"Brave Enough to Heal" - When Men Get Real About Their Trauma w/ Rudy Soto - Wrong To Strong - Chicago

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:15):
From the city of Chicago, a citymost recently known for its
crime and violence.
On this podcast, we will besharing stories of redemption
from individuals raised in thetough streets of Chicago and
from around the country.
Some of them were gang members,drug dealers, incarcerated
victims, and perpetrators ofviolence.

(00:36):
Listen to my guests as theyshare their experiences,
struggles, trauma, but also thestrength, hope, faith and
perseverance, these havedeveloped in them to keep
pushing and moving forward inlife.
Tune in to hear how their liveshave gone from darkness to light
and from wrong to strong.

Omar (01:00):
Hello everyone.
Welcome to another episode ofwrong to strong Chicago.
I'm your host.
My name is Omar Calvillo.
And tonight I have my brother,Rudy Soto.
Uh, I met this brother back in2014 when I, when I first
visited a new life.
community church.
it was, uh, Garfield Ridge.
They were meeting out in, uh,Kennedy High School.
Uh, so when I went there, he wasone of the first brothers that I

(01:23):
met there.
Um, Rudy, man, basically thesound tech setting up cables,
everything, everything on stage.
So they had a, like a, a team ofbrothers, you know, that, and
sisters that were setting up,you know, for, for the church
service there at Kennedy HighSchool.
Uh, so I met him there, I gotplugged in and man, it's been
for me 10 years that I've beenin New Life.

(01:44):
But uh, welcome to the podcast,Rudy.
Thank you for having me, man.
Appreciate it.
For sure, man.
You know, uh, um, like, and thenback then, you know, like when I
connected with you, obviouslyPastor Juan and everybody else
that was there.
Yeah.
You know, that was the, thebeginning of, of where I'm at
now, you know, so you definitelyplay, played a part in that.
You know,

Rudy (02:03):
we got the kids part of road crew Oh yeah.

Omar (02:07):
you know, we'll, we'll, we'll, we'll get into that, but
I'm sure that's part of you, butpart of the testimony there.
Amen.
Amen.
Of, uh, of, of launching, youguys launching for.
Um, new life, uh, midway, youknow, going, uh, to, to Kennedy
high school, man, doing theLord's work.
And man, there's been a, a lotof fruit that came out of that.
Yeah.
So.
So we could definitely get intothat in a little bit, man, but,
uh, definitely, man, definitely,but I don't know.

(02:27):
Welcome and a man.
Usually we start at thebeginning.
So, uh, can you tell us, youknow, what, what, what part of
the city?
I believe you grew up in Chicagoyour whole life, born and
raised, born and raised inChicago.
There you go.
There you go.
All right.
All right.
You want to tell us?
Because there's some people thatlisten to this podcast.
Don't maybe didn't didn't growup in Chicago.
You know, could you describePilsen?
You know, like for somebodywho's never been there, you

(02:49):
know, especially in those earlyyears for you.
Yeah, well, originally I grew upin 26th

Rudy (02:53):
Street.
Okay, that's that's uh, how manyyears did you stay out there?
And um, I think I was in 26thStreet probably about five, six
years.
Okay.
Yeah.
Do you have any memories of outthere?
Like, oh, yeah, yeah.
You know, we used to liveactually on, I want to say 21st
and Albany.

(03:14):
Okay.
So there was a big old folkshome there and, uh, a retirement
facility and, you know, we justto run around and, you know, but
my parents, they always hadbusinesses.
They were, you know,entrepreneurs.
And so they were selling theflea market and then they worked
their other job.
So they always had us working.
You know, whether it was like,you know, uh, packing bags of

(03:36):
groceries or like tomatoes,pinto beans, different things
that they would sell either atthe flea market or they would
call it Jew town back then.
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
Back then, yeah.
And you would tell people, whatwas that, uh, was that a Halsted
or what was right off of Halstedand like 14th street, uh, it's
all now University Village.
Uh, but back then that was allopen land and, and every Sunday,

(03:58):
and you know, religiously itwould get full.
You know, uh, different peoplewere selling everything from
like vegetables to porn videos.
You know, and, and, and so, uh,you can get everything there and
it would get packed.
And even on days it was likebelow zero.
No.
Yeah.

(04:18):
Yeah.
And you just put a, you know, acan with, you know, You know,
wood and boxes and Yeah.
You were selling.
Yeah.
You know, I remember, uh, boxesgold.
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Gold everyth jewelry.
Yeah, yeah.
Everything, man.
Everything.
They had big, you know, trucksparked, they would, uh, sell
like, uh, vinyl and they wouldplay like, uh, like r and b

(04:39):
music or, you know, like inmusic and stuff like that.
So it was, it was.

Omar (04:45):
Man, that, that, that was in those years when you were
still, okay?
Yeah, yeah.
And, um, I know you mentionedthey put you to work, you
remember even working at thatearly age?
Oh, yeah.
Oh, yeah?

Rudy (04:53):
Oh, yeah.
Since I was small.
My, my, you know, I, I, I thinkmy parents grew up that way.
Yeah.
And, you know, they had a reallyhard life in Mexico, you know,
they, uh, they actually had a,uh, a, a, a child, you know,
that, that passed away becauseof starvation.
Oh, no way.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, uh, to them, they worked.
Like, that was their way of,like.

(05:14):
You know, giving us life, youknow, so it was really hard on
them and, you know, I'm, I'm oneout of seven.
So they, they lost three.
So, um, you know, now I havethree older brothers.
So, so yeah, it was verydifficult for them.
So when they came, my dad wasdoing everything he could do to
earn money, you know?

(05:34):
So, and that's how he startedhis grocery stores and things
like that.

Omar (05:38):
And that's deep, like, to have that experience, I'm sure
that's what propelled them tolike, man, it.
Like, man, I can't let thathappen again and I said, I got
to do whatever it takes to

Rudy (05:48):
yeah, yeah, yeah, they were willing to work, you know,
day and night, you know, theywould, they would, uh, um, they
would work full time jobs andthen they would go out and sell
outside of nightclubs, tacos,and they would sell groceries
outside of Walgreens and fruit.
And then on Sundays we sell inthe flea market.
So it was

Omar (06:07):
non stop

Rudy (06:08):
seven days a week?
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
And then we would live, like, inan unfinished basement, so that
they could, like, you know.
Rent and you know, so yeah,because they were, they were,
they were really trying to savetheir money.
They wanted to open up abusiness and so they knew, they
knew what suffering was and whatnot having was.

(06:29):
So, uh, so they came and theywere, they were determined to
work and make it right.
You know, make a man.

Omar (06:35):
I know you mentioned suffering, but also sounds like,
uh, I think, you know, thewords, uh, sacrifice.
Yeah.
Like you mentioned, like.
Even living in their ownfurnished basement, but it
probably would imagine in orderto save.
Yeah To for the vision that theyhad I guess right?
Yeah Yeah.
Oh, that's good, man.
But, uh, oh, okay.
So you're, you're there in 26and then you moved to Pilsen

(06:56):
probably what like six, five,six years old?
Yeah.
Yeah.

Rudy (06:58):
And that's when they, uh, uh, opened up their store.
Okay.
Right on, on 18th street andthey would, you know, start
selling.
It was on 18 and what?
18 and Polina.
Oh, okay.
Uh, like there's a gas stationthere.
By the train tracks, right?
Yeah.
Right by the train tracks, rightin the middle of the block.
Oh, no way.
You know?
Yeah.
They were there for like 20something years or more.
No way.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, uh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

(07:18):
They did.
They did really well there.
Uh, All right.
You know, when they firststarted, it was just like they,
they rented the store and theybrought all the boxes of produce
and stuff that they had and theystarted selling outside.
And, you know, uh, my, my dadwould cook a little meat on a
little, little, little stoveand, uh, man, you know, I was
his worker.

(07:39):
So I was like, he'd put me in acashier or he'd put me to fix
produce and shelves as he gotthem.
And, you know, my mom wouldstill go to work and he would
still go to work and they wouldhave the store.
So it, it was, you know, uh, itwas, it was, it was tough, you
know.
You know, I know for them,

Omar (07:59):
you know, okay.
No, no, what about you did itwas it like tough like be I
would imagine going to schooland then going to work or How
did your life look like duringthose?

Rudy (08:07):
Well, you know, I would get really frustrated because he
would yell at me a lot Yeah, youknow when you're little and
you're in a cash register andyou make mistakes You know, my
dad's the butcher and he'slooking at me is that you know,
man, so With a knife?
Yeah.
Oh man.
You know, and, and, you know,there's customers that would try
to rip you off and I, you know,a lot of times I didn't know the

(08:30):
scams, like they'd give me a,uh, they show me a 20 and then
give me a 2 bill or somethingand then want their change.
And you know, when you'relittle, you know, you don't, you
don't, you know, you getnervous.
And I think I began to develop alot of anxiety.

Omar (08:44):
Like, how old do you think you were during

Rudy (08:46):
this?
Probably.
I would say like seven, eight,

Omar (08:51):
nine, you know.
That's young to be handlingmoney,

Rudy (08:54):
man.
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Oh, man.
And we work, you know.
Work hours and stuff.
And I watch all the kids walk,you know, through this through
the windows going to playbaseball and stuff like that and
man It just was you know, I waslike I want to go But you know,
it's it's just I was alwayshelping my dad,

Omar (09:15):
you know, no there was a whole family involved I know you
mentioned other brothers andyeah, you know

Rudy (09:20):
by the time I think my my next brother I have three older
brothers that he's probably likesix Six, seven years older than
me.
So by the time I got to thatage, they were already leaving.
So they got involved into gangs.
Uh, you know, they were alwaysin trouble.
Um, and so, you know, there wasa lot of like frustration on my

(09:40):
parents, you know?
So I, I would, I wouldn't reallysee them until they would come
and then they would stay.
And then they would, you know,kind of leave, you know?
So there was, there was a lotof, um, like turmoil, you know,
that.
You know, for them.
Right,

Omar (09:54):
right.
And I'm sure for them.
And it affected everybody.
Obviously, mom and dad, tryingto, trying to, trying to do
good, you know, provide, but

Rudy (10:03):
yeah.
And, you know, originally whenmy, my, my mom, my dad had them
in Mexico, but they, my, my dadcame and then my mom came
following him.
Um, and so they left my brothersin Mexico for about four years.
Um, and so they had me here.
So, by the time my, my parentswere able to get everything

(10:25):
together and go back and getthem, uh, you know, they had,
they, they stayed with my auntand a couple other, you know, my
grandma and they were very, mygrandpa, they were very mean to
them, very abusive toward them.
And so, by the time they cameback to the States, you know,
they were pretty much tellingthem, it's like, you know, the
reason your parents left isbecause they got a new kid.

(10:47):
An American kid now, and youknow, they don't want you guys
no more, you know, uh,definitely, definitely that
wasn't my mom, and that's hard,you know, but, uh, that turned
out to be very destructivebetween me and them, because
they, they, they would.
They were very angry and, andtowards me, I mean, this whole

(11:07):
time, my parents are like, yeah,you got your older brothers,
here's their pictures.
You're going to see them.
And you know, it wasn't thecase.
So there was a lot of abuse thatwhen I started, you know,
coming, you know, through thatfrom, from them.
Yeah.
A lot of abuse.
You know what I mean?
You know, my, my, one of mybrothers like hit me in the face
with a baseball bat, shot me inthe face with a pellet gun and

(11:30):
chest and, you know, and mybutt, you know, like, like
penetrate.
Yeah, I still have a pelletlike, uh, that's stuck lodged in
my, the muscle of my cheek.
No way.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, and they couldn't remove itbecause of the way it got
lodged.
They said they would have toscar like that muscle.
This is a long time ago toothough.
Right, right.
You know, and now it's actuallymoved forward where I can feel

(11:51):
it.
I could, I could, you know, butback then it was, I, because I
was younger, I think, you know,as I got older, it just got
dislodged, you know, so now it'slike, how old do you think you
were when, when this happened?
Like probably, probably

Omar (12:07):
like six, man.
Yeah, probably six, six, seven,you know, Yeah, that that's
rough because I know youmentioned I'm sure a part of
that had to be abandonment tooand that they felt From being
left over there and youmentioned abuse on the part of
the grandparents.
Yeah, so it was just like Yeah,they already came It wasn't this

(12:29):
I won't say necessarily you butyou were just like I guess a way
to For them to vent it.

Rudy (12:34):
I'm not like yeah, you know, just just their anger and
a frustration.
It's whole new culture here Youknow, uh, so, so I think to
them, uh, you know, there's Ithink this separation between
especially like parents thatimmigrate here and then the kids
that are, you know, assimilatedinto the culture that, you know,
they, they find other people tohang out with and, um, you know,

(12:56):
and, and just a lot of anger,you know, a lot of anger in
them, you know, and they wouldhave fights, they would, they
would go out like, and my dad,he was actually in the military.
Um, he was a boxer, a goldenglove boxer, and so my dad was a
rough guy, you know, he wouldtell you your truths, you know,
he wouldn't, he wasn't a man forwords, you know, he was just

(13:19):
like work, this and this andthat, so, you know, um, when
he'd get upset, sometimes theywould just punch us, you know,
or my brothers would go at it,you know, and break stuff as if,
and my dad would let him fight.
You know, so there was, therewas that, that, that kind of
that chaos, you know, that, thatwould strike a lot of fear in
me, you know, and so, you know,my way of kind of coping with

(13:40):
things is I would just kind ofgo off to the side and, you
know, not like detach and playwith.
You know, with star wars figuresor something and just, you know,
hope that it didn't come my wayYou know, so so yeah, it was it
was it was it was it was veryvery destructive like and I

(14:01):
don't think I realized how muchuntil I got older, you know,
because it was began to be likesexual abuse and you know, there
was a lot of manipulation kindof like Like, hey, you know, uh,
I, I care about you, I love you,like, let's go to this room and
I, you know, I wanted to beclose to my brothers and, you
know, and, and, you know, theydo what they want to do and then

(14:22):
it was a matter of like, uh, youknow what, if you tell anybody,
I'll tell them you're gay andthey won't ever talk to you
again or, you know, um, youknow, now I'm going to mistreat
you and, and, you know, you'regoing to do whatever I want.
And so they would be really niceto get what they wanted.
Yeah.
You know, or to lure me, andthen it was, so it really, like,

(14:44):
it messed, like, a lot of my,my, my way I would connect, and
just the way I would feel, and,you know, there was even times
that my, you know, my brotherwould come and just, I'd be
playing, and he'd start peeingon me, you know, and he'd think
it was really funny, you know,he'd think it was really funny,
and, and, you know, it, it justwould, you know, like, I'd get

(15:05):
up and I'd just walk away.
You know,

Omar (15:08):
so did anybody ever find out during that time or you just
kept a lady quiet like

Rudy (15:14):
You know what?
I I don't I Gotta be honest likefor a long time There was there
was blocks.
They were just I would black Iwouldn't remember.
Yeah, you know There was therewas times like they sent me to
school and I wouldn't know Ijust keep walking I wouldn't
remember who I was or you knowwhere I was going You know, and,

(15:34):
and I, uh, there was a pointwhere I stopped eating and, you
know, my mom said she was likereally scared because I just,
you know, took me to the doctorto try to figure out what was
going on with me.
And she said that one day I juststarted eating again, you know,
and, and, and, and, you know,you know, it's, it's, you know,
my mom's, my mom, she's a veryloving person, you know, she's

(15:55):
very kind, but I know yearslater, you know, she told me
that she knew what was going on.
But she was just like, what canI do?
Right.
They're brothers.
Like I, we brought them here totry to make a family.
Yeah, yeah.
And, and to, you know, she'slike, how, how can, and and, and
then she kind of hinted that shehad gone through similar things.
Mm.
You know, and, and so, you know,um, it, it just, it was just

(16:21):
difficult.
Yeah.
You know?

Omar (16:24):
Well, man, I know you mentioned like the mistreatment.
I wonder maybe if even they wentthrough that, maybe Mexico, you
know, and they were justprobably repeating.

Rudy (16:33):
Yeah.
That's what they saw.
It's how they were treated.
You know, um, and it's, it'sjust, you know, just, just
continue on and, and, um, youknow, with me, I would follow
them everywhere, you know, itwas just, uh, uh, you know, just
cause I was told I had thesebrothers that, you know, um,
But, you know, it was, it was,it was a tough time.

(16:54):
Gotcha.
Tough time.
So,

Omar (16:55):
so that was going on.
And I know you mentioned thatyour brother's like, you know,
wild and gangs, like as youstart getting older, I don't
know, let's say like eighthgrade, maybe going into high
school.
How does life look for you?
Like, like what, what directiondo you go?
What was going on?
Like like seventh

Rudy (17:10):
grade was, was really difficult cause I went through a
lot of bullying.
Um, uh, you know, I try toprotect the kid they were
bullying and instead it justturned on me.
Um.
Yeah.
Gotcha.
And, you know, I was just at oneof those places where, um, and I
remember chasing a kid in classwith a, with a knife.
Um, and, you know, they hadcalled the police and stuff like

(17:32):
that.
And, and, you know, uh, someonehad mentioned what was happening
in the class.
And they began to ask me, and Ithink that's what diffused it.
Uh, you know, with the teacherand things like that.
Um, you know, I, I, I don't evenremember like talking to my mom
or anything, but I just remembergetting so angry, you know, or

(17:53):
chasing him, I guess, you know,um, but my, my dad actually
eighth grade, he drove me toMexico and with my family and he
wanted to put me in a monasteryand leave me there.
Um, he just felt he didn't, youknow, he was, he was, he didn't
want to lose me too.
You know, so but the thing thathad happened was that in the
monastery, they walked me aroundI got to see the place and They

(18:18):
told them it's like we hadsomeone try to leave an American
citizen here a kid But he's likewe got into trouble because we
didn't have certain paperwork Solike these are the papers that
we need It's like get thesepapers signed and then you can
bring them and you can stay hereHe's like well, you know, we'll
keep them my dad made Bigdonation to the church and so

(18:40):
they could keep you.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um, it's kind of crazy, but it'smy dad, you know, my dad's way
of like trying to, you know, uh,Do something, you know, with
what was going on, you know,with, I'm sure he was
overwhelmed and things likethat, you know, uh, but you
know, on the way back, you know,they, they took me to an

(19:03):
amusement park.
Cause it's like, you know, thisis going to be the last time,
you know, you know, my mom, shewould be like, you know, are you
okay with me?
Who is it?
I was like, I don't care.
That's how I was like, Oh yeah.
Okay, whatever, you know, um,but they ended up changing their
mind.
You know, they said they, theyfelt bad, you know, at the end,

(19:23):
uh, and then they put me in aCatholic school, uh, from public
to Catholic and, and St.
Anne's in Pilsen.
And, and that's where I thinkthings kind of began to, to
change because it wasn't, it wasdifferent than when I was in
public school, you know.
Uh, the families were different,the kids were different, you
know, uh, and by then I was, Iwas getting really detached, you

(19:44):
know, I wasn't, you know, reallypaying attention to stuff and
just showing up and, you know,uh, to, to some extent, a lot of
it is like a blur, you know, uh,so, so it, it, it's, you know,
uh, uh, Yeah, so it was it wasjust it was just tough.
Okay.
It

Omar (20:04):
was just tough.
Yeah, and but you you went thereand then did you go to a high
school?
Yeah, it was a Catholic highschool to Catholic.

Rudy (20:11):
I went to Quigley.
Yeah, and and Quigley Southwhich is now st.
Rita Uh, this is on the southside of Chicago, so, you know, I
would, you know, I, and this is,you know, just some things about
me because, you know, and I, Iwould, because I would work in
the store so I'd get change and,and, and parents would give me
money and stuff.
So you're always in the cashregister, you know, they're,

(20:31):
they're giving me money andstuff.
So I would just get on a trainand go downtown.
go to the video games.
You're talking about like six.
Instead of going to school?
No, no.
I mean, I'm just talking aboutas a kid.
I'm just like my mentality.
Like I would, I would just getup and go places, you know, it
was just, just, you know, and socome to high school, you know, I
would take like from Pilsen, youknow, the, the back then was a

(20:55):
blue line.
Now they call it the pink line.
I would, I would get on, on, onAshland right there on 18th and
Ashland.
I would get off in California.
Yeah.
I mean, I'm Western and then Iwould take the bus straight to
79th and Western, you know, so,you know, that was my day, you
know, every morning there, everymorning back, you know, that'd
be like an hour commute.

(21:16):
No, how

Omar (21:16):
long was it for you?

Rudy (21:18):
Maybe that.

Omar (21:19):
Yeah, right.
Because I'm thinking, yeah, this

Rudy (21:21):
40 minutes, you know, uh, so, so, yeah, and, and, and, you
know, it's, it's.
By that time, you know, I, I, Istarted playing baseball, you
know, my dad would, you know,put me to work and, um, and I
would be like, Hey, can I, can Igo?
Like, I just want to walk to thepark and be like, okay.
And I wouldn't come back.

(21:42):
I go play baseball.
Well, we're at Harrison Park.
Yeah.
Sometimes we'd be up on thenorth side, you know, and, and
we were in front of a Walgreens,he's selling like some stuff,
you know, and some groceriesand, you know, I'm, I'm working
and I was like, Hey, can I go?
And he's like, yeah.
And I just went, walk.
Yeah, I just, it's kind ofcrazy, man.

(22:04):
I think about it, you know.
Um, just, just where my mindwas.
Right.
Like, you know, just, you

Omar (22:11):
know, so.
So, so that was like in the highschool years.
Yeah, yeah.
And anything that stands outfrom those years, you know.

Rudy (22:18):
Um, you know, I, I, I went and I wanted to try out for
baseball and, and I began, I metsome of my, my friends that I
know to this day, you know, andI think that it was them.
One of my friends, his name isTito, another guy Ernesto, that,
man, they would just pursue,like, we would just, we would
play baseball and he wouldprotect me.

(22:39):
He was, he was a bigger kid, youknow, and he was, you know, he'd
get angry and he'd want to fightwith people, you know, but we,
we would start just hanging outtogether, you know, so whenever
I had time, I'd go play baseballwith him, you know, and, and we
got on, on team and, um, youknow, it, it was.

(23:00):
It was one of those things thatI just believe God sent.
Just someone that would walkwith me.
Because, because I always wantedto be alone, you know.
Uh, you know, at night I'd gojust in my room and shut off all
the lights and just sit there indarkness.
Um, but with him, man, he justwould bug me.
He'd come looking for me.
And it was, it was harder for mydad to say no for, it's like,

(23:22):
Hey, can, can Rudy come playwith us?
Like, who are you?
He's got to work, you know, it'slike, yeah, we'll, we'll come
back.
And, and, and, and man, it just,it was, you know, I think, and
I, and I, and I've told them,you know, I, I think it was
because of those friendshipsthat.
I didn't put a bullet in myhead.

Omar (23:40):
No way.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That young could, could I askyou the, like, at what age do
you think those thoughts came toyou?
Like, just my le le let me, youknow, let me escape this.
Like,

Rudy (23:49):
oh, you know, I, I, I, I can, I can think of things
probably as early as like five,you know, I just, I would, I
would just wanna run into astreet.
You know, I, I'd almost feellike there was something telling
me to run into the street, youknow, just like this voice, you
know, and just, you know, itwas, it was, you know, it just,

(24:11):
you was, it It was, it was, itwas terrible.
In, in, in, in the sense, youknow,

Omar (24:20):
look, look, when you look back, do you think it was
spiritual too?
Oh, yeah.
I mean, I mean obviously allthat was in the natural,
everything that was happening toyou was real.
But you think that had aspiritual aspect, like that
voice?

Rudy (24:30):
Yeah, yeah.
And, and, you know, and, andthese are things that, I mean,
we, we got time here, right?
Um, there was just abuse evenwith babysitters, you know, and,
and I think it, it, it followedme.
You know, I, I, I feel like it,it was like something that, you
know, people would sense it inme.

(24:51):
You know, I could be standingthere with, I remember one time
I was standing, helping my momin the store and we had like an
aisle, like cashier, and a guyjust came up and he looked at me
and he started humping me.
And my mom, she was like, youknow, so it was probably like,
like eight or nine at the time.

(25:13):
And.
I, I froze like, I, I was justlike, I didn't, I didn't
respond, you know, I just, I wasjust like, and my mom, like, she
like threw something at him andyou know, he, he said that he
likes little boys and, and thisis in the store with customers,

(25:35):
you know, middle of the day.
And my mom, she like yelled atme, you know, she was like, how
could you ever let anybody?
You know, like do that to you,but I, I, I feel like I was just
conditioned, it was, it wasjust, it was already happening.
Yeah.
It was just, it was just, um,you know, so it, it, I, I didn't

(25:56):
know how to respond, you know.
Um, and so there was this, thischaos in my head, you know, um,
so, you know, it is when, whenit came to my friends, like, you
know, you know, it was like.
Like to me, it was like heaven,but just playing baseball and
out in the fields and stuff and,and, and, you know, having fun,

(26:20):
man,

Omar (26:22):
having fun,

Rudy (26:23):
having

Omar (26:24):
people that, that are, man, they want to see you like.
Good, like the good, good foryou instead of,

Rudy (26:30):
yeah, just talking about baseball and talk about baseball
players and their battingstands.
And, you know, you play swift,you know, you throw a rubber
ball against a black and, youknow, score, you know, and, and
it was, it was, we began to justhang out all the time together
and we were just, we're socompetitive, you know, uh, with
each other.
And I, I had, I had got like aNintendo.

(26:51):
Um, and then we would, wouldplay and then, you know, by now
I think my dad kind of let go,you know, they like, they
stopped, you know, and so I wasout like playing and, you know,
I would come back and help himin the store or whatnot, you
know, and, um, but I, I was Iwas determined to like leave,
you know,

Omar (27:11):
so, so yeah, it was, like you mentioned, it was almost
like life saving at that time.
Those relationships, are thosefriends still?
Yeah, yeah,

Rudy (27:18):
yeah, yeah, yeah, uh, Tito Ernesto, you know, another
friend of mine, Dave, you know,uh, you know, he also went to
Quigley and we just, you know,it was those years that I just
felt, man, God just sentsomeone.
You know that that would just behow you're doing Rudy Looking
for me and stuff and I was likeman, just leave me alone.

(27:40):
Like blah blah blah.
Come on.
Let's go play baseball Yeah,just you know Even though I want
it, but like I just there wasthis aspect to me that was just
I was detached I checked out,you know, I understand it now,
but like back then it was

Omar (27:54):
just oh, no Yeah, yeah in the moment, you know when you
look back then you can see Whatwas going on?
How you were thinking andfeeling and I was affecting, you
know, like, yeah,

Rudy (28:03):
yeah, yeah, yeah.

Omar (28:04):
So, so, so that was high school, like a college.
Did you end up going to college?

Rudy (28:07):
Yeah, yeah, you know, and, and my, my, uh, my, uh, senior
year at Quigley.
It was, and it's a seminary.
It's a Catholic seminary.
Um, one of the priests, FatherZorn, you know, he was taught
religion class, but he's one ofthose priests that would swear.
You know, it's where he tellsjokes, you know, and he was just

(28:29):
like, but I remember him pullingme like kind of aside and saying
like, like, you know, uh, he'slike, you know, every time
you're in this class, he's like,you know, I have these students
that he's like, I have them inother classes.
They're, they're, uh, nerds, ashe would put it, he's like, they
never say nothing.
But when you're there, they'retroublemakers.

(28:50):
It's like, it's like you bringsomething in them out.
That I don't see anywhere else.
He's like, I think you have agift.
Of what?
Trouble making?
What he was saying of gettingpeople Influence making?
Yeah, yeah, like getting peoplethat are kind of closed off to
to talk.
And he was like, I think he'slike, you should really think

(29:10):
about being a priest.
He's like, he's like, you knowsomeone, you know, had seen that
in me.
It's like that, that I would youknow, that he would bring that
out in people.
And, and he's like, I, I thinkyou can You know, God can really
use you, you know, and it'sstuck in my head because like, I
think for once it was likeoutside of like wanting to be in

(29:31):
the major leagues, you know,like purpose, like a calling,
like, you know, something, youknow, that, that is future.
Do you think he was the firstone that sparked that in you?
Yeah.
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
When he said that and he talkedto me and, and, and I was like,
man, you know what?
Yeah.
Like.

(29:52):
I could begin to see that.
You know, I could begin to seehow there's like, there's like I
have, like a certain kind ofinfluence, like a connection
that, like I bring out certainthings in some people, you know?
And, and I just, it stayed withme and so when, graduating from
high school, my next step wasto, to go to um, um Uh, Niles

(30:15):
College Seminary, which was thatstep before the priesthood.
Okay, you know, so so I I madethat choice and and I went and
asked him for a letter ofrecommendation and You know, um,
uh, I made that decision to goyou know uh and and um It was

(30:35):
it's like I don't know like justjust things kind of got my words
right now, but um, You know, itwas it was there when I went
man.
I feel my heart is like man likeI want to serve you God, like I
want to, I want to know youbegan to take like my, my faith
as a Catholic.
We're serious.
And my parents, they never wentto really church, you know,
outside when they went toMexico.

(30:56):
Uh, they would try to go everyyear, you know, uh, there they
would go like on Christmas.
They would go, you know,sometimes like during Easter,
you know, uh, but it was, youknow, you go out there, like you
don't really ever enter thechurch.
There's like so packed.
So we were here like in Latin, Ithink, you know, we didn't
really understand, you know, Youknow, um, uh, so, so it was, I

(31:21):
began to take my faith moreserious, you know, uh, but then,
you know, in the seminary, therewas a lot of people that were
drinking, they were partying,you know, um, and man, once I
started drinking.
You know, it, things changed,like, it, that, like, it just, I
started getting so drunk, youknow.

Omar (31:42):
Is that the first time you started drinking at that age?
Yeah,

Rudy (31:44):
yeah.
Even younger, you didn't touch?
No, no, no.
I mean, I think, uh, one of myfriends and I, so we might have
had, like, a drink.
Okay.
You know, it was, but just kids,like, you know, but there, I
started drinking, and I thinkthat's when, like, a lot of
anger started coming out.
A lot of, you know, just.
Um, man, and that, uh, that,that drinking just, it became

(32:08):
going clubbing and, and, youknow, and, and, and you wouldn't
think you're going to seminary,you know,

Omar (32:14):
you start getting drunk at seminary.
That's crazy.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It was, it was wine though.
It was wine.
Right.

Rudy (32:22):
Yeah.
Well, you know, it, it, it'scrazy because, you know, like
one time I, I got so drunk, uh,driving down the 90,'cause this
was in Nile, so, so I would takethe, this

Omar (32:32):
by, by Skokie, right?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Well, well, no, Nile was is itin that area or no?
Yeah.

Rudy (32:37):
No, I don't, I don't think it's like, um, I can't think of,
um, Glenview like out Okay.
Like, out that way.
Alright.
Or by the O'Hare, like towardsout there.
Okay.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Like, um, and, and I got pulledover by the police and I was.
Straight DUI, right?
Um, but the police officer waslike, Where are you going?
Blah, blah, blah.

(32:57):
I was like, going to NilesCollege Seminary.
He's like, What do you do there?
I'm a student.
I'm starting to be a priest.
He's like, You're really goingto be a priest?
I was like, Yeah.
He's like, Alright.
I'm going to drive you to theseminary.
You know, you follow me, right?
And, uh, he drove me.
And when he got out, He was likean escort.
And he was like, Hey, you know,finish

Omar (33:19):
and pray for me.
You know?
He must have been a Catholic.
You could atone for some of mysins.

Rudy (33:26):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
It was, it was, um, Yeah, yeah.
You know, you gotta, uh, youknow, just, just, it makes

Omar (33:35):
you laugh.
It's crazy.
This is probably, what, like inthe 90s, I'm gonna imagine?
Well, I

Rudy (33:42):
graduated in 92, so this would be

Omar (33:43):
like 93, 94.
You know, DUIs back then, theywere different, man.
I remember like my dad too, inthe 80s and stuff.
He said, man, they will driveyou home.
It was, it was different thannow.
Obviously it wasn't as harshpeople drinking.
They were more lighter, I guess,back then, but yeah.

(34:04):
So, okay.
So, so, okay.
So you start drinking there.
What happens with that path ofwanting to be a priest?
Do you continue?
Does it stop?
Or what?

Rudy (34:14):
Well, you know, it's, it's, I think my, my junior
year, uh, there was one of themen there that was, uh, going to
be, he was going to Mundelein,which is where you actually get
ordained.
And he was doing all thispaperwork.
I remember sitting in a roomwith him asking him like, Hey
man, like, how did you?
Come to that decision, you know,uh, you know, a lot of people
here feel it's a joke He's likeyeah, but like I actually do

(34:37):
feel like there's calling likeAnd you know, he's just telling
us, you know, how how it workedout for him and and how he made
his decision and and you had aobviously The chapel and and I
went to the chapel and Iremember like in the back of the
chapel They had this littlebalcony and I was just like, you
know God I'm thinking aboutdoing this and, you know, if

(35:01):
this is what you want from me,you know, um, you know, let me
know, like, like help meunderstand that this is the
right thing for me to do, youknow, and, uh, you know, I, I,
um, I prayed and, Six monthslater, I'd been kicked out.
laughter

Omar (35:18):
Here's your

Rudy (35:21):
sign, yeah.
laughter You know, he answeredyou know but by then you know I,
you know, there was a young ladythat I had met and you know I
was kind of dating her and umyou know, bringing her to the
university and um, you knowthere were things that would

(35:42):
happen there at the seminary youknow, that were You know, I
would work there over the summerand we would go out, um, and,
and, you know, move theboyfriends of the priest.
We'd move them, you know, fromone place to another.
Or, you know, we'd, um, uh, youknow, they would have parties

(36:03):
and stuff and we would clean upafter their parties.
You know, we would put away thekeggers and all the bottles and
Of the priest?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Um I'm serious, and I'm nottalking about like, you know,
your ordinary parish priest, Imean these are priests that are
running seminary, you know,these are priests that, um, and
you know, you would hear things,and I think it was at that time,

(36:27):
like, I kind of seen that, thatit began to like, really change,
like, my view of them, and ofGod, because I always kind of
viewed them as, you know, men ofGod.
No, yeah, yeah.
Um.
Uh, at one time, you know, meand one of the guys in the
seminary, we stole all theliquor.

(36:47):
They were so drunk.
We took all the kegs and thebottles and we put it in our
room and uh, you know, one ofthe priests came up and he was
like, you know, Rudy, uh, he'slike, you know, we, you know, we
were wondering if you remember,you still have the tap.
For the case because we have toreturn them We don't know what

(37:09):
we left after you guys And allthat stuff was put in one of our
rooms, you know one of the dormsand and one of my friends, you
know and Uh, and it just sohappens that, you know, I think
they were, it was a Saturdaynight, you know, they were
partying like, and so Sunday, myfriend, uh, his parents came to

(37:31):
visit him, you know, just, youknow, and Good Catholics, you
know, we came with our son.
He's you know, I came to hisroom But yeah, you know it It,

(38:02):
uh, it, it started kind of whatwould have been, you know, a
real like bad cycle becausethat, that school year, um, I
moved in with, you know, we hadthe dorms, we had a new, I had a
new roommate and it turns outlike, uh, this guy, he was, you
know, he was gay, you know, and,and, you know, I would have
these drawings I would put up onthe wall and he would, he was

(38:24):
like, You know, why you put thatstuff up there?
And you know, uh, he would tearhim down and you know, Um, he,
he would, like, I'd wake upsometimes and he'd be standing
over me and I began to getreally freaked out and, and you
know, one, one, you know, oneday he's like, hey, you know,
I'll give you a ride back to,you know, Chicago.
And I was like, yeah, but hesaid, let me, let me get some

(38:45):
money.
He said, I'll take you out toeat, you know, and you know, we,
we went, he stopped by a, by achurch, by his house.
He went in.
I came back with money and I'mlike, it's like, what are you
doing in there?
I went to get money.
He's like, got it from theoffering.
It's like the offering, theoffering box.
Yeah.
Yep.
Got it from the box.
Bro.
You can't do that.

(39:07):
Bro.
He's like, Oh, don't worry.
I got keys to the place.
Like, don't, don't worry aboutit.
It's like, let's go.

Omar (39:13):
I was like,

Rudy (39:13):
and it was, and I went and told the main priest, you know,
um, I don't even want to saynames, but, um, you know, and,
and I remember, you know, he'slike, well, tell me exactly what
happened and blah, blah, blah.
And, you know, and, and I waslike, well, this is what

(39:33):
happened.
He's like, you know, uh, whatturns out then, you know, he
turned against me, you know, andhe started, you know, um, you
know, just, you know, um, Long

Omar (39:47):
story short, I got expelled, you know?
Yeah.
You know what?
It is crazy.
'cause you mentioned he had thekeys, so when you went to report
'em, he was already probably inwith them, you know, if he's, if
he had access to, well that,

Rudy (39:57):
that parish was not one different one.
It was the seminary that wasanother parish by his house and
he lived on the north side, youknow, so, um, this, this was
something you know.
Um, but, you know, once I gotkicked out, um.
The seminary came after me andbecause we would do all these
fundraisers for like the city ofChicago We would serve some of

(40:20):
the elite of Chicago like thatmayor Daley and all these
millionaires that would donateto the Catholic Church So we
would come in in our suits Wewould serve them, you know, and
and they would donate to theseminary and and some of that
you would go towards our tuitionYou know and and and things room
and board because man we have Imean we had we got really good
food And Yeah, you know, youknow, they, they, I got sued by

(40:45):
the Catholic Church, I gotexpelled, and then they froze my
transcripts when I went toLoyola, um, and I couldn't go
back to school.
So, um, you know, and then whenI tried to talk to them, they
wouldn't answer, wouldn't talkto me or, or, or anything, you
know, and so I felt really hurt,I felt really angry, you know,

(41:06):
um.
At the Catholic Church, youknow, and, and, and them, and,
and I felt like, like, like,man, like, what you, what you
guys are doing is wrong, like,and, you know, um, and then when
they sued me in court, like,they had a, they had a panel of
attorneys, and it was just me,you know, and they're asking me,
like, man, do you have a bed, doyou have, you know, a radio, do

(41:29):
you, like, what do you have, youknow, that collateral, like,
like, because you got to paythis debt, and it got so bad
that, In court that day, youknow, when, when I was in front
of the judge and I was workingfor u, working for UPS, then,
um, that, um, the judge gotupset with them because they
were like this person.
They were, they were just, I,you know, I was just sitting

(41:51):
there and like, in a, not evenjust blanked out, you know, just
you go in court with no lawyeror nothing.
No lawyer.
No lawyer, no lawyer, you know,um.
And the judge is like, hey, whyare you doing this to him?
Like, why are you talking abouthim like this?
He's like, you know what?
He works for a Fortune 500company.

(42:11):
It's like, UPS, you can justcall them and find out what he
makes.
It's like that simple, you know?
Um, and he told me, he's like,you know, like, you need some,
you need help.
Like, there's, you know, Idon't, and I kid you not, like,
I don't remember like I just Iremember the judge being so
angry, you know, and and andyelling at them It's like you

(42:32):
guys should be ashamed ofyourselves, you know, what
they're doing to you.
Yeah and in court You know, butI just you know, I was just
different mentally.
Yeah.
Yeah, you know and otherstudents who had happened to you
know They got an attorney and Ithink because they did that and
the attorney began to representall of them All of them

(42:54):
Hispanic.
It changed what happened to me.
And they changed what the amountwas to like, I think it was like
12, 000 or 13, 000.
What was the initial?
I think it was like 30, 000.
It was a lot.
It was a lot.
But one of the things that,like, with the priest, the main

(43:16):
priest, what he told me, youknow, he, I remember just kind
of like being frustrated, andthis is, I'm jumping now.
No, no, yeah, yeah.
But, but he was like, he's like,he's like, you know, the only
reason you're here is becausethe people don't white, don't
want white people who speakSpanish as priests overseeing

(43:41):
them.
It's the only reason you'rehere.
It's like, it's like, you know,uh, and maybe so angry, you
know, it, it, he said that whileyou were still in school.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, it was still, it was stillin school.
Like right, right.
When I was going through thewhole process, you know, it was
getting, being kicked out andstuff like that.
And he was like, he's like, youguys don't, don't belong here,

(44:03):
you know?
And I never really saw, like, Ithink.
It didn't connect to me, theracism, um, and this is coming
from, from like the main, yeah,yeah.
Wow.
Um, you know, um, and I thinkthey still have the, the late
Cardinal Birdley, I think hepassed away like that year.
Um, I think it was my junioryear.

(44:27):
Because I would, they would behaving, and I say they, like,
you know, bunch of white kids,you know, and, and the priests,
they'd be reading the Bible.
And I'd be like, hey, what areyou guys doing?
It's like, oh man, how can wehelp you?
It's like, man, you guys readingthe Bible?
Like, what are you doing?
Like, you know, it's like, well,when you know what, what you
need help with, you can comeback.
It's like, but you guys arereading the Bible.
Like, yeah.
It's like, what do you need?

(44:49):
It's like, all right, you know,and here they would have like
Wednesday, like prayer anddifferent things like that.
So, you know, when, when all ofthis happened, uh, and I got,
like, I got, I got kicked out, Igot sued, I got my transcripts
frozen, man.
I was like, you know what, youknow what God, like you, I feel

(45:13):
like I'm gonna live my life.
Yeah.
And that's when I think the,the, the, the wheels fell off
because then I, it was partying.
I became a dj.
I started, you know, playing atclubs and, you know, just, just
drinking, you know, uh, I, Iwake up different places, you

(45:34):
know, just, it, it was, and youknow, my friends, we, we, you
know, like we would go out andparty and stuff like that, you
know, and it was just, it, itwas.
It's just really angry, youknow, just, just, man, like I
hated everything about myself.
Hated my last name.
I hated the color of my skin.

(45:55):
I hated, uh, man, I, I, I just,I, I, I, you know, I, I grabbed
the gun and I just, I'd just besitting there.
Yeah.
You know, and, and, and, youknow, I don't know what it was,
but it, you know, there was justalways something, man, that
would.
Like, I don't know, just, just,just speak to me, just distract

(46:18):
me, you know, you're in thatplace and you're just like, you
know, just, just, you know,just, just angry, you know?
Um, you know, it, it was, it, itwas.
It was, it was, it was, it wastough, man.
It was, it was tough, you know?
And, um, you, you know, youdon't feel nothing.

(46:39):
You're, you're just one dayafter another.
And as I became a better dj, youknow, I, I'd get booked all over
the place.
People got to know me, gotpopular, you know, and I was.
You know, that was my, my, mylife and, and I wouldn't even
remember deejaying.
Half the time I have like littlebottles of like Hennessy or I,
I, I, I, Christian Brothers.
You know, little bottles.

(47:01):
And, and then I'd be down andum, and I'd be out there
deejaying.
I wouldn't remember whathappened.
You know, people would come up,Rudy, that was an amazing set
you threw down.
Like, I don't remember.
I don't remember.
I don't remember.
And I think about it now.
It was like so demonic, man.
It was, it was, and, and, youknow, I got really into

(47:22):
witchcraft.
I got really, since I was small,like I was young, like I would,
I'd be at the flea market andI'd tell them, like, we'd be
working there and they'd have acurandera or, you know, one of
the brujas or whatever, and I'dcome over and I'd be looking at
stuff.
It was just, just, I was justreally curious about it and it
felt.
You know, my, you know, myCatholic faith, I didn't really
feel there was power oranything, but like, you know,

(47:43):
she would do tarot cards andstuff like that, and she'd start
talking to me, you know?
Um, but now when I'm drinkingand partying, now I'm really
getting into witchcraft.
Now I'm like, really, man, likeOuija boards.
Oh, no way.
You know, and I went to one ofthe, the, the, uh, the ladies,
it was a witch or a bruja orwhatever.

(48:05):
Yeah, yeah.
And I was like, Hey, I wantwitchcraft.
I was like, are you sure?
I want what you have.
How old are you at this time?
Now I'm like, 22, you know, 21.
Yeah, yeah.
22, 23 maybe.
Um, and she put the tarot cardsin my stomach.
And she was like, now you gotit.

(48:29):
And man, you know, I began to beable to read tarot cards.
And I, you know, I was so intoit, you know.
You know, it was, it was, um,but I felt it was power, like,
because, you know, I, I feellike I had visions, like I knew
things about people, I knewthings about their house, I, you
know, I was doing spells, and Iwas reading books, and, and, you
know, and I, I felt like, youknow, this, like, new age, this

(48:53):
all, like, man, it was, youknow, it, it, like, I felt I was
balanced now, like, I was, youknow, enlightened, and, and I
had control of my emotions andall this stuff, you know, and,
and so.
I felt like I had found it.
It was power there.

Omar (49:08):
It wasn't with God when you said F U but you found it
now in here, right?

Rudy (49:12):
Yeah, but I had already kind of shifted to this mind
that like God is energy, God islike you, right?
That, um, you know he's, youknow, um, Pretty much your God,
but like back then that therewas authority and all these
things and you know, just kindof like you speak things into

(49:33):
existence and you know, um, andthen, you know, you're, you're
clubbing and you're doing allthis stuff.
And I started selling nitroustanks.
Okay.
Um, and I call them whippets Sofor those that don't know, it's
like, it's like, uh, laughinggas.
What is it?
Yeah.
Yeah.
They would give it like adentist.
I think like, like, uh, medicaland then just like industrial,
you know, uh, we do

Omar (49:56):
raves back then.
There was a lot of raves.
Those are people that don'tknow.
What does that look like?
You've got the tank.
Yeah.

Rudy (50:01):
Yeah.
You're at a tank and you gotyour bag of balloons and, and
kids are lining up, you'recharging five bucks a balloon,
you know, and these raves, theyhave like thousands of kids.
You know, um, you know, lateron, a lot of kids started dying
because of ecstasy and differentthings, you know, um, but man,
like you buy a tank for like 225and you're making a grand off of

(50:23):
it, you know, so I was like,man, why am I selling?
Why sell wheat?
You know, I could drive aroundwith my truck full of tanks,
better business, right?
And I get pulled over andthey're like, what's that?

Omar (50:35):
No nitrous.
How, how easy was it to get?
Where would you get it backthen?
Well,

Rudy (50:40):
back then there was a connect on the north side and,
and it was, it, you know, you,you certain people were able to
go and get it for you, so theyupcharge you, you know, so tank
that, you know, maybe they pay 175, they're charging 2 50, 300.
Right, right.
3 25 for it, you know?
Um, obviously if you're making aG on it, you know you're not
Yeah, yeah.
It's not, you know, but whenyou're using, using it, and

(51:01):
that's, I think when I, Istarted really, like, I, I, I
wasn't a person could eversmoke.
I never could do weed.
It would give me migraines, youknow, uh, but drinking, I could,
you know, but nitrous, Icouldn't.
So, man, it was, you know, fullblown addiction.
You know, I, I sell tanks out ofthe garage, you know, and we

(51:22):
ended up getting, my friend, youknow, we ended up getting a
connection.
We just were looking for nitroustanks, and one of them walked
into a, uh, a medical facilitywhere they had tanks, and the
guys started selling us thetanks.
Yeah, and so, you know, you knowat first we were paying them a
lot We're paying like like 225or something like that.
But then it was like we'rebuying 10 15 20 tanks 30 tanks

(51:45):
40 tanks So now I'm like man,you got to give me to like 125
And my addiction just

Omar (51:53):
You know, what did the nitrous do for you?
Like when when you would takeit?
I don't why did you make youfeel what made it so addictive?
I guess

Rudy (52:01):
it was like you you Uh, the music gets louder.
Like, you're almost like, almostlike, think of like, you know,
like something's black and whiteand all of a sudden it's 3D.
You know, color, like, like, youknow, music all around.
You're, you're in this, thisplace and that.
The zone.
Yeah, yeah, and, and, and, andthen it'll go away and you're.

(52:24):
You're normal.
You're not, you know, you're,you're back to your senses.
You don't have the effects thatmaybe you would have in other
drugs where it has to go leaveyour system.

Omar (52:32):
Cause, uh, nitrous is very temporary, right?
That feeling.
Yeah.
Then maybe like a minute orwhat?
Like two

Rudy (52:38):
seconds at first, but then you develop a tolerance to it.
You know, and, and it, it, it'lllasts longer.
Well, first maybe it lastslonger and then it got shorter,
but then you're doing more andmore and more and, and you would
have visions.
You, you'd have like, you know,and, and that's why I think like
the, the, the, the magic and,and, uh, witchcraft became

(52:59):
because more real when Yeah.
Got, yeah.
Because you're, you're likepraying, you're doing this and
that, or praying you're doingyour Yeah, yeah.
You know, incantations andthings like that, you know, and,
and.
So it was really empowering, butthen I could feel I was starting
to lose, like, control.
Like, um, you know, I was doinglighting, had my lighting

(53:19):
company then, and, um, and Ilove music.
You know, it just, it's justsomething about me I can get
lost in, you know.
And, and I started missing gigs,you know, cause I was just doing
the nitrous, you know, I'd be inthe garage or in the truck and
just, just doing nitrous, youknow, and just like, oh man, it

(53:39):
just, it was, it was getting outof control.

Omar (53:42):
You know, you end up just having a mask.
The recipe to the tank or no,you

Rudy (53:45):
know, we would think of all sorts of things.
Never that, you know, like, likewe would, we put it in water
and, and the water under itwould stop it from freezing when
you're using it.
So it lasts a little longer.
You'd bang them and inside wouldfreeze.
And then the nitrous would breakapart and then it become.
You'd get more, you know, sothere was like every way you

(54:07):
could think of, of trying tofigure out, you know, and we,
you know, I remember readingonline what nitrous did is
really repeated depleted yourbody of like vitamin, like B12
and things like, so I went andstarted buying it.
Vitamin B12.
Cause I'm losing it.
Yeah, yeah.
You know.

(54:28):
It was, it was, it was sillyman.
It was silly.

Omar (54:31):
How many years did this last?
This lifestyle that you were in?
I gotta say from like 22 toabout 26.
Did something happen thatbrought about a change around
that age at 26?
Well, yeah,

Rudy (54:47):
you know, I, I was, I was, you know, getting high in the
garage, well really it was inthe truck and friends would come
by and they'd get high too and,uh, you know, I'd be selling
tanks.
So it was like, kind of like Isit here, I get high, I sell and
I'm making money and I'm, youknow, and, and, and by now, like
my mom's really worried.
You know, because they didn'tunderstand what tanks were and

(55:09):
they had a grocery store.
So, you know, um, I bring thetanks and I put them in the, you
know, I, I, and she's like, whatare they?
Oh, no, we're, you know, they'refor parties and, you know,
balloons and stuff like that.
I started figuring out it wasmore, you know, and, uh, and I
would sleep like, like all, youknow, all day.

(55:29):
And I was up at night, you know,like every day.
You know, and, and you know, Iwas, I was, I was clubbing like
Thursday, Friday, Saturday, um,Sunday sometimes.
And then I was like drinking atclubs like Monday, Tuesday,
Wednesday, you know, you know,and, and here you are when you
were making money, you're like,$50, keep the tip.

(55:50):
I bought three graphs.
Not if you tip, keep, you know,put, you know, it's you, you,
you're just spending money, youknow?
But what ended up happening islike, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm
sitting in this high cube truck,you know, and you know, I'm
getting high and some of myfriends, they, they went to go
do something and they were goingto come back and I'm getting
high and, and then, um, youknow, I'll say this beforehand,

(56:13):
like the first thing that Istarted noticing that was very
different is that I'd wake upand I would start crying.
I had no idea what's it said,you know, it's in the mirror
like, what the hell, why was hecrying?
It's weird.
You know, it's like medicine.

(56:34):
I tell you guys, you guys everjust start crying.
Oh man.
All right, man.
And we have conversations aboutGod and stuff like that, like
spirituality stuff, but youknow, when you're off, you know,
it's, it's.
But there was just something inme that I think just connected
to, like, when I was younger,you know, um, You know, they

(56:57):
were there when I was a littlekid I was like four or five and
they had a hernia because I waslifting stuff and I ended up
developing a hernia.
Yeah, and You know, I rememberthat they had to take blood and
I remember, you know, Like beingin line to take blood.
I saw that needle and I rememberjust saying God Please help me.

(57:19):
I'm so afraid.
I don't want to do that needle.
Like, please, like, help me.
Like, and, uh, phone call.
It was a doctor.
The kid doesn't need to take it,get his blood drawn.
It stuck with me.
It stuck with me.
That I had, this little kid,like, it just stuck.

(57:42):
Way out there, you remember,like, yeah, and so now here I'm
the truck and I'm getting highand, and, and, and, and man,
like, I could feel like, likesomething was wrong, you know,
like something, you know, it'sdifferent.
And I just, I would look up andthis, the Haiku truck, because

(58:02):
it's the lights and it's darkoutside and wherever you can
see, like a little bit of lighton the top.
Yeah, you can see a little bitof light on the, on the top.
Um, and I remember like, likesaying, like, you know what,
like God, if you're real, it'slike, I'm telling you right now,
like, unless you do somethinglike it's going to get crazy.

(58:28):
You know, like I felt it, youknow, like I felt it in my
spirit, like, like just kind ofthose crossroads, you know, you
know.
And, you know, I was talking tothis guy about selling like a
ton of tanks in Indiana, and Iwas like, man, it's gonna be a
ton of money, and, you know,I'm, I'm, I'm, you know, I'm
excited, but I had this partnerwith me, and I was like, man, I

(58:49):
gotta get rid of this guy, youknow.
Um, but I just, I rememberlooking up and just saying, man,
like, there's gotta be more.
You know, there's gotta be moreto this.
It's like, just selling thesetanks, making money, I see my
parents making money, like.
You know, and I would look upand I was just like, man, gotta
be real, like, show yourself,you know, because if you don't,

(59:13):
I'm telling you, you know, andas I was just, I was just
getting high, you know, likethere was this, this, this part
of me that.
It was just like, I looked upand I was like, you know what,
God, like, help me, you know, ifyou're real, like, just, just

(59:34):
help me.
And then there was somebodylike, like sitting next to me
and he was like, man, why areyou talking to him?
And I was like, uh, man, like,why are you talking to him?
He's like, man, I know you,like, man, we're going to make a
ton of money, man.
It's, it's, it's all good, youknow?
And I was like, yeah, and I meanI could see the money, you know,

(59:55):
I could see like the trucks Icould see the pool.
I could see the house, you know,I could see And I was like, yeah
Yeah Yeah, let's do this.
I mean i'm i'm in man.
I like man i'm about money, youknow, you know And then I would
just look up and and somethingwould just like grieve my heart,
and you know, this person'slike, he's talking to me, it's

(01:00:17):
like, man, it's all good, like,like, don't talk to him.
But there was, there was thispart, man, where I was just
like, Like, God, help me see.
And it was when I said thatword, help me see, and I looked
at him and he was the devil.
He was, he was red.

(01:00:37):
I mean, obviously I'm going tosay the devil's like red, but
like I looked at him and I waslike, you know, like you're the
devil and he's like, you knew Iwas a devil.
No, I didn't.
I didn't know you were a devil.
He's like, You've always known,who do you think you serve?
You don't serve him.
Look at everything you do, man,you serve me.

(01:00:58):
I was like, nah, man, nah.
He's like, don't talk to me likethat.
He's like, I'll destroy you.
He's like, I'll kill your mom.
I'll destroy her.
And man, I thought, my mom.
You know, my jefita, you know,like, oh, man, nah, man, nah.
And I was just like, oh, and allof a sudden, like, he
disappeared.
And, you know.

(01:01:20):
Started, you know, I could feellike something was moving around
and like these letters were onthe walls and I got out that
truck and I was like What theheck just happened today, you
know?
I was like, man, I gotta gethigh some more.
That was an amazing experience.
I mean, I think about it now.
I'm just like, oh my goodness.

(01:01:40):
You know, but some guys werecoming to pick up some tanks.
And I went to the garage and Ihad like a ton of tanks.
And I walked in there, gave themthe tanks.
And, you know, I, um, went inthe garage.
I had my truck.
This brand new truck, TVs,Nintendo, I mean TVs all around
the truck.
Who does that?

(01:02:03):
I think about it now, I waslike, what are you doing really?
And I want to listen to music,but I didn't want to leave my
truck out there so the policewouldn't come and they would
ask.
So I put the car in the garage.
I closed the garage.
You know, and I'm listening tomusic.
I put it up, I'm jamming, I'mgetting high.
You know, somebody, you know,get some calls, Hey, what time

(01:02:24):
you coming, man?
Like, oh yeah, we'll be therelater on.
I'm ready.
Pick, pick up some food.
Alright, cool man.
So here I am, I'm in, I'm in thegarage and the car's going, you
know, and then all of a suddenthere's light in that room.
Like, think of a black, a darkgarage, you know, all of a
sudden there's light.
All of a sudden it's like clearas day.
I know there's a God.

(01:02:46):
I've always known there was aGod, and I've always known I
wanted nothing to do with it.
And, and, and that tank, therewas these chains, they were, you
know, like, kind of like this,and they were hooked on me.
And, and as I was filling theballoon, when it would go, shh,
really, it was like, help!People crying out for help, you

(01:03:13):
know, and now I'm, I'm freakedout and I could see those
little, like, it was like theselittle spirits with wings, you
know, and they're holding thechain and they're like, just a
little bit more, just a littlebit more in your ours, you know?
And I fall on my knees and I wasjust like, God save me.
Like, if you save me, I willtell people about you.

(01:03:37):
And it was at that moment that abright light came into that
garage.
So bright.
Powerful light, and I was thrownto my, my, my face on the floor.
You know, uh, I could see on myhand I was like a leper.
I was like white and ashy, youknow?
And, those spirits got like tornapart.

(01:03:58):
Like, when this light, thisperson came in that room, tore
him apart.
If you could imagine someonescreaming, like, how it would
sound.
Like someone's torn apart.
Like that, like that scream,like a horrific scream.
I could hear them scream likehow they were torn apart, you

(01:04:22):
know, and something, someone wasin front of me.
I couldn't look up at him.
Someone was in front, in thatroom, you know, and then I was
just, I was, I couldn't, I wasjust on my knees flat, you know,
sorry, just flat.

(01:04:43):
And then, you know.
So, something took me, like,where I was sitting, something
took me high up, and it wasdarkness around me.
And I was like, you know, what'sthis?
You know, where am I at?
And he was like, you thinkyou're a god.
You're no god.
You're a god of nothing.

(01:05:03):
There's nothing around me.
Emptiness, you know.
And I was brought back down, andas a kid, you know, I, I would,
probably around seven, I wouldbreak into houses and had not
remembered that, you know, Ibroke into this house and, you

(01:05:26):
know, I was going through theguy's bed and I had a knife and,
you know, I, I, the guy came in,I didn't realize he was in the
bathroom and I was going underhis mattress, you know, I was
searching his house and stuffand he came out and I went at
him.
And I remember the fear that wasin his face, you know, he was a
hispanic guy.
And I ran out the house, Ijumped out the window, and, uh,

(01:05:50):
I was in the alley, and I waslike, but it felt good, it was
like adrenaline, like, but Iremember someone, something just
said, what you're doing iswrong, and I see you, and I was
filled with fear, you know.

(01:06:11):
And I never did that again, youknow, I hadn't remembered that,
I had not remembered that.
And you know, my brothers had alot of trouble with their kids
and my mom ended up taking themin.
So they would live with us, youknow, and, you know, they would
make me really angry, you know,they would break stuff, they'd
break my records and they wantedattention, you know, they were

(01:06:33):
young.
But I would get so angry andyell at them, I'd grab them and
say, man, your mom don't evenwant to see you, man.
You know, mom don't care aboutyou.
She was supposed to come.
She didn't come.
You start crying and stuff, youknow.
Um, and I remember that verysame thing.
And I remember the words justsaying, something thrown into

(01:06:56):
the water.
Just words saying, man, it'sbetter to be thrown into the
water.
You know, with cement blockaround your neck.
And what it's going to be.
What you do to those littlekids, you know, and uh, and man
When I got up I'm just likeforgive me.

(01:07:20):
I Don't know who you are I don'tknow who you are.
You know, I'm sorry like Help,you know and the first thing
something said get out thatgarage Got out that garage the
freaking car was on I forgot thecar was on.
I wasn't trying to kill myself.
I forgot the car was on.

(01:07:40):
And I closed the garage.
I don't know how long this took,you know?
But I remember standing outsidethe garage and I popped open
the, uh, The garage door openerand, you know, I'm just sitting
there and I'm just like, Dang!But I went back into that garage

(01:08:01):
and I was like, Man, that was acrazy experience.
Another balloon, but nothing.
I didn't get high.
Nothing.
I was like, now I was freakedout.
There was some Coronas that wereleft out, but it was water.

(01:08:22):
I was like, what the heck isthis?
You know, what just happened?
I wanted to get high again,because then I was getting like,
I was scared, but then I waslike tripped out and, you know,
I get tripped out again, almost,you know, I was like, Oh my God,
what happened?
Something's different, you know,but now things are different

(01:08:45):
around me.
Like it was, I sense things havechanged, you know, and I got
this pain in my stomach, youknow, I was like, Oh, I didn't
realize I hadn't eaten days Iwas so busy getting high It was
like, oh, so I'm gonna, I'm, I'mgonna go to Lawrence's.
I I'm gonna go and, and getsome, some shrimp shrimp over

(01:09:06):
there on Canal Street.
So I drove, you know, spot.
Yep.
Yeah.
And I drove and back then, it'snot the way it looks now, it's
like little ghetto, you know?
It was like always like bunch ofpeople out there and, and so I,
I got my shrimp and I parked mytruck.
Brand new truck, you know, I'msitting there eating my shrimp.
And then this station wagonpulls up and then there's
there's a guy and and These guyscome up to him right and he got

(01:09:29):
CDs and he's like 20 or whateverand it gives him the CD and I'm
my truck is a little higher.
So I'm there's a station wagonand The guy opens it And there's
drugs in there, the CD, youknow?
And then a little kid comes upfrom behind, like, Dad, I want
to go home.
And I was like, What kind oflowlife does that?

(01:09:53):
You know?
Selling! Like, in front of hiskid, like.
And then something just told me,that's what you do.
The nitrous.
You know?
We'd be at parties, you know,filling balloons, and the kids
are curious.
So you give them a balloon, butyou tie it up and they're like
doing what everybody's doing.
Because we have people, we'd beat people's houses, you know,

(01:10:14):
throwing house parties, youknow.
And, man, I was so, I was soshamed, you know, I, I, I just
was like, I'm a bad person.
Like everybody knows I, I, whatI do, like, just so much shame.
And then I, I, I started to geton, uh, you know, on, on, on
Halstead or what was it?
Like Cermak to, to, uh.

(01:10:37):
Go, go back home and, uh,Something in me was just like,
man, just drive.
Go, go to Wisconsin.
It's like, start all over.
You know, it's like, you know,no one cares about you.
Shame, you know.
And I was like, alright, I havea lot of money in my pocket.
So I was like, yeah, I'm, I'm,I'm going.

(01:10:58):
And as I got on the freeway, Igot a vision, like, of my mom.
And my mom.
I stayed up praying for me, youknow, and she was on the table,
you know, and she was just like,she fell asleep, you know, she
was praying for me and then man,it was about to jump 94,

(01:11:21):
Wisconsin and the, or two 90going west towards Cicero, you
know, I just turned towardsCicero, you know.
No cars, like seven in themorning, like six, like five,
like six in the morning, nocars, not a single car.
It was weird, you know, you'redriving and I'm like, man, this

(01:11:46):
is out of this world, likesomething, you know.
And, you know, I, I, I got tothe house, I went upstairs and
my mom was sleeping on thetable, you know.
And, you know, I was just like,man, well, my brother, you know,
he had went to prison with hisbrother and, you know, he had

(01:12:08):
come back a believer, but, youknow, we, we always made fun of
him, you know, cause he cameback, didn't want to watch
movies, didn't want to listen tomusic, you know, want to always
tell us about Jesus.
And we're like, you know, Oh,here's the padrecito, you know,
la culita, you know, and, and.
You know, but I just had thisexperience, you know, so, um,

(01:12:30):
you know, I'm, I'm the next,this is the next day, you know,
I'm, I'm burning, you know, backthen you, when you make music,
you had to like put the, the,the, the songs and MP3s on, on
the, on the, on the file fromAnd then you had to burn it and,
uh, and then it had to finalizethe CD or else it wouldn't work.
You had to finalize it, right?
So, you know, I was makingthese, putting all these songs

(01:12:52):
and stuff like that and, uh, youknow, my brother's like, Hey
man, like, I have court, youknow, in Kalamazoo.
He's like, man, can you pleasetake me?
I was like, no, I ain't going toKalamazoo, you're crazy, you
know, I ain't going to take you,he's like, come on, man, please,
man, like, like, you know, fine,bro, like, dude, you're, you're
always in trouble, you alwaysfreaking need help, you know,

(01:13:14):
like, fine, you know, um, so, soI'm sitting there, you know, Um,
you know, put in the music and,you know, he's like, Hey man,
can you put one song on therefor me?
He's like, you know, so we can,you know, you're going to play
it in your car, right?
And I was like, nah, man, Iain't putting your Christian
music out here, but I know, Iknow what you're asking.

(01:13:36):
Like, nah, man, I don't want tohear that, you know, and he's
like, come on, man, just onesong.
Fine.
What song?
He said, man, it's"Sumergeme",man.
You know, I was like, so Ilooked it up for him.
I think it was LimeWire at thetime, you know Downloaded the
song put it on the thing andthen he's like walking away or

(01:13:56):
whatever And and then as I'msitting here, I get this feeling
like someone's there and I'mlike and then the cans fall off
the aisle And I'm like freakedout now, you know and I man
something's different man theseYou know, I think these spirits
said that they were my friendsand not my friends no more.

(01:14:17):
And, and, you know, um, mybrother comes back.
And he said, hey man, whathappened?
Like, here, it's like, it's likethe, the, the shopping carts are
all moved.
I was like, nah man, I thinksome crazy stuff is going on.
You know, I had this experiencewith God, you know.
He's like, you did?
He's like, yeah, yeah, you know.
He's like, I know God now.

(01:14:38):
He said, really, you know Jesus?
We got a new guy, you know?
And, you know, he's like It'slike, man, let me tell you, you
know, and I have to do it.
I want to hear about your God.
Like, I know God now.
I had this experience.
I start telling him, you know,and he's like, nah, man, like
you need Jesus.
It's like, nah, bro, like I hadthis experience.
It's an amazing experience.
You know, man, I lost it.

(01:14:58):
I was sorry, you know, and he'slike, well, you know, we got to
get some sleep before, you know,um, like, let's just go upstairs
or whatever.
And I, and so I'm walking out ofthe store with them.
And then he's like, um, he stopsme and he says, Rudy, do you
want to accept Jesus as yoursavior?
And I had this Arizona bottle,big bottle, you know, and boom,

(01:15:22):
I busted in his head, you know,but I didn't do it.
Like I thought I did.
Cause he was like bleeding, likehe was, in what I saw, he was
bleeding, he was like screaming.
But then, like I had the bottlein my hand, he said, Rudy, what,
what, what are you doing?
And the bottle just fell, and Ilost it.
Like, I just freaked out.

(01:15:43):
You know, uh, and I startedcrying, like sobbing, like just
sobbing uncontrollably.
Like, I didn't know what wasreal or what wasn't real
anymore, like.
Just, you know, I don't, Idon't, I don't, I hadn't like
slept, you know, it just, it wasjust, and went upstairs and, and
my brother's like, hey man, doyou want to accept Jesus as your

(01:16:06):
Savior?
And I started laughing, but Iwas like, I do.
And he asked me to pray withhim.
And the moment I started prayingwith him, man, something
manifested.
And I saw like myself, but withblack eyes and.
And that thing was just like,you know, and I was like, and
then I had this incredible joy.

(01:16:27):
I mean, I, I, I, it was like,it's like, like sunshine, you
know, just, it was, it was somuch beauty, so much peace.
It was just incredible, youknow?
And my brother's like, you know,God loves you, you know?

(01:16:48):
He's gonna begin to show yousome things, he's just talking
to me, you know, and I'm like,okay man, and I'm talking, and
I'm like chippery, like, man,what's, like, man, like, I'm so
happy, like, man, I feel free,like, I feel like something left
me, you know, he's like, man,like, what you were doing, he's
like, was dangerous, he's like,you know.

(01:17:12):
And I was like, okay, you know,I like, yeah, it's like, it's
like, whoa, it's like, man, it'salready time for me to go.
Like, let's go, man.
So I'm like, cool.
And I had this truck that I toldyou, man, I had TVs, had big
crazy sound system, you know, Igot extra batteries in the back.
And so my sound system, like.
If the battery died for somereason, you couldn't just jump

(01:17:34):
it.
Like, my stereo, you had to putin the code, and you had to get
a big, like, we had to use ourwork truck to jump it, or else
it just took forever, you know?
So, um, you know, um, I'msitting in the car, and the
car's dead.
And I'm like, oh man, I'mgetting really frustrated now,
and my brother's like, hey,relax, like, you know, God is,

(01:17:57):
you know, it's, it's, it's okay,you know?
And I'm like, nah, bro, youdon't understand, like, this
car's dead.
Like, I made sure it wasn'tdead, like, I, I, dude, like, I
gotta go get the truck, like,you know what, let's just, like,
you know what, I can't, I, like,I say, Rudy, let's pray.
Like, what the hell is prayinggonna do?
Like, come on, like, it'sfrickin dead, ugh, Rudy, let me

(01:18:19):
pray.
I was like, bro, like, I'm justsitting there like, And he
starts praying over the car.
And he's like, I'll try it.
And he prayed in Jesus name andthe whole thing, you know?
So then, you know, I'm like,dude, I'm not going to try it.
The car's dead.
Like, don't you understand that?
No, try it.
Let me tell you, I freaked out.

(01:18:46):
To me, God had always been likethis God that, you know, I'm not
going to try it.
Was in a supernatural was neverin a natural realm, you know,
he's not the kind of God thatturns green lights or you know
Moves one thing to anotherplace, you know has I must feel
like he didn't really mess withus Like Like that wasn't his

(01:19:13):
thing kind of thing, you knowand to see that happen Shocked
me.
Hmm it I couldn't explain it,and then my TV comes up, and I
have to enter the codes.
Which told me it was dead.
You know, and this is the otherkicker.

(01:19:34):
Before I got, before I gave mylife to the Lord, we're in the
store where I'm, I'm recordingthe CD and then the computer
shuts off.
And so the CD pops out andwhenever it did that, it means
it didn't finalize.
It's no good.
Right.
Right.
So then, you know, I'm like,dude, I throw it in the garbage

(01:19:54):
and my brother's like grabs it.
It's not good.
It's like, it's okay with him.
So here we are driving, so it'slike, you know, quite a few
hours over there.
Puts the CD, and gets, guesswhat's the only song that works?
"Sumergeme".
I never heard the song.

(01:20:15):
But here I'm driving, and itstarts off with, like, Cansado
del Camino.
And man, I just start bawling.
I'm just tired, brother.
You know, like, like, I'm justso You know, I'm so tired of
this life, um, you know, youknow, you know, and Man, like, I

(01:20:41):
would play it over and over.
Even my brother's like, hey man,can we play a different song?
But, I left this part out.
Um, When the whole thinghappened with the garage, you
know, like After all thathappened.
I remember saying to God that Ididn't want to live To take me

(01:21:02):
with him, you know And I, and Iremember him saying to me, like,
in my spirit, you know, that Iwas never alone.
And I was like, but how will Iknow?
You know, and he says, you'llknow, he's like, and I heard the

(01:21:23):
birds singing, you know, and itwas four in the morning or
whatever, like, I could hear thebirds singing.
And he said he would be with me,right?
So, now, like, that, that day,my mom, she's under the table,
and then I come downstairs, andI never, I had a really hard

(01:21:46):
time with my dad.
You know, we just never gotalong, you know?
So I walk downstairs, and, andthe first thing I think, you
know, it's like, man, dad, like,I mean, man, God, like, I don't
get along with my dad.
Can you help me with him?
So I come downstairs, and mydad's like, Hey, son.
How you doing?
He's like, I'm okay.

(01:22:06):
He's like, do you wantbreakfast?
I said, okay.
Sit down.
He's like, you know, he's makingsome breakfast, some eggs and
stuff.
And he's like, man, how youbeen?
It's like, okay.
And I was like, oh, man, it'sgood.
Good.
You know, sat down.
He's eating.

(01:22:29):
Never had a conversation.
Like that

Omar (01:22:33):
so that moment.

Rudy (01:22:35):
Yeah, yeah.
You know, so, you know, I'm, I'msitting there and I'm talking,
like, now I'm sitting in the carlike, like driving and hearing
this song, and I'm just, I'mhearing and, and it's just like,
you know,"Canzado del Camino"and I'm telling God, like, I'm
tired, like I'm worn out.

(01:22:55):
Yeah.
You know, and I start hearingthose birds singing, you know?
I'm in a car driving, mind you,like 65, 70 miles an hour, and
I'm hearing them and I'm like, Idon't know, I'm going crazy,
man.
This is, I can't, like, I'm noteven trying to explain it

(01:23:16):
anymore, you know, I'm justlike, you know.
And that was the big change, youknow.

Omar (01:23:24):
So you experience that man all these things and How does
your life look?
What do you do next?
I know you were, you had allthose tanks.
Like, did you feel the need toget rid of that?
Like, what changes begin tohappen?
You know, I

Rudy (01:23:38):
could tell you that, you know, I took my brother to his
court date and everything andgot back and my friends would
come looking for me cause theywanted to get tanks, you know?
And, uh, you know, they, theyended up like calling me on my
cell phone.
They're like, where are you?
And I'm like, ah, man, I'm, I'mright here in the kitchen.

(01:23:58):
And they're like, dude, we werejust there.
We didn't see you.
I'm, I'm looking in the kitchen.
I'm like, sitting right here inthe kitchen, man.
Where you at?
Like, dude, we just, we justleft your store.
Like, man, can you o can you getyour guy open up?
He's like, we got the money,blah, blah.
I like, dude, just give it tohim.
Just give it to him man.
Give him the money.
He like, dude, you don't wantyour cut?

(01:24:19):
Nah, just give it to him, bro.
You know?
Uh, it's all right, whatever,you know, and I go up to the
front and I like, you know, thisis in the grocery store, you
know, and I tell my mom, like,Hey, some people come looking
for, it's like, yeah, it's intothe back.
I don't know.

(01:24:39):
Yeah.
Yeah.
You know, I ended up talking tothe guy that was buying all the
things I, Hey man, you want, youwant my side of the business?
How much, man?
How much?
Give me 2, 500 for real.
Yeah.
You know, it's all right, man.
I, I take, you know, I, I giveyou the money right now, man.
I was like, cool.
You know, then guy bald is like,man, what are you doing, bro?

(01:25:02):
Like, did you just like, yeah,dude, I'm done.
Why bro?
Like, bro, come on, man.
Like I get some females like,like, bro, like I do.
I'm cool, man.
Like I wanted to do with that.
Like, wow, bro.
Like what happened, man?
I say, dude, I want nothing todo with that no more, man.
I want nothing to do with that,man.
I don't even want to go overthere.

(01:25:23):
Just give him the tanks you knowand and Uh, and and it just so
seems that when I met with thisguy, you know, um, he gave me
the money um I don't know whathappened to the money I almost
feel like the devil just cameand took it, you know, I don't

(01:25:43):
know, man, I don't know.
I was just like, and, and theywould call me at times and be
like, bro, like we got thisdeal, Brian, where they're
dropping off.
Can we just drop off by yourplace, you know, 30, 40 tanks,
whatever, 25 tanks, whatever.
And bro, I'll give you a cup of,no, come on, bro.
Like just do this one time forme.
No.

(01:26:04):
You really done with this?
I'm done.
Bro, I'll see you later man.
And then I just started stayingat the store with my mom.
You know, I'd be just in thecashier.
You know But my brother, there'sa church in the corner, and, you
know, that's where he went.
It's called Monte de Olivos, youknow?
A Pentecostal church, and mybrother's like taking me, you

(01:26:25):
know, and so here I am inchurch, you know, and he's, you
know, telling me stuff about theBible and I was in the seminary.
I didn't understand anything hewas saying, you know, I felt
like a little kid, you know,he's talking to me about the
Bible and this and that.
I'm like, Dude, I've read theBible before.
I don't get it.

(01:26:46):
I don't understand, you know.
I don't know what to do with it,you know?
I just, uh, so I'm just like,God, like, begin to help me, you
know?
Well, they ended up, you know,they would go out and
evangelize, and, you know, theywould start taking me,, you
know.
But, you know, God just, Hebegan, like, just to speak to me

(01:27:09):
through His Word, and I startedjust reading, just absorbing the
Word, just every day, just on myknees, just crying out to God,
you know, and, man, just, justtelling Him, like, like, I need
you, like, like help me, and Ibegan to understand more, you
know, and then the spiritualattacks started coming, and, you
know, then I'd be praying, man,and something would throw

(01:27:32):
something at me.
You know, and I'm like, I couldkill snakes, man.
I'd get so discouraged and, youknow, we'd have church like
seven o'clock and, you know, I'mjust sitting there in the
corner, I'm just like, no,that's it, I'm done, I can't do
this no more, man.

(01:27:52):
And then my brother would comeup, he's like, man, what are you
doing, man, church has got tocome.
I'm like, bro, I can't.
Like, already?
You're quitting?
Yeah.
You don't understand.
And he's like, bro.
You don't understand what I'vebeen through.
He said, well, that's whatyou've been through, man.
Like, you weren't here just alittle while ago, man.
You know?
And he said, man, let me prayfor you, man.

(01:28:14):
All right, man.
Pray for me, you know?
And he's like, man, well, if youwant to go to church, I'll see
you there, you know?
I could tell he was sodisappointed, you know?
Yeah, and he left, and, youknow, I'd be like, sitting
there, and I'm just like Okay.
I'm going to get up and I'mgoing to go to church, you know,
but you know, at this time, mymom, she was really angry at me

(01:28:37):
for going to church.
She was, she was,

Omar (01:28:43):
she

Rudy (01:28:43):
was

Omar (01:28:44):
angry, you know, because you were going to a Christian
church.

Rudy (01:28:48):
Yeah.
My mom's never been like, I

Omar (01:28:51):
didn't

Rudy (01:28:52):
understand, you know, just like, she's like, why can't you
just, you know, do our faith.
Like, you know, like, why, whydo you have to, I was like, ah,
like, I, I would tell her, Itold her what happened to me,
you know, and she's just like,just angry.
I didn't want anything to dowith you.
Isn't that

Omar (01:29:11):
crazy, man?
When, when, uh, religion, uh,uh, I put a clip out to Julio
where religion, almost like agang, like you betrayed, but
like, I think about, man, youpreferred me being a drug
addict, drug dealing.
As long as I was a Catholic, butnow, now, now God, I have a
genuine encounter with Jesus.

(01:29:32):
My life transformed and yeah,now I'm a Christian, but it's
almost like you prefer me beinga Catholic and still being in
the lifestyle is where y'alllive when you think about it.
Like, and I know like a lot ofpeople go through that with
family members, man, but it'salmost like, uh, I think about,
um, Gideon.
Yeah.
When he called him in, uh, howhe burned, uh, the idols, his

(01:29:54):
father's idols, but he did it inthe middle of the night because
he was scared of his family.
He was scared of his dad.
And then when they woke up, allthe idols are in a man who

Rudy (01:30:01):
burned all this stuff.

Omar (01:30:03):
Like I believe God calls us to, to leave certain
traditions, religion, and justseek him and like a genuine
relationship.

Rudy (01:30:11):
Yeah.
Well, I, you know, I, I, I beganto burn, I began to burn
everything that was.
Opposite of God, you know, I, I,I, everything I, cause I had all
these books that I had boughtabout new age, um, you know,
funny, I see some of those bookswhere I work at CPS, you know,
piles and piles of them in themain office.

(01:30:32):
No way.
Yeah.
Um, but, um, man, like all thatstuff began to burn, began, I
began to, you know, like, uh, afire, you know, and, and, and
yeah, my mom was like superangry.
You know, but, you know, it was,I think it was a big difference
between like me and my brotherbecause like my brother, you

(01:30:53):
know, he, he had had He had cometo Christ and I went back come
to Christ and back back to work.
Yeah coming Christ, you know andYou know, he he was just he
would steal the food off thetable before you know Drugs and
heavy, you know drinking andjust he was just Um, and so he

(01:31:15):
would sober up and then he waslike, all about Jesus and, you
know, talk and, and hey, help mein this and that.
And the next thing you know, butI think it was different with
me, you know, because I guessthe baby of the family and, and,
you know, my mom just saw medifferent, you know, and, and my

(01:31:37):
mom could always talk to me, youknow, when she was going through
stuff, she would just like, juststart.
Yeah.
When she just continued to seethe change, you know, and then I
got baptized, um, my mom's like,I go to church, you know, um,
and, and then her, you know, shegot saved and then she got

(01:32:00):
baptized and then my grandma whowas hardcore Catholic.
I mean, she did go to church,Sunday, had the saints,
everything in her house, had thenuns come over, had the priests
come over, because my, my, mygrandfather was a doctor.
So, uh, you know, uh, she endedup coming to Christ, you know,

(01:32:28):
and she would be at church, youknow.
And I would take them when theywould come to the states because
they had their, their sugar,they were diabetic and they were
at the point where they weregoing to pass away.
You know, they couldn't see andthey were just coming and so I
would take them to the doctor.
Um, and I would haveconversations with them, you
know, taking them to the doctor,I'm telling them about Jesus,

(01:32:48):
right?
You know, and, my grandma wouldfight me, man, my grandfather,
man,

Omar (01:32:54):
whoo.

Rudy (01:32:55):
You know, um, but then, you know, it's because I had
such a radical encounter withChrist.
Like, you know, I used to be aDJ and I was promoting clubs,
but now I'm at the clubs withtracks passing out Bibles, I'm
inside the club with the ownersand talking to the DJ.
Because I still had lightsbecause I told you I had a
lighting company So I would rentout those, you know, rent out

(01:33:18):
lighting rigs for fun forparties and stuff like that And
so at these big clubs, you know,it's I'd get paid so I'd be
doing shows outside This isbefore I got saved the show is
outside I would have my lightsrented in clubs and then I was
doing parties and then I wasDJing right And sell you the

(01:33:39):
nitrous right, but now I'm savedright so so now like, you know I
go to the clubs to you know,collect my money and talk to
them and I'm just like hey guys.
I Came to Jesus Want you to knowabout Jesus?
I Can't be coming about anymoreI'll sell you my equipment.

(01:33:59):
I don't know like how you wantto do it, you know, tiny loose
ends, right?

Omar (01:34:03):
Yeah, yeah,

Rudy (01:34:04):
and you know the guys like And that's great came to Jesus,
you know, like man, I read theBible too, you know I'm talking
to him about Jesus and you know,and You know, they're like man
just just come later on tonight,you know, and you know, we'll
give you some money and Youknow, but with them you had to

(01:34:26):
wait no so I came later on anight and clubs for thousand
plus people You know, and I'm upthere at the DJ booth, you know,
uh, and I know, I know all thesepeople, right?
And they're like, Rudy, like,what's going on, man, I haven't
seen you in like, dude, Godchanged my life, man, Jesus,

(01:34:47):
man, I accepted him as mysavior, man, and man, bro, it's
love and peace and joy, bro,like, I can't even explain it,
man, you know?
He's like, hey man, hold on,hold on.
I'm about to start DJing, youknow.
And I'm like, yeah, go ahead, goahead.
And, you know, he's DJing andbeing between songs, you know.
He's like, hey, really?
You're not drinking no more?
I said, nah, dude, I don'tdrink.
Man, I'm telling you, like, youknow, my girl left me.

(01:35:10):
Dude, let me pray for you.
I'm praying for him.
He's DJing.
In the club.
You know, I pray for him and,you know, we're talking, he's
mixing again, and, and, youknow, I see these owners and,
and these people, you know,like, hey, Rudy, how's it going?
Like that, dude, came Jesus,man.

(01:35:30):
You know?
It's like, man, like, like, oh,man, that's, okay, all right,
man, you know, well, I'm, I'mhappy for you, you know, uh, and
then I look outside a nightclub,you know, like the crowd, you
know, all the lights are goingand stuff and, and.
I see this tall black lady,tall, you know, probably like

(01:35:52):
6'4 she was a little heavy, youknow, but with a pink bag, like
a pink backpack, and I'm lookingat her, and I'm like, something
tells me she's hurting, youknow.
I come down, go through themiddle of the club, everybody
start praying for her.

(01:36:16):
And she turns around and shelooks, she's sobbing.
I didn't know that, right?
I just saw her in the lights andeverything, you know, like doing
their stuff, you know, you know,and I'm like praying for her and
at this point I walked to the,to the stage of the club and the
club was called E2s and I sitthere and I start crying out to

(01:36:40):
God.
I get on my knees, I startpraying and man, I'm like, it's
a spiritual warfare.
It's a God.
I pray for them.
I pray against them.
I felt like I was grieved.
I was angry.
But there was like, I love them,you know?
And I'm praying for them, youknow?
On stage.

(01:37:01):
I come down from the club and mycar was parked across the
street.
This was actually on, onMichigan, Michigan.
And I'm sitting, I'm sitting outthere praying.
My car now, you know?
Cause that's just what I wasseeing, man, like it almost like
I was seeing demons, like I wasseeing, you know, I don't sound
crazy, man, but I'm looking, I'mlooking at this place and I'm

(01:37:23):
just like, I see people, I seepeople smile and then I see
demons, I see in their faces, Isee them in the shadows, I see
the eyes and so I walk out thatplace and I'm, you know, and
then a bunch of, uh, gypsiesstart showing up and they're
passing out.

(01:37:43):
Business cards, but they'relooking around, you know?
I'm sitting in my car and I'mlooking at them.
I was like, That's the enemyright there! You know?
That's the enemy right there!They're looking, and then they
stop and they see me.
And then they're like, staringat me.
And I'm staring at them, and I'mstarting to pray.

(01:38:04):
You know?
You know, I 828.
We just talked about that.
Roman's 828.
Second, second time.
Yeah, yeah.

Omar (01:38:16):
Okay.
So, so I know you mentioned, youknow, all these, uh, spiritual
attacks, everything that youencounter.
And it's obvious that God was,uh, like moving and reveal
himself, not only revealinghimself, but also the enemy.
Like, you know, like you wereable to discern it, but, uh, I
eventually want to get into howdid you end up like a new life?
And if you could take us throughthat transition, like, uh, how
did you end up there?

(01:38:37):
What begins to happen there?
And, uh,

Rudy (01:38:39):
yeah, yeah.
Well, just even quickly beforewe even transition.
You know when I came back thefollowing day to the club to get
paid and to close out a fightbroke out 21 people died in the
club

Omar (01:38:55):
No way, I remember that that's when they got a trampled
in the hallway.
You said that was the next noway Yeah, for anybody that
doesn't know do you want to dodo you want to share like maybe
some people are not familiarwith that Yeah, yeah

Rudy (01:39:11):
This is this club, you know, they had a lot of traffic
over a thousand people a fightbroke out.
They used mace and You know thethe owners they They had locked
the doors so that they wouldn'tget the promoters and the money
and stuff.
But then, you know, they openedthe doors and I guess people

(01:39:32):
stampeded out and they got stuckin the hallway.
You know, and over 20 peopledied.
Over 20 people died in thatplace.
I was about to walk in thatplace uh, when I felt something
put a hand on my chest.
It said, stop.
Go back.
And then the club owner calledme and he was like, Rudy, where

(01:39:53):
are you at?
And I was like, I'm in front.
I just got here.
He was like, get out.
I was like, bro, I'll take careof you tomorrow.
He's like, there's somethingreally bad happening here.
Yeah.
One of the police officers thatwould be working there actually,
uh, flatlined three times.
Yeah.
And then I saw him in new life.
No way.

(01:40:13):
Yeah, yeah, this guy that youwould not think would want
anything to do with God.
He was trying to help somepeople and he got caught in a
stampede.
Flatlined in the ambulance.
I ended up seeing him at NewLife.
You know, um, so like, um, youknow, I mean, you're asking
about how I got to New Life.

(01:40:34):
I'm at this Pentecostal churchand, you know, one thing is I
was just, just so lonely.
You know, that just now I'm,I'm, you know, I'm following God
and I'm, you know, I'm notsleeping around.
I'm not, um, you know, a lot ofthese relationships that I had
before are gone now.
And I'm, I'm just like, it justalmost seems like everybody

(01:40:56):
around me is in love and invalentines, like, you know, it
just, everybody seems so happy.
At least you're saving money.
Yeah, flowers, right?
You know, and, and, and, youknow, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm driving
to school and, and honestly,like, I just, I start crying to
God.
I'm like, I, I, I need yourhelp.
Like, I, I, you know, there waspoints in my life where, you

(01:41:19):
know, I was in relationshipsand, you know, It's very easy
just taking them to get anabortion, you know, uh, and if
anybody ever done that, youknow, it's it's it's just, you
know, when you, you pick her upor you, you know, just saw a
slobbering and the medicationand, um, man, um, but I just

(01:41:40):
felt like, man, I, I've reallymessed this up, like, I'm, I'm
going to be, you know, alone,like, Um, God would never pair
me up with somebody and, and,you know, at that church, you
know, there wasn't any girls oranything and, but it wasn't even
that, you know, just, just aslike an aspect where I, you
know, English is my, my mainlanguage,

Omar (01:42:00):
you know, and that was Spanish.
All Spanish.
So

Rudy (01:42:02):
I'm reading the, you know, and I was, I'm being invited to
a couple churches and, um,somebody had told me about New
Life.
Okay.
You know, I, I ended up like,uh, going and the moment I
walked in, it was at IIT.
The moment I walked in, man, Ifelt like my spirit just jumped,
like this was home.

(01:42:22):
This was home.
You know, like, um, man, youknow, you walk home, you walk in
the house, it's just, you justfeel it, you know, um, and, and
man, uh, uh, it is, it'sinteresting because like I would
just go to church and I startedinviting everybody I knew over
there.
Cause for some reason, like Iwould invite them to the Spanish

(01:42:42):
church, but it just.
Yeah, Spanish wasn't their firstlanguage, you know, and it was
just always a barrier, you know,and, uh, but I started inviting
to new life, you know, and, and,you know, I met my wife there,
you know, working with theyouth, you know, I was, I was
doing lighting and stuff, youknow, and that's a whole nother
story, you know, how long didyou guys

Omar (01:43:04):
know each other before you finally, uh, took the step, you
know,

Rudy (01:43:10):
um, I hadn't never, um, It was before I went to new life.
I had said, you know what, God,um, if it's your will that I
would get married, um, let meknow.
But what I'm going to do is I'mgoing to fast and I'm going to
fast until you answer me.

(01:43:31):
So I started fasting one dayafter

Omar (01:43:33):
another.
What kind of fast were you on?

Rudy (01:43:35):
Water.

Omar (01:43:36):
Just water?
I

Rudy (01:43:37):
was like, I'm going to bug God until you answer me.
What's going to happen withthis, you know, because there
was just so much anxiety, likeso much loneliness, you know,
so, you know, it's, I mean,those of you who are single, I
mean, you just, you, you know,it's, it's, it's overwhelming,
you know, and I kept and I keptand I kept and I kept and I

(01:44:03):
would not, and then one day Icame home from school and I sat
And I was praying on my knees,crying out to God, saying, Here
I am.
I'm praying.
Right?
And it's just going to continue.
You know, it's I fell asleep.
And I was at a wedding.

(01:44:25):
And in that wedding, he was atthe table, and he was telling
the person, he's like, this iswhat I was talking about.
And he's like, Rudy, you ready?
The doors opened, and it was awedding ceremony.
And I walked up.
And, there was a woman up at thefront, you know, and I went up
and I could see her in her eyeshow much she loved me, you know.

(01:44:47):
I didn't recognize her, I didn'tknow her, you know, never met
her.
And I remember as I woke up,some, you know, the words that
said, you shall have a son.
And from that moment, no moreanxiety about being single.
I was content.
Hmm.
Got on my knees.

(01:45:07):
I was like, you know, and Iwasn't even thinking about
eating cause I hadn't beeneating, you know, I wasn't
thinking about it.
Uh, you know, I went to, to, toback to school cause I had to
get books for my semester.
And I said, I'll return, youknow, afterwards.
And, and the girl at theregister was like, I don't know
why I'm going to tell you this,but you just need to eat
already.

(01:45:28):
It's done.
And Okay.
I went home, bacon and eggs, andtortillas, and started eating,
man.
You know, I was content.
It was gone.
Right, right.
You know, it's like he spoke.
I was just like, God, I'm goingto do it your way.

(01:45:50):
I know I'm going to botch it up.
Like, I've botched everythingup.
I'm going to trust you with it.
You know, I'm going to do ityour way.
So, whatever it looks like, I'mgoing to trust you with it.
And so, people came.
Girls came.
At New Life.
At school.
Believers.

(01:46:10):
Uh, this is crazy, another guyowed me money, he called me to
go to the club, uh, I met himout in front, and I want a girl
that I was always liked, nevercame into the, gave me the time
of day, you know, she's likeRudy, I've been wanting to talk
to you, I've been wanting tohook up with you, let's go out,

(01:46:32):
here's my number, come on man,come on.
For real.
Yeah.
Thanks.
I walked out.
Yeah.
Cause I knew who that was, man.
You know, it's just, and so, youknow, here I am, you know, a new
life and I'm, I'm now I'mserving, you know, I'm, I'm
helping out with tech, I'm doingall these different things and

(01:46:54):
you know, uh, you know, I see mywife, she's serving, she's, you
know, setting up the stage and,you know.
And, you know, I thought, man,that's the most beautiful girl
I've ever seen.
It's like, wow, you know?
She had like this platinumblonde hair and, you know, it's
just like, man, I was like, butI didn't see her like next

(01:47:14):
Sunday, but then I saw heragain, you know?
And I was just like, man, like,you know?
She was so thin then, you know?
She was super thin, you know?
And, um, you know, it, it, itwasn't until we started doing
some concerts with Pastor, uh,Josh that, um, that I ended up

(01:47:35):
giving her a ride to one of themeetings, you know, for the
event.
And you know, uh, I, first timeI actually got to talk to her.
And the moment we startedtalking, you know, it was, you
know, we, we, we, we connected,you know, but she was so
standoffish, you know, she wasjust like, you know, I, I was
giving her a ride.
And she's like, Look, I'm datingJesus.

(01:47:57):
Don't waste your time.
You know, okay Rude Rude, man,you know, it was just you know
But yeah, yeah, and it'sinteresting that the day we got
married and

Omar (01:48:13):
You know, how long later did you guys get married from
that time?
You guys talked a

Rudy (01:48:20):
Couple year.

Omar (01:48:21):
Okay

Rudy (01:48:22):
a couple years because You know, I, I actually, I, to be
honest, like, even though wewere connecting and things like
that, I wasn't thinking datingor anything.
I was just like, God, wouldn'tyou, you know, and she ended up
asking if I could teach her howto drive.
And I was like, yeah, I'll teachyou how to drive, you know, but

(01:48:42):
there was just something reallybeautiful about her spirit, you
know, um, and, you

Omar (01:48:48):
know.
Then I knew you were saying thatthe day you got married, you
were going to say, so

Rudy (01:48:55):
they got married.
I, I, I, I saw her at the altarand it was my dream.
She looked different, you know,she looked different.
She had changed her hair, youknow, years.
I mean, you're talking aboutwithin years, like things have
changed, you know?
And I, you know, I, I, I askedher, I asked her pastor, ASA, if
I could date her, you know, uh,asked her dad.

(01:49:19):
I was just like, I'm not playingno games, I'm doing it.
Yeah, no games with her, nogames with you Lord, you know,
if it's your will.
You know, he did a backgroundsearch on me, he was asking
about me, he pestered me, hedidn't say yes right away.
Yeah, I was like, man, I wasexpecting he was going to say
yes right away, I was like, no,no.
And her dad, you know,ultimately when I asked to marry
her, to get engaged, uh, youknow, he was like, just, I just

(01:49:42):
want her to, to graduate fromcollege.
Done.
I'll wait till she graduatesfrom college.
Yeah, I wait.
Yeah.

Omar (01:49:52):
Um, yeah, how long you guys been married now?
19 years.
90.
Wow.
19 years.
I mean, we just celebrated 20years.
But yeah, yeah,

Rudy (01:50:02):
yeah, yeah.

Omar (01:50:03):
Time time flies.
Uh,

Rudy (01:50:04):
I

Omar (01:50:05):
know you mentioned part of it and the vision to a son.
You want to talk about family.
Now, how does family look foryou right now?

Rudy (01:50:12):
You know, I had opened up a store.
Um, and uh, You know, my wife,you know, she, we moved in
together and I had a littleapartment I had fixed behind
and, uh, you know, it was alldifferent for her, you know, you
know, living, just married and abusiness and, you know, to me

(01:50:33):
that I grew up that way, youknow, around business, you know,
so, you know, um, but, you know,my first thing was like, man, I
want ready to have a son.
And to her, she was like, yeah.
No.
And one of the things that I hadtold her that I did want was
children, you know, and it'sjust God, bro.

(01:50:56):
It's just God because he likechanged her, you know, and I was
like, I'll honor you.
You know, you're not ready tohave kids, but, um, but you
know, it, it, uh, it happened.
We were like probably married.
Uh, I mean, my son just turned18.
Oh, right, yeah.
So, uh, like, within like half ayear or so, we ended up getting

(01:51:23):
pregnant and, you know, man, itwas, it was just an amazing
thing.
I know she was scared.
She was super scared and, youknow, she, you know, she
doesn't, you know, didn't reallyhave a good relationship with
her mom and, you know, couldn'treally live with her dad and
stuff.
And, um, man, like, you know, myson, man, it was, Like, it was

(01:51:46):
amazing, man, you know, justbecause God had spoken it, you
know, God has spoken it.

Omar (01:51:53):
He didn't just bless you with one, you got two.
How far apart are they, uh,

Rudy (01:51:58):
four years, four years.
So like my, my oldest justturned 18.
He graduates from high schoolthis year.
And my other one just turned 14.
He graduates from grammar schoolthis year.

Omar (01:52:06):
Right.

Rudy (01:52:07):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Pretty crazy, eh?
Yeah.
You know, so, um.
And, and, you know, it was oneof those things that, you know,
with, with my son, um, you know,there were, there was, we, we
knew early on something waswrong.
Hmm.
You know, you know, he was, hejust noises, he just would not
go to sleep.

(01:52:27):
Uh, just is is a huge struggle,you know?
Uh, as, as he got a littleolder, you know, we ended up
getting him, you know, testedbecause at uh, El Valor where
we, you know.
Like a preschool and stuff, youknow, they were like, Hey, we're
seeing some things that areproblematic, you know, so they

(01:52:48):
went and got them tested, youknow, uh, it turned out that he
had like sensory integrationdisorder, you know, just were
sensory, just didn't want totake baths, didn't things,
noises, just all, and, and, youknow, he was on the spectrum,
you know, for, uh, uh,asperger's back.
Okay.
Okay.
Like, yeah, but you know, um,yeah.

(01:53:10):
And then that was, it was hard,it was very, very hard because,
you know, um, you know, as afather, man, you, you, you want
him to, to, you have this ideaof what normal is, you know,
and, and God began anotherjourney with me with him there,

(01:53:30):
you know, uh, because, and Iwould get angry because he, you
know, he, he would, Uh, youknow, get, get, get overload,
sensory overload and things likethat.
And he would, you know, get, youknow, get really frustrated and,
you know, we couldn't really goto restaurants.
A lot of times people didn'twant to babysit him, you know,

(01:53:51):
and my mom and dad, they lovedhim.
I was just like, you know, he'smy baby, you know, and, and at
that time, you know, uh, my wifestarted going through some
postpartum and I, I realizedsome things were, you know, we
needed help.
Duh.
You know, uh, you know, as wegot married, we were in fusion,
as we got married, we got, youknow, we're in fusion.

(01:54:12):
That's how you gotta keep fixingit, right?
No, no, yeah, no.
You keep drifting, yeah.
Yeah, I get, I get comfortable,you know.
But.
No, you just, just bring it withyou.
Yeah, for real.
Yeah, for real.
That way it could be.
Yeah, yeah.
Um, and, uh, you know, uh, wewere leading fusion group, you
know, at first we started justattending the group.
Um, when we got engaged, butthen we were, you know, we were

(01:54:34):
assistants because as they said,Hey, you guys don't have no
fires going on, you know, so,uh, and then we're so thankful
for the ministry, man.
It really helped us.
So for people that don't know,fusion is what a marriage
ministry, you know, that, um,Um, you know, uh, to teach you
tools and God's design, biblicaldesign for marriage, you know,

(01:54:56):
covenant versus contract and,uh, you know, conflict
resolution and, uh, uh, youknow, just your conflict styles
and, and even, you know, um,roles in marriage and, you know,
so it's, it's very well designedto, um, you know, we were, you
know, began to lead groups, youknow.

(01:55:16):
But.
Yeah.
You know, with our son, itbecame, you know, difficult.
And so we had to get him like,you know, occupational therapy
and different things like that.
And, you know, that's kind ofled my wife to go into teaching.
You know, uh, into specialeducation teaching, you know.
That's what she's doing now,right?
Yeah, she's been doing that forlike 12 years now.

(01:55:37):
Like, you know, um, and, um, Youknow, so, so there was like a
shift, you know, because here weare leading groups.
Um, I could see that it'soverwhelming to have a business,
you know, uh, and I could see mywife is really having a hard
time, you know, uh, and so, youknow, I was trying to get as

(01:55:59):
much help as I could and, youknow.
Uh, when I could just see thatshe was just at her labor and I
was like, Hey, let me take herson and take him by my mom's
and, you know, have some timejust for you, you know, and her
mom started coming in andhelping también, you know, so,
you know, it was, it was, Irealized how much we had, how
much we were carrying, the kindof load we were carrying then,

(01:56:21):
you know, and in ministering tocouples and, you know, and then
groups 20, 30 people in a groupand God's doing things and
you're just like, you know, youwalk out of there and I could
see that my wife was, you know,just kind of like, you know, but

(01:56:42):
you know, we're, you know,faithful, you know, uh, you
know, helping.
ministering to couples and, youknow, wanted to glorify, you
know, God and give tools andsave time and try to manage the
business.
And so I decided to sell thebusiness.
And I was like, man, I have tochange some things.
Like, I can't manage.

(01:57:02):
So we ended up selling thebusiness and started helping my
family with real estate, youknow, and working with my family
then, you know.
Uh, became very difficultbecause of a lot of the past,
you know, so, you know, now I'magain, you know, almost like
reflection of being in a grocerystore with them now, or, you

(01:57:23):
know, they have a store and, um,you know, they're doing handling
real estate and, and, and man,just a lot of things began to
fall apart, you know, um, to thepoint where, you know, um, the
market crashed and went intobankruptcy, um, and, uh, um,
Fights with my brother, youknow, my dad had a stroke,

(01:57:47):
became lost, you know, um, um,functioned in the right side of
his body, you know, my mom, shewas just like only going to take
care of him, she droppedeverything, and then it's me and
my older brother, you know, andI have three brothers, and it
was just conflict after conflictafter conflict, you know, um,

(01:58:09):
You know, he struggled back intosome of his addictions and uh,
man, things just fell apart.
And I kind of fell apart.
You know, there was points whereI'd be driving around to collect
rents and man, you know, I'dshow up to collect rent and the
tenant's like, dude, are youokay?
I don't know, man.

(01:58:30):
It's like I was just thingsgetting blurry, bro.
I look at you man There'ssomething here's a coca cola and
and Advil migraine, you know,like take three of these and
drink that coke.
I Drink, I feel alright That wasmy that was my habit that's how
I was working every day bro cokeand and you know Migraine, you

(01:58:51):
know, it's just, it's just moreand more two, three, four, five,
six, seven pills, another coke,another coke, another coke, you
know, um, and, and handling thebusiness, you know, and, and as
things are falling apart,falling apart, falling apart,
you know, my wife is justoverwhelmed, you know, she's,
you know, we had bought her ownhouse, you know, and, you know,
uh, finances just fell apart andjust all the arguing and I just

(01:59:15):
came in, put the bank books andeverything to my dad and my mom
and I'm done.
Yeah.
Can't handle it.
It's over.
You know, I walked out of there.
I don't care what happens.
Yeah, and sure enough, we, youknow, property started to get
lost and, and it went intobankruptcy, you know, and, and,
um, I had the relationships withthe banks.

(01:59:35):
I knew what, you know, every, Icould have saved things, but I
was done.
You know, it's done.
I just gave them everything.
I was like, man, can't do it.
You know, and I don't know, Idon't know what I was gonna do,
you know.
Uh, so I just went into thisdownward spiral, man, and, and,
you know, you know, fightingwith my wife and, you know,

(01:59:59):
we're still like, you know, inall accounts and purposes, it
looks good.
You know, ministry, right?

Omar (02:00:07):
No, you do.
Do you want to talk about that?
Because I know like recently youshared your testimony or what
you were doing.
Like you were like, man, all inand ministry.
But I guess behind the scenesyou could say right things all
this was going on dude, so Canyou share with the with the
listeners?
What were people seeing?
I?
Guess and outside, you know,like what were you doing?

(02:00:30):
I guess I'm to compensate orwhatever but like what were
people seeing because That Imean, I didn't know what was
going on to you share recentlyman when you shared your
testimony Like man, I believe mejust like a lot of people didn't
know that you were going throughall that during that season
during those years So because Iremember so so go ahead and show
that what was going on.

(02:00:50):
Well,

Rudy (02:00:51):
you know, there was this a loss of my identity Because you
know doing real estate andbusiness and you know, you were
from the lighting and from backthen I am I you know I was
making money And my, myidentity, I figured I was going
to end my life doing realestate, you know, and, and, you
know, uh, because my parentswere doing it, I was doing it,

(02:01:12):
and now it was gone.
And I always had that connectionwhere, even though with my
family I wasn't connected and Iwas having so many problems, I
compensated with the people atchurch.
I had friendships andrelationships with them, and
there was a couple couples, youknow, that we were just really
close to.
And, um, You know it just youyou you almost like you squeeze

(02:01:32):
the balloon it just pops on thisside you know you you even
though on this side, it's it'syou're you're you're you're
holding on to that other partand You know that you know me
and my wife, you know, I mean,she was just really concerned
for me You know, I was trying tofigure out what to do, you know,
and and I you know, there was aperiod where I was just lacking
myself in the basement, youknow, and and I was just just

(02:01:56):
It's checked out, you know, evenPastor Juan.
I came one day over my wife.
Just like I'm concerned with itand he just talked with me and
you know, and you know, he left,you know, but You know, I
Started working at the churchThinks of you know, Pastor Juan
and stuff he you know gave me ajob there and you know that I

(02:02:20):
was man like humbled from likeYou know, think about it, you're
doing real estate, you're,you're doing deals and, and one
deal I made 550, 000, you know,um, I have the check, you know,
um, and I bought a brand newMercedes, 100, 000 car, you
know, white Mercedes, you know,AMG, you know, a BMW X5, you

(02:02:43):
know, and, and, but, you know,All that stuff ended up just, I
had to let go of it.
Couldn't, couldn't pay for it.
Uh, and I, you know, I was justso depressed.
Cause now I'm sitting here andall that's gone.
You know, and I'm, I have mytwo, my two sons then I think.
Yeah, my two sons and I, Idon't, what am I to do?

(02:03:04):
You know, my wife, she's bustingher butt.
You know, going, working.
Teacher.
I can tell she's overwhelmed.
You know.
And I'm just like, thank God.
So humbly.
Because here I'm at church,cleaning toilets.
You know, the, the basement'sflooding and I'm down there,
like, knee high in the water.
You know, unclogging the pumpsand, you know, um, you know, the

(02:03:32):
payer means what they could paybut you, you, you can't live off
of that.
You know, and, and naturally,man, I'm around ministry, like,
you know, I'm, I'm, and sothere's this aspect that I feel
good when I'm around ministry,I'm, I'm doing things, and then
there's this sober part of thegrand disappointment in my life,

(02:03:54):
you know, um, but still, man,I'm hardened, you know, I'm,
I'm.
I can do ministry.
I can pray for people.
I mean, God's doing amazingthings, you know, uh, and this
is what you're talking about.
You saw me doing sound and stufflike that for Ridge and yeah, I
mean, like, man, you know, youknow, uh, uh, God saving people
and, and baptizing and, and man,just, just utilizing the tools

(02:04:17):
and the walk I've had with Godand, you know, but you know, all
of this, it's covering this,this storm inside me.
You know, this, and man, each ofthose things that have happened,
you know, the bankruptcy, youknow, um, you know, that the,
all the change, the frustration,man, it's, it's triggering, you

(02:04:40):
know, because I fight with mymom, my dad, my brothers, you
know, and man, you know, and I,I want nothing to do with them.
You know, I'm, I'm like, youknow, just, just, just really
hurt, you know?
And, um, You know, I, I, I endup, uh, just, and, and it's
just, it's interesting becauseI'm, I'm at church, and there's

(02:05:02):
like, uh, a leaders, eldersmeeting, and up there, you know,
some people are being promoted,guys doing some things, right,
and I'm hearing, like, oneperson promoted, you know, never
led a group, you know, um, and Igot so angry, like, and I'm

(02:05:24):
like, Like, for real, God?
Like, I've been faithful when noone showed up, man.
You know?
Faithful, you know?
Day in, day out, man.
Someone who's, who's not, youknow?
Could say that's from God?
You know?

(02:05:46):
It just really hurt, you know?
And I, you know, remember justlike, kind of like, walking into
church and just being like,everything just looked like Just
disappointment.
And, I remember just saying toGod, like, I'm so frustrated
with this.
You know.
Um, and like, I don't even wantto be here.

(02:06:09):
You know, like, what's the pointthat You know, you work, you
toil the fields, you know, yousee things that are missing, you
see, you, you, you fill thegaps, you know, you're, man,
God, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm going,meeting people, meeting them,
going out to eat, calling them,like, man, you know, uh, raising
up people, raising up leaders,man, like, giving them vision,
you know, like, man, and I'm,and, and this, you know, and I

(02:06:35):
remember God just kind of sayingto me, you know, it's like, you
know, you, you, you, It's like,you're really angry.
It's like, if you want to seeme.
You know, moving your life, thenfollow me.

(02:06:55):
I didn't understand what thatmeant.
It's like, I thought I'd beenfollowing you, man.
But he's like, you know, like,stop complaining.
He's like, and be teachable.
And that's the thing, stopcomplaining, be teachable.

(02:07:18):
And say yes when I ask you tosay yes.
You know, and so.
I ended up applying for a jobat, uh, Well, actually through
Pastor Juan, I got a job doing,like, as a stagehand.
And I started going out, doingevents, and getting, you know,
making a little bit bettermoney.
And I got a job at Amazon.

(02:07:38):
So I'm working all these jobs.
I'm working at the church.
I'm working at Amazon.
And I'm working at thestagehand, you know?
You know?
And, um Man, just starting fromthe ground up, you know, and I
remember I told you I used towork at UPS, right?
Uh, well, at UPS, like, I was asorter, so I was getting paid
more than most people, and theyhad offered me a higher job, but

(02:08:00):
I didn't take it because Iwanted to be with my friends.
Well, here I am at Amazon,working as a sorter.

Omar (02:08:09):
You know, how many years later?
About 20 years later, or, yeah,yeah, yeah.

Rudy (02:08:13):
Back then I was like, like 20.
I was, it was my junior year, soI grad, you know, I would've
been like 21.
Gotcha.
You know, and, uh, full circle.
Hmm.
You know, and, and man, it was,it was then that God just began
to.
I began to see the, the, thewilderness,

Omar (02:08:33):
the walk where he was taking me,

Rudy (02:08:34):
you know, you

Omar (02:08:36):
know.
When he told Elijah, go, go backthe way you came, right?

Rudy (02:08:42):
Yes, yes, yes.
Go back.
You know, and it all just, and,um, you know, and, and there was
this aspect now to where, youknow, that, that, that God began
to deal with my anger, you know,he began to.
You know, speak to me about,like, because, you know, as, as

(02:09:05):
my wife started, it was goingthrough counseling and we had
this argument about finances,you know, and, and I was just
kind of like, you know what?
You have your account.
I have my account.
You know, it's like, I'm, I'mjust, I'm tired, tired of, you
know, cause she made more moneyand it just, it was humiliating

(02:09:25):
to me, you know?
It just felt like she was askingquestions, she was, you know,
this and that, and And man, itwas a big blowout.
And I was to the point where Iwas like, I was so angry.
I knew I needed help.
And at that moment I came backand, and she, I could tell, you
know, she was just like, Youknow, not knowing what to do,

(02:09:48):
right?
And, and I was just like, hey,hey, uh, where do you go for
counseling?
I was like, you know, I have toenjoy it.
It's like, send me theirinformation.
It's like you willing to docounseling, professional
counseling?
She's like, yes, yes.
She's like, I'll handle it.
Send me information.
She sent it to me.

(02:10:08):
You know, it's like one of thosemoments, you know, like I've
been telling you, you get to apoint.
Yeah.
You know, and you're just like,you feel there's a crossroad,
you know?
I thought that was a crossroads,you know?
I don't know, because I care.
Like I need to do something, youknow?
Yeah.
We started.
Filled out all the information,you know, chose the counselor,

(02:10:31):
we started going to counseling.
And that's when he startedasking me questions.
I started, like, asking me abouthow I felt about my past.
And, you know, there was anaspect about my past that I
didn't want to think about it.
You know?
It was because, man, look at allthe things I've done.
Like, I don't want to thinkabout that.
Think about People touching me.

(02:10:53):
I don't think about that stuff.
Like, a lot of it was blanks,man.
Like, I honestly don't remember.
Like, it was just blanks, youknow?
And he was just started askingquestions, like, well, what
happened here?
Like, how did you feel?
And I began to realize it wasfocusing more on me, you know,
and I started realizing.

(02:11:13):
Okay,

Omar (02:11:14):
so you start going as a couple?
Couple, yeah.
But he's focusing more, okay,okay, got it.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Rudy (02:11:18):
Because I, you see the shutdowns, you see the anger and
I'm talking about it.
And one thing I said, like, youknow, I'm going to be real, you
know, like, just, it's just, youknow, it just felt like, like, I
don't want to say I had beenlike, like, I'm going to say
like, I like, like I felt I wasmaking the best of everything.

(02:11:39):
Like I was doing the best Icould with it, you know?
And now it's like I'm just gonnabe real.
Hmm.
But I'm, I'm, I'll tell you howI really feel.
Yeah.
Okay.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
You know, that's it, you know?
Yeah.
I gotcha.
And then when it started gettinginto some emotion was start
coming, man, it was like, andthose, and those tears would dry
up all of a sudden.

(02:12:01):
And I could tell.
It tugged on something, youknow, and you

Omar (02:12:08):
mentioned the tears will come and they'll dry up.
Oh, like, like you, you felt thesense of wanting to cry and
then,

Rudy (02:12:15):
but something would come out.
Like there was something andit's, let me tell you, before I
got saved, I would, with thetanks, like I would look in the
mirror and I would start tearingup.

Omar (02:12:26):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And you will ask people, Hey,are you guys crying?
And it

Rudy (02:12:29):
would go away.
Like, it was just like, what?
And all of a sudden it wouldhappen.
And he's, he's asking me like,Well, you know, tell me about
your childhood.
You know, tell me about this,you know.
He's like, you know what, let mehave a session where it's just
me and you.
And I'm like, man.
You know.
But, you know, there was justlike this aspect where I just

(02:12:51):
felt like there was a monsterthere.
You know.
And I was kind of afraid.
That monster, you know, becauseit was times, man, that I told
you, I broke into the house.
Like it was times, man, that Iwould, I would see red, man, it
was just being like an anger atme, man.

(02:13:12):
I'd be walking around andlooking at people and, you know,
my brother would have a gun hereand I just would want to shoot
him, you know, and it scared me.
And it was like an aspect aboutthat person that.
But no one saw me that way, noone saw me that way, right?

(02:13:35):
It was just like an anger, awrath, you know?
And he was like, man, like, Iencourage you to maybe get one
on one.
And I was like, nah, man, I'mcool.
I'm cool, man, I'm cool.
I don't want to do it.
Like, you know, he's like, allright, man.
Yeah, yeah, right.
You know, but in the sessions,man, it's, it's I would see my
wife vulnerable.
I could see her like, you know,just sharing and like, man,

(02:13:58):
it's, you know, it would be liketalking about me and her.
And it was just like, I couldfeel like I had the love.
Like it was, but it was like,and it was just this moment
where we like, he asked me, he'slike, man, what are you feeling
right now?
I got up and I was like, I'm outof here.
And I went to just the bathroom,man.

(02:14:20):
Yeah.
Like nothing.
I was normal again.
Came back like, I'm ready.
Like, what's up?
He said, Hey, how are youfeeling?
I'm fine, man.
Just had to go to the bathroom.
It's all good, you know, it'sall good.
And, and, and, and God justbegan to speak to me, you know,

(02:14:41):
and, and, and as he began tolike speak to me and it had
changed, you know, as he's kindof, you know, I'm seeing all
these, you know, where I'mshutting down and where I'm
angry.
You know, and, and then therewas this, like, this question
of, you know, when you think of,like, God is holy, like, be holy
for I'm holy.
And there was always thismindset of, that meant, like, be

(02:15:02):
obedient.
Like, man, do what I tell you,like, follow the, you know,
like, it's almost like now hewas, like, saying, when I say be
holy, I'm saying be healed.
It's like, you know.
And, I began to, like, to talkabout it, you know, as he kind

(02:15:23):
of would ask me, and when hesaid, like, you know, like, what
you went through, like, youknow, like, that's how, that
wasn't right, you know, like,that had to have been, like, how
did you, it had to be painful,you know.

(02:15:45):
And it was like, I, I was back,I was normal, I was like, I
don't know, I was, you know, mybrothers, they went through
stuff, man, they got abused, andblah, blah, blah, just on and
off, you know?
But after that, man, God wouldstart speaking to me, you know,
He would start saying, you know,reminding me of what happened.
And all of a sudden, thesememories started getting
unlocked, I started rememberingthings I hadn't.

(02:16:08):
And man, that's when the, that'swhen I would just start, you
know, the waterworks would comein the car.
You know, I'm, I'm worshipingand he's just like, like, he's
like, I love you.
You know?
And we had gone through liketheophastic prayer and different
things like that, you know, butit never really, never touched

(02:16:29):
it, you know?
And I began, I began to realize,like.
That I was hiding things.
Yeah.
That I had, I had, like, closetsand things that I just was not
wanting to, you know, just,just, you know, I, I didn't want
to say they were, like, painful,but I just didn't want to deal

(02:16:51):
with it.

Omar (02:16:51):
Yeah.

Rudy (02:16:52):
Or revisit them, right?
Revisit.
You know?
And there was, like, this partwhere I just, like, I began
grieving.
Began grieving, you know?
Um.
There was this aspect where,like, God was just kinda saying
that to me, like, like you'regrieving.
There's such pain, you know,such hurt, you know, like my

(02:17:19):
innocence was taken, you know,and like I learned to protect
myself against it, you know.
And I, I would hide, I, I would,I would, like my, the way I did
it before is I would just go offto the corner, like I said, I
would stay away when they wereangry, you know, I, I, you know,
when my parents weren't there,I, I, I tried to, you know, uh,

(02:17:42):
unless they, you know, wooed mein or whatever, but, you know,
I, I just was so angry at myselffor allowing that to happen, so
angry, you know, and I hadforgiven that, like when I came
to Christ, like, I went and Imade things, I, I, I, I, it
wasn't like I, it wasn't like Ihad not gone and talked to them

(02:18:05):
about it.
You know, I, I had talked to myolder brother about it and he
was just like, Oh, I don'tremember, man.
I don't remember, you know.
Um, and you know, there was justlike this aspect of, I was like,
but God, like I made that right.
Like I forgave him, you know?

Omar (02:18:21):
Like,

Rudy (02:18:24):
like, I rebuked that fear, like, I rebuked, like, you know,
those lies, like, I come againstthem, like, what are you, what
are you doing now, like, like, Irebuked that, like, that, that,
that, you know, that, that fear,that spirit of fear, that, that,
you know, the tears, like, Irebuked that.
But this guy would just comeback, and he just wanted to talk

(02:18:48):
about it, you know, and incounseling, you know, it just
would come up, and I could seethe walls, you know, as I'm
communicating with my wife, asmy anger would come up, you
know, and, you know, I was justlike, man, why am I so angry
towards her, you know?
And he would, you know.
He call it like negativesentiment override or, or just

(02:19:10):
other things.
And he gave me a book, you know,and, and, and this is really
where it, it, the kicker, youknow, you know the, the, and I
can't even remember the name ofthe book right now, but

Omar (02:19:19):
this is the, the body keeps score all.
Hey, you mentioned me.
You had told me about book orsomething.
Not that one.

Rudy (02:19:24):
No.
Okay.
No, no, no.
Um, but in it, it talks aboutlike the importance of needing
your wife, like needing her morethan anything else, you know?
And.
I just never needed anybody.
I just Even though, I mean,obviously, I got, but like, at
the end of the day, like, youknow, I kind of winged it, you

(02:19:48):
know?
You know?
I did what he was, you know, Iwasn't really, you know, I
wasn't um, needing somebodyphysical.
You know, I could just go toGod.

Omar (02:20:00):
You

Rudy (02:20:01):
know?
And I realized that, like, thatwas Like, I was supposed to need
her, but to need her, what thatmeant, you know, I mean,
imagine, I don't know, like,like it was, it was so
overwhelming because like Ineeded a physical person in my
whole life, you know, I, Iavoided people, I like didn't

(02:20:28):
need them, like I figured itout,

Omar (02:20:29):
you know,

Rudy (02:20:30):
you know, as long as, as long as I was old enough, I
figured it out.
And, like, marriage, like, wewere one in Christ, and I was,
like, always serving and doingwhat I needed to do.
I was serving the body ofChrist, like, I didn't really
need, you know, say, the body ofChrist, or, you know, uh, I
just, I could just go to talk toGod, just me and Him.

(02:20:51):
Like, man, just, it was so deep.
I would have amazing prayertimes with Him.
You know, amazing, like, man.
But now He was, like, You gottahave relationships, you know,
but deep relationships werevulnerable relationships, you
know, and, and I can tell younow, like, even just talking
right now, there's part of methat detaches,

Omar (02:21:16):
you

Rudy (02:21:16):
know, like right now, like I could tell you, man, it's, I
could feel the work.
Like I could, like I shared, youknow, like that, that aspect of,
of, of God just, just, justsaying, like, You know, like, be
vulnerable, you know, and like,be teachable, like, allow me,

(02:21:39):
you know, and that's when Ichose to start going to like,
one on one counseling, you know,

Omar (02:21:45):
and How long did this start, the one on one?

Rudy (02:21:48):
It's been like, now I think a year, year and a half?
You know,

Omar (02:21:55):
what, what, what has been, what, what, what have you seen
now where you're at todaylooking back, what, what, what,
what has that done for youindividually and then like in
marriage and, you know,

Rudy (02:22:07):
um, You know, it's, I think the biggest thing for me
is that I began to realize that,um, I began to realize that the
very thing I didn't want to see,like, things that happened to me

(02:22:27):
as a kid.
It was the very things that Ineeded to see.
Like, like it's almost like Iwas, I was protecting that
little kid.
You know, I was his defender,you know.
And for a long time I just feltlike it was a monster.

(02:22:52):
But I, but I think I realizedthat.
You know, there was a me thatneeded to get healed, that I
needed to allow God into.
It's kind of like, you know, alittle kid in a closet with a
filthy bear, you know, withworms, and he won't let it go.
He won't get out the closet.
He won't, it keeps him content,it comforts him, you know?

(02:23:16):
And I would, and to let go ofthose things was like, like I
needed to go in there and Seeyou later.
Like, it's okay.
Like, I'm here.
Like, God's here.
Like, it's, like, Like, I loveyou.
You know?

(02:23:37):
Like, it's okay.
You know, like, we can talkabout it.
You know?
You know, and that part of methat had to protect and shield
him and be hard, I don't needhim anymore.
Thank you, but don't need

Omar (02:23:53):
you How does that feel like I don't know the word that
came to my mind is almost likeliberating like, um Well, how
would you explain how you feelnow and now now that you say
almost like I don't got toprotect them like Okay,

Rudy (02:24:07):
it's transparent, you know But it's but at the same time
like I could feel things aroundme Like I could feel people
differently now.

Omar (02:24:18):
Hmm So, more sensitive, like, to the hurts, or like, of
others?
Yeah.

Rudy (02:24:25):
Yeah.
Like, like I felt like before,even when I told you about
praying for that lady,

Omar (02:24:29):
like, I

Rudy (02:24:30):
felt like God told me that person was hurting.
Yeah.
And I feel like now, I feel it.
Like, it's like empathy.
Like, I think that before Icouldn't connect on that level.
Like, I feel bad for people.
You know, like I knew they weregoing through a hard time, like
I could maybe grieve with them.

(02:24:54):
But I couldn't connect likethat.
Like I can now.
Like I feel that now, you know?
And free is, like, doesn't,doesn't do it justice, you know?
Like, there's like transparency.

(02:25:15):
Like you can touch into the pastalmost, you know?
Like, like you could see it,like, it isn't as bad, like, not
that what happened, but like,like I'm safe there, like I feel
safe, yeah, that's part of theword,

Omar (02:25:33):
like safe,

Rudy (02:25:33):
not free, like, like safe, you know, like things aren't,
like now I can tell you like nowtrials aren't punishment, they
are like, they don't, you know,demonstrate.
And how I'm maybe not goodenough or, you know, they don't,
when things are good, they don'tvalidate me now.

(02:25:56):
Like, I think before I wouldlook validation in how I
performed, the things that Idid, you know, how I, how I, I,
you know, work through things,you know.
And I think now, like, I see itas like God teaching me, like
it's, like, Like we're walkingup a mountain, you know, uh, and

(02:26:20):
I didn't see it like thatbefore.

Omar (02:26:22):
Can I ask you something right now?
You mentioned God teaching,teaching me when you shared your
testimony, because you sharedyour testimony at church, um,
two, three weeks ago.

Rudy (02:26:30):
Yeah.

Omar (02:26:31):
You shared something about you used to view yourself and
not smart enough, like I can'tlearn or I forget exactly how
you phrased it.
But you said that through thisprocess, you went and
encountered, um.
Almost like, I believe you saidthat old tape player, I forget
exactly, but can you share that?
The way you viewed yourself,what counseling did, and then

(02:26:54):
what you're doing now, like um,schooling wise and all that.

Rudy (02:26:58):
You know, I was a terrible, at school I was a
terrible test taker, I wouldn'tdo well in my classes, like, I
wouldn't remember things, um,you could tell me something and
I'd forget it right off the bat,you know.
Um, and it just so happens that,you know, after the pandemic,
when I got furloughed and, uh, Ibegan to like, uh, help at the
church at the pantry, um, youknow, there was this, this

(02:27:22):
aspect that as I began to bemore vulnerable and trust God
and follow Him and think aboutwhat He's pointing out, you
know, things began to change,you know, um.
You know, my, my, my wife, she'sa teacher and she was just like,

(02:27:43):
Hey, why don't you like thinkabout becoming a Sika and that's
helping students withdisabilities.
Okay.
Yeah.
Uh, you know, uh, Sika, youknow, special education
classroom, uh, teacher orassistant.
You know, and I was like, man,school, no, thanks.
You know, I think I remember theseminary.

(02:28:05):
I don't want to think about it.
Uh, but, um, There was an aspectlike, uh, you know, she went,
applied for the license, youknow,

Omar (02:28:16):
on your behalf.

Rudy (02:28:17):
Yeah, on my behalf.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Got the appointment, you know,but you know, here I'm, I'm, you
know, I'm, I'm, God's reallyworking on my heart.
He's softening me, man, youknow, and then when my wife
tells me, I'm like, yeah, like,you know what?
I'll go, I'll go to theinterview, you know, um, and
it's like.
Everything just lines up, youknow, and it seemed like before

(02:28:39):
everything was just like itstarted going good, roadblock,
roadblock, bad, bad, bad, youknow, you climb a little bit
bad, down, down, down, like youget like punished, you know,
and, and that was sofrustrating.
And it just seemed likeeverything now lined up.
But almost just like when I toldyou about like pursuing God
about marriage or about like,like that all just lining up and

(02:29:05):
I'm like, okay, I'm gonna.
It's like now everything just,the moment I said, God, I'll do
it your way.
Where do you want me to go?
Yeah.
How do you want me to do it?
Yeah.
But I don't really, butwhatever, like I'll clean
toilets.
I'll go back to Amazon.
You know, embarrassing, youknow, like I'll do stagehands.

(02:29:27):
Like I'll work at this Freemanplace, you know, and I was like,
I'll go be a Sika.
Whatever, like, I'll go, youknow, and all of a sudden it's
like, they told me aboutbecoming a teacher and
something's like, do it.
And I shouldn't have ever evenbeen in that program because you
needed like a 3.

(02:29:48):
0 GPA and my GPA is like a 2.
2, at least at that university,you know, uh, it was a 0.
2.
But anyway, uh, so

Omar (02:29:58):
how did you get in there?

Rudy (02:30:01):
You know, there was, I think there was an aspect that
because of my trauma, becausethings that I went through, my
wounds, you know, I, I, I wouldquit.
I would just feel I'm not goodenough, I'm not smart enough,
I'm stupid, you know, like, um,but now it was like something
was telling me, like, like, no,ask them, write them an email.

(02:30:25):
You know?
Okay.
Like, hey, you know, this is whyI want to be a teacher, blah,
blah, blah, blah, blah, youknow, and, um, the door opened,
you know, but God's teaching menow, like, He's teaching me,
like, hey, don't give up, youknow, keep, keep following,
keep, keep going, like, just alittle, like, you know, leading

(02:30:47):
me by the hand, um, and, Youknow, I, I went into the program
and, and, and now since Ireturned to school, now that the
pandemic, granted, it's like 20years since I was in school at
the seminary, like 20 years, mytranscripts were frozen, man,
and all that stuff, you know,um, like now, man, I'm doing my,

(02:31:08):
my work and I'm finishing it,I'm in discussions, I'm, I'm
focused, I'm, you know, it'schanged, like, it's almost like
my mind now is retaining.
Yeah.
It's, it's remembering as I wasremembering the past and I was
working through things and I wasremembering, you know, and
talking to God about thosethings and, and, and, and, and,

(02:31:29):
you know, you know, just, justpouring my heart out.
Now I'm retaining.
Now it's my ability to finishwork and, you know, stay
consistent and not quit.
You know, and so, man, I gothrough the program, you know,
and, and I get my bachelor's,you know, and then I go through

(02:31:55):
another program and now myschool's paying for my master's
and part of my master's and, youknow, some loans and
scholarships and stuff.
And, and God's still like, justbe vulnerable with me, you know,
don't hide, you know, don't hidethe hurt.
If it hurts, say it hurts, youknow.
And I'm beginning to do that,you know, my sessions, I'm, I'm,

(02:32:17):
you know, instead of getting upand when I could feel that tear
crying, you know, I could, Icould feel it in my, and, and
the first thing my body, youknow, I, I, and my body's
reflecting the way I would feelbefore the anxiety I would get
before, you know, the fear Iwould get before, like, man,
I'm, I'm learning to breathe,I'm, I'm, and I, I stay there,

(02:32:38):
I'm like, yeah, this is what'shappening, this is how, and
boom, the floodgates startcoming, man.
Yeah.
You know, and a friend of mine,he wrote a book from, from work
and he gave me the pamphlet, youknow, and it was a book and I, I
start reading it and the veryfirst word that just pops out is

(02:32:58):
abandoned.
And I go to my wife and I'mlike, you know, babe, I'm
reading this book and she'slike, yeah, it's right before
we're going to work.
And you know, she's like, I saythis book and the word that
sticks out is abandoned.
And it's like.
Why?
Man, it just, it poured out.

(02:33:19):
Man, just felt abandoned by mymom.
You know, she didn't protect me.
Felt abandoned by my brothers,you know.
You know, just, you know, just,just felt abandoned.
You know, uncared, unloved.
You know, manipulated, abused,and at work just abandoned.
And I just remember God waslike, I won't abandon you.

(02:33:41):
Is this back?
You know, from that little,little birds, you know?
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
It's like, I won't abandon you.
And I just began to talk to himmore, more about it.
And that's when, man, thefloodgates would just start
coming now.
And now I'm just, I'm startingto recall, I'm starting to
remember, starting to, specificthings now.

(02:34:03):
Clear.
Before everything was just like,bullet points.
You know?
And now You know, I'm, I'mremembering times, you know,
that I would forget and I wouldfeel stupid, you know, and I
would talk to God about it, youknow.
I was afraid, you know, that Iwould hide.

(02:34:26):
You know, and I realized, likeman, like some of the reason why
I have a hard time forgetting orremembering was just because I
was always trying to forget, youknow, like a defense mechanism.
Yeah.
It was avoidant.
And my counselor is like, man,you're, you're, you're an
avoidant.
You've learned to avoid thingsto protect yourself.

(02:34:47):
I think I could agree with that.
Yeah.
And, and it was, it was my wayof defending myself, you know?
And, and, but God, man, he wasjust so persistent, you know,
uh, and, you know, he, he was,he was just, he would just
connect dots, you know, I'mdriving to work and it was

(02:35:08):
always driving to work with myworship music, you know, and,
and, and he would, he would havethings in my life that would,
that the surroundings or the,would imitate things that were
traumatic to me.
And I would get triggered, andthen he would point it out, and

(02:35:29):
then he'd connect it to thememory.
And then I'm like, you know, I'mlike, you know, and the whole
time I'm like going through myresidency, my teacher leader,
she's like watching me andeverything I'm doing, and like,
oh, you're not doing it right,but like, you know, like, why
don't you get this?
Boom.
Boom.

(02:35:49):
Boom.
Trigger and my first thing islike, I don't wanna come back
here anymore.
I don't wanna be here.
And God's like, you know, whyare you feeling that way?

Omar (02:36:04):
Hmm.

Rudy (02:36:05):
What happened?
It's, he's already connected.
Yeah.
Good.
Yeah.
You know, he's, I'm not sayingit the way, like it's just, he's
just con, it's like super, likethe supernatural.
He just, he's just connecting.
And I'm like, okay.
You know, and then I'm gettingready to go to work, all I could
feel is that fear, that goingback to the same situation, and

(02:36:27):
I don't want to do it, it justscares the hell out of me.
I'm sitting in my car, and Icould feel it again, I could,
you know, everything would getquiet, you know, my trauma, just
the sound would just drop.
You know, I'd like to hear a pindrop, you know, my breathing's,
you know, it's just like I startbreathing, you know, it's like,

(02:36:50):
you're safe.
Let's go do this.
Okay.
I'm praying.
You know, I can't even describehow he was like talking to me,
man.
Like, honestly, I can't, Ican't, you know, but he was
just, And instead of like,before, I think I would have

(02:37:11):
just avoided it, because that'swhat would have happened.
So now you're facing thingswhere normally you

Omar (02:37:16):
would.

Rudy (02:37:17):
And he's just like, follow me.
Be teachable.
Amen.
You know, like listen, lookwhat's going on around you.
You know, bless my wife, youknow, because she's like You
know, and she's so good, likeher gift is so good about
connecting the way you'refeeling.
Like she, well, one of thethings in ministry, like me and

(02:37:38):
her, we've been sitting withcouples and she could connect
the feeling right away.
She could, what the person'sfeeling, she put it in words,
and the person's like, yeah!It's her gift, you know?
And so I'm living with my wifeand she's just like, yeah, and
I'm just like, yeah.
Man, for real, just you say theword, you know, like the word

(02:38:00):
abandoned moment.
She said it.

Omar (02:38:04):
I think I, I think I shared with you too, because
that's why I asked you earlierwhen you mentioned about the,
the tears coming and drying upbecause it happened to me
recently.
Well, I think I shared with youwhat my wife told me, uh, you've
never allowed yourself to grievefor those years that you're
incarcerated.
As soon as she finished sayingit, my eyes were like welled up.
And then they dried up and like,but the same thing with my wife,

(02:38:28):
she, like, I believe God's usingher to like a point that you
mentioned those feelings andtime to, because I believe, I
believe God wants to bringhealing.
That's why I told you when, whenyou share the testimony, I
wanted you to, to, to come onthe podcast and talk about this
because I believe God wants toheal like many people, a lot of
men, my, myself included, like.

(02:38:50):
That that hardness or thatavoidance, I don't, I don't want
to think about certain things inmy past cause I'm good man.
I'm yeah, I know I survived it,man.
I'm good, but I'm not good whenit affects me and my
relationships today, you know,yeah,

Rudy (02:39:03):
yeah, yeah.
And you know, honestly, like, I,I feel this all like, I know we
were doing the furnace together,you know, and there was an
aspect to that where, you know,men are coming and, and they're,
they're, you know, asking forhelp, you know, things are going
like.
These are going bad for them,their marriages, you know, with
their kids, you know, and theirwalk and stuff like that, you

(02:39:24):
know, and I remember just beingso frustrated then and, you
know, uh, and, and because, youknow, things would get better on
the outside and then theywouldn't come back or, you know,
it was just kind of the samething over and over again.
And, and, and I was just like,man, God, like, like, you know,

(02:39:46):
what are you doing here?
Like, It helped me understandand I would pray specifically
for that, you know, and I thinkit leads to like what God's
doing now because I feel like, Ifeel like the thing now is that
a lot of times as believerswe're, we're, you know, we're,
we're casting out things or webelieve that and us being

(02:40:07):
obedient and doing the work ofGod and, and, you know, showing
up to church and praying withour families and, and, and doing
ministry, um, it validates.
That we're okay, you know, it'sit's it says like, okay God like
got a little star, you know Butwe're not working through a her

Omar (02:40:30):
no

Rudy (02:40:30):
and and we're so detached emotionally that we Can't sense
and feel people's love

Omar (02:40:37):
and

Rudy (02:40:37):
I can't you know Uh, connect with my wife and I can't
connect with God in that sensebecause that part of my life was
blocked off.
And what I would feel with God,what he would say to me is like,
I want that part of you.
It's like, I'm not worried aboutthe ministry things that you're
doing.
This is the part of you that Iwant, the part that you're

(02:40:59):
holding out, holding away fromme, that you're holding out on
me.
You think I don't see it.
You know, and you can go outthere and, you know, lead people
to the Lord and, you know, leadgroups and, you know, pray with
people and, and you're hidingthis from me.
And because you're hiding thisfrom me, you're doing it because

(02:41:20):
you're being prideful.
You know, you, you, you thinkthe things that you do, you
know, you know, are a stamp ofapproval.
They don't validate.
You know, because you're notbeing vulnerable, you know, you
know, you're, you're hiding fromme.

Omar (02:41:40):
Yeah.
You know what?
I like as I'm thinking aboutlike me or believers, you think,
man, you know, I'm, I'm, I'msaved filled with the Holy
spirit, like, and you know, he,he saved me, he's delivered me.
He's healed me.
There's no need for me to, youknow, to revisit those things,
you know, man, I'm.
But I do believe exactly whatyou're saying, like, God wants

(02:42:04):
to, like, I guess I would tie itinto sanctification, almost,
right?
Yeah,

Rudy (02:42:08):
yeah, yeah.
It's, it's, and it began tochange the way I would see
things, because before, like, Iwould say holiness or
sanctification meant that I wasset apart and I was doing the
will of God.
You know?
And, and, and now I'm viewing itnow more in the context that,
When he's sanctifying or settingyou apart, he's pulling you

(02:42:29):
apart in order to work deeper inyour heart so that you could,
you know, unveil almost liketake your masks off, you know,
now take away, you know, therewas this, this one time I was
just praying and I had thisalmost like, uh, you know, ashes

(02:42:50):
and sackcloth and, and it waskind of like, he was like, yeah,
Take that off, you know, it'sreligious because you're not
being vulnerable with me, youknow, you know, you, you, you
share as much as you're able tobecause you've learned to

(02:43:13):
protect yourself and you'veprotected yourself for me too.
And he's like, I'm, I'm, I'mgoing to pursue you, you know?
Like, and, and I understand nowwhen I look at it in the long
picture, I understand what hewas doing.
Cause I think back then, I, hebegan to do that early in my

(02:43:34):
walk, but I started doing works.
I got so consumed because backthen I would sit on my knees and
I would cry out.
I would tell him what hurt, Iwould tell him I could, I was
afraid I needed him.
You know, but then I shiftedinto, man, just, hey, let's go
do this brother party, you know,like, not parties, but like

(02:43:56):
picnics and templos evangelismo,and then you see other people
hurling and you're praying forthem, and it's almost like you
become distant.
You, you, you, you know, andwhen I would start going through
things, that's when I would,things I didn't understand,
that's when I would come back.
And I was like, yeah, I don'tunderstand, like, like, and I
think as he allowed things tofall apart for me, so that then

(02:44:19):
I didn't know what to do, right?
Like, because I'm like, okay,yeah, I'm doing ministry, like,
but I'm not even understandingwhat you're doing here, you
know?
But I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I couldfeel you, I could see you do
things, but I feel likesomething, you know, I, I
couldn't understand it then, butI understand it now.

(02:44:40):
Like, almost like the coldness,like I was cold in areas, you
know?
And, and now I understand itmore, you know?
And I, and I feel like there wasthat shift.
You know, as you do better, youknow, your, your, your gifts,
you start using your gifts andstuff like that and, and, and,
and you are spending time with,I mean, I ran up into that

(02:45:02):
furnace, man, I was at night,wake me up one, two, three, but
I'm on my knees crying to him.
It's like, I'm wondering likenow, like what happened?
And I realized now that I wasprotecting myself.
I would let him only so far.
Because I didn't know how elseto do it.
And he was, he was working.

(02:45:25):
He was, he was allowingsituations to simulate things
that would trigger me.
And it would force me to have tosee things different, you know.
But back then I would get angryat him.
Because I would say like, man, Idon't have your favor.
That person has favor.
So I would, I think, I wouldshift it.
The enemy would shift it, youknow.

(02:45:46):
And, and then he'd have to bringme back, you know, like, like,
yeah, I'm not doing this to hurtyou, but you, you've closed this
off and locked it away.
I have to almost, I'm not goingto talk for him, but I have to
almost simulate something, youknow, that, that represents your

(02:46:07):
trauma and then you gettriggered and now you're angry.
And now I can.
Touch things because things arebroken inside.
They're not hardened, they'rebroken, you know.
Even my dad when he passed,like, it broke things.
And I think that was the startof when he really began to go
deep.
When my dad passed, you know,because there was a lot of anger

(02:46:32):
there, you know.
And, and, you know, I couldn'teven grieve.
Like, the whole time, like, Iburied him, I didn't cry.
Like, you know, and not that I,I, I love them, I miss them.
I would see them places, like I,I, I was free, but man, it's
like, and that's when Ihonestly, like if you want to

(02:46:54):
like the real trigger to thewhole thing was the passing of
my dad.
It's when it really shatteredsomething deep in me, you know,
and I, I knew, man, something'swrong with me, you know, I'm not
mourning, like, like I'm okay.
You know, and, and I heard, Iheard someone say like, like,

(02:47:15):
man, how would you feel if yourmom passed away right now, you
know, like that's emotion,that's, and I was like, I
wouldn't, I'd be okay.
There's detachment.
I had, I had, you know, I had,you know, really, you know, just
boxed that, you know, and I feelGod in his kindness.

(02:47:41):
You know, he would not let mecontinue, you know, and, and so
as I struggled more and morewith like ministry stuff and
with family and, you know, I gotinto arguments with like my
brother and my mom about aproperty and, you know, and, and
it was just like, it was justbringing all of that out, you

(02:48:01):
know, and, and God was justconsistently, you know, because
after I realized how angry Iwas, you know, he, he would
like, you know, You know, itwas, he would just begin to
speak to me and he's like, man,like, where's that hurt?
Like, it's like, that's hurt,that's deep hurt, you know?

(02:48:23):
And so, you know, I, I, like, I,like, I would just say what I
see he's doing now is I feellike his, his, his wanting to
move in the hearts of men andbring true healing, holiness,
you know?
You know?
So that.
You know, not only are they, arethey, you know, free, but

(02:48:46):
they're safe and they could seeGod in a different light, you
know, they can cry, you know,they can, they can truly be
vulnerable.
They could truly be transparent.
I think before I wasn'ttransparent, you know, I was as
transparent as I could be.
And it's acceptable by people,you know, I mean, you know, I
mean, that's the way they, Idon't want to say that's the

(02:49:06):
way, like, that's the way itfunctions, right?
Like, like, man, you're doinggood because you know,

Omar (02:49:12):
I'll go think about I'll give you just enough so you can
leave me alone.
Like, you know what I'm saying?
Like, yeah, you wantvulnerability out here.
So I'm vulnerable.
And is that good enough?
All right, I'm good.
I guess you know what I'msaying?
But God, he doesn't want that.
He wants the dimension wants togo deep.
Like, yeah,

Rudy (02:49:31):
yeah.
Like even, you know, this, thismeeting that we had earlier, you
know, uh, You know, we'retalking about our souls, and,
and, you know, when I shared,you know, when I got home, there
was, I could feel like Godsaying, I'm on a treadmill,
right?
And I could feel God say, like,uh, you weren't transparent.
That's not how you were feeling.

(02:49:55):
And I was like, you're right.
Like, I'm feeling afraid.
I have some big assignmentscoming up because I'm going now
for my, my PhD and, and, and,you know, type 75 and

Omar (02:50:06):
I have, can I ask you real quick, uh, how long has it been
from the, um, you got yourbachelor's till now?
How many years?
Uh, so

Rudy (02:50:13):
this is the crazy part, the pandemic happened in 2020
pretty much everything shutdown.
Um, I, I started working for Cfor CPS in, in, in August of
2020.
So now it's 2025.
And up until that happened, Ididn't have an associate.
So in four years, I got mybachelor's, my master's, and I'm

(02:50:38):
a semester into my PhD.
Wow.
Amen.
People at my work, they'retripped out.
They're like, man, you were outhere doing the parking lot with
us, you know, as an assistant.
Numb walking in with teachersand you know, man, like, it,

(02:51:00):
it's, it's, and, and, and Iwould say this is like, one
thing I've learning is thatthere's like, key, you know that
until you're willing to use thekey to, to allow that key to
open things, other things don'thappen.
You know, and you're locked,you're.

(02:51:22):
You're like, like Elijahrunning, you know, you know, I
mean, you think about that,right?
You think about Elijah, I mean,the guy does the battle of the
prophets, fire comes down, man,just gotta raise people from
dead and whatnot, you know, anda letter from Jezebel makes him

(02:51:43):
go berserk.
And you gotta, you gotta wonderhow that triggered him.
Yeah, because you think aboutElijah, it's his mom who dropped
him off when he was little.
Was it?
Yeah.
Remember, he was, he was givento, to, to serve God.
So, so, you know, there's thataspect to, you know, you, you

(02:52:07):
think there's those connections,you know, there's those
connections, you know, that, youknow, there, there's those
things that trigger you anduntil once, once it's, it keys
in.
You know, you know, once you,you do what's supposed to, you
know, you, the doors open, youknow, and until then you're like
wondering, you know,

Omar (02:52:31):
man, well, what would you say, man, thank you for sharing
that, like, what would you sayto, I know you mentioned the
key, like having that keyturning it, what would you say
to somebody to, to a man orwoman that's going to be hearing
your story?
What's the first step?
I know, I'm sure there's plentyof steps, but what's one, one of
the first or second things thatthey could do, like, to get on

(02:52:55):
that journey of healing?
What would you say, like?
You

Rudy (02:52:59):
know, I think the biggest thing is to be teachable and to
trust God to lead you, you know?
Um, I think a lot of times,like, there's a way that we want
it.
You know, there's, there'sthings that we don't want to
approach, there's things that wedon't want to talk about, and a

(02:53:22):
lot of those times, a lot ofthose things are rooted in
shame.
A lot of things are rooted in,you know, in, in, in hurt.
And so we view a lot of times,the hard times, things that are
happening around you as likedisapproval.
And I think that was the firstshift, is like, instead of
looking at things asdisapproval, God's disapproval.

(02:53:44):
Looking at it, it's like, man,this is where God wants me to
be.
There's things he wants me topay attention to.
Things he wants me to look outfor.
Because this is teachable.
And I think I didn't do thatbefore.
You know, a lot of times Ifunctioned without thinking.
You know?
It was almost like, door's open,I walk through it.

(02:54:05):
You know?
Somebody asks you to do this,you do that.
Or you see something, you'repraying and you want, you know.
And, and instead of like,wanting God to use you, you,
like, God doesn't use people,you know, doesn't, you know, he
doesn't, he works through you,you know, you're, you're not

(02:54:27):
something, he values you so muchthat he's, you know, you're not
means to an end, you know, youknow, he, he wants to work
through you and have you walkwith him in the process.
You know, and before I wanted tobe used because it made me feel
like I had value.

(02:54:49):
And what to tell people, it'slike, God wants to work through
you and the struggles thatyou're in right now are actually
designed, right, to bring youcloser to God.
They're beautiful moments thatyou can, you can see things that
he wants to point out.
And how you're responding, howyou're feeling, how you're being

(02:55:11):
triggered, how, how your woundsare, you know, and, and, and
because that's where, that'swhere the pathway to your
healing is.
And I think a lot of times we,we, we feel like, man, you know,
the devil, he like, he gets us,you know, and, but that's his
biggest mistake because when thedevil shipwrecks us, that's the
exact way, pathway to ourhealing.

(02:55:32):
He actually leads us.
So the very, the very thing heused to shipwreck you, whether
it was your lust, whether it wasyour, you know, pride, whether,
you know, it was, you know, yourdesires or whatever it was, you
know, that's actually thedoorway because that's, that
unlocks the very triggers thatunlocks.

(02:55:53):
You know, the very things that,that hold you back, that you've,
you've locked, you've, you'vechanged yourself to, you know,
that you, you didn't want to seeanymore that you're like, ah,
you know, and I think that'swhen the breakthrough and that's
when healing, that's when youstart seeing amazing things, you
know, um, and, and now likethings, other things, they just

(02:56:15):
don't look the same.
You know, now it's like, God, Iwant to be vulnerable with you,
you know, it doesn't, you know,make me feel like silly or, or
stupid,

Omar (02:56:28):
you know, or, or weak or weak, you know, a lot of men,
you know, look at it, right.
Like counseling, opening upsharing emotion

Rudy (02:56:39):
because a lot of times people come in, they're like
praying, especially, you know,you're praying and they're like,
Oh man, like I want my wifeback.
Yeah, it's like.
Like, man, you just want God tovalidate the way you've been
living, the way you've beentreating her, you know, put a
stamp of approval and changeher.
You don't want to change, youknow, you don't want to go deep

(02:56:59):
into why you're behaving the wayyou're behaving, why you
mistreat her, why that fearcomes up and you act in anger
because a lot of times I hopethat's how I respond, you know,
um, and God's not gonna validatethat.
I mean, he's not going to say,cause he, You know, he's he's
looking to to bring healing.
He's looking to have you repentand turn from your ways You know

(02:57:23):
and follow him,

Omar (02:57:25):
you know and and that And, and I think that's where it's
like, God, I'm not, I'm, I'm,I'm, I'm turning, I'll do things
differently.
And I started taking care of myhealth and I started eating
better and, and running on thattreadmill and, and, and saying,
man, like, like I'm gonna stopquitting.
I'm going to grab things thatare really difficult, like
running on a treadmill, I haterunning like 10 seconds in, I'm

(02:57:47):
like, ah, I'm going to go eat.
And I'm like, no, everything inmy mind is like.
No, stop.
I'm like, no, I'm going to keepwalking and keep running.
And I started realizing barriersin my thinking, barriers and all
these things, and God is justusing all these things to show,
you know, where I used to quit,where I used to, you know, where
I used to just, it was easy, you

Rudy (02:58:08):
know, but yeah, that's what it just, just feel like,
man.
Like, that, that turning, youknow, it sounds like very, you
know, we say this, Christians,like, it's repentance, you know,
but it's this aspect of, like,God, like, I'll go to the hard
places.
Like, I'll trust you with myheart, not, not just like your,
your, your, you know, your, yourdesires and your hopes and the

(02:58:31):
way you see yourself and blah,blah, blah, but I'll trust you
with, with every part of it.
And, and I, and.
And I'll talk about it, like a,like you're talking about things
like going to prison and thingslike, and that, that things are
taken and there's a real griefthere.
There's, there's real fearthere.
There's real, you know, walkinginto that place, right?

(02:58:51):
I never like been in prison, butlike I've been in situations
where, you know, you, you're,you're

Omar (02:58:57):
terrified.
That's, that's what, uh, as I'vebeen doing this, a common theme,
obviously you, you, you're notgoing to show that you're
scared.
But every man that I've talkedto that's been in there, man,
yeah, I was scared, you know, Ididn't tell nobody back then.
Well, yeah, it's like me.
I went in there a hundred andtwenty seven pounds, you know,
like a little little twig goingin there like man, obviously

(02:59:20):
like Yeah, there's this fear,you know, and and I'm glad that
these guys Are vulnerable goingback to vulnerable enough to
share that.
Hey, man, man, I was scared Youknow, I don't know what's gonna
happen to me.
I don't know what goes on inthere.
And yeah, it just, it'sdefinitely a real feeling, you
know?
Yeah.
That, that you suppress.
Yeah.
So that's the other bad thingtoo, though, you know?

(02:59:40):
Man, I ain't gonna feel no fear.
So you gonna, I, I love what yousaid right now, how anger is
rooted in fear.
Yeah.
So what do you do in order notto show that fear?
You're gonna put on this bra abravado, right?
Yeah.
Or this anger, like, man.

Rudy (02:59:55):
Yeah.
And you begin to avoid or youdetach, you know, emotionally,
you know, and, and like, Ihonestly, like my marriage now,
like it's a different world.
Like, I thought before, like,honestly, I thought before we
had an amazing marriage.
Like, honestly, like, we haveproblems, but, like the intimacy

(03:00:17):
with her, things we could talkabout.

Omar (03:00:20):
Yeah.

Rudy (03:00:20):
Yeah.
Like, the things I could share,you know, and, and like, I can
feel like she sees me.
Like, I feel like I see herdifferently, you know, you know,
like we're one, you know, likewe're dancing together, like,
like a waltz, you know, it'snever like that, you know, like,

(03:00:42):
you know, I don't know that I'veseen it, like the things that
I'm not saying better or worse,like, like, I've not seen this,
you know.
I'm not, I'm not seeing it, andso it's, it's caused me to be
very wary of, of just even the,I pour my time into, you know,
and, and because like, man, itjust, I, I realized I have so
much pride.
There was so many things I was,I was, you know, my, my heart in

(03:01:07):
it, you know, what it was, youknow, and, and, and obviously I
love the Lord and, and my heartwas to, to tell people about the
goodness, what He had done in mylife, you know.
But it, it become like just, youknow, a detached like messenger,
you know, like God wanted to godeeper, you know, and I, I would

(03:01:30):
fight him,

Omar (03:01:33):
but now you're, you're, uh, reaping the fruit of it,
man.
Like, you know where you're at,you know, your marriage, like
it's beautiful to see man, likethe joy in you and your wife,
you know, like you, like you,you.
You could visually see it, youknow, and like,

Rudy (03:01:52):
but,

Omar (03:01:52):
but also

Rudy (03:01:52):
see the triggers, like I would walk in church.
I don't know if you would seeit.
Like I would walk in church andI would feel like, like before I
would use my charisma realeasily.
I'm like, Hey, what's up?
But all of a sudden I waswalking in there and I was like,
I was feeling detached.
I wasn't talking to peoplebecause things that were coming
out was triggering me, but Iwas, I was accepting it.

(03:02:14):
I was trying to, I was, I was, Iwas not hiding it anymore.
I wasn't, I can easily go to youand be like, what's up bro, how
you doing?
But man, I was, I was like hurt.
Like I was, these things werecoming out.
I was, I was, I was, you know,and, and now I had to process
it.
You don't want to come up.
I've heard like with you andseen God do things with you and

(03:02:37):
and then I'd be hurt You knowbecause I wasn't to tech anymore
and I see other and and and allthese different hurts are coming
up and now I mean I'm feelingand I told you like I even
wanted to leave the church youknow and go to a different
church and and and it was justlike almost like when I told you
like You know when I was doingthose tanks and stuff and I was
gonna go to you know, WisconsinSo yeah, and it was just that

(03:03:00):
again Full circle, just leave,just go to another place.
And I'm telling you, I was thereand the preacher was like, I
don't know who this person is,but you don't belong here.
This is not, you should not behere.
It's like, you're like a treethat's planted and your roots
are deep and when you get pulledout you would destroy everything
around you.

(03:03:22):
And I had just finished praying.
Like, God, is this the church?
Is this what you want?
Tell me.
I'm listening.
And so like now I'm having toface, you know, and I'm, I'm
sitting there and these feelingsare coming out.
And my first reaction is nah,man, you know, I'm not going to

(03:03:43):
deal with that.
Like, because I'm good attalking with people, you know,
this is so cars, you know, soreal estate, you know, you know,
it's worked at a store, youknow, no one to sell things, you
know, but I'm not doing thatanymore.
I'm not, you know, and if I feela certain way, I feel that way,

(03:04:04):
I'm going to feel it.
I'm trying to, at least, I don'thave it together, man, I'm just,
I'm just, I'm just, I'm justtrying.
I'm just, I'm listening.
I'm just following him.
And sometimes they don't makeno, like feelings come out and
I'm just like, Oh, you know, youknow?
Oh, and, um.

(03:04:26):
You

Omar (03:04:26):
know, I'm just processing it.
Hey man, hey man, you're on thejourney, you know.
Yeah.
Man, it's, I think I shared withyou too, that I had told my
wife, like, man, I, I, causeshe's, that's something that
she's brought up aboutcounseling, you know, like.
Yeah.
So that's something that I'veheard and, uh, from the last
few, not, not just a fewpodcasts, like even beforehand,

(03:04:47):
it's been coming up, guysmentioning how, uh, how it's
benefited them, how it's helpedthem.
process, heal, you know,themselves, so, and benefit the
relationships that they're in.
So it's definitely somethingthat definitely if you're
watching and listening to thestory, you should definitely
consider doing that.
Yeah.
Christian counseling.
Yeah.

Rudy (03:05:04):
You know, one of the things with my counselor, first
thing we do is we pray.
Amen.
Yeah.
It's the first thing we do, youknow, and, and at first I
wasn't, at first I would come inand come in hot, you know, and I
just, something was like, man,why aren't you praying?

Omar (03:05:21):
Going off praying, man.
Before we started, you asked me,what was the longest interview?
I think I told you, yeah, it waslike 220, 230.
We're like at three hours, man.
But anyways, Rudy, man, anyfinal word?
And then if you want to close usout in prayer.
Any, you know, anything thatcomes to mind?

Rudy (03:05:41):
I think just, I think it's going to be okay.
Like, I think everything has apurpose.
And our God is good, He'sfaithful, you know, I think
sometimes we get confusedbecause of the pain that we've
been through.
It's a hard place to go, a hardplace to trust anybody, but

(03:06:03):
you've got to start trusting Himand, you know, allowing Him to
prune you, you know, so that youcan bear fruit, you know.
And, and that's just myencouragement, you know, my
encouragement is to.
A lot.
My encouragement, dude, I'msorry.
You know, my, my encouragementis to allow him to, to, to peel

(03:06:26):
you like an onion, you know,and, and to, and to ask, you
know, the, the tough things, youknow, when you, when you see
those crossroads, man, let, letthem lead you, you know, I don't
know what it looks like fordifferent people.
It's always looks different.

Omar (03:06:40):
Right.

Rudy (03:06:41):
You know, uh, but for me, man, it's, it's been that, like,
like, I get so frustrated andthere's a crossroads and it's
just like, okay, God, how, how,how do you want to do this?
Like, I don't know how.
And I think that's when yourpride goes out the window.
Can you, you can't handle anissue or something that you
could finally, God can finallyspeak to you, you know?

(03:07:02):
But, yeah, man, with that,let's, let's pray.
Amen, amen.
Let's pray.
Father God, we come before youin the mighty name of Jesus,
through the power of your HolySpirit, Father.
Father, I know there's so manypeople that are hurting, Lord.
So many men, Lord, that are goodat just smiling.
So many men that are good at,Father, just, just, Father,

(03:07:26):
making other people laugh andmaking it sound like it's all
good, Lord.
And yet they're hurting, yetthey're suffering in silence,
Lord.
Yet, Father, they're holdingback from you.
They're, they're, they'reThey're not wanting, Father, to,
to allow you into that deep partof their heart, Lord.
And I pray right now, FatherGod, that, um, Father, that they
would know that you're tuggingat their heart, that you're

(03:07:46):
wanting to heal them.
You're wanting to touch them,Lord.
You're wanting, uh, Father, to,to unveil them, Father, to sit
with them, Lord, and, and sothey could feel your love, so
they could feel your goodness,Lord.
And I know it's hard.
But I'm just praying that youwould follow him and and I know

(03:08:06):
the Holy Spirit will lead youThere would be a breakthrough
that there would be deep healingLord I'm just I'm praying that
for them and I'm just continueto pray that for myself and even
my brother Omar here And I justthank you right now in the
mighty name of Jesus Amen,

Omar (03:08:22):
amen, man.
Thank you brother for coming onhere and sharing your Journey
and Yeah, definitely.
And sounds like definitelyyou're still going through it,
you know, you're still workingand man, that's, that's
encouraging, you know, like, uh,for, for me to hear, like I
said, when, when I heard youshare your testimony, like
that's a theme that's beencoming up recently, like
healing, like I believe God,God, God wants to, like, heal

(03:08:44):
me, heal others.
And it's, it's definitelysomething that I, that I'm
sensing.
I guess that's why I, I know,and I knew we needed to have
this.
Yeah.
And I know this conversation'sgonna bless many and God
willing, it'll give them that,uh.
That courage to, uh, maybe turnthat key of counseling or
whatever it is, or maybe thefirst step is coming to coming

(03:09:04):
to God.
Yeah.
Maybe they don't have arelationship with God.
You know, maybe it's come likeyou, like you crying out to God,
to Jesus, you know, when yourbrother led you in that, uh,
prayer to make Jesus Christ,I'll say that's the first step,
man.
If you don't have a relationshipwith God, start there, call out
to Jesus, ask him to become Lordand savior of your life.
you know, just confess, you knowthat you're a sinner in need of

(03:09:26):
a savior.
And I say, you know, the, the,the Lord Jesus to, to fill you,
to basically take the, the, theseed and the throne of your
heart.
You know?
Mm, no, no, no, no longer let itbe you.
I think you mentioned like, man,I, I'm, I'm my own, my own God,
right?
Like, nah.
Yeah.
We can be this is only one Godand we gotta allow him to be God
in our lives, right?
Yeah, you got nothing.

(03:09:47):
No, but uh, thank you.
Thank you for being out here.
Thank you for sharing your storyAnd with that we're gonna wrap
up Matthew 4 16 reads The peoplewho sat in darkness have seen a
great light and upon those whosat in the region and shadow of
death Light has dawned alongsidemy brother rudy soto.
I'm your host omar calvillo andwe are wrong too strong

(03:10:11):
Hey! Hey! Hey! Hey!

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"Brave Enough to Heal" - When Men Get Real About Their Trauma w/ Rudy Soto

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}"Brave Enough to Heal" - When Men Get Real About Their Trauma w/ Rudy Soto