July 31, 2025 • 45 mins
In this episode of Heliona Insight, I sit down with Amber Miller Manning, CEO of The Miller Group, to talk about what it really takes to retain great people in one of the hardest industries: insurance.
Amber shares how she and her team have built a culture that holds a remarkable 90% employee retention rate—by centering communication, care, and consistency at every level of leadership.
We talk about the emotional reality of leading during high-pressure moments, what it means to set expectations with love, and how The Miller Group is modeling a better way to lead in service-centered work.
If you're trying to build a team that stays, this is the blueprint.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Clarity is when certain roles aren't communicating clearly.
It's the leader's job to facilitate that and make sure
that's a direct conversation. Can't grow if you don't have
clarity in what you're doing andwho's doing what.
When we post a job, we have it where we are able to get someone
in the door in 30 days, which iscrazy.
Our team trusts us that we won'tlet them drown.
(00:21):
So we're proactively hiring instead of reactively hiring.
We've been successful on just here's where we're going, here's
our strategic vision. Every month I share our
financials and talk about how things are going.
Sometimes it doesn't go well andI don't hide from it.
And our whole executive team is incredibly transparent, so no
(00:42):
one feels like decisions are being made over here and they
don't know what's going to happen.
And having the responsibility ofsomeone trusting you with their
livelihood is a big responsibility that we do not
take lightly. You know, we want to
continuously be working towards that trust and that respect that
we have for employees that they,they feel that for us that we're
(01:05):
working every day to make this better so that they can have a
better life too. What if the secret to retaining
top talent was not about perks or trendy benefits, but building
a culture people genuinely trust?
(01:27):
In this episode of Helion Insight, I'm joined by Amber
Miller Manning, CEO of The Miller Group, A People First
insurance firm that's redefiningwhat retention looks like in a
traditionally high turnover industry.
With a 90% employee retention rate, Amber brings both clarity
(01:47):
and compassion to how she leads.We talked about what it takes to
create consistency in uncertain times, how to lead with care
while driving results, and why employee experience is no longer
just an HR issue, but a leadership mandate.
This is a playbook for building a workplace where people want to
(02:12):
stay. So let's get into it.
All right, Amber, thank you for being here today.
And you know, I just want to saycongratulations.
I know you've been ACEO for the Miller Group for three years
now, but I want to officially congratulate you.
You're kind of course and I wanted to talk to you about just
(02:35):
the experience of you, you know,like starting from benefits to
now being ACEO, like how was that experience like for you
personally going through that? So we so I'm third generation
family operator and owner. We have bylaws you have to work
outside of the business for a while.
So it didn't. Benefits was the middle of my
(02:55):
career on the way to CEO, right?And I worked in every
departments but benefits was thelargest chunk of time.
Wow, OK, yeah, I don't, I don't hear it very often because, you
know, I've talked to a lot of individuals that that I've also
went through generational, you know, like where they have to
become CEOs, but you know, I, I don't hear them talk about that.
(03:15):
Why do you think that was important?
Was that something like implemented by I'm?
I'm assuming that the original founder your grandfather?
No. So we, my grandfather was
amazing, but he didn't have muchstructure that he applied.
He was just building the business and doing a beautiful
job serving our clients second generation.
(03:36):
My dad and uncle put more parameters around it because
we're an insurance broker. So we advise on the business
needs, surety needs and the health insurance needs.
And we've seen so many businesses where there's been
struggles. So we've implemented rules to
protect our family, company and just our clients from having
(03:58):
someone in the wrong seat and just having someone in because
you want to work with family or you feel you deserve it.
That's not how we operate. We operate if there's a job, you
need it. If there's a job, I'm not saying
that correctly. If we have a the company has a
job and you qualify for it and you've been successful somewhere
(04:19):
else, then you get recruited to come and work here and then you
get opportunities if you're goodat what you do, but you don't
get them just cuz you last your last name.
Yeah, Wow. Well, that's very powerful.
And, you know, they just, you know, I took my mind to the T,
you know, the TV series Succession.
So you guys are succession, but with a lot of integrity and you
(04:41):
actually got to earn it. Yes, to to be.
You know the name. As you see that like the mental
health of the characters they portray, you know, there's a lot
of and we feel this for everyonein our company.
You have a lot of pride when youare good at what you do, you
contribute regardless of the level.
(05:01):
So we're very big on making surethat we take care of the whole
person and allow them to be successful, stretch in different
jobs, but have it where they cango home satisfied and happy and
take care of their family because they're in the right
position. Right.
And, and, you know, like one of the other things that I hear,
(05:23):
it's like the term like family. I, you know, I actually had a
guest here who, who was ACFO as a company and he left because he
felt like, you know, he just could not find himself in, in
the company that he was working in because they use the Word
family. And I want to just ask you this
like how do you go about especially the company as a
whole, how do you guys go about just making sure the people that
(05:47):
are coming in feel like they belong with the term family?
So we are a business that we canscale a lot of revenue with not
not a lot of employees. So it's incredibly important
that everyone is working together.
So I did it yesterday. I'm the final interview on
anyone we hire and our team is really big on kind of defining
(06:09):
what our culture is, defining what respect looks like,
defining how to voice your opinion, how you engage in our
community so you feel like it's family.
And just like family, you have hard conversations.
Things don't always go well, butyou respect each other and we
(06:30):
make sure to manage to that thatwe make sure that everyone is
working together so that it feels like family.
You know, when one person's hit,people jump to help, you know,
it's not like you're in it alone.
And being alone is one of the biggest things we see right now
with impacting health, impactingour communities, or people just
(06:51):
feel isolated, right? Yeah, I mean, you know, I, I
actually had a, you know, at some point I had a team of
around 60. It also tells you the type of
leader. I'm trying to think of the
number. It's been so long and I need to
go back and look at the roster. But yeah, I had a team of in the
60s and I'm also trying to cultivate that cuz I grew up in
(07:12):
a very big family where I feel like I was connected to
everyone. Everyone had a purpose within
the family as a whole and we were very like integrated, like
the cousins, the aunties, prettymuch everyone add to the family
and we had a great time. So I was trying to cultivate
that within my own company in the early 8 stages of my career,
early on 20s, I was very successful.
(07:34):
I built a very successful agency, but everything just fell
because I didn't do it well. And I want to talk to you as
someone who has been in a company that has been around for
three generations and I want to figure out how have you guys
done it? Well, you've kind of talked
about a few, you know, like points of like how you guys did
it from from your grandfather tonow to you today.
(07:56):
And feel free to use my story asan example because I was someone
who was I had no culture in the company.
I felt like I had a culture, butI didn't understand what culture
was. I had a bunch of people in a
actually in this room where where we would have meetings.
But then, you know, I would justlet anyone just do whatever they
wanted to do because I wanted them to feel like they belong.
(08:18):
And I think that's one of the hardest parts is most people
feel that in order to be respectful, you would have to
let people run their own way, right?
But it's almost the opposite. You know, if you're not
providing feedback on direction,vision, and helping, it's not,
it's not dictating, it's not micromanaging, it's engagement.
(08:40):
You know, how do you team memberfit into this equation?
How do you contribute to this? How do you see yourself in the
future? Here's what growth means, and
it's getting everyone bought in to where you're running and
teaching all managers in the business.
Middle managers are so important, so if they can't
communicate that to your frontline, then you fail.
(09:01):
You know you have to make sure what you're doing at the top
makes it way down to every levelof your company has every person
could be a weak link and preventyou from serving your customers
how you need to, serving our community how you need to and
serving each other how how is best.
So we've been successful on justhere's where we're going.
(09:24):
Here's our strategic vision. Every month I share our
financials and talk about how things are going.
Sometimes it doesn't go well andI don't hide from it.
And our whole executive team is incredibly transparent, so no
one feels like decisions are being made over here and they
don't know what's going to happen.
(09:45):
You know, having clarity and having the responsibility of
someone trusting you with their livelihood is a big
responsibility that we do not take lightly.
You know, we want to continuously be working towards
that trust in that, that, that respect that we have for our
employees that they, they feel that for us that we're working
(10:07):
every day to make this better sothat they can have a better life
too. OK, You know, I'm, I'm like
taken aback a little bit becauseI don't usually hear people say
that, you know, just that mindset and having that for your
people, you know, especially as you're talking.
I'm, I'm hearing you saying that, you know, we're always
trying to earn our employee stress, not the other way
(10:29):
around. The fact that you have to share
your financial to me, that's huge.
You know, I talked to a lot of really, you know, like really
successful individuals, you know, in this podcast in the
past where they, they've shared like they've actually equitized
the entire company where they don't buy companies until they
know that every employee has access to that because he sees
that when he buys companies, a lot of grief happens where all
(10:52):
of these people that have been there for years.
And I know you guys have a long tenure with your people as well.
And I want to know, you know, just #1 you know, I know it took
generations for your, for you guys to be in that mindset.
But let's say a new company today.
How can they learn from your experience, your family's, you
know, experience that willingness to be open and
(11:13):
vulnerable with your people to be where you guys are today?
Someone new that maybe just fiveyears in business it's.
So different than when you go totherapy.
It's accepting and owning thingsthat can be truths you as a for
profit business, there's nothingwrong with profit.
I find when businesses get comfortable with owning that
they need a profit. They want a profit that helps
(11:35):
everything go around. It translates into more
transparency because there's less awkwardness and guilt on
people in higher levels make good money and they take a lot
of risk and they but they can begood stewards of that and they
can give back. So there's I think in business
(12:00):
sometimes you feel like you can do the profitable thing or the
right thing, you can do both andthat is a challenge that you see
businesses go through. So I may not perfectly answer
your question there like. That's actually a very good
answer because I have a friend right now, Ezra, he also has
this massive agency and he also has a podcast where where he
(12:20):
would open the podcast with likelet's go and make money while
changing the world or like or, or, or he would say we can, we
can change the world while we profit, right?
So, you know, I can hear that from you as well.
But to me, the biggest point is that you guys are sharing your
financials, right? That's huge.
I just, I just want you to like take that in well.
And we, we, we always have, but we add more dialogue to it, you
(12:45):
know? Yeah, I like that.
So you're opening the doors for it for you people to actually
share with you. OK, cool.
And and you know, I want to talkabout, you know, something that
comes up in this podcast a lot, you know which I'll call it a
three C's now and I want to get your take on it.
You know, I've I've talked to somany guys here and overall that
concluded to to those 3C's that now I used to talk about.
(13:09):
The first one is clarity, which you've already talked, you know,
like touched on, wait, you know,feel free to add more.
And the second one is communication, which you also
touched on. And then the final one is
capacity, which I I, I definitely want to get into more
in right review, because I don'tknow, three generation.
There's so many feedback and, you know, like learnings that
you guys have had. So the first C and, and this
(13:30):
three CS based off all the guests that I've had here, it
contributes to retention. You know, it it like, you know,
it also cut costs for, you know,people living all the time, like
why all these different problemsthat we see today, right.
So the first C as far as clarity, where do you guys see
that play out most in your company?
(13:51):
Role clarity. Is this yours?
Should it be delegated? Talking through that openly, you
know, when people's desires for a career path and what the
company needs are different, gotto talk about that.
So that's clarity. You don't need two people
running two different ways. Clarity is when certain roles
aren't communicating clearly. It's the leader's job to
(14:15):
facilitate that and make sure that's a direct conversation,
right? So all these things distract
from serving and our mission as a business.
And you can't grow if you don't have clarity in what you're
doing and who's doing what. So we have a lot of
conversations around this. Brené Brown has clear his kind.
We talk about that constantly. Because if I'm assuming you're
(14:37):
thinking this, but you're assuming I'm thinking this, then
we're going to run like this andnever we're just, we're just, we
could still grow and do well, but there's going to be too much
tension. Yeah, and there's.
It's OK to disagree, that's whatI think many people don't
recognize to get clarity can be bumpy, but that short term pain
(14:59):
is worth the gain right in relationship and all other
wonderful things I. Like that and and that actually
leads me to communication like how do you make sure that
clarity stays through communication as you're
navigating all of those responsibilities as a leader so
we. Have a lot of training for our
(15:19):
team around this and I always tell everyone that I work with
it's 10 seconds of awkward and then say your point and then
stop and let your team members speak or client speak.
Put the statement on the table and then look at it together.
Most people don't want to do it because it makes you sick to
your stomach to think about saying that 10 seconds of really
(15:42):
hard right. Awkward.
I like that and and. It's not.
We're a pretty cohesive company.We when we get recognized for
best place to work, we have some, we have 90% employee
retention. We have so many things going
well, but we have this all the time.
Everyone does. I think you don't.
You could trick yourself into not seeing where communication
(16:03):
is needed through blind spots and not wanting that 10 seconds
of pain. And the more you recognize your
blind spots and the more you work through, you know, seeing
the benefit of that 10 seconds, the more you do it and the
better you get as a business. I like that.
You know, I my, my brain works best when I put like numbers on
(16:27):
like problems. So the 10 seconds I may steal
it. Just a heads up, go for it.
Go for it. Yeah.
So, and the final piece of capacity, which is capacity, I
think that that's actually one of the most important pieces.
And the reason why I compiled these three CS, it's because of
the Gallup research that came out.
And it states that almost 70% ofemployee engagement, right, is
(16:48):
dependent on management, right, mostly frontline managers,
right. And usability, capacity is
always a problem in that area. And the fact that you guys have
90% retention, that's mind blowing.
You know, Gallup just wants companies to get to 17.
You guys are like, now we're at 90.
Yeah. So how do you guys go about
capacity when it comes to not not even just employees, but the
(17:11):
middle managers, Correct, You know, and the executive team as
well, right. And you don't.
Want to have too much too many layers because that slows you
down as well, right so and then deletes your message.
You want to make sure that you have a clear message through all
of your leaders, right So we so going to the number side of
things, we feel our quality of what we provide to the community
(17:33):
and our clients is dependent on having internal capacity.
So we have metrics and they're getting better every year on OK,
if X happens that triggers Y&Y means X amount of payroll that
can go towards service. So we're proactively hiring
instead of reactively hiring. You know, we, our competitors
(17:54):
and others, we see they wait till everyone is just dying and
the quality's done. The retention's going down of
clients. We don't do that.
We we do it based off of objective metrics.
And there's some people that have different gifts than
others. There's some people that are
really good at X and they can manage more of that than this
(18:15):
person. So we make sure we're balancing
ability and work flows and all those good things.
But we really strive to be proactive.
And our date when we post a job,we have it where we are able to
get someone in the door in 30 days, which is crazy.
So we have a pipeline of people that have either said they want
(18:37):
to work with us or we've talked to them.
So we our team trusts us that wewon't let them know.
Wow, I like that cuz I like working advertising and one of
the biggest clients that I've worked with was Marvel Studios.
And back then I was managing a very small team compared to
Marvel. It was like 40 to 50.
(18:57):
Plus. I meet content creators, like
media buyers, just a combinationof the whole marketing
ecosystem. And then back then we don't stop
like our, you know, we, we had ateam that was in charge of just
making sure we get as many, you know, like eyeballs into a, you
know, you know, whatever we're selling back then, which we
would call just the impression, just as get get as many
(19:19):
impressions as you can so that we can always have interested
individuals that are ready to drop into that whenever we say,
OK, bye now, right. So I like that you guys are
doing that the same process, similar process to your own, you
know, like recruiting. And this also brought an
another, you know, like questionthat I hear all the time.
You know, the market is shiftinglike very drastically for a very
(19:39):
long time, you know, like employers were kind of in
charge. They were in the seat, they were
making the decision when to hire.
But now we're seeing that peopleare dropping off during, you
know, like the interview process.
And, you know, someone will takeone interview and they just
ghost. Yeah.
And I know that ghosting is not,you know, like personal.
A lot of employees are that genuinely.
(20:01):
If they feel like it's work, just trying to get work, but for
a very long time, employers has been, you know, they've had the
agency to ghost. You know, to me, even though
tools, you know, like sentence e-mail that people get when they
apply, you spend months applyingfor a job and then you get that
one sentence e-mail. Hey, sorry, you are not a good
fit. We we went to someone else.
(20:22):
Thank you have a great day. That that alone is ghost.
I feel like employees have been doing that for a very long time.
But now that the market shift now employees, they have the
cards and they're the one making, you know, anyone can go
to TikTok nowadays and, and havea TikTok shop.
Why should you go work for someone and spend all the time
and, and maybe one day they justdecide to cut everyone off,
(20:42):
right. And I know you guys are doing
extremely well on the retention side and then also getting
people interested in your product or your, you know, your
own company or your clients. Like what, what have you guys
learned? So the man, you know, like
managers and like employees thatare always saying, Oh, they're
ghosting us. Like what's happening?
Like no one wants to work. Like, yeah, what can you say to
(21:04):
those individuals? You don't really.
Have that issue, right. So we are fortunate in that way,
but oh gosh, so I lost it and then I found it Good, good.
We, we work in a very complicated space that is very
misunderstood. So insurance is an incredibly
(21:26):
complicated product and incredibly frustrating from a
consumer's perspective. So our team takes a lot of pride
in explaining it to your client.I guess what I'm trying to get
at is we don't have ghost in because our team for the most
part sees the value in what we're doing and knows how
(21:48):
important it is and the ripple effect it creates.
So we through our interviewing process have found ways to find
engaged team players committed to teamwork and continuous
improvement is our slogan. But we interviewed to that so
that we have engaged people right out the gate.
And if they're not engaged in it, they don't find how they can
(22:08):
impact. We do cut we part ways with
someone quickly, so very quick into their time with us.
We can tell is this something they're going to find their way
to have a passion or can they dothey see themselves here?
And if they don't, it's totally fine.
So I like that. We want we want to have dignity
(22:31):
and have we want to be upfront. Hey, it seems like this isn't
something that sparks any joy for you, if that's the question
you're trying to. No, no, no.
Yeah, yeah. You know, I have this friend,
maybe you've heard his name, like Gary V He's like this
Internet personality who talks about, you know, he hires very
fast and he. Yeah.
And he fires very, very fast, Right.
(22:53):
And I know when it comes to executive level, I've talked to
a lot of other leaders that havetold me you hire very slow on
the top because, you know, it's,it's a very important role, you
know, a lot of money, Yes. And now people are throwing
bonuses everywhere. Yes, I've had also another CEO
who got hired, guy given all these benefits, like a lot of
(23:13):
money. And then he'd realized this is
not for me and he wanted to leave.
But those benefits were holding it back, right?
Isn't that a good? Thing for like companies to just
throw benefits everywhere well. You, so we believe, like sign
on. Bonuses to be to be precise.
Sign on. Bonuses we we don't do that.
We believe deeply in fair compensation.
(23:35):
We do multiple compensation studies.
We have multiple third parties that help us validate a correct
fair comp package and we tie a lot of it to results, you know,
so it's fair. You see, we, we both are running
towards the same thing. I've never believed that
throwing money at a situation ever fixed it unless, unless
(24:01):
it's a clear, you know, it's gotto fit in.
You can't just throw money at something and you know, we got
to make sure that the comps fair.
And if it was public, could you look yourself in the mirror,
talk to people on why you did XYZ?
You know, if I did a signing bonus for you, but I haven't
done it historically, is that the right move?
I don't know it could, but I we haven't done that to date.
(24:22):
I know places like engineering firms or other that are having a
hard time with recruiting in general.
Oh yeah, that's a needed strategy.
So we just don't have as much experience with that, right?
Well, you can throw a lot of money if it's a guy wearing a
fedora and a banana style. Yeah, OK.
It takes a lot of work. You might think every day waking
up 6:00 AM with a three month old baby done that.
(24:45):
You know to. Dress up and show up every day.
OK, but just just so you know, anyone out there is thinking
about throwing money, There's a guy wearing a fedora right here.
But yeah, so as far as like whenit comes to just like retention,
peace to me. I'm trying to go back to the 90%
because I know a lot of companies are struggling to
(25:05):
that. And number one, I just want to
say bravo to the whole team because I know it takes a team
to get to those stats. That's, that's, that's just mind
blowing. And, and we, we have a lot of
listeners here and I want to talk about #1 the retention
piece and how that correlates the benefits.
You know, you mentioned that, you know, just insurance itself
(25:26):
is just very confusing for a lotof, you know, people in general.
And you guys make it your goal to make sure people understand
like how do you go about that piece?
Number one, just what exactly isinsurance in the workplace?
Because I, I think sometimes we overlook how much people
actually know. You know, I've, I've been to
(25:47):
companies where a lot of employees don't even know that
they have these benefits available because no one talks
to them about it. But I, but I love that you guys
have that education arm within your company.
Yes, that's constantly educating.
But number one, I want you to help me understand what is what
is insurance and how those that you know that retention
correlates to that benefit. So within our own employees or
(26:09):
what we do for clients both. Yeah, if you're comfortable with
sharing clients, sure. Oh.
Yeah, I didn't share Bradley, you know, so for clients, we
pride ourselves on if we can help your hourly employee get
access to care through an affordable fashion, we've done
our job and we've done more goodthan a nonprofit in a way, you
(26:32):
know, taking care of people and their health needs is so
important. So we we strive to communicate
in multiple different ways and have a whole structure around
campaigns you can do to help explain things because the
terminology alone doesn't make sense.
You know you're sick, you need to go to the doctor.
(26:54):
How do you find that doctor? Well, here are some tools that
help you select the doctor that for the highest quality care,
best results. There's all sort of tools that
you can use to help drive peopleto the best outcomes for their
personal health. And most of the time, if you
haven't been sick, you, you don't know how complicated it is
(27:16):
and you're so stressed. You know, think of that hourly
worker that's a very, that couldbe 20% of their income just to
hit their deductible, their takehome pay.
You know, think about that alonein a plan design.
You say you have financial stress, you have, you need to
get time off to go or coordinatefor your kids, all those things
(27:38):
to try and find the right doctor.
And sometimes if it's a specialized need, then you have
to go to another doctor. So it's incredibly stressful
and, and sometimes through you maybe prescribe something, a
drug or a procedure and you get this scary letter that says it's
not covered. Well, there's all sorts of steps
along the way that our team works with our clients on
(28:02):
assuring their client, their employees, here's what you need
to do. It's going to be OK.
Take care of your health. We'll get this sorted for you.
And that gives our liaisons at the companies we work with a lot
of Peace of Mind, right? Knowing that we're their
advocate for their team so that their team can find the care
(28:22):
they need. Because a lot of times people
find their doctors by asking their friends who they go to
that doesn't take into account outcomes.
Is that doctor high have high success on this procedure?
Are there costs in line with what's what's reasonable or do
(28:43):
they have a higher cost structure?
There's so many ways that we canhelp, and we do, and it's an
absolute joy to be able to contribute in that way.
That's, that's that, that that just open a whole realm of
questions because, you know, as you were saying that I, I got so
chill. I was like, now, now I see why
you guys maintain that 90%, but I'm saying I'm the interviewer.
(29:05):
Wake up Abraham and you can be chilled here, but thank you for
explaining that. And then do you guys have tools
within your marketplace? I'm assuming you have a
marketplace to be able to do allthat.
Yeah, OK. So we.
Customize. No, we customize we have in
house. We can make a website for you,
we can make it out for you. We can help you make a
(29:26):
presentation that's recordable. We can have individuals sit down
with every single one of your employees like we have all these
different tools that we can pullbased getting as.
Much feedback as you can, yeah. It's incredible multiple touches
and we don't want it to be and some, but you know, I, I feel a
duty as a broker to not contribute to the issues that we
(29:50):
are having in healthcare, right?There's cost issues, there's
access issues, and we can eitherbe contributing or trying to
make it better. And every day we're trying to
make it better, right I. Love that.
Wow. OK.
So my next question is benefits and hopefully I don't forget all
the questions just by chilling. Me too much.
(30:13):
Let what exactly are benefits, because I feel like a lot of
companies don't do benefits verywell yeah, you know, I, I know
friends that have incredible benefits like I have a friend
who works for Google, right and they have incredible like when I
say benefits, I want to drop everything and go to Google and
work there. But but then he has worked for
(30:33):
Apple, like all these companies,so he takes it for granted.
Yes, in my in my opinion, but then he says that he doesn't
need all that yes, I'm sorry, are you insane?
I, I think those companies are doing phenomenal at benefits and
I know they have a whole army ofbenefits right, you know, in
general, but I, I want to understand why is it that a lot
of you know, like mid science companies, they do it very
horribly. I, I know some leaders that are
(30:56):
struggling with like retention and they say, well, I give him
and this, I gave him that. I gave him this and to me, I
found that very wrong to say I gave them.
You know that that term alone isa red flag for me, which tells
me that you are not getting as much feedback as you can for me.
People don't understand what is it that they need.
It's. And I can see the frustration
from an employer and owner's perspective is so expensive
(31:19):
until you get to a large budget.This is a large percentage of
your your total spend. And if your team doesn't see the
value, I get it. Like I get where that that's
frustration and that's where we help our employers with their
employees. From an employee perspective,
(31:39):
there's so many things that you can view as benefits.
So there's core benefits that are medical, dental, life
insurance works. So like accident coverage there
you could, I'm I'm blanking on some, but pet and there's all
sorts of like products you can buy for the basic.
(32:00):
But then if you go a step further, we feel like your
employee handbook and policies mirror what you're trying to do
that can really enhance your benefits as well.
So looking at your time off schedule, does it complement
looking at your Wellness program?
(32:23):
So Wellness can be financial Wellness, it could be
traditional mental health as youthink of it, but it also can be
spiritual. So depending on the company and
what direction you're looking at, we, we as a company, we have
financial training courses we pay for, for our team and their
(32:44):
children and their parents that allows them access to how to
financially plan. And that's one aspect that's not
a product we sell or, you know, we work with clients on, but
it's something that we advise that works.
We also have ways to improve your, your fitness and your
activity reimbursements for gym active wear, things like that,
(33:05):
little policies. And then on the spiritual side,
we have corporate chaplains thatare non denominational.
You don't, you're not required to participate, but there's a
lot of people that that is a waythat they can engage and feel
whole. So we're making sure we're
touching all these different buckets from a benefits
perspective to make sure that they're all cohesive in
(33:28):
communicating the message that we're saying we care about you,
you know, and on top of all of that, we have a concierge
product that allows people to text with a tool to ask these
questions. Do I have this?
And it can pull that without them having to be embarrassed
and go to their manager or HR and ask, do I have access to
this? Can you help me with this?
(33:49):
Right. We're just trying to find as
many ways as possible and look at benefits more than just the
health and core offerings, right?
Huh, OK, I can, you know, I lovethat you guys have, you know,
the, the, the physical, the spiritual, the mental, the
emotional, all those four different areas.
(34:10):
We just like we know we work with people.
People are complex. Everyone has their own beliefs,
right? They have their own values and
we want to meet them where they are right and and work with
them, which is big. It's so again, I'm not a Abraham
Fedoral point for you guys, but so in a in in in like a real
world scenario. And you know, this may be just
(34:34):
like trade secrets. So you don't have to go into it
if you like it, but I want you to kind of help me.
Let's let's play a game here because again, I genuinely want
to understand benefits because Iwork with people and you know,
the term comes up. Even he Leona, the company
behind the podcast. We've been getting a lot of
approach from benefits, you know, like individuals,
companies, etcetera, because theproduct is focused on bringing
(34:56):
in, you know, like middle managers and then giving them an
Ave. for them to work with execsand the rest of the teams.
But mental health being a priority.
And I want to know how you know that there's been a lot of stats
around mental health and how it cost the company.
And I want to know from your ownperspective, your own
experiences, things that you've done in the past or all all like
(35:17):
right now present, how do you guys see mental health play out
in, in in the benefits realm? Are people seeking it?
Is this something that employeesare asking about it or like
execs are demanding to give to employees?
It is a sad state we're in currently.
There's not enough psychiatrists, they're not
(35:39):
enough providers for the need that's in the community.
So at one point, if you had a child under the age of 10, there
was two people in town that did that.
Well, there's a lot of people intown.
And are you to wait till your child's well on a path where
their mental health is harder toget back on track than
addressing it when you first seeit?
(36:00):
So there's, there's a provider need in the community.
So we have partnered with some telehealth options.
So through your phone, through the Internet, you can get
quicker appointments nationwide with quality psychiatric care
before it becomes an emergency. So depending on the market, so
(36:23):
depending on where the client's at, there's different provider
needs. So if you have mental health
that requires there's pharmaceutical drug medicine to
get you back on track, you need a good psychiatrist.
And in order to get a good psychiatrist, it can take up to
a year to get in with them. And if you're in a state of an
(36:44):
emergency, that's not not going to work.
So these telehealth options havebeen fantastic because we've
internally and with clients havebeen able to get people in with
providers quicker to get a treatment plan started.
So then they can wait to get into that provider in town, 9,
12 months, depending on how longthat goes.
So that's access to care. The other route is if talk
(37:07):
therapy can help you. There's people that specialize
in different things. So making sure that you get
through through different programs, Eaps or one of them
get in with a therapist that canaddress the need that you're
facing and help you proactively manage that is again, so
incredibly important. So we're making sure we're
talking about these things and that that may seem overly basic,
(37:31):
but if you see that an employee needs something and this is
training we do for our managers,here are the things as a manager
you can say are at their disposal.
So we internally, if we have someone in crisis or their
child's in crisis, hey, you havethis Teledoc option.
Hey, you have this EAP. So counselors and therapist
(37:55):
options, we also have this corporate chaplain if that's an
option you need as well. And then we also then have a
benevolence fund for all our employees that if a lot of good
therapy, a lot of good mental health providers are out of
pocket cost right now. So we have a fund people can
applied for anonymously to pay for all of that.
(38:16):
So we don't want you to get off track because this is an
unplanned expense or not take care of yourself because it's a
expense. So we provide them a bucket of
money outside of our HSA contribution and all these other
things we do to help care for that person I like.
That and and then, you know, I like that you first highlighted
(38:39):
that that's a surge of of like big shortage.
That you. Know we we just like a big
problem that I think a lot of you know B2B companies don't
recognize usable that's like we we need more right, we need more
but that's a huge problem right now there's not a lot of
professionals to cover that areathere's.
Also a lot of denial. This is my observation.
(39:00):
It is not backed by statistics or anything of that nature.
So I'll, I'll, I'll add that, but I feel too that we as a
society treat cancer, treat diabetics, treat other things
with how are you doing? How's it going?
But when it comes to mental health, we get scared and don't
do any of that it until we as a society get to the point where,
(39:23):
hey, how are you doing? You know, treating it no
different than anything else. I think it's, I think it's
harder as well because then you have an easy time saying, yes, I
have cancer because the test said I have cancer.
But if you have a mental health disease, you do not embrace that
diagnosis the same way. Which, this is all my opinion,
(39:44):
creates an issue as well. Absolutely.
Oh yeah. I talked to a lot of people to
to like agree to what you just said about just I feel like the
stigma around mental health and and I know everyone says the
stigma, but it's such a big problem, right?
And when I say problem, not on the individual, the problem as
to whenever they hear depressionor whatever, right that that may
(40:08):
be immediately becomes a defective you're lesser than.
Yeah, which you are not, right, Right.
So so like. How can companies, you know,
create, you know, like create spaces where if an employee is
going through that or an employer is going through that
as well, how can they make sure that they feel supported in that
space to not identify with, withthat mental illness that may
(40:30):
hinder, you know, their chances within the company, their own
personal growth within the company?
How can a a company as a whole, or or the whole body of the
organization create spaces wherepeople can feel like they're
supported? You, you have to be objective of
what the job is and what's needed and you have to have
(40:52):
direct uncomfortable conversations.
Here's what's needed. I know you're going through X
OK, let's work together on how we get it done.
Here's the job you're working towards.
OK, how do we balance that? I, I felt a different, it's not
the same, not even close. But as a new mom, as working and
balancing all that, I felt like I would get left behind because
(41:12):
I was trying to balance all the things.
And I have a fantastic husband who helped, but my with the
right management, we were able to balance it together.
So that, and it's no different for anyone with anything.
OK, you have a cancer diagnosis and have chemo.
OK, let's work this out. Here's what needs to get done.
(41:32):
How do you take care of you? And we have what needs to get
done. It's overly simple, you know,
but and if you have to take leave, take leave.
We'll work out. You know it's it can be simple
if you look at it as just another thing that you're
working through, right? Yeah, I mean, thank you for
even, you know, like sharing your own personal experience as
(41:54):
a mom because I think benefits sometimes do leave out the, you
know, the new parents. Yep, a lot, especially moms.
As a new parent myself, my wife parents, you know, she works in
healthcare and they have they didn't have any, you know,
benefits for her as a as a new mom.
And she she got so, you know, like burnt out about that
experience that she decided to leave and she was one of the top
(42:18):
employees. Like she was running that office
and all of the employees lean lean, you know, lean on her and
how Boston even check in, just send her a gift card and like,
right. It was like and and she
literally did not open the card.She just put it in the trash,
right? And she's like, I'm never going
back. I'm just like, yeah, you
definitely don't, which is. You know, such a sad state, but
(42:42):
it's not a uncommon story, right?
You know, there's, you just needa little grace sometimes and
that grace is not expensive and it's not hard.
You just have to be a little uncomfortable, you know, and
that goes back to that 10 secondrule.
Hey, I see you're struggling. This being a new mom is hard.
(43:03):
Put the issue on the table. How do we get you through the
next few months and get you back?
Because we, we need you. We see, we see potential in you
and you know, that's what we need.
The harder part is when you haveperformance and mental health,
and that is probably what peoplethink of most, right?
You know, But again, what's needed for the job, right?
(43:25):
And are you talking through that?
Wow, that's. Powerful.
You know, I wasn't going to steal the 10 second rule, but
you brought it back. So it's from now on it's
Abraham's. So thank you for reminding me.
I'm still from now on, you guys are going to hear me talk about
the 10 second rule and obviouslyI give credit to my guests.
Yeah. So we've come to the end of this
(43:45):
conversation and I hope I can have you in Season 2, which will
be a full production here. But after everything that we've
talked about here, just how is your spirit right now?
In what way? Just in.
General, in general, everything that's happening before you
walked into this studio and now that we had this whole whole
conversation, I. I feel I am incredibly blessed
(44:10):
and have such a great gift to beable to do good.
And this today is a great reminder.
Regardless of the bumps you you do, you can do good.
Power doesn't have to just be bad.
It can be a force of good too. So this is a nice reminder of
that. So thank you.
(44:31):
I love that. Wow, well thank you.
I'm also going to steal that too.
Power doesn't have to be doesn'talways have to be bad.
It could be a good now I messed it up.
I'll go back and listen and it will be an another Abraham
court. So.
But again, thank you so much forbeing here today.
This has been a refreshing conversation.
I've been up since 3:00 AM but this has given me the.
(44:52):
How's your spirit? Yeah, my.
Spirit is currently doing B boy dance and backflips Powered by
Coffee 6:00 AM. But you know, I'm managing.
I. I think I have some time to nap
today. No good.
You'll be good then. You can do anything with a nap.
Yeah, but. Again, thank you so much for
being here. Thank you for having.
Me and I. I look forward to, you know,
just getting to know you more. So no I.
(45:14):
Love it. Thank you.
Clarity is when certain roles aren't communicating clearly.
It's the leader's job to facilitate that and make sure
that's a direct conversation. Can't grow if you don't have
clarity in what you're doing andwho's doing what.
When we post a job, we have it where we are able to get someone
in the door in 30 days, which iscrazy.
Our team trusts us that we won'tlet them drown.
(00:21):
So we're proactively hiring instead of reactively hiring.
We've been successful on just here's where we're going, here's
our strategic vision. Every month I share our
financials and talk about how things are going.
Sometimes it doesn't go well andI don't hide from it.
And our whole executive team is incredibly transparent, so no
(00:42):
one feels like decisions are being made over here and they
don't know what's going to happen.
And having the responsibility ofsomeone trusting you with their
livelihood is a big responsibility that we do not
take lightly. You know, we want to
continuously be working towards that trust and that respect that
we have for employees that they,they feel that for us that we're
(01:05):
working every day to make this better so that they can have a
better life too. What if the secret to retaining
top talent was not about perks or trendy benefits, but building
a culture people genuinely trust?
(01:27):
In this episode of Helion Insight, I'm joined by Amber
Miller Manning, CEO of The Miller Group, A People First
insurance firm that's redefiningwhat retention looks like in a
traditionally high turnover industry.
With a 90% employee retention rate, Amber brings both clarity
(01:47):
and compassion to how she leads.We talked about what it takes to
create consistency in uncertain times, how to lead with care
while driving results, and why employee experience is no longer
just an HR issue, but a leadership mandate.
This is a playbook for building a workplace where people want to
(02:12):
stay. So let's get into it.
All right, Amber, thank you for being here today.
And you know, I just want to saycongratulations.
I know you've been ACEO for the Miller Group for three years
now, but I want to officially congratulate you.
You're kind of course and I wanted to talk to you about just
(02:35):
the experience of you, you know,like starting from benefits to
now being ACEO, like how was that experience like for you
personally going through that? So we so I'm third generation
family operator and owner. We have bylaws you have to work
outside of the business for a while.
So it didn't. Benefits was the middle of my
(02:55):
career on the way to CEO, right?And I worked in every
departments but benefits was thelargest chunk of time.
Wow, OK, yeah, I don't, I don't hear it very often because, you
know, I've talked to a lot of individuals that that I've also
went through generational, you know, like where they have to
become CEOs, but you know, I, I don't hear them talk about that.
(03:15):
Why do you think that was important?
Was that something like implemented by I'm?
I'm assuming that the original founder your grandfather?
No. So we, my grandfather was
amazing, but he didn't have muchstructure that he applied.
He was just building the business and doing a beautiful
job serving our clients second generation.
(03:36):
My dad and uncle put more parameters around it because
we're an insurance broker. So we advise on the business
needs, surety needs and the health insurance needs.
And we've seen so many businesses where there's been
struggles. So we've implemented rules to
protect our family, company and just our clients from having
(03:58):
someone in the wrong seat and just having someone in because
you want to work with family or you feel you deserve it.
That's not how we operate. We operate if there's a job, you
need it. If there's a job, I'm not saying
that correctly. If we have a the company has a
job and you qualify for it and you've been successful somewhere
(04:19):
else, then you get recruited to come and work here and then you
get opportunities if you're goodat what you do, but you don't
get them just cuz you last your last name.
Yeah, Wow. Well, that's very powerful.
And, you know, they just, you know, I took my mind to the T,
you know, the TV series Succession.
So you guys are succession, but with a lot of integrity and you
(04:41):
actually got to earn it. Yes, to to be.
You know the name. As you see that like the mental
health of the characters they portray, you know, there's a lot
of and we feel this for everyonein our company.
You have a lot of pride when youare good at what you do, you
contribute regardless of the level.
(05:01):
So we're very big on making surethat we take care of the whole
person and allow them to be successful, stretch in different
jobs, but have it where they cango home satisfied and happy and
take care of their family because they're in the right
position. Right.
And, and, you know, like one of the other things that I hear,
(05:23):
it's like the term like family. I, you know, I actually had a
guest here who, who was ACFO as a company and he left because he
felt like, you know, he just could not find himself in, in
the company that he was working in because they use the Word
family. And I want to just ask you this
like how do you go about especially the company as a
whole, how do you guys go about just making sure the people that
(05:47):
are coming in feel like they belong with the term family?
So we are a business that we canscale a lot of revenue with not
not a lot of employees. So it's incredibly important
that everyone is working together.
So I did it yesterday. I'm the final interview on
anyone we hire and our team is really big on kind of defining
(06:09):
what our culture is, defining what respect looks like,
defining how to voice your opinion, how you engage in our
community so you feel like it's family.
And just like family, you have hard conversations.
Things don't always go well, butyou respect each other and we
(06:30):
make sure to manage to that thatwe make sure that everyone is
working together so that it feels like family.
You know, when one person's hit,people jump to help, you know,
it's not like you're in it alone.
And being alone is one of the biggest things we see right now
with impacting health, impactingour communities, or people just
(06:51):
feel isolated, right? Yeah, I mean, you know, I, I
actually had a, you know, at some point I had a team of
around 60. It also tells you the type of
leader. I'm trying to think of the
number. It's been so long and I need to
go back and look at the roster. But yeah, I had a team of in the
60s and I'm also trying to cultivate that cuz I grew up in
(07:12):
a very big family where I feel like I was connected to
everyone. Everyone had a purpose within
the family as a whole and we were very like integrated, like
the cousins, the aunties, prettymuch everyone add to the family
and we had a great time. So I was trying to cultivate
that within my own company in the early 8 stages of my career,
early on 20s, I was very successful.
(07:34):
I built a very successful agency, but everything just fell
because I didn't do it well. And I want to talk to you as
someone who has been in a company that has been around for
three generations and I want to figure out how have you guys
done it? Well, you've kind of talked
about a few, you know, like points of like how you guys did
it from from your grandfather tonow to you today.
(07:56):
And feel free to use my story asan example because I was someone
who was I had no culture in the company.
I felt like I had a culture, butI didn't understand what culture
was. I had a bunch of people in a
actually in this room where where we would have meetings.
But then, you know, I would justlet anyone just do whatever they
wanted to do because I wanted them to feel like they belong.
(08:18):
And I think that's one of the hardest parts is most people
feel that in order to be respectful, you would have to
let people run their own way, right?
But it's almost the opposite. You know, if you're not
providing feedback on direction,vision, and helping, it's not,
it's not dictating, it's not micromanaging, it's engagement.
(08:40):
You know, how do you team memberfit into this equation?
How do you contribute to this? How do you see yourself in the
future? Here's what growth means, and
it's getting everyone bought in to where you're running and
teaching all managers in the business.
Middle managers are so important, so if they can't
communicate that to your frontline, then you fail.
(09:01):
You know you have to make sure what you're doing at the top
makes it way down to every levelof your company has every person
could be a weak link and preventyou from serving your customers
how you need to, serving our community how you need to and
serving each other how how is best.
So we've been successful on justhere's where we're going.
(09:24):
Here's our strategic vision. Every month I share our
financials and talk about how things are going.
Sometimes it doesn't go well andI don't hide from it.
And our whole executive team is incredibly transparent, so no
one feels like decisions are being made over here and they
don't know what's going to happen.
(09:45):
You know, having clarity and having the responsibility of
someone trusting you with their livelihood is a big
responsibility that we do not take lightly.
You know, we want to continuously be working towards
that trust in that, that, that respect that we have for our
employees that they, they feel that for us that we're working
(10:07):
every day to make this better sothat they can have a better life
too. OK, You know, I'm, I'm like
taken aback a little bit becauseI don't usually hear people say
that, you know, just that mindset and having that for your
people, you know, especially as you're talking.
I'm, I'm hearing you saying that, you know, we're always
trying to earn our employee stress, not the other way
(10:29):
around. The fact that you have to share
your financial to me, that's huge.
You know, I talked to a lot of really, you know, like really
successful individuals, you know, in this podcast in the
past where they, they've shared like they've actually equitized
the entire company where they don't buy companies until they
know that every employee has access to that because he sees
that when he buys companies, a lot of grief happens where all
(10:52):
of these people that have been there for years.
And I know you guys have a long tenure with your people as well.
And I want to know, you know, just #1 you know, I know it took
generations for your, for you guys to be in that mindset.
But let's say a new company today.
How can they learn from your experience, your family's, you
know, experience that willingness to be open and
(11:13):
vulnerable with your people to be where you guys are today?
Someone new that maybe just fiveyears in business it's.
So different than when you go totherapy.
It's accepting and owning thingsthat can be truths you as a for
profit business, there's nothingwrong with profit.
I find when businesses get comfortable with owning that
they need a profit. They want a profit that helps
(11:35):
everything go around. It translates into more
transparency because there's less awkwardness and guilt on
people in higher levels make good money and they take a lot
of risk and they but they can begood stewards of that and they
can give back. So there's I think in business
(12:00):
sometimes you feel like you can do the profitable thing or the
right thing, you can do both andthat is a challenge that you see
businesses go through. So I may not perfectly answer
your question there like. That's actually a very good
answer because I have a friend right now, Ezra, he also has
this massive agency and he also has a podcast where where he
(12:20):
would open the podcast with likelet's go and make money while
changing the world or like or, or, or he would say we can, we
can change the world while we profit, right?
So, you know, I can hear that from you as well.
But to me, the biggest point is that you guys are sharing your
financials, right? That's huge.
I just, I just want you to like take that in well.
And we, we, we always have, but we add more dialogue to it, you
(12:45):
know? Yeah, I like that.
So you're opening the doors for it for you people to actually
share with you. OK, cool.
And and you know, I want to talkabout, you know, something that
comes up in this podcast a lot, you know which I'll call it a
three C's now and I want to get your take on it.
You know, I've I've talked to somany guys here and overall that
concluded to to those 3C's that now I used to talk about.
(13:09):
The first one is clarity, which you've already talked, you know,
like touched on, wait, you know,feel free to add more.
And the second one is communication, which you also
touched on. And then the final one is
capacity, which I I, I definitely want to get into more
in right review, because I don'tknow, three generation.
There's so many feedback and, you know, like learnings that
you guys have had. So the first C and, and this
(13:30):
three CS based off all the guests that I've had here, it
contributes to retention. You know, it it like, you know,
it also cut costs for, you know,people living all the time, like
why all these different problemsthat we see today, right.
So the first C as far as clarity, where do you guys see
that play out most in your company?
(13:51):
Role clarity. Is this yours?
Should it be delegated? Talking through that openly, you
know, when people's desires for a career path and what the
company needs are different, gotto talk about that.
So that's clarity. You don't need two people
running two different ways. Clarity is when certain roles
aren't communicating clearly. It's the leader's job to
(14:15):
facilitate that and make sure that's a direct conversation,
right? So all these things distract
from serving and our mission as a business.
And you can't grow if you don't have clarity in what you're
doing and who's doing what. So we have a lot of
conversations around this. Brené Brown has clear his kind.
We talk about that constantly. Because if I'm assuming you're
(14:37):
thinking this, but you're assuming I'm thinking this, then
we're going to run like this andnever we're just, we're just, we
could still grow and do well, but there's going to be too much
tension. Yeah, and there's.
It's OK to disagree, that's whatI think many people don't
recognize to get clarity can be bumpy, but that short term pain
(14:59):
is worth the gain right in relationship and all other
wonderful things I. Like that and and that actually
leads me to communication like how do you make sure that
clarity stays through communication as you're
navigating all of those responsibilities as a leader so
we. Have a lot of training for our
(15:19):
team around this and I always tell everyone that I work with
it's 10 seconds of awkward and then say your point and then
stop and let your team members speak or client speak.
Put the statement on the table and then look at it together.
Most people don't want to do it because it makes you sick to
your stomach to think about saying that 10 seconds of really
(15:42):
hard right. Awkward.
I like that and and. It's not.
We're a pretty cohesive company.We when we get recognized for
best place to work, we have some, we have 90% employee
retention. We have so many things going
well, but we have this all the time.
Everyone does. I think you don't.
You could trick yourself into not seeing where communication
(16:03):
is needed through blind spots and not wanting that 10 seconds
of pain. And the more you recognize your
blind spots and the more you work through, you know, seeing
the benefit of that 10 seconds, the more you do it and the
better you get as a business. I like that.
You know, I my, my brain works best when I put like numbers on
(16:27):
like problems. So the 10 seconds I may steal
it. Just a heads up, go for it.
Go for it. Yeah.
So, and the final piece of capacity, which is capacity, I
think that that's actually one of the most important pieces.
And the reason why I compiled these three CS, it's because of
the Gallup research that came out.
And it states that almost 70% ofemployee engagement, right, is
(16:48):
dependent on management, right, mostly frontline managers,
right. And usability, capacity is
always a problem in that area. And the fact that you guys have
90% retention, that's mind blowing.
You know, Gallup just wants companies to get to 17.
You guys are like, now we're at 90.
Yeah. So how do you guys go about
capacity when it comes to not not even just employees, but the
(17:11):
middle managers, Correct, You know, and the executive team as
well, right. And you don't.
Want to have too much too many layers because that slows you
down as well, right so and then deletes your message.
You want to make sure that you have a clear message through all
of your leaders, right So we so going to the number side of
things, we feel our quality of what we provide to the community
(17:33):
and our clients is dependent on having internal capacity.
So we have metrics and they're getting better every year on OK,
if X happens that triggers Y&Y means X amount of payroll that
can go towards service. So we're proactively hiring
instead of reactively hiring. You know, we, our competitors
(17:54):
and others, we see they wait till everyone is just dying and
the quality's done. The retention's going down of
clients. We don't do that.
We we do it based off of objective metrics.
And there's some people that have different gifts than
others. There's some people that are
really good at X and they can manage more of that than this
(18:15):
person. So we make sure we're balancing
ability and work flows and all those good things.
But we really strive to be proactive.
And our date when we post a job,we have it where we are able to
get someone in the door in 30 days, which is crazy.
So we have a pipeline of people that have either said they want
(18:37):
to work with us or we've talked to them.
So we our team trusts us that wewon't let them know.
Wow, I like that cuz I like working advertising and one of
the biggest clients that I've worked with was Marvel Studios.
And back then I was managing a very small team compared to
Marvel. It was like 40 to 50.
(18:57):
Plus. I meet content creators, like
media buyers, just a combinationof the whole marketing
ecosystem. And then back then we don't stop
like our, you know, we, we had ateam that was in charge of just
making sure we get as many, you know, like eyeballs into a, you
know, you know, whatever we're selling back then, which we
would call just the impression, just as get get as many
(19:19):
impressions as you can so that we can always have interested
individuals that are ready to drop into that whenever we say,
OK, bye now, right. So I like that you guys are
doing that the same process, similar process to your own, you
know, like recruiting. And this also brought an
another, you know, like questionthat I hear all the time.
You know, the market is shiftinglike very drastically for a very
(19:39):
long time, you know, like employers were kind of in
charge. They were in the seat, they were
making the decision when to hire.
But now we're seeing that peopleare dropping off during, you
know, like the interview process.
And, you know, someone will takeone interview and they just
ghost. Yeah.
And I know that ghosting is not,you know, like personal.
A lot of employees are that genuinely.
(20:01):
If they feel like it's work, just trying to get work, but for
a very long time, employers has been, you know, they've had the
agency to ghost. You know, to me, even though
tools, you know, like sentence e-mail that people get when they
apply, you spend months applyingfor a job and then you get that
one sentence e-mail. Hey, sorry, you are not a good
fit. We we went to someone else.
(20:22):
Thank you have a great day. That that alone is ghost.
I feel like employees have been doing that for a very long time.
But now that the market shift now employees, they have the
cards and they're the one making, you know, anyone can go
to TikTok nowadays and, and havea TikTok shop.
Why should you go work for someone and spend all the time
and, and maybe one day they justdecide to cut everyone off,
(20:42):
right. And I know you guys are doing
extremely well on the retention side and then also getting
people interested in your product or your, you know, your
own company or your clients. Like what, what have you guys
learned? So the man, you know, like
managers and like employees thatare always saying, Oh, they're
ghosting us. Like what's happening?
Like no one wants to work. Like, yeah, what can you say to
(21:04):
those individuals? You don't really.
Have that issue, right. So we are fortunate in that way,
but oh gosh, so I lost it and then I found it Good, good.
We, we work in a very complicated space that is very
misunderstood. So insurance is an incredibly
(21:26):
complicated product and incredibly frustrating from a
consumer's perspective. So our team takes a lot of pride
in explaining it to your client.I guess what I'm trying to get
at is we don't have ghost in because our team for the most
part sees the value in what we're doing and knows how
(21:48):
important it is and the ripple effect it creates.
So we through our interviewing process have found ways to find
engaged team players committed to teamwork and continuous
improvement is our slogan. But we interviewed to that so
that we have engaged people right out the gate.
And if they're not engaged in it, they don't find how they can
(22:08):
impact. We do cut we part ways with
someone quickly, so very quick into their time with us.
We can tell is this something they're going to find their way
to have a passion or can they dothey see themselves here?
And if they don't, it's totally fine.
So I like that. We want we want to have dignity
(22:31):
and have we want to be upfront. Hey, it seems like this isn't
something that sparks any joy for you, if that's the question
you're trying to. No, no, no.
Yeah, yeah. You know, I have this friend,
maybe you've heard his name, like Gary V He's like this
Internet personality who talks about, you know, he hires very
fast and he. Yeah.
And he fires very, very fast, Right.
(22:53):
And I know when it comes to executive level, I've talked to
a lot of other leaders that havetold me you hire very slow on
the top because, you know, it's,it's a very important role, you
know, a lot of money, Yes. And now people are throwing
bonuses everywhere. Yes, I've had also another CEO
who got hired, guy given all these benefits, like a lot of
(23:13):
money. And then he'd realized this is
not for me and he wanted to leave.
But those benefits were holding it back, right?
Isn't that a good? Thing for like companies to just
throw benefits everywhere well. You, so we believe, like sign
on. Bonuses to be to be precise.
Sign on. Bonuses we we don't do that.
We believe deeply in fair compensation.
(23:35):
We do multiple compensation studies.
We have multiple third parties that help us validate a correct
fair comp package and we tie a lot of it to results, you know,
so it's fair. You see, we, we both are running
towards the same thing. I've never believed that
throwing money at a situation ever fixed it unless, unless
(24:01):
it's a clear, you know, it's gotto fit in.
You can't just throw money at something and you know, we got
to make sure that the comps fair.
And if it was public, could you look yourself in the mirror,
talk to people on why you did XYZ?
You know, if I did a signing bonus for you, but I haven't
done it historically, is that the right move?
I don't know it could, but I we haven't done that to date.
(24:22):
I know places like engineering firms or other that are having a
hard time with recruiting in general.
Oh yeah, that's a needed strategy.
So we just don't have as much experience with that, right?
Well, you can throw a lot of money if it's a guy wearing a
fedora and a banana style. Yeah, OK.
It takes a lot of work. You might think every day waking
up 6:00 AM with a three month old baby done that.
(24:45):
You know to. Dress up and show up every day.
OK, but just just so you know, anyone out there is thinking
about throwing money, There's a guy wearing a fedora right here.
But yeah, so as far as like whenit comes to just like retention,
peace to me. I'm trying to go back to the 90%
because I know a lot of companies are struggling to
(25:05):
that. And number one, I just want to
say bravo to the whole team because I know it takes a team
to get to those stats. That's, that's, that's just mind
blowing. And, and we, we have a lot of
listeners here and I want to talk about #1 the retention
piece and how that correlates the benefits.
You know, you mentioned that, you know, just insurance itself
(25:26):
is just very confusing for a lotof, you know, people in general.
And you guys make it your goal to make sure people understand
like how do you go about that piece?
Number one, just what exactly isinsurance in the workplace?
Because I, I think sometimes we overlook how much people
actually know. You know, I've, I've been to
(25:47):
companies where a lot of employees don't even know that
they have these benefits available because no one talks
to them about it. But I, but I love that you guys
have that education arm within your company.
Yes, that's constantly educating.
But number one, I want you to help me understand what is what
is insurance and how those that you know that retention
correlates to that benefit. So within our own employees or
(26:09):
what we do for clients both. Yeah, if you're comfortable with
sharing clients, sure. Oh.
Yeah, I didn't share Bradley, you know, so for clients, we
pride ourselves on if we can help your hourly employee get
access to care through an affordable fashion, we've done
our job and we've done more goodthan a nonprofit in a way, you
(26:32):
know, taking care of people and their health needs is so
important. So we we strive to communicate
in multiple different ways and have a whole structure around
campaigns you can do to help explain things because the
terminology alone doesn't make sense.
You know you're sick, you need to go to the doctor.
(26:54):
How do you find that doctor? Well, here are some tools that
help you select the doctor that for the highest quality care,
best results. There's all sort of tools that
you can use to help drive peopleto the best outcomes for their
personal health. And most of the time, if you
haven't been sick, you, you don't know how complicated it is
(27:16):
and you're so stressed. You know, think of that hourly
worker that's a very, that couldbe 20% of their income just to
hit their deductible, their takehome pay.
You know, think about that alonein a plan design.
You say you have financial stress, you have, you need to
get time off to go or coordinatefor your kids, all those things
(27:38):
to try and find the right doctor.
And sometimes if it's a specialized need, then you have
to go to another doctor. So it's incredibly stressful
and, and sometimes through you maybe prescribe something, a
drug or a procedure and you get this scary letter that says it's
not covered. Well, there's all sorts of steps
along the way that our team works with our clients on
(28:02):
assuring their client, their employees, here's what you need
to do. It's going to be OK.
Take care of your health. We'll get this sorted for you.
And that gives our liaisons at the companies we work with a lot
of Peace of Mind, right? Knowing that we're their
advocate for their team so that their team can find the care
(28:22):
they need. Because a lot of times people
find their doctors by asking their friends who they go to
that doesn't take into account outcomes.
Is that doctor high have high success on this procedure?
Are there costs in line with what's what's reasonable or do
(28:43):
they have a higher cost structure?
There's so many ways that we canhelp, and we do, and it's an
absolute joy to be able to contribute in that way.
That's, that's that, that that just open a whole realm of
questions because, you know, as you were saying that I, I got so
chill. I was like, now, now I see why
you guys maintain that 90%, but I'm saying I'm the interviewer.
(29:05):
Wake up Abraham and you can be chilled here, but thank you for
explaining that. And then do you guys have tools
within your marketplace? I'm assuming you have a
marketplace to be able to do allthat.
Yeah, OK. So we.
Customize. No, we customize we have in
house. We can make a website for you,
we can make it out for you. We can help you make a
(29:26):
presentation that's recordable. We can have individuals sit down
with every single one of your employees like we have all these
different tools that we can pullbased getting as.
Much feedback as you can, yeah. It's incredible multiple touches
and we don't want it to be and some, but you know, I, I feel a
duty as a broker to not contribute to the issues that we
(29:50):
are having in healthcare, right?There's cost issues, there's
access issues, and we can eitherbe contributing or trying to
make it better. And every day we're trying to
make it better, right I. Love that.
Wow. OK.
So my next question is benefits and hopefully I don't forget all
the questions just by chilling. Me too much.
(30:13):
Let what exactly are benefits, because I feel like a lot of
companies don't do benefits verywell yeah, you know, I, I know
friends that have incredible benefits like I have a friend
who works for Google, right and they have incredible like when I
say benefits, I want to drop everything and go to Google and
work there. But but then he has worked for
(30:33):
Apple, like all these companies,so he takes it for granted.
Yes, in my in my opinion, but then he says that he doesn't
need all that yes, I'm sorry, are you insane?
I, I think those companies are doing phenomenal at benefits and
I know they have a whole army ofbenefits right, you know, in
general, but I, I want to understand why is it that a lot
of you know, like mid science companies, they do it very
horribly. I, I know some leaders that are
(30:56):
struggling with like retention and they say, well, I give him
and this, I gave him that. I gave him this and to me, I
found that very wrong to say I gave them.
You know that that term alone isa red flag for me, which tells
me that you are not getting as much feedback as you can for me.
People don't understand what is it that they need.
It's. And I can see the frustration
from an employer and owner's perspective is so expensive
(31:19):
until you get to a large budget.This is a large percentage of
your your total spend. And if your team doesn't see the
value, I get it. Like I get where that that's
frustration and that's where we help our employers with their
employees. From an employee perspective,
(31:39):
there's so many things that you can view as benefits.
So there's core benefits that are medical, dental, life
insurance works. So like accident coverage there
you could, I'm I'm blanking on some, but pet and there's all
sorts of like products you can buy for the basic.
(32:00):
But then if you go a step further, we feel like your
employee handbook and policies mirror what you're trying to do
that can really enhance your benefits as well.
So looking at your time off schedule, does it complement
looking at your Wellness program?
(32:23):
So Wellness can be financial Wellness, it could be
traditional mental health as youthink of it, but it also can be
spiritual. So depending on the company and
what direction you're looking at, we, we as a company, we have
financial training courses we pay for, for our team and their
(32:44):
children and their parents that allows them access to how to
financially plan. And that's one aspect that's not
a product we sell or, you know, we work with clients on, but
it's something that we advise that works.
We also have ways to improve your, your fitness and your
activity reimbursements for gym active wear, things like that,
(33:05):
little policies. And then on the spiritual side,
we have corporate chaplains thatare non denominational.
You don't, you're not required to participate, but there's a
lot of people that that is a waythat they can engage and feel
whole. So we're making sure we're
touching all these different buckets from a benefits
perspective to make sure that they're all cohesive in
(33:28):
communicating the message that we're saying we care about you,
you know, and on top of all of that, we have a concierge
product that allows people to text with a tool to ask these
questions. Do I have this?
And it can pull that without them having to be embarrassed
and go to their manager or HR and ask, do I have access to
this? Can you help me with this?
(33:49):
Right. We're just trying to find as
many ways as possible and look at benefits more than just the
health and core offerings, right?
Huh, OK, I can, you know, I lovethat you guys have, you know,
the, the, the physical, the spiritual, the mental, the
emotional, all those four different areas.
(34:10):
We just like we know we work with people.
People are complex. Everyone has their own beliefs,
right? They have their own values and
we want to meet them where they are right and and work with
them, which is big. It's so again, I'm not a Abraham
Fedoral point for you guys, but so in a in in in like a real
world scenario. And you know, this may be just
(34:34):
like trade secrets. So you don't have to go into it
if you like it, but I want you to kind of help me.
Let's let's play a game here because again, I genuinely want
to understand benefits because Iwork with people and you know,
the term comes up. Even he Leona, the company
behind the podcast. We've been getting a lot of
approach from benefits, you know, like individuals,
companies, etcetera, because theproduct is focused on bringing
(34:56):
in, you know, like middle managers and then giving them an
Ave. for them to work with execsand the rest of the teams.
But mental health being a priority.
And I want to know how you know that there's been a lot of stats
around mental health and how it cost the company.
And I want to know from your ownperspective, your own
experiences, things that you've done in the past or all all like
(35:17):
right now present, how do you guys see mental health play out
in, in in the benefits realm? Are people seeking it?
Is this something that employeesare asking about it or like
execs are demanding to give to employees?
It is a sad state we're in currently.
There's not enough psychiatrists, they're not
(35:39):
enough providers for the need that's in the community.
So at one point, if you had a child under the age of 10, there
was two people in town that did that.
Well, there's a lot of people intown.
And are you to wait till your child's well on a path where
their mental health is harder toget back on track than
addressing it when you first seeit?
(36:00):
So there's, there's a provider need in the community.
So we have partnered with some telehealth options.
So through your phone, through the Internet, you can get
quicker appointments nationwide with quality psychiatric care
before it becomes an emergency. So depending on the market, so
(36:23):
depending on where the client's at, there's different provider
needs. So if you have mental health
that requires there's pharmaceutical drug medicine to
get you back on track, you need a good psychiatrist.
And in order to get a good psychiatrist, it can take up to
a year to get in with them. And if you're in a state of an
(36:44):
emergency, that's not not going to work.
So these telehealth options havebeen fantastic because we've
internally and with clients havebeen able to get people in with
providers quicker to get a treatment plan started.
So then they can wait to get into that provider in town, 9,
12 months, depending on how longthat goes.
So that's access to care. The other route is if talk
(37:07):
therapy can help you. There's people that specialize
in different things. So making sure that you get
through through different programs, Eaps or one of them
get in with a therapist that canaddress the need that you're
facing and help you proactively manage that is again, so
incredibly important. So we're making sure we're
talking about these things and that that may seem overly basic,
(37:31):
but if you see that an employee needs something and this is
training we do for our managers,here are the things as a manager
you can say are at their disposal.
So we internally, if we have someone in crisis or their
child's in crisis, hey, you havethis Teledoc option.
Hey, you have this EAP. So counselors and therapist
(37:55):
options, we also have this corporate chaplain if that's an
option you need as well. And then we also then have a
benevolence fund for all our employees that if a lot of good
therapy, a lot of good mental health providers are out of
pocket cost right now. So we have a fund people can
applied for anonymously to pay for all of that.
(38:16):
So we don't want you to get off track because this is an
unplanned expense or not take care of yourself because it's a
expense. So we provide them a bucket of
money outside of our HSA contribution and all these other
things we do to help care for that person I like.
That and and then, you know, I like that you first highlighted
(38:39):
that that's a surge of of like big shortage.
That you. Know we we just like a big
problem that I think a lot of you know B2B companies don't
recognize usable that's like we we need more right, we need more
but that's a huge problem right now there's not a lot of
professionals to cover that areathere's.
Also a lot of denial. This is my observation.
(39:00):
It is not backed by statistics or anything of that nature.
So I'll, I'll, I'll add that, but I feel too that we as a
society treat cancer, treat diabetics, treat other things
with how are you doing? How's it going?
But when it comes to mental health, we get scared and don't
do any of that it until we as a society get to the point where,
(39:23):
hey, how are you doing? You know, treating it no
different than anything else. I think it's, I think it's
harder as well because then you have an easy time saying, yes, I
have cancer because the test said I have cancer.
But if you have a mental health disease, you do not embrace that
diagnosis the same way. Which, this is all my opinion,
(39:44):
creates an issue as well. Absolutely.
Oh yeah. I talked to a lot of people to
to like agree to what you just said about just I feel like the
stigma around mental health and and I know everyone says the
stigma, but it's such a big problem, right?
And when I say problem, not on the individual, the problem as
to whenever they hear depressionor whatever, right that that may
(40:08):
be immediately becomes a defective you're lesser than.
Yeah, which you are not, right, Right.
So so like. How can companies, you know,
create, you know, like create spaces where if an employee is
going through that or an employer is going through that
as well, how can they make sure that they feel supported in that
space to not identify with, withthat mental illness that may
(40:30):
hinder, you know, their chances within the company, their own
personal growth within the company?
How can a a company as a whole, or or the whole body of the
organization create spaces wherepeople can feel like they're
supported? You, you have to be objective of
what the job is and what's needed and you have to have
(40:52):
direct uncomfortable conversations.
Here's what's needed. I know you're going through X
OK, let's work together on how we get it done.
Here's the job you're working towards.
OK, how do we balance that? I, I felt a different, it's not
the same, not even close. But as a new mom, as working and
balancing all that, I felt like I would get left behind because
(41:12):
I was trying to balance all the things.
And I have a fantastic husband who helped, but my with the
right management, we were able to balance it together.
So that, and it's no different for anyone with anything.
OK, you have a cancer diagnosis and have chemo.
OK, let's work this out. Here's what needs to get done.
(41:32):
How do you take care of you? And we have what needs to get
done. It's overly simple, you know,
but and if you have to take leave, take leave.
We'll work out. You know it's it can be simple
if you look at it as just another thing that you're
working through, right? Yeah, I mean, thank you for
even, you know, like sharing your own personal experience as
(41:54):
a mom because I think benefits sometimes do leave out the, you
know, the new parents. Yep, a lot, especially moms.
As a new parent myself, my wife parents, you know, she works in
healthcare and they have they didn't have any, you know,
benefits for her as a as a new mom.
And she she got so, you know, like burnt out about that
experience that she decided to leave and she was one of the top
(42:18):
employees. Like she was running that office
and all of the employees lean lean, you know, lean on her and
how Boston even check in, just send her a gift card and like,
right. It was like and and she
literally did not open the card.She just put it in the trash,
right? And she's like, I'm never going
back. I'm just like, yeah, you
definitely don't, which is. You know, such a sad state, but
(42:42):
it's not a uncommon story, right?
You know, there's, you just needa little grace sometimes and
that grace is not expensive and it's not hard.
You just have to be a little uncomfortable, you know, and
that goes back to that 10 secondrule.
Hey, I see you're struggling. This being a new mom is hard.
(43:03):
Put the issue on the table. How do we get you through the
next few months and get you back?
Because we, we need you. We see, we see potential in you
and you know, that's what we need.
The harder part is when you haveperformance and mental health,
and that is probably what peoplethink of most, right?
You know, But again, what's needed for the job, right?
(43:25):
And are you talking through that?
Wow, that's. Powerful.
You know, I wasn't going to steal the 10 second rule, but
you brought it back. So it's from now on it's
Abraham's. So thank you for reminding me.
I'm still from now on, you guys are going to hear me talk about
the 10 second rule and obviouslyI give credit to my guests.
Yeah. So we've come to the end of this
(43:45):
conversation and I hope I can have you in Season 2, which will
be a full production here. But after everything that we've
talked about here, just how is your spirit right now?
In what way? Just in.
General, in general, everything that's happening before you
walked into this studio and now that we had this whole whole
conversation, I. I feel I am incredibly blessed
(44:10):
and have such a great gift to beable to do good.
And this today is a great reminder.
Regardless of the bumps you you do, you can do good.
Power doesn't have to just be bad.
It can be a force of good too. So this is a nice reminder of
that. So thank you.
(44:31):
I love that. Wow, well thank you.
I'm also going to steal that too.
Power doesn't have to be doesn'talways have to be bad.
It could be a good now I messed it up.
I'll go back and listen and it will be an another Abraham
court. So.
But again, thank you so much forbeing here today.
This has been a refreshing conversation.
I've been up since 3:00 AM but this has given me the.
(44:52):
How's your spirit? Yeah, my.
Spirit is currently doing B boy dance and backflips Powered by
Coffee 6:00 AM. But you know, I'm managing.
I. I think I have some time to nap
today. No good.
You'll be good then. You can do anything with a nap.
Yeah, but. Again, thank you so much for
being here. Thank you for having.
Me and I. I look forward to, you know,
just getting to know you more. So no I.
(45:14):
Love it. Thank you.
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