"Ripple Effect: The Battle from Violence to Victory" w/ Mike Petrovic

Episode Transcript
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(00:02):
Um, Uh, Uh,

Omar (00:15):
hello everyone.
And welcome to another episodeof wrong to strong Chicago.
I'm your host.
My name is Omar Calvillo.
And tonight I have my guests,Michael Petrovic, uh, and we're
out here at restoration house.
I tried to write it on the boardover here.
But it's called a restorationhouse out here in Gary, Indiana.
So this is barely my secondpodcast.

(00:36):
I like to call it on the road,you know?
So this is wrong to strongChicago on the road.
Uh, so the reason I'm here is,uh, through, through a brother.
Uh, I met this brother back in,uh, 2008 his name is, uh, Daniel
Rivera.
Uh, so back then I was comingout to church out here in East
Chicago, Indiana.
Uh, brother Daniel had was justrecently released from prison

(00:56):
back then.
Uh, we connected, we met there,talked in church, and uh, years
later, I reconnected once again,I don't know how many years that
is.
Uh, but he reached out to meprobably about a month and a
half ago.
He told me what he's doing outhere.
They're out out here.
Maybe I'll let the brother, youknow, share a little bit of
what's going on here, butthey're all helping the
community, helping men, uh,restore their lives.

(01:19):
You know, like we were talkingabout earlier, you know, from
the inside out and letting Goddo the work.
Uh, but they're out here doing agreat work.
So I drove all the way out here,you know, from Chicago, our
drive out here.
And, uh, man, I'm excited to behere.
I'm excited to get my brother'stestimony out there.
Uh, I know he's excited to shareit.
So man, Hey, welcome to thepodcast, brother.

Mike (01:37):
Thank you, my brother.

Omar (01:38):
You want to share a little bit of what exactly like happens
here?
You know, at this place,

Mike (01:42):
Okay.
At the restoration house, it isa, um, it's a home.
It's a, it's a program.
It's a program.
It's not a shelter.
It's not a place where it's, itis for people That's a halfway
house or anything like that.
It's a program that is designedto direct you to Jesus Christ.
It's filled with the HolySpirit.

(02:03):
God is, has his hand on thisplace.
Um, he protects it.
He guides it.
He, he, Keeps the goodindividuals coming here, um, to
serve.
We serve the community we, uh,so any type of identity that we
may have on the streets thatgets broken down by holding

(02:24):
signs out here, serving thecommunity free lunch, and that
gives, that gives us anopportunity to really, to give
back because that's what Jesusis all about.
He's about giving, he's aboutserving.
And, and that's what thisprogram does.
This program allows men.
To foc, to, to focus and restorereform themselves.

(02:47):
Let God work through them toreform them into productive
members of society.
Be to become the fathers thatthey were, didn't know how to
be, to be free of drugaddiction, to be free of gang
life, to have a direction, tohave focus, to.
Um.
Serve to, to be disciples ofJesus Christ.

Omar (03:10):
Christ.
Amen.
Amen, brother.
Thanks for that.
And, uh, eventually we're goingto share how you ended up here.
You know how you got here.
We, we, we got a story to tell,but man, we, we like to start at
the beginning.
Uh, so if you could tell us,man, well, where did you grow up
at?
You know, maybe you moved aroundfrom place to place, but like
maybe your early years, where,you know, you could remember a
place and if you can name that,uh, city, that community.

(03:31):
And if you could describe it forthe people that they've never
been there, you know

Mike (03:35):
Okay, um, I was born November 1st, 1974 in Berwyn.
Um, that, that relationship, howmy mother and father came
together, that was, that was abad experience.
And, uh, My mother ended up,long story short, my mother
ended up living in an abandonedhouse in, in 55th and Claremont

(03:56):
in South Chicago.
And she was stealing baby foodwhile pregnant with my sister,
just to feed us.
So, uh, a friend introduced herto, uh, my stepfather.
Which, um, was the worstalcoholic and drug addict and
violent individual.

(04:17):
That you would care to know orbe around.
And, um, my mom was kind offorced into that situation just
to get us off the, off thestreets, out of the abandoned
house.
And, um, that was, that was astart of a very hard, long

(04:38):
grooming process to be a violentperson that I ended up becoming.

Omar (04:43):
You, you, you want to, um, man, I know that that's rough,
but, uh, it's tough becauseeither being in an abandoned
home or go stay with thisindividual is like choosing
between like wrong and wrong.
I had a brother was on there.
It's not between the rightchoice and the wrong choice.
It's like, but it's a littlebetter, man.
So I don't know how much of thatexperience you want to share.

(05:05):
Some of the things that werehappening at home that maybe,
uh, affected you, you

Mike (05:08):
It's very important because, um, my stepfather He
came home drunk every night, hedestroyed the house every single
night, he beat my mom, he wouldeven beat the dogs.
And that happened every singlenight.
So, that was, there was extremefear, extreme display of

(05:31):
violence.
Led to the police called andthen a lady officer coming and
consoling.
So that became a custom thingevery night.
So it went from fear.
To comfort, to, to attentionfrom a nice lady police officer.
So, as a child in thatdeveloping stage, I synapsed the

(05:55):
two together.
Like, it went from fear tocomfort, fear to comfort, but
stemming from violence.
So I learned how to use violencein everything.
How to, how to use it when Ineeded attention, when I needed
comfort, when I needed to speak,when I needed friends, when I
needed people to be, uh, uh,boundaries set up and walls put

(06:18):
up because I started, I starteddisplaying violence very early
at school.
And, and I used violence ingetting up in the middle of the
class and beating some kid Forno reason, but I knew that no
one would want to be my friend.
No one would want to come overto the house.
No one would want to hang out.

(06:40):
So that was kind of protecting,keeping the home life secret.

Omar (06:45):
you.
You don't want nobody to seewhat was going on or even maybe
maybe how the home looked

Mike (06:51):
Right.
So I used violence as a socialmechanism in every way.
Okay, what ended up happeningwith that is that reputation
built.
Okay, and then there was timeswhen the reputation builds like
that.
There was times when you don'twant to do violence, but because

(07:11):
you have that reputation, youhave to kind of feel like you
have to live up to that.

Omar (07:15):
like you have to live up to it.
I

Mike (07:22):
I was stuck.
I was stuck in that.
This is a very significant pointI'm going to bring up, um, My
stepdad used to have friendscome over and they used to party
and do drugs.
One night, uh, My sister wasmolested when she was still in

(07:47):
diapers.
And, uh, old were you at thetime?
We

Omar (07:56):
old were you at the time?

Mike (07:59):
young.
And, um, I can't remember theage.
It was, she was still indiapers.
She's got cystic fibrosis.
So, the bed wetting kind of wenton until later stages, but
wasn't too old.
We were still young.
And, uh, I remember yelling outto my mom, and she kind of just,

(08:24):
she was so mad about my, my, mystepdad having, um, friends over
partying, she kind of ignored.
So my sister was, uh, cryingout, like, can I sleep in your
bed?
And I was like, no, no, becausethat wasn't the right thing to
do.
And after that, the violencejust kept on getting more, you

(08:49):
know, I kept on lashing out,just beating people, beating
people and, uh, I remember oneday, matter of fact, the guy
never got caught.
My stepdad got into a car, triedto run him off the road.
He never got caught.
So,

Omar (09:06):
So did your stepdad find out about this?

Mike (09:09):
this?
Yeah, they knew because whenthey hurried up, when they heard
me and my sister screaming formy mom, they kind of scurried
out the door and took off in thecar.
And my stepdad They came inbecause we kept screaming for my
mom and my dad and he tried torun them off the road and he

(09:29):
never got up to them.
But here's, here's, here's whathappened.
I remember one day I was cuttinga lawn and um, I said, God, give
me the, give me the powers of avampire so I can never let no
one hurt my sister or my familyagain.

(09:50):
I can stop my stepdad, I can, Ican have the strength to do
that.
So I sat there and nothinghappened.
Okay, so I'm just a kid pushingthe lawnmower, cutting the

Omar (10:03):
How old are you around this time?
Like

Mike (10:06):
About 8, 10ish.
Around there.
And, uh, man, I remember at thatmoment, this is, this is a, this
is a point in my life, I said,okay, Satan, give me the powers
of a vampire.
And I, and I, and I promise Iwill, I will serve you.

(10:29):
I didn't know any better.
I didn't know any better, but Ithought to me that was, that's
what blasphemy meant.
So at that point, when I saidthat to him, I felt like I could
not never turn back to God.
So I thought that was blasphemy.
So in that, I heard a voice inmy head that said, okay, Kill

(10:52):
every little living thing andyou will gain the power through
the soul or life force that isfrom that.
So I went around as a kidstomping ants, insects,
everything that I came acrossthat was living, I, I killed
thinking that I was going togain power out of And that just

(11:15):
snowballed into just this whole.
life of violence.
And I didn't know anybody.
I didn't grow up around.
Um, God fearing people wasaround violence and drugs and
alcohol.

Omar (11:33):
And you, you let me ask you this.
I know you mentioned God andSatan.
So not growing around like thethings of God, or how did you
know to Call out to God or, orto Satan for, for that matter.
I,

Mike (11:46):
Okay, that brings a good point because there was times,
fast forwarding a little bit,Pastor Dan asked me, he said, he
told me, God is not bound bytime.
So go back and ask him to takeyou back to the times where you
were broken and there washealing.
So at that time, God startedrevealing the times when he was

(12:10):
trying to get my attention.
And one of the times was, as Iremember as a kid, I used to
drive around, ride around inEvergreen Park.
That's where I grew up and inthe cemetery and there was a
little caves with Mary and, andJesus in them.
And, and I would go in thereand, and sit with Jesus and Mary

(12:33):
in, in the little caves and, andthat would be my day.
I felt comfortable in that.
I felt comfortable in the familythat was down the street that
was, uh, um, friends of minethat they were church going
people and they used to give usKool Aid and feed us lunches and
everything.
And I just felt realcomfortable.

(12:54):
I felt every time I approachedthe Bible, I would get
goosebumps just to touch theBible.
And I knew there was power inthat.
I knew there was a feeling thatI had that, that was just really
comforting, really belonging,really embrace.
And, and I didn't know exactlywhat it was, but God revealed

(13:19):
those times to me when he wasthere and I didn't listen.
I didn't listen.
So I.
Knew that there was power.
I knew that there was power.
I just didn't know

Omar (13:37):
Yeah, I

Mike (13:38):
Abused I didn't know I didn't know the difference
between you know, I'm sayingwhat I was doing

Omar (13:44):
So go.
Going back.
Okay.
So you, you, you said that youstart hearing that voice.
Yeah.
You said you start stompinganything.
So what, what, what, how, whatelse does that lead you to do, I
guess, as your, like, growingup, like going forward?

Mike (13:56):
Well, every, every, the fighting got worse.
I, uh, I crippled my handfighting.
And God finally, after, this wasafter I became saved in 2005
when I was in the penitentiary,fast forwarding.
But he revealed to me, he said,you will not hit anybody
anymore.

(14:17):
You're done with the violence.
So he.
I couldn't, I can't make a fistnow.
And, uh, those are just one ofthe many times God was banging
on my shoulder and trying to getme to listen.
And I just, I just was so lost.
I was so lost, but, uh,continuing on with, with that,

(14:41):
uh, um, the childhood.
So the reputation built.
And that led me to not having a,I didn't have a family life
growing up.
There was no connection there.
There was no love there.
So I met some gang members.
Okay.

(15:02):
Um, each Chicago.
And I became a gangster two, sixin Chicago and, uh, man, I went
really trying to.
Prove myself and my nicknamethat many thousands of people,
like mostly penitentiary peopleknow me by the name of loco

(15:26):
pastor.
Dan knows me by loco.
That's what my nickname was.
I, I identified with that and Ifelt like I had to live up to
that name

Omar (15:34):
At, at the age of, what did you, uh, join?
Like, like

Mike (15:36):
14 years old.
So it was in 1988.
And, uh, I.
Quickly was I was going aroundand just shooting people,
robbing, kicking in doors forpistols and weapons and
supplying the organization forthat.
And, uh, that, that was, thatwas bad news.

(15:59):
I went to, uh, I ended up, uh,committing a crime when I was 18
years old.
I, uh, I took somebody's life.
For no reason.
So, uh, I wasn't angry.

(16:22):
It was someone challenged mewhere my loyalty was.
And because this individualwasn't affiliated with what I
was affiliated with, I felt hislife wasn't worth anything.
So, I took his life.
And, uh, It's been haunting meever since.

(16:48):
Uh, what ended up happening,which I will get a little bit
further down.
But that was a, that was aripple effect.
And, uh, I want

Omar (17:01):
know you're in the gangs.
Are you like, you know,drinking, getting into all the
drugs?
How did your life look?
Like right before this incident,you know, like, What was the
mindset, I guess?

Mike (17:13):
The mindset was local gangster, two, six local, don't
mess with me.
I was considered a leader.
I, uh, had my own little groupthat I was responsible for and
it was the worst of the worst.
So it was a pack of us runningaround, just wreaking havoc on

(17:38):
the communities.
Just, it was all about violence.
It was all about destruction.
It wasn't, you know, a lot ofdrugs are sold and, and stuff
like that.
But that wasn't my part.
My part was if there was aproblem, you call local.
And, and, and I was too eagerto, to, to fulfill that.

(18:00):
And, um, that led to me takingsomebody's life.
And, uh, That's where I metPastor Dan.

Omar (18:10):
You, you, you want to take us, I know you said you're 18.
Maybe take us through the court.
You know, how long did you fightthe case?
When would you finally uh, foundguilty I guess?

Mike (18:19):
I fought the case for about a year and a half.
Um, there wasn't, my, my verybest friend told on me.
My childhood friend.
He was, he got pulled over onsome traffic stops, but Um, You
know, I was, I was willing atthat point to just accept what I
did, you know?

(18:39):
And, uh, I didn't plead guilty.
I didn't make a statement.
I kept my mouth shut the wholetime.
And the jury was pretty muchlike, we have a dead body here
and this person saying that youdid it you're not backing up any
kind of story.
So I just code of silence on thestreet.

(19:02):
And I just, I went away and Igot 43 years in prison, which
was pretty much kind of a breakbecause, uh,

Omar (19:11):
now is the the 43, uh, did you have to do 50?

Mike (19:15):
I had to do 50 percent of that.
I had to do 50 percent of that.
And, um, as soon as I got intothe, as soon as that happened, I
just started learning.
I started, I got my GED.
I was still really involved inthe gang.
Um, Um, stuff actually inleadership positions because
there was some young kids thatcame in with murder cases in the

(19:38):
penitentiary and we're allscared.
Really when it comes down to it,deep down inside on the
exterior, we didn't show it, butinside 18, 19 years old gang,
like now we're, now we're, we'regrown men in a maximum security
prison.
Yeah.
We had not.
Not a something that anyone'squick to jump into.

Omar (20:00):
anyone's quick to jump into.
Man, none of

Mike (20:10):
I thought my life was over.
I did nothing but cry behind theclosed doors.
And, uh, I just felt my life wasover.
My, I was never going to see myfamily again, none of that.
And then it.
And it quickly just, it, afterthat release, it turned to just,

(20:34):
you know what I'm saying?
Hardened.
Just my heart hardened.
It had to.
It was about survival mode atthat point.
And uh, it had to.
So you know, um, prison lifewas, uh, um, was not easy.

(20:56):
As a young kid and affiliatedwith a small group.
You know the the group that Iwas involved in we only had a
few of them.
So we had to act Really thecraziest

Omar (21:07):
Now, um, like this gang you mentioned, you, you're
talking about East Chicago.
So you're in Indiana.
This is not Illinois.
Now this gang is really big,like in Chicago, Illinois.
So I'm sure in the Illinoisprisons, I mean, they're
everywhere, but you're sayinglike in Indiana, it wasn't the
case, huh?

Mike (21:23):
there was only like three or four of us including pastor
dan And They weren't, theyweren't really hip to the Latin
folks or Latin people or whitepeople that were claiming to be
folks or vice or any of themother.
So, there's a lot of fighting.
You know what I'm saying?

Omar (21:43):
You could ask you something.
Cause like in Illinois, a lot ofpeople trip out like, um, like
you could be a gang and bedifferent races in Illinois.
Like let's say Latin folks, youcould be Hispanic, white, black,
you know, and vice versa, like,but when I talk to people in
other States, it's racial.
Like, let's say, even if in thestreets, let's say you got a

(22:06):
Hispanic, white, black in thestreets in the same gang.
Okay.
Once they hit the penitentiary,like they had a stick by race.
Now what's the situation inIndiana prison?
How does that look?

Mike (22:18):
It's great.
It's segregated.
It's segregated.
It's, it's now it's really aboutwhere your streets are from.
So, and it's really about,there's no integrity.
There's, it's, it's a lotdifferent from back then.
There, there's no, there's nocodes.
Okay.
So if you got a little bit ofmoney, A little bit of

(22:39):
commissary, like if you got somedrugs, you're in there, you
know, so it's, it's,

Omar (22:44):
but how is it in the beginning?
Like in those, well, what yearswere this?
Uh,

Mike (22:48):
1990.
So the, okay.
The difference was, is the, inthe penitentiary then, okay,
there, there were criminals,there wasn't dope fiends.
Okay.
Now the, now the prisons arefull of dope fiends.
So there was really justcriminals and, and people that,
um, were still in, in, inIndiana State Prison from the

(23:14):
Revolutionary Times.
Like, so there was still like,wearing bell bottoms with afros
and, so they were still stuckfrom them days.
So there was a completelydifferent mentality.
There was only marijuana inthere.
There wasn't the hard drugs thatthere is now.
Now it's full of the hard drugs.

(23:35):
It's just wiping people out.
Just, just taking them.
And, uh, it was a lot different.
It, the organizations wereorganizations back then.
Now it's just about getting highand making a dollar.
So it's, it's, it's.

Omar (23:52):
yeah, yeah.
So, you're talking aboutrecently because obviously you,
you were, we're going to get tothat, but you ended up doing a
lot of time.
But in those early years, youknow, what were some of those
things?
Like you mentioned, there werejust a few of you guys.
So, how did that look?
You know, how did, how did likeprotecting yourselves or
establishing yourselves, youknow?

Mike (24:10):
we had to walk with integrity and back then the,
from the organizations that westemmed from, like our laws
governed us, like we were themtypes of, and every single one
of us had murder cases and wedid not.
Take any kind of any type ofbacklash it like we reacted

(24:33):
immediately.
So You know, I mean it we we gotit we got our respect we had to
we had to we had too much timeSo it was it was another
situation where I was like kindof forced into the violence
Forced in the display ofviolence all the time.
I could not get out of thatcycle That cycle has been

(24:58):
destroying me my whole life upuntil just a year ago.
And, uh, God really saved me,like, we'll get to that point.
Yes,

Omar (25:10):
yes, definitely.

Mike (25:11):
I always pointed to Jesus.
The whole point on this is howJesus Christ has worked.
Finally, after all the rehabs,all the psych units, all the
penitentiary time, the onlything that worked was Jesus
Christ.
Man,

Omar (25:26):
you know, let's go through that.
You just mentioned like a lot ofthings that you went through in
there.
You want to talk maybe some ofthe things that stand out to you
because how many years total didyou end up doing?
27 years.
now, obviously that's more thanhalf of what you mentioned
earlier, right?
So you you want to tell us whathappened?
Did you end up having to getmore time while you were already
in

Mike (25:45):
Well, I

Omar (25:46):
did that look?

Mike (25:47):
I, I got out in 2011, I got a bachelor's degree in
psychology, I got my schoolingin, I got four years time cuts,
um, because I'm, I, as a, beingthe leader in there, I made it
mandatory that you had to getyour, you had to get your time
cuts, your four years time cuts,everyone had to.

(26:08):
So the only way to do that wasschool.
So.
the group of brothers all gotout with college degrees and all
got out early.
I mean, that's the one thing Icould say is none of us got
hurt.
None of, and we all got outearly and they've all got
families and everything.
I'm the only one that came back,man.

(26:28):
Still battling with addiction,still battling with violence.

Omar (26:31):
you're the one, in a sense, pushing them.

Mike (26:34):
the one pushing them.
And I came back.
And I realized God gave me therevelation.
He said, because you never didit for yourself.
You never did it for Jesus.
You never did it.
You never put Jesus in your lifeand did it for yourself.
You was always doing it foreveryone else.
You made it mandatory foreveryone else, but you didn't
make it mandatory for yourself.

Omar (26:55):
You know, let me ask you a question.
You grew up in this household,obviously very violent.
It sounded like maybe not muchlove and affection there.
What made you in a sense, as aleader, it sounds like you're
protecting these

Mike (27:09):
Yeah.

Omar (27:10):
You know, where, where, where do you feel that comes
from?
Even though you were violent,sounds like there was a side of
you that wanted to look out foryour, for your buddies.
You know, like you care forthem.
I would imagine, you know, how,how, where do you think that
came

Mike (27:21):
That came from my stepdad coming home and destroying the
house, beating the dogs, beatingmy mom, like the family, like,
and me stepping in.
And say, no, no, no, gettingthe, getting the attention,
getting taken on, taking theabuse on me, you know what I'm
saying?
Like protecting my sister fromnever letting that situation

(27:44):
that happened to her again, likenothing happened to my mom,
like, so those were the types ofsituations that I stepped into
them roles.
All the time, like, no, you'renot gonna hurt.
No, you're not gonna hurt'em.
You're not gonna hurt'em.
Do it to me.

(28:04):
Not the dogs.
Do it to me.
Don't touch my, don't touch mymom, don't touch my sister.
Do it to me.
So I was always in that role of,come on, I can take it.
I can take it.
And, uh, so I, I, I suspect.
That's where that came from.
And just wanting to be a part ofa family.

(28:26):
Just wanting the love.
Just, I'm really a type of guythat's full of love, man.
I'm full of love.
I'm not a person that's full ofhate or anger, you know what I'm
saying?
Or rage or anything like that.
Like, I'm full of love.
And, I'm passionate.

(28:47):
You know?
And, um I guess those werequalities.
I guess not having that familyand is finding that I wanted to
keep it.
I wanted to find some type ofidentity and put love into it.
Hold on to it because thatbecame my family.

Omar (29:03):
that, that makes like a, like a lot of sense what you
mentioned, man.
Like, and you, you did that foryour family.
Now you brought that with you tothe streets, you know, to the
group of guys you were with and,and then be behind bars, start
doing that, you know, for yourguys.
And there's no, that makes, thatmakes sense, man.

Mike (29:19):
And a lot of, a lot of outsiders gravitated outside
other organizations, gravitated,and, uh, it was just the love
that's displayed.
And this is why I say JesusChrist and the love that he
displays is still going ontoday.
It's still going on today.

(29:39):
That has an effect way morepowerful than.
Hitler.
I'm not comparing.
I don't want to put that inthose names together, but I'm
saying what he what that thatindividual did that that stopped
right there.
Jesus is love and he's displayedis still continuous.

Omar (29:59):
brother.
Okay.
So, uh, you, you mentioned, youknow, you're trying to help your
guys.
They get out, you ended up goingback.
What, what, what, happens therethat, uh, So how long did you,
okay, you said you got out in2011, I believe.
How long did you stay out for?
And then what happens that youend up, you know, back behind
bars?

Mike (30:16):
Okay, so I paroled to Joliet, Illinois.
And I said, I'm never going togo back to Indiana again.
So I went to go live with mysister.
Well, my sister at that time,she's, she's so she had not
surrendered to Jesus Christ.
She's, she's discipled withJesus Christ now.

Omar (30:36):
Oh, today.
Okay.
Yes.
Gotcha.

Mike (30:38):
but she, she didn't surrender.
And I wasn't.
Surrendered to Jesus.
Uh, we believed, but we didn'tknow how to follow.
We didn't know how to walk andjust being away from my family
for that long.
And then going to a livingsituation with them.

(30:58):
We're strangers.
We don't know how that is goingto turn out to be like when,
when, when people split apartand then they try to come back
together again.
You necessarily don't know eachother anymore.
And, and that it's like, youdepend on your own will, your

(31:21):
own strength, your ownunderstanding, when you, when
you don't have Jesus in yourlife, when you don't have God in
your life to direct you throughthat, through establishing
relationships, how to navigatethrough that, we tend to do it
by our own.
And that doesn't always work.

(31:42):
it doesn't always work.

Omar (31:43):
So, at this point in 2011, how long had it been?
Or how much time exactly was itfrom when you got locked up to
then?

Mike (31:51):
Okay.
So in 2011, me and my sister gotinto an argument and that didn't
work out.
Well, the parole officer inIllinois said, you have to go
back to Indiana.
And my mother was Wasn't, shedidn't have her own place.
So I had to call on the guysagain, and then I called the

(32:12):
guys from the penitentiary andwas like, Hey man, I need a
place to stay.
And I'm here.
I'm back in the hood in Marktownin Chicago, to go.
And, uh, um, here it is fallingback on the guys and then got,
you know, and, uh, So, still, myaddiction, my addiction has been

(32:36):
the downfall of my entire life,because regardless of what I
believed in, if I'm stillhanging on the fence, addicted,
and addiction is this, addictionis the need to Do something or

(32:57):
consume something to feeldifferently than how I do now.
It doesn't matter the substance.
You could be addicted toviolence, TV, whatever, but it's
the need to do something to feeldifferently than I do right now.
And that mindset I couldn't getout of.

(33:18):
I, I was always needing to feeldifferently than how I do now
because how I feel now.
I hated myself.
I didn't want to live.
I lived a reckless life that wassuicidal.
You know, I tried to commitsuicide.
I got scars up and down my arms.

(33:40):
You know, that just happened ayear ago.

Omar (33:43):
Oh, no way.

Mike (33:45):
Yeah.
that just happened a year ago inWestville when I was, uh, I
completely gave up and God keptpulling me through.
He kept pulling me out of thesesituations when I wasn't even
looking to him.
I wasn't even asking for him andhe kept pulling me out.
And it was them finally thesetimes that I don't want to get

(34:07):
too far forward,

Omar (34:08):
right, right.

Mike (34:09):
But yeah, there was that, that was another time.
And I went back intopenitentiary and this time I
couldn't go back in being theloco because I was on a parole
violation and a write up couldset you.
And I was facing a lot of backuptime.
So I said, I, I went back for adrug overdose.

(34:31):
I, uh, in Chicago Heights,somebody, uh, shot me up with
some heroin and it was too muchcause he wanted to rob me.
And he wiped me down and I wokeup in the ambulance and I didn't
tell my parole officer about it.
I had six months left to go onmy parole and wound up back in

(34:53):
the penitentiary again and didanother six years.
And I couldn't be the sameperson that I had just left
because I had too much backuptime.
And I wanted to get back outonto the streets because I had a
taste of life.

Omar (35:09):
of life.
What does that mean, backuptime?
What do you mean by that?

Mike (35:13):
Backup time is if 43 years, you do 21 years, you do
half that time.
So now there's 21 years left outof the 43.
That's time that they can takeaway from you.
That's your backup, like that'sthe time that you can, that they
stack onto you and they can makeyou serve.

(35:36):
That's your backup time.
So.

Omar (35:39):
keep getting in trouble catching stuff, you could be
possibly doing all the

Mike (35:45):
All of it.
Yeah, got it.
And I was just faced with that.
With the outdate of 2036.

Omar (35:51):
Wow.
So, okay, so you're, you're backin there, you know, the
overdose, but what begins tohappen in there?
Like,

Mike (35:58):
Okay.
So when I went back in, um, Ihad to completely be in a
submissive posture, which whereI just left from, they weren't
used to that.
They weren't used to the locothat they were used to.
So I had to constantly be into atype of submissive posture,

(36:19):
worried about the next, worriedabout getting a write ups and
the kind of scary, what peoplecall scary.

Omar (36:26):
Now this is for you not getting in trouble with the
officers

Mike (36:29):
the

Omar (36:30):
what you mean like getting any write ups you mean like
Doing anything that they, thatyou're not obeying, I guess.

Mike (36:36):
Right, right.
So in living that way for sixyears, I came out, okay.
I finally got released

Omar (36:45):
what, what, what, what year was this?

Mike (36:47):
um, 2019.
Okay.
So.
Then I just kind of went withthe flow what everyone told me
to do.
Okay.
Okay.
Okay, you know I'm saying andStill I wasn't doing things for
the I didn't have Jesus in mylife.
First of all, I didn't have Godin my life I wasn't I believed

(37:10):
that there was a God but Ididn't believe in God to where
every day I walked with him

Omar (37:16):
Yeah.

Mike (37:17):
There's a difference there.
So In that, I ended up messingwith the same crowd.
I messed with a girl And man hada dentist.
That's a horrible, that therewas a horrible experience.
I was with this woman for nineyears.
She ended up sleeping aroundwith everyone at my job.

(37:41):
they ended up, um, I ended upthreatening, which he was an ex
police officer.
I ended up threatening his life

Omar (37:51):
the guy's life

Mike (37:52):
yeah, the guy's life.
And, uh, at this time I had achange of address warrant out
for me.
So he said to prostitutes, tryto call me for a tattoo because
I do tattoos.
And really it was just, theykind of, they contacted police

(38:14):
and told This warrant and I wentback again to prison and this
time I went back completely likeremembering the last six years
that I went back for travelingout of state without permission
and that's a technical violationand I went back again for

(38:36):
another three years for a changeof address and this time I
absolutely gave up.
I consumed all of it.
every single drug that I could.
I caught three differentstabbing cases inside the
penitentiary.

Omar (38:53):
was just you hurting somebody else.
Is that what you mean?
Okay.

Mike (38:56):
Um, one of them, I was beat into a coma.
Five guys jumped me and I was ina coma for 11 days.
I was airlifted to critical carein South Bend.
Um, I woke up in the infirmaryafter 11 days of being in a coma
and was mad that I didn't die.

(39:18):
I was, again, God save, again,the overdose.
Then this situation.
Matter of fact, let me take youback.
The year that, in 2011, when Igot out, I died twice that year
from bronchospasms and asthmaattacks.
Twice, I had to be rushed andintubated.
To the hospital.

(39:39):
Now, I never had that happen tome in my entire life, but I'm
understanding now of thespiritual battle that's going on
with me and in this spiritualbattle, death is happening and
in life is being brought back tome.
And it's clearly, It's Satan andGod just tugging and pulling,

(40:05):
tugging and pulling.
And it's in that battle where Ifinally submitted and said,
okay, what is it that you wantme to do?
What is it?
You have a purpose that ishigher than me.
Your thoughts are higher thanmine.
Like it says in Isaiah, like my,your ways are higher than my

(40:25):
ways.
So what is it?
So it was in that fiercespiritual battle, me trying to
commit suicide, bringing me backto about

Omar (40:36):
this.
I know you mentioned 2011 diedtwice, those asthma attacks.

Mike (40:41):
Yeah.

Omar (40:42):
Then what year was it that they beat you into a coma?

Mike (40:45):
That was, um, about a year and a half ago.

Omar (40:49):
Okay.
Gotcha.
And then when was this afterthat, the, the trying to kill
yourself after

Mike (40:54):
This was before

Omar (40:56):
okay.
All right.
You, you, you want to take usback to, let's say that this
instance, like, what were youthinking, feeling at the time
that led you to do this, youknow, the

Mike (41:05):
Okay, so, I went to my parole hearing, and I knew they
were going to set me, because Iwas already, I was going in
front of them with stabbingcases.
And, um, I came back.
Now, this parole hearing wasdifferent, because I had read an
Orthodox, I'm Serbian Orthodox,was baptized when I was younger.

(41:26):
So I read an Orthodox bookcalled 12 Steps to Heaven.
This book brought an anointingon, like changed me the way I
was feeling inside.
So when I went to the parolehearing, I told him, I said, you
know what?
I don't want it.

(41:47):
Don't release me because God hassomething to do.
He's got to work on me.
I told them that, and they wereblown back.
Now, this is normally a phonecall that I usually make
afterwards.
They just told me, listen, stayout of trouble.
We're going to wipe the slateclean.
Come back next year with nowrite ups.

(42:07):
And I said, okay.
So I call my mom and I call mysister that day and they can
feel the change.
I was so happy that, It'susually a phone call where it
just wrecks everybody like theytook another year for me and my
mom She's getting old and mysister's got cystic fibrosis,

(42:28):
and she's not well with herhealth and and it just wrecks
everybody This day wascompletely different.
They were crying.
We were all crying in happinessin tears because I was really
Putting Jesus in my life puttinghim first So I come, I come back

(42:49):
and I'm on the unit and I'mreading my Bible.
There's some, uh, Muslims thatare not Muslims.
They're just, they just identifywith that to serve their own
agenda.

Omar (43:04):
Yeah.

Mike (43:05):
And, uh, they're making fun of me reading the Bible.
So now I'm starting to hear.
Plots and voices and stuff goingon in my head.
And now I'm hearing voices in myhead talking about, Take your
bunkie out.
My bunkie was a satan disciple.

(43:28):
And, uh, I couldn't stop thevoices going on.
Let

Omar (43:32):
Let me ask you this.
Were, were these voices happenafter you were letting God in
your life or was this somethingthat was ongoing prior to you
reading those 12 steps toheaven, you know, feeling that
anointing, I guess.

Mike (43:45):
Okay.
So it was a mixture of beingaddicted and then hanging on the
fence with trying to readscriptures.
You can, listen, I don't, do notsuggest anyone to hang on the
fence like that because You canlet in voices and stuff that,

(44:11):
that in your head that is not ofGod, that are data, demonic
voices.
You cannot, the fence is Satan.
You cannot straddle the fence.
You have to choose one way oranother.
You cannot be actively addictedto drugs and alcohol, whatever,
and then still try to be servingJesus Christ.

(44:33):
Because for me, at least, I'mspeaking for me.

Omar (44:36):
Yeah

Mike (44:38):
You can get twisted in your thoughts, and that's
exactly what happened.
So, um, the voices and thenmixed with drug usage.
And I said, man, I cannot hurtnobody else.
So I tried to take my life.
I, I couldn't, I couldn't dealwith it.

(44:58):
So I cut my arms wide open and Iwent to go cut my neck and a
gangster disciple.
He's high ranking, tackled me onthe ground.
He was like, no, local don't.
And

Omar (45:11):
what was this happening at?
What were you at now?
Were you on the, on the deck?
Were you in your

Mike (45:16):
was, I was on a deck.

Omar (45:17):
Okay.
Were you loud in the open

Mike (45:18):
Yeah.
Cause it's like a dorm setting.
There's

Omar (45:21):
Oh, okay.
You want to explain that like a

Mike (45:23):
yeah, there's not single man cells.
Like there was in, in Indianastate prison, it's a dorm site
type setting.
So.
There's no doors.
Like everyone

Omar (45:34):
it like a bunch of bunk beds?

Mike (45:36):
Yeah.
Bunks of bunks.

Omar (45:37):
yeah, okay, and it's out in the open, everybody can see
each

Mike (45:40):
It's out in the open and it looks tore down.
It's like an abandoned it.
Everything's torn down.
Gotcha.
Okay.
So it, it's, it's, it's not agood environment and, um, start

Omar (45:49):
doing this and somebody, you said there's a GD that sees

Mike (45:53):
Yeah.
Yeah.
He, and he tackles me and hesaid, no, don't.
And before I went to cut mythroat, so.
This is the hard part.
So, uh, uh, I get brought downto the infirmary.
And, uh, um, Now I'm talking toa captain.

(46:18):
Captain, Captain Hurt.
And he's a disciple of JesusChrist.
And we're up all night stitchingup my arms.
And we're talking about Jesus.
And we're talking about God.
And, uh, um, That's when Reallystuff started to hit me.
I came bandage up on both myarms back to the unit.

(46:41):
And then every single leader,leader of the vice Lords, leader
of the Latin King, all theleaders got together and went to
the director on that side of.
Westville and said, help thisman.
He is a good man.
Help him.
He's, he's addicted to drugs.

(47:02):
He's, he needs help.
So they got me into the RWIprogram.

Omar (47:07):
Do you want to explain what that is?

Mike (47:08):
Okay.
And RWI program is the substanceabuse program that they have in
there.
But, uh, um, I'm going to behonest with you.
There wasn't a day that it wentwithout drugs and this is a
substance abuse program.
There's, there's, there's.
Flooded with drugs.
So here's another battle andI'm, I'm reading scriptures.

(47:28):
I'm doing my prayers and it, I'mfighting hard, man.
I'm fighting, I'm fighting thisbattle hard.
And, uh, um, that's when Igraduated the program.
a, that was a hard fight rightthere.
And, uh, I met Wayne Antousis.
That's a, that's a man that,that did 23 years in Illinois

(47:51):
prison, man.
He was facing life withoutparole and he did 23 years.
He was gang banging in SouthChicago and he did 23 years for
a crime he didn't do.
23 years serving Jesus Christ,doing Bible studies the whole
time.

(48:11):
And he got out and, uh, Um, Godtold him you're going to go back
into prisons.
You're not done with prison.
You're going to go back intothem and you're going to bring,
you're going to shed light.
And he did.
He shined some light inWestville and I met him in
Westville and a great dearfriend of mine.

(48:31):
He's a soldier in Christ.
A lot of opportunities arehappening for Pastor Dan, Wayne
Entousis, me, like, um, I do, Ido small little, uh, Bible
studies on Facebook and man, uh,a man, a disciple of Jesus
Christ from Pakistan saw one of,out of all the stuff, of all the

(48:55):
nonsense that's on social media,he finds me and then now I'm
doing FaceTime with him and thekids in Pakistan.
And I'm speaking at conferenceswith missionaries that are going
into war zones.

Omar (49:13):
doing now, but let's, let's transition.
Cause at the point of the story,you just graduated the drug
program, you know, the guys,man, and this is crazy that you
mentioned all these gangleaders, even from opposite
gangs trying to help you.
So, okay, you graduated thegroup, uh, drug program.
What happens from there thateventually leads you to, to

(49:35):
where you're at now, you know,how, how, what, what does that,
that timeframe look like

Mike (49:38):
there?
and That's how God works.
I wasn't even program eligible.
I could not get the time cut orget any of the benefits.

(50:00):
I was just there because theseindividuals said, man, help this
guy.
And I was there struggling,fighting, trying to get this
help.
And uh, I went, my parolehearing came up and man, by the
grace of God, released me andthey granted my parole.

Omar (50:21):
Okay, so this was,

Mike (50:25):
happened?
Okay, so this was, this was lastyear.
Okay, because I haven't, I'veonly been out for four months.

Omar (50:33):
Okay.
Recent.
So what, what, what, what month

Mike (50:35):
So, so this was, this was happening December.

Omar (50:39):
December, 2023.
Yes.
Gotcha.
Okay.

Mike (50:42):
December 2023.
So, now here it is.
Um, Parole Board and I'm, uh.
I said, man, I can't get out andgo to the same hood with the
same gangs doing the same thingbecause I'm going to die.
I'm going to go back to prisonor I'm a, I'm a, I'm a die.

(51:04):
If I come back to, I'm a die.
So I filled out applications forsober living houses and no one
answered back.
So now I'm sitting there and I'mtwo days away from.
Um, hitting the streets and I'malready in my mind.

(51:25):
I'm thinking, man, I'm justgoing to get out and do me and
hook up with the guys and youhook up with the females and
just do me.
And then my counselor sends me aposted note.
The only place that contacted meback of the applications that I
filled out was calledrestoration house.

(51:46):
And I was like, I seen theaddress on it.
It was a Gary and I was like, Ohman, the hood again, man.
I can't get out the hood.

Omar (51:54):
That this, uh, this close to where you grew up at.

Mike (51:56):
Yeah.
And, uh, um, but the name on itsaid Daniel Rivera.
And I was like, what?
So I said, I know.
So I used my last phone call andI call up my sister and I said,
call this number and ask him ifthis is the.
he doesn't want me to go by his,his old nicknames.

(52:19):
I said, ask him if this is thatman that I started serving time
with.
And she said, hold on.
And it was, and I said, is thatnow I thought about this man
because we started out our timetogether.
He was 18.
I was 19.

Omar (52:37):
Uh, how many, uh, years did you guys end up doing
together or?

Mike (52:40):
We did about.
seven, eight years

Omar (52:44):
that, that's a, that's a time

Mike (52:46):
Yeah, but, but it was the time period we, we started
doing, we faced, we starteddoing this before we even went
to our trials, so we're facingmurder trials, gang banging,
like young, never been to prisonbefore, and we're on exterior,

(53:07):
we're tough guys.
Right.
No, we're actually scaredinside.
So it was at that point where wehad the most impact on each

Omar (53:20):
each other.
Yeah, yeah, because you werestill, I think in those years,
you were still like, uh, What'sthe word I'm looking at?
Impressionable, moldable kind

Mike (53:27):
seeking for an identity, uncomfortable with, you know,
we're not grounded in the man,like who we are.

Omar (53:34):
yeah, no, yeah, yeah.
Even like now they're realizingthat the brain is still like a,
what do you call it?
Developing.
I believe, uh, I believe theysay now to the age of 25, I
believe is when they're stilllike, like, uh, I guess
biologically speaking,

Mike (53:48):
Yes.
And you, you stunt that growthwith alcohol and drug abuse.
When it, for the abuse andtrauma, you stunt it.

Omar (53:56):
Gotcha.
So, okay, going back.
Daniel Rivera.
That's the only one that, thatreaches out, huh?

Mike (54:02):
He's the only one that reaches out.
So, and I find out that's him.
That's the man that I starteddoing and I, he's been on my
heart because I would follow himin the world and, and I was
like, man, I've respected thisman on a street level, probably
one of the only individuals thatI really had that, this kind of

(54:23):
love and respect for because hewas a different kind of person,
man.
And, uh, um, here it is.
And I said, man, God, if you arenot like, if you are not, I
don't know.
You've saved me out of my life,uh, situations, dying several
times.

(54:44):
And you've released me comingback, back and forth from prison
several But now you are coveringme with individuals that are
serving in your kingdom.
So I said, okay.
Okay.
I'm going to, I'm, I'm, if youdidn't already convince me,
we're bringing me back to life.

(55:06):
Okay.
You convince me now we'reputting this man after all these
years, I've thought about himand here he is.
So I got out, I got, I wasreleased and I went right back
into getting drinking, gettinghigh, hanging out with the
crowd.
And Danny Rivera said, man,Mike's got to pursue me.

(55:27):
I'm not going to pursue him.
I'm done.
He told that to my sister.
I

Omar (55:31):
got it.
Okay.

Mike (55:32):
And, um,

Omar (55:34):
it was your sister trying to reach out to him, I guess, to
get you some help.
Okay.

Mike (55:37):
And, uh, uh, I showed up with that man, Wayne Antunes,
that did 23 years in Illinois.
I said, I made him a promisewhen he was in Westfield doing,
he's had a class, Ten Steps toChrist.
And, uh, I said, I'm going tochurch the first Sunday I'm out.
Wow.
That's amazing.
With my sister and I'm a man ofmy word.

(56:01):
So I showed up to church with mysister that first Sunday.
And, uh, he said, guess whatwe're going to do.
I said, what's that?
He said, we're going out in theparking lot.
We're going to call pastor Dan.
So I got nervous because thisis, this is saying goodbye.
This is saying goodbye.
I'm going to follow a pastor.
Dan, you know what I'm saying?
Like, cause I respect this man,I respected him on the streets

(56:24):
and I haven't seen him in.
Over 20 years.
So I'm nervous.
And he said, Mike, I happen tobe driving down the street.
And, like I said, God does not,our God is not about coincidence
or circumstance or mistakes.
He doesn't work like that.
So, here it is.

(56:46):
My, Daniel Rivera pulls up inthe car.
Now he is a pastor and he is theminister over restoration house
that saves men's lives Puts himon a path Jesus Christ's path to
serve his purpose and his willand Here he is standing in front

(57:07):
of me after 23 years man and andand If that is just not one of
the many things God has, has,has exemplified what he has
shown, you know, saving, savingyour life or whatever.
They, people can argue it like,but there's too many incidences

(57:29):
that I haven't seen this man in23 years.
And now he's a pastor standingin front of me and we were
gangbanging, beating people up,hurting people, selling drugs.
20 some years ago.
Now he's talking about, man,Mike, you're going to serve
Jesus Christ.
And I'm going to show you, I'mgoing to guide you.

(57:50):
I'm going to be the earthly, uh,accountability individual in
your life that God has put me inyour life.
He's put us together and man,Easter Sunday, guess who
baptized me?
Pastor Dan.
So all these years, like.

(58:12):
Here's an individual I gang bangwith now.
He's baptizing me at thecrossing church on Easter and
not only that my sister's thereand Darlene is a great lady of
God Baptizing my sister and notonly that in Arizona where my
family Jaime Casares a pastorout there And my great niece, my

(58:38):
great nephew, Miranda, his wifeis all getting baptized at the
same time.
And we didn't even know this wasgoing on.
We got pictures of it up.
We put it on.
We didn't even know that we wereall doing this at the same time.

Omar (58:52):
Holy, holy God, man.
Praise God, man.
That's, that's amazing.

Mike (58:58):
it is, I just, it's just one of the many, many, many
things that's happening.
Uh, That's happening in my lifethat I would never, I would, I
would never be sitting heretalking to you, brother.
If it wasn't for me saying, God,okay, I'm going to do your will

(59:22):
and do your purpose.
I'm a soldier up.
I did so long for the streets.
I did so much stuff for thestreets.
I'm going to give my time to younow.
And this is one of the things.
Uh, Nicky Gracious.
I don't know if you know him.
Like, he's a, he's a very goodHe's a famous, uh, Christian rap

(59:43):
artist.
He used to be a maniac Latindisciple.
I served 10 years with him inprison.
One of my closest friends now.
And, uh, we stay in contact.
He's, he's serving the kingdom.
Uh, Brian T.
Are you up to Brian T.?

Omar (01:00:00):
Oh, is it a brain trejo?
Yeah.
Okay.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah at

Mike (01:00:03):
very, very close with my family.
In Arizona, I just went to aspiritual event down there with
him.
Yeah.
So these are all nowindividuals.
I'm starting to see theseindividuals that.
Serve the world did all thisgangbanging, all this drug
dealing, all this, this hurt,all this stuff, and now serving

(01:00:27):
Christ and, and making animpact.
Because guess what?
The, the, the Christians, thedisciples of Christ doesn't
necessarily look like the suitand tie individuals.
They look like us.
They look like us.
And boy, we are making animpact.

(01:00:49):
Of serving Jesus Christ anddirecting people to just look to
him.
That's all, that's all I can do.
No, I can't.
I can only help people to lookto him.
And, uh,

Omar (01:01:03):
know what, there's something to be said about that,
man.
Because, uh, All the, some ofthe qualities that you mentioned
earlier, like when you weretalking about that love, that
dedication, that commitment toprotect, man, one, once God
grabs a hold of those samequalities that, that I believe
the enemy corrupts, he twists,but God says, nah, we're going

(01:01:25):
to keep all that, but not likeyou mentioned, soldiering up,
you soldiered up for the streetsfor whatever gang said you were
in.
I want that same commitment.
That same, you mentioned a wordearlier.
I think you were passionate.

Mike (01:01:38):
Yeah,

Omar (01:01:39):
You were passionate for those things.

Mike (01:01:41):
Omar,

Omar (01:01:42):
yeah.
Go ahead, brother.

Mike (01:01:43):
uh, to exclamation point and this is how God works.
The revelation that God put onme.
He said, uh, uh, I allowed youto get trained in the world by
Satan and all the things to gowithout.
To be hungry, to be thatsoldier, because I knew that one

(01:02:04):
day you were going to turn to meand you was going to already
possess all them qualities.
And I was like, Ooh, man, itimpacted me.
Like, wow.
Okay.
I, I get it.
I get it.
So, yeah.
Uh, um, what, what same thoughtthat he had.

(01:02:27):
A good soldier in doing him.
No, no, those qualities, thosequalities are now serving
Christ.
And, and, and man, I am sograteful for every day, every
day that I wake up.
I am so, man, there's thingsthat's unfolding in my life
that, that I, uh, is like notquite unfolded yet, but it's

(01:02:50):
just.

Omar (01:02:52):
getting, uh,

Mike (01:02:54):
getting, I'm, I'm getting glimpses of it.
Uh, now people are just beentelling me you're, you're
knowing you got something goingon.
You got some special, I cannotwait to see what's going on.
And it's coming.
It's only because I served JesusChrist because I'd never meet
these people.
It's only because I'm free frommy drug addiction.

(01:03:16):
It's only because I'm not gangbanging anymore and all the
other stuff.
It's only because I am nowwalking the path.
And walking with Jesus every daythat these things are coming
into my life and they are comingThey are coming as as i'm
responsible for them I know thatgod says listen I'm, not going

(01:03:40):
to give you a job right now.
That's going to give you a wholebunch of money I'm, not going to
bless you because you'll ruinyourself with it

Omar (01:03:46):
Gotcha.

Mike (01:03:47):
You I so That that keeps me obedient You That keeps me
respecting the obedience,respecting the boundaries,
respecting God's timing, likerespecting God, the people that
God puts in my life to hold meaccountable, you know what I'm
saying?
The Holy Spirit to dwell withinme, to convict me of the things

(01:04:09):
that, that, that I may be doingwrong.
It starts with our thoughts,starts with my thoughts.
So in staying obedient.
And seeing these blessingscoming, you want to stay, I want
to stay more obedient.
I want to stay, Hey, okay.
Like I'm not going to try tomicromanage your control.

(01:04:29):
None of this because Jesus, Igive it up to you and you are
showing me every step of theway, every step of the way.
I listen, I don't have violencein my heart anymore.
I'm not angry anymore.
I don't want to, I don't Lashout to people and my desires
have completely changed.

(01:04:51):
My desires have completelychanged.
I don't glorify any, all thestuff that you, I used to
glorify, man, I don't glorifynone of that anymore.
I glorify marriage.
I glorify a family.
I glorify serving thecommunities.
I glorify man, the people likeme that look like me, that look

(01:05:13):
like you.
Becoming grateful servants,Jesus Christ, and giving back.
And, and I look forward to thatevery day now that I wake up.
I can't wait for the next one.
Because opportunities, theyjust, it just comes in
abundance.
It just comes in abundance andit's just the beginning.
It's just the beginning, Omar.

Omar (01:05:35):
Amen.

Mike (01:05:35):
It's just the beginning and I just, man.
I, I promise I, I, I plead withanybody that's out there, like,
listen, surrender, surrender,surrender, surrender, submit to
Jesus Christ, allow him to showyou how to live, show you how to

(01:05:57):
think, show you how to, how toact, show you how to love.
Because that's, I didn't knowhow to love.
I didn't really know how to loveuntil Jesus Christ showed me how
to love.
I didn't know how to forgive.
I didn't know what peace wasabout until I learned what
forgiveness was about.
Forgiveness gives me peace.

(01:06:18):
It gives me the calmness.
Calling on the Holy Spirit todwell within me.
You can't leave.
Listen, drugs were created tokind of like replace God.
Replace the Holy Spirit.

(01:06:39):
Like, so I promise it's, Ipromise.
I said that to say this, whenyou invite the Holy Spirit in,
don't need that alcohol.
You don't need them drugs.
You don't need the things thatyou did that run, run out.
That runs out.
The alcohol runs out.
The drugs run out.
The money runs out.

(01:07:00):
The chasing after females thatall runs out.
Jesus Christ does not run out.
The Holy Spirit does not run outrich in that mercy and
forgiveness and love rich in it.
And I I'm just speaking out oftestimony, like period.
I am, I am free from all thethings that held me in prison.

(01:07:24):
And let me tell you something.
You don't have to be behind barsto be in prison.
You don't have to be behindbars.
There's many people out therethat's in prison.
And, and, and now my passion is,is to direct you, to free you
from that.

Omar (01:07:44):
What are some of these things that are keeping people
in prison?
While they're out here, youknow, free in a sense in the
world, but still a captive

Mike (01:07:53):
Addiction is number one.
The use of alcohol andsubstances is number one.
Trying to seek an identity isanother one.
You can get locked in, in tryingto be something that you think
is, is prosperous.
That you think gives you streetcredit or that you think that

(01:08:17):
gives you strength.
That's all false.
That's all lies that the deviluses to twist, and that's how he
works.
Devil's not some red figure thatcomes from the concrete with a
pitchfork and the ground cracksopen.
It's the, he manipulates thethoughts and, and, and, and, and

(01:08:39):
implants lies in your head.
At least that's how he workswith me.
I, I can't, I'm not gonna speakfor everyone, but.
And lies and tells you thatyou're not worth it.
Shame and embarrassment and, andregret and anger and all those
things that are not of God,those things aren't of God.

(01:09:02):
Those things are of, ofdarkness.
And I want people to shed thelight.
Share the light, bring the lightin the darkness.
And that's Jesus Christ.
That's Jesus

Omar (01:09:17):
all that.
You know, one thing that came tomy mind, you mentioned a lot of
things, but you mentioned peace,something that you never knew.
Now, forgiveness was anotherword that stood out.
How hard or easy was it for youto forgive?
Cause like going back to thebeginning of your story, there
was a lot of hurt.
A lot of trauma.

(01:09:37):
I'm sure you had plenty ofunforgiveness towards a lot of
people.
Now once the Holy Spirit came,once God starts working, how
easy or hard was it for you toforgive?
And then what did you experiencewhen you truly forgave?

Mike (01:09:51):
Okay.
So let me tell you, let me takeit.
And this is a perfect window.
The, the unforgiveness cameabout me.
Okay.
That.
Held me captive for the up untilrecently and I'll share that,
but, um, and it was because theindividual, the victim on my

(01:10:15):
case, his brother became, got aletter about the year I was
getting out in about 2010.
And it was from the victim'sbrother and he said, I am the
brother of so and so and I justwant you to know, um, I forgive

(01:10:37):
you.
And he gave me some Bible versesand he told me, he said, but I
want you to know what the familywent through.
And he said, uh, our mother lefther home and lived in Walmart
parking lot.
And.
She stayed in her car for a yearand a half until the psych unit

(01:10:59):
had to remove her.
So he was like, there was anissue between him and my, our
mother that will never beresolved.
And, uh, he's like, I became apolice officer where you dumped
my, my, uh, brother's body.

(01:11:20):
And he said, I used your face toarrest every.
Child molester, rapist, burglar.
He went all the way down theline.
He said, until I became numberone police officer.
And he said, then I becamedetective and I used your face
on every child rapist.
And he went all the way down theline.
He said, I came head detectiveuntil one day I fell to my knees

(01:11:43):
and I said, Lord, forgive me forI locked up so many innocent men
using this man's face.
And man, it hit me right there.
And I said, dang, man, thatsplit second of me turning that
pistol and shooting that personhad a ripple effect to still

(01:12:05):
that's still going on.
It's still going on that.
So many families were destroyed.
This man went on a vengeance,locking innocent men up that
police department.
And this is what the Holy Spiritrevelation came to me.
I said, damn, that attitude thatthat individual had in that

(01:12:25):
police department, it was inHarvey.
That police department had aripple effect amongst the other
officers and they had thateffect on the rest of the
community.
So what was bothering him had aneffect on the other police
officers, which had an effect onthe community.
And he was, they were alllocking now corruption.

(01:12:48):
If anybody knows about theHarvey police department, big
corruption happened in there,they had to have federal FBI
come in to do the work forpolice officers.
There are a lot of policeofficers got in trouble.
So.
Many innocent people.

(01:13:09):
And then he said, Finally, Ifell to my knees and I said,
Lord, forgive me for I locked upfor many innocent men using this
man's face and he quit his job.
So fast forward to a men'sencounter that is at Living
Stones Church.
Now, this is a group of about300 men that spend the night at

(01:13:31):
the church and it's a three daypress into the Lord.
Uh, event that goes on.
So they separate us and break usinto groups.
So, like I said, our God is notby circumstances, our
coincidence.
So I'm sitting next to a CookCounty police officer in my
group.

(01:13:51):
And it's only like nine guys.
And I'm sitting next to anotherindividual from Harvey.
And he tells me about his sisteralmost getting killed.
By one of the detectives andthat it was possibly the
individual that I took hisbrother's life, but it just

(01:14:18):
confirmed the, the, therevelation that God put in me
and said, man, what you did hada ripple effect.
It's still going on today.
And how many lives, how manyattitudes that people had based
on the attitude of theseofficers and how it just kept
on, how many lives weredestroyed over that split second

(01:14:43):
decision to turn and shootsomebody thinking I was being a
tough guy or gangbanger or sowhatever like that is still
having an effect on Way biggerlevel than I could ever imagine.

(01:15:04):
And I caused that.
So as a soldier that I callmyself, it's my responsibility
to start doing the good now,because this, what I thought
about, I said, if that one splitsecond decision caused this much

(01:15:27):
ripple effect.
All these years, imagine if I'vebeen doing good all these years,
loving, serving people, doinggood, that ripple effect never
happened again, Omar.
I'll never make that mistake andcause that pain like that with,

(01:15:52):
with people again, because.
I thought about all the men thatwere locked up for innocent,
destroyed the families, kidswere ripped away from their,
their father, financial, likepeople's, someone's husband was
pulled away from somebody'sfather was pulled away from

(01:16:15):
because a dumb decision I madeand took somebody's life in.
How that affected my family,like, the ripple effect from a
stupid decision Has an effect.
It has an effect.

(01:16:35):
It has an effect.
And, uh, If you care just alittle bit, man, a little bit
You think about that, man.
You think about that because Idon't want to be the reason why

(01:16:56):
men are pulled, ripped away fromtheir homes, away from their
kids.
You know, I don't want to bethat, I'm not that guy, man.
These are the things that youthink about way down the line.
See, people may want to act liketough, like strong, like I'll,

(01:17:19):
I'll shoot you or whatever.
Okay.
What happens down the line when,when, when, when all the
realities start happening ofwhat you did.
Tear you up.
So back to your question

Omar (01:17:40):
Yeah.
Yeah.

Mike (01:17:42):
on forgiveness of myself, it bound me, man.
It kept me in prison forever.
And, uh, It wasn't until PastorDan, when I was telling him, I
said, man, how do you, how doyou act, how do you get over
that you killed somebody?

(01:18:02):
How do you, how do you hold yourhead up?
And I was explaining to him andhe stopped me right there.
And he said, wait a minute.
He said, when that man forgaveyou, he said, that was the end
of it right there.
He freed you from that.
So be free from that.
He said, man, God forgave you.
That man forgave you.

(01:18:23):
He said, why'd you keep onthrowing it in the God's face?
Why'd you keep on reminding himof what he just forgot about?
Stop doing that.
Because you're going to neverpress on, but that's what Satan
does.
That's what the devil does.
He will keep that in your mindand, and keep you in prison

(01:18:44):
because what he wants to happenis for you to die.
Not following Jesus Christ, notbeing a soldier, not serving
Jesus Christ.
He wants you to die in thedarkness take your soul.

Omar (01:19:00):
all that brother and man like here I was thinking
forgiveness like for the familyand everything that you
experience that you witness, butourselves man is a lot of times
like it's easy to even extendforgiveness to others for what
they've done to us, but We wantto accuse in a sense ourselves,

(01:19:21):
I know the enemy accuses ofSatan, you know, he's the
accuser of the brethren, but Ifeel sometimes like us, like we
can't receive that forgivenessfrom God that easily, even
though man, Jesus went on thecross and died for all of our
sins for all of them.
It could be from somebodytelling a little white lie to.
To murder the taking ofsomebody's life, but there's

(01:19:42):
something about us almost like,man, I, I gotta, I gotta do
something to earn theforgiveness.
I gotta, I gotta give back, butno, he already did it all, man.
And like he mentioned, you know,Jesus forgave us, you know, God,
the father forgives us throughthe atoning sacrifice of his
son.
The man for forgave you thebrother, you know, and, uh, and
sharing everything that theripple effect, man.
But now here's the thing too.

(01:20:04):
Now, like that's the rippleeffect from a bad action.
But.
What's the ripple effect from aman that surrenders his life to
Jesus Christ and the effect thatis going to have not only around
those around them, but thegenerations that are to come and
that's going to be a greaterimpact.
Like,

Mike (01:20:22):
So let me,

Omar (01:20:23):
yeah, go ahead.

Mike (01:20:23):
down to you Omar.
So, so many people follow me inthe world.
And they looked up to me, okay,the street people, man, you
wouldn't believe that peoplejust watch me.
And this is why this is what wetalked about in, in, in Bible
class about the burden, theburden of being, being a

(01:20:46):
disciple of Christ.
I understand it because, um, nowindividuals that are watching me
like, what?
Man, local, and they're not, nowthey're calling me Michael, they
changed, they're not respectingit, call me Michael, they're not
bringing the folly around, man,don't you know, brother, my, I

(01:21:08):
have an ex girlfriend, uh, shewas, uh, dealing
methamphetamines, Latin queen inChicago, you know what I'm
saying, and everything, man, shedropped all that, just out
watching, like, and now istalking about Jesus Christ.
The, She's not the only onethere is another brother that
he's showing up to church nowYou know i'm saying in imperial

(01:21:31):
gates and I did a lot of timewith uh showing up to church man
Like these individuals are nowdropping their pistols dropping
their drugs dropping and nowfollowing the path because They
they are seeing That a man,this, this, this guy right here,
this loco is changing his lifeand the things that are

(01:21:52):
happening with him.
And I see, I see the difference.
I want what he's got and it isnot drugs.
It's not drugs.
It's not drugs that he's doing.
It's jesus christ that he'sdoing and and now they are now
people are following now peopleare Man, i'm witnessing it.
I'm witnessing it and i'm i'mI'm amazed and it keeps me

(01:22:16):
driving.
It keeps me going every day.
It keeps me in obedience.
It keeps me surrendering.
It keeps me not ever having abig head because I can never, I
can never, ever, ever, ever saythat this was me that did this

Omar (01:22:32):
That's right.

Mike (01:22:34):
wasn't me, me cut my arms up.
Me put myself in a penitentiary.
Me caused all these.
Problems in the world.
Like all these families rippedapart.
Me cause a lot of pain and hurtJesus Christ.
He's he's where he's taken allthat.
And now he's bringing people tohim.

(01:22:56):
And I'm just like, in, in that Istay obedient because he's the
one that's, he's the, he's thegeneral,

Omar (01:23:04):
Amen.

Mike (01:23:04):
he's the general,

Omar (01:23:06):
just soldiering

Mike (01:23:07):
just soldiering up.

Omar (01:23:08):
Amen.
Hallelujah.

Mike (01:23:10):
So I'm, I'm grateful for every day.
I'm, I'm, if anybody knows Nikkigracious, that's my, like my
best homie.
He's every day, Brian T'sfamily, every, like, these are
individuals that I'm tellingyou, like, pay attention, pay

(01:23:31):
attention, people pay attentionto all of folly.
They spend all the time chasingthe bag or a female on the
streets or standing outside inthe cold trying to serve But
give him give some time to Jesusgive some time to Jesus give
some time paying attention tothe individuals that He's
changed because he doesn't wantno one's good.

(01:23:54):
There ain't no good in us Hewants to take all the bad And
reform it to give him the graceand the glory.

Omar (01:24:01):
That's right.
Man, we're just uh, um, like uh,what do you call it?
Like clay vessels, man, thatwe're nothing.
Without him filling us man, anduh, that's why I told people
kind of the same thing manThey're the only good in me is
him like there's nothing good inme You know I'm saying like uh,
I'll be doing a prison ministryand my wife asked me Uh, man, do

(01:24:21):
you love the guys that you go towitness to?
And I thought about it for asecond, like, honestly, I can't
say that I love him, but I knowwho does.
It is the father's love in me.
Cause I know me, you know whatI'm saying?
Like I could be selfish attimes, you know, I could be
comfortable at home, you know,spending time with my wife and
kids, but I know where God isdesiring me to send me.

(01:24:45):
To, to witness to these menbehind bars that, you know, man,
like I was there.
I know, I know how that feels.
So for me to say, I love mywife's.
I was just like, man, but youknow, part of you has to love
them, but I know it's thefather's love.
You know, it's like, is it hislove that compels me to do what
I do now?
His love that compels me to, todo this, to help share stories,

(01:25:06):
man.
Cause it's.
It's his love, like the Biblesays, I believe this in first
John, like we love because hefirst loved us.
Once you realize, man, thefather's love and then what
Jesus did, that kind of lovecan't help but to love and then
to, to give it back.

Mike (01:25:23):
Like, like, uh, like I said, I didn't know what love,
you know, a lot of times peoplebase love on an emotion, how
they feel.
But love is an action wordBelieving is an action word
Faith is an action word.
You know I'm saying these areaction words like Loving is an

(01:25:45):
action word.
You can't just people throw thataround all the time.
I love you And I don't that'sjust a saying to a lot of people
but that there's action that'srequired behind that There's
sacrifice and there's love Thatrequires behind it, like, like
it says in the Bible, there's nogreater love than to lay down
your life for your brother.

(01:26:06):
Like, and that's, that's thetype of preparation that, that,
uh, um, we used to do on thestreets.
Laying your life down for yourhomie.
Well, it's the same thing, butnow for Jesus Christ

Omar (01:26:24):
Amen.

Mike (01:26:25):
now for Jesus Christ, I have no problem now.
So he's taking soldiers thatused to be in the street and
making soldiers for his kingdom.
And man, I am, I'm going to be apart of that.
I'm not going to be on thesidelines watching it.
I want to be in it.
I'm a front linesman.

(01:26:45):
Battle ready.
So I'm just grateful, man.
Oh, mom, grateful foreverything.

Omar (01:26:51):
brother, man, that's great story, man.
Great testimony.
And what God's is obvious, man,what God's doing, the
transformation, may he continueto do it.
You know what, is there anythingelse that you want to share?
Maybe something we didn't get achance to touch on, maybe
anything on your heart, youknow, you want to say maybe to
those that are listening to yourstory.

Mike (01:27:10):
One thing, and, and, and this, this kind of tickles me a
little bit.
Um, when I, when I get, when Igot saved in 2005, uh, I watched
Passion of the Christ for thefirst time on Christmas.
I couldn't stop bawling.
Okay.
I could not stop bawling.

(01:27:31):
I'm inside the penitentiary.
Now, when my homeboy, AngelCasares, when he passed away, I
tattooed a teardrop because Irefused to cry at a
penitentiary.
I'm not crying.
When Julio Carina passed away, Itattooed a teardrop'cause I
refused to cry.
So when that happened, fastforward to the passion of the

(01:27:55):
Christ.
God told me, he said, man, everytime the Holy Spirit dwells
within you, you're gonna, you'regonna cry now since you wanted a
tattoo teardrops on your face.
Tough guy.
So now, every time when the HolySpirit dwells within you, you're
gonna be crying and I can't.
Now I can't stop it.
Every time I feel the HolySpirit in me, I, it, it consumes

(01:28:18):
me and I cannot stop it.
So I embrace it as Paul's thornin the side.
And he was like, my grace issufficient enough.
When Paul was like, they, canyou take, can you help me out
here?
So I'm like, Lord, can you, man,it's embarrassing.
Kind of crying all the time,man.
I was supposed to be, no, mygrace is sufficient.

(01:28:40):
Every time that the Holy spirit,you teardrops on your face, like
a tough guy.
Okay.
You going to be tough.
Every time the Holy spiritcomes, you going to know because
you going to be balling.

Omar (01:28:53):
but you know what?
Can I, can I say this, man?
That's also God using you tolead by example, because there's
a lot of men that are bound bythat mentality where a men don't
cry.
And they've been told this aslittle kids and here they are
with all this trauma and allthis pain, but they're just
holding it in, but there'shealing.
I believe healing comes, man.
When you finally release, shedthem tears for, there was a guy

(01:29:17):
that was on the podcast, uh,Marine, uh, law enforcement.
He said that, uh, some of hisbuddies, uh, uh, he heard one of
his buddies took his life,suicide, another guy.
He said he wouldn't cry.
Uh, finally, uh, one of hisclose friends took his life and
he, he couldn't cry.
He was mad.
Cause he said.

(01:29:38):
As a Marine law enforcement,we're tough guys.
Like we don't do this.
And he became physically ill andgoing to all type of doctors,
going to all type of everythingand nothing, nothing.
He said he kept, uh, gettingweak physically, just didn't
know what it was.
So finally it was revealed tohim.
You're not mourning.

(01:29:59):
You're not crying.
You know, you're talking aboutthose.
Tattoo teardrops as a toughMarine.
He, he couldn't, it wasn't untilhe got to that point, that
revelation where, man, youhaven't mourned.
You haven't cried for yourfellow brothers that you lost.
And that's where he experiencedhealing, man.
So I believe this man needs tosee.

(01:30:19):
A real

Mike (01:30:20):
Yeah.
Yeah

Omar (01:30:21):
Cry.
You understand what I'm saying?
Yeah.
It's not a sign of weakness.
So, I believe even that is Godusing you.
I know you called it a thorn inthe side.
Yeah.
Man, I believe God wants peopleto see you.
Hey man, it's okay to cry

Mike (01:30:33):
Yeah,

Omar (01:30:34):
as a man,

Mike (01:30:34):
absolutely.
Absolutely.
And, and, uh, you can call itwhat you, if you want to
consider it, all the streetcred, whatever you want to call
the street cred, well, I've gotboatloads of it and you're going
to see this man right heresharing true feelings now.
Really experienced in love,really shedding the tears,

(01:30:55):
really showing people like, Hey.
God is real.
God is real.
If you don't think that God isreal, let me tell you something.
Watch, just pay attention, payattention to the individuals.
It's lives are changing.
Pay attention, pay attention.
I promise I beg you.

(01:31:15):
I beg you because I, I want thisfor everybody.
I want this for everybody, man.
I genuinely do.
That's, that's the differencewith my heart.
Now.
Is back then, back then Icouldn't care about any, any of
that.
Now I want this for you.
Like, I want you to, I listen, Iwant to work with law

(01:31:41):
enforcement.
I want to work side by side withy'all and try to reach out to
help some people that'sstruggling.
I never had that desire before.
I don't, I'm not talking aboutno, I don't want to arrest
nobody or nothing like that.
I'm talking about, I want toreach out to some people that
are struggling, man, and say,hey, listen, man, the police

(01:32:04):
officers, they're not bad likethat, man.
They're not all bad.
Like, don't get that twisted,man.
These people are, they're notall bad.
First responders, ambulance,medics, police officers, like
they're really there to try tohelp.
Like if it wasn't for them, likeit'd be straight chaos.

(01:32:26):
There would be people like merunning around just doing
whatever.
I'm telling you, like your heartchanges.

Omar (01:32:34):
Yeah.
You, you know, I'm glad youshared that about working with
the police officer, the, thepodcast I just released a
podcast, think this, thisweekend.
And it was a former, uh, a, a POman police officer, uh, 31 years
Chicago Police Officer.
Uh, 33 years between Marines andthe army.
And, uh, you know what, realquick, I'm going to grab my

(01:32:55):
phone because you bring up agood point, man.
Uh, I released a video on, onYouTube, you know, like the full
interview, but I, I want toshare this comment that somebody
posted, you know, because, uh, Ithink it ties in like to, to
what you're talking about, man.
I want to share this.
So, so somebody listened to thisformer police officer share his
story, you know, and then, andthis is what he put.

(01:33:16):
This is the comment, the guyput.
He put thank you to this man forsharing his story.
I grew up on the opposite sideof the law, but felt so many of
the same pains and emotions ashe did.
I sat in the cells for yearsbroken, thirsty to listen to
someone like him speak.

(01:33:37):
This is very filling of the soul

Mike (01:33:40):
man.

Omar (01:33:42):
Because this, this man shared his heart.
Sure.
This, um, personal andprofessional struggles.
And when it's all said and done,We're all men, we're all human,
man.
We all go through the sameissues, man.
Like same, similar traumas, butwe just end up in two different

(01:34:03):
sides of the law and it justgives you an understanding, you
know, like for them.
So for this guy to, to, to postthat and like, man, they really,
they, they need to hear that,you know, like that we could
work together.
So this is the, I'm, I'm therewith you, man.
Like I go to, To Cook CountyPrison to, to minister, some are
former, uh, law enforcement.

Mike (01:34:23):
Yeah.

Omar (01:34:24):
So you got former criminals, you could say, you
know, law enforcement, but we'reall there doing the same work,
basically on the same side forthe Lord.

Mike (01:34:33):
Yeah.
So, so, uh, my point is when youaccept Jesus Christ in your
life, when you truly do, whenyou surrender, your heart
changes, you start viewingthings differently.

Omar (01:34:47):
you

Mike (01:34:48):
Like you don't longer have, likeyou have a choice, but when you
truly surrender, know what I'msaying?
Like you just go with it, gowith it.
Because there's so much, uh,everything that, that, that
you're used to doing, drinkingand smoking and everything, try

(01:35:09):
to fill them voids.
Oh, that is filled.
When you accept Jesus Christ.

Omar (01:35:15):
Amen amen brother, you know what?
With that, with that, can youclose us out in a prayer,
brother?
Maybe pray, you know, whateverGod pleases on your heart, you
know.

Mike (01:35:24):
Father God, me and Omar come here tonight and thank you,
Lord, for this opportunity,because I would never have this
opportunity if I didn't turn myeyes and my heart towards you,
Jesus.
I just want to thank you for.
The people that are watchingfather that that their interests
are of you That just reaches outto somebody and help somebody

(01:35:47):
lord because it's been so manytimes that We do the wrong
things that I have done thewrong things lord I want to do
something to help out and I justwant to thank you for that
opportunity lord I want to blessomar With safe travels in his
traveling mercies, Lord.
I want to put a hedge ofprotection for all the women,
all the children, all the men,all the disciples of Jesus,

(01:36:11):
Lord, and just guide us, guideus.
Holy spirit convict us in everyway that, that, that went, that.
We come off track that you putus back on track and in Jesus
name in holy Jesus's name Ithank you for what he did in his
life To show us how to love toshow us how to think to show us
how to walk To show us how tosacrifice to show us how to

(01:36:34):
forgive.
I want to thank you for showingus that I want to thank You for
what you did on your cross justsacrifice Just exemplified.
Lord, we should always bewilling to sacrifice for the
next man.
And I just want to thank you foryour son.
I want to thank you for the HolySpirit.
I want to thank you, Father, foreverything that you were doing

(01:36:56):
in everybody's life that serveyou and that you give everyone
the opportunities to come toyou, Lord.
And I just want somebody to seethis Lord and maybe put their
sights on you, Jesus.
In Jesus name, I pray.

Omar (01:37:13):
Amen.
Amen Brother man.
Thank you for man sharing yourstory with us.
Man, uh, thank God for thisdivine connection, man.
Shout out to a pastor, DanielRivera out here, uh, restoration
house.
You know, I tried to write alittle something on the board
over here, but they're out hereand, uh, Gary, Indiana,
obviously, as you could tell,doing amazing work, helping men,
you know, get back on theirfeet, get back, reestablish to

(01:37:36):
society, But more importantly berestored back unto the lord, you
know back to our heavenly fatherThrough our lord and savior
jesus christ.
I will definitely put us somelinks up to as far as uh the
house I'm sure maybe there's away that they could donate and
contribute to the work that'shappening here, you know

Mike (01:37:53):
be awesome

Omar (01:37:54):
Yeah, so we'll put that on there and uh, god willing i'm
gonna get pastor dan to sharehis story as well one day You
know, so I know he said hewanted me to come out here and
get your story out there firstUh, and i'm glad I did man.
I was blessed by thisconversation And I know this
conversation is gonna bless manyman Uh, oh, no, it will brother.

(01:38:14):
Trust me.
It's blessed me as i'm sittinghere and I know many men Women,
families need to hear a lot ofthe stuff you shared, man, the
ripple effect, you know, likeyou mentioned, it could have, it
could be negative, but at thesame way,

Mike (01:38:25):
can be

Omar (01:38:26):
once God grabs a hold of us, watch out, you know, make an
impact for, for, for thekingdom, you know, uh, all in
Jesus name, man.
So with that.
Uh, we're going to get ready towrap up.
I want to thank my, my guest,Mike, for being on here.
Uh, Matthew 4, 16 reads, thepeople who sat in darkness have
seen a great light and uponthose who sat in the region and

(01:38:47):
shadow of death, light hasdawned alongside my brother,
Mike.
My name's Omar Calvillo.
We are wrong to strong.

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