and I'm not going to
notice the difference betweenthe $100 and the $30 one.
So they're definitely not ourclient, for sure.
And yeah there's just differentlevels of you know what a
(45:12):
customer pays in every industrycars, houses, all that stuff.
So you just have to find whatthat client likes and it's could
not be yours and that's totallyfine.
You can't be like heartbrokenor feel like you failed or you
have terrible customer serviceevery time you know there's an
upset customer or you have tolike let somebody go, it's just,
it's just how it is so yeah, Iagree that that old saying the
(45:36):
customer is always right iswrong.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (45:40):
That's what I always say.
No, the customer is alwaysright until they're not right
right.
So if they're wrong, they'rewrong.
Nikki Sanderson (45:46):
Yeah, it does happen, like our policy of the
salon is.
You know, 90 over 95 percent ofcomplaints or issues get fixed
like we'll deal with it,absolutely, we take that on.
And then there's a very smallamount where, like I said,
you're just not our client,you're never going to get it,
you never we're going to respectanything, no matter what we do,
it's not going to be goodenough.
(46:07):
And then you just have to letgo of them.
And yeah, obviously those aregoing to be ones that write
reviews and you know, have, youknow create the biggest uproar.
But then you have to rememberall the thousands of other ones
who love your business and youknow you would literally do
anything for to keep them andyou've got to find your good
clients and do anything to keepthose ones for sure yeah, the
(46:29):
old 80 20 rule right.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (46:31):
20 percent of your people are going to bring
you 80 percent of your revenue.
Nikki Sanderson (46:35):
So find those 20 and treat them well yeah, and
how it's so much more expensiveto find a new client as it is
to keep your existing ones.
So you know, obviously we dowant new clients, but if you're
just not the right fit, then I,just I as a business owner, like
there's stress I'm willing totake on, but I just I cannot
deal with the stress of acontinually like upset client
(46:55):
who's just always causingproblems, like just not
respecting policies, like youknow.
I just I can't deal with it.
It's just I don't even want to.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (47:03):
So well, and you don't have to.
That's the glory of owning yourown business.
Nikki Sanderson (47:06):
You say goodbye and that's that yeah, yeah,
then that's a nice thing too, isyou get to set your own
policies and make make the finaldecision, and yeah, that's kind
of nice too.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (47:15):
So yeah, for sure, Nikki.
Thank you so much.
This time has just flown by.
It literally did.
It's already been 1 minutes.
I know I don't even understandhow this happens, but I know
people are going to want to knowmore about you and more about
Capelli.
So where is the best place forthem to find you?
Nikki Sanderson (47:31):
Definitely Instagram my tag.
What do you call it a handle?
Yeah, it's a Nikki, a Capelli,that's.
Yeah, that's where you can findall of our team members, their
name, at Capelli.
It's kind of the thing thatwe've taken on.
So, yeah, you can find me thereto reach out if you have any
questions awesome.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (47:49):
Thank you so much.
I really appreciate it.
I love your transition and Ihave been there from the start.
I feel like seeing you, so I'mvery proud.
Congratulations on all of yoursuccess.
Nikki Sanderson (47:59):
Mackenzie, you're welcome h h having
having having me on.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (48:01):
It was so much fun it was.
Thank you so much and toeverybody listening, we'll see
you on the next episode.
Thanks for listening to winning.
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(48:21):
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(48:42):
Special thanks to shana fosterfor Shauna voicing Foster our
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Thanks again for listening andI'll see you on the next episode
.
Winning is your guide to making it in business.
Join our award-winning host andentrepreneur, Mackenzie Kilshaw
, and special guests in casualconversations that will educate
and inspire you on your businessjourney.
Winning will help you learn thehard lessons the easy way, with
guidance from celebratedentrepreneurs and business
(00:26):
leaders.
It's fun, it's informative,it's Winning.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (00:31):
Hello, welcome to Winning.
I am your host, MackenzieKilshaw, and today's guest is
Nikki Sanderson.
Hi, Nikki, hi, how are you?
Nikki Sanderson (00:38):
I'm really good .
How are you?
I'm so good.
Thank you for having me my veryfirst podcast.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (00:44):
Oh, I love it .
I love hearing that you'regoing to be such a great guest.
If you don't know Nikki she isa dynamic and accomplished
hairstylist whose journey beganin 2014.
She started as an assistant,she moved to a full-time stylist
and she was making over$100,000 a year, which is
amazing.
Her success led her to actuallypurchase the salon.
(01:08):
She became the owner ofCapelli' S Studio in Saskatoon
in 2020.
We're really going to talk alot about her transition from
being an employee at a businessinto being the owner.
Also, something extremely coolshe expanded the business just
eight months into her ownershipand doubled the size of the
(01:29):
salon.
We're going to talk about thattoo.
Thank you so much, Nikki, forbeing here.
Why don't you just give theaudience a little bit of an idea
of more of who we are?
Nikki Sanderson (01:39):
Okay, well, yes , thank you, I'm so excited to
be here.
Yes, my name is Nikki.
I became Nikki when I startedat the salon.
I was known as Nicole.
When I started there, there wasthree Nicolels that worked
there, so we all had to getthese nicknames.
That's kind of how Nikki becameto be.
My family always called me thatgrowing up, but pretty much I
was always Nicole.
My high school girlfriends arestill a little bit weirded out
(02:03):
when they hear Nikki, becausethat's just how everybody knows
me.
Now that's basically my name.
But yes, I'm Nikki.
I'm 31 years old.
I grew up in Medicine Hat inAlberta.
It's a small town well, not atown, it's more of a city of
about 60,000 people.
That's where I graduated highschool.
When I graduated high school, Imoved away.
I could not wait to get out.
(02:24):
I moved to London, Ontario, forjust about a year.
My sister lives out there, so Itried that out for a bit and
then I decided to come back.
I just missed my friends and myfamily and I moved to Calgary
and I lived there for aboutthree years.
I was just kind of figuring outmy life at that point.
I was young 20s, very young 20s.
I always had a passion forscience, like biology and
(02:50):
chemistry.
But even though I failed it inhigh school, I still I really
liked it.
So I did go to the UofC for onesemester.
I took, you know, sciences.
I potentially had a dream ofbecoming a microbiologist or you
know something like that Marinebiologist.
But I really quickly learnedthat that's not at all how I
(03:15):
excel in learning.
I was failing pretty quicklywithin that first semester.
I had always loved doing hair.
When I was younger I had moreof an unhealthy passion with my
hair.
I was coloring it like everyday and you know I would have
mental breakdowns in my bathroomwhen I was a teenager if it
didn't work out good.
But nonetheless I was alwaysbraiding, you know, my friend's
(03:37):
hair, my mom's hair, coloringtheir hair, whatever it was.
So I knew that I always hadthat underlying passion for hair
and the reason that I didn'tpursue it in when I came out of
high school is just being in asmaller city.
There's kind of always thatmentality or stereotype that o
don't make a lot of money, theydon't like their job, they're
just doing it.
(03:58):
You know they're not reallypassionate about it and that I
knew like no matter what I didin life that I didn't want that
to be me.
I mean, it's not bad to say,but I knew I wanted to make
money and be successful and beindependent on my own.
I knew I didn't want to go to ajob every day, that I hated
just kind of all those things,but I didn't think that you
(04:18):
could really do that with hairunless you moved away to like
New York and became somecelebrity stylist or you know,
moved to Toronto and workeddowntown Toronto or something.
I just I didn't think that youreally, you know, made any money
, and this is like 15 years agoas well too.
So I think now, with the riseof Instagram that's obviously
you know the narrative hasbecome quite different regarding
hair.
Like you know, it's an awesomecareer, so, anyway.
(04:41):
So I dropped out of a universityin my first semester I think it
was like December and Iremember telling my dad like I'm
not doing this anymore, likeI'm going to hair school, and
he's like, oh, that's great,like I think that you'll be
really great at that, and hejust automatically kind of knew
that would be a good task for me.
So I decided to work for alittle bit more in Calgary just
to save up some money and do alittle bit of traveling before I
(05:03):
committed to going to hairschool.
And at the time my sister andmy mom had kind of relocated out
to Saskatoon, since I wasliving in Calgary.
And so I decided to come toSaskatoon to go to hair school
because I knew I wouldn't beable to really work at all
because it was a full time kindof you know school schedule.
So I drove out to Saskatoon andI couldn't believe I was now
(05:23):
living in Saskatchewan.
I just was like I'm going toget out of here as soon as I can
, like I'll move back to Calgaryas soon as I can, because I
cannot live in Saskatchewan.
That was terrible.
And then, yeah, I went to hairschool and I absolutely loved
hair school.
Like looking back on it, youknow I would never want to be in
hair school again.
But I just remember I went intoit just bright eyed and I
(05:45):
couldn't wait for my career tohappen.
And so, yeah, I really likedhair school.
And then they told me about asalon owner named Alicia in the
city and she owned a saloncalled Capelli.
I had never even heard of it.
I was almost done school prettymuch, but I had never even
heard of Capelli until theymentioned her and that she had
done New York Fashion Week.
And from that moment, I waslike I have to work for this
(06:05):
woman, like I need to meet her,I need to go to her salon.
And yeah, I reached out and shewas just about to have her
second baby and so, you know, Idon't even know if she was
really hiring or what the kindof deal was, but, yeah, I
basically kind of harassed heruntil she gave me a job there.
And then, you know, even at thatmoment, I was like I'll work
here for a year, I'll become anassistant, I'll get that, you
(06:27):
know, maybe get my journeymanhere or whatever, and then I'll
go back to Calgary to, you know,be a successful stylist there.
But you know, as I got into itat Capelli, I just realized like
this is, this is for me likeAlicia was a great mentor and,
yeah, I just I fit in right awayand I just found my groove
there.
And, yeah, within I trained upin 2015, June to December, and
(06:51):
on my first year, in my firstyear on the floor, in 2016, I
brought in over a hundredthousand in revenue, which, to
me.
I didn't know.
You know, I was just workinghard and I loved it.
I didn't know that that wasquite unheard of, and then it
kind of just went up from there.
So, yeah, I mean, I've beenable to be quite successful as a
stylist pretty quick.
I don't know.
(07:13):
I think that happens whenyou're really passionate about
it and you want to have successfor yourself.
Then I bought it in 2020 as ourowner moved on to her tech
company.
She started an app for the hairsalon community and she had to
go pretty hard into that.
That kind of opportunity cameup for me and I had never even
wanted to be a salon owner.
(07:34):
I thought it would be.
Obviously, Alicia had a greatsalon, but just seeing the
struggles that she went through,I just was like no, I can't
imagine going through that.
It's just so great to wake upevery day and only have to worry
about yourself.
You come and you do clients,you go to bed.
You don't have to worry aboutanything, and that's what I
thought I wanted.
Then the sale of the salon cameup and she had kind of mentioned
(07:57):
it and told me about it.
If it wasn't me that bought it,it was going to be some random
person and I just don't think Icould work for anybody but
Alicia.
I took over and away.
I went two months after Ibought it, six weeks or
something.
We closed down because of COVID.
So that was a huge struggle,but lots of learning happened in
(08:20):
that time as well.
Then we reopened and probablyfour months after that or five
months I expanded.
The restrictions were just toolimiting for us.
Obviously.
They went on for two and a halfyears or something.
We just had no opportunity forgrowth had we stayed in that
(08:41):
smaller space and stuff.
Now I'm here almost four yearslater.
I guess four years time flies.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (08:48):
It does.
Honestly, I want to backtrack alittle bit because, first off,
when you said you went touniversity and then you kind of
failed at that in reality failedif you weren't doing good in
your classes but always had thatpassion for hair, following
what you love doing, look at thepath you're on now, really yeah
(09:13):
.
Also, I hear it all the timejust a hairstylist.
For many of the trades, oh, I'mjust a hairstylist.
People will say that aboutthemselves even.
Or oh, he's just a plumber orjust an electrician or what have
you and the trades I mean yourvery first year as a full-time
stylist, making over $100,000,that is amazing.
(09:35):
And I know it's grown fromthere with the growth of taking
over ownership, expanding andeverything else.
But it just shows you thatthere is no limit.
When you love doing somethingand you're passionate about it,
there's no limit of what yourincome can be.
Nikki Sanderson (09:51):
Absolutely and that, yeah, you can become
anything like you know, you canbe anything and start your own
business at it.
And as long as you have apassion for it or even just an
understanding of business, youjust want to see your business
succeed, then you can honestlydo anything.
And the thing I love abouthairstylists is, sure, there are
just hairstylists Like in anyindustry, there are people who
(10:12):
just do that and they might notbe as passionate about it.
It's just the job.
That's totally fine.
But if you move into that nextlevel of you know it's your
career, it's your passion,you're growing.
All that stuff there, honestly,is no limit to hairstylists.
I have heard of somehairstylists in LA making a
million dollars a year.
Right, their haircuts are$2,500.
Like, the thing with hair thatI love so much about it is that
(10:35):
you can go from zero to 100 soquickly.
There's no like there's norules or limits as to how much
you can make in every year.
And and, yeah, at the end ofthe day, I get that we provide
services but we're artists andwhen you're an artist, you can,
you don't have to cap out atanything.
Like people painters, you knowcharge $20,000 for a painting,
(10:57):
like, if somebody's going to payit, then you can make it.
So I mean, obviously, as longas the quality is there and
everything.
But yeah, that's one thing thatI love about about this
industry as compared to othertrades.
Like a plumber, you can't, youknow, come charge $50,000 to
Change a toilet out.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (11:14):
I mean maybe I don't know, bu n know my
know husband , know, yeah,exactly.
Nikki Sanderson (11:21):
We'd be doing it.
But yeah, with hair, I meanhonestly like if you got that
passion, you built thatclientele, you, you know, have
that brand behind you, then thesky's the limit, so it's really
cool.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (11:33):
Yeah, exactly , we're going to go a lot
through your story about goingfrom being an employee to the
owner.
But I also want to go back toone thing COVID and I know so.
My store I had a physicalclothing store was just down the
I'm forward down or something.
Yeah, yeah from Nikki.
So I mean, we saw each otherall the time.
(11:54):
Of course, I got my hair donethere and you guys shopped with
me and whatnot.
But before we get really intoyour story, I want to talk a
little bit about something yousaid about COVID, where you had
to expand because of therestrictions.
And it's almost like theopposite of what people think,
because most people downsizeduring COVID right, got rid of
(12:17):
their office space or whatnot tosay, but you guys actually, by
expanding, that's what kept yougoing and really now has given
you even more success.
So do you want to talk a littlebit about that?
Totally.
Nikki Sanderson (12:31):
Yeah, absolutely yeah.
So when I bought the salon, itobviously was one day we had 10
stations but we had nineoperating chairs, because one
just wasn't really in a goodspot, yeah.
And then the restrictionshappened.
Our chairs were just a littlebit too close together, so we
could only have every other oneoperating and I think at the
time we maybe had eight stylistsor eight, or nine, or not even
(12:53):
probably.
So, yeah, that was five, fouror five chairs that we could
only use now.
So from nine till three, oneperson stylus came in to use
that chair and then from threeto nine, the next one came in.
So it was almost just likeshift work.
You had to be really, like youknow, tight on your schedule and
I mean, yeah, we could havejust stayed that way as well.
(13:15):
But I just think about, youknow, I don't, if I was a
stylist and I didn't own thesalon at that point, I would not
want to work that way for threeyears, two years, you know just
not even having the ability tolike be able to stay late for a
client because somebody was inthat chair, and you know it.
Just, it was really packed inthere as well.
(13:36):
Also another reason that Idecided to expand was the bay
next to us had been vacant forprobably about a year and, yeah,
at that point I kind of well,yeah, when it did become vacant,
our old owner before she soldit and had the idea to sell it.
She wanted to expand andhopefully take that.
But then she decided to selland then when I took it over, I
was like, oh, maybe one dayit'll still be open and you know
(13:58):
I can have the opportunity toexpand.
But obviously, like I'm justbuying this salon right now, so
it's not a good idea to do itright now.
And then we closed and yeah,when we were really opened, like
obviously we were only open forsix weeks, I only had six weeks
of money as a new business andthe bank account.
And then we closed for twomonths, yeah, and we had no
(14:20):
money.
And then to reopen under thoserestrictions, I just knew that
if that space ever got leasedwhich it honestly probably could
have, because I feel like postCOVID, there was a lot of new
businesses popping up.
Almost, like you know, peoplewere inspired to start these new
businesses and I actually thinkthat somebody was looking at
the space, but I ended upgetting it just because we were
(14:41):
already the tenants there.
But yeah, had that space beentaken, we would have had to move
locations completely.
I probably wouldn't evenbothered expanding right away,
probably wouldn't even expand itat all.
So, yeah, I just saw theopportunity and you know, you
make a little plan, you run thenumbers and if you just, you
just have to hire more peopleand I just figured that would be
(15:03):
the least.
Of my problems, you know, isjust finding people.
So, yeah, we did it and Ihaven't looked back since.
It's not like it's been easyall the time, but it's
definitely something I don'tregret at all.
It just pushes us into thatnext level.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (15:19):
Yeah, that's awesome and really you took a
really bad situation, which wasour people can only work half
time really they're working parttime hours and you took that
into doubling the amount ofstaff you had.
Totally, yeah, which is crazy.
I'm hard to believe.
Nikki Sanderson (15:36):
Yeah, I mean, when those stylists are off for
two months too, and now they'vecome back and now they're so
limited in their schedule, likethat's not fun either.
So I just I had this fear Iguess you could call it that the
people that I had with me,which were awesome people that
eventually, after so long theywould just go find a new job
because they don't wanna worklike that.
And I wouldn't have wanted youeither.
So yeah, I mean, I don't know,the risk is risk, it's all the
(16:01):
same.
I'm kind of learning.
So you know, I don't know, itwas a good choice for sure.
And we ended up yeah, we endedup doubling the space, the
chairs, the revenue.
Like, honestly, we doubled therevenue.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (16:13):
So it worked, I guess yeah, and your expenses
probably didn't double, right,right, yeah.
Nikki Sanderson (16:20):
Increase, but not double.
Yeah, exactly, the rentsobviously doubled, but you know
that's kind of a fixed cost anddoesn't really change.
So I mean the power I don'teven honestly, I don't even know
what the power bill is inmonths.
Maybe that's a bad thing, butit gets paid, so I don't know.
But yeah, it was just.
It was the move for sure.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (16:40):
Yeah, okay, let's go back a little bit risk.
So the former owner is like,hey, hey, nikki, thinking about
like I got to sell my salon, areyou interested?
Are you like absolutely no?
Or are you like, yeah, I mean,you're not risk-inverse?
Clearly, you expand during apandemic.
(17:02):
So where you're just like, yeah, I'm buying this, this is it,
or were you?
Did you have to think about itfor a long time?
Nikki Sanderson (17:08):
How did that go ?
Well, yeah, it's not like oneday she just came to me and
asked me the question flat out,right?
I feel like her and I havealways been really close.
She's always shared businessideas with me, like I feel like
I always kind of knew what washappening at the salon and we
would have these long talks allthe time and I just feel like
for five years she really got meto this point to where it
(17:29):
wasn't so scary anymore.
So, as she's moving along withher other business and the
topics of who's gonna buy it andall that stuff and how she's
gonna move along and all thatstuff, so obviously I just kind
of became the next in line and Ithink at first I definitely
wanted to keep her on almost aslike a co-owner for one to two
years and that was our originalplan.
(17:50):
Was to do that because I justlike the thought of the bank
accounting in my name, likebeing PST.
I was like where do you even goto pay PST?
I don't even know what that islike.
You know, who do I call thefile taxes?
Like I just had no idea.
So, yeah, she was gonna come onas a co-owner and we I think it
was September of 2019.
(18:12):
We went on this retreat togetherand that's where we decided I
would buy the salon and that shewould be co-owner though
December of 2019, we weresigning loans to get funding and
at that point I was just likeno, you know what I can do this.
I don't think that at the endof the day, I have her, no
matter what, she's always thephone call, text and meet up
(18:34):
away.
Yeah, so I didn't feel likethat would even serve any of us
any purpose.
Yeah, and then by February 1st,I owned the salon right out.
So, yeah, there was that periodthat I thought that I would
need somebody to help me, and Ido have her to help me, but,
yeah, you don't need that.
So, unless you know nothingabout the business, you need
(18:55):
somebody to like guide youthrough like the process.
But, like I had said, I feellike for five years she kind of
got me to that point.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (19:02):
So it was good yeah, that's good.
So you were prepared andprobably we're gonna get into
this about transitioning.
But did you think you wereprepared and you weren't really
prepared, or were you preparedcause I feel like, yeah, like I
feel like I was, like I knoweverything that's happening, and
then you start and you're likeholy crap, I don't know anything
(19:23):
that's happening.
Nikki Sanderson (19:25):
Right, I'm almost like the office that I
feel.
Like in your own head you thinkso, not negatively, but I just
how could I do this?
Like I don't know anything,like I've never paid PST, like
how do you make sure that you'regood on payroll, like all that
stuff?
And then you just do it andyou're like okay, like it's not
that bad.
(19:45):
I think you just think thatthis mountain of things that you
have to do, yes, it's veryintimidating, but you just kind
of do it.
It's like anything in life,right, but yeah, yeah.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (19:56):
So yeah, yeah , transitioning.
So you went from being afull-time stylist and I know you
were one of the busiest,probably stylist in the salon so
you go from literally seeingclients all day long to now you
not only have to see clients butyou also have to run the
business right.
So you now are responsible onceyou sign that paper and you're
(20:19):
the owner.
Like you just said, you'reresponsible for paying the taxes
and paying your staff, and Iknow in the hair industry
ordering product right, like youhave to get the color in, you
have to get the retail productsin.
Somehow you have to make surethat your team is all a
community and they're allgetting the education they need
(20:39):
and whatnot.
So how do you make thattransition from being a
full-time stylist to now being astylist and the owner?
Nikki Sanderson (20:49):
Yeah, it was.
Honestly, that's been one ofthe hardest parts, like even
still to this day, because, likeI said, I loved being a stylist
, like knowing that you go towork, you wake up, you go to
work, you do hair and not tomake that sound monotonous but
you just know what your goalsare for the day and you leave
feeling good.
I did this for people.
(21:09):
I made them feel great.
You don't take anything homewith you, really, unless you had
a terrible day at work, whichis far between.
But yeah, it just was easy.
Nobody's calling you for thisand that and whatnot.
If something goes wrong, likethere's a matter for you, right?
So that was always the bestpart about doing hair.
If you wanted to make moremoney, you just go in and you do
that.
You can just take time awaylike no one's gonna need you,
(21:33):
essentially, right, like ifyou're just, if you're a stylist
, like you can just take offwhatever you want and you take
vacation.
Go for two months, yeah, yeah,it's not a big deal, right?
So that was always the bestpart, for sure.
And then I moved into being anowner and now my day is taking
care of all these people which Ido honestly love so much.
But, yeah, it's no longer justabout me.
I'm responsible now foreverybody else's career, which
(21:55):
is like a blessing, for sure,because I'm somebody who needs
to be motivated and I thrive onthat and getting to the next
step and all that stuff.
So the pressure almost ofhaving all these people's career
in my hands is kind of whatkeeps me going almost.
But yeah, my brain almost Ithink I've had the toughest time
(22:19):
with is just as the owner.
You're not behind the chairanymore, so now you have to come
up with things to do in the day, and not that there aren't
enough things, but what am Igonna work on now?
What needs my attention now?
And I have a very hard timelike focusing on that because
I'm constantly gettingdistracted.
It would at home or at thesalon, it's all the same.
(22:40):
But the thing that I love mostabout being behind the chair is
just like you're just doing hair.
You're washing hair, you'reblow drying hair.
Now you're coloring it.
If you made a mistake, youfixed it, whatever, but your
task is right in front of yourface.
And that's what I loved, and Ihave definitely had a challenge
of coming in and prioritizingwhat needs to be done.
And then, if I didn't do 10things today, then I walk away
(23:02):
feeling like a failure, like youknow what I mean Like I didn't
do anything today.
So in reality, that's not thecase.
But, yeah, sometimes I do havestruggles now with you know, if
I have to make content, or, yeah, make a newsletter or something
like that, it's, it's.
I feel like I'm taking foreverto do it.
So, but I'm getting better atit.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (23:22):
So really, your day to day tasks and life
have changed a lot, because it'snot you standing with your
client anymore and doing theirhair.
It is now doing a whole bunchof other things.
Nikki Sanderson (23:35):
Right, exactly, and I definitely have more
flexibility in my day now forsure, like I don't have to be, I
always do try and be present inthe salon.
I think that's a big thing thathelps with the culture and just
helps people feel like I'mthere for them.
Is, you know, I try to be thereTuesday, like I'm not behind
the chair, so I'll be thereTuesday mornings, you know, nine
(23:56):
till three or two or three, butthen I have the option to kind
of you know if I have anappointment or something I can
leave.
Wednesdays has always kind ofbeen my really long day behind
the chair.
I'm there for anywhere fromfall to 13 hours and that day is
kind of just like I'm a stylistright now, you know.
But then when something goeswrong on, it's usually on a
Wednesdays, you know dishwasherbreaks or something goes wrong
(24:18):
and then it's just chaotic.
And then, yeah, Thursdays Iusually you know just up
recently I've been working fromhome a little bit and Fridays
I'm back in the salon, just, youknow, being there and helping
people out, and some Saturdays Igo in and some Saturdays I'm
behind the chair, not too muchanymore.
But yeah, I kind of keep thatday for myself and Sundays for
(24:40):
myself, and then Monday I'm, youknow, doing podcasts but this
type of thing, like you know,maybe meetings or appointments
and stuff Like that.
So I definitely have moreflexibility in my schedule now,
but everything is myresponsibility now, right?
So even if.
I come home.
I'm still working sometimes,which you know it is totally
fine, but it's not like I'm justyou know taking off for the
(25:02):
week or anything like that.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (25:04):
Yeah, exactly I like how you said that
Saturday and Sunday is your time, because, yeah, especially when
you're new I mean, you're now afew years doing this but I
think a lot of times whathappens is we're like, oh, I'm
the owner, now I have to bethere or I have to be working,
and we forget about ourselves,our literally ourselves our
(25:25):
physical health, mental health,relaxation, spending time with
your family and friends and allthose things, because you're so
focused on the business and itis so important to really
schedule yourself that timeright so you can recharge and
rest and relax and everythingelse.
Nikki Sanderson (25:43):
Yeah, and I think that's no matter what
industry you're in.
I think it's super important tohave that time.
You know I'm never notanswering my phone if something
is like falling apart at thesalon.
I'm never going to be like, ohno, it's my time, like figure it
out yourself.
But I think it's very importantthat everybody business owner,
stylist or wherever you workthat you do have those days.
(26:04):
My thing has always been in myexpectations of you know,
employees is like when you'rescheduled to work, you work hard
, like I want your 110%, andthen when you're off, like don't
worry about it, like you takeyour time off, you take
vacations, it's never going tobe a problem.
But yeah, as long as you're,you know, giving it your all and
putting that hard work induring your working hours, you
(26:26):
know if you want to come in onyour day off and do content
totally like that's your choiceto do that.
But yeah, I'm never going toforce somebody.
You know, even with likeclients, like even if it was,
you know, a correction orsomething like I hope that you
get them in during your workinghours and on the very rare
chance that you have to do itoutside of your hours, I guess
that's just part of the industry.
(26:46):
But I would never say tosomebody yeah, you're going to
have to stay, you know, on aSunday and do this like that's
your time.
So, yeah, yeah.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (26:55):
Yeah, and that's a good outlook because
you're showing your team howimportant it is to take care of
themselves.
Nikki Sanderson (27:01):
And for sure.
And yeah, as the owner too, Ifeel like you know, maybe it's
different in another industry,but if the salon falls apart, if
I'm not there for a Saturday orif I take a week of vacation,
the salon is falling apart, likeobviously I didn't hire the
right people, I'm not doing myjob properly, right, like I
should.
I want to be there and I amthere, but if I'm not for some
reason and it things blow uplike what does that say about
(27:24):
the business?
That doesn't function that wellby itself, right?
So yeah, kind of the balancethat I want to have is that I
will be there, I am alwaysavailable in there, but if I'm
not, for some, reason ifsomething comes up, then
everybody's good.
you know it's got a good systemin place, so yeah.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (27:39):
Yeah, that's a great point, because most
people look at success asfinancial, like, oh, we make
money, we make good money, okay,great, but having the right
people on the right proceduresin place, you shouldn't have to
be at your business all day,every day that's.
You shouldn't have to do thatbecause your business should be
able to run without you there.
(28:00):
That, to me, is the real signof success.
Nikki Sanderson (28:04):
Totally, and especially now that I'm not just
doing hair.
I would be there if I was doingclients all day, and now I'm
answering emails, editingcontent, making content, like
doing all these things thatdon't necessarily require me to
be at the salon, and sometimesit's.
You know, our salon has 15chairs now, probably like 14
staff members, and you knowwe've got this big table at the
(28:25):
front and if I sit there andwork, I absolutely love it
because I can be present in thesalon.
But then, you know, thestylists are coming up to talk
to me, which is fine.
You know my clients or otherclients walk in.
They want to chat, like youknow, distributors they're
coming in to chat, like thephone rings, all that stuff.
So it is quite distracting, butI do still want to be there.
But sometimes I just have towork from home to have that
(28:47):
quiet time and, yeah, I thinkthat that's not a bad thing.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (28:51):
No, I agree, I always think it's funny too,
and you probably feel the same.
But when you said that it'skind of distracting, I used to
do that too.
Sometimes I'd be like, oh, I'lljust go to my store and work
for a few hours and all of thatended up happening was my staff
asked me questions and I'm like,if I wasn't here, would you
have texted me that or would youhave just they're like I
probably would have just done it.
I'm like, yeah, like you don'tneed to ask me, then just do
(29:13):
what you think you should do.
And it is good to network withyour, with your client, even if
they're not your client, likethey're coming to your business.
Nikki Sanderson (29:22):
But you're right, there is also that point
where you don't get anythingproductive done because you're
just spending time visiting andanswering and chatting and
answering the phone, you know,and all that stuff, hanging
coats up, like which you knowsounds like, yeah, but I want to
be there.
Somebody walks in andsomebody's not at the front.
(29:43):
Then you got to, you know,greet them, hang their coat up,
which you know is obviouslyexpected, but yeah, then it,
anything I'm working on, like Isaid, my brain gets very
distracted and then I just 30minutes go by and I'm like, oh,
yeah, I was supposed to beworking on that thing, so, and
then it's three o'clock and thenI'm going home.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (29:59):
So, yeah, exactly, oh yeah, hours fly when
you're in your business, likeyou don't realize, like oh, it's
only lunchtime and all of asudden it's four and you're like
, how did that happen?
Nikki Sanderson (30:10):
Yeah, and I accomplished nothing.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (30:12):
Yeah, yeah, exactly yeah.
What has been the mostchallenging thing for you with
this change?
Nikki Sanderson (30:23):
I would probably say, just challenge it.
Yeah, like being nowresponsible for everybody.
You know you got to check in oneverybody and make sure you
know everyone's growing andloving their work, which, at the
end of the day, you know if youdon't, then do something about
(30:44):
it.
You know, it's not like I'mbabysitting or anything, but I
think sometimes that because Imean, I was kind of always
somebody who never needed thatLike I'm just like I had a leash
obviously that inspired me andall that, but I never needed
like I'm feeling something today, like I need like motivation
and you know I just I kind ofmade it for myself and I knew
(31:04):
what I wanted and nothing wasreally going to stop me.
Sometimes it is, you know, alittle, a little hard sometimes
when you have to do that forpeople, but that's just part of
of being the owner and I, yeah,I wouldn't change it for
anything, but I would just kindof say that is feeling with
people's not everybody'spersonality, but just a certain
(31:26):
type for sure.
And, yeah, trying to make surethat everybody's always feeling
good.
And yeah, because sometimes youknow you're not feeling good
and I, yeah, I don't know.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (31:36):
It's true.
And you're taking on everyoneelse's stress kind of as your
own right, like to make surethat everybody's happy.
Everybody's doing what they'resupposed to be doing.
How can you improve things?
There's a problem?
What do you do that?
Even if you don't think aboutit, you're taking on that load
yourself now right.
Where before that wasn't yourproblem.
Nikki Sanderson (31:59):
Yeah, exactly, I would just maybe hear about it
through.
You know what I mean.
I didn't even have to ever dealwith it.
But yeah, and just you know thehardest part, just I don't know
.
There's just you know, somemonths are so great and overall,
overall it's been great.
Some months are very hard andyou know, when you're feeling
down, the team feel like theyfeed off that energy as well.
(32:22):
So it's very hard sometimes tomake sure that you're keeping
like I'm keeping myselfmotivated when I come in.
You know I can't be mopingaround and I don't.
But imagine if your owner justdid that and you're like, oh
okay, well, that's not theenergy I wanted today.
So you know, above everythingthat you go through as an owner,
you always have to rememberthat there's, you know, 10, 15
(32:43):
other people looking at you.
You know who will immediately,like change their behavior based
off how you're acting.
So sometimes that's hard to forsure.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (32:52):
Yeah, do really.
You're putting everybody elsebefore you.
Nikki Sanderson (32:55):
Yeah.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (32:56):
Yeah, you're really under the microscope for
sure when you're the owner,because how you handle
situations, your attitude, allof that, people are looking for
you.
Like you said, Alicia was yourmentor.
You are the mentor now to manyof the stylists there, so
they're looking at you right.
So you have to bring thatpositive energy and
(33:16):
problem-solve and all of thateverything.
Nikki Sanderson (33:18):
Exactly, yeah, be the cheerleader for everybody
.
And I mean honestly, I do loveit.
I love my job so much in thisposition that I've changed into.
But yeah, I think that would be.
The hardest part is justdealing with so many
personalities and you know somany people want different
things and have different workethics.
Not like a bad standard, butyeah, it's just.
(33:40):
You know what you see in oneperson.
You wish you could duplicate itacross the board almost, and
you know, if it doesn't happenthat way, then you're kind of
like okay.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (33:48):
Yeah, yeah for sure.
What has been the best partabout going from an employee to
the owner?
Nikki Sanderson (33:56):
Ooh, that's a good one.
Um, the best part, I would.
Maybe this sounds like a littleselfish, or not even selfish,
but just looking at everythingand being like wow, like I
didn't obviously create that bymyself, like I've got a whole
team of people that have equallyplayed an important role, but
(34:18):
when you look back on it, you'relike wow, I did that, like I
really I think that that's justsuch a cool thing.
And then you know this person'ssuccessful, or going on this to
this class, or you know theirdreams are coming true because
of a part that I played, and youknow I think that that's like
really cool and a huge motive.
Yeah, factor in my motivationthat keeps me going is is seeing
(34:39):
that for sure.
Yeah, it's awesome.
Being the owner is honestlyawesome, like I said, like more
of a flexible schedule to anextent, for sure, but it's more
pressure having everything on me.
But it is cool just to look athow it all comes together and to
be like I did that, like that,you know, with me.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (34:59):
So, yeah, obviously there's a lot of
people that help out, but no,it's something definitely to be
proud of and I can tell you fromsomeone that's started a
business, ran business, sold abusiness, moved on the
relationships that you have withyour team.
Those relationships arelifelong.
Like I still have people thatwork for me now my business.
(35:21):
I opened my business 10 yearsago already.
I have people that worked forme 10 years ago.
I have one staff member I'm notold enough to be her mom, but I
kind of always feel like hermom a little bit because she was
like 18 when she started for me.
N s.
She called the other day hey,would you be a reference for the
?
You know, like you still havethose bonds with people and
(35:43):
seeing what an amazing womanshe's become like that brings me
so much joy.
And it really has nothing to dowith my business, it's just
those connections with your team.
They're life changing for sure.
Yeah.
Nikki Sanderson (35:58):
And your team, honestly, is your biggest.
It's the biggest thing in thebusiness, for sure, because,
yeah, without clients youwouldn't have any revenue, you
wouldn't have a business, but itdoes start with your team.
Like, imagine calling into abusiness and their customer
service department is atrocious,like you would never shop there
, right?
So I think it really boils downto who you keep on your team
and that's one of my biggestthings is who we hire, who we
(36:21):
have to let go if it's notworking.
But yeah, I'm a huge supporterof my team because I honestly
think without them who they werewe would not be where we are
today.
So I will always, you know,stick up for them.
You know, obviously withinreason, but yeah, they're the
person that I fight for andstick up for.
And you know we have policies inplace and you know we've
(36:43):
changed up how we charge forthings and all that, just so it
supports them and betters them.
For sure, because you know, Idon't want them to ever feel
like, you know, I'm just onlythere for the money and I don't
care about them, because that'sit's almost the opposite Like I
care so much about them andtheir success because that's
(37:04):
what I had.
And you would never want tofeel like your boss or whatever
is against you, right, likeyou're going to, you're walking
on eggshells if you know youhave a customer complaint or
customer said this or that orwhatever.
Like yeah, I'm going to, youknow, I'm going to be on their
side, but also on the customerside too, if that makes sense.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (37:22):
But yeah, yeah, I think, too, having the
team that you have also comesback to you, because that's who
you hire and that's who youtrain and that's who you mentor,
right?
So a lot of that is you, whichyou should be really proud of?
Nikki Sanderson (37:39):
Yeah, totally.
And I mean, yeah, it's just whoyou surround yourself with.
Like, I don't want to work withpeople I don't like either.
You know, yes, there'sdifferent personalities you have
to deal with in a day, but Iwant to work with people I like
and I'm sure that they feel thesame and you know they want to
work with people that they like.
So it's kind of like, you know,if we hire somebody new, it's a
mutual decision among the team,Like, do we like this person?
Does everybody get along withthem and see them doing well
(37:59):
here?
And you know, for a couple ofpeople, like, no, not really.
Then okay, that's not a problem.
Like, you know, I don't nottrust their judgment because,
yeah, if you have a good team,you want to make sure that those
people end up liking coming towork and all that stuff.
So, for sure, I think it'simportant to, yeah, as an owner,
support your team the best thatyou can, because that'll end up
coming back into your businessand you'll end up having clients
(38:21):
that love your staff and loveyour business.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (38:24):
So yeah, yeah , and that's the best philosophy
to have, right, because, at theend of the day, your staff is
happier, you're happier, yourbusiness is better.
It's a win across the board,right.
Nikki Sanderson (38:35):
Definitely yeah , and the happier staff that
feels respected and valued and,like they're, you know, have the
potential to earn.
Like a great wage equals happycustomers, because that's the
energy that they're seeing aswell, right?
So if everybody was miserableand hated their life, then the
client would be like I don'twant to be there.
So then it would just be yeah,instantly fall apart.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (38:55):
So yeah, I love that.
Do you have a most importantlesson that you've learned from
going from an employee to theowner?
Nikki Sanderson (39:05):
Yes, that's a good one too.
I don't know how to put it intolike an eloquent phrase, I
guess, but I would probably saythe only person holding you back
is you.
I guess.
If you're probably wonderingwhy things aren't happening for
you, I would think that they'relooking in the mirror, because I
(39:27):
truly believe that good thingscome to people who work hard for
them and have a great attitudeand outlook on life and you know
, they're able to be flexibleand adapt to change and all that
stuff.
I've worked with people whodefinitely no longer work there,
but you know, you'd ask themone little thing and it would be
(39:47):
a fight.
You know those type of people.
But then they're wondering why,you know, why this, why that?
Why am I not busy this?
And I just think it's such afull circle thing like my big,
my thing that I always tellpeople to is you go into any
situation and any job whetheryou honestly like it or not.
If you don't like it, thenleave.
That's your choice, right.
But if you go into a situationand you're just like, what can
(40:11):
this do for me?
What can this person do for me?
I'm only here to you know, takewhat they can give me.
It's not going to be a verylong relationship, I feel like.
But if you go into everyrelationship, work, whatever,
saying how can I add value tothis day, what can I do that's
going to make this person's daybetter or easier, whatever,
(40:31):
honestly, is how I always wentinto work.
Just how can I make the daybetter?
All that stuff when I was astylist and it got me to this
point.
And you know, if I didn't likethe salon then I would have left
.
But I love the salon and I feellike that's because of my
outlook on it.
So yeah, I just I would say,like probably the only person
(40:52):
holding you back is you, and youknow everybody wants and even
if you don't want the thing youstill want to make decent money
and everybody wants to liketheir job right.
But, yeah, sometimes the onlyperson getting in your way is
you.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (41:05):
So, yeah, yeah for sure.
Look at yourself, if you whatwere presented with the
opportunity to buy the store orthe salon and you would have
said, no, I don't think I can doit.
Nikki Sanderson (41:17):
That would have been the end of that right and
like look what you've done yeah,yeah, or just yeah, had a
generally bad attitude or youknow, just push back on
everything.
And you know there's been somehard conversations that the
former owner has had with theteam previous team and, um, some
went good, some didn't, allthat stuff, but I just was.
I remember always being like,yeah, whatever you got to do to
(41:39):
make sure that this place staysopen, I'm fine with, because I
don't want to lose my job, right, but yeah, I left and moved on
somewhere because I didn't likewhat was happening when I
wouldn't have owned it.
And I get that not everybodywants to own.
That's that's what I thought,too, right, and but but not
everybody has that too.
Like you have to be, you know,a certain type of person to want
to take this on for sure.
And um, yeah, I don't thinkthat everybody has that ability
(42:03):
for sure, but I didn't want toown it either, and and now I do
and I don't work at it at all.
So, yeah, sometimes you justhave to be open to the
opportunity and and take them asthey come, because you never
know what one year, two years,five years is gonna look like.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (42:16):
So, for sure is there anything you wish you
had known?
Nikki Sanderson (42:21):
Yeah, definitely like going into it.
I think I was a little naive,for sure.
Um, just regarding, like, whatpeople would say to you and you
know how not everybody's on yourside at the end of the day,
like, even if it appears thatway.
Um, so I wish I just would havenot tried to give so much to
(42:45):
some people just because Ithought, oh, like I am so
desperate to keep them on, youknow.
Um, yeah, I wish I just wouldhave like realized that I want
to keep my team, obviously, butsome, some people you just can't
keep on your team.
They're just it's just tootoxic and it drains you and it's
only going to be bad in thelong run.
So, yeah, if you ever havepeople like this on your team,
(43:07):
just get rid of them.
So I'd be, some advice for sure.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (43:10):
Nikki, I didn't learn that until many
years in.
I call it breaking up withpeople, and it also goes for
clients.
It's okay to break up withclients totally oh my gosh yeah
that is.
Nikki Sanderson (43:22):
That is a huge thing too, is that?
Yes, one thing that I'velearned as well is not
everybody's your client like youdon't need to do the hair of
every single person in the city.
That is not even possible,right, there are some people who
do not get your business.
They don't get the way that youoperate, they don't respect
your policies, and that'sactually like a huge rule that I
have, too is I I believe incustomer service to the 10th
(43:45):
degree, but if you don't respectmy team and the policies that
we've set in place because ofcertain things that have
happened, then they can't haveyou in the salon.
Like that's just, you know, justbecause you're a customer, like
seeking out services doesn'tgive you the right to come here,
like it's a two-way thing,right, so that's a huge thing
that I then we don't fire a lotof clients.
(44:05):
It's maybe one to two a year.
But, yeah, if you don't respecttheir policies, like you don't
agree with them, that's totallyfine, but it's just not going to
be the salon for you.
But we, a business, has to havepolicies in place for a reason,
and and yeah, and that justsupports the salon, it supports
the staff members, it makespeople feel like they have, you
know, like a clear path ofwhat's going to happen and yeah,
(44:26):
so that's a huge thing too.
It is everybody's your clientyeah, not everybody's your
client.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (44:31):
It doesn't matter what your business is.
You are not the place foreveryone and don't try to be.
This is a great way to end here, because you cannot ever be
everything to everyone, so findyour niche, stick to it right,
yeah, and and people, you know,clothing people, some people
don't see the value.
Nikki Sanderson (44:50):
And expensive clothing, yeah, quality clothing
not everybody sees the value injust hair, even just a $30
haircut.
They don't care what it lookslike, right?
So they're not going to likethe $100 haircut, they're not,
certainly not going to like theprice of it and I'm not going to
notice the difference betweenthe $100 and the $30 one.
So they're definitely not ourclient, for sure.
And yeah there's just differentlevels of you know what a
(45:12):
customer pays in every industrycars, houses, all that stuff.
So you just have to find whatthat client likes and it's could
not be yours and that's totallyfine.
You can't be like heartbrokenor feel like you failed or you
have terrible customer serviceevery time you know there's an
upset customer or you have tolike let somebody go, it's just,
it's just how it is so yeah, Iagree that that old saying the
(45:36):
customer is always right iswrong.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (45:40):
That's what I always say.
No, the customer is alwaysright until they're not right
right.
So if they're wrong, they'rewrong.
Nikki Sanderson (45:46):
Yeah, it does happen, like our policy of the
salon is.
You know, 90 over 95 percent ofcomplaints or issues get fixed
like we'll deal with it,absolutely, we take that on.
And then there's a very smallamount where, like I said,
you're just not our client,you're never going to get it,
you never we're going to respectanything, no matter what we do,
it's not going to be goodenough.
(46:07):
And then you just have to letgo of them.
And yeah, obviously those aregoing to be ones that write
reviews and you know, have, youknow create the biggest uproar.
But then you have to rememberall the thousands of other ones
who love your business and youknow you would literally do
anything for to keep them andyou've got to find your good
clients and do anything to keepthose ones for sure yeah, the
(46:29):
old 80 20 rule right.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (46:31):
20 percent of your people are going to bring
you 80 percent of your revenue.
Nikki Sanderson (46:35):
So find those 20 and treat them well yeah, and
how it's so much more expensiveto find a new client as it is
to keep your existing ones.
So you know, obviously we dowant new clients, but if you're
just not the right fit, then I,just I as a business owner, like
there's stress I'm willing totake on, but I just I cannot
deal with the stress of acontinually like upset client
(46:55):
who's just always causingproblems, like just not
respecting policies, like youknow.
I just I can't deal with it.
It's just I don't even want to.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (47:03):
So well, and you don't have to.
That's the glory of owning yourown business.
Nikki Sanderson (47:06):
You say goodbye and that's that yeah, yeah,
then that's a nice thing too, isyou get to set your own
policies and make make the finaldecision, and yeah, that's kind
of nice too.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (47:15):
So yeah, for sure, Nikki.
Thank you so much.
This time has just flown by.
It literally did.
It's already been 1 minutes.
I know I don't even understandhow this happens, but I know
people are going to want to knowmore about you and more about
Capelli.
So where is the best place forthem to find you?
Nikki Sanderson (47:31):
Definitely Instagram my tag.
What do you call it a handle?
Yeah, it's a Nikki, a Capelli,that's.
Yeah, that's where you can findall of our team members, their
name, at Capelli.
It's kind of the thing thatwe've taken on.
So, yeah, you can find me thereto reach out if you have any
questions awesome.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (47:49):
Thank you so much.
I really appreciate it.
I love your transition and Ihave been there from the start.
I feel like seeing you, so I'mvery proud.
Congratulations on all of yoursuccess.
Nikki Sanderson (47:59):
Mackenzie, you're welcome h h having
having having me on.
Mackenzie Kilshaw (48:01):
It was so much fun it was.
Thank you so much and toeverybody listening, we'll see
you on the next episode.
Thanks for listening to winning.
Be sure to subscribe to get allof our new episodes.
If you enjoyed this episode andyou'd like to help support the
podcast, please share it withothers, post about on social
media and leave a rating andreview wherever you listen to
(48:21):
winning.
To catch all of the latest fromus, you can follow winning
podcast on Instagram a winningpodcast, facebook at Facebook
winning podcast Winning andPodcast on twitter at Twitter
winning a pod.
Winning was created and isproduced by me, mackenzie
Kilshaw Mackenzie music createdby summer for Summer me f by
Seth Armstrong.
(48:42):
Special thanks to shana fosterfor Shauna voicing Foster our
opening and, of course, a hugethank you to this episode's
guest.
Thanks again for listening andI'll see you on the next episode
.
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Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.