The Crossroads of Spirituality and Trauma in Religious Practice

Have you ever felt ensnared by the thorny questions surrounding spirituality and organized religion? Together with my insightful guest Iya Ola, we venture into these sensitive zones, stripping away the confusion and confronting the pain of religious trauma. Our candid dialogue traverses personal narratives of struggle against restrictive church doctrines and journeys us toward a more expansive understanding of spirituality. We dissect the ancestral echoes in our dreams and the subtle distinctions between hoodoo and voodoo, challenging the stereotypes and guiding listeners to their awakening.

Spirituality is no mere trend; it's a disciplined path that demands reverence and education. In our conversation, we address the recent upswing in spiritual practices and how they can be misused without proper understanding. From the potent energy of Moldavite crystals to the complex terrain of Voodoo and Hoodoo, Iya Ola and I traverse the importance of finding a trustworthy mentor and safeguarding your spiritual integrity. We share our transformative experiences and emphasize the need to approach these practices with the seriousness they deserve, protecting our spiritual well-being as fiercely as our physical safety.

Closing our soul-stirring session, we touch upon the controversy and openness needed to explore spirituality. As we celebrate Hulu Heritage Month and hint at future discussions on revolutions and resistance, I encourage you to follow those who continue to enlighten my spiritual journey. This exchange is more than just talk; it's an invitation to embrace growth, authenticity, and the disciplined pursuit of enlightenment. Join us on this profound exploration of belief, practice, and what it means to connect with the essence of who we truly are.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
Hey guys, welcome to another episode of Working Out
the Kings, the Podcast, withTash D'Aula, and today I am with
a special friend, miss Ayahola,and as we talk, we're just
gonna have a real openconversation about spirituality
and really what that means, andto me it just seems like there

(00:23):
just seems to be a little bit ofa discommunication or just like
not real understanding of whatthat really means.
It kind of it kind of comes offalmost as a trigger these days.
So I'm like I'm just gonna goto the source and we just gonna
ask some questions.

Speaker 2 (00:39):
So, hi, Well, no, that's the thing.
It is sort of a trigger, likeyou said, because a lot of
people grow up in the church andwe're taught anything
witchcrafty or witchy is demonic, it's evil you're gonna go to

(01:00):
hell.
You're not supposed to do it.
And now that spirituality hasbecome a trend, yeah,
everybody's doing it.
Now the church is like hold up,wait, what is this, you know?
So I think there's a lot ofpeople who have turned to
spirituality because ofreligious trauma.
And they can I, they canidentify and say I have

(01:23):
religious trauma, but they don'talways know how to heal
correctly or what to do about it.
They just know I'm church hurt,I'm sick of church people, so
I'm going over here.
And then they get over here andthe behaviors don't change,
just the quote unquote set ofbeliefs change.
So I think that's where thetrigger part comes in,

(01:47):
especially if you have nothealed correctly and you
definitely have to heal.

Speaker 1 (01:53):
I could say when I started my journey, which I
didn't even realize I was, thisis like well over maybe eight,
nine years ago, like I rememberstill going to everyone points.
They're going to Baptist church, got grow Baptist but not
really understanding thethoughts of some things that the

(02:14):
future would say.
Like you know, I definitelyhave friends in like the LGBT
community and then they talkabout you know, like you're
going to hell if you lovesomeone else and I just kind of
felt like how can this be theGod that I serve, but the people
who I love is not love back you?
know, so it really kind of likeit's didn't?
It didn't make sense to me.

(02:34):
And then you know it's alwaysthis idea of you know, sin, sin,
sin.
But then you know all sin issupposed to be the same, no
matter what you do, whether it'skilling or fornication,
whatever you want to call it.
But then it was in ourcommunity.
It seemed to be like, okay, Iknow, it says all sin is equal.
However, this one is way worsethan this one so then I was like
, okay, this doesn't make sense.

(02:56):
So then I started doing my ownresearch.
I started actually reading theBible, not just the you know few
scriptures they read the sermongame from exactly so I started
reading, I got deep into the OldTestament.
I'm just like, well, I don'tlike this, this doesn't make
sense to me.
And I'm just like I remember atone point I put the book down,
come, just like this, thisirritate, it irritated me.

(03:19):
And again it's like you can't.
But then you can't question.
And I'm like, how can I have afull understanding of what I
worship if there's noquestioning?
You have to question things.
At least I feel that way.
That's how you understand.
So I backed away.
And then, as I backed away, I'mjust like, well, I'm just not,
I'm still believing this, butI'm just not gonna do, I'm not
gonna do the religious thing youknow.

(03:40):
And then, as time went on, Ikind of just stayed in that vibe
.
And then, as time went on, I'mlike, well, I'm gonna start
reading this and I'm gonna startreading that.
And then I'm, at one time I hadthis dream and it's dream I
won't go into it, y'all, becausethat's my personal story and I
was just like, but it scared meand I was like so I'm not felt

(04:01):
like there's more to this.
Our talk to a friend of minewho's already, I would say,
leagues ahead in her spiritualjourney and she'll like oh, baby
, that's just the answers wasreaching out to you.
I was just about to say I was anatural answers saying all right
, baby, we need you over hereand it's insane because, like,
when this happened, I talked tomy siblings about it and my
brother was like, oh, I had adream, not the same one as me,

(04:25):
but it was still somebodyreaching out and then my sister
was just like I don't know y'all.
And then, like, maybe a monthor two later, she ended up
having a dream.
So it's just like, so y'alljust gonna get us back to back
to back, mm-hmm, like come ony'all.
But I guess it started with mybrother, since he's the youngest
and he just worked his way up.
So you know, so we all kind ofstart talking about things from
here in there, but it's all ourown different paths, though, and

(04:47):
we understand that mm-hmm.
So from that moment, like I said, now I'm just like okay, I just
want to do with someunderstanding, because I know
there's like a lot of people whofollow like the Yoruba culture.
I know there's some mixing ofdifferent things that I think
you kind of.
I saw your Facebook post theother day when you was like
which I'm gonna ask you toexplain like the difference
between who do and voodoo andwhy these are like different and

(05:08):
why I can't believe, but, likethe TV and media tell you,
because that's just the whitepage, patriarch, and trying to
keep a hold of what ourspirituality is.
But go on all right.

Speaker 2 (05:21):
So where to start?
Um, so mine was slightlysimilar my journey.
I grew up in a church, grew upat this.
My daddy was a minister.
My mother was one of the prayerwarriors.
I got baptized when I was five.
I saw the teachers Sundayschool when I was seven.
I got my license in Christianeducation when I was 13.

(05:43):
I did all the things.
I was an aquire.
I was on a dance team.
I was the sergeant over thedrill team.
I was president over the usherboard.
I did national andinternational biblical
competitions.
I know the Bible.
It made no sense, though, but Iwas so indoctrinated with God

(06:07):
and with this book, like Iremember at last year, people
used to pick on me.
I would not answer back.
I would literally write Bibleverses back to them.
Oh wow, it did not help, butyou know, it was my comfort.
You know, in high school, um,it was the same thing I was.

(06:28):
People knew me mostly thechurch girl mm-hmm.
I went to school Friday night, Iwas at church Saturday morning,
I was at competitions.
I didn't do.
I did very little footballgames.
Yes, I did extra curriculas,but I had to balance it all out,
mm-hmm.
And then Katrina hit move toTexas, draw the church up there.

(06:49):
Same thing, different state,mm-hmm.
And in 2018, my mom wentthrough something very serious
and we did what we called.
I called it a social experimentbecause we had a women's
conference and people were like,oh my god, I'm thank you so
much for beating this, thank youso much for being honest with

(07:10):
us.
If you needed anyone to talk toher here, and then she needed
someone and no one was theremm-hmm so I said let's not go to
church one Sunday and see whathappens.
Three weeks went by.
Nobody said nothing for me.
That was my straw, because Iwas like I'm already questioned

(07:31):
in this Bible mm-hmm and theyteach you.
The Bible is basic instructionsbefore leaving earth, but I
can't question my instructionsand the instructions don't make
sense.
This book does not logisticallymake sense.
You cannot tell me me as apansexual person I'm going to
help because I'm pansexual right.

(07:52):
I'm going to help because I'mprobably.
I'm going to help for all ofthese reasons, but I'm doing
more for the church than theseholy people are doing.
Right, you can't tell me thatthe Bible, theologically at his
bases of doctrine, makes sense.
How did you go from people inthe Old Testament living to be a

(08:13):
thousand years to the NewTestament?
They only get 70.
Yeah, you get three.
Score intended, you live aprior.
A pious life is the promise ofthe Bible.
You only get 70.
Even when I saw this study in ahistory of the people that wrote
the Bible, how many differentpeople it took, how many books
they wrote, what was going onthe 1600 year gap between the

(08:35):
Old Testament and the NewTestament.
It makes no sense.
And I had questions and nobodywould answer my questions.
But I knew I was alwaysspiritually into from a young
age.
I could.
I used to be able to interpretdreams they might get.
I don't know.
I used to be able to seespirits.
I can still feel spirits, I cando the things.

(08:57):
But once I was in church it waskind of suppressed because my
focus became God, there's God,that it was to the point.
My clubbing days was going to aChristian nightclub.
I don't know if you know theypause yeah, there's what so

(09:17):
there is.
There are things called aChristian nightclub and it's
this church that runs it andit's literally like a club, but
they play modern Christian music.
There's Christian line music,christian dance music, and it's
from Friday night between from 7to 11, and at the brown 1030

(09:39):
they do the invitation todiscipleship and a quick little
devotional and then you go onabout your night.
That's what I did.

Speaker 1 (09:45):
That doesn't actually sound terrible actually?

Speaker 2 (09:48):
it is because what I realized was I was going to this
Christian club every Fridaynight, leaving from there and
then going to TGI Fridays tohave drinks, or I was going out
doing whatever mm-hmm so it waskind of productive, and even to

(10:10):
the point that I have a fear ofhaunted houses, which is, yeah,
I don't do haunted houses.
I don't, I don't like them, Idon't.
But I went to Hell House inTyler, texas, which is a
Christian haunted house.
It is actually very popularnational thing what they do.

(10:30):
They take you through acemetery first and then you meet
Satan.
He puts you on this thingything that's supposed to
represent bringing you down tohell.
They walk you through 16different sins or scenes so it's
things like suicide, pedophilia, pornography, disrespect, and
you're watching these actorsplay it out all the while these

(10:51):
demons are chasing you.
Then they put you in this thingthat is no bigger than this for
one minute underground, withthe temperature is 100 degrees
for you to feel like what hellfeels like, while you hear Satan
over the loudspeaker readingfrom the Satanic Bible and
warping the scriptures.

(11:12):
Then you walk out of that andyou see Jesus getting beaten for
your sins.
You see Jesus that's dramaticacross, then you see Jesus rise,
and then they take you forsomebody to minister you and
give you two bike cupcakes and acup of coffee, and it's
literally meant to scare thehell a lot of you yeah, I mean

(11:34):
that's more like scare straightlike the Christian.
Christian edition like verymuch beyond scare straight and I
went to this and I was likewhat, what?
is going on why this did nothelp.
This made it worse.
So then, when I moved back hereand we went to that whole thing
in 2018, I was like you knowwhat I need to find God for

(11:58):
myself and that's something I'veheard in church.
A lot from people I grew upwith was I left the church to
find God for myself, and in theback of church.
You can't do that.
You become the prodigal son.
You can't do that.
You can't leave.
If you leave and come back,you've got to go in front the
church and confess what you didand bring talk about everything
that's your journey, which islike.

Speaker 1 (12:18):
Technically, it's not no one's business about your
journey, what they tell you isopen sin, open confession.

Speaker 2 (12:23):
But where did I sit openly?
Except for the fact I stoppedgiving you my money every
weekend, showing up.
Hold it for conversation, though, but after that I had questions
, and then I started doingresearch mm-hmm and I was like,
well, this is always pulled tome was the ATRs, the African
traditional religions,especially when you know the

(12:45):
Christian Bible mm-hmm was givenwas published 1492, 1503.
One of them.
One of them, king James, did itand it was used as a part of
our enslavement, mm-hmm.
So my question is, if thishappened here, what did we have

(13:08):
before?
Because if you go on thebiblical timeline, in the
beginning was the word and theword was with God and the word
was God.
That's John, one in one.
So if I go by this Bible yougave me, god woke up one day and
decided I'm going to create theworld.

(13:29):
Took him six days to do it.
On the seven day he rested,first chapter, first 10 verses
of the first chapter of Genesis.
And then we get through all ofthis.
Jesus came, the world went fromBC to AD.
He lived, he died, he rose, andthat was 2000 years ago.

(13:51):
And now we wait, knowing in thecomeback.
Logistically that don't makesense, because if you look at
science, science predates that.
So I was like, okay, let's dosome research.
And then I found I re-lookedinto Voodoo, because we're in

(14:14):
New Orleans.
It's everywhere.

Speaker 1 (14:17):
Skeleton Key.
I see your little key.

Speaker 2 (14:20):
Skeleton Key Got one on the hair, skeleton Key, and
Skeleton Key is one of the best,truest forms of Voodoo that
I've seen, with some Voodoo init.
That movie is the truest whenit comes down to conjuring,
dealing with spirits, makingpacks and contracts that you
have to fulfill.
It's one of the truest onesthat I've seen.

(14:43):
But, like you mentioned earlier, you see things in the media.
They get to mixed up.
One of my favorite ones todiscuss is American Horror Story
Coming.
Oh God it's one of my favoriteones, because they took a whole
bunch of stories that, granted,they all do run together, but
they mixed up the energies.
That was not Papa Legba, thatwas Baron Samadhi.

(15:06):
So they took an Orisha, who'salso a Loa, and assigned it to
Marie Levo, but it was actuallythe Loa Bel-Aus-Samadhi
Completely different energiesand most people.
Yeah, she had to give PapaLegba a baby once he got.

(15:26):
No, she didn't.
That's not what happened.
Stop saying that.
But if you don't know, you goto these media representations,
you go to American Horror Story,you go to Skellin Tiki, you go
to another one, because therewas a bunch I'm trying to think

(15:49):
of popular ones that people haveseen that they will say, oh,
it'll come to me later.

Speaker 1 (15:55):
I will say I'm hoping if I'm wrong I will change it
in the descriptor.
But on YouTube this is a womanI want to say her name is Black
Witch Yaya and she does somestories.
I've seen a lot of her stuff.
I actually kind of like herstuff I really do Because I feel
like she comes in a space ofhonesty and she kind of really
breaks it down.

(16:15):
So it kind of helped me alittle bit understand certain
things.
Remember, she has a series orsegments, I guess, that go over
different popular movies and shetalks about the good, the bad
and not so true.

Speaker 2 (16:30):
Yeah, I've seen a lot of her stuff.
I like her stuff too.
Yeah, she's good.

Speaker 1 (16:33):
I haven't checked out her boyfriend, the Baron.
I haven't checked out his stuffyet.
Yeah, the.

Speaker 2 (16:37):
Baron.
I haven't checked out his,mainly because I live with a
Baron.
There, you go, but yeah, butyeah.
It's a lot of stuff that's outthere that people are drawing to
.
Oh American Gods.

Speaker 1 (16:53):
Oh, I didn't watch that series.

Speaker 2 (16:55):
So I started it, did not watch it.
I want to watch it, but theseason that I really want to
watch it, they took it down,which is season two, because I
need to watch Anansi show hisnatural behind, oh my God.
Okay, so all of his stuff wasnot scripted, that is, his words

(17:15):
and his knowledge of what heunderstands spirituality to be
and what he understands universeand spirit to be.
That's why he was fired fromthe show, because he was
speaking too much truth, oh, andthat's why they took it down.
Well, they don't want you toknow the truth Exactly.
As long as they can make adollar or restrict what we do

(17:41):
and what we have access to, it'salways going to be an issue.
It's just like down here youcan go to most of these stores
and you can get a Gregory bag,you can get a voodoo doll, you
can get a Lachies, you can getwhatever, and there's nobody
there to tell you how to usethem or what they're for.

Speaker 1 (18:00):
Right.
You can end up harming yourselfin the end if you don't use it
the correct way.
So I think you got to be verycareful.
But you know, people just againsee what they see on TV and
he's buying to like this.
I remember one time I had a soy'all know I work in the service
industry and I had these guestswho were just like so where's
the best voodoo shop to go to?
And I'm just like dude, I'm noteven about to get into this

(18:21):
with you, get out of my face.
You better go YouTube, goGoogle it or something.

Speaker 2 (18:28):
They're going to end up at that one little store on
Rampart Street with that oneperson that wrote the voodoo
deck.

Speaker 1 (18:37):
Dang, don't be throwing shots on the.
Oh no, I'm not throwing shots.

Speaker 2 (18:40):
Okay, so her store is actually.
I like her store for what it is.
She actually has one of the.
She has the only true hoodoodrugstore left open in the city.
There were two one closed since2018, and that one was F and F
Botanica on Broad Street, buther store is the only true

(19:02):
hoodoo store that's open still.

Speaker 1 (19:08):
But no, okay, let's make it sure I was like no.
I was like.

Speaker 2 (19:13):
no, I was like girl although I do have her deck.
Yeah, it's in my bag.

Speaker 1 (19:20):
Oh, really, I was like no.

Speaker 2 (19:23):
Not that one, not that one.
But she is what's known as thehoodoo queen of New Orleans, but
it's a white woman.
Oh.

Speaker 1 (19:38):
So now you know, yeah , I know who you are girl.

Speaker 2 (19:43):
I ended up at the ceremony the St John's East
Virtual.
I was like no.
I wanted to be dozy.
Don't do that, Don't do it,Don't do that.
Do not make my mistake.
Y'all.
I was like why am I one of thefew black people out here?

(20:06):
Why am I the only person wholooks like I belong here?
There were like even peoplewelcomed to me like oh my God,
can you cleanse me?
Yo, yes, You're supposed to beover there.

Speaker 1 (20:21):
So we're going to take it back a little bit
because we just get into our ownlittle tangents, but we're
going to take it back.
Now you mentioned you know KingJames was written somewhere or
finished between 1492 and1503-ish, right?
I think it was around there.
So you know slavery is likewhat?
1619 when we get over here,right?

Speaker 2 (20:43):
That's what they tell us.
That's what they tell us.

Speaker 1 (20:45):
But you know, we're just going to go with what the
books say, right?
So that's the issue.
We know that we've hadsomething before then, so can
you perhaps walk us through theprocess of you know, perhaps,
what we did do beforeChristianity?

Speaker 2 (21:04):
And I just looked it up, I was wrong 1611.

Speaker 1 (21:07):
Okay, there we go.
Okay, well, so just shy ofeight years of us coming to
America.
Oh okay, go ahead.

Speaker 2 (21:16):
So before that, in Africa, you had traditional
African traditional religions,atrs, depending on what part of
Africa you were in kind ofdetermine what it was you
believed.
You had people who believed inanimism, which is the spirit,
which is the belief thateverything has a spirit People,

(21:38):
animals, nature, everything hasa spirit or soul inside of it.
In West Africa, you had voodoo.
You had Yoruba, which is, if Iyou know the ones that happen,
your inbox, your ancestors havesent me here to give you yes,

(21:58):
not all of them are like that,but that's what people associate
with them.
But you had if I you havevoodoo, you had animism and
that's kind of.
Then you had Catholicism, whichactually started in Ethiopia.
From what I understand, myhusband's Catholic, so he's

(22:19):
teaching me all of the thingsthat I don't like about the
Catholic Church.
Oh, okay, because I grew uplike I don't disagree with this,
and he's cradle Catholic, sohe's like so I'm just going to
teach you things.

Speaker 1 (22:30):
Yeah, my grandmother was Catholic and there's no
shade.
It was just very boring as achild going to the church
because they didn't really sing.
They start talking in adifferent language.
I didn't understand and no onecan tell me what they're saying
and letting.
I was just so confused.

Speaker 2 (22:43):
But go on.

Speaker 1 (22:44):
Well, no.

Speaker 2 (22:44):
I call.
I told him.
I went to Mass with him onceand I was like yo, if you want
to be an exercise, this is allyou have to say.
But that was some doctrinalthings.
I disagree with Catholicism andso he's teaching me, I'm
teaching him and it helps uswith what we do now.

(23:05):
But there was also Catholicismand then eventually,
christianity.
So a lot of what we practicedbefore was if I, which was
working with the Eretias, whichis what it looks like,
everybody's running straight tothe Eretias, everybody wants to
be a child of ocean, everybodywants to deal with Papa Legba,

(23:27):
everybody wants to deal with Oyaor Yamoya or Shangol or Goon or
Colsi, any of them, that is ifa.
Those are the Eretias.
Then you have Voodoo, which youhave the Loa, so you have the
Gereda Rara, brazil, memo,brigitte, baron, sanmity well,

(23:49):
all four, the main four of theBarons.
So all of those spirits.
Now, voodoo does changeaccording to where you practice
it.
African Voodoo is differentthan Haitian Voodoo.
It's different than New OrleansVoodoo, just like Voodoo.
You have New Orleans Voodoo,appalachian Voodoo, southern,
down under the Delta Voodoo.

(24:10):
There's all these differentversions and it really just
changes according to your regionand your bloodline.
So the way we practice Voodoo,some people that are very close
to practice it a littledifferently, and that's fine,
because it's according to whatyour bloodline is, your
ancestors, what you haveinitiated into.

Speaker 1 (24:34):
Right.
So, that being said, do youthink if someone wanted to I
guess quote, unquote, practicethe right version would they
like perhaps get an ancestralreading to understand their
bloodline?

Speaker 2 (24:47):
I would definitely recommend that, definitely start
.
So my biggest thing I tellpeople if you're starting out,
always start with your ancestors.
Before you start running off toanybody else, you build a
connection with your ancestors.
Each person is made up of 14generations of ancestors, so

(25:09):
there's 14 generations of DNA,knowledge, understanding, trauma
, gifts, ability.
All of that Did you have accessto.
Why would you go outside of whoyou already are?
That's the way I look at it.
So if I know that I have all ofthese, all of this ingrained in

(25:31):
my DNA, that's why I'm goingfirst.
I'm going over here Before Istart running off, because you
can run off to the original alittle while, whatever, and then
you end up making contracts andpacks and then you end up
messing yourself up.
But as far as practicing theright way, the only right way to
practice is what feels right toyou.
In my opinion, right, whatfeels right to you, because

(25:55):
everybody has a different path.
Everybody has different gifts,different abilities, a different
calling, a different purpose.
You know, some people arehealers, some people are
divinators, some people aremedicine, women, conjugal root
workers.
Whatever it may be.
There is a place for everybody.
But before you get to, I'm suchand such and I do such and such

(26:17):
.
Do you know who you are first,before you try to make other
people believe who you are?
And have you set with yourancestors for their guidance and
their knowledge?
So I always say go with yourancestors first, always go with
them first.

Speaker 1 (26:33):
I think that's probably the most important
thing that's been said today.
Like, whatever you practice, orif you don't practice at all,
just like, do you know yourself?
Like, how can you heal fromanything, any trauma, especially
as black people Like we areliterally just raised within
trauma, within trauma, withintrauma?
How can we begin to heal fromthat if we don't even know who

(26:56):
we are?

Speaker 2 (26:57):
Exactly and knowing who you are is deeper than just
being angry.
And a lot of people end up overhere because they're angry.
They're angry that churchdidn't understand them.
They're angry that parentsdidn't understand them.
They're angry about enslavement.
They're angry and they don'tunderstand how many generations

(27:21):
back that anger goes.
They don't understand just howdeep seated that actually is.
And so you're walking around,going I'm angry at God, I'm
going over here to spiritualityand now you're angry.
In spirituality and using theguides of, I'm doing my shadow

(27:42):
work, I'm in my spiritualwarfare, I'm doing my healing
and you're not healing, you'rejust finding new things to be
angry about.
So if you're going to come overhere and you're going to say I
want to practice correctly, youdo your ancestor connection, you

(28:05):
build that connection, you doyour ancestor veneration and you
have to heal.
If you ain't healing, I ain'tgot nothing for you.
I don't, and healing iscontinuous.
I really need people tounderstand that.
There's economists conceptionthat, oh, I feel my inner child,

(28:25):
I'm good.
No, no, you didn't.
Because there's alwayssomething that comes up.
There's always a suppressedsomething that you did not
realize, that you forgot wasthere.
There's your teenage self, youryoung adult self, your current
self.
Then you go into the ancestorveneration of healing your
bloodline, of venerating andhonoring your ancestors, which

(28:47):
is funny because the church doesthe same thing.
Antalus is wrong.
It's in the Bible literally.
When Jesus went up on a lot oftransfigurations and Moses and
Elijah showed up, those were hisancestors.
If you look at the bloodline ofJesus, those are his direct
ancestors.

Speaker 1 (29:07):
I can't wait.
You can use the knowledge thatyou have Like the absolute
knowledge.

Speaker 2 (29:14):
Hey, one of my biggest things I've learned and
I've said this recently and Ithink you saw it when I said it
I didn't leave God, I left thechurch.
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, but in a blankperiod.
I use my Bible more now than Idid when I was in church.

Speaker 1 (29:30):
And I think that's so important too, because a lot of
people who don't really knowwhat spirituality is thinks that
it means that you turn yourback on God.
That's not it at all.
If anything, I just feel likeI've grown closer because I
don't have, because I'm learningwho I am as a person and what I

(29:52):
spent and literally seeing Godwithin myself, right Like it's
not just the idea of it beingsome white guy on a cloud
looking above judging me.
I feel like that's just a partof who I am.

Speaker 2 (30:05):
Mm-hmm, but even the Bible tells you that.
The Bible tells you that God iswithin us.
The body is the church.
It tells you where two or threeare gathered.
God is in the midst.
So, as long as we're sittinghere on one accord, god is here
because we are here.
That's what your orary is.

(30:25):
Your higher self is your Godconsciousness.
So I deconstruct it as they'reusing now from the white guy on
the cloud, from the white guy onthe throne with his hand out,
saying stuff of the little Idon't need that.
I know how to use my Bible todo what I need to get done.

(30:46):
It's called Bibliomancy.
That's your word of the day.

Speaker 1 (30:51):
That's the word of the day.

Speaker 2 (30:53):
It's called Bibliomancy and it's basically
using the Bible scriptures forwhat you're doing.
Everybody loves to say the bookof songs is a book of spells.
Ok, we know that it's 66 booksin the Bible.
You can use all 66 of them.
You don't have to stick to justone.

(31:14):
And then start doing yourresearch to the books that's not
in the Bible, like the book ofEnoch.

Speaker 1 (31:21):
That part, kari, I'm going to need you to write them
down for me if I can do my ownresearch, the thing about it I
remember as a little girl y'allthis is a real story.
I can share this one.
My great-grandmother, oh, shewas something spiritual she has
to be Because she used to alwaystell me oh well, you know, baby
, they say 66, but you know theygot more than that.
And of course I've had my olderaunts be like, don't tell them,

(31:42):
kids that.
But she was speaking the truth.
And I'm just like I think aspeople get older, you respect
your elders but you also quietthem.
And I'm just like I wish Iwould have had the chance to
learn more from her.
You know, you do, I do.
Now, I know that now.
Oh, I know that now.

Speaker 2 (32:03):
She likes to walk around in houses?

Speaker 1 (32:05):
Yeah, I do now, probably because her name is
written on some things, buty'all ain't going to be going to
talk about that later.

Speaker 2 (32:13):
That would make sense , because I swear I just saw her
with her olive oil praying oversome of y'all, so yeah, Just
let it go yeah.
And that's the thing too.
A lot of older people did huduand put it under church, which
is what hudu is.
It's traditional Africanpractices with Christianity.
Olive oil, the holy oil.

(32:37):
The anointing oil.
And you use it to anoint andpray.
Same thing Even in the book ofPsalms, where it talks about how
to clean with hyssop anddifferent herbs.
What do we cleanse with Hiss upin different herbs?

(32:57):
In the book of Exodus, when ittalks about Moses making the
breastplate and it has 12different crystals listed.
Go look it up girl look go lookit up better make.
I will pull it up now real quick.
Go ahead, we got time, shoot um.
It talks about, and I wanted umMoses breastplate.

(33:20):
These are all the crystals.
I'm gonna show you the picturethat was that he would have put
on the breastplate, and so thethe Christians tell you Is
demonic, right, we're notsupposed to use it.
Oh, it's Aaron's breastplatered jasper, citrine, quartz,

(33:44):
topas, emerald, ruby, lapislazuli, sapphire, diamond,
golden sapphire, blue, sapphire,amethyst, yellow jasper, glow
um onyx.
And this last one ischrysophage.

Speaker 1 (34:00):
So for some of the crystals you name that I know
top off my head, I know that'slike a, that's protection, I
know that's like protecting yourenergies and, um, I know
another one's also like aboutpeacefulness.
Now, I'm still learning mycrystals.

Speaker 2 (34:15):
Yeah, so this is exodus 28, 17 through 20.

Speaker 1 (34:19):
Oh, so y'all can go look it up for yourself.

Speaker 2 (34:22):
So I want y'all to keep this in mind.
There's 12 crystals here.
There's 12 tribes of the ofJudah.
So you have your citrine, whichis a lot of people use for
manifestation, for grounding.
You have your jasper.
Your emerald lapis lazuli isgreat for your throat chakra,
learning how to speak correctly.

(34:43):
What did Aaron do?
He spoke.
He was a priest.
You have your sapphire, youramethyst, so all of the things
that the church tells us isdemonic and we can't put our
faith in rocks.
It's literally in the bible.

Speaker 1 (35:00):
Now, come on y'all.

Speaker 2 (35:03):
Literally in the bible.
All of it's there, even down tohow and who do and who do the
wailing women would sing overchildren and as they pray over
them, they will sing.
What did they do in the bible?
They prayed and they sang.
They laid hands.

(35:23):
But when you have a picture ofJuanita by them and Ayala
vanzana laying hands, it's aproblem, because Ayala vanzana
is an initiated Europe, apriestess, she's an e5 priestess
, but she's in church layinghands doing the same thing.
People were mad with Juanita bythem because she had an altar.
Have y'all been in the CatholicChurch?

(35:44):
Thank you?

Speaker 1 (35:47):
I'm like, what do y'all think?
You like you.
You like the candle.
I'm like that's an altar.

Speaker 2 (35:53):
Like you, talk about us doing rituals is wrong y'all
literally.

Speaker 1 (35:57):
You're doing a ritual when you do, when you drink the
blood of christ and eat thelittle cracker on the plate.

Speaker 2 (36:02):
Communion is a ritual .
Baptism is a ritual Um thelaying of hands and exercising
demons.
If demons are so demonic andyou're exercising them, why
can't we do it?
These are things that just makeyou go, hmm.

Speaker 1 (36:22):
Absolutely is.
It makes you questioneverything, but in a good way.
But, like I said, I think thisis like.
I know it does seem likenowadays it's becoming more of a
trend, kind of like a coupleyears ago, when Madonna had,
like, the caballo string andeverybody wants a
world-wrestling on their own.
I don't know.
You remember that, yeah, andyou know, and I'm hoping that

(36:43):
you know it, people are actuallylearning from this, which is
why I want you here to kind ofspeak about it, because you know
, you again, you don't want todo the wrong thing when you like
, oh, I'm gonna go ahead andlight this candle up, but then
you don't really know who youcalling.

Speaker 2 (36:55):
Oh no, here's the big example.
You remember the mold of Icraze, I craze when everybody
wanted mold of I Modified is agreen crystal and it is an
amplifier of whatever is goingon.
So, like a year or so ago,everybody wanted mold of I.

Speaker 1 (37:14):
So I have a necklace I want you to check out before
you leave, okay, so this is whathappened.
It was my birthday, right, andmy brother's friend just went to
like the French market andpicked out a necklace.
He thought it was pretty andbrought it and I was just like,
oh, again, this is before Istarted really getting into like
my learning and I just like,cool, what is it?
And he didn't really have ananswer because he's just like,
oh, it's just something prettyin green.

(37:35):
Okay, cool, I'm not wearing itbecause I don't know what it is
and I don't want to invitenothing into me that I don't
know what it is.
So we're gonna check that outbefore you leave.

Speaker 2 (37:44):
Yeah, I'll check it out, but now there's people
talking about oh my god, I gotthe motivate and my life went to
shambles.
Hmm.
Like people are doing thesetrends.
The ways be trend Great.
I do have a set of ways beads.
I take them on and off Becausewhatever energy is on the ways

(38:05):
beads, once you tie it on, youare tied into that energy.
So if the person that put it onyou had bad intentions of
whatever it is, it is now tiedon you until you take it off.
No, it was the red cavala thing.
It was the motivate.
It was um, what's the latestone?
Now?
The core cutting trend is thelatest one when you do a candle

(38:31):
ritual to cut cords between youand another person.

Speaker 1 (38:35):
Oh, okay, I was like that's the.
I was wondering because, yeah,you know, I do my doula work,
right, so I'm working onlearning blessing way ceremony.
So this is one thing they hadwhich I think is kind of cool.
Um, it's, you know, you haveall these women who, some of
them are moms, some of them areodds, and they share all these
wonderful stories.
So when the lady goes intolabor, uh, they like they can't

(38:57):
have to pray together and then,after the baby is here safely
and everyone's fine andeverything's good, you cut the,
um, the yarn that you wear onyour wrist, because now that has
happened, so I'm just like it'snothing, all right, I had to
make sure and I was like girl.

Speaker 2 (39:10):
I know someone who was um, I know who is a doula
and also spiritual.
I'm gonna see if she's open tohaving conversations, because I
think y'all too.
We might be able to click up andconnect y'all might be able to
do some things, but um, there'sall these different trends that
people are following and they'renot studying the cabala

(39:31):
bracelet.
That ain't american, it's not.
Yeah, you know what?
Something that you thought itwas pretty?
Wearing the evil eye if youdon't know what it is, take it
off.
Wearing a hamster and callingyou at the evil eye, the hand I
don't know what you're sayingcalling it the evil eye.
There's Oof.

(39:52):
One of my biggest ones is goinginto a store and they sell a
lakeies or who do we call themcollars.
If you did not initiate, youain't supposed to be walking to
a store and selling them andbuying them.
And people go in there I wantthis one for a shoot and I want
this one and then they wear themand you're wearing spirits you
have nothing to do with.
Even you people who don'tbelieve in spirituality until

(40:21):
there's a retrograde or a fullmoon.
I don't get it.
I don't.
You tell me every other time ofthe month that what I do is
that it's okie dore.
It's that okie dope.
Oh, my god, mercury's in themicrowave, mercury's in
retrograde.
You do know there's a bunch ofother planets besides mercury,

(40:46):
or a common one that most peopledon't know is your bird chart.
You're not supposed to shareyour bird chart.
That is like your spiritualsocial security number.
So people talk about well, I'mthis moon and this rising, and I
have this and Venus and thisand this and this.
You're telling people how toget access to you.
Um, and your bird chart?

(41:09):
Yes, it does explain thingsabout you, but you have to get
somebody that knows how to readyour sign With the house.
How many empty houses.
You have to know what all ofthat is, and not just Well, I'm
a moon and I'm a perico and I'ma rising, and I'm a rising and
my son is this, and this is inleo and this is my lilith.

(41:31):
Don't know, like I don't think,I tell people I am a super
burgo.
Those that know me that know,they know.
But you got to protect yourself, exactly Like I.
The way you protect yourselfphysically, you have to do even
more spiritually, just likeanother big one.
Stop showing your.

Speaker 1 (41:52):
I was just about to say that I was like I, I first
of all, I don't show my all toyou.
It's not out here for thepeople to see, all right,
because that's somethingpersonal to me and I just I just
feel like that's my sacred area, right?
So yeah, you would never see iton social media, because I mean
, I'm about to just open awindow for you to sit there and
put something bad energy on me,you know, and that's what

(42:14):
happens, right?

Speaker 2 (42:15):
Yeah.
So if you want, if you come inmy house, I have two alters by
my front door that protect thehouse.
Then you come in a little bitand I have my ancestor altar.
My husband has his ancestoraltar, my alters.
Most people walk past and don'teven realize it, because it's a

(42:38):
bookshelf, nice, and you haveto look at what's on the
bookshelf To catch.
Oh, those are alters.
Otherwise it just looks like awhite bookshelf.
I like that.
But my ancestors alters are outin the open because my
ancestors like to be out in theopen, they like people, they
like socialize.
My husband's family is the sameway.

Speaker 1 (43:00):
Okay, I keep them locked up.
I should probably them out.

Speaker 2 (43:04):
So they like to be out.
We leave them out, but we alsodon't have a lot of people in
our house either.

Speaker 1 (43:09):
That's true and that's, and they is like me and
my husband.
We are very, very particularwho we allow in here.
Um.
Like my husband.
I think he's very sensitive tolike different people.
Personally, like he, just likehe's always, even when we were
younger, he would always say Irather have four quarters and a
hundred pennies.
That is his favorite.

Speaker 2 (43:27):
He's an extreme empath and until he learns how
to deal with that, he's notgonna deal well with a lot of
new people.
Yeah, and that's just him.
He has to he's.

Speaker 1 (43:38):
Y'all know he's very sensitive.
He's a sweet guy and the onething I wish I could learn from
him Is when he was someone said,does something wrong, and they
say I'm sorry, and they showforgiveness, he's just like,
okay, I can forgive you, and hejust moves past.
Now my ass, my ass, be like Allright, cool, like I forgive you

(44:00):
and depending how much I careabout you at the, keep you or I
don't see, and mine is the sameway.

Speaker 2 (44:04):
He's the most patient person to a fault, mm-hmm, he
has all the patients in theworld and my little firecracker
self.
I'm like, bro, the running jokeat our house is he's gonna
forgive you, I have a jar foryou.
That's the running joke at ourhouse.
But it's the balance.

(44:28):
But yeah, we don't have a lotof people in our house and our
house energy is set.
You can't come in our housewhen the when the bull don't do
it.
If you come in the house andyou want some forgave these
stuff, you got 30 minutes tops,tops Before you start itching to
get out, and that's how I setthe energy in my house.

(44:49):
You're gonna get sick, you'regonna be uncomfortable, you're
gonna feel off.
Did you have to amen that, bro?

Speaker 1 (45:00):
Yeah, yeah, I know, yoko the dog, my pomeranian, is
pretty much in every episode, soif y'all hear him, I do
apologize for channel.
This is a real podcast and mydog does not like to not be a
part of it, so if you hear himbreathing extra hard, I
apologize.

Speaker 2 (45:17):
But yeah, I set the energy of my house.
My house is warm, it'swelcoming.
Yeah, you come over, but youneed if we got it.
I got you right.
Don't bring no mess, I will runyou out of there.

Speaker 1 (45:29):
And have no problems, as it should be.
I mean, you know, now you knowwe got this house, like recently
, we moved in January.
But one of the things I've keptsaying to myself and I look now
I'm like, wow, I, when we werelike deciding on what house to
get and what to do, I just keptsaying to the house I just Want
a house that I feel safe in,that I feel secure and in that

(45:49):
this can be a house of love.
That's what I wanted.
You know, I feel like that'swhat we got you know you set the
energy in this house.

Speaker 2 (45:56):
This energy is like, uh, we chill it, Stay over there
.
Well, thank you.

Speaker 1 (46:04):
So if someone is interested in you know
understanding Spirituality, whodo voodoo, what would you
recommend them do?
Like if they're books ofthinkery, is there a mentorship
to get you on the right track?
Like what does one do?
And a loaded question therevery loaded question.

Speaker 2 (46:27):
If you are wanting to start, okay, let's start here.
Voodoo is a religion.
Yes, hulu, there's a runningdebate on a hoodu.
Is a religion or not?
It depends on who you ask andwhere they are.

Speaker 1 (46:43):
Is it because who do has such a mixture of different
things?

Speaker 2 (46:46):
Yes, okay and voodoo is a worldwide recognized
religion.
So most people in voodoo youcan practice voodoo without
initiating, but a lot of peopledo go through the process of
getting their met said what wasthat in Sabrina?
It was in Sabrina, oh teenage,which go ahead.

Speaker 1 (47:08):
Did you watch it a little bit, but I barely
remember it.
I remember watching episodesbefore she went to like college
or something.
No, no, no, no, the new Sabrina.
Oh, I didn't finish it, cuzgirlie, it took my Netflix, but
but I did see like season one.

Speaker 2 (47:26):
No, no, no, this is season Two or three.
So what happens is prudence.
And Ambrose goes to find herdaddy, father blackwood.
She ends up in New Orleans andshe meets Mambo Marilla floor.

Speaker 1 (47:39):
Spoiler alert.
By the way, I'm sorry, Ilearned.

Speaker 2 (47:42):
But she's like, hey, I want the real hoodu, voodoo
stuff.
They, she does a bonedivination.
I see a man she is what it'scalled and she helps her locate
where father blackwood is.
But then she ends up comingback to help the coven and it's
presented that this she's amambo, which is a voodoo

(48:04):
priestess.
It's presented that she'ssupposedly a reflection of
Marielle Vo.
In the end you find out she'snot Marielle Vo.
She's actually spoiler alert theFemale representation of Baron
Samadine Over death in thecemetery and things like that.

(48:27):
So that's another one that itmade sense.
But you have to know to know,because you're watching this
whole coven wicking pagan thingand it's like, okay, and then
boom, black folks, oh, atrs, andit can throw you off.
But that's anotherrepresentation, just when we

(48:49):
were talking earlier.
Right, but in who do, who do isa lot of self initiation.
Your bloodline is what initiatesyou into it.
Now, if you're a member of ahoodu house, you can go through
an initiation process, but a lotof people are not members of
official spiritual houses andthey go through their own

(49:11):
initiation process, whether youwere baptized in church or
whether your ancestors had youdo some stuff on your own.
I've gone through a coupledifferent ones.
I was baptized as a young agebut I also was in the hoodu
house and in the hoodu house Iwas initiated that way.
So if you are trying topractice I always recommend Get

(49:36):
you somebody you trust that'snot going to site for your
energy MS over you.
Mmm that is a mistake I madewhen I very, very, very first
started practicing officially.
I met this chick and she toldme all the right things Until
they got weird.
She told me she was a livingbody made of spirit.

(49:56):
She told me she caused covid.
Oh, wow, okay, her and her 12year old at the time.
We were gonna be stuck in thehouse because she was stuck in
the DV situation and until shegot out of that we were gonna be
stuck inside.
Then she had me doing moneyrituals for her.
She was making thousands ofdollars a month, I think.
It kind of was consistentlygoing negative.

(50:17):
Then she got mad because Iwouldn't quit my job and work
for her full time.
That was it.
Then, when I met my spiritualmentor and started talking to
her, she was like yo run and Ijoined her house.
Just kind of where I'm at right?
Um, but get you a mentor, evenif not everybody that practices

(50:41):
is gonna be under a house, likeI said.
But you need somebody that canhelp you learn at least the
basics, because Google is notalways your friend and A lot of
people can say a lot of nothingand make it sound good.
So get you a mentor that youtrust and ask your ancestors

(51:05):
back to that ancestor connectionRight.
Ask them to bring the peoplearound you that supposed to be
there.
Ask them to bring the peoplethat's gonna actually help guide
you and not just take from you.
As far as books, books aregonna be tricky because again,
everybody has a different path.
The books are read.
Most people are not gonna read.

(51:26):
If you're coming from thechurch, read the Bible mm-hmm.
You already know it.
They drill that scripture inour head.
Yes, they did study to show thatself-approved unto God, a
workman, need to not be ashamed.
Rightly, dividing the word istruth and the church, they tell
you.
That means you're supposed tostudy the Bible, so that way

(51:46):
nobody can tell you anythingdifferent.
Mm-hmm, same thing inspirituality.
If you know God for yourself,you know what it is for yourself
.
Nobody else can tell youdifferently.
But get a mentor, somebody thatcan help you learn what to do
and what not to do, how to workwith moon phases, how to heal
yourself, how to do yourspiritual warfare, how to do

(52:11):
your candle work, how to workwith your herbs, how to give
offerings correctly, how to evengo to your ancestors correctly,
because some people, ancestorsare very formal.
Oh, some of them is like yo,what's up?
I need this you know, so Ialways say get a mentor, get a

(52:32):
reading from somebody you trust,and please don't let everybody
read you mm-hmm.
There.
There's a lot of people thatcome to me for readings and
they're like oh, I've got areading from this person and I
went over here and I went overthere and I'm like Paul.
So you didn't let all thesepeople into your energy?
Did they cut the connection?
Oh, no, yes, you know, you gottoo many people pulling on you.

(52:55):
I have one, two, three, four,maybe four or five people that I
allowed to read me at any givenmoment, on any, whatever it is.
I can call them as like yo.

(53:17):
I Know I can read myself, but Ineed you, I need a little extra
, or or.
This is what I pulled, this iswhat I got.
Do you see anything differently?
I Don't let everybody haveaccess to my energy, and that's
something that I had to learn,because when I started, I Wanted
to be captain save-o you can'tdo that.

Speaker 1 (53:37):
They don't want to be saved.

Speaker 2 (53:38):
Don't save her, no but everybody want to be told
something good and because Iunderstand myself and my gifts,
I would just walk up to you.
You get a reading.
You get a reading, you get adefinition.
Oh, here's free Florida water.
Here's free sage, here's thiscandle, whatever it was.
Until I read myself ragged Tothe point, my spiritual mentor

(53:58):
was like up you go on thisocclusion, shut everything down.
My husband was like you, nottalking to nobody, he will legit
tell me not to talk to anybody,not even him, for 24 hours.

Speaker 1 (54:08):
Oh, that's nice.

Speaker 2 (54:11):
He's like.
Then he was like okay, you canonly talk to me, that's it,
because your energy is preciousand for people that are impasse
the intuitives you don't knowwhat to do with that.
And that's where that mentorcomes in to help you learn who
you are and how to work with whoyou are, versus how to be what

(54:33):
you think you are of the versionof yourself You're trying to
perpetrate because you're notsure.

Speaker 1 (54:40):
Damn, that's also.

Speaker 2 (54:44):
Because, think about it growing up, we all had oh, my
nickname is this, this is mypersona.
I had a bunch.
I had a bunch.
Everybody was up in the.
It was up I'm cool, you knowand then got Into my special
interest.

Speaker 1 (55:03):
Yeah, yeah, quote unquote, you know yeah.

Speaker 2 (55:06):
I'm sure it's right got my name over there and then
I joined spirituality and onething that I learned was that my
name changed according to myjourney, so the name that I have
now is nothing name I have whenI started.

Speaker 1 (55:19):
right, it's changed a few times and and which is why
I asked you how to pronounce cuzlike yeah, I understand.
This is who you are now and Ijust want to be respectful of
that my mom has now taken tocalling me Reverend alphabet
Brutal.
Girl, your mama mess.

Speaker 2 (55:39):
This is why this is why so, when I first started, I
was given the name Omo a yonfé,which means child of choice, and
that lesson was I had to learnthe things that I allowed to
happen to me was a choice, and Icouldn't play victim and
manipulate situations.
Then I went to EndowellEndowell, you call a, you call a

(56:04):
lot in Papa Wayne, in one waygo, which is shelter at the
crossroads.
That's where I should start acall to me, reverend alphabet,
because I also am ordained.
Then I went to IIT Ova, whichis mother of gardens, which I,
that one, kicked my Because, um,you can't grow, it isn't

(56:27):
playing it right.
Mm-hmm, you can't grow, wasrotten and I have to watch who I
allow into my fertilizer.
So then I got One day in key youknow, I got not in tea, which
is the mother of discipline.
So when you see that hashtag,that's what that is.
It Takes discipline to do thisand I really need people to

(56:52):
understand that.
And I brought that up becauseof the question you asked of how
do you do this?
This takes discipline.

Speaker 1 (56:57):
This is not just can't welcome to it tomorrow and
just be done with it.

Speaker 2 (57:02):
This is not.
I'm finna.
Go get me a tarot deck, a Blackcrystal and I'm gonna be the
craft.
That's not what this is.
And now I'm at the honorablemother, which in theory sounds
good.
But being honorable takes work.
It takes the discipline that Ilearned before.
Yeah, it takes all of thelessons I learned before to know

(57:24):
my audio and my visual has tomatch up the way that I Do my
practice.
One is for me to do mm-hmm, butit's also For my ancestors,
it's for my bloodline, it's forthe ones that's coming after me.
All right, you know, eventuallywe gonna have us a little

(57:45):
chunky kid running around.
No, no, it's gonna be chunky.
It's gonna be a chunky kid.
I know that it's gonna be cute.
Yeah, so I do things for me,but I also had to learn not to
run off and do the things.
A funny story I did not want toread tarot cards.
I grew up afraid of tarot cards.

(58:07):
Why the church?

Speaker 1 (58:09):
and Carmen, the hip hopper of oh girl, when I flip
through that card and Beyoncegot that.

Speaker 2 (58:20):
It's gonna say death and I'm a die.
And my mom grew up telling methat my great aunt was a voodoo
priestess and she taught my momsome things.
So I'm like, oh my god, what?
No, I don't like it.
So I grew up afraid, sarahparts, and one day I was with my
spiritual mentor and I was likeAt first I got the Death and

(58:46):
path awaken as the New OrleansOracle deck and I was like yo,
I'm drawn to this.
I don't know why.
She was like get it Shuffled it, read it.
Okay, okay, it's not, it's notas rough as a tarot, I'm good.
And then my ancestors saidPlaying cards, which I did not

(59:07):
know.
There was a thing, it's calledcarter man, see, reading playing
cards.
It taught me something new goneso that's actually the most
traditional form of who dodivination is reading playing
cards.

Speaker 1 (59:19):
It's.
That's why you know supposed toplay with playing cards.
I know the church sometimefrown on you playing like that
and stuff like that's because ofgambling.

Speaker 2 (59:27):
They won't pay money and they don't want you.

Speaker 1 (59:28):
Oh gambling.

Speaker 2 (59:31):
But that's also why you're not supposed to gamble
with the deck that you read with, cuz you mix the energies.
So some gooners, spirits likeTracy DiAmo, real of, oh, father
buzzer, dr John, they all useplaying cards as a form of
reading people.
So when I called her and I'mlike yo, I got playing card.
I heard playing cards.
She was like, yeah, I knowyou'll come get them at the end

(59:52):
of the month.
And then she got me.
She handed me a deck.
She was like read me, read youwhat's?
Oh, wow.
And that's how I started.
But I did what most people doran off the races.
I was like I do readings, comeover here, get a reading yeah, I

(01:00:14):
remember your post and and whenI first started it was horrible
, not because I didn't know whatI was doing, because I didn't
know how to manage the energy.
Because I was doing it from thewrong place.
A lot of people do things inspirituality just as a money
grab.
Everybody made ways meanseverybody do readings, everybody

(01:00:36):
do candle work, everybody madeyour fun, and it's for money
grabbing, not for actuallybuilding a community and healing
.
So that's what a mentor comesin, because she was there, I
just wasn't listening.
My nickname and tribe is calledbuff baby because I don't

(01:00:56):
listen.
I did not listen.
So that's and and that's andthat's the other part of
mentorship and discipline.
You have to listen.
Yeah, you have to listen.
Your ancestors can beat you allday long and, trust me, they
will get you a decision.
Your mentor can tell you allday long a sat down and learn

(01:01:16):
you something, but the momentpeople trying to do something
I'm offering this readingspecial, I'm doing this, I'm
doing that and Everybody's likeyo.
We didn't tell you to do thatand that does not help your
healing process Because you'renot listening, you're not
applying the appropriatediscipline, you're not focusing

(01:01:40):
on the correct things.

Speaker 1 (01:01:47):
That was the cutest.

Speaker 2 (01:01:53):
But that's where that mentor comes in.
And having somebody that couldsay yo, let's say something, my
mentor don't play no games.
She played no games.
She'd say.
I love you to death, but.
I like you.
Oh damn, she plays no games.
She gonna keep it real with you.
She will support you, she willhelp you, but you on your own,

(01:02:16):
because, at the end of the day,what you?
She said, what you eat, don'tmake me shit.

Speaker 1 (01:02:22):
Yeah, this is all for you.

Speaker 2 (01:02:26):
It's for you.
So it was up to me to listenand I ended up getting myself in
some big trouble a few timeswithin the tribe.
I didn't got sat down, I didn'tgot out most without.
I don't have some issues why?
Because I, even though I washealing, was choosing to be an
attention seeker, choosing thatI had to get validation.

(01:02:51):
However, I thought I could getit versus just being, and that's
one of the biggest things inspirituality I think people
forget is that a lot of this isjust you being you once you find
you, and it's OK to go throughthe journey to find yourself.
You have to.
You have to go through therepair and process, you have to

(01:03:14):
go through the unlearning oldtapes to relearn better
behaviors.

Speaker 1 (01:03:21):
I think some of that comes from just like believing
that you're enough by yourself,because I mean when you think
about it, like again, I can onlypull from, like my back, just
upbringing.
You know you walk with Jesusthe whole time, so or whatever.
So just like, ok, how do I knowthat I can be enough in

(01:03:42):
anything?
And I'm assuming the medium forthat comes from.

Speaker 2 (01:03:48):
I think for a lot of Christians I'm going to take it
from that standpoint it isbecause you're taught crisis
perfect.
You are not.
Right.
So there's always a striving ofeven if you listen to the music
or listen to people talk Lord.
I know I'm not perfect, but I'mtrying.
You're never going to beperfect, but you're always
trying.

(01:04:08):
So there's this undertone ofperpetual you're never good
enough.
There's this undertone andperpetual no matter what you'll
do, you'll never get it right.
And then you come over tospirituality with those same
behaviors.
So this basic indoctrinationhas turned into attention
seeking, manipulation Selfsabotage is a huge one

(01:04:37):
Sabotaging of other people,lying, creating false narratives
, disassociation.
All of that can come from thebasis of religious trauma that,
once you go on a spiritualjourney, you have to unlearn it.
You have to go through theprocess of forgiveness, healing

(01:05:00):
and acceptance and thewillingness and ability to
listen and repair it, becauseeverything is intentional.
You don't just wake up one dayand say, oh, I'm over it.
No, you have to be intentionalwith how you feel.
You have to be intentional withyour actions.

(01:05:20):
You have to be intentional withstudying the information,
studying what to do and when,studying who to listen to,
because, again, there's a wholebunch of information out there
that, I mean, is right.

(01:05:41):
I'm not going to say rightbecause it was right from one
mind I'd be right for somebodyelse.
And I say right, it may not bewhat's right for you.
And that's where the basis of itis, and I know that sounds like
a lot for a basis.
It's a lot for a basis, right,because in church they tell you

(01:06:01):
come to Christ, lay your, castall your burdens, and I'm good,
spirituality nine, you finnaheal first, you finna go through
some things and you're going tobe all right.
I did it.
I ended up losing a six and ahalf year relationship where I
was engaged.

Speaker 1 (01:06:16):
Right.

Speaker 2 (01:06:19):
I married somebody else.
Now I ended up losing a job.
I got a job.
Now you know, I'm building myown business.
I'm happy, and happiness is nota word that you even hear in a
church unless you're happy inJesus.
Over in spirituality, we learnjust to be happy.

(01:06:40):
We learn to be settled.
I'm going to say Because inchurch they tell you when all
things be content.
I don't want to be content, Iwant to be happy, I want to be
solid, I want to be stable andI'd have to depend on Jesus to
do it.

Speaker 1 (01:06:57):
Right, because I mean there's definitely a difference
between content and happiness.
Because I feel like when yousay the words content, it's just
like this will do.
This is OK, this is all right.
My happiness is just a purenessof, just a feeling.
So I mean words matter, wordstruly matter.

(01:07:18):
So when people say differentthings, words are spells Exactly
, even when you said before likethe honorable mother, I'm like
honorable.
What does that mean?
How do you live up to that?
So, just like for me, I try tolike break it down.
What does that mean to you?
It means a lot.

Speaker 2 (01:07:33):
Yeah For me to have the name I have now.
It's intentional for me to feellike one, that I deserve the
name.
Right.
But if I didn't deserve it, orif I didn't wasn't able to carry
the mantle that came with it,my ancestors wouldn't have gave
it to me.
That's what I tell myself, butfor me it's a thing of intention

(01:07:57):
and discipline.
I have to remain in balance atall times.
Am I going to get it right allthe time?
No, I don't.
Am I going to make mistakes?
Yes, am I going to run off therails?
Sometimes?
Probably.
Can I pull myself together andget back on track, absolutely,

(01:08:22):
when I fall off my meditationschedule.
Hunting in the world is for thescorch.

Speaker 1 (01:08:31):
Husband problems, it's all right, that's fine.
I'm actually about to wrap upanyway, but yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:08:37):
So for me, with that, it's just I have to remain in
balance, I have to remainfocused, I have to bring it on
track.
I can't let myself fall around,fall off.
I can't.
I don't want to be sloppy.
And that's the way I look at it, because when you think about
honor, you think about astand-up person, someone who

(01:08:58):
does what they say, somebody youcan trust, and that's what I'm
aspiring to, not to be withanybody else thinks I should be,
and that's what I'mdeconstructing from is I am who
I am because I said that I am.
I like that.

(01:09:19):
I like that.
I don't have to be your versionof me, because your version of
me is not my version of me.

Speaker 1 (01:09:31):
What's that old phrase?
I'm going to mess it up.
It's something like youropinion of me is not my business
, something like that.
Your opinion.
It's something like that.
I could be messing it up, but Iknow it's something like look.

Speaker 2 (01:09:47):
I'll tell everybody look, I might not be your shot
of whiskey, but I'm sure it'ssomebody shot of rum.
Ooh, what the hell.
All right now.
And there's a spot with a videogoing around that says I'm not
the whiskey, you see, but I'mthe water you need.
Your version of me does notmatter, and in the church you're

(01:10:08):
taught that it matters.
In church you're taught the waypeople see you is how your
value is.

Speaker 1 (01:10:15):
It's the outside validation.

Speaker 2 (01:10:17):
Exactly so.
For me it turned into attentionseeking and manipulation.
I tell everybody look, I wasMrs Deyo girl.
If I wanted to, I got her.
Or wanted your man, I got him.
Whatever it was, I wanted to bepraised.
That praise king gets a wholething.
Call me a good girl, tell meI'm pretty.
But it turned into attentionseeking and now I don't need it.

(01:10:43):
You know, I am in my skin andcomfortable in my skin because I
am loving the skin I'm in.
Right.
And I don't need you to tell methat it's pretty.
I don't need you to tell meyou're doing a good job.
It's nice to hear.
Don't get me wrong.

(01:11:04):
But I don't need it.
I don't need it.
You know, and that's a part ofmy deconstructing and learning
process and that's a part of thewhole foundation.
Part of this whole thing Isreparenting yourself learning
how to love yourself firstbefore you try to love other
people.

Speaker 1 (01:11:25):
So you're still doing terrible readings, right?
So if someone wanted to reachout to you, how could they do so
?

Speaker 2 (01:11:32):
So if you're following me on Facebook, which
is under Aya Ola, you can do itthat way, or my Instagram is
Conjure Chronicles, because thatis the name of my business,
conjure Chronicles.

Speaker 1 (01:11:44):
OK, hashtag that.

Speaker 2 (01:11:46):
Because I feel like well one.
I'm a Conjure woman, so I workwith spirits, but I feel like
anything in life that we do.
We conjure it up, whether it'snegative or positive.
And Chronicles because we allhave a story to tell, and my
story didn't end because Iwalked out of the door of the
church.

Speaker 1 (01:12:06):
I'm so getting you right now.

Speaker 2 (01:12:08):
So my Instagram is Conjure Chronicles.
You can do it that way also.

Speaker 1 (01:12:12):
All right, so I'm hoping this episode wasn't too
controversial for some people.
I hope that if you did decideto listen to this one, that you
listen with an open heart andopen mind Again.
I know I'm personally workingon my own journey.
I know people already know thatabout me, but also I just felt
like if I have questions, I'msure there's plenty of other

(01:12:34):
people who got questions too.
Also, today we are in October.
I don't know when this is goingto come out because my schedule
is ridiculous right now, but ifthis somehow comes out in
October, we are in Hulu HeritageMonth.

Speaker 2 (01:12:51):
And today is day two.
It is Nat Turner Day.
Ooh the honorable Nat Turner.
Yeah, let's talk aboutrevolutions.

Speaker 1 (01:13:00):
That's a whole other episode.
I will do the.

Speaker 2 (01:13:02):
Facebook and a six-hack hose later, I promise
Right.

Speaker 1 (01:13:05):
So y'all please follow her.
I'm learning so much alreadyand I plan on learning even more
, but I'm going to let y'all go.
We are already over an hour, soI'm going to let y'all go.
Y'all have a good day.
Bye.