What if your personality could help you avoid burnout, create better content, and run a business that actually feels aligned?In this insightful episode, Kate chats with Taylor Smith of Refreshed Wellness on the Road about all things Enneagram—and how understanding your type can radically improve how you work, create, and connect.
Taylor is a yoga teacher, content creator, designer, and RV mama of three who’s deeply passionate about helping others live with more clarity, calm, and joy. She shares how the Enneagram helped her understand her strengths, stop overcommitting, and find more flow in family and business life on the road.
Whether you’re brand new to the Enneagram or already know your number, this episode is packed with useful takeaways for anyone building a life and business with intention.
Key takeaways:
🧠 Self-awareness is the key to success
Taylor breaks down how understanding your Enneagram type improves communication, conflict resolution, productivity, and even content creation.
📦 You’re not “just a number”—you’re a whole system
From stress and growth tendencies to “wings” and motivations, the Enneagram shows how you operate under pressure and when you’re thriving.
🎯 Tools like this help you create with clarity
The more you understand your personality, the easier it becomes to build a brand that feels true to who you are—and connect with others in a meaningful way.
🌪 Enneagram in real life
Taylor explains how knowing she’s a 7 helped her manage overwhelm and bring more sustainability to her creative work. Plus, why marrying a 1 was the perfect match.
💻 Want to learn more?
Taylor is hosting a workshop inside RV Queens Circles on April 21, 2025. You can join the community at rvqueenspodcast.com/community and use code ALOHA to get 25% off your membership for life (and support Taylor at the same time!).
🔗 Connect with Taylor:
Instagram: @refreshedwellnessontheroad
Follow along for tips on family travel, homeschooling, wellness, cold brew obsession, and all the beautiful chaos of RV life.
—
Mentioned in the episode:
- Book: The Road Back to You by Ian Cron
- Book: Becoming Us by Beth McCord
- Ted Talk: “Start With Why” by Simon Sinek
- Enneagram workshop for RV Queens Circles Members – April 21, 2025
- Link to Taylor’s Recommended Enneagram Test
—
🎙️ Want to Start and Monetize your Podcast? Join our workshop on May 8 2025 to Launch your Podcast and Build Paid Brand Partnerships!
—
👑 Join the RV Queens Community – Get 20% off your membership for life with code PODCAST at rvqueenspodcast.com/community
—
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
I consider the Enneagram like the rumble strips on the
highway. Since most of us watching this
are probably travellers. You know what the rumble strip
is on the side of the road? It's for truckers and drivers.
If you're all of a sudden driving down the road and you're
just a little drowsy and you veer into the wrong lane, you're
gonna feel the blah, blah, blah,blah, and it's gonna wake you
up. That's how I, over the years,
(00:21):
have used the Enneagram successfully.
Like, I know where I go in stress.
I know what I do in health. Welcome back to the RV Queens
Podcast, where we dive into the world of women making money on
the road. I'm your host, Kate White, and
today's episode is an especiallyfun one because it's packed with
insight and enthusiastic energy.You'll get what I mean pretty
(00:43):
soon. Taylor Smith is my guest today.
She's a full time RV, mom of 3A,yoga instructor, and a long time
Enneagram enthusiast. If you've ever felt like your
personality is just too much or wondered why you keep bumping
into the same struggles in your business or relationships, this
conversation will help connect the dots.
(01:05):
Taylor breaks down the Enneagramin a super approachable way,
including how to figure out yournumber and how to use that
knowledge to make better decisions, communicate with your
loved ones more clearly, and even create content that aligns
with who you really are. She also shares why the
Enneagram isn't about putting yourself.
In a box but. Rather, understanding the lens
(01:27):
you use to view the world. And if you're a travel woman
like us, trying to build a meaningful life and business
outside the mold, you know how important self-awareness really
is. So pour yourself a cup of cold
brew and let's roll. Taylor Smith, Aloha and welcome
(01:48):
to the RV Queens podcast. Where in the world are you
today? Yeah, so Aloha, I just got to
Tennessee today. And how is it?
So far so good, but there is a hailstorm impending, so we'll
see how that goes. April in the Midwest ish slash S
Yeah, choppy weather going on, I'm sure.
(02:12):
Never know what it's going to belike.
It starts like this. We'll see how it ends.
Yeah, if we start hearing dumping in the background, we'll
be like, cut. I have a lot to cover with you
today. I'd like to start where I start
all my interviews. Back before you and your family
started living in an RV, What led up to those days when you
(02:37):
guys decided to ditch your more normalish American life to live
and travel in a camper? The reason why I greet Aloha a
lot is we are. I use the word from loosely from
Maui, Hawaii, not born and raised, but my husband was there
for 17 years and I was there for12.
We got married there. We we met married and had two
(03:00):
out of our three kids there in Hawaii.
It was one of those things wherewe're like, OK, we're ready to
like go to the mainland and experience everything that's
there. You can't really RV PS on Maui.
So it was like, OK, let's let's make a change.
So we moved to the mainland seven years ago now and we've
been on the road for a year. But it all started.
The RV stuff all started for us because we got a travel trailer
(03:23):
and we were weekend warriors. And more and more we would come
home from a trip and everyone meet him.
The three kids were like, you don't want to come home.
Like, can we just like go a little longer, you know, like,
we didn't want to come home. And of course it's vacation, so
nobody wants to come home. But one particular trip, we were
gone, booked for a week. And then on the way back, we
(03:46):
were like, do we have to go home?
Can we just extend? And the State Park we were at in
Florida was like, yeah, we have availability.
My husband already worked remotely.
I already homeschooled. So we were kind of like, we
should maybe try this. So the one week trip turned in
two weeks. And we basically looked at each
other and went, I think we couldprobably try this, not in the
(04:07):
travel trailer, like let's get something bigger, but I think we
should try this. I love it so much and I love
that you actually were familiar with RV ING before because it's
a mixed bag. Some people are familiar with
RV's and then they go full time and then there's people like
myself and other crazies that are like, I don't know, let's
(04:27):
buy one off of Craigslist and see what happens.
So good for you, you took a smarter approach.
I didn't tell anything before I bought this and I'm like, OK, we
had a little bit. We had like 2 years on the
weekends of like experience to figure it out.
Yeah. But you know what?
We survived and here we are 2 1/2 years later, so it all
worked out. There you go.
(04:48):
OK Taylor, you are a multi passionate person, as are many
women I meet on the road and many other members of the RV
Queen circles. I actually met you when you
taught yoga at TTO this winter. By the way, you are an excellent
yoga teacher. I take yoga classes all over the
(05:09):
country and I loved your class, so there's that.
You are also a graphic designer,you're a content creator and you
are an aficionado of the Enneagram, which is what we are
going to focus on today. For those who aren't familiar at
all, give us like an Enneagram elevator pitch.
(05:29):
What is it and why should peoplecare about it?
So the enneagram is a personality typing system.
People get all caught up with what does it mean and is it is
it weird? And the circle that we can show
maybe on a graphic somewhere, itlooks kind of like a pentagram.
It has nothing to do with anything like negative like
(05:49):
that. But it's a 9 sided circle is
what the gram and penta in the original language means 9 and
gram means chart. So it's a nine sided chart
basically. But the, the, the why behind the
Enneagram is really like, do youimagine a whole bunch of
different lenses? So like there's a zoom lens,
(06:09):
there's a like a monocle, there's eyeglasses, some people
have astigmatism, some people are near sighted, far sighted.
Everyone has different lenses that they look through the world
at. And the Enneagram gives you
really good insight into what your lenses like.
How do you see the world? And if you know other people's
(06:30):
Enneagram numbers as well, like we'll kind of get into that.
Like it helps you to understand some people might have a zoom
lens that they see the world through and they walk through
life every day with. And you might not, you might be
in like more of an overview person.
I've seen the aerial of the whole world.
So it's a way to notice how you see the world, but then also
(06:52):
when you find out friends and family and loved ones and
coworkers like what their enneagram is, you can relate to
people better. Really.
It's a great self modality. I guess it's the best way to
describe it. And I personally feel like if
everybody was self aware enough to understand their personality
types and then secondary if you know your loved ones, it would
change the way that we interact with people.
(07:14):
Like I'm not going to go so far as to say like we'd have real
peace or any of that. But if the more you're self
aware better the world's going to be right and you might not.
You might be in like more of an overview person.
I've seen the aerial of the whole world.
So it's a way to notice how you see the world.
(07:34):
But then also when you find out friends and family and loved
ones and Co workers like what their enneagram is, is you can
relate to people better. Really, it's a great self
self-awareness modality, I guessis the best way to describe it.
And I personally feel like if everybody was self aware enough
to understand their personality types, and then secondary, if
(07:55):
you know your loved ones, it would change the way that we
interact with people. Like, I'm not going to go so far
as to say like we'd have real peace or any of that, but if the
more you're self aware, the better the world's going to be,
right? It's a helpful tool, yeah.
And yeah, something I've noticedabout the people in the travel
community is they tend to be very intentional and they've
(08:18):
decided to live this counter cultural lifestyle for a reason.
And the women who are starting and running businesses want
their endeavors to align with their life and their values and
their personality. And this is a helpful tool to
help that alignment, right? So how can the Enneagram help
(08:40):
people live a more aligned, selfaware life?
So I feel like there's like 4 main like reasons, like if you
were in school and the professorwas right, not the outline like
the four main tenants would be, you know, communication.
How do you communicate conflict resolution, productivity And
(09:04):
then like if you're a content creator, which I know not every
entrepreneur is, but if you are a content creator, like how you
create that content. Those are like the main, if you
will, like areas, we'll touch onother things, but those feel
feel like those always come backto me.
There was somebody who did, maybe it was Yale, like 77, top
(09:26):
CE OS like the most successful people in the country at the
time when they did the study asked what is the number one
like precursor for success? And they said self-awareness.
If we all knew who we were, whatour limitations were, what our
strengths, what our weaknesses are like that would really help
you with success in anything. But in business, on the road,
it's very pertinent, you know? OK, quick tangent, because you
(09:48):
mentioned content creation and you said not everyone is a
content creator. OK, Yeah, I think you're right
that not everyone is a like, quote UN quote influencer
content creator. You work with brands, have the
partnership, all those things. But I do think, and I've said
this on the podcast many times, is the idea of having a personal
(10:13):
brand and creating content that's like, this is who I am.
This is what I want to say. I'm putting this out into the
world. Whether you're an employee and
you have your own personal brandon LinkedIn or Instagram or pick
your platform, whatever, TikTok,I think that skill is going to
become like more and more important as the decades roll
(10:35):
on. And as there's like so much
content to consume. What's going to make people care
about what you're saying is thisis exactly who I am, This is
what I want to say. This is why it matters to you.
And these tools, like the Enneagram, can only help you
like, hone in on that more. The more I talk about the
Enneagram with anybody, whether I'm like around the campfire or
(10:57):
talking to you or talking to somebody on the phone or
somebody that's at a location that I'm at, is like, it's
really helpful for everything. Like I know we're mostly talking
about like making money on the road and being an entrepreneur,
but the more you talk about it, the more you're like, oh, OK,
like this could help anybody, help anything, anyone.
If you're not on the road 5 years from now and you're in a
bricks and sticks, knowing this is still going to help you, you
(11:19):
know, like it's, it's so useful for so many places and so many
situations. All right, let's get into the
details here. So describe, if you can, the
Enneagram system. So if you imagine a Ferris wheel
and it's got all the little, youknow, cart, not carts, what are
they called? Seats that are like people are
sitting in all the seats, right?So the Ferris wheel is going
(11:40):
around and around and around, and there's nine different
cartwheel or carts, let's say. And at the very top of the
Ferris wheel is #9 it's actuallynot number one, and we'll get
into that in just a second. Why that is?
So you've got 9 and then 12345678.
So when you're at the nine position, let's say 9 is in the
best position that they're at the very top and they look down
(12:03):
into the others, they can see everyone else, right?
And one of the things I love about the indiogram is if you
were a nine, which some people are harder to type to find their
type and some are easier. Nines are actually some of the
hardest people to type. But if you are a nine and you
look down and you can see in everyone else's carts that it is
(12:25):
a good thing that you can resonate with everybody below
you. But it's also really hard
because it's the hardest number to try to figure out because you
relate to everybody and you get along with everybody and you
kind of think everybody, oh, I'ma nine, but I'm also a four and
I think I'm a 2 and maybe a 7. So that's why I always start off
because a lot of times I'll havepeople say, oh, I tried that and
(12:46):
I can't figure it out. I took a test, I read a book and
I'm not any number and I'm like was 9/1 of the numbers that you
might have thought you were and they're like, yeah, that is the
number that I thought I might bethe way that you could think of
the Enneagram. As far as that, you know, Ferris
wheel is everybody has their owncart, but if you happen to be
(13:07):
here and you see this number down here and you look into
theirs, you're like, oh, look, they're having a picnic.
Like that's so fun. You can see into them.
You still are a primary number here, but you can also resonate
with this number. And we'll talk about the minute
it's wings and we'll kind of getinto where our numbers that go
to stress are numbers that go instress negative and then
positive. But biggest thing to understand
(13:29):
is there's one number that you're mostly going to resonate
with the most. Even if you think you resonate
with everyone, there's one number that is probably going to
ring true to you the most. And I always highly encourage
people when they're taking the test.
If you're watching this podcast and you're like, what is she
talking about? Like I don't know what number I
am read about them a little bit.You can go online super easy.
(13:51):
Ask ChatGPT to give you like onesentence about each, about each
Enneagram number. And I always tell people read
about one through 9 immediately,you're probably going to
eliminate like 6 of the numbers.You're like, that's not me.
Nope, Nope, no way, no. And then you might have a
couple. You're like, maybe that's me, I
don't know. Then take an Enneagram test.
(14:13):
I don't really recommend paying for the ones that they charge as
a couple free ones. If anybody wants to contact me,
like I can give you the link after you take that test,
they're usually about 18 to 20 questions.
They're not really long. You'll probably have a better
idea of what number you are. And a lot of people get caught
up with this when you're taking an Enneagram test.
If you're stuck on an answer, you're like, I just don't
(14:35):
genuinely know how to answer this question.
Go back to who you were when youwere like 18 or 19.
If you got married when you werereally young, this might not
work. But if you were not married and
raising a family when you were like 18 or 19, that is usually
when you were the most you. You didn't have a lot of
responsibilities. You just made the decisions that
you wanted to make. So that's kind of my advice with
(14:56):
the personality test, Like if you take the test somewhere
online, just think about how would 18 year old me have
answered this question? And that usually helps people
get unstuck from figuring out their number.
OK, so is it worth talking through one through 9 like
giving us A1 sentence and and seeing if we could do?
That, yeah. Eliminate or resonate with one
(15:19):
as we go through. If you're not sure about the
Enneagram, if even you're interested in it, you're like, I
don't even know if I should be interested in it.
There is a really good Ted talk and it's by Simon Sinek.
I don't know if I pronounced that wrong.
Last name is SINEK Simon super famous.
It was from a long time ago. It's like 2009 and his video is
titled the why of how we think. I think is what it's called.
(15:41):
But if you type in start with Y start with Y is the name of the
podcast and he talks about how people don't buy whatever
product service thing you sell. People don't buy what you do.
They buy why you do it. And he talks about Apple and how
Apple, you know, does this. It's it's a great.
I'm not going to try to sum up his Ted Talk like it was
(16:03):
amazing. Go listen to that.
But the the gist behind it is the Enneagram explains the why,
how we think, how we act and howwe feel.
I was just talking to somebody the other day who actually is an
RV queen and her and I were chatting about the intergram and
she was a little hesitant about it and was like, I don't know if
that's something I should be interested in.
(16:23):
It seems like it's a little woo woo for me.
And I told her what I'll tell everyone here, the intergram.
Historically, you don't even really know where it came from.
Like there's different civilizations, like the Incas
will say, we found this etched in this cave that's this old.
And then the Greek people are like, no, we invented it.
(16:43):
And then like there's, there's Asian countries that'll be like,
no, we didn't. So my idea of why I feel like
it's important is that it's so true for for people like once
you start using the Enneagram and understanding how it works,
you'll Start learning about friends and family and you're
like, that's why they are the way they are.
(17:04):
Like that makes sense. It just makes sense.
If that if that makes any sense.The history goes way back, I
guess is the best way to describe it.
And Americans didn't actually know about the Enneagram as
recent as the rest of the world.It was in 1990 that this like
Franciscan monk Richard Rohr. It was in one of the books I
read. I know I've got to remember, but
in 1990 something, I don't know what it is exactly, he wrote a
(17:28):
book in English, which all the other Enneagram books were
written in different languages. And it was like the Enneagram
from a Christian perspective, I think is the title of the book.
And so that's when America started like hearing about it
because it was in English. But before that, it was like
other civilizations had used it in their civilizations.
I guess that's. I mean, I think everyone's
(17:48):
curiosity loop is definitely open at this point.
Like what are these numbers and what is this?
What is she even talking about? So yeah, please satisfy our
curiosity and at least give us like a one liner for each
number. So Enneagram one, we'll just
start with one. The Enneagram 1 is sometimes
called the perfectionist, sometimes called the reformer.
(18:10):
You get the gist. It's one of those ones you don't
have to really go that deep into.
But the Enneagram 1 is usually more of a perfectionist.
A couple sentences that people will read and they'll be like,
oh, I resonate with that. OK, so that's what I'll do.
Like a couple quotes. So you might be an Enneagram one
if this is not a Jeff Foxworthy comedy show, but you might be an
(18:31):
Enneagram one if are overly critical of others or yourself.
You tend to be a perfectionist. You don't like it when people
ignore or break the rules. That's like kind of a good
enneagram one in a nutshell. There's good benefits to that.
There's bad and we can talk about that later.
Like there's there's being a healthy 1 and being an unhealthy
(18:51):
1. The same with all the numbers #2
would be the helper is usually the word people usually use to
relate to number 2. And so those are the people that
are always volunteering for things.
Those are the people that are kind of, if you ask them on a
personal level that say, I just really don't know how to say no
to people. They're usually overextending
themselves. They're usually really good
(19:12):
listeners too. That's actually a benefit, a
huge benefit for twos. 3 is usually the achiever and these
are the people that you usually see that are like really good at
leading teams. Like maybe they're super high up
in like a multi level marketing.They're very, very driven.
They can also be a little vain and they might, may or may not
admit that to themselves, but the way that the world sees them
(19:35):
is very, very important to them.That would be 3 though all
different kinds of words are 4, but I prefer the word artist.
Doesn't mean you have to be an actual artist, but they're more
of like introspective and compassionate and like very
expressive and creative. So the sentences they might
think are I never feely really feel like I belong.
(19:56):
That's usually a four. I have really big feelings.
I have really big feelings that can overwhelm me.
That sometimes is a 4 #5 visionary.
A visionary is someone that is more analytical.
They're usually, honestly, they're usually the smartest
person in the room. And they usually know that
they're the smartest person in the room and they're very wise.
(20:19):
They usually are the smartest person in the room.
And the quote that they might say is I really love my
solitude. And I don't always say it out
loud, but in my head I think I'mpretty cynical.
That's like a big thing for a 5-6 is the analyst and the way
that I describe an analyst is someone who has not post
(20:40):
traumatic stress syndrome. Like everybody knows if you go
through something traumatic sixes will have pre traumatic
stress syndrome. So they can walk into a room and
already be stressed out because they see this could happen and
that could happen and this couldhappen and that could happen,
but nothing has actually happened yet.
Like they're really good at at risk assessment.
(21:01):
So like they're very, very good.They're usually very loyal too,
very likable, very loyal. But they see everything that's
going to potentially go wrong #7is the enthusiast.
And those are usually like the fun loving, very likable.
Kind of if when they were in high school, probably friends
with every different friend group, upbeat optimist.
(21:24):
And the quote that I have from them is I'm an optimist to a
fault. The glass is always half full
and I'd like to plan zero rest days. 8 is the challenger, 8 is
the people who are, they're verycompassionate, but they also
feel like what's the best word? They feel that arguments are
(21:49):
intimate, like people who argue with people and then feels like
an intimacy towards them insteadof like I'm arguing because I'm
mad at you. I I just argued with you and now
I feel so much closer to you. That might be an 8.
A quote for the 8 is I have beentold that I am too bold, too
blunt and or too aggressive. So that would be an 8 and I also
(22:11):
don't do things halfway. Eights, eights and ones are very
similar in that respect. They will go all the way.
Total best of their abilities. OK.
And then 9 is the last one. Nine are the peacemakers and
like I mentioned previously, they definitely can be the
hardest to type because they arepeaceful and generous and relate
(22:32):
to every single other number on the wheel.
And their quote would be, I justwant to move slow, sit in a
hammock and then go hiking. That's like in a traveler
perspective. I mean, we all want to do that
really. But they're also very, I know
quite a few nines and it's really hard for them to be self
starters. Like they're not as self
(22:53):
motivated to do things as others, but they are completely
happy to just go with the flow. They're like the easiest person
to just go with the flow. So that's kind of in a nutshell.
But I will say every number has like, this is me at my best and
then this is me at my worst. And both can be good or bad, if
(23:13):
that makes sense. Like there's a strength and
there's a weakness. Everybody has it.
If you're really healthy, you'regoing to look like this as an 8.
If you're really unhealthy, you're going to look like this
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(23:57):
The one thing that I wanted to mention, well, two things that
are coming to mind from my Enneagram research is the fact
that like you talked about thesebeing lenses at the beginning.
And I think a lot of people thatare just getting into this might
be like, oh, I feel like a little bit of all of them, you
(24:19):
know, and that's normal. Like there is a little bit of
all of them in us, but it's likea helpful tool.
Again, finding the one that resonates the most with you.
And then whenever you get into the research, like you mentioned
about when you are in an unhealthy state or a healthy
state, you also lean into these other numbers.
(24:39):
To me, that was the part that I was able to recognize that I was
a 7 whenever I started breeding like deeper into that part of
the Enneagram. So there's, there's like these
other layers going on here. And yes, so and then the other
concept like another layer to all this is this word called a
(25:04):
wing that you mentioned before and it's you know where.
Go ahead and describe what a wing is real quick.
Yeah, yeah, with a wing again. Imagine we're back to the Ferris
wheel and let's say we're going to do 9.
We're going to pick on the poor little nines because they're at
the top and they're easy to understand.
So if you're a nine, you look atthe carts.
It's not a cart. What's the word for those things
(25:26):
like the the baskets? It works, yeah.
Cart seat. Cart basket seats.
Yeah, look at the people, look at the numbers that are next to
you. So if this is the nine, you're
either going to be looking at the eight or the one, the ones
that are next to you. Every single person has a
primary number, if you will, that you most resonate with.
(25:46):
And then the wings are the numbers that are on either side
of you. So a lot of people are confused
and they're like, I took the test like five years ago and I
think I'm like a 7, but I'm a wing 4/3.
And you're like, you can't actually do that.
Sevens are the rule Breakers. So I get that if they were, but
but yeah, no, it's your wing is the number, the number on the
(26:07):
left and the right of you. So when you look at a picture,
there you go. Now what I will say is they say
the word wings because you imagine a bird and if a bird has
wings, they have two wings. Now you can learn to use, you
know, one wing more than the other.
A lot of people will say, oh, I have balanced wings.
I really feel like I relate to let's just go to sevens.
(26:27):
I really relate to the 6th and to the 8th pretty equally.
That would be, you would be A7 with balanced wings.
But then you also talk to one ofmy best friends is A7 with A6
wing. And she does not relate to the 8
at all. She's never seen any of that in
her life. And she's, you know, well into
her 30s. And she's like, I think I'm
just, I'm just A7 wing. 6 is howpeople would word that.
(26:49):
Or if you see it typed out, it'slike 7 W 6 is how you would in
the Enneagram lingo. Yeah.
So that's how. The real nerds would write it.
Yeah. Yeah, exactly.
OK, if there's someone listeningthat is interested and they are
a deep dive type person like I am and they want a book
(27:11):
recommendation, you know, not Chat GPTI don't want to go take
a test. I want to I want to research and
deep dive and understand what's going on here.
What is your book recommendation?
I always tell people when they're reading books to be
really aware of who wrote the book, right?
Because if I wrote a book, and Idon't know if I already
mentioned, but FYI, everybody, me and Kate are the same number.
(27:33):
So we're both sevens. So if you are really, really
like all about this, you're like, oh, I'm 70 now hard.
We're both sevens. But pay attention to who wrote
the book. The books that I get a lot of
what I speak about because it's who I got into the Instagram
from is the author is Ian Cron and the book is the road back to
you. And he Co wrote it with another
(27:56):
author as well. And then I, I listened to his
podcast for a while. He kind of got like a little
like a little weird during COVID, to be honest with you.
So I didn't I don't follow his podcast as much anymore, but his
book was, I think written in like, I don't know, 20-17,
something like that. And I really, really liked his
book. Another book that I've only
(28:16):
perused have not read cover to cover, just to be honest, is
Richard Rohr the the Franciscan Monk.
And that was the enneagram, a Christian perspective, which I
thought was wildly interesting. And I can't think of the other
one. Oh no, the other one, if you're
married or even just, you know, significant other Becoming Us by
(28:37):
Beth McCord. And I actually have seen Beth
McCord. I've met her in person.
I went to her one for Enneagram workshops in Bradenton, FL a few
years ago. And then I also met Ian Kron.
I've actually seen Ian Kron speak twice in Nashville and
then in Florida. So those are both like big names
from before the boom. There was like an Enneagram boom
(28:58):
and then everybody's Instagram. Everybody had an Instagram about
that. But those were the authors that
I really that I really appreciated their information.
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, we're like five
years behind the curve right now, but it's fine.
Maybe 7. I like to be late to trends.
It's fun. OK, let's cuz we're 7 let's talk
(29:21):
about interpersonal relationships real quick here
because this is again a helpful tool to figure out why I act
this way and maybe why other people act this way.
Now, whenever the first time I read about a nine, I felt like I
understood my mom like completely for the first time in
(29:42):
my life. But is that recommended to kind
of like type other people in your mind or how do you
recommend we play this? Amazing question.
Great, great question. So you are not supposed to type
other people and I'll tell you why.
When you take a personality test, you figure this out too.
(30:04):
You're like, I'm answering yes to this question, but I'm
answering yes really because XYZ, right?
My example is let's pretend thatyou work in an office, which is
like making me sick to my stomach to think about.
But like, you know, water cooleroffice setting, right?
And somebody comes into your cubicle and they're like, hey,
it's Diane's birthday next week.Should we throw for a birthday
(30:26):
party? And they ask a bunch of people
this and like, you know, one girl's like, yeah, we should
throw her birthday party. And then someone else is like,
yeah, we should throw her birthday party.
So you throw a birthday party for her.
But then you find out later the real motivation as to why those
two fictitional people said yes,their motivation is completely
different. One of them, and I won't tell
you which numbers they are, but let's say one of them, actually
(30:48):
I will, one of them is a 7. And it's like my my type.
And they're like, yeah, I said yes, we should totally throw
Diana party because I love a good party.
Like it's great. I want everybody to just feel
fun. And at work it would be more
productive if we're having fun. So like I said, yes, but This is
why I said yes, this is my motivation.
Then somebody else is like, well, yeah, I said yes, but I
(31:10):
said yes because I kind of really want the parking spot
next to Diane and she's my boss.So I'm thinking that, you know
what I mean? Like their motivation wildly
different. So that's why you're not really
supposed to type other people because you don't know their
motivation. In that same breath, I will say
that I 100% typed my mother and I 100% typed my husband.
(31:36):
But then I also had them go takethe test and like figure out to
confirm that that's what it was.Just a cautionary tale.
I mistyped myself wrong for like7 months.
When I first learned about the Enneagram, I read all the books.
I thought I knew it all. I thought I was a two.
It's the helper. It's the person who's always
doing things for other people. But I was a mom of littles.
(31:59):
I'm always helping everybody, right?
I didn't follow the rules because I'm a rule breaker.
The rules say you should read about every single one of the
nine types, eliminate who you know you're not, and then take
the test. And I was just like 1-2.
Oh, yeah, that's me. So that's kind of why.
And the season of life is different.
(32:19):
If I had thought about how I would have answered when I was
18 or 19, I probably wouldn't have mistyped myself as A7 or as
a 2 when it turns out I was a 7.And my mom's A2, She has a
strong personality. I'm raised by a single mom.
So in my mind I was like, oh, I totally resonate with that.
But a lot of that was my childhood.
It wasn't actually me. Yeah, and I think the phase of
(32:39):
life is a big thing to consider as well because I remember when
I was studying this more in depth, I was working a full time
job. I was very motivated to kind of
like get to the top of my career.
I on the side was working on a startup and doing fundraising.
And I was like high energy, verymotivated corporate like
(33:05):
conversations with investors, you know, like in one of these
phases of my life. And I thought I was a three for
a long time. And the deeper I got into it and
the more I read it, I'm like, no, I'm A7, I know it.
The enthusiast in me was my superpower of like all of the, I
(33:26):
thought I was, you know, super motivated and career focused,
but I was actually just extremely enthusiastic about
what I wanted to do. And that's how I was selling
everyone around me to help me dothese things.
So it's fascinating. I think everyone should kind of
like consider that. There's 3 levels that everyone's
in, everybody in the world, whether it's an anagram or not,
(33:48):
there's usually 3 levels of likeyou're either healthy, meaning
like it's kind of hard to even ascertain the negative aspects
of your personality because you're just healthy.
Like you're, you're just like you're at peace with yourself.
You know yourself, you're just healthy.
The example I give is we knew somebody for years and years.
She was an 8, which is more of the like kind of kind of
(34:10):
personality like can like lawyers, attorneys, oftentimes
you'll find are 8. And we knew this person for
years. And my sweet husband one time
found out that she was an 8 and he was like what?
She's an 8, but she's so nice. That was like, she's healthy,
like she's a healthy 8, You know, so there's the healthy
level that people should be at, you know, hopefully.
(34:32):
Then there's like average, whichhonestly is like autopilot.
It's kind of what most of the population is in.
And you're kind of living in your own strengths.
You're just kind of getting by. Like you're getting by, but
you're just kind of getting by. And then there's the unhealthy,
which, you know, you're living in kind of a realm of way beyond
(34:52):
survival. And you might need help to get
out of that level. Like that's more of like, let's
get some counseling. Let's really do some hard work
to get out of it. So when you are a healthy or an
average or you're vacillating between the two, your number
won't be dreadfully obvious to alot of people, you know, unless
they really know you intimately.Like you would still probably
know your mom, your spouse. I will mention kids because
(35:15):
people always ask me that at every Enneagram speaking event
I've ever had. Can I type my kids?
I think my kids A7. I'm like, well, pretty much
every kid is A7 when they're kids.
And the Long story, short answerof that from every author I've
read and speaker I've spoke to is you really can't type kids
until they've lived more life. And I always tell parents, if
(35:38):
their parents asking me, you haven't screwed them up enough
to like figure out like, how arethey going to handle what lens
are they going to use to handle this?
You know, if you have a shy kid,you might think, oh, well, this
is their number. Or if you have an outgoing kid,
oh, this is their number. But it's more of like, let's
have them live a little more life and see how their natural
bent is to dealing with trauma in in life before you figure out
(36:01):
what number they are. I hear the rain starting so I
know I need to like get to my most important questions here
because I'm worried it's going to start hailing on you any
minute. OK, this is the question I've
been leading up to this interview for.
Give an example of how knowing your type has helped you in your
(36:23):
business endeavors. Sevens are more motivated, like
I'm more motivated. You can tell me if you are or
not to by like freedom and adventure.
Those are like my tagline words if you will.
Like I show up with high energy.I'm multi passionate, which is
kind of what you were talking about earlier, like you were
doing this and I'm full of ideas.
(36:45):
So like I would lend myself natural to like I was a
concierge for years. I would just talk to people
about all the fun stuff they cando.
And we love to Maui, so it's easy to be excited about that.
More spontaneous gigs, like somebody just says, hey, do you
want to design my logo? I haven't done a lot of full
time graphic design for a while,but sure, I'll do that like just
spontaneous side gigs. But what I've noticed is I need
(37:09):
to knowing my Enneagram, I need to know that I need to watch out
for overcommitting because I am an overcommitter to the Max.
I also have to be really carefulthat I don't just get bored with
a project that has just kind of like drug out a little too long.
Like I don't want to abandon things because I don't have the
(37:30):
staying power, which is great when I'm married to A1 because
I'm great about getting the excitement going, starting it,
launching it, gathering people around to like, help me do it.
I'm so excited. And then I start it and then
it's kind of the boring phase. And I'm like, I guess I can keep
doing this. And he'll be like, hey, guess
(37:52):
what? And then he'll kind of like
carry me to the finish line, youknow, and just knowing what I'm,
what my strengths are. Like my strengths I'm very aware
of, but like, sometimes you're not as aware of your, your
weaknesses. And definitely the staying
power, the staying power is the,is the weakness for me.
But I know that so I can lean into what's going on and then
(38:13):
ask other people or ask other RVQueens.
That's why it's been so incredible to be part of RV
Queens because you're always in circles with different people
all the time. Every month it changes.
So if I've already ascertained that person's really good at
this and this is kind of my weakness, hey, how do you do
that exactly? Like, yeah.
We can talk on that topic for a long time and if anyone is
(38:35):
interested in going deep and you're listening to this
podcast, like Taylor mentioned, we are having like more of a
dive deep workshop for RV QueensCircles members.
You can join at any time, Army queenspodcast.com/community.
That workshop is April 21st, 2025.
So if you would like to be a part, you are welcome.
(38:57):
And you can use Taylor's discount code and she will
receive a perk which is Aloha and you will get 25% off your
membership for life. So OK Taylor, this has been so
helpful and aspiring. Go ahead and share with everyone
where they can connect with you online.
And if the weather holds up, I will ask you my last question.
(39:21):
Yes. So you can find me on Instagram.
That's my primary channel and it's refreshed Wellness on the
road and we share all kinds of tips and tricks for family life
on the road. As I mentioned, we travel with
our three kids, so 10-7 and four.
It's crazy chaos and I personally love it.
(39:44):
It totally lends into my my 7 personality.
And we talk about homeschool hacks, Bible study tips.
I talk about the crazy on my crazy obsession with cold brew
and just kind of like everythingin between.
So yeah, follow me there. That's where you'll find me.
I love it and we will put a linkin the show notes.
I will also link Taylors book recommendations and her, you
(40:09):
know, special Aloha code. If you want to join podcast the
RV Queen circles through her code.
All the things will be LinkedIn the show notes.
All right, Taylor, here is my final question for this season
of the interview. I have been doing a one in one
question where I ask a question and we both answer it and today
(40:31):
of course this has to be my question because we're both
sevens. What do you like about being an
Enneagram 7? I can always find a silver
lining. Do you do you feel like that?
Do you feel like you can always find the the half full option A?
100% to the point that I'm like,am I sometime I have to be like,
am I being realistic right now? You know what I mean?
(40:54):
Like I'm always like, it's fine,it's fine.
Like look, it's going to work out.
It's going to blah, blah, blah. And my husband is also a 7, so
we have to have like, most of the time we're like, yeah, yeah,
yeah, it's fine, It's fine. Obviously, we are both human and
not everything is rainbow and sunshine all the time.
(41:14):
But for the most part, we just want to, like, have fun.
And we think everything's going to work out.
And guess what? It has.
So do you feel like you have balanced wings or do you learn
more towards the eight or the six?
Don't think I have a shred of eight in me.
I'm like do not like confrontation or yeah, it hurts
(41:38):
me. My husband is probably stronger
more towards the 8 and I'm more towards 6:00-ish.
That's awesome. But yeah, I think for me, what I
like about being a 7 is and why I really resonate with A7 is
like I mentioned before, the enthusiasm and reading about it
(41:59):
as this personality type, it wasthe first time I saw it as a
strength. Because my whole life, yes, I've
been like just the happy girl and Oh my gosh, she's always
happy. Like, do you ever have a bad
day? And I'm like, am IA weirdo?
Like, why am I? I'm just so excited about
(42:20):
everything, you know? When the like phrase toxic
positivity came out, I was like,no, I will not believe in that.
That doesn't exist. What's wrong with being
positive? Like, huh, if you you know the
phrase what you focus on, you create more of.
Like I'm just such a believer inthat if you look for the good,
you will find the good. And then it keeps perpetuating.
(42:41):
So I have a question. So the the first little storm
came through and there's no hail, there's no rain right now.
Actually we'll see if it even and starts to rain.
But I have a question. We didn't talk about numbers
that you go to in stress and numbers that you go to in
health. So do we have another couple
minutes? Sure.
Let's do it. So this is really interesting to
me because even though you have one primary number and then you
(43:03):
also have your wings, OK, so let's count together.
I'm like teaching my preschooler.
So if you have one main number, but then you have a wing and
maybe another wing, maybe you'rebalanced, you also are resonated
with three, right? But then you also have a number
you go to in stress and then a number you go to in health.
So you're actually knowledgeableabout 5 when it all comes down
(43:25):
to it. So I'm just going to pick on us
because it's easy and it's us. So stress number first.
So again, imagine you're look against Ferris wheel and seven.
This is going to be backwards, Iguess with the camera.
But like if this is a nine, thenthis would be like 123456789.
OK, so we're 7. So we're like we're like up
(43:45):
here. So A7 goes to A1 when they're in
stress. What I mean by that is your
personality will start to look like the the negative side of 1,
not the positive side. Like my husband's got all kinds
of positives being a one. He's diligent, he does really
good work. He doesn't half ass anything
like all of these good attributes.
(44:07):
No, it's like the negative aspects of A1A1 is very
checklist oriented and very black and white.
There's no Gray area. And I don't know about you, but
I live in a world of Gray like, oh, we can do this or maybe this
can happen. Like that's never choose A or B.
I'm like, well, can I choose AB and C?
Like, But when I'm stressed, I go to the one and the one I get
(44:31):
very black and white and I get very snippety and very like
overwhelmed with all the details.
But when I'm feeling healthy in my 7, I'm like, it's fine,
whatever. It's going to all work out just
like you said. Yeah.
So so your stress number is a number that your personality
moves towards when you're overtaxed, under fire,
overwhelmed. And if you find online, you can
(44:54):
find a stress health number and it'll show you the arrows of
like where everything goes. But again, if I'm the Ferris
wheel, here's the seven, the onewould be the number we go to in
stress, Right. OK, So then the opposite is your
security number or your healthy number.
And that's where your personality will move towards
when like your energy isn't being sapped, you feel pretty
(45:15):
secure. Like my friend who was an 8 but
wasn't acting like a bossy 8. So that for us, if we're the
seven, it's the number that's down here, it's a 5.
And so we will start not lookinglike acting like, I guess kind
of looking like the healthy sideof five.
(45:37):
And so when you, if you come into the workshop for the RV
queen circles, I'll dig into more of like the positive and
the negative side of each number.
But just to give us an example, like at their best, fives are
very analytical, they're very wise and they're very
perceptive, like very perceptiveto things like you pick up on if
(45:57):
anybody ever tells you like, wow, you picked up on that.
Nobody else noticed that you might be a 5 or you might be a
really healthy 7 that's feeling insecure and like kind of
getting into that like wisdom ofI picked up on something that
nobody else picked up on. So that's kind of everyone has a
stress number, everyone has a health number or a security
number. It depends on what author you
(46:18):
read. So that's really interesting.
So then you're like, well, I'm A7, but then I'm, I resonate
because I'm also a little bit ofan 8, a little bit of a six and
I go to 1 when I'm stressed and I go to five when I'm healthy.
So you end up knowing a lot of different numbers.
A lot of people, specifically the nines, I'm looking at you
guys, they don't want to be typed, they don't want to be put
(46:41):
in a box, they don't want to feel like that.
But then you can tell those people, well, it's not just the
9 like you do, you're a multi faceted person.
So you do have, you know, other things to to contemplate I
guess. Does that make sense?
Yeah, that's right. And again, yeah, it's, it's the
lens idea like keeps coming to mind that you mentioned at the
(47:02):
very beginning. It's like I start seeing the
world through when I'm stressed out.
I'm like, like you said, my black and white filter is on and
my enthusiasm has been drained and now we are just going to get
this done right now. Yeah, that's the stress Mom 7.
But the healthy Mom 7 is like, you know what?
(47:23):
There is a deeper side to me. Like, let's talk about you know
what I mean? I'm not just all rainbows and
unicorns all the time. There's also the deeper
analytical. Yes.
I can do that work. Well, I don't know about you,
but a lot of people think that people are positive all the
time. Also can't get deep and like get
in the trenches. And if you have a friend who's
(47:43):
going through trauma or loss or grief, a lot of times people
will pitch the positive Unicorn.People are like, oh, well, they
can't handle that. If I'm healthy and I'm like
secure and where the season of life I'm in, I'm like, I can be
crying with my friend who just lost her mother.
I can be like in the trenches with her.
But if I'm unhealthy and I, I know that about myself and I'm
like, I can't talk about anything negative anymore.
(48:06):
You guys would talk to me about the ticket you got and that your
rent's going up like I can't do anymore.
I know that about myself, which I can't believe I didn't mention
this earlier. I hope to anybody who's made it
this far on the podcast, if you only hear one thing, this is so
important to me and I get this from an author.
I didn't make it up. I consider the Enneagram like
(48:29):
the rumble strips on the highway.
And since most of us watching this are probably travelers,
maybe you're passenger princesses.
So you're not driving. But you know what the rumble
strip is on the side of the road.
It's for truckers and drivers. If you're all of a sudden
driving down the road and you'rejust a little drowsy and you
veer into the wrong lane, you'regoing to feel the blah, blah,
blah, blah, blah, and it's goingto wake you up.
(48:50):
You're not going to just like, oh, let me just ride in these
rumble strips for a while. Like you're going to like make a
reaction and you're going to getback to where you need to be.
That's how I, over the years, have used the Enneagram
successfully. Like I know where I go in
stress. I know what I do in health.
I'm 43, so obviously I just knowmyself.
But knowing the specifics of like, oh, I'm looking like a
(49:11):
real unhealthy one right now. Rumble strips, Let's start over
again. I need to get back in my lane
because I was over here. Yeah, the rumble strip an
allergy. Totally.
And I can't remember which book it is or I would give the author
quote, but that really resonatedwith me.
Like, that's a great way to use the Enneagram with those rumble
(49:33):
strips. Yeah, I love it.
Can I tell you about the Fight Club rules About Enneagram?
OK. The Fight Club rule is first
rule about the Enneagram is not.Don't talk about the Enneagram.
The first rule of the Enneagram is don't use it as a shield or
as a sword. And I've been guilty of this.
(49:55):
And my wonderful, loving husbandof 18 years will tell you this.
It is so important to not use itas a shield of like, well, I'm
just going to hide behind this because I'm a seven.
Sorry I was late. I'm just a 70.
Like, don't use it as a shield. It's not going to help you.
It's not going to help people around you.
Don't use it as a sword. You're always just making such a
(50:17):
big deal out of this thing because you're a one stab stab,
like you're just blah, blah, blah because you're a three and
like don't do that either. It's not going to help you.
It's not going to help the people.
What we talked about earlier about typing people is when I do
speaking engagements, I say like, don't commit a suicide.
Don't assume just because you know somebody's number and maybe
they did tell you like, hey, I listen to that podcast.
(50:39):
I did my thing and this is my number.
And you're like, oh, OK, you still don't know all their
motivations. You know, a big thing for me
that I've learned is don't use knowledge of the Enneagram to
manipulate people because it's real easy to like always ask
that #2 that, you know, for a ride when your car breaks down,
because that too is always goingto give you a ride.
(51:00):
You know, like, and then the last one that I say that really
helps people when they're getting into it is give the
Enneagram a break and don't boast about it.
Because if all you ever talk about is the Enneagram, which I
did for the better part of a year and all my friends were
over it, they were like, stop italready.
Because it really does take years of studying.
(51:20):
It's like we talked about, it's like an onion.
Like there's multiple layers of this onion and you could study
for years and years. That's why I don't call myself,
even though technically I think of what I've done in the places
I've gone. I don't ever call myself an
Enneagram coach or an Enneagram counselor.
I call myself an Enneagram enthusiast because that's what I
(51:43):
am. I love it, so I tell people
about it. But there's other layers I will
not get into. There's subtypes and triads and
like if you're a deep, deep, deep diver, you could go even
further with the enneagram for sure.
So good. Well, thank you so much for
giving us the overview today. Again, if anyone wants to deep
(52:03):
dive and you're listening to this before April 21st, 2025,
join the RV Queens community to be a part of our Deep Dive
workshop that's coming up. Taylor, thank you so much for
being on the show today, for educating us, for inspiring us,
for being an enthusiast with me.It was super fun.
(52:24):
I've enjoyed this conversation and I know our listeners are
going to get a lot. Out of it.
Thank you for having me on, Kate.
I loved it. You're welcome.
I feel like everything I say needs to be super enthusiastic
right now. All righty, Taylor, I will see
you on the road. Thank you so much for tuning in
to today's episode and for beingpart of with the RV Queens
(52:46):
community. Remember to hit subscribe on
whatever platform you're listening on.
And guess what? You can have conversations like
I had on this episode with your fellow RV women who are living
intentionally and making money on the road.
Head to rvqueenspodcast.com/community to
join RV Queens circles today. It's a totally unique online
(53:08):
space with a shared prosperity model that's all about community
over competition. I'd love to have you be a part.
Alright guys, I'll see you next week or hopefully I will see you
on the road. You're welcome.
I consider the Enneagram like the rumble strips on the
highway. Since most of us watching this
are probably travellers. You know what the rumble strip
is on the side of the road? It's for truckers and drivers.
If you're all of a sudden driving down the road and you're
just a little drowsy and you veer into the wrong lane, you're
gonna feel the blah, blah, blah,blah, and it's gonna wake you
up. That's how I, over the years,
(00:21):
have used the Enneagram successfully.
Like, I know where I go in stress.
I know what I do in health. Welcome back to the RV Queens
Podcast, where we dive into the world of women making money on
the road. I'm your host, Kate White, and
today's episode is an especiallyfun one because it's packed with
insight and enthusiastic energy.You'll get what I mean pretty
(00:43):
soon. Taylor Smith is my guest today.
She's a full time RV, mom of 3A,yoga instructor, and a long time
Enneagram enthusiast. If you've ever felt like your
personality is just too much or wondered why you keep bumping
into the same struggles in your business or relationships, this
conversation will help connect the dots.
(01:05):
Taylor breaks down the Enneagramin a super approachable way,
including how to figure out yournumber and how to use that
knowledge to make better decisions, communicate with your
loved ones more clearly, and even create content that aligns
with who you really are. She also shares why the
Enneagram isn't about putting yourself.
In a box but. Rather, understanding the lens
(01:27):
you use to view the world. And if you're a travel woman
like us, trying to build a meaningful life and business
outside the mold, you know how important self-awareness really
is. So pour yourself a cup of cold
brew and let's roll. Taylor Smith, Aloha and welcome
(01:48):
to the RV Queens podcast. Where in the world are you
today? Yeah, so Aloha, I just got to
Tennessee today. And how is it?
So far so good, but there is a hailstorm impending, so we'll
see how that goes. April in the Midwest ish slash S
Yeah, choppy weather going on, I'm sure.
(02:12):
Never know what it's going to belike.
It starts like this. We'll see how it ends.
Yeah, if we start hearing dumping in the background, we'll
be like, cut. I have a lot to cover with you
today. I'd like to start where I start
all my interviews. Back before you and your family
started living in an RV, What led up to those days when you
(02:37):
guys decided to ditch your more normalish American life to live
and travel in a camper? The reason why I greet Aloha a
lot is we are. I use the word from loosely from
Maui, Hawaii, not born and raised, but my husband was there
for 17 years and I was there for12.
We got married there. We we met married and had two
(03:00):
out of our three kids there in Hawaii.
It was one of those things wherewe're like, OK, we're ready to
like go to the mainland and experience everything that's
there. You can't really RV PS on Maui.
So it was like, OK, let's let's make a change.
So we moved to the mainland seven years ago now and we've
been on the road for a year. But it all started.
The RV stuff all started for us because we got a travel trailer
(03:23):
and we were weekend warriors. And more and more we would come
home from a trip and everyone meet him.
The three kids were like, you don't want to come home.
Like, can we just like go a little longer, you know, like,
we didn't want to come home. And of course it's vacation, so
nobody wants to come home. But one particular trip, we were
gone, booked for a week. And then on the way back, we
(03:46):
were like, do we have to go home?
Can we just extend? And the State Park we were at in
Florida was like, yeah, we have availability.
My husband already worked remotely.
I already homeschooled. So we were kind of like, we
should maybe try this. So the one week trip turned in
two weeks. And we basically looked at each
other and went, I think we couldprobably try this, not in the
(04:07):
travel trailer, like let's get something bigger, but I think we
should try this. I love it so much and I love
that you actually were familiar with RV ING before because it's
a mixed bag. Some people are familiar with
RV's and then they go full time and then there's people like
myself and other crazies that are like, I don't know, let's
(04:27):
buy one off of Craigslist and see what happens.
So good for you, you took a smarter approach.
I didn't tell anything before I bought this and I'm like, OK, we
had a little bit. We had like 2 years on the
weekends of like experience to figure it out.
Yeah. But you know what?
We survived and here we are 2 1/2 years later, so it all
worked out. There you go.
(04:48):
OK Taylor, you are a multi passionate person, as are many
women I meet on the road and many other members of the RV
Queen circles. I actually met you when you
taught yoga at TTO this winter. By the way, you are an excellent
yoga teacher. I take yoga classes all over the
(05:09):
country and I loved your class, so there's that.
You are also a graphic designer,you're a content creator and you
are an aficionado of the Enneagram, which is what we are
going to focus on today. For those who aren't familiar at
all, give us like an Enneagram elevator pitch.
(05:29):
What is it and why should peoplecare about it?
So the enneagram is a personality typing system.
People get all caught up with what does it mean and is it is
it weird? And the circle that we can show
maybe on a graphic somewhere, itlooks kind of like a pentagram.
It has nothing to do with anything like negative like
(05:49):
that. But it's a 9 sided circle is
what the gram and penta in the original language means 9 and
gram means chart. So it's a nine sided chart
basically. But the, the, the why behind the
Enneagram is really like, do youimagine a whole bunch of
different lenses? So like there's a zoom lens,
(06:09):
there's a like a monocle, there's eyeglasses, some people
have astigmatism, some people are near sighted, far sighted.
Everyone has different lenses that they look through the world
at. And the Enneagram gives you
really good insight into what your lenses like.
How do you see the world? And if you know other people's
(06:30):
Enneagram numbers as well, like we'll kind of get into that.
Like it helps you to understand some people might have a zoom
lens that they see the world through and they walk through
life every day with. And you might not, you might be
in like more of an overview person.
I've seen the aerial of the whole world.
So it's a way to notice how you see the world, but then also
(06:52):
when you find out friends and family and loved ones and
coworkers like what their enneagram is, you can relate to
people better. Really.
It's a great self modality. I guess it's the best way to
describe it. And I personally feel like if
everybody was self aware enough to understand their personality
types and then secondary if you know your loved ones, it would
change the way that we interact with people.
(07:14):
Like I'm not going to go so far as to say like we'd have real
peace or any of that. But if the more you're self
aware better the world's going to be right and you might not.
You might be in like more of an overview person.
I've seen the aerial of the whole world.
So it's a way to notice how you see the world.
(07:34):
But then also when you find out friends and family and loved
ones and Co workers like what their enneagram is, is you can
relate to people better. Really, it's a great self
self-awareness modality, I guessis the best way to describe it.
And I personally feel like if everybody was self aware enough
to understand their personality types, and then secondary, if
(07:55):
you know your loved ones, it would change the way that we
interact with people. Like, I'm not going to go so far
as to say like we'd have real peace or any of that, but if the
more you're self aware, the better the world's going to be,
right? It's a helpful tool, yeah.
And yeah, something I've noticedabout the people in the travel
community is they tend to be very intentional and they've
(08:18):
decided to live this counter cultural lifestyle for a reason.
And the women who are starting and running businesses want
their endeavors to align with their life and their values and
their personality. And this is a helpful tool to
help that alignment, right? So how can the Enneagram help
(08:40):
people live a more aligned, selfaware life?
So I feel like there's like 4 main like reasons, like if you
were in school and the professorwas right, not the outline like
the four main tenants would be, you know, communication.
How do you communicate conflict resolution, productivity And
(09:04):
then like if you're a content creator, which I know not every
entrepreneur is, but if you are a content creator, like how you
create that content. Those are like the main, if you
will, like areas, we'll touch onother things, but those feel
feel like those always come backto me.
There was somebody who did, maybe it was Yale, like 77, top
(09:26):
CE OS like the most successful people in the country at the
time when they did the study asked what is the number one
like precursor for success? And they said self-awareness.
If we all knew who we were, whatour limitations were, what our
strengths, what our weaknesses are like that would really help
you with success in anything. But in business, on the road,
it's very pertinent, you know? OK, quick tangent, because you
(09:48):
mentioned content creation and you said not everyone is a
content creator. OK, Yeah, I think you're right
that not everyone is a like, quote UN quote influencer
content creator. You work with brands, have the
partnership, all those things. But I do think, and I've said
this on the podcast many times, is the idea of having a personal
(10:13):
brand and creating content that's like, this is who I am.
This is what I want to say. I'm putting this out into the
world. Whether you're an employee and
you have your own personal brandon LinkedIn or Instagram or pick
your platform, whatever, TikTok,I think that skill is going to
become like more and more important as the decades roll
(10:35):
on. And as there's like so much
content to consume. What's going to make people care
about what you're saying is thisis exactly who I am, This is
what I want to say. This is why it matters to you.
And these tools, like the Enneagram, can only help you
like, hone in on that more. The more I talk about the
Enneagram with anybody, whether I'm like around the campfire or
(10:57):
talking to you or talking to somebody on the phone or
somebody that's at a location that I'm at, is like, it's
really helpful for everything. Like I know we're mostly talking
about like making money on the road and being an entrepreneur,
but the more you talk about it, the more you're like, oh, OK,
like this could help anybody, help anything, anyone.
If you're not on the road 5 years from now and you're in a
bricks and sticks, knowing this is still going to help you, you
(11:19):
know, like it's, it's so useful for so many places and so many
situations. All right, let's get into the
details here. So describe, if you can, the
Enneagram system. So if you imagine a Ferris wheel
and it's got all the little, youknow, cart, not carts, what are
they called? Seats that are like people are
sitting in all the seats, right?So the Ferris wheel is going
(11:40):
around and around and around, and there's nine different
cartwheel or carts, let's say. And at the very top of the
Ferris wheel is #9 it's actuallynot number one, and we'll get
into that in just a second. Why that is?
So you've got 9 and then 12345678.
So when you're at the nine position, let's say 9 is in the
best position that they're at the very top and they look down
(12:03):
into the others, they can see everyone else, right?
And one of the things I love about the indiogram is if you
were a nine, which some people are harder to type to find their
type and some are easier. Nines are actually some of the
hardest people to type. But if you are a nine and you
look down and you can see in everyone else's carts that it is
(12:25):
a good thing that you can resonate with everybody below
you. But it's also really hard
because it's the hardest number to try to figure out because you
relate to everybody and you get along with everybody and you
kind of think everybody, oh, I'ma nine, but I'm also a four and
I think I'm a 2 and maybe a 7. So that's why I always start off
because a lot of times I'll havepeople say, oh, I tried that and
(12:46):
I can't figure it out. I took a test, I read a book and
I'm not any number and I'm like was 9/1 of the numbers that you
might have thought you were and they're like, yeah, that is the
number that I thought I might bethe way that you could think of
the Enneagram. As far as that, you know, Ferris
wheel is everybody has their owncart, but if you happen to be
(13:07):
here and you see this number down here and you look into
theirs, you're like, oh, look, they're having a picnic.
Like that's so fun. You can see into them.
You still are a primary number here, but you can also resonate
with this number. And we'll talk about the minute
it's wings and we'll kind of getinto where our numbers that go
to stress are numbers that go instress negative and then
positive. But biggest thing to understand
(13:29):
is there's one number that you're mostly going to resonate
with the most. Even if you think you resonate
with everyone, there's one number that is probably going to
ring true to you the most. And I always highly encourage
people when they're taking the test.
If you're watching this podcast and you're like, what is she
talking about? Like I don't know what number I
am read about them a little bit.You can go online super easy.
(13:51):
Ask ChatGPT to give you like onesentence about each, about each
Enneagram number. And I always tell people read
about one through 9 immediately,you're probably going to
eliminate like 6 of the numbers.You're like, that's not me.
Nope, Nope, no way, no. And then you might have a
couple. You're like, maybe that's me, I
don't know. Then take an Enneagram test.
(14:13):
I don't really recommend paying for the ones that they charge as
a couple free ones. If anybody wants to contact me,
like I can give you the link after you take that test,
they're usually about 18 to 20 questions.
They're not really long. You'll probably have a better
idea of what number you are. And a lot of people get caught
up with this when you're taking an Enneagram test.
If you're stuck on an answer, you're like, I just don't
(14:35):
genuinely know how to answer this question.
Go back to who you were when youwere like 18 or 19.
If you got married when you werereally young, this might not
work. But if you were not married and
raising a family when you were like 18 or 19, that is usually
when you were the most you. You didn't have a lot of
responsibilities. You just made the decisions that
you wanted to make. So that's kind of my advice with
(14:56):
the personality test, Like if you take the test somewhere
online, just think about how would 18 year old me have
answered this question? And that usually helps people
get unstuck from figuring out their number.
OK, so is it worth talking through one through 9 like
giving us A1 sentence and and seeing if we could do?
That, yeah. Eliminate or resonate with one
(15:19):
as we go through. If you're not sure about the
Enneagram, if even you're interested in it, you're like, I
don't even know if I should be interested in it.
There is a really good Ted talk and it's by Simon Sinek.
I don't know if I pronounced that wrong.
Last name is SINEK Simon super famous.
It was from a long time ago. It's like 2009 and his video is
titled the why of how we think. I think is what it's called.
(15:41):
But if you type in start with Y start with Y is the name of the
podcast and he talks about how people don't buy whatever
product service thing you sell. People don't buy what you do.
They buy why you do it. And he talks about Apple and how
Apple, you know, does this. It's it's a great.
I'm not going to try to sum up his Ted Talk like it was
(16:03):
amazing. Go listen to that.
But the the gist behind it is the Enneagram explains the why,
how we think, how we act and howwe feel.
I was just talking to somebody the other day who actually is an
RV queen and her and I were chatting about the intergram and
she was a little hesitant about it and was like, I don't know if
that's something I should be interested in.
(16:23):
It seems like it's a little woo woo for me.
And I told her what I'll tell everyone here, the intergram.
Historically, you don't even really know where it came from.
Like there's different civilizations, like the Incas
will say, we found this etched in this cave that's this old.
And then the Greek people are like, no, we invented it.
(16:43):
And then like there's, there's Asian countries that'll be like,
no, we didn't. So my idea of why I feel like
it's important is that it's so true for for people like once
you start using the Enneagram and understanding how it works,
you'll Start learning about friends and family and you're
like, that's why they are the way they are.
(17:04):
Like that makes sense. It just makes sense.
If that if that makes any sense.The history goes way back, I
guess is the best way to describe it.
And Americans didn't actually know about the Enneagram as
recent as the rest of the world.It was in 1990 that this like
Franciscan monk Richard Rohr. It was in one of the books I
read. I know I've got to remember, but
in 1990 something, I don't know what it is exactly, he wrote a
(17:28):
book in English, which all the other Enneagram books were
written in different languages. And it was like the Enneagram
from a Christian perspective, I think is the title of the book.
And so that's when America started like hearing about it
because it was in English. But before that, it was like
other civilizations had used it in their civilizations.
I guess that's. I mean, I think everyone's
(17:48):
curiosity loop is definitely open at this point.
Like what are these numbers and what is this?
What is she even talking about? So yeah, please satisfy our
curiosity and at least give us like a one liner for each
number. So Enneagram one, we'll just
start with one. The Enneagram 1 is sometimes
called the perfectionist, sometimes called the reformer.
(18:10):
You get the gist. It's one of those ones you don't
have to really go that deep into.
But the Enneagram 1 is usually more of a perfectionist.
A couple sentences that people will read and they'll be like,
oh, I resonate with that. OK, so that's what I'll do.
Like a couple quotes. So you might be an Enneagram one
if this is not a Jeff Foxworthy comedy show, but you might be an
(18:31):
Enneagram one if are overly critical of others or yourself.
You tend to be a perfectionist. You don't like it when people
ignore or break the rules. That's like kind of a good
enneagram one in a nutshell. There's good benefits to that.
There's bad and we can talk about that later.
Like there's there's being a healthy 1 and being an unhealthy
(18:51):
1. The same with all the numbers #2
would be the helper is usually the word people usually use to
relate to number 2. And so those are the people that
are always volunteering for things.
Those are the people that are kind of, if you ask them on a
personal level that say, I just really don't know how to say no
to people. They're usually overextending
themselves. They're usually really good
(19:12):
listeners too. That's actually a benefit, a
huge benefit for twos. 3 is usually the achiever and these
are the people that you usually see that are like really good at
leading teams. Like maybe they're super high up
in like a multi level marketing.They're very, very driven.
They can also be a little vain and they might, may or may not
admit that to themselves, but the way that the world sees them
(19:35):
is very, very important to them.That would be 3 though all
different kinds of words are 4, but I prefer the word artist.
Doesn't mean you have to be an actual artist, but they're more
of like introspective and compassionate and like very
expressive and creative. So the sentences they might
think are I never feely really feel like I belong.
(19:56):
That's usually a four. I have really big feelings.
I have really big feelings that can overwhelm me.
That sometimes is a 4 #5 visionary.
A visionary is someone that is more analytical.
They're usually, honestly, they're usually the smartest
person in the room. And they usually know that
they're the smartest person in the room and they're very wise.
(20:19):
They usually are the smartest person in the room.
And the quote that they might say is I really love my
solitude. And I don't always say it out
loud, but in my head I think I'mpretty cynical.
That's like a big thing for a 5-6 is the analyst and the way
that I describe an analyst is someone who has not post
(20:40):
traumatic stress syndrome. Like everybody knows if you go
through something traumatic sixes will have pre traumatic
stress syndrome. So they can walk into a room and
already be stressed out because they see this could happen and
that could happen and this couldhappen and that could happen,
but nothing has actually happened yet.
Like they're really good at at risk assessment.
(21:01):
So like they're very, very good.They're usually very loyal too,
very likable, very loyal. But they see everything that's
going to potentially go wrong #7is the enthusiast.
And those are usually like the fun loving, very likable.
Kind of if when they were in high school, probably friends
with every different friend group, upbeat optimist.
(21:24):
And the quote that I have from them is I'm an optimist to a
fault. The glass is always half full
and I'd like to plan zero rest days. 8 is the challenger, 8 is
the people who are, they're verycompassionate, but they also
feel like what's the best word? They feel that arguments are
(21:49):
intimate, like people who argue with people and then feels like
an intimacy towards them insteadof like I'm arguing because I'm
mad at you. I I just argued with you and now
I feel so much closer to you. That might be an 8.
A quote for the 8 is I have beentold that I am too bold, too
blunt and or too aggressive. So that would be an 8 and I also
(22:11):
don't do things halfway. Eights, eights and ones are very
similar in that respect. They will go all the way.
Total best of their abilities. OK.
And then 9 is the last one. Nine are the peacemakers and
like I mentioned previously, they definitely can be the
hardest to type because they arepeaceful and generous and relate
(22:32):
to every single other number on the wheel.
And their quote would be, I justwant to move slow, sit in a
hammock and then go hiking. That's like in a traveler
perspective. I mean, we all want to do that
really. But they're also very, I know
quite a few nines and it's really hard for them to be self
starters. Like they're not as self
(22:53):
motivated to do things as others, but they are completely
happy to just go with the flow. They're like the easiest person
to just go with the flow. So that's kind of in a nutshell.
But I will say every number has like, this is me at my best and
then this is me at my worst. And both can be good or bad, if
(23:13):
that makes sense. Like there's a strength and
there's a weakness. Everybody has it.
If you're really healthy, you'regoing to look like this as an 8.
If you're really unhealthy, you're going to look like this
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(23:35):
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(23:57):
The one thing that I wanted to mention, well, two things that
are coming to mind from my Enneagram research is the fact
that like you talked about thesebeing lenses at the beginning.
And I think a lot of people thatare just getting into this might
be like, oh, I feel like a little bit of all of them, you
(24:19):
know, and that's normal. Like there is a little bit of
all of them in us, but it's likea helpful tool.
Again, finding the one that resonates the most with you.
And then whenever you get into the research, like you mentioned
about when you are in an unhealthy state or a healthy
state, you also lean into these other numbers.
(24:39):
To me, that was the part that I was able to recognize that I was
a 7 whenever I started breeding like deeper into that part of
the Enneagram. So there's, there's like these
other layers going on here. And yes, so and then the other
concept like another layer to all this is this word called a
(25:04):
wing that you mentioned before and it's you know where.
Go ahead and describe what a wing is real quick.
Yeah, yeah, with a wing again. Imagine we're back to the Ferris
wheel and let's say we're going to do 9.
We're going to pick on the poor little nines because they're at
the top and they're easy to understand.
So if you're a nine, you look atthe carts.
It's not a cart. What's the word for those things
(25:26):
like the the baskets? It works, yeah.
Cart seat. Cart basket seats.
Yeah, look at the people, look at the numbers that are next to
you. So if this is the nine, you're
either going to be looking at the eight or the one, the ones
that are next to you. Every single person has a
primary number, if you will, that you most resonate with.
(25:46):
And then the wings are the numbers that are on either side
of you. So a lot of people are confused
and they're like, I took the test like five years ago and I
think I'm like a 7, but I'm a wing 4/3.
And you're like, you can't actually do that.
Sevens are the rule Breakers. So I get that if they were, but
but yeah, no, it's your wing is the number, the number on the
(26:07):
left and the right of you. So when you look at a picture,
there you go. Now what I will say is they say
the word wings because you imagine a bird and if a bird has
wings, they have two wings. Now you can learn to use, you
know, one wing more than the other.
A lot of people will say, oh, I have balanced wings.
I really feel like I relate to let's just go to sevens.
(26:27):
I really relate to the 6th and to the 8th pretty equally.
That would be, you would be A7 with balanced wings.
But then you also talk to one ofmy best friends is A7 with A6
wing. And she does not relate to the 8
at all. She's never seen any of that in
her life. And she's, you know, well into
her 30s. And she's like, I think I'm
just, I'm just A7 wing. 6 is howpeople would word that.
(26:49):
Or if you see it typed out, it'slike 7 W 6 is how you would in
the Enneagram lingo. Yeah.
So that's how. The real nerds would write it.
Yeah. Yeah, exactly.
OK, if there's someone listeningthat is interested and they are
a deep dive type person like I am and they want a book
(27:11):
recommendation, you know, not Chat GPTI don't want to go take
a test. I want to I want to research and
deep dive and understand what's going on here.
What is your book recommendation?
I always tell people when they're reading books to be
really aware of who wrote the book, right?
Because if I wrote a book, and Idon't know if I already
mentioned, but FYI, everybody, me and Kate are the same number.
(27:33):
So we're both sevens. So if you are really, really
like all about this, you're like, oh, I'm 70 now hard.
We're both sevens. But pay attention to who wrote
the book. The books that I get a lot of
what I speak about because it's who I got into the Instagram
from is the author is Ian Cron and the book is the road back to
you. And he Co wrote it with another
(27:56):
author as well. And then I, I listened to his
podcast for a while. He kind of got like a little
like a little weird during COVID, to be honest with you.
So I didn't I don't follow his podcast as much anymore, but his
book was, I think written in like, I don't know, 20-17,
something like that. And I really, really liked his
book. Another book that I've only
(28:16):
perused have not read cover to cover, just to be honest, is
Richard Rohr the the Franciscan Monk.
And that was the enneagram, a Christian perspective, which I
thought was wildly interesting. And I can't think of the other
one. Oh no, the other one, if you're
married or even just, you know, significant other Becoming Us by
(28:37):
Beth McCord. And I actually have seen Beth
McCord. I've met her in person.
I went to her one for Enneagram workshops in Bradenton, FL a few
years ago. And then I also met Ian Kron.
I've actually seen Ian Kron speak twice in Nashville and
then in Florida. So those are both like big names
from before the boom. There was like an Enneagram boom
(28:58):
and then everybody's Instagram. Everybody had an Instagram about
that. But those were the authors that
I really that I really appreciated their information.
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, we're like five
years behind the curve right now, but it's fine.
Maybe 7. I like to be late to trends.
It's fun. OK, let's cuz we're 7 let's talk
(29:21):
about interpersonal relationships real quick here
because this is again a helpful tool to figure out why I act
this way and maybe why other people act this way.
Now, whenever the first time I read about a nine, I felt like I
understood my mom like completely for the first time in
(29:42):
my life. But is that recommended to kind
of like type other people in your mind or how do you
recommend we play this? Amazing question.
Great, great question. So you are not supposed to type
other people and I'll tell you why.
When you take a personality test, you figure this out too.
(30:04):
You're like, I'm answering yes to this question, but I'm
answering yes really because XYZ, right?
My example is let's pretend thatyou work in an office, which is
like making me sick to my stomach to think about.
But like, you know, water cooleroffice setting, right?
And somebody comes into your cubicle and they're like, hey,
it's Diane's birthday next week.Should we throw for a birthday
(30:26):
party? And they ask a bunch of people
this and like, you know, one girl's like, yeah, we should
throw her birthday party. And then someone else is like,
yeah, we should throw her birthday party.
So you throw a birthday party for her.
But then you find out later the real motivation as to why those
two fictitional people said yes,their motivation is completely
different. One of them, and I won't tell
you which numbers they are, but let's say one of them, actually
(30:48):
I will, one of them is a 7. And it's like my my type.
And they're like, yeah, I said yes, we should totally throw
Diana party because I love a good party.
Like it's great. I want everybody to just feel
fun. And at work it would be more
productive if we're having fun. So like I said, yes, but This is
why I said yes, this is my motivation.
Then somebody else is like, well, yeah, I said yes, but I
(31:10):
said yes because I kind of really want the parking spot
next to Diane and she's my boss.So I'm thinking that, you know
what I mean? Like their motivation wildly
different. So that's why you're not really
supposed to type other people because you don't know their
motivation. In that same breath, I will say
that I 100% typed my mother and I 100% typed my husband.
(31:36):
But then I also had them go takethe test and like figure out to
confirm that that's what it was.Just a cautionary tale.
I mistyped myself wrong for like7 months.
When I first learned about the Enneagram, I read all the books.
I thought I knew it all. I thought I was a two.
It's the helper. It's the person who's always
doing things for other people. But I was a mom of littles.
(31:59):
I'm always helping everybody, right?
I didn't follow the rules because I'm a rule breaker.
The rules say you should read about every single one of the
nine types, eliminate who you know you're not, and then take
the test. And I was just like 1-2.
Oh, yeah, that's me. So that's kind of why.
And the season of life is different.
(32:19):
If I had thought about how I would have answered when I was
18 or 19, I probably wouldn't have mistyped myself as A7 or as
a 2 when it turns out I was a 7.And my mom's A2, She has a
strong personality. I'm raised by a single mom.
So in my mind I was like, oh, I totally resonate with that.
But a lot of that was my childhood.
It wasn't actually me. Yeah, and I think the phase of
(32:39):
life is a big thing to consider as well because I remember when
I was studying this more in depth, I was working a full time
job. I was very motivated to kind of
like get to the top of my career.
I on the side was working on a startup and doing fundraising.
And I was like high energy, verymotivated corporate like
(33:05):
conversations with investors, you know, like in one of these
phases of my life. And I thought I was a three for
a long time. And the deeper I got into it and
the more I read it, I'm like, no, I'm A7, I know it.
The enthusiast in me was my superpower of like all of the, I
(33:26):
thought I was, you know, super motivated and career focused,
but I was actually just extremely enthusiastic about
what I wanted to do. And that's how I was selling
everyone around me to help me dothese things.
So it's fascinating. I think everyone should kind of
like consider that. There's 3 levels that everyone's
in, everybody in the world, whether it's an anagram or not,
(33:48):
there's usually 3 levels of likeyou're either healthy, meaning
like it's kind of hard to even ascertain the negative aspects
of your personality because you're just healthy.
Like you're, you're just like you're at peace with yourself.
You know yourself, you're just healthy.
The example I give is we knew somebody for years and years.
She was an 8, which is more of the like kind of kind of
(34:10):
personality like can like lawyers, attorneys, oftentimes
you'll find are 8. And we knew this person for
years. And my sweet husband one time
found out that she was an 8 and he was like what?
She's an 8, but she's so nice. That was like, she's healthy,
like she's a healthy 8, You know, so there's the healthy
level that people should be at, you know, hopefully.
(34:32):
Then there's like average, whichhonestly is like autopilot.
It's kind of what most of the population is in.
And you're kind of living in your own strengths.
You're just kind of getting by. Like you're getting by, but
you're just kind of getting by. And then there's the unhealthy,
which, you know, you're living in kind of a realm of way beyond
(34:52):
survival. And you might need help to get
out of that level. Like that's more of like, let's
get some counseling. Let's really do some hard work
to get out of it. So when you are a healthy or an
average or you're vacillating between the two, your number
won't be dreadfully obvious to alot of people, you know, unless
they really know you intimately.Like you would still probably
know your mom, your spouse. I will mention kids because
(35:15):
people always ask me that at every Enneagram speaking event
I've ever had. Can I type my kids?
I think my kids A7. I'm like, well, pretty much
every kid is A7 when they're kids.
And the Long story, short answerof that from every author I've
read and speaker I've spoke to is you really can't type kids
until they've lived more life. And I always tell parents, if
(35:38):
their parents asking me, you haven't screwed them up enough
to like figure out like, how arethey going to handle what lens
are they going to use to handle this?
You know, if you have a shy kid,you might think, oh, well, this
is their number. Or if you have an outgoing kid,
oh, this is their number. But it's more of like, let's
have them live a little more life and see how their natural
bent is to dealing with trauma in in life before you figure out
(36:01):
what number they are. I hear the rain starting so I
know I need to like get to my most important questions here
because I'm worried it's going to start hailing on you any
minute. OK, this is the question I've
been leading up to this interview for.
Give an example of how knowing your type has helped you in your
(36:23):
business endeavors. Sevens are more motivated, like
I'm more motivated. You can tell me if you are or
not to by like freedom and adventure.
Those are like my tagline words if you will.
Like I show up with high energy.I'm multi passionate, which is
kind of what you were talking about earlier, like you were
doing this and I'm full of ideas.
(36:45):
So like I would lend myself natural to like I was a
concierge for years. I would just talk to people
about all the fun stuff they cando.
And we love to Maui, so it's easy to be excited about that.
More spontaneous gigs, like somebody just says, hey, do you
want to design my logo? I haven't done a lot of full
time graphic design for a while,but sure, I'll do that like just
spontaneous side gigs. But what I've noticed is I need
(37:09):
to knowing my Enneagram, I need to know that I need to watch out
for overcommitting because I am an overcommitter to the Max.
I also have to be really carefulthat I don't just get bored with
a project that has just kind of like drug out a little too long.
Like I don't want to abandon things because I don't have the
(37:30):
staying power, which is great when I'm married to A1 because
I'm great about getting the excitement going, starting it,
launching it, gathering people around to like, help me do it.
I'm so excited. And then I start it and then
it's kind of the boring phase. And I'm like, I guess I can keep
doing this. And he'll be like, hey, guess
(37:52):
what? And then he'll kind of like
carry me to the finish line, youknow, and just knowing what I'm,
what my strengths are. Like my strengths I'm very aware
of, but like, sometimes you're not as aware of your, your
weaknesses. And definitely the staying
power, the staying power is the,is the weakness for me.
But I know that so I can lean into what's going on and then
(38:13):
ask other people or ask other RVQueens.
That's why it's been so incredible to be part of RV
Queens because you're always in circles with different people
all the time. Every month it changes.
So if I've already ascertained that person's really good at
this and this is kind of my weakness, hey, how do you do
that exactly? Like, yeah.
We can talk on that topic for a long time and if anyone is
(38:35):
interested in going deep and you're listening to this
podcast, like Taylor mentioned, we are having like more of a
dive deep workshop for RV QueensCircles members.
You can join at any time, Army queenspodcast.com/community.
That workshop is April 21st, 2025.
So if you would like to be a part, you are welcome.
(38:57):
And you can use Taylor's discount code and she will
receive a perk which is Aloha and you will get 25% off your
membership for life. So OK Taylor, this has been so
helpful and aspiring. Go ahead and share with everyone
where they can connect with you online.
And if the weather holds up, I will ask you my last question.
(39:21):
Yes. So you can find me on Instagram.
That's my primary channel and it's refreshed Wellness on the
road and we share all kinds of tips and tricks for family life
on the road. As I mentioned, we travel with
our three kids, so 10-7 and four.
It's crazy chaos and I personally love it.
(39:44):
It totally lends into my my 7 personality.
And we talk about homeschool hacks, Bible study tips.
I talk about the crazy on my crazy obsession with cold brew
and just kind of like everythingin between.
So yeah, follow me there. That's where you'll find me.
I love it and we will put a linkin the show notes.
I will also link Taylors book recommendations and her, you
(40:09):
know, special Aloha code. If you want to join podcast the
RV Queen circles through her code.
All the things will be LinkedIn the show notes.
All right, Taylor, here is my final question for this season
of the interview. I have been doing a one in one
question where I ask a question and we both answer it and today
(40:31):
of course this has to be my question because we're both
sevens. What do you like about being an
Enneagram 7? I can always find a silver
lining. Do you do you feel like that?
Do you feel like you can always find the the half full option A?
100% to the point that I'm like,am I sometime I have to be like,
am I being realistic right now? You know what I mean?
(40:54):
Like I'm always like, it's fine,it's fine.
Like look, it's going to work out.
It's going to blah, blah, blah. And my husband is also a 7, so
we have to have like, most of the time we're like, yeah, yeah,
yeah, it's fine, It's fine. Obviously, we are both human and
not everything is rainbow and sunshine all the time.
(41:14):
But for the most part, we just want to, like, have fun.
And we think everything's going to work out.
And guess what? It has.
So do you feel like you have balanced wings or do you learn
more towards the eight or the six?
Don't think I have a shred of eight in me.
I'm like do not like confrontation or yeah, it hurts
(41:38):
me. My husband is probably stronger
more towards the 8 and I'm more towards 6:00-ish.
That's awesome. But yeah, I think for me, what I
like about being a 7 is and why I really resonate with A7 is
like I mentioned before, the enthusiasm and reading about it
(41:59):
as this personality type, it wasthe first time I saw it as a
strength. Because my whole life, yes, I've
been like just the happy girl and Oh my gosh, she's always
happy. Like, do you ever have a bad
day? And I'm like, am IA weirdo?
Like, why am I? I'm just so excited about
(42:20):
everything, you know? When the like phrase toxic
positivity came out, I was like,no, I will not believe in that.
That doesn't exist. What's wrong with being
positive? Like, huh, if you you know the
phrase what you focus on, you create more of.
Like I'm just such a believer inthat if you look for the good,
you will find the good. And then it keeps perpetuating.
(42:41):
So I have a question. So the the first little storm
came through and there's no hail, there's no rain right now.
Actually we'll see if it even and starts to rain.
But I have a question. We didn't talk about numbers
that you go to in stress and numbers that you go to in
health. So do we have another couple
minutes? Sure.
Let's do it. So this is really interesting to
me because even though you have one primary number and then you
(43:03):
also have your wings, OK, so let's count together.
I'm like teaching my preschooler.
So if you have one main number, but then you have a wing and
maybe another wing, maybe you'rebalanced, you also are resonated
with three, right? But then you also have a number
you go to in stress and then a number you go to in health.
So you're actually knowledgeableabout 5 when it all comes down
(43:25):
to it. So I'm just going to pick on us
because it's easy and it's us. So stress number first.
So again, imagine you're look against Ferris wheel and seven.
This is going to be backwards, Iguess with the camera.
But like if this is a nine, thenthis would be like 123456789.
OK, so we're 7. So we're like we're like up
(43:45):
here. So A7 goes to A1 when they're in
stress. What I mean by that is your
personality will start to look like the the negative side of 1,
not the positive side. Like my husband's got all kinds
of positives being a one. He's diligent, he does really
good work. He doesn't half ass anything
like all of these good attributes.
(44:07):
No, it's like the negative aspects of A1A1 is very
checklist oriented and very black and white.
There's no Gray area. And I don't know about you, but
I live in a world of Gray like, oh, we can do this or maybe this
can happen. Like that's never choose A or B.
I'm like, well, can I choose AB and C?
Like, But when I'm stressed, I go to the one and the one I get
(44:31):
very black and white and I get very snippety and very like
overwhelmed with all the details.
But when I'm feeling healthy in my 7, I'm like, it's fine,
whatever. It's going to all work out just
like you said. Yeah.
So so your stress number is a number that your personality
moves towards when you're overtaxed, under fire,
overwhelmed. And if you find online, you can
(44:54):
find a stress health number and it'll show you the arrows of
like where everything goes. But again, if I'm the Ferris
wheel, here's the seven, the onewould be the number we go to in
stress, Right. OK, So then the opposite is your
security number or your healthy number.
And that's where your personality will move towards
when like your energy isn't being sapped, you feel pretty
(45:15):
secure. Like my friend who was an 8 but
wasn't acting like a bossy 8. So that for us, if we're the
seven, it's the number that's down here, it's a 5.
And so we will start not lookinglike acting like, I guess kind
of looking like the healthy sideof five.
(45:37):
And so when you, if you come into the workshop for the RV
queen circles, I'll dig into more of like the positive and
the negative side of each number.
But just to give us an example, like at their best, fives are
very analytical, they're very wise and they're very
perceptive, like very perceptiveto things like you pick up on if
(45:57):
anybody ever tells you like, wow, you picked up on that.
Nobody else noticed that you might be a 5 or you might be a
really healthy 7 that's feeling insecure and like kind of
getting into that like wisdom ofI picked up on something that
nobody else picked up on. So that's kind of everyone has a
stress number, everyone has a health number or a security
number. It depends on what author you
(46:18):
read. So that's really interesting.
So then you're like, well, I'm A7, but then I'm, I resonate
because I'm also a little bit ofan 8, a little bit of a six and
I go to 1 when I'm stressed and I go to five when I'm healthy.
So you end up knowing a lot of different numbers.
A lot of people, specifically the nines, I'm looking at you
guys, they don't want to be typed, they don't want to be put
(46:41):
in a box, they don't want to feel like that.
But then you can tell those people, well, it's not just the
9 like you do, you're a multi faceted person.
So you do have, you know, other things to to contemplate I
guess. Does that make sense?
Yeah, that's right. And again, yeah, it's, it's the
lens idea like keeps coming to mind that you mentioned at the
(47:02):
very beginning. It's like I start seeing the
world through when I'm stressed out.
I'm like, like you said, my black and white filter is on and
my enthusiasm has been drained and now we are just going to get
this done right now. Yeah, that's the stress Mom 7.
But the healthy Mom 7 is like, you know what?
(47:23):
There is a deeper side to me. Like, let's talk about you know
what I mean? I'm not just all rainbows and
unicorns all the time. There's also the deeper
analytical. Yes.
I can do that work. Well, I don't know about you,
but a lot of people think that people are positive all the
time. Also can't get deep and like get
in the trenches. And if you have a friend who's
(47:43):
going through trauma or loss or grief, a lot of times people
will pitch the positive Unicorn.People are like, oh, well, they
can't handle that. If I'm healthy and I'm like
secure and where the season of life I'm in, I'm like, I can be
crying with my friend who just lost her mother.
I can be like in the trenches with her.
But if I'm unhealthy and I, I know that about myself and I'm
like, I can't talk about anything negative anymore.
(48:06):
You guys would talk to me about the ticket you got and that your
rent's going up like I can't do anymore.
I know that about myself, which I can't believe I didn't mention
this earlier. I hope to anybody who's made it
this far on the podcast, if you only hear one thing, this is so
important to me and I get this from an author.
I didn't make it up. I consider the Enneagram like
(48:29):
the rumble strips on the highway.
And since most of us watching this are probably travelers,
maybe you're passenger princesses.
So you're not driving. But you know what the rumble
strip is on the side of the road.
It's for truckers and drivers. If you're all of a sudden
driving down the road and you'rejust a little drowsy and you
veer into the wrong lane, you'regoing to feel the blah, blah,
blah, blah, blah, and it's goingto wake you up.
(48:50):
You're not going to just like, oh, let me just ride in these
rumble strips for a while. Like you're going to like make a
reaction and you're going to getback to where you need to be.
That's how I, over the years, have used the Enneagram
successfully. Like I know where I go in
stress. I know what I do in health.
I'm 43, so obviously I just knowmyself.
But knowing the specifics of like, oh, I'm looking like a
(49:11):
real unhealthy one right now. Rumble strips, Let's start over
again. I need to get back in my lane
because I was over here. Yeah, the rumble strip an
allergy. Totally.
And I can't remember which book it is or I would give the author
quote, but that really resonatedwith me.
Like, that's a great way to use the Enneagram with those rumble
(49:33):
strips. Yeah, I love it.
Can I tell you about the Fight Club rules About Enneagram?
OK. The Fight Club rule is first
rule about the Enneagram is not.Don't talk about the Enneagram.
The first rule of the Enneagram is don't use it as a shield or
as a sword. And I've been guilty of this.
(49:55):
And my wonderful, loving husbandof 18 years will tell you this.
It is so important to not use itas a shield of like, well, I'm
just going to hide behind this because I'm a seven.
Sorry I was late. I'm just a 70.
Like, don't use it as a shield. It's not going to help you.
It's not going to help people around you.
Don't use it as a sword. You're always just making such a
(50:17):
big deal out of this thing because you're a one stab stab,
like you're just blah, blah, blah because you're a three and
like don't do that either. It's not going to help you.
It's not going to help the people.
What we talked about earlier about typing people is when I do
speaking engagements, I say like, don't commit a suicide.
Don't assume just because you know somebody's number and maybe
they did tell you like, hey, I listen to that podcast.
(50:39):
I did my thing and this is my number.
And you're like, oh, OK, you still don't know all their
motivations. You know, a big thing for me
that I've learned is don't use knowledge of the Enneagram to
manipulate people because it's real easy to like always ask
that #2 that, you know, for a ride when your car breaks down,
because that too is always goingto give you a ride.
(51:00):
You know, like, and then the last one that I say that really
helps people when they're getting into it is give the
Enneagram a break and don't boast about it.
Because if all you ever talk about is the Enneagram, which I
did for the better part of a year and all my friends were
over it, they were like, stop italready.
Because it really does take years of studying.
(51:20):
It's like we talked about, it's like an onion.
Like there's multiple layers of this onion and you could study
for years and years. That's why I don't call myself,
even though technically I think of what I've done in the places
I've gone. I don't ever call myself an
Enneagram coach or an Enneagram counselor.
I call myself an Enneagram enthusiast because that's what I
(51:43):
am. I love it, so I tell people
about it. But there's other layers I will
not get into. There's subtypes and triads and
like if you're a deep, deep, deep diver, you could go even
further with the enneagram for sure.
So good. Well, thank you so much for
giving us the overview today. Again, if anyone wants to deep
(52:03):
dive and you're listening to this before April 21st, 2025,
join the RV Queens community to be a part of our Deep Dive
workshop that's coming up. Taylor, thank you so much for
being on the show today, for educating us, for inspiring us,
for being an enthusiast with me.It was super fun.
(52:24):
I've enjoyed this conversation and I know our listeners are
going to get a lot. Out of it.
Thank you for having me on, Kate.
I loved it. You're welcome.
I feel like everything I say needs to be super enthusiastic
right now. All righty, Taylor, I will see
you on the road. Thank you so much for tuning in
to today's episode and for beingpart of with the RV Queens
(52:46):
community. Remember to hit subscribe on
whatever platform you're listening on.
And guess what? You can have conversations like
I had on this episode with your fellow RV women who are living
intentionally and making money on the road.
Head to rvqueenspodcast.com/community to
join RV Queens circles today. It's a totally unique online
(53:08):
space with a shared prosperity model that's all about community
over competition. I'd love to have you be a part.
Alright guys, I'll see you next week or hopefully I will see you
on the road. You're welcome.
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