April 18, 2025 • 39 mins
The golden rule of etiquette isn't what you learned in school. As Dina Schmid of Queen City Etiquette explains to Kathy Piech-Lukas of Your Dream Day, true etiquette means finding out how others want to be treated—and then doing exactly that. This principle becomes especially crucial when planning a wedding, where guests ranging from toddlers to grandparents bring different expectations and needs.
Throughout our conversation, we unravel the often-confused concepts of tradition versus etiquette. While traditions are simply repeated practices (like smearing cake in your partner's face), etiquette focuses on creating comfort. That distinction helps navigate thorny issues like adult-only receptions, where Dina offers a masterclass in handling awkward situations with grace. Her advice for dealing with guests who RSVP with uninvited children? A direct phone call offering solutions demonstrates both boundary-setting and consideration.
Communication emerges as the cornerstone of wedding etiquette. Whether it's clearly stating that a reception has a cash bar, providing hotel block options at different price points, or sending timely thank you notes that specifically mention each gift received, thoughtful communication prevents the uncomfortable surprises that can dampen celebrations. We also explore the evolution of wedding traditions, from RSVP cards (once considered insulting!) to modern QR codes, and how etiquette adapts alongside these changes.
Dina shares fascinating insights into dress codes, from the ultra-formal white tie (think gloves and tuxedos with tails) to casual themes, while cautioning against the trending practice of dictating guest color schemes. Her parting wisdom captures the essence of wedding planning perfectly: "It's okay to break tradition, but it's not okay to break etiquette." By focusing on what makes your guests comfortable while staying true to your vision, you'll create a celebration that honors both tradition and consideration—setting the perfect tone for your marriage.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
We are making our own story as we go.
Hi, welcome to your Dream Daypodcast.
I'm your host, Kathy PiechLukas, and today we have a real
treat.
I've been looking forward tothis podcast so much.
I would like to introduce DinaSchmid of Queen City Etiquette
and we are going to talk aboutwedding etiquette and what you
should and should not be doingas far as etiquette goes for
(00:24):
your wedding in general.
So thank you so much for comingon.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Thank you for having me, Kathy, I'm excited.
I love to talk etiquette.
I kind of geek out a little bit.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
Well, the first thing we were just talking about is
there's a difference betweentradition and etiquette.
They're two completely separatethings.
What would be some examples ofsomething that was tradition
that is not etiquette, or isetiquette became tradition, or
vice versa?
Speaker 2 (00:52):
So I think what might help is if I first give an
explanation of what etiquette is, because I want people to
understand that etiquette isn'tthat complicated.
It's also not all that formal.
A lot of people have the wrongidea and there are really just
two principles that I would saythat you want to follow in order
to do etiquette right.
That first one is to rememberthat etiquette's goal is to put
(01:16):
yourself and others at ease.
That's really what it is.
That's why we don't sneeze intosomebody's face.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
We sneeze into our sleeve, for example, because
it's going to make the otherperson uncomfortable, right?
Speaker 2 (01:28):
So there's some of those things.
The other thing that I thinkpeople really need to think
about when they think aboutetiquette is that the golden
rule that you probably learnedin school, you know, the one
that says treat others the waythat you want to be treated.
Well, that doesn't work foretiquette.
What you really need to followis the golden rule of etiquette
(01:50):
and that one tells you that youshould find out how others want
to be treated and then do that,and a lot of that, I think, is
going to come into play withwedding etiquette in particular,
knowing that weddings areattended by people who may be
just a couple months old topeople who may be approaching a
hundred, and so there's a widevariation of ages, experiences,
(02:11):
mobility, so that willdefinitely come into play.
Now I want to get back totradition versus etiquette.
I feel like it was importantthat we get that piece.
No of course.
So things that are traditionalare just things that have been
done and done and done, and Ithink a good example of
etiquette versus tradition isthat shoving the cake, smearing
the cake into your partner'sface, that is actually poor
(02:35):
etiquette.
I mean, really it isn't.
We're supposed to eat neatly.
We're not supposed to smearfood into somebody else's face.
That would be an example ofsomething that's tradition but
is poor etiquette.
Now there are other times,though, where traditions will
change and the etiquette changesalong with them, so RSVP is a
(02:57):
great example of that.
Speaker 1 (02:59):
Oh, perfect example.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Yes, a hundred years ago, if you had sent someone an
RSVP card, they would have beeninsulted.
Wow, right it was saying youdon't know how to properly
respond to an invitation.
Of course it was a little morehighbrow back then.
You, as a guest, would havebeen expected to take a piece of
your own stationery, out yourown pen, write down your
(03:20):
response and mail that Probablyin cursive.
Probably in cursive, and whoknows whether you were dipping
it in an inkwell.
I'm not really sure, but itwould have been a lot different.
I do know that we weren'tsending them Pony Express a
hundred years ago.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
Oh, that's good.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
So we had that.
When the RSVP cards first cameout and started going in
invitations, the etiquetteexperts were just abhorrent
about it.
It was terrible.
We weren't supposed to be doingthat.
It was an insult to your guests, but people liked it.
Much more convenient, and Ithink brides liked it too,
because they probably weren'tchasing down as many RSVPs.
(03:59):
So that started to becometradition.
Well, now, in the electronicera, we are able to take that
even one step further.
We can have people RSVP by wayof email or QR codes.
I got my first invitation with aQR code last year, where I was
able to just blip, blip andrespond right there.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
By the last two to three years.
I've seen a lot of invitationsthat have the QR code RSVP and
it connects directly to awedding website where they have
an RSVP manager and you canenter in the number of guests
and it indicates the number ofguests that are invited.
So it'll say blank of four orblank of two, which also leads
(04:41):
into when are children invitedand when are they not.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
Right.
There's no tradition, there'sno etiquette rules that say you
have to invite children or thatyou shouldn't invite children.
I think that is one where it isreally your personal taste.
It's among the expectations Iknow.
When I got married, my youngestsibling was only 13 at the time
, or no, he was 11,.
Speaker 1 (05:06):
I think Wow.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
I'm trying to do the math in my head.
I think he was only 11 oraround 11.
So I had to invite childrenbecause I needed my own siblings
to come.
Plus, we had lots of youngernieces and nephews.
We did want them there.
To us it wouldn't have feltright without them there, but I
know for other people itwouldn't feel right with the
children there.
(05:28):
So that's really not anetiquette thing, but how you
handle not inviting children orhow you handle the situation
gets down a little bit more toetiquette.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
How would somebody handle?
I'm going to give you ascenario.
Let's say a wedding invitationwas sent and it says clearly on
the invitation come celebratewith us adult reception to
follow.
They send back their RSVP andwe'll use an RSVP card in this
particular situation because theQR code they would have figured
(06:00):
out and they put their childrenwho are under the age of 12 as
part of the RSVP.
How do you handle that?
Speaker 2 (06:08):
Sure.
Well, in that situation I wouldsay you have to call them.
You don't want to rely on atext message or an email because
you don't know for certain thatthey've received it.
Tone of voice can't comethrough on that either, and you
don't want to tell your mom todeal with it.
Mom, can you talk to their momand tell them?
You don't want to do thatReally.
You need to call them so thatyou can actually know that your
(06:31):
message got through to them.
You need to explain to them.
You need to be very polite,open about this.
Start the conversation.
Oh, I received your RSVP.
Thank you for RSVPing.
I don't know that, if younoticed, but on the wedding
invitation we have noted thatwe're having an adult reception.
Will you still be able toattend without your children?
(06:52):
Or you can say I'm sorry, butwe're unable to have your
children?
Sometimes it could just be amiscommunication.
They may apologize If they giveyou pushback on it.
You're going to have to stayfirm.
Tell them that we just areunable to accompany your
children.
Here's the point, though thatmakes it good etiquette.
(07:12):
See if there's something youcould do to help them.
I would really like for youhusband, spouse, whomever to be
able to attend this wedding.
Is there anything I could do tohelp?
Would it help if I gave yousome recommendations for a
babysitter?
This is assuming that maybethey have to travel for the
wedding.
I've known some people who'vegone so far as to get a room at
(07:35):
the hotel and providebabysitters, and that's a
fantastic thing.
We talk about putting people atease.
Maybe they're uncomfortablewith putting their very young
children with a babysitterthey've never met Yet.
For a lot of people that'sgoing to put them at ease
knowing that their kids are atthe hotel close by and they're
not messing with anyone at thereception either.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
So that's a win-win as far as I'm concerned.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
So if you, have to have that pushback.
See if there's something youcan do to facilitate this person
coming, and if they can't, youjust say I'm really sorry, we
will miss you.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
And there's nothing wrong with saying that no.
You know, I tell people no isan answer, it's not a bad word
and in this particular case, itjust sounds like you have to set
your boundaries and say no youdo, don't get upset, don't do
anything.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Try to be empathetic.
I understand that you want tobring them with you and then, if
you have to be a littleclinical, be a little clinical.
We are unable to accompanychildren.
That's about it.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
One time I had a wedding reception that was an
adult only reception, and partof the reason was they decided
not to have a DJ.
They decided to have a comedianinstead.
Oh, an adult comedian, an adultcomedian and the adult comedian
had tailored this actspecifically to the couple.
(08:57):
So the couple had shared withthem some of their little inside
jokes and their inside quirksand stories and whatnot, and he
incorporated it into this adultgig.
So to say, you did not want anychild under the age of 18 in
there because it would have beeninappropriate, it would have
been extremely uncomfortablebecause they probably wouldn't
(09:19):
have known what they weretalking about and if they did, I
would have been even morefrightened known what they were
talking about, and if they did,I would have been even more
frightened Mommy.
What's this so I mean?
So that's also something tokeep in mind when you're RSVPing
for an event.
If it does say adult onlyreception, there may be a reason
for that.
It may not just be.
We don't want kids and anklebiters running around the dance
(09:43):
floor and causing trouble.
There may be other stuff goingon.
The property itself may not beconducive to children.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
Right, and that sounds like a situation I had
with one of my own sisters.
My youngest sister got married.
They had a daytime wedding.
There was a very small luncheonafterwards.
They chose a public venue witha 21 and over admission policy
for the evening to have thereception at.
It was basically a bar.
Well, my kids were under theage of 21 at the time.
(10:14):
They were in the wedding, butthey were unable to come to that
evening.
We had to travel.
So in that case, my husbandended up having to stay in the
hotel room with our kids.
My brother-in-law stayed withhis kids as well, so my sister,
my other sister and I could goto this reception.
Was it ideal for me?
(10:34):
No, but did I understand?
Yes, did.
Speaker 1 (10:36):
I put up a fight?
Speaker 2 (10:37):
No, because it was, as you said, a situation where
it just wasn't appropriate forchildren to be at anyways.
And it worked out.
And sometimes you do have to bethat gracious guest as well.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
No, that's a perfect example.
And another example right herein greater Cincinnati is the
casino downtown.
They can hold three 400 peopleinside that ballroom, but you
have to be over the age of 21 toenter the property, so you
cannot have children at thatproperty, because they don't
allow children in the propertyat all.
Speaker 2 (11:10):
Yeah, and that's a situation where it should be a
little bit easier to explain tosomeone.
Your children cannot beadmitted.
We're having this at a casino.
It's mandatory.
Speaker 1 (11:21):
It's mandatory.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
You must be 21 to enter our reception.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
Exactly, Exactly.
Speaking of guests coming infrom out of town, the sooner
that you can let them know thebetter.
How does Save the Date?
And all of that wrap intoetiquette.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
So Save the Dates are fantastic.
I love them, especially becausethey are more formal than
somebody telling you that oh,the wedding's going to be here.
So I love save the dates, Ilove getting them far in advance
, especially if I'm going tohave to travel.
I do like to say about a yearin advance, if you have it.
I recognize that some peoplearen't going to be planning
their wedding perhaps that farin advance.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
Oh, you'd be surprised.
Usually it's 12 to 18 months.
Especially if you have aproperty that's very, very
popular, that will book 12 to 18months out.
Speaker 2 (12:10):
So, but what I was going to say is even if you are
planning it further, you don'treally need to send it more than
12 months in advance.
I also like the save the datesas an indication of who's going
to be invited.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
Absolutely, I had that experience recently.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
My niece is getting married next year.
She sent out save the dates andit was very clear that my adult
children are being invitedindividually, because they each
received their own save the date, even though one of them still
lives with us, so we receivedthat separately.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
How does plus one work?
Speaker 2 (12:44):
So there was no indication on the save the date
whether or not there would be aplus one.
I don't know what her policy isgoing to be.
What I do tell people, though,is again go back to that.
What is etiquette?
It's putting yourself andothers at ease.
And think about the situation.
I understand that there'susually a limit to the space and
the budget.
You can't invite a plus one foreverybody all the time.
(13:06):
That would be the idealsituation.
Understand that.
So sometimes you really need tothink about what's going to put
the person at ease.
Let's say you have onechildhood friend who happens to
be single and they're going tobe traveling for this wedding
but they're not going to knoweveryone there.
Well, give them the plus one sothat they can be more
comfortable, have a travelcompanion, someone to come with
(13:27):
them, so they're not completelyby themselves.
If you've got a bunch of singlefriends in town, they don't
necessarily need the plus one.
Speaker 1 (13:35):
Right, and I did that for my own wedding.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
We had a group of friends.
We invited all of them.
We did not give a plus one toany of them.
If they had a serioussignificant other, we knew them
at that point.
When it came to family, we didextend plus ones if we knew
there was someone that was intheir life.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
And to me that's the way to go and not even so much
as being the host when you'rethe couple, you are the host of
the event.
But even as somebody who'scoming to the event, just show
your host some respect.
I mean, if you have asignificant other that you've
been dating for an extendedperiod of time, or it's someone
that you see potentiallyspending the rest of your life
with, that is somebody that Iwould say is acceptable to bring
(14:18):
as a plus one to a wedding.
Don't bring a plus one just forthe sake of bringing a plus one
, because that host, aka thecouple who's throwing the
wedding they have to pay forthem to eat, they have to pay
for them to have a slice of cake, they have to pay for a seat to
sit in, which means that theyhave to pay for another table,
another centerpiece.
So it's very disrespectful tothe host.
(14:41):
If you are a guest.
Just bringing a plus one forthe sake of bringing a plus one
and not for this is my partnerin crime.
This is my partner in life.
Speaker 2 (14:51):
That's who should be the plus one attending and it's
also rude to bring a plus onewhen you have not been invited
with a plus one.
You should never overstep thatboundary and try to bring
someone, and it should be clearon the invitation also how many
people are invited.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
So if you are inviting with a plus one, do
that If it is a specialsignificant other put their name
Absolutely, and you can findout the name If you call the
guest that you're going toinvite.
Just ask them what's their nameso that we have it not only for
the invitation but for theplace card.
Because at the weddingreception, if it's a plated
dinner, you need to make a placecard for each individual
(15:30):
because the serving team needsto know what they're eating.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
Yes, and that's another etiquette thing is your
servers are part of that idea ofputting yourself and others at
ease your serving team,everybody who's there at that
venue that day needs to betreated with etiquette, please.
Thank you All of those things.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
So we've gone to the wedding, we've gotten the
wedding invitation, we'vescanned our QR code, we've
RSVP'd.
Yes, we know that we can orcan't bring our children with us
.
We get to the wedding andthere's a cash bar.
Is that proper etiquette?
How does that work?
Speaker 2 (16:05):
Sure, a cash bar is totally acceptable.
There's nothing says that youhave to pay for drinks.
In fact, I also want to make itclear that you don't even have
to serve drinks If there issomething culturally religious
where you don't drink or youdon't want people to drink.
Maybe you are in recovery fromsomething, maybe a member of the
wedding party is.
It's okay not to have alcoholserved.
(16:29):
I want people to understandthat that's okay.
If you want to serve alcoholand charge the guests for it,
have a cash bar.
Please make sure they know inadvance.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
Absolutely, you absolutely do.
Speaker 2 (16:41):
You need to put it on the invitation Reception to
follow with cash bar and if it'struly cash bar which I can't
imagine we would have in today'sday and age make it very clear
that it's actually cash.
Only cash will be accepted.
If you're only acceptingelectronic payments, though, you
probably should let people knowthat ahead of time as well, I
(17:04):
have some relatives who don'teven have smartphones.
It's only recently that Iforced my husband to get Venmo,
you're lucky.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
I just taught my husband how to use an ATM card
about five years ago, so Venmois going to be another decade
from now.
Speaker 2 (17:20):
You have to think about that.
What's going to put yourselfand others at ease?
Well, you don't want peoplegoing up to the bar and then
being like I don't have a way topay.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
Right.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
And other.
Do other guests have to pick itup for them?
We had a situation at a weddingfor one of my family members a
long time ago where my parentsended up picking up the bill
because there was a charge.
It was a.
It was a strange situation.
There was a charge to get in tothe bar at the one I mentioned.
Speaker 1 (17:45):
A cover charge.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
It.
There was a charge to get in tothe bar, the one I mentioned, a
cover charge.
It was actually a cover chargefor everyone to get in to even
get to the bride and groom, letalone had to buy their own
drinks that evening.
So my parents ended up payingfor a room because people
weren't expecting that, andthat's where the etiquette is.
Poor is when people don't knowwhat to expect.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
No, and that's a good point, because there's some
things that I do see at weddings.
With regard to transportationand parking, it is not bad
etiquette if you make yourguests pay for parking.
It's polite and kind and niceif you cover the parking costs
for them, but you're notobligated to do that.
Same thing goes with shuttles.
(18:26):
If you have a large groupstaying in one hotel, they're
all from out of town and youprovide a charter bus for them
to get to and from yourreception.
That's being kind.
It's not expected by any means.
Speaker 2 (18:39):
No, it isn't.
What would be nice, though, isto give people parking
information Absolutely and letthem know it's going to cost $15
to park at this lot all night.
Closest parking is here.
Valet parking is available fora fee.
Let people know thatcommunication piece is vital.
It is so important.
Nobody likes walking into asituation and being thrown
(19:02):
because I wasn't expecting tohave to pay for parking and then
people get a little upset too.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
Oh, absolutely.
And that's where a weddingwebsite could really come into
play, because if you send yourguests the link to your wedding
website, not only can they RSVPthere, they can get hotel block
information, they can learn alittle bit about you and your
wedding party, they can seethings to do in the area, you
can also talk about parking feesand things like that as well.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
Yes, a well informed guest is going to be at ease and
there's not going to be thosenegative surprises.
They're going to enjoythemselves much more, and so
will you, because you're notgoing to hear the grumbling and
it's going to be some great aunt.
Speaker 1 (19:39):
It will it absolutely will.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
That's what's going to happen.
So you don't want thatsituation.
It's your day, it's yourspecial day.
You want it to go well andgetting rid of these little
roadblocks for your guests orthose stumbles or surprises
which let's talk hotel block fora moment.
Yes, because you mentioned that.
Yes, and I know that's anotherthing.
Should I provide a hotel block?
(20:03):
Do I need to provide a hotelblock?
Technically?
No, you don't need to provide ahotel block.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
Should you?
Absolutely.
There's no reason why you can't.
If you have what's called acourtesy block, which is
something your Dream Day canhelp you do no charge.
We do offer a hotel blockservice that allows your guests
to call into the hotel or clicka special link that their block
is built into it.
You can reserve the room withyour credit card and you'll have
(20:33):
a room.
If there's any leftover rooms,they're put into general
inventory at the hotel, so thecouple is not responsible for
paying for those, unless there'sa contingency, which that's a
whole other podcast, but it'sout of respect.
Now, one thing to keep in mindwith the hotel block is, say
there's 100 rooms at a hotel,ten of those rooms will be on
(20:57):
third-party sites such as Yahoo,expedia, travelocity.
They may be a little bit lessthan your hotel block rate and
the reason for that is you havea discounted rate from the list
rate, so you do have adiscounted rate.
Is it possible that one ofthose Expedia sites could be a
couple dollars cheaper?
Absolutely.
(21:17):
However, the minute those 10rooms are gone, it is going to
spike higher than what yourblock is and in addition to that
, when your guests get to thehotel, if they've booked with a
site like Expedia or if they'veused RewardPoint, they won't be
in the same part of the hotel asthe rest of the guests either,
(21:37):
unless you contact the hotel inadvance and you give them a list
of your guests and ask if theycould reference the reservations
and try to keep all of themtogether.
But it's a lot of work to do itthat way, but that's how a
hotel block works.
Speaker 2 (21:54):
And they are a great thing to provide, especially if
you are doing any type ofdestination wedding.
You absolutely have to providethat block for people because
they're going to be traveling.
Speaker 1 (22:06):
That's a lot of research to put on your guests.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
It is.
There's also a little bit ofcomfort that comes from knowing
that the wedding party hasvetted the hotel.
It's in a decent part of town,you're going to be close to the
reception or maybe it's even thesite of the reception.
So that is something that Iwould say, even though
technically the rules ofetiquettes don't mean that you
have to do it.
If we look at that overarchingprinciple of etiquette then yes,
(22:32):
you should provide that blockto people.
The other thing that I've seenI know I've been grateful when
I've received invitations wherethey've had more than one block
because of price breaks.
We need to be conscious thatpeople are going to be price
sensitive.
You're going to have somepeople who it's going to be a
stretch for them to be able toattend your wedding and to get a
hotel room, and you're going tohave other people who are going
(22:54):
to be like whatever, I justwant the closest, the best, and
they're going to do that.
So I like that.
I know we provided that withour own guests.
When we got married, we had thereception at a hotel.
We had rooms at the hotel, butwe were concerned that they
would be a little too expensivefor people, so we had a block at
a nearby hotel as well wherethe rates were significantly
lower.
So I think that's a really nicething to provide to people as
(23:19):
well.
And as a guest, you don't haveto stay at the hotel block
either If you are traveling onpoints.
I know there's people thesedays.
Speaker 1 (23:27):
Marriott points.
Yes, marriott points are a bigone.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
Right.
So you've got your Marriottpoints and I am a Marriott bot
point member myself.
I will admit I've got.
I've actually got one freenight right now and I'm working
on more so if somebody were toget married and there's a nearby
Marriott, I may choose to staythere.
Your guests are under noobligation to stay at that block
either.
Speaker 1 (23:49):
Right, right.
Well, that's a good point.
So you also had talked a littlebit about the traditions versus
etiquette during the weddingreception.
So we had already talked aboutthe cake feeding and smudging it
in your face.
That's not it's.
It's not necessarily pooretiquette, it's just.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
I consider it poor etiquette.
Yeah, I mean it's, it's, um,how do people might not?
I mean, if you want to do it,what I don't like, and I'm sure
we've all seen those videos orwhere one person smears it and
the other person you can see isa little upset about it so if
you're going to do that talkabout it ahead of time.
I know that my husband and Italked about it.
(24:31):
We were not going to smear iton anyone.
We just, we just didn't want todo that?
Speaker 1 (24:35):
Yeah, we didn't either.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
I was.
I was uncomfortable with thatidea.
There are other things, though,with the tradition versus
etiquette.
For a long time, tradition andI would say, to some point the
etiquette was that you had tohave that receiving line.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
Everybody had to line up.
Speaker 2 (24:50):
You had to have.
You know, I think it's thebride's parents first, and the
bride and groom then the groom'sparents.
Some people would opt to havethe wedding party after that.
At least you had to have thosecore people, though, up front.
Well, that's not something youhave to do.
You can still do it.
But where the etiquette comesin, though, is that you still
need to talk to your guests.
Speaker 1 (25:11):
Exactly.
And nowadays it's logisticallydifficult to do a receiving line
because if you have 200 guestsit's going to take you an hour
just to do that receiving line.
And let's just say you're at aCatholic church, you're going to
have an hour before theceremony, you're going to have
the actual ceremony for an hourand then you have maybe up to an
(25:31):
hour after that to takepictures and then you have to
get out, and so more and more.
I mean I'm not seeing thereceiving line much anymore.
I still see row dismissalswhere you go row by row.
The advantage of that is thatyou control how fast it goes,
whereas if you're having areceiving line you might get you
(25:52):
know Aunt Betty, who just won'tstop talking to somebody, and
she holds up the line for 10minutes.
That's, you avoid that problem.
Some of the newer trends whereyou get to at least talk to
every guest has been the photobomb, where you have the couple
in the middle on guest has beenthe photo bomb where you have
the couple in the middle on thedance floor and each table comes
up to them and they pose apicture, so at least they get to
(26:14):
see them at some point duringthe night.
That seems to be the reallymost logistically.
It's fun and it's alogistically friendly way to do
it too.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
The idea, though, is that the etiquette there.
You do still need to talk toyour guests.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
You need to agree with, preferably, each person
there.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
You can't just spend time with your wedding party.
You can't just be with justyour best friend all night, or
even just the couple all night.
You'll have the rest of yourlives together.
Your friends will be there.
A lot of these people travelfor that day and want a little
bit of that recognition.
Absolutely At least acknowledgethem, say hi.
You don't have to giveeverybody a big hug, whatnot you
(26:58):
do?
Just make an effort.
Just make an effort, yes.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
And people know that they were seen.
And one other thing that youcan do this is something I've
had couples doing the last fewyears is after they're done with
group photos.
A lot of times you will go andhang out with your wedding party
and have some drinks and ordersfor maybe half an hour or so
before you go into the reception, their dinner during cocktail
(27:28):
hour in front of theirbridesmaids and groomsmen, in
that private room specificallyso they can go around during
dinner while everybody else iseating and say hi.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
And that is fine.
I know it can be difficult whenit is your own wedding to find
the time to eat and drink.
I know from my personalexperience.
I don't know how many drinks Ipicked up, put down and then
lost.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
Oh, I think guests go through that problem too.
That's not just.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
that's just not a couple problem, I don't think I
finished an entire drink and Ithink that's okay as long as
your wedding party knows they'regoing to eat.
So I had an experience thatgoes against all etiquette.
Many, many years ago, friendsfrom high school got married.
We were still in college at thetime and I attended with some
(28:10):
of my friends from high school.
We went together as a group.
If I remember correctly, weeven pitched in together to get
a bigger gift.
So we went, we attended theirwedding and then we went to the
reception and it was adinnertime reception.
I seem to recall it startedabout 5 pm and there were some
trays with cheese and crackersthere and we were munching on
those, waiting for the bride andgroom, waiting for the wedding
(28:34):
party.
When one of the people at mytable got up, they went to
explore the hotel.
They had to go to the restroom.
They came back.
They had seen that thebridegroom and the wedding party
were in a room adjacent eatinga full meal.
That is not putting your guestsat ease and we ended up having
to leave because we were allstarving after a couple hours
(28:57):
because they didn't feed us, butthey fed themselves, and so
that would be something where Iwould say that would be
different.
Speaker 1 (29:03):
That would be different.
Yeah, no, I totally agree.
So we have the reception, we'redancing, we're having a great
time and now it's time to gohome.
And how do you handle that?
One tipsy had too much funparty goer, which every wedding
has one?
I will tell you that I wouldsay at least one, yes.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
So this is the case where I like to confer
responsibility to another person.
Do you have a responsiblefriend or relative that you can
put in charge of making surethat that tipsy person doesn't
get in the car and drive underthe influence?
That's the way I recommendhandling that you don't have to
pay for the Uber.
It would be a very nice thingto do, but if you have that
(29:47):
responsible friend or friends,put them in charge of it have
them stop that person, have themoffer them a ride home or to
the hotel, whatever it is, orhave them order them an Uber.
You really do need to make sure,though, that you don't have
anyone doing that.
You also want to make sure thatnobody is completely
over-served.
Hopefully, whomever you'vehired who's running the bar will
(30:08):
make sure that you don't haveanyone who's fall down drunk at
that point.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
So now they've gotten home and now it's time to send
thank yous out.
How do thank yous work?
What is proper etiquette forthank yous?
Speaker 2 (30:20):
So I'm a stickler on the thank you notes.
I will say that Thank you notesdo need to be sent out.
You notes I will say that thankyou notes do need to be sent
out, and the general timeline isthat you have about two months
after the wedding to send them.
I think it's best if you stayon top of them.
And I'd like to bring upprincess Diana.
Uh, when I talk about thank younotes.
So she was princess for a veryshort time.
(30:42):
People forget she died youngshe was.
She died at the age of I thinkit was 36.
And she is known for havingwritten tens of thousands of
handwritten notes during hertime as being a princess.
She was supposedly someone who,if she got a gift that day, she
had a hard time going to sleepwithout writing the thank you
note for it.
So it's easier if you stay ontop of them.
(31:05):
If you write the notes forgifts that arrive before the
wedding, that's going to meanless you have to do after the
wedding.
So I highly recommend that youdo need to send the note, though
.
If somebody sent a gift, theydon't even know if it was
received, they don't know whatto do.
You absolutely need to sendthat thank you, and it can't be
a form letter either.
(31:26):
I don't know how many peoplehave read.
Is the the diary of a wimpy kidwhere he used to have fill in
the blank notes for thank yous?
That is not appropriate.
You, you are an adult.
You are responsible enough toenter into a marriage.
You need to write an actualthank you note.
I don't care if you use thesame formula for each gift, but
(31:46):
it should mention the giftspecifically.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (31:49):
So that people know it was received.
You do need to send it withintwo months and it does need to
be handwritten.
It really is not appropriatefor you to be sending a text
message.
Hey, got your gift.
Speaker 1 (32:03):
Yeah, yeah, that's a little tacky got your gift yeah,
that's a little tacky.
Well, I know just from personalexperience.
We had one wedding guest at ourwedding more than 20 years ago
and we're like they didn't getus a gift.
Okay.
So we're like, how do we handlethis?
So in the thank you note wesaid it was so great to see you
(32:24):
at the wedding, we appreciateyou joining us, you were the
greatest gift, or something likethat, Like your presence was
the greatest gift.
It was something along thoselines.
One week later, we got a phonecall did you not get my gift?
Because we didn't mention it inthe thank you note?
And it turned out that the giftthey ordered had been placed on
back order.
So we didn't get it for threemonths.
(32:46):
So it's a significant timeline,but they had no idea that we
didn't get it and had we notsent that thank you, we would
have had a little grudge likegeez thanks.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
And the thing I want to talk about is you really
shouldn't hold a grudge for that.
There are going to be peoplewhose circumstances dictate that
they are not able to send agift.
I don't want you to feel bad.
If somebody doesn't send a gift, it's okay, and you handled
that perfectly, though, bywriting that note saying your
presence was our present type ofthing.
We're very grateful for you forcoming, and that's a great way
(33:18):
to handle it In this case.
Speaker 1 (33:20):
Yes, it alerted them my gift hadn't been received.
Absolutely Any other tips thatyou would like to share with our
engaged couples and peoplewatching today.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
No, I would just say that it's okay to break
tradition, but it's not okay tobreak etiquette.
Speaker 1 (33:36):
Wonderful.
How can people find you?
Speaker 2 (33:39):
Sure, if people want to find me, I am, as I said.
As you mentioned earlier in theintroduction, I own queen city
etiquette.
I'm on the web.
I am on linkedin more than I amon social media.
I do also have a youtubechannel.
Oh, I know, what we didn't talkabout was appropriate dress.
Oh, yes, that, because thatreminded me.
(33:59):
I am on Pinterest with somethings about dress codes, so if
you want to communicate to yourguests what type of dress code
you want.
You could look at my Pinterest,see the examples of the
different types of dress codesand communicate based on what
you want people to wear.
Speaker 1 (34:16):
In short, what does each one mean?
Speaker 2 (34:18):
So the most formal we're going to start there.
The most formal is actuallywhite tie.
A lot of people think it'sblack tie, but white tie is even
more formal.
If I were a guest at a whitetie event, I would have to have
a long gown.
I am probably going to even bewearing gloves.
We are going to see men in thewaistcoat where they have the
little tails coming out.
(34:39):
They're probably going to haveon a vest.
It's the most formal.
Most people aren't ever going tobe invited to a white tie event
.
Black tie is the next one down.
That is also formal.
That is where we're talkingtuxedos for men and I would say
most likely long gowns notnecessarily what we'd call a
(35:03):
dress is what we would be doing.
There are some circumstanceswhere people are going to do
T-length or something a littlebit different as well, and you
will find some people don'tnecessarily like the traditional
tuxedos.
A dark suit would be a possiblethat you could wear there, but
you're going to definitely wantto have dress shoes.
It's not a place to show offyour chucks or whatever, you're
(35:29):
not going to wear your.
Doc Martens with this and you'renot going to have that, so
that's going to be with that.
Then we come down and we havesemi-formal.
Semi-formal is where if youwanted to wear a tux, you could.
You're under no obligation to,but again, you're going to,
you're going to go with a suitand even if you are a woman, you
don't necessarily have to havea dress or a skirt on.
(35:51):
You yourself could wear a suitas well.
Speaker 1 (35:53):
You're going to want a nice blouse with it.
Speaker 2 (35:55):
You accessories are going to raise it to a more
elegant level as well.
Speaker 1 (36:00):
But in that semi-formal.
Speaker 2 (36:02):
You're probably not going to have the floor length
gown, You're going to have moreof a cocktail dress.
At that point we bring it downand then some people will choose
something that's more likebusiness attire, which is taking
it down from that semi-formaland is still going to be a
little bit nicer.
Maybe we're not wearing a suitjacket, we're just wearing the
(36:25):
tie and the shirt and that's avery typical wedding attire, In
fact most weddings where theydon't say any type of dress code
.
That's basically what we expect.
You're also going to want todress according to the time of
day and the season.
If it is going to be an eveningwedding, darker colors are
(36:48):
going to be more appropriate.
If it's a daytime gardenwedding, if you show up in all
black, you're going to look alittle odd.
You're going to want to havesomething a little bit more
colorful for that.
So that's going to changewithin those steps there, there
are also people who will havecasual weddings.
I went to a wedding that was onHalloween and we were
(37:09):
encouraged to wear costumes.
They wanted the reception to bea costume party because, that's
how they had met was at aHalloween party.
So you will occasionally getthemed ones too.
So you will occasionally getthemed ones too.
What's important is that you docommunicate those themes, how
you want your guests to dress.
The other thing that's beencoming into play a lot more
(37:30):
recently is communicatingpreferred color schemes.
Speaker 1 (37:34):
Yes, I'm not a fan of that.
Speaker 2 (37:37):
I am not.
Speaker 1 (37:38):
I'm not a fan of that .
There's actually a networkinggroup that they actually give
you a dress code to come, and Iactually don't enjoy going to
those events because it's toomuch effort.
I just want to talk to people.
But I do understand it givesflair to the event If everybody
matches it can make the photoslook more harmonious.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
I get that as an etiquette instructor and as a
wedding guest too.
I am not a fan of those either.
I feel that it puts a littlebit of an undue burden on guests
who may not have something inthe appropriate color or style
that has been requested.
They then need to get somethingor they need to rent something.
I know personally I had toassist my mother for a wedding
(38:18):
of a family member and my motherwas really stressed out.
Is this the right color?
Because they had been given, Ithink, four colors, and she
wasn't even sure if it was theright shade.
She was very stressed out aboutit.
This dress code was not puttingher at ease for certain, so I
am not a big fan of those.
Speaker 1 (38:37):
I'm so glad because I'm not either, but under no
circumstances, ladies, youshould not be wearing the color
white to a wedding.
Speaker 2 (38:46):
No.
Speaker 1 (38:46):
Absolutely not.
Speaker 2 (38:49):
To an American wedding in the US.
There are other places wherewhite would be appropriate
because the bride isn't going tobe wearing white to a US-based
wedding, though yes, you shouldabsolutely not be wearing white.
Well, us-based wedding note yes, you should absolutely not be
wearing white.
Speaker 1 (39:03):
Well, wonderful.
On that note, Thank you so muchfor joining us.
Please subscribe so that youcan get future podcasts, and
we'll try to post something oncea week so that you can get
educated from the professionalsabout how to plan your wedding.
This is Kathy Piech Lukas withYour Dream Day.
Happy planning.
We are making our own story as we go.
Hi, welcome to your Dream Daypodcast.
I'm your host, Kathy PiechLukas, and today we have a real
treat.
I've been looking forward tothis podcast so much.
I would like to introduce DinaSchmid of Queen City Etiquette
and we are going to talk aboutwedding etiquette and what you
should and should not be doingas far as etiquette goes for
(00:24):
your wedding in general.
So thank you so much for comingon.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Thank you for having me, Kathy, I'm excited.
I love to talk etiquette.
I kind of geek out a little bit.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
Well, the first thing we were just talking about is
there's a difference betweentradition and etiquette.
They're two completely separatethings.
What would be some examples ofsomething that was tradition
that is not etiquette, or isetiquette became tradition, or
vice versa?
Speaker 2 (00:52):
So I think what might help is if I first give an
explanation of what etiquette is, because I want people to
understand that etiquette isn'tthat complicated.
It's also not all that formal.
A lot of people have the wrongidea and there are really just
two principles that I would saythat you want to follow in order
to do etiquette right.
That first one is to rememberthat etiquette's goal is to put
(01:16):
yourself and others at ease.
That's really what it is.
That's why we don't sneeze intosomebody's face.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
We sneeze into our sleeve, for example, because
it's going to make the otherperson uncomfortable, right?
Speaker 2 (01:28):
So there's some of those things.
The other thing that I thinkpeople really need to think
about when they think aboutetiquette is that the golden
rule that you probably learnedin school, you know, the one
that says treat others the waythat you want to be treated.
Well, that doesn't work foretiquette.
What you really need to followis the golden rule of etiquette
(01:50):
and that one tells you that youshould find out how others want
to be treated and then do that,and a lot of that, I think, is
going to come into play withwedding etiquette in particular,
knowing that weddings areattended by people who may be
just a couple months old topeople who may be approaching a
hundred, and so there's a widevariation of ages, experiences,
(02:11):
mobility, so that willdefinitely come into play.
Now I want to get back totradition versus etiquette.
I feel like it was importantthat we get that piece.
No of course.
So things that are traditionalare just things that have been
done and done and done, and Ithink a good example of
etiquette versus tradition isthat shoving the cake, smearing
the cake into your partner'sface, that is actually poor
(02:35):
etiquette.
I mean, really it isn't.
We're supposed to eat neatly.
We're not supposed to smearfood into somebody else's face.
That would be an example ofsomething that's tradition but
is poor etiquette.
Now there are other times,though, where traditions will
change and the etiquette changesalong with them, so RSVP is a
(02:57):
great example of that.
Speaker 1 (02:59):
Oh, perfect example.
Speaker 2 (03:00):
Yes, a hundred years ago, if you had sent someone an
RSVP card, they would have beeninsulted.
Wow, right it was saying youdon't know how to properly
respond to an invitation.
Of course it was a little morehighbrow back then.
You, as a guest, would havebeen expected to take a piece of
your own stationery, out yourown pen, write down your
(03:20):
response and mail that Probablyin cursive.
Probably in cursive, and whoknows whether you were dipping
it in an inkwell.
I'm not really sure, but itwould have been a lot different.
I do know that we weren'tsending them Pony Express a
hundred years ago.
Speaker 1 (03:34):
Oh, that's good.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
So we had that.
When the RSVP cards first cameout and started going in
invitations, the etiquetteexperts were just abhorrent
about it.
It was terrible.
We weren't supposed to be doingthat.
It was an insult to your guests, but people liked it.
Much more convenient, and Ithink brides liked it too,
because they probably weren'tchasing down as many RSVPs.
(03:59):
So that started to becometradition.
Well, now, in the electronicera, we are able to take that
even one step further.
We can have people RSVP by wayof email or QR codes.
I got my first invitation with aQR code last year, where I was
able to just blip, blip andrespond right there.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
By the last two to three years.
I've seen a lot of invitationsthat have the QR code RSVP and
it connects directly to awedding website where they have
an RSVP manager and you canenter in the number of guests
and it indicates the number ofguests that are invited.
So it'll say blank of four orblank of two, which also leads
(04:41):
into when are children invitedand when are they not.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
Right.
There's no tradition, there'sno etiquette rules that say you
have to invite children or thatyou shouldn't invite children.
I think that is one where it isreally your personal taste.
It's among the expectations Iknow.
When I got married, my youngestsibling was only 13 at the time
, or no, he was 11,.
Speaker 1 (05:06):
I think Wow.
Speaker 2 (05:08):
I'm trying to do the math in my head.
I think he was only 11 oraround 11.
So I had to invite childrenbecause I needed my own siblings
to come.
Plus, we had lots of youngernieces and nephews.
We did want them there.
To us it wouldn't have feltright without them there, but I
know for other people itwouldn't feel right with the
children there.
(05:28):
So that's really not anetiquette thing, but how you
handle not inviting children orhow you handle the situation
gets down a little bit more toetiquette.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
How would somebody handle?
I'm going to give you ascenario.
Let's say a wedding invitationwas sent and it says clearly on
the invitation come celebratewith us adult reception to
follow.
They send back their RSVP andwe'll use an RSVP card in this
particular situation because theQR code they would have figured
(06:00):
out and they put their childrenwho are under the age of 12 as
part of the RSVP.
How do you handle that?
Speaker 2 (06:08):
Sure.
Well, in that situation I wouldsay you have to call them.
You don't want to rely on atext message or an email because
you don't know for certain thatthey've received it.
Tone of voice can't comethrough on that either, and you
don't want to tell your mom todeal with it.
Mom, can you talk to their momand tell them?
You don't want to do thatReally.
You need to call them so thatyou can actually know that your
(06:31):
message got through to them.
You need to explain to them.
You need to be very polite,open about this.
Start the conversation.
Oh, I received your RSVP.
Thank you for RSVPing.
I don't know that, if younoticed, but on the wedding
invitation we have noted thatwe're having an adult reception.
Will you still be able toattend without your children?
(06:52):
Or you can say I'm sorry, butwe're unable to have your
children?
Sometimes it could just be amiscommunication.
They may apologize If they giveyou pushback on it.
You're going to have to stayfirm.
Tell them that we just areunable to accompany your
children.
Here's the point, though thatmakes it good etiquette.
(07:12):
See if there's something youcould do to help them.
I would really like for youhusband, spouse, whomever to be
able to attend this wedding.
Is there anything I could do tohelp?
Would it help if I gave yousome recommendations for a
babysitter?
This is assuming that maybethey have to travel for the
wedding.
I've known some people who'vegone so far as to get a room at
(07:35):
the hotel and providebabysitters, and that's a
fantastic thing.
We talk about putting people atease.
Maybe they're uncomfortablewith putting their very young
children with a babysitterthey've never met Yet.
For a lot of people that'sgoing to put them at ease
knowing that their kids are atthe hotel close by and they're
not messing with anyone at thereception either.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
So that's a win-win as far as I'm concerned.
Speaker 2 (07:58):
So if you, have to have that pushback.
See if there's something youcan do to facilitate this person
coming, and if they can't, youjust say I'm really sorry, we
will miss you.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
And there's nothing wrong with saying that no.
You know, I tell people no isan answer, it's not a bad word
and in this particular case, itjust sounds like you have to set
your boundaries and say no youdo, don't get upset, don't do
anything.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Try to be empathetic.
I understand that you want tobring them with you and then, if
you have to be a littleclinical, be a little clinical.
We are unable to accompanychildren.
That's about it.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
One time I had a wedding reception that was an
adult only reception, and partof the reason was they decided
not to have a DJ.
They decided to have a comedianinstead.
Oh, an adult comedian, an adultcomedian and the adult comedian
had tailored this actspecifically to the couple.
(08:57):
So the couple had shared withthem some of their little inside
jokes and their inside quirksand stories and whatnot, and he
incorporated it into this adultgig.
So to say, you did not want anychild under the age of 18 in
there because it would have beeninappropriate, it would have
been extremely uncomfortablebecause they probably wouldn't
(09:19):
have known what they weretalking about and if they did, I
would have been even morefrightened known what they were
talking about, and if they did,I would have been even more
frightened Mommy.
What's this so I mean?
So that's also something tokeep in mind when you're RSVPing
for an event.
If it does say adult onlyreception, there may be a reason
for that.
It may not just be.
We don't want kids and anklebiters running around the dance
(09:43):
floor and causing trouble.
There may be other stuff goingon.
The property itself may not beconducive to children.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
Right, and that sounds like a situation I had
with one of my own sisters.
My youngest sister got married.
They had a daytime wedding.
There was a very small luncheonafterwards.
They chose a public venue witha 21 and over admission policy
for the evening to have thereception at.
It was basically a bar.
Well, my kids were under theage of 21 at the time.
(10:14):
They were in the wedding, butthey were unable to come to that
evening.
We had to travel.
So in that case, my husbandended up having to stay in the
hotel room with our kids.
My brother-in-law stayed withhis kids as well, so my sister,
my other sister and I could goto this reception.
Was it ideal for me?
(10:34):
No, but did I understand?
Yes, did.
Speaker 1 (10:36):
I put up a fight?
Speaker 2 (10:37):
No, because it was, as you said, a situation where
it just wasn't appropriate forchildren to be at anyways.
And it worked out.
And sometimes you do have to bethat gracious guest as well.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
No, that's a perfect example.
And another example right herein greater Cincinnati is the
casino downtown.
They can hold three 400 peopleinside that ballroom, but you
have to be over the age of 21 toenter the property, so you
cannot have children at thatproperty, because they don't
allow children in the propertyat all.
Speaker 2 (11:10):
Yeah, and that's a situation where it should be a
little bit easier to explain tosomeone.
Your children cannot beadmitted.
We're having this at a casino.
It's mandatory.
Speaker 1 (11:21):
It's mandatory.
Speaker 2 (11:21):
You must be 21 to enter our reception.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
Exactly, Exactly.
Speaking of guests coming infrom out of town, the sooner
that you can let them know thebetter.
How does Save the Date?
And all of that wrap intoetiquette.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
So Save the Dates are fantastic.
I love them, especially becausethey are more formal than
somebody telling you that oh,the wedding's going to be here.
So I love save the dates, Ilove getting them far in advance
, especially if I'm going tohave to travel.
I do like to say about a yearin advance, if you have it.
I recognize that some peoplearen't going to be planning
their wedding perhaps that farin advance.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
Oh, you'd be surprised.
Usually it's 12 to 18 months.
Especially if you have aproperty that's very, very
popular, that will book 12 to 18months out.
Speaker 2 (12:10):
So, but what I was going to say is even if you are
planning it further, you don'treally need to send it more than
12 months in advance.
I also like the save the datesas an indication of who's going
to be invited.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
Absolutely, I had that experience recently.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
My niece is getting married next year.
She sent out save the dates andit was very clear that my adult
children are being invitedindividually, because they each
received their own save the date, even though one of them still
lives with us, so we receivedthat separately.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
How does plus one work?
Speaker 2 (12:44):
So there was no indication on the save the date
whether or not there would be aplus one.
I don't know what her policy isgoing to be.
What I do tell people, though,is again go back to that.
What is etiquette?
It's putting yourself andothers at ease.
And think about the situation.
I understand that there'susually a limit to the space and
the budget.
You can't invite a plus one foreverybody all the time.
(13:06):
That would be the idealsituation.
Understand that.
So sometimes you really need tothink about what's going to put
the person at ease.
Let's say you have onechildhood friend who happens to
be single and they're going tobe traveling for this wedding
but they're not going to knoweveryone there.
Well, give them the plus one sothat they can be more
comfortable, have a travelcompanion, someone to come with
(13:27):
them, so they're not completelyby themselves.
If you've got a bunch of singlefriends in town, they don't
necessarily need the plus one.
Speaker 1 (13:35):
Right, and I did that for my own wedding.
Speaker 2 (13:36):
We had a group of friends.
We invited all of them.
We did not give a plus one toany of them.
If they had a serioussignificant other, we knew them
at that point.
When it came to family, we didextend plus ones if we knew
there was someone that was intheir life.
Speaker 1 (13:54):
And to me that's the way to go and not even so much
as being the host when you'rethe couple, you are the host of
the event.
But even as somebody who'scoming to the event, just show
your host some respect.
I mean, if you have asignificant other that you've
been dating for an extendedperiod of time, or it's someone
that you see potentiallyspending the rest of your life
with, that is somebody that Iwould say is acceptable to bring
(14:18):
as a plus one to a wedding.
Don't bring a plus one just forthe sake of bringing a plus one
, because that host, aka thecouple who's throwing the
wedding they have to pay forthem to eat, they have to pay
for them to have a slice of cake, they have to pay for a seat to
sit in, which means that theyhave to pay for another table,
another centerpiece.
So it's very disrespectful tothe host.
(14:41):
If you are a guest.
Just bringing a plus one forthe sake of bringing a plus one
and not for this is my partnerin crime.
This is my partner in life.
Speaker 2 (14:51):
That's who should be the plus one attending and it's
also rude to bring a plus onewhen you have not been invited
with a plus one.
You should never overstep thatboundary and try to bring
someone, and it should be clearon the invitation also how many
people are invited.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
So if you are inviting with a plus one, do
that If it is a specialsignificant other put their name
Absolutely, and you can findout the name If you call the
guest that you're going toinvite.
Just ask them what's their nameso that we have it not only for
the invitation but for theplace card.
Because at the weddingreception, if it's a plated
dinner, you need to make a placecard for each individual
(15:30):
because the serving team needsto know what they're eating.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
Yes, and that's another etiquette thing is your
servers are part of that idea ofputting yourself and others at
ease your serving team,everybody who's there at that
venue that day needs to betreated with etiquette, please.
Thank you All of those things.
Speaker 1 (15:49):
So we've gone to the wedding, we've gotten the
wedding invitation, we'vescanned our QR code, we've
RSVP'd.
Yes, we know that we can orcan't bring our children with us
.
We get to the wedding andthere's a cash bar.
Is that proper etiquette?
How does that work?
Speaker 2 (16:05):
Sure, a cash bar is totally acceptable.
There's nothing says that youhave to pay for drinks.
In fact, I also want to make itclear that you don't even have
to serve drinks If there issomething culturally religious
where you don't drink or youdon't want people to drink.
Maybe you are in recovery fromsomething, maybe a member of the
wedding party is.
It's okay not to have alcoholserved.
(16:29):
I want people to understandthat that's okay.
If you want to serve alcoholand charge the guests for it,
have a cash bar.
Please make sure they know inadvance.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
Absolutely, you absolutely do.
Speaker 2 (16:41):
You need to put it on the invitation Reception to
follow with cash bar and if it'struly cash bar which I can't
imagine we would have in today'sday and age make it very clear
that it's actually cash.
Only cash will be accepted.
If you're only acceptingelectronic payments, though, you
probably should let people knowthat ahead of time as well, I
(17:04):
have some relatives who don'teven have smartphones.
It's only recently that Iforced my husband to get Venmo,
you're lucky.
Speaker 1 (17:14):
I just taught my husband how to use an ATM card
about five years ago, so Venmois going to be another decade
from now.
Speaker 2 (17:20):
You have to think about that.
What's going to put yourselfand others at ease?
Well, you don't want peoplegoing up to the bar and then
being like I don't have a way topay.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
Right.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
And other.
Do other guests have to pick itup for them?
We had a situation at a weddingfor one of my family members a
long time ago where my parentsended up picking up the bill
because there was a charge.
It was a.
It was a strange situation.
There was a charge to get in tothe bar at the one I mentioned.
Speaker 1 (17:45):
A cover charge.
Speaker 2 (17:52):
It.
There was a charge to get in tothe bar, the one I mentioned, a
cover charge.
It was actually a cover chargefor everyone to get in to even
get to the bride and groom, letalone had to buy their own
drinks that evening.
So my parents ended up payingfor a room because people
weren't expecting that, andthat's where the etiquette is.
Poor is when people don't knowwhat to expect.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
No, and that's a good point, because there's some
things that I do see at weddings.
With regard to transportationand parking, it is not bad
etiquette if you make yourguests pay for parking.
It's polite and kind and niceif you cover the parking costs
for them, but you're notobligated to do that.
Same thing goes with shuttles.
(18:26):
If you have a large groupstaying in one hotel, they're
all from out of town and youprovide a charter bus for them
to get to and from yourreception.
That's being kind.
It's not expected by any means.
Speaker 2 (18:39):
No, it isn't.
What would be nice, though, isto give people parking
information Absolutely and letthem know it's going to cost $15
to park at this lot all night.
Closest parking is here.
Valet parking is available fora fee.
Let people know thatcommunication piece is vital.
It is so important.
Nobody likes walking into asituation and being thrown
(19:02):
because I wasn't expecting tohave to pay for parking and then
people get a little upset too.
Speaker 1 (19:07):
Oh, absolutely.
And that's where a weddingwebsite could really come into
play, because if you send yourguests the link to your wedding
website, not only can they RSVPthere, they can get hotel block
information, they can learn alittle bit about you and your
wedding party, they can seethings to do in the area, you
can also talk about parking feesand things like that as well.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
Yes, a well informed guest is going to be at ease and
there's not going to be thosenegative surprises.
They're going to enjoythemselves much more, and so
will you, because you're notgoing to hear the grumbling and
it's going to be some great aunt.
Speaker 1 (19:39):
It will it absolutely will.
Speaker 2 (19:42):
That's what's going to happen.
So you don't want thatsituation.
It's your day, it's yourspecial day.
You want it to go well andgetting rid of these little
roadblocks for your guests orthose stumbles or surprises
which let's talk hotel block fora moment.
Yes, because you mentioned that.
Yes, and I know that's anotherthing.
Should I provide a hotel block?
(20:03):
Do I need to provide a hotelblock?
Technically?
No, you don't need to provide ahotel block.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
Should you?
Absolutely.
There's no reason why you can't.
If you have what's called acourtesy block, which is
something your Dream Day canhelp you do no charge.
We do offer a hotel blockservice that allows your guests
to call into the hotel or clicka special link that their block
is built into it.
You can reserve the room withyour credit card and you'll have
(20:33):
a room.
If there's any leftover rooms,they're put into general
inventory at the hotel, so thecouple is not responsible for
paying for those, unless there'sa contingency, which that's a
whole other podcast, but it'sout of respect.
Now, one thing to keep in mindwith the hotel block is, say
there's 100 rooms at a hotel,ten of those rooms will be on
(20:57):
third-party sites such as Yahoo,expedia, travelocity.
They may be a little bit lessthan your hotel block rate and
the reason for that is you havea discounted rate from the list
rate, so you do have adiscounted rate.
Is it possible that one ofthose Expedia sites could be a
couple dollars cheaper?
Absolutely.
(21:17):
However, the minute those 10rooms are gone, it is going to
spike higher than what yourblock is and in addition to that
, when your guests get to thehotel, if they've booked with a
site like Expedia or if they'veused RewardPoint, they won't be
in the same part of the hotel asthe rest of the guests either,
(21:37):
unless you contact the hotel inadvance and you give them a list
of your guests and ask if theycould reference the reservations
and try to keep all of themtogether.
But it's a lot of work to do itthat way, but that's how a
hotel block works.
Speaker 2 (21:54):
And they are a great thing to provide, especially if
you are doing any type ofdestination wedding.
You absolutely have to providethat block for people because
they're going to be traveling.
Speaker 1 (22:06):
That's a lot of research to put on your guests.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
It is.
There's also a little bit ofcomfort that comes from knowing
that the wedding party hasvetted the hotel.
It's in a decent part of town,you're going to be close to the
reception or maybe it's even thesite of the reception.
So that is something that Iwould say, even though
technically the rules ofetiquettes don't mean that you
have to do it.
If we look at that overarchingprinciple of etiquette then yes,
(22:32):
you should provide that blockto people.
The other thing that I've seenI know I've been grateful when
I've received invitations wherethey've had more than one block
because of price breaks.
We need to be conscious thatpeople are going to be price
sensitive.
You're going to have somepeople who it's going to be a
stretch for them to be able toattend your wedding and to get a
hotel room, and you're going tohave other people who are going
(22:54):
to be like whatever, I justwant the closest, the best, and
they're going to do that.
So I like that.
I know we provided that withour own guests.
When we got married, we had thereception at a hotel.
We had rooms at the hotel, butwe were concerned that they
would be a little too expensivefor people, so we had a block at
a nearby hotel as well wherethe rates were significantly
lower.
So I think that's a really nicething to provide to people as
(23:19):
well.
And as a guest, you don't haveto stay at the hotel block
either If you are traveling onpoints.
I know there's people thesedays.
Speaker 1 (23:27):
Marriott points.
Yes, marriott points are a bigone.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
Right.
So you've got your Marriottpoints and I am a Marriott bot
point member myself.
I will admit I've got.
I've actually got one freenight right now and I'm working
on more so if somebody were toget married and there's a nearby
Marriott, I may choose to staythere.
Your guests are under noobligation to stay at that block
either.
Speaker 1 (23:49):
Right, right.
Well, that's a good point.
So you also had talked a littlebit about the traditions versus
etiquette during the weddingreception.
So we had already talked aboutthe cake feeding and smudging it
in your face.
That's not it's.
It's not necessarily pooretiquette, it's just.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
I consider it poor etiquette.
Yeah, I mean it's, it's, um,how do people might not?
I mean, if you want to do it,what I don't like, and I'm sure
we've all seen those videos orwhere one person smears it and
the other person you can see isa little upset about it so if
you're going to do that talkabout it ahead of time.
I know that my husband and Italked about it.
(24:31):
We were not going to smear iton anyone.
We just, we just didn't want todo that?
Speaker 1 (24:35):
Yeah, we didn't either.
Speaker 2 (24:36):
I was.
I was uncomfortable with thatidea.
There are other things, though,with the tradition versus
etiquette.
For a long time, tradition andI would say, to some point the
etiquette was that you had tohave that receiving line.
Speaker 1 (24:49):
Everybody had to line up.
Speaker 2 (24:50):
You had to have.
You know, I think it's thebride's parents first, and the
bride and groom then the groom'sparents.
Some people would opt to havethe wedding party after that.
At least you had to have thosecore people, though, up front.
Well, that's not something youhave to do.
You can still do it.
But where the etiquette comesin, though, is that you still
need to talk to your guests.
Speaker 1 (25:11):
Exactly.
And nowadays it's logisticallydifficult to do a receiving line
because if you have 200 guestsit's going to take you an hour
just to do that receiving line.
And let's just say you're at aCatholic church, you're going to
have an hour before theceremony, you're going to have
the actual ceremony for an hourand then you have maybe up to an
(25:31):
hour after that to takepictures and then you have to
get out, and so more and more.
I mean I'm not seeing thereceiving line much anymore.
I still see row dismissalswhere you go row by row.
The advantage of that is thatyou control how fast it goes,
whereas if you're having areceiving line you might get you
(25:52):
know Aunt Betty, who just won'tstop talking to somebody, and
she holds up the line for 10minutes.
That's, you avoid that problem.
Some of the newer trends whereyou get to at least talk to
every guest has been the photobomb, where you have the couple
in the middle on guest has beenthe photo bomb where you have
the couple in the middle on thedance floor and each table comes
up to them and they pose apicture, so at least they get to
(26:14):
see them at some point duringthe night.
That seems to be the reallymost logistically.
It's fun and it's alogistically friendly way to do
it too.
Speaker 2 (26:26):
The idea, though, is that the etiquette there.
You do still need to talk toyour guests.
Speaker 1 (26:31):
You need to agree with, preferably, each person
there.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
You can't just spend time with your wedding party.
You can't just be with justyour best friend all night, or
even just the couple all night.
You'll have the rest of yourlives together.
Your friends will be there.
A lot of these people travelfor that day and want a little
bit of that recognition.
Absolutely At least acknowledgethem, say hi.
You don't have to giveeverybody a big hug, whatnot you
(26:58):
do?
Just make an effort.
Just make an effort, yes.
Speaker 1 (27:00):
And people know that they were seen.
And one other thing that youcan do this is something I've
had couples doing the last fewyears is after they're done with
group photos.
A lot of times you will go andhang out with your wedding party
and have some drinks and ordersfor maybe half an hour or so
before you go into the reception, their dinner during cocktail
(27:28):
hour in front of theirbridesmaids and groomsmen, in
that private room specificallyso they can go around during
dinner while everybody else iseating and say hi.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
And that is fine.
I know it can be difficult whenit is your own wedding to find
the time to eat and drink.
I know from my personalexperience.
I don't know how many drinks Ipicked up, put down and then
lost.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
Oh, I think guests go through that problem too.
That's not just.
Speaker 2 (27:49):
that's just not a couple problem, I don't think I
finished an entire drink and Ithink that's okay as long as
your wedding party knows they'regoing to eat.
So I had an experience thatgoes against all etiquette.
Many, many years ago, friendsfrom high school got married.
We were still in college at thetime and I attended with some
(28:10):
of my friends from high school.
We went together as a group.
If I remember correctly, weeven pitched in together to get
a bigger gift.
So we went, we attended theirwedding and then we went to the
reception and it was adinnertime reception.
I seem to recall it startedabout 5 pm and there were some
trays with cheese and crackersthere and we were munching on
those, waiting for the bride andgroom, waiting for the wedding
(28:34):
party.
When one of the people at mytable got up, they went to
explore the hotel.
They had to go to the restroom.
They came back.
They had seen that thebridegroom and the wedding party
were in a room adjacent eatinga full meal.
That is not putting your guestsat ease and we ended up having
to leave because we were allstarving after a couple hours
(28:57):
because they didn't feed us, butthey fed themselves, and so
that would be something where Iwould say that would be
different.
Speaker 1 (29:03):
That would be different.
Yeah, no, I totally agree.
So we have the reception, we'redancing, we're having a great
time and now it's time to gohome.
And how do you handle that?
One tipsy had too much funparty goer, which every wedding
has one?
I will tell you that I wouldsay at least one, yes.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
So this is the case where I like to confer
responsibility to another person.
Do you have a responsiblefriend or relative that you can
put in charge of making surethat that tipsy person doesn't
get in the car and drive underthe influence?
That's the way I recommendhandling that you don't have to
pay for the Uber.
It would be a very nice thingto do, but if you have that
(29:47):
responsible friend or friends,put them in charge of it have
them stop that person, have themoffer them a ride home or to
the hotel, whatever it is, orhave them order them an Uber.
You really do need to make sure,though, that you don't have
anyone doing that.
You also want to make sure thatnobody is completely
over-served.
Hopefully, whomever you'vehired who's running the bar will
(30:08):
make sure that you don't haveanyone who's fall down drunk at
that point.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
So now they've gotten home and now it's time to send
thank yous out.
How do thank yous work?
What is proper etiquette forthank yous?
Speaker 2 (30:20):
So I'm a stickler on the thank you notes.
I will say that Thank you notesdo need to be sent out.
You notes I will say that thankyou notes do need to be sent
out, and the general timeline isthat you have about two months
after the wedding to send them.
I think it's best if you stayon top of them.
And I'd like to bring upprincess Diana.
Uh, when I talk about thank younotes.
So she was princess for a veryshort time.
(30:42):
People forget she died youngshe was.
She died at the age of I thinkit was 36.
And she is known for havingwritten tens of thousands of
handwritten notes during hertime as being a princess.
She was supposedly someone who,if she got a gift that day, she
had a hard time going to sleepwithout writing the thank you
note for it.
So it's easier if you stay ontop of them.
(31:05):
If you write the notes forgifts that arrive before the
wedding, that's going to meanless you have to do after the
wedding.
So I highly recommend that youdo need to send the note, though
.
If somebody sent a gift, theydon't even know if it was
received, they don't know whatto do.
You absolutely need to sendthat thank you, and it can't be
a form letter either.
(31:26):
I don't know how many peoplehave read.
Is the the diary of a wimpy kidwhere he used to have fill in
the blank notes for thank yous?
That is not appropriate.
You, you are an adult.
You are responsible enough toenter into a marriage.
You need to write an actualthank you note.
I don't care if you use thesame formula for each gift, but
(31:46):
it should mention the giftspecifically.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (31:49):
So that people know it was received.
You do need to send it withintwo months and it does need to
be handwritten.
It really is not appropriatefor you to be sending a text
message.
Hey, got your gift.
Speaker 1 (32:03):
Yeah, yeah, that's a little tacky got your gift yeah,
that's a little tacky.
Well, I know just from personalexperience.
We had one wedding guest at ourwedding more than 20 years ago
and we're like they didn't getus a gift.
Okay.
So we're like, how do we handlethis?
So in the thank you note wesaid it was so great to see you
(32:24):
at the wedding, we appreciateyou joining us, you were the
greatest gift, or something likethat, Like your presence was
the greatest gift.
It was something along thoselines.
One week later, we got a phonecall did you not get my gift?
Because we didn't mention it inthe thank you note?
And it turned out that the giftthey ordered had been placed on
back order.
So we didn't get it for threemonths.
(32:46):
So it's a significant timeline,but they had no idea that we
didn't get it and had we notsent that thank you, we would
have had a little grudge likegeez thanks.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
And the thing I want to talk about is you really
shouldn't hold a grudge for that.
There are going to be peoplewhose circumstances dictate that
they are not able to send agift.
I don't want you to feel bad.
If somebody doesn't send a gift, it's okay, and you handled
that perfectly, though, bywriting that note saying your
presence was our present type ofthing.
We're very grateful for you forcoming, and that's a great way
(33:18):
to handle it In this case.
Speaker 1 (33:20):
Yes, it alerted them my gift hadn't been received.
Absolutely Any other tips thatyou would like to share with our
engaged couples and peoplewatching today.
Speaker 2 (33:31):
No, I would just say that it's okay to break
tradition, but it's not okay tobreak etiquette.
Speaker 1 (33:36):
Wonderful.
How can people find you?
Speaker 2 (33:39):
Sure, if people want to find me, I am, as I said.
As you mentioned earlier in theintroduction, I own queen city
etiquette.
I'm on the web.
I am on linkedin more than I amon social media.
I do also have a youtubechannel.
Oh, I know, what we didn't talkabout was appropriate dress.
Oh, yes, that, because thatreminded me.
(33:59):
I am on Pinterest with somethings about dress codes, so if
you want to communicate to yourguests what type of dress code
you want.
You could look at my Pinterest,see the examples of the
different types of dress codesand communicate based on what
you want people to wear.
Speaker 1 (34:16):
In short, what does each one mean?
Speaker 2 (34:18):
So the most formal we're going to start there.
The most formal is actuallywhite tie.
A lot of people think it'sblack tie, but white tie is even
more formal.
If I were a guest at a whitetie event, I would have to have
a long gown.
I am probably going to even bewearing gloves.
We are going to see men in thewaistcoat where they have the
little tails coming out.
(34:39):
They're probably going to haveon a vest.
It's the most formal.
Most people aren't ever going tobe invited to a white tie event
.
Black tie is the next one down.
That is also formal.
That is where we're talkingtuxedos for men and I would say
most likely long gowns notnecessarily what we'd call a
(35:03):
dress is what we would be doing.
There are some circumstanceswhere people are going to do
T-length or something a littlebit different as well, and you
will find some people don'tnecessarily like the traditional
tuxedos.
A dark suit would be a possiblethat you could wear there, but
you're going to definitely wantto have dress shoes.
It's not a place to show offyour chucks or whatever, you're
(35:29):
not going to wear your.
Doc Martens with this and you'renot going to have that, so
that's going to be with that.
Then we come down and we havesemi-formal.
Semi-formal is where if youwanted to wear a tux, you could.
You're under no obligation to,but again, you're going to,
you're going to go with a suitand even if you are a woman, you
don't necessarily have to havea dress or a skirt on.
(35:51):
You yourself could wear a suitas well.
Speaker 1 (35:53):
You're going to want a nice blouse with it.
Speaker 2 (35:55):
You accessories are going to raise it to a more
elegant level as well.
Speaker 1 (36:00):
But in that semi-formal.
Speaker 2 (36:02):
You're probably not going to have the floor length
gown, You're going to have moreof a cocktail dress.
At that point we bring it downand then some people will choose
something that's more likebusiness attire, which is taking
it down from that semi-formaland is still going to be a
little bit nicer.
Maybe we're not wearing a suitjacket, we're just wearing the
(36:25):
tie and the shirt and that's avery typical wedding attire, In
fact most weddings where theydon't say any type of dress code
.
That's basically what we expect.
You're also going to want todress according to the time of
day and the season.
If it is going to be an eveningwedding, darker colors are
(36:48):
going to be more appropriate.
If it's a daytime gardenwedding, if you show up in all
black, you're going to look alittle odd.
You're going to want to havesomething a little bit more
colorful for that.
So that's going to changewithin those steps there, there
are also people who will havecasual weddings.
I went to a wedding that was onHalloween and we were
(37:09):
encouraged to wear costumes.
They wanted the reception to bea costume party because, that's
how they had met was at aHalloween party.
So you will occasionally getthemed ones too.
So you will occasionally getthemed ones too.
What's important is that you docommunicate those themes, how
you want your guests to dress.
The other thing that's beencoming into play a lot more
(37:30):
recently is communicatingpreferred color schemes.
Speaker 1 (37:34):
Yes, I'm not a fan of that.
Speaker 2 (37:37):
I am not.
Speaker 1 (37:38):
I'm not a fan of that .
There's actually a networkinggroup that they actually give
you a dress code to come, and Iactually don't enjoy going to
those events because it's toomuch effort.
I just want to talk to people.
But I do understand it givesflair to the event If everybody
matches it can make the photoslook more harmonious.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
I get that as an etiquette instructor and as a
wedding guest too.
I am not a fan of those either.
I feel that it puts a littlebit of an undue burden on guests
who may not have something inthe appropriate color or style
that has been requested.
They then need to get somethingor they need to rent something.
I know personally I had toassist my mother for a wedding
(38:18):
of a family member and my motherwas really stressed out.
Is this the right color?
Because they had been given, Ithink, four colors, and she
wasn't even sure if it was theright shade.
She was very stressed out aboutit.
This dress code was not puttingher at ease for certain, so I
am not a big fan of those.
Speaker 1 (38:37):
I'm so glad because I'm not either, but under no
circumstances, ladies, youshould not be wearing the color
white to a wedding.
Speaker 2 (38:46):
No.
Speaker 1 (38:46):
Absolutely not.
Speaker 2 (38:49):
To an American wedding in the US.
There are other places wherewhite would be appropriate
because the bride isn't going tobe wearing white to a US-based
wedding, though yes, you shouldabsolutely not be wearing white.
Well, us-based wedding note yes, you should absolutely not be
wearing white.
Speaker 1 (39:03):
Well, wonderful.
On that note, Thank you so muchfor joining us.
Please subscribe so that youcan get future podcasts, and
we'll try to post something oncea week so that you can get
educated from the professionalsabout how to plan your wedding.
This is Kathy Piech Lukas withYour Dream Day.
Happy planning.
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