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Why wait for motivation to get healthy? What if that’s exactly what’s keeping you stuck, and there’s a better way forward?

I’m joined by Jenn Trepeck, host of Salad with a Side of Fries and an optimal health coach who helps people build sustainable habits, without extremes. We break down why motivation is not the key to fitness success and how relying on it keeps us in a cycle of guilt, shame, and inconsistency. Instead, we talk about building momentum through simple, repeatable actions that fit into real life, even on your busiest days. Jenn also shares two practical movement routines anyone can start today.

Today, you’ll learn all about:

3:43 – Replace motivation with another M word
6:23 – What discipline really looks like
10:21 – Make fitness fun and doable
16:07 – How to start without overwhelm
20:04 – Consistency beats intensity
25:49 – Aligning expectations with your life
35:02 – When tracking helps more than hurts
54:27 – Your sustainable plan starts here
58:45 – Two-minute routine for busy days
1:01:17 – Affirmations that actually work

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Transcript

Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Philip Pape (00:01):
I just need to get motivated to go to the gym, to
improve my nutrition, to startwalking more, etc.
Sound familiar.
If you just found the rightinspiration, the perfect program
or enough willpower, you'dfinally stick to your fitness
routine.
But what if I told you thatwaiting for motivation is
exactly what's keeping you stuckin cycles of starting and

(00:23):
stopping, all or nothingthinking and blaming yourself
when things don't work out.
Today, my guest reveals whymotivation is not just
unreliable it's actually workingagainst you.
You'll discover the reason mostpeople fail their goals, the
powerful alternative tomotivation that actually drives
long-term success, and how tobuild systems that work with
your life instead of against it,whether you feel motivated or

(00:46):
not.
Welcome to Wits and Weights, theshow that helps you build a
strong, healthy physique usingevidence, engineering and
efficiency.
I'm your host, philip Pape, andtoday we're going to challenge
one of the most deeply heldbeliefs in the health and
fitness world that you just needto get motivated to succeed.

(01:08):
We hear it all the time.
I'm just waiting to getmotivated.
I need motivation, and my guesttoday is Jen Trebek, an optimal
health coach and host of theSalad with a Side of Fries
podcast.
Please go, give that a follow.
Jen helps people buildsustainable habits without
extremes, and she's going tochallenge everything you think
you know about what it takes tolive your healthiest, happiest

(01:29):
life Today.
You're going to learn whymotivation is a myth, what
really drives sustainablebehavior change, and how to
build momentum without relyingon willpower or waiting for just
the right time If you'refeeling like something's wrong
with you.
When you're not motivated,stick around.
Get a fresh jolt of energy,maybe some motivation though
that's ironic to get you on theright path for you.

(01:49):
Jen, welcome to the show.

Jenn Trepeck (01:51):
Thank you so much.
First of all, I hope I live upto everything you just shared,
but I love it.

Philip Pape (01:56):
I love the irony of like you're going to leave this
motivated, but we're going totell you why that's not the
thing.
Which is great, because thenpeople are like what does this
all mean?
Because we're going to definewhat motivation is and why
people fail so frequently.
And look, you and I have beenthrough it.
I'm sure both of our storiesare just full of times when we
said this and we hear it fromlisteners and clients.

(02:16):
But let's just start at thebeginning and examine what
happens when someone is saying,as an excuse or as their reason,
I just need to get motivated,right, whether it's nutrition,
training, lifestyle, all thethings.

Jenn Trepeck (02:30):
Yeah, I hear it all the time and sometimes what
it sounds like is I know what todo, I'm just not doing it Right
, or sometimes it's I'm waitingto want to do it, I'm supposed
to want to do this before I.
You know, whatever it is, getoff the couch to go walk or lift

(02:51):
or whatever.
And it's such BS Like we'vebeen taught that that comes
first, and so we're all sittingaround waiting for lightning to
strike first, and so we're allsitting around waiting for
lightning to strike, and itfeels like lightning, you know,
because we have this expectationthat that's what's going to get

(03:11):
us up off the couch.
The truth is it's not, andthat's why we feel like
something's wrong with us,because we've been told that
this is what we're supposed tofeel right, that this is what we
need to get going, and we don'tfeel that way and we think
we're broken.
So, fundamentally, you are notbroken.

(03:33):
There is nothing wrong with you.
It's that we've been fed a linethat motivation is what we need
, and it's not.
I call it a different M word.
Okay, you're going to tease uson there You're going to deliver

Lisa (03:51):
the goods right now.

Jenn Trepeck (03:52):
Should we do it now?

Lisa (03:52):
Should we wait.
No, we can do it now, Becauseyou know to guys listening.

Philip Pape (03:56):
There's a lot more to come in this episode besides
just this reveal.

Jenn Trepeck (04:01):
So the other M word is actually momentum,
because in the beginningmotivation actually looks like
discipline.
So in the beginning what weneed is not motivation.
What we need is discipline.

(04:22):
What we need is a commitment.
What we need is just to put theactivity or the thing in our
calendar and do it, even if wedon't feel like doing it.
We do it because that's what wecommitted to is just taking the
action right.
And so over time, thediscipline of doing something

(04:45):
consistently allows us todevelop momentum where it
becomes part of what we do andby doing it consistently we
experience the benefit and wecan connect the benefit to the

(05:06):
action.
That's when we get themotivation, not before.
So what we're actually lookingfor to get going is not
motivation but discipline andthat discipline turning into
momentum.

Philip Pape (05:21):
Beautiful Mic drop.
This is great.
This is great.

Jenn Trepeck (05:25):
We could end this now, but we have so much more we
could.

Philip Pape (05:27):
We want to dive into each, because I know
there's probably questions aboutwhat we mean by commitment, by
discipline.
What if you don't even havethat first thing, et cetera.
One of the first times I heardthis concept was actually
probably from Mike Matthews,legion Athletics.
Poor guy, he ended his podcastbecause he's a millionaire now.
These, you know, legionathletics.
Or guy handed his podcast causehe's a millionaire now, but you
know, uh, he, he talked aboutthis a long time ago action

(05:49):
leading to, uh, the result,leading to the momentum.
And we talk about systems andclosed feedback loops here as
well.
So I love what you're saying,that you've got to have a
catalyst, and we want todistinguish that catalyst from
motivation, I think, becausemotivation, I think people get
overwhelmed with thinking like,oh my God, I have to go to the
gym three days a week.
How am I going to keep gettingmotivated to do that?

(06:10):
And it's just this thought thatfesters.
It's kind of like when youprocrastinate, right, and it
literally takes you five minutesto clean out the garage.
You know when you thought it.
It's this huge thing.
So, momentum, discipline,commitment let's focus on that
word, discipline, I think itgets misused.
Start there, maybe, define that.

Jenn Trepeck (06:26):
So when I use the word discipline, I mean I'm
doing the things that I toldmyself I'm going to do.
Way, because when that guiltand shame show up because we

(06:51):
didn't do the things we said wewere going to do right, by the
way, that's when guilt and shameshow up.
We are more likely to avoidthat when it is a commitment
that we make to other people.
It's why having the appointmentwith a trainer gets us there.
Right, not just the money piece,but somebody else is involved

(07:13):
in that dynamic and we don'twant to let them down, or
whatever.
It is right, like we are morelikely to keep the commitments
that we make to other people,and so, when it's in this space
of feeling challenged bymotivation, this is the
discipline to keep thecommitments we make to ourselves

(07:34):
.
And then what that looks likeis maybe having 10 minutes in
the calendar, right.
It looks like making sure thatwe set our clothes out the night
before.
It looks like eating dinnerwith our sneakers on, so that
the walk after dinner is likewell, I'm already halfway there,
right.

(07:54):
It looks like a lot of littlethings that are seemingly so
small that are actually the bigthings yeah, I have to say, jen,
you draw me in the way youspeak.

Philip Pape (08:05):
I'm like I want to hear what's next.
A lot of, a lot of silence isgood, it's good Cause I'm such a
, I'm such a rambler, all right,and and, and I'm proud of it, I
own it.
But anyway, a few things stuckout of me there, because the
simple things.
As a coach, I almost feelinadequate, right, when I'm
trying to give somebody such asimple piece of advice and I'm

(08:27):
like, why hasn't this comeacross your mind up till now?
The idea of putting a reminderin your phone app that says do
this.
Or, like you said, removingfriction, removing resistance
from going to the gym byprepping your gym bag the night
before, right, yeah, just todayor yesterday, someone in my
Facebook group said should Ieven start lifting weights for

(08:49):
fat loss?
Okay, and immediately.
I'll like cringe, I'm like it'sa non-negotiable.
But hold on, let me see what shehas to say.
And she said you know, I'm amom, I have young toddlers.
I get up at seven and I'm go go, go to like 4 pm.
You know, I don't even think Ican get to the gym.
And one of my questions to herwas well, if this was your
number one priority, how wouldyou do it?

(09:11):
Just to get her thinking out ofthe box, and then you can see
the wheels turning of.
Okay, it's a schedule issue,but then it's like still
overwhelming because she'sprobably looking for motivation.
How do I get that started?

Jenn Trepeck (09:28):
So that's kind of what you're hitting on is like
exactly, you got to take thestep, but you have to find a way
to make it easy for yourself todo it Exactly.
So what it looks like is maybethree minutes, right.
What it looks like is 10minutes here or there.
You know, maybe what it lookslike is actually not going to
the gym.
What it looks like is notlifting weights but lifting your
kids.
You know, like make it a gamewith them.

(09:53):
I mean, like look, I got tolift you up over my head 12
times.
You ready, here we go Right.
Like bend down, squat, liftthem.
You know, extend overhead, likedo that three times a day.
They're going to have a greattime and you're getting your
movement in.
I think part of it is like wehave this idea of what it looks
like in order for it to count inair quotes, to count, you know,

(10:16):
have you heard?
I'm sure you have.
You know the like, sitting isthe new smoking, of course, yeah
, yeah, right.
And they say that because it'slike the thing we're doing that
we don't realize is slowlykilling us.
And the thing that I say toeverybody is because, you know,
the human body wasn't designedto sit all day.
Okay, well, you knowcontroversial opinion here.

(10:39):
I also think it's not human tosit all day and go berserk for
an hour Like actually humanmovement looks like a little bit
all the time.
So guess what, mom, you are astep ahead, given that you are
nonstop from seven to four.

(11:00):
We just have to reframe howwe're looking at some of these
activities.
Right, maybe, as you're puttingaway the groceries, you're
doing bicep curls with thelaundry detergent and we get it
in.
I have a thing that I teachpeople called DWDS.
I don't know if you saw thisnutrition nugget in my podcast.

(11:23):
So, dwds, drink water, dosquats.
So inevitably, right, we'retalking in health.
We talk about hydration.
By the way, hydration is aboutmore than just water, but we
drink, we want to drink water,right?
Well, drinking more water meansthat we're going to have to go
use the restroom more, right?
Cool, when you go to therestroom, hold on to the sink

(11:47):
and do 10 squats.
So, drink more water, do squats.
Over the course of the day,you're going to get probably a
few squats in, right, like itdoesn't have to be going to the
gym committing all out, havingthis insane hour where you leave
exhausted, unable to do otherthings, until you sort of

(12:09):
replenish that energy.

Philip Pape (12:10):
So that brings up another point then, jen, which I
know my listeners are thinkinglike what if my ultimate goal is
to do something and there's achasm from here to there, and
you're kind of addressing that alittle bit already Is
motivation a matter of degrees?
Is it a matter of the thing youwant to do versus something
someone else wants to do?
I guess where I'm going withthat is, if the person really

(12:32):
truly wants to, let's say, startlifting weights full on, should
we shortcut that process withwhat you're talking about in
some way, like that's thedevil's advocate in me.

Jenn Trepeck (12:43):
You can or you can say what I really want is this
Am I willing to do what it takesto get that?
Am I willing to do that Like?
Can I find, as you said, inthat you know Facebook group?
What if this was your numberone priority?
The challenge that I have withpeople is that they think that

(13:05):
something has to be their numberone priority in order for it to
happen at all.

Philip Pape (13:10):
Yes, that is true.

Jenn Trepeck (13:11):
And so the piece is to me is there an alignment
between our capacity and what wesay we want?
Neither one is wrong.
We just have to make sure thatthose things align.
So we might want to compete inthe bodybuilding competition,

(13:38):
and to do that requires a levelof commitment.
It requires, you know, foodchoices and exercise choices and
time that we may or may not beable to commit to to the degree
that we would need to at thismoment.
So maybe it's not the right timefor that.

(13:58):
Or maybe it's about going tothe other people around us to
say, hey, this is something thatI really want and I need your
help.
I'm going to the other peoplearound us to say, hey, this is
something that I really want andI need your help.
I'm going to need you to watchthe kids.
I'm going to need you to helpafter school, Like, could you
make dinner three nights a weekso I can go do this Right?
We have to then set up thescenario around us to allow for

(14:22):
that, but it comes down to thatalignment between sort of what
we say we want and what we'rewilling to do.
Does that make sense?

Philip Pape (14:33):
Makes sense, I'm giving you the space to dig in,
because that's a great examplewhere you're right.
People might have aspirationsthat are pretty aggressive and a
far cry from where they aretoday.
Maybe they're realistic, maybethey're not.
That's not for us to judge.
We kind of have to go throughthat process.
But that raises the questionrelated to habit formation and

(14:55):
behavior.
You already alluded to buildingmomentum as the main thing
we're trying to do here.
So when somebody is at thebeginning of their journey and
they know there's these you knowthey heard somebody on a
podcast say there's these sevenpillars or whatever of you gotta
be training, you have to bewalking, you have to be this,
you have to be this and I see itall the time in emails are like
I'm so stressed I don't knowwhere to start, so I haven't

(15:16):
made any progress.
I'm like, well, what's onething at least that's most
important to you?
Do you subscribe to that?
Like build it up approach, likestart from one thing it sounds
like it sounds like you do butlike walk us through.

Jenn Trepeck (15:27):
Yeah, yeah, go ahead.
How might that look?
Yeah, yeah.
So there's a lot of differentways to take this, and so my
brain is going in 12 directionsat once.
So, yes, and again, it comesdown to aligning our
expectations with what we arewilling and able to do.

(15:49):
So start where you can Expectwhat you are able to do, rather
than expecting perfection orexpecting what we think is
required to get the result right.
Like I mean, even think about ababy learning to walk right.

(16:13):
It's not like you would say toa baby like, sit there Until you
can get up and walk and ride abike, you're going to do nothing
, don't move, don't sit there,right?
When we put it in that context,it sounds hilarious, like
that's so silly, but we expectthat of ourselves as adults.
Like we expect to go from zeroto a thousand by standing up,

(16:38):
and it's like, well, hold on aminute, right, it's just.
I think for a lot of us, it'sbeen a long time since we've
been a beginner at something orsince we've learned something in
that way you know what I meanor like since we haven't known
what to do, and it feels like,especially in my world of

(16:59):
nutrition, like I always say,what I teach people is the
nutrition education we're allsupposed to know, but no one
ever taught us, and so I thinkwe have this expectation that
we're supposed to know how to doall this, that we should just
have this ability without everlearning it, and it's part of
what sets us up and has usfeeling really frustrated and
therefore doing nothing, becausewe feel like we have to do

(17:23):
everything that that is so trueand I'm connecting with
something personal in my lifewhere, because you talk about
being a beginner and we becomeso skilled in certain areas and
it could give you a sense ofeither complacency or arrogance,
or, like every new thing you'regoing to do, you need to jump
in at some level of advancementthat you're not ready for.

Philip Pape (17:42):
I started sprinting recently and I talk about it a
lot.
I had some guests on the showwhere we talked about, you know,
the anabolic benefits ofsprinting for lifters, blah,
blah, blah, um, but it's notsomething I did regularly.
You know, I used to do a lot ofcardio back in the day that I
gave up eventually and move moretoward, uh, you know, higher
recovery, uh type training.
But, uh, in my mind I was likeI'm just going to go out and be

(18:05):
able to flat ground, sprint allout, and I didn't do that.
But people are doing that andif you do it, uh, you'll find
that you're probably not goingto be able to walk in the next
day, you're not going to be ableto do your squats, you know,
and you might hate it, right?
So there is this idea of it'snot just all or nothing, it's
also the feedback loop andexpanding your comfort zone and

(18:27):
the things you talked aboutconnecting to the action.
If you take an action thatgives you this really painful
outcome, that's also a recipefor giving up.
That's kind of my point, right?
Yeah, like with diets, you knowpeople are like I'm going to go
all in, I'm going to do arestrictive diet and just cut
everything out, and then it'sjust as painful, miserable,
suffering, whether it works ornot for you, it doesn't matter,

(18:47):
it's just like the process isn'tenjoyable.

Jenn Trepeck (18:49):
A thousand percent .
Well, so, like to me, what, asyou're saying that, like what
comes up to me is something Italk about is C versus I have
consistency versus intensity.
That's a good one, right?
So when?
Especially with diets, right,and I intentionally using the
word diet, right, like I'm veryparticular about my word choices

(19:12):
.

Philip Pape (19:12):
Diet, culture, diet yes, the diet yeah.

Jenn Trepeck (19:15):
Diet.
Yeah, um, you know, the firstthree letters say die.
So there's that, um.
No, but, like when we do thethings, cut out whole food
groups, you know, commit towhatever it is right.
Like that requires this insanelevel of intensity, right?

(19:38):
Whether it's that super intenseworkout, right, like to your
point, even on that workout,could you do that same workout
the next day?
Even on that workout?
Could you do that same workoutthe next day?
No, Because you hurt, right?
But our expectation is thatthat's what's required and
that's what we're supposed to do, but it's not so.

(20:05):
Consistency and intensity are,like inversely correlated.
So the more intense somethingis, the harder it is to be
consistent with it.
The more consistent we are withsomething, the less intense
it's likely to be right.
The less intense something is,the more likely we are to be
consistent.
And so really, what we knowfrom every bit of research, from

(20:28):
behavior change, science infitness and nutrition and
psychology and business andeverything, is that consistency
is what gets us progress.
But the way we're taught, theway we're sold, fitness and

(20:49):
nutrition in particular, is thatintensity is what's required.
So it's 100% intensity, 100% ofthe time is the only thing
that's gonna get you the results, and I argue that that is
patently wrong.

Philip Pape (21:04):
I wanna address that because that's really
elegant.
It's an elegant framework ormodel for this, because what
comes to mind at least twothings that have come up
recently one on the diet, orI'll say on the nutrition or
eating side, whatever you wantto call it, because I'm not just
talking about diets is fat lossright.
We just did a rapid fat losschallenge in my community and

(21:25):
it's a very, a very controlledprotocol for people who are
ready for it and most of themare not ready for it for two
weeks.
For two weeks, right, exactlyRight.
And it's always this inverserelationship of okay, yeah, I
know you have that target ofweight loss, but let's reverse
engineer like what makes thissustainable so you can stick
with it, and what does that getyou at the end of the day?

(21:47):
And of course, the longevity ofit is dependent on, like you
said, how easy it is and how lowthe intensity is, but then the
result is going to depend on thetime of those two factors
coming together, right?
So from a fat loss perspective,it's, it's, a great example.
The other one is someone was Iwas probably Lyle McDonald,
cause he, he, he loves to justcurse at all the other people in

(22:07):
the industry.
I love him.

Jenn Trepeck (22:10):
So many do yeah.

Philip Pape (22:12):
He was talking about training to failure and
he's like look, if the generalpremise of training to failure
is that you had to do that togrow muscle, nobody would have
muscle, because nobody trains tofailure, implying that, of
course, training effectivelyover the long term to reduce
injury, to increase recovery, ofcourse training effectively
over the long term to reduceinjury, to increase recovery, is
it going to be some level ofsubmaximal?
And that's really reallyimportant.

(22:33):
It's almost more important thanthe training itself, the fact
that you have recoverability andlongevity behind it.
That's what comes to mind forme, so good concept.

Jenn Trepeck (22:39):
Yeah, and I think it goes back to also what are
your goals?
Why are you doing this?
What do you actually want toachieve?
Because, also in theseconversations, is that we get
caught up in what everybody elseis doing and what everybody
says we're supposed to do, andthen we sort of lose sight of.
Wait a minute, I'm followingthe guidelines of somebody who

(23:00):
wants to be and do things thatactually have zero relevance to
me.
You know like I have clientswho simply not so simply want to
be able to get on the floorwith their grandkids and play a
game and stand up on their ownright, to be 90 years old and
not need help getting off thetoilet, right, guess what.

(23:25):
Off the toilet, right, guesswhat.
You don't have to train for afitness competition to achieve
that.
But if you listen to everybodycoming at us, it'll make us
think we do, you know like.
So sometimes you know it's it'sblocking out all the noise and

(23:47):
saying you know?
I sort of tell people it's likeyou got to have your Wonder
Woman bangles on.
You have to be able to hearwhat's coming at us or read the
headline and say, based oneverything I know, is that true?
Is that true for me, how doesthat fit in with what I know I

(24:12):
want and what I know works forme?
And then, if you need to throwup the Wonder Woman bangles to
deflect it?
Because that consistency inwhat we know works for us is
infinitely more powerful thanthe shiny object syndrome of
something intense all the timeor feeling like and this goes

(24:35):
back to the thing of the all ornothing on off, good, bad, piece
of like we're doing this thingthat's super intense, expecting
to do that 100% of the time,which is an inappropriate
expectation, and then we can'tmaintain that intensity, we
think something's wrong with us,we give up, we're like oh, I'm
broken, I don't have themotivation, you know, taking us

(24:59):
full circle.

Philip Pape (25:00):
Yeah, definitely taking us full circle, and the
question of is it true?
For me is so core to everythinghere, right, personalization.
But also you talk about being abeginner.
You talked about thecompounding of your habits over
time.
Effectively, when you put itall together, it, what comes to
me, is okay.
Where you're at right now,you've got this certain scope,
this certain box that you canlimit fears, and this is, in a

(25:22):
positive sense, a box in thatyou don't have to worry about
all these stuff outside of itfor now, and the power from you
taking that next step and thatdiscipline and commitment is a
very large step change in youroutput for a pretty small,
accessible, you know, step, evenif to the person next to you
who's training for thebodybuilding competition, that's

(25:42):
like far behind in their dustof their life, like it's nothing
, it's not going to help them,but for you it's going to make a
big difference.
That's what comes to mind,which, that's the empowering
piece of it.
It's like you're not, you'renot just limiting yourself here
or holding yourself back.
You're actually doing the thingthat's going to lead to
consistency and massive resultsover time.

Jenn Trepeck (26:07):
And the choices we're willing to make today are
different than the choices wemight be willing to make in a
week or a month, or six monthsor a year.
So, because of this is a greatexample, so it reminds me before
my sister's wedding in 2011,.
I've been doing this for a verylong time.
I started coaching in 2007,like before this was a thing you
know and 2011 before mysister's wedding, I coached my

(26:27):
family and in the beginning Idon't know how it came up my
sister and I grew up eatingketchup on just about everything
.

Philip Pape (26:40):
I know the type right.

Jenn Trepeck (26:42):
I don't know why, but like and we were also like
very healthy eaters, like wewould eat steamed Brussels
sprouts and diplomate ketchupand like we're so happy, you
know.
So when we first started, Idon't know, it came up that I
was using a ketchup that wasmade with not high fructose corn

(27:03):
syrup, you know, and differentin actual, like tomatoes and
some other things, and my sistersaid to me if you're going to
tell me that I can't have myketchup, I'm going to punch you
in the face, right?
Not really, but kind of right.
She was like I have no interestand I was like cool, keep your

(27:25):
ketchup right.
That's your non-negoti.
Like, cool, keep your ketchup.

Philip Pape (27:27):
Right, that's your non-negotiable.

Jenn Trepeck (27:29):
Right, fine, whatever, keep your ketchup.
A couple months later she goeswhat's that ketchup that you use
?
Right, and I gave her the brandand she bought it.
She was like, oh, this is good,but the choices that we're
willing to make today aredifferent than the choices that
we're willing to make today, aredifferent than the choices that
we're willing to make in acouple months.
So if right now you want to keepyour Heinz, go for it Like who

(27:54):
cares, right, we can decide tomake these things deal breakers
or not and recognize to yourpoint on the box, right, that
box is going to look different.
On the box right, that box isgoing to look different.
What's outside of that box isgoing to look different after
we've made some progress.
So I see it all the time withpeople's food choices right, not

(28:16):
just with ketchup or even thethings that they're willing to
try, because also your tastebuds adjust right, your strength
changes the moves that you'rewilling to try we start to feel
more confident.
We maybe have a guide or atrainer or someone who's going
to help us do these other thingsand, all of a sudden, stuff
that seemed completely foreignto us six months ago is now the

(28:38):
thing we are most excited to do.

Philip Pape (28:40):
Yep, yeah, 100%.
When you're ready, you'refinally ready for it and it
seems almost easy and a foregoneconclusion when it finally
happens I mean, that's ofteneasy, it feels natural.
I think when that happens,right, like okay, you're not
forcing it, you're not forcingit.
I want to pull a thread ofsomething you mentioned earlier
related to this whole motivationor momentum chain, when you

(29:03):
mentioned a trainer andaccountability to someone else,
because the word accountabilitywe haven't really addressed that
either.
And there's a lot of theory inthe psychology literature about
external versus internalmotivation.
There's also what is it Self?
What is the theory?
Is it self, not self-motivation, self-something, I forget what?

(29:24):
it is, but it involves likehaving the knowledge, having the
efficacy and having therelatedness.

Jenn Trepeck (29:29):
Yeah, yeah, I know .

Philip Pape (29:30):
Right, you know what I'm talking about.
So there's so many.
Yeah, I'm with you.
I'm with you, okay.

Jenn Trepeck (29:34):
So in which case?

Philip Pape (29:35):
oh, we haven't even gotten to that level of
nerdiness.
Yeah, I'm looking forward to it, cause you have a finance
background right, like a kind ofanalytical background.

Jenn Trepeck (29:44):
Yeah, like business and marketing.
Yeah, but Okay.

Philip Pape (29:47):
Okay.
So what strikes me is like,even though we're not, we
shouldn't wait for motivation.
Is seeking out some sort ofaccountability or push, whether
it's external or internal, stilla valid step as far as the
commitment and discipline goes?

Jenn Trepeck (30:03):
Yeah, To me that's the hack of discipline.

Philip Pape (30:07):
Cool Right, it's the hack of discipline to make
discipline even easier.

Jenn Trepeck (30:10):
Yeah, right, how do we create discipline?
Right, accountability is a toolfor that.
There's a piece ofaccountability right with that
personal trainer.
There's a piece ofaccountability that also happens
with the gamification of youknow ticking off how many days
in a row, you know there'saccountability of meeting the

(30:33):
friend to go for the walk.
I also think, like in my spaceon the nutrition side, a lot of
people think accountability isthe food police and I'm like
sorry, no, you know, I am notthe food police.
And I'm like sorry, no, I amnot the food police.
What I am is the accountabilitythat sometimes that voice in

(30:56):
your mind, and more often thannot I'm not the food police, I'm
the cheerleader pointing outeverything you did do, because
your mind goes to everything youdidn't do, right?
So is the accountabilitychecking off the days in your
calendar?
Is the accountability sayingdid I do something to move my

(31:20):
body today, and that counts,whether it's the 10 squats when
I went to pee or a super intensetraining session?
Right, like, all of thosethings get to be part of you
know, checking off thataccountability and knowing
yourself, I think is the key tothe accountability that actually

(31:43):
works, to the accountabilitythat actually works, because if
you feel like you're not goingto keep that for yourself, right
that we know we need theexternal, and then where is that
line for you?
Is it better that it's thefriend you're meeting at the gym
or the one that you're makingsocial plans with, and part of

(32:04):
those social plans is, you know,a walk or a fitness class or
something?
Or is it that I actually needthe accountability where, if I
don't report into you, I need aconsequence?
You know, like there's a selfawareness piece in that, and the
other side that I think isreally important for everyone to

(32:24):
recognize here is that theaccountability just like the
things that we're willing to do,tomorrow might be different
than today the accountabilitythat works for us today.

Philip Pape (32:34):
Can change.

Jenn Trepeck (32:35):
Exactly, and it doesn't mean we're broken.
It doesn't mean there'ssomething wrong with us.
It means that we just need abunch of different frameworks or
frames or types ofaccountability.

Philip Pape (32:50):
Yeah, yeah, no, I love that because the method you
know, I always talk aboutprinciples versus method and the
principle here is a solidfoundation and there are a
thousand methods and, like yousaid, the method you enjoy or
can use will change and also, Ithink, people's understanding of
the method, uh, and how itchanges.
What comes to mind, for example, is people who hate quote,

(33:13):
unquote hate tracking food, andit's because they've used my
fitness file.
And then they try this otherapp that's way easier and more
efficient, and they're like,well, now I like tracking food.
Okay, well, the problem wasn'tthe tracking, it was a method of
little things like that, right.
And then you talk aboutgamification.
So then I was like, oh, that'sa good trigger for me.
I love gamification, um, andhabit streaks and challenges and
stuff, and that's supermotivating and I don't see

(33:34):
anything wrong with like comingback to that on a regular basis.
If that's the thing, that's thething that works for you.

Jenn Trepeck (33:39):
And sorry, like I think there's a piece of that to
tie together between theconsistency and the intensity,
right?
So when we're going to dosomething more intense that
gamification or whatever thatstreak because in my head I
don't know why, but in my headwhen we say gamification I'm
thinking of streaks we just wantto make sure that the streak

(34:00):
that we're looking for matchesthe intensity.
Streak that we're looking formatches the intensity.
So if it's more intense, we'rewe want to plan on a shorter
streak to the win, right, andthen we can do another, less
intense, for a longer period oftime, right.
Those pieces are also workingtogether and fitting in.

Philip Pape (34:23):
A hundred percent and the streaks can be evolving
into new streaks.
As you go right, they becomeharder or higher, intense, and
streaks, or whatever Is there.
I think you already answeredthis question.
You got ahead of this questionalready.
I was going to ask if thetracking or the, the method of
self-accountability can becomeobsessive, and but I think you

(34:44):
got ahead of that by saying,like, you have to have the
self-awareness of whether it'sworking for you and then
evaluate it.
Where I see people fall shortsometimes is they give up too
quickly on something and theydon't give it enough time.
Like what's your advice forreally feeling out a method long
enough so that it works?

Jenn Trepeck (35:03):
Yeah, I think there's a piece of this where my
recommendation is actually workwith someone, because so,
especially in my space andespecially with my clients, like
I work with a lot of people whohave a history of disordered
behavior or eating disorders or,you know, like a lot of,
especially as we think aboutfood tracking, like a very

(35:25):
tumultuous relationship withfood and food tracking and all
of these things, and part of itis a perspective shift.
Part of it is what you weresaying about.
You know, what method are weusing to track this information
or to do the tracking?
And one of the things that Isee most often is that it wasn't

(35:50):
tracking that made someone feelobsessive.
It was actually the expectationto track and then doing it in
their head, not on paper or notwith a tool, doing it in their
head, not on paper or not with atool.

(36:10):
When we start to feel obsessive, it's because we're trying to
keep it all in our heads and soit becomes this constant running
, you know, hamster wheel ofexpectation, disappointment.
But it's running through everysingle time.
What did I eat this morning?
How much did I have?
What am I eating for lunch?
What did I eat for lunch?

(36:31):
When am I eating next?
How much am I having?
What am I allowed to have?
Did I eat this already?
Is this a good thing?
Is this a bad thing?
Should I be eating this nowBecause I'm going to bed?
The more we're trying to keep inour head, the more overwhelming
it becomes.
Keep in our head the moreoverwhelming it becomes, the

(36:51):
more obsessive we feel like weare when it gets out of your
head and onto paper.
Right, I see it over and overwith clients.
When they stop tracking intheir head and they put it on a
piece of paper, they go whoa, Ihave a lot of mental capacity.
Imagine all of the things thatyou could do in this world with

(37:13):
all of that mental capacityfreed up, where, when you are
thinking about dinner, you couldlook at your phone or a piece
of paper and go great, this iswhat I'm having in seven seconds
, rather than running that wholerigmarole through every time.
You're going to drink water orhave a tea, or do I want a snack
?
Do I need a snack.

(37:33):
Am I right?
Like that is what's exhaustingwhen it comes to understanding
this piece of resistance that wehave to something it's sort of
worth digging into.

(37:53):
Well, what is it that'sactually frustrating?
What is it that we actuallydon't want?
What are we trying to avoid?
And how do we actually get to aplace where we're avoiding that
?
Because I think sometimes weassociate it with something that
may be, you know, kind ofmisaligned.

Philip Pape (38:11):
Yeah, you make great points the mental clarity
and the bandwidth, andespecially those of us who are
perfectionists, and there's likesix types of perfectionism,
where, yeah, we talked aboutprocrastination to it, like it's
all linked.
You know when you're trying toget to sleep and you can't get
to sleep because those thoughtsare running through your head,
and you just get up and write itdown and boom, you get the
mental capacity.
That's a great example for mypodcast and you probably do the
same, like I have a notes app.

(38:32):
Every time I have an idea,which is about seven times a day
, a thousand percent.
I'll write it down, but thenI'll be able to go through and
churn through and like delete,consolidate you know, no, that's
next day and but it helps taketons of stress off.
So the fact that you're sayingtracking can relieve you of
stress and give you clarity andgive you awareness and help you

(38:52):
build momentum and help youclose the loop.
It's what I say to Jen.
I just need people to come onhere.

Jenn Trepeck (38:59):
I know we need to hear things.
What's the set like?
Seven times, seven differentways from seven different people
.
I also think it's at sevendifferent times because what
we're willing to hear, what weactually hear, right Like and
especially I say it to peopleall the time I have people who
will do my course multiple times, because when everything is new
, what you hear is maybe 50% ofwhat's there the next time, when

(39:25):
it's not totally new, you hearsomething that you didn't even
hear it all the first time.
It's why listening to theseepisodes, even over and over,
actually becomes tremendouslyhelpful.

Philip Pape (39:37):
So do that, guys, right, do that guys.
Go back, listen to all300-something episodes again.

Jenn Trepeck (39:42):
Right On different days because, by the way, the
apps count the same day as thesame download.

Philip Pape (39:47):
Oh yeah, Help the algorithm please Mix it up just
every day.
Pick 10 to one.
So I was thinking of the matrixand memento and some of the
best movies, and where you needto watch them at least two or
three times to get the messagethat's so good.
So, all right, You'redefinitely hitting on my like
analytical brain here.
Um, it's funny, I just.
I just took a communicationstyle assessment.

(40:08):
You know those personality?

Jenn Trepeck (40:10):
assessments, which one of those, I'll do.

Philip Pape (40:12):
This one was through Toastmasters, so it was
actually part of a projectbecause I was developing a
speech related to it.
What's interesting is how thatevolves over time.
And, uh, the two strengths ofmine today, as of right now, are
analytical and supportive.
Which supportive is interesting?
It comes from the coaching side, but I get that energy from you
as well, in that you want tohelp people and people can help

(40:33):
themselves too with this ifthey're so empowered to do so
and want to have the disciplineand get the accountability and
do it.

Jenn Trepeck (40:40):
And the reason why is because that's what changed
everything for me, right?
I believe the differencebetween knowing what to do and
actually doing it isunderstanding why, right, it's
not living by the shoulds.
Right, everybody, stop shootingthe bed, right, like, cause, I

(41:00):
did every diet under the sun,right, I lived in that world on
that rollercoaster of gainingand losing, and I would feel at
times like I would just breatheand gain weight and I was like I
do not understand, right?
Yes, and then I remember thisso, so vividly.
So I used to work in hedgefunds, which is what you were

(41:21):
talking about before a financebackground.
So I used to work in hedgefunds.
In one of our offices there wasa communal kitchen on the floor
of a bunch of hedge funds andMonday mornings there was a

(41:42):
thing of fruit and a platter ofmini muffins and croissants and
pastry, all the things.
And I could go into the kitchenon a Monday morning and get
water once and ignore the plateof pastries.
The second time it was astruggle.
And the third time I'm walkingin and going what is wrong with
me?
That this croissant has a voiceand it is screaming my name and

(42:05):
I can't deal Like what is wrongwith me.
This is insane.
It's making me feel literallyinsane.
You know, and I remember it,there was one day I walked in
the kitchen and I was like, oh Iget why this is appealing to me
right now.
So what I actually need to do isgo eat the breakfast that I

(42:28):
brought and then see how I feelabout the croissant and then, if
I want the croissant, eat thecroissant, but at least from
then I'm eating it after havingsomething that has nutrition and
stabilizes my blood sugar.
Lo and behold, I go back andeat the breakfast that I brought
and the croissant no longer hasa voice and I can walk in and
out of the kitchen 20 times andit doesn't matter, right?

(42:52):
So for me, learning thisnutrition stuff, how our body
processes food, what food doesto our body biochemically all
the things that are happeningmade every food decision go from
being emotional of why do Isuck, why can't I just walk in
the kitchen and walk out withouthaving an internal debate about

(43:14):
a croissant to an intellectualone of like oh I get why that's
appealing.
This is what I got to do Onward.
The difference between knowingwhat to do and actually doing it
is understanding why.

Philip Pape (43:27):
Because if what we said was what every diet before
told me of you shouldn't eat acroissant now the only thing I
want is the stupid croissantyeah, yeah, you hit on a lot of
good points again, because thewhy, when, when you first
started talking about why, I didgo to where you went with
nutrition science, but then Ialso thought closing the loop
with your own experimentationand feedback and giving it a

(43:50):
shot and doing the thing alsohelps you understand why for you
like, why is this working foryou?
It also helps dispel tons ofmythology in the industry when
you realize that doing somethingeveryone else says you
shouldn't and it doesn't causethe sky to fall is very powerful
.
Right, it's very, very powerful, and I know we fight that all
the time because, unfortunately,there's so much misinformation

(44:12):
that people are just afraid totry the thing because they feel
like they're killing themselves.
You know, I'm going to eat seedoils or this or that or
whatever.
They don't even know.
So mindfulness and intentionand understanding why is
important when.
How about, though, the counterto to that?
Is there a time when whydoesn't matter that much because
it could hold you back, andwhat I mean by that is some
people perfectionists again waitto find out every bit of the

(44:37):
why before they take action.
Where does that problem comeinto this?

Jenn Trepeck (44:43):
It's interesting because I don't necessarily
experience that piece of theperfectionism with my clients.
Okay, what I tend to see moreis the perfectionism of now
expecting themselves to onlyever eat the low glycemic impact
things and then feeling like,you know, on off, good bad

(45:04):
failure at the birthday partywhen they ended up eating the
birthday cake, you know.
So I think If you're in a placeof I'm doing nothing till I
learn everything, then are youactually learning what's being
presented?

Philip Pape (45:21):
Good point.

Jenn Trepeck (45:22):
Yeah Right, good point.
Yeah Right, like, maybe we'rejust sort of blocking out
because if we're fullyunderstanding what's being
shared, it likely would lead toright, some sort of action to
experience it and see if, evenas an experiment of saying, is

(45:43):
that the case for me?
Right, like, is that what Ihave?
You know what I experience whenI do X, y or Z.

Philip Pape (45:51):
For sure, for sure.

Lisa (45:54):
Hi, my name is Lisa and I'd like to give a big shout out
to my nutrition coach, philipPate.
With his coaching I have lost17 pounds.
He helped me identify thereason that I wanted to lose
weight, and it's very simpleLongevity.
I want to be healthy, activeand independent until the day I
die.
He introduced me to thiswonderful app called Macro
Factor.
I got that part of my nutritionfigured out.
Along with that is the movementpart of my nutrition figured

(46:19):
out.
Along with that is the movementpart of nutrition.
There's a plan to it and hereally helped me with that.
The other thing he helped mewith was knowing that I need to
get a lot of steps in.
So the more steps you have, thehigher your expenditure is and
the easier it is to lose weight.
When it's presented to you likehe presents it, it makes even
more sense.
And the other thing that he hadwas a hunker guide and that
really helped me.

Philip Pape (46:39):
So thank you.
Yeah, that's that's kind ofwhat I was getting at, because
it's hard to explain the avatarthat I'm thinking of, but it's
more of the person who just willnot take the action until they
understand the why out of fear.
So when we think of thepsychological things going on
here, when someone does finallytake action, then they start

(46:59):
strong.
The other problem we have ispeople quote unquote fall off
track.
Now, I know there's a wholeaspect to that of like the fact
that you have a track and thefact that we're thinking all or
nothing and is there ever such athing as failure and all that
fun stuff?
So and then they blamethemselves, because then they
lack willpower, they can't stickto it.
So even if they've done thethings you've done, there are
people that will still strugglebecause of life, et cetera.

(47:21):
How does someone deal with that?

Jenn Trepeck (47:23):
So I think one of the things I say all the time is
that if your plan doesn't allowfor life to happen, it's not
the plan for life.
So are you following a planthat, for you, is better to be

(47:44):
something we do for a finiteperiod of time, not the plan to
be followed ad infinitum, right?
So the plan for life has toallow for life.
So if your plan doesn't allowfor birthdays or vacation or
enjoying these things, then wegot to take a step back and

(48:08):
reassess that plan.
Right?
If you're living in that on off, right, I'm doing this, I'm
doing nothing.
The issue is with the track.
You're on, not you.

Philip Pape (48:21):
Somebody really smart recently, in the last 40
minutes, talked about somethingcalled consistency versus
intensity, and again it rearsits I'll say ugly but beautiful
head.
Um, that is exactly what you'resaying.
It's like it, the plant is toointense if it's not allowing for
those things, unless it's fortwo weeks and life is boring
during those two weeks, right,and then that's fine, right?

Jenn Trepeck (48:41):
And we recognize that that's the choice that
we're making, that's thetrade-off and we're cool with
that.
We've made that choiceintentionally, and you know part
of what I'm hearing in yourquestion too.
With this thing of like youknow falling off, a couple of
things come up in my mind.
One is what we talked aboutbefore of not just the

(49:06):
consistency versus intensity,but this piece of our
expectations of ourselves.
Is this really what works forme?
Is this really what works forme?
It's not that I'm broken, it'sthat, you know, whatever it was
right, the design is flawed, notyou, yes, but it also brings up

(49:34):
for me a bit of emotionaleating and situations or things
that come up that derail us thatnaturally right.
Like things happen, andespecially in my world, with
food, you know, like I don'tthink, contrary to many, I don't
think emotional eating.
Is this thing to be completelyavoided, a thousand percent Like
?
Name me a culture in the worldthat doesn't convene over food,

(49:58):
that doesn't create communityaround food, that doesn't grieve
over food.
There is something reallyspecial about some of these
things that have now beendemonized and so it's just about
saying what was my plan,Recognize where we're at and

(50:25):
aligning those expectations too.
So it's not falling off if whatwe do is what we told ourselves
we were going to do.
We do is what we told ourselveswe were going to do, so
different from sort of theemotional eating thing.
I had a client who was going onvacation and she was like we're
going to my brother's.

(50:45):
I'm not in charge of the food,I'm not.
You know, we're at his house,not a hotel.
There isn't a gym, theactivities, I don't even know
what he has planned for us, youknow.
And the conversation that wehad was well, how do you want to
feel on your way home, you know?

(51:06):
And she was like I want to feelproud of myself and I'm okay
with a little bit of a weightgain.
I just I want to feel like Imade some healthy choices.
I was like awesome, Okay, whatneeds to exist for you to be on

(51:26):
the way home feeling proud ofyourself and that you made some
healthy choices?
Okay, well, that turned into aprotein-packed breakfast.
That turned into a couple walkswhile they were there, Not

(51:47):
trying to transplant everythingshe does at home, in the
environment that is set up foreverything she needs, you know,
transplanted to her brothers,where everything was out of her
control, you know.
So it's our expectations ofourselves and the commitment
that we make to ourselves.
If we align the fact that whatwe're looking to do is X and we

(52:10):
meet that, it is infinitely morepowerful than expecting
ourselves to do something andthen not doing that.
Yes, yes, that's what createsthat.
I'm off track.
I need to get back on trackSome of my least favorite words.
Can we stop trying to get backand just keep going?

Philip Pape (52:33):
There you go, just keep going.
Yeah, the expectations are huge.
Um, as you were saying that, Iwas just like I made a little
list of like three examples ofmy own clients.
Cause, just to relate to thisone client, he's going to be at
a camp for like three monthswith the crappiest food you can
imagine.
Right Like and I just mean, youknow, it's all designed for kids
who have very limited palates.

(52:54):
You know sugary yogurt andchicken nuggets and all that,
and.
But he's like, look, that's thereality of the situation.
So we're going to beintentional, we're going to come
up with a plan and theexpectations are going to be a
little different than at home.
But it's three months so we gotto come up with something.
So that's that's one that comesto mind.
Another is a client who hewanted to enjoy that barbecue

(53:18):
and he's like I planned ahead oftime to gorge myself and enjoy
the barbecue.
You do, you bro, enjoy everysecond of it.
Yeah, and his normal, his normalcalorie intake is like 2,500,
3,000.
And he ate like 7,000 calories.
And I said, how'd that feel?
And what happened afterward?
And he's like, yeah, I lookedback and I did what I said I was
going to do and then the nextday I got back to it and that's
like a good mental frame onthose kinds of things.

(53:38):
And then we, you and I weretalking about like
peri-postmenopausal women, andthat's one of the strongest
demographics, I would say, wherethe expectations really have to
be understood upfront, right,because we know, with hormones
and metabolism and everythingthat you may not be able to be
on the same timeline for fatloss, for example, as someone
else.
And it's like that's almost thekey, the magic key to unlock

(54:03):
success for the first time in along time, because every other
time you've wanted to get thatquick result or what everyone
else is doing, and for you, likeyou said, it may take six
months of just very slow.
I don't want to say slow andsteady.
I mean that's fine, slow andsteady, but you know very modest
, reasonable, consistency.
And then you look back and like, cool, I did that.
So, yeah, thank you for youknow, highlighting all these

(54:24):
things, cause these are superimportant points that people can
take away.
Let's get into practical Jen.
Then like, if someone'sthinking I really want to go
start working out and we alludedto these things, but just walk
them through Step one todaythey're like it's Friday when
I'm listening to this, when thisepisode comes out, which in
their mind they're thinking I'mgoing to start Monday.
That's cool.
What do they need to do next?

Jenn Trepeck (54:44):
Create the plan right.
What is your plan?
Starting Monday, doing what?
And create the plan designedfor your busiest, most hectic,
stressful day, not the ideal daythat exists twice a year, full

(55:08):
stop.
That's it right.
I'll add to that there's somereally interesting research
around specificallyexercise-related behavior and in
behavior change.
There are sort of two schoolsof thought, right.
There's the one side that saysdo it every single day, no

(55:32):
matter what the other school ofthought says.
Figure out the pattern that youcan be consistent with and do
that.
Well.
Really interesting researchwhen it comes to movement
specifically.
What we see is that we actuallyneed to do it every single day

(55:54):
in order to then eventually beable to maintain a pattern that
is not daily.
So if the objective is toimplement an exercise habit,
then we want to create the planfor our busiest, most hectic,
most stressful day and figureout what's the thing that we can

(56:18):
do every single day and startwith that.
If you want my recommendation,it's a 10-minute walk after you
eat.
Start with one meal a day.
When that happens, maybe youadd a second meal a day.
Maybe you decide to do thatwith a couple of wrist weights
one day.
Don't go crazy.

(56:39):
Maybe you got time to make it15 minutes.
Maybe one day you actually havetime to do it twice a day, but
the plan is the 10 minutes.
So some days we can exceed it,right, but the plan, the
objective is for that mosthectic, most stressful, busiest

(57:06):
day and then build from there.

Philip Pape (57:10):
I love it.
So have a template the worstday, because it's not going to
get any worse than that.
And then I like how you talkedabout every day.
It makes me think this is alifestyle, this is a you know
you're trying to be, you'retrying to establish a new
identity as an athlete, as amobile person.
Honestly, that is what manypeople are missing.
Is just any movement at allright.
You're on your desk all day.
You're not walking.
So even if you do want to liftweights and you want to walk and

(57:32):
you want to sprint and all that, start with what Jen's saying
do something every day and thenyou can ramp up from there.
All right, I'll give you onemore.
Okay.

Jenn Trepeck (57:40):
And then there was something else you said that
made me think of something, andnow it went out of my head, so
hopefully it'll come back.

Philip Pape (57:45):
But so another one.

Jenn Trepeck (57:47):
I know story of my life If you can't do the 10
minute walk or that feels like alot you to call 30-30-30.
Three different exercises, 30repetitions of each.
You're going to choose thembased on your level of mobility.
So I have some clients who dothis in a chair with like 30 arm
circles, 30 side bends, 30 leglifts.

(58:09):
I have other clients wherewe're doing 30 squats, 30
pushups, 30 crunches.
I created a whole bunch ofdifferent variations of this and
tested them.
They all took less than twominutes.
You didn't have to change yourclothes.
You don't get sweaty, itdoesn't matter.
I don't know about you, but Iam never more productive than in

(58:29):
the two minutes before the nextZoom meeting or the five
minutes before I need to leavethe house.
We all have those moments oflike what can I get done in the
three minutes?
Right, and we're looking around, this is what you're going to
do A 30, 30, 30.
It takes less than two minutes.
Just do it and see what happens.

(58:50):
The blood flow alone is goingto make you feel instantly more
energized.
And then you never know.
But if 10 minutes feels like alot, start with a 30, 30, 30.

Philip Pape (59:00):
Love it, exercise snacks.
Those are, those are big.

Jenn Trepeck (59:03):
Exactly.

Philip Pape (59:04):
All right, I could go on.
I know we're we're short ontime here.
There's so much I didn't get tothat I would love to ask you.
Maybe we can connect again inthe future, but for now, is
there anything we didn't coverthat you're like?

Jenn Trepeck (59:20):
no, I had to cover this one, this one thing that
we didn't cover related.
Well, now I'm sitting heregoing.
What was the thing that justpopped into my head?
Oh man, I'm going to think ofit as soon as we press, you know
.
End recording.

Philip Pape (59:25):
It's okay.
It's okay.
There's so.
There's so much.
It's funny with humans.
I always think there's likeit's the tip of the iceberg,
where people hear and see fromus and the icebergs in our brain
that they'll just never getaccess to All right.
So, jen, this has beenfantastic.
Absolutely love theconversation.
I think people will practicallybe able to take from this the

(59:48):
ability to build momentum, notto get motivated, not to wait
for the right time, not to beperfect or do more than the
expectations allow them to do.
Just start where you're at andbuild momentum.
Take the commitment, thediscipline and turn it into
momentum.
I want people to be able tofind you, jen.
Obviously, we've got thepodcast Salad with a Side of
Fries.
We'll link that in the shownotes.

Jenn Trepeck (01:00:05):
Anywhere else, All social media.
I am at Jen Trebek,j-e-n-n-t-r-e-p-e-c-k, and
website isasaladwithasideoffriescom.
I will tell you, hearing fromyou is my absolute most favorite
thing, so please send a message.
Oh, I know what I wanted to say.
Now let's do it Because on mywebsite there is I have a

(01:00:28):
download for you called it's notwhat to eat, it's how to eat
that you can download there, butthere's another one that I
sometimes offer.
Maybe I'll send this to you toput a link in the episode notes.
That's my bullseye of change.
It's a framework for behaviorchange Awesome.
And the piece of this is whatyou said about this identity.
We're trying to develop thisnew identity, and that sort of

(01:00:49):
reminded me of affirmations orthings that we say right, we're
trying.
And the piece of this that is socritical is that you know, if
you're like you were saying,like we want to become this
athlete, right, if saying toyourself I am an athlete creates
that other voice, that's likeno, you're not right.

(01:01:09):
We need a different affirmation, the trick to making sure that
this works right.
So our subconscious minddoesn't know the difference
between truism and falsehood.
It's going to believe whateverwe tell it, but it has to bypass
the conscious mind.
So if your conscious mind says,no, you're not, that

(01:01:33):
affirmation will not program thesubconscious mind so I am
becoming athletic might be morehelpful in the moment, till you
start to feel like an athlete.
And then it becomes I'm anathlete right, it might be.

(01:01:53):
I make healthy choices.
Well, that might feel like alot right.
Maybe the affirmation is I makehealthy choices.
Well, that might feel like alot right.
Maybe the affirmation is I makehealthier choices.
I eat a vegetable every time Ieat.
Right, find the thing thatactually rings true and use that
and that can evolve also.
But that's key to developingthis new identity where, if

(01:02:15):
we're trying to tell ourselvessomething that we're really not
believing, it's not going tohappen.

Philip Pape (01:02:19):
You got to believe yourself and believe in yourself
and give yourself the rightaffirmation.
So great advice.
Thank you, jen.
No, not, don't apologize.
Seriously, that's good.
I hope people stuck around tohear that because otherwise they
missed out Fire at the end foreverybody.

Jenn Trepeck (01:02:34):
That's right.

Philip Pape (01:02:34):
That's right, fire emoji.
So we'll throw those all in theshow notes.
And again, jen, it's been apleasure.
Thank you so much for coming on.
Wits and Weights.

Jenn Trepeck (01:02:42):
Likewise.
Thank you so much.

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