Doula to Doula: Zana's Insight on Nurturing New Life and Families

When Zana, a beacon in the realm of childbirth assistance and owner of Zion Doula Services, recounts her transformation from a medical assistant to a full-time doula, you can't help but feel the passion behind her calling. Her journey is a vivid illustration of dedication and the profound impact of following one's heart into the world of birth work. Alongside Zana, we traverse the emotional landscape of doula responsibilities, from offering unwavering support during pregnancy to fostering autonomy during childbirth, and even the importance of nourishing the body and soul after the baby arrives.

Every birth story is a unique narrative, ripe with its challenges and triumphs, and this episode paints a broad stroke across the canvas of birthing experiences. We engage in conversations that demonstrate how doulas navigate intricate client relationships and the ethics of their practice, particularly the delicate matter of continuous care from prenatal to postpartum stages. Zana shares her insights into the crucial role of childbirth education, empowering expectant parents to advocate for their birthing plans and exploring the profound influence of the healthcare system on the birth process.

Culminating in a discussion on the spiritual and healing practices intertwined with birth work, we examine unconventional methods like placenta encapsulation and the creation of restorative soups, underscoring the holistic approach to postpartum care. Zana's voice adds depth to our understanding of the doula's role, not just in the physical act of birthing, but in the emotional and relational shifts that accompany this transformative time. Join us as we celebrate the sacred journey of childbirth and the doulas who are committed to supporting families through every step of this natural and powerful experience.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome, guys, to another episode of Working Out
the Kings, the Podcast.
We are here today with Zaina.
She is the owner of Zion DulaServices.
She's going to go ahead andtell her story of how she became
a Dula in this segment of Dulato Dula.
So gone, girl Peace everybody.

Speaker 2 (00:21):
I am Zaina, of course , the owner of Zion Dula
Services.
I have been a birth worker for18 years.
Birth work has been a part ofmy life since I can remember.
I would say at least 12 yearsold when I had my first birth
experience, but then also beforethat, I was always fascinated

(00:43):
with birth.
I would be that kid in the roomwatching some type of birth
video.
I'm not sure why I loved birth.
I just knew that it was acalling for me.
It was something that keptcoming up into my space, coming
up into my life, and it'ssomething that I just wasn't.
I wanted more of.
I wasn't.
I got pregnant really young, somy goal was to be an OBGYN.

(01:09):
I didn't know too much about mewith free.
I also didn't know too muchabout a Dula what a Dula is?
There was no word to what I wasdoing when I was serving
families.
It was just like oh, call Zainabecause she's pretty calm.
And then I was a medicalassistant.
I worked with netwives anddoctors, so I was pretty
educated on certain things thathappened in the birth space.

(01:30):
So everybody called me,everybody called me for
everything when it came down tobirth reproductive STDs.
So I just became that person inthe family that everybody would
call for birth and I just thatwas just a part of me, it was
natural for me.
So, 18 years later, and I'mdoing it now full time.

(01:55):
So this is what I do full time.
I don't have a full time jobanymore.
This is my work, my life's work.

Speaker 1 (02:02):
That is so awesome Because I remember you were
still working at like an officewhen I first met you, and now
you're just completely full time.

Speaker 2 (02:10):
Full time Because I mean, I literally I couldn't.
I needed birth, like I neededto breathe.
That makes sense.
Yeah, I think because I am moreof I'm shifting my work in this
birth work game where I'm nowI'm shifting to midwifery, but I

(02:32):
just couldn't do it anymore.
I felt like why would I put mylife, my life, work, my passion,
the love on as a hobby orsomething to do on the side?
Right, I was like I'm going tohave to jump out there.
But it's very scary, right itis.

(02:52):
It's very to know that you go.
You go from getting a paycheckevery week, I'm going to get
this paycheck every week.
I don't have to think about it.
But now when you're shiftingand you're saying like, okay,
it's like your own installbuilding, and you're like, okay,
I'm going to jump and I'm goingto make it to this parachute,
right, to kind of like balancemyself so I won't get hurt, but

(03:13):
you kind of like, you kind oflike don't care at this point,
like I'm going to jump andwhatever happens happens.
But it took me a while, years,to get there and I just remember
waking up saying I can't dothis anymore.
I got to the point to where Iwas working in the clinic, I was
so nasty and mean to the peopleI was so like, just, I had no,

(03:36):
because I was in a toxicenvironment too, where I you
know, where we were dealing witha lot of people that don't look
like me and they were over thesame certain things, and I had
no.
I had got to the point to whereI had no control to say
something.
Right, I had no control to belike oh, you think you're going

(03:56):
to talk to me like that, but letme, you know, let me see what I
have to say.
So when I realized that I wasgetting depressed, I was like
what are you going to do?
You're going to jump or you'regoing to keep just standing
outside the building?
What are you going to do?
And something happened at workand I was like I'm done, I'm
done, I'm going to do this, I'mgoing to do this.

(04:17):
And I'm telling you I was soscared I remember being dry
mouth.
What did I do?
Like, what did I do?
You know, because you knowbirth work is, you can be a
hustle, like there's a hustle,like you got to get out there
and put your name out there.
You got to go visit thesepeople in South City.
So you have to get yourself outthere.

(04:37):
And so I mean, at that point Iwasn't as popular as I am now,
but you know, I had to get outthere and put myself out there
and I was like, look, nothing, Ihad never been, was no poem.
I'm going to have to do what Igot to do.
I have to do what I got to doand you know, in the
multi-spirit my ancestors, wejust all got together and we

(05:02):
just collectively said this iswhat has to be done.
You know, and it took.
You know it took a while.
I'm not going to lie and say Iwasn't scared.
Right, I was scared.
And there was time when mybusiness slowed up and I didn't
know how I was going to pay mybills.
That was a thing.
But I had to sacrifice thatbecause this is what I love.

(05:25):
Like I had to be able to sayyou know what, if I don't go on
this journey, if I don't go, youknow, if I don't go on this
journey right here, then what amI doing?
Like you, this is a journey,like you know, you're not going
to jump out again, everythinggoing to be taken care of.
So you've got to get off themud, and that's what I did.

Speaker 1 (05:44):
That's amazing Because, I have to admit,
there's definitely that momentwhere there's like almost every
week, every day, it's just like,yeah, what I'm supposed to be
doing right now, this is itright.
And then you know, and then youhave that client, and then it
just feels like, yeah, thisfeels right, right.

Speaker 2 (06:03):
This is one thing I never had to question.
I never had to question wasthis walk for me?
I never.
When I question was why am Iwaiting?
What are you doing?
Like?
What are you doing?
Like you're going punctureclock you letting people tell
you when you can use thebathroom, when you can.

(06:25):
You know there's patients in aroom and you have to go from
room to room.
Like I never questioned myselfas a birth worker.
I really questioned myself isare you going to continue to be
a worker B?
Are you going to do your thing?
You know, I think birth work,when it's when it's an ancestral
calling, it's like it'sundeniable, like you can't even

(06:47):
there is undeniable, like things, when things fall into place
and you meet people and thingshappen, it's like I belong here,
okay.
It's like that reassurance,like that confirmation, like
when it said one or two agree,then you know that it's for you
and that's just what it was.
And I think I think, by all ofthe things happening prior to me
, even my job was.

(07:09):
I have been talking to a lot ofmy births and I'm like then the
client, like I can't tell themanymore and my mentee, she
finished.
She was the first person tofinish my mentor program, my
mentorship program, and she,she's such a wise little soul.
Every, every time we talk,you're still working, you're

(07:29):
still working.
She always made me think aboutit because I think she knew, I
think she knew, like man, you, abeast, people love you.
You got the spirit of whateverancestors that's here into my
spirit.
I don't know, I don't know.
I'm the only one in my familythat's a birth worker.
So that spirit comes fromsomewhere.

(07:51):
You know I do.
I do know that on my dad's sideI have a I had a great great I
think it was a great great greatgrandmother that was a midwife.
So you know, um, yeah, so Inever that's one thing I never
questioned.

Speaker 1 (08:08):
I never questioned me as a birth worker, but I
definitely questioned me being aworker bee, like you know not
having to say what to do andwhat you can't do, and I have to
admit that's the one thing thatis hard for me, because I don't
think I'm at that space yet tojust like jump out of work and
just do this full time.

(08:29):
I'm not quite there yet.
I'm still super, super fresh.
However, there's definitelythose moments when I'm just like
at my job, I'm just like Ihaven't used the bathroom in
five hours, yeah, yeah, and it'slike, good Lord, this is not
natural, this isn't.

Speaker 2 (08:44):
No, absolutely not, Absolutely not.
But listen to me, it took me.
So when I again, I was a doulaway before I knew there was a
word to it, right?
I didn't know what it was.
I just know, I'm always justsomebody they wouldn't do, every
holding their hand, you know,breathing with them.
I'm always in the familymembers, just friends, you know.

(09:05):
So I didn't even know that wasa name to what I was doing until
at that job Listen to this.
This was, this was very, verypowerful.
That's how I knew that I waslike okay, this is, this is the
path here.
I was working in podiatry andyou know that's definitely
different from you know, that'sso different, so vastly

(09:29):
different.
I went from working withmidwives to working with
podiatrists.
To be honest, they paid more.
To be honest, that's what itwas about, and I was.
I was clipping this lady'snails and I had never seen this
grand, her granddaughter.
That was with her, she was my,and when she would come in she
was like I want Zana, so I'mdoing her nails, I'm doing her

(09:54):
nails.
Her daughter looks, hergranddaughter looks at me and
she says do you like your job?
And I said, yes, okay.
She said what would you?
What would you really, reallywant to do?
This woman didn't know me fromanywhere.
That was my first time seeingher and I had been working with
her grandmother for years andshe was like I said well, me

(10:17):
personally, I would love to work.
I would love to work side byside with a doctor or a new wife
and a person.
I would love to be, you know, asupport person for pregnant,
for pregnant mamas.
I said, but my goal ismidwifery.
I said, but I really, really dowant to stop getting myself
back into the labor and deliveryroom, you know.
And she said, oh, like a doulaNow, this was in 2016.

(10:41):
And I said like a who?
And I said, oh, that's a, so Iit immediately.
I wrote it down, right, and shesaid, well, my sister just
finished the training withSister Nicole in New Orleans.
She's a midwife.
And I was like, okay, writethat down for me and I'm going
to check it out.

(11:02):
I typed in Sister Nicole no,but it was Sister Midwife
Productions and she popped up.
I was like that's my person,I'm going.
So I saved up them five.
I think it was like five and ahalf dollars.
I saved up that money.
I was like I'm taking it andthat's it.
I'm not looking back.
And that was my introductioninto what a doula really was and

(11:25):
how to get started by doing,you know, an actual training.
So I went to her in 2017.
I think we did like a 10 week,but at that time it was in
person, so it was very deep.
Oh my God, changed my life.
That program, oh my God, thetraining changed my life.
Everything was, it was.

(11:47):
It just was never, never beenin the space of you, like, this
is my people, this is where I'msupposed to be, and that's what
it was.
It wasn't even just on birth,so it's just shifting the way
that you think.
You think, you know, you know,and that's what it did for me
and it was like a aha moment.
This is you, you know, andthat's how I got introduced to

(12:08):
what a doula was.
I had been doing it for so long.
So now I'm like, oh, so now Iget into this training and I'm
going to talk about job oreducation.
We're talking aboutbreastfeeding.
We're talking about the spiritto walk, you know.
We're talking about domesticislands.
We're, you know, let's do thewhole.
We're a whole bunch of thingsin one, Like we do it all.
We, the therapist, we, thesister, you know, we, the, we

(12:31):
could be the partner, we, youknow, we are the whole bunch of
things at one time.
And, you know, getting intothat and realizing that this is
deep, this is not just aboutholding somebody's hand and
breathing with them.
This is really really deep.
And the more we talked about,you know, that spiritual
connection with birth work, itwas just like, okay, this is why

(12:53):
I used to be 12 or 13 years oldwatching a birth story.
Like, why are you watching that?
Like you know I, oh, it had tobe something surrounded by birth
and I remember just watchingthe episode after episode after
episode after episode is likethis is beautiful, Um, but it
was a deeper dive into whatdoolers do and it literally

(13:19):
changed my whole everything whenit came down to how to serve my
people and knowing what mytarget audience was, you know
how to promote myself, all ofthe things, and I'm grateful for
that.
You know that training becauseI do know that they have
trainings out here that's threedays, four days, you know, and
it's like, hey, you can be okayif that's what you're doing it

(13:39):
on that level of a business.
But but that training was sodeep that it just shifted.
It just shifted everything thatI thought I knew about birth
and how to serve and, you know,and be with families.

Speaker 1 (13:55):
I'm glad you said that, um, because the work we do
is community based.
Yeah, it is very much likeanybody who I have worked with
so far.
I have grown a friendship withthem.
Yes, I know that it's got to dowith it, I would say spiritually
changing time Very vulnerabletoo, and you're very vulnerable

(14:17):
in that moment and it's like howdo you not grow a connection
with these people?
And there are some doulas outthere who literally just like I
see you here, I see you there,I'm on call for X amount of
weeks.
And then after that, if there'ssomething past the baby being
here, whether or not I canreference you to someone else to

(14:40):
speak to, my job is done andI'm just like whoa.
My God, how can you just cutsomeone off?

Speaker 2 (14:49):
like that, oh my God.

Speaker 1 (14:51):
After seeing them in such a vulnerable moment and at
one point I kind of wondered, amI just too emotional for this?
And I'm like, oh, I'm in theright space, You're in the right
, yeah.
Yeah, and this is crazy to me,but you know, it is what it is.
It's just not for me just tocut somebody off there.

Speaker 2 (15:09):
Yeah, and I know that we have doulas that's broken
into columns, right, like youknow or specializations, like I
do postpartum better than I dolabor delivery, or I do
preconception, you know, and sosome people are more, are good

(15:31):
at you know one thing and theyare another.
But as a doula, we are fullspectrum.
Right, we are full spectrum, wedo it all.
But I also know that if you'renot gonna serve from the root of
to the tooter, I don't know, Idon't know, like I don't know
how you know how that, how youcan do that, but I do know that

(15:55):
they do have people that's like,hey, I'm only doing labor and
delivery, you know, I can giveyou whatever.
I've heard that before andthat's a disservice, because now
what happens is what you thinkhappened with that postpartum.
They have a hormone boost ofall over the place, right, they
used to be in with you.
We did childbirth education, wedid comfort measures, we did

(16:18):
massage, we did all the thingswe did labor and delivery.
You see my who I open up to.
Yes.

Speaker 1 (16:24):
Hello, I say, if I see in your who how we are
friends now.

Speaker 2 (16:29):
Come on, we are like this my girl Okay, that'd be
cool, you know, and so, and thenafter, I'm so sorry, my dog is
doing something.
He don't have no business, butdon't worry about it, I can,
I'll deal with him.
But, like, you got to be ableto serve, you got to be able to

(16:50):
serve these people, becausepostpartum is a weird time for
moms and don't talk, we're noteven talking about that.
These people already haddepression prior to, anxiety
prior to, so their attention tohaving postpartum through this
order goes up about 30%, right,and so it's like, okay, now I
got to get to know somebody elsethat probably could not be my

(17:12):
people.
I'm comfortable with you, butI'm being shifted over.
That's why it's great when youhave, in your interviews, you
tell people your limitations, soyou can give them that you know
the opportunity to say, well,hey, this is not, yeah, this is
not what I want.
You know, type, deal, I'll goto the next person.

Speaker 1 (17:31):
That's real and else and it you have to be.
What's the word I'm looking for?
I guess open.
I'm just gonna say open toeverything Because, you know,
maybe if you do have likerestrictions of what you're able
to do, at least then you can belike your client.
This person can be like youknow what I like you, I like

(17:52):
what I've seen online, but Ineed a little bit more, like
some people.
Like some people.
They actually need more helppostpartum than prenatal.

Speaker 2 (18:00):
Then they prenatal.

Speaker 1 (18:00):
that's it, you know.
So if that's the case and theyneed to be with someone who's
gonna help them when they needthe most help, that's it.

Speaker 2 (18:07):
That's it.
That's it, that's facts.
Yeah, you know, and then alsolike, like that's your people
too.
Like are you my people?
You know, cause?
I had a transition where I was,I was serving everybody.
Like anybody do an interviewwith me, oh yeah, remember your
doula.
You can't even do that today.
You can't get me to do thattoday, the moment I feel like,

(18:30):
hmm, something is off.

Speaker 1 (18:33):
I will say.
I will say, personally, I don'tthink.
Maybe cause it was the personwho it was.
I don't think I'm great atbeing a backup doula unless I
have met this person alreadyonce.
That's it Cause I had asituation once and this is the
only time this has happened tome.
I had a girl who I was backingup for and she was at a bird so

(18:55):
she couldn't leave and she askedme to take over her client.
So I was, so I went to thebirthing room and this is like,
hey, I kind of met her onceduring like an interview, but
she didn't pick me, she pickedthe other girl.
So, and I only think she evenremembered me, but I remembered
her, yeah, so I'm trying to justlike jump in and I'm trying to

(19:18):
like guess what's your comfortmeasures and what are?
you comfortable with and I'mlike we don't have any type of
relationship.

Speaker 2 (19:24):
So I don't really know.

Speaker 1 (19:26):
So I'm trying to figure out what works for you,
and this is the only time I'veever had a person who I worked
with curse me out and I felt sodisrespected and I was like, wow
, Like this is and like I know,I've never had birds.
I can't say the amount of whatpeople go through when they're
in that moment, but I've neverhad a client curse me out.

(19:47):
Yeah, like cause, I guess youknow I was trying to use like
words of like affirmations andshe was not with it.
But I'm like, how do I knowyou're not with it when I've
never met him?
Right, I'm trying to figure outwhere we stand.
And then you know she had awonderful birth.
Like you know, we did all thethings that she needed and like
her husband was really nice andsweet.
And then you know her husbandhad to bring up to her like, hey

(20:09):
, you know, you did curse herout, like she was like you know,
did I do anything wrong?
Do I did anything bad?
And he was like, well, yeah,you cursed her out.
And then she was like, oh, I'mso sorry, I don't even remember.
And I'm just like, do youreally, or are you just
comfortable in that momentbecause you could?

Speaker 2 (20:27):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (20:29):
It really meant to be fair.
She's the only person I'venever like developed a
relationship with.

Speaker 2 (20:34):
Yeah, because she wasn't actually my client so
what our thing was said and done.

Speaker 1 (20:39):
it went back to, you know, like the postpartum that
went back to the original duela.

Speaker 2 (20:43):
Yeah, yeah, and you know, the backup thing is so
weird to me too, like I'm justgetting this year, I'm just
getting into the whole.
I'm really not still into it.
I'm not into it.
However, you know, if I amworking with somebody because I
do work with a colleague as wellnow and I do my own and if you

(21:10):
know, if I'm on backup and Ineed to talk to this person,
right, I need to have aconversation with this person,
because I just don't think thatis a I don't.
I don't want to say the wrongthing, but I just don't.
The whole backup thing is weirdto me, and I'm seeing that

(21:30):
because when you're in communitywith these mamas, right, these
families, you buildrelationships, you build trust,
right, and you have seen thisperson since 12, 13 weeks, and
now here's the birth, and theperson that I've grown this
connection with is not there.
They're going to bring somebodyelse on.
They don't sit right with me,they just don't.

(21:54):
And I know that, hey, you knowsome people they OK with it, but
I just can't do that.
So what I do is I kind of like,bring my mentee on right.
Like my mentee, she comes withme, I go with her to her freedom
so we can build thisrelationship where we're in, you

(22:16):
know, so it's safe.
But instance, hey, you know Ican't, maybe I'm at another
birth or whatever.
Whatever is happening.
You got somebody that you alsoconnected with.
Like just to show up out of onevisit or out of one Zoom
meeting is just bizarre to me,but it happens.

(22:36):
But then I also schedule.
Well, right, I don't do morethan three, I'm only doing three
births a month.
Right, and those three births amonth, my mentee is going to be
at my pre-meetings with me,especially if she have people,
because we kind of coordinateour days with each other or our
gestation days with each other.

(22:57):
So if she has somebody that'scloser, I'm like, ok, we can tag
, see me do it.
We got to do it in buildcommunity with these families
together and so they arecomfortable with you, if you
know.
But just to just pop up and belike, hey, I'm taking over for
time, no, no, I can't get withthat new wave.
I can't.
I can't get with that, that'snot a thing.

(23:19):
And also I don't look myselflike crazy.
I was going to say People thinkI do a lot of births, it'd be
like you're going to be rolling.
I say it looks like I'd berolling because you see me post
out on delivery or whatever.
But if you can, if you actuallygo back and see sometimes I
don't hit my three births amonth.
I don't hit that all the time,but when I do I'm out for the

(23:40):
count like this month no births,because I did three already for
a month before I got to regroupmyself.
I got to be able to replenishmyself.

Speaker 1 (23:50):
And that's what I wanted to ask you about, because
I mean, you have been doingthis for like 18 years.
How do you not have the burnout?
And I'm assuming it's becauseyou only take so much a month.

Speaker 2 (23:59):
Yeah, and then also, I don't over.
I'm not a people pleaser, right?
So I'm not a person that'sgoing to be like overly doing
things for my clients Like Ididn't I'm not going to lie when
I started out man listen, whenI thought that I was such a
little I'll make yourappointments for you, I'll do

(24:20):
these things and just overlydoing things and just wearing
myself out.
But when I had a reality checktwo years ago, I was like you
going to be in this game Becausegoing around you, going baby,
you're not going to be in thisgame.
We got a quick burnout in whatwe do.
So it's like I make sure Ispend time with myself.

(24:42):
So I did three births back toback.
I was supposed to do, I wassupposed to be going postpartum,
but it came out that we didn'twork and we didn't work out.
So I'm like OK, this was areason for me to take a break
and that's what I did.
So if I do three the next month, I may not do any, because I

(25:03):
got to replenish myself.
I got to serve the mamas thatneed postpartum that I just did
a delivery with a few weeks ago.
So I got to go check up on mypostpartum mamas, I may cook a
whole meal and go bring it toour family.
So there are things that I dowith my people.
That is something that we dofor each other, like that is
just my people.

(25:23):
So you have to be able toreplenish yourself and share
space with yourself.
Take you some breaths, get yousome rest.
You don't have to be nothingextravagant, like going to get
your nails done.
You don't have to do thosethings.
You don't have to, butdefinitely share space with
yourself.
Take some breaths, realize,like sit down and just like

(25:45):
decompress.
What did I just witness?
What does it happen?
Depending upon a birth that youhad right?
So I try to do as muchself-care as I can, because this
work is my life's work.
I ain't going to burn out, Iain't going to let it happen.
I'm not going to let it happen.

(26:05):
And then I'm shifting over tome with free next year, so I
have a free self, thank you.
I have a beautiful priestesswho I've been working with for
the last couple of years, so I'mdoing births with her, and then
I'm doing births with my mentee, so I'm always doing some
things with.
That's what I'm going to say.
Hey, y'all, I'm good, I need abreak.

(26:26):
I know how to say that.
I didn't used to.
Now I do All right.

Speaker 1 (26:31):
So, speaking of mid-referring, because last
season we had Shay come on andshe kind of went, like you know,
at home it were free and howthat's kind of different from
working with a midwife in ahospital Very.

Speaker 2 (26:44):
So it was very, very different.

Speaker 1 (26:45):
So I'm assuming you're going the at home route,
absolutely.

Speaker 2 (26:49):
Yes, absolutely.
Hospitals listen, the hospitalshas got me in a chokehold right
now, like I'm at the point towhere and I know that 98% of
people are still having babiesin the hospital Right, so it's
getting to the point to wherenext year I may shift out of the

(27:10):
hospital.
To be honest, it's getting morebizarre, it's getting more
taxing on my spirit.
Hence why I have to take awhole month off, hence why I
need that we're at the birth Two, three days.
I'm out Emotionally.
I got to replenish myselfBecause you watch your people,

(27:35):
not that they treat it bad,because I have great
relationships with midwives anddoctors and nurses, but it's the
whole mechanical thing, right.

Speaker 1 (27:47):
It is mechanical.
When you watch it, you'rewatching them.

Speaker 2 (27:51):
Just hear this.
Hear go side attack for fourhours, hear go serve a deal for
so many hours, hear go for toastand hear go the foley balloon.
And you're watching themphysically interrupt a
physiological birth, personalexperience.
And you, like y'all are so inmy mind.
I'm like y'all are lost, youknow.
And so when they do see a momcome in and they are seven

(28:14):
centimeters, they're like, oh myGod, what's going on?
We got to do so.

Speaker 1 (28:16):
It's like Put this out, and put this out, and put
this out.

Speaker 2 (28:20):
It's like y'all don't understand if y'all just take a
freaking breath, if y'all justleave these numbers alone and
let them burst.
I promise you is going tochange and shift your whole way
of thinking.
But it's a system that they'rein and so when you're in a
system and, like you know, Ihave people say all the time
like hey, but then you, you needit there, you know, or you need

(28:44):
to be a midwife in a hospital,listen to me, you're a part of
the system the system will eatyou up and spit you out, because
it's a thing that you're doingevery day.
Right, you're in this, you'rein this tunnel of checking on
this patient, giving them silo,take, giving them, put those in
and this is a real current overand over and over, and become

(29:05):
like breathing for you.
I don't want that.
I don't need that in my spaceand I don't want that for my mom
More specifically, my black momis.
That's why I serve.
It'll never come a time where Iwill ever desire a hospital
education for as having mybabies in the hospital, for as

(29:27):
being a midwife.
I will never desire that.
That will never be somethingthat I ever desire.

Speaker 1 (29:32):
No, I mean it makes sense, because I mean every
person is different, everysituation is different, but when
you're in the hospital setting,everybody's treated the exact
same.

Speaker 2 (29:42):
That's right.

Speaker 1 (29:42):
It's like you know, you know it's gonna happen by
clockwork.
Like yeah, the last client,like she, was like so how's this
gonna work?
So I'm like oh, let me tell yousomething like so first we're
gonna come in, they're gonnamove the car, they gonna do this
on the car.
They're gonna do this.
I'm gonna put this underneathyou.
It's gonna look like a littleziplock bag.

Speaker 2 (29:58):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (30:00):
And literally like clockwork, it happens Exactly.

Speaker 2 (30:06):
And listen.
We understand that women bodiesin their system, in which the,
in a way that they carry babies,have babies, are so different,
mm, hmm.
And so to put a bunch of womenin this system where it's not
individualized at all, it's likeyou get this and everybody get

(30:27):
the same thing.
Something is bound to happen.
Something is bound to happenbecause the side of tech, do to
somebody else, you know, do thesame thing to me, versus.
So it's like something is boundto happen.
So that's why we have all thesetraumatic stories and deaths
and things like that.
And then also, education is key.
Education is key.

(30:48):
That's why, for me, my mom waschildbirth education is
recommended.
You can't even sign with me.
You got to have childbirtheducation and I ain't gonna ask
you too many times about it.
If we have a conversation andhey, I'm saying childbirth
education, I sent you the officethis week for childbirth
education, the next period ofvisit, we don't discuss it.

(31:09):
You tell me oh, I didn't go.
Oh, but we must not be, we mustnot be community with each
other.
Something or no, like what'shappening for me.
I'm a do that gets a.
I go to the spirit.
What's going on with you?
Well, you're not.
You're not complying withcertain things, because I want
you to know what I know.
I don't want to have to tellyou that's the problem that

(31:31):
we're having.
I don't want to have to tellyou to do this and do that and
this was going to happen.
I want you to know what I know.
So when you walk in, I can'tspeak for you.
Right, I'm your do la.
I'm going to advocate for you,yes, but I cannot tell this
doctor she doesn't want this andno, you're not going to that's
that's not how.

Speaker 1 (31:51):
I'm glad you said that, because that is one thing
I hear a lot of.
Oh, what I want to do, becauseI want them to say this and do
this, I'm like my job is to beyour backup.
That's it for yourself.
That's it, and I'm going tolike reaffirm what you say.
Absolutely, I cannot tell thisdoctor what to do, else I'm
going to be kicked out.
That's it.

Speaker 2 (32:13):
I cannot speak for you, and not even the whole
point of being kicked out.
That's just not your job, right, like my.
So my tagline is do is empowerand empower.
For my job, this is to empoweryou to have this experience, and
whatever the experience maylook like to you, it doesn't
have to be of this water bird,this home bird, it can be

(32:33):
whatever you desire, and my jobis to empower you to do so.
So for me to empower you, Ihave to educate you.
I have to give you the rightresources to make sure that
you're getting all theinformation that you need to be
able to sustain theseconversations that these are
talking to you about, becausethey like to say big words and

(32:55):
things that you may not evenknow.
But if you were to take a NikiaLawson job with education, who I
, who is my go to person, youdon't remember?
Oh, I remember that, right?
So, help me, help you, help me,help you.
That's my, that's my thing, andso you know.
You know it can be wrong,because our community don't,

(33:16):
don't, don't tell you certainthings that we should, and
education is one of them.

Speaker 1 (33:23):
Right, unfortunately, and it's like no disrespect or
any shade towards who do likethe who you call it a gender
reveal parties and all this.
Right, that's cool.
Yeah, you should take a littlemoney on the side for yourself
to educate yourself, so whenyou're walking, you know, that's
it.

Speaker 2 (33:43):
That's it and listen.
Maybe you can't afford a doula,right?
Maybe there's some thingsthat's happening.

Speaker 1 (33:49):
Right.

Speaker 2 (33:49):
But you can't tell me that a topic, education says
you know, can't help you, right,and I'm talking up you know.
So you've got to be able toeducate yourself and that's the.
That's the problem.
If we are able to go to thesedoctors, appointments, whatever,
I don't like to say the phone,I like to see it in paper,
because you know, most ofdoctors are not really like tech

(34:13):
savvy.
Ask the questions, bring allthe questions that you have each
time you go to the doctor.
You should at least have fivequestions.

Speaker 1 (34:20):
Right, and I think the issue is that, you know,
doctors pretty much have what1015 minutes per person to be
with, and I agree, but I thinksome women actually feel afraid
to ask those questions becausethey feel like they're, you know
, interrupting the doctor and oh, I don't want to take too much

(34:40):
of that person's time and it'sjust like but it's not about
them, it's about you.

Speaker 2 (34:44):
And so guess what?
And that's why I say I'm a, I'ma, I'm a do love spirit.
Because when we're sitting downand having community with each
other, I'm asking about child,childhood trauma, mama daughter
relationships, people pleasingRight, I'm talking to you about
your partners, relationshipbetween y'all to right.
And I'm talking about let'stalk about therapists, right,

(35:07):
I'm that person.
I'm not that person that'sgoing to be like what a bandaid
on it.
Let's see what we doing, let'swhat's going on.
I'm a and that's and that's,and I need something that I do
on purpose.
My spirit can't, ain't gonnaallow me to just be like see
this woman, I'm looking at youand I can see that you and, or
more something is happeningwithin yourself, because

(35:27):
pregnancy brings on shifts inrelationships Mama, daughter,
dad and daughter.
You know partner and partner.
You know it brings on all thesedifferent, you know entities,
to where your body is, and youknow it's like a spirit of
trying to align things together.
And so you may have a greatrelationship over here, and not

(35:49):
so much for the one that's, notso much as the relationship you
want.
So let's talk about it.
Let's talk about what we can do, like I had a meeting this
right before here, like let'stalk about this, this
partnership.
You know, like where you feellike you're not being heard at,
and I think that's the besttherapist that I that I said
both of the, both of thesetherapists are my clients.
They are the beast.

(36:10):
So let me, let me give you thisinformation, that way y'all can
have y'all some couples thereif y'all bring your mom, bring
your dad, it's, I think it'swhen you're pregnant.
It's time to become aligned,because when you are pregnant
and you bring in a baby, forwhen you have all of those
things happening right and whenyou have all of those

(36:30):
relationships going all aroundyou, how you can properly be a
fulfilled mother when you havethings here that's happening.
So I'm not doing, I'm not doingit.
Hey, let's do this, let's youknow and and and I mean to open
up and let's talk.
I had so many people bus out andcry and I love it, let it go,
release it, because I mean I,you can tell me, you think I

(36:53):
hear some stuff, I can tell yousome stories, and I'm like, tell
it to me, I'm here for it, Ican take it.
I can take it, release it.
That's what I want my people tobe able to come to me and sit
in my space and release we'rethinking about to release so
that way I can give them theright resources to help them get
on that journey Right.
Because imagine having all ofthese things going on mentally

(37:16):
you decide to have a baby,you're going through postpartum,
you're going throughbreastfeeding, right, you're
going through healing, and thenthe other elephants in the room
how, how, how, you, you know,how is that?
And so I'm definitely a spiritperson like let's, let's align
some stuff.
Let's, let's get some stuff onthis journey happening.

(37:36):
It ain't gonna happen beforethe baby get here, but at least
you can start on it, at least wecan have some, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (37:45):
That is a lot.
That is what I love it, though,because it's something so
necessary.
It is like you can't physicallylet go.
You know it mentally cannot letgo, like your body is really
connected.
That's it, it's reallyconnected.
So you have to pull a man, thatgirl, you good, you listen and

(38:09):
also listen to this.

Speaker 2 (38:10):
Listen to this If you've ever been in the space of
a mother right that has hadissues and she is always female
relationships, it's a mama right, it's a grandma.
If the end of pregnancy, it'salmost like the baby summons
these people and you're cryingand all of a sudden you're

(38:33):
really, you're thinking aboutthe relationship with my
grandmother, the relationshipwith my mom, the relationship
with my aunt, and you try tofigure out what is coming from.
This baby is trying to alignthese female relationships.
That's what's happening.
So let's talk about it, put iton the table.
I'm good as a mediator.
Let's talk about it.
So and not to soup my horn andit would be ego I want a lot of

(38:57):
people.
I bought a lot of peopletogether and that's why my
relationships with my family isso deep.
So deep because I love you andI want you to be as full as you
can with this baby.
Because these, these womencoming, they are coming to
change and shift this, this,this thing called earth.

(39:18):
They come in the shift and theyneed a mama and a baba who is
good enough and clear enough tobe able to understand what
they're birthday.
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 1 (39:35):
So I have a question and it's not really.
It's not really related to whatwe just talked about.
I do have a question.
So I had a client recently andyou know, one of the things we
were talking about a lot waslike birthing positions and like
what she feels comfortable with, because, you know, we should
really want to do like like aside position birth.

(39:56):
We talked about it, we wentover everything in her prenatals
and then the moment came andyou know, the doctor, you know
the first thing to do is putthem down, stirrups up, and I'm
just like, okay, she didn't wantto do this.
So I'm looking at her and I'mlike, hey, client, not gonna say
any name, yeah, we talked aboutthis during your prenatal.

(40:16):
Is there something you want tospeak to your doctor about?
Like are we going to go on anddo the position you talked about
, you know, giving her the roomto speak?
And you can touch was like Idon't know if I'm gonna do it
anymore.
And I'm just like, do you?
I'm like, are you sure?
Like it is your decision andI'm going to back up what you
want.
Yeah, I do remember us havingthis conversation about your

(40:39):
choice and what you wanted to doand the whole time the doctor
just looking at me, like so,like mid, like nurses, mid
putting up the store up, like Idon't know what to do.
I'm looking at her and I'mlooking at the client and I'm
looking at the client's husband.
I'm like we just had thisreally long conversation.
Like you know, you don't haveto do it this way.
I'm like, girl, I can.

(40:59):
You know, this is why we weargloves.
I can hold that leg, that's it,that's it.
And then she was like, no, I'mjust gonna go ahead and do it
this way.
So it is your choice.
I have respect to choice younow I'm going to take because
the doctor's kind of alreadygotten you that way how do you
deal with that?

Speaker 2 (41:18):
Well, I would say this it doesn't start in the
birth room.
So, with my clients, what we dois we have all of these
conversations right and thenalso understanding that the
doctor can say one thing at thebeginning of the pregnancy and
at the end say another.
That is a thing.

Speaker 1 (41:34):
And we talked about that during that prenatal.

Speaker 2 (41:36):
Mm, hmm, and so what I do is I tell my clients, we,
if we have a, if we have avirtual right, and I'm like,
okay, what are your threequestions?
Right?
And so we'll put all thewhatever the five questions that
she has and I'll, and I'll askthem, like, hey, making sure
that your bird plant hasn'tchanged, right, do you want to
deliver?
On your side, do you want todeliver?

(41:58):
And you know, on all fours,whatever that looks like, I say,
well, make sure that yourdoctor I say because the doctor
are not really trained any otherway so if they say at the
beginning, hey, yeah, this iswhat I want to do, make sure,
before you make 30 weeks, thatyou had that question again.
And I'm going to tell you whyyou had that conversation with

(42:18):
them again.
Because then, hey, you probablydon't have to switch if you
have to, because that's a bigdeal to shift what my process
and what my thought was, becausemy doctor is not comfortable,
right, and so, and what happenedto do that?
Say 30, you know, 30 weeks ishard for you to kind of transfer
when you're 32 and you're 35.

(42:40):
So, making sure that you havespecific conversations with this
doctor.
This is my wishes.
Here is my bird plan.
This is what I, this is what I,this is what I desire is my
preference, you know, and makingsure that they are accountable
for that.
Hey, I gave you this and not in, that's what I'm saying.
Confidence is real.
In that moment.

(43:02):
She probably had thatrelationship with the doctor to
be able to say, no, I don't wantto do it this way, you know,
because they bullies.
But they don't have to bebullies and saying words.
It's just their presencesometimes that way and they
don't know, like you know thatthey have to comply.
But that conversation has tohappen in prenatals with you and
appointments with the doctor.

(43:23):
So that's why I go with myclients to to at least one or
two for sure.
They have to be induced becausethey have the station diabetes
or they have a preeclampsia.
Then we got to be talking aboutyour birth, your induction
methods, how the what that willlook like.
So, making sure that you go tothem, go with them to the

(43:43):
doctor's appointments and havethose conversations with that
position and and so if you keeptalking about it to them, they
have no choice but to honor it.
So when you get in there andthey decide that he's going to
put you in stirrups, thereminder okay, she's going to
get on her side and you ain'tgot to wait for him to say it on
your side and he's gonna haveto make his money.

(44:03):
You have to work for it.
Yes, he or she's gonna have towork for that money.
Yes, yeah, you know, and soit's like I understand, like I
understand, like you know, somedoctors are just like old school
and this is the way that theydo things and this is what
they're comfortable with.
Because if you ever been on mylike doctors, like outside of

(44:25):
birth, everything is like oh, oh, my God, you know, a hurry like
type of deal nurses to, becausethat's a system that they're in
, but people at the forefrontand having a conversation with
them, to where she's comfortableenough to not even reply to him
, putting her in the stirrup.
Just turn yourself around toyour brother, put your leg up,
hold my, hold my legs.

(44:45):
Do your job, sir, ma'am, doyour job, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (44:58):
Yeah, I guess, for a moment I was like okay, I guess
we're just gonna do it this way.
I'm just like I just it is tome.

Speaker 2 (45:07):
I'm unmedicated because, sometimes she was
medicated.
Okay, because I say sometimeswhen they unmedicated is like so
many things is happening atonce and they can't think about
it.
They can't.
You know what I'm saying.
So, yeah, that's the thing thatdoes.
I've never had that happen.
I'm like that because myclients be like no, we're gonna

(45:31):
do it this way.
We got we get up because I'm on.
I also will say this butunmedicated birth, you can't lay
on your back and hurt, sothat's the most.
You know that that is sointense when you do that.
So my client like I don't likethat, I'm like it, I'm gonna do
it like this, you know.
So I'm medicated.
People admit it may not be astough to him because they didn't

(45:52):
kind of like numb, so it's like, oh, not so bad, okay, I'll do
it.
You know that could be thereason behind it.
It just depends on in which waythe birth makes sense, all
right.

Speaker 1 (46:06):
so I have questions about Zion do the services.
So what do we all offer withour do the services?
Just to you know, talk up somebusiness.

Speaker 2 (46:19):
Yeah, okay, so I do offer listening to encapsulation
.
I offer breastfeeding classes,postpartum classes.
I also offer nesting partiesfor families.
What else I do?
Meal prep?
I do a little bit of everything.

(46:39):
Yeah, I don't like you, do alittle bit of everything.
My one thing about it myclients don't get a meal and
they don't get nothing else.
They're gonna get a nestingparty because I love postpartum
and I love to prep forpostpartum and so those things
going to happen.
Your last visit, we allpostpartum baby.
Our other ones, we talked aboutthe.
You know the transition, youknow, but we're going to be on

(47:05):
this postpartum kick right here,babe, we all offer a good bit
of things.
I'm trying to shift out.
I stopped doing job oreducation because it doesn't
resonate with me.
That because, not that, itdoesn't resonate with me, but I
am not a person that likes to beon.
Zoom five was at a time that,amy, I'm okay with it, I'm okay

(47:27):
in it, I'm not great at it.
So I stick to the things thatI'm great at.
Okay.
So the key of law and would dothe owner of the international
donor.
She does all of my job witheducation classes for my mom's
and they free.
And when I tell you sister is,she's so do, and so you know,

(47:51):
yeah, so we offer a good bit ofthings here.

Speaker 1 (47:55):
Yeah, that's probably what I need to look at.
Maybe maybe not, we shall see.
I've already taken placentaencapsulation classes, which I
do love, but I always have totell people because when I talk
about it I just let people knowlook, this is just something
that we know from looking atanecdotal situations.

(48:17):
But it also makes me sad thatwe kind of don't have anything
from a scientific research.
You know, because I do likescience, I've always been that
kind of nerd, like in school,like in science and stuff, but
then I'm always just like well,you got to think about it also
from like a Western hospitalstandpoint.
If there was a way to like helpwomen with their milk and with

(48:41):
like postpartum depression andall that and it's natural from
your body, why would they doresearch on it when they can't
sell you the products?
So I'm like you also have tothink about it from that thought
process.

Speaker 2 (48:54):
And then also, like I'm a okay science person right,
I'm okay with science.
I'm a person that looks at ahuman experience, right?
So if I have done encapsulationspecifically encapsulation for
most of my moms and for them totext me and say these things are

(49:18):
really a mood booster, like Iwas feeling sad, a few minutes
ago I took these pills and now Ifeel I have energy, I have.
So I'm a person that I don'tneed science to tell me that
something works.
When I see it work, I see it.
And then also they're sellingplacentas.
They're using it for makeup,they're using it for diabetic
ooms, they're using it for somany other things hair, right.

(49:42):
I had a client who was fromJamaica.
They used them.
Back in the day, the mom wasjust taking placenta from the
hospital to keep it in thefreezer, to do what you know
what they used to do with itGrind it up and put it in oil
for their hair to grow, and so Iknow what.
The placenta is the mostamazing life-sustaining organ

(50:03):
that I've ever had the pleasureof working with.
So it's like I see what it does, I know what it does, you know.
I can remember when I got I hada hysterectomy, maybe eight
years ago, and I was havingthese bad high flashes.
It was so bad and mymother-in-law it took me to

(50:24):
Whole Foods and there was thesepills and it's called menopause,
24-hour remedy, right.
And so I'm taking the pills andthey stink so bad.
I hate to smell these things,but guess what?
They worked.

Speaker 1 (50:38):
I didn't have to work .

Speaker 2 (50:40):
I had the AMNP and I had to worry about not getting
sleep and the nighttime, nonight sweats, like it was
perfection.
So when I went into now I'msaying this to say like how
powerful placenta is or howpeople have been using placenta
for so long in supplements andwe don't even know it, we don't
even know it, they just call itsomething different.
Yes.

(51:00):
So what happened?
I took this training with oneof my E-fi sisters, stacey, the
one who taught me placentaencapsulation Shout out to
Stacey, oh my God and mypreceptor, who also taught me as
well.
But I had a one-on-one withStacey where I did this two-week
intensive postpartum, livingwith her and man, it was life

(51:26):
changing and I had always wantedto work with the placenta.
Like even when my clients wouldhave them, I was like I wanna
touch it, like I just always hadthis gravitation towards the
placenta and I was like I reallywanna and I used to send my
clients to someone else to doplacenta encapsulation just
because I was like I don't know,I wanna do it but it ain't
resonating with my spirit to,kind of like, go ahead on and do

(51:49):
it.
So as years passed by, I waslike I just keep this, it keeps
coming up to me, it keeps comingup.
And I did this training and weput the placenta in a steamer
and it smelled Mells and I said,oh my God, this is the smell
that the pills smell, like thatI used to take when I had my own

(52:11):
, but I used to have half lashesand she was like, huh, I say
yes, I say this is the samesmell.
It was like it was so strong.
I was like oh my God, thisremind me of the pills that I
took and I said I got on myphone immediately.
I was like 24 hour remedy, halflashes, whole foods.
Couldn't find them nowhere, butwe ended up finding something

(52:35):
on Amazon.
Amazon, that was the same boxthat I used.
Right, it was discontinued.
It was placenta, okay.

Speaker 1 (52:49):
Let me just say just quick question.
You're gonna say everything yousaying.
I know you're not a big scienceperson.
Yeah, all you're saying is alab report.
Yeah, that's it.
That is a lab report.
It's just not me.
It's just not certified byschool.
That is the only difference towhat you're saying.
But yeah, but it's real, thoughit's like we know this.

(53:10):
I mean, the animals do it for areason, right.

Speaker 2 (53:13):
Hello.

Speaker 1 (53:15):
Like they not dumb, like they do it for a reason.
But yeah, I mean they probablygot discontinued because they
probably was using somebody'splacenta and they probably not
without knowledge too.
That's it.
That's it, Because it's stillsomebody's body parts but go on,
that's it.

Speaker 2 (53:28):
And then also, knowing that people are now
understanding, like, howpowerful the placensas are and
they're keeping them.
So maybe the flow of placensas,you know, slow down.
But let me tell you somethingthat field, those fields, was
amazing, that was the best.
Like I was like can't find themanywhere.
And like you say, animals do itright.
One thing about an animal theycome here on earth and do

(53:51):
exactly what they're supposed todo.
They don't go outside it, theycome in and do exactly what
they're supposed to do.
So that's what I'll find theanimal anywhere, because that's
what they're gonna do, what theyhave to do.
And then also with humanexperience, you're watching
these moms who have had birdsbefore and had postpartum mood

(54:12):
disorder, and now they have yourplacenta encapsulations and
they're like, oh my God, it'slike night and day.
So you're watching this actualevidence, not that this big lab
or this FDA and all these peoplethat can give you a stamp of
approval.
You see it, you see it.
And so for me that's all theevidence I need and it's just a

(54:32):
beautiful thing.
I'm just very, very blessed tobe able to give something to
somebody and pour so much loveinto that capsule, each capsule
actually, because it's very deepfor me.
It's very, very, very deep forme when I'm working with a
placenta, and so you know, humanexperience is the best
experience for me.

Speaker 1 (54:52):
I heard that.
Now I have another question,for I end up letting you go.
But to the meal prep.
I like food, what you cooking.

Speaker 2 (55:03):
So everybody loved my famous Oprah stew.
Oh, yes, I love it, they lovedmy stew.
I've made squash soup.
I've made tomato soup, I'vemade meat-soaked soup.
What else I made, I just madefor a client last week we before
last this potato and kale soup.

(55:24):
It was delicious and that wasthe first time I had made it.
So what I do is I have aPinterest, right, and so my
Pinterest will give you all ofmy post-partum meals that I'll
do for my clients.
So it depends on your package,right?
If you get the Deluxe package,you automatically get three
soups for me.
So I'll send off at the end ofthe pregnancy, I'll send off the
you know, the printers and say,hey, pick which soups that you

(55:48):
want.
Nine times out of ten they'regoing to pick that Oprah stew
and look, it's going to hitevery time.

Speaker 1 (55:54):
Every time it's going to hit Girl that's so smart,
and what I really like about itis that you're not just picking
garbage to give people you knowwhat I mean, just respect to
anybody or any culture oranything.
Yeah, what I'm saying iseverything you mentioned is high
in fiber.
Yeah, have good vitamins.
There's nutrients in everysingle meal and that's so

(56:15):
important because you've alreadylost so much blood.

Speaker 2 (56:17):
Yes, that's it, that's it.

Speaker 1 (56:19):
Like you need that.
Oh, that's so good.
Yep, yep, I love that.
Oh yes, ma'am, I love soups, Ilove that, I know, and it's so
easy it's so easy too, so good.
I had this mushroom and seaweedmiso soup and I make it all the
time, and I love seaweed.
Seaweed is good.

Speaker 2 (56:39):
I eat seaweed out of all packs from Trader Joe's.
Just I love it.

Speaker 1 (56:44):
That's my favorite snack Because they have the
Asian markets and they have thedry seaweed and they just soak
stuff and I mean there's so manynutrients in seaweed.

Speaker 2 (56:54):
That's in the iron?
Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 1 (56:57):
Absolutely.
That's actually a really coolidea.
I might have to write that down.
Pick up yeah, my daughter,because I don't never use
Pinterest, but a Pinterest soupboard sounds amazing.

Speaker 2 (57:08):
Yes, and all you have to do it, and they give you
great ideas too.
And then also, if I'm startingon Instagram and I see Mama
Shafia, she do these beautifulsoups and I'm like, oh, I'm
going to look on Pinterest tosee how I can do it, and what
I'll do is I'll go to the storeand play with it, I'm like, ok,
let me make this and see howthis tastes.
I'm that type of person.
I love it.

(57:29):
So, yeah, I like to makehealing soup and warm soups.
That's good for the soul.
I tell my clients all the timehey, after you didn't push this
baby out with no medication, getyou a push, you can do it.
You deserve to eat whatever youwant to eat when you get home.
We're healing over here, babe.
We're going to have these soupsfor the first week.
We're going to soup you down.

(57:51):
We're going to vegetable youdown.
We're going to fruit you down.
We're going to do all of thethings, so yeah.

Speaker 1 (58:00):
So I lied.
One more question.
I'm going to get all myquestions out as I think about
it.
I'm just going to ask so,especially for people who are
listening and they probably wanta doula.
Never had a doula before, theywant a doula.
A lot of times people are shyaway from the idea because they
feel doulas are expensiveBecause you're paying out of

(58:21):
pocket.
You're not really you know, it'snot like assurance really
covers us fully, because I knowwe haven't even been going back
and forth with the state abouthaving this coverage, but that's
a whole different topic for adifferent story.
That's some ish that we are notgoing to get into right now.
But what do you do to kind ofmake people comfortable with

(58:42):
your services, like, do youoffer partial payment, term of
the day or go on and talk.

Speaker 2 (58:48):
So my policies are right.
I have three different packagesand they range from 1275 to
1675.
So with each of those packagesthere's a deposit.
So you will pay your deposit inyour book.
So each month you will paysomething on that package.

(59:09):
The minimum you can pay is $100.
But it has to be paid out by 37weeks.
So you can do that however youlike you know.

Speaker 1 (59:19):
Have you ever had a situation when somebody did not
pay about 37 weeks?

Speaker 2 (59:28):
Probably once or twice, and that's OK for me.
So if we have a communicationand you're like, hey, this is
what's happening for this month,ok, it's OK, life happens, I'm
OK with that.
I just have that to where Iwon't get, you know, I want to
be paid.

Speaker 1 (59:47):
We all got them bills .
Come on, we would love to dothis for free, because it is
great for the soul.
Yes, it is not great for thebills, that's it.

Speaker 2 (59:56):
Come on.

Speaker 1 (59:57):
That's all.

Speaker 2 (59:59):
But if I had somebody that needed a couple more weeks
, cool.
I've had somebody who didn'tfinish their bill until after
they had their baby, cool.
But we build community and lovefrom each other, so I'm not
worried about you skipping outon me on the bill.
I don't think about thatbecause my clients are good to
me and I'm good to my clients.
I don't really have that wholeissue like money, money, money,

(01:00:21):
money, money.

Speaker 1 (01:00:23):
I will say I think that kind of also makes the
difference between certain billsand money companies.
Like if you build thatcommunity with your client, at
that point one they're no longera client, they're almost like
family.

Speaker 2 (01:00:37):
That's family.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:00:38):
So you know it's like okay, like you didn't fully pay
by this time period, but we'regoing to go ahead and have this
baby and we're just going tohandle it.
Postpartum.
There are certain people whoare just like but now you didn't
make your payment, I'm notshowing up to the birth and I'm
just like whoa, you're going toleave this person out, like,
literally, you're going to leavethem hanging?

Speaker 2 (01:01:00):
No, I don't have that .
That's that mean you don't?

Speaker 1 (01:01:05):
got no love for your client.
That means you really don'thave this phone.
You ain't going to show up.

Speaker 2 (01:01:11):
But then also like what relationship you have with
the client to even think likethat.

Speaker 1 (01:01:16):
Exactly.

Speaker 2 (01:01:18):
That's crazy.

Speaker 1 (01:01:19):
I'm just I'm just saying.
I'm just saying things thatI've heard.
Yeah, I don't know if it's everhappened before I pray it never
happened before.
I'm just saying things thatI've heard and I'm just like
dang.

Speaker 2 (01:01:30):
Yeah, no, I never had that.
I'm grateful, I'm so grateful,I really am.

Speaker 1 (01:01:37):
Well, thank you so much for your time.
I do appreciate it.
I know you had a prenatalbefore this so I know girl must
need, you must need a littlebreak to humsel.
But I appreciate thisconversation, I appreciate.
Just running into you that dayat the hospital I was like, oh
my God, I was like.
I was like I was like what?
I need a hug.
I'm like, oh my God, I haven'tseen you in so long, but it was

(01:02:00):
just like I saw you out, Iimmediately like lit up and I
was just all smiles Do you bringit out?
I think I'm just like.
Every time I see you, I'm justlike, oh my God, everything you
do online, I just go oh, she'slike she's doing so well and it
kind of just gives it, gives meencouragement, mm, hmm, and I'm
happy, I'm happy to hear that,absolutely.

(01:02:22):
So I'm just like you know, if Iever, if I never, ever gave you
flowers, I want to give it toyou now.

Speaker 2 (01:02:27):
Thank you so much, Tasha.
I appreciate you.
I really do.

Speaker 1 (01:02:30):
So yeah, so I love you to pieces, Thank you for
just having this moment with meand guys.
I can't wait to have anothersession, because I love Dula,
the Dula, because I just like it.

Speaker 2 (01:02:42):
It's so dope, this is dope, this is dope.
This is no great work.
I love it Because you know.

Speaker 1 (01:02:48):
I feel like you know, sometimes, when you hear like
Dula, midlife or whatever, it'sjust these terms, but just like
yeah, we actually have thesecrazy experiences that some
people would just never know.
Yes, so I just want to justlike you know, we're going to
talk about these things andwe're going to get it out, and
just I just wanted to be like alittle bit more transparency in
the middle so people aren'tafraid, they know what they're

(01:03:11):
getting into.
And yeah, I feel like it justcan be like a part of my life's
work, just to kind of be like yo, like it's okay, like birth can
be scary but also very healing.
It can be rewarding and like,as women, not our, not our sole
purpose, but it is part of thethings that we do.
Yeah, it shouldn't have to belooked at as a negative

(01:03:35):
experience.
Sometimes, when you look at themedia, it looks very negative.

Speaker 2 (01:03:40):
Yeah, and look, anything that's I feel like with
social media is pushed.
You know it is scare tactics tothe black woman oh, you're
going to die if you go, you know, and it's like the key thing
that we're missing is education.
Yeah, that's, that's what we'remissing.
That's the, that's the.
That's in a nutshell, because Ididn't.

(01:04:01):
I didn't get into where I haveto go toe to toe with a doctor
and he realized I knew what Iknew and that completely up, and
that's highly unlikely thatthey do that.

Speaker 1 (01:04:11):
But I mean.

Speaker 2 (01:04:12):
But so I know what education and do I know what
knowing what you know can changethe environment in which that
doctor thinks or you either putup a new show up or you keep it
going, or you are me right, youare me, so I can find me another
doctor, who who will honor whoI am.
You know this birth and bodythat I have.

Speaker 1 (01:04:34):
Oh boy.
Well, in that case, y'all buteducate yourselves, go on to
these classes.
What's the name?
Is it Nikki Lawson?
You said?

Speaker 2 (01:04:45):
Nikia Lawson.
Yeah, she's the president ofdonor international.
She has.
If y'all go look her up, she'son.
She's on Instagram.
You click, click that link.
You register for the classevery month.
They're free.
So you're going to.
There's four sessions.
The first they're Tuesday andThursday.
That the first first, becauseof whatever month it is, and
then a second week, which is thenext Tuesday and Thursday.

(01:05:08):
But when I tell you, get theinformation and make sure that
when you do not understand thatpeople that hospitals have big
job education classes, I get it.
But also remember that it'sgoing to be geared towards how
to be a perfect patient.
Come on.
Oh so making sure that youunderstand that this job and

(01:05:28):
education, that classes thatyou're taking, these are our end
labor delivery, are in theseclasses teaching you, and they
hold nothing back, because whatthey want is they want you to be
treated with dignity and theywant you to know what they want
to know, what you know andthat's how I know.
My friends, I don't want tohave to tell you everything.
You know what I'm saying.

(01:05:49):
Imagine that to tell yourclient everything.
No, I need.
This is a.
This is a community thing.
Right?
This is a reciprocity.
You give, I give, you take, Itake.
Let's all come in community andget this information.
So I don't want to be myclients all I don't.
I want them to be able to getthis work, understand what's

(01:06:10):
happening, do their research andshow up, show up, show up,
because when you don't show upand they know you ain't showing
up, they gonna do whatever theywant to become, become another
mechanical delivery.
That's unnecessary.

Speaker 1 (01:06:29):
Zaina, can you also just leave your information, so
they want to reach out to you.
They know how.

Speaker 2 (01:06:34):
Yes, so I am Zaina.
Of course, again was I into theservices.
My Instagram handle is Zionunderscore services LLC.
Take it to underscore themeasure, of course.
Facebook, I do have my personalZaina's a kid.
You can follow that to.
It doesn't matter, I put burstup on either one, either one.

(01:06:56):
I am also on tiktok a Zion Ziondo a service LLC.
So you know hey hit me up.

Speaker 1 (01:07:03):
That's right.
But y'all, thank y'all forlistening and I hope you all
have a wonderful day.

Speaker 2 (01:07:09):
Thank you, tash, you have a good one.
Thank you Listen.