February 22, 2023 • 46 mins
Wait a second...isn't loneliness something I should be avoiding? Kimber talks with mental health counselor and friend Susie Edwards about how we can shift our understanding of loneliness from something to ignore or avoid, to a kind of "check-engine" light. When we start viewing loneliness as an indicator of a need in our lives, we can begin bravely moving toward those things.
Susie shares about her journey through lonely seasons and how healing from childhood loneliness wounds helped her grow from being someone who feared female friendships to truly treasuring them.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Kimber (00:09):
Hey there friends.
Welcome to the, your sisterKimber podcast.
My name is Kimber Gilbert, andI'm so glad you're here.
We all know that the idea offriendship should be something
desirable, but what happens whenthat's not the reality?
When friendship feels scary.
The last thing that we're goingto want to do is dive right in
boldly.
When we can appreciate whatfriendship has to offer.
(00:30):
That's one thing.
But what about when friendshipsfeel like they might not turn
out to be safe?
My friend, Susie Edwards, and Iare digging into this today, and
I hope our conversation helpsyou begin to see how your own
younger years of friendshipmight be impacting how you
handle your loneliness today.
I could talk to Susie all dayand I hope it helps you grow
(00:51):
authentic friendships in yourown life that honor God and draw
closer to Jesus.
I wish we could talk this outover coffee, but this is the
next best thing.
I'm so glad you're here, friend.
Let's get started.
Susie Hallel.
How are you doing?
Susie (01:11):
And dealing with.
Kimber (01:12):
Oh, good.
Thanks so much for coming on thepodcast today.
I'm so thankful.
You're willing to talk to metoday.
I'm
Susie (01:18):
Yeah.
I'm excited for our timetogether as well.
Kimber (01:20):
What do you just go ahead and introduce yourself to
our friends listening?
Who may not know yet?
Susie (01:25):
Yeah.
So my name is Susie Edwards.
Um, Lived in Alaska since 2003.
Except for two years.
And yeah.
I'm close to 50 mama for most ofthem.
Young adults now.
Kimber (01:40):
Yeah, they're leaving the house quickly.
Yes.
Does it, is it like a relief oris it sad for you or both?
Susie (01:47):
Probably both.
Yeah.
Yeah.
My last one just turned 18.
It's her senior year.
So we're.
We're right at the doorway ofempty nest.
Yup.
Kimber (01:57):
absolutely.
Ah, that's so exciting.
That's really cool.
You know, Susie, I just learnedwhen we were talking the other
day, I asked you if you wouldcome on the podcast and share
with us because.
I have long respected yourvoices.
One of wisdom, in the circlesthat I've been around.
And so I was asking you if youwould come on and talk with us
about loneliness and you toldme, I didn't know this, but
(02:19):
you're a counselor.
And so I'm excited to hear bothyour like, personal perspective
on this and also, how your jobplays into Those kinds of
conversations as well, but I'minterested to notice a little
background on that.
Like how long have you been acounselor?
Is it like something, have youenjoyed it?
what's like kind of your storywith that.
Susie (02:37):
Yeah.
So I have, Then a mental healthcounselor for about three and a
half years now.
Um, I was a stay home mom beforethat.
Um, Yeah.
I was military wife for awhile,and then we settled up here and
stay home mom.
So kinda did a later lifecareer.
And.
But I had been working a lot inlay work, doing very, very
(02:59):
similar things.
Um, Before.
I actually went back and got.
My degree and, and all of that.
So.
been.
a wild couple of years to be inthat profession because I
started in 19 and we rolled into2020.
Kimber (03:13):
Yeah, we all needed.
We all needed help.
Susie (03:16):
Yeah.
Kimber (03:16):
that.
What would you say is like yourfavorite part of it?
What have you most enjoyed?
Susie (03:21):
what I love about counseling is it's just, it's an
honor.
To get to be invited into otherpeople's stories.
And into their journeys and suchan intimate way.
I just feel like that's anhonor.
Um, I would almost even use theword sacred, like it's a sacred
space.
And so that feels like such anhonor.
That I get to do regularly.
(03:43):
You have the jury people, aslong as they want me to journey
with them.
And I don't know, that justfeels like a gift and a
privilege.
Kimber (03:51):
That's really cool.
You know, actually I just wentto counseling for the very first
time this last week, which was abig step for me, mostly because
not because I had been like,opposed to the idea of going to
counseling for me, it was likefiguring out the logistics and
like actually making it happen,like making the phone calls and
filling out the paperwork andblah, blah, blah, like.
(04:12):
I feel like there's a lot ofsteps and it was always just
easier to like, kind of put itoff, uh, but it was really good
and I, I really appreciated mytime there.
And.
as I was like dumping all of myjunk at this kind woman's feet,
I was like, I don't know, thismust be like such a challenging
job.
Like it seems to me like itwould be really.
just challenging to like hearpeople's hardest stuff, all the
(04:36):
time.
And so, I was just really likethankful for her.
And, um, for, you know, those ofyou there in that field, like,
do you find that to bechallenging or how do you kind
of manage that for yourself?
Susie (04:46):
Yeah.
I've definitely had thatquestion more than once.
Um, And sadly sometimes fromlike my own children or friends,
because I'll get to the end of anine hour day.
You know, And then they'll havesomething hard.
Call me with something hard.
To be like, you've been doingthis all day.
Yeah.
I was thinking to some of mykids.
You've been doing this all day,mom.
Sorry to, you know, but for me,It's barely draining in that
(05:11):
way.
It's.
Those deep waters to.
Really beautiful.
So I don't struggle very muchwith the emotional fatigue of
it.
the part that I sometimesstruggle with is what I would
call a mental fatigue, and thatjust probably comes from focused
listening.
For eight.
To nine hours.
Um, so I'm the.
That that would be kind of likethe hardest part of counseling.
(05:33):
Coming to me is that sometimesI'm driving home and then I walk
into the house and.
You
Kimber (05:38):
brain's done.
Yeah.
Susie (05:40):
Yeah.
And.
You know, I, you know, myhusband, my daughter, like.
What are, you know, they're fullof life and want to talk about
their days and.
Um, and.
so that I've heard fromlonger-term counselors that you,
you gain that endurance and overtime, not as much.
but for me, it's my, it's moreof that.
Um, the years have kind oftaught me even before, as a
(06:01):
counselor to walk with people ontheir journey, but it's not mine
to carry their story.
Very their story.
I walk with them.
so I'm grateful for that.
Kimber (06:10):
That's really cool.
That's so I think it's such agood, it sounds like such a
gift, but also something thatyou're like learning to steward
even better.
But, uh, yeah, it sounds like,sounds like you found a
wonderful fit.
Well, I'm excited that we get totalk to you today.
Like I said, from thatperspective also, just from your
personal perspective, you know,but when I was talking to you
(06:31):
about like, kind of this pitch,which I've talked to some other
people too, and I've.
Shared that I just feel likeit's kind of a hard pitch, like,
you know, tell me about your,your loneliness.
Like that's, that's a big ask.
And so one, thank you for beingwilling to share with us today.
But, when I was talking withyou, when I learned you were a
counselor, you just talked a bitabout how like their
(06:52):
professional training thatyou've had for that job.
It kind of gave you some insightabout how loneliness or why it
is.
Uh, part of all of our lives.
And so I'd be interested to heara little bit more about that.
I think, did you call it like acore emotion?
Susie (07:06):
Yeah.
Kimber (07:07):
like that.
Yeah.
So can you tell us a little bitabout that and how do you think
that plays into the fact thatlike we're all going to
experience loneliness at somepoint in our lives?
Susie (07:16):
Yes.
I would love to.
Yeah.
I had to bring, when you walkedup and asked me.
Um, you know, about, would youlike to do a podcast at
loneliness?
Cause right.
Yeah.
Like.
You're Like.
wow, that's a vulnerable ass.
Right.
But I, my heart, my faceprobably did too.
I just grins
Kimber (07:30):
Oh,
Susie (07:31):
our practice.
We use various approaches thatare our name approach is a very
emotionally in tuned focusedtech.
Approach.
Uh, therapy.
And so, that's like at the coreof what I do every day is,
focusing on, people's emotions.
And so.
So lonely.
(07:53):
Is one, I called it a coreemotion.
Yeah.
Cause we consider at ourpractice and you know, different
there's different models aroundthis, but.
That there's eight coreemotions.
And so some of us saw the movieinside out and they kind of put
four in that movie
Kimber (08:10):
is so good.
Susie (08:11):
yes, it comes up.
It comes up in our sessionssometimes,
Kimber (08:15):
bet.
Susie (08:16):
yeah, but there's, you know, we consider, um, the
Thursday it's.
Uh, core emotions and lonelinessis one of those eight core
emotions.
And I would say It's actuallyprobably in a way to me, one of
the most central ones to, um, Tobe able to journey.
And heal.
Um, and our own stories.
So We at.
(08:36):
In our model, we just kind ofthink of the emotions just like
I years ago, taught.
Taught classes on this, on it,like emotionally.
Healthy spirituality andemotions.
And in that people you wouldlist on like a whiteboard.
I just say, throw me someemotions and you very quickly
can have like a hundred wordsfor emotions upon the board.
(08:57):
and so what's really beautifulabout this is just like colors
and art.
There's primary colors, right.
And art, and, you know, I justthink of kids with Crohn's, you
know, there's the box.
The smaller box, the bigger boxand the huge box.
Right.
and so these eight emotions are,I think like at the roots or
core of almost any emotional,other words we might say.
Kimber (09:19):
Yes.
Susie (09:20):
How, um, within those, we, we look at fear, anger.
Hurt sad.
Lonely.
Shame.
Guilt and glad.
Kimber (09:32):
Wow.
There's only one pot, like,well, That's probably an
interesting thing.
Only one of those soundspositive to me.
Which is so telling.
Yeah.
Susie (09:44):
Yes, that comment is almost always said.
That exact Thomas and.
That is kind of where we beginbecause it's shifting peoples.
Uh, relationship with their ownemotions.
Cause we actually consider allof those good emotions
Kimber (10:00):
Interesting.
Susie (10:01):
All of those emotions.
Light up in our hearts for areason.
To let us know.
to guide us like to lead us,basically, they aluminate, they
light up and aluminate to leadus to a need that's underneath
each one of those emotions.
Kimber (10:16):
Yeah.
Susie (10:16):
to be aware of the need, we need the emotion to guide us
to the need.
Which takes me back toloneliness.
So.
Loneliness illuminates on thehuman heart.
Too.
Make us aware of our need forconnection.
Kimber (10:33):
Yeah.
Susie (10:33):
Our deep desire for connection.
And I believe that that one islike, Almost.
At the core of the core of thoseemotions, because when you look
at Genesis.
Genesis two 18.
Um, this is before the fall.
So before it.
I mentioned spear and shamecoming in.
before the fall, God says toman, it is not good for man to
(10:57):
be alone.
And God is with that now.
So that now.
Kimber (11:01):
Right.
Susie (11:02):
Before the fall.
And he says it's not good to bealone.
And so I really believe that Godcreated us in the likeness of
the Trinity.
And so in that imprint in us, Isa deep imprint.
For not just connectedness withGod.
But for connectedness withothers.
So I believe that that.
Is the core in the side of us.
(11:24):
It's there for a reason.
It's because we're created forconnection.
Kimber (11:27):
Yes.
And it, it forces us to pursuethat.
Yeah.
Um, That's really beautiful.
I love that perspective becauseit's so easy for me to like,
when I feel things that arehard, of course, it's like,
okay, I want to eliminate that.
and I think with loneliness,that is definitely like, our
(11:48):
instinct is like, I don't wantto feel loneliness, so what can
I do?
To fix it.
And, I, I love that perspectiveof it being like, you know, it
can drive us to something.
So actually it's like anessential, it's like the, you
know, like the hurt response injust like our fingers.
Like you touch a stove and likeyou want to stop touching the
stove.
Like.
You know, and, and yeah, itdrives us towards people.
(12:11):
I think that's, that's so cool.
I would love for you to sharewith us a little bit about, what
this has looked like in yourlife as well.
Like, as you're walking withpeople, you, you see this play
out in a million ways and.
I would love if you're willingto share with us a little bit
about like where loneliness has,has come up in your life and how
(12:32):
you've walked through that.
Especially like almost inhindsight, seeing like, okay,
this was not a terrible thing.
It like drove me to good things.
yeah.
What does that look like foryou?
Susie (12:44):
Yeah, so loneliness for me.
You know, as I've spent timehealing, like you mentioned,
going to counseling, About 15years ago.
I hit a place in my life and mymarriage, my family.
Um, where.
Really needed.
I can't kind of came, I'd say itkind of came to the end of
myself.
(13:04):
And all the ways that I, triedto fill.
Those spaces inside me that feltempty and fall on us.
Started.
Basically like collapsing aroundme.
Um, and I found myself, this ismy mid thirties.
I found myself.
At one point.
Literally laying on my bed.
(13:25):
And the fetal position.
Feeling like.
Everything was breaking apart.
and.
Asking God, you know, to drawnear to that space.
And I felt God's cousins come inand it sounds funny to say this
God.
But almost like spoon me.
Kimber (13:43):
Uh,
Susie (13:44):
Right.
Like in that fetal position inmy
Kimber (13:46):
wrap around.
Yeah.
Susie (13:49):
And that was it really Pivotal time in my life to
finally.
Starts, like I had finallygotten to the gift of
desperation.
To really start looking at theways that I had Constructed
things to try to sell.
The lack within me.
Um, and so then we reallypursued my own journey of
(14:10):
healing through.
Counseling and, Mentorship and.
Friendship.
And really being on a journeyof.
Healing.
Um, The fragmented pieces of myown story.
Kimber (14:23):
yeah, obviously I love that image of like the
wraparound.
It makes me think of, um, In, Ithink it's called the passion
translation.
It's like a loose paraphrase ofsome of the scriptures that have
come out.
Uh, semi-recently and, anytimethat, like in the Psalms, maybe
we hear it ha it kind ofdescribes God as like, with
(14:45):
wings, like wings that wraparound, or like covering of your
wings, that kind of language, ittranslates it as like God's
wrap-around presence.
Which I love just like that.
All encompassing, like, youknow, behind, before all around.
just coming around you in thosemoments.
I think it's such a powerfulimage that, and I mean, that's
(15:06):
like what's coming up there isjust, that is that loneliness
and.
Letting God meet us there firstis something that I've been
really trying to grow in becauseI feel like my instinct is to
like reach out to people or tryto change my circumstances.
you know, try to solve theproblem myself, which I think
those are not always terrible,you know, things to do.
(15:27):
Obviously.
I think many of them are good,but it's like allowing him to
meet.
My need for that first is suchlike a learning experience for
me.
Is that something that you havestruggled with or grown in or is
that something that comes morenaturally for you?
Like going to God with yourloneliness first, do you think.
Susie (15:45):
Oh, that has for sure.
Grown.
Yes.
I came up with this funny littlejingle for myself years ago.
To run to the throne instead ofthe phone.
Kimber (15:56):
Oh, that's good.
I'm going to remember that.
That's good.
Susie (16:00):
I think it's that.
I absolutely think.
Action is important.
So we need to reach out and.
Phone into our people, but, um,definitely.
Learning more and more to,Lehman to the arms of the great
I am, you know, the creator andsustainer.
Um, sorry.
So, yeah.
I've definitely grown in that.
Kimber (16:19):
I love that run to the throat instead of the phone.
That's good.
Susie (16:23):
Yeah.
Kimber (16:23):
You know, as I was talking to you also about coming
on the podcast, one thing thatyou brought up as significant
to.
Loneliness in your life that Ireally resonated.
Like that made sense to me wasyou were like, oh, I don't know
where this all started.
Like, you know, you talk aboutyour moment of kind of where you
had that gift of desperation.
(16:44):
You said, I like that.
But it's like, this is all comefrom somewhere, right?
Like, it's not like we wake upin.
Our twenties or thirties orforties whenever this happens,
which I think of those moments.
Um, any time throughout thereand, uh, repeatedly even.
But when we reached thosemoments where we're like, this
is not working or, you know, Ineed something here.
(17:04):
It didn't just like, Appear likethis is built up from something
and you were talking a littlebit about how.
Often our experience withloneliness.
It isn't just an isolated event.
Like these things are all linkedtogether and, you know, come
from lots of differentexperiences in our life, which
can often.
(17:25):
Date back really far into ourpast.
And, so I mean, in your life,what does this look like?
Like how do you think our pastloneliness can impact how we.
Experienced loneliness asadults, like as we're, you know,
maybe looking at, Hey, I need tolike, do some counseling.
Maybe you're like, I need towork on some healing here.
Talk to the Lord about it.
(17:46):
Like whatever combo that lookslike.
Where do you think we go to,like, do we start somewhere?
What has this looked like inyour life?
Kind of going back to your pastand reflecting here.
Susie (17:58):
Yeah, that.
Comes back, to something.
you know, I've done this, ofcourse in my own journey, but
when I.
Working with clients in the areaof loneliness.
It's helping them to see that wehave loneliness.
There's loneliness.
There's three ways we canexperience loneliness,
loneliness.
For cells.
(18:19):
For God and for others.
And.
I big gap in that usually.
And you kind of spoke with thata little bit is where we run to
others to like fill theloneliness.
Is that.
I find a lot of people and Iwent on this healing journey
myself, is that.
It's trying to fill thosewounded fragmented parts on the
(18:39):
inside somehow on the outside.
So if I marry the right man, IfI have children.
Aye.
You know, fill in the blank.
Um, Then.
Kimber (18:51):
Find the perfect best friend or yeah.
Yeah.
Susie (18:54):
perfect job that I love that then.
And I won't feel this acheinside.
And so for me, My healingjourney was coming home to
myself.
I often call it to me.
Home to my own heart
Kimber (19:11):
Hmm.
Susie (19:12):
I needed to go back.
And be able to look at and tellthe truth about.
The wounded parts of myself andmy own story.
And so that hearing.
You know, it's kinda like if youcover over.
He fall.
The bike for over a wound tooquickly without cleaning it out,
(19:32):
you could have gravel.
Kimber (19:35):
Yeah.
Infection.
Susie (19:38):
Yes.
And so it was going back andrealizing kind of like you said,
um, My reactions, my defenses,my coping mechanisms around
loneliness.
Has been there for a while andthey're there for a reason.
So.
part of my journey.
I was going back and looking andsomething that was very
formative.
(19:59):
Disconnection.
that created loneliness for me.
Um, or swelled loneliness madeit larger.
Was.
I grew up.
Very, um, My mom came from avery hard background.
Um, her.
Parents and.
Family lineage for refugees.
And so she, she kind of grew upin a scarcity mindset.
(20:21):
And a lot of poverty and.
That's a whole nother, we.
Nerd out on the counselingstuff.
And that X that we do believethat some of that stress can be
passed down for generations, butalso.
my mom went through a majortrauma right before I was born.
my brother who's 18 monthsolder, almost died of spinal
meningitis.
Kimber (20:40):
Hm.
Susie (20:41):
He was hospitalized on life support.
Uh, basically the week before Iwas born.
And.
So my mother, I was literallyborn.
I was based in her anxiety,anxiety, and.
For a world of anxiety.
And so.
The first four years of my life,I would really only let my
mother hold me or carry me.
(21:01):
I didn't talk till I was four.
Um, I was very attached to her.
And so.
Eventually it went tokindergarten, had the sweetest
kindergarten teacher, lovelywoman, and started to be a
little less shy.
Uh, start to have friends enjoyplaying on the playground.
Good things.
first and second grade, I movedschools had a new.
(21:24):
Best friend.
Uh, she's kind of the color.
The queen bee of the playground.
Um, she would be always the oneout there saying what we were
playing that day.
And, so it would be the queenbee and I was just happy to get
to be a part.
So I would do, I would be, Iplay whatever role she wanted me
to play.
The beginning of my third gradeyear.
So I've been friends with hertwo years rolling into a third
(21:46):
year, sometime at the beginningof that year.
I was tired of.
Pene boss and told what to do.
And so I just remember one dayon the playground telling her,
no, I don't want to play that.
I don't want to do that.
Kimber (22:01):
Yeah.
Susie (22:02):
She said, well, you'll do that and you'll play what I want
to play.
Or I'll make sure that no oneplays with you.
Kimber (22:09):
Oh, gosh.
Cool.
Oh,
Susie (22:13):
Sadly.
You would hope that one thirdgrade little girl wouldn't have
that kind of power, but.
Kimber (22:19):
Oh, but they do.
Yeah.
Susie (22:21):
And She did.
And so
Kimber (22:23):
Hm.
Susie (22:24):
Talk to the other kids.
And I remember them all on thisA-frame play thing.
Kind of mocking me and the otherkids honestly looked more afraid
standing behind her, but.
that rolled into a year of, mehaving lots of stomach aches,
being scared and not wanting togo out on recess and, you know,
my parents being like, you know,what's shifted and little Suzy.
(22:46):
I had a sweet teacher, so theteacher started letting me just
stay in at recess and be like ateacher's helper.
Um, so I would just not go torecess.
I would stay inside.
Um, and all that sounds well andgood.
But no one was really dealingwith the problem.
Kimber (23:03):
Right.
Right.
The actual thing that was goingon.
Yeah.
Susie (23:07):
And so.
a year.
That young in life.
Of not having any friends andbeing alone.
Really changes.
Mentally.
Kimber (23:18):
Yeah.
Susie (23:19):
Your peers and how you see yourself.
And so that year, um, I rememberreally, I think it really
started.
It marred.
I think of as being fearfullyand wonderfully made is like,
Susie as this beautiful mosaiccreated by God for his light to
shine through.
And that year it's like mud gotsmeared over that mosaic.
(23:41):
And I started wondering.
What is wrong with me?
You know, is there somethingdefective with me?
That other kids don't want toplay with me
Kimber (23:50):
Right.
Susie (23:50):
that.
My fault that I'm so lonely,what's wrong with me.
so it also put that in me thatlike, Feeling of toxic shame
inside of me that there wassome.
I've been wrong with me, butthen also on the outside of me,
it created a fear of my peersand like a hypervigilance.
you know, after that,
Kimber (24:09):
Because it wasn't just a random, like, girl, this was
someone that you had calledfriend.
Right.
Like, even though it sounds likemaybe she wasn't a great friend,
but for you.
You didn't know, like, yeah.
So there's, there's betrayalthere too, right?
Susie (24:22):
Yeah.
Yep.
Definitely.
Uh, betrayal when they're too.
yeah, so that was really, thatreally shifted how safe I felt
in the world.
And.
It's amazing how formative thatwas.
Um, And some actually very.
Hard ways developmentally andme.
That natural child's heart.
(24:42):
To go out and want to play.
And.
Be who they are.
I felt like I needed always tobe hyper aware of.
What was coming off of,especially girls.
Kimber (24:52):
Yeah.
Susie (24:53):
And another there's that one.
And then there was one moreformative right after that, that
really started shaping this evenmore.
So I'm in fifth grade.
So fourth grade, that girl wasin a different pod and didn't
have the same recess.
And so.
I had friends again, I had myfirst boyfriend, which is not
even a boyfriend in fourthgrade.
(25:14):
You pass them out
Kimber (25:16):
We know the kind yeah.
Susie (25:18):
And so forth.
It's kind of fun.
Fifth grade again, it's just a Cwent on and had different
friends.
It just didn't have as muchpower, but in first grade, There
was a day.
And the lunch room that therewas this.
Girl named Becky that she wasspecial needs.
probably similar to downsyndrome, but I don't think it
was actually down syndrome.
I don't know, but she was very,very sweet.
(25:40):
Sweet sweet girl.
And, sometimes I would sit closeto her at lunch and, two other
girls that it's funny in fifthgrade, thinking of popular girls
that.
They were pretty neat.
I had some of that gravitasaround them.
And.
Becky liked to eat a lot.
So she would ask for otherpeople's food at lunch and the
girls put some like dead fliesand a hamburger.
Kimber (26:01):
my gosh.
Susie (26:02):
And.
And it said, Hey, Becky, wehave.
Hamburger and I saw them dothis.
And so they handed it to her.
And this little Susie, I'm allof a sudden in a crisis because
I'm like, do I speak out?
Against the bullies and perhapshave the target news to me
again.
Kimber (26:22):
Right.
Susie (26:23):
Or do I keep silent?
And watch.
Something really cruel.
Kimber (26:28):
Yeah.
Susie (26:29):
So.
I couldn't like get burnedinside of me and I couldn't stay
quiet.
So I spoke up and I said, Becky,don't eat that.
Hamburger.
And she looked at me like I wasbetraying her, like, why
wouldn't I.
It's a gift.
Kimber (26:42):
cool.
Susie (26:42):
And I don't either.
You can have mine.
And she's like, why is this twogirls are glaring.
Glaring at me.
And I just say, Becky, they putsomething in your hamburger.
That's not okay.
Kimber (26:55):
Yeah.
Susie (26:55):
Here, take mine.
And.
At that point, those girlsstarted hating on me.
But the reason I bring thatstory up is your question kind
of started with like, Some ofthe roots of it and the
formation of it.
And that really shifted thingsin me of.
Feeling still some of theloneliness.
I did have some sweet friendsafter that.
(27:18):
But I kind of had this weird,odd relationship with some of
those girls.
Cause I just.
I would notice the kids beingbullied.
And would want to go and kind ofadvocate for them.
And so it created this kind of,fear of.
That continuing then fear thenof girls.
(27:38):
And what there.
Cannabis mean girls mentalityand.
Kimber (27:43):
Are there motives?
What are their motives?
Are they going to turn on me?
Yeah.
Susie (27:47):
Yeah.
So I, again, I grew thisdistrust that girls were safe
Kimber (27:53):
Right.
Susie (27:53):
I knew there were som, but I, I went forward with that.
So.
That was very formative for me.
And, Also, my, my mom was a lotmore introverted.
Didn't have a lot ofgirlfriends.
And so when I would come homechronic from school with those
various instances, a lot oftimes she would try to Sue me
and.
Be kind to be with me, but shewould, I had told her brothers
(28:17):
so on and so forth and she say,yeah, sometimes I think guys are
easier to be with.
They just like punch.
Over with girls can be pettyand.
Even though she was trying to beencouraging.
It created this.
I feel like lie.
That I carried with me, right.
The girls.
you can't really connect withgirls.
They're unsafe
Kimber (28:34):
Right.
Susie (28:36):
It took me years.
It took me into adulthood.
To finally.
do enough healing work.
It sounds funny, but it's like,I feel like if there's a
spiritual battle and evil wouldhave loved for that to stay.
Kimber (28:49):
Yeah.
Susie (28:50):
The message.
Long-term and keep me lonely
Kimber (28:53):
Because it keeps you isolated.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Susie (28:58):
so after lots of work, And healing journey for myself.
I remember.
A space where I'm like, Throughthe blood of Jesus Christ.
I revoked.
My name.
From that contract, you know,where I co-sign with evil
saying.
Kimber (29:12):
Yep.
I am undesirable.
Yeah.
Susie (29:16):
And I'm undesirable one.
You know, and, I started leaningin and that was a lot of my
healing journey is leaning inwith a beautiful mentor.
That's a beautiful woman.
Other courageous friends leaningin saying, no, there's a lot of
beautiful women in this world.
there's a lot of beautifulpeople and just leaning in and
(29:36):
saying, You know, hurt people,hurt people.
And so those that sometimes dothe heart, they have their own
stories of hurt, but there'slots of.
Other.
You know, wounded healers andother people that walk with
lamps, but are beautiful peopleto walk with.
And.
I feel much differently today.
I love women.
I love being a woman.
I love raising women.
Kimber (29:57):
Yeah.
Susie (29:58):
and I have a much different relationship with that
today than I use.
Kimber (30:04):
And what, like a gift of God to be able to like totally
restore that.
area of your life that was like,so formatively damaged.
Like I feel like when we've beenhurt, learning to trust again,
that just, it seems like so muchof my story is caught up in that
struggle is like, you know,cause my, most basic, like
(30:27):
subconscious says, if it's hurtyou before.
Stay way away from it.
You know, why would you, whywould you go back and try that
again?
And when that is.
That like.
Female relationships are notsafe.
Like holy cow, how do we recoverfrom that?
Like either we recover from thatby the grace of God or we, or we
(30:50):
stay lonely.
I feel like those are, those arethe only two ways.
He friend, forgive me for takinga real quick moment in this
conversation to ask a favor ofyou.
I hope my conversation withSusie is blessing you today.
(31:10):
And if so, would you take amoment to rate and review the
show on apple podcasts?
Reviews are huge in helping newfriends find the show.
And the bonus is I love reading.
What is blessing you from thepodcast?
You can find the link to leave areview in the description of
this episode.
So thanks so much for taking asecond to do that friends.
All right.
(31:30):
Now, back to the show.
What do you feel like where someof the, like most, important
ways that you started to movetowards healing there?
You mentioned like a mentor,like.
your own counseling journey,like what were, what are maybe
some first steps for some of ourfriends listening?
If they're really feeling this,they're like, yes.
(31:52):
Like relationships with womenfeel scary to me.
I don't feel like.
Vulnerability.
There is some, it feels like ahard ask.
what would you say could be likesome first steps for them or
where would you, direct them tostart?
Susie (32:06):
Such a great question.
Yeah.
I would just really encourage, Imean, first of all, which is so
hard.
When we're talking about.
Loneliness.
And some of those things thatmake it scary to reach out.
And one of the scariest thingsis reaching through that.
Kimber (32:21):
And that's what you have to do.
Yeah.
Yes.
Susie (32:24):
doing the opposite of what your insights.
Kimber (32:27):
Totally.
Susie (32:27):
so it's to the degree that they can moving out of
isolation.
Um, a lot of times.
You know, it can be a pastor.
It can be a friend somewhere.
You know, notice, notice thosepeople in your circles That
seemed to be those woundedwarriors.
Like you can tell that they'vehealed from things themselves
and you know what I mean?
(32:49):
There's a wholeness to them.
Move towards them.
Ask them out for coffee, take
Kimber (32:53):
Um,
Susie (32:54):
that would be
Kimber (32:54):
Lean into it.
Yeah.
Hm.
Susie (32:57):
Lean into it.
Another thing I would say.
And I do think, you know,counseling's beautiful.
Um, and a lot of people do italso because it's confidential.
So it feels.
Slightly less scary.
and so, for any who want toencourage that, it's just a
place to be known and it canfeel a little scary cause it's.
Accidental.
Kimber (33:17):
There's not going to be those relational risks.
Like there are, I feel like withjust like a friend.
Susie (33:23):
Yep.
Yep.
Yep.
So it can feel safer and then ofcourse it can help with that
healing journey.
Kimber (33:29):
Totally.
They have the tools.
Yeah.
Susie (33:31):
They can start giving you the tools to walk the road.
And then, I guess I said, noticethose women, but then I do
believe a lot of it is just.
Having the courage to try again.
To ask for coffee and.
The first three women say no.
To Kindle that desire inside ofyou.
To ask someone else again.
Kimber (33:53):
Yeah.
Susie (33:53):
But I do think a big thing for me.
I think it's really hard.
Cause you talked about therepetitive.
Like we can repeat them.
A site.
So I do believe that it's reallyimportant to understand.
A little bit about what is someof the woundings that created?
That loneliness Meredith.
And then what are the defensesthat I built up?
(34:17):
Around that.
because without curiosity, thatway.
I can't just reach through likemy system almost won't let me do
it.
Like, just reach through.
I have to be curious about thosedefenses.
So that they can start to heal.
And come down
Kimber (34:32):
Interesting.
Susie (34:33):
can give access to who I am.
So, especially for women whofeels scared that have had kind
of repeat patterns, I do reallyencourage.
Someone, whether it's acounselor or a mentor or whoever
it is that someone who's kind ofalready walked.
Kimber (34:50):
Right.
Susie (34:51):
Some of those bad lands to come back and walk through.
Those bad lands with them.
Um, cause it's hard to seeourselves.
Kimber (34:57):
Yes, that is so true.
That is so true.
It's like our blinders areexperiential blinders are just
like, and we don't even realizewhich what they are sometimes.
So it's like, how do youdismantle something without
realizing it's even a thing thatyou do?
Susie (35:12):
Exactly.
Yes.
Yes.
So it's hard to invite someoneinto that space, but I love how
you called it.
Blinders.
I think of the horses, the rightthat
Kimber (35:21):
Right.
That's what I'm thinking of.
Yes.
Yeah.
Susie (35:24):
And we have to have someone that gently with us that
we will trust to start to let usknow what's behind our blinders
so that we can start to heal.
Kimber (35:34):
Right.
I love that encouragement tolike notice the women around you
that you think might be equippedto help you with that because,
like sometimes I think we'reeither drawn to people.
That maybe aren't what we need.
And those kinds of moments.
or, you know, we're, we're justnot even looking for it.
(35:55):
But I think to intentionally,try to notice those people
around us that see, I love the,the like wounded warriors kind
of terminology or idea, like.
To be looking for that.
And I think we can even like askGod to show us, you know, like
someone who could walk with us,um, to help us walk through
these kind of.
past experiences because, ifwe're not sure, like, I think
(36:17):
we, you know, he says, If any ofyou lacks wisdom, like ask him.
And so I think we can.
We can ask him to show us thosepeople or bring that person to
our, into our life.
And then, I love also that it'slike, we don't have to, build
Rome in a day, whatever, like,we can start with one person
that.
we're trusting is safe and, youknow, we could be wrong.
Yes.
Like we don't have probablycertainty there, but that using
(36:40):
our best judgment feels safe.
We can start with just them and.
someday we may have richcommunity in our lives again,
but coming back from thosewounds, it doesn't have to be
instantaneous.
We can start small and just oneperson at a time.
I love that encouragement to us.
Susie.
Do you still feel lonely todaysometimes.
(37:02):
Do you think, or is thissomething that's gotten smaller
and smaller in your life?
What is that experience like inyour present day?
Look like for you.
Susie (37:09):
Hmm.
Well, absolutely.
Um, Like we never rise abovebeing human and.
Until heaven.
I'm going to live and walk in awounded world.
And so.
For sure.
I still experience.
Kimber (37:26):
How do you think despite that, cause I would agree.
Totally.
Like, how do you handle itdifferently today though, than
you think you did like 20 or 30years ago?
Like, what is kind of the shiftfor you?
Like, when you feel thoseloneliness, that those feelings
of loneliness crop up.
Um, how do you take that?
(37:46):
Differently today than maybe youthink you would have.
You know, 20 or 30 years ago.
Susie (37:51):
Mm, I love that.
for me, I always start with acuriosity within myself.
Asking myself, if the lonelinessI'm feeling.
Is a loneliness for myself,which to me is the need for
solitude.
Uh, I mean for a walk.
Doing our, you know, whatever itis.
But the thing Connects me tomyself.
whether I'm feeling lonely forGod.
(38:12):
And if so then maybe I need totake a walk with God or sit
quietly with him.
Spent some time in contemplativeprayer, you know, relaxing into
the goodness of God.
or am I lonely?
For someone else.
And if so, who.
And so just this week.
I was driving home from work andas I was driving.
(38:33):
I have a half an hour drive andI was like, man, I'm feeling the
ache of.
Kimber (38:37):
Um,
Susie (38:37):
And so I asked myself that question, Susie, who.
Or what are you lonely for?
And my heart.
Spoke back a girlfriend, likesome of my good heart
girlfriends.
And so one of them I knew Icouldn't get ahold of, I have
multiples out of state that aresweet women.
And so it was one specificfriend who was in Nebraska, out
(38:57):
of state that she's.
Really busy.
I can always get ahold of her,but I'm like, I'm going to try.
So.
Kimber (39:02):
Yeah.
Susie (39:03):
him.
And she, she picked up the phoneand started chuckling.
She's like perfect.
I was cleaning my house with myair by.
Kimber (39:12):
Hm.
Susie (39:13):
And we talked and we laughed and we shared hearts.
so I guess that's the bigdifference today is today.
I move.
As soon as I feel loneliness,they move with.
compassion and kindness towardsmy own farts asking.
What am I lonely for?
And then as soon as my heartlets me know.
The night.
moved towards that.
(39:35):
So if the need for solitude, I,you know, get my corgi mind and
take a walk.
And sometime with me, if Icreate space for that, and if
it's a friends or.
You know, someone else, I makemovement towards that.
And I know sometimes that's notspelled right.
Like sometimes the person can'tpick up the phone or.
(39:55):
But with that.
I just honor that desire.
And so I may put a reminder onmy phone and.
Ms back in the night.
Kimber (40:04):
Try again, right?
Yeah.
I love that heart of compassionfor yourself.
again, not like being like, oh,I'm lonely, terrible shame.
I wish I didn't feel this, butlike recognizing it as something
that's going to communicate aneed of our hearts and.
then asking that question of,okay, like, what am I lonely
for?
Like, it's not a bad thing tofeel this it's going to help me
(40:26):
know.
Um, what to move towards andthen taking that courageous
step.
I love that that's reallyhelpful.
man, Susie.
Well, thank you so much for justsharing.
both your is your wisdom thatyou have gained from your
personal experience and yourprofessional with us.
But, I just also loved hearingyour stories.
(40:46):
You have.
it seems like your brain worksin stories.
And I love hearing that.
So I, I thank you for, forsharing those with us today,
they were really encouraging tomeet, to hear.
And, uh, no that I'm not theonly one with, a bunch of stuff
in my life.
It's always so encouraging tohear.
Susie (41:02):
Absolutely.
Yeah.
Thanks.
For inviting me in timber.
Kimber (41:05):
Yes.
Yes.
that was good.
Well, Susie.
So, to wrap us up here, one ofmy main missions with the
podcast is, just to help, equipus to love our people better, to
like lean towards or, uh, Likelean into that, like you were
saying.
And, I think part of that isjust like being intentional
(41:25):
about learning how our friendsreceive love.
And so, you know, as we'relearning about our friends is
we're doing this introspectivework ourselves, like
communicating that to eachother, like what makes them feel
loved, seen, cared for how canwe reach to others in our lonely
moments?
And so.
I've been ending the podcast byasking my friends.
(41:46):
What, is that for you?
What makes you feel most loved,seen, cared for by your friends
lately?
Because I want to, I want tomodel this, in my own life and I
want to practice it to likeintentionally asking these kinds
of questions so that we can bepressing into this in practical
ways.
And I think that question isbeen helpful for me at least to
(42:08):
learn.
So, I'd be interested.
Interested in hearing for you?
Like what has made you feel mostloved, seen and cared for by
your friends lately?
Susie (42:16):
Hmm.
Love that question.
Got a beautiful question.
Kimber (42:20):
I can't take credit for it.
My, one of my good friends inour life group originally asked
it to our group and I was justlike, oh my gosh, I love that.
So good.
So I've been trying to ask morepeople at, so yeah.
What, what stands out for you?
Susie (42:32):
Hmm.
Uh, for me, I think it's myfriends who, um, You know, where
you, you just think of someonelike they're on your heart and
you reach out.
I think it's when my friends dothat.
like, it's neat to be celebratedon your, I don't know your
birthday or.
Remembered on a special event orsomething, but it's those
spontaneous acts of love.
(42:54):
that I think.
Make my heart just feel so muchjoy and kind of take my breath
away.
So.
it makes me think of, I hadthree surgeries this past year,
which is a whole nother story,but, um, one of my best friends,
Lives out of state and the daybefore my surgery.
This box came in the mail and Iopened the box and it literally
(43:17):
was decorated all with yellow.
And it said a box of sunshine.
Kimber (43:21):
Oh,
Susie (43:23):
At the dollar store.
All the fun, yellow things likea squishy.
Stress ball lemonade, like sillyninja.
Minion sticky notes, but.
And
Kimber (43:36):
love that a box of sunshine, so cool.
Susie (43:39):
Yeah.
I just felt so seen and loved bythat.
Um, So I think it's just thosespontaneous, you know, and it
can be more simple than that,right?
Like a friend's voice.
I'm just saying, I was thinkingof you today.
I love you so much.
Whatever.
So I guess those spontaneousacts of love.
Kimber (43:58):
I love that.
It's I think it's so common forus to.
Like we think of someone and wethink, oh, I was thinking, I'm
thinking of them, like whatever.
And then we just move on.
And so I love that.
Just inspiration to like act onit, to, make the move.
whether it's a text or somethingbigger.
I think getting in the habit ofacting on our thoughts, when
(44:19):
those friends come to mind, Ithink that's the holy spirit
bringing them to our hearts.
So.
I think that's a way we canpractice obedience to his voice.
So that's so cool.
Well, Susie, thank you so muchfor being here.
I loved hearing from me todayand, I just appreciate your,
your voice in my life and thatwe were able to get to hear,
hear from me today.
So thanks so much, friend.
Susie (44:38):
All right.
Thanks so much number.
Kimber (44:46):
Sisters.
I'm so glad you could join Susieand I this week on the, your
sister Kimber podcast.
Loneliness comes for us all attimes, but I love how Susie
taught us that lonelinessshouldn't necessarily be viewed
as something negative to avoid,but rather as a check engine
light to invite reflection,prayer, and then movement
(45:07):
towards something we need.
And as you're digging into someof these reflective questions,
what better place to do thatthen with a trusted friend?
My new digital resource mightjust be the tool to get you
started on this kind ofconversation.
Part of it is all about howyou're wired as an introvert
extrovert, internal or externalprocessor.
And whether you like to be morespontaneous or if you're a
(45:29):
planner like me, I hope thesequestions, which are just a few
out of 20 facts that you canlearn about your friends by
printing out this free PDF touse it, your next girls
gathering.
I hope it'll help you growcloser to each other and maybe
more aware of how you receivefriendship.
You can download it on mywebsite, which is linked in the
description of this episode.
(45:49):
And if you haven't yet joined mynewsletter crew, will you visit
your sister kimber.com right nowto subscribe?
When you subscribe, you get myweekly newsletters goes directly
to your email inbox each weekwith a preview of what will be
featured on the podcast thatweek.
Plus a link to this month's blogpost, and some other fun
resources and tips to help yougrow friendships that.
(46:10):
Honor God and draw closer toJesus.
I really hope it blesses you.
And I just want to say friends.
Thank you so much.
For being part of this communitywith me.
Until next time.
It's your sister Kimber.
Hey there friends.
Welcome to the, your sisterKimber podcast.
My name is Kimber Gilbert, andI'm so glad you're here.
We all know that the idea offriendship should be something
desirable, but what happens whenthat's not the reality?
When friendship feels scary.
The last thing that we're goingto want to do is dive right in
boldly.
When we can appreciate whatfriendship has to offer.
(00:30):
That's one thing.
But what about when friendshipsfeel like they might not turn
out to be safe?
My friend, Susie Edwards, and Iare digging into this today, and
I hope our conversation helpsyou begin to see how your own
younger years of friendshipmight be impacting how you
handle your loneliness today.
I could talk to Susie all dayand I hope it helps you grow
(00:51):
authentic friendships in yourown life that honor God and draw
closer to Jesus.
I wish we could talk this outover coffee, but this is the
next best thing.
I'm so glad you're here, friend.
Let's get started.
Susie Hallel.
How are you doing?
Susie (01:11):
And dealing with.
Kimber (01:12):
Oh, good.
Thanks so much for coming on thepodcast today.
I'm so thankful.
You're willing to talk to metoday.
I'm
Susie (01:18):
Yeah.
I'm excited for our timetogether as well.
Kimber (01:20):
What do you just go ahead and introduce yourself to
our friends listening?
Who may not know yet?
Susie (01:25):
Yeah.
So my name is Susie Edwards.
Um, Lived in Alaska since 2003.
Except for two years.
And yeah.
I'm close to 50 mama for most ofthem.
Young adults now.
Kimber (01:40):
Yeah, they're leaving the house quickly.
Yes.
Does it, is it like a relief oris it sad for you or both?
Susie (01:47):
Probably both.
Yeah.
Yeah.
My last one just turned 18.
It's her senior year.
So we're.
We're right at the doorway ofempty nest.
Yup.
Kimber (01:57):
absolutely.
Ah, that's so exciting.
That's really cool.
You know, Susie, I just learnedwhen we were talking the other
day, I asked you if you wouldcome on the podcast and share
with us because.
I have long respected yourvoices.
One of wisdom, in the circlesthat I've been around.
And so I was asking you if youwould come on and talk with us
about loneliness and you toldme, I didn't know this, but
(02:19):
you're a counselor.
And so I'm excited to hear bothyour like, personal perspective
on this and also, how your jobplays into Those kinds of
conversations as well, but I'minterested to notice a little
background on that.
Like how long have you been acounselor?
Is it like something, have youenjoyed it?
what's like kind of your storywith that.
Susie (02:37):
Yeah.
So I have, Then a mental healthcounselor for about three and a
half years now.
Um, I was a stay home mom beforethat.
Um, Yeah.
I was military wife for awhile,and then we settled up here and
stay home mom.
So kinda did a later lifecareer.
And.
But I had been working a lot inlay work, doing very, very
(02:59):
similar things.
Um, Before.
I actually went back and got.
My degree and, and all of that.
So.
been.
a wild couple of years to be inthat profession because I
started in 19 and we rolled into2020.
Kimber (03:13):
Yeah, we all needed.
We all needed help.
Susie (03:16):
Yeah.
Kimber (03:16):
that.
What would you say is like yourfavorite part of it?
What have you most enjoyed?
Susie (03:21):
what I love about counseling is it's just, it's an
honor.
To get to be invited into otherpeople's stories.
And into their journeys and suchan intimate way.
I just feel like that's anhonor.
Um, I would almost even use theword sacred, like it's a sacred
space.
And so that feels like such anhonor.
That I get to do regularly.
(03:43):
You have the jury people, aslong as they want me to journey
with them.
And I don't know, that justfeels like a gift and a
privilege.
Kimber (03:51):
That's really cool.
You know, actually I just wentto counseling for the very first
time this last week, which was abig step for me, mostly because
not because I had been like,opposed to the idea of going to
counseling for me, it was likefiguring out the logistics and
like actually making it happen,like making the phone calls and
filling out the paperwork andblah, blah, blah, like.
(04:12):
I feel like there's a lot ofsteps and it was always just
easier to like, kind of put itoff, uh, but it was really good
and I, I really appreciated mytime there.
And.
as I was like dumping all of myjunk at this kind woman's feet,
I was like, I don't know, thismust be like such a challenging
job.
Like it seems to me like itwould be really.
just challenging to like hearpeople's hardest stuff, all the
(04:36):
time.
And so, I was just really likethankful for her.
And, um, for, you know, those ofyou there in that field, like,
do you find that to bechallenging or how do you kind
of manage that for yourself?
Susie (04:46):
Yeah.
I've definitely had thatquestion more than once.
Um, And sadly sometimes fromlike my own children or friends,
because I'll get to the end of anine hour day.
You know, And then they'll havesomething hard.
Call me with something hard.
To be like, you've been doingthis all day.
Yeah.
I was thinking to some of mykids.
You've been doing this all day,mom.
Sorry to, you know, but for me,It's barely draining in that
(05:11):
way.
It's.
Those deep waters to.
Really beautiful.
So I don't struggle very muchwith the emotional fatigue of
it.
the part that I sometimesstruggle with is what I would
call a mental fatigue, and thatjust probably comes from focused
listening.
For eight.
To nine hours.
Um, so I'm the.
That that would be kind of likethe hardest part of counseling.
(05:33):
Coming to me is that sometimesI'm driving home and then I walk
into the house and.
You
Kimber (05:38):
brain's done.
Yeah.
Susie (05:40):
Yeah.
And.
You know, I, you know, myhusband, my daughter, like.
What are, you know, they're fullof life and want to talk about
their days and.
Um, and.
so that I've heard fromlonger-term counselors that you,
you gain that endurance and overtime, not as much.
but for me, it's my, it's moreof that.
Um, the years have kind oftaught me even before, as a
(06:01):
counselor to walk with people ontheir journey, but it's not mine
to carry their story.
Very their story.
I walk with them.
so I'm grateful for that.
Kimber (06:10):
That's really cool.
That's so I think it's such agood, it sounds like such a
gift, but also something thatyou're like learning to steward
even better.
But, uh, yeah, it sounds like,sounds like you found a
wonderful fit.
Well, I'm excited that we get totalk to you today.
Like I said, from thatperspective also, just from your
personal perspective, you know,but when I was talking to you
(06:31):
about like, kind of this pitch,which I've talked to some other
people too, and I've.
Shared that I just feel likeit's kind of a hard pitch, like,
you know, tell me about your,your loneliness.
Like that's, that's a big ask.
And so one, thank you for beingwilling to share with us today.
But, when I was talking withyou, when I learned you were a
counselor, you just talked a bitabout how like their
(06:52):
professional training thatyou've had for that job.
It kind of gave you some insightabout how loneliness or why it
is.
Uh, part of all of our lives.
And so I'd be interested to heara little bit more about that.
I think, did you call it like acore emotion?
Susie (07:06):
Yeah.
Kimber (07:07):
like that.
Yeah.
So can you tell us a little bitabout that and how do you think
that plays into the fact thatlike we're all going to
experience loneliness at somepoint in our lives?
Susie (07:16):
Yes.
I would love to.
Yeah.
I had to bring, when you walkedup and asked me.
Um, you know, about, would youlike to do a podcast at
loneliness?
Cause right.
Yeah.
Like.
You're Like.
wow, that's a vulnerable ass.
Right.
But I, my heart, my faceprobably did too.
I just grins
Kimber (07:30):
Oh,
Susie (07:31):
our practice.
We use various approaches thatare our name approach is a very
emotionally in tuned focusedtech.
Approach.
Uh, therapy.
And so, that's like at the coreof what I do every day is,
focusing on, people's emotions.
And so.
So lonely.
(07:53):
Is one, I called it a coreemotion.
Yeah.
Cause we consider at ourpractice and you know, different
there's different models aroundthis, but.
That there's eight coreemotions.
And so some of us saw the movieinside out and they kind of put
four in that movie
Kimber (08:10):
is so good.
Susie (08:11):
yes, it comes up.
It comes up in our sessionssometimes,
Kimber (08:15):
bet.
Susie (08:16):
yeah, but there's, you know, we consider, um, the
Thursday it's.
Uh, core emotions and lonelinessis one of those eight core
emotions.
And I would say It's actuallyprobably in a way to me, one of
the most central ones to, um, Tobe able to journey.
And heal.
Um, and our own stories.
So We at.
(08:36):
In our model, we just kind ofthink of the emotions just like
I years ago, taught.
Taught classes on this, on it,like emotionally.
Healthy spirituality andemotions.
And in that people you wouldlist on like a whiteboard.
I just say, throw me someemotions and you very quickly
can have like a hundred wordsfor emotions upon the board.
(08:57):
and so what's really beautifulabout this is just like colors
and art.
There's primary colors, right.
And art, and, you know, I justthink of kids with Crohn's, you
know, there's the box.
The smaller box, the bigger boxand the huge box.
Right.
and so these eight emotions are,I think like at the roots or
core of almost any emotional,other words we might say.
Kimber (09:19):
Yes.
Susie (09:20):
How, um, within those, we, we look at fear, anger.
Hurt sad.
Lonely.
Shame.
Guilt and glad.
Kimber (09:32):
Wow.
There's only one pot, like,well, That's probably an
interesting thing.
Only one of those soundspositive to me.
Which is so telling.
Yeah.
Susie (09:44):
Yes, that comment is almost always said.
That exact Thomas and.
That is kind of where we beginbecause it's shifting peoples.
Uh, relationship with their ownemotions.
Cause we actually consider allof those good emotions
Kimber (10:00):
Interesting.
Susie (10:01):
All of those emotions.
Light up in our hearts for areason.
To let us know.
to guide us like to lead us,basically, they aluminate, they
light up and aluminate to leadus to a need that's underneath
each one of those emotions.
Kimber (10:16):
Yeah.
Susie (10:16):
to be aware of the need, we need the emotion to guide us
to the need.
Which takes me back toloneliness.
So.
Loneliness illuminates on thehuman heart.
Too.
Make us aware of our need forconnection.
Kimber (10:33):
Yeah.
Susie (10:33):
Our deep desire for connection.
And I believe that that one islike, Almost.
At the core of the core of thoseemotions, because when you look
at Genesis.
Genesis two 18.
Um, this is before the fall.
So before it.
I mentioned spear and shamecoming in.
before the fall, God says toman, it is not good for man to
(10:57):
be alone.
And God is with that now.
So that now.
Kimber (11:01):
Right.
Susie (11:02):
Before the fall.
And he says it's not good to bealone.
And so I really believe that Godcreated us in the likeness of
the Trinity.
And so in that imprint in us, Isa deep imprint.
For not just connectedness withGod.
But for connectedness withothers.
So I believe that that.
Is the core in the side of us.
(11:24):
It's there for a reason.
It's because we're created forconnection.
Kimber (11:27):
Yes.
And it, it forces us to pursuethat.
Yeah.
Um, That's really beautiful.
I love that perspective becauseit's so easy for me to like,
when I feel things that arehard, of course, it's like,
okay, I want to eliminate that.
and I think with loneliness,that is definitely like, our
(11:48):
instinct is like, I don't wantto feel loneliness, so what can
I do?
To fix it.
And, I, I love that perspectiveof it being like, you know, it
can drive us to something.
So actually it's like anessential, it's like the, you
know, like the hurt response injust like our fingers.
Like you touch a stove and likeyou want to stop touching the
stove.
Like.
You know, and, and yeah, itdrives us towards people.
(12:11):
I think that's, that's so cool.
I would love for you to sharewith us a little bit about, what
this has looked like in yourlife as well.
Like, as you're walking withpeople, you, you see this play
out in a million ways and.
I would love if you're willingto share with us a little bit
about like where loneliness has,has come up in your life and how
(12:32):
you've walked through that.
Especially like almost inhindsight, seeing like, okay,
this was not a terrible thing.
It like drove me to good things.
yeah.
What does that look like foryou?
Susie (12:44):
Yeah, so loneliness for me.
You know, as I've spent timehealing, like you mentioned,
going to counseling, About 15years ago.
I hit a place in my life and mymarriage, my family.
Um, where.
Really needed.
I can't kind of came, I'd say itkind of came to the end of
myself.
(13:04):
And all the ways that I, triedto fill.
Those spaces inside me that feltempty and fall on us.
Started.
Basically like collapsing aroundme.
Um, and I found myself, this ismy mid thirties.
I found myself.
At one point.
Literally laying on my bed.
(13:25):
And the fetal position.
Feeling like.
Everything was breaking apart.
and.
Asking God, you know, to drawnear to that space.
And I felt God's cousins come inand it sounds funny to say this
God.
But almost like spoon me.
Kimber (13:43):
Uh,
Susie (13:44):
Right.
Like in that fetal position inmy
Kimber (13:46):
wrap around.
Yeah.
Susie (13:49):
And that was it really Pivotal time in my life to
finally.
Starts, like I had finallygotten to the gift of
desperation.
To really start looking at theways that I had Constructed
things to try to sell.
The lack within me.
Um, and so then we reallypursued my own journey of
(14:10):
healing through.
Counseling and, Mentorship and.
Friendship.
And really being on a journeyof.
Healing.
Um, The fragmented pieces of myown story.
Kimber (14:23):
yeah, obviously I love that image of like the
wraparound.
It makes me think of, um, In, Ithink it's called the passion
translation.
It's like a loose paraphrase ofsome of the scriptures that have
come out.
Uh, semi-recently and, anytimethat, like in the Psalms, maybe
we hear it ha it kind ofdescribes God as like, with
(14:45):
wings, like wings that wraparound, or like covering of your
wings, that kind of language, ittranslates it as like God's
wrap-around presence.
Which I love just like that.
All encompassing, like, youknow, behind, before all around.
just coming around you in thosemoments.
I think it's such a powerfulimage that, and I mean, that's
(15:06):
like what's coming up there isjust, that is that loneliness
and.
Letting God meet us there firstis something that I've been
really trying to grow in becauseI feel like my instinct is to
like reach out to people or tryto change my circumstances.
you know, try to solve theproblem myself, which I think
those are not always terrible,you know, things to do.
(15:27):
Obviously.
I think many of them are good,but it's like allowing him to
meet.
My need for that first is suchlike a learning experience for
me.
Is that something that you havestruggled with or grown in or is
that something that comes morenaturally for you?
Like going to God with yourloneliness first, do you think.
Susie (15:45):
Oh, that has for sure.
Grown.
Yes.
I came up with this funny littlejingle for myself years ago.
To run to the throne instead ofthe phone.
Kimber (15:56):
Oh, that's good.
I'm going to remember that.
That's good.
Susie (16:00):
I think it's that.
I absolutely think.
Action is important.
So we need to reach out and.
Phone into our people, but, um,definitely.
Learning more and more to,Lehman to the arms of the great
I am, you know, the creator andsustainer.
Um, sorry.
So, yeah.
I've definitely grown in that.
Kimber (16:19):
I love that run to the throat instead of the phone.
That's good.
Susie (16:23):
Yeah.
Kimber (16:23):
You know, as I was talking to you also about coming
on the podcast, one thing thatyou brought up as significant
to.
Loneliness in your life that Ireally resonated.
Like that made sense to me wasyou were like, oh, I don't know
where this all started.
Like, you know, you talk aboutyour moment of kind of where you
had that gift of desperation.
(16:44):
You said, I like that.
But it's like, this is all comefrom somewhere, right?
Like, it's not like we wake upin.
Our twenties or thirties orforties whenever this happens,
which I think of those moments.
Um, any time throughout thereand, uh, repeatedly even.
But when we reached thosemoments where we're like, this
is not working or, you know, Ineed something here.
(17:04):
It didn't just like, Appear likethis is built up from something
and you were talking a littlebit about how.
Often our experience withloneliness.
It isn't just an isolated event.
Like these things are all linkedtogether and, you know, come
from lots of differentexperiences in our life, which
can often.
(17:25):
Date back really far into ourpast.
And, so I mean, in your life,what does this look like?
Like how do you think our pastloneliness can impact how we.
Experienced loneliness asadults, like as we're, you know,
maybe looking at, Hey, I need tolike, do some counseling.
Maybe you're like, I need towork on some healing here.
Talk to the Lord about it.
(17:46):
Like whatever combo that lookslike.
Where do you think we go to,like, do we start somewhere?
What has this looked like inyour life?
Kind of going back to your pastand reflecting here.
Susie (17:58):
Yeah, that.
Comes back, to something.
you know, I've done this, ofcourse in my own journey, but
when I.
Working with clients in the areaof loneliness.
It's helping them to see that wehave loneliness.
There's loneliness.
There's three ways we canexperience loneliness,
loneliness.
For cells.
(18:19):
For God and for others.
And.
I big gap in that usually.
And you kind of spoke with thata little bit is where we run to
others to like fill theloneliness.
Is that.
I find a lot of people and Iwent on this healing journey
myself, is that.
It's trying to fill thosewounded fragmented parts on the
(18:39):
inside somehow on the outside.
So if I marry the right man, IfI have children.
Aye.
You know, fill in the blank.
Um, Then.
Kimber (18:51):
Find the perfect best friend or yeah.
Yeah.
Susie (18:54):
perfect job that I love that then.
And I won't feel this acheinside.
And so for me, My healingjourney was coming home to
myself.
I often call it to me.
Home to my own heart
Kimber (19:11):
Hmm.
Susie (19:12):
I needed to go back.
And be able to look at and tellthe truth about.
The wounded parts of myself andmy own story.
And so that hearing.
You know, it's kinda like if youcover over.
He fall.
The bike for over a wound tooquickly without cleaning it out,
(19:32):
you could have gravel.
Kimber (19:35):
Yeah.
Infection.
Susie (19:38):
Yes.
And so it was going back andrealizing kind of like you said,
um, My reactions, my defenses,my coping mechanisms around
loneliness.
Has been there for a while andthey're there for a reason.
So.
part of my journey.
I was going back and looking andsomething that was very
formative.
(19:59):
Disconnection.
that created loneliness for me.
Um, or swelled loneliness madeit larger.
Was.
I grew up.
Very, um, My mom came from avery hard background.
Um, her.
Parents and.
Family lineage for refugees.
And so she, she kind of grew upin a scarcity mindset.
(20:21):
And a lot of poverty and.
That's a whole nother, we.
Nerd out on the counselingstuff.
And that X that we do believethat some of that stress can be
passed down for generations, butalso.
my mom went through a majortrauma right before I was born.
my brother who's 18 monthsolder, almost died of spinal
meningitis.
Kimber (20:40):
Hm.
Susie (20:41):
He was hospitalized on life support.
Uh, basically the week before Iwas born.
And.
So my mother, I was literallyborn.
I was based in her anxiety,anxiety, and.
For a world of anxiety.
And so.
The first four years of my life,I would really only let my
mother hold me or carry me.
(21:01):
I didn't talk till I was four.
Um, I was very attached to her.
And so.
Eventually it went tokindergarten, had the sweetest
kindergarten teacher, lovelywoman, and started to be a
little less shy.
Uh, start to have friends enjoyplaying on the playground.
Good things.
first and second grade, I movedschools had a new.
(21:24):
Best friend.
Uh, she's kind of the color.
The queen bee of the playground.
Um, she would be always the oneout there saying what we were
playing that day.
And, so it would be the queenbee and I was just happy to get
to be a part.
So I would do, I would be, Iplay whatever role she wanted me
to play.
The beginning of my third gradeyear.
So I've been friends with hertwo years rolling into a third
(21:46):
year, sometime at the beginningof that year.
I was tired of.
Pene boss and told what to do.
And so I just remember one dayon the playground telling her,
no, I don't want to play that.
I don't want to do that.
Kimber (22:01):
Yeah.
Susie (22:02):
She said, well, you'll do that and you'll play what I want
to play.
Or I'll make sure that no oneplays with you.
Kimber (22:09):
Oh, gosh.
Cool.
Oh,
Susie (22:13):
Sadly.
You would hope that one thirdgrade little girl wouldn't have
that kind of power, but.
Kimber (22:19):
Oh, but they do.
Yeah.
Susie (22:21):
And She did.
And so
Kimber (22:23):
Hm.
Susie (22:24):
Talk to the other kids.
And I remember them all on thisA-frame play thing.
Kind of mocking me and the otherkids honestly looked more afraid
standing behind her, but.
that rolled into a year of, mehaving lots of stomach aches,
being scared and not wanting togo out on recess and, you know,
my parents being like, you know,what's shifted and little Suzy.
(22:46):
I had a sweet teacher, so theteacher started letting me just
stay in at recess and be like ateacher's helper.
Um, so I would just not go torecess.
I would stay inside.
Um, and all that sounds well andgood.
But no one was really dealingwith the problem.
Kimber (23:03):
Right.
Right.
The actual thing that was goingon.
Yeah.
Susie (23:07):
And so.
a year.
That young in life.
Of not having any friends andbeing alone.
Really changes.
Mentally.
Kimber (23:18):
Yeah.
Susie (23:19):
Your peers and how you see yourself.
And so that year, um, I rememberreally, I think it really
started.
It marred.
I think of as being fearfullyand wonderfully made is like,
Susie as this beautiful mosaiccreated by God for his light to
shine through.
And that year it's like mud gotsmeared over that mosaic.
(23:41):
And I started wondering.
What is wrong with me?
You know, is there somethingdefective with me?
That other kids don't want toplay with me
Kimber (23:50):
Right.
Susie (23:50):
that.
My fault that I'm so lonely,what's wrong with me.
so it also put that in me thatlike, Feeling of toxic shame
inside of me that there wassome.
I've been wrong with me, butthen also on the outside of me,
it created a fear of my peersand like a hypervigilance.
you know, after that,
Kimber (24:09):
Because it wasn't just a random, like, girl, this was
someone that you had calledfriend.
Right.
Like, even though it sounds likemaybe she wasn't a great friend,
but for you.
You didn't know, like, yeah.
So there's, there's betrayalthere too, right?
Susie (24:22):
Yeah.
Yep.
Definitely.
Uh, betrayal when they're too.
yeah, so that was really, thatreally shifted how safe I felt
in the world.
And.
It's amazing how formative thatwas.
Um, And some actually very.
Hard ways developmentally andme.
That natural child's heart.
(24:42):
To go out and want to play.
And.
Be who they are.
I felt like I needed always tobe hyper aware of.
What was coming off of,especially girls.
Kimber (24:52):
Yeah.
Susie (24:53):
And another there's that one.
And then there was one moreformative right after that, that
really started shaping this evenmore.
So I'm in fifth grade.
So fourth grade, that girl wasin a different pod and didn't
have the same recess.
And so.
I had friends again, I had myfirst boyfriend, which is not
even a boyfriend in fourthgrade.
(25:14):
You pass them out
Kimber (25:16):
We know the kind yeah.
Susie (25:18):
And so forth.
It's kind of fun.
Fifth grade again, it's just a Cwent on and had different
friends.
It just didn't have as muchpower, but in first grade, There
was a day.
And the lunch room that therewas this.
Girl named Becky that she wasspecial needs.
probably similar to downsyndrome, but I don't think it
was actually down syndrome.
I don't know, but she was very,very sweet.
(25:40):
Sweet sweet girl.
And, sometimes I would sit closeto her at lunch and, two other
girls that it's funny in fifthgrade, thinking of popular girls
that.
They were pretty neat.
I had some of that gravitasaround them.
And.
Becky liked to eat a lot.
So she would ask for otherpeople's food at lunch and the
girls put some like dead fliesand a hamburger.
Kimber (26:01):
my gosh.
Susie (26:02):
And.
And it said, Hey, Becky, wehave.
Hamburger and I saw them dothis.
And so they handed it to her.
And this little Susie, I'm allof a sudden in a crisis because
I'm like, do I speak out?
Against the bullies and perhapshave the target news to me
again.
Kimber (26:22):
Right.
Susie (26:23):
Or do I keep silent?
And watch.
Something really cruel.
Kimber (26:28):
Yeah.
Susie (26:29):
So.
I couldn't like get burnedinside of me and I couldn't stay
quiet.
So I spoke up and I said, Becky,don't eat that.
Hamburger.
And she looked at me like I wasbetraying her, like, why
wouldn't I.
It's a gift.
Kimber (26:42):
cool.
Susie (26:42):
And I don't either.
You can have mine.
And she's like, why is this twogirls are glaring.
Glaring at me.
And I just say, Becky, they putsomething in your hamburger.
That's not okay.
Kimber (26:55):
Yeah.
Susie (26:55):
Here, take mine.
And.
At that point, those girlsstarted hating on me.
But the reason I bring thatstory up is your question kind
of started with like, Some ofthe roots of it and the
formation of it.
And that really shifted thingsin me of.
Feeling still some of theloneliness.
I did have some sweet friendsafter that.
(27:18):
But I kind of had this weird,odd relationship with some of
those girls.
Cause I just.
I would notice the kids beingbullied.
And would want to go and kind ofadvocate for them.
And so it created this kind of,fear of.
That continuing then fear thenof girls.
(27:38):
And what there.
Cannabis mean girls mentalityand.
Kimber (27:43):
Are there motives?
What are their motives?
Are they going to turn on me?
Yeah.
Susie (27:47):
Yeah.
So I, again, I grew thisdistrust that girls were safe
Kimber (27:53):
Right.
Susie (27:53):
I knew there were som, but I, I went forward with that.
So.
That was very formative for me.
And, Also, my, my mom was a lotmore introverted.
Didn't have a lot ofgirlfriends.
And so when I would come homechronic from school with those
various instances, a lot oftimes she would try to Sue me
and.
Be kind to be with me, but shewould, I had told her brothers
(28:17):
so on and so forth and she say,yeah, sometimes I think guys are
easier to be with.
They just like punch.
Over with girls can be pettyand.
Even though she was trying to beencouraging.
It created this.
I feel like lie.
That I carried with me, right.
The girls.
you can't really connect withgirls.
They're unsafe
Kimber (28:34):
Right.
Susie (28:36):
It took me years.
It took me into adulthood.
To finally.
do enough healing work.
It sounds funny, but it's like,I feel like if there's a
spiritual battle and evil wouldhave loved for that to stay.
Kimber (28:49):
Yeah.
Susie (28:50):
The message.
Long-term and keep me lonely
Kimber (28:53):
Because it keeps you isolated.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Susie (28:58):
so after lots of work, And healing journey for myself.
I remember.
A space where I'm like, Throughthe blood of Jesus Christ.
I revoked.
My name.
From that contract, you know,where I co-sign with evil
saying.
Kimber (29:12):
Yep.
I am undesirable.
Yeah.
Susie (29:16):
And I'm undesirable one.
You know, and, I started leaningin and that was a lot of my
healing journey is leaning inwith a beautiful mentor.
That's a beautiful woman.
Other courageous friends leaningin saying, no, there's a lot of
beautiful women in this world.
there's a lot of beautifulpeople and just leaning in and
(29:36):
saying, You know, hurt people,hurt people.
And so those that sometimes dothe heart, they have their own
stories of hurt, but there'slots of.
Other.
You know, wounded healers andother people that walk with
lamps, but are beautiful peopleto walk with.
And.
I feel much differently today.
I love women.
I love being a woman.
I love raising women.
Kimber (29:57):
Yeah.
Susie (29:58):
and I have a much different relationship with that
today than I use.
Kimber (30:04):
And what, like a gift of God to be able to like totally
restore that.
area of your life that was like,so formatively damaged.
Like I feel like when we've beenhurt, learning to trust again,
that just, it seems like so muchof my story is caught up in that
struggle is like, you know,cause my, most basic, like
(30:27):
subconscious says, if it's hurtyou before.
Stay way away from it.
You know, why would you, whywould you go back and try that
again?
And when that is.
That like.
Female relationships are notsafe.
Like holy cow, how do we recoverfrom that?
Like either we recover from thatby the grace of God or we, or we
(30:50):
stay lonely.
I feel like those are, those arethe only two ways.
He friend, forgive me for takinga real quick moment in this
conversation to ask a favor ofyou.
I hope my conversation withSusie is blessing you today.
(31:10):
And if so, would you take amoment to rate and review the
show on apple podcasts?
Reviews are huge in helping newfriends find the show.
And the bonus is I love reading.
What is blessing you from thepodcast?
You can find the link to leave areview in the description of
this episode.
So thanks so much for taking asecond to do that friends.
All right.
(31:30):
Now, back to the show.
What do you feel like where someof the, like most, important
ways that you started to movetowards healing there?
You mentioned like a mentor,like.
your own counseling journey,like what were, what are maybe
some first steps for some of ourfriends listening?
If they're really feeling this,they're like, yes.
(31:52):
Like relationships with womenfeel scary to me.
I don't feel like.
Vulnerability.
There is some, it feels like ahard ask.
what would you say could be likesome first steps for them or
where would you, direct them tostart?
Susie (32:06):
Such a great question.
Yeah.
I would just really encourage, Imean, first of all, which is so
hard.
When we're talking about.
Loneliness.
And some of those things thatmake it scary to reach out.
And one of the scariest thingsis reaching through that.
Kimber (32:21):
And that's what you have to do.
Yeah.
Yes.
Susie (32:24):
doing the opposite of what your insights.
Kimber (32:27):
Totally.
Susie (32:27):
so it's to the degree that they can moving out of
isolation.
Um, a lot of times.
You know, it can be a pastor.
It can be a friend somewhere.
You know, notice, notice thosepeople in your circles That
seemed to be those woundedwarriors.
Like you can tell that they'vehealed from things themselves
and you know what I mean?
(32:49):
There's a wholeness to them.
Move towards them.
Ask them out for coffee, take
Kimber (32:53):
Um,
Susie (32:54):
that would be
Kimber (32:54):
Lean into it.
Yeah.
Hm.
Susie (32:57):
Lean into it.
Another thing I would say.
And I do think, you know,counseling's beautiful.
Um, and a lot of people do italso because it's confidential.
So it feels.
Slightly less scary.
and so, for any who want toencourage that, it's just a
place to be known and it canfeel a little scary cause it's.
Accidental.
Kimber (33:17):
There's not going to be those relational risks.
Like there are, I feel like withjust like a friend.
Susie (33:23):
Yep.
Yep.
Yep.
So it can feel safer and then ofcourse it can help with that
healing journey.
Kimber (33:29):
Totally.
They have the tools.
Yeah.
Susie (33:31):
They can start giving you the tools to walk the road.
And then, I guess I said, noticethose women, but then I do
believe a lot of it is just.
Having the courage to try again.
To ask for coffee and.
The first three women say no.
To Kindle that desire inside ofyou.
To ask someone else again.
Kimber (33:53):
Yeah.
Susie (33:53):
But I do think a big thing for me.
I think it's really hard.
Cause you talked about therepetitive.
Like we can repeat them.
A site.
So I do believe that it's reallyimportant to understand.
A little bit about what is someof the woundings that created?
That loneliness Meredith.
And then what are the defensesthat I built up?
(34:17):
Around that.
because without curiosity, thatway.
I can't just reach through likemy system almost won't let me do
it.
Like, just reach through.
I have to be curious about thosedefenses.
So that they can start to heal.
And come down
Kimber (34:32):
Interesting.
Susie (34:33):
can give access to who I am.
So, especially for women whofeels scared that have had kind
of repeat patterns, I do reallyencourage.
Someone, whether it's acounselor or a mentor or whoever
it is that someone who's kind ofalready walked.
Kimber (34:50):
Right.
Susie (34:51):
Some of those bad lands to come back and walk through.
Those bad lands with them.
Um, cause it's hard to seeourselves.
Kimber (34:57):
Yes, that is so true.
That is so true.
It's like our blinders areexperiential blinders are just
like, and we don't even realizewhich what they are sometimes.
So it's like, how do youdismantle something without
realizing it's even a thing thatyou do?
Susie (35:12):
Exactly.
Yes.
Yes.
So it's hard to invite someoneinto that space, but I love how
you called it.
Blinders.
I think of the horses, the rightthat
Kimber (35:21):
Right.
That's what I'm thinking of.
Yes.
Yeah.
Susie (35:24):
And we have to have someone that gently with us that
we will trust to start to let usknow what's behind our blinders
so that we can start to heal.
Kimber (35:34):
Right.
I love that encouragement tolike notice the women around you
that you think might be equippedto help you with that because,
like sometimes I think we'reeither drawn to people.
That maybe aren't what we need.
And those kinds of moments.
or, you know, we're, we're justnot even looking for it.
(35:55):
But I think to intentionally,try to notice those people
around us that see, I love the,the like wounded warriors kind
of terminology or idea, like.
To be looking for that.
And I think we can even like askGod to show us, you know, like
someone who could walk with us,um, to help us walk through
these kind of.
past experiences because, ifwe're not sure, like, I think
(36:17):
we, you know, he says, If any ofyou lacks wisdom, like ask him.
And so I think we can.
We can ask him to show us thosepeople or bring that person to
our, into our life.
And then, I love also that it'slike, we don't have to, build
Rome in a day, whatever, like,we can start with one person
that.
we're trusting is safe and, youknow, we could be wrong.
Yes.
Like we don't have probablycertainty there, but that using
(36:40):
our best judgment feels safe.
We can start with just them and.
someday we may have richcommunity in our lives again,
but coming back from thosewounds, it doesn't have to be
instantaneous.
We can start small and just oneperson at a time.
I love that encouragement to us.
Susie.
Do you still feel lonely todaysometimes.
(37:02):
Do you think, or is thissomething that's gotten smaller
and smaller in your life?
What is that experience like inyour present day?
Look like for you.
Susie (37:09):
Hmm.
Well, absolutely.
Um, Like we never rise abovebeing human and.
Until heaven.
I'm going to live and walk in awounded world.
And so.
For sure.
I still experience.
Kimber (37:26):
How do you think despite that, cause I would agree.
Totally.
Like, how do you handle itdifferently today though, than
you think you did like 20 or 30years ago?
Like, what is kind of the shiftfor you?
Like, when you feel thoseloneliness, that those feelings
of loneliness crop up.
Um, how do you take that?
(37:46):
Differently today than maybe youthink you would have.
You know, 20 or 30 years ago.
Susie (37:51):
Mm, I love that.
for me, I always start with acuriosity within myself.
Asking myself, if the lonelinessI'm feeling.
Is a loneliness for myself,which to me is the need for
solitude.
Uh, I mean for a walk.
Doing our, you know, whatever itis.
But the thing Connects me tomyself.
whether I'm feeling lonely forGod.
(38:12):
And if so then maybe I need totake a walk with God or sit
quietly with him.
Spent some time in contemplativeprayer, you know, relaxing into
the goodness of God.
or am I lonely?
For someone else.
And if so, who.
And so just this week.
I was driving home from work andas I was driving.
(38:33):
I have a half an hour drive andI was like, man, I'm feeling the
ache of.
Kimber (38:37):
Um,
Susie (38:37):
And so I asked myself that question, Susie, who.
Or what are you lonely for?
And my heart.
Spoke back a girlfriend, likesome of my good heart
girlfriends.
And so one of them I knew Icouldn't get ahold of, I have
multiples out of state that aresweet women.
And so it was one specificfriend who was in Nebraska, out
(38:57):
of state that she's.
Really busy.
I can always get ahold of her,but I'm like, I'm going to try.
So.
Kimber (39:02):
Yeah.
Susie (39:03):
him.
And she, she picked up the phoneand started chuckling.
She's like perfect.
I was cleaning my house with myair by.
Kimber (39:12):
Hm.
Susie (39:13):
And we talked and we laughed and we shared hearts.
so I guess that's the bigdifference today is today.
I move.
As soon as I feel loneliness,they move with.
compassion and kindness towardsmy own farts asking.
What am I lonely for?
And then as soon as my heartlets me know.
The night.
moved towards that.
(39:35):
So if the need for solitude, I,you know, get my corgi mind and
take a walk.
And sometime with me, if Icreate space for that, and if
it's a friends or.
You know, someone else, I makemovement towards that.
And I know sometimes that's notspelled right.
Like sometimes the person can'tpick up the phone or.
(39:55):
But with that.
I just honor that desire.
And so I may put a reminder onmy phone and.
Ms back in the night.
Kimber (40:04):
Try again, right?
Yeah.
I love that heart of compassionfor yourself.
again, not like being like, oh,I'm lonely, terrible shame.
I wish I didn't feel this, butlike recognizing it as something
that's going to communicate aneed of our hearts and.
then asking that question of,okay, like, what am I lonely
for?
Like, it's not a bad thing tofeel this it's going to help me
(40:26):
know.
Um, what to move towards andthen taking that courageous
step.
I love that that's reallyhelpful.
man, Susie.
Well, thank you so much for justsharing.
both your is your wisdom thatyou have gained from your
personal experience and yourprofessional with us.
But, I just also loved hearingyour stories.
(40:46):
You have.
it seems like your brain worksin stories.
And I love hearing that.
So I, I thank you for, forsharing those with us today,
they were really encouraging tomeet, to hear.
And, uh, no that I'm not theonly one with, a bunch of stuff
in my life.
It's always so encouraging tohear.
Susie (41:02):
Absolutely.
Yeah.
Thanks.
For inviting me in timber.
Kimber (41:05):
Yes.
Yes.
that was good.
Well, Susie.
So, to wrap us up here, one ofmy main missions with the
podcast is, just to help, equipus to love our people better, to
like lean towards or, uh, Likelean into that, like you were
saying.
And, I think part of that isjust like being intentional
(41:25):
about learning how our friendsreceive love.
And so, you know, as we'relearning about our friends is
we're doing this introspectivework ourselves, like
communicating that to eachother, like what makes them feel
loved, seen, cared for how canwe reach to others in our lonely
moments?
And so.
I've been ending the podcast byasking my friends.
(41:46):
What, is that for you?
What makes you feel most loved,seen, cared for by your friends
lately?
Because I want to, I want tomodel this, in my own life and I
want to practice it to likeintentionally asking these kinds
of questions so that we can bepressing into this in practical
ways.
And I think that question isbeen helpful for me at least to
(42:08):
learn.
So, I'd be interested.
Interested in hearing for you?
Like what has made you feel mostloved, seen and cared for by
your friends lately?
Susie (42:16):
Hmm.
Love that question.
Got a beautiful question.
Kimber (42:20):
I can't take credit for it.
My, one of my good friends inour life group originally asked
it to our group and I was justlike, oh my gosh, I love that.
So good.
So I've been trying to ask morepeople at, so yeah.
What, what stands out for you?
Susie (42:32):
Hmm.
Uh, for me, I think it's myfriends who, um, You know, where
you, you just think of someonelike they're on your heart and
you reach out.
I think it's when my friends dothat.
like, it's neat to be celebratedon your, I don't know your
birthday or.
Remembered on a special event orsomething, but it's those
spontaneous acts of love.
(42:54):
that I think.
Make my heart just feel so muchjoy and kind of take my breath
away.
So.
it makes me think of, I hadthree surgeries this past year,
which is a whole nother story,but, um, one of my best friends,
Lives out of state and the daybefore my surgery.
This box came in the mail and Iopened the box and it literally
(43:17):
was decorated all with yellow.
And it said a box of sunshine.
Kimber (43:21):
Oh,
Susie (43:23):
At the dollar store.
All the fun, yellow things likea squishy.
Stress ball lemonade, like sillyninja.
Minion sticky notes, but.
And
Kimber (43:36):
love that a box of sunshine, so cool.
Susie (43:39):
Yeah.
I just felt so seen and loved bythat.
Um, So I think it's just thosespontaneous, you know, and it
can be more simple than that,right?
Like a friend's voice.
I'm just saying, I was thinkingof you today.
I love you so much.
Whatever.
So I guess those spontaneousacts of love.
Kimber (43:58):
I love that.
It's I think it's so common forus to.
Like we think of someone and wethink, oh, I was thinking, I'm
thinking of them, like whatever.
And then we just move on.
And so I love that.
Just inspiration to like act onit, to, make the move.
whether it's a text or somethingbigger.
I think getting in the habit ofacting on our thoughts, when
(44:19):
those friends come to mind, Ithink that's the holy spirit
bringing them to our hearts.
So.
I think that's a way we canpractice obedience to his voice.
So that's so cool.
Well, Susie, thank you so muchfor being here.
I loved hearing from me todayand, I just appreciate your,
your voice in my life and thatwe were able to get to hear,
hear from me today.
So thanks so much, friend.
Susie (44:38):
All right.
Thanks so much number.
Kimber (44:46):
Sisters.
I'm so glad you could join Susieand I this week on the, your
sister Kimber podcast.
Loneliness comes for us all attimes, but I love how Susie
taught us that lonelinessshouldn't necessarily be viewed
as something negative to avoid,but rather as a check engine
light to invite reflection,prayer, and then movement
(45:07):
towards something we need.
And as you're digging into someof these reflective questions,
what better place to do thatthen with a trusted friend?
My new digital resource mightjust be the tool to get you
started on this kind ofconversation.
Part of it is all about howyou're wired as an introvert
extrovert, internal or externalprocessor.
And whether you like to be morespontaneous or if you're a
(45:29):
planner like me, I hope thesequestions, which are just a few
out of 20 facts that you canlearn about your friends by
printing out this free PDF touse it, your next girls
gathering.
I hope it'll help you growcloser to each other and maybe
more aware of how you receivefriendship.
You can download it on mywebsite, which is linked in the
description of this episode.
(45:49):
And if you haven't yet joined mynewsletter crew, will you visit
your sister kimber.com right nowto subscribe?
When you subscribe, you get myweekly newsletters goes directly
to your email inbox each weekwith a preview of what will be
featured on the podcast thatweek.
Plus a link to this month's blogpost, and some other fun
resources and tips to help yougrow friendships that.
(46:10):
Honor God and draw closer toJesus.
I really hope it blesses you.
And I just want to say friends.
Thank you so much.
For being part of this communitywith me.
Until next time.
It's your sister Kimber.
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