May 24, 2023 • 35 mins
Kimber launches a new series called Being the Friend You Need with series guest co-host Meghan Fravel. Kimber and Meghan share the vision for this series and its inspiration, and talk about a few of the conversations they're most excited for this summer. They discuss some important contexts for the series and how growing in our relationship with Jesus will always lead to growth in our friendships, as well.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Kimber (00:09):
hey friends.
Welcome to the, your sisterKimber podcast.
My name is Kimber Gilbert, andI'm so glad you're here today.
We're kicking off our new summerseries called being the friend
you need.
And we'll be digging into thequalities of a friend that we
might want to look for as we'repursuing authentic friendships.
But even more than that, we'llbe learning how we can lead the
(00:30):
way by seeking to grow ourselvesas being the kind of friends
that we want in our lives.
And while being a thoughtfulfriend who like brings coffee or
always remembers your birthdayis great.
The kind of friend that wereally need and the kind that we
can be.
That will really bless ourpeople in the deepest ways.
Is a friend who is pursuingholiness and a deeper
(00:52):
relationship with Jesus.
He is the source of community.
So when we grow with him, ourfriendships benefit too.
And during this series, I can'twait to dig in topics like
prayer, confession, worshipmorning, listening to the holy
spirit and more to learn howgrowing in these aspects of our
spiritual lives can spill outinto our friendships to.
(01:13):
I'm also excited to introduceyou guys to my friend, Megan
phrasal, who will be joining meas a special guest co-host for
this summer series.
She has such a heart forfriendship and community, just
like I do.
So I pray our conversations helpyou grow authentic community in
your life and friendships thathonor God and draw closer to
Jesus.
I wish we could snag a table forthree and talk this out over an
(01:37):
iced coffee because hellosummer.
But this is the next best thing.
I'm so glad you hear friend.
Let's get started.
hello friends.
Welcome to this new series thatwe are diving into today on the
podcast.
I'm so excited to introduce youguys, uh, not just to today's
(01:58):
guest, but this is gonna be aspecial guest host for this
series over the course of thesummer.
Megan Frak is joining us todayand I am just so excited to tag
team with her and we're gonna bekind of diving into this new
series, uh, about being thefriend you need.
And so I'm so excited to haveyou with me today, Megan, and we
(02:19):
don't have to just talk aboutall the things today.
We get to like spread ourconversation out, which is gonna
be so fun.
Meghan (02:23):
I know it's awesome.
Hi, I'm so excited for thissummer.
Kimber (02:27):
Will you go ahead and introduce yourself or our
friends listening who may notknow you, although you are a
returner to the podcast.
Meghan (02:32):
Yes, I know.
I'm so excited.
First of all, thanks for askingme to do this cuz I'm really
excited about it and glad, uh,yeah, just the topics and
everything is gonna be a greatsummer and I'm really excited to
just be talking with my friendand new friends, so be
Kimber (02:46):
That's the good stuff, right?
That's what we love.
Meghan (02:49):
yes, but I'm Megan Frak.
For those of you who don't knowwho I am, um, I.
Live in Alaska with Kimber and Iam married to my husband Justin.
We've been married for, um,it'll be 17 years this fall, and
we have four kiddos spanningfrom 14 to six, and I work
part-time at our church.
(03:10):
As a first impressionscoordinator, I have a couple
homeschool kids.
I have one in public school.
We got a nice mixed bag withthat.
And um, I am usually out,especially with summer
approaching, we'll be outsideall day every day, but I also
love ice cream and movies, soI'm pretty well, well rounded,
active and lazy all at the sametime.
(03:30):
So, yeah, that's
Kimber (03:32):
are, those were really good things.
What is your, what are you mostexcited for?
With the summer?
Meghan (03:36):
Ooh.
Um, well it's been, as you know,a long winter.
So honestly, I'm just excited tosee flowers and I got really
excited, um, the other day cuzit was like 50 degrees, which
for all of us in Alaska was I, Iwas in
Kimber (03:51):
Yeah.
Meghan (03:51):
and my flip flops.
Um, but I saw like threebutterflies and I like, Kind of
freaked out.
I was so excited.
Cause I'm like, summer's coming,
Kimber (03:59):
You're like a little, A little toddler who sees a
butterfly for the first time.
You're like, whoa.
Oh
Meghan (04:05):
I was very excited.
Um, yeah.
So I'm just excited for that.
Yeah.
And then just all the communitythat summer brings here, it's
just everyone just kind ofconjoins together.
So, um, that and flowers.
Kimber (04:16):
Hmm.
That's so true.
I love it.
Megan, you have such a heart forcommunity, which is one way that
we first connected, which I justlove so much.
And, uh, one reason that I'm soexcited to talk with you on the
podcast for this series, cuz Iknow that this is something like
really dear to your heart aswell and so I feel like we have
a kinship over that, which Ilove.
Um, and you have also podcastedbefore.
(04:38):
And so, um, I'm excited to like,rejoin you in this world.
Um, what is it about podcastingthat you enjoy doing?
Like, what is the draw for youhere?
Meghan (04:47):
I think I love, what I love about podcasts in general
is just that it.
I feel like it connects us to somany different people.
And, I love that I can just getin my car on the way to the
grocery store and I feel likeI'm almost in a discussion with
a friend, even though I mightnot have a part in it.
Um, just listening to it as a,as a listener.
but I think I get the ability tokind of hone in and just kind of
(05:09):
share like what's in my heartthat I don't necessarily always
get to just sit and have a cupof coffee with someone and
share, but just that dive deep.
Um, Part of the, of the talker,and I am an extrovert, so any
chance I can to, to talk isn'tthat,
Kimber (05:23):
Right.
I feel like you, you and I, wecould, like, if our whole days
were just like back to backmeetings of like getting to talk
to people about life and stufflike that would be a good day.
Like for me.
Is that accurate?
Meghan (05:37):
Yeah.
So I feel like podcasting'salmost like having a coffee,
like I, I get to just sit
Kimber (05:41):
It's like when you can't do that all day, you get to do
Meghan (05:45):
And for me as a, as a listener, it literally, this
might be really weird, I don'tknow if you're like this, but
when I know that I'm not gonnasee my friends this on a day, I
will listen to some podcastsbecause I feel like I'm hearing
people talk
Kimber (05:57):
that's like the,
Meghan (05:58):
me
Kimber (05:59):
the extrovert level expert, like, oh, that's
Meghan (06:03):
see my friends, but I got to hear Jess Connolly on her
podcast talking, and I laughedand felt like I was a part of
something.
Kimber (06:09):
Yeah, no, I think it's true.
I think it connects us andthat's one reason I wonder if
like, I think especially likemoms or even just like, you
know, busy working life, womenof our age, I feel like we're
really drawn to podcasting.
I think part of it is becauseit's like that connection when
you feel like life is too busyfor connection and so, you know,
(06:31):
in one way.
I love that because I think it,um, It like fills us up in a
way, like getting to share that,those conversations in a, in a
small part.
but then also like the flip sideof that is then like, okay, but
we have to make sure we're,we're getting the real thing
too.
Which I know is not a problemfor you.
But, um, but you know, I thinkthat's, I think that's kind of
(06:52):
the draw though, is that we,like, we need these kind of
conversations with people and sopodcasting can meet that need
when we don't have the abilityto do it in person.
But of course we wanna make surethat's not.
That we're not substituting
Meghan (07:05):
Right.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
Yes.
Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah.
And it's just really cool thatwe are in a world where I can
literally go on a, the podcastapp and search for anything I
want.
And there's something like ifI'm like, I wanna learn how to
like raise bees, like I can lookup beekeeping and you know, so
you get that kind of, I don'thave somebody my immediate
Kimber (07:25):
Yeah.
Meghan (07:25):
life that I could just, I just want a little more wisdom
in this area than search for it.
So it's really awesome.
I think it's such a great tool.
Kimber (07:31):
If there was like a, hobby that you could learn
that's like really random likethat, like beekeeping, if you
were like, I'm gonna go out andlearn to do something, is there
anything that's like percolatingin your head, like, I would love
to learn to do this.
Meghan (07:46):
Um, so baking, because I don't bake, like I, I literally
can't, and I just got my firstKitchenAid mixer like last week.
Kimber (07:54):
Oh good.
Meghan (07:56):
So I, I
Kimber (07:57):
You've arrived.
Meghan (07:58):
I've arrived.
I feel like an adult now that Ifinally have a KitchenAid mixer.
so hopefully I could actuallylearn to make my kids like
cookies for my kids that, thatdon't.
I just started doing sourdoughcuz all my friends have now
started doing.
I.
The sourdough thing and like,I'm not even kidding when I tell
you like all 2020 when that wassuch a huge deal, I could not
bake bread.
(08:18):
I tried so hard and it's like myfamily, it's like a joke now,
like mom's making cookies.
Like, oh no, mom's trying tomake bread again.
Oh boy.
And I.
My sweet, one of our sweetmutual friends has been just my,
I call her like my littlesourdough sensei cause she's
just like teaching me all thethings.
And I made my first love ofbread and it
Kimber (08:39):
Did
Meghan (08:40):
good.
I did.
It was so good.
You would've thought I won agold medal in my uh, family cuz
they high fives.
I got texts from my husbandlike, oh my gosh, I can't
believe you actually did it.
Kimber (08:50):
That's so funny.
I love that.
They were so excited too.
I mean, because they probablybenefited
Meghan (08:55):
Oh yes.
And then mean, and I've beenlike, just try it.
It's not that bad.
And I was like, Hmm.
It's like this dense
Kimber (09:02):
Right, right.
Meghan (09:03):
brick.
Yeah.
So I did it.
I did it.
So it's a big, yeah.
So baking, if I could get goodat one thing, that would be it.
Yeah.
What about you?
Kimber (09:11):
Um, I feel like for me, that made me think of actually
like canning.
Like that's something that I'vebeen talking about, like, oh, I
should do this, I should dothis, I should do this.
Which makes us sound verydomestic and I don't know.
I love lots of other things too,
Meghan (09:22):
I just learned how to can salmon, like with Sarah, our
Kimber (09:25):
Yeah.
yeah,
Meghan (09:27):
we did canned salmon a couple weeks ago and it's
awesome.
I'd love to do that too.
So many things.
Kimber (09:31):
I know there's so many things, but I do love that the
podcast world is one of the waysthat we can explore those
things.
It's good.
Although I will say if I couldlisten to a podcast or just have
my friend come and teach me inmy kitchen, it's gonna be the
Meghan (09:44):
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
Oh yeah, 100%.
But if you know, if there isn'tone, that's always an option.
Kimber (09:50):
what you got.
Cool.
Well, Megan, I'm so excited tokind of dig into what our series
coming up is gonna be talkingabout today.
We're just gonna be looking atsome of the ideas that are gonna
be birthed out of this series, Ihope, and the direction that
we're going.
Um, we're gonna be calling itbeing the Friend You Need.
And so my heart for this seriesis really around this.
Idea of, and we probably allheard this phrase or this idea
(10:14):
of, hey, be the friend thatyou're looking for, the friend
that you need.
I think that comes from that.
Um, what is it, like a Gandhiquote that's like, be the change
you wanna see in the world.
Right.
I think it probably comes fromthat idea.
but it's like, I think we, aswe're looking for our
friendships in the world, weshould.
Be not just saying, this is thekind of person that I want to
(10:36):
have as a friend.
This is, you know, that lookslike someone that I would love
to hang out with.
But also we should be reflectingon like, okay, what are the
qualities about those peoplethat are drawing me to them?
And then how can I.
In my own life, like beexemplifying those things
because otherwise we're justlooking to people to like meet
our needs rather than like, Hey,I see something in that person
(10:57):
and so I want to pursue thatmyself.
So that's kind of where I'mhoping and like my heart behind
this, what is like your firstthoughts that come up as you
think of this series title beingthe Friend You Need and those
kind of friendship themes?
Meghan (11:11):
Yeah, no, I, I totally agree with you on that.
And I think that to be thefriend that we need first needs
to start with like taking a lookat our life as I was just
thinking about it, of what in mylife do I have to offer and what
areas in my life do I need togrow?
Because if I want a friend who'sreally trusting, I need to look
and say, but am I a trustingfriend?
(11:32):
And so there is a level of likeownership in that, that can be
really hard to look at thosethings in our life and go, I
want those things, but that'smaybe not quite where I'm at
yet.
And I think being honest aboutthat is the first step.
And then getting those like,Hey, I, I see that you are so
good at prayer.
I wanna get better.
And that can be a great way tostart that friendship too.
But you're, you're on thatjourney as well.
(11:53):
And so taking that look, thatpause of.
I have this list maybe of thingsthat I want in a friend, but
where am I at on these?
Kimber (12:01):
Yeah, because as we're, I don't know about you.
I feel like Things that I lookfor in my friends have even
changed.
And so it's like I feel like Ieven need to evaluate that a
little bit for myself as youknow, my life seasons change as
I just grow as a person, youknow, in good ways.
Or maybe even as I go throughthings in my life that are hard
(12:22):
or you know, just like seasonchanges.
Like I wanna be evaluating kindof constantly.
Or at least regularly, like,Hey, what are the kind of people
that I want to surround myselfwith right now?
And so as I was reflecting onthis a little bit, I think that
like those things have shiftedfor me, uh, in some ways, not in
every way, but um, I wasthinking back to when I was
(12:45):
younger and like in my earlytwenties and even in like high
school and stuff.
I think that I put a lot morepremium on the.
Kind of impression or aura thatpeople gave off?
Like not aura in like aspiritual sense, but like just
in
Meghan (13:02):
the vibe.
Kimber (13:03):
Yes.
Yeah.
Um, and it was like if, ifsomeone was like, you know,
charismatic or impressive to me,I feel like that.
Drew me to them.
And that's not necessarily a badthing.
but I feel like now I'm likealmost a little skeptical of
that because I, it, it has in,sometimes it has led me astray.
(13:24):
Not always, but in some waysit's like obviously the heart of
a person is way deeper than, youknow, that those external
experiences and, um, I thinkabout what.
Like the Lord tells Samuel whenhe's looking for the next king,
and he is like Samuel's lookingat all of these impressive
looking brothers of David.
And David's like, you know, thislike little scrawny shepherd
(13:48):
kid, you know, he is liketotally discounted.
Um, and he is like, God looks atthe heart.
And so thinking about that withour friendships, like, you know,
that's right.
Like I see that as I grow older,I feel like I see more and more
evidence for that being thething that I really need to be
looking for.
But it's like, as a human, likeas a person, I'm just drawn to
certain things.
(14:08):
Right?
And so I feel like it's not abad thing always like.
You know, what you're drawn tois maybe kind of just natural,
but it's like, being able toknow that that's not the whole
story is maybe the mostimportant thing for me there
that I've seen.
How do you think it's shifted orchanged for you?
How you kind of like look forfriends and
Meghan (14:29):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well thankfully it's shiftedfrom, cause I definitely, I know
that, um, I think the big thingfor me has been honesty and
truth telling.
so I know like probably in myteens, my early twenties for
sure, I had a few experienceswhere I had friends that would
come to me with.
Just things they were seeing inmy life and wanting me to be a
(14:50):
better person.
But I saw that as such a threatand the most like unloving thing
that you could do is to tell methe truth that I, I did.
I walked away from some of thoseor just really shut myself down.
And then thankfully, like with.
The Lord's work in my heart, mylife, realizing they were
actually doing the opposite.
They were doing the most lovingthing possible by saying, Hey,
(15:11):
like, we want better for you.
And so I think now that's likethe thing that I actually look
for the most is like, are youwilling to tell me the hard
stuff, and, and then working onmy heart to be able to receive
it well, you know, and so itnever feels awesome, but
Kimber (15:26):
Right,
Meghan (15:27):
Oh, but it is like if, if you can.
Look me now and tell me thetruth, and we're like, good to
go.
So, um, I think that'sdefinitely been a big thing
where before I'd be like, Ooh,I'm not sure.
And now it's like the thing Icrave the most in a friendship.
Yeah.
Kimber (15:40):
How do you feel like, was it just like you started to
see the fruit of like lettingthem tell the truth or what,
like helped you make thatswitch?
Meghan (15:48):
I think just growing.
I honestly growing in my faith.
With the Lord.
I think the Holy Spirit, likereally?
I can't think of like an exactlike moment.
It just all clicked in my head.
But, you know, one ex I thinkI've actually, I don't know if
I've shared it with you but, youknow, I had a friend that that
just shared some things in mylife that I needed to, that they
were seeing.
And not anything likecatastrophically bad, but just,
(16:10):
hey, like, I want better for youin this.
And I think just taking anhonest look at that years later
of Wow and just growing in otherfriendships and actually seeing
like that was actually a reallyloving thing.
And the whole like principlestabbing in the front.
Like I'd much rather have afriend stabbing me in the front
than the back.
um, and so, you know, and I'vegone back to them and been like,
you know what?
(16:30):
You actually being really lovingand I didn't take it that way
and I'm sorry.
So I don't know if it was like.
A specific thing that the lightbulbs clicked, but just as I
just got more refined in myfaith and God just doing a lot
of
Kimber (16:41):
yeah.
Meghan (16:42):
of, that, so
Kimber (16:43):
Yeah.
Well I love that you mentionedthat too, because I feel like
that is something that I reallywanna focus on in this series is
like, I love, I'm all aboutpractical stuff.
Like I'm all about tips andtricks, but tips and tricks
aren't going to like transformour relationships because the
only thing that like transformsour lives is Jesus, like the
power of the Holy Spirit workingin us.
(17:04):
And so of course that appliesto.
The specific area of friendshipas well, so like we need.
The transformative power of thegospel in our friendships as
well.
And so as we're looking at thisseries, that's like where I
wanna focus is like, okay, whatare these areas that like
transform us across the board?
And then how do theyspecifically apply to
(17:25):
friendship?
Which I'm super excited to marrythose things because I think
that.
Sometimes they get shoved intodifferent sectors like, you
know, church life or like mypersonal bible study, my
personal faith.
And then like, oh, how I dofriendship is over here.
But, I don't think that's true.
I don't, I don't think that'strue.
And so, um, there one of the,people that I like to listen to,
um, speaking of podcast world isJackie Hill Perry.
Meghan (17:47):
I love her.
Oh yeah.
I love Jackie.
I love her podcast in her books
Kimber (17:52):
Yeah.
Yeah, she's incredible.
And around the time when I waskind of, brainstorming or
working up this series, I cameacross, I think it was just like
a, a like clip on Instagram orsomething that was about her
talking about on one of herepisodes of their podcast, um,
talking about friendship andsomething that she was saying.
It actually came across to me assort of like, Oh, like, I don't
(18:13):
know.
I don't know how I feel.
Is that right?
Like I wa you know, like whereyou kind of question, you're
like, I don't know if I agreewith that.
and so I went and listened tothe full episode, which is a
great practice.
If you hear a clip of somethingand you're like, I don't know
about that, go listen to thefull context, um, because it's
very helpful.
But essentially what she wassaying is like, she's like, I'm
(18:34):
not looking for.
Friends right now who aren'tlike pursuing Holiness.
And I, and I think it hit me alittle weird at first because I
was like, well, okay, but like,shouldn't we not be like, I
don't know, judgemental of that?
Or like, shouldn't we have, weshould have friends who aren't
Christians too, right?
Like, and so went and listenedto the full episode and um, you
(18:57):
know, she ended up talking someabout like, you know, you're,
yeah, you're gonna have friendsin all different.
Like walks of life, differentplaces in their spiritual
journeys.
Right.
that's, that's great.
But it's like, who are yourclosest people?
Like, who is speaking into yourlife?
Like who is, who are youbouncing things off of?
(19:19):
Like who is, who's the ironsharpening your iron?
And if those people who are likeyour closest people, your core
people speaking into your life,if they're not pursuing holiness
as, you know, not asimperfection, but is in becoming
more and more like Christ astheir highest goal, then that's
gonna impact your friendships.
(19:39):
And so that was really impactfulto me because I, I feel like,
It's easy to think of thesethings as separate spheres, as,
you know.
Oh, I, I have friends, but theydon't necessarily, we can
believe different things like,you know, we can, go about life
differently.
Do life differently, and, well,that's true to an extent.
I think it's the question of whois really speaking into your
(20:00):
life and who is your closestpeople?
Because, you know, it's notabout like, Curating a crew with
exclusivity or anything, it'smore like I need to acknowledge
that my closest people do impactthe type of person I'm becoming.
And so talking about being thefriend you need, who we need is,
we need friends who are pursuingholiness to be our, our very
closest And so, that just reallyhit me and, challenged me a
(20:24):
little bit,
Meghan (20:25):
Yeah.
That's so good.
Yeah, I love that.
Um, I, yeah, I love Jackie HillPerry, and I couldn't agree with
that more.
I can totally see where you'relike, wait, how is this gonna
pan out?
But it's true.
So, um, when I was in middleschool, you know, middle school
girls can be a lot and, uh, youknow, and you're trying to fit
in and figure out where you'reat.
And my mom actually, uh, one ofthe things that sticks out to me
(20:46):
the most is she had me stand ona chair.
And she was talking to me aboutinfluence and about how people
have influence on you.
And my, cuz my response is I canbe a good influence on them and
I can be, you know, all thesethings.
And so she had me stand on oneof their kitchen chairs and she
was standing next to me and shegoes, I want you to try to pull
me up on the chair.
And of course I couldn't, butshe could yank me down real
(21:07):
fast.
He's like, see, this is what isgonna happen when you let your,
the closest friends who aren'tgreat influence, who aren't
impacting you well, aren'tbringing you closer to God,
they're gonna bring you down.
Really quick, even if you havethe best intentions in the
world, and I think that's sotrue in a way of.
Who you're closest to is gonnaimpact who you are.
um, and that's not to say thatwe can't, of course we need to
(21:29):
have people in our life thatwe're like pouring into and have
ministry with, but that's notnecessarily the person I'm gonna
go to when my marriage isstruggling or my kids are going
through something really hard,or I'm in the middle of
something really deep and I needsomeone to pour God's holiness
back into me.
And.
Pour his words back in.
and so if, so, we need friendsthat are doing that same thing
(21:50):
and we're gonna find ourselvesin wilderness seasons and we're
gonna find ourselves wherethat's gonna be hard.
But we're still like seekingthat and trying that.
And then that's when ourcommunity gets to come in and be
like, I know you're goingthrough this, but let me like
help push
Kimber (22:02):
Hmm.
Meghan (22:02):
up for you.
but we can't, we can't do that.
Cuz if we're always got thatfriends like, well then do this
or try this, believe in this,then.
It's gonna be real easy as we'retrying thinking we're going here
that now we've just veered offcourse so far.
so I think that close circledefinitely needs to be that.
Kimber (22:17):
Yeah.
I love the, way that you saidthat of it's when the
metaphorical poo hits the fan,right?
Like, Like, that is when youreally realize.
Oh, like who I am friends with,like my closest friends.
That matters because like yousaid, there's people that we can
pour into that we can, be, Ithink just like, uh, I dunno,
(22:41):
casual friends sounds like a, aweird term, but like you can be
friends with someone, but thatdoesn't mean you're going to
trust them in your hardestmoments to speak truth into your
life.
And I, and so I think that islike such a helpful dichotomy
because it's like, if you are.
In just a pretty chill seasonand like things are going okay,
it may not seem like a big deal,who I spend, you know.
(23:02):
I go to the movies with, or whoI, have play dates with or
whatever.
but it's like, who am I gonna betalking to when things get
really hard and things getreally rough because like you
said, it's gonna like mirrorback to me or pour truth back
into me depending on who I'mspeaking to.
And so, um, I think that's areally helpful dynamic.
(23:23):
One way that I think of itsometimes that, that helps me
because I think it is soimportant that we don't just
have like this holy huddle.
I hear it called a lot of thetime where it's like, you know,
I only have Christian friendsaround me and that's my entire
circle.
you know, I think it's, I thinkit's so important to.
Diversify simply in the factthat we are to be salt and
(23:44):
light, right?
Like that is part of ourmission, and it's not just to be
comfortable with people whoagree with us, right?
Like we are to be salt and lightin the world.
And so I, I do think that aspectis important, but then one of
the ways that I.
Kind of manage that.
I guess in my head, cuz I feellike I can get really murky is I
think of it like concentriccircles of closeness in my
friendships a lot of the time.
(24:04):
And it's like, I might have likeat the very center is like, I
guess the very, very centershould be me and the Lord,
right?
Like that should be my numberone closest relationship, the
one that I tell everything toand.
Of course, uh, we all know verywell that I'm not perfect.
And so that is, um, somethingI'm aspiring to.
I would not say that's always myreality, but it's definitely
something that I know is ofvalue.
(24:25):
Um, and then I think it shouldbe my husband, right?
Because he needs to be my bestfriend.
And, uh, if I'm gonna tell mygirlfriend about something, I
probably should have told him,uh, which again, I'm, I don't
always.
Do great at that.
And so that's a challenge.
But then I have like my, my nextclosest, probably my closest
people.
And that, that center circle tome is where really we're talking
(24:48):
about here, I think most islike, these are the people that
like you're gonna telleverything to that, you're gonna
go to in your hardest momentsthat you really trust to, like
you said, um, speak honestly toyou and like.
Tell the truth to you.
And if those people don't evenshare my same worldview,
regarding like that, you know,Jesus is my savior and like my
(25:10):
life is a gift, God, God glory.
If they don't agree with eventhose central things, I feel
like.
That, that's gonna fracture ourability to like really take care
of each other well.
and then from there, it's likemy circles go out to like, maybe
village or like community toacquaintances, you know, and on
out.
But I think kind of like mindingthose circles and like being
(25:33):
aware of who's in which one andtherefore how am I trusting
them.
I think that can maybe help,that helps me to kind of keep
this dynamic straight in my mindand give me room for these
relationships that maybe aren'tChrist-centered, but are still
important.
Um, mission field or just bringme joy or whatever.
(25:54):
Um, but know that they're notthe most central ones.
How do you feel like for you,you kind of balance this idea
that like not all of ourfriendships are going to be.
The, you know, that, that calledholiness.
Like not all of our friendshipsare going to be about that.
Um, but how do we still lovethose people?
Well, how do you feel like youbalance kind of those things?
Meghan (26:15):
Well, I think that first, like the best.
Picture of this was in the biwas Jesus.
Jesus did this so well in theBible and he really had those
circles.
Like obviously
Kimber (26:25):
he did.
Meghan (26:25):
everyone and showed
Kimber (26:27):
of his thing.
Meghan (26:28):
compassion kind of a thing.
Um, to the people that everyonehad cast out as unlovable and
unworthy.
Like he really broke down thosewalls of we need to extend
ourselves to these people andthey are just as worthy as.
We are, you know, of love.
And then as they, it got closer,you got Lazarus and you've got
Mary and Martha and and then youhave the disciples and you had
(26:50):
his 12.
But then within that 12 therewas still his three that he
really told everything too.
So I think the first thing islooking at that.
It's done so well that Jesus hasdid that.
And it is, it is hard.
And I think for a long time Ilived with this, like everyone
has to have full access and andthen so people that start
speaking into my life thatprobably should have had no,
(27:13):
like nowhere near should havehad the access that they had.
Kimber (27:16):
Yeah.
Meghan (27:16):
and so I look at it as who in my life is.
On the receiving end of that,who's, who's the one that is
calling me, that sees me as aperson that can be the truth
teller that is there, knows thatI'm gonna be there.
And, and that kind of helps megauge, they're in, they're in my
circle, but they've earned thattrust.
They're asking for that trust.
There's that give and takethat's happening.
(27:37):
Um, because obviously God is ournumber one, our husbands.
If you, if you're married andyour spouse and then, yeah.
And then that core three whoare.
Who are showing themselves thatthey're going to show up, that
they're praying, that they'repursuing holiness just as hard
on their own race andcheerleading for yours along the
way.
Um, yeah.
But still not feeling likeyou're building up walls.
(28:00):
We don't wanna build walls,
Kimber (28:01):
Right?
Yeah.
That's another aspect of it,right?
Like, oh, you're not in myexclusive inner circle or
something.
That's not right.
That's not of the
Meghan (28:11):
Yeah, I I, heard something that was kind of like,
I think it was more talkingabout boundaries, but like, you
don't do walls, you do fences,you do gates.
And so being able that, there'sgonna be people that maybe
started out as moreacquaintance, that as time goes
on, they're gonna maybe move upor seasons change and life
things happen.
And maybe someone from thatcloser is gonna, you know, that,
which we've talked about, justthat.
(28:32):
Kind of moving in and out ofthose spheres a little bit, you
know?
And so, and that's o that's okaytoo.
So be open to that.
Kimber (28:39):
Right, because sometimes I think the Lord is.
Behind a lot of that.
Like, you know, like, Hey, this,this is the person that I've put
in your life right now.
And it's like, you know, he'slike thumping you on the head
trying to get you to realizethat like they're a person who
he has given you to help youthrough this time, or just to be
a good friend to you.
And so it's like sometimes wehave to be aware, like, oh, like
(29:00):
there's a gate.
Like they could come into thiscircle, right?
For this time.
Yeah.
And people, people can sometimesleave and that's okay sometimes.
I love that.
Well, Megan, we, we have kind oflooked at the list of, um, ideas
that we've generated for thisseries, and I'm so excited for
it.
I would love to hear, as we kindof wrap up here, what is, what
(29:20):
are you most excited to talkabout this summer in regards to
like, areas or like specificways that we can start working
towards being the friend that weneed.
Like these are the things we'relooking for and, this is where I
wanna start growing so thatthese kind of people come into
my life.
What are you most excited
Meghan (29:39):
Yeah, I think I'm really excited for the talking about
prayer and,
Kimber (29:45):
me too.
Meghan (29:46):
yes, because I, this is something that probably within
the last, I don't wanna say yearthat the Lord's really
challenged me on is so manytimes we'll get, I'll get a text
message or a phone call or youknow, Hey, will you pray for me?
Will you do this?
And I'm like, of course I'mgonna pray for you.
But am I like really taking timeall the time to really stop and
actually do that?
And sometimes, yes, I am, butsometimes I'm like, oh, I said I
(30:07):
was gonna, Pray for them.
And I didn't like just beingfull on it, like it happens
Kimber (30:11):
percent.
Man, I've done that.
I don't think we're the onlytwo.
Yeah.
Meghan (30:14):
no, no, no, And um, so that's been something that like,
I really want my words to notjust fall flat, that when I say
I'm gonna pray for you, like Ireally am.
So that's something that I'vereally, really been working on
this last year, is that when afriend texts me and says, I need
you to pray for me, or Will youjust like, I'm like in that
moment, it doesn't matter whatI'm doing.
If it's 32nd prayer or sometimeslike a five minute prayer and
(30:38):
plea to God, like I'm doingthat.
So I'm really excited to kindalike, grow in that, to kind of
talk about that journey.
you know, hear what other peoplehave to say about it.
Um, that's for me, that's a bigone.
And then always, um, having afriend that's challenging me,
um, cuz if
Kimber (30:52):
Megan, I, those are literally the two that I was
gonna say.
I love
Meghan (30:56):
and you on the notes.
I was like, well, we're thesame.
So, cause I don't, that's whereI'm like,
Kimber (31:01):
It's So great.
What are you excited for aboutthat specifically?
Meghan (31:05):
Uh, I think I'm just, yeah, I'm just in a season, uh,
my friend told me this littlething, a little ditty she does,
called if I, I can't grow if Idon't know.
And I'm like, I love that cuz Iwanna be pursuing holiness and,
and like refining in my life andsoftening those edges that I
need to soften and.
And I can't always do that.
Like you're your own worst kindof person in your brain.
(31:26):
I can't trust my thoughts.
And so obviously it's praying,asking the Holy Spirit and
talking to your spouse, buthaving someone that's maybe that
outsider that can go, Hey, haveyou tried this?
Or, I have noticed you're doingreally good on this, but maybe
you could try growing in.
You know this and I.
Um, and so having someone to dothat is so, I, I'm just like
really craving that in theseason cuz there's areas of my
life I really wanna grow in, butI can't do that if no one's
(31:49):
gonna be honest with me aboutit, you know, and just be like
the yes, I don't need someonethat's just like, you're fine
and you're
Kimber (31:55):
amazing.
Meghan (31:56):
and you're amazing.
Like, you know, sometimes I amdoing amazing and it's always
nice to hear that too, but, butI know that half a 80% of the
day I'm not.
So let's be, let's be honest
Kimber (32:06):
Well, and I think when you hear from a friend who is
like, again, in that closecircle where like you know that
you can trust them and that yourrelationship is stable to
weather those kind of like maybehard talks.
Um, I think when someone doeschallenge you like that, then it
makes the affirmations from themfeel more authentic.
(32:30):
Like, because it's Like, I knowthat they tell me the truth.
Like you said.
And and that counts for hardstuff and that counts for, for
encouragement.
And so to me that makes thosethings all the more valuable,
which again, just deepens yourtrust in each other and can
really be such like a blessing.
I think.
So I
Meghan (32:49):
Yes.
100%.
Same for you?
Kimber (32:51):
Mm.
Yes.
Same for me.
I think, uh, those are the,those are kind of the two that
have been standing out to me.
And, um, man, there's a lot of,there's a lot of cool stuff that
I'm excited to talk with youabout this summer.
So, um, we're gonna get into itin the coming weeks.
So thank you so much for kind ofkicking us off today with me.
Um, I really, my last thing thatI will say with this, um, this
(33:13):
series is I really hope that ourconversations here, Megan can,
really just give.
Our friends listening anopportunity to like start
thinking about these topics andthen go have them in their
living rooms, in their smallgroups, you know, on the
playground, like wherever you'reat.
On your hikes, you know?
Um, yeah, it's like aspringboard, right?
(33:34):
Like you, you start it, start atturn in, and then friends
listening, we want you to gohave these conversations with
your people.
Um, because that's where I feellike the real like life change
happens and where yourfriendships are gonna grow.
Meghan (33:47):
Yes, absolutely.
I'm excited cause I love all thethings we're gonna talk about
this summer.
and yeah, I just see that too.
I see the mamas on theplayground.
They're kids going, Hey, I wannastart working on prayer.
Can we start praying for eachother?
Or, you know, like, yeah, it'sgonna be awesome.
Yeah.
Yes.
Go out and do it.
Kimber (34:03):
Well, friends, it's been so fun chatting with you and
Megan today.
Thanks so much for joining us.
Next week we're gonna startdiving into, we're gonna start
with prayer cuz we're both soexcited about it, so we're gonna
get after it.
So can't wait to talk to youguys more about how we can be
the friend we need when it comesto engaging in prayer in our
lives next week.
So we'll see you guys then.
Meghan (34:23):
All right.
Bye.
Kimber (34:28):
Friends.
I'm so glad you could join meand Megan on the show this week,
as we dive into the series aboutbeing the friend you need, I
pray that as Megan and I said,you will take these topics to
your conversations with yourreal life friends.
Don't let us stop here.
Consider who your closest peopleare, who you trust to pour into
you and speak truth back to you.
(34:48):
And I challenge you to challengeeach other.
To grow and being the friendsyou need, not by trying harder,
but by pursuing Jesus more andmore.
Friends.
If you're excited for thisseries, I want you to do
something for me.
This weekly, you share thepodcast with a friend, just
shoot her a DM with a post fromsocial or text her an episode
link with something like.
I'm so excited for this newseries on the, your sister
(35:10):
Kimber podcast.
And I love if you listened inand we can talk about it the
next time we hang out.
This is such a great way to getthose conversations going about
growing in holiness and how thatcan impact your specific
friendships.
And I know how busy summer canget.
So make sure you subscribe tothe podcast wherever you listen.
So you don't miss an episode.
You can also sign up to be partof my newsletter crew so that
(35:32):
you get a weekly previewdirectly to your email inbox of
what will be on the podcast thatweek.
Just visit your sisterkimber.com and subscribe there.
Fred.
Thank you so much for spendingpart of your day with us until
next time.
It's your sister.
Kimmer.
hey friends.
Welcome to the, your sisterKimber podcast.
My name is Kimber Gilbert, andI'm so glad you're here today.
We're kicking off our new summerseries called being the friend
you need.
And we'll be digging into thequalities of a friend that we
might want to look for as we'repursuing authentic friendships.
But even more than that, we'llbe learning how we can lead the
(00:30):
way by seeking to grow ourselvesas being the kind of friends
that we want in our lives.
And while being a thoughtfulfriend who like brings coffee or
always remembers your birthdayis great.
The kind of friend that wereally need and the kind that we
can be.
That will really bless ourpeople in the deepest ways.
Is a friend who is pursuingholiness and a deeper
(00:52):
relationship with Jesus.
He is the source of community.
So when we grow with him, ourfriendships benefit too.
And during this series, I can'twait to dig in topics like
prayer, confession, worshipmorning, listening to the holy
spirit and more to learn howgrowing in these aspects of our
spiritual lives can spill outinto our friendships to.
(01:13):
I'm also excited to introduceyou guys to my friend, Megan
phrasal, who will be joining meas a special guest co-host for
this summer series.
She has such a heart forfriendship and community, just
like I do.
So I pray our conversations helpyou grow authentic community in
your life and friendships thathonor God and draw closer to
Jesus.
I wish we could snag a table forthree and talk this out over an
(01:37):
iced coffee because hellosummer.
But this is the next best thing.
I'm so glad you hear friend.
Let's get started.
hello friends.
Welcome to this new series thatwe are diving into today on the
podcast.
I'm so excited to introduce youguys, uh, not just to today's
(01:58):
guest, but this is gonna be aspecial guest host for this
series over the course of thesummer.
Megan Frak is joining us todayand I am just so excited to tag
team with her and we're gonna bekind of diving into this new
series, uh, about being thefriend you need.
And so I'm so excited to haveyou with me today, Megan, and we
(02:19):
don't have to just talk aboutall the things today.
We get to like spread ourconversation out, which is gonna
be so fun.
Meghan (02:23):
I know it's awesome.
Hi, I'm so excited for thissummer.
Kimber (02:27):
Will you go ahead and introduce yourself or our
friends listening who may notknow you, although you are a
returner to the podcast.
Meghan (02:32):
Yes, I know.
I'm so excited.
First of all, thanks for askingme to do this cuz I'm really
excited about it and glad, uh,yeah, just the topics and
everything is gonna be a greatsummer and I'm really excited to
just be talking with my friendand new friends, so be
Kimber (02:46):
That's the good stuff, right?
That's what we love.
Meghan (02:49):
yes, but I'm Megan Frak.
For those of you who don't knowwho I am, um, I.
Live in Alaska with Kimber and Iam married to my husband Justin.
We've been married for, um,it'll be 17 years this fall, and
we have four kiddos spanningfrom 14 to six, and I work
part-time at our church.
(03:10):
As a first impressionscoordinator, I have a couple
homeschool kids.
I have one in public school.
We got a nice mixed bag withthat.
And um, I am usually out,especially with summer
approaching, we'll be outsideall day every day, but I also
love ice cream and movies, soI'm pretty well, well rounded,
active and lazy all at the sametime.
(03:30):
So, yeah, that's
Kimber (03:32):
are, those were really good things.
What is your, what are you mostexcited for?
With the summer?
Meghan (03:36):
Ooh.
Um, well it's been, as you know,a long winter.
So honestly, I'm just excited tosee flowers and I got really
excited, um, the other day cuzit was like 50 degrees, which
for all of us in Alaska was I, Iwas in
Kimber (03:51):
Yeah.
Meghan (03:51):
and my flip flops.
Um, but I saw like threebutterflies and I like, Kind of
freaked out.
I was so excited.
Cause I'm like, summer's coming,
Kimber (03:59):
You're like a little, A little toddler who sees a
butterfly for the first time.
You're like, whoa.
Oh
Meghan (04:05):
I was very excited.
Um, yeah.
So I'm just excited for that.
Yeah.
And then just all the communitythat summer brings here, it's
just everyone just kind ofconjoins together.
So, um, that and flowers.
Kimber (04:16):
Hmm.
That's so true.
I love it.
Megan, you have such a heart forcommunity, which is one way that
we first connected, which I justlove so much.
And, uh, one reason that I'm soexcited to talk with you on the
podcast for this series, cuz Iknow that this is something like
really dear to your heart aswell and so I feel like we have
a kinship over that, which Ilove.
Um, and you have also podcastedbefore.
(04:38):
And so, um, I'm excited to like,rejoin you in this world.
Um, what is it about podcastingthat you enjoy doing?
Like, what is the draw for youhere?
Meghan (04:47):
I think I love, what I love about podcasts in general
is just that it.
I feel like it connects us to somany different people.
And, I love that I can just getin my car on the way to the
grocery store and I feel likeI'm almost in a discussion with
a friend, even though I mightnot have a part in it.
Um, just listening to it as a,as a listener.
but I think I get the ability tokind of hone in and just kind of
(05:09):
share like what's in my heartthat I don't necessarily always
get to just sit and have a cupof coffee with someone and
share, but just that dive deep.
Um, Part of the, of the talker,and I am an extrovert, so any
chance I can to, to talk isn'tthat,
Kimber (05:23):
Right.
I feel like you, you and I, wecould, like, if our whole days
were just like back to backmeetings of like getting to talk
to people about life and stufflike that would be a good day.
Like for me.
Is that accurate?
Meghan (05:37):
Yeah.
So I feel like podcasting'salmost like having a coffee,
like I, I get to just sit
Kimber (05:41):
It's like when you can't do that all day, you get to do
Meghan (05:45):
And for me as a, as a listener, it literally, this
might be really weird, I don'tknow if you're like this, but
when I know that I'm not gonnasee my friends this on a day, I
will listen to some podcastsbecause I feel like I'm hearing
people talk
Kimber (05:57):
that's like the,
Meghan (05:58):
me
Kimber (05:59):
the extrovert level expert, like, oh, that's
Meghan (06:03):
see my friends, but I got to hear Jess Connolly on her
podcast talking, and I laughedand felt like I was a part of
something.
Kimber (06:09):
Yeah, no, I think it's true.
I think it connects us andthat's one reason I wonder if
like, I think especially likemoms or even just like, you
know, busy working life, womenof our age, I feel like we're
really drawn to podcasting.
I think part of it is becauseit's like that connection when
you feel like life is too busyfor connection and so, you know,
(06:31):
in one way.
I love that because I think it,um, It like fills us up in a
way, like getting to share that,those conversations in a, in a
small part.
but then also like the flip sideof that is then like, okay, but
we have to make sure we're,we're getting the real thing
too.
Which I know is not a problemfor you.
But, um, but you know, I thinkthat's, I think that's kind of
(06:52):
the draw though, is that we,like, we need these kind of
conversations with people and sopodcasting can meet that need
when we don't have the abilityto do it in person.
But of course we wanna make surethat's not.
That we're not substituting
Meghan (07:05):
Right.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
Yes.
Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah.
And it's just really cool thatwe are in a world where I can
literally go on a, the podcastapp and search for anything I
want.
And there's something like ifI'm like, I wanna learn how to
like raise bees, like I can lookup beekeeping and you know, so
you get that kind of, I don'thave somebody my immediate
Kimber (07:25):
Yeah.
Meghan (07:25):
life that I could just, I just want a little more wisdom
in this area than search for it.
So it's really awesome.
I think it's such a great tool.
Kimber (07:31):
If there was like a, hobby that you could learn
that's like really random likethat, like beekeeping, if you
were like, I'm gonna go out andlearn to do something, is there
anything that's like percolatingin your head, like, I would love
to learn to do this.
Meghan (07:46):
Um, so baking, because I don't bake, like I, I literally
can't, and I just got my firstKitchenAid mixer like last week.
Kimber (07:54):
Oh good.
Meghan (07:56):
So I, I
Kimber (07:57):
You've arrived.
Meghan (07:58):
I've arrived.
I feel like an adult now that Ifinally have a KitchenAid mixer.
so hopefully I could actuallylearn to make my kids like
cookies for my kids that, thatdon't.
I just started doing sourdoughcuz all my friends have now
started doing.
I.
The sourdough thing and like,I'm not even kidding when I tell
you like all 2020 when that wassuch a huge deal, I could not
bake bread.
(08:18):
I tried so hard and it's like myfamily, it's like a joke now,
like mom's making cookies.
Like, oh no, mom's trying tomake bread again.
Oh boy.
And I.
My sweet, one of our sweetmutual friends has been just my,
I call her like my littlesourdough sensei cause she's
just like teaching me all thethings.
And I made my first love ofbread and it
Kimber (08:39):
Did
Meghan (08:40):
good.
I did.
It was so good.
You would've thought I won agold medal in my uh, family cuz
they high fives.
I got texts from my husbandlike, oh my gosh, I can't
believe you actually did it.
Kimber (08:50):
That's so funny.
I love that.
They were so excited too.
I mean, because they probablybenefited
Meghan (08:55):
Oh yes.
And then mean, and I've beenlike, just try it.
It's not that bad.
And I was like, Hmm.
It's like this dense
Kimber (09:02):
Right, right.
Meghan (09:03):
brick.
Yeah.
So I did it.
I did it.
So it's a big, yeah.
So baking, if I could get goodat one thing, that would be it.
Yeah.
What about you?
Kimber (09:11):
Um, I feel like for me, that made me think of actually
like canning.
Like that's something that I'vebeen talking about, like, oh, I
should do this, I should dothis, I should do this.
Which makes us sound verydomestic and I don't know.
I love lots of other things too,
Meghan (09:22):
I just learned how to can salmon, like with Sarah, our
Kimber (09:25):
Yeah.
yeah,
Meghan (09:27):
we did canned salmon a couple weeks ago and it's
awesome.
I'd love to do that too.
So many things.
Kimber (09:31):
I know there's so many things, but I do love that the
podcast world is one of the waysthat we can explore those
things.
It's good.
Although I will say if I couldlisten to a podcast or just have
my friend come and teach me inmy kitchen, it's gonna be the
Meghan (09:44):
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
Oh yeah, 100%.
But if you know, if there isn'tone, that's always an option.
Kimber (09:50):
what you got.
Cool.
Well, Megan, I'm so excited tokind of dig into what our series
coming up is gonna be talkingabout today.
We're just gonna be looking atsome of the ideas that are gonna
be birthed out of this series, Ihope, and the direction that
we're going.
Um, we're gonna be calling itbeing the Friend You Need.
And so my heart for this seriesis really around this.
Idea of, and we probably allheard this phrase or this idea
(10:14):
of, hey, be the friend thatyou're looking for, the friend
that you need.
I think that comes from that.
Um, what is it, like a Gandhiquote that's like, be the change
you wanna see in the world.
Right.
I think it probably comes fromthat idea.
but it's like, I think we, aswe're looking for our
friendships in the world, weshould.
Be not just saying, this is thekind of person that I want to
(10:36):
have as a friend.
This is, you know, that lookslike someone that I would love
to hang out with.
But also we should be reflectingon like, okay, what are the
qualities about those peoplethat are drawing me to them?
And then how can I.
In my own life, like beexemplifying those things
because otherwise we're justlooking to people to like meet
our needs rather than like, Hey,I see something in that person
(10:57):
and so I want to pursue thatmyself.
So that's kind of where I'mhoping and like my heart behind
this, what is like your firstthoughts that come up as you
think of this series title beingthe Friend You Need and those
kind of friendship themes?
Meghan (11:11):
Yeah, no, I, I totally agree with you on that.
And I think that to be thefriend that we need first needs
to start with like taking a lookat our life as I was just
thinking about it, of what in mylife do I have to offer and what
areas in my life do I need togrow?
Because if I want a friend who'sreally trusting, I need to look
and say, but am I a trustingfriend?
(11:32):
And so there is a level of likeownership in that, that can be
really hard to look at thosethings in our life and go, I
want those things, but that'smaybe not quite where I'm at
yet.
And I think being honest aboutthat is the first step.
And then getting those like,Hey, I, I see that you are so
good at prayer.
I wanna get better.
And that can be a great way tostart that friendship too.
But you're, you're on thatjourney as well.
(11:53):
And so taking that look, thatpause of.
I have this list maybe of thingsthat I want in a friend, but
where am I at on these?
Kimber (12:01):
Yeah, because as we're, I don't know about you.
I feel like Things that I lookfor in my friends have even
changed.
And so it's like I feel like Ieven need to evaluate that a
little bit for myself as youknow, my life seasons change as
I just grow as a person, youknow, in good ways.
Or maybe even as I go throughthings in my life that are hard
(12:22):
or you know, just like seasonchanges.
Like I wanna be evaluating kindof constantly.
Or at least regularly, like,Hey, what are the kind of people
that I want to surround myselfwith right now?
And so as I was reflecting onthis a little bit, I think that
like those things have shiftedfor me, uh, in some ways, not in
every way, but um, I wasthinking back to when I was
(12:45):
younger and like in my earlytwenties and even in like high
school and stuff.
I think that I put a lot morepremium on the.
Kind of impression or aura thatpeople gave off?
Like not aura in like aspiritual sense, but like just
in
Meghan (13:02):
the vibe.
Kimber (13:03):
Yes.
Yeah.
Um, and it was like if, ifsomeone was like, you know,
charismatic or impressive to me,I feel like that.
Drew me to them.
And that's not necessarily a badthing.
but I feel like now I'm likealmost a little skeptical of
that because I, it, it has in,sometimes it has led me astray.
(13:24):
Not always, but in some waysit's like obviously the heart of
a person is way deeper than, youknow, that those external
experiences and, um, I thinkabout what.
Like the Lord tells Samuel whenhe's looking for the next king,
and he is like Samuel's lookingat all of these impressive
looking brothers of David.
And David's like, you know, thislike little scrawny shepherd
(13:48):
kid, you know, he is liketotally discounted.
Um, and he is like, God looks atthe heart.
And so thinking about that withour friendships, like, you know,
that's right.
Like I see that as I grow older,I feel like I see more and more
evidence for that being thething that I really need to be
looking for.
But it's like, as a human, likeas a person, I'm just drawn to
certain things.
(14:08):
Right?
And so I feel like it's not abad thing always like.
You know, what you're drawn tois maybe kind of just natural,
but it's like, being able toknow that that's not the whole
story is maybe the mostimportant thing for me there
that I've seen.
How do you think it's shifted orchanged for you?
How you kind of like look forfriends and
Meghan (14:29):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well thankfully it's shiftedfrom, cause I definitely, I know
that, um, I think the big thingfor me has been honesty and
truth telling.
so I know like probably in myteens, my early twenties for
sure, I had a few experienceswhere I had friends that would
come to me with.
Just things they were seeing inmy life and wanting me to be a
(14:50):
better person.
But I saw that as such a threatand the most like unloving thing
that you could do is to tell methe truth that I, I did.
I walked away from some of thoseor just really shut myself down.
And then thankfully, like with.
The Lord's work in my heart, mylife, realizing they were
actually doing the opposite.
They were doing the most lovingthing possible by saying, Hey,
(15:11):
like, we want better for you.
And so I think now that's likethe thing that I actually look
for the most is like, are youwilling to tell me the hard
stuff, and, and then working onmy heart to be able to receive
it well, you know, and so itnever feels awesome, but
Kimber (15:26):
Right,
Meghan (15:27):
Oh, but it is like if, if you can.
Look me now and tell me thetruth, and we're like, good to
go.
So, um, I think that'sdefinitely been a big thing
where before I'd be like, Ooh,I'm not sure.
And now it's like the thing Icrave the most in a friendship.
Yeah.
Kimber (15:40):
How do you feel like, was it just like you started to
see the fruit of like lettingthem tell the truth or what,
like helped you make thatswitch?
Meghan (15:48):
I think just growing.
I honestly growing in my faith.
With the Lord.
I think the Holy Spirit, likereally?
I can't think of like an exactlike moment.
It just all clicked in my head.
But, you know, one ex I thinkI've actually, I don't know if
I've shared it with you but, youknow, I had a friend that that
just shared some things in mylife that I needed to, that they
were seeing.
And not anything likecatastrophically bad, but just,
(16:10):
hey, like, I want better for youin this.
And I think just taking anhonest look at that years later
of Wow and just growing in otherfriendships and actually seeing
like that was actually a reallyloving thing.
And the whole like principlestabbing in the front.
Like I'd much rather have afriend stabbing me in the front
than the back.
um, and so, you know, and I'vegone back to them and been like,
you know what?
(16:30):
You actually being really lovingand I didn't take it that way
and I'm sorry.
So I don't know if it was like.
A specific thing that the lightbulbs clicked, but just as I
just got more refined in myfaith and God just doing a lot
of
Kimber (16:41):
yeah.
Meghan (16:42):
of, that, so
Kimber (16:43):
Yeah.
Well I love that you mentionedthat too, because I feel like
that is something that I reallywanna focus on in this series is
like, I love, I'm all aboutpractical stuff.
Like I'm all about tips andtricks, but tips and tricks
aren't going to like transformour relationships because the
only thing that like transformsour lives is Jesus, like the
power of the Holy Spirit workingin us.
(17:04):
And so of course that appliesto.
The specific area of friendshipas well, so like we need.
The transformative power of thegospel in our friendships as
well.
And so as we're looking at thisseries, that's like where I
wanna focus is like, okay, whatare these areas that like
transform us across the board?
And then how do theyspecifically apply to
(17:25):
friendship?
Which I'm super excited to marrythose things because I think
that.
Sometimes they get shoved intodifferent sectors like, you
know, church life or like mypersonal bible study, my
personal faith.
And then like, oh, how I dofriendship is over here.
But, I don't think that's true.
I don't, I don't think that'strue.
And so, um, there one of the,people that I like to listen to,
um, speaking of podcast world isJackie Hill Perry.
Meghan (17:47):
I love her.
Oh yeah.
I love Jackie.
I love her podcast in her books
Kimber (17:52):
Yeah.
Yeah, she's incredible.
And around the time when I waskind of, brainstorming or
working up this series, I cameacross, I think it was just like
a, a like clip on Instagram orsomething that was about her
talking about on one of herepisodes of their podcast, um,
talking about friendship andsomething that she was saying.
It actually came across to me assort of like, Oh, like, I don't
(18:13):
know.
I don't know how I feel.
Is that right?
Like I wa you know, like whereyou kind of question, you're
like, I don't know if I agreewith that.
and so I went and listened tothe full episode, which is a
great practice.
If you hear a clip of somethingand you're like, I don't know
about that, go listen to thefull context, um, because it's
very helpful.
But essentially what she wassaying is like, she's like, I'm
(18:34):
not looking for.
Friends right now who aren'tlike pursuing Holiness.
And I, and I think it hit me alittle weird at first because I
was like, well, okay, but like,shouldn't we not be like, I
don't know, judgemental of that?
Or like, shouldn't we have, weshould have friends who aren't
Christians too, right?
Like, and so went and listenedto the full episode and um, you
(18:57):
know, she ended up talking someabout like, you know, you're,
yeah, you're gonna have friendsin all different.
Like walks of life, differentplaces in their spiritual
journeys.
Right.
that's, that's great.
But it's like, who are yourclosest people?
Like, who is speaking into yourlife?
Like who is, who are youbouncing things off of?
(19:19):
Like who is, who's the ironsharpening your iron?
And if those people who are likeyour closest people, your core
people speaking into your life,if they're not pursuing holiness
as, you know, not asimperfection, but is in becoming
more and more like Christ astheir highest goal, then that's
gonna impact your friendships.
(19:39):
And so that was really impactfulto me because I, I feel like,
It's easy to think of thesethings as separate spheres, as,
you know.
Oh, I, I have friends, but theydon't necessarily, we can
believe different things like,you know, we can, go about life
differently.
Do life differently, and, well,that's true to an extent.
I think it's the question of whois really speaking into your
(20:00):
life and who is your closestpeople?
Because, you know, it's notabout like, Curating a crew with
exclusivity or anything, it'smore like I need to acknowledge
that my closest people do impactthe type of person I'm becoming.
And so talking about being thefriend you need, who we need is,
we need friends who are pursuingholiness to be our, our very
closest And so, that just reallyhit me and, challenged me a
(20:24):
little bit,
Meghan (20:25):
Yeah.
That's so good.
Yeah, I love that.
Um, I, yeah, I love Jackie HillPerry, and I couldn't agree with
that more.
I can totally see where you'relike, wait, how is this gonna
pan out?
But it's true.
So, um, when I was in middleschool, you know, middle school
girls can be a lot and, uh, youknow, and you're trying to fit
in and figure out where you'reat.
And my mom actually, uh, one ofthe things that sticks out to me
(20:46):
the most is she had me stand ona chair.
And she was talking to me aboutinfluence and about how people
have influence on you.
And my, cuz my response is I canbe a good influence on them and
I can be, you know, all thesethings.
And so she had me stand on oneof their kitchen chairs and she
was standing next to me and shegoes, I want you to try to pull
me up on the chair.
And of course I couldn't, butshe could yank me down real
(21:07):
fast.
He's like, see, this is what isgonna happen when you let your,
the closest friends who aren'tgreat influence, who aren't
impacting you well, aren'tbringing you closer to God,
they're gonna bring you down.
Really quick, even if you havethe best intentions in the
world, and I think that's sotrue in a way of.
Who you're closest to is gonnaimpact who you are.
um, and that's not to say thatwe can't, of course we need to
(21:29):
have people in our life thatwe're like pouring into and have
ministry with, but that's notnecessarily the person I'm gonna
go to when my marriage isstruggling or my kids are going
through something really hard,or I'm in the middle of
something really deep and I needsomeone to pour God's holiness
back into me.
And.
Pour his words back in.
and so if, so, we need friendsthat are doing that same thing
(21:50):
and we're gonna find ourselvesin wilderness seasons and we're
gonna find ourselves wherethat's gonna be hard.
But we're still like seekingthat and trying that.
And then that's when ourcommunity gets to come in and be
like, I know you're goingthrough this, but let me like
help push
Kimber (22:02):
Hmm.
Meghan (22:02):
up for you.
but we can't, we can't do that.
Cuz if we're always got thatfriends like, well then do this
or try this, believe in this,then.
It's gonna be real easy as we'retrying thinking we're going here
that now we've just veered offcourse so far.
so I think that close circledefinitely needs to be that.
Kimber (22:17):
Yeah.
I love the, way that you saidthat of it's when the
metaphorical poo hits the fan,right?
Like, Like, that is when youreally realize.
Oh, like who I am friends with,like my closest friends.
That matters because like yousaid, there's people that we can
pour into that we can, be, Ithink just like, uh, I dunno,
(22:41):
casual friends sounds like a, aweird term, but like you can be
friends with someone, but thatdoesn't mean you're going to
trust them in your hardestmoments to speak truth into your
life.
And I, and so I think that islike such a helpful dichotomy
because it's like, if you are.
In just a pretty chill seasonand like things are going okay,
it may not seem like a big deal,who I spend, you know.
(23:02):
I go to the movies with, or whoI, have play dates with or
whatever.
but it's like, who am I gonna betalking to when things get
really hard and things getreally rough because like you
said, it's gonna like mirrorback to me or pour truth back
into me depending on who I'mspeaking to.
And so, um, I think that's areally helpful dynamic.
(23:23):
One way that I think of itsometimes that, that helps me
because I think it is soimportant that we don't just
have like this holy huddle.
I hear it called a lot of thetime where it's like, you know,
I only have Christian friendsaround me and that's my entire
circle.
you know, I think it's, I thinkit's so important to.
Diversify simply in the factthat we are to be salt and
(23:44):
light, right?
Like that is part of ourmission, and it's not just to be
comfortable with people whoagree with us, right?
Like we are to be salt and lightin the world.
And so I, I do think that aspectis important, but then one of
the ways that I.
Kind of manage that.
I guess in my head, cuz I feellike I can get really murky is I
think of it like concentriccircles of closeness in my
friendships a lot of the time.
(24:04):
And it's like, I might have likeat the very center is like, I
guess the very, very centershould be me and the Lord,
right?
Like that should be my numberone closest relationship, the
one that I tell everything toand.
Of course, uh, we all know verywell that I'm not perfect.
And so that is, um, somethingI'm aspiring to.
I would not say that's always myreality, but it's definitely
something that I know is ofvalue.
(24:25):
Um, and then I think it shouldbe my husband, right?
Because he needs to be my bestfriend.
And, uh, if I'm gonna tell mygirlfriend about something, I
probably should have told him,uh, which again, I'm, I don't
always.
Do great at that.
And so that's a challenge.
But then I have like my, my nextclosest, probably my closest
people.
And that, that center circle tome is where really we're talking
(24:48):
about here, I think most islike, these are the people that
like you're gonna telleverything to that, you're gonna
go to in your hardest momentsthat you really trust to, like
you said, um, speak honestly toyou and like.
Tell the truth to you.
And if those people don't evenshare my same worldview,
regarding like that, you know,Jesus is my savior and like my
(25:10):
life is a gift, God, God glory.
If they don't agree with eventhose central things, I feel
like.
That, that's gonna fracture ourability to like really take care
of each other well.
and then from there, it's likemy circles go out to like, maybe
village or like community toacquaintances, you know, and on
out.
But I think kind of like mindingthose circles and like being
(25:33):
aware of who's in which one andtherefore how am I trusting
them.
I think that can maybe help,that helps me to kind of keep
this dynamic straight in my mindand give me room for these
relationships that maybe aren'tChrist-centered, but are still
important.
Um, mission field or just bringme joy or whatever.
(25:54):
Um, but know that they're notthe most central ones.
How do you feel like for you,you kind of balance this idea
that like not all of ourfriendships are going to be.
The, you know, that, that calledholiness.
Like not all of our friendshipsare going to be about that.
Um, but how do we still lovethose people?
Well, how do you feel like youbalance kind of those things?
Meghan (26:15):
Well, I think that first, like the best.
Picture of this was in the biwas Jesus.
Jesus did this so well in theBible and he really had those
circles.
Like obviously
Kimber (26:25):
he did.
Meghan (26:25):
everyone and showed
Kimber (26:27):
of his thing.
Meghan (26:28):
compassion kind of a thing.
Um, to the people that everyonehad cast out as unlovable and
unworthy.
Like he really broke down thosewalls of we need to extend
ourselves to these people andthey are just as worthy as.
We are, you know, of love.
And then as they, it got closer,you got Lazarus and you've got
Mary and Martha and and then youhave the disciples and you had
(26:50):
his 12.
But then within that 12 therewas still his three that he
really told everything too.
So I think the first thing islooking at that.
It's done so well that Jesus hasdid that.
And it is, it is hard.
And I think for a long time Ilived with this, like everyone
has to have full access and andthen so people that start
speaking into my life thatprobably should have had no,
(27:13):
like nowhere near should havehad the access that they had.
Kimber (27:16):
Yeah.
Meghan (27:16):
and so I look at it as who in my life is.
On the receiving end of that,who's, who's the one that is
calling me, that sees me as aperson that can be the truth
teller that is there, knows thatI'm gonna be there.
And, and that kind of helps megauge, they're in, they're in my
circle, but they've earned thattrust.
They're asking for that trust.
There's that give and takethat's happening.
(27:37):
Um, because obviously God is ournumber one, our husbands.
If you, if you're married andyour spouse and then, yeah.
And then that core three whoare.
Who are showing themselves thatthey're going to show up, that
they're praying, that they'repursuing holiness just as hard
on their own race andcheerleading for yours along the
way.
Um, yeah.
But still not feeling likeyou're building up walls.
(28:00):
We don't wanna build walls,
Kimber (28:01):
Right?
Yeah.
That's another aspect of it,right?
Like, oh, you're not in myexclusive inner circle or
something.
That's not right.
That's not of the
Meghan (28:11):
Yeah, I I, heard something that was kind of like,
I think it was more talkingabout boundaries, but like, you
don't do walls, you do fences,you do gates.
And so being able that, there'sgonna be people that maybe
started out as moreacquaintance, that as time goes
on, they're gonna maybe move upor seasons change and life
things happen.
And maybe someone from thatcloser is gonna, you know, that,
which we've talked about, justthat.
(28:32):
Kind of moving in and out ofthose spheres a little bit, you
know?
And so, and that's o that's okaytoo.
So be open to that.
Kimber (28:39):
Right, because sometimes I think the Lord is.
Behind a lot of that.
Like, you know, like, Hey, this,this is the person that I've put
in your life right now.
And it's like, you know, he'slike thumping you on the head
trying to get you to realizethat like they're a person who
he has given you to help youthrough this time, or just to be
a good friend to you.
And so it's like sometimes wehave to be aware, like, oh, like
(29:00):
there's a gate.
Like they could come into thiscircle, right?
For this time.
Yeah.
And people, people can sometimesleave and that's okay sometimes.
I love that.
Well, Megan, we, we have kind oflooked at the list of, um, ideas
that we've generated for thisseries, and I'm so excited for
it.
I would love to hear, as we kindof wrap up here, what is, what
(29:20):
are you most excited to talkabout this summer in regards to
like, areas or like specificways that we can start working
towards being the friend that weneed.
Like these are the things we'relooking for and, this is where I
wanna start growing so thatthese kind of people come into
my life.
What are you most excited
Meghan (29:39):
Yeah, I think I'm really excited for the talking about
prayer and,
Kimber (29:45):
me too.
Meghan (29:46):
yes, because I, this is something that probably within
the last, I don't wanna say yearthat the Lord's really
challenged me on is so manytimes we'll get, I'll get a text
message or a phone call or youknow, Hey, will you pray for me?
Will you do this?
And I'm like, of course I'mgonna pray for you.
But am I like really taking timeall the time to really stop and
actually do that?
And sometimes, yes, I am, butsometimes I'm like, oh, I said I
(30:07):
was gonna, Pray for them.
And I didn't like just beingfull on it, like it happens
Kimber (30:11):
percent.
Man, I've done that.
I don't think we're the onlytwo.
Yeah.
Meghan (30:14):
no, no, no, And um, so that's been something that like,
I really want my words to notjust fall flat, that when I say
I'm gonna pray for you, like Ireally am.
So that's something that I'vereally, really been working on
this last year, is that when afriend texts me and says, I need
you to pray for me, or Will youjust like, I'm like in that
moment, it doesn't matter whatI'm doing.
If it's 32nd prayer or sometimeslike a five minute prayer and
(30:38):
plea to God, like I'm doingthat.
So I'm really excited to kindalike, grow in that, to kind of
talk about that journey.
you know, hear what other peoplehave to say about it.
Um, that's for me, that's a bigone.
And then always, um, having afriend that's challenging me,
um, cuz if
Kimber (30:52):
Megan, I, those are literally the two that I was
gonna say.
I love
Meghan (30:56):
and you on the notes.
I was like, well, we're thesame.
So, cause I don't, that's whereI'm like,
Kimber (31:01):
It's So great.
What are you excited for aboutthat specifically?
Meghan (31:05):
Uh, I think I'm just, yeah, I'm just in a season, uh,
my friend told me this littlething, a little ditty she does,
called if I, I can't grow if Idon't know.
And I'm like, I love that cuz Iwanna be pursuing holiness and,
and like refining in my life andsoftening those edges that I
need to soften and.
And I can't always do that.
Like you're your own worst kindof person in your brain.
(31:26):
I can't trust my thoughts.
And so obviously it's praying,asking the Holy Spirit and
talking to your spouse, buthaving someone that's maybe that
outsider that can go, Hey, haveyou tried this?
Or, I have noticed you're doingreally good on this, but maybe
you could try growing in.
You know this and I.
Um, and so having someone to dothat is so, I, I'm just like
really craving that in theseason cuz there's areas of my
life I really wanna grow in, butI can't do that if no one's
(31:49):
gonna be honest with me aboutit, you know, and just be like
the yes, I don't need someonethat's just like, you're fine
and you're
Kimber (31:55):
amazing.
Meghan (31:56):
and you're amazing.
Like, you know, sometimes I amdoing amazing and it's always
nice to hear that too, but, butI know that half a 80% of the
day I'm not.
So let's be, let's be honest
Kimber (32:06):
Well, and I think when you hear from a friend who is
like, again, in that closecircle where like you know that
you can trust them and that yourrelationship is stable to
weather those kind of like maybehard talks.
Um, I think when someone doeschallenge you like that, then it
makes the affirmations from themfeel more authentic.
(32:30):
Like, because it's Like, I knowthat they tell me the truth.
Like you said.
And and that counts for hardstuff and that counts for, for
encouragement.
And so to me that makes thosethings all the more valuable,
which again, just deepens yourtrust in each other and can
really be such like a blessing.
I think.
So I
Meghan (32:49):
Yes.
100%.
Same for you?
Kimber (32:51):
Mm.
Yes.
Same for me.
I think, uh, those are the,those are kind of the two that
have been standing out to me.
And, um, man, there's a lot of,there's a lot of cool stuff that
I'm excited to talk with youabout this summer.
So, um, we're gonna get into itin the coming weeks.
So thank you so much for kind ofkicking us off today with me.
Um, I really, my last thing thatI will say with this, um, this
(33:13):
series is I really hope that ourconversations here, Megan can,
really just give.
Our friends listening anopportunity to like start
thinking about these topics andthen go have them in their
living rooms, in their smallgroups, you know, on the
playground, like wherever you'reat.
On your hikes, you know?
Um, yeah, it's like aspringboard, right?
(33:34):
Like you, you start it, start atturn in, and then friends
listening, we want you to gohave these conversations with
your people.
Um, because that's where I feellike the real like life change
happens and where yourfriendships are gonna grow.
Meghan (33:47):
Yes, absolutely.
I'm excited cause I love all thethings we're gonna talk about
this summer.
and yeah, I just see that too.
I see the mamas on theplayground.
They're kids going, Hey, I wannastart working on prayer.
Can we start praying for eachother?
Or, you know, like, yeah, it'sgonna be awesome.
Yeah.
Yes.
Go out and do it.
Kimber (34:03):
Well, friends, it's been so fun chatting with you and
Megan today.
Thanks so much for joining us.
Next week we're gonna startdiving into, we're gonna start
with prayer cuz we're both soexcited about it, so we're gonna
get after it.
So can't wait to talk to youguys more about how we can be
the friend we need when it comesto engaging in prayer in our
lives next week.
So we'll see you guys then.
Meghan (34:23):
All right.
Bye.
Kimber (34:28):
Friends.
I'm so glad you could join meand Megan on the show this week,
as we dive into the series aboutbeing the friend you need, I
pray that as Megan and I said,you will take these topics to
your conversations with yourreal life friends.
Don't let us stop here.
Consider who your closest peopleare, who you trust to pour into
you and speak truth back to you.
(34:48):
And I challenge you to challengeeach other.
To grow and being the friendsyou need, not by trying harder,
but by pursuing Jesus more andmore.
Friends.
If you're excited for thisseries, I want you to do
something for me.
This weekly, you share thepodcast with a friend, just
shoot her a DM with a post fromsocial or text her an episode
link with something like.
I'm so excited for this newseries on the, your sister
(35:10):
Kimber podcast.
And I love if you listened inand we can talk about it the
next time we hang out.
This is such a great way to getthose conversations going about
growing in holiness and how thatcan impact your specific
friendships.
And I know how busy summer canget.
So make sure you subscribe tothe podcast wherever you listen.
So you don't miss an episode.
You can also sign up to be partof my newsletter crew so that
(35:32):
you get a weekly previewdirectly to your email inbox of
what will be on the podcast thatweek.
Just visit your sisterkimber.com and subscribe there.
Fred.
Thank you so much for spendingpart of your day with us until
next time.
It's your sister.
Kimmer.
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