June 19, 2023 • 53 mins
I had the pleasure of sitting down with Therese for a heartfelt conversation, reminiscing about our shared love for tennis and exploring the impact sports had on her upbringing. We delved into the physical nature of soccer, how it develops skills useful in other sports like tennis, and how her father encouraged his five children to participate in sports, leading to Therese excelling at a young age.
As our discussion continued, we navigated the world of country tennis and the class barriers that often come with it. Therese shared how her brother inspired her to pursue tennis, and how their rivalry pushed her to improve. We also touched on the importance of embracing individual personalities within sports and how the tennis landscape has evolved over the years. Finally, we tackled the emotional and mental aspects of sports, with Therese opening up about her experiences and the impact it had on her emotional development.
Throughout our conversation, we explored the importance of having a supportive community, the power of positive thinking, and how self-improvement plays not only plays a crucial role in tennis, but a crucial role in evolving as a person. Don't miss this engaging and insightful conversation with Therese, as we dive into the world of sports and the lessons we can learn from our experiences on and off the court.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
You are listening to your league tennis podcast with
your host, anthony Radonia.
Anthony is an avid weekendwarrior tennis player, just like
you.
Every week, he'll beinterviewing new and exciting
guests that will not only differin experience and skill level,
but also in age and physicalability.
Your league tennis podcast isabout making you a better tennis
(00:26):
player, whether you're abeginner or have been playing
for years, in your 20s or inyour 60s.
Now here is your host, anthonyRadonia.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
All right Therese.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
How much did you pay for those people to clap?
Speaker 2 (00:45):
for you, For those people a lot.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
I need to pay them too for myself.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
This thing was such a pain in the butt to learn, like
have you ever seen these things?
Speaker 3 (00:54):
No, I mean, it's like you're a DJ.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Yeah, that's what they did.
They use this for music too, socool, yeah.
So, yeah, it took me a longtime to learn it, but now it's
pretty easy.
But, thank you, you're here forthe weekend, visiting anyways.
Yeah, so I figured, why notLet's talk?
Yeah, so this is cool.
A little intro for you and thenfor anyone like watching, i
guess.
So you sort of know what Iattempt to do here.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
I mean sort, of Sort of.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
So at first I think it's sort of morphed into
something different.
At first I was more focused onlike give me a tip on a forehand
or something Right, and I thinkit's sort of morphed for me at
least into like you play tennis,but you also have a life.
I just want to learn about you.
So that's really what it turnedinto And I'm more excited about
that.
(01:43):
Like lately, like my last onewas with my friend Tom, who
actually went to Tacoma.
You better have a better storyto top that by the way.
Speaker 3 (01:50):
No commas, no commas, no dang it.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
But yeah, i was kind of like that and you know he and
he had a different story, likehow he you know anyways, but
that's where my interest hassort of lied.
Now We're just learning aboutyou, your family, your love for
tennis, right, obviously we'regoing to talk about that.
But you know you don't have tofeel like you have to give me
tips or anything, but I'm morethan happy to accept them every
(02:16):
single time if you have some.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
I don't have any tips for you, but I'm good at
critiquing, oh good.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
See, just kidding, i'm going to do that.
We'll talk about me a little.
Speaker 3 (02:25):
No, actually this is cool.
I think tennis is a great wayto connect to people and that's
how I remember it, because I'mnot avidly playing like you and
Denise are anymore, but it was.
It was when I was reallyplaying.
It's a time in my life that wasso fun And I played like seven
days a week and never got sickof it, until just necks and
(02:46):
shoulders and just the rigmaroleof working and life gets in the
way.
But truthfully, if my boyfriendor husband I only have one
husband, but boyfriends at thetime didn't play, i sort of
didn't play, which was kind ofdumb.
But I always played with dudesSince I was little, since, like
my dad was like, come on, let'splay tennis, and then just the
(03:09):
competitive nature of our family, just trying to beat my older
brother was always the end game,which never happened.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
So you have two brothers And I'm married to one
of your sisters, you have twosisters And so your dad, Al, he
puts you all into sports, or howdid that start?
Speaker 3 (03:26):
Yeah, I mean look, five kids menace, you know, at
home they're like get out of thehouse.
I can remember like that.
at that time, you know, in my40s now, you weren't allowed to
really be in the house.
You had to be out of the house.
So we always, you know, theyalways pushed us to do sports
just so they could have a break.
And really, my dad was an avidfan and then also wanted to play
(03:49):
.
So he was.
it wasn't just about him likecheering you on, it was like him
cheering you on And then can Iplay You?
Speaker 2 (03:55):
know, it's kind of like that.
So did he play sports when hewas young?
Speaker 3 (03:59):
No, he was called.
he was a genius musician,bannered I mean and I love music
, don't get me wrong but it waskind of classified as a bannered
.
That's what he used to tell us.
So for him, sports came later.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Okay, yeah, through his kids.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
Yeah, and what's funny is he had the most
athletic kids.
Well, you know, in terms of incomparison to him.
Speaker 2 (04:21):
Yeah, yeah.
So what did you start outplaying?
Like probably soccer, or Soccer.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
you know they put us in everything Soccer, softball,
tennis, basketball, dance, youknow, and I knew when I could
see like Denise and Candice likedoing back walkovers, like I
knew that gymnastics dance thatwasn't going to be for me.
I felt like I was like born asan inflexible human, like my
splits are terrible.
But what came really naturally,what started to come really
(04:49):
naturally for Denise and myself,was soccer.
So we both kind of just startedto excel at soccer and I
started traveling at like eightyears old.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
Which is funny because I was never really into
soccer but only recently Istarted going to see live
matches.
One of my friends son plays init Yeah.
I realized how physical thatsport is And I apologized to
soccer people, probably likeyeah, you had more on, but it is
so crazy physical.
And the reason I'm bringingthat up is when I watched Denise
play tennis.
(05:19):
She is a monster And I wish Ihad more of that.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
Yeah, and like, as we talk about it, i feel like
soccer was a huge reason why Iat least got as far as I could
without actually taking a realtennis lesson, and then because
the footwork was there And soyou know, you're fast, you're,
you can anticipate.
I think anticipates a big wordin tennis, because if you
(05:44):
couldn't anticipate and like getthere, you're never going to be
good, you're never going to befun to play with.
So, yeah, soccer played a bigrole in why it was a little
easier to transition intosomething like tennis.
If that wasn't innate to me,tennis kind of came later.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
Yeah, it's like basketball, tennis, soccer.
Those sports really are a longdistance, plus sprinting
incorporated.
So I think football obviouslyis a.
I mean, they're sprinting, youknow.
I don't know if you canconsider football long distance
a lot of short spurts, right.
Speaker 3 (06:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Baseball?
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
Baseball, come on.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
No, i love any baseball but no, you don't have
to.
No, you can sit down and drinkbeer.
You totally can.
Speaker 3 (06:30):
Sorry Russ, my brother, big baseball guy.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
So first time you picked up a racket was when, do
you remember?
Speaker 3 (06:36):
I think we used him as weapons against each other as
kids, like doing it, like naileach other.
I just remember my brother.
So we lived in this cul-de-sacand it had a hill And my brother
was that quintessential jerkRichard D-I-C-K brother.
He was like Chet in WeirdScience.
You know that guy.
(06:58):
He would literally take, likethis, these our neighbors had
what we'd call lava rocks.
They were just rocks that theyused for their ground covering
and he would take a bunch ofthem and tell us to go down the
street and he would take themand try to hit us with the rocks
, with the tennis racket.
So the tennis racket had alittle bit of a negative meeting
(07:18):
in our house, but you know,every time there was a tennis
match, like I grew up with theJohn McRose, Yvonne Lendles,
like Martin and Chris Everett,my dad would be like I love
Chrissy, Yeah, I'm like Chrissy.
Okay, dad, like you really knowher.
Stephie Graff was somebody thatalways I just thought she was
incredible and incredible towatch.
(07:39):
I've seen her, I've saw herlive a couple of times, but we
grew up with those people and Ifelt closer to the game then
than I do now.
And then our parents put us inlike a tennis camp by a local
woman.
Her name was Melissa Porozakand she had this tennis camp and
I'll say when I'd say camp, itwasn't like maybe what you're
(07:59):
thinking, it was prettyrecreational, Didn't matter what
level you were.
We were like eight, nine, 10,somewhere in those ages, and I
have to fix this, And so youknow it was fun more than it was
like competitive.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
Yeah, yeah.
So it was all day, all week,all summer.
Speaker 3 (08:16):
It was a summer camp, it wasn't all day, it was, like
you know, eight to noon, andthen that was it.
So I think the real thingstarted for me was when my dad
would make me play and then hebring Russ out and then it would
just be like an all outcompetitive.
I would see them just fightLike somebody would throw a
racket, like we definitely tookafter Macaronar family.
(08:38):
And then I remember like Russ'sfriend met us at the court with
his little brother who was myage We were in the same
elementary school and my dadleft, so the two boys locked me
and my schoolmate in the courtand just nailed balls at us.
So this sounds terrible, likeyou'd think, why would I ever
want to play tennis?
(08:58):
but there was some fire in me.
I just wanted to get good, tobe my brother.
That was the whole thing.
And so I really didn't playthat much in the years of, i
would say, from that tennis campeight, nine, 10 to like
sophomore year of high school Ididn't play that much.
Denise was taking lessons inhigh school When it was like her
(09:20):
, she decided to take somelessons and I was in middle
school and she's like Hey,teresa, let's go play tennis And
I'm like sure, and she I'msorry, denise, i love you and I
know you're going to edit this,but it was no contest And so it
was like okay there's some Youwon Yeah.
There was, and she'd get mad andleave and never talked to me
(09:40):
and write mean things about meand her diary and vice versa,
And like we just always, therewas always a little bit of a
competitive thing, but yeah.
so I just knew I had somethingnatural, but I didn't take it
seriously.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
And then.
So when you're playing now, doyou feel that competitiveness at
all?
Is it more just fun or Well,let me kind of so.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
This is what happened .
I was playing PE, the varsitytennis.
You know, you played tennis atPE and the varsity tennis coach
was this woman named Mrs Yardennow, and she goes Hey, teresa, i
think you should try out fortennis.
And I was on the varsity soccerteam.
I made it as a freshman And soI thought soccer was going to be
my path.
But truthfully, in my heart ofhearts, i was getting sick of
(10:25):
soccer.
I wanted to be with a boyfriendand I, you know, was trying to
smoke a cigarette or two.
I mean, i was just kind ofrebelling against sports because
I didn't love all my coaches.
Like I felt a couple of mycoaches were turn offs for me
And it wasn't, like you know,rocky four.
I felt like I'd the Russiancoach or something.
(10:46):
Just I did.
You know, just the stuff theymade me personally do, just made
me hate the sport like startedbecause they were too like
military or they didn't careabout it.
Speaker 2 (10:55):
Militant, Oh okay.
Speaker 3 (10:58):
And I had a little bit of an upbringing where my
mom was tough, my dad was alittle easier, but I was kind of
sick of that And and so I wasstarting to like get sick of the
competitive part.
But I had so much fun playingtennis and PE and it always
ended up being this me and thisguy and we'd go at it at the
(11:19):
very end and we'd win Like I'dwin or we'd play doubles
together, we'd win.
So I ended up trying out like Iactually fell asleep during
that, like I slept through thetryout the first one cause I
didn't think I was really gonnado it and Miss Yarnel sent
someone to knock on my doorcause we live behind in the high
school and she's like we wantyou to try out.
So I did and I ended up makingvarsity and I started out kind
(11:42):
of as a doubles player, which Iwas new to me, and then I ended
up playing third single, like Iwas running like third singles
and then did doubles with youknow that too, And it was.
I was surprised myself.
I ended up being this is whatsomeone said to me you're
seventh in the county in.
San Diego like based off yourwinnings, And we ended up
(12:04):
winning CIF.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (12:06):
Yeah, which is kind of cool.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
Oh, that's huge.
Speaker 3 (12:08):
Until your dad brings his trumpet to the CIF final
and plays it.
Speaker 2 (12:12):
So that's what he would do.
He would literally bring histrumpet and play Cause.
You guys tell that story, but Ireally don't.
I can't really like perceive itreally.
So he's always there with histrumpet.
Speaker 3 (12:22):
Yeah, like some people would call it cool.
You know, like, oh, your dad'sso cool.
I it was a nightmare becauseTennis is supposed to be quiet
and it's not supposed to be likehe'd play a jazz version of the
charge song.
So it was.
They called me a sacrificiallamb in the newspaper because I
(12:42):
lost all my matches.
We still won CIF, but I was atthe you know detriment of me
losing all my matches.
So you know, it was just.
That was another element Ithink that turned me off.
Like, look, i would do anythingto go back and have my dad
there with his trumpet at 47,you know, losing my dad, that
like I would do anything to.
(13:03):
Like let him be him.
But as a kid, especially inyour teenage years, when your
you know friends watch you oryour boyfriend, the last thing
you want is a dad who playstrumpet at your tennis match but
you know he did use my biggestfan, so there's that.
So yeah, it was, you know.
and then here's what happened.
This is not as like the bigstory, like your last coma story
(13:26):
, but I ended up there Like youneed to go and actually take
this seriously.
And, by the way, i had a coupleof people tried to change my
stance.
I had an open stance which Iguess back then wasn't-.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
It wasn't a good thing at the time, yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:40):
But it worked for me.
In fact, most of my strokeswere wrong And so I sort of like
muscled my way through it Andthey're like you really need to
go take the lessons.
Do the country club thing.
So I'm forgetting what the namewas, but there was this country
club in Escondido that likewere really good people went.
And so I tried and I realizedI'm not.
(14:04):
Well, i wasn't as good, but Igot a little bit intimidated and
somewhat termed off by thecountry club.
Oh, okay.
I didn't have the outfits.
I saw people looking me up anddown.
I was in soccer shorts, not atennis skirt.
I was in a Padre hat, not avisor, because my parents
weren't gonna go out and buy meall this gear.
(14:26):
It's not like they had all thiscash to do that.
So there was a little bit of aand I don't know if anyone else
has felt this, but at the timelike an alitness to the sport
that I almost, like, said Idon't deserve to be here And
literally shut my mental gameand I didn't wanna play.
So I didn't actually play mysenior year.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
No, i know exactly what you mean.
I mean me.
It was a little differentbecause my dad was my coach and
the high schools back then werealways open.
Speaker 3 (14:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:57):
So we would literally go to high school every day
after school.
That's what we would do.
So I didn't really have that.
It was more like we were sortof middle class.
I think we could have affordedmore private lessons.
But it was, my dad was my coachand it gets really expensive.
So he would coach us every day.
But no, i know what you mean.
(15:17):
I mean I think that's alwaysbeen sort of the knock on the
sport a little too formal, alittle too traditional.
Speaker 3 (15:24):
If that's a bad thing , i know it could be a good
thing, obviously too.
Let's be honest, it felt like alittle bit of a case system or
something like that.
I mean, I'm a half Asian whitegirl in a country club that no
one looked like me, And so Ifelt a little.
you tell yourself stories and Ihad experienced some things
(15:47):
like that just growing up in thetown.
I grew up And I just felt like,okay, that's not for me.
There's more people that playsoccer that look like me.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
I get you.
Speaker 3 (15:54):
It just felt like I don't know.
I just told myself it's not foryou And then, as I got older, i
ended up playing a little USTA.
I got in and out of it prettyfast.
We won our mixed doubles.
My partner was some dude I metoff Craigslist.
He looked like Garfield, he wasweird but he was good, and he
(16:17):
was like you could be a 5.0, icould train you Cause, he said
he trained people at UCLA Likebut, I think that was a lot Like
I don't know.
It wasn't like.
I Googled a lot back then, buthe really did make me better And
we won our mixed four.
I think I found the plaque theother day was like 4.5.
But, singles wise, I didn'tplay 4.5.
(16:39):
I was just playing USTA as adoubles.
Yeah.
And so, yeah, i mean at the endof the day, when I got to my
20s, 30s, i ended up moving toArizona for business partnership
and I joined a country club andI felt it again.
It was very clicky and no.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
What age was this?
Speaker 3 (17:02):
This was.
I moved to Arizona at like 30,31.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
And And why did you join it?
Speaker 3 (17:08):
I wanted to play tennis.
I moved to Arizona.
I knew no one.
I was good enough to play, youknow, i'd been out of it for a
year or so, but I had thisboyfriend that he didn't play
tennis, but we got into it andhe was an Olympic baseball
player, so he was just a goodathlete.
We were playing seven days aweek.
So we got so many people toplay.
(17:28):
We had these courts that wejust took over in LA and keep
doing that And we just had agreat time.
So when I moved to Arizona, Imissed that community And so I
tried to join this country clubbefore having it.
So, yeah, i think I experiencedsome.
You know where I look at youguys and your community here in
(17:52):
Murrieta in Temecula.
It's so fun, like everyone'slike cool.
Speaker 2 (17:59):
Oh, it's been so lucky because I remember when we
moved out here, i wasn'tplaying at all.
Actually, i haven't picked up aracket and I don't even know
when, like 18, 19 years, andthen so the local country club,
murrieta country club I calledand said hey, i just want to hit
with someone.
And I remember going there, igo, oh, I don't even have a
racket.
You know, i've been playingtennis my whole life and I
(18:20):
didn't bring a racket, i justsomething was like I haven't
done it in so long And so, butonce they let me borrow a racket
, i bought some shoes at likeDix or whatever it was, and I
didn't even have tennis shoesAnd I was wearing basketball
shorts because I haven't playedliterally in many, many years.
And once I started hittingagain, i just was like addicted
It's so fun Yeah.
And then I got just so lucky,like you said, because the
(18:42):
community is what we really fellin love with, because Denise
has so many friends now becauseof it, i have so many friends
now because of it, and it's likeI don't know.
It just opened us up toenjoying something different
within our marriage but alsooutside our marriage, like you
can do something outside andhave fun, but at the same time
we can play together.
(19:03):
You know, and her friends aremy friends, my friends are her
friends, you know, kind, ofthing.
Speaker 3 (19:07):
We love seeing Denise this happy and having a hobby
that she actually loved beforeshe knew you, and I think she
just didn't have the people toplay with And so it's like so
nice when you find your peopleAnd tennis has become much more
universal And I think so manylook a lot of the players kind
(19:28):
of broke the rules too, likewhen you see like Venus and
Serena and like the outfitspeople wear and it's become a
little more colorful interestingDip.
Speaker 2 (19:39):
Yeah, sorry that things I keep doing this.
No, I gotta buy betterconnections.
Speaker 3 (19:43):
Every single person has a connection problem, Sorry
it's because I have musing myhands, but it's just really nice
to see the sport evolve.
Yeah yeah, and now I reallygoing back in my head, or you
know, if I knew what I knew,then I would have stuck with it,
i wouldn't have.
You know, part of it was like Iwas intimidated by it instead
of embracing it.
(20:04):
I was like, well, i could neverbe like that, i'm not gonna be
able to measure up and look thepart and just the dumb things
you think about as an insecureteenager.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
It's funny how you're focused more on that and then
you started talking about thefashion I know sort of side of
it.
but that's you, That's mebecause you're, you're.
I guess it's not really fashionindustry, right, it's not
because that's clothing, right?
Speaker 3 (20:27):
where I've been in the beauty industry 20 years.
And I always knew I wanted abeauty brand.
I was always wearing, like, nota full face and makeup, but I'd
wear lip gloss on the court,like a couple of us did, yeah
and So, yeah, i always felt like, you know, it was nice, it was
(20:47):
fun to be girly, yeah, whilebeing like a tough, competitive
athlete like I liked both.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Yeah Yeah.
So I Mean, i know you don'twatch much tennis right now, but
I wonder really who embracesthat as a pro tennis player.
I mean, there's obviouslypeople who are more into fashion
as pro tennis players, but alot of it's pretty boring and
the weird thing is like if yousee like the guys and their Nike
outfits, they're prettyhorrible.
(21:14):
Have you been seeing?
Speaker 3 (21:15):
that You know.
I just it's nice that noteverything just has to be your
quintess.
I like, don't get me wrong, ilike a white traditional, you
know, but I like that things area little more fun.
Yeah, i feel like you know.
Did you see that movie air With, like the making of Michael
Jordan's shoe?
Speaker 2 (21:33):
Oh, yes, I did.
Speaker 3 (21:34):
Like there's.
There had to be some rulebreaking to do that, and that's
right, because they had acertain amount of red.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
I mean the shoe.
Speaker 3 (21:41):
Okay, yeah and I feel like when the players, it has
to come from them Really.
It has to come have agroundswell from within.
Yeah and I think that's whathas happened to golf and tennis
and, like these, moretraditional.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
Well, just even like two years ago, kirio swore his
Nike Air Jordans walking out toWimbledon and later on he was
like destroyed for it And saidyou can't.
You were told you can only wearwhite shoes because Wimbledon's
white white shoes, white shorts, white shirt.
And People were like why wouldyou dare do that?
He's like why wouldn't I?
you know and find me if youwant.
(22:14):
So it was just even thatquestion.
He was like shocked, like oh, ican't even wear a different
color shoe out here.
So it's really, really strange.
Speaker 3 (22:23):
Yeah, it's interesting, it's like well,
even you know, from the rackIt's on, everything's evolved
and that's a good thing And Ithink people's personalities
come through much more.
The only time I haven't seenreal like personalities come
Have you ever seen like?
did you see Mickelson againstTiger Woods in that HBO?
Speaker 2 (22:42):
When they were mic'd up.
Speaker 3 (22:43):
I thought it was gonna be so fun to see their
personalities truly shine.
It was the most boring was itboring, I didn't get to see it
but I feel like thepersonalities come through now
through the clothes, through,you know it's, it's fun to watch
that you know where before itwas like better not say anything
but Mac and row pretty much.
Speaker 2 (23:00):
No, but you're right.
Even recently.
Now They're questioning theplayers on hey, should we allow
the crowd to get more into it?
because Obviously, tennis is ifyou're in the crowd you can't
even sneeze like your cell phonerings.
Oh, shut up your jerk.
But now they're trying to dostuff to incorporate more of the
crowd, and they were evenasking pro players like Like no,
we need this to be more like abasketball game, more like a
(23:21):
soccer game, like there needs tobe noise all the time.
Because I get it, though, whenit's quiet and then there's a
noise, it messes you up.
Speaker 3 (23:28):
Yeah, I need white noise.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (23:30):
I do feel like there's certain traditionalists
and players that want it how itis.
But I do think, like you wantthe crowd to be engaged.
You know You want people towant to be there and these
rivalries help.
But also like, like seeingsomething that's different or,
like you know, seeing somethingchange is always fun to see, you
know.
So, yeah, how do you feel?
Actually, i want to ask you acouple questions since I'm your
(23:52):
sister-in-law.
Um, you seem to always have alittle bit of a game face in
poker.
You do it in Conversationswhere I might ask you questions
that make you go a little bitmore.
You're like an onion that Ihaven't fully Peeled so when you
say game face, you mean I'm.
I feel like, yeah, you haveyour game.
(24:14):
Like I play tennis like you,don't let much get to you.
Okay you know you kind of areresilient, like that, which is a
good thing.
I don't see you get upset and Idon't see you get super
exuberant.
You're sort of it like rightnow, you're sort of the hmm, but
I know There's a lot happeningin there.
So when do you ever let like,let all your things like colors,
(24:36):
flat, like?
I've never seen you deviatemuch.
Speaker 2 (24:42):
So here's the real interesting part of your
question Only recently I'vereally been trying to um, like
go deeper into that question formyself, because I really feel
that when I'm the best, i'mletting more emotion out, and so
I I find myself, um, calmingmyself down and not letting
(25:06):
myself like exactly what yousaid.
It's actually pretty spot-on.
I try to find myself notgetting upset, but then when I
don't let myself get upset, idon't also have those highs of
like joy or like Pumping, likeI'm not that player on the court
like come on, like that kind ofstuff.
But I but I remember when I'vedone that and it's been
(25:26):
extremely rare When I've donethat it's my best tennis by far
Like, and there's somethingabout allowing me just to be me,
because I think it is a sort oflike I shouldn't be this way,
like I think it's rude Or Idon't want to be rude to you, my
opponent, kind of thing.
Yeah and there's only certaintimes when I really just go out
there And it's in poker too,actually, when I'm on the table
(25:50):
talking Confident, maybe alittle cocky, throwing in some
jokes.
That's when I'm really on, i'mwatching you, i'm watching what
you're doing, or if I'm like alittle submissive and I'm just
quiet and trying to be nice, i'mnot playing my best poker, and
I feel it's the same exact wayon tennis.
Speaker 3 (26:06):
Have you always been like that, as a kid too?
Like what?
what was that from?
Speaker 2 (26:12):
Yeah, it's a.
It's a good question.
I don't, truthfully, i don'tknow.
I really feel that, um Gosh,i've never even thought of it
going back that far, to behonest.
I've only tried examining thepresent.
But if I try to examine myself,oh gosh, it has to be something
with my dad.
Let's be real, i mean, let'swe're talking about dad's.
Speaker 4 (26:31):
It's father's day today.
Oh, you're right.
Happy father's day.
Oh my gosh, we are, but I do, ifeel like so much sports of our
mannerisms and or our drive.
Speaker 3 (26:39):
If you really peel back, the onion can really come
from that parental.
You know, either the support ofor in opposition of, or both at
different times.
Yeah could be driving us.
Speaker 2 (26:51):
Yeah, i mean, and so before I maybe say something,
because I, my dad's beenwatching these, but I have the
most supportive parents, themost loving parents.
They are a split second Theywould do anything for me, give
me all their money, come andchange a tire.
That kind of parents Literallythe best parents in in the world
, i feel.
But at the same time when I wasyoung, i did feel a little like
(27:12):
I don't know.
I'm now thinking back on it.
There was a lot of missedemotion for me Because it was
very harsh, like coachingsometimes, like doing push-ups,
you know, like being told to dopush-ups during your practice or
maybe even like during play.
I remember like if I would lookat my dad I'm playing a match,
(27:32):
i shouldn't be thinking aboutwhat my dad's thinking about,
yeah, and so I remember justsort of closing myself a little
and I think that sort ofprogressed into me now.
But it also helps in my job too,where I can't be so emotional
you're an attorney Yeah sorepresenting people I can't
really I I sometimes can't feelso Emotionally, emotionally
(27:55):
attached to them, because then Ifeel maybe I'll be a little
biased For the wrong things.
Do you know what I'm saying?
So I have to sort of sometimesdetach myself But at the same
time care about them.
So it's really tough.
Speaker 3 (28:07):
It's tough and yeah, and to your point about your
daddy's always so kind, that'show it was more back then, even
when I read, like I readAgassi's book and like You know,
there was always an intenseparent or an intense coach, and
that's kind of what washappening with me.
I had this really intense couplecoaches that made me take my
(28:27):
shoes off, hit kick Heavierballs, and I was the only one
that they made stay afterpractice to do that And I'm like
, why am I singled out?
But looking back, it was sortof that again rocky for
reference where You know youhave to train harder and you
have to.
You know you have to train yourmind and you know.
But I also think that Stuntedsomething in me too, where I
(28:49):
just was like I don't want to dothis.
It was getting too much, whereI didn't know what I was
processing.
And then I would take it home,i'd see my dad and then I'd take
it home and We just it kind ofdid hurt our relationship
because I didn't know how to Doit, i didn't know how to have
that, that intensity And thenalso, let, like him, be my dad.
(29:11):
I don't know how to explain it.
Speaker 2 (29:13):
Do you have any feelings of like?
and this is funny because I hada conversation with my oldest
daughter about this recently.
We were talking about regret orsomething And I'm trying to tie
this in because it made methink of it, so I hope this does
connect here.
But my oldest daughter wasasking about regret and things
like that And I startedrealizing that the only time I
(29:34):
have regret it's not because ofsomething I did and failed or
something.
Maybe necessarily I didn't eventry.
I know some people say like ifyou don't try, you have regret.
My regrets and my past werealways that I didn't.
What is it Like?
sort of stand up for myselfwhen I should have.
I didn't speak up when I shouldhave because it makes you feel
(29:54):
small later, like you know, ifyou were in a situation where if
you didn't speak up and someonesort of takes advantage of you
in a weird way later on, thatregrets there because you feel a
little small and takenadvantage of.
And I feel the connection is intennis sometimes I'm not
letting my true feeling out Andlater on I don't regret my
(30:15):
strokes, like I didn't hit agood forehand today.
I've usually hit a pretty goodforehand, but there's something
about I'm regretting that Ididn't let myself like fully.
Just I don't know what, what'sthe word?
Speaker 3 (30:27):
I know it's probably why I asked this question Like
I'm so stoked to have you in thefamily for many reasons, tennis
being one of them.
Maybe, you know, not the firstone, obviously but it's awesome
to watch you play And the minuteI think I'm good, i remember
about you and I'm like I'm notthat good at all.
Never was, never will be.
(30:47):
You do have a gazelle like theway you play and I see you hit
with.
You know people that are betterand not you guys like make each
other better.
You have it all.
I think the thing that if I wasgoing to do a critique, it's
always been like yeah, there'snot, like, there's not that
emotional burst.
(31:08):
There's never anything, you know, And so sometimes I'm like is
he connecting to that thing AndI don't know cause?
I've had those issues too,where I haven't been able to say
everything I want to say or dothose things in business too,
Like when you meet certain typesof people like I'm always
having to ask for money cause Iam raising money And sometimes I
(31:31):
automatically give that, themthe power, you know, some things
like that.
And then I feel small, like I'mbegging and you know, instead of
looking at it as an equalexchange and an opportunity and
investment, that kind of thing,Sometimes those old programs run
.
So, yeah, it'd be like I thinkabout like Serena even hitting a
ball and like how, like I'vehad a coach tell me you know how
(31:54):
Serena hits the ball, just likegrunt, do the thing.
I can't.
do it Like I can't.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
Yeah, because it's almost like it feels a little
weird, weird and unnatural andlike I'm embarrassed,
embarrassed.
Speaker 3 (32:06):
Yeah, i think that's what it is.
It's not having the confidence.
Speaker 2 (32:11):
Yeah So you know what and you said that right now
about your job.
It really does like just, i'mreally glad we're talking about
this, cause it makes.
This is all I've been thinkingabout lately.
I don't know, even know why Iwant to start the podcast.
I just wanted to do somethingelse, to be passionate about,
cause I'm passionate about thisAnd so I've been really feeling
better.
But also, at the same time, ifeel like I'm trying to examine
(32:33):
other parts of my life where I'mnot doing this.
And so you talking about yourjob, where you felt a little
small.
When you're asking for money,all you had to do, i think you
hit it around the nose.
All you had to do was think ofit differently.
It's not that you're beggingfor money.
It's that you're giving someonean opportunity to invest in you
and your company, and once youthink of it that way, you're now
(32:54):
on equal footing with thisperson.
I think I have to think of itthat way with tennis, which is
sometimes.
It's weird.
I shouldn't even be playingsports if I think this way, but
sometimes if I beat someone in agame, i feel bad for them,
isn't?
Speaker 3 (33:08):
that weird.
Speaker 2 (33:08):
It is weird.
So shouldn't I flip the scriptand go no, they're trying to
improve, just like I'm trying toimprove.
Losing helps you improve.
Speaker 3 (33:18):
Agreed Right.
Speaker 2 (33:20):
So I have to think of it differently.
Where it's not me feeling badCause, then I start to shrink, i
start to not play as good, istart to not be as passionate.
Speaker 3 (33:28):
I can do that with me .
You're allowed to do that withme.
Feel bad.
I feel bad with you.
No, no, it's true.
I feel like that's.
it's some old programs thatcome out in sports.
They come out in thesesituations and business and
sports, and you kind of root forthe underdog and then you
(33:50):
become sort of, like you said,smaller, and that's not the
example you want to set.
No one wants to.
No one wants to lose to someone.
That's too nice.
Speaker 2 (33:59):
Nice.
Yeah, it's so weird.
You know, remember that.
this made me just now think ofthis song in the nineties, and I
recently just downloaded it,like a month ago, which is crazy
.
Do you remember Enigma?
Speaker 3 (34:10):
Yeah, totally.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Okay, and the return to innocence.
Speaker 3 (34:13):
Totally.
You do remember that song.
Speaker 2 (34:14):
Okay, sort of a corny song, totally.
You probably wouldn't belistening to it alone in the car
with the windows down, but inthe shower you're probably
singing it Right.
It's that kind of song.
Speaker 3 (34:22):
It's hard to sing to though Totally.
I dare you to do it right now.
No, I dare you.
Speaker 2 (34:27):
Definitely not.
But there's this one part and Iactually remember it when I was
young because I didn'tunderstand it, but like a month
ago it just made me think I'mlike what an interesting quote.
This one part of the song saysdon't be too proud to be strong.
That's the quote.
Speaker 3 (34:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:44):
And I'm literally like this makes no sense.
What does that even mean?
You can't.
why would you be too proud tobe strong?
Like?
isn't strength like a virtue,right, yeah, so why would you be
?
why would the song be tellingyou don't be too proud to be
strong?
And then it actually sort ofhit me.
Speaker 3 (35:03):
Yeah, you kind of just said it, yeah.
Speaker 2 (35:05):
And I was like wait, this is a weird prideness,
proudness thing where I'm tryingnot to hurt their feelings, i'm
trying to show everyone look,guys, i'm not getting mad on the
court And it's something moreabout like me, like, instead of
being no, you should be strong,because people want to see you
be strong and they want to beinspired by you.
Speaker 3 (35:27):
Well, and on this podcast like it's those things
that people are gonna listen,wanna listen to it's getting not
just getting it out of yourguests, but getting it out of
you too, cause you'll say I'mpassionate, and you'll say it
just like that.
Yeah, yeah.
I'm passionate.
I'm like oh really.
Oh really.
I wanna see it in your face.
You have a great face, can showthe passion, but that's the
(35:48):
thing is like giving yourselfpermission to be in your
fullness and in your power, andthat's been hard for me my
entire life, and I think it washard for my parents, and I think
it it's like my mom wantedperfection, cause she's kind of
has that, but then I was almostscared of her too, so it's like
(36:12):
I wanted her to be proud but, Iwas also scared.
It's just crazy.
But a lot of that did play out.
It plays out in adult life Ifyou don't figure it out in all
sorts of ways.
But sports, the one regret Ihave is quitting.
I quit.
I couldn't take it mentally.
So in some ways what your daddid probably strengthened your
(36:32):
mental game where I just kind offell apart in my head And then
I'm like, whatever, i have aboyfriend, i wanna focus on that
.
Whatever, i'll just get a job.
You know, it was like there'sso many other things I wanna do,
but I still have this hunger tobe an athlete.
Now I'm injured and I have backissues, all the things.
But there was a good window of10 years where I just was sad
(36:55):
because I gave up.
Speaker 2 (36:57):
Yeah, Man, I mean, you're making me think a lot.
You said I'm not no, and I'm notjoking around, but you're right
, though, that this is.
This is the part why somepodcasts you really just listen
to and you don't care, almost ina weird way, what they're
talking about.
As long as they're passionateabout what they're talking about
You, you find it interestingand I think that's why, like the
(37:21):
Joe Rogan podcast It's just tosay it because everyone sort of
knows about it He has adifferent guest on every week
about totally different subjects.
It's interesting because theguest is passionate about their
craft, whatever that is, whetherit's UFOs or whether it's
science or math, but they'repassionate about it.
Speaker 3 (37:41):
And then the host is interested about it and it just
becomes interesting right, and I, you know, i've listened to
smart lists where it's JasonBateman and a couple of I
forgetting their names at themoment.
But what they do is they justtalk to each other and Let
people hear, and then they bring.
And then someone brings in aguest and it's surprised to the
other two.
(38:01):
Oh so it's kind of cool becauseyou don't know it's not
rehearsed.
Yeah but I feel like you know,at the end of the day, people
just want to connect and yeah,so, whether it's the community
of tennis, whether it's anysport or any sort of anything
you do When you feel isolated orsmall, it sucks, you know.
And so what I feel like tennisdid for me at a time in my life
(38:24):
was making me feel part ofsomething fun and cool.
And, you know, more peoplestarted to come into our lives.
I learned more about people, istarted going on Trips with
these people, i started learningother skills through.
You know, it's that communitypiece that I think everyone
wants to connect to.
Yeah, and then, in addition,really allowing yourself to be
(38:45):
in your full like, and what doesthat take?
and you know, because thatthing I mentioned before about
asking for money for investors,by the way, i have to like, okay
, every day, every time, likeyou're probably gonna hear no,
but it's, you know, it's reallyabout the exchange if you have
something to offer.
Speaker 2 (39:07):
You know I have to put myself up every single time
and it's still you think andI'll tell you how I feel after
and I I think I know the answer,but I want to hear what you
think.
Do you think everyone thinksthat way, or is it just you like
?
do you think you're the onlyone that has to give yourself a
pep talk?
Speaker 3 (39:23):
No, i think there's so many people I mean look, i've
done a lot of self-work overthe years.
Well, you know, whether that'stherapy, whether that's, you
know, reading the right books orthe ones that resonate, and
then doing the like, practicingthose things, like even in
marriage.
Marriage is, you know, no onesaid that was easy.
I have to really practice.
(39:44):
Yeah these, these mindset trickson myself.
No, i think it's constant inthe minute.
You think you're good, you'renot like.
It's constant.
And it's a good thing, becauseour whole goal, i think, on this
planet is to evolve and tolearn and to inspire and to be
of service.
And so you.
That means you have to learnmore about people.
(40:05):
Yeah and how, how you, you takeand.
Speaker 2 (40:09):
The thing I'm I think I'm more focused on is when I
do the pep talks prior to atennis match, i find a little
bit of insecurity Leaking in,because I find the pep talk is
sometimes I'm trying to petmyself up.
right the pep talk, i'm tryingto talk myself into it, i'm
trying to listen to the rightmusic you know, i got my
(40:30):
headphones on Something justtrying to get pumped up But I
find sometimes the pep talk is alittle too much and I find
myself being a little insecure,like why do I need this?
Speaker 3 (40:40):
Does your pep talk sound like a negative voice or
does it sound like a out of boy?
You got this, you know.
Speaker 2 (40:47):
Hmm, i don't know, to be honest.
I have to think more about that, but it must be a little.
It must be more, a little likeCome on, like don't do what you
did last time, maybe that'sthat's more negative, that's
more negative, that's that was.
Speaker 3 (41:01):
if I'm really honest, that's my pep talk.
It's like, come on, you knowwhat?
you're doing.
How you know what to do, likewhy are you doing this?
and then I checked to see youknow.
Then I have a little bit oflike a Weird, like you know.
No, marcus, see, a para has tolike do all those things.
Yeah.
I have a little of that too.
Yeah like I'm checking if mylaces are like all the things.
Speaker 1 (41:21):
I'm a doll stuff.
Speaker 3 (41:22):
But yeah, it's never like you're amazing trees,
you've got this like you know.
It's like I don't even know howto say that even out loud.
So I think the negativeself-talk has always been the
motivation.
Like I said earlier, like my,just the wanting to be my older
brother, like Yeah, that well,and that wasn't for a good
(41:43):
reason, it was because I can't.
I've hated him and I wanted tobeat him.
Now I love him but and I stillhaven't beaten him, but it was.
It's sports to me has alwayshad a little bit of that.
Speaker 2 (41:53):
Do you think it'd be beneficial to have a hype man
going into any sporting event?
You know, boxers literally havea person behind the seat.
Yeah, it almost makes sense,right.
Speaker 3 (42:01):
Look at Tony Robbins.
How many people go to a seminar.
I mean, i feel like it'd benice to have that come naturally
, but if it doesn't, thensomeone there, yeah, yeah, and I
feel like that's why somebodyYou know always want someone in
the audience for them that theycan look at and just be grounded
again.
Yeah, but yeah, it'd be cool to.
Speaker 2 (42:22):
I mean, i wonder if because if you can just like
write down a piece of paper likeall the things you would want
to have, a Perfect scenariogoing into a tennis match, i
guess, because we're talkingabout tennis, that would be one
of them, actually some sort ofperson there, almost like what
movies that?
oh, not your Libre, rememberwhen?
um yeah, remember when theywere massaging the.
Speaker 3 (42:41):
The evil guy was his name, oh, my god, i can't
remember any names from thatmovie, but yeah, ramses and then
he would.
Speaker 2 (42:46):
There he's getting a massage, he goes Ramses is
number one, ramses muscles arenumber one, like that kind of
stuff.
Yeah it's a big pep talk.
Speaker 3 (42:53):
I think so.
But you know what we would dobecause we're not used to it.
We'd be like shut up.
Speaker 2 (42:56):
No, we're not like no , you're right, I'm like you're
right, do it to him, not to meHe probably needs it more than I
do, you're right.
Speaker 3 (43:02):
That's what would happen.
You're right until, like, wewould train it ourselves to be
worthy and deserving.
Yes we're always gonna likethat.
Speaker 2 (43:11):
See, that's interesting too, because I
always think of it as trainingmyself to be like a killer, but
it's more like just trainingyourself to feel deserving of
the win, of the success.
Yeah, that's interesting.
No, i know.
Yeah, that's really interesting.
Speaker 3 (43:27):
Yeah, and then to know that when you do win, that
it was deserved and that thatother person needs to know what
it feels like.
Yes lose and learn to be aloser.
Speaker 4 (43:39):
Yeah, because it was for the moment of the moment,
for the moment.
Speaker 3 (43:42):
Yeah, you're not a loser.
Yeah, you lost a game, yeah,and then you can learn from it,
you know, because if you neverlost like, you're not gonna
improve.
You know, but I feel like it'sa lot mental.
tennis is always mental, youknow, for me, because it didn't
matter how great a shape I was,if I had an off day or if I
wasn't Feeling good in my skinOh, i just sucked.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
No, i'm totally with you.
The days where somethinghappened the night before or
works on my mind or I felt likea little I should have done
better with that file at work orsomething like that, even that
slight insecurity translated tome during the tennis match and
it just wouldn't be the same me.
Speaker 3 (44:25):
No, that slight insecurity was enough for me to
quit sports when I shouldn'thave.
I shouldn't have, but I didn'thave the tools.
I didn't have that positivevoice in my head, certainly not
then to have had the.
You know, just be patient withmyself.
And but most those coaches backthen were 80s coaches that were
(44:47):
just like you suck, you don'tscore, you're out of here.
So it was those sort of anddon't get me wrong, those are
also motivational, but it's notbeing able to discern worthiness
, and I think that's the thingis.
Like you here, you suck enough,do.
I suck.
Those are the voices you know,And I still have that when I
play tennis, if and when I playanymore.
Speaker 2 (45:09):
but But isn't that interesting though, that you, or
maybe even me, if we heard thatwe would take it one way.
But there's probably anotherkid out there that would almost
use that as the chip on theirshoulder to strive to be better.
Speaker 3 (45:23):
I think that that's true, but I always think there's
a glass ceiling you're gonnahit eventually, whether it
happens on the court or in yourpersonal life.
some things gotta give therebecause at some point it it, it
caves in.
Speaker 2 (45:38):
Yeah.
You know, So do you think,cause I'm experiencing this with
Isla now, like even outside,just hitting tennis balls with
her on the street if I'mcorrecting her a little too much
, I can see her little face likesort of getting sad And she
just wants dad to be proud ofher and play with her And like.
So I find myself just sayinggood job, good job, and then
(45:58):
she's naturally enjoying thesport more, so it's even outside
.
It's sort of hard for me to tryto be the right coach and the
right dad.
And she's eight.
Speaker 3 (46:08):
So by eight I had those coaches and I was, you
know, and I had this competitive.
I think I just had thatinnately.
I'm one of five kids Likeyou're always vying for your
place on the couch, the remote,the front seat of the car.
You know you were just alwayswanting.
You know my parents couldn'tafford five things for everyone,
(46:29):
so it was like that one thingAnd then you have to fight for
it, right?
So you know, i think we all hadthis like competitive edge.
I think you're either have thator you don't at some point.
But at eight it is interestingfor me to see when I go to cause
I don't have kids, my niecesand nephews games like how nice
the coaches are, and like PC andgood at a girl, and like my
(46:53):
mind goes, what the heck?
Like I'm thinking you shouldhear what I'm thinking in my
head that I can't say becausethese are eight year old kids,
but you should hear, and so Ithink there's something wrong
with me.
But I'd be like God can't watchthis.
It's like they're all bunchedin the middle.
They need to be on the sun,like it's crazy.
So I think to your point, likewhat you're doing is probably
(47:15):
the healthy thing.
I just it would be interestingto like sort of go unpack that
more with someone who knows,because at what point does it
turn competitive?
and that you do need a littlefire under your butt, like at
what point does that happen?
Speaker 2 (47:33):
Well, it's definitely a thing I struggle with being a
parent too, because the whensomeone sees like your kid get a
scrape knee or something andthen you go and say, oh my gosh,
there's always a person thatsays, like throw a little dirt
on it, and I get the expressiontotally right, cause you want
(47:54):
them to toughen up.
The real world's going to bevery tough, so they need to
experience that with you, kindof thing.
But at the same time it's likeso hard to not be their
protector, right, and to likepick them up and all that kind
of stuff.
Oh, now the dog came in thedoor.
So it's just it's interestingthat I'm having a real tough
(48:17):
time like figuring out even thatpart, but that's being a parent
, i guess.
Speaker 3 (48:20):
I think that's being a parent And I don't know if
anyone will ever really figurethat out, but I think you're
doing a great job.
I see two very well adjustedhumans.
They're really sweet, kindpeople, and that's you know.
But in terms of sports, ihaven't seen them enough in a
(48:40):
sporting, competitive, that's so.
So I wouldn't know.
But I look, look I when I seelike even our niece Kalista, she
has that, this competitive edge, and it's fun to see that.
So I just don't know if it's anade or if it's Todd or if it's
both, or like.
I'd be interesting to havesomebody on here that knows.
Speaker 2 (49:01):
Yeah, that would be.
that would be a goodconversation When do you go from
kid to competitor?
Yeah, it's, I don't know.
That's a good question.
It seems like it's sort of halfand half in a weird way, Like
you need someone to be there tohelp you along, but at the same
time you need that drive inside.
Yeah, Two, because if you havejust one or the other, it's
(49:21):
maybe won't work.
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (49:23):
I mean, i was surrounded by other people that
had had it too, so whether it'ssiblings or other sports people.
Like you know, we had somereally great teams growing up.
I mean, my high school soccerteam was better than my college
soccer team.
Like we grew up in a veryathletic like driven town, so it
was nice to have that, but atthe same time that's that
(49:45):
negative.
That negative just got to me.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (49:50):
Well.
Speaker 3 (49:50):
I know now we have.
We have people in the room.
Speaker 2 (49:52):
Yeah, little ones came in the room when they
shouldn't have come in, but Imean, i really enjoyed talking
with you, therese.
Yes, the time's been 50 minutes.
Speaker 3 (50:00):
I me too, you know.
I feel like next I'm going totalk to you in podcast mode all
the time, because it's nice toconnect.
Yeah.
I mean as a sister in law, likeyou don't have to be BFFs with
your family in laws, but it isnice to have a closeness that we
all have and to like get toknow each other and connect that
way too.
Speaker 2 (50:24):
Not to talk about, hold on a second, not to talk
about, like cell phones andthings.
But it's funny, my daughterthat just graduated high school.
She said they didn't allow themto use cell phones during the
graduation and she goes.
We were all just talking, soit's so crazy.
(50:44):
But you're right, this kind ofstuff needs to happen more often
.
It shouldn't just happen whenwe put ourselves in podcast mode
Like there's nothing wrong withlike going to get a beer
together and like putting ourcell phones away, right, like
seeing what we talk about.
Speaker 3 (50:58):
And actually being present and being like curious
Yes, Like naturally curiousabout each other.
I think that's the thing.
So I know we've talked a lotabout random things, but I think
the underlying thing is likethe community piece, the mental
health aspect of being acompetitive sports athlete, and
(51:21):
then also like this desire towant to continue to learn about
yourself and to allow yourselfto be in its full glory full
expression It's hard.
Speaker 2 (51:33):
It is hard, and then to allow yourself to be what's
the word?
What's that word?
Expose, like, allow yourself tobe exposed a little.
Yeah, like, exactly.
Speaker 3 (51:46):
So I think that's when I'm like Anthony, you have
a poker face.
I think we did play a game ofquestions And I could just feel
you weren't fully answeringeverything, And I don't.
I didn't know what that was,but I really do understand you a
little bit more after.
Speaker 2 (51:59):
Well, i don't the funny thing is just to wrap it
up sort of like I actually willcounsel people to do that, like
if I hear Denise talk withsomeone, they'll ask her about
something, and I feel I knowthis might sound weird She's a
little too open.
Later on I'll go, babe, likeyou know, like you don't really
know that person, be a littlemore, hold it back a little more
.
Do you know?
(52:19):
maybe you shouldn't be tellingthem all these things?
Then I started thinking tomyself like yeah, i don't really
open myself up like that, whichI should.
Speaker 3 (52:27):
Well, it's interesting you chose podcasting
In this part of your lifebecause I think the attorney
thing.
I forget sometimes that you'rean attorney when I think about
you as my brother-in-law, butthat makes total sense.
And now you're choosingsomething that you have to
actually be vulnerable and becurious.
Speaker 2 (52:45):
Oh my gosh, this dog is cracking me up.
Speaker 3 (52:47):
See vulnerable and curious.
Speaker 2 (52:49):
Well, since the little kid and the dog ruined
our podcast.
but that was awesome, Teresa.
Speaker 3 (52:53):
No, it was fun, Thank you Thanks for having me No
that was so cool, so let me endit here.
Speaker 2 (52:57):
and I really appreciate it.
Thanks.
Oh, i give everyone a littlegift.
Rock and rod labor justreminded me of your dad for some
reason, so I found rod laborcard for you.
So there's your gift The rockand rod.
It reminds me of your dad,right?
Yeah, well, thank you Teresa.
Thank you so much.
You are listening to your league tennis podcast with
your host, anthony Radonia.
Anthony is an avid weekendwarrior tennis player, just like
you.
Every week, he'll beinterviewing new and exciting
guests that will not only differin experience and skill level,
but also in age and physicalability.
Your league tennis podcast isabout making you a better tennis
(00:26):
player, whether you're abeginner or have been playing
for years, in your 20s or inyour 60s.
Now here is your host, anthonyRadonia.
Speaker 2 (00:41):
All right Therese.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
How much did you pay for those people to clap?
Speaker 2 (00:45):
for you, For those people a lot.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
I need to pay them too for myself.
Speaker 2 (00:50):
This thing was such a pain in the butt to learn, like
have you ever seen these things?
Speaker 3 (00:54):
No, I mean, it's like you're a DJ.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Yeah, that's what they did.
They use this for music too, socool, yeah.
So, yeah, it took me a longtime to learn it, but now it's
pretty easy.
But, thank you, you're here forthe weekend, visiting anyways.
Yeah, so I figured, why notLet's talk?
Yeah, so this is cool.
A little intro for you and thenfor anyone like watching, i
guess.
So you sort of know what Iattempt to do here.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
I mean sort, of Sort of.
Speaker 2 (01:23):
So at first I think it's sort of morphed into
something different.
At first I was more focused onlike give me a tip on a forehand
or something Right, and I thinkit's sort of morphed for me at
least into like you play tennis,but you also have a life.
I just want to learn about you.
So that's really what it turnedinto And I'm more excited about
that.
(01:43):
Like lately, like my last onewas with my friend Tom, who
actually went to Tacoma.
You better have a better storyto top that by the way.
Speaker 3 (01:50):
No commas, no commas, no dang it.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
But yeah, i was kind of like that and you know he and
he had a different story, likehow he you know anyways, but
that's where my interest hassort of lied.
Now We're just learning aboutyou, your family, your love for
tennis, right, obviously we'regoing to talk about that.
But you know you don't have tofeel like you have to give me
tips or anything, but I'm morethan happy to accept them every
(02:16):
single time if you have some.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
I don't have any tips for you, but I'm good at
critiquing, oh good.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
See, just kidding, i'm going to do that.
We'll talk about me a little.
Speaker 3 (02:25):
No, actually this is cool.
I think tennis is a great wayto connect to people and that's
how I remember it, because I'mnot avidly playing like you and
Denise are anymore, but it was.
It was when I was reallyplaying.
It's a time in my life that wasso fun And I played like seven
days a week and never got sickof it, until just necks and
(02:46):
shoulders and just the rigmaroleof working and life gets in the
way.
But truthfully, if my boyfriendor husband I only have one
husband, but boyfriends at thetime didn't play, i sort of
didn't play, which was kind ofdumb.
But I always played with dudesSince I was little, since, like
my dad was like, come on, let'splay tennis, and then just the
(03:09):
competitive nature of our family, just trying to beat my older
brother was always the end game,which never happened.
Speaker 2 (03:16):
So you have two brothers And I'm married to one
of your sisters, you have twosisters And so your dad, Al, he
puts you all into sports, or howdid that start?
Speaker 3 (03:26):
Yeah, I mean look, five kids menace, you know, at
home they're like get out of thehouse.
I can remember like that.
at that time, you know, in my40s now, you weren't allowed to
really be in the house.
You had to be out of the house.
So we always, you know, theyalways pushed us to do sports
just so they could have a break.
And really, my dad was an avidfan and then also wanted to play
(03:49):
.
So he was.
it wasn't just about him likecheering you on, it was like him
cheering you on And then can Iplay You?
Speaker 2 (03:55):
know, it's kind of like that.
So did he play sports when hewas young?
Speaker 3 (03:59):
No, he was called.
he was a genius musician,bannered I mean and I love music
, don't get me wrong but it waskind of classified as a bannered
.
That's what he used to tell us.
So for him, sports came later.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
Okay, yeah, through his kids.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
Yeah, and what's funny is he had the most
athletic kids.
Well, you know, in terms of incomparison to him.
Speaker 2 (04:21):
Yeah, yeah.
So what did you start outplaying?
Like probably soccer, or Soccer.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
you know they put us in everything Soccer, softball,
tennis, basketball, dance, youknow, and I knew when I could
see like Denise and Candice likedoing back walkovers, like I
knew that gymnastics dance thatwasn't going to be for me.
I felt like I was like born asan inflexible human, like my
splits are terrible.
But what came really naturally,what started to come really
(04:49):
naturally for Denise and myself,was soccer.
So we both kind of just startedto excel at soccer and I
started traveling at like eightyears old.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
Which is funny because I was never really into
soccer but only recently Istarted going to see live
matches.
One of my friends son plays init Yeah.
I realized how physical thatsport is And I apologized to
soccer people, probably likeyeah, you had more on, but it is
so crazy physical.
And the reason I'm bringingthat up is when I watched Denise
play tennis.
(05:19):
She is a monster And I wish Ihad more of that.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
Yeah, and like, as we talk about it, i feel like
soccer was a huge reason why Iat least got as far as I could
without actually taking a realtennis lesson, and then because
the footwork was there And soyou know, you're fast, you're,
you can anticipate.
I think anticipates a big wordin tennis, because if you
(05:44):
couldn't anticipate and like getthere, you're never going to be
good, you're never going to befun to play with.
So, yeah, soccer played a bigrole in why it was a little
easier to transition intosomething like tennis.
If that wasn't innate to me,tennis kind of came later.
Speaker 2 (06:01):
Yeah, it's like basketball, tennis, soccer.
Those sports really are a longdistance, plus sprinting
incorporated.
So I think football obviouslyis a.
I mean, they're sprinting, youknow.
I don't know if you canconsider football long distance
a lot of short spurts, right.
Speaker 3 (06:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Baseball?
I don't know.
Speaker 3 (06:22):
Baseball, come on.
Speaker 2 (06:23):
No, i love any baseball but no, you don't have
to.
No, you can sit down and drinkbeer.
You totally can.
Speaker 3 (06:30):
Sorry Russ, my brother, big baseball guy.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
So first time you picked up a racket was when, do
you remember?
Speaker 3 (06:36):
I think we used him as weapons against each other as
kids, like doing it, like naileach other.
I just remember my brother.
So we lived in this cul-de-sacand it had a hill And my brother
was that quintessential jerkRichard D-I-C-K brother.
He was like Chet in WeirdScience.
You know that guy.
(06:58):
He would literally take, likethis, these our neighbors had
what we'd call lava rocks.
They were just rocks that theyused for their ground covering
and he would take a bunch ofthem and tell us to go down the
street and he would take themand try to hit us with the rocks
, with the tennis racket.
So the tennis racket had alittle bit of a negative meeting
(07:18):
in our house, but you know,every time there was a tennis
match, like I grew up with theJohn McRose, Yvonne Lendles,
like Martin and Chris Everett,my dad would be like I love
Chrissy, Yeah, I'm like Chrissy.
Okay, dad, like you really knowher.
Stephie Graff was somebody thatalways I just thought she was
incredible and incredible towatch.
(07:39):
I've seen her, I've saw herlive a couple of times, but we
grew up with those people and Ifelt closer to the game then
than I do now.
And then our parents put us inlike a tennis camp by a local
woman.
Her name was Melissa Porozakand she had this tennis camp and
I'll say when I'd say camp, itwasn't like maybe what you're
(07:59):
thinking, it was prettyrecreational, Didn't matter what
level you were.
We were like eight, nine, 10,somewhere in those ages, and I
have to fix this, And so youknow it was fun more than it was
like competitive.
Speaker 2 (08:13):
Yeah, yeah.
So it was all day, all week,all summer.
Speaker 3 (08:16):
It was a summer camp, it wasn't all day, it was, like
you know, eight to noon, andthen that was it.
So I think the real thingstarted for me was when my dad
would make me play and then hebring Russ out and then it would
just be like an all outcompetitive.
I would see them just fightLike somebody would throw a
racket, like we definitely tookafter Macaronar family.
(08:38):
And then I remember like Russ'sfriend met us at the court with
his little brother who was myage We were in the same
elementary school and my dadleft, so the two boys locked me
and my schoolmate in the courtand just nailed balls at us.
So this sounds terrible, likeyou'd think, why would I ever
want to play tennis?
(08:58):
but there was some fire in me.
I just wanted to get good, tobe my brother.
That was the whole thing.
And so I really didn't playthat much in the years of, i
would say, from that tennis campeight, nine, 10 to like
sophomore year of high school Ididn't play that much.
Denise was taking lessons inhigh school When it was like her
(09:20):
, she decided to take somelessons and I was in middle
school and she's like Hey,teresa, let's go play tennis And
I'm like sure, and she I'msorry, denise, i love you and I
know you're going to edit this,but it was no contest And so it
was like okay there's some Youwon Yeah.
There was, and she'd get mad andleave and never talked to me
(09:40):
and write mean things about meand her diary and vice versa,
And like we just always, therewas always a little bit of a
competitive thing, but yeah.
so I just knew I had somethingnatural, but I didn't take it
seriously.
Speaker 2 (09:55):
And then.
So when you're playing now, doyou feel that competitiveness at
all?
Is it more just fun or Well,let me kind of so.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
This is what happened .
I was playing PE, the varsitytennis.
You know, you played tennis atPE and the varsity tennis coach
was this woman named Mrs Yardennow, and she goes Hey, teresa, i
think you should try out fortennis.
And I was on the varsity soccerteam.
I made it as a freshman And soI thought soccer was going to be
my path.
But truthfully, in my heart ofhearts, i was getting sick of
(10:25):
soccer.
I wanted to be with a boyfriendand I, you know, was trying to
smoke a cigarette or two.
I mean, i was just kind ofrebelling against sports because
I didn't love all my coaches.
Like I felt a couple of mycoaches were turn offs for me
And it wasn't, like you know,rocky four.
I felt like I'd the Russiancoach or something.
(10:46):
Just I did.
You know, just the stuff theymade me personally do, just made
me hate the sport like startedbecause they were too like
military or they didn't careabout it.
Speaker 2 (10:55):
Militant, Oh okay.
Speaker 3 (10:58):
And I had a little bit of an upbringing where my
mom was tough, my dad was alittle easier, but I was kind of
sick of that And and so I wasstarting to like get sick of the
competitive part.
But I had so much fun playingtennis and PE and it always
ended up being this me and thisguy and we'd go at it at the
(11:19):
very end and we'd win Like I'dwin or we'd play doubles
together, we'd win.
So I ended up trying out like Iactually fell asleep during
that, like I slept through thetryout the first one cause I
didn't think I was really gonnado it and Miss Yarnel sent
someone to knock on my doorcause we live behind in the high
school and she's like we wantyou to try out.
So I did and I ended up makingvarsity and I started out kind
(11:42):
of as a doubles player, which Iwas new to me, and then I ended
up playing third single, like Iwas running like third singles
and then did doubles with youknow that too, And it was.
I was surprised myself.
I ended up being this is whatsomeone said to me you're
seventh in the county in.
San Diego like based off yourwinnings, And we ended up
(12:04):
winning CIF.
Speaker 2 (12:05):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (12:06):
Yeah, which is kind of cool.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
Oh, that's huge.
Speaker 3 (12:08):
Until your dad brings his trumpet to the CIF final
and plays it.
Speaker 2 (12:12):
So that's what he would do.
He would literally bring histrumpet and play Cause.
You guys tell that story, but Ireally don't.
I can't really like perceive itreally.
So he's always there with histrumpet.
Speaker 3 (12:22):
Yeah, like some people would call it cool.
You know, like, oh, your dad'sso cool.
I it was a nightmare becauseTennis is supposed to be quiet
and it's not supposed to be likehe'd play a jazz version of the
charge song.
So it was.
They called me a sacrificiallamb in the newspaper because I
(12:42):
lost all my matches.
We still won CIF, but I was atthe you know detriment of me
losing all my matches.
So you know, it was just.
That was another element Ithink that turned me off.
Like, look, i would do anythingto go back and have my dad
there with his trumpet at 47,you know, losing my dad, that
like I would do anything to.
(13:03):
Like let him be him.
But as a kid, especially inyour teenage years, when your
you know friends watch you oryour boyfriend, the last thing
you want is a dad who playstrumpet at your tennis match but
you know he did use my biggestfan, so there's that.
So yeah, it was, you know.
and then here's what happened.
This is not as like the bigstory, like your last coma story
(13:26):
, but I ended up there Like youneed to go and actually take
this seriously.
And, by the way, i had a coupleof people tried to change my
stance.
I had an open stance which Iguess back then wasn't-.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
It wasn't a good thing at the time, yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:40):
But it worked for me.
In fact, most of my strokeswere wrong And so I sort of like
muscled my way through it Andthey're like you really need to
go take the lessons.
Do the country club thing.
So I'm forgetting what the namewas, but there was this country
club in Escondido that likewere really good people went.
And so I tried and I realizedI'm not.
(14:04):
Well, i wasn't as good, but Igot a little bit intimidated and
somewhat termed off by thecountry club.
Oh, okay.
I didn't have the outfits.
I saw people looking me up anddown.
I was in soccer shorts, not atennis skirt.
I was in a Padre hat, not avisor, because my parents
weren't gonna go out and buy meall this gear.
(14:26):
It's not like they had all thiscash to do that.
So there was a little bit of aand I don't know if anyone else
has felt this, but at the timelike an alitness to the sport
that I almost, like, said Idon't deserve to be here And
literally shut my mental gameand I didn't wanna play.
So I didn't actually play mysenior year.
Speaker 2 (14:47):
No, i know exactly what you mean.
I mean me.
It was a little differentbecause my dad was my coach and
the high schools back then werealways open.
Speaker 3 (14:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:57):
So we would literally go to high school every day
after school.
That's what we would do.
So I didn't really have that.
It was more like we were sortof middle class.
I think we could have affordedmore private lessons.
But it was, my dad was my coachand it gets really expensive.
So he would coach us every day.
But no, i know what you mean.
(15:17):
I mean I think that's alwaysbeen sort of the knock on the
sport a little too formal, alittle too traditional.
Speaker 3 (15:24):
If that's a bad thing , i know it could be a good
thing, obviously too.
Let's be honest, it felt like alittle bit of a case system or
something like that.
I mean, I'm a half Asian whitegirl in a country club that no
one looked like me, And so Ifelt a little.
you tell yourself stories and Ihad experienced some things
(15:47):
like that just growing up in thetown.
I grew up And I just felt like,okay, that's not for me.
There's more people that playsoccer that look like me.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
I get you.
Speaker 3 (15:54):
It just felt like I don't know.
I just told myself it's not foryou And then, as I got older, i
ended up playing a little USTA.
I got in and out of it prettyfast.
We won our mixed doubles.
My partner was some dude I metoff Craigslist.
He looked like Garfield, he wasweird but he was good, and he
(16:17):
was like you could be a 5.0, icould train you Cause, he said
he trained people at UCLA Likebut, I think that was a lot Like
I don't know.
It wasn't like.
I Googled a lot back then, buthe really did make me better And
we won our mixed four.
I think I found the plaque theother day was like 4.5.
But, singles wise, I didn'tplay 4.5.
(16:39):
I was just playing USTA as adoubles.
Yeah.
And so, yeah, i mean at the endof the day, when I got to my
20s, 30s, i ended up moving toArizona for business partnership
and I joined a country club andI felt it again.
It was very clicky and no.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
What age was this?
Speaker 3 (17:02):
This was.
I moved to Arizona at like 30,31.
Speaker 2 (17:05):
And And why did you join it?
Speaker 3 (17:08):
I wanted to play tennis.
I moved to Arizona.
I knew no one.
I was good enough to play, youknow, i'd been out of it for a
year or so, but I had thisboyfriend that he didn't play
tennis, but we got into it andhe was an Olympic baseball
player, so he was just a goodathlete.
We were playing seven days aweek.
So we got so many people toplay.
(17:28):
We had these courts that wejust took over in LA and keep
doing that And we just had agreat time.
So when I moved to Arizona, Imissed that community And so I
tried to join this country clubbefore having it.
So, yeah, i think I experiencedsome.
You know where I look at youguys and your community here in
(17:52):
Murrieta in Temecula.
It's so fun, like everyone'slike cool.
Speaker 2 (17:59):
Oh, it's been so lucky because I remember when we
moved out here, i wasn'tplaying at all.
Actually, i haven't picked up aracket and I don't even know
when, like 18, 19 years, andthen so the local country club,
murrieta country club I calledand said hey, i just want to hit
with someone.
And I remember going there, igo, oh, I don't even have a
racket.
You know, i've been playingtennis my whole life and I
(18:20):
didn't bring a racket, i justsomething was like I haven't
done it in so long And so, butonce they let me borrow a racket
, i bought some shoes at likeDix or whatever it was, and I
didn't even have tennis shoesAnd I was wearing basketball
shorts because I haven't playedliterally in many, many years.
And once I started hittingagain, i just was like addicted
It's so fun Yeah.
And then I got just so lucky,like you said, because the
(18:42):
community is what we really fellin love with, because Denise
has so many friends now becauseof it, i have so many friends
now because of it, and it's likeI don't know.
It just opened us up toenjoying something different
within our marriage but alsooutside our marriage, like you
can do something outside andhave fun, but at the same time
we can play together.
(19:03):
You know, and her friends aremy friends, my friends are her
friends, you know, kind, ofthing.
Speaker 3 (19:07):
We love seeing Denise this happy and having a hobby
that she actually loved beforeshe knew you, and I think she
just didn't have the people toplay with And so it's like so
nice when you find your peopleAnd tennis has become much more
universal And I think so manylook a lot of the players kind
(19:28):
of broke the rules too, likewhen you see like Venus and
Serena and like the outfitspeople wear and it's become a
little more colorful interestingDip.
Speaker 2 (19:39):
Yeah, sorry that things I keep doing this.
No, I gotta buy betterconnections.
Speaker 3 (19:43):
Every single person has a connection problem, Sorry
it's because I have musing myhands, but it's just really nice
to see the sport evolve.
Yeah yeah, and now I reallygoing back in my head, or you
know, if I knew what I knew,then I would have stuck with it,
i wouldn't have.
You know, part of it was like Iwas intimidated by it instead
of embracing it.
(20:04):
I was like, well, i could neverbe like that, i'm not gonna be
able to measure up and look thepart and just the dumb things
you think about as an insecureteenager.
Speaker 2 (20:13):
It's funny how you're focused more on that and then
you started talking about thefashion I know sort of side of
it.
but that's you, That's mebecause you're, you're.
I guess it's not really fashionindustry, right, it's not
because that's clothing, right?
Speaker 3 (20:27):
where I've been in the beauty industry 20 years.
And I always knew I wanted abeauty brand.
I was always wearing, like, nota full face and makeup, but I'd
wear lip gloss on the court,like a couple of us did, yeah
and So, yeah, i always felt like, you know, it was nice, it was
(20:47):
fun to be girly, yeah, whilebeing like a tough, competitive
athlete like I liked both.
Speaker 2 (20:53):
Yeah Yeah.
So I Mean, i know you don'twatch much tennis right now, but
I wonder really who embracesthat as a pro tennis player.
I mean, there's obviouslypeople who are more into fashion
as pro tennis players, but alot of it's pretty boring and
the weird thing is like if yousee like the guys and their Nike
outfits, they're prettyhorrible.
(21:14):
Have you been seeing?
Speaker 3 (21:15):
that You know.
I just it's nice that noteverything just has to be your
quintess.
I like, don't get me wrong, ilike a white traditional, you
know, but I like that things area little more fun.
Yeah, i feel like you know.
Did you see that movie air With, like the making of Michael
Jordan's shoe?
Speaker 2 (21:33):
Oh, yes, I did.
Speaker 3 (21:34):
Like there's.
There had to be some rulebreaking to do that, and that's
right, because they had acertain amount of red.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
I mean the shoe.
Speaker 3 (21:41):
Okay, yeah and I feel like when the players, it has
to come from them Really.
It has to come have agroundswell from within.
Yeah and I think that's whathas happened to golf and tennis
and, like these, moretraditional.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
Well, just even like two years ago, kirio swore his
Nike Air Jordans walking out toWimbledon and later on he was
like destroyed for it And saidyou can't.
You were told you can only wearwhite shoes because Wimbledon's
white white shoes, white shorts, white shirt.
And People were like why wouldyou dare do that?
He's like why wouldn't I?
you know and find me if youwant.
(22:14):
So it was just even thatquestion.
He was like shocked, like oh, ican't even wear a different
color shoe out here.
So it's really, really strange.
Speaker 3 (22:23):
Yeah, it's interesting, it's like well,
even you know, from the rackIt's on, everything's evolved
and that's a good thing And Ithink people's personalities
come through much more.
The only time I haven't seenreal like personalities come
Have you ever seen like?
did you see Mickelson againstTiger Woods in that HBO?
Speaker 2 (22:42):
When they were mic'd up.
Speaker 3 (22:43):
I thought it was gonna be so fun to see their
personalities truly shine.
It was the most boring was itboring, I didn't get to see it
but I feel like thepersonalities come through now
through the clothes, through,you know it's, it's fun to watch
that you know where before itwas like better not say anything
but Mac and row pretty much.
Speaker 2 (23:00):
No, but you're right.
Even recently.
Now They're questioning theplayers on hey, should we allow
the crowd to get more into it?
because Obviously, tennis is ifyou're in the crowd you can't
even sneeze like your cell phonerings.
Oh, shut up your jerk.
But now they're trying to dostuff to incorporate more of the
crowd, and they were evenasking pro players like Like no,
we need this to be more like abasketball game, more like a
(23:21):
soccer game, like there needs tobe noise all the time.
Because I get it, though, whenit's quiet and then there's a
noise, it messes you up.
Speaker 3 (23:28):
Yeah, I need white noise.
Speaker 2 (23:29):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (23:30):
I do feel like there's certain traditionalists
and players that want it how itis.
But I do think, like you wantthe crowd to be engaged.
You know You want people towant to be there and these
rivalries help.
But also like, like seeingsomething that's different or,
like you know, seeing somethingchange is always fun to see, you
know.
So, yeah, how do you feel?
Actually, i want to ask you acouple questions since I'm your
(23:52):
sister-in-law.
Um, you seem to always have alittle bit of a game face in
poker.
You do it in Conversationswhere I might ask you questions
that make you go a little bitmore.
You're like an onion that Ihaven't fully Peeled so when you
say game face, you mean I'm.
I feel like, yeah, you haveyour game.
(24:14):
Like I play tennis like you,don't let much get to you.
Okay you know you kind of areresilient, like that, which is a
good thing.
I don't see you get upset and Idon't see you get super
exuberant.
You're sort of it like rightnow, you're sort of the hmm, but
I know There's a lot happeningin there.
So when do you ever let like,let all your things like colors,
(24:36):
flat, like?
I've never seen you deviatemuch.
Speaker 2 (24:42):
So here's the real interesting part of your
question Only recently I'vereally been trying to um, like
go deeper into that question formyself, because I really feel
that when I'm the best, i'mletting more emotion out, and so
I I find myself, um, calmingmyself down and not letting
(25:06):
myself like exactly what yousaid.
It's actually pretty spot-on.
I try to find myself notgetting upset, but then when I
don't let myself get upset, idon't also have those highs of
like joy or like Pumping, likeI'm not that player on the court
like come on, like that kind ofstuff.
But I but I remember when I'vedone that and it's been
(25:26):
extremely rare When I've donethat it's my best tennis by far
Like, and there's somethingabout allowing me just to be me,
because I think it is a sort oflike I shouldn't be this way,
like I think it's rude Or Idon't want to be rude to you, my
opponent, kind of thing.
Yeah and there's only certaintimes when I really just go out
there And it's in poker too,actually, when I'm on the table
(25:50):
talking Confident, maybe alittle cocky, throwing in some
jokes.
That's when I'm really on, i'mwatching you, i'm watching what
you're doing, or if I'm like alittle submissive and I'm just
quiet and trying to be nice, i'mnot playing my best poker, and
I feel it's the same exact wayon tennis.
Speaker 3 (26:06):
Have you always been like that, as a kid too?
Like what?
what was that from?
Speaker 2 (26:12):
Yeah, it's a.
It's a good question.
I don't, truthfully, i don'tknow.
I really feel that, um Gosh,i've never even thought of it
going back that far, to behonest.
I've only tried examining thepresent.
But if I try to examine myself,oh gosh, it has to be something
with my dad.
Let's be real, i mean, let'swe're talking about dad's.
Speaker 4 (26:31):
It's father's day today.
Oh, you're right.
Happy father's day.
Oh my gosh, we are, but I do, ifeel like so much sports of our
mannerisms and or our drive.
Speaker 3 (26:39):
If you really peel back, the onion can really come
from that parental.
You know, either the support ofor in opposition of, or both at
different times.
Yeah could be driving us.
Speaker 2 (26:51):
Yeah, i mean, and so before I maybe say something,
because I, my dad's beenwatching these, but I have the
most supportive parents, themost loving parents.
They are a split second Theywould do anything for me, give
me all their money, come andchange a tire.
That kind of parents Literallythe best parents in in the world
, i feel.
But at the same time when I wasyoung, i did feel a little like
(27:12):
I don't know.
I'm now thinking back on it.
There was a lot of missedemotion for me Because it was
very harsh, like coachingsometimes, like doing push-ups,
you know, like being told to dopush-ups during your practice or
maybe even like during play.
I remember like if I would lookat my dad I'm playing a match,
(27:32):
i shouldn't be thinking aboutwhat my dad's thinking about,
yeah, and so I remember justsort of closing myself a little
and I think that sort ofprogressed into me now.
But it also helps in my job too,where I can't be so emotional
you're an attorney Yeah sorepresenting people I can't
really I I sometimes can't feelso Emotionally, emotionally
(27:55):
attached to them, because then Ifeel maybe I'll be a little
biased For the wrong things.
Do you know what I'm saying?
So I have to sort of sometimesdetach myself But at the same
time care about them.
So it's really tough.
Speaker 3 (28:07):
It's tough and yeah, and to your point about your
daddy's always so kind, that'show it was more back then, even
when I read, like I readAgassi's book and like You know,
there was always an intenseparent or an intense coach, and
that's kind of what washappening with me.
I had this really intense couplecoaches that made me take my
(28:27):
shoes off, hit kick Heavierballs, and I was the only one
that they made stay afterpractice to do that And I'm like
, why am I singled out?
But looking back, it was sortof that again rocky for
reference where You know youhave to train harder and you
have to.
You know you have to train yourmind and you know.
But I also think that Stuntedsomething in me too, where I
(28:49):
just was like I don't want to dothis.
It was getting too much, whereI didn't know what I was
processing.
And then I would take it home,i'd see my dad and then I'd take
it home and We just it kind ofdid hurt our relationship
because I didn't know how to Doit, i didn't know how to have
that, that intensity And thenalso, let, like him, be my dad.
(29:11):
I don't know how to explain it.
Speaker 2 (29:13):
Do you have any feelings of like?
and this is funny because I hada conversation with my oldest
daughter about this recently.
We were talking about regret orsomething And I'm trying to tie
this in because it made methink of it, so I hope this does
connect here.
But my oldest daughter wasasking about regret and things
like that And I startedrealizing that the only time I
(29:34):
have regret it's not because ofsomething I did and failed or
something.
Maybe necessarily I didn't eventry.
I know some people say like ifyou don't try, you have regret.
My regrets and my past werealways that I didn't.
What is it Like?
sort of stand up for myselfwhen I should have.
I didn't speak up when I shouldhave because it makes you feel
(29:54):
small later, like you know, ifyou were in a situation where if
you didn't speak up and someonesort of takes advantage of you
in a weird way later on, thatregrets there because you feel a
little small and takenadvantage of.
And I feel the connection is intennis sometimes I'm not
letting my true feeling out Andlater on I don't regret my
(30:15):
strokes, like I didn't hit agood forehand today.
I've usually hit a pretty goodforehand, but there's something
about I'm regretting that Ididn't let myself like fully.
Just I don't know what, what'sthe word?
Speaker 3 (30:27):
I know it's probably why I asked this question Like
I'm so stoked to have you in thefamily for many reasons, tennis
being one of them.
Maybe, you know, not the firstone, obviously but it's awesome
to watch you play And the minuteI think I'm good, i remember
about you and I'm like I'm notthat good at all.
Never was, never will be.
(30:47):
You do have a gazelle like theway you play and I see you hit
with.
You know people that are betterand not you guys like make each
other better.
You have it all.
I think the thing that if I wasgoing to do a critique, it's
always been like yeah, there'snot, like, there's not that
emotional burst.
(31:08):
There's never anything, you know, And so sometimes I'm like is
he connecting to that thing AndI don't know cause?
I've had those issues too,where I haven't been able to say
everything I want to say or dothose things in business too,
Like when you meet certain typesof people like I'm always
having to ask for money cause Iam raising money And sometimes I
(31:31):
automatically give that, themthe power, you know, some things
like that.
And then I feel small, like I'mbegging and you know, instead of
looking at it as an equalexchange and an opportunity and
investment, that kind of thing,Sometimes those old programs run
.
So, yeah, it'd be like I thinkabout like Serena even hitting a
ball and like how, like I'vehad a coach tell me you know how
(31:54):
Serena hits the ball, just likegrunt, do the thing.
I can't.
do it Like I can't.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
Yeah, because it's almost like it feels a little
weird, weird and unnatural andlike I'm embarrassed,
embarrassed.
Speaker 3 (32:06):
Yeah, i think that's what it is.
It's not having the confidence.
Speaker 2 (32:11):
Yeah So you know what and you said that right now
about your job.
It really does like just, i'mreally glad we're talking about
this, cause it makes.
This is all I've been thinkingabout lately.
I don't know, even know why Iwant to start the podcast.
I just wanted to do somethingelse, to be passionate about,
cause I'm passionate about thisAnd so I've been really feeling
better.
But also, at the same time, ifeel like I'm trying to examine
(32:33):
other parts of my life where I'mnot doing this.
And so you talking about yourjob, where you felt a little
small.
When you're asking for money,all you had to do, i think you
hit it around the nose.
All you had to do was think ofit differently.
It's not that you're beggingfor money.
It's that you're giving someonean opportunity to invest in you
and your company, and once youthink of it that way, you're now
(32:54):
on equal footing with thisperson.
I think I have to think of itthat way with tennis, which is
sometimes.
It's weird.
I shouldn't even be playingsports if I think this way, but
sometimes if I beat someone in agame, i feel bad for them,
isn't?
Speaker 3 (33:08):
that weird.
Speaker 2 (33:08):
It is weird.
So shouldn't I flip the scriptand go no, they're trying to
improve, just like I'm trying toimprove.
Losing helps you improve.
Speaker 3 (33:18):
Agreed Right.
Speaker 2 (33:20):
So I have to think of it differently.
Where it's not me feeling badCause, then I start to shrink, i
start to not play as good, istart to not be as passionate.
Speaker 3 (33:28):
I can do that with me .
You're allowed to do that withme.
Feel bad.
I feel bad with you.
No, no, it's true.
I feel like that's.
it's some old programs thatcome out in sports.
They come out in thesesituations and business and
sports, and you kind of root forthe underdog and then you
(33:50):
become sort of, like you said,smaller, and that's not the
example you want to set.
No one wants to.
No one wants to lose to someone.
That's too nice.
Speaker 2 (33:59):
Nice.
Yeah, it's so weird.
You know, remember that.
this made me just now think ofthis song in the nineties, and I
recently just downloaded it,like a month ago, which is crazy
.
Do you remember Enigma?
Speaker 3 (34:10):
Yeah, totally.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Okay, and the return to innocence.
Speaker 3 (34:13):
Totally.
You do remember that song.
Speaker 2 (34:14):
Okay, sort of a corny song, totally.
You probably wouldn't belistening to it alone in the car
with the windows down, but inthe shower you're probably
singing it Right.
It's that kind of song.
Speaker 3 (34:22):
It's hard to sing to though Totally.
I dare you to do it right now.
No, I dare you.
Speaker 2 (34:27):
Definitely not.
But there's this one part and Iactually remember it when I was
young because I didn'tunderstand it, but like a month
ago it just made me think I'mlike what an interesting quote.
This one part of the song saysdon't be too proud to be strong.
That's the quote.
Speaker 3 (34:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (34:44):
And I'm literally like this makes no sense.
What does that even mean?
You can't.
why would you be too proud tobe strong?
Like?
isn't strength like a virtue,right, yeah, so why would you be
?
why would the song be tellingyou don't be too proud to be
strong?
And then it actually sort ofhit me.
Speaker 3 (35:03):
Yeah, you kind of just said it, yeah.
Speaker 2 (35:05):
And I was like wait, this is a weird prideness,
proudness thing where I'm tryingnot to hurt their feelings, i'm
trying to show everyone look,guys, i'm not getting mad on the
court And it's something moreabout like me, like, instead of
being no, you should be strong,because people want to see you
be strong and they want to beinspired by you.
Speaker 3 (35:27):
Well, and on this podcast like it's those things
that people are gonna listen,wanna listen to it's getting not
just getting it out of yourguests, but getting it out of
you too, cause you'll say I'mpassionate, and you'll say it
just like that.
Yeah, yeah.
I'm passionate.
I'm like oh really.
Oh really.
I wanna see it in your face.
You have a great face, can showthe passion, but that's the
(35:48):
thing is like giving yourselfpermission to be in your
fullness and in your power, andthat's been hard for me my
entire life, and I think it washard for my parents, and I think
it it's like my mom wantedperfection, cause she's kind of
has that, but then I was almostscared of her too, so it's like
(36:12):
I wanted her to be proud but, Iwas also scared.
It's just crazy.
But a lot of that did play out.
It plays out in adult life Ifyou don't figure it out in all
sorts of ways.
But sports, the one regret Ihave is quitting.
I quit.
I couldn't take it mentally.
So in some ways what your daddid probably strengthened your
(36:32):
mental game where I just kind offell apart in my head And then
I'm like, whatever, i have aboyfriend, i wanna focus on that
.
Whatever, i'll just get a job.
You know, it was like there'sso many other things I wanna do,
but I still have this hunger tobe an athlete.
Now I'm injured and I have backissues, all the things.
But there was a good window of10 years where I just was sad
(36:55):
because I gave up.
Speaker 2 (36:57):
Yeah, Man, I mean, you're making me think a lot.
You said I'm not no, and I'm notjoking around, but you're right
, though, that this is.
This is the part why somepodcasts you really just listen
to and you don't care, almost ina weird way, what they're
talking about.
As long as they're passionateabout what they're talking about
You, you find it interestingand I think that's why, like the
(37:21):
Joe Rogan podcast It's just tosay it because everyone sort of
knows about it He has adifferent guest on every week
about totally different subjects.
It's interesting because theguest is passionate about their
craft, whatever that is, whetherit's UFOs or whether it's
science or math, but they'repassionate about it.
Speaker 3 (37:41):
And then the host is interested about it and it just
becomes interesting right, and I, you know, i've listened to
smart lists where it's JasonBateman and a couple of I
forgetting their names at themoment.
But what they do is they justtalk to each other and Let
people hear, and then they bring.
And then someone brings in aguest and it's surprised to the
other two.
(38:01):
Oh so it's kind of cool becauseyou don't know it's not
rehearsed.
Yeah but I feel like you know,at the end of the day, people
just want to connect and yeah,so, whether it's the community
of tennis, whether it's anysport or any sort of anything
you do When you feel isolated orsmall, it sucks, you know.
And so what I feel like tennisdid for me at a time in my life
(38:24):
was making me feel part ofsomething fun and cool.
And, you know, more peoplestarted to come into our lives.
I learned more about people, istarted going on Trips with
these people, i started learningother skills through.
You know, it's that communitypiece that I think everyone
wants to connect to.
Yeah, and then, in addition,really allowing yourself to be
(38:45):
in your full like, and what doesthat take?
and you know, because thatthing I mentioned before about
asking for money for investors,by the way, i have to like, okay
, every day, every time, likeyou're probably gonna hear no,
but it's, you know, it's reallyabout the exchange if you have
something to offer.
Speaker 2 (39:07):
You know I have to put myself up every single time
and it's still you think andI'll tell you how I feel after
and I I think I know the answer,but I want to hear what you
think.
Do you think everyone thinksthat way, or is it just you like
?
do you think you're the onlyone that has to give yourself a
pep talk?
Speaker 3 (39:23):
No, i think there's so many people I mean look, i've
done a lot of self-work overthe years.
Well, you know, whether that'stherapy, whether that's, you
know, reading the right books orthe ones that resonate, and
then doing the like, practicingthose things, like even in
marriage.
Marriage is, you know, no onesaid that was easy.
I have to really practice.
(39:44):
Yeah these, these mindset trickson myself.
No, i think it's constant inthe minute.
You think you're good, you'renot like.
It's constant.
And it's a good thing, becauseour whole goal, i think, on this
planet is to evolve and tolearn and to inspire and to be
of service.
And so you.
That means you have to learnmore about people.
(40:05):
Yeah and how, how you, you takeand.
Speaker 2 (40:09):
The thing I'm I think I'm more focused on is when I
do the pep talks prior to atennis match, i find a little
bit of insecurity Leaking in,because I find the pep talk is
sometimes I'm trying to petmyself up.
right the pep talk, i'm tryingto talk myself into it, i'm
trying to listen to the rightmusic you know, i got my
(40:30):
headphones on Something justtrying to get pumped up But I
find sometimes the pep talk is alittle too much and I find
myself being a little insecure,like why do I need this?
Speaker 3 (40:40):
Does your pep talk sound like a negative voice or
does it sound like a out of boy?
You got this, you know.
Speaker 2 (40:47):
Hmm, i don't know, to be honest.
I have to think more about that, but it must be a little.
It must be more, a little likeCome on, like don't do what you
did last time, maybe that'sthat's more negative, that's
more negative, that's that was.
Speaker 3 (41:01):
if I'm really honest, that's my pep talk.
It's like, come on, you knowwhat?
you're doing.
How you know what to do, likewhy are you doing this?
and then I checked to see youknow.
Then I have a little bit oflike a Weird, like you know.
No, marcus, see, a para has tolike do all those things.
Yeah.
I have a little of that too.
Yeah like I'm checking if mylaces are like all the things.
Speaker 1 (41:21):
I'm a doll stuff.
Speaker 3 (41:22):
But yeah, it's never like you're amazing trees,
you've got this like you know.
It's like I don't even know howto say that even out loud.
So I think the negativeself-talk has always been the
motivation.
Like I said earlier, like my,just the wanting to be my older
brother, like Yeah, that well,and that wasn't for a good
(41:43):
reason, it was because I can't.
I've hated him and I wanted tobeat him.
Now I love him but and I stillhaven't beaten him, but it was.
It's sports to me has alwayshad a little bit of that.
Speaker 2 (41:53):
Do you think it'd be beneficial to have a hype man
going into any sporting event?
You know, boxers literally havea person behind the seat.
Yeah, it almost makes sense,right.
Speaker 3 (42:01):
Look at Tony Robbins.
How many people go to a seminar.
I mean, i feel like it'd benice to have that come naturally
, but if it doesn't, thensomeone there, yeah, yeah, and I
feel like that's why somebodyYou know always want someone in
the audience for them that theycan look at and just be grounded
again.
Yeah, but yeah, it'd be cool to.
Speaker 2 (42:22):
I mean, i wonder if because if you can just like
write down a piece of paper likeall the things you would want
to have, a Perfect scenariogoing into a tennis match, i
guess, because we're talkingabout tennis, that would be one
of them, actually some sort ofperson there, almost like what
movies that?
oh, not your Libre, rememberwhen?
um yeah, remember when theywere massaging the.
Speaker 3 (42:41):
The evil guy was his name, oh, my god, i can't
remember any names from thatmovie, but yeah, ramses and then
he would.
Speaker 2 (42:46):
There he's getting a massage, he goes Ramses is
number one, ramses muscles arenumber one, like that kind of
stuff.
Yeah it's a big pep talk.
Speaker 3 (42:53):
I think so.
But you know what we would dobecause we're not used to it.
We'd be like shut up.
Speaker 2 (42:56):
No, we're not like no , you're right, I'm like you're
right, do it to him, not to meHe probably needs it more than I
do, you're right.
Speaker 3 (43:02):
That's what would happen.
You're right until, like, wewould train it ourselves to be
worthy and deserving.
Yes we're always gonna likethat.
Speaker 2 (43:11):
See, that's interesting too, because I
always think of it as trainingmyself to be like a killer, but
it's more like just trainingyourself to feel deserving of
the win, of the success.
Yeah, that's interesting.
No, i know.
Yeah, that's really interesting.
Speaker 3 (43:27):
Yeah, and then to know that when you do win, that
it was deserved and that thatother person needs to know what
it feels like.
Yes lose and learn to be aloser.
Speaker 4 (43:39):
Yeah, because it was for the moment of the moment,
for the moment.
Speaker 3 (43:42):
Yeah, you're not a loser.
Yeah, you lost a game, yeah,and then you can learn from it,
you know, because if you neverlost like, you're not gonna
improve.
You know, but I feel like it'sa lot mental.
tennis is always mental, youknow, for me, because it didn't
matter how great a shape I was,if I had an off day or if I
wasn't Feeling good in my skinOh, i just sucked.
Speaker 2 (44:06):
No, i'm totally with you.
The days where somethinghappened the night before or
works on my mind or I felt likea little I should have done
better with that file at work orsomething like that, even that
slight insecurity translated tome during the tennis match and
it just wouldn't be the same me.
Speaker 3 (44:25):
No, that slight insecurity was enough for me to
quit sports when I shouldn'thave.
I shouldn't have, but I didn'thave the tools.
I didn't have that positivevoice in my head, certainly not
then to have had the.
You know, just be patient withmyself.
And but most those coaches backthen were 80s coaches that were
(44:47):
just like you suck, you don'tscore, you're out of here.
So it was those sort of anddon't get me wrong, those are
also motivational, but it's notbeing able to discern worthiness
, and I think that's the thingis.
Like you here, you suck enough,do.
I suck.
Those are the voices you know,And I still have that when I
play tennis, if and when I playanymore.
Speaker 2 (45:09):
but But isn't that interesting though, that you, or
maybe even me, if we heard thatwe would take it one way.
But there's probably anotherkid out there that would almost
use that as the chip on theirshoulder to strive to be better.
Speaker 3 (45:23):
I think that that's true, but I always think there's
a glass ceiling you're gonnahit eventually, whether it
happens on the court or in yourpersonal life.
some things gotta give therebecause at some point it it, it
caves in.
Speaker 2 (45:38):
Yeah.
You know, So do you think,cause I'm experiencing this with
Isla now, like even outside,just hitting tennis balls with
her on the street if I'mcorrecting her a little too much
, I can see her little face likesort of getting sad And she
just wants dad to be proud ofher and play with her And like.
So I find myself just sayinggood job, good job, and then
(45:58):
she's naturally enjoying thesport more, so it's even outside
.
It's sort of hard for me to tryto be the right coach and the
right dad.
And she's eight.
Speaker 3 (46:08):
So by eight I had those coaches and I was, you
know, and I had this competitive.
I think I just had thatinnately.
I'm one of five kids Likeyou're always vying for your
place on the couch, the remote,the front seat of the car.
You know you were just alwayswanting.
You know my parents couldn'tafford five things for everyone,
(46:29):
so it was like that one thingAnd then you have to fight for
it, right?
So you know, i think we all hadthis like competitive edge.
I think you're either have thator you don't at some point.
But at eight it is interestingfor me to see when I go to cause
I don't have kids, my niecesand nephews games like how nice
the coaches are, and like PC andgood at a girl, and like my
(46:53):
mind goes, what the heck?
Like I'm thinking you shouldhear what I'm thinking in my
head that I can't say becausethese are eight year old kids,
but you should hear, and so Ithink there's something wrong
with me.
But I'd be like God can't watchthis.
It's like they're all bunchedin the middle.
They need to be on the sun,like it's crazy.
So I think to your point, likewhat you're doing is probably
(47:15):
the healthy thing.
I just it would be interestingto like sort of go unpack that
more with someone who knows,because at what point does it
turn competitive?
and that you do need a littlefire under your butt, like at
what point does that happen?
Speaker 2 (47:33):
Well, it's definitely a thing I struggle with being a
parent too, because the whensomeone sees like your kid get a
scrape knee or something andthen you go and say, oh my gosh,
there's always a person thatsays, like throw a little dirt
on it, and I get the expressiontotally right, cause you want
(47:54):
them to toughen up.
The real world's going to bevery tough, so they need to
experience that with you, kindof thing.
But at the same time it's likeso hard to not be their
protector, right, and to likepick them up and all that kind
of stuff.
Oh, now the dog came in thedoor.
So it's just it's interestingthat I'm having a real tough
(48:17):
time like figuring out even thatpart, but that's being a parent
, i guess.
Speaker 3 (48:20):
I think that's being a parent And I don't know if
anyone will ever really figurethat out, but I think you're
doing a great job.
I see two very well adjustedhumans.
They're really sweet, kindpeople, and that's you know.
But in terms of sports, ihaven't seen them enough in a
(48:40):
sporting, competitive, that's so.
So I wouldn't know.
But I look, look I when I seelike even our niece Kalista, she
has that, this competitive edge, and it's fun to see that.
So I just don't know if it's anade or if it's Todd or if it's
both, or like.
I'd be interesting to havesomebody on here that knows.
Speaker 2 (49:01):
Yeah, that would be.
that would be a goodconversation When do you go from
kid to competitor?
Yeah, it's, I don't know.
That's a good question.
It seems like it's sort of halfand half in a weird way, Like
you need someone to be there tohelp you along, but at the same
time you need that drive inside.
Yeah, Two, because if you havejust one or the other, it's
(49:21):
maybe won't work.
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (49:23):
I mean, i was surrounded by other people that
had had it too, so whether it'ssiblings or other sports people.
Like you know, we had somereally great teams growing up.
I mean, my high school soccerteam was better than my college
soccer team.
Like we grew up in a veryathletic like driven town, so it
was nice to have that, but atthe same time that's that
(49:45):
negative.
That negative just got to me.
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (49:50):
Well.
Speaker 3 (49:50):
I know now we have.
We have people in the room.
Speaker 2 (49:52):
Yeah, little ones came in the room when they
shouldn't have come in, but Imean, i really enjoyed talking
with you, therese.
Yes, the time's been 50 minutes.
Speaker 3 (50:00):
I me too, you know.
I feel like next I'm going totalk to you in podcast mode all
the time, because it's nice toconnect.
Yeah.
I mean as a sister in law, likeyou don't have to be BFFs with
your family in laws, but it isnice to have a closeness that we
all have and to like get toknow each other and connect that
way too.
Speaker 2 (50:24):
Not to talk about, hold on a second, not to talk
about, like cell phones andthings.
But it's funny, my daughterthat just graduated high school.
She said they didn't allow themto use cell phones during the
graduation and she goes.
We were all just talking, soit's so crazy.
(50:44):
But you're right, this kind ofstuff needs to happen more often
.
It shouldn't just happen whenwe put ourselves in podcast mode
Like there's nothing wrong withlike going to get a beer
together and like putting ourcell phones away, right, like
seeing what we talk about.
Speaker 3 (50:58):
And actually being present and being like curious
Yes, Like naturally curiousabout each other.
I think that's the thing.
So I know we've talked a lotabout random things, but I think
the underlying thing is likethe community piece, the mental
health aspect of being acompetitive sports athlete, and
(51:21):
then also like this desire towant to continue to learn about
yourself and to allow yourselfto be in its full glory full
expression It's hard.
Speaker 2 (51:33):
It is hard, and then to allow yourself to be what's
the word?
What's that word?
Expose, like, allow yourself tobe exposed a little.
Yeah, like, exactly.
Speaker 3 (51:46):
So I think that's when I'm like Anthony, you have
a poker face.
I think we did play a game ofquestions And I could just feel
you weren't fully answeringeverything, And I don't.
I didn't know what that was,but I really do understand you a
little bit more after.
Speaker 2 (51:59):
Well, i don't the funny thing is just to wrap it
up sort of like I actually willcounsel people to do that, like
if I hear Denise talk withsomeone, they'll ask her about
something, and I feel I knowthis might sound weird She's a
little too open.
Later on I'll go, babe, likeyou know, like you don't really
know that person, be a littlemore, hold it back a little more
.
Do you know?
(52:19):
maybe you shouldn't be tellingthem all these things?
Then I started thinking tomyself like yeah, i don't really
open myself up like that, whichI should.
Speaker 3 (52:27):
Well, it's interesting you chose podcasting
In this part of your lifebecause I think the attorney
thing.
I forget sometimes that you'rean attorney when I think about
you as my brother-in-law, butthat makes total sense.
And now you're choosingsomething that you have to
actually be vulnerable and becurious.
Speaker 2 (52:45):
Oh my gosh, this dog is cracking me up.
Speaker 3 (52:47):
See vulnerable and curious.
Speaker 2 (52:49):
Well, since the little kid and the dog ruined
our podcast.
but that was awesome, Teresa.
Speaker 3 (52:53):
No, it was fun, Thank you Thanks for having me No
that was so cool, so let me endit here.
Speaker 2 (52:57):
and I really appreciate it.
Thanks.
Oh, i give everyone a littlegift.
Rock and rod labor justreminded me of your dad for some
reason, so I found rod laborcard for you.
So there's your gift The rockand rod.
It reminds me of your dad,right?
Yeah, well, thank you Teresa.
Thank you so much.
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