In this episode of the Women on the Move Podcast, host Sam Saperstein sits down with Laura Modi, CEO and co-founder of the organic infant formula brand, Bobbie. From her early days as a first-time mom navigating formula options in a drugstore to founding Bobbie, Laura's journey reflects her commitment to revolutionizing the infant formula industry.
Born from motherhood
Laura says her journey to founding Bobbie began in trauma: as a new mother excited to do everything possible for her baby, she suffered from mastitis and found herself unable to breastfeed. “Here I am doing something I wished and I hoped and I wanted to do so badly and I wasn't anatomically able to feed my child,” she tells Sam.
When she went to shop for formula, things got worse: “I'm in the middle aisle of a pharmacy, a place that you go for a medical solution, not food,” she says. “It didn't feel natural. Even worse, I had to ring a button to get someone to open up. So now you almost feel like you're asking for permission in a way that you felt shamed.“
She also remembers seeing ingredients she wouldn’t feed herself: corn syrup, palm oil, and “ingredients or words that I'd never even heard of.” She felt shame and guilt, but also she knew there should be a better option. She and her husband were astounded that the baby formula industry seemed to be stuck at least 40 years in the past. That’s when she started dreaming of disrupting the industry, and creating the formula she wanted.
An ounce of naivety
Before founding Bobbie, Laura was the director of host operations at Airbnb, and she drew on her experiences there when she created her own business. And when it came time to select a partner and co-founder, Laura turned not to a food scientist or a technologist, but someone who she had worked with at Airbnb, someone who she knew she wanted as her “work wife.”
As for actually formulating the baby formula they wanted to make, Laura says that she was nearly clueless. “An ounce of naivety is probably the secret sauce to succeeding,” she tells Sam. “You learn on the go and then you go, ‘Oh God, if I knew that I probably wouldn't have gotten this far.’"
With her partner Sarah, Laura started with a global standard review, looking for the best infant formulas in the world and researching breast milk and how they could get as close as possible to breast milk in the most natural way possible. “And by no means was I trying to find a world where I was replacing breast milk or creating something ‘better’ than breast milk,” she says. “I wanted to create something that I felt could get as close as possible in the most natural way, so that in absence of not being able to breastfeed, you don't feel guilty.”
Managing growth
In 2020, just as the pandemic unfolded, Bobbie got FDA approval, the green light to launch. At the time, two baby formula companies were producing 80 percent of the nation’s formula—and not long into the pandemic, there was a nationwide shortage of available formula. Bobbie’s customer count doubled overnight. As a start-up founder, Laura had to make the difficult decision to uphold their commitment to their existing subscribers and not take new orders. The company took some flak for the decision, but as a result, Laura says, Bobbie was the only baby formula company at the end of the shortage that was able to continue to feed its customers.
For the next two years, Bobbie had to manage a growing waitlist, balancing what they knew they could deliver with the fast-growing demand from new parents. Today, the formula is available in major retailers but still focuses on its subscription service. Laura says it’s a model that makes sense, since formula is an ongoing, measurable need. And it’s important to her that customers have an option to avoid the drug-store trips. She wants people to be “able to wear Bobbie loud and proud on a sweater, even if they've never been a parent, they've never used the product, but they are so connected to our mission and what we stand for that they're willing to wear it on their chest.”
Disclaimer: The speakers’ opinions belong to them and may differ from opinions of JPMorgan Chase & Co. and its affiliates. Views presented on this podcast are those of the speakers; they are as of October 22nd, 2024 and they may not materialize.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
My entire life,
(00:00):
you prepare for something,you succeed at it.
And in this moment, here Iam doing something I wish
and I hoped and I wanted to do so badly
and I wasn't anatomicallyable to feed my child.
- It really gets to the heart.
Welcome back to the "WomenOn the Move" podcast.
(00:21):
I'm your host, Sam Saperstein.
In this episode, I'mspeaking with Laura Modi,
the CEO and Co-Founder
of the organic infantformula brand, Bobbie.
From her early days as a first time mom
navigating formula options in a drugstore
to founding Bobbie,
Laura's journey reflects her commitment
to revolutionizing theinfant formula industry.
She's providing a better,
(00:42):
more transparent formulaoption for parents,
free from unnecessary additives,
while also focusing on fostering a culture
of confidence in parenting.
Before founding Bobbie,
Laura played a significant role at Airbnb
as the Director of Host Operations,
where she helped shape thecompany's international expansion
and community building.
(01:02):
I'm so excited to be speakingher today to hear about
how she's taking on infant formula.
Laura, welcome to the"Women on the Move" podcast.
It is great to have you on with us.
- Thank you Sam, pleasure to be here.
- So what we love to dowith our founders is go back
to your origin story, whyyou created the business.
So take us back to that daywhen you were in the drugstore
looking at formula options.
(01:26):
- PTSD.- What does that mean?
- Back to that moment.
They always say it likestarts with a problem.
Well, this is a visceral one.
I just assumed I would breastfeed.
I went into motherhood,Irish Catholic woman,
thought it would be easy.
And you're told by society
and everyone around you thatthis is something you can do.
This is completely natural.
(01:47):
So you don't even goin thinking otherwise.
I don't think I had eventhought of infant formula
before having a child.
But I went in and it wasn't that natural.
I got mastitis several days in.
For anyone who's listeningand they've heard of mastitis,
I have no doubt they'reprobably shuddering
because it is an infection of the breast
where your tissue gets damaged,
(02:09):
there's blisters, there's blood.
It is not the best moment.
On top of the fact that as a new mother,
you're also not feeling yourself.
You're 40 pounds overweight,you've got dark circles,
you're questioning youridentity in every single way.
Who am I? Where am I going?
Will I ever be myself?
And in your most vulnerable state,
you feel like a complete failure.
(02:30):
And those emotions are hard to shake
because like my entire life,
you prepare for something,you succeed at it.
And in this moment, here Iam doing something I wish
and I hoped and I wanted to do so badly
and I wasn't anatomicallyable to feed my child.
- I really gets to the heart.
- It does.
And you know, we'll get intolike more of like why Bobbie
(02:53):
really exists, but it'sthe emotions and you know,
people talk about Bobbie
and it's the connectionto feeling not guilty
just as much as a good product.
- So there you were,
you needed to buy formula
for your newborn.- I needed to buy formula.
- And you're looking at theoptions at the drugstore.
What do you see there?
- Well, to the left and right,I saw cat food and diapers.
- Okay, so now this is whatyou're focused on, right?
(03:15):
This is a choice.
- Like the middle aisle of apharmacy, a place that you go
for a medical solution.
- Yes.- Not food.
It didn't feel natural.
It's 10:00 PM at night.
Oh, even worse, I had to ring a button
to get someone to open up.
- Oh, it was locked.- It was locked.
So now you almost feellike you were asking
for permission in a waythat you felt shamed.
You go, you buy the product.
(03:35):
And I remember that feeling of,
I really hope they give methe bag that isn't transparent
because I would like to get from here home
without anyone knowing thatfive days into having a baby,
I need to feed her formula.
I mean I get emotional thinking about-
- It's a lot.
That's heavy.- How vulnerable.
It is heavy.
And you know, we'll get to thefeeling of eight years later
with the fire and passion tosay, oh, it doesn't matter.
(03:57):
But at the time it does matter.
- Yeah.- I turned the can around
and I remember seeing ingredients
that I knew in that moment Iprobably wouldn't feed myself.
- Hmm, like?
- Corn syrup, let's use the obvious one.
Palm oil, which youknow, is directly related
to things like constipation.
- And then ingredients or wordsthat I'd never even heard of
(04:20):
or hard to articulate.- Right.
- And I think a lot of people could say,
well just because you can't articulate it
doesn't mean it's not important.
That's true.
All of that said, in mymost vulnerable moment
in that place, I didn't feelcomfortable feeding her this.
So I'm reading it, I'm feelingbad, I'm feeling guilty.
And on top of it,
I knew there should havebeen a better option.
- Yeah, for sure.- I, me and my husband,
(04:41):
we got into the conversation.
It's like everything else in life,
you look around, has evolved,
from our granola bars to the cereal
to everything in this home.
And why is it that the sameformula I'm buying my daughter
is probably the same oneI was fed 40 years ago?
- Right. Great question.
- That's crazy.- Yeah.
- So anyway, the genesis was a mix
(05:02):
of questioning why theindustry hasn't changed
to the ingredients in theproduct to my emotional guilt
and vulnerability.
And it set me off on what Iwould refer to as my first
and only PhD of studying the ins and outs
and becoming maniacally obsessed
with understanding infant formula.
- So break that down for us a little bit.
(05:23):
You know, you think aboutwhat you feed babies
should seem all natural.
Maybe you breastfeed.
So that is, you know, nature's milk.
How do you even study this?
And could you even whipthis up in your kitchen
like a lot of founders do?
How do you even make this?
- Okay, no, you cannotwhip it up in your kitchen.
But I had to, I had to learn that through,
you know, osmosis of learning this.
(05:45):
That's a great question'cause it brings me back
to even trying to disrupt an industry.
And I remember that feeling.
I want to take on this industry,
but it wasn't likethere was a yellow pages
of infant formula companies
that you could call andfind out how to do this.
There was no playbook online.
The FDA didn't have a public phone number
that you could just pick up and call.
And it was a lot of coldcalling on LinkedIn,
(06:09):
trying to find people in the industry
that'd be willing to have a phone call.
I remember doing a Googlesearch for a baby formula expert
and I landed on babyformulaexpert.com.
I found a woman on it.
I made a phone call and wespent three hours one evening
talking about it.
She educated me on theproduct, the science,
the matching of breastmilk, the importance of it.
One very vivid memoryI have is being in bed.
(06:32):
I was like, I'm prettysure I want to do this.
And I was trying to finda book to help me learn
how to be able to understandit from formula and the process
and the manufacturingand science behind it.
And I found one book,it was the "Biochemistry
of Infant FormulaManufacturing Practices."
- Wow.- Riveting.
- Yes.- Horrific.
Long hard back book.
- But is this the bible of-
- This was the Bible and I remember going
(06:54):
and I found it on Amazon and it was $217.
- Oh my goodness.- For a book.
I remember in that momentsitting there going,
turned to my Amazon was like, "Honey,
if I buy this book, like we're all in."
- Yeah.- Like,
there's no turn in back.- No way, right.
- I'm about to spend $200 on a book.
He's like, "That's an expensive book."
I'm like, "I know it's an expensive book,
but this is the start.
If I do this, now I'mgoing to have to learn it,
(07:15):
we're in it."
Obviously there's manyother stories like that
where it's one step leads you to the next,
but the learning journey was long.
- That is great.
So tell us about how you connected
with your co-founder Sarah
and what put the two of you on the path
to do this company together?
- So me and Sarah workedtogether at Airbnb
(07:36):
and worked hand in hand
through all differentoperational challenges.
Funny enough, through ourjourney of having kids
and working together at Airbnb,
not once did we ever talkabout our feeding journey,
which is another problem in society
that we just don't talkabout these things.
- Yeah, yeah.
- I left, started Bobbie,personal pain point,
(07:59):
and about a year and ahalf into being in a place
where the product was up andrunning, we were ready to go.
I remember sitting theregoing, it's a long journey
to build a company.- Oh, yeah.
- And started hiring folks.
And I remember turningto Sarah and I was like,
I want you to do this
with me.- Wow.
- And I'll never forget at thetime, having investors say,
(08:20):
but you need to find your food scientist.
You need to find your technologist.
You need to find themanufacturer as your co-founder.
And at the end of the day,when you're on a long journey
of building a company,
it's actually completely the opposite.
You need to find your work wife.
And that's exactly what I did.
- So it's so interestingyou went with your gut
on such a critical decision so early on
(08:41):
when people are tellingyou to do one thing
and you knew what was right for you,
was that an easy decision to make
when you listened to yourself?
Or did you really haveto struggle with that?
- The decision itself was easy.
Continuing to question your gut
and push back on others,I think is something,
it's hard and you justcontinue to learn over time.
(09:01):
- So you set out to build aproduct, but also a workplace.
- Yes.- So what did you start with,
you know, the blank sheet of paper.
What do we want Bobbie tobe? What was the culture?
What was that like foryou in the early mission
you really wanted to adhere to?
- When you have an opportunityof working within a company,
and you know, I'll go backto early days at Airbnb
(09:23):
and you can tell that people are not there
because they want a paycheck.
They're there becausethey fundamentally believe
in the disruption, theproduct, the change,
even the people that they work with.
It is toxic energy in the most healthy,
beautiful, incredible way.
- Mm.- You are addicted to it.
(09:43):
And that energy Iremember having at Airbnb,
Sarah as well, was one that you walk away
and you think there'sno way you can go back.
- Mm.- And we have an opportunity
to replicating it and get tobuild a company where we say,
I am going to transitionfrom my personal life
into my professional lifeand it shouldn't feel harsh.
(10:03):
How do we create a workculture where I am here
because I want to be andnot because I have to be.
- Yeah. Which is rare by the way.
- It's so tough.- Especially to sustain that.
- Yes.- And so how did you go about
looking for employees who you wanted
on this mission with you?
- Well, you have tobecome very good at hiring
to be able to like assess that out.
(10:25):
- And in a startup you reallyneed to hire great people.
You don't, you can't really make mistakes
given there's a small team andyou have to get a lot done.
- I believe in the goodin humans in general.
And that if humans are in the right place,
good humans are in the right place.
They will figure out how to do the job.
(10:45):
And you hire people againwho have the appetite,
who have the passion,who want to be there.
Then it's our job as a culture
to be able to foster that and to build it.
- I love that.- So assessing it,
you've to spend just as muchtime interviewing people,
not just against the skillset
of what they're coming in to do,
but against the reason they'releaving their other job.
That at the time and earlyon was probably paying
(11:06):
a hell of a lot more than wewere able to as a startup.
- Yeah.- And you need to know
that they're willing tocome in and do this job
in the same way thatyou're waking up every day
wanting to succeed at it.
- I love that.
Okay, so you formulatethis new infant formula.
Where did you have togo? How did you test it?
(11:27):
How did you make sure that itwas going to be the right one?
- I'm laughing because Ithink if I knew very early on
exactly how to do it, Iprobably wouldn't have done it.
- So many people say that.- I know.
- So maybe it was good tonot know everything going in.
- It's definitely good.
Like that ounce of naivetyis probably the secret sauce
to succeeding, you learnon the go and then you go,
(11:48):
oh God, if I knew that,
I probably wouldn't have gotten this far.
- But I'm going.- You just keep going.
- Right?- Keep going.
- And then you also need tohave enough self-awareness
that you don't know it andyou're willing to keep learning.
But I essentially did aglobal standard review.
What were some of the bestinfant formulas in the world?
What does breast milk look like
and how do we get as close as possible
(12:10):
to breast milk in themost natural way possible?
- Yeah, yeah.- And I,
I must say this because Ialways worry about these things
getting taken out of context as well,
which is breast milk is beautiful.
And by no means was Itrying to find a world
where I was replacing breastmilk or creating something,
(12:30):
and it's really important to note this,
better than breast milk.
I think breast milk is themost beautiful dynamic,
truly dynamic thing thatyou will ever come across.
This is a mother who'sliterally producing milk
from their body.
- It's magical.- Yeah, it really is.
But not everyone can do it.
And the reductionist perspective
that sometimes I hear insociety where, which is,
(12:53):
yeah, but they shouldjust be breastfeeding.
I'm like,
but maybe they can't.- Right.
- And for so many different reasons.
And in absence of not being able to do it,
shouldn't the alternative bethe closest best possible?
- Absolutely, right.- Solution.
And if we keep takingthe reductionist path,
then you're going to have83% of society out there
(13:13):
on what everyone deems second best.
So on my journey, Iwanted to create something
that I felt could get as close as possible
in the most natural way.
So that in absence of notbeing able to breastfeed,
you don't feel guilty.
- Yes. Oh, I love that.
So I'm not a chemist,
and maybe this is a little over my head,
(13:33):
but why is it so hard toreplicate breast milk?
What's the hardest thing to do?
- So I said dynamic,
your breast milk on yoursecond day of feeding
is going to be differentto what your breast milk
looks like maybe on yoursecond week of feeding
and your second month of feeding.
Your diet, your stress,
(13:54):
your environment, youranatomical background
and physiology all plays into that.
So now you take howdifferent your breast milk is
in comparison to the nextwoman and the next woman,
it's very different.
So replicating somethingthat's meant to be standard
and safe in a way that is dynamic
(14:15):
at every given point in timeis extremely challenging.
So what one needs to beable to do is break down
what is the major componentsof breast milk, the carbs,
the proteins, and the fats.
And that's the most simpleway to be able to describe it.
- We get those. Yeah, we understand.
- That the key factorsto be able to help a baby
develop and thrive, whichis words the parents hear
all the time, are they developing?
(14:36):
Are they thriving? Are they growing?
Are you seeing them hitthe scales they need to.
And those factors are very important.
So you take the carbs, proteins, and fats
and you say, how can we mimic that
in the nutritional output of formula?
But what is hard ismatching the dynamic nature
of what breast milk provides.
(14:56):
- Hmm, and now you havea line that does that,
that has it at different stages,
presumably of differentstages of development.
- You can, and you can growwith it in different ways,
but there is the magicall in solution too,
to be able to ensurethat a baby is getting
the main nutritional output
they need across the board.
- Yeah.- And also knowing
that once a baby hits a certain point,
(15:17):
they're also getting othernutrition in other ways as well.
So knowing that thatsupplementation is happening,
but it's not just hardto mimic breast milk,
it's also hard to make sure
that you're creating analternative that is safe.
- Mm. Of course,
- We're not creatinga typical CPG product.
(15:37):
We're not a granola baror a typical beverage.
We are creating a product
that is feeding the mostvulnerable audience,
the sole nutrition,
and they're consumingnothing else for a long time.
- That is a lot of pressure.
That is a high, high bar.
So Bobbie got FDA approval,
the green light to launch in 2020.
That is such an accomplishment.Tell us about that.
(16:00):
What did it take to get there
and how did that makeyou feel once you did?
- How did it make me feel?
On one side it's like, it was amazing,
but you know, it wasalso about effing time.
That feeling of,
and I say this with humility,which is the feeling
(16:21):
of we have worked very hard to get here.
And it was like milk, sweat and tears
to get to that place.
We followed, we probably createdthe playbook in many ways.
And there was a lot ofdiligence and thoroughness,
quality testing, trialing,consumer research studies
to get to that place wherewhen you got the green light,
(16:44):
it wasn't a feeling of shock.
- No.- It was a feeling of reward
and it was about time.
- Mm, and the recognitionfor all the hard work.
So 2020, quite an unusual year, of course.
Very hard to be in a business,
very hard to be in ababy formula business.
There was a nationwide formula shortage
(17:04):
at a certain point too since pandemic.
Tell us about that.
How did you get through that
and how is Bobbie positioned differently
actually from other companies
that enabled you toaddress what was going on?
- A nationwide infant formula shortage.
So you start a company and you know,
especially what I get fromformula, it's controversial.
(17:24):
You know, most people I wouldget into conversations with,
I would, they'd say, what are you doing?
You know, what's your company?
I'd say, infant formula.
And they're looking for the exit.
They're like, I don't,
the last thing I want to dois talk about infant formula.
You know-- Moms might.
- They don't talk about their journey.
They, it had a dirtiness to it.
And I say that very publicly now
because I think a partof what we need to do
(17:44):
is change the conversation.- Yeah.
- So before the nationwideformula shortage,
it was forgotten.
And not just by theaverage person in society,
also by those working in it,
even within the FDA and someof the existing companies.
And I, again, I'm not pointing fingers,
I'm highlighting it in a way,
(18:05):
which is when an industryhasn't changed in decades-
- Right, right.- Complacency sets in.
- Mm.- So what happened was
two companies were feedingover 80% of the country,
- Which is a remarkable domination.
- Huge, and when we see thisin many other industries,
when two companies, aduopoly owns the majority
(18:26):
of the industry, you areessentially setting up
a lack of resiliency thatin case something happens,
how are you planning to combat that issue?
And what happened wasone company had a failure
and that failure requiredthem to close their doors
of which was absolutelythe right decision.
It was safety first above anything else.
(18:47):
But what we forgot was, as acountry for an essential good,
we became reliant on thosetwo companies feeding America.
So when one of them hadto close their doors,
of which was over 30%,it took several weeks
to get to a place where all ofa sudden shelves were empty.
And parents were driving, Imean, state to state almost.
(19:07):
- Right, right.- To find,
literally to find foodto feed their babies.
- Unbelievable stress.
- We were only on the market for one year.
Typical startup, you're all excited.
You're learning on the go,you're seeing your growth go up.
And when the shortage happened,
I'll never forget my Head of Growth.
She came to me and she said,"Laura, our customer count.
(19:28):
It just doubled overnight."
- Wow.- And on one side,
you're sitting there going,that's amazing, right?
Like, we're growing,
this is exactly what acompany wants to see.
But I took off my CEO hat at that time
and I remember feeling like a mother,
which I was, feeding my third child.
- Mm.- And,
I remember in that moment thinking,
(19:49):
we can't run out of infant formula.
- Right.- And she said,
"Well, we have some safety stock,
but if we do not turn offour top of funnel growth,
essentially turn off our website
and stop growing the business,
we will run out of formulafor our existing customers.
- Oh my goodness.
So now you're in justthis impossible dilemma.
- It was, it was literally thatgrowth innovator's dilemma.
(20:11):
And you're sitting there going
and everyone's going,"Well, will it be over?"
I'm like, "I have no clue."
- No one knew.
- Like, no one's lookinginto a crystal ball.
Like how long will thisformula shortage last?
You would assume they'd catchup and make more quickly.
You'd assume the government'sgoing to step in and fix it.
So I got on with my investors
and we started debating what do we do?
And I'll never forget afew of them on the side
(20:33):
of just like, well,I'm sure it'll be over.
Just keep growing. It seems ridiculous.
Don't turn it off.
A few guys is like, but in the case it is,
this isn't a good situation.
We're not a sofa where it'slike, we're coming back soon.
- Right, right.- It doesn't work that way.
So it was less than 24 hours later,
I turned to our platform team and said,
turn off the website.
- Wow.- We can't take the risk.
And we put out a message andit got very mixed reactions.
(20:56):
And that message was,
we have made a promise toour existing subscribers
and I will hold that commitment
that whatever product we produce,
we need to keep it for them.
And you know, if you wantto join our wait list,
we're here for you.
And it got resounding support
from those that felt supported.
And even those that wanted to be part of
(21:16):
our future community said,I want to be part of that.
- Yes.- I want to be part
of the company and the leadership who says
we take care of our parents.
- That's an amazing promise.
- It was a good promise.- But really tough.
I mean, I really, I'm tryingto think in your mind,
when you're sitting theregetting different views
from your investors as to what to do,
of course the founderwants to grow, grow, grow
(21:36):
at all costs.
Why would you ever want toturn off customer acquisition?
And yet you were in a situation
where not many people have to do that.
Where there's a product that'sliterally not to be found
with children on the other end.
I mean, that's quite remarkable.
- We became the only companyat the end of the shortage
(21:57):
that was able to continueto feed its customers.
And we had to keep ourwebsite off for seven months.
- Wow. Off for new.
- Completely.- Interesting.
- And you know, what are, I mean,
it's a case study initself, supply and demand,
typical problems, but it's,
I think the case studyis not supply and demand.
(22:18):
I think the case study is your reaction.
And what are the thingsthat you do in the moment
that then result in theknock on effects of growth
and loyalty and organic growth.
- Yes.- After the fact.
- So tell us about that.
So you could turn it back on,
the shortage was coming to an end.
How did the new customers find you then?
(22:39):
And did you see a bump incustomers that couldn't,
you know, join you until then?
- So we, you kind of createyour own problem, right?
You create a wait list and the wait list
is growing and growing and growing.
And it got to the placewhere you're like, oh God,
we have 40,000 parents,we have 50,000, 60.
- Wow.- The problem is that
now you're staring at thewait list and you're going,
guys, we have to keep producing product
to serve the wait list.
- Right.- So you're trying to build
(23:00):
your safety stock andthe wait list is going up
and the safety stock has to keep going up.
And at one point we actuallyhad to cut off the wait list.
- Oh no.- Because otherwise,
then we were promisingpeople they'd get off
when they couldn't.
So it was a sequencing game
where our forecasters hadto very carefully figure out
how are we promising justenough that we continue to have,
(23:22):
so it was probably another year,
a full year later post the2022 shortage all through 2023,
where it was letting peopleslowly off our wait list
to be able to come on.
But over the course of those two years,
we grew 100% organically.- Wow.
Never happens.- And as a D2C business,
predominantly a directto consumer business,
(23:44):
not having to go payand acquire customers,
it allowed us to lookat our marketing dollars
in a very creative way.
- Mm, love that.
And to instead, rather thanseeing what we were coming out
and doing and saying asa way to sell product,
let's come out and try and change culture.
Change the conversation
and be part of change for the industry.
(24:06):
- And so did you do different campaigns
with different messages
that you're planning?- Exactly.
- And what did you want tosay to everybody at the time?
- Well, we did a fabulous campaign
with one of our keypartners, Ashley Graham.
She just had her two twins.
We'd no product at the time.
And it was all about combo feeding.
(24:27):
And the message was,no matter how you feed,
your babies will result in the same way.
And to give peopleconfidence, that combo feeding
and changing the conversationand the culture of feeding
and to end essentially the feeding wars
was what we needed to do.
So we put out a big culture campaign
and that culture campaigngot more attention
(24:49):
for the conversationthan it did the product.
- Wow, which of coursewill have knock on effects
on the product, but also position you as,
you're not just a companyselling infant formula,
you are selling communityor building community.
- Yes.- And conversation.
- Exactly.- The fact that you
also were doing things differentlywith a subscription model
is really interesting.
So tell me about the experience you wanted
(25:11):
new parents to have versusgoing to the drugstore
late at night and havingto look at shelves.
- You know, it's not overly radical,
but it was one of thosethings in the moment
of thinking what is our business model?
And this was a product thatyou want to be able to get
reliably, consistently every month.
- You need it.- You need it and again,
(25:32):
like I said, it, it is more,
it is an essential good,unlike a typical CPG product
where one month you wantwant it, the other you don't.
So by being able tocalculate what age a baby is,
how much are they feeding,we could get to a level
of predictability for howmuch formula you need.
So really it came down to reliable service
(25:53):
and making sure that therewasn't any disruption
in someone receiving theproduct that they need.
- Yeah, yeah.
- And it's not just the D2C side of it is,
we've gotten so much joy too,
doing fun things related to the products.
When you open the box,I'm so proud of this.
We create these unique stickers
and these unique stickers have messages,
(26:13):
messages of support and advice.
Pats on the back, making you smile.
- I love that.
- So when you open your box of eight cans,
each one will have a different sticker.
- Nice.- And a message of support.
And I can't even begin to tell you
out of our customer service tickets,
which we did not expect to see,
more of them are related to their love
(26:33):
and even recommendationsfor what should go
on the stickers-- So funny, really?
- Than calls or complaintsin relation to the product.
- That's when you know you'reonto something really special
when your customers are willing
to do your job for you actually, right?
- Yes.- Create those stickers.
Build a community, they'reprobably telling their friends.
They're looking at it with their partners.
That's amazing. That's really special.
(26:54):
- It's such a joy.
You know, then all of a suddenyou're creating a department
for people-- For people to, yes.
- You know, contact in about the stickers,
but not a job you thought you'd have to.
- Yeah.- Well I'm sorry to say
I had my children well beforeyou had founded your company
because I would've reallyenjoyed using the product.
So let's talk about your other experience,
your other work experience before Bobbie.
So you worked at Airbnb asDirector of Host Operations.
(27:15):
What did you learn there fromsuch a unique company as well?
They were also breakingboundaries and doing things new.
And what did you learn there
that really influencedyour leadership at Bobbie?
- I feel like we had avery, very fortunate seat
in the company.
And I remember very acutely being early on
at Airbnb and getting a front row seat,
(27:35):
watching our relatively young founders
and watching the CEO ofAirbnb, who is a friend,
a fabulous leader.
And I am honored, I mean truly.
And I say that with so much gusto
to have a front row seatwatching what they built.
(27:55):
- Yeah.- And,
how it shaped my leadership is,
I think the biggest thingwas, never forget one story.
It was early on and to the CEO of Airbnb,
he came in and he announceda new hire and he said,
"We're going to hire a Chief Council."
And he said, "And I'll be honest,
I didn't know what aChief Council Officer was
until yesterday," and hegave us the definition.
(28:17):
And I remember thinking, wow,
how beautiful is it thatyou have come forward
with that level of vulnerability
and you recognize the learning journey,
'cause it is a learning journey.
And if you are not opening your aperture,
and as my dad would always say,
like one of the greatest dangers in life
is thinking you know it all.
- Oh yeah.- And you can,
you literally cannot disrupt something.
(28:39):
I mean, the literal definitionis being able to come in
and change something, inwhich case you have to learn.
- Yeah.- So that front row seat
at Airbnb in that past experience was,
I watched a group of people,
from the CEO the whole way down,
recognize that theywere taking something on
that they needed to learn.
And I definitely, I thinkit's one of the biggest things
(28:59):
I apply to my day-to-day job.
- Mm, and how would that come across,
so for your own employees,what would they see?
- What they see is vulnerabilityin not knowing something
and trying something, opennessand forgiveness to fail.
And in the moments of maybethe ball getting dropped,
standing up and owning it and recognizing
what were the two or threethings that we maybe learnt
(29:21):
in that moment that we getto apply as we try it again.
But going from zero to one is really hard.
- Oh yeah, I bet.- And it doesn't,
going from zero to onein a disruptive company
doesn't stop just becausethe product's being made
and the idea's now in, you know, motion,
going from zero to onehappens in your processes,
your systems, yourcreation of new standards.
(29:43):
Right Now we own a manufacturing facility
and we're saying, can wedisrupt what standards look like
in the way something's manufactured?
Let's redo it, let's rethink it.
- So when Bobbie came onto the market,
it was the first babyformula brand in six years,
new one to be released
and is now the fastestgrowing brand since the 1980s.
And that's unbelievablebecause as you say,
this was a pretty mature market,
(30:05):
probably had been growing very steadily.
It's based on obviously howmany babies get born every year.
What do you think reallyled to such a big demand
and such a great response that you saw?
- I think two things.
I think the first, my kind of the,
my business investorside of me will answer,
which is it is a big marketthat hasn't been untouched,
(30:26):
or has been untouched for decades.
There was a gap.
And I think as a motherit was very obvious
that it was broken andthere was a huge appetite
to come in for something different.
And there was a black market.
But why I wasn't beingtouched was because the people
who were seeing it were not in a position,
(30:47):
in their most vulnerable state
in their first year ofhaving a baby to say,
"Hey, let me just pause inthe middle of questioning
my entire identity to godo something about this."
So I honestly think thatit was one of those things,
and I now hear it from people when I say
what Bobbie is and what got me here.
I always get the reaction,oh, that, that was smart.
(31:07):
Like, that was a broken industry.
- In hindsight, yes.- In hindsight.
So I do think to take something on,
you need to see that it's broken,
but you also need to havethe experience and confidence
to go do it, and I thinkthose two things collectively,
someone feeling the problem-
- Yes.- May not,
there wasn't enough people out there
(31:27):
in the moment who also feltlike I could go take this on.
I think secondary was we saw this
as a community-driven brand from day one.
And it is.
And I fundamentally believe that.
My story was the thing that started it.
But it's every otherperson who uses Bobbie,
who wants to be part of Bobbie,who wants to join Bobbie,
(31:50):
their stories are fueling the growth.
And we're giving them a platform
where their story can finally be told.
Because it is one that's important.
- Yes.- It's one that needs
to be shared, how you feed your child,
how you're going through those emotions,
the symbolism of everything around it
and the support needed.
(32:11):
It is very community driven.
- You mentioned at one point feeding wars
and how there's both sides of this issue.
Breast is best versus formula.
But you also talkedabout the combo feeding
and maybe doing both.
You're really tapping intosomething that's so primal,
I think for so many women
who are facing this situationand the fathers too.
(32:33):
How do you think you've beenadvancing this conversation?
How do you want it to be advanced
in terms of having a legacy
for what you're able to contribute?
- Well, I don't think it needs to be about
one versus the other.
And again, this is wheremy investors will say like,
no, you got to, you got to push Bobbie.
You got to say Bobbie's best.
I don't, I think whateverworks for you is what's best.
(32:55):
And I want our legacy, Bobbie's legacy
to get to a place where feedingand questioning how you feed
and feeling guilty about how you feed
and people judging how you feedis not part of the dialogue.
- Yeah.- You need to get back
to the joys, the ups and downs,the becoming of the parent.
That is what people need to focus on.
Not the how are you feeding your child.
(33:16):
- Right.- Let's move away
from how we're feeding,what we're feeding,
to the joys of parenting.
So I want us to drive ourself out of a job
would be the legacy.
How do you get to the place
where we have fundamentallychanged conversation
and culture is following thatpeople are not sitting back
going, I really hope people don't think
formula's in my bottle,that needs to change.
(33:37):
- Yeah, I have to ask you this question
as a female founder, tell meabout the fundraising part
of your experience.
What was unsavory about that?
Did people question, wasthis a viable business?
Are you going to stop whenyou have your children?
You know, what did youhear from investors?
- I was eight and a half months pregnant
with my second child when Istarted to go out and fundraise
(34:00):
for the first time.- Okay.
So let's pause on that for a minute.
So an eight and a halfmonths pregnant woman
is coming into investorswho generally don't see
that kind of founder.- Yeah.
And if they do, theyprobably make assumptions.
- What they saw was,
instead of a woman who wascoming in to pitch them,
who had the business acumen,
a resume to be able to prove
(34:22):
that she could do this job.- Yeah.
- I wasn't a 20-year-old founder.
I had experienced workingin Google and Airbnb.
I was a previous investor.
So much of my resume shouldprove that walking in there
with a very strong business pitch
would've had them go, I'm all in.
Instead what they saw was amom with a passion project.
(34:43):
- Ah, your hobby.- My hobby.
- By the way, breast milk isnot generally people's hobby.
So I'm not really surewhere they would going that.
- No, no.- But, okay.
- Yeah, powdered milk was not my dream.
- Right.
- I never thought I wouldsee myself being here.
- What do you do, collect it?
- It was a hard shift.- Yeah.
- And again, you'llnever hear me speak ill
of anyone or anything.
So I, again, I say this,
which is, these arejust natural challenges
(35:06):
that we're up against in life in general.
And I say we, I mean I'msure that there's a male
in a different situation tryingto do something different
who has their own story.
Cards were stacked against me.
I didn't come from theworld of infant formulas.
That was the first judgment.
Why would you jump from technologyinto CPG and making milk?
That's right, you want it for your baby.
- Mm.- So I was missed out
(35:29):
as being seen as the entrepreneur
with a real market opportunity to succeed.
And instead the assumptionscame to the table
and the assumptions were amom with a passion project.
So it was hard.
I spoke to 68 investors.- Oh my goodness.
- Of which four of themended up investing.
And I woke up every day
through those final weeks of my pregnancy,
(35:50):
waking up to four new pitches,
five new nos.
- Oh my goodness.
- And you hear, youknow, it's also painful
'cause you're reading, youknow, with one eye open,
you're exhausted.- Still have a baby,
by the way.- I'm ready
for this child to come.
Oh, I still have my other child.
- Still first.
- My husband who's like, youshould have stayed in the job
because it would've gotten parental leave.
Like, what are we doing?
Everything in life,you're being questioned.
(36:11):
I remember reading those emails thinking,
is this the email that'sgoing to push me over the edge
and say, fold it, this isn't worth it.
You know, you can go get another job.
Like, let's just move on.
And the emails were everything from,
I don't think this is going to work.
No one's going to feel,
no one's ever going to feel passionate
about wanting to sell infant formula.
(36:32):
This will never be aconsumer driven brand.
You'd never get, because you know,
I talked about how we need toget people who had platforms-
- Yes.- To be able to come out
and actually share their story
because they're also parents and mothers.
- Yeah.- And dads.
No celebrity would ever want to talk about
infant formula and their feeding journey.
I mean, it was one no afteranother with an excuse,
(36:52):
after an excuse for not investing.
And yeah, I talked aboutzero to one being hard,
that was really like zero zero to-
- Biggest mountain youhave to climb first.
- It was, and how easy it would've been,
like now thinking through this,
how easy it would've been tojust wake up that one morning
and say, nah, I only spent $200 on a book.
(37:14):
Let's just move on, you know?
- But thankfully youdidn't for so many people
and their babies.
So what must make you feel really proud
is hearing from your customers
about what they thinkand how you helped them
and how you were there ina very, very tough time.
Can you share some of yourcustomer feedback with us?
- I get into this habit now every day.
I mean, obviously when youstart to build a company,
(37:35):
now all of a sudden you'removing between meetings
where you're dealing withsupply chain problems
and just the woes of building a company.
- Operations, yeah.
- I mean it's constant,implementing NetSuite.
Not the most fun meeting, butyou got to do these things.
But I've gotten into thehabit now of every morning
with a cup of coffeebefore my day kicks off,
we have a Slack channel
and that Slack channel isBobbie customer love letters.
(37:58):
Every day, there isdozens of love letters.
And if I just, even in ourSlack that we have right now,
yesterday is one that got put in here
and our customer service team,
they'll email customer service,
and I really mean this,they're not like two sentences.
These are love letters that are essays.
- Wow, touched.- And they send them in.
(38:20):
- Yeah.- Okay.
So here's the first one from yesterday.
Hi. It's a DM on Instagram, by the way.
We are currently on daythree in the hospital
with our two week old baby boy
who is fighting a respiratoryvirus and is on oxygen.
And I just wanted to say how Iliterally cried, all in caps,
happy tears when I pulledout the can of Bobbie
(38:41):
I had pushed into my pack
before heading to the emergencydepartment this morning
and it reads this, and she sends a photo
and it's a photo of our sticker.
- Stickers.- Stickers on the can
and it says, wisdom from our Bobbie Fam
is that you're strongerthan you think you are.
- Aw.- This mother is sitting
in the emergency departmentwith her baby who's on oxygen.
And she has decided in thatmoment to pull out Instagram
(39:05):
and send our company, which is a brand,
but she doesn't see it as a brand.
She, we have to keep remembering this.
We are not selling a typical company.
We are both saving lives.
We are helping peoplethrough what is a blip.
You know those ECG, you know,
charts?- Yes.
- I believe becoming a parent,
(39:26):
in the first year ofparenting is the biggest blip
you will see on your life map.
And we as a company, we as the brand,
we have the privilege, thebeautiful, beautiful privilege
of getting to play a role in their lives.
- So Laura, Bobbie is not just a brand,
it's an advocate for change.
So tell us about your advocacy efforts
and Bobbie for Change.
(39:47):
What is that and whatare you trying to do?
- So one on my team cameto me a few years ago
and she said, "Laura,you'll never guess what.
Did you realize that amother who's undergone
a double mastectomy isgiven a free breast pump
and sticky nipples, butthey're not given formula
to feed their babies?"
And when I tell you she came forward
(40:07):
to the level of passion and furylike, you want to feed this?
Okay, what are we going to do?
She's like, "We got todo something about this.
We got to get loud about the fact
that there is a policy out there
that isn't helping moms
through one of their toughest moments."
And we decided to, in that first year,
take a few mothers who'dundergone a mastectomy
who weren't able to feed their baby
(40:29):
in the way that they wanted
and to be able to sponsor themfor a full year on Bobbie.
- Oh wow.- That became the impetus
and the moment where we decided we exist
for so much more thancreating powdered milk.
So we created Bobbie for change,
and under Bobbie for change,we fight for paid leave,
(40:51):
new insurance policies, theBlack maternal mortality crisis.
We look at issues that areancillary to what we do,
but are the most important things
for our constituents, which are parents.
- Yes.- When I start getting
into these stats, I mean somany people have come to me
and they say, I'm so happythat you do Bobbie for Change.
(41:12):
Sometimes they say it andthey don't even realize
that we also sell infant formula.
- Oh, that's incredible.- We've gotten to a place
as a business where our very existence
to fight for the issuesthat matter to our customers
is what gets us up every day.
And these aren't comingjust from me in top down.
These are our employees whoare coming forward saying,
(41:34):
"Hey, I just had my baby
and they're in the NICU andour policy doesn't cover us
to be able to take time offfor a baby that's in the NICU
weeks before leading up."
So what does that do?
It fires us up to not onlychange our internal policy-
- Yeah.- But then go create
an open-sourced policyso that other companies
can then adopt it.- That's incredible.
(41:54):
- So here's the other thing I'dsay about Bobbie for Change,
which I think a lot ofcompanies need to internalize
in the same way that industries change
and that consumers taste change,
work cultures do as well.
And there is somethinghappening right now,
which is when people decideto go to work every day,
they're not seeing a transition
from their personal life toprofessional life, it's all one.
(42:17):
And if a company is not figuring out
what they're doing toengage their employees
on what they really care about
and find that activism arm
that is worth them lookingback saying, that's my legacy.
My legacy is changing that policy,
helping those parents, changing laws,
(42:37):
then what's it all worth for anyway?
- You're really touchingsuch a nerve with me
because I see more and more people
and younger people and their careers,
saying I want to cometo work for a purpose.
I don't want to haveto wait my whole career
and do the purposeful work at the end.
So I think you're totally right
and when I hear you alsoengage with consumers,
it really makes me feel likeyou're creating something
that's going to long last the years
(42:59):
that you sell formula to them,
that you're going tobe there as a platform
and a community like you mentioned,
and that's a brandthat's with you for life.
- Hear, hear.
I want people to be able to wear Bobbie
loud and proud on a sweater
even if they've never been a parent,
they've never used the product,
but they are so connected to our mission
(43:20):
and what we stand for,
that they're willing towear it on their chest.
- I'm sure they will. It's so powerful.
I mean, I just hope that would-be founders
listen to your story and say,that's going to motivate me.
And would-be investorslisten to that story and say,
maybe those assumptions Imake about hobby businesses
and women out there, I canput aside for other things.
(43:42):
- And if they want to email me
and say they missed out, I'mtotally fine accepting those.
- And just recommend it to their friends.
Laura, you've been sowonderful to talk to.
What a pleasure.
It is really inspiring to seewhat you built with Bobbie
just from your personalexperience through thinking,
through culture and aproduct and a community.
So we wish you the very best
as you continue to move forward.
(44:03):
And I'll have to recommend it, I guess,
to other mothers with babies in my life.
- Sam, thank you.
- Thank you for listeningto my conversation
with Laura Modi of Bobbie.
This was such an inspiring conversation
to hear how not only she metthe market need for a product,
but really developed a community.
(44:24):
And I hope that would-befounders out there,
take inspiration from her
and push forward to follow your dreams.
If you enjoyed this podcast,
please follow on your favorite podcast app
and please share with others.
I hope today that you learn something
that will help you lead with purpose.
My entire life,
(00:00):
you prepare for something,you succeed at it.
And in this moment, here Iam doing something I wish
and I hoped and I wanted to do so badly
and I wasn't anatomicallyable to feed my child.
- It really gets to the heart.
Welcome back to the "WomenOn the Move" podcast.
(00:21):
I'm your host, Sam Saperstein.
In this episode, I'mspeaking with Laura Modi,
the CEO and Co-Founder
of the organic infantformula brand, Bobbie.
From her early days as a first time mom
navigating formula options in a drugstore
to founding Bobbie,
Laura's journey reflects her commitment
to revolutionizing theinfant formula industry.
She's providing a better,
(00:42):
more transparent formulaoption for parents,
free from unnecessary additives,
while also focusing on fostering a culture
of confidence in parenting.
Before founding Bobbie,
Laura played a significant role at Airbnb
as the Director of Host Operations,
where she helped shape thecompany's international expansion
and community building.
(01:02):
I'm so excited to be speakingher today to hear about
how she's taking on infant formula.
Laura, welcome to the"Women on the Move" podcast.
It is great to have you on with us.
- Thank you Sam, pleasure to be here.
- So what we love to dowith our founders is go back
to your origin story, whyyou created the business.
So take us back to that daywhen you were in the drugstore
looking at formula options.
(01:26):
- PTSD.- What does that mean?
- Back to that moment.
They always say it likestarts with a problem.
Well, this is a visceral one.
I just assumed I would breastfeed.
I went into motherhood,Irish Catholic woman,
thought it would be easy.
And you're told by society
and everyone around you thatthis is something you can do.
This is completely natural.
(01:47):
So you don't even goin thinking otherwise.
I don't think I had eventhought of infant formula
before having a child.
But I went in and it wasn't that natural.
I got mastitis several days in.
For anyone who's listeningand they've heard of mastitis,
I have no doubt they'reprobably shuddering
because it is an infection of the breast
where your tissue gets damaged,
(02:09):
there's blisters, there's blood.
It is not the best moment.
On top of the fact that as a new mother,
you're also not feeling yourself.
You're 40 pounds overweight,you've got dark circles,
you're questioning youridentity in every single way.
Who am I? Where am I going?
Will I ever be myself?
And in your most vulnerable state,
you feel like a complete failure.
(02:30):
And those emotions are hard to shake
because like my entire life,
you prepare for something,you succeed at it.
And in this moment, here Iam doing something I wish
and I hoped and I wanted to do so badly
and I wasn't anatomicallyable to feed my child.
- I really gets to the heart.
- It does.
And you know, we'll get intolike more of like why Bobbie
(02:53):
really exists, but it'sthe emotions and you know,
people talk about Bobbie
and it's the connectionto feeling not guilty
just as much as a good product.
- So there you were,
you needed to buy formula
for your newborn.- I needed to buy formula.
- And you're looking at theoptions at the drugstore.
What do you see there?
- Well, to the left and right,I saw cat food and diapers.
- Okay, so now this is whatyou're focused on, right?
(03:15):
This is a choice.
- Like the middle aisle of apharmacy, a place that you go
for a medical solution.
- Yes.- Not food.
It didn't feel natural.
It's 10:00 PM at night.
Oh, even worse, I had to ring a button
to get someone to open up.
- Oh, it was locked.- It was locked.
So now you almost feellike you were asking
for permission in a waythat you felt shamed.
You go, you buy the product.
(03:35):
And I remember that feeling of,
I really hope they give methe bag that isn't transparent
because I would like to get from here home
without anyone knowing thatfive days into having a baby,
I need to feed her formula.
I mean I get emotional thinking about-
- It's a lot.
That's heavy.- How vulnerable.
It is heavy.
And you know, we'll get to thefeeling of eight years later
with the fire and passion tosay, oh, it doesn't matter.
(03:57):
But at the time it does matter.
- Yeah.- I turned the can around
and I remember seeing ingredients
that I knew in that moment Iprobably wouldn't feed myself.
- Hmm, like?
- Corn syrup, let's use the obvious one.
Palm oil, which youknow, is directly related
to things like constipation.
- And then ingredients or wordsthat I'd never even heard of
(04:20):
or hard to articulate.- Right.
- And I think a lot of people could say,
well just because you can't articulate it
doesn't mean it's not important.
That's true.
All of that said, in mymost vulnerable moment
in that place, I didn't feelcomfortable feeding her this.
So I'm reading it, I'm feelingbad, I'm feeling guilty.
And on top of it,
I knew there should havebeen a better option.
- Yeah, for sure.- I, me and my husband,
(04:41):
we got into the conversation.
It's like everything else in life,
you look around, has evolved,
from our granola bars to the cereal
to everything in this home.
And why is it that the sameformula I'm buying my daughter
is probably the same oneI was fed 40 years ago?
- Right. Great question.
- That's crazy.- Yeah.
- So anyway, the genesis was a mix
(05:02):
of questioning why theindustry hasn't changed
to the ingredients in theproduct to my emotional guilt
and vulnerability.
And it set me off on what Iwould refer to as my first
and only PhD of studying the ins and outs
and becoming maniacally obsessed
with understanding infant formula.
- So break that down for us a little bit.
(05:23):
You know, you think aboutwhat you feed babies
should seem all natural.
Maybe you breastfeed.
So that is, you know, nature's milk.
How do you even study this?
And could you even whipthis up in your kitchen
like a lot of founders do?
How do you even make this?
- Okay, no, you cannotwhip it up in your kitchen.
But I had to, I had to learn that through,
you know, osmosis of learning this.
(05:45):
That's a great question'cause it brings me back
to even trying to disrupt an industry.
And I remember that feeling.
I want to take on this industry,
but it wasn't likethere was a yellow pages
of infant formula companies
that you could call andfind out how to do this.
There was no playbook online.
The FDA didn't have a public phone number
that you could just pick up and call.
And it was a lot of coldcalling on LinkedIn,
(06:09):
trying to find people in the industry
that'd be willing to have a phone call.
I remember doing a Googlesearch for a baby formula expert
and I landed on babyformulaexpert.com.
I found a woman on it.
I made a phone call and wespent three hours one evening
talking about it.
She educated me on theproduct, the science,
the matching of breastmilk, the importance of it.
One very vivid memoryI have is being in bed.
(06:32):
I was like, I'm prettysure I want to do this.
And I was trying to finda book to help me learn
how to be able to understandit from formula and the process
and the manufacturingand science behind it.
And I found one book,it was the "Biochemistry
of Infant FormulaManufacturing Practices."
- Wow.- Riveting.
- Yes.- Horrific.
Long hard back book.
- But is this the bible of-
- This was the Bible and I remember going
(06:54):
and I found it on Amazon and it was $217.
- Oh my goodness.- For a book.
I remember in that momentsitting there going,
turned to my Amazon was like, "Honey,
if I buy this book, like we're all in."
- Yeah.- Like,
there's no turn in back.- No way, right.
- I'm about to spend $200 on a book.
He's like, "That's an expensive book."
I'm like, "I know it's an expensive book,
but this is the start.
If I do this, now I'mgoing to have to learn it,
(07:15):
we're in it."
Obviously there's manyother stories like that
where it's one step leads you to the next,
but the learning journey was long.
- That is great.
So tell us about how you connected
with your co-founder Sarah
and what put the two of you on the path
to do this company together?
- So me and Sarah workedtogether at Airbnb
(07:36):
and worked hand in hand
through all differentoperational challenges.
Funny enough, through ourjourney of having kids
and working together at Airbnb,
not once did we ever talkabout our feeding journey,
which is another problem in society
that we just don't talkabout these things.
- Yeah, yeah.
- I left, started Bobbie,personal pain point,
(07:59):
and about a year and ahalf into being in a place
where the product was up andrunning, we were ready to go.
I remember sitting theregoing, it's a long journey
to build a company.- Oh, yeah.
- And started hiring folks.
And I remember turningto Sarah and I was like,
I want you to do this
with me.- Wow.
- And I'll never forget at thetime, having investors say,
(08:20):
but you need to find your food scientist.
You need to find your technologist.
You need to find themanufacturer as your co-founder.
And at the end of the day,when you're on a long journey
of building a company,
it's actually completely the opposite.
You need to find your work wife.
And that's exactly what I did.
- So it's so interestingyou went with your gut
on such a critical decision so early on
(08:41):
when people are tellingyou to do one thing
and you knew what was right for you,
was that an easy decision to make
when you listened to yourself?
Or did you really haveto struggle with that?
- The decision itself was easy.
Continuing to question your gut
and push back on others,I think is something,
it's hard and you justcontinue to learn over time.
(09:01):
- So you set out to build aproduct, but also a workplace.
- Yes.- So what did you start with,
you know, the blank sheet of paper.
What do we want Bobbie tobe? What was the culture?
What was that like foryou in the early mission
you really wanted to adhere to?
- When you have an opportunityof working within a company,
and you know, I'll go backto early days at Airbnb
(09:23):
and you can tell that people are not there
because they want a paycheck.
They're there becausethey fundamentally believe
in the disruption, theproduct, the change,
even the people that they work with.
It is toxic energy in the most healthy,
beautiful, incredible way.
- Mm.- You are addicted to it.
(09:43):
And that energy Iremember having at Airbnb,
Sarah as well, was one that you walk away
and you think there'sno way you can go back.
- Mm.- And we have an opportunity
to replicating it and get tobuild a company where we say,
I am going to transitionfrom my personal life
into my professional lifeand it shouldn't feel harsh.
(10:03):
How do we create a workculture where I am here
because I want to be andnot because I have to be.
- Yeah. Which is rare by the way.
- It's so tough.- Especially to sustain that.
- Yes.- And so how did you go about
looking for employees who you wanted
on this mission with you?
- Well, you have tobecome very good at hiring
to be able to like assess that out.
(10:25):
- And in a startup you reallyneed to hire great people.
You don't, you can't really make mistakes
given there's a small team andyou have to get a lot done.
- I believe in the goodin humans in general.
And that if humans are in the right place,
good humans are in the right place.
They will figure out how to do the job.
(10:45):
And you hire people againwho have the appetite,
who have the passion,who want to be there.
Then it's our job as a culture
to be able to foster that and to build it.
- I love that.- So assessing it,
you've to spend just as muchtime interviewing people,
not just against the skillset
of what they're coming in to do,
but against the reason they'releaving their other job.
That at the time and earlyon was probably paying
(11:06):
a hell of a lot more than wewere able to as a startup.
- Yeah.- And you need to know
that they're willing tocome in and do this job
in the same way thatyou're waking up every day
wanting to succeed at it.
- I love that.
Okay, so you formulatethis new infant formula.
Where did you have togo? How did you test it?
(11:27):
How did you make sure that itwas going to be the right one?
- I'm laughing because Ithink if I knew very early on
exactly how to do it, Iprobably wouldn't have done it.
- So many people say that.- I know.
- So maybe it was good tonot know everything going in.
- It's definitely good.
Like that ounce of naivetyis probably the secret sauce
to succeeding, you learnon the go and then you go,
(11:48):
oh God, if I knew that,
I probably wouldn't have gotten this far.
- But I'm going.- You just keep going.
- Right?- Keep going.
- And then you also need tohave enough self-awareness
that you don't know it andyou're willing to keep learning.
But I essentially did aglobal standard review.
What were some of the bestinfant formulas in the world?
What does breast milk look like
and how do we get as close as possible
(12:10):
to breast milk in themost natural way possible?
- Yeah, yeah.- And I,
I must say this because Ialways worry about these things
getting taken out of context as well,
which is breast milk is beautiful.
And by no means was Itrying to find a world
where I was replacing breastmilk or creating something,
(12:30):
and it's really important to note this,
better than breast milk.
I think breast milk is themost beautiful dynamic,
truly dynamic thing thatyou will ever come across.
This is a mother who'sliterally producing milk
from their body.
- It's magical.- Yeah, it really is.
But not everyone can do it.
And the reductionist perspective
that sometimes I hear insociety where, which is,
(12:53):
yeah, but they shouldjust be breastfeeding.
I'm like,
but maybe they can't.- Right.
- And for so many different reasons.
And in absence of not being able to do it,
shouldn't the alternative bethe closest best possible?
- Absolutely, right.- Solution.
And if we keep takingthe reductionist path,
then you're going to have83% of society out there
(13:13):
on what everyone deems second best.
So on my journey, Iwanted to create something
that I felt could get as close as possible
in the most natural way.
So that in absence of notbeing able to breastfeed,
you don't feel guilty.
- Yes. Oh, I love that.
So I'm not a chemist,
and maybe this is a little over my head,
(13:33):
but why is it so hard toreplicate breast milk?
What's the hardest thing to do?
- So I said dynamic,
your breast milk on yoursecond day of feeding
is going to be differentto what your breast milk
looks like maybe on yoursecond week of feeding
and your second month of feeding.
Your diet, your stress,
(13:54):
your environment, youranatomical background
and physiology all plays into that.
So now you take howdifferent your breast milk is
in comparison to the nextwoman and the next woman,
it's very different.
So replicating somethingthat's meant to be standard
and safe in a way that is dynamic
(14:15):
at every given point in timeis extremely challenging.
So what one needs to beable to do is break down
what is the major componentsof breast milk, the carbs,
the proteins, and the fats.
And that's the most simpleway to be able to describe it.
- We get those. Yeah, we understand.
- That the key factorsto be able to help a baby
develop and thrive, whichis words the parents hear
all the time, are they developing?
(14:36):
Are they thriving? Are they growing?
Are you seeing them hitthe scales they need to.
And those factors are very important.
So you take the carbs, proteins, and fats
and you say, how can we mimic that
in the nutritional output of formula?
But what is hard ismatching the dynamic nature
of what breast milk provides.
(14:56):
- Hmm, and now you havea line that does that,
that has it at different stages,
presumably of differentstages of development.
- You can, and you can growwith it in different ways,
but there is the magicall in solution too,
to be able to ensurethat a baby is getting
the main nutritional output
they need across the board.
- Yeah.- And also knowing
that once a baby hits a certain point,
(15:17):
they're also getting othernutrition in other ways as well.
So knowing that thatsupplementation is happening,
but it's not just hardto mimic breast milk,
it's also hard to make sure
that you're creating analternative that is safe.
- Mm. Of course,
- We're not creatinga typical CPG product.
(15:37):
We're not a granola baror a typical beverage.
We are creating a product
that is feeding the mostvulnerable audience,
the sole nutrition,
and they're consumingnothing else for a long time.
- That is a lot of pressure.
That is a high, high bar.
So Bobbie got FDA approval,
the green light to launch in 2020.
That is such an accomplishment.Tell us about that.
(16:00):
What did it take to get there
and how did that makeyou feel once you did?
- How did it make me feel?
On one side it's like, it was amazing,
but you know, it wasalso about effing time.
That feeling of,
and I say this with humility,which is the feeling
(16:21):
of we have worked very hard to get here.
And it was like milk, sweat and tears
to get to that place.
We followed, we probably createdthe playbook in many ways.
And there was a lot ofdiligence and thoroughness,
quality testing, trialing,consumer research studies
to get to that place wherewhen you got the green light,
(16:44):
it wasn't a feeling of shock.
- No.- It was a feeling of reward
and it was about time.
- Mm, and the recognitionfor all the hard work.
So 2020, quite an unusual year, of course.
Very hard to be in a business,
very hard to be in ababy formula business.
There was a nationwide formula shortage
(17:04):
at a certain point too since pandemic.
Tell us about that.
How did you get through that
and how is Bobbie positioned differently
actually from other companies
that enabled you toaddress what was going on?
- A nationwide infant formula shortage.
So you start a company and you know,
especially what I get fromformula, it's controversial.
(17:24):
You know, most people I wouldget into conversations with,
I would, they'd say, what are you doing?
You know, what's your company?
I'd say, infant formula.
And they're looking for the exit.
They're like, I don't,
the last thing I want to dois talk about infant formula.
You know-- Moms might.
- They don't talk about their journey.
They, it had a dirtiness to it.
And I say that very publicly now
because I think a partof what we need to do
(17:44):
is change the conversation.- Yeah.
- So before the nationwideformula shortage,
it was forgotten.
And not just by theaverage person in society,
also by those working in it,
even within the FDA and someof the existing companies.
And I, again, I'm not pointing fingers,
I'm highlighting it in a way,
(18:05):
which is when an industryhasn't changed in decades-
- Right, right.- Complacency sets in.
- Mm.- So what happened was
two companies were feedingover 80% of the country,
- Which is a remarkable domination.
- Huge, and when we see thisin many other industries,
when two companies, aduopoly owns the majority
(18:26):
of the industry, you areessentially setting up
a lack of resiliency thatin case something happens,
how are you planning to combat that issue?
And what happened wasone company had a failure
and that failure requiredthem to close their doors
of which was absolutelythe right decision.
It was safety first above anything else.
(18:47):
But what we forgot was, as acountry for an essential good,
we became reliant on thosetwo companies feeding America.
So when one of them hadto close their doors,
of which was over 30%,it took several weeks
to get to a place where all ofa sudden shelves were empty.
And parents were driving, Imean, state to state almost.
(19:07):
- Right, right.- To find,
literally to find foodto feed their babies.
- Unbelievable stress.
- We were only on the market for one year.
Typical startup, you're all excited.
You're learning on the go,you're seeing your growth go up.
And when the shortage happened,
I'll never forget my Head of Growth.
She came to me and she said,"Laura, our customer count.
(19:28):
It just doubled overnight."
- Wow.- And on one side,
you're sitting there going,that's amazing, right?
Like, we're growing,
this is exactly what acompany wants to see.
But I took off my CEO hat at that time
and I remember feeling like a mother,
which I was, feeding my third child.
- Mm.- And,
I remember in that moment thinking,
(19:49):
we can't run out of infant formula.
- Right.- And she said,
"Well, we have some safety stock,
but if we do not turn offour top of funnel growth,
essentially turn off our website
and stop growing the business,
we will run out of formulafor our existing customers.
- Oh my goodness.
So now you're in justthis impossible dilemma.
- It was, it was literally thatgrowth innovator's dilemma.
(20:11):
And you're sitting there going
and everyone's going,"Well, will it be over?"
I'm like, "I have no clue."
- No one knew.
- Like, no one's lookinginto a crystal ball.
Like how long will thisformula shortage last?
You would assume they'd catchup and make more quickly.
You'd assume the government'sgoing to step in and fix it.
So I got on with my investors
and we started debating what do we do?
And I'll never forget afew of them on the side
(20:33):
of just like, well,I'm sure it'll be over.
Just keep growing. It seems ridiculous.
Don't turn it off.
A few guys is like, but in the case it is,
this isn't a good situation.
We're not a sofa where it'slike, we're coming back soon.
- Right, right.- It doesn't work that way.
So it was less than 24 hours later,
I turned to our platform team and said,
turn off the website.
- Wow.- We can't take the risk.
And we put out a message andit got very mixed reactions.
(20:56):
And that message was,
we have made a promise toour existing subscribers
and I will hold that commitment
that whatever product we produce,
we need to keep it for them.
And you know, if you wantto join our wait list,
we're here for you.
And it got resounding support
from those that felt supported.
And even those that wanted to be part of
(21:16):
our future community said,I want to be part of that.
- Yes.- I want to be part
of the company and the leadership who says
we take care of our parents.
- That's an amazing promise.
- It was a good promise.- But really tough.
I mean, I really, I'm tryingto think in your mind,
when you're sitting theregetting different views
from your investors as to what to do,
of course the founderwants to grow, grow, grow
(21:36):
at all costs.
Why would you ever want toturn off customer acquisition?
And yet you were in a situation
where not many people have to do that.
Where there's a product that'sliterally not to be found
with children on the other end.
I mean, that's quite remarkable.
- We became the only companyat the end of the shortage
(21:57):
that was able to continueto feed its customers.
And we had to keep ourwebsite off for seven months.
- Wow. Off for new.
- Completely.- Interesting.
- And you know, what are, I mean,
it's a case study initself, supply and demand,
typical problems, but it's,
I think the case studyis not supply and demand.
(22:18):
I think the case study is your reaction.
And what are the thingsthat you do in the moment
that then result in theknock on effects of growth
and loyalty and organic growth.
- Yes.- After the fact.
- So tell us about that.
So you could turn it back on,
the shortage was coming to an end.
How did the new customers find you then?
(22:39):
And did you see a bump incustomers that couldn't,
you know, join you until then?
- So we, you kind of createyour own problem, right?
You create a wait list and the wait list
is growing and growing and growing.
And it got to the placewhere you're like, oh God,
we have 40,000 parents,we have 50,000, 60.
- Wow.- The problem is that
now you're staring at thewait list and you're going,
guys, we have to keep producing product
to serve the wait list.
- Right.- So you're trying to build
(23:00):
your safety stock andthe wait list is going up
and the safety stock has to keep going up.
And at one point we actuallyhad to cut off the wait list.
- Oh no.- Because otherwise,
then we were promisingpeople they'd get off
when they couldn't.
So it was a sequencing game
where our forecasters hadto very carefully figure out
how are we promising justenough that we continue to have,
(23:22):
so it was probably another year,
a full year later post the2022 shortage all through 2023,
where it was letting peopleslowly off our wait list
to be able to come on.
But over the course of those two years,
we grew 100% organically.- Wow.
Never happens.- And as a D2C business,
predominantly a directto consumer business,
(23:44):
not having to go payand acquire customers,
it allowed us to lookat our marketing dollars
in a very creative way.
- Mm, love that.
And to instead, rather thanseeing what we were coming out
and doing and saying asa way to sell product,
let's come out and try and change culture.
Change the conversation
and be part of change for the industry.
(24:06):
- And so did you do different campaigns
with different messages
that you're planning?- Exactly.
- And what did you want tosay to everybody at the time?
- Well, we did a fabulous campaign
with one of our keypartners, Ashley Graham.
She just had her two twins.
We'd no product at the time.
And it was all about combo feeding.
(24:27):
And the message was,no matter how you feed,
your babies will result in the same way.
And to give peopleconfidence, that combo feeding
and changing the conversationand the culture of feeding
and to end essentially the feeding wars
was what we needed to do.
So we put out a big culture campaign
and that culture campaigngot more attention
(24:49):
for the conversationthan it did the product.
- Wow, which of coursewill have knock on effects
on the product, but also position you as,
you're not just a companyselling infant formula,
you are selling communityor building community.
- Yes.- And conversation.
- Exactly.- The fact that you
also were doing things differentlywith a subscription model
is really interesting.
So tell me about the experience you wanted
(25:11):
new parents to have versusgoing to the drugstore
late at night and havingto look at shelves.
- You know, it's not overly radical,
but it was one of thosethings in the moment
of thinking what is our business model?
And this was a product thatyou want to be able to get
reliably, consistently every month.
- You need it.- You need it and again,
(25:32):
like I said, it, it is more,
it is an essential good,unlike a typical CPG product
where one month you wantwant it, the other you don't.
So by being able tocalculate what age a baby is,
how much are they feeding,we could get to a level
of predictability for howmuch formula you need.
So really it came down to reliable service
(25:53):
and making sure that therewasn't any disruption
in someone receiving theproduct that they need.
- Yeah, yeah.
- And it's not just the D2C side of it is,
we've gotten so much joy too,
doing fun things related to the products.
When you open the box,I'm so proud of this.
We create these unique stickers
and these unique stickers have messages,
(26:13):
messages of support and advice.
Pats on the back, making you smile.
- I love that.
- So when you open your box of eight cans,
each one will have a different sticker.
- Nice.- And a message of support.
And I can't even begin to tell you
out of our customer service tickets,
which we did not expect to see,
more of them are related to their love
(26:33):
and even recommendationsfor what should go
on the stickers-- So funny, really?
- Than calls or complaintsin relation to the product.
- That's when you know you'reonto something really special
when your customers are willing
to do your job for you actually, right?
- Yes.- Create those stickers.
Build a community, they'reprobably telling their friends.
They're looking at it with their partners.
That's amazing. That's really special.
(26:54):
- It's such a joy.
You know, then all of a suddenyou're creating a department
for people-- For people to, yes.
- You know, contact in about the stickers,
but not a job you thought you'd have to.
- Yeah.- Well I'm sorry to say
I had my children well beforeyou had founded your company
because I would've reallyenjoyed using the product.
So let's talk about your other experience,
your other work experience before Bobbie.
So you worked at Airbnb asDirector of Host Operations.
(27:15):
What did you learn there fromsuch a unique company as well?
They were also breakingboundaries and doing things new.
And what did you learn there
that really influencedyour leadership at Bobbie?
- I feel like we had avery, very fortunate seat
in the company.
And I remember very acutely being early on
at Airbnb and getting a front row seat,
(27:35):
watching our relatively young founders
and watching the CEO ofAirbnb, who is a friend,
a fabulous leader.
And I am honored, I mean truly.
And I say that with so much gusto
to have a front row seatwatching what they built.
(27:55):
- Yeah.- And,
how it shaped my leadership is,
I think the biggest thingwas, never forget one story.
It was early on and to the CEO of Airbnb,
he came in and he announceda new hire and he said,
"We're going to hire a Chief Council."
And he said, "And I'll be honest,
I didn't know what aChief Council Officer was
until yesterday," and hegave us the definition.
(28:17):
And I remember thinking, wow,
how beautiful is it thatyou have come forward
with that level of vulnerability
and you recognize the learning journey,
'cause it is a learning journey.
And if you are not opening your aperture,
and as my dad would always say,
like one of the greatest dangers in life
is thinking you know it all.
- Oh yeah.- And you can,
you literally cannot disrupt something.
(28:39):
I mean, the literal definitionis being able to come in
and change something, inwhich case you have to learn.
- Yeah.- So that front row seat
at Airbnb in that past experience was,
I watched a group of people,
from the CEO the whole way down,
recognize that theywere taking something on
that they needed to learn.
And I definitely, I thinkit's one of the biggest things
(28:59):
I apply to my day-to-day job.
- Mm, and how would that come across,
so for your own employees,what would they see?
- What they see is vulnerabilityin not knowing something
and trying something, opennessand forgiveness to fail.
And in the moments of maybethe ball getting dropped,
standing up and owning it and recognizing
what were the two or threethings that we maybe learnt
(29:21):
in that moment that we getto apply as we try it again.
But going from zero to one is really hard.
- Oh yeah, I bet.- And it doesn't,
going from zero to onein a disruptive company
doesn't stop just becausethe product's being made
and the idea's now in, you know, motion,
going from zero to onehappens in your processes,
your systems, yourcreation of new standards.
(29:43):
Right Now we own a manufacturing facility
and we're saying, can wedisrupt what standards look like
in the way something's manufactured?
Let's redo it, let's rethink it.
- So when Bobbie came onto the market,
it was the first babyformula brand in six years,
new one to be released
and is now the fastestgrowing brand since the 1980s.
And that's unbelievablebecause as you say,
this was a pretty mature market,
(30:05):
probably had been growing very steadily.
It's based on obviously howmany babies get born every year.
What do you think reallyled to such a big demand
and such a great response that you saw?
- I think two things.
I think the first, my kind of the,
my business investorside of me will answer,
which is it is a big marketthat hasn't been untouched,
(30:26):
or has been untouched for decades.
There was a gap.
And I think as a motherit was very obvious
that it was broken andthere was a huge appetite
to come in for something different.
And there was a black market.
But why I wasn't beingtouched was because the people
who were seeing it were not in a position,
(30:47):
in their most vulnerable state
in their first year ofhaving a baby to say,
"Hey, let me just pause inthe middle of questioning
my entire identity to godo something about this."
So I honestly think thatit was one of those things,
and I now hear it from people when I say
what Bobbie is and what got me here.
I always get the reaction,oh, that, that was smart.
(31:07):
Like, that was a broken industry.
- In hindsight, yes.- In hindsight.
So I do think to take something on,
you need to see that it's broken,
but you also need to havethe experience and confidence
to go do it, and I thinkthose two things collectively,
someone feeling the problem-
- Yes.- May not,
there wasn't enough people out there
(31:27):
in the moment who also feltlike I could go take this on.
I think secondary was we saw this
as a community-driven brand from day one.
And it is.
And I fundamentally believe that.
My story was the thing that started it.
But it's every otherperson who uses Bobbie,
who wants to be part of Bobbie,who wants to join Bobbie,
(31:50):
their stories are fueling the growth.
And we're giving them a platform
where their story can finally be told.
Because it is one that's important.
- Yes.- It's one that needs
to be shared, how you feed your child,
how you're going through those emotions,
the symbolism of everything around it
and the support needed.
(32:11):
It is very community driven.
- You mentioned at one point feeding wars
and how there's both sides of this issue.
Breast is best versus formula.
But you also talkedabout the combo feeding
and maybe doing both.
You're really tapping intosomething that's so primal,
I think for so many women
who are facing this situationand the fathers too.
(32:33):
How do you think you've beenadvancing this conversation?
How do you want it to be advanced
in terms of having a legacy
for what you're able to contribute?
- Well, I don't think it needs to be about
one versus the other.
And again, this is wheremy investors will say like,
no, you got to, you got to push Bobbie.
You got to say Bobbie's best.
I don't, I think whateverworks for you is what's best.
(32:55):
And I want our legacy, Bobbie's legacy
to get to a place where feedingand questioning how you feed
and feeling guilty about how you feed
and people judging how you feedis not part of the dialogue.
- Yeah.- You need to get back
to the joys, the ups and downs,the becoming of the parent.
That is what people need to focus on.
Not the how are you feeding your child.
(33:16):
- Right.- Let's move away
from how we're feeding,what we're feeding,
to the joys of parenting.
So I want us to drive ourself out of a job
would be the legacy.
How do you get to the place
where we have fundamentallychanged conversation
and culture is following thatpeople are not sitting back
going, I really hope people don't think
formula's in my bottle,that needs to change.
(33:37):
- Yeah, I have to ask you this question
as a female founder, tell meabout the fundraising part
of your experience.
What was unsavory about that?
Did people question, wasthis a viable business?
Are you going to stop whenyou have your children?
You know, what did youhear from investors?
- I was eight and a half months pregnant
with my second child when Istarted to go out and fundraise
(34:00):
for the first time.- Okay.
So let's pause on that for a minute.
So an eight and a halfmonths pregnant woman
is coming into investorswho generally don't see
that kind of founder.- Yeah.
And if they do, theyprobably make assumptions.
- What they saw was,
instead of a woman who wascoming in to pitch them,
who had the business acumen,
a resume to be able to prove
(34:22):
that she could do this job.- Yeah.
- I wasn't a 20-year-old founder.
I had experienced workingin Google and Airbnb.
I was a previous investor.
So much of my resume shouldprove that walking in there
with a very strong business pitch
would've had them go, I'm all in.
Instead what they saw was amom with a passion project.
(34:43):
- Ah, your hobby.- My hobby.
- By the way, breast milk isnot generally people's hobby.
So I'm not really surewhere they would going that.
- No, no.- But, okay.
- Yeah, powdered milk was not my dream.
- Right.
- I never thought I wouldsee myself being here.
- What do you do, collect it?
- It was a hard shift.- Yeah.
- And again, you'llnever hear me speak ill
of anyone or anything.
So I, again, I say this,
which is, these arejust natural challenges
(35:06):
that we're up against in life in general.
And I say we, I mean I'msure that there's a male
in a different situation tryingto do something different
who has their own story.
Cards were stacked against me.
I didn't come from theworld of infant formulas.
That was the first judgment.
Why would you jump from technologyinto CPG and making milk?
That's right, you want it for your baby.
- Mm.- So I was missed out
(35:29):
as being seen as the entrepreneur
with a real market opportunity to succeed.
And instead the assumptionscame to the table
and the assumptions were amom with a passion project.
So it was hard.
I spoke to 68 investors.- Oh my goodness.
- Of which four of themended up investing.
And I woke up every day
through those final weeks of my pregnancy,
(35:50):
waking up to four new pitches,
five new nos.
- Oh my goodness.
- And you hear, youknow, it's also painful
'cause you're reading, youknow, with one eye open,
you're exhausted.- Still have a baby,
by the way.- I'm ready
for this child to come.
Oh, I still have my other child.
- Still first.
- My husband who's like, youshould have stayed in the job
because it would've gotten parental leave.
Like, what are we doing?
Everything in life,you're being questioned.
(36:11):
I remember reading those emails thinking,
is this the email that'sgoing to push me over the edge
and say, fold it, this isn't worth it.
You know, you can go get another job.
Like, let's just move on.
And the emails were everything from,
I don't think this is going to work.
No one's going to feel,
no one's ever going to feel passionate
about wanting to sell infant formula.
(36:32):
This will never be aconsumer driven brand.
You'd never get, because you know,
I talked about how we need toget people who had platforms-
- Yes.- To be able to come out
and actually share their story
because they're also parents and mothers.
- Yeah.- And dads.
No celebrity would ever want to talk about
infant formula and their feeding journey.
I mean, it was one no afteranother with an excuse,
(36:52):
after an excuse for not investing.
And yeah, I talked aboutzero to one being hard,
that was really like zero zero to-
- Biggest mountain youhave to climb first.
- It was, and how easy it would've been,
like now thinking through this,
how easy it would've been tojust wake up that one morning
and say, nah, I only spent $200 on a book.
(37:14):
Let's just move on, you know?
- But thankfully youdidn't for so many people
and their babies.
So what must make you feel really proud
is hearing from your customers
about what they thinkand how you helped them
and how you were there ina very, very tough time.
Can you share some of yourcustomer feedback with us?
- I get into this habit now every day.
I mean, obviously when youstart to build a company,
(37:35):
now all of a sudden you'removing between meetings
where you're dealing withsupply chain problems
and just the woes of building a company.
- Operations, yeah.
- I mean it's constant,implementing NetSuite.
Not the most fun meeting, butyou got to do these things.
But I've gotten into thehabit now of every morning
with a cup of coffeebefore my day kicks off,
we have a Slack channel
and that Slack channel isBobbie customer love letters.
(37:58):
Every day, there isdozens of love letters.
And if I just, even in ourSlack that we have right now,
yesterday is one that got put in here
and our customer service team,
they'll email customer service,
and I really mean this,they're not like two sentences.
These are love letters that are essays.
- Wow, touched.- And they send them in.
(38:20):
- Yeah.- Okay.
So here's the first one from yesterday.
Hi. It's a DM on Instagram, by the way.
We are currently on daythree in the hospital
with our two week old baby boy
who is fighting a respiratoryvirus and is on oxygen.
And I just wanted to say how Iliterally cried, all in caps,
happy tears when I pulledout the can of Bobbie
(38:41):
I had pushed into my pack
before heading to the emergencydepartment this morning
and it reads this, and she sends a photo
and it's a photo of our sticker.
- Stickers.- Stickers on the can
and it says, wisdom from our Bobbie Fam
is that you're strongerthan you think you are.
- Aw.- This mother is sitting
in the emergency departmentwith her baby who's on oxygen.
And she has decided in thatmoment to pull out Instagram
(39:05):
and send our company, which is a brand,
but she doesn't see it as a brand.
She, we have to keep remembering this.
We are not selling a typical company.
We are both saving lives.
We are helping peoplethrough what is a blip.
You know those ECG, you know,
charts?- Yes.
- I believe becoming a parent,
(39:26):
in the first year ofparenting is the biggest blip
you will see on your life map.
And we as a company, we as the brand,
we have the privilege, thebeautiful, beautiful privilege
of getting to play a role in their lives.
- So Laura, Bobbie is not just a brand,
it's an advocate for change.
So tell us about your advocacy efforts
and Bobbie for Change.
(39:47):
What is that and whatare you trying to do?
- So one on my team cameto me a few years ago
and she said, "Laura,you'll never guess what.
Did you realize that amother who's undergone
a double mastectomy isgiven a free breast pump
and sticky nipples, butthey're not given formula
to feed their babies?"
And when I tell you she came forward
(40:07):
to the level of passion and furylike, you want to feed this?
Okay, what are we going to do?
She's like, "We got todo something about this.
We got to get loud about the fact
that there is a policy out there
that isn't helping moms
through one of their toughest moments."
And we decided to, in that first year,
take a few mothers who'dundergone a mastectomy
who weren't able to feed their baby
(40:29):
in the way that they wanted
and to be able to sponsor themfor a full year on Bobbie.
- Oh wow.- That became the impetus
and the moment where we decided we exist
for so much more thancreating powdered milk.
So we created Bobbie for change,
and under Bobbie for change,we fight for paid leave,
(40:51):
new insurance policies, theBlack maternal mortality crisis.
We look at issues that areancillary to what we do,
but are the most important things
for our constituents, which are parents.
- Yes.- When I start getting
into these stats, I mean somany people have come to me
and they say, I'm so happythat you do Bobbie for Change.
(41:12):
Sometimes they say it andthey don't even realize
that we also sell infant formula.
- Oh, that's incredible.- We've gotten to a place
as a business where our very existence
to fight for the issuesthat matter to our customers
is what gets us up every day.
And these aren't comingjust from me in top down.
These are our employees whoare coming forward saying,
(41:34):
"Hey, I just had my baby
and they're in the NICU andour policy doesn't cover us
to be able to take time offfor a baby that's in the NICU
weeks before leading up."
So what does that do?
It fires us up to not onlychange our internal policy-
- Yeah.- But then go create
an open-sourced policyso that other companies
can then adopt it.- That's incredible.
(41:54):
- So here's the other thing I'dsay about Bobbie for Change,
which I think a lot ofcompanies need to internalize
in the same way that industries change
and that consumers taste change,
work cultures do as well.
And there is somethinghappening right now,
which is when people decideto go to work every day,
they're not seeing a transition
from their personal life toprofessional life, it's all one.
(42:17):
And if a company is not figuring out
what they're doing toengage their employees
on what they really care about
and find that activism arm
that is worth them lookingback saying, that's my legacy.
My legacy is changing that policy,
helping those parents, changing laws,
(42:37):
then what's it all worth for anyway?
- You're really touchingsuch a nerve with me
because I see more and more people
and younger people and their careers,
saying I want to cometo work for a purpose.
I don't want to haveto wait my whole career
and do the purposeful work at the end.
So I think you're totally right
and when I hear you alsoengage with consumers,
it really makes me feel likeyou're creating something
that's going to long last the years
(42:59):
that you sell formula to them,
that you're going tobe there as a platform
and a community like you mentioned,
and that's a brandthat's with you for life.
- Hear, hear.
I want people to be able to wear Bobbie
loud and proud on a sweater
even if they've never been a parent,
they've never used the product,
but they are so connected to our mission
(43:20):
and what we stand for,
that they're willing towear it on their chest.
- I'm sure they will. It's so powerful.
I mean, I just hope that would-be founders
listen to your story and say,that's going to motivate me.
And would-be investorslisten to that story and say,
maybe those assumptions Imake about hobby businesses
and women out there, I canput aside for other things.
(43:42):
- And if they want to email me
and say they missed out, I'mtotally fine accepting those.
- And just recommend it to their friends.
Laura, you've been sowonderful to talk to.
What a pleasure.
It is really inspiring to seewhat you built with Bobbie
just from your personalexperience through thinking,
through culture and aproduct and a community.
So we wish you the very best
as you continue to move forward.
(44:03):
And I'll have to recommend it, I guess,
to other mothers with babies in my life.
- Sam, thank you.
- Thank you for listeningto my conversation
with Laura Modi of Bobbie.
This was such an inspiring conversation
to hear how not only she metthe market need for a product,
but really developed a community.
(44:24):
And I hope that would-befounders out there,
take inspiration from her
and push forward to follow your dreams.
If you enjoyed this podcast,
please follow on your favorite podcast app
and please share with others.
I hope today that you learn something
that will help you lead with purpose.
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