March 14, 2025 • 35 mins
In this episode, we welcome Erica Lockheimer. Known for her remarkable career in tech, Erica shares insights from her career journey at LinkedIn, where she not only played a crucial role in the growth of the platform, but also founded the Women in Tech initiative. Erica shares her story and challenges she faced as one of the few women in her field.
We discuss the pivotal moments that led her to redefine success on her own terms, breaking away from expectations to pursue what she had a passion for. Now, as the founder and CEO of HumanizeHer, Erica is passionate about cultivating a world where women can thrive and shatter glass ceilings. Tune in to discover Erica's journey, her thoughts on the evolving role of LinkedIn, and her vision for women in tech and careers beyond. This episode is inspiring and a must-listen for anyone looking to follow their own path and possibilities.
Episode Highlights:
- Redefining Success: Erica talks about how challenging societal norms and expectations was a pivotal step in her personal journey. She emphasizes identifying and pursuing what truly resonates with you, even if it means straying from the path expected by others.
- LinkedIn's Evolution: From leading LinkedIn's growth team to spearheading Women in Tech, Erica shares behind-the-scenes stories of her dynamic experiences and the platform's transformation over the years.
- AI and Diversity: Erica discusses the critical role of diverse representation in algorithm development, especially in AI, and how biases can be mitigated.
- Empowering Women: Learn more about HumanizeHer, Erica's inspiring initiative aimed at creating a world where every woman can thrive, excel, and define success personally.
Key Quotes:
- “You better have diverse people at the table, building products, because representation matters in everything we create.”
- “We can’t be our best-kept secrets—women’s voices need platforms to be heard and celebrated.”
- “I never worked harder, but I’ve never enjoyed my work more than I do now.”
Connect with Erica and HumanizeHer:
- Website: https://www.instagram.com/humanizehernow/
- LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ericalockheimer/
- Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/humanizehernow/
- YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@HumanizeHer
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Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
One of our taglines is redefine success on her own
terms.
The world has conditioned us tobe a certain way and act a
certain way and do that nextthing.
So to break away from that moldof expectation is the first
thing that I had to go through.
Everybody expects me to do this, but I'm going to do this
because I have to do this.
(00:20):
When else am I going to do it?
If you have that struggle,that's number one, identifying
it, and then you have to gothrough the process.
Well, what is that other thing?
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Welcome back to the show.
Hope you're all having a greatweek so far.
I am so excited to be talkingin this episode about one of my
favorite social platforms and,honestly, the one I use the most
, which is LinkedIn.
If you're not familiar withLinkedIn, it's known as a
business networking platform andit's really evolved over the
(01:01):
years, and I remember joining itback in probably 2006, 2007.
And the platform has reallyjust done such amazing things
for people in terms of findingjobs, finding connections,
networking, building theirbusiness all of these really
cool things.
So, on today's episode of theshow, I have Erica Lockheimer on
(01:25):
.
Erica is the founder and CEO ofHumanizeHer, which we talk
about, but she also spent 13years at LinkedIn.
She was a VP of engineering andshe was the founder of Women in
Tech at LinkedIn, and shereally has had this amazing and
prominent career over the courseof the last 30 years in tech.
(01:47):
And what I loved about myconversation with Erica is we
talk about the early days ofLinkedIn, which I, as I just
mentioned, love the platform, soloved learning a little bit
more about LinkedIn and how itstarted and how it's grown.
And then we talk about whatit's like to be a woman in tech
as an engineer, and what thatjourney was like for Erica, and
(02:13):
then to today, where she's thefounder and CEO of Humanize Her,
and she has been building thisamazing platform that is aimed
at cultivating a world whereevery woman can thrive and
shatter the glass ceilings andreally redefine what success
means to her on her own terms.
So I really loved thisconversation with Erica.
(02:35):
There's a lot of reallyinteresting insights in here.
So with that, I'm going to letyou hear my conversation with
Erica Lockheimer.
Here we go going to let youhear my conversation with Erica
Lockheimer.
Here we go.
Erica, welcome to the show.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
Thank you for having me.
I appreciate it.
I'm so excited, so excited yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
I am too.
Well, first of all, you workedon a platform, one of the social
platforms, and I consider it asocial platform, right, linkedin
, absolutely.
It's the platform I am the mostactive on and always have been
it's.
It's a platform I understand, Iguess, the best, just because I
think everyone has the platformthat you know that they kind of
(03:14):
naturally gravitate towards,and for me it's always been
LinkedIn.
When did you start at LinkedIn?
Let's start with that, and howlong were you there?
Speaker 1 (03:23):
It's a great question and I'm glad it's the platform
of choice for you and I think Iunderstand it the most as well,
probably because I helped buildit.
I was there for 13 and a halfyears.
Wait, was that the beginning?
Yeah, so it was 2010 when Istarted and I was there when we
had less than 150 millionmembers on the platform.
(03:45):
Linkedin has now than 150million members on the platform.
Linkedin has now over a billionmembers on the platform.
It's insane.
And when I joined, I was askedto lead the growth team and, to
be honest, I was more from thecamp before that.
I'm an engineer by trade, so Iwas working behind the server,
(04:11):
you know, in the server room,behind the server wall.
I just like making sure systemswould work on the back end.
I'd never like thought aboutdoing social platform at all,
and you're right, it is a socialplatform.
It's where it was like the timeof if you could be there and
you know you had Facebook, youhad all these things that were
coming up and they're like hey,you know, can you lead the
growth team?
I honestly stepped into a rolethat I didn't really know how to
do, but I remember hittingevery single milestone.
We'd hit 150 million members,200 million members, 300.
(04:33):
We would just go go crazy.
It was all about growth.
So I was in charge of theregistration flow, the emails
that you would get, pushnotifications, all the growth
strategies.
I was responsible for that.
And then we got smarter aboutquality growth as well, so it
sounds a lot like.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
So I I spent the first part of my career at
American Express doing creditcard marketing all all the
different kinds of credit cardmarketing stuff that there was
to do there and one of themarketing teams was acquisition
and one of the marketing teamswas acquisition and engagement.
Like a new member engagementand it sounds like a lot of the
(05:09):
things you're talking about withthe registration, the email,
the push notifications.
Those are all things you doearly in, as soon as someone
almost becomes a member, so thatthey have a path to
understanding the value of whatthis platform and for me it was
the credit card, but in yourcase it was the platform was
(05:31):
going to do for them.
What would you say is the waythat you think about LinkedIn
and how maybe professionals andother people should think about
LinkedIn?
Speaker 1 (05:44):
Yeah, it's a great question.
And just to respond to yourexperience as well, you're right
, like retention, acquisition,all of that was critical and
once you get someone on theplatform, the worst thing that
you can actually do is you getthem on the platform and they
have no one they're connected to, right.
So that's why importing youraddress book, all those types of
things, and connecting to thepeople that you know so that
you're there and then you have agreat experience.
(06:07):
And so when you think aboutLinkedIn, it definitely has
evolved over time and I've hadmany jobs at LinkedIn so I've
also led their learning business.
When we acquired Linda, I alsoled their LinkedIn talent
business, which is recruiter onthe platform and jobs on the
platform.
So if you think about theevolution of LinkedIn, it was,
at first, just your professionalidentity online.
(06:28):
You know that is number onething that I think honestly,
everybody should do so, even asa student, and I think that's
what's challenging is when Ispeak to students.
I speak to them a lot andthey're like, well, I don't have
a job, I don't have jobexperience, but you know you got
to start somewhere and you alsohave projects you worked on and
such, so you need to showcaseyourself.
It's your professional identity.
(06:50):
And if you think about it, ifyou do a Google search, someone
searches for your name.
They're like who's this personthat I got an email from?
The first thing you're going todo is you're going to search
for that person and you'll.
Seo is a great solution forLinkedIn.
So, number one be there, andthen number two, depending on
what your needs are.
Like some people are they wantto look for a job.
Well, guess what?
(07:10):
They have so many jobs onLinkedIn across multiple
industries.
That is going to be your firstplace to.
Number one look for one.
Number two apply.
They make the process veryseamless.
And then also there's arecruiter platform.
That recruiter platform doessearch and algorithms to do
(07:31):
matching of skills to findsomeone, a match really for that
job that they have posted andthat person that's online.
So if you're not there, guesswhat?
You're never going to have anopportunity.
So, depending, if you'relooking for a job, definitely be
there.
If you're in the recruitingspace, definitely be there.
And then also the other part islearning.
There's LinkedIn learning.
On there you can learn aboutdifferent topics on the
professional, you know, and thetech side.
I mean the vast majority thatthey have is content is pretty
(07:55):
high.
And then the other part isnetworking.
I will tell you, I was atLinkedIn for 13 and a half years
.
I wasn't looking for a job, soI wasn't using OutPrize, but
I've never used LinkedIn morethan now in my life when I'm not
there.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
Interesting.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
Yeah, I'm able to reach out to people because I
have a podcast as well, so Ineed to recruit I'm in sales,
guess what?
I want different people that Idon't know outside my network.
I got to reach out to them.
It's the platform of choice toactually reach someone.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
I'll just tell you about my perspective on LinkedIn
versus the other socialplatforms.
And as a company our company,she Speaks.
We work on the other socialplatforms, much more so than,
let's say, we work on LinkedInbecause we're working with
social media influencers.
But I think, from theperspective of reliability, I
(08:47):
feel like the other platformsthere are a lot more bogus
accounts, so to speak, in thesense that someone's
representing themselves and youdon't really know if that's
actually who they are.
I feel like on LinkedIn thereis a lot more checks and
balances for that, in some ways,I find it more reliable when
(09:08):
I'm looking up somebody onLinkedIn versus the other
platforms.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
You're absolutely right.
When I was working there, therewere some countries that would
actually use the identity onLinkedIn as a proven thing
because it's like a number onetrusted site.
So you're absolutely right.
Your opinion is massive acrossthe world.
I liked your perspective thatyou brought up the differences
between like Instagram dependingon who the person is.
I'm like they are amazing onInstagram, not on LinkedIn.
(09:35):
And then you see that opposite,it's so like oh, I'm going to
post this and it's not going togo well for this person here on
LinkedIn, but it's on Instagram,so I'm learning that as well.
Everybody has their platform ofchoice, especially on the
creative side.
I see a lot of that, like yousaid, on influencers on
Instagram and TikTok.
Speaker 2 (09:53):
I definitely see more influencers just in the space
that we're in.
We work with, you know, socialmedia influencers who are
probably big.
Their following is mostly on,let's say, a TikTok and an
Instagram, because what we'reworking on is B2C, so business
to consumer products.
So think your Coca-Colas of theworld and your Mars Wrigley's.
(10:16):
Those are the types of productswe're working on, so usually
we're trying to reach people whoare everyday consumers.
But what's really interestingthat we're finding is a lot of
those influencers are realizingthat they have huge opportunity
if they can build theirreputation and some thought
(10:37):
leadership, even on LinkedIn,for finding clients Yep, yep.
Finding partnerships, becausethat's how influencers make.
A big chunk of their money isthrough partnerships and
sponsorship dollars.
So I'm definitely seeing a lotof those social media
influencers migrating, probablyin the last year and a half, two
(10:59):
years, to LinkedIn.
Speaker 1 (11:01):
Like Reese Witherspoon, she just joined
LinkedIn.
Snoop Dogg's there, I mean.
It's been kind of a crazy funride to see.
Like Reese Witherspoon, shejust joined LinkedIn.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Snoop Dogg's there, I mean it's been kind of a crazy
fun ride to see.
So, yeah, well that's, I mean,what an amazing opportunity to
be there to see that.
It like sort of hockey stickgrowth that the platform had.
Let's talk a little bit aboutyour engineering background,
because I love coming acrosswomen that have this type of
background.
One of my daughters is verymuch this is like the way she
(11:30):
thinks and it's reallyinteresting to me to see how
successful women who have thatbackground can be in
non-technical environments, canbe in non-technical environments
Like go on to become chiefmarketing officers, go on to
(11:50):
become successful entrepreneursand like not just in the
technology realm.
Let's talk a little bit aboutengineering for women.
How is the field evolving forwomen?
I know there's been a lot moreconversation to try to make STEM
more inviting for young womenso that that becomes a field
that they want to go into.
What was your draw toengineering and how do you think
(12:14):
it sets you up for success?
Speaker 1 (12:16):
Yeah, so fabulous question.
And when I got involved inengineering, I was really good
at math and it was a mathteacher in high school that said
, hey, why don't you try thisprogramming class called Pascal?
If anybody still knows whatthat is?
Okay, good, you do.
So.
I remember being in thatclassroom and it was just an
(12:37):
amazing experience to have thiscomputer.
You could do inputs and outputs.
I mean I it was a revolutionarygame tic-tac-toe that I
programmed.
But I created it and it's justthat feeling of innovation and
creation.
I was hooked.
I was honestly, honestly hookedand I was like, okay, maybe
this is something I wanted to do.
(12:58):
But then you quickly lookaround the classroom and then
you realize you're the only one,right.
And then I also wasn't your.
I was like a cheerleader.
I was like just everything didnot compute of.
You know the stereotype of whatan engineer should look like,
or you know they would call usnerds at the time, right?
So I still am.
I love being called a nerd.
(13:19):
I am a total big geek and Ilove it, but yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
Word is a badge of honor.
Speaker 1 (13:24):
I know it is, and so I actually stepped out of it and
I didn't know what to do.
So I basically went to juniorcollege.
I was the first person in myfamily to graduate from college,
but I walked the halls of SanJose State after two years in
junior college and I saw thisplaque of women and society
engineers and that's honestlyhow I chose my major.
(13:45):
It was another sense ofbelonging, of like.
Oh, maybe I could be like her,and I always wanted to go to
those grassroots of an engineer.
My dad was always wanting to bean engineer as well, and then I
majored in computer engineering.
But again I got there and theroom, the classrooms were again
not like people like me.
(14:06):
So it took me seven years tograduate.
I did.
I was working 30 hours a weekand I had my one friend
girlfriend that was there.
We're still friends todaybecause of slim pickings right,
we're the only two in theclassroom.
But I completed my studies andI was so proud.
But I just realized every stagethen I get to the workforce and
it's again the same thing.
(14:26):
It was just.
A lot of this stuff that I'mfocused on now is really born
out of frustration and just notfeeling that sense of like oh, I
fit in, even though I want todo this.
So that's why I started Womenin Tech at LinkedIn in the early
days, because when I joinedthere, we were less than it was
like maybe two or three of uswomen in the field, and so it's
(14:49):
always just been kind of in myblood and my DNA.
It should be a better feelingand we need more women in this
field.
The global population guess what?
Half of it are women.
So if you're going to build andcreate, you better have them at
the table, you better have themin the algorithms and then with
AI, if those biases are in thesystems, it's going to take
(15:10):
forever to like re-undo all ofthat work.
So I think it's so, so criticalto have diverse people at the
table building products.
And I've seen this and it's notjust saying it, right, I've
seen it.
I give you an explicit examplewhen I worked at LinkedIn,
worked on the recruiter product,right, if you're going to
search for I want to find anengineer, I want to hire for
(15:31):
this job how you decide todisplay those results on the
first page.
Say, you have 60% men, becausethose are just what the odds are
, and 40% women.
That first page that you renderon those search results.
Guess what it better be thatrepresentation, because that's
also how you're deciding guesswhat.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
It better be that representation, because that's
also how you're deciding.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
I'm going to go out, I'm going to have that person
apply for the job, right?
So you have to pay attention tothose algorithms, the data that
you have, the missing data,missing data that you have, in
order to get the right results.
So it's everywhere.
You just got to start payingattention to it and make sure
that's there.
But I feel, even with I mean Ican go on and on I'm going to
pause.
(16:10):
But because I have a lot ofexamples, like even with sexual
harassment and women on theplatform, I remember early days
like I would show them like areyou guys getting this?
They're like I don't get any ofthat.
It's like, okay, we need towork on some of this stuff in
the platform because there'sjust there's use cases that we
have that other people don'thave, and we just have to look
(16:31):
at the world with a differentlens and we have a different
perspective.
Speaker 2 (16:35):
Well, you mentioned AI, artificial intelligence and
how do we ensure that just fromthe start, that there's not bias
in the system and as it relatesto gender, Can you talk a
little bit just so peopleunderstand?
Because, let's say, you knowsomeone who's listening to this
(16:55):
understand, they're hearing alot about AI, they're not sure
how it impacts what they do.
But can you talk a little bitmore about what you meant when
you said this?
Like there could be someintroduction of bias in the
system as it relates to women?
Just give us a practicalexample so people can understand
what that means and why itwould have a negative impact.
Speaker 1 (17:17):
Right.
So I'll go back to the exampleand maybe I wasn't as clear.
But if you think about, I mean,ai is really not like new,
right, we've had thesealgorithms like for years.
It's just more that now AI ismore accessible to folks like
ChatGPT or Gemini for Google.
I use it every day, which isfantastic.
(17:39):
But if you think about what AIis right, it's basically you
have data, right, so you're onlyas good as your data, and then
you build algorithms on thatdata and then you get output
based on prompts and such likethat.
So if you think about the usecase that I brought before,
where it's like I'm going tosearch for a software engineer
(18:01):
right.
So then, if I'm going to searchfor a software engineer, what
data do I have?
Well, guess what?
I better have diverse data onthe platform, right?
So am I going to have the rightrepresentation of people on the
platform?
Or how?
Think about how I'm evengetting you to sign up for
LinkedIn or me.
What represents thoseindividuals?
How are we going after thoseindividuals?
(18:22):
Can you get them on theplatform in the first place?
So are they there?
And then look at, I think, alsosaying people are sometimes like
, oh, I don't want to say whatmy gender is or whatever, but
that also helps all thesealgorithms to make sure that you
have representation.
Like what else?
What if you're also givingthese results and you're like,
wow, all my results are men, butthat's not true, right?
(18:44):
It's like no.
So you need some identity,self-identity in some of these
algorithms, which is hard to get.
So sometimes you do things likeby name, which is hard, and
you'll do misses, but you kindof have to still like do the
inventory of the data that youhave.
Does it represent the world andwhat you're trying to
accomplish?
And then you create algorithmson it.
If you're not paying attentionto what those data sources are
(19:06):
and you just blindly createalgorithms, output is going to
be shit.
Sorry, garbage in, garbage out.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
One hundred percent.
Speaker 1 (19:15):
Everybody has their different use case, so you need
to understand who you'rebuilding, for what you're
building, what that data is, toget the right outputs.
Speaker 2 (19:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:24):
Yeah Well, you need the human element in it.
You can't just let these.
Speaker 2 (19:39):
AI algorithms go rogue.
It's not going to work.
Were at LinkedIn.
You started Women in Tech atLinkedIn, which talked about and
understand why, but yourecently relatively recently
left LinkedIn to start HumanizeHer.
Can you talk about whatHumanize Her is and why did you
leave this amazing place thatyou had, you know, spent years
(20:04):
in and obviously been part ofthe growth to take the leap into
entrepreneurship?
Speaker 1 (20:09):
Yeah, I am still honestly having an identity
crisis.
I'll be honest, I've been intech for nearly 30 years.
I mean I never took a break inmy career.
I had two kids six weeks max.
I'd never.
I mean, I was just trained to.
That is my path and it'sinteresting.
(20:32):
Many things happen of like thewhy, and I'm still processing
the why.
I'll be honest, but I went alot on feelings of how I evolved
as a human and the things thatwere bringing so much joy to my
life.
I loved leading.
I was building, I was leading ateam of over a thousand people
(20:53):
and half nine and a half billionrevenue of LinkedIn.
It was like a huge ass job.
It was a job I cried for, Ifought for, I wanted so bad and
I had for many, many years justclimbing that corporate ladder
and then, all of a sudden, I'mlike why am I not happy anymore?
It's like I don't know, likewhat happened, erica, you know,
but many things happened in mylife around that time and I'll
(21:15):
and I'll be transparent I wasgoing.
I'm not going to share all my,my family drama, but there's
some stuff that happened in myfamily and there's when you go
through we all go through stuffright, and so when that happens,
that kind of gives you aperspective like, okay, I was
creating more time to have morecontrol about when I did things,
how I did things, and so thatbecame a part of it.
(21:37):
And my kids are 16 and 18.
I'll never get those years backand I just wanted a little bit
more connection time and I feltthey needed it.
Then the second thing I, youknow, I had a health scare.
I had cancer smacked in themiddle of my face.
I looked like Frankenstein andthere's nothing like that that
makes you wake up and like, okay, mortality, your mortality is,
(21:58):
is, is possibility here, and andthen also getting to 50, that
mid perspective, and so, puttingthat all together, I'm like,
you know, I'm going to take abreak.
And I didn't know what I wantedto do and that was the scariest
thing.
It's not how my dad raised meor my parents.
You put a job, you get anotherjob like you're making a whole
bunch of money in this company,like why?
(22:20):
But I wanted to just go withthese feelings and so I just
quit and I said I'm going totake a break, and I didn't know
what it meant.
But that only lasted like threemonths so, but I traveled, I
did a lot of trips with familyand friends and girlfriends, and
then I was on a run and one ofthe things that I realized that
I missed the most was how I hadbuilt a community for women at
(22:44):
LinkedIn and outside of LinkedIn, and so many women were still
coming to me, like Erica helpedme manage this next phase.
And then I started meeting otherwomen like entrepreneurs, and I
always thought this lonelinessof women in tech is just that's
how I was conditioned for somany years, like this problem is
everywhere, it's in sports,it's in entrepreneurship, it's
like everyone and just gosh, youknow, can we all come together
(23:06):
and maybe build a community,share these stories, a lot of
what you're doing, which is, youknow, amazing?
And I just was on a run and Ijust said you know, I'm going to
create a community, I'll justcreate my own.
I don't know what it is and Iwas on a.
I used to.
When I was in product meetingsat LinkedIn, they would go
through all these product specsand they'd talk about what this
(23:26):
feature is and I would alwayssay can you humanize it for me
for a second?
And then, when I was on a run,I was like humanize her so
literally.
That's how it came, and so Isaid the first thing I'm going
to do is I'm going to build apodcast, because we can't be our
best kept secrets and we need aform to share our stories.
Also, I've been using it.
(23:47):
Honestly.
I feel like some of thesesessions have been therapy for
me, where I'm learning from allthese incredible women that I've
never met before, across allindustries, and they're going
through things that are similar,but then also they've figured
it out in some ways and so Ijoin their stories and then I'm
also like buy from them, supportthem, invest in them, elevate
(24:09):
their voices, like a simplething.
I was like I need some art onthe back of my podcast.
This woman I found from Dubaiit's all custom art from her,
and she just decided to leavetech and focus on her arts.
I'm like all these collabs thatwe can do and we're so much
stronger together, it just feelsgood right now.
And so I have a crew.
My whole crew is uh, I'm notgoing to half-ass anything, as
(24:32):
I'm an engineer by trade, so Iprobably spent a shit ton of
money on all my cameras andequipment and the team, but
they're all from LinkedIn.
They created LinkedIn learningvideos, still there and having a
good time, and we're buildingand I'm elevating women's voices
and it feels good work.
I feel like this is my purpose,but to be honest.
(24:52):
How do I make it a business?
That's another thing.
I want to prove that that canbe possible too.
But I'm figuring out.
I'm just kind of following howI feel right now and it feels
like I'm helping and I'm women,you know be more successful, and
it feels fantastic and thatfeels great.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
So I love that Well, so many of those things resonate
, I think, probably with thepeople listening to this.
I think that there is, first ofall, there is something that
like I don't know another wordbut magical.
There's something magical thathappens when women come together
.
And I don't think there is.
(25:33):
I think there are so manyreasons why you can go into like
, what's all the rationale?
I mean, my last name is Freud,so I love psychoanalyzing things
, but there's something about, Ithink, how women we are earnest
and want to help.
There is something about, Ithink, how women we are earnest
and want to help.
And so when you get a group ofwomen together, our orientation
(25:53):
is to help and to be of serviceand to be in service to others,
and that is not a small thing.
And in thinking about howimportant that is for each of us
and how we live our lives, itis not a small thing.
And I think that there issomething that, as women and I
(26:15):
again, I can't speak for menbecause I am not nearly as
expert in the men's space as Iam in the women's space just
done, doing what I've done foras long as I have I do think
that there is something abouthow women are built, that we
need to feel like we are beingin service in some ways to
others, that it's not just allabout me, it's about how can I
(26:39):
help other people.
So it is so not surprising tome that you built this career
for yourself.
You've achieved those things.
And then you looked at it andyou thought, well, how, how,
what's the next step, what's thenext thing for me?
Because what?
Maybe what I've done before isnot necessarily the thing that's
(27:01):
going to serve me and that Ican be helpful in moving forward
.
And I think a lot of women gothrough that.
And the question just is youknow, do you listen to that
voice in your head?
Do you listen to that little,you know that little thing that
you have a big company and knewthat I wanted to do something
(27:23):
different, but it took me awhile to figure out what it was.
And the other thing you saidthat I also want to highlight it
made me think that when I wasgoing through the process of you
(27:46):
know what do I want to do?
What's it going to be?
I know there's more I can dowant to do what's it going to be
?
I know there's more I can do,but I don't know what it is.
There's this thing that keptcoming into my head, this phrase
of master of my own destiny.
That was just, it was there andI could not ignore it.
And then there's.
Then there's a process, andthis is what I want to.
(28:07):
I'm going to get to thequestion, because I'm so
fascinated when women share thekinds of story that you're
sharing.
What was it?
Did you have a process?
Do you have anything you canrecommend to our listeners who
maybe are at a similar point intheir life where they're like
what I've been doing up untilthis point was it served me for
(28:28):
a lot of years, but now I feellike this sort of discomfort and
I want I know there's more, Iknow there's something else, but
getting to.
Okay, what is that thing?
Do you have any advice or fromwhat you went through that you
can share?
Was it running?
You said you ran?
Is it like exercise?
(28:48):
Is it journaling share?
Was it running?
You said you ran?
Is it like exercise?
Is it journaling?
What is the like?
Are any tips for people who arelistening and maybe can learn
from what you did?
Speaker 1 (28:57):
Yeah, it's a great question and thank you for
sharing your journey.
I could probably listen to youand about so many things to
learn as well.
I, it was the scariest thingthat I've ever done, right,
because everybody you being in acorporate job as well everybody
expected you to do this otherthing, but you, you go through
that process and you're like I'mgoing to.
(29:18):
One of our taglines is redefinesuccess on her own terms, right
?
So I think we're the world hasconditioned us to be a certain
way and act a certain way and dothat next thing.
So to break away from that moldof expectation is the first
thing that I had to go through.
In my head, everybody expectsme to do this, but I'm going to
(29:38):
do this because I have to dothis.
When else am I going to do it?
So, if you have that urge andyou're fighting and you have
that struggle like you had toeven describe, and it took you
three years and I'm still goingthrough it, I'm like, oh, did I
make the right mistake?
Did I make the right move?
And you know you're stillquestioning yourself.
So I think if you have thatstruggle, that's number one,
(29:59):
identifying it and then you haveto go through the process.
Well, okay, well, what is thatother thing?
And I'll be honest, I wentcrazy.
So, like it's kind of likesoftware.
I honestly have been AB testingmyself.
I'd been in real estate forsome investment properties and I
thought, oh, maybe I'll just dothat full time, maybe you know,
(30:19):
and we built this ADU that I'min right now and I was like, oh,
and I'm going to work with thecontractors, I'm going to do all
this stuff.
Maybe I'll become like there'snot many women in contracting
and so that's what I'm going todo.
Like I was thinking that's whatI was going to do.
I built this thing with thecontractor and guess what it was
?
Now it turned into a studio.
I had no idea that it was goingto be this, but sometimes you
(30:40):
just have to play through stuffand then I realized, no, that
doesn't bring me joy.
So, again, go back to A-Btesting stuff.
I had to do exploration.
I did so many talks.
Also, I go, maybe I need to bea public speaker and maybe
that's what I need to do.
And so I spoke at Google, Ispoke at Handshake.
I was going through all these.
Maybe that's what I should doand I enjoyed that, but it just
(31:02):
wasn't enough for me.
So I was like, oh, that's notenough.
So I think, just going throughthose emotions and I did a lot
of exercising, did a lot ofmentor talks I all of a sudden I
would be posting on my LinkedInMaybe you could see, maybe a
year ago, walked with thisperson, learned this and
realized everybody else is goingthrough stuff.
So I think you have to figureout that struggle, identify it,
(31:25):
maybe test some things and then,when you just kind of feel like
the podcast was one thing thatI got a whole bunch of amazing,
you go back to the communityaspect of women, like to help
women.
I got five amazing people and Isaid, what do you think?
They were sitting in this roomwith like nothing on the wall
that hurt my advisors andfriends and they were like you
(31:45):
should totally do this.
This is you, this is peoplethat have that know you in a
different way, and then theyalso give you that light to say
go for it.
And you just, sometimes you justneed that.
So I think, surround yourselfwith your believers and then you
just do.
I'm just doing right now andI'm learning.
I only released 10 episodes andI've created, I think, 27.
(32:09):
And we released every two weeksand I'm the engineer, I'm the
deployment, I'm the all thethings and the marketing sales,
all of it.
And you just do and I'm livingthrough it.
But I've never worked harder,never enjoyed as much as my work
, as much as I have now in thisnew phase of my life and I have
the flexibility to go pick up mydaughter from school, drop her
off, do all those things, go ona trip with my son to an airport
(32:32):
ride.
So it checks all those otherboxes of my why.
Speaker 2 (32:39):
Yeah, that's what I'm doing right now.
Yeah, I love that.
Well, you spend a lot of timeencouraging women to dream
bigger.
What is your next big dream for?
Humanize Her.
Speaker 1 (32:53):
I well, I'm.
I feel like I'm doing it rightnow.
We are going to be going toSouth by Southwest in about a
week.
We're nervous.
We're bringing the whole crew10 of us and what's great when
we record is we basically have aslumber party.
They all sleep here for like aweek and we record like nine at
a time.
It's insane.
So we're going to South by mysister's coming, my advisors,
(33:16):
the people on the team.
So I want to be successful andit's going to be live for the
first time.
As you know, live is a littlebit different than recorded and
editing and publishing and doingall that.
So a bit nervous, doing allthat, so a bit nervous.
And then after that I want tosee if we can have bigger reach
and I really want to get thecommunity aspect behind the
podcast.
So I did do one event, launchparty and had about 200 people
(33:39):
here and it was super fun justto see a room full of women just
wanting to support each other.
So I want to bring themtogether, promote their
businesses, have kind of like amini trade show type of thing,
and plan on doing that again.
Maybe you'll be around, I'dlove to have you so.
Speaker 2 (33:54):
I mean, I love this idea and let me just tell you,
as someone who has been involvedin seeing a lot of other, you
know, women starting businesses,building businesses this you
are.
You have the right approachbecause you're not saying this
is a hundred percent how it hasto be and this is like it's.
(34:15):
You know, if it doesn't go thisway, then then it's not going
to go anyway it's.
It's this explore and learnapproach, where you're
recognizing that you're going tofind the value as you go and
you have the kernel of.
You know what the value isultimately, but then it's how do
(34:36):
you create structure aroundthat?
How do you create scale aroundit?
How do you create monetizationaround it?
Those are all the things thatcome as you explore and as you
do it.
So I am, I mean, I am soexcited for you, erica.
If people want to follow youand the journey of Humanize Her,
(34:58):
what is the best way for themto do that?
Speaker 1 (35:00):
Well, since we put so much time and effort into a
video podcast.
So YouTube would be theplatform of choice, but we're on
Spotify.
You know Apple, obviously.
Go to humanizehercom and youcan find all you know the places
where to go.
But yeah, that's, that's wherewe're at.
We're on all your shorts onInstagram and LinkedIn and
TikTok, everywhere.
(35:21):
But we're growing, we'restarting, we're new, so
appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (35:25):
Awesome.
Well, thank you so much forspending the time with us today.
Thank you.
One of our taglines is redefine success on her own
terms.
The world has conditioned us tobe a certain way and act a
certain way and do that nextthing.
So to break away from that moldof expectation is the first
thing that I had to go through.
Everybody expects me to do this, but I'm going to do this
because I have to do this.
(00:20):
When else am I going to do it?
If you have that struggle,that's number one, identifying
it, and then you have to gothrough the process.
Well, what is that other thing?
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Welcome back to the show.
Hope you're all having a greatweek so far.
I am so excited to be talkingin this episode about one of my
favorite social platforms and,honestly, the one I use the most
, which is LinkedIn.
If you're not familiar withLinkedIn, it's known as a
business networking platform andit's really evolved over the
(01:01):
years, and I remember joining itback in probably 2006, 2007.
And the platform has reallyjust done such amazing things
for people in terms of findingjobs, finding connections,
networking, building theirbusiness all of these really
cool things.
So, on today's episode of theshow, I have Erica Lockheimer on
(01:25):
.
Erica is the founder and CEO ofHumanizeHer, which we talk
about, but she also spent 13years at LinkedIn.
She was a VP of engineering andshe was the founder of Women in
Tech at LinkedIn, and shereally has had this amazing and
prominent career over the courseof the last 30 years in tech.
(01:47):
And what I loved about myconversation with Erica is we
talk about the early days ofLinkedIn, which I, as I just
mentioned, love the platform, soloved learning a little bit
more about LinkedIn and how itstarted and how it's grown.
And then we talk about whatit's like to be a woman in tech
as an engineer, and what thatjourney was like for Erica, and
(02:13):
then to today, where she's thefounder and CEO of Humanize Her,
and she has been building thisamazing platform that is aimed
at cultivating a world whereevery woman can thrive and
shatter the glass ceilings andreally redefine what success
means to her on her own terms.
So I really loved thisconversation with Erica.
(02:35):
There's a lot of reallyinteresting insights in here.
So with that, I'm going to letyou hear my conversation with
Erica Lockheimer.
Here we go going to let youhear my conversation with Erica
Lockheimer.
Here we go.
Erica, welcome to the show.
Speaker 1 (02:48):
Thank you for having me.
I appreciate it.
I'm so excited, so excited yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
I am too.
Well, first of all, you workedon a platform, one of the social
platforms, and I consider it asocial platform, right, linkedin
, absolutely.
It's the platform I am the mostactive on and always have been
it's.
It's a platform I understand, Iguess, the best, just because I
think everyone has the platformthat you know that they kind of
(03:14):
naturally gravitate towards,and for me it's always been
LinkedIn.
When did you start at LinkedIn?
Let's start with that, and howlong were you there?
Speaker 1 (03:23):
It's a great question and I'm glad it's the platform
of choice for you and I think Iunderstand it the most as well,
probably because I helped buildit.
I was there for 13 and a halfyears.
Wait, was that the beginning?
Yeah, so it was 2010 when Istarted and I was there when we
had less than 150 millionmembers on the platform.
(03:45):
Linkedin has now than 150million members on the platform.
Linkedin has now over a billionmembers on the platform.
It's insane.
And when I joined, I was askedto lead the growth team and, to
be honest, I was more from thecamp before that.
I'm an engineer by trade, so Iwas working behind the server,
(04:11):
you know, in the server room,behind the server wall.
I just like making sure systemswould work on the back end.
I'd never like thought aboutdoing social platform at all,
and you're right, it is a socialplatform.
It's where it was like the timeof if you could be there and
you know you had Facebook, youhad all these things that were
coming up and they're like hey,you know, can you lead the
growth team?
I honestly stepped into a rolethat I didn't really know how to
do, but I remember hittingevery single milestone.
We'd hit 150 million members,200 million members, 300.
(04:33):
We would just go go crazy.
It was all about growth.
So I was in charge of theregistration flow, the emails
that you would get, pushnotifications, all the growth
strategies.
I was responsible for that.
And then we got smarter aboutquality growth as well, so it
sounds a lot like.
Speaker 2 (04:49):
So I I spent the first part of my career at
American Express doing creditcard marketing all all the
different kinds of credit cardmarketing stuff that there was
to do there and one of themarketing teams was acquisition
and one of the marketing teamswas acquisition and engagement.
Like a new member engagementand it sounds like a lot of the
(05:09):
things you're talking about withthe registration, the email,
the push notifications.
Those are all things you doearly in, as soon as someone
almost becomes a member, so thatthey have a path to
understanding the value of whatthis platform and for me it was
the credit card, but in yourcase it was the platform was
(05:31):
going to do for them.
What would you say is the waythat you think about LinkedIn
and how maybe professionals andother people should think about
LinkedIn?
Speaker 1 (05:44):
Yeah, it's a great question.
And just to respond to yourexperience as well, you're right
, like retention, acquisition,all of that was critical and
once you get someone on theplatform, the worst thing that
you can actually do is you getthem on the platform and they
have no one they're connected to, right.
So that's why importing youraddress book, all those types of
things, and connecting to thepeople that you know so that
you're there and then you have agreat experience.
(06:07):
And so when you think aboutLinkedIn, it definitely has
evolved over time and I've hadmany jobs at LinkedIn so I've
also led their learning business.
When we acquired Linda, I alsoled their LinkedIn talent
business, which is recruiter onthe platform and jobs on the
platform.
So if you think about theevolution of LinkedIn, it was,
at first, just your professionalidentity online.
(06:28):
You know that is number onething that I think honestly,
everybody should do so, even asa student, and I think that's
what's challenging is when Ispeak to students.
I speak to them a lot andthey're like, well, I don't have
a job, I don't have jobexperience, but you know you got
to start somewhere and you alsohave projects you worked on and
such, so you need to showcaseyourself.
It's your professional identity.
(06:50):
And if you think about it, ifyou do a Google search, someone
searches for your name.
They're like who's this personthat I got an email from?
The first thing you're going todo is you're going to search
for that person and you'll.
Seo is a great solution forLinkedIn.
So, number one be there, andthen number two, depending on
what your needs are.
Like some people are they wantto look for a job.
Well, guess what?
(07:10):
They have so many jobs onLinkedIn across multiple
industries.
That is going to be your firstplace to.
Number one look for one.
Number two apply.
They make the process veryseamless.
And then also there's arecruiter platform.
That recruiter platform doessearch and algorithms to do
(07:31):
matching of skills to findsomeone, a match really for that
job that they have posted andthat person that's online.
So if you're not there, guesswhat?
You're never going to have anopportunity.
So, depending, if you'relooking for a job, definitely be
there.
If you're in the recruitingspace, definitely be there.
And then also the other part islearning.
There's LinkedIn learning.
On there you can learn aboutdifferent topics on the
professional, you know, and thetech side.
I mean the vast majority thatthey have is content is pretty
(07:55):
high.
And then the other part isnetworking.
I will tell you, I was atLinkedIn for 13 and a half years
.
I wasn't looking for a job, soI wasn't using OutPrize, but
I've never used LinkedIn morethan now in my life when I'm not
there.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
Interesting.
Speaker 1 (08:12):
Yeah, I'm able to reach out to people because I
have a podcast as well, so Ineed to recruit I'm in sales,
guess what?
I want different people that Idon't know outside my network.
I got to reach out to them.
It's the platform of choice toactually reach someone.
Speaker 2 (08:26):
I'll just tell you about my perspective on LinkedIn
versus the other socialplatforms.
And as a company our company,she Speaks.
We work on the other socialplatforms, much more so than,
let's say, we work on LinkedInbecause we're working with
social media influencers.
But I think, from theperspective of reliability, I
(08:47):
feel like the other platformsthere are a lot more bogus
accounts, so to speak, in thesense that someone's
representing themselves and youdon't really know if that's
actually who they are.
I feel like on LinkedIn thereis a lot more checks and
balances for that, in some ways,I find it more reliable when
(09:08):
I'm looking up somebody onLinkedIn versus the other
platforms.
Speaker 1 (09:12):
You're absolutely right.
When I was working there, therewere some countries that would
actually use the identity onLinkedIn as a proven thing
because it's like a number onetrusted site.
So you're absolutely right.
Your opinion is massive acrossthe world.
I liked your perspective thatyou brought up the differences
between like Instagram dependingon who the person is.
I'm like they are amazing onInstagram, not on LinkedIn.
(09:35):
And then you see that opposite,it's so like oh, I'm going to
post this and it's not going togo well for this person here on
LinkedIn, but it's on Instagram,so I'm learning that as well.
Everybody has their platform ofchoice, especially on the
creative side.
I see a lot of that, like yousaid, on influencers on
Instagram and TikTok.
Speaker 2 (09:53):
I definitely see more influencers just in the space
that we're in.
We work with, you know, socialmedia influencers who are
probably big.
Their following is mostly on,let's say, a TikTok and an
Instagram, because what we'reworking on is B2C, so business
to consumer products.
So think your Coca-Colas of theworld and your Mars Wrigley's.
(10:16):
Those are the types of productswe're working on, so usually
we're trying to reach people whoare everyday consumers.
But what's really interestingthat we're finding is a lot of
those influencers are realizingthat they have huge opportunity
if they can build theirreputation and some thought
(10:37):
leadership, even on LinkedIn,for finding clients Yep, yep.
Finding partnerships, becausethat's how influencers make.
A big chunk of their money isthrough partnerships and
sponsorship dollars.
So I'm definitely seeing a lotof those social media
influencers migrating, probablyin the last year and a half, two
(10:59):
years, to LinkedIn.
Speaker 1 (11:01):
Like Reese Witherspoon, she just joined
LinkedIn.
Snoop Dogg's there, I mean.
It's been kind of a crazy funride to see.
Like Reese Witherspoon, shejust joined LinkedIn.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Snoop Dogg's there, I mean it's been kind of a crazy
fun ride to see.
So, yeah, well that's, I mean,what an amazing opportunity to
be there to see that.
It like sort of hockey stickgrowth that the platform had.
Let's talk a little bit aboutyour engineering background,
because I love coming acrosswomen that have this type of
background.
One of my daughters is verymuch this is like the way she
(11:30):
thinks and it's reallyinteresting to me to see how
successful women who have thatbackground can be in
non-technical environments, canbe in non-technical environments
Like go on to become chiefmarketing officers, go on to
(11:50):
become successful entrepreneursand like not just in the
technology realm.
Let's talk a little bit aboutengineering for women.
How is the field evolving forwomen?
I know there's been a lot moreconversation to try to make STEM
more inviting for young womenso that that becomes a field
that they want to go into.
What was your draw toengineering and how do you think
(12:14):
it sets you up for success?
Speaker 1 (12:16):
Yeah, so fabulous question.
And when I got involved inengineering, I was really good
at math and it was a mathteacher in high school that said
, hey, why don't you try thisprogramming class called Pascal?
If anybody still knows whatthat is?
Okay, good, you do.
So.
I remember being in thatclassroom and it was just an
(12:37):
amazing experience to have thiscomputer.
You could do inputs and outputs.
I mean I it was a revolutionarygame tic-tac-toe that I
programmed.
But I created it and it's justthat feeling of innovation and
creation.
I was hooked.
I was honestly, honestly hookedand I was like, okay, maybe
this is something I wanted to do.
(12:58):
But then you quickly lookaround the classroom and then
you realize you're the only one,right.
And then I also wasn't your.
I was like a cheerleader.
I was like just everything didnot compute of.
You know the stereotype of whatan engineer should look like,
or you know they would call usnerds at the time, right?
So I still am.
I love being called a nerd.
(13:19):
I am a total big geek and Ilove it, but yeah.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
Word is a badge of honor.
Speaker 1 (13:24):
I know it is, and so I actually stepped out of it and
I didn't know what to do.
So I basically went to juniorcollege.
I was the first person in myfamily to graduate from college,
but I walked the halls of SanJose State after two years in
junior college and I saw thisplaque of women and society
engineers and that's honestlyhow I chose my major.
(13:45):
It was another sense ofbelonging, of like.
Oh, maybe I could be like her,and I always wanted to go to
those grassroots of an engineer.
My dad was always wanting to bean engineer as well, and then I
majored in computer engineering.
But again I got there and theroom, the classrooms were again
not like people like me.
(14:06):
So it took me seven years tograduate.
I did.
I was working 30 hours a weekand I had my one friend
girlfriend that was there.
We're still friends todaybecause of slim pickings right,
we're the only two in theclassroom.
But I completed my studies andI was so proud.
But I just realized every stagethen I get to the workforce and
it's again the same thing.
(14:26):
It was just.
A lot of this stuff that I'mfocused on now is really born
out of frustration and just notfeeling that sense of like oh, I
fit in, even though I want todo this.
So that's why I started Womenin Tech at LinkedIn in the early
days, because when I joinedthere, we were less than it was
like maybe two or three of uswomen in the field, and so it's
(14:49):
always just been kind of in myblood and my DNA.
It should be a better feelingand we need more women in this
field.
The global population guess what?
Half of it are women.
So if you're going to build andcreate, you better have them at
the table, you better have themin the algorithms and then with
AI, if those biases are in thesystems, it's going to take
(15:10):
forever to like re-undo all ofthat work.
So I think it's so, so criticalto have diverse people at the
table building products.
And I've seen this and it's notjust saying it, right, I've
seen it.
I give you an explicit examplewhen I worked at LinkedIn,
worked on the recruiter product,right, if you're going to
search for I want to find anengineer, I want to hire for
(15:31):
this job how you decide todisplay those results on the
first page.
Say, you have 60% men, becausethose are just what the odds are
, and 40% women.
That first page that you renderon those search results.
Guess what it better be thatrepresentation, because that's
also how you're deciding guesswhat.
Speaker 2 (15:48):
It better be that representation, because that's
also how you're deciding.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
I'm going to go out, I'm going to have that person
apply for the job, right?
So you have to pay attention tothose algorithms, the data that
you have, the missing data,missing data that you have, in
order to get the right results.
So it's everywhere.
You just got to start payingattention to it and make sure
that's there.
But I feel, even with I mean Ican go on and on I'm going to
pause.
(16:10):
But because I have a lot ofexamples, like even with sexual
harassment and women on theplatform, I remember early days
like I would show them like areyou guys getting this?
They're like I don't get any ofthat.
It's like, okay, we need towork on some of this stuff in
the platform because there'sjust there's use cases that we
have that other people don'thave, and we just have to look
(16:31):
at the world with a differentlens and we have a different
perspective.
Speaker 2 (16:35):
Well, you mentioned AI, artificial intelligence and
how do we ensure that just fromthe start, that there's not bias
in the system and as it relatesto gender, Can you talk a
little bit just so peopleunderstand?
Because, let's say, you knowsomeone who's listening to this
(16:55):
understand, they're hearing alot about AI, they're not sure
how it impacts what they do.
But can you talk a little bitmore about what you meant when
you said this?
Like there could be someintroduction of bias in the
system as it relates to women?
Just give us a practicalexample so people can understand
what that means and why itwould have a negative impact.
Speaker 1 (17:17):
Right.
So I'll go back to the exampleand maybe I wasn't as clear.
But if you think about, I mean,ai is really not like new,
right, we've had thesealgorithms like for years.
It's just more that now AI ismore accessible to folks like
ChatGPT or Gemini for Google.
I use it every day, which isfantastic.
(17:39):
But if you think about what AIis right, it's basically you
have data, right, so you're onlyas good as your data, and then
you build algorithms on thatdata and then you get output
based on prompts and such likethat.
So if you think about the usecase that I brought before,
where it's like I'm going tosearch for a software engineer
(18:01):
right.
So then, if I'm going to searchfor a software engineer, what
data do I have?
Well, guess what?
I better have diverse data onthe platform, right?
So am I going to have the rightrepresentation of people on the
platform?
Or how?
Think about how I'm evengetting you to sign up for
LinkedIn or me.
What represents thoseindividuals?
How are we going after thoseindividuals?
(18:22):
Can you get them on theplatform in the first place?
So are they there?
And then look at, I think, alsosaying people are sometimes like
, oh, I don't want to say whatmy gender is or whatever, but
that also helps all thesealgorithms to make sure that you
have representation.
Like what else?
What if you're also givingthese results and you're like,
wow, all my results are men, butthat's not true, right?
(18:44):
It's like no.
So you need some identity,self-identity in some of these
algorithms, which is hard to get.
So sometimes you do things likeby name, which is hard, and
you'll do misses, but you kindof have to still like do the
inventory of the data that youhave.
Does it represent the world andwhat you're trying to
accomplish?
And then you create algorithmson it.
If you're not paying attentionto what those data sources are
(19:06):
and you just blindly createalgorithms, output is going to
be shit.
Sorry, garbage in, garbage out.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
One hundred percent.
Speaker 1 (19:15):
Everybody has their different use case, so you need
to understand who you'rebuilding, for what you're
building, what that data is, toget the right outputs.
Speaker 2 (19:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:24):
Yeah Well, you need the human element in it.
You can't just let these.
Speaker 2 (19:39):
AI algorithms go rogue.
It's not going to work.
Were at LinkedIn.
You started Women in Tech atLinkedIn, which talked about and
understand why, but yourecently relatively recently
left LinkedIn to start HumanizeHer.
Can you talk about whatHumanize Her is and why did you
leave this amazing place thatyou had, you know, spent years
(20:04):
in and obviously been part ofthe growth to take the leap into
entrepreneurship?
Speaker 1 (20:09):
Yeah, I am still honestly having an identity
crisis.
I'll be honest, I've been intech for nearly 30 years.
I mean I never took a break inmy career.
I had two kids six weeks max.
I'd never.
I mean, I was just trained to.
That is my path and it'sinteresting.
(20:32):
Many things happen of like thewhy, and I'm still processing
the why.
I'll be honest, but I went alot on feelings of how I evolved
as a human and the things thatwere bringing so much joy to my
life.
I loved leading.
I was building, I was leading ateam of over a thousand people
(20:53):
and half nine and a half billionrevenue of LinkedIn.
It was like a huge ass job.
It was a job I cried for, Ifought for, I wanted so bad and
I had for many, many years justclimbing that corporate ladder
and then, all of a sudden, I'mlike why am I not happy anymore?
It's like I don't know, likewhat happened, erica, you know,
but many things happened in mylife around that time and I'll
(21:15):
and I'll be transparent I wasgoing.
I'm not going to share all my,my family drama, but there's
some stuff that happened in myfamily and there's when you go
through we all go through stuffright, and so when that happens,
that kind of gives you aperspective like, okay, I was
creating more time to have morecontrol about when I did things,
how I did things, and so thatbecame a part of it.
(21:37):
And my kids are 16 and 18.
I'll never get those years backand I just wanted a little bit
more connection time and I feltthey needed it.
Then the second thing I, youknow, I had a health scare.
I had cancer smacked in themiddle of my face.
I looked like Frankenstein andthere's nothing like that that
makes you wake up and like, okay, mortality, your mortality is,
(21:58):
is, is possibility here, and andthen also getting to 50, that
mid perspective, and so, puttingthat all together, I'm like,
you know, I'm going to take abreak.
And I didn't know what I wantedto do and that was the scariest
thing.
It's not how my dad raised meor my parents.
You put a job, you get anotherjob like you're making a whole
bunch of money in this company,like why?
(22:20):
But I wanted to just go withthese feelings and so I just
quit and I said I'm going totake a break, and I didn't know
what it meant.
But that only lasted like threemonths so, but I traveled, I
did a lot of trips with familyand friends and girlfriends, and
then I was on a run and one ofthe things that I realized that
I missed the most was how I hadbuilt a community for women at
(22:44):
LinkedIn and outside of LinkedIn, and so many women were still
coming to me, like Erica helpedme manage this next phase.
And then I started meeting otherwomen like entrepreneurs, and I
always thought this lonelinessof women in tech is just that's
how I was conditioned for somany years, like this problem is
everywhere, it's in sports,it's in entrepreneurship, it's
like everyone and just gosh, youknow, can we all come together
(23:06):
and maybe build a community,share these stories, a lot of
what you're doing, which is, youknow, amazing?
And I just was on a run and Ijust said you know, I'm going to
create a community, I'll justcreate my own.
I don't know what it is and Iwas on a.
I used to.
When I was in product meetingsat LinkedIn, they would go
through all these product specsand they'd talk about what this
(23:26):
feature is and I would alwayssay can you humanize it for me
for a second?
And then, when I was on a run,I was like humanize her so
literally.
That's how it came, and so Isaid the first thing I'm going
to do is I'm going to build apodcast, because we can't be our
best kept secrets and we need aform to share our stories.
Also, I've been using it.
(23:47):
Honestly.
I feel like some of thesesessions have been therapy for
me, where I'm learning from allthese incredible women that I've
never met before, across allindustries, and they're going
through things that are similar,but then also they've figured
it out in some ways and so Ijoin their stories and then I'm
also like buy from them, supportthem, invest in them, elevate
(24:09):
their voices, like a simplething.
I was like I need some art onthe back of my podcast.
This woman I found from Dubaiit's all custom art from her,
and she just decided to leavetech and focus on her arts.
I'm like all these collabs thatwe can do and we're so much
stronger together, it just feelsgood right now.
And so I have a crew.
My whole crew is uh, I'm notgoing to half-ass anything, as
(24:32):
I'm an engineer by trade, so Iprobably spent a shit ton of
money on all my cameras andequipment and the team, but
they're all from LinkedIn.
They created LinkedIn learningvideos, still there and having a
good time, and we're buildingand I'm elevating women's voices
and it feels good work.
I feel like this is my purpose,but to be honest.
(24:52):
How do I make it a business?
That's another thing.
I want to prove that that canbe possible too.
But I'm figuring out.
I'm just kind of following howI feel right now and it feels
like I'm helping and I'm women,you know be more successful, and
it feels fantastic and thatfeels great.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
So I love that Well, so many of those things resonate
, I think, probably with thepeople listening to this.
I think that there is, first ofall, there is something that
like I don't know another wordbut magical.
There's something magical thathappens when women come together
.
And I don't think there is.
(25:33):
I think there are so manyreasons why you can go into like
, what's all the rationale?
I mean, my last name is Freud,so I love psychoanalyzing things
, but there's something about, Ithink, how women we are earnest
and want to help.
There is something about, Ithink, how women we are earnest
and want to help.
And so when you get a group ofwomen together, our orientation
(25:53):
is to help and to be of serviceand to be in service to others,
and that is not a small thing.
And in thinking about howimportant that is for each of us
and how we live our lives, itis not a small thing.
And I think that there issomething that, as women and I
(26:15):
again, I can't speak for menbecause I am not nearly as
expert in the men's space as Iam in the women's space just
done, doing what I've done foras long as I have I do think
that there is something abouthow women are built, that we
need to feel like we are beingin service in some ways to
others, that it's not just allabout me, it's about how can I
(26:39):
help other people.
So it is so not surprising tome that you built this career
for yourself.
You've achieved those things.
And then you looked at it andyou thought, well, how, how,
what's the next step, what's thenext thing for me?
Because what?
Maybe what I've done before isnot necessarily the thing that's
(27:01):
going to serve me and that Ican be helpful in moving forward
.
And I think a lot of women gothrough that.
And the question just is youknow, do you listen to that
voice in your head?
Do you listen to that little,you know that little thing that
you have a big company and knewthat I wanted to do something
(27:23):
different, but it took me awhile to figure out what it was.
And the other thing you saidthat I also want to highlight it
made me think that when I wasgoing through the process of you
(27:46):
know what do I want to do?
What's it going to be?
I know there's more I can dowant to do what's it going to be
?
I know there's more I can do,but I don't know what it is.
There's this thing that keptcoming into my head, this phrase
of master of my own destiny.
That was just, it was there andI could not ignore it.
And then there's.
Then there's a process, andthis is what I want to.
(28:07):
I'm going to get to thequestion, because I'm so
fascinated when women share thekinds of story that you're
sharing.
What was it?
Did you have a process?
Do you have anything you canrecommend to our listeners who
maybe are at a similar point intheir life where they're like
what I've been doing up untilthis point was it served me for
(28:28):
a lot of years, but now I feellike this sort of discomfort and
I want I know there's more, Iknow there's something else, but
getting to.
Okay, what is that thing?
Do you have any advice or fromwhat you went through that you
can share?
Was it running?
You said you ran?
Is it like exercise?
(28:48):
Is it journaling share?
Was it running?
You said you ran?
Is it like exercise?
Is it journaling?
What is the like?
Are any tips for people who arelistening and maybe can learn
from what you did?
Speaker 1 (28:57):
Yeah, it's a great question and thank you for
sharing your journey.
I could probably listen to youand about so many things to
learn as well.
I, it was the scariest thingthat I've ever done, right,
because everybody you being in acorporate job as well everybody
expected you to do this otherthing, but you, you go through
that process and you're like I'mgoing to.
(29:18):
One of our taglines is redefinesuccess on her own terms, right
?
So I think we're the world hasconditioned us to be a certain
way and act a certain way and dothat next thing.
So to break away from that moldof expectation is the first
thing that I had to go through.
In my head, everybody expectsme to do this, but I'm going to
(29:38):
do this because I have to dothis.
When else am I going to do it?
So, if you have that urge andyou're fighting and you have
that struggle like you had toeven describe, and it took you
three years and I'm still goingthrough it, I'm like, oh, did I
make the right mistake?
Did I make the right move?
And you know you're stillquestioning yourself.
So I think if you have thatstruggle, that's number one,
(29:59):
identifying it and then you haveto go through the process.
Well, okay, well, what is thatother thing?
And I'll be honest, I wentcrazy.
So, like it's kind of likesoftware.
I honestly have been AB testingmyself.
I'd been in real estate forsome investment properties and I
thought, oh, maybe I'll just dothat full time, maybe you know,
(30:19):
and we built this ADU that I'min right now and I was like, oh,
and I'm going to work with thecontractors, I'm going to do all
this stuff.
Maybe I'll become like there'snot many women in contracting
and so that's what I'm going todo.
Like I was thinking that's whatI was going to do.
I built this thing with thecontractor and guess what it was
?
Now it turned into a studio.
I had no idea that it was goingto be this, but sometimes you
(30:40):
just have to play through stuffand then I realized, no, that
doesn't bring me joy.
So, again, go back to A-Btesting stuff.
I had to do exploration.
I did so many talks.
Also, I go, maybe I need to bea public speaker and maybe
that's what I need to do.
And so I spoke at Google, Ispoke at Handshake.
I was going through all these.
Maybe that's what I should doand I enjoyed that, but it just
(31:02):
wasn't enough for me.
So I was like, oh, that's notenough.
So I think, just going throughthose emotions and I did a lot
of exercising, did a lot ofmentor talks I all of a sudden I
would be posting on my LinkedInMaybe you could see, maybe a
year ago, walked with thisperson, learned this and
realized everybody else is goingthrough stuff.
So I think you have to figureout that struggle, identify it,
(31:25):
maybe test some things and then,when you just kind of feel like
the podcast was one thing thatI got a whole bunch of amazing,
you go back to the communityaspect of women, like to help
women.
I got five amazing people and Isaid, what do you think?
They were sitting in this roomwith like nothing on the wall
that hurt my advisors andfriends and they were like you
(31:45):
should totally do this.
This is you, this is peoplethat have that know you in a
different way, and then theyalso give you that light to say
go for it.
And you just, sometimes you justneed that.
So I think, surround yourselfwith your believers and then you
just do.
I'm just doing right now andI'm learning.
I only released 10 episodes andI've created, I think, 27.
(32:09):
And we released every two weeksand I'm the engineer, I'm the
deployment, I'm the all thethings and the marketing sales,
all of it.
And you just do and I'm livingthrough it.
But I've never worked harder,never enjoyed as much as my work
, as much as I have now in thisnew phase of my life and I have
the flexibility to go pick up mydaughter from school, drop her
off, do all those things, go ona trip with my son to an airport
(32:32):
ride.
So it checks all those otherboxes of my why.
Speaker 2 (32:39):
Yeah, that's what I'm doing right now.
Yeah, I love that.
Well, you spend a lot of timeencouraging women to dream
bigger.
What is your next big dream for?
Humanize Her.
Speaker 1 (32:53):
I well, I'm.
I feel like I'm doing it rightnow.
We are going to be going toSouth by Southwest in about a
week.
We're nervous.
We're bringing the whole crew10 of us and what's great when
we record is we basically have aslumber party.
They all sleep here for like aweek and we record like nine at
a time.
It's insane.
So we're going to South by mysister's coming, my advisors,
(33:16):
the people on the team.
So I want to be successful andit's going to be live for the
first time.
As you know, live is a littlebit different than recorded and
editing and publishing and doingall that.
So a bit nervous, doing allthat, so a bit nervous.
And then after that I want tosee if we can have bigger reach
and I really want to get thecommunity aspect behind the
podcast.
So I did do one event, launchparty and had about 200 people
(33:39):
here and it was super fun justto see a room full of women just
wanting to support each other.
So I want to bring themtogether, promote their
businesses, have kind of like amini trade show type of thing,
and plan on doing that again.
Maybe you'll be around, I'dlove to have you so.
Speaker 2 (33:54):
I mean, I love this idea and let me just tell you,
as someone who has been involvedin seeing a lot of other, you
know, women starting businesses,building businesses this you
are.
You have the right approachbecause you're not saying this
is a hundred percent how it hasto be and this is like it's.
(34:15):
You know, if it doesn't go thisway, then then it's not going
to go anyway it's.
It's this explore and learnapproach, where you're
recognizing that you're going tofind the value as you go and
you have the kernel of.
You know what the value isultimately, but then it's how do
(34:36):
you create structure aroundthat?
How do you create scale aroundit?
How do you create monetizationaround it?
Those are all the things thatcome as you explore and as you
do it.
So I am, I mean, I am soexcited for you, erica.
If people want to follow youand the journey of Humanize Her,
(34:58):
what is the best way for themto do that?
Speaker 1 (35:00):
Well, since we put so much time and effort into a
video podcast.
So YouTube would be theplatform of choice, but we're on
Spotify.
You know Apple, obviously.
Go to humanizehercom and youcan find all you know the places
where to go.
But yeah, that's, that's wherewe're at.
We're on all your shorts onInstagram and LinkedIn and
TikTok, everywhere.
(35:21):
But we're growing, we'restarting, we're new, so
appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (35:25):
Awesome.
Well, thank you so much forspending the time with us today.
Thank you.
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