Q&A - Women Over 50 Strength Training and Fat Loss (Pam Sherman) | Ep 399 - Wits & Weights | Fat Loss, Nutrition, & Strength Training for Lifters

Episode Transcript
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Philip Pape (00:01):
If you're a woman over 50 who's been strength
training and eating enoughprotein, and you've heard all
the things about your metabolismand hormones working against
you, that building musclesharder and harder, and frankly,
you're not seeing the strengthgains or the fat loss or body
reconf you know should behappening.
This episode is for you becausetoday I'm teaming up with
fitness coach Pam Sherman toanswer all the questions women

(00:24):
over 50 are asking abouttraining, nutrition, body
recomp.
We're covering everything frombone density and joint issues to
protein and recovery.
You'll learn why the adviceyou've been following might be
holding you back, what arealistic timeline looks like
for gaining muscle over 50, andspecific tips that make a
difference in strength and fatloss while your physiology is

(00:46):
changing.
Welcome to Wits and Weights,the show that helps you build a
strong, healthy physique usingevidence, engineering, and
efficiency.
I'm your host, certifiednutrition coach Philip Pape, and
today I'm doing something alittle bit different.
Instead of an interview, I'mteaming up with fellow coach,

(01:07):
women over 50 expert, all aroundgreat person Pam Sherman.
She was on the podcast before,we'll give you a link to that.
But today we're gonna do acollaborative QA focused
specifically on women over 50.
Now, Pam and I are going totackle those super important
questions that all of you haveabout strength training,
nutrition, body recompositionfor women who, when you're over

(01:31):
50, we've covered the period ofpost-menopause and beyond phases
of life.
And all these questionsactually came straight from you,
the listener, the women wholisten to the show and are
struggling with real challenges,concerns about osteoporosis and
joint pain, to how much proteindo I eat, to what's going on
with my metabolism.
And neither Pam nor I haveactually seen the questions yet.

(01:53):
I took a lot of questions fromyou guys.
I smushed them into AI and cameup with a curated list.
And we're gonna make it asurprise QA, a little twist to
make it more interesting for allof you.
So, Pam, my friend, thank youand welcome back to the show.

Pam Sherman (02:07):
Thank you.
It's so great to be here.
We always have the best timetalking.
You could talk for too long, soI know we're gonna keep it in a
certain amount of time.

We'll keep it concise.
I so I have like 11 questions.
I don't know if we'll get tothem all, but we'll just tackle
them.
How about that?
You want to jump right in?
Okay.
So the first one is about bonemineral density and strength
training, very important topicfor this age range.
And the question is how doesstrength training specifically
impact bone density, bonemineral density for women in

(02:35):
peri and postmenopause?
And then, of course, corollaryto that, what exercises are
effective for the areas that alot of women care about the
most, like your hips and yourspine.
So, what are your thoughts onthat?

Well, hips and spine scream deadlift to me.
Uh, truly.
Our muscles protect our bones.
And I still see a lot of ladiesat the gym not lifting enough
weight.
Anytime your dumbbell has acolor, we're gonna put those
dumbbells down and we are goingto lift heavier weights.
That's really weird.

Wait, wait, wait.
Mine are black.
That's my color dumbbell.

Pink, orange, yellow, blue.
Uh I think a lot of women, andif you are not certain of what
to do, hire a trainer for asession or two to get your forum
down.
But you're gonna get the mostbang for your buck with your
basic compound lifts, yourdeadlifts, your squats, overhead
press.
You don't have to do benchpress, but shoulder press.
More load is gonna be betterfor your body.

(03:29):
And that's not more load rightaway.
It's working up to more load,but your muscles always are
gonna protect are protective foryour bones.
So starting now and neverstopping, I think is your best
bet to help.
I have osteoarthritis in my lowback.
And I like I've been strengthtraining and it is a natural
cause in our bodies, but I'mgonna do everything I can to
keep it from increasing.
So more load, more load, moreprotein, more calcium-rich

(03:54):
foods.
I even take a supplement, but Iknow the supplements aren't
gonna do nearly as much as mystrength training does for my
body.

Yeah, I love that you well first mentioned
deadlift.
It's my favorite liftpersonally, and it's also one
that I tell people all the timecan solve a lot of back issues
for folks if you do it right.
But the heavy is a trigger wordbecause I know when I go on
shows and they're like, whatdoes it mean to lift heavy or
how should you lift heavy?
It requires some nuance andmaybe you can help us explore
this.
Here's my perspective twothings.

(04:21):
One is that we know the driverof muscle development
specifically, not strength, butmuscle growth and size, is
mechanical tension, which isgetting close to failure.
And we know that there's a widerange of heaviness, i.e., rep
ranges, that can get you there.
When we're talking osteoporosisspecifically, and you mentioned

(04:41):
heavy, I really do think wemean in the strength regime of
heavier, more like 60% of yourmax or higher is the threshold
I've learned, where it truly islower reps and quite heavy
because the bones respond tothat pressure on the muscles,
kind of requiring the matrixinside those bones to stitch

(05:03):
back together more densely whenyou adapt.
You know what I mean?
That's kind of where my mindgoes.
And then I've heard other goodcoaches say, like, yeah, one of
the important things is the bigcompound lifts actually in the
like five to eight rep range ishwhen osteoporosis is a concern.
So do you agree with that?
Is that what you think of asheavy or is there a wider range
here?

No, I definitely do.
If you're getting a 10, that'snot heavy enough.

Yeah.

Um, and if you've never done this before, I want
to start with a movementpattern.
In fact, I have a couple maleclients I just started with.
We started with a body bar toget the pattern of the hinge
because they weren't hinging.
So you have to get the movementdown first.
And I love what you said thatit's great for your back because
I know people who don't knowabout lifting say, oh, that
lifting's terrible for yourback.
I'm like, it's not for yourposterior chain, it's great, but

(05:46):
you have to have the rightpattern for that to work.
And then I would say six, eightis even too much.
I would say four to six is agreat rep range as well.

Yeah, it's interesting because if you
program eight, then it almostmentally gets to the point where
people will not push hardenough and they'll kind of like
stop at eight.
If you program five, you kindof start getting the picture of
what heavy means.
Yes.
Because you're like, well,yeah.
You know, it's a different now.

(06:14):
When you get down to likesingles and triples, that's a
little more on the powerliftingside.
That's a different beastaltogether.
You don't have to do that, butit's interesting.
Okay, let's go to the next one.
Let's just pop through these.
This is fun.
So, another muscle training, amuscle-related one, and this is
about the timeline for regaininglost muscle mass after age 50,
which I think is a great premiseon the question that

(06:35):
acknowledging we do lose musclemass, like starting in our 30s,
if we're not doing somethingabout it.
So, this question is if I'msedentary now, which a lot of
listeners have found this showmaybe wondering about training,
training curious, what are theexpectations?
Because we know we're not aboutquick fixes, we're not about
like getting jack swollen sixsix pack in six months.

(06:55):
If you've never trained before,that's not what it's about.
What would you say is like atimeline for at least regaining
lost muscle mass, let alonebuilding new muscle?

Realistically, nine months to a year.

Yeah.
Okay.

Um, I it's not that long.
It's not that long.
And time is gonna pass anyway.
It's just hard in our quick fixsociety where we get I can
order something on Amazon nowand have it be delivered
tonight.
I mean, your health really issomething that is there's never
a quick a quick solution.
And where you are right now,say where you are right now is
at the top of a mountain.
Well, how long did it take youto get to the top of that

(07:27):
mountain?
50 years?
You can't expect a quick on theother side.
Consistency is going to be yourbest friend and know that a
year from now, you could feel100% different with consistency.
That's it.

Yeah.
Let me ask you aboutconsistency because first of
all, I love the quote that timeis going to pass anyway.
I always say, like, you can'tget in a time machine.
So let's buckle up, let's bestoics about it and say, what
can we control now?
But consistency, I heardsomeone mention, actually, it
was Alan Lazarus who wasactually recently on the podcast
just last week before thisepisode came out, and on his
podcast was talking about whenhe works with men and women, he

(08:02):
hears different languagesometimes that resonates when it
comes to consistency.
That sometimes men respond tothat word and respond to
discipline more.
And then women sometimesrespond to routine.
What are your thoughts?
Being a woman, working withwomen, are is there language
that this is a side tangent, butI was just curious about that.

Well, I think women probably do because we are
mostly in charge of, well, whenour kids were little, they're
breakfast, they're packing theirlunches, making dinner, getting
to soccer, laundry, and that'sour routine for many, many, many
years, where it's different forguys.
They don't, you know, they'renot as much in the day-to-day as
in as far as child raisinggoes.
So that probably does resonatemore with women.

(08:41):
And putting it in your routinedoes not make you selfish.
It's self-care.
That's it.
And yeah, you hear people say,you know, put yourself first on
the list.
It's very hard for women to putthemselves first.
I just want them to putthemselves on the list, period.

Put themselves in there.
Yes.
With with everything else.
Okay, so building that routine.
So you said nine months to ayear, which I like that timeline
because it's like not so longthat it feels forever, and it's
not so short that we'reunrealistic about it.
My opinion on this, so to giveyou my thoughts, are we're
talking about regaining lossmuscle mass and training for the
first time.
You're gonna get a lot of, youknow, what we call newbie gains,

(09:16):
right?
In the first three months,let's say, even the first month,
you're gonna find your actualnumbers.
Like if you start with amovement pattern, like Pram was
talking about, and you learn tosay body weight squat, then you
grab a goblet, maybe, and thenyou immediately go to a barbell,
which you can start prettyearly in a barbell.
I've heard like I've heardnarratives of like, we don't
start with a barbell, we'dladder up, but but you can go

(09:36):
really light with the barbell.
So it's in my opinion.
And it's a very different likecenter of gravity and slight
different positioning.
But you start there, and thenthe first month or two, your
numbers just go up and up and upbecause if you keep the routine
of showing up in the gym two orthree times a week and squat
every time, it's gonna be easywhat you did last time.
So you're gonna have to go up.

(09:57):
That neuromuscular adaptationis all between the brain and the
nervous system.
You're not gonna seenecessarily visual changes in
that first month.
Probably not.
You know, you may, you may not.
I don't know.
But when you're talking nine to12 months, now you've got like,
okay, the first three months isstrength.
Then your body has to buildmore muscle and make your
muscles bigger because you justkeep pushing it.

(10:18):
What are you doing to me now?
You you're trying to actuallyuse this thing after all these
years.
And so it has to get bigger,and that's where you start to
see visual changes.
The one thing I would cautionis like, make sure you're
tracking this stuff and havemaybe somebody else that gives
you an independent perspectivebecause people are down on
themselves all the time.
Like, women, like, I don't seeany change.
I'm like, show me your beforeand after photos.

(10:40):
Wow, look at those back musclespopping, like your waist is
down, you're looking morevibrant, you've got great
posture.
And that's just the physiqueside, let alone the mental
changes.
So, what what are your?
I know you have some thoughtshere.

Yeah, women are very hard on themselves.
And I encourage them to takeweekly pictures because it's
very hard to you see yourselfevery day.
It's very hard to see that.
But in a picture, you might seeyour waist coming in, you might
see muscles in your back.
I mean, it's the little, andyou know, before women get in a
you could be in a gym outfit,you could be in a bathing suit,
you could be something that justshows your body, but it's just

(11:12):
for you to see and to takemeasurements because those
inches here and there, you won'tsee in the mirror.
But when you measure, you'relike, oh my gosh, I lost an inch
off my hips.
That's a lot.
And to celebrate showing up foryourself.
There is no overnight success,but showing up for yourself over
and over, I encourage my ladiesto keep win journals.

(11:32):
Did you drink water?
Did you eat enough protein?
Did you show up at the gym?
Like those are all wins asopposed to, I didn't, you know,
X, Y, or Z.
Like, let's be positive withyour progress.

Yeah.

You're amazing.
You're showing up for yourself.
That's great.
And yes, you will see gains.
But I also think you have tolike do those things every week
to see.
You don't have to be on thescale, maybe once a month, once
every other week if you hate thescale, but you have to do the
things to show yourselfprogress.

100%.
100%.
And and anyone who listens tothis show knows I actually have
a slightly more extreme take onscale weight of weighing
yourself every single daybecause there's trade-offs or
benefits to that in terms of thepsychological aspect, but you
have to have some context andawareness of like when you see
that number, how not to freakout and understand what it
means.
But that's a different topic.
Yeah, no, I love everythingyou're saying.

(12:17):
And I guess the next questionis perfect because we're talking
about lifting heavy, we'retalking about developing a
routine, but we're also talkingto women over 50.
And the question is about jointissues while training.
Some of you already start withjoint issues, knee issues, back
pain, um, shoulder issues beforeyou even start.
And you may feel like that'sholding you back.
Others who are listening,they're like, okay, I hear what

(12:39):
Pam and Philip are saying aboutlifting heavy.
What about bad knees, frozenshoulder, that back pain, you
know, because you're probablysitting all day at your desk
job.
How do I prevent gettinginjured?
Because this sounds like ascary thing, slinging around all
this weight.

Frozen shoulder, ladies.
Have you gone to see your OBand gotten your hormone levels
checked?
That is a common symptom ofmenopause and low estrogen.
Literally, it's one of thebiggest it really is.
When you've got menopausesymptoms, frozen shoulder is
huge for menopausal women.
And for if you've never heardthat before and you haven't
gotten your hormone levelschecked, listen to my friend
Karen Martel's podcast.
He is amazing about educatingyou on hormones and menopause.

(13:15):
But estrogen can make a hugedifference with that.
If you have bad knees, oh mygosh, strength training is gonna
help your knees because you'regonna strengthen your quads and
your hammies and your glutes,which will make your knees feel
better.
It's gonna do nothing but makeyour knees feel better.
If you have extra weight tolose, losing that weight will
make your knees feel better aswell.
Those are my my first initialthoughts.

Yeah, those are great.
And I want to add to that,because that's that's an
encouragement to just get goingwith it and see if your symptoms
actually improve, like doing asquat the right way.
And now you're loading yourknees a little bit, but doing it
through the range of motion andseeing how that progresses.
I guess to add to that would beif you're doing something
that's out and out, outrightpainful, that is something's off

(13:56):
there with potentially yourform or the weight or something
like that.
But if you start light and youbuild from there, your body will
adapt to it.
And that's an important conceptfor people to understand.
They're like, well, I'm gonnalift heavy.
It's heavy for you, which mightbe like 50 pounds, might be 20
pounds, you know, not 200pounds, but eventually you get
there.
And then the other piece, Iguess, is if you truly have an

(14:18):
injury or surgery you'rerecovering from, of course, take
your medical advice.
But also, there are so manyways to adapt a movement with
grips, with width, with range ofmotion.
And I've had to go through thismyself, ladies, with with my
shoulder because I had rotatorcuff surgery.
And I finally found, like withlandmines and close grips and
pauses that I can train.

(14:40):
And the guy, the goal is how doyou train?
Not I can't train because I'minjured.
It's how do I train not throughthe injury per se, but how do I
train in a safe way?
Anyway.
Any other thoughts add there?

Yeah, I feel like we need to focus on what we can
do versus what we can't do.
I had a friend that hadmeniscus surgery last year, and
I'm like, okay, so why can't wejust train your upper body and
your core?
And she's like, Oh.

Yeah, yeah, the all or nothing is like so So
prevalent.
Prevalent.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um, all right, we're almost ata protein question, I noticed,
but the next one is one moretraining question, and that
question four, because I I Ilove this uh yoga.
Is yoga, Pilates, or barconsidered adequate strength
training for women over 50, oris dedicated heavy resistance

(15:24):
training non-negotiable?
Okay, this is this is an easyone for us.
Come on.

Stop it, ladies.
Non-negotiable.

Yeah.

I I I have many, many women who love, love, love,
love, love Pilates and bar.
Fine.
However, you are not gonna getthat load on your muscles in
Pilates or yoga.
Do it because you love it andadd two minimum days of strength
training in a week.
If you could do three, thatwould be amazing.
I encourage women to do whatthey love because you should get
joy, some joy of your exercise,and then some exercises do it

(15:51):
because it's great for you foryour long-term health and
wellness.
And it actually drives me crazythat women think that Pilates
is enough.
Like I can't even with that,Philip.

Is it because they just love it so much?
Or does strength training soundtoo hard and different?
What's the reason or anotherreason?

Well, I do think women love group exercise with
other people, you get thoseendorphins, somebody's telling
you what to do.
Strength training, I don'tthink so, but many do.
It's just boring and it's hard.
It's hard to push yourself.
Uh, and it's just not fun.
I mean, I'm weird.
I think it's fun.
I have a great playlist, Ithink it's fun, no problem.
But many women are notself-motivated and don't know

(16:58):
what to do, so they find it astruggle to make that time that
45 minutes to an hour to get tothe gym to work out.
Nobody's there cheering themon, telling them what to do.
It's more of a solitary thing,which if it's all or nothing,
yes, go to bar, but maybe find agirlfriend and go to the gym
and do your strength trainingtogether if that's what it's
gonna take.
But really for the rest of yourlife, I think strength training

(17:19):
is a non-negotiable.

Yeah, I think what you hit on is trying to find the
thing that motivates you andthat you like about it and maybe
integrate it into your strengthtraining and or add in the
training, understand that that'simportant and that's why you're
doing it, and then still do oneor two of the other things,
knowing there could be sometrade-offs depending on your
goals and everything else.
But all in all, that's part oflife, right?
Is trade-offs to enjoy and stayconsistent.

(17:43):
Okay, so now we got our firstprotein question.
Question number five.
Now, as this episode comes out,guys, you just heard episode
398 was a definitive updatedprotein episode I did.
All the things, okay.
So the straight up what thescience says, but what are the
minimum daily protein intakegoals uh in grams or pound per

(18:03):
body weight, specifically forwomen over 50 who are lifting
and want to improve bodycomposition?
So, what I want to I want toadd to that, Pam, I think what
she we should answer is what arethe differences because they
are women over 50?
I want to see if if there areand like why, rather than
general protein requirements,because they can hear my last
episode and I talked it todeath.
Let's just be specific here.

Well, our protein needs actually increase as we
get older because we are losingmuscle.
So I would say at a minimum,one gram per pound of ideal body
weight.
So if your ideal body weight is150, if you can get 135 to 150,
like it's not a game ofperfection, it's a game of you
know, doing what you can.
That is so, so important.
And I find so many womenstruggle with this.

(18:45):
And I'll say it, it's not hard.
You just gotta.
I actually enjoy my two cups ofcoffee in the morning with uh
protein powder in it so I canstart my day with 30 grams, and
I'm ahead of the game there.
But we want to build muscle andwe want to keep our muscle.
And in order to do that, wehave to get enough protein in.

You know, you mentioned the reason for that is
the loss of muscle mass.
But are there other factors?
Um, because there is thisconcept of anabolic resistance
that I've researched a lot and Istill feel like it's slightly
not supported as a real thing.
And a lot of these things areconfounded by the fact that
you're losing muscle mass andyou're just older because of

(19:23):
that.
But I have I have seen throughthe evidence over the years that
like women might need a littlemore than men, older people need
a little bit more than younger,independent of some of these
factors.
But I do like yourrecommendation of one being kind
of the upper limit where youneed to be worried about.
If you're nowhere close tothat, get more, you don't have
to go more than that.
What are your thoughts on that?
Like, I don't know how much ofa science you're aware of.

I I am not aware of a ton of science.
I just know that women have thehardest time.
So for if you've never evenlogged your food before, I would
say minimum 25 grams of proteinevery time you eat.
That includes your snack.
So if you ate four times a day,you're at 100.
Baseline, start there and thenget it to 30 grams every time
you eat, and then 35 grams.
And what I find is women arelike, I just want a little

(20:06):
mid-afternoon something.
And I'm like, yeah, yeah, have30 grams with that mid-afternoon
something, something.
Be intentional with your food.
And I know I'm over the top onthis, and I'm so passionate
about it, as I know you are,Philip.
But I'm looking at, I'm almost60.
When I'm 80, I want to feel asgood as I do now.
And how I eat and how I move isgonna affect that.
And, you know, women are a lotof women are afraid to eat more.

(20:26):
I'm like, you're never gonnagain weight eating protein.
You're just not.

Yeah.

Please, your your body's gonna look better when
you eat more protein.

And sometimes the opposite happens in that you eat
more protein, you get fuller,you know, you eat higher quality
food, and all of a sudden itdisplaces things, and you eat
less calories, fewer calories.
You know, that's what I see waymore often.
Yeah, you're not gonna overeaton protein.
If you ate pure sirloin steaksall day, which you know, there's
carnivore people that do that.
Seriously, though, like howmuch could you eat?
Like, that's just a goodthought experiment of how many

(20:56):
calories you actually or bowl ofyogurt.
Like, I eat a bowl of yogurtand I'm like, okay, I'm done.
Like this, I'm pretty full, youknow.
This is great.
But if I ate bowls of a bowl ofyogurt all day, I'm only gonna
eat what probably my body needs.
It's kind of interesting.

Yeah, your protein department, like we went out for
a steak dinner, my son'sbirthday was Monday to a steak
place.
The smallest steak they had iseight ounces, and I'm like, I
can't do that.
I can't even, I can barely eveneat four.
I got the lobster tail insteadbecause I could eat all that
lobster tail, but there's acertain amount of fullness that
your body's like, I just I can'tdo it.

Yeah, yeah.

So um, when women say, Oh, I had two scrambled
eggs, I'm like, you need four orfive, like, oh, I can't eat
that much.
Like, you can.

Yeah.

Or have a cup of egg whites and one egg, and then
you know, that'll be easier.
But really, you are so muchmore full.
I could eat my head size inchips.
I could not eat my head sizeand protein.
It just doesn't work like that.

It's exactly it.
It's exactly.
Every time my wife cooks bigpork chop or chicken breast, I'm
like, you know, it's it's it'sprotein and I'm full.
Like it's just gonna be full,you know.
So all I can stomach on theside is some quinoa broccoli or
something, you know?
Yes.
Yeah, no, it's good.
Okay, let's go, let's continueon the food train here.
The next question is aboutcalorie deficits, which we
talked to death on this show.

(22:05):
But the again, let's getspecific.
How should a woman over 50calculate a sustainable calorie
deficit?
I like that word for weightloss, which here we like to talk
about fat loss as well, notjust weight loss, given common
issues with trackinginaccuracies, hormone-related
changes throughout the cycle andfluid retention.
I'm just ad-libbing here, anduh potentially lower BMR, which

(22:30):
I assume could mean just womenversus men, but also your
metabolism tends to declineduring peri postmenopause for
other reasons as well.
Go.
Sustainable calorie deficit.

Well, I really like you introduced me to
macrofactor, and I really likethat.
And one other thing that Ireally think is important is
eating different calories on thedays that you lift versus the
days that you don't lift.
Where I mean, until youintroduce me to that, and I've
done, you know, obviously, asyou get older, you get more
research in.
Like, we shouldn't be eatingthe same amount of calories

(23:02):
every single day.
When you put more effort intoyour lifting, your body needs
more food on the days thatyou're maybe it's doing a little
bit of cardio, you don't needas much.
So you have to look at yourlife and think, okay, well,
first of all, there's also youronline calculators with your
daily um T D E, right?
Those calculators.
I would do those.
That's that's a great baseline.
And it's really soindividualized.

(23:24):
If you are working really hard,you are not in a big calorie
deficit that day.
That's just you just and makesure your protein is spot on so
you are not hangry all day long.
I find women, you know, whenthey want to save calories,
they're trying to cut back likedon't eat a lot for breakfast,
don't eat a lot for lunch, andthen they they're hangry and
then they overeat.
Be smart about your food andtry to plan it out.

(23:46):
When you eat it, like you said,a big bowl of Greek yogurt with
some berries, that's a greatmeal post-lift because you
aren't full.
Maybe some you know, oatmeal onthe side, you want some carbs
in there too.
And don't be afraid of carbs.
You talked about that a lottoo, is our bodies need protein,
carbs, and healthy fats.
All that is going to play inyour calorie deficit.
And the great thing is, you getto decide what you eat.
Like don't look at online foodplans.

(24:07):
Eat what you would like to eat.
That makes such a bigdifference.

Yeah, so you hit on a couple of really good themes.
One is just tracking, whichwe'll talk to the cows come
home.
You have to track whatever youneed to measure.
And the other is what you'reeating.
And ladies, listen, this is areally important point because
I'm gonna tie this into aconcept I've been like playing
in my head with recently.
Let's say you're not trackingany of this stuff, but you
listen to what Pam says and youfocus prioritize protein.

(24:32):
I would also argue prioritizingfiber and nutrients, and and
nutrients only come fromnutrient-dense foods, you know,
berries and you know, uh seedsand nuts and lean meats and
dairies and all the fun wholefoods we have available, the
bounty of foods, lots of colors,lots of variety.
If you start there and nowyou're feeling better and you're

(24:53):
more satiated and you'reperforming better in the gym,
only then should you say, okay,calorie deficit.
Like too many women get itbackward.
They're like, how do Icalculate my calorie deficit and
jump into that?
No, no, no, no, no.
Let's eat really well.
Let's perform, let's setourselves up for success.
And then even if you weren'ttracking, and this is gonna

(25:14):
sound like sacrilege for me,Pam.
Even if you don't useMacroFactor, guess what you have
to do?
See how you feel and is yourbody trending up or down, and
then change the amounts.
It's actually that simple.
So a sustainable caloriedeficit should feel like
something that's just a tiny bithungrier than usual, that's a
tiny bit less than usual, andyour body fat is trending down

(25:35):
slowly over time relative tomaintaining.
And if you were then to trackthat with a calorie app, you
would see it should matchsomething like a few hundred
calories below your maintenance,you know, and it's gonna change
constantly.

You can't measure what you don't track.
So I have had 99% of my clientsgo, I hate tracking.
I'm like, they said it's hard.
I said, you know, it's hard.
Having a baby's hard.
Tracking your food is not hard.
Literally.
No, it's not hard.
It's not hard.
It doesn't take very long.
We eat a lot of us eat the samestuff all the time.
It might take an extra fiveminutes a day.
If it's important to you, it'sworth doing.
I love the TikTok.

(26:09):
I love my animal videos on theTikTok.
I can also track my food.
Like people make time for thethings that they want to do.
And if it's important enough,if it's important enough for
you, you can absolutely do it.
And I will say this also can weplease get rid of that stupid
1200 calorie number that was hasbeen around forever.
That's for a very small person,like maybe five, two or less

(26:30):
for an adult woman.
That's way, way too little.
And what happens is you mightgut it out and get there, and
then you're starving and youwill overeat to compensate.
Your body will always try tocatch up.
So throw that number out thedoor.
That is not for an adult-sizedwoman for the most part.

Yeah, no, a hundred percent.
And if you're hearing that andand feeling like, no, no, no,
that is me.
There's probably something onthe expenditure side, right?
On the uh metabolism side wewant to look at.
And it might be the lifestylefactors, it might also be
hormones.
Because again, we're talking40s, 50s.
There definitely could be athyroid thing going on.
There could be, but I don'twant to fear monger, because

(27:05):
many cases that's not.
Um, could be a testosterone,could be all these things.
Uh something in your bloodwork, could be a nutrient
deficiency, right?
Could be all those things.
I would look, that's going backto how are you eating?
How are you feeling?
How are you performing?
Tracking is gonna acceleratethat process because it'll give
you more targeted awareness ofall those things.
And then I was gonna addressyour timing comment.

(27:25):
The cycling is also veryindividual.
That I think that's what you'regetting at is like you don't
have to do it in one way.
You know, you don't have tohave the same calories every
day, nor do you have to do upand down every other.
Like it could be all on theweekends that you get your extra
calories.
It could be very fluid and itcould go with your cycle as
well.
Not that there's a benefit incycle-based eating or training

(27:46):
necessarily, but that you feelhungrier and so you should eat
more then.

I think all the tracking is good.
Tracking your sleep, trackingyour steps, you know, tracking
your workouts and noticing likeif you keep a journal, like
noticing the days you'rehungrier, they're probably your
lower body days if you'relifting because you recruit so
much more muscle.
So you're gonna be a littlehungry on those days, and that's
okay.
But it really is important toknow yourself inside and out.
And on the days when you're notas hungry, go, oh yeah, I

(28:10):
didn't lift today.
I just walked, and that's okay.
That that's fine.
You might, you know, bake acouple calories for the next
day.
But really becoming the experton you is so, so important.

Yep.
We have a challenge coming upuh called the strong finish
challenge in physiqueuniversity.
And I'm doing something I'venever done before, Pam, but it
reminded me of that is a lot oftimes you talk about a minimum
viable habit or product, right?
Like here's the minimum, nozero days, here's the thing I
want to do, but here's theminimum.
I'm gonna take it a stepfurther and say there's a
bailout strategy.
In other words, even if youcan't do the minimum because

(28:42):
you're shopping for Christmaspresents, you've got all the
events, you've got all theparties.
Is there something even lessthan that?
To your point of like, ifyou're tracking it, at least you
can have a streak of something.
Like I went out for afive-minute walk, not a
20-minute walk.
It's still a five-minute walk,you know?
It reminded me of that.
So um, yeah, no, good stuff.
Okay, so continuing on, kind ofrelated, is a metabolism

(29:02):
question.
And this is a good one.
This is gonna hit on somethingthat is, I think, highly
misunderstood.
And that is the assumption thatyour metabolism slows down with
age.
Okay, and I don't want togaslight anyone, but the
research is very clear whenthey've looked at populations
all across the planet from theHadza tribe to Western obese
populations, that our metabolismis pretty steady from the age

(29:25):
of 20 to age of 60, and then itstarts to decline, most likely
because we've lost so muchmuscle mass and are so sedentary
that it just can't help butreflect that.
So when we talk about our 40s,50s, and maybe 60s, what the
heck is going on when it lookslike our metabolism is slowing
down, and what do we do aboutit?

I think people are just in general less active.
They are at their desks moreand they're not moving as much.
I mean, think about your 20s,you're in college, you're
working on campus.
I was a waitress.
I walked a million miles a dayas a waitress.
Um, I ran marathons, I wasreally, really busy, and your
life slows down a little bitunless you make time for it.
If you make sure you walk everyday, if you are fitting in,

(30:06):
putting yourself on that listand getting your strength
training in going to yoga, fine.
Go yoga is great for somemobility.
I mean, we are losing losingmobility as well, but making
your health a priority andfitting it into your week.
I don't think our metabolismhas to necessarily go down if
you are staying active as youage.
Now, if you're like, you knowwhat, I just want to sit, I'm

(30:27):
getting old.
It's I'd rather be doingnothing, then yes, your
metabolism is going to go downand you will see the effects of
that.
We see the effects of it allaround us.
It was very interesting,Philip.
I was just in the Paris airportlast month.
No overweight people.

Okay.

They're active.
They walk everywhere.
They are a culture of walking,walking.
Same thing in Greece.
I was in Greece.
No heavy people, really, theonly heavy people sound
Americans.
Our American society is set upto be less active as we get
older.
So I think 60 is an age wherelike I'm just kind of coast.
But if you want to feel great,if you do not want your
metabolism to go in the tank,lifting, daily walking, eating

(31:04):
for your health.
I mean, I think we can dothings to reverse that
statement.

Yeah, I agree.
The guys on Mind Pump weretalking about going to Disney
World and all the people onscooters.
However, they mentioned thedifference between Florida
Disney World and CaliforniaDisneyland.
California had far fewer ofthose people, and there was just
like more of a culture in thatparticular area.
What's it Anaheim, I think, isDisneyland?
Yeah.

(31:29):
Where obviously it must be more,you know, there are stereotypes
about the South being having alot of health issues that are
true stereotypes regarding dietand things like that.
But it, in other words, it's inour control as human beings.
It's not inevitable.
I guess the the thing I want tochallenge both of us on then is
what about the hormone piece?
I know that's Karen's like bag.
She and I talked about themetabolic storm and how, oh,

(31:52):
what if you are doing all thesethings and still something's
there?
Is it then inevitably hormones?
How big of a piece is that?
What are your thoughts there?

I love hormone replacement therapy.
And I really encourage women tofind out more about it.
That it's not awful for us.
It's actually awesome for ourhealth.
And it helps our bodies runlike they should be running.
It's keeping your hormonesstable.
When we're in menopause, theystart to tank and really keeping
your hormones stable.
You're doing everything you canto keep feeling great.
So if you are not on anything,certainly you your energy is

(32:22):
going to go down without thattestosterone.
You're not going to be sleepingas well.
You're getting hot flashes,which means you are not going to
want to work out.
You're not going to want toprep food.
Like it's going to affect everypart of your life.
So, yes, it could be a hormonalstorm in your body.
And you can also get themreplaced and see how great you
feel.
So everything is in our well, Ishouldn't say everything, a lot

(32:43):
of things are under control.
Some women can't take it forcertain reasons.
If you can, I would suggest itbecause it just means you're
like fine-tuning your health bykeeping your hormones in
balance.

Yeah, get yourself baseline tested.
Um, any men who are stilllistening to this or decided to
listen through this, same thing,like get it tested.
Um, we do performance bloodwork, but there's lots of great
practitioners.
You know, we talk about Karenand I can hook you up with Pam
when it comes to a lot of thisstuff as well with connections.
But yeah, it's it's more andmore important.
Hopefully, the healthcareindustry will slowly shift over
toward a better recognition ofwomen's health and hormones

(33:14):
because obviously it's not thereyet, but I hear see inklings of
it starting to happen.
So maybe 30 years from now.

I hope so, because I know I'm have my hormones done
through Karen's group and theywant you to feel optimal.
And it's interesting because Iget it's out of pocket, of
course.
So I go to my regular OB andI'm like, so can I get my
testosterone cream at thislevel?
I'm like, oh no, that's way toohigh.
It's not.
It's actually how I feel mybest.
So I will continue to pay outof pocket because I want to be

(33:43):
optimal.
I don't want to just be okay.

I agree.
Yeah.
It's uh I know some of thepractitioners will also call it
like physiological levels, whichI like that term as well.
I like optimal and performanceand physiological.
Like all those terms kind ofmean the same thing in our world
of it's not the normalpopulation range.
It's shifted up to a feelingbetter range, which then some
regular doctors might say is toohigh or unnecessary.

(34:05):
So when you think ofphysiologic range, it's like,
where were you in your 20s and30s?
If you were there and perfectlysafe, why couldn't you be there
in your 50s and perfectly safe?
It's, you know, now men tryingto get up to 3,000 total
testosterone for perform, youknow, for the gym, that's that's
a different thing.
There's risks there.
So um, yeah, no, that that'sgood to understand about this

(34:26):
whole metabolism thing.
I think it also ties into allthe research.
Uh, Lauren Calenzo's Semple ofMass, I drop her name all the
time because I love her.
She's great.
She is constantly pushing backon the narrative that the sky is
falling for women, like foreverything.
And and it's not really true.
It's just that there arelifestyle factors and some other
things that are exacerbating itfor women in that age range.

(34:47):
And it's not to, again,gaslight you guys.
It's to say, you've got powerhere.
Like you can go after it.
And then once you do thethings, it removes constraints
that were there and it revealswhatever constraints were made,
you know, like the hormones.
Anyway, I'm going on adiatribe.

No, I've heard women say, like, I'm just gonna
suffer through it.
And I'm like, why?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
You don't have to sufferthrough it.
You can feel better.
You can actually sleep bettertoo.
That let's not suffer.
Come on.
Let life is hard enough.
Let's feel great during thisstage of life.

Feel great.
And so part of feeling great,moving to the next question, is
the physical expression of allthis.
And a lot of women who havegained a lot of weight over the
years and then they lose theweight, they lose some fat, and
they're trying to work on their,you know, how they look and
feel, they got loose skin.
Let's talk about loose skin.
The next question is aboutwomen who've lost a lot of
weight and they have loose skin.
Is this purely a cosmeticthing?

(35:38):
Can it be helped with like howmuch muscle you have, your
nutrition can be helpful withany of that?
Should you get surgery incertain circumstances?
Like, what are your thoughtsaround loose skin?

I think a lot of that's genetic.
Okay.
Whether I and if you've lost ahundred pounds, I don't know how
much strength training is gonnahelp that.
Like, I really think aconsultation with a plastic
surgeon, it would be great.
That's amazing.
But that's a whole like fifthgrader that you lost.
Now, if it's 20 pounds andyou're a little loose, I I think
you always have to giveyourself a year of regular

(36:07):
working out to see what yourbody's gonna do.
You can't make any snapdecisions, but with a lot of
loose skin, that's really such apersonalized decision.

Yep.
I can't add to that becauseit's not my area of expertise.
I have seen that the degree,the degree of it matters and
your body does adapt to someextent.
But like obviously, if you havemassive amounts of loose skin,
you know, it's your personalchoice how you want to deal with
that.
But just do the things you cando and then see what's left.
Kind of continuing our themetoday.
Okay, recovery uh is the nextquestion, of course.

(36:36):
Recovery strategies.
And the question here is reallyabout recovery being harder
when you're older.
You know, recovery time is alittle bit longer.
And so there's a lot ofinformation out there about
supplements, mobility work,sleep hygiene, mindfulness,
meditation, yoga.
The list goes on and on.
Walking, what should youprioritize?

(36:58):
Like if you had to pick onething to recover from your
training, that's gonna assumeyour strength training and not
over-training.
Actually, that's maybe a partof the answer, right, Pam, is
don't overtrain.
What are your thoughts onrecovery?
It's a big topic.

I think you absolutely have to have rest
days.
And rest days can includewalking.
I think we should walk everyday.
I know me personally, on days Ido legs, my legs always feel
better if I'm walkingafterwards.
But days of no strengthtraining.
Like you need you need rest.
Stretching, I'm a big proponentof stretching.
I always have been.
I think stretching is great.

(37:31):
I'm gonna drop the name umTravis Elliott on YouTube.
He has a yin playlist.
It hurts so good because he'sholding the stretches for like
three to five minutes.
Stretching, great.
And it's like a meditation andstretching, so it's two for one.
If you like yoga, great.
But I really think you have toknow your body.
I was just having thisconversation.
I just told you this with a galwho wants to train for a

(37:53):
marathon.
I told her, you can't work outevery day.
You have to actually, she's 62.
I said, you have to let yourbody have rest days.
You're not gonna perform unlessyou give your body the rest it
needs.
And yes, sleep hygiene, crazyimportant.
I mean, sleep is our number onething for recovery for
everything.
So it's a good sleep, totalrest days, daily walking,

(38:14):
stretching, really important,and not beating yourself up for
doing less.
We need to do less so we can domore in the gym.

Yeah, I think maybe the psychological piece of the
doing less is maybe you replacethat thing with the thing you're
doing for yourself and count itas that.
In other words, like you cancall it active recovery.
I don't like that phrase somuch.
But like, if you like to workout every day, well, on your
rest day, your workout is yourwalk.

(38:42):
You know what I mean?
Like, like put that as part ofyour routine.
So I was thinking, I want thelistener to think about when
they've gone on vacation to abeach, you know, they're
stressed out of their mind fromtheir work, from their
lifestyle.
And they finally go to the,they go to a beach, the
weather's beautiful, they get torelax, they're not thinking
about training, they're nottracking even, they're not maybe
not thinking about food andthey're just enjoying whatever

(39:03):
food, maybe alcohol.
I don't care.
You know, you're just relaxedand enjoying yourself.
And like from a parasympatheticnervous system state, you're
maximizing it to the fullest.
However, you get there.
Maybe not alcohol, but anyway.
Um then you get back, and ofcourse, you reached out to me or
Pam ahead of time, and you'relike, how do I deal with my not
working out for a week?
And we're like, don't stressit, it's just a week.

(39:23):
And then when you get back, youfind that all you're stronger
than you were, and you find thatlike lifting feels great and
your joints feel better.
What does that tell you?
Like that tells you that weneed this time, and sometimes it
happens accidentally.
Like for me, if my schedulegets so hectic, I just can't get
that training day in and justskip a training day.
I don't feel guilty about itanymore because sometimes I come
back and now I've skipped twoweeks on that session, like that

(39:45):
Wednesday session I haven'tdone in two weeks.
All of a sudden my lifts all goup again.
I'm like, this is crazy howthat works, right?
So we need it.

But your body needs rest.

Sleep and sleep is a big part of that too.
Oh, don't get started on sleep,right?

That's uh and can we stop shooting all over
ourselves?
Sometimes you shouldn't.
And look what happens.
You you are more rested.
So that next session, yourbody's like, let's go.

Yeah, for sure.
So I mean, I guess the long andthe short of it is what Pam
said is first, are you doing toomuch and not giving you
yourself space for rest?
And then pick a few things thatare the most important
low-hanging fruit for you.
And that could be sleep, thatcould be the stretching,
something else.

Well, look at your whole week.
I mean, I know I'm a formerover-exerciser.
I'm just gonna say that I usedto run marathons, I used to
probably run seven days a week.
I just way too much.
No strength training.
All I did all the things wrong.
And now when I help, I havesome runners that I'm training.
Like, do we need to do a junkmile?
Do we need to do a three milerun?
I don't think you do.
I think you could do some upperbody strength and do some

(40:47):
stretching and help.
Like, what is your long-termgoal for yourself?
And you want to feel good doingthis, whatever you're doing
next year, five years, 10 years.
So doing less is gonna reallybenefit you later on.
I mean, if you felt better twoweeks later, that's still on
your body, like rest is best,really.

Exactly.
And you just mentioned aligningwith your goals.
We have two questions left, andI'm gonna flip them around
because the last question wasgonna be about goals.
Let's talk about that.
Okay.
And the question is just howcan a woman set meaningful
long-term fitness goals beyondthe superficial like appearance
or beyond weight loss, thatcenter on capability, aging

(41:26):
gracefully, you know, the thingsthat, you know, as we get
older, we start to value thesethings more and we want to kind
of latch on to those and getmotivated and push on those.
What do you think?

Well, I think it's good to pick, like I just, my
girlfriend, uh, she's 59, shegoes, I want to do a pull-up
before I'm 60.
That's that's a good goal.
And I told her exactly exactlyhow to do it because it's not
easy, but there is a way to getthere.
Do you have a like a squat goalyou have?
Do you want to be able to do afull body push-up?
That's very hard for women.
Like, I would pick out physicalthings that are a challenge to
you.
And then once you get there,set another goal.

(41:57):
But yes, we all want to look atour clothes and all the things,
but it's good to have aphysical challenge to work on.
And then when you get there,you're like, oh my gosh, I did
it.

Like it feels really good.
That's a really good one, Pam,because I know I can blather on
about like process-related goalsand habits and blah, blah,
blah.
But the idea of like stillmaking it about some outcome to
help drive that process, but anoutcome itself that makes it
more meaningful is beautiful.
Like that's goal, right?
So physical could becompetition, it could be, you

(42:29):
know, if it's if it's foodrelated, I don't know, what
would be a good likefood-related?
Do you even need a food-relatedgoal?
Because if you're trying to geta training goal, it kind of
forces in the right nutrition.
But what would be a good foodgoal?

It depends what you struggle.
If you struggle with protein,getting 125 plus grams of
protein a day for the next year,that would be hard to do for a
lot of women.

Yep.

But you guess, but you have to track to be able to
do that.

Yeah.
So that's see, that that goes toa conversation I had with
again, Alan Lazarus.
We talked about meta skills,how there's like meta skills,
skills, and micro skills.
And like to me, the grams perprotein a day is like a micro
skill.
And the skill is justconsistently getting protein,
and the meta skill isconsistency, you know, how it
like abstracts up.
So trying to get your firstpull-up, you then have to map it

(43:14):
back and reverse engineer andsay, like, okay, what is the
escalation process to get thepull-up?
What do I have to do three daysa week or one day a week or
whatever to get there?
You know, you have to break itall the way down.
So with a protein goal, let'sbrainstorm it real quick, Pam.
Is that enough to say, like, Iknow I need X per day?
Or is there something moremeaningful, like medium to long

(43:36):
term, that would drive that?

Well, I think for women, we're so used to not
thinking about ourselves.
We have to think aboutourselves and look at our day.
What's realistic?
You know what?
Getting 30 grams of my coffee,yummy and delicious, easy, easy
way to start the day.
Greek yogurt, one meal a day,super like and it's like two
servings because I want to getover that 30 grams.
Thinking about the meals thatyou like.
And of course, if you havedinner with your family, that's

(43:59):
a different story.
But the first, you know, yourcoffee, breakfast, lunch, you
can control that and thinking,what do I like?
And have it's okay to haveboring meals on rinse and repeat
that you like that keep yousatisfied, but it makes your
life easier, makes groceryshopping easier.
And then dinners, you know,they can be more than three or
four because they're probablyfor your family.
But really reverse engineeringyour whole week to go, okay,

(44:21):
what are my breakfasts thisweek?
What am I gonna pack for lunch?
What are my non-negotiables?
What am I not gonna have?
If you're a teacher, there's abunch of holiday treats in the
room, you're not gonna go there,or you're just gonna have gum
or mint and avoid that.
Like literally think aboutevery part of your week and how
you're gonna hit those goals.
It's a lot of saying no, andit's a lot of thinking, what am
I gonna do?
How am I gonna create asuccessful day for myself every

(44:44):
day?

Lisa (44:44):
Hi, my name is Lisa, and I'd like to give a big shout-out
to my nutrition coach, Felipe.
With his coaching, I have lost17 pounds.
He helped me identify thereason that I want to lose
weight, and it's very simplelongevity.
I want to be healthy, active,and independent until the day I
die.
He introduced me to thiswonderful little app called
Macro Factor.
I got that part of my nutritionfigured out.
Along with that is the movementpart of nutrition.

(45:08):
There's a plan to it, and hereally helped me with that.
The other thing he helped mewith was knowing that I need to
get a lot of steps in.
So the more steps you have, thehigher your expenditure is, and
the easier it is to loseweight.
When it's presented to you likehe presents it, it makes even
more sense.
And the other thing that he hadwas a hunker guide, and that
really helped me.
So thank you, Villa.

We just had Halloween and uh when Chuck
Retreating, and you because youmentioned the candy, and it's
like those are super caloriedense, and I know I'm getting
off track, but like even I enjoythe occasional Kit Kat or
Reese's or whatever.
I think I told you this on I onIG, and I don't know if you
were horrified or not, butthat's me.
It's like my idea offlexibility, right?
But I know they're so caloriedense that I'm like, even just
one little mini Kit Kat's like,you know, 120 calories.

(45:50):
And so I'm like, okay, I'm justgonna have one and I'm gonna
build it in, I'm gonna pre-logit, and now work back from that.
And it's like, okay, that's inthere.
Now let me get my protein, letme get this, that.
And you mentioned the one ortwo meals a day that you can
start with.
I do, I love that idea,especially breakfast.
Maybe at the top of the list,and maybe lunch is secondary,
only because so few people getenough protein at breakfast.

(46:12):
Like lunch, they might, youknow, maybe they have a lot of
turkey in their sandwich, theyhave leftover chicken or
something from dinner, maybe.
But breakfast, I almost neversee people have enough protein
because you have it's likebreakfast foods we get from
growing up in America, wherelike cereal, bagels, muffins,
maybe oatmeal.
That's like starting to getprotein, but we don't often
don't have eggs.

(46:32):
Like I grew up thinking eggsand bacon are like a fun weekend
type thing at a diner or likeon the weekend.
I'm not gonna have eggs on aMonday, you know?
So um, anyway, I it's a greatidea.
So, ladies, think about thatone meal a day that you just
don't get protein and how areyou gonna do it?
How are you gonna do it?
It's you know, make it happen.

Well, and you can use convenience foods like Fair
Life is a great shake.
I just saw Chibani came outwith one for people who are not
way-based or gain house whenthey're all at Costco.
I've seen those.
If you had that with yourbreakfast, you're gonna get to
30 grams.
So you don't have to makeeverything yourself.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.
There's competition now amongthe processed food makers for
higher protein foods, which Idon't think is the worst thing
in the world.
It's not bad.
Um, like oikos brand Greekyogurt.
Um, I forget what it'ssweetened with.
It might have artificialsweeteners, you know.
Um, but I recommend it to a lotof people if you can, if you
like, if you're okay with theingredients, you know.
I think they they use eitherartificial sweetener or or

(47:26):
stevia.
It might actually be stevia,and and it's fat-free, but
because it has some vanillaflavor in there with a stevia,
you know, it tastes great andit's a ton of protein.
So look for those options.

I am gonna say I love powdered peanut butter and
Greek yogurt.

There you go.
Yeah, like PB2 or something.

Oh with a little bit of brown sugar swerve.

It's like a beef in a cloud.
I love it, love it.
And it's easy, it's easy tomake.
And then ninja creamy is awhole other thing.
I should do a whole uh episodejust about that.
That um, my actually kids gotme for was it my birthday?
Yeah, it was my birthday just afew weeks ago.
They got me a ninja creamy highprotein recipe book.
I was like, this is great.
You guys are awesome.
So, all right, so the lastquestion we have today is, and

(48:10):
this is a good one to end on.
For a beginner, woman over 50who is maybe intimidated,
intimidated by the gym, youknow, not used to going, maybe
anxiety over the gym, maybedoesn't have a lot at home, but
wants to build a home gym.
Let's focus on that.
What's the most essential home?
So, this question was exerciseswith minimal equipment.
I want to challenge thequestion and say, like, let's

(48:33):
address the equipment too,because you may need to invest
in some more equipment.
What are your thoughts just onthis very common problem?

Well, I would say you can do a ton with your body
weight.
There are so many YouTubevideos out there, and I have a
bunch myself on my YouTubechannel.
Bodyweight exercises start withbody weight.
Get a mat.
You want to stretch on the mat.
Dumbbells are great, but I feellike women would not buy heavy
enough dumbbells to that's afact.

Like nothing truth right there.

Nothing under 10 pounds.
But and and FacebookMarketplace is a great place to
buy used workout equipment.
So I would definitely go onthere.
Um, and it depends how muchspace you have and where you
live.
I live in California.
I can walk outside all yearlong, so I would not buy a
treadmill.
If you are in the East Coast,you're you know, winter's
coming, treadmill might be agreat option.
Uh, what are you looking for?

(49:21):
Cardio, I mean, I hope you'regonna do strength, but I would
say a mat and some good, like akettlebell.
Kettlebells would be great tostart but body weight for a
month, see how you feel, andthen work from there, but get
your body moving first.
And then you might be like, allright, this is boring, go to a
gym.
I would highly recommend go toa gym.

(49:41):
Because most people, I used toactually, I worked at Linda
Evans Fitness Centers in the90s.
She was a big deal back.
I'm a lot older than you,Philip, but she was a big um TV
star.
And when we got trained, 95% ofpeople who have equipment at
home do not use it.
They use it for clotheshangers, they use it for
everything else besides.
So I would say if you livewithin eight minutes of a gym,

(50:04):
join a gym.
But if you want to start athome, find home workouts that
are for body weight and then geta friend and go to classes and
then get a trainer and be in thegym.

Yeah, there's some common themes there.
I see all the time with clientsas well.
So, what one theme, as youmentioned, is don't use the
excuse of not having equipmentto not start, get started.
And maybe getting started athome is the lowest friction
thing for a lot of people.
But then within a few weeks,you're gonna find you're too
strong for some of theseexercises.
And then it like gives you thebug of, okay, what's my

(50:35):
solution?
You got to kind of keep pushingthat and and be and get ahead
of that.
Like, where's the nearest gym?
What do they have?
Go visit it.
So I have clients who likeacross the spectrum, some will
say, you know, they've got asweet home gym set up, and I'm
like, good to go, or hey, myhusband has barbells.
I'm I'm like, good, let's startusing that.
And they have a coach to kindof push them to do it.
And like you said, not 95% ofpeople don't use their home gym

(50:58):
equipment.
So you gotta evaluate what'skeeping you accountable.
And then the I'll say, like, isthere a commercial gym?
And sometimes people are justin rural areas or they're
ranchers or something, and it'slike, you know, 40 minutes away.
I don't even want to spend 10minutes going to the gym, me
personally, but that's because Iwill work out at home.
So it's a whole spectrum oflike, where are you starting

(51:19):
from?
Love all that advice, Pam.
I also think getting gymequipment on Facebook, getting
gym equipment from like allthese sad CrossFit gyms that are
closing that have to get rid oftheir equipment.
Um, there's not many left now,but they were closing a lot over
the past few years.
And yeah, just uh no excuses.
Just get strong.
Get strong and have fun withit.

Well, and really, we talked about group exercise.
It's a fine place to start.
I find women don't pushthemselves enough, but that's a
great place to start.
And then be like, okay, I cando more.
Then grab a friend and get atrainer, do a double training
session and start from there.
But you always want to beprogressing.
I have a girlfriend who takesclasses and she goes, Some of
these ladies have not changedtheir weights in class for six

(52:00):
months.
Yeah, you are not gonna seeresults by doing the same thing
over and over.
That's the definition ofinsanity, right?
So you always want to bechallenging yourself.

That's exactly it.
That's progressive overloadright there.
So, all right, that's all thequestions that I have.
But I always like to ask onefinal one is is there one do you
think women over 50 are askinga lot that we didn't really
touch on?

Yes.
And I'm sorry to break yourhearts, ladies.
Peanut butter is not protein.

Peanut butter is very specific.

Nuts are not protein.
Do not grab a handful of nutsand think you're doing yourself
a favor.
I have said that over and overand over, probably for the last
20 years, on you could be eating600 calories of nuts.
And if you're trying to loseweight, that could be more not
half your day's calories, but alot of your day's calories in a
handful.
Um, and I just had a lady thisweek who just said, you know,
well, I love my peanut butterand jelly.
I said, okay, but you're noteating for your goals.

(52:53):
That's eating for comfort.
And sometimes you have to breakup with a toddler inside of you
and say, okay, you're notgetting any protein.
And you're not having only twotablespoons, you're probably
having four or five, becausenobody can just have two.
It's too delicious.
So if you are serious aboutyour goals, I you I you have to
eat for your goals.
And it that that doesn't meaneating bad stuff.

(53:14):
What do you like?
Do you like chicken?
Do you like fish?
Do you like steak?
Do you like pork?
Do you like turkey?
Eat what you like protein-wiseand get enough fiber, 25 grams a
day, I would say minimum.
And then really prioritize thatprotein and fiber at every
meal.
But so many women think avocadotoast, almond butter toast,
peanut butter and jelly, that'sa good meal.
I'm like, that's not a goodmeal.

(53:34):
And that's so much fat.
And in my experience, I'm not adoctor, nutrition or
nutritionist, women don't dowell on a ton of fat.
They don't get enough protein,eat more protein, and then let's
see how you feel.
Sorry, sorry.

No, it's true.
Uh, a lot of that is a vestigeof like the paleo and keto world
because they pushed a lot ofthose recipes that end up being
super, super high fat.
I was in that world for a whilemyself.
Listen, I'm a big, not big.
I wish I was big.
I'm only I'm an average guy.
I'm a guy, so I'm bigger thanmost women, and I eat about 2600
calories for maintenance rightnow.
And I have 20 grams of peanutbutter a day in my oatmeal.

(54:10):
That's all the peanut butter Ihave.
And I intentionally include itin there because I like the
taste of what it does to myoatmeal.
And that's a little over atablespoon.
And I, but I have to measurethat out because if you take a
big spoonful and dump it in,you'll find you're already past
that amount.
Peanut butter is so caloriedense.
Yeah.
And I include that in myoatmeal.
My oatmeal is like 325calories, and like half of that
is the peanut butter.

(54:31):
Like that's it, it's superdense.
And when you mention nuts too,nowadays my thought on nuts is
like a nutrient source, like tosupplement in little amounts.
So, like if you need someselenium or um other nutrients
that are found in certain nuts,I think you think of it as like
almost like a supplement you'readding in in small sprinkled
amounts.
Because you're right, if youjust grab a handful, that's like

(54:53):
500 calories right there ofwhatever nut it is, even though
they're delicious.

So and so many people think they're healthy, so
they're fine.
And yes, they are healthy, butnot in that quantity.

Yeah, because in nature, you'd have to like you'd
have to grab them one by one,you'd have to break them open,
you have to peel, yeah, you haveto take them out of the shell
and all that.
Yeah, exactly.
All right, that was fun, uh,Pam.
I think we covered a lot ofgreat questions.
Definitely watch your peanutbutter, eat for your goals,
track, lift weights, do all thefun things.
Hopefully, we covered it fromsome fun angles today.
And Pam, I'll just leave withwhere can people reach out to

(55:26):
you so you can continue yourconversation here?

I'm on Instagram and TikTok at lowercase pam
underscore sherman one.
I'm active on those, so you canreach out and, you know, well,
message me, be happy to talk toyou.
I think it's never too late toreach your goals.
I would love to help you.
I've been there, I've gainedweight, I've lost weight, I've
helped women for 28 years ontheir health journey.
And there's no quick fixes, butconsistency will definitely

(55:51):
help you get to your goals.
And I'm sorry, peanut butter isnot awesome.

So if you need help with peanut butter and you're
picking up what Pam is puttingdown today, please definitely
reach out to her.
I love the community of coacheswe have, you know, throughout
the industry and on this show.
And like it's an abundancementality here because we can
all help the right people ifthey need it.
So reach out to Pam.
Pam, thanks so much for doingthis.
It was kind of a last minute,guys.
Like, I invited Pam like lastweek.

(56:16):
We said we need to get togetherfor a fun QA.
Let's do it.
She said yes.
So thank you so much.
I appreciate you, and thank youfor coming on Wits and Weights.

Always a great time.
Thanks, Philip.

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Q&A - Women Over 50 Strength Training and Fat Loss (Pam Sherman) | Ep 399

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Q&A - Women Over 50 Strength Training and Fat Loss (Pam Sherman) | Ep 399