March 18, 2025 • 51 mins
Did you know there are over 500,000 cases of female genital mutilation (FGM) in the United States and 230 million worldwide? This shocking reality persists into the 21st century, driven by cultural and religious traditions. Dr. Maria Viola Sanchez, founder of the nonprofit organization Stop the Cut Now, joins Shelley Johnson and Kathy Tuccaro in this episode to discuss her mission to eradicate this heinous practice and raise awareness about its devastating effects on women and girls. Dr. Sanchez shares her extensive expertise and experiences, emphasizing the pain and trauma inflicted upon victims, many of whom are subjected to this procedure as young as infancy, Throughout the episode, we delve into the painful realities of FGM, the challenges faced in changing societal norms, and the importance of education and legislation to combat this human rights violation. Dr. Sanchez highlights the lack of awareness and legislative action, particularly in nine U.S. states and Washington D.C., where no laws currently prohibit FGM. This episode serves as a rallying cry for listeners to educate themselves and take action against this barbaric practice, urging them to support organizations working towards legislative reform and community awareness. Join us as we explore how we can collectively work towards a future free of FGM and empower women globally.
- stopthecutnow.org
- womenroadwarriors.com
- www.podpage.com/women-road-warriors/
- https://womenspowernetwork.net
female genital mutilation, FGM awareness, Stop the Cut Now, Dr. Maria Viola Sanchez, women's rights, human rights violations, genital mutilation statistics, cultural practices women's health, eradicate FGM, female empowerment, women's health education, international women's issues, Shelley Johnson, Shelley M. Johnson, Kathy Tuccaro, Women Road Warriors
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
This is Women Road warriorswith Shelly Johnson and Kathy Tucaro.
From the corporate office tothe cab of a truck, they're here
to inspire and empower womenin all professions.
So gear down, sit back and enjoy.
(00:23):
Welcome.
We're an award winning show ddedicated to empowering women in
every profession throughinspiring stories and expert insights.
No topics off limits on ourshow, we power women on the road
to success with expert andcelebrity interviews and information
you need.
I'm Shelly.
And I'm Kathy.
(00:44):
Our show takes on some toughtopics sometimes, but our mission
is to educate, empower andcreate awareness to further the progress
and fair treatment of women.
What we have today is a toughissue that needs to be discussed.
It may be a difficult one forsome listeners, so we want to give
fair warning.
Did you know that 230 milliongirls and women across the United
(01:07):
States and around the worldhave been forced into female genital
mutilation?
Also called fgm.
This is the practice ofremoving or cutting the labia and
clitoris for non medical reasons.
It's an extremely painful andemotionally damaging practice that
leaves a woman without theability to experience pleasure during
intercourse.
(01:28):
It's primarily done as areligious practice.
Some cultures believe it's away to preserve virginity, enhance
male sexual pleasure, orimprove female hygiene.
It leaves terrible emotionaland physical scars.
It can cause infection, andthe vagina and urethra can close
over, leaving only a smallopening leading to painful intercourse
(01:50):
or an incision needed if awoman gives birth.
Who could imagine that thishorrific practice is even going on,
especially in North America inthe 21st century?
Stop the Cut now is anorganization on a mission to eradicate
this terrible practice.
Dr.
Maria Viola Sanchez is the CEOand founder of this nonprofit.
(02:12):
They're committed to creatingawareness worldwide and achieving
a unified voice to eliminatethis terrible practice.
Dr.
Sanchez is also presidentelect of the Ventura County Psychological
association, which was named2024's chapter of the year by the
California Psychologicalassociation, among many other positions.
She's also on the board oftrustees at Fielding Graduate university.
(02:35):
We have Dr.
Maria Viola Sanchez with ustoday to educate us.
Welcome, Maria.
Thank you so much for being onthe show.
Shelley.
What a marvelous introduction.
My goodness.
Thank you for encapsulating itso well.
Well, thank you, Maria.
Yeah, I want people to reallystop, give pause and think.
Because when I first heardabout this, I was shocked.
(02:59):
Yes.
And what's interesting aboutit, I was just in Washington, D.C.
last week.
I do a lot of as much activismas I can in the United States and
people always say to me, firstof all, when they hear about it,
they're like, what?
And then if we want, we can gointo some of the details of.
Of it, because there are fourdifferent types of procedures that
(03:22):
fall under the umbrella offemale genital mutilation, or FGM,
as you said.
And when I mentioned thatthere's 230 million, as you did in
the introduction, in theworld, they're like, what?
And I said, yes, this is an epidemic.
And then I said, and then, oh,by the way, there's over 500,000
(03:43):
women in the United States of America.
And they're like, now it'slike, yes, it does.
And what's unfortunate is thatnot only is it not going away, the
UNICEF released numbers and they.
The number that we had beenusing since 2016 was 200 million,
and they revised that to 230million, as you just said.
(04:08):
God, that's just unbelievable.
It is unbelievable.
Yeah, it's shocking.
It is shocking.
And what's really the reasonbehind my foundation is that I have
been aware of female genital mutilation.
Actually, I had a program onNPR and a guest came on to talk about
(04:32):
it.
And this was in the late 90s,and that was the first I learned
of it.
So it's always been in thebackground of my mind.
And UNICEF and the Unitednations and the World Health Organization,
it's on their radar.
And everyone says, oh, it's aterrible thing.
And February 6th every year isthe International Day of the Eradication
(04:55):
of Female Genital Mutilationat the United Nations.
I've attended it in personseveral times.
This was pre Covid, and Iactually went there on February 6,
2020, right before we got intotrouble with the pandemic.
There was less than 100 peoplein the room.
And it's an international day.
And I got so upset that allyou do is talk about it.
(05:19):
Then you give one day a yearto say how terrible it is, and then
you go on about your business.
So that is what motivated meto found Stop the cut now.
Because I kept saying Iassumed that these deep pocketed
international organizationswould be doing something about it,
and it appears that they're not.
(05:40):
First of all, Maria, I just.
Lip service.
Oh, yeah.
Unbelievable.
You know, if this happened tomen, it'd be an act of war.
It would be.
Yeah, it would.
Oh, Maria, I want to commendyou for founding this organization.
I had not heard about thatInternational Day in February either.
So there's not enough awareness?
No, there's.
And that's.
(06:00):
And I'll tell you, quitehonestly, Shelly and Kathy, a lot
of the problem is authenticignorance, because it's not a part
of a conversation in generalthat we would have.
But the other thing is, whenwe do have the conversation, which
we're having now, it makespeople uncomfortable.
(06:21):
And when you're talking aboutcutting the genitals, they perform.
The average age is from 6months to 15 years old.
That's the range in general.
And people wince.
And they, you know, they.
I spoke to the 58 district ofattorneys in the state of California
(06:42):
two years ago.
They wanted to know more aboutit because really, it's violence
against women.
It's domestic violence.
It's, you know, gender,whatever you want to say, discrimination.
And I'm in this room withseasoned law enforcement individuals,
and my PowerPoint is animated,and so is the website, because it's
(07:04):
so uncomfortable.
I'm not showing anatomicallycorrect pictures.
And they were wincing, lookingdown, crossing their legs.
You could see howuncomfortable they were.
And these are people who tryall kinds of heinous, atrocious crimes
in the state of California.
And that just showed me thatit doesn't matter who's listening.
(07:26):
If you have a heart, you care.
Yeah.
You know, this is a humanrights violation.
There's no other way todescribe it.
100% correct.
And there's no place for it ever.
And in the 21st century, it's unbelievable.
And the fact that it's notbeing given the kind of priority
(07:48):
that it should, it shows womenand girls are not being given the
priority that they deserve.
And I'm so, so thankful yourorganization is creating this awareness.
I wanted to talk briefly a bitabout your background.
I see you're a psychologist.
You said you've been in the media.
Could you kind of talk about alittle bit about that?
(08:09):
I mean, certainly you being inthe media, you know how to harness
that and get people'sattention, which is so important.
Yes.
Thank you.
So I have been a radio talkshow host for almost 30 years, which
will tell you how old I am.
And I.
My programs were lifestyle,health, parenting, relationships.
(08:31):
It was very, very little political.
And if it was political, Ididn't care what side of the fence
you were on, just as long asyou were intelligent, articulate,
respectful.
And then when syndication cameout and the budget started shrinking
for local markets, includingin Los Angeles, that's kind of when
(08:51):
I went to other arenas and Idecided to pursue my graduate education,
because psychology, as much asother industries might, doesn't really
have ageism built into it.
People appreciate that you'velived and that you have some wisdom
and that you might have some perspective.
(09:13):
So I got my master's inclinical psychology, and then I got
my master's in mediapsychology, and then I got my PhD
in psychology with an emphasison media psychology.
And my dissertation was aboutthe eradication of female genital
mutilation.
So it's been a long journey,but a rewarding one.
(09:34):
And what my dissertationproved was it doesn't take a lot.
It really just takes awarenessand education.
It does, and it needs to betalked about.
And I want to commend you again.
Bravo, Maria.
We have to bring this out, outof the shadows.
People need to know, even ifthey get uncomfortable, and the fact
(09:56):
they're getting uncomfortable,they got to know it's wrong.
Well, studying it, so havingit on my radar.
And you read about it?
Not often, because it's asecret and it goes underground.
I was at the United nationsfor an event, and the woman who was
(10:16):
part of the Health Ministry ofSierra Leone, which is in Africa,
she was speaking.
And I went specificallybecause I wanted to talk to her about
female genital mutilation.
That wasn't the topic of her conversation.
She was trying to solicitfunds for the Health Department in
Sierra Leone.
And I went up afterwards and Isaid to her, could you tell me about
(10:38):
female genital mutilation inyour country?
And she acted as if I hadslapped her across the face.
She recoiled.
She moved away from me.
And her handlers surroundedme, men and said, what is it that
you just asked her?
And I repeated my sentence.
And the man said to me, oh, wedon't do that.
And I said, that's not whatthe United nations does.
(11:00):
You have a cut rate that's 85to 91% cut rate, meaning how many
of the girls are cut and their culture.
And he said, oh, no, we don'tdo that.
And I said, really?
He goes, if a girl at the ageof 18 asks for it to be performed,
then we will accommodate her request.
And so that's thedisinformation that you get.
(11:22):
So I contacted the Unitednations afterwards, and I said, I
want to tell you this is aconversation that I had at the event
that you just hosted.
And they said, oh, yeah, theylie all the time.
No one wants to admit it, you.
Know, and denial is deadly.
Right?
And that's what they're doing.
They would rather put it underthe rug.
And how is this any differentthan domestic abuse, which they've
(11:45):
done the same kind of thingfor Years and years and years too.
I can't even imagine taking asix month old infant and doing this
to the child.
I mean, how is that not child abuse?
Well, and the worst of it isit's done in unsanitary conditions.
It's usually done in the bushon dirt.
(12:06):
It is done with items that arenot sanitized like scissors and razor
blades and shards of glass.
It is barbaric beyond.
And there's no anesthesia.
Of course, the younger theyare, the less they remember, the
older.
I've spoken with survivorsthat had it done on them when they
were 7, 8, 12, they pass outfrom the pain, so they don't remember
(12:31):
the exact whole part of it.
But then the worst of it isit's the women that perpetuate it
on the girls.
So one survivor I spoke with,her mother was a part of the four
people.
They hold them down each limband spread their legs.
Sometimes someone has to siton the child's chest.
(12:51):
And she said, I looked over atmy mother and I thought, aren't you
the one that's supposed toprotect me?
Aren't you the one that'ssupposed to keep me out of harm's
way?
And she passed out.
She came to.
So the most severe form of itis type 3.
After they cut, they bindtheir ankles and their thighs together
(13:14):
so that they can scarce withthe healing, which closes up, as
you mentioned, not only thevagina, but the urethra.
They leave an opening the sizeof the head of a Q tip from which
they're supposed to urinateand menstruate.
And they also limit theirliquids because they don't want them
urinating because it hurts,because there's flesh wounds there.
(13:36):
And the mom brought her somesoup and put a spoon in her mouth
and she spit it right back ather mother and said, how dare you?
Yeah.
And their relationship wassevered from that point forward.
That's so unbelievable.
You know, it's interesting, Iknew that it was a few years back
(13:57):
in Michigan.
There was a judge, there was ajudge who basically overturned a
federal ban on female genitalmutilation based on the premise that
it was states rights, it couldnot be a federal ban.
But what had brought this tohis courtroom was a case in Michigan,
(14:18):
some doctors that were doingthis and I guess there were a couple
of mothers who had trickedtheir seven year olds into thinking
that they were going toDetroit for a girls trip and instead
they had their genitals cut.
Oh my God.
And I remember when I firstheard this, I'm like this is going
on in Michigan.
Yes.
(14:40):
So federal legislation gotpassed in 1996 and then your judge
is the one that reversed it.
And we in the community werethen panicking because now there
was no federal ban in theUnited States of America.
And fortunately, a lot of theactivists got together and created
(15:00):
legislation and it actuallygot signed by President Trump on
January 1st 5th, the daybefore the insurrection.
So it didn't get any pressthat the federal law was back in
place because of what happenedat our Capitol the next day.
But there are still ninestates and the District of Columbia
(15:23):
that do not have legislationoutlying female genital mutilation.
You know, I think part of thatwould you say is because people don't
know this goes on.
Probably because that's thelack of awareness.
The state of Washington didn'thave legislation and people were
bringing their daughters tothe state of Washington to have it
(15:46):
performed there.
And that's also illegal.
You're not supposed to bring achild across state lines to do that
kind of thing.
But because there wasn't a lawin the state of Washington, they
were getting away with it.
So I worked with a coalition.
I testified four times totheir assembly and Senate and their
governor signed it into law inApril of 2023, moving it from 10
(16:09):
to nine.
So when they got wind of it,they did something about it.
Now, I've testified to theDistrict of Columbia twice.
They are still nowhere nearpassing legislation and they know
about it.
They've been talking about it.
They pulled people into theroom to testify.
So I don't know what theirproblem is, why they're dragging
(16:29):
their feet.
There was in Kentucky, I knowyou mentioned in your introduction
that it's primarily cultural,which is true, but there are right
wing Christian segments thatperform it too in the United States.
And this woman in her 30s inKentucky went to her legislator and
(16:51):
said, I need you to know thatthis was done to me, this is happening
in our state.
And they rallied round andthey created legislation and it passed.
And they call it Jenny's Lawbecause the woman who came forward,
that's her name.
So there has been progress,but for nine states and the District
of Columbia to still not haveit illegal is somewhat unconscionable
(17:13):
and also unbelievable.
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(18:35):
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(19:17):
We want to help as many womenas possible.
Did you know that There areover 500,000 cases of genital mutilations
of women and girls in theUnited States and 230 million around
the world.
It's shocking.
This is happening in the 21st century.
Dr.
Maria Viola Sanchez is on amission to stop this horrendous practice.
(19:39):
She's the founder of Stop theCut now to rally support and get
people around the world toeradicate this terrible practice
that's often motivated byreligious and cultural traditions.
Dr.
Sanchez says a lot of theproblem is authentic ignorance because
it's not a part of theconversation that we would have.
When we do have theconversation, it makes people uncomfortable
(20:01):
to get all of this to change.
Dr.
Sanchez says it takesawareness and education.
The problem is genitalmutilation is a dirty secret that
goes underground where itcan't be discussed.
No one wants to admit to thepractice and they lie about it even
happening.
There are still nine states inthe District of Columbia in the United
(20:21):
States that do not have lawsbanning female genital mutilation.
Think about that for a second.
It's just horrific.
Dr.
Sanchez's information and hermission are so important for everyone
to know and to get involved.
Dr.
Sanchez, what is the reasonthis is done?
I know that religion, certainreligions do not believe that women
(20:47):
should experience sexual pleasure.
Correct.
And they want them to maintaintheir virginity.
Obviously this is going todiscourage anybody wanting to have
sexual intercourse.
Correct.
It would be a very painful experience.
Correct.
It is so the primary reasonsome people say religion, but nowhere
does it say that in any religious.
(21:09):
It's not in the Bible, it'snot in the Quran.
There are imams that thinkthat it's religious.
But then there's an Iman inthe United States who came from Sudan
who has said no.
Muhammad said do no harm.
No.
Abraham said do not harm.
So they're evolved.
(21:29):
A lot of it honestly is just habit.
And I'm going to be a reallyvulnerable statement that I'm making
here.
I ignorantly circumcised mysons when they were born because
my dad was.
My brothers were.
My husband, their father was.
(21:50):
I didn't even think anythingabout it.
And if that's what I did as aWestern woman who's educated and
intelligent, that's one of thereasons it's still prevalent.
This is what we do.
Sure.
Well, I think withcircumcision and we're told that
that prevents infection andit's more hygienic.
(22:12):
But there are.
That is not true.
But yes, that's what we're told.
Is it really though?
It's not true.
The foreskin serves a lot ofpurposes and I have apologized to
my sons and I even waspublished John Hopkins Press, they
did a story on regrets of male circumcision.
So some people compare the twoand there is no comparison because
(22:36):
mine was done in a hospitalwith a local anesthetic by a physician,
you know, whereas this is not.
But to your point about thecase in Michigan, there were physicians
that were.
They.
It's called medicalized thatthey were doing it the way we would
perform surgery on any otherpart of our bodies.
(22:58):
Right.
I'm just looking online.
I see because being Canadianto see what's what it is here.
And I'm just reading that thegovernment of Canada condemns FGM
and other harmful practicesthat threaten the well being of women
and girls and violate theirhuman rights.
In 1997, Canada's CriminalCode was amended to clarify that
(23:20):
FGM is a form of aggravatedassault and that removing a child
from Canada, for the purposesof mgm, is a criminal offense.
So that's kind of good to know.
You have a very great activistgroup in your country, and there's
a woman, she's done adocumentary on it.
It's called something like,Not My Daughter and Giselle Poitney,
(23:44):
I believe her name is.
And she.
She.
I've interviewed her and I'veseen her documentary twice.
And you should be reallyproud, because Canada is very progressive
in that regard, and so is thestate of California.
I mean, we passed our law inthe state in 1996 after the feds
did theirs, and it was enactedin 1997.
(24:04):
And I introduced legislationin the state of California because
it's not good enough.
It's old.
There's loopholes.
There was a public healthreporting that was never done.
And my bill passed through theAppropriations Committee unanimously
and is now stuck in the SenateAppropriations Committee because
there's a cost to it, becausewe're making the penalties stronger.
(24:29):
And they're sayingincarceration then costs the state
more to keep somebody there longer.
And in the meantime, we'recosting people's lives.
I mean, emotionally, it's gotto devastate.
Physically, I mean, I can'teven imagine.
And the fact that this isbeing done to girls.
Yes.
I mean.
(24:49):
And they don't have the understanding.
I mean, I don't have theunderstanding as an adult woman,
why on earth any of this wouldbe allowed.
Why it's considered acceptableby certain groups of people.
To me, it looks like male domination.
There is a lot of that, Shelley.
It is patriarchal.
It is also, as you mentioned,a way to ensure that a girl is a
(25:11):
virgin.
And countries that value thatthe dowry for their daughter is higher
if the girl is cut.
And then the sad part is, isthat if and when they do have intercourse,
after they get married, theyusually rupture and hemorrhage and
have to go to the hospitalbecause the penis isn't meant to
(25:33):
fit into an opening that small.
No.
The pain.
Yeah.
And then the worst is thatthen the women don't want to have
intercourse because it's painful.
Oh, sure.
So a husband ends up having awife who doesn't want to engage.
It's a.
It's a lose, lose, lose for everybody.
(25:53):
No one would want to havepainful intercourse.
No.
Thus, you know, out of dutyand obligation, they acquiesce.
Um, but there are men who areagainst fgm, too, and they say, we
want a woman who gets pleasureout of making love.
That's the whole point.
And it's like, yeah, so if,yeah, if you're in pain that you
(26:14):
know, then what's the value in it?
Yeah.
So the good news is there aremen getting involved because some
men just accepted that this isa rite of passage and the tradition.
And then when they're alsoeducation and awareness made aware
that this is really barbaricand it doesn't benefit anybody, they're
(26:35):
like, yeah, why would we do that?
Why would I allow my daughterto be sedentary?
That.
So there is movement in thatregard, but the numbers.
Not in terms of the numbers.
Sure.
Well, that's where awarenessand what your organization is doing
is so essential because it'sreeducating people and it's bringing
it out into the sunlight,which is where it needs to be.
You were talking about fourtypes of fgm.
(26:58):
I'm reading some of thedetails on that.
It's absolutely disgusting.
Feel free to go into some ofthe gory details so people can really,
really step back and say,yeah, no.
Sugar coating, because this is real.
Right.
So that was part of mylegislation too, was that California's
definition of female genitalmutilation should align with the
World Health Organization'sdefinition, which they created in
(27:22):
1995 and then they fine tunedit again in 2007.
But part one is the partial ortotal removal of the clitoris.
Part two is the removal ofthat, the clitoris and then the labia
minora.
And then part three is the onethat's the most egregious.
(27:43):
So that's the narrowing of thevaginal orifice.
And then they bring togetherthe cut skin from the labia minora
and the labia majora.
And then that cut edge,they're stitched together and that's
referred to as infibulation.
And then type 4 is any kind ofprocedure to the genitals.
(28:04):
And that's pricking, piercing,scraping, cauterizing, nicking.
And so some people are saying,well, type 4 isn't as bad as the
others.
So how about if we just dotype 4?
That conversation exists too.
And it's like, no, that isalso mutilation.
You know what I would say tosomebody like that?
(28:25):
Okay, you want to be the firstone to stand up and volunteer for
that?
Yeah, you know, you go first.
Yeah.
So there are organizations andthat's the other thing that my foundation
does, is so I'm involved notonly with a network in the United
States formally, but, but Ihave global, we call ourselves intactivists
(28:47):
throughout the world wherethey're trying to make their mark
globally, too.
So the United States, Imentioned, there's over half a million
girls that have been cut.
That's true.
In the United Kingdom and theEuropean Union, they each have about
500,000.
Kerr.
So I'm in touch with Paris andDublin and London that they're trying
(29:11):
to do that eradication ontheir level.
So that's the good news iswe're collaborative.
Like, I don't have any problemif somebody's.
I have a friend, herorganization works in Kenya.
I sit on the advisory board ofa woman whose organization works
in Liberia.
Like, you know, the more the merrier.
If we can move the needle at all.
(29:32):
Let's do it.
Let's work on this.
Yep.
So, like the organization inLiberia, she actually is in the United
States.
But what she does is shesponsors girls.
She gives them tuition,uniforms, books, school supplies,
menstrual pads, and has theirfamily signed a legally binding document
(29:57):
that they will not cut their daughter.
They have to go to a physicianonce a year to prove that they haven't
been cut.
And these girls actually getto go through high school and they
get to go on to collegebecause FGM also holds girl back
socioeconomically.
So, unfortunately, she onlygives 20 scholarships a year because
(30:20):
that's all her organizationcan afford.
And it's like $20 a year to do that.
She ships menstrual pads,because that's another thing that
if they don't have menstrualpads, they stay at home for five
to seven days while they're menstruating.
So it gives them theopportunity to go to school.
And so what I try and do issupport her work as much as possible,
(30:42):
because she already has theboots on the ground in Liberia.
She already has their trustand their confidence.
She already has the documents,the physicians, et cetera.
I just want her to be more successful.
Bravo to that.
And it takes a village to makethese changes.
It actually does.
It really does.
It really does.
(31:03):
And that's why I would like toget the ear of an Oprah Winfrey,
for example, who has a lot ofa footprint in Africa, because they
say that the largestpopulation of FGM girls is in Africa.
I was reading that.
Yeah.
So it's.
(31:23):
But it doesn't.
It's not exclusively so, but it's.
You know, if we could move theneedle in Africa, we would be making
a big difference in the world.
Yeah.
So, like, for example,Somalia, they cut 98% of their girls.
Egypt cuts 91% of their girls.
So I was in Dubai in The uae.
(31:47):
And I was working with somecultural folks there, and I talked
about female genitalmutilation, and they said, we don't
do that here.
And it's like, that's not true.
What's the percentage in Dubai?
So I don't have that number bya city, but it's high.
(32:07):
And they're considered one ofthe more progressive areas of the
Middle East, I think.
No, they still subjugate theirwomen to, you know, they just let
them start to drive.
Recently, they having beenthere, you know, you cover up from
head to toe, even foreigners,you have to cover your knees and
your shoulders and.
(32:30):
Yeah, no, I have a realproblem with the uae.
I'll never go back.
I was asked to speak there again.
Like, I just can't.
I cannot justify how you treatwomen and girls.
And I know that they have alot of money and, you know, but it.
They do terrible things.
So I just.
I'm like, no, I.
I've been there once.
(32:50):
That's good enough.
Yeah, I don't blame you.
I think that the publicperspective is that Dubai is more
progressive, but unless you'veactually been there, you don't know.
Yeah, they don't.
It's amazing how people kindof hide some of that, you know, just
bury it.
Well, there's actually adocumentary, Shelley, about Dubai
when they were hosting theWorld cup for soccer for FIFA, and
(33:13):
they basically incarceratedtheir workers for six, seven, eight
years to build the stadiumthat it was going to be hosted in.
And they interview.
The documentary shows thatthey pay them very hardly livable
wages.
They stock them away indormitories without air conditioning
(33:34):
and 122 degrees, et cetera.
And then two days before thetournament was to begin, they reneged
on their beverage contract,and I believe it was Budweiser beer.
They said, no, you will not beable to serve that because they have
no alcohol in their country.
Right.
(33:54):
And so I can't help but thinkall along they knew they were going
to do that, but they justlured everybody with their, you know,
we're being progressive andthis is a worldwide event, and it's
not just for our.
Our culture and our population.
So I don't trust them.
I don't blame you.
That's the long and the shortof it.
Sure.
(34:14):
Maria, what your organizationis doing is so essential, and the
fact that you're on our showso we can let our listeners know
is really important.
I am sure that there's somepeople who are listening right now
who want to know what they cando to help what can people do to
help your organization?
Because more.
More people need to be madeaware, more people need to be involved.
(34:36):
So thank you, Shelley, forthat and Kathy, too, for the opportunity.
I'm afraid to say that it allboils down to donations, really,
because there's only so muchthat we can do without that.
But the good news is it's notthat complicated.
So education and awarenesscost just in terms of producing the
(34:58):
materials and sometimes havingthe language changed, depending on
the population, because likethe communities.
So California leads thecountry in the number of putt girls.
So out of the 500,000 in theUnited States, they say 513,000,
almost 80,000 of them live inthe state of California.
(35:19):
That's an inordinate amount ofthe population of the country.
It sure is.
And so for me to get themessage to the various communities
that are affected by it, thatrequires getting into their communities,
getting their confidence,having them feel safe that they can
share, getting the materialsand their language of origin.
(35:40):
And again, that's where thecosts come in.
But the good news is that oncepeople are exposed and understand
that this isn't what we needto be doing, there is a population
that is agreeing to changetheir culture, their traditions,
(36:01):
and their way of life.
The other thing is that themedical school curriculum doesn't
include female genitalmutilation in it.
So that when pediatricians andOBGYN see it in their practice, they
are shocked because they don'tknow what they're looking at.
That boils down to public health.
Yes, it does.
(36:22):
And again, that costs money.
It's just to get the message out.
It's always about money.
The money makes the world go round.
Yeah.
I just wanted to say thank youso much for just your.
Your dedication and yourcommitment to getting this.
This word out there.
And the education is everything.
(36:43):
I personally am partiallyinvolved in the whole menstruation
beyond, beyond menstruationthat's going on in India where the
women have to be in huts andwhen they have their period every
month and they're banned andthey're considered dirty and filthy.
And so I, I think betweenyourself and myself and anybody who's
(37:04):
vocal about these issues, it'sthe only way to get the public to
react is by being vocal andparticipating in.
In things that make them uncomfortable.
Right.
Because, I mean, you got tostep outside their comfort zone if
you want to be real and honestabout what.
What's really going on and nothiding behind that.
That white picket fence said,oh, all is rosy, you know, and, and
(37:28):
not listen to, to the peoplethat say, no, it's not happening
in our country.
Yes, it is happening, and youneed to open your eyes and do something
about it.
So I just wanted to, I justwant to commend you again.
Thank you so much.
Yes, thank you, Marilla.
Thank you for that.
Because I think it's actuallywomen that will probably be the biggest
game changer in that When Ifounded Stop the Cut now, the second
(37:52):
title is Eradicating FemaleGenital Mutilation.
So people know exactly whatwe're talking about.
It's not about, you know, selfharm, self cutting, that, those other
psychological issues.
My husband's on the boardalso, and he's an avid golfer.
And they'll say things, youknow, what do you do?
Or whatever.
(38:12):
And he'll bring it up.
And they're like, now hegolfed with a physician from Texas.
And the guy was like, no.
And he was like, oh, yeah.
So the, I love it that it'scoming from a man, too.
But the title of thefoundation apparently is good enough
because sometimes they'll goto stopthecutnow.org and they'll
(38:33):
contact me and said, I playedgolf with your husband this week
and he told me about the workthat you're doing and I would like
to donate.
And it's like, oh, my gosh,how you know.
And again, it's $100 here or$200 there.
It doesn't matter.
It all adds up.
It's just, especially for men,I think is because they'll say, I
have a wife, I have daughters,you know what?
(38:56):
And it's like, yeah, what?
Yeah, they're shocked andincredulous, but it's information
they need to know.
Everybody needs to know it orit's never going to change.
I commend you for what you're doing.
Stay tuned for more of womenRoad warriors coming up.
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Welcome back to Women Roadwarriors with Shelly Johnson and
(40:24):
Kathy Tucaro.
In certain parts of the world,virginity is a requirement for women
before marriage.
The dowry for a daughter isgreater if her labia and clitoris
have been removed.
This is just one of thereasons that many girls as young
as infants and teens aresubjected to genital mutilation.
(40:47):
Their labia minora andclitoris are cut for non medical
reasons, leaving thempermanently scarred.
In one particular procedure,there's only an opening about the
size of a Q tip that's left toallow girls and women to urinate
and menstruate.
Once these women haveintercourse after their marriage,
they typically rupture andhemorrhage and they have to go to
the hospital.
(41:08):
Stop the Cut now is aNonprofit founded by Dr.
Maria Viola Sanchez that'sworking internationally to stop this
terrible abuse of women andgirls, which, shockingly, is not
talked about.
It's denied and quietlycontinues even in the United States,
where at least 500,000 womenand girls are mutilated every year.
(41:29):
Dr.
Sanchez's organization isworking to change laws and educate
people around the world.
She talks about the obstaclesand what we all need to know to issue
a rallying cry to stop thisbarbaric practice once and for all.
The good news is awareness andeducation are making a change, even
though it's at a snail's pace.
Maria, you're really making adifference by opening people's eyes
(41:51):
to the ugly truth of thisterrible practice.
We do on our website try to beas educational as we can.
You've got no nonsense, candidinformation and you list all the
current stats of what'shappening around the world, including
the United States, and what states.
It is really powerful.
It's moving the needle.
(42:12):
That's what's important, youknow, bit by bit by bit.
Yep.
Every little bit ofinformation makes the difference.
It gains the awareness and itmakes the change.
And Shelli, you're part of thebit by bit just by us having this
conversation and for your listeners.
I mean, as I said, if you knowyou need something to be done, sometimes
(42:36):
you have to do it yourself.
Yes, that's very true.
Well, Maria, I'm so glad to beable to help.
Because this awareness,bringing things out, like I said,
into the sunshine is the onlyway it's going to change.
This is marginalization.
It's abuse.
It is nothing but a humanrights violation.
It should not exist.
(42:56):
And the more people that hearabout it get out of the denial phase.
You know, it's not a pleasant topic.
It's creepy.
You know, it makes peopleuncomfortable, but they need to be
and they need to realize ifthey feel uncomfortable just hearing
about it, it's wrong andsomething needs to be done.
You know, just to let yourlisteners know.
(43:17):
There's a country called theGambia and they had legislation that
outlawed female genital mutilation.
Their national assemblydecided that maybe they would reverse
that and they would allow cutting.
And we, my internationalactivists, we circulated a petition,
we got over 150 signatures ofbig time upper ups in the world.
(43:40):
But they were deciding whetheror not to make it legal, which they
would have been the firstcountry to do.
So three quarters of theirgirls are cut and they voted and
they voted to keep the ban.
But 34 of them voted to keepthe ban and 19 voted to overturn
it.
So you know, 19 people saidthat they wanted female genital mutilation
(44:03):
to be legal in their country.
Now see, that's devaluingwomen too and marginalization.
And it does feel like we taketwo steps forward and 10 steps back.
But that's where perseveranceneeds to take place.
People can't give up.
They have to have a voice.
42 of them voted to overturnthe ban.
(44:24):
They got more information.
They, to their credit, theyhad a period where they welcomed
people to talk.
That's why we did our petitionand et cetera.
And of those 42 overturningit, only 19 stayed to overturn it.
But it was close, it was scary.
We were all worried throughoutthe world.
And that happened just last year.
That's super scary.
(44:46):
Wow, Maria, you're creating awareness.
You're creating a unifiedvoice which, which is so necessary
and this awareness is makingthe difference to stop these laws,
to educate the lawmakers,which is so necessary.
And I know that that's part ofthe mission of your organization.
Where do people find you?
(45:07):
How do they reach out?
Can they reach out to you?
Absolutely.
So stopthecutnow.org is the website.
There is the information, youknow, brief education.
There is a donate button onevery page and my contact information
is with, at the very bottom ofthe website.
Not only my personal cellphone, but my email.
(45:28):
So it's stopthecutnow.org weare, by the way, 501C3.
And the IRS has given us taxexempt status, so we're as legit
as they come.
And that wasn't easy to get either.
Oh, it never is.
Excellent.
What do you have the greatestneed right now?
(45:51):
I would like to see the ninestates and the District of Columbia
pass legislation.
And I'd like to see AssemblyBill 798 in California, which is
the one that I sponsored, get passed.
And then when we have tackledthat, then we can get onto the world.
We do need to tackle the world.
People need to be aware ofthis issue to stop it.
(46:13):
All of this needs to betotally eradicated.
This practice should never happen.
It's just atrocious.
Every kind of descriptor I canfind, mind.
It's just heinous.
You know, this is.
This is torture.
This is abuse.
It is everything that shouldnever, ever happen to any human being.
And if it happened to a boy ora man, like I said earlier, there's
(46:36):
no way it would happen, you know?
Well, if you think about 230million women in the world, we don't
even have that many women inthe United States.
That puts it in perspective.
Makes you really think of thegravity and the size of it.
That's a lot of people.
It really is.
It's a lot of people.
It's a lot of people.
I was involved in theeradication of polio, and now that's
(47:00):
only in Afghanistan, Pakistanand Nigeria.
So I've seen global campaignswork and this one needs to be a global
campaign, too.
Yep.
And people need to attend theinternational day about this issue
that happens every year in February.
They need to be involved.
(47:20):
Yeah.
And an Egyptian girl had justdied from being cut because one of
the things that can happen isdeath because of the bleeding.
And they talked about thatwhen I was there on February 6th
of 2020.
So we had a real life.
Right.
The same week example of howterrible it is.
It's just so.
(47:41):
Just so you know, Shelly, I.
If your listeners are feelingthat there is vicarious trauma, as
I start to feel when you hearthat, what happens?
How can you not feel empathy?
Oh, yeah, absolutely.
One of the survivors, she'sfrom Somalia.
She's told her story at aconference I attended in the uk and
(48:02):
I couldn't stop crying becauseshe's the one that remembers.
She was 7 when she was cut.
She remembers it all.
I was just like, oh, my gosh,what do you say?
I'm sorry.
Like, is that good enough?
Yeah.
I mean, the person's Life isforever changed.
Correct.
Not in the good.
Not for the good at all.
(48:22):
It's emotionally andphysically traumatic.
It leaves a scar.
And I can't imagine any parentthat would say, gee, this is an okay
practice.
Right?
You know?
Well, thank you, Maria, forwhat you're doing.
We definitely need some peopleinvolved, and that's why I wanted
you on the show.
It's a tough topic, butsometimes it takes the tough topics
(48:44):
to make a change.
It really does.
Well, and thank you for yourcourage, too, and what you do on
a regular basis, becausethat's so empowering.
It really is helpful forwomen, period.
And men, because it's beenproven that the stronger a woman
is in society, the better offthat society is for all concerned.
(49:06):
Absolutely.
Yes.
It's very true.
And people need to know that.
And that's why we want toempower everyone but women.
Definitely.
Women and girls, education,knowledge, empowerment, all of that
is so very important.
It's the best thing for humanity.
It really is.
It really is.
Yeah.
(49:26):
Thank you, Shelley.
Thank you for the privilege.
I really appreciate the opportunity.
It's been an honor having youon the show.
I.
I appreciate that.
Thank you, Shelly.
Continued success.
Thank you.
I wanted to add a postscript,an update for our listeners.
After recording this interviewwith Dr.
Sanchez, Kathy and I found outthat the California bill that she
discussed, AB798, eventuallydied in the California Senate Appropriations
(49:51):
Committee in 2024.
If you're as outraged by thatas we are and you live in California,
please contact your lawmakers.
That's true for any of theother states and District of Columbia
that are silent on this humanrights violation.
Female genital mutilation hasno place anywhere in the world.
It takes a village and aunified voice to stop it.
(50:14):
It also takes awareness.
Please tell other people aboutit, share this interview or reach
out to Stop the Cut now formore information on how to help@stopthecutnow.org
thank you.
We hope you found this latestepisode informative.
And if you'd like to hear moreepisodes of Women Road warriors or
(50:36):
learn more about our show, besure to check out womenroadwarriors.com
and please follow us on social media.
And don't forget to subscribeto our podcast on our website.
We also have a selection ofpodcasts just for women.
They're a series of podcastsfrom different podcasters.
So if you're in the mood forwomen's podcasts, just click the
(50:57):
Power network tab onwomenroadwarriors.com youm'll have
a variety of shows to listento anytime you want to Podcasts Made
for Women Women Road warriorsis on all the major podcast channels
like Apple, Spotify, Amazon,Audible, YouTube and others.
Check us out and please followus wherever you listen to podcasts.
Thanks for listening.
(51:20):
You've been listening to WomenRoad warriors with Shelly Johnson
and Kathy Tucaro.
If you want to be a guest onthe show or have a topic or feedback,
email us@sjohnsonomenroadwarriors.com.
This is Women Road warriorswith Shelly Johnson and Kathy Tucaro.
From the corporate office tothe cab of a truck, they're here
to inspire and empower womenin all professions.
So gear down, sit back and enjoy.
(00:23):
Welcome.
We're an award winning show ddedicated to empowering women in
every profession throughinspiring stories and expert insights.
No topics off limits on ourshow, we power women on the road
to success with expert andcelebrity interviews and information
you need.
I'm Shelly.
And I'm Kathy.
(00:44):
Our show takes on some toughtopics sometimes, but our mission
is to educate, empower andcreate awareness to further the progress
and fair treatment of women.
What we have today is a toughissue that needs to be discussed.
It may be a difficult one forsome listeners, so we want to give
fair warning.
Did you know that 230 milliongirls and women across the United
(01:07):
States and around the worldhave been forced into female genital
mutilation?
Also called fgm.
This is the practice ofremoving or cutting the labia and
clitoris for non medical reasons.
It's an extremely painful andemotionally damaging practice that
leaves a woman without theability to experience pleasure during
intercourse.
(01:28):
It's primarily done as areligious practice.
Some cultures believe it's away to preserve virginity, enhance
male sexual pleasure, orimprove female hygiene.
It leaves terrible emotionaland physical scars.
It can cause infection, andthe vagina and urethra can close
over, leaving only a smallopening leading to painful intercourse
(01:50):
or an incision needed if awoman gives birth.
Who could imagine that thishorrific practice is even going on,
especially in North America inthe 21st century?
Stop the Cut now is anorganization on a mission to eradicate
this terrible practice.
Dr.
Maria Viola Sanchez is the CEOand founder of this nonprofit.
(02:12):
They're committed to creatingawareness worldwide and achieving
a unified voice to eliminatethis terrible practice.
Dr.
Sanchez is also presidentelect of the Ventura County Psychological
association, which was named2024's chapter of the year by the
California Psychologicalassociation, among many other positions.
She's also on the board oftrustees at Fielding Graduate university.
(02:35):
We have Dr.
Maria Viola Sanchez with ustoday to educate us.
Welcome, Maria.
Thank you so much for being onthe show.
Shelley.
What a marvelous introduction.
My goodness.
Thank you for encapsulating itso well.
Well, thank you, Maria.
Yeah, I want people to reallystop, give pause and think.
Because when I first heardabout this, I was shocked.
(02:59):
Yes.
And what's interesting aboutit, I was just in Washington, D.C.
last week.
I do a lot of as much activismas I can in the United States and
people always say to me, firstof all, when they hear about it,
they're like, what?
And then if we want, we can gointo some of the details of.
Of it, because there are fourdifferent types of procedures that
(03:22):
fall under the umbrella offemale genital mutilation, or FGM,
as you said.
And when I mentioned thatthere's 230 million, as you did in
the introduction, in theworld, they're like, what?
And I said, yes, this is an epidemic.
And then I said, and then, oh,by the way, there's over 500,000
(03:43):
women in the United States of America.
And they're like, now it'slike, yes, it does.
And what's unfortunate is thatnot only is it not going away, the
UNICEF released numbers and they.
The number that we had beenusing since 2016 was 200 million,
and they revised that to 230million, as you just said.
(04:08):
God, that's just unbelievable.
It is unbelievable.
Yeah, it's shocking.
It is shocking.
And what's really the reasonbehind my foundation is that I have
been aware of female genital mutilation.
Actually, I had a program onNPR and a guest came on to talk about
(04:32):
it.
And this was in the late 90s,and that was the first I learned
of it.
So it's always been in thebackground of my mind.
And UNICEF and the Unitednations and the World Health Organization,
it's on their radar.
And everyone says, oh, it's aterrible thing.
And February 6th every year isthe International Day of the Eradication
(04:55):
of Female Genital Mutilationat the United Nations.
I've attended it in personseveral times.
This was pre Covid, and Iactually went there on February 6,
2020, right before we got intotrouble with the pandemic.
There was less than 100 peoplein the room.
And it's an international day.
And I got so upset that allyou do is talk about it.
(05:19):
Then you give one day a yearto say how terrible it is, and then
you go on about your business.
So that is what motivated meto found Stop the cut now.
Because I kept saying Iassumed that these deep pocketed
international organizationswould be doing something about it,
and it appears that they're not.
(05:40):
First of all, Maria, I just.
Lip service.
Oh, yeah.
Unbelievable.
You know, if this happened tomen, it'd be an act of war.
It would be.
Yeah, it would.
Oh, Maria, I want to commendyou for founding this organization.
I had not heard about thatInternational Day in February either.
So there's not enough awareness?
No, there's.
And that's.
(06:00):
And I'll tell you, quitehonestly, Shelly and Kathy, a lot
of the problem is authenticignorance, because it's not a part
of a conversation in generalthat we would have.
But the other thing is, whenwe do have the conversation, which
we're having now, it makespeople uncomfortable.
(06:21):
And when you're talking aboutcutting the genitals, they perform.
The average age is from 6months to 15 years old.
That's the range in general.
And people wince.
And they, you know, they.
I spoke to the 58 district ofattorneys in the state of California
(06:42):
two years ago.
They wanted to know more aboutit because really, it's violence
against women.
It's domestic violence.
It's, you know, gender,whatever you want to say, discrimination.
And I'm in this room withseasoned law enforcement individuals,
and my PowerPoint is animated,and so is the website, because it's
(07:04):
so uncomfortable.
I'm not showing anatomicallycorrect pictures.
And they were wincing, lookingdown, crossing their legs.
You could see howuncomfortable they were.
And these are people who tryall kinds of heinous, atrocious crimes
in the state of California.
And that just showed me thatit doesn't matter who's listening.
(07:26):
If you have a heart, you care.
Yeah.
You know, this is a humanrights violation.
There's no other way todescribe it.
100% correct.
And there's no place for it ever.
And in the 21st century, it's unbelievable.
And the fact that it's notbeing given the kind of priority
(07:48):
that it should, it shows womenand girls are not being given the
priority that they deserve.
And I'm so, so thankful yourorganization is creating this awareness.
I wanted to talk briefly a bitabout your background.
I see you're a psychologist.
You said you've been in the media.
Could you kind of talk about alittle bit about that?
(08:09):
I mean, certainly you being inthe media, you know how to harness
that and get people'sattention, which is so important.
Yes.
Thank you.
So I have been a radio talkshow host for almost 30 years, which
will tell you how old I am.
And I.
My programs were lifestyle,health, parenting, relationships.
(08:31):
It was very, very little political.
And if it was political, Ididn't care what side of the fence
you were on, just as long asyou were intelligent, articulate,
respectful.
And then when syndication cameout and the budget started shrinking
for local markets, includingin Los Angeles, that's kind of when
(08:51):
I went to other arenas and Idecided to pursue my graduate education,
because psychology, as much asother industries might, doesn't really
have ageism built into it.
People appreciate that you'velived and that you have some wisdom
and that you might have some perspective.
(09:13):
So I got my master's inclinical psychology, and then I got
my master's in mediapsychology, and then I got my PhD
in psychology with an emphasison media psychology.
And my dissertation was aboutthe eradication of female genital
mutilation.
So it's been a long journey,but a rewarding one.
(09:34):
And what my dissertationproved was it doesn't take a lot.
It really just takes awarenessand education.
It does, and it needs to betalked about.
And I want to commend you again.
Bravo, Maria.
We have to bring this out, outof the shadows.
People need to know, even ifthey get uncomfortable, and the fact
(09:56):
they're getting uncomfortable,they got to know it's wrong.
Well, studying it, so havingit on my radar.
And you read about it?
Not often, because it's asecret and it goes underground.
I was at the United nationsfor an event, and the woman who was
(10:16):
part of the Health Ministry ofSierra Leone, which is in Africa,
she was speaking.
And I went specificallybecause I wanted to talk to her about
female genital mutilation.
That wasn't the topic of her conversation.
She was trying to solicitfunds for the Health Department in
Sierra Leone.
And I went up afterwards and Isaid to her, could you tell me about
(10:38):
female genital mutilation inyour country?
And she acted as if I hadslapped her across the face.
She recoiled.
She moved away from me.
And her handlers surroundedme, men and said, what is it that
you just asked her?
And I repeated my sentence.
And the man said to me, oh, wedon't do that.
And I said, that's not whatthe United nations does.
(11:00):
You have a cut rate that's 85to 91% cut rate, meaning how many
of the girls are cut and their culture.
And he said, oh, no, we don'tdo that.
And I said, really?
He goes, if a girl at the ageof 18 asks for it to be performed,
then we will accommodate her request.
And so that's thedisinformation that you get.
(11:22):
So I contacted the Unitednations afterwards, and I said, I
want to tell you this is aconversation that I had at the event
that you just hosted.
And they said, oh, yeah, theylie all the time.
No one wants to admit it, you.
Know, and denial is deadly.
Right?
And that's what they're doing.
They would rather put it underthe rug.
And how is this any differentthan domestic abuse, which they've
(11:45):
done the same kind of thingfor Years and years and years too.
I can't even imagine taking asix month old infant and doing this
to the child.
I mean, how is that not child abuse?
Well, and the worst of it isit's done in unsanitary conditions.
It's usually done in the bushon dirt.
(12:06):
It is done with items that arenot sanitized like scissors and razor
blades and shards of glass.
It is barbaric beyond.
And there's no anesthesia.
Of course, the younger theyare, the less they remember, the
older.
I've spoken with survivorsthat had it done on them when they
were 7, 8, 12, they pass outfrom the pain, so they don't remember
(12:31):
the exact whole part of it.
But then the worst of it isit's the women that perpetuate it
on the girls.
So one survivor I spoke with,her mother was a part of the four
people.
They hold them down each limband spread their legs.
Sometimes someone has to siton the child's chest.
(12:51):
And she said, I looked over atmy mother and I thought, aren't you
the one that's supposed toprotect me?
Aren't you the one that'ssupposed to keep me out of harm's
way?
And she passed out.
She came to.
So the most severe form of itis type 3.
After they cut, they bindtheir ankles and their thighs together
(13:14):
so that they can scarce withthe healing, which closes up, as
you mentioned, not only thevagina, but the urethra.
They leave an opening the sizeof the head of a Q tip from which
they're supposed to urinateand menstruate.
And they also limit theirliquids because they don't want them
urinating because it hurts,because there's flesh wounds there.
(13:36):
And the mom brought her somesoup and put a spoon in her mouth
and she spit it right back ather mother and said, how dare you?
Yeah.
And their relationship wassevered from that point forward.
That's so unbelievable.
You know, it's interesting, Iknew that it was a few years back
(13:57):
in Michigan.
There was a judge, there was ajudge who basically overturned a
federal ban on female genitalmutilation based on the premise that
it was states rights, it couldnot be a federal ban.
But what had brought this tohis courtroom was a case in Michigan,
(14:18):
some doctors that were doingthis and I guess there were a couple
of mothers who had trickedtheir seven year olds into thinking
that they were going toDetroit for a girls trip and instead
they had their genitals cut.
Oh my God.
And I remember when I firstheard this, I'm like this is going
on in Michigan.
Yes.
(14:40):
So federal legislation gotpassed in 1996 and then your judge
is the one that reversed it.
And we in the community werethen panicking because now there
was no federal ban in theUnited States of America.
And fortunately, a lot of theactivists got together and created
(15:00):
legislation and it actuallygot signed by President Trump on
January 1st 5th, the daybefore the insurrection.
So it didn't get any pressthat the federal law was back in
place because of what happenedat our Capitol the next day.
But there are still ninestates and the District of Columbia
(15:23):
that do not have legislationoutlying female genital mutilation.
You know, I think part of thatwould you say is because people don't
know this goes on.
Probably because that's thelack of awareness.
The state of Washington didn'thave legislation and people were
bringing their daughters tothe state of Washington to have it
(15:46):
performed there.
And that's also illegal.
You're not supposed to bring achild across state lines to do that
kind of thing.
But because there wasn't a lawin the state of Washington, they
were getting away with it.
So I worked with a coalition.
I testified four times totheir assembly and Senate and their
governor signed it into law inApril of 2023, moving it from 10
(16:09):
to nine.
So when they got wind of it,they did something about it.
Now, I've testified to theDistrict of Columbia twice.
They are still nowhere nearpassing legislation and they know
about it.
They've been talking about it.
They pulled people into theroom to testify.
So I don't know what theirproblem is, why they're dragging
(16:29):
their feet.
There was in Kentucky, I knowyou mentioned in your introduction
that it's primarily cultural,which is true, but there are right
wing Christian segments thatperform it too in the United States.
And this woman in her 30s inKentucky went to her legislator and
(16:51):
said, I need you to know thatthis was done to me, this is happening
in our state.
And they rallied round andthey created legislation and it passed.
And they call it Jenny's Lawbecause the woman who came forward,
that's her name.
So there has been progress,but for nine states and the District
of Columbia to still not haveit illegal is somewhat unconscionable
(17:13):
and also unbelievable.
Stay tuned for more of womenRoad warriors coming up.
Dean Michael, the tax doctor here.
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(17:34):
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rate speaks for itself.
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(17:55):
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(18:15):
of a moment you're proud andjoin us on social media.
Learn more@truckingmovesamerica.com.
Welcome back to Women Roadwarriors with Shelly Johnson and
Kathy Taccaro.
(18:35):
If you're enjoying thisinformative episode of Women Road
Warriors, I wanted to mentionKathy and I explore all kinds of
topics that will power you onthe road to success.
We feature a lot of expertinterviews, plus we feature celebrities
and women who've been trailblazers.
Please check out ourpodcast@womenroadwarriors.com and
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(18:56):
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(19:17):
We want to help as many womenas possible.
Did you know that There areover 500,000 cases of genital mutilations
of women and girls in theUnited States and 230 million around
the world.
It's shocking.
This is happening in the 21st century.
Dr.
Maria Viola Sanchez is on amission to stop this horrendous practice.
(19:39):
She's the founder of Stop theCut now to rally support and get
people around the world toeradicate this terrible practice
that's often motivated byreligious and cultural traditions.
Dr.
Sanchez says a lot of theproblem is authentic ignorance because
it's not a part of theconversation that we would have.
When we do have theconversation, it makes people uncomfortable
(20:01):
to get all of this to change.
Dr.
Sanchez says it takesawareness and education.
The problem is genitalmutilation is a dirty secret that
goes underground where itcan't be discussed.
No one wants to admit to thepractice and they lie about it even
happening.
There are still nine states inthe District of Columbia in the United
(20:21):
States that do not have lawsbanning female genital mutilation.
Think about that for a second.
It's just horrific.
Dr.
Sanchez's information and hermission are so important for everyone
to know and to get involved.
Dr.
Sanchez, what is the reasonthis is done?
I know that religion, certainreligions do not believe that women
(20:47):
should experience sexual pleasure.
Correct.
And they want them to maintaintheir virginity.
Obviously this is going todiscourage anybody wanting to have
sexual intercourse.
Correct.
It would be a very painful experience.
Correct.
It is so the primary reasonsome people say religion, but nowhere
does it say that in any religious.
(21:09):
It's not in the Bible, it'snot in the Quran.
There are imams that thinkthat it's religious.
But then there's an Iman inthe United States who came from Sudan
who has said no.
Muhammad said do no harm.
No.
Abraham said do not harm.
So they're evolved.
(21:29):
A lot of it honestly is just habit.
And I'm going to be a reallyvulnerable statement that I'm making
here.
I ignorantly circumcised mysons when they were born because
my dad was.
My brothers were.
My husband, their father was.
(21:50):
I didn't even think anythingabout it.
And if that's what I did as aWestern woman who's educated and
intelligent, that's one of thereasons it's still prevalent.
This is what we do.
Sure.
Well, I think withcircumcision and we're told that
that prevents infection andit's more hygienic.
(22:12):
But there are.
That is not true.
But yes, that's what we're told.
Is it really though?
It's not true.
The foreskin serves a lot ofpurposes and I have apologized to
my sons and I even waspublished John Hopkins Press, they
did a story on regrets of male circumcision.
So some people compare the twoand there is no comparison because
(22:36):
mine was done in a hospitalwith a local anesthetic by a physician,
you know, whereas this is not.
But to your point about thecase in Michigan, there were physicians
that were.
They.
It's called medicalized thatthey were doing it the way we would
perform surgery on any otherpart of our bodies.
(22:58):
Right.
I'm just looking online.
I see because being Canadianto see what's what it is here.
And I'm just reading that thegovernment of Canada condemns FGM
and other harmful practicesthat threaten the well being of women
and girls and violate theirhuman rights.
In 1997, Canada's CriminalCode was amended to clarify that
(23:20):
FGM is a form of aggravatedassault and that removing a child
from Canada, for the purposesof mgm, is a criminal offense.
So that's kind of good to know.
You have a very great activistgroup in your country, and there's
a woman, she's done adocumentary on it.
It's called something like,Not My Daughter and Giselle Poitney,
(23:44):
I believe her name is.
And she.
She.
I've interviewed her and I'veseen her documentary twice.
And you should be reallyproud, because Canada is very progressive
in that regard, and so is thestate of California.
I mean, we passed our law inthe state in 1996 after the feds
did theirs, and it was enactedin 1997.
(24:04):
And I introduced legislationin the state of California because
it's not good enough.
It's old.
There's loopholes.
There was a public healthreporting that was never done.
And my bill passed through theAppropriations Committee unanimously
and is now stuck in the SenateAppropriations Committee because
there's a cost to it, becausewe're making the penalties stronger.
(24:29):
And they're sayingincarceration then costs the state
more to keep somebody there longer.
And in the meantime, we'recosting people's lives.
I mean, emotionally, it's gotto devastate.
Physically, I mean, I can'teven imagine.
And the fact that this isbeing done to girls.
Yes.
I mean.
(24:49):
And they don't have the understanding.
I mean, I don't have theunderstanding as an adult woman,
why on earth any of this wouldbe allowed.
Why it's considered acceptableby certain groups of people.
To me, it looks like male domination.
There is a lot of that, Shelley.
It is patriarchal.
It is also, as you mentioned,a way to ensure that a girl is a
(25:11):
virgin.
And countries that value thatthe dowry for their daughter is higher
if the girl is cut.
And then the sad part is, isthat if and when they do have intercourse,
after they get married, theyusually rupture and hemorrhage and
have to go to the hospitalbecause the penis isn't meant to
(25:33):
fit into an opening that small.
No.
The pain.
Yeah.
And then the worst is thatthen the women don't want to have
intercourse because it's painful.
Oh, sure.
So a husband ends up having awife who doesn't want to engage.
It's a.
It's a lose, lose, lose for everybody.
(25:53):
No one would want to havepainful intercourse.
No.
Thus, you know, out of dutyand obligation, they acquiesce.
Um, but there are men who areagainst fgm, too, and they say, we
want a woman who gets pleasureout of making love.
That's the whole point.
And it's like, yeah, so if,yeah, if you're in pain that you
(26:14):
know, then what's the value in it?
Yeah.
So the good news is there aremen getting involved because some
men just accepted that this isa rite of passage and the tradition.
And then when they're alsoeducation and awareness made aware
that this is really barbaricand it doesn't benefit anybody, they're
(26:35):
like, yeah, why would we do that?
Why would I allow my daughterto be sedentary?
That.
So there is movement in thatregard, but the numbers.
Not in terms of the numbers.
Sure.
Well, that's where awarenessand what your organization is doing
is so essential because it'sreeducating people and it's bringing
it out into the sunlight,which is where it needs to be.
You were talking about fourtypes of fgm.
(26:58):
I'm reading some of thedetails on that.
It's absolutely disgusting.
Feel free to go into some ofthe gory details so people can really,
really step back and say,yeah, no.
Sugar coating, because this is real.
Right.
So that was part of mylegislation too, was that California's
definition of female genitalmutilation should align with the
World Health Organization'sdefinition, which they created in
(27:22):
1995 and then they fine tunedit again in 2007.
But part one is the partial ortotal removal of the clitoris.
Part two is the removal ofthat, the clitoris and then the labia
minora.
And then part three is the onethat's the most egregious.
(27:43):
So that's the narrowing of thevaginal orifice.
And then they bring togetherthe cut skin from the labia minora
and the labia majora.
And then that cut edge,they're stitched together and that's
referred to as infibulation.
And then type 4 is any kind ofprocedure to the genitals.
(28:04):
And that's pricking, piercing,scraping, cauterizing, nicking.
And so some people are saying,well, type 4 isn't as bad as the
others.
So how about if we just dotype 4?
That conversation exists too.
And it's like, no, that isalso mutilation.
You know what I would say tosomebody like that?
(28:25):
Okay, you want to be the firstone to stand up and volunteer for
that?
Yeah, you know, you go first.
Yeah.
So there are organizations andthat's the other thing that my foundation
does, is so I'm involved notonly with a network in the United
States formally, but, but Ihave global, we call ourselves intactivists
(28:47):
throughout the world wherethey're trying to make their mark
globally, too.
So the United States, Imentioned, there's over half a million
girls that have been cut.
That's true.
In the United Kingdom and theEuropean Union, they each have about
500,000.
Kerr.
So I'm in touch with Paris andDublin and London that they're trying
(29:11):
to do that eradication ontheir level.
So that's the good news iswe're collaborative.
Like, I don't have any problemif somebody's.
I have a friend, herorganization works in Kenya.
I sit on the advisory board ofa woman whose organization works
in Liberia.
Like, you know, the more the merrier.
If we can move the needle at all.
(29:32):
Let's do it.
Let's work on this.
Yep.
So, like the organization inLiberia, she actually is in the United
States.
But what she does is shesponsors girls.
She gives them tuition,uniforms, books, school supplies,
menstrual pads, and has theirfamily signed a legally binding document
(29:57):
that they will not cut their daughter.
They have to go to a physicianonce a year to prove that they haven't
been cut.
And these girls actually getto go through high school and they
get to go on to collegebecause FGM also holds girl back
socioeconomically.
So, unfortunately, she onlygives 20 scholarships a year because
(30:20):
that's all her organizationcan afford.
And it's like $20 a year to do that.
She ships menstrual pads,because that's another thing that
if they don't have menstrualpads, they stay at home for five
to seven days while they're menstruating.
So it gives them theopportunity to go to school.
And so what I try and do issupport her work as much as possible,
(30:42):
because she already has theboots on the ground in Liberia.
She already has their trustand their confidence.
She already has the documents,the physicians, et cetera.
I just want her to be more successful.
Bravo to that.
And it takes a village to makethese changes.
It actually does.
It really does.
It really does.
(31:03):
And that's why I would like toget the ear of an Oprah Winfrey,
for example, who has a lot ofa footprint in Africa, because they
say that the largestpopulation of FGM girls is in Africa.
I was reading that.
Yeah.
So it's.
(31:23):
But it doesn't.
It's not exclusively so, but it's.
You know, if we could move theneedle in Africa, we would be making
a big difference in the world.
Yeah.
So, like, for example,Somalia, they cut 98% of their girls.
Egypt cuts 91% of their girls.
So I was in Dubai in The uae.
(31:47):
And I was working with somecultural folks there, and I talked
about female genitalmutilation, and they said, we don't
do that here.
And it's like, that's not true.
What's the percentage in Dubai?
So I don't have that number bya city, but it's high.
(32:07):
And they're considered one ofthe more progressive areas of the
Middle East, I think.
No, they still subjugate theirwomen to, you know, they just let
them start to drive.
Recently, they having beenthere, you know, you cover up from
head to toe, even foreigners,you have to cover your knees and
your shoulders and.
(32:30):
Yeah, no, I have a realproblem with the uae.
I'll never go back.
I was asked to speak there again.
Like, I just can't.
I cannot justify how you treatwomen and girls.
And I know that they have alot of money and, you know, but it.
They do terrible things.
So I just.
I'm like, no, I.
I've been there once.
(32:50):
That's good enough.
Yeah, I don't blame you.
I think that the publicperspective is that Dubai is more
progressive, but unless you'veactually been there, you don't know.
Yeah, they don't.
It's amazing how people kindof hide some of that, you know, just
bury it.
Well, there's actually adocumentary, Shelley, about Dubai
when they were hosting theWorld cup for soccer for FIFA, and
(33:13):
they basically incarceratedtheir workers for six, seven, eight
years to build the stadiumthat it was going to be hosted in.
And they interview.
The documentary shows thatthey pay them very hardly livable
wages.
They stock them away indormitories without air conditioning
(33:34):
and 122 degrees, et cetera.
And then two days before thetournament was to begin, they reneged
on their beverage contract,and I believe it was Budweiser beer.
They said, no, you will not beable to serve that because they have
no alcohol in their country.
Right.
(33:54):
And so I can't help but thinkall along they knew they were going
to do that, but they justlured everybody with their, you know,
we're being progressive andthis is a worldwide event, and it's
not just for our.
Our culture and our population.
So I don't trust them.
I don't blame you.
That's the long and the shortof it.
Sure.
(34:14):
Maria, what your organizationis doing is so essential, and the
fact that you're on our showso we can let our listeners know
is really important.
I am sure that there's somepeople who are listening right now
who want to know what they cando to help what can people do to
help your organization?
Because more.
More people need to be madeaware, more people need to be involved.
(34:36):
So thank you, Shelley, forthat and Kathy, too, for the opportunity.
I'm afraid to say that it allboils down to donations, really,
because there's only so muchthat we can do without that.
But the good news is it's notthat complicated.
So education and awarenesscost just in terms of producing the
(34:58):
materials and sometimes havingthe language changed, depending on
the population, because likethe communities.
So California leads thecountry in the number of putt girls.
So out of the 500,000 in theUnited States, they say 513,000,
almost 80,000 of them live inthe state of California.
(35:19):
That's an inordinate amount ofthe population of the country.
It sure is.
And so for me to get themessage to the various communities
that are affected by it, thatrequires getting into their communities,
getting their confidence,having them feel safe that they can
share, getting the materialsand their language of origin.
(35:40):
And again, that's where thecosts come in.
But the good news is that oncepeople are exposed and understand
that this isn't what we needto be doing, there is a population
that is agreeing to changetheir culture, their traditions,
(36:01):
and their way of life.
The other thing is that themedical school curriculum doesn't
include female genitalmutilation in it.
So that when pediatricians andOBGYN see it in their practice, they
are shocked because they don'tknow what they're looking at.
That boils down to public health.
Yes, it does.
(36:22):
And again, that costs money.
It's just to get the message out.
It's always about money.
The money makes the world go round.
Yeah.
I just wanted to say thank youso much for just your.
Your dedication and yourcommitment to getting this.
This word out there.
And the education is everything.
(36:43):
I personally am partiallyinvolved in the whole menstruation
beyond, beyond menstruationthat's going on in India where the
women have to be in huts andwhen they have their period every
month and they're banned andthey're considered dirty and filthy.
And so I, I think betweenyourself and myself and anybody who's
(37:04):
vocal about these issues, it'sthe only way to get the public to
react is by being vocal andparticipating in.
In things that make them uncomfortable.
Right.
Because, I mean, you got tostep outside their comfort zone if
you want to be real and honestabout what.
What's really going on and nothiding behind that.
That white picket fence said,oh, all is rosy, you know, and, and
(37:28):
not listen to, to the peoplethat say, no, it's not happening
in our country.
Yes, it is happening, and youneed to open your eyes and do something
about it.
So I just wanted to, I justwant to commend you again.
Thank you so much.
Yes, thank you, Marilla.
Thank you for that.
Because I think it's actuallywomen that will probably be the biggest
game changer in that When Ifounded Stop the Cut now, the second
(37:52):
title is Eradicating FemaleGenital Mutilation.
So people know exactly whatwe're talking about.
It's not about, you know, selfharm, self cutting, that, those other
psychological issues.
My husband's on the boardalso, and he's an avid golfer.
And they'll say things, youknow, what do you do?
Or whatever.
(38:12):
And he'll bring it up.
And they're like, now hegolfed with a physician from Texas.
And the guy was like, no.
And he was like, oh, yeah.
So the, I love it that it'scoming from a man, too.
But the title of thefoundation apparently is good enough
because sometimes they'll goto stopthecutnow.org and they'll
(38:33):
contact me and said, I playedgolf with your husband this week
and he told me about the workthat you're doing and I would like
to donate.
And it's like, oh, my gosh,how you know.
And again, it's $100 here or$200 there.
It doesn't matter.
It all adds up.
It's just, especially for men,I think is because they'll say, I
have a wife, I have daughters,you know what?
(38:56):
And it's like, yeah, what?
Yeah, they're shocked andincredulous, but it's information
they need to know.
Everybody needs to know it orit's never going to change.
I commend you for what you're doing.
Stay tuned for more of womenRoad warriors coming up.
(39:19):
Dean Michael, the tax doctor here.
I have one question for you.
Do you want to stop worryingabout the irs?
If the answer is yes, thenlook no further.
I've been around for years.
I've helped countless peopleacross the country, and my success
rate speaks for itself.
So now you know where to findgood, honest help with your tax problems.
What are you waiting for?
If you owe more than $10,000to the IRS or haven't filed in years,
(39:41):
call me now at 888-557-4020 orgo to mytaxhelpmd.com for a free
consultation and get your life back.
Industry movement, TruckingMoves America Forward is telling
the story of the industry, oursafety champions, the women of trucking,
independent contractors, thenext generation of truckers, and
(40:01):
more.
Help us promote the best ofour industry.
Share your story and what youlove about trucking.
Share images of a momentyou're proud of and join us on social
media.
Learn more@truckingmovesamerica.com.
Welcome back to Women Roadwarriors with Shelly Johnson and
(40:24):
Kathy Tucaro.
In certain parts of the world,virginity is a requirement for women
before marriage.
The dowry for a daughter isgreater if her labia and clitoris
have been removed.
This is just one of thereasons that many girls as young
as infants and teens aresubjected to genital mutilation.
(40:47):
Their labia minora andclitoris are cut for non medical
reasons, leaving thempermanently scarred.
In one particular procedure,there's only an opening about the
size of a Q tip that's left toallow girls and women to urinate
and menstruate.
Once these women haveintercourse after their marriage,
they typically rupture andhemorrhage and they have to go to
the hospital.
(41:08):
Stop the Cut now is aNonprofit founded by Dr.
Maria Viola Sanchez that'sworking internationally to stop this
terrible abuse of women andgirls, which, shockingly, is not
talked about.
It's denied and quietlycontinues even in the United States,
where at least 500,000 womenand girls are mutilated every year.
(41:29):
Dr.
Sanchez's organization isworking to change laws and educate
people around the world.
She talks about the obstaclesand what we all need to know to issue
a rallying cry to stop thisbarbaric practice once and for all.
The good news is awareness andeducation are making a change, even
though it's at a snail's pace.
Maria, you're really making adifference by opening people's eyes
(41:51):
to the ugly truth of thisterrible practice.
We do on our website try to beas educational as we can.
You've got no nonsense, candidinformation and you list all the
current stats of what'shappening around the world, including
the United States, and what states.
It is really powerful.
It's moving the needle.
(42:12):
That's what's important, youknow, bit by bit by bit.
Yep.
Every little bit ofinformation makes the difference.
It gains the awareness and itmakes the change.
And Shelli, you're part of thebit by bit just by us having this
conversation and for your listeners.
I mean, as I said, if you knowyou need something to be done, sometimes
(42:36):
you have to do it yourself.
Yes, that's very true.
Well, Maria, I'm so glad to beable to help.
Because this awareness,bringing things out, like I said,
into the sunshine is the onlyway it's going to change.
This is marginalization.
It's abuse.
It is nothing but a humanrights violation.
It should not exist.
(42:56):
And the more people that hearabout it get out of the denial phase.
You know, it's not a pleasant topic.
It's creepy.
You know, it makes peopleuncomfortable, but they need to be
and they need to realize ifthey feel uncomfortable just hearing
about it, it's wrong andsomething needs to be done.
You know, just to let yourlisteners know.
(43:17):
There's a country called theGambia and they had legislation that
outlawed female genital mutilation.
Their national assemblydecided that maybe they would reverse
that and they would allow cutting.
And we, my internationalactivists, we circulated a petition,
we got over 150 signatures ofbig time upper ups in the world.
(43:40):
But they were deciding whetheror not to make it legal, which they
would have been the firstcountry to do.
So three quarters of theirgirls are cut and they voted and
they voted to keep the ban.
But 34 of them voted to keepthe ban and 19 voted to overturn
it.
So you know, 19 people saidthat they wanted female genital mutilation
(44:03):
to be legal in their country.
Now see, that's devaluingwomen too and marginalization.
And it does feel like we taketwo steps forward and 10 steps back.
But that's where perseveranceneeds to take place.
People can't give up.
They have to have a voice.
42 of them voted to overturnthe ban.
(44:24):
They got more information.
They, to their credit, theyhad a period where they welcomed
people to talk.
That's why we did our petitionand et cetera.
And of those 42 overturningit, only 19 stayed to overturn it.
But it was close, it was scary.
We were all worried throughoutthe world.
And that happened just last year.
That's super scary.
(44:46):
Wow, Maria, you're creating awareness.
You're creating a unifiedvoice which, which is so necessary
and this awareness is makingthe difference to stop these laws,
to educate the lawmakers,which is so necessary.
And I know that that's part ofthe mission of your organization.
Where do people find you?
(45:07):
How do they reach out?
Can they reach out to you?
Absolutely.
So stopthecutnow.org is the website.
There is the information, youknow, brief education.
There is a donate button onevery page and my contact information
is with, at the very bottom ofthe website.
Not only my personal cellphone, but my email.
(45:28):
So it's stopthecutnow.org weare, by the way, 501C3.
And the IRS has given us taxexempt status, so we're as legit
as they come.
And that wasn't easy to get either.
Oh, it never is.
Excellent.
What do you have the greatestneed right now?
(45:51):
I would like to see the ninestates and the District of Columbia
pass legislation.
And I'd like to see AssemblyBill 798 in California, which is
the one that I sponsored, get passed.
And then when we have tackledthat, then we can get onto the world.
We do need to tackle the world.
People need to be aware ofthis issue to stop it.
(46:13):
All of this needs to betotally eradicated.
This practice should never happen.
It's just atrocious.
Every kind of descriptor I canfind, mind.
It's just heinous.
You know, this is.
This is torture.
This is abuse.
It is everything that shouldnever, ever happen to any human being.
And if it happened to a boy ora man, like I said earlier, there's
(46:36):
no way it would happen, you know?
Well, if you think about 230million women in the world, we don't
even have that many women inthe United States.
That puts it in perspective.
Makes you really think of thegravity and the size of it.
That's a lot of people.
It really is.
It's a lot of people.
It's a lot of people.
I was involved in theeradication of polio, and now that's
(47:00):
only in Afghanistan, Pakistanand Nigeria.
So I've seen global campaignswork and this one needs to be a global
campaign, too.
Yep.
And people need to attend theinternational day about this issue
that happens every year in February.
They need to be involved.
(47:20):
Yeah.
And an Egyptian girl had justdied from being cut because one of
the things that can happen isdeath because of the bleeding.
And they talked about thatwhen I was there on February 6th
of 2020.
So we had a real life.
Right.
The same week example of howterrible it is.
It's just so.
(47:41):
Just so you know, Shelly, I.
If your listeners are feelingthat there is vicarious trauma, as
I start to feel when you hearthat, what happens?
How can you not feel empathy?
Oh, yeah, absolutely.
One of the survivors, she'sfrom Somalia.
She's told her story at aconference I attended in the uk and
(48:02):
I couldn't stop crying becauseshe's the one that remembers.
She was 7 when she was cut.
She remembers it all.
I was just like, oh, my gosh,what do you say?
I'm sorry.
Like, is that good enough?
Yeah.
I mean, the person's Life isforever changed.
Correct.
Not in the good.
Not for the good at all.
(48:22):
It's emotionally andphysically traumatic.
It leaves a scar.
And I can't imagine any parentthat would say, gee, this is an okay
practice.
Right?
You know?
Well, thank you, Maria, forwhat you're doing.
We definitely need some peopleinvolved, and that's why I wanted
you on the show.
It's a tough topic, butsometimes it takes the tough topics
(48:44):
to make a change.
It really does.
Well, and thank you for yourcourage, too, and what you do on
a regular basis, becausethat's so empowering.
It really is helpful forwomen, period.
And men, because it's beenproven that the stronger a woman
is in society, the better offthat society is for all concerned.
(49:06):
Absolutely.
Yes.
It's very true.
And people need to know that.
And that's why we want toempower everyone but women.
Definitely.
Women and girls, education,knowledge, empowerment, all of that
is so very important.
It's the best thing for humanity.
It really is.
It really is.
Yeah.
(49:26):
Thank you, Shelley.
Thank you for the privilege.
I really appreciate the opportunity.
It's been an honor having youon the show.
I.
I appreciate that.
Thank you, Shelly.
Continued success.
Thank you.
I wanted to add a postscript,an update for our listeners.
After recording this interviewwith Dr.
Sanchez, Kathy and I found outthat the California bill that she
discussed, AB798, eventuallydied in the California Senate Appropriations
(49:51):
Committee in 2024.
If you're as outraged by thatas we are and you live in California,
please contact your lawmakers.
That's true for any of theother states and District of Columbia
that are silent on this humanrights violation.
Female genital mutilation hasno place anywhere in the world.
It takes a village and aunified voice to stop it.
(50:14):
It also takes awareness.
Please tell other people aboutit, share this interview or reach
out to Stop the Cut now formore information on how to help@stopthecutnow.org
thank you.
We hope you found this latestepisode informative.
And if you'd like to hear moreepisodes of Women Road warriors or
(50:36):
learn more about our show, besure to check out womenroadwarriors.com
and please follow us on social media.
And don't forget to subscribeto our podcast on our website.
We also have a selection ofpodcasts just for women.
They're a series of podcastsfrom different podcasters.
So if you're in the mood forwomen's podcasts, just click the
(50:57):
Power network tab onwomenroadwarriors.com youm'll have
a variety of shows to listento anytime you want to Podcasts Made
for Women Women Road warriorsis on all the major podcast channels
like Apple, Spotify, Amazon,Audible, YouTube and others.
Check us out and please followus wherever you listen to podcasts.
Thanks for listening.
(51:20):
You've been listening to WomenRoad warriors with Shelly Johnson
and Kathy Tucaro.
If you want to be a guest onthe show or have a topic or feedback,
email us@sjohnsonomenroadwarriors.com.
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