June 28, 2023 • 36 mins
Kimber and series guest co-host Meghan Fravel talk about how practicing confession in the context of friendship can lead to growth and trust in your relationships.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Kimber (00:09):
Hey friends.
Welcome to the, your sisterKimber podcast.
My name is Kimberly Gilbert, andI'm so glad you're here.
All relationships are messybecause we all bring sin to the
table, even on our best days.
So it matters whether a closestpeople have a sober or soft view
of sin.
Not so that they can throw it inyour face, but so they can
(00:29):
recognize their own sin and begrieved by it because they
understand the cost that has toyour friendship.
One way we can invite this soberunderstanding of how sin impacts
our friendships into ourrelationships.
Is by practicing confession andrepentance openly, honestly, and
regularly with your closestcircle.
Today, our series guest co-hostMegan Freeville and I are
(00:52):
digging into what confession andrepentance can look like in a
friendship practically speaking.
And why integrating thesepractices into your friendships
just as you're working to growin them by the holy spirit, in
your walk with the Lord.
Can bless and deepen yourrelationships.
I wish we could talk about thisover coffee on a sunny back
porch today, but this is thenext best thing.
(01:13):
I'm so glad you're here, friend.
Let's get started.
Hey friends.
I am here with our summer seriesspecial guest co-host, which is
holy cow.
That's a.
Title.
If I've ever heard one.
Megan framer.
Meghan (01:31):
Hey,
Kimber (01:31):
Me to work on shortening that up a little bit, but.
It's good.
Communicates everything we need.
Meghan (01:38):
s.
Kimber (01:39):
Oh, yes.
Yes.
We'll work.
We'll workshop that.
But I'm so glad to hear Megan.
I've been loving ourconversation so far.
Uh, we got to camp togetherrecently.
And it was so fun.
Um, but I'm interested to knowwhat summer adventure you most
excited for coming up.
Meghan (02:00):
Oh, I am excited for dip netting.
I think I'm like super excited.
Um, So for those that don't knowwhat dip netting is, it's
Kimber (02:08):
Yes.
Meghan (02:09):
Way a salmon fish, um,
Kimber (02:12):
Yeah.
Meghan (02:13):
with a really big net.
um,
Kimber (02:15):
perfect.
Like it's like bigger than ahula hoop, but you stick it in
the side of
Meghan (02:20):
yes, you stand in the water and just hold it.
And this, wait for them to swimin.
Kimber (02:25):
It sounds so weird.
When you're not familiar withit.
Meghan (02:28):
Um, last year was the first year we were allowed to
dip net, so this is our second.
And we just had so much fun.
I know.
I just love it.
I'm just, Yeah.
So I'm excited for fishing.
We're almost there.
Kimber (02:38):
We loved it knitting too.
And I feel like there's justsomething about being in a big
group, out camping and then dev.
Nanny is such like an adventure.
Like sometimes it's great.
And sometimes it's terrible.
And I mean, anyone who fishesknows the gist of that, and, and
so, yeah, there's just somethingreally special about it.
(02:58):
I agree.
Meghan (02:58):
Yes, and We go with, you know, well you come, but we a
big group of us all go out.
And so we're all together andjust with like this common goal
of just slaying fish all day andthen we get to come back to the
campfire and it's always just,you know, a good time of last
year we did the tortillachallenge and it was awesome.
So we'll see what kind ofmischief we all get into.
Kimber (03:19):
I am sure it will be something if our friends
listening don't know what thetortilla challenges, three like
slap each other with tortillas.
On the phase, when you have amouthful of water and whoever
spews the water out first loses.
Meghan (03:33):
yes.
Were you a part of that lastyear?
We did Like a whole, uh, what doyou call it?
oh my gosh.
Bracket?
Yes.
Thank you.
The word, a whole bracket.
It was
Kimber (03:43):
I wasn't, I don't know where we were when that was all
happening.
Maybe we weren't there yet.
Cause we came down a little bitlater, but I've done it.
I've done it with staff and
Meghan (03:52):
Yes, that's
Kimber (03:52):
oh my goodness.
Turns out I have a high paintolerance.
Meghan (03:56):
You got slapped hard.
Kimber (03:58):
But so did the girl I was going against.
So we just were in like thisstandoff.
It's like this cold war.
Finally we gave up, I think.
Meghan (04:08):
That's awesome.
Yeah, it's So fun.
What about you?
Kimber (04:11):
Um, Yeah, I would probably say dip netting.
Um, although I'm, we're going ona trip, that maybe by the time
this airs, we will have already.
Been on.
I can't remember, but we'regoing to Valdez finally, which
again, friends who are not inAlaska, it's like six hours
away, but it's one of thoseplaces that we have.
Been like, we need to go, weneed to go.
(04:32):
We need to go.
And we just never have, and it'swhat I hear over and over is
like, it's the most beautifuldrive like that you'll ever
take.
Meghan (04:40):
That's on our list too, because we haven't gone yet.
And so I try, we're gonna try togo in June.
Um, that's what we've heard.
It's like the best drive ever.
If we end up getting a goodsummer, it'll be nice out.
We can hopefully yeah.
Kimber (04:52):
know, I'm really excited for that.
We're going with my parents, sothat'll be really
Meghan (04:56):
fun.
Oh, that's awesome.
Valdez.
Yes.
That's on the bucket list for ushere,
Kimber (05:00):
I love it.
Well, friends listening.
I hope you're loving your summerso far.
We're we're hoping that by thetime.
Yes.
By the time this airs that ithas turned into a warm and
wonderful summer, it's kind ofrainy.
Or not rainy, even just likecloudy and cold so far here in
Alaska, but we are fingerscrossed, praying hard for some
(05:22):
sun to come.
Meghan (05:23):
Please Lord,
Kimber (05:24):
we are a little ways into a series here on the
podcast called being the friendyou need that we're talking
about all summer.
And if you're just jumping intothis series, I would encourage
you to go back and listen to theintro episode.
It's called being the friend youneed it's episode 52.
Um, just for some context forthese conversations, because.
This series really is not abouttrying harder, um, or like
(05:48):
remembering things better, justlike being more thoughtful.
because I feel like there can besuch pressure when we're talking
about friendships to like, oh,be a better friend, like be the
friend you need.
But really what we're focusingon in this series is just this
idea that We're working out oursalvation through holy spirit
with Jesus.
Right.
And as we're doing that,whatever we're getting from him
(06:11):
and however we're growing withhim.
That is what's going to flow outinto our relationships and help
us grow in being that friendthat we know we need.
And so what we're reallyfocusing on here, I feel like is
how do the ways that I'm growingwith Jesus?
How can those bleed out into myfriendships and just being
intentional about looking forthose ways and when we find them
(06:34):
leaning into those, because Ithink sometimes we can just let
them pass us by just cause we'renot looking for those
opportunities.
So what has.
Been your favorite nugget orpart of what we've talked about
so far in these conversations,what has like been turning
around in your head most, sincewe started talking.
Meghan (06:52):
Ooh, that's a good one.
Wow, this has been such a greatconversation.
I think just I, I'd say that I'mpretty good at stepping out, and
initiating things, but I thinkeven more so of that, maybe even
more of where my heart is oncertain areas.
Has really been like somethingI've been mulling around of just
being more vulnerable in thoseof, of, of letting people in
(07:16):
maybe my closest circle in alittle bit more into maybe where
some of the areas I'm strugglingwith the most that I haven't
like maybe fully let everybodyinto yet.
Um, and so I've been just kindof trying to be a little bit,
more intentional about.
Kind of with the conversationsteer that way, or even steering
a conversation that way of justbeing like, Hey, I just need to
share this a little bit.
(07:37):
And, um, so that bravery of, ofthat has been a good, um, been
really good for
Kimber (07:42):
I love that idea of steering the conversation
because it's easy to not steer.
Uh, conversation.
Right.
And just let it like gowherever.
and I think for me, what it is,is it's like paying attention to
those moments when I have theopportunity to steer the
conversation.
Cause I think I can get justtarget locked on like.
You know, What's the plan?
Or like, whatever we're doing.
And I, I forget thoseopportunities exist.
(08:06):
Um, and so just like even payingattention to when those
opportunities come up and then Ilove that piece too, of like
having the bravery to then.
Say the thing that steers thedirection.
And so good.
Well today, we're, we're havingkind of one of these harder
conversations.
Yeah.
And.
This is something that I've beenexcited to talk about, because I
(08:26):
feel like it is something thatwas not a part of my friendship
conversations until, uh, maybethe last like.
Five years or so if that, andthis is just this idea of like
confession, repentance beinggrieved by sin that we see in
our relationship.
And just even growing in ourrelationship with God and how we
(08:48):
view our sin as serious and aslike weighty.
And so this is something thatI've been working through in
just my relationship with theLord and like how I both see my
sin as.
Sirius and wadey in light of, ofcourse the like overwhelming
(09:08):
grace of God, right?
Like how those things.
Relate to each other.
And in the realm of friendship,I feel like it's easy to not
focus on.
How our sin affects ourrelationships just with people
around us.
Like, we don't want to talkabout that.
We don't want to think aboutthat.
You know?
And I, and I do love like agrowth mindset, you know, like
(09:28):
how can we do better?
How can we love well, like thatkind of thing.
But.
I think that we can't, we're notgoing to take that journey
seriously.
Unless we are actually allowingourselves to be grieved by our
sin.
And we recognize that sin doesbreak relationships.
And even if your friendship islike, okay, still, it doesn't
(09:48):
mean that it's not effected byour sin.
And so that to me is just such asobering reminder that there has
to be room for confession andrepentance in.
Our relationships with our, withour friends.
And I don't think that'ssomething we talk about a ton.
Have you.
Where are you at on this, thiskind of subject?
Where have you seen this?
Come up?
Meghan (10:09):
Um, Yeah.
I think I would be the same asyou.
That it wasn't, um, somethingthat I talked about.
It was always like the goodthings, like, oh, God's teaching
me this, and it's all this,like, you know, great things,
but not going into.
The kind of the darker, youknow, the darker side of my sin.
Um, Yeah.
But now that, that's, that'sbeen something that, in our
small group we're we talk, dolike a confession and sometimes
(10:34):
and talk about where we're at.
And then with our, my closefriends of this is where I'm
struggling, Um, I try to be alittle more of like, I know I'll
be like, this isn't gonna soundlike.
Not like Jesus Right.
now, and here's where you needto put me back on.
Like, this is just the raw truthof where my heart is and I know
this isn't where I wanna be.
Um, and then allowing them tokind of speak into that and help
(10:54):
direct me back, um, and startingthat confession.
But, growth requires a death andthat death is our sin.
And so we can't move forward.
Even our, even in ourconversations of this is where
God is, teaching me somethingRight.
now.
Maybe it's.
Patience.
Okay.
But there's still a growth, a, adeath of my impatience that
needs to happen.
And so going to that of like,this is where I'm, you know,
(11:18):
being impatient in my life andconfessing that to God and maybe
even to others, becausehonestly, maybe it comes out in
your friendship.
This is where I'm struggling inmy sin and this is where I now
need to go.
But we can't grow unlesssomething dies and that death
Kimber (11:32):
Hm.
I love that perspective becauseyou're right.
That it's like, it's hard toconfess those things and to talk
about it.
And I love that practice thatyou're developing in small group
because man, if you don't have aplace to practice that it's
definitely never going tohappen.
I mean, confession is awkward.
(11:53):
It's hard.
Like it's hard.
I think in our prayer life, likeprivately.
And it's for sure hard when it'slike in-person across from
someone, I think, especially in,um, I wonder if this is easier
ever for someone who has kind ofa background of a more.
Um, maybe like Catholic based orlike more liturgical background
(12:14):
that maybe practices confessionmore as part of their faith
tradition.
Um, or at least more formally aspart of their faith tradition.
But for me, man, it just, itfeels so hard every time it
comes up.
In conversation with friends,one thing, um, with that small
group that, um, kind of setting.
That has been helpful.
I think with this idea is, um,we were doing.
(12:38):
Uh, it was like this girl'snight that one of my friends did
for us in our small group.
And one of the questions waswhat is one thing that you are
experiencing right now that weshould know about?
Meghan (12:50):
Oh, that's a good question.
Kimber (12:52):
Is a really good question and I've hijacked it a
lot
Meghan (12:55):
I was like, I'm gonna write that down.
Kimber (12:56):
You should write it down right now.
What is the one thing thatyou're experiencing right now
that we should know about?
And a couple of things I loveabout that question that I think
can provide opportunity forconfession.
One it's experiencing, not justsomething that's going on.
Like, I feel like if you'reexperiencing it, that could be
like A temptation or a sinstruggle like that is a prime
(13:20):
opportunity for something likethat to come up.
Um, or it could be somethinglighter.
Like I'm experiencing a lot ofjoy in hiking, like, you know,
whatever, but.
Um, it gives the opportunity foryou to go that route, if you
need to confess something or notto, if you don't want to go
there.
Um, and then the idea of like,that we should know about kind
(13:43):
of is the same thing where it'slike, I'm accountable to these
people.
Like my sin doesn't only affectme.
It affects my relationships,especially those closest
relationships to me.
And so it's just that idea oflike, I'm accountable to some
people in my life because Idon't live in a vacuum or in a
bubble.
(14:04):
Um, and so I think that questionhas been helpful in our small
group, at least, and if you knowour friends listening, if you're
looking for a way to like,Invite this confession kind of
practice into, a small groupsetting or into a relationship.
I think that can be a greatquestion
Meghan (14:20):
Yeah, that's a really great question.
Yeah.
And even, um, you know, I workat our church and we just did
integrity checks and it wassome, you know, the questions
were Yes.
And I will, like, are you livingwith sexual integrity?
Yes.
Or I am.
And it's not to be like thisshame, not to bring shame, but
how can we like.
How can we come alongside you tohelp you if this is an area that
(14:43):
you're struggling with, and notthat you need to do integrity
checks necessarily with.
your friend, this big, like,formal thing, but like where
Yeah.
What are you experiencing Right.
now?
Like asking those kind ofpointed questions.
Um, yeah.
It's hard.
It's, it doesn't feel good.
It's definitely one that for methat I'm like, Ooh, that's never
easy.
Kimber (15:02):
Yeah.
cause it's like, I think it'sjust a little bit counter
intuitive to the like culturalway that I think we're taught to
approach friendship, I think isvery.
Um, Like lacks accountability,because I think it's very,
self-centered, you know, it'slike when we're talking about
our Christian friendships,especially our closest ones in,
(15:23):
even just the context of thechurch, it's like the body of
Christ is all connected.
So like, you know, if you.
Chop off your toe, like yourwhole body feels that.
Right.
And even though it's like, faraway from it, You feel that all
over.
And so I feel like we maybeunderstand that in the context
(15:44):
of the church, Like maybeintellectually, but I don't
think we always allow that tothen.
Pervade like our friendships,which artists, a microcosm of
that, right?
Like your small group or, youknow, your closest Christian
friends who you're.
You know, sharing like Biblestudy with, or that you pray
with.
Like those also have to be thepeople that we are accountable
(16:06):
with.
I think not maybe everyone thatyou do those other practices
with, but at least someonebecause otherwise we're acting
like.
that part of our spiritualityisn't connected to the rest of
the body.
And it is like, I just don'tthink there's any way around it.
Do you see it that way too, asinterconnected?
Um, how do you think that.
(16:27):
Impacts the idea of needing topractice confession in our
friendships.
Meghan (16:32):
Well, I think it's almost just how we're talking
about the other episodes of wecan't help but share out of the
overflow of what we consume, andthat's kind of with our sin.
I mean, you might not think it'saffecting anybody but it, it is,
like you said, like you can'tcut off your toe and your whole
body not, not feel it.
Now, of course we can have Awhole big conversation of
(16:52):
Simpsons are more, Outwardlyeffective and maybe some of your
inner things.
Sure.
But eventually That's all gonnaseep out.
And yeah.
So I think that there's reallyno way around it.
And it's, I know for me, sharingthat is hard.
Like, it, it makes me feel veryvulnerable.
And where I start, where theenemy starts to speak into my
mind is if you share where yourheart is, where you're
(17:14):
struggling, people are gonnaleave and walk away and, you
know, and so, yeah.
And so for me it's really.
I know that's the enemy one tokeep me in darkness.
and you might have a totallydifferent lie that the enemy's
thrown at you with why you maybedon't want to share that, but
like, that's not from God.
Cuz God wants us to go into thelight and that is confession and
(17:34):
that is speaking out that hardthing.
And yeah, truth is they mightwalk away.
They might be like, whoa, too.
much.
but what if they don't?
And what if they come close andthen they get to share where
they're at, and then you get topoint each other back to Christ
and work, work through it, youknow, together.
And so, Yeah.
It is, I feel like it's, it's apart of friendship.
Our culture is very much like,you're amazing.
(17:55):
You're doing great.
keep going.
You know, instead of, Yeah.
Sometimes you're not in this,you know, and And so it's hard.
Kimber (18:03):
And I feel like it's a good thing to remember then is
the boundary context of wherethis happens because.
Like you said there, thecultural way to navigate
friendship is just, is either byjust straight encouraging.
Like you're amazing.
Just like affirmation,affirmation, affirmation, which
is great.
(18:23):
We should affirm each other.
That's so important.
But the cultural way is to sayoh, when you're not crushing it,
when I'm not going to affirmyou.
Then I leave.
Like I drop you if you're notserving me essentially, or like
meeting my needs.
And there's a definite happymedium there.
(18:46):
Like there's, there's a sweetspot, right?
Like on either end of theextreme, we don't need to just
like, Affirm each otherconstantly, especially when
there's something that like,you've talked about it before,
like a way that a friend seesthat we could really use some
room for growth and they try tobe loving and how they bring
that to us.
But then also that side of like,where does that fear of
rejection come from?
(19:07):
Well, it probably comes from thefact that sometimes that's what
people do.
Like sometimes people just dropyou, you know?
And if they find out somethingor if you share something that
doesn't feel like it meets theirnarrative.
And so.
Um, within.
Like Christian relationshipsthough, we have a middle ground
where it's like, we can infer,affirm and encourage.
(19:28):
Right.
But we can also, rebuke and,encourage confession and like
walk with people through that.
Because I think it's a matter ofsource it's like, because
community is coming as a sourcefrom the Lord, not from just are
my needs being met.
That's why we can sit insometimes that not happy medium,
but that uncomfortable middlewith our people.
(19:50):
And so the reality is that wedon't sit in that.
Safe space.
everyone.
Right.
Like, you know, if we try tobring confession into our small
group or something and you know,someone doesn't receive it well
like that, that is a risk thatwe take.
And so how do you feel like wenavigate knowing what the
(20:12):
boundaries are for when we sharethis kind of thing or when we
invite confession?
Um, how can we go about justlike, okay.
If I, if I know that this issomething that is important to
my deepest, closest friendships.
how do I know which ones thatapplies to where I should share
this?
What the context is?
Meghan (20:30):
Yeah.
Well, I think the first thing todo is to talk to God about it
and pray about who it is thatyou need to maybe, open up and
share with, because maybe itdoesn't need to be, Three or
closest friends, maybe this isonly something that you feel
like one person needs.
So praying about it, and I, Ireally do feel like God's gonna
put that person on your heart oflike, this is who I need to open
up to, um, about it.
(20:51):
And then, and then maybe callinghim or meeting up with them and
saying, Hey, I got, I gottashare something with you That's
just really heavy on my heart.
Do you think we could gettogether and, and to talk about
it?
And, um, And I think that That'sgonna be the way to start it, is
prayer and, and asking God andconfessing to God first too.
Um, and this might be on theflip side, where maybe you're
(21:14):
seeing something in somebodythat you feel like maybe you
need to speak into.
Again, I'd say pray about it andthen like, Hey, you know,
there's something I wanna talkto you about and get that.
conversation going.
the thing is that we're, we'reall sinners.
Not one of us is.
Is sitting in the, the seat ofvictory in this yet.
Um, and so that reminder of weare all on a level playing field
(21:37):
here and we all need God's graceand I wanna be able to extend
grace just as much as I wantpeople to give it to me.
And there's a, there was a quotethat I love that.
it's like this Puritan pastor,he, I wrote it down cuz I loved
it.
And it said, till sin be bitter,Christ will not be sweet.
And so there is this like levelof this sin.
(21:58):
It has gotta me, it has gottabreak me in a way of, a grief in
a morning, of breaking God'sheart of what it, maybe it's
affected in my life and others'lives.
And then when that happens, whenthere's that breaking, like
that's a good thing is, but, andnot in a shame based of like,
I'm worthless, but now Christ,that grace can just get poured
(22:19):
into me.
And then that chasm, that ofspace that we have with God is
now just been bridged becausehis death on the cross took that
away in that moment.
And so, but it has to, it has tobreak us, I think, first.
Kimber (22:34):
Yeah, because, I mean, that's the idea that.
friends listening may or may nothave heard of, but this idea of
like cheap grace, you know, thatif like, if we haven't been, I
think the other phrase that getsthrown out is like he who has
been forgiven much, like lovesmuch, you know?
And it's this idea of like, ifwe haven't been forgiven of
much, because we think that.
(22:54):
we're pretty great.
Like we got it all together.
then her view of God's grace isjust so, I think.
And so it's, yeah, it's not outof shame, but it's out of just
like, it expands your view ofhow kind and good God is.
And I think the same can applyin our friendships because if,
if we think like, oh, I'm apretty good friend.
(23:16):
Like, I mean, we might be apretty good friend.
That's true.
And it's not like we need to bedown on ourselves.
Like, oh, I'm terrible.
I'm the worst, you know, that's,not what I'm saying here, but.
rather just a sober view of mysin does impact my friendships.
it breaks relationships aroundme.
Like when I am selfishlymotivated in my friendships
(23:37):
that.
Cracks our relationship.
When I say unkind things, evenif like, oh, I meant it jokingly
or what, like that breaks myrelationships.
And if I act like it, doesn't.
Then it's just going to keepfracturing.
Right.
Whereas if I have a sober viewof how my sin impacts my
relationships, Then I have anopportunity to confess that,
(24:01):
which deepens your friendships.
And repent as in trying to dobetter by the power of the holy
spirit walk closer and closer toChrist.
And so I feel like it's, it'sjust that, like you're saying
that awareness of the chasm,because the chasm exists either
way.
It's just whether or not.
We acknowledge
Meghan (24:20):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yep, yep.
And it's not even just ouroutward maybe sin that we have
a, we are gonna sin against eachother too, like, being able to
go to your friend and confess, Iprobably hurt you, or I need to
apologize for this, or viceversa, is so important because
we are, we're gonna hurt eachother's feelings.
(24:40):
We're gonna say the wrong thing,we're gonna do the wrong thing.
That's just life with a bunch ofsinners.
we're gonna, we're gonna, like,it's gonna happen.
And then I know I alwaysreference Jenny Allen, but
sorry, but she says, um, youknow, she's awesome.
Sorry.
Um, but she says, you know, I, Iwill disappoint you.
You will disappoint me, but Godwill never disappoint us.
(25:01):
And that's such a good reminderof, again, like that triangle of
there's gonna be times where I'mgonna disappoint you.
That's just inevitable.
You're gonna disappoint me.
But when we have God as a centerof our friendship, that's where
we get to confess and repent andreally deepens our friendship
when we can go to one anotherand our brokenness and be like,
I messed up and I was wrong.
(25:22):
Um, and will you forgive me?
And that's pretty much all yougotta say, you know, is just to
do that.
Kimber (25:28):
Yeah, because it's, again, that like restoration
because at least I know for me,sometimes I'm unaware of it.
Um, And that's an opportunity tolike, receive.
You know, rebuke from a friendand I in a good way, which is,
which is really hard.
But sometimes I am aware of itand I'm like, Ooh, I said that
(25:49):
and I hope she didn't take thatwrong or whatever.
You know, I say to myself, and alot of times I will just not say
anything and I'll stew on that.
And, you know, worry, wonder ifit hurt her feelings, whatever.
but man confession doesn't bringa wider gap to our friendships.
I don't think, I think it,builds that bridge.
Like you're saying it bringsrestoration because it just, it
(26:13):
like when you received that froma friend, at least in my
experience, it doesn't make melike, think they're terrible.
I already was aware of it.
it it was hurtful, right?
Like.
I think we're seeing sometimesif we confess something that
then suddenly someone's aware ofit, but, and I guess with
personal sin, they might nothave been aware of it, but if
it's like relational, They'reprobably very well aware of it.
(26:36):
And so it's just going to bringrestoration.
I don't think it's going to harmthe relationship.
Like we
Meghan (26:42):
no.
Kimber (26:42):
think it might.
Meghan (26:43):
Yes.
No, I think that it's such atangible picture of what Christ
has done for us.
When we get to practice thatwithin community of restoration,
of repentance and confession, itreally is that way that we get
to see what Christ did for us tobe able to give that to somebody
else and vice versa.
That I get to experience gracethe way God's given me grace
(27:05):
over and over and over again tobe able to do that for a friend
to receive that.
Grace when I've messed up.
And to give it when they need ittoo.
Yeah.
there's just, that does bringabout such a friendship,
intimacy.
Um, I know that some of myclosest friends are the ones
that we've had, we've had issue,we've had things we've had to
work through, but it's broughtus closer to God.
It's brought us closer to eachother because we've worked
(27:26):
through
Kimber (27:27):
Yeah.
Meghan (27:27):
things.
Kimber (27:28):
Yeah.
The other thing that I feel likeconfession can do, is it like,
just makes me more aware of mytendencies to sin in my
friendships.
Like.
I think of this one situationwhere I said something to a
friend that was, um, just out ofsome bitterness that really
didn't have much to do with her.
And I kind of realized thatafter the fact.
(27:49):
And so I ended up texting herlike, Hey, I think I said that
out of a lot of bitterness, thatwas not directed at you.
I'm sorry I responded that wayor something like that.
And now, like, I think I'm awareof that.
Tendency and so I can guardagainst it.
And so I think that's the otherthing about confession is the
speaking out of sin is sopowerful.
(28:11):
even if we know it in our head,there's something about speaking
it out that not only bringsfreedom, I think to us, but can
also bring awareness of atendency in our lives.
To sin in a certain way, andwhich can then invite us to
Meghan (28:24):
Mm-hmm.
Kimber (28:25):
against that.
Meghan (28:26):
And maybe sometimes like, you know, like you said,
like you said something out of.
That wasn't directed at her, butit was coming outta that deeper
route of, I had some bitternessturning and again, like it's
gonna come out somehow and ourfriends, our family are going to
get some of that.
And even though it wasn't like apersonal thing towards her,
again, it's going like, Ooh,Yeah.
(28:47):
I actually, there's, I've gotsomething happening that had
nothing to do with you and Itook it out on you and I'm so
sorry, but I've got somebitterness like.
Of a different, you know, and sothat can be even a good, when
those things happen of like,what's actually happening here,
here in my heart, that, youknow, it's like that whole like
anger.
Anger is a secondary emotion.
So what is that, what'shappening underneath here?
(29:10):
That's really the, the sin,like, yes.
Angry, you know?
Anyway, so,
Kimber (29:14):
Yeah, I totally get that.
Meghan (29:15):
at that.
Kimber (29:16):
It makes me think of how like marriage always gets talked
about as like a crucible, right?
Like, you know, within marriage,you.
Realize.
Some sin in your life.
Like, you know, it, it's aprocess that can guide us to
holiness if we allow it to.
And I think that's true for allclose relationships in our
(29:38):
lives, you know, and like, Ourfriendships.
Aren't going to accomplish thatin the same way that a marriage
relationship does.
But especially when we'retalking about like our closest
people, it's an opportunity tobe made more holy through the
like, Rubbing up of your sinagainst each other, you know,
because when that happens, then.
You have the opportunity to seeit more clearly?
(30:01):
I think.
And so I think it really canlike eliminate some areas like
you're saying of, oh, I was notaware of this issue, but because
I was being honest in myfriendship, you know, and I, I
was reflecting on it orwhatever.
I have been made aware.
Of this, this way that the Lordwants to grow me.
Meghan (30:19):
Yeah, absolutely.
Kimber (30:21):
Um, well, let's kind of wrap up with your challenge,
Megan.
Um, this series friendslistening, we have then ending
with a challenge just to helptake the stuff we're talking
about and turn it into practicalaction.
In our lives with the people inyour life, because one thing to
talk to like, or not talk to,but hear me and Megan talk about
this.
And, we hope that you're noddingalong as you're listening in
(30:43):
your car while you're doingdishes or whatever.
but I feel like the process isincomplete unless you take those
conversations to your closefriends, to your circles, to
your hikes or coffee dates orwherever and make these real in
your life.
And so Megan's challenges havebeen just so way to help us do
that.
So what do you think in, inregard to like confession,
(31:06):
repentance?
Just being grieved by sin thatwe see happening in our
friendships.
Meghan (31:11):
So, um, it's gonna be kind of going back to the first
episode and then bringing intothis, but the first one is to
Process with God first of.
Maybe if there's something likewhen you're listening to this
podcast that's kind of stirredin your heart of like, A sin or
something that you're strugglingwith that you feel like it needs
to be brought out.
Like bring that to God first.
Practice that, and then bepraying about who you can take
(31:34):
that to and take It to somebody.
So the challenge this week is,after you've, you've prayed in
process with God, bring somebodyinto this and it could be like,
Hey friend, I really need totalk to you about something.
Shoot a text.
Can we.
Meet up this week.
It could be a phone call if it'syou know, someone that maybe
doesn't live in your town, butbring somebody into that and ask
(31:55):
them to like, pray with you andto repent of that and how they
can point you closer to Christthrough that.
And, you know, that's a reallybig challenge.
it's it's a heavy one.
Kimber (32:05):
it's a hard thing,
Meghan (32:06):
it's a very hard thing, but, um, I promise you that.
The hardest part is gonna bejust taking that breath and that
first word.
Just, just keep plowing throughit and do it, um, and know that
what's gonna come out of that isso sweet and so precious.
It's gonna bring you closer toChrist.
It's gonna bring you closer toyour friend.
(32:27):
and yeah, beautiful things aregonna grow out of just that,
that death that you're puttingaway.
Kimber (32:32):
Hm, because the truth is that like the enemy doesn't want
us to.
Confess in our friendshipsbecause he knows that it brings
us deeper.
He knows that through Jesus, wehave freedom when we confess and
receive his grace.
Meghan (32:45):
And I know when you're praying, when you're doing this,
like the enemy, the last thinghe wants you to do is speak into
this and speak it out tosomebody.
And so just know that that'swhat's gonna happen and know
what the lies of the enemy arelike.
God doesn't want you to keep itin the dark.
He doesn't want you to feelshame.
He doesn't want you to feelfear.
Um, so when those lies come knowthat that is a lie that's not
(33:06):
from Christ.
Christ wants you to bring it outinto the light and know that
there's grace waiting for you.
There's peace and so when that'shappening, like just rebuke the
enemy in that moment like thatis not from God.
Kimber (33:18):
Um, I love that.
And I love that you started thischallenge too, with the reminder
to take it to God first and prayabout who is this person that I
can bring this to, because Ithink so often that voice, like
you were saying of like, oh, isthis person I'm going to receive
this well is really loud.
but I think that it can, like ifwe take it to the Lord first,
that is an opportunity for himto say like kind of point us to
(33:41):
who this could be in our lives.
If we're not sure in some peoplelistening, they probably know.
Know who their people are.
And.
who they're, they would go towith this kind of thing.
And it's more of a, okay, do Ihave the courage to actually say
it?
Um, and some people you may belike, I don't know who this
would be for me.
And so if that's you, I thinkthat starting with prayer is
such a good reminder
Meghan (34:03):
Yes.
Yes.
Yeah.
He'll bring something to someoneto mind for you.
Kimber (34:07):
Yeah.
I love that.
Well, Megan, thanks so much fortalking with me today,
especially about a toughsubject, but one that I think is
it's so good.
Because again, if we're, ifwe're not thinking about it,
we're definitely not probablypracticing it.
So I love that we got somechance to think and talk about
it today so that we can startputting this into action.
Meghan (34:28):
Yeah.
This was so good.
Thank you.
Kimber (34:29):
Awesome.
Well, we'll talk to you later.
Friends, go be the friend youneed.
Bye.
Friends.
I'm so glad you could join meand Megan on the show this week.
It's never fun to confess in,let alone to friends, but I
really believe this is apractice that will deepen your
relationships.
(34:50):
Like no other.
We think confessing sin willbreak relationships.
But the truth is that our sin isalready breaking the
relationship.
And when we acknowledge it,we've made the first move toward
repenting and pursuing growthand restoration.
It's hurting us either way, butwhen we get it exposed to the
light of the Lord's healing, wewill share a new kind of depth
in that relationship because ofthat honesty.
(35:12):
If you're loving this series sofar, would you tell a friend
about the podcast this week?
Just shoot her a DM with a postfrom social or texts her an
episode link and.
I ask if she listen so that youguys can talk about it the next
time you hang out.
This is a great way to jumpstartthese conversations.
We're praying the series sparksin your friendships this summer,
as you're out doing all thatsummer fun.
(35:32):
I pray, many fruitful, hearthearts, accompany your hikes and
lake days and campfires.
And speaking of, I know how busysummer can get some, make sure
that you subscribe to thepodcast wherever you listen, so
that you don't miss an episode.
You can also sign up to be partof my newsletter crew so that
you get a weekly previewdirectly to your email inbox of
what will be on the podcast thatweek.
(35:52):
Just visit your sisterkimber.com and subscribe there.
Friends.
Thank you so much for spendingpart of your day with us until
next time.
It's your sister Kimber.
Hey friends.
Welcome to the, your sisterKimber podcast.
My name is Kimberly Gilbert, andI'm so glad you're here.
All relationships are messybecause we all bring sin to the
table, even on our best days.
So it matters whether a closestpeople have a sober or soft view
of sin.
Not so that they can throw it inyour face, but so they can
(00:29):
recognize their own sin and begrieved by it because they
understand the cost that has toyour friendship.
One way we can invite this soberunderstanding of how sin impacts
our friendships into ourrelationships.
Is by practicing confession andrepentance openly, honestly, and
regularly with your closestcircle.
Today, our series guest co-hostMegan Freeville and I are
(00:52):
digging into what confession andrepentance can look like in a
friendship practically speaking.
And why integrating thesepractices into your friendships
just as you're working to growin them by the holy spirit, in
your walk with the Lord.
Can bless and deepen yourrelationships.
I wish we could talk about thisover coffee on a sunny back
porch today, but this is thenext best thing.
(01:13):
I'm so glad you're here, friend.
Let's get started.
Hey friends.
I am here with our summer seriesspecial guest co-host, which is
holy cow.
That's a.
Title.
If I've ever heard one.
Megan framer.
Meghan (01:31):
Hey,
Kimber (01:31):
Me to work on shortening that up a little bit, but.
It's good.
Communicates everything we need.
Meghan (01:38):
s.
Kimber (01:39):
Oh, yes.
Yes.
We'll work.
We'll workshop that.
But I'm so glad to hear Megan.
I've been loving ourconversation so far.
Uh, we got to camp togetherrecently.
And it was so fun.
Um, but I'm interested to knowwhat summer adventure you most
excited for coming up.
Meghan (02:00):
Oh, I am excited for dip netting.
I think I'm like super excited.
Um, So for those that don't knowwhat dip netting is, it's
Kimber (02:08):
Yes.
Meghan (02:09):
Way a salmon fish, um,
Kimber (02:12):
Yeah.
Meghan (02:13):
with a really big net.
um,
Kimber (02:15):
perfect.
Like it's like bigger than ahula hoop, but you stick it in
the side of
Meghan (02:20):
yes, you stand in the water and just hold it.
And this, wait for them to swimin.
Kimber (02:25):
It sounds so weird.
When you're not familiar withit.
Meghan (02:28):
Um, last year was the first year we were allowed to
dip net, so this is our second.
And we just had so much fun.
I know.
I just love it.
I'm just, Yeah.
So I'm excited for fishing.
We're almost there.
Kimber (02:38):
We loved it knitting too.
And I feel like there's justsomething about being in a big
group, out camping and then dev.
Nanny is such like an adventure.
Like sometimes it's great.
And sometimes it's terrible.
And I mean, anyone who fishesknows the gist of that, and, and
so, yeah, there's just somethingreally special about it.
(02:58):
I agree.
Meghan (02:58):
Yes, and We go with, you know, well you come, but we a
big group of us all go out.
And so we're all together andjust with like this common goal
of just slaying fish all day andthen we get to come back to the
campfire and it's always just,you know, a good time of last
year we did the tortillachallenge and it was awesome.
So we'll see what kind ofmischief we all get into.
Kimber (03:19):
I am sure it will be something if our friends
listening don't know what thetortilla challenges, three like
slap each other with tortillas.
On the phase, when you have amouthful of water and whoever
spews the water out first loses.
Meghan (03:33):
yes.
Were you a part of that lastyear?
We did Like a whole, uh, what doyou call it?
oh my gosh.
Bracket?
Yes.
Thank you.
The word, a whole bracket.
It was
Kimber (03:43):
I wasn't, I don't know where we were when that was all
happening.
Maybe we weren't there yet.
Cause we came down a little bitlater, but I've done it.
I've done it with staff and
Meghan (03:52):
Yes, that's
Kimber (03:52):
oh my goodness.
Turns out I have a high paintolerance.
Meghan (03:56):
You got slapped hard.
Kimber (03:58):
But so did the girl I was going against.
So we just were in like thisstandoff.
It's like this cold war.
Finally we gave up, I think.
Meghan (04:08):
That's awesome.
Yeah, it's So fun.
What about you?
Kimber (04:11):
Um, Yeah, I would probably say dip netting.
Um, although I'm, we're going ona trip, that maybe by the time
this airs, we will have already.
Been on.
I can't remember, but we'regoing to Valdez finally, which
again, friends who are not inAlaska, it's like six hours
away, but it's one of thoseplaces that we have.
Been like, we need to go, weneed to go.
(04:32):
We need to go.
And we just never have, and it'swhat I hear over and over is
like, it's the most beautifuldrive like that you'll ever
take.
Meghan (04:40):
That's on our list too, because we haven't gone yet.
And so I try, we're gonna try togo in June.
Um, that's what we've heard.
It's like the best drive ever.
If we end up getting a goodsummer, it'll be nice out.
We can hopefully yeah.
Kimber (04:52):
know, I'm really excited for that.
We're going with my parents, sothat'll be really
Meghan (04:56):
fun.
Oh, that's awesome.
Valdez.
Yes.
That's on the bucket list for ushere,
Kimber (05:00):
I love it.
Well, friends listening.
I hope you're loving your summerso far.
We're we're hoping that by thetime.
Yes.
By the time this airs that ithas turned into a warm and
wonderful summer, it's kind ofrainy.
Or not rainy, even just likecloudy and cold so far here in
Alaska, but we are fingerscrossed, praying hard for some
(05:22):
sun to come.
Meghan (05:23):
Please Lord,
Kimber (05:24):
we are a little ways into a series here on the
podcast called being the friendyou need that we're talking
about all summer.
And if you're just jumping intothis series, I would encourage
you to go back and listen to theintro episode.
It's called being the friend youneed it's episode 52.
Um, just for some context forthese conversations, because.
This series really is not abouttrying harder, um, or like
(05:48):
remembering things better, justlike being more thoughtful.
because I feel like there can besuch pressure when we're talking
about friendships to like, oh,be a better friend, like be the
friend you need.
But really what we're focusingon in this series is just this
idea that We're working out oursalvation through holy spirit
with Jesus.
Right.
And as we're doing that,whatever we're getting from him
(06:11):
and however we're growing withhim.
That is what's going to flow outinto our relationships and help
us grow in being that friendthat we know we need.
And so what we're reallyfocusing on here, I feel like is
how do the ways that I'm growingwith Jesus?
How can those bleed out into myfriendships and just being
intentional about looking forthose ways and when we find them
(06:34):
leaning into those, because Ithink sometimes we can just let
them pass us by just cause we'renot looking for those
opportunities.
So what has.
Been your favorite nugget orpart of what we've talked about
so far in these conversations,what has like been turning
around in your head most, sincewe started talking.
Meghan (06:52):
Ooh, that's a good one.
Wow, this has been such a greatconversation.
I think just I, I'd say that I'mpretty good at stepping out, and
initiating things, but I thinkeven more so of that, maybe even
more of where my heart is oncertain areas.
Has really been like somethingI've been mulling around of just
being more vulnerable in thoseof, of, of letting people in
(07:16):
maybe my closest circle in alittle bit more into maybe where
some of the areas I'm strugglingwith the most that I haven't
like maybe fully let everybodyinto yet.
Um, and so I've been just kindof trying to be a little bit,
more intentional about.
Kind of with the conversationsteer that way, or even steering
a conversation that way of justbeing like, Hey, I just need to
share this a little bit.
(07:37):
And, um, so that bravery of, ofthat has been a good, um, been
really good for
Kimber (07:42):
I love that idea of steering the conversation
because it's easy to not steer.
Uh, conversation.
Right.
And just let it like gowherever.
and I think for me, what it is,is it's like paying attention to
those moments when I have theopportunity to steer the
conversation.
Cause I think I can get justtarget locked on like.
You know, What's the plan?
Or like, whatever we're doing.
And I, I forget thoseopportunities exist.
(08:06):
Um, and so just like even payingattention to when those
opportunities come up and then Ilove that piece too, of like
having the bravery to then.
Say the thing that steers thedirection.
And so good.
Well today, we're, we're havingkind of one of these harder
conversations.
Yeah.
And.
This is something that I've beenexcited to talk about, because I
(08:26):
feel like it is something thatwas not a part of my friendship
conversations until, uh, maybethe last like.
Five years or so if that, andthis is just this idea of like
confession, repentance beinggrieved by sin that we see in
our relationship.
And just even growing in ourrelationship with God and how we
(08:48):
view our sin as serious and aslike weighty.
And so this is something thatI've been working through in
just my relationship with theLord and like how I both see my
sin as.
Sirius and wadey in light of, ofcourse the like overwhelming
(09:08):
grace of God, right?
Like how those things.
Relate to each other.
And in the realm of friendship,I feel like it's easy to not
focus on.
How our sin affects ourrelationships just with people
around us.
Like, we don't want to talkabout that.
We don't want to think aboutthat.
You know?
And I, and I do love like agrowth mindset, you know, like
(09:28):
how can we do better?
How can we love well, like thatkind of thing.
But.
I think that we can't, we're notgoing to take that journey
seriously.
Unless we are actually allowingourselves to be grieved by our
sin.
And we recognize that sin doesbreak relationships.
And even if your friendship islike, okay, still, it doesn't
(09:48):
mean that it's not effected byour sin.
And so that to me is just such asobering reminder that there has
to be room for confession andrepentance in.
Our relationships with our, withour friends.
And I don't think that'ssomething we talk about a ton.
Have you.
Where are you at on this, thiskind of subject?
Where have you seen this?
Come up?
Meghan (10:09):
Um, Yeah.
I think I would be the same asyou.
That it wasn't, um, somethingthat I talked about.
It was always like the goodthings, like, oh, God's teaching
me this, and it's all this,like, you know, great things,
but not going into.
The kind of the darker, youknow, the darker side of my sin.
Um, Yeah.
But now that, that's, that'sbeen something that, in our
small group we're we talk, dolike a confession and sometimes
(10:34):
and talk about where we're at.
And then with our, my closefriends of this is where I'm
struggling, Um, I try to be alittle more of like, I know I'll
be like, this isn't gonna soundlike.
Not like Jesus Right.
now, and here's where you needto put me back on.
Like, this is just the raw truthof where my heart is and I know
this isn't where I wanna be.
Um, and then allowing them tokind of speak into that and help
(10:54):
direct me back, um, and startingthat confession.
But, growth requires a death andthat death is our sin.
And so we can't move forward.
Even our, even in ourconversations of this is where
God is, teaching me somethingRight.
now.
Maybe it's.
Patience.
Okay.
But there's still a growth, a, adeath of my impatience that
needs to happen.
And so going to that of like,this is where I'm, you know,
(11:18):
being impatient in my life andconfessing that to God and maybe
even to others, becausehonestly, maybe it comes out in
your friendship.
This is where I'm struggling inmy sin and this is where I now
need to go.
But we can't grow unlesssomething dies and that death
Kimber (11:32):
Hm.
I love that perspective becauseyou're right.
That it's like, it's hard toconfess those things and to talk
about it.
And I love that practice thatyou're developing in small group
because man, if you don't have aplace to practice that it's
definitely never going tohappen.
I mean, confession is awkward.
(11:53):
It's hard.
Like it's hard.
I think in our prayer life, likeprivately.
And it's for sure hard when it'slike in-person across from
someone, I think, especially in,um, I wonder if this is easier
ever for someone who has kind ofa background of a more.
Um, maybe like Catholic based orlike more liturgical background
(12:14):
that maybe practices confessionmore as part of their faith
tradition.
Um, or at least more formally aspart of their faith tradition.
But for me, man, it just, itfeels so hard every time it
comes up.
In conversation with friends,one thing, um, with that small
group that, um, kind of setting.
That has been helpful.
I think with this idea is, um,we were doing.
(12:38):
Uh, it was like this girl'snight that one of my friends did
for us in our small group.
And one of the questions waswhat is one thing that you are
experiencing right now that weshould know about?
Meghan (12:50):
Oh, that's a good question.
Kimber (12:52):
Is a really good question and I've hijacked it a
lot
Meghan (12:55):
I was like, I'm gonna write that down.
Kimber (12:56):
You should write it down right now.
What is the one thing thatyou're experiencing right now
that we should know about?
And a couple of things I loveabout that question that I think
can provide opportunity forconfession.
One it's experiencing, not justsomething that's going on.
Like, I feel like if you'reexperiencing it, that could be
like A temptation or a sinstruggle like that is a prime
(13:20):
opportunity for something likethat to come up.
Um, or it could be somethinglighter.
Like I'm experiencing a lot ofjoy in hiking, like, you know,
whatever, but.
Um, it gives the opportunity foryou to go that route, if you
need to confess something or notto, if you don't want to go
there.
Um, and then the idea of like,that we should know about kind
(13:43):
of is the same thing where it'slike, I'm accountable to these
people.
Like my sin doesn't only affectme.
It affects my relationships,especially those closest
relationships to me.
And so it's just that idea oflike, I'm accountable to some
people in my life because Idon't live in a vacuum or in a
bubble.
(14:04):
Um, and so I think that questionhas been helpful in our small
group, at least, and if you knowour friends listening, if you're
looking for a way to like,Invite this confession kind of
practice into, a small groupsetting or into a relationship.
I think that can be a greatquestion
Meghan (14:20):
Yeah, that's a really great question.
Yeah.
And even, um, you know, I workat our church and we just did
integrity checks and it wassome, you know, the questions
were Yes.
And I will, like, are you livingwith sexual integrity?
Yes.
Or I am.
And it's not to be like thisshame, not to bring shame, but
how can we like.
How can we come alongside you tohelp you if this is an area that
(14:43):
you're struggling with, and notthat you need to do integrity
checks necessarily with.
your friend, this big, like,formal thing, but like where
Yeah.
What are you experiencing Right.
now?
Like asking those kind ofpointed questions.
Um, yeah.
It's hard.
It's, it doesn't feel good.
It's definitely one that for methat I'm like, Ooh, that's never
easy.
Kimber (15:02):
Yeah.
cause it's like, I think it'sjust a little bit counter
intuitive to the like culturalway that I think we're taught to
approach friendship, I think isvery.
Um, Like lacks accountability,because I think it's very,
self-centered, you know, it'slike when we're talking about
our Christian friendships,especially our closest ones in,
(15:23):
even just the context of thechurch, it's like the body of
Christ is all connected.
So like, you know, if you.
Chop off your toe, like yourwhole body feels that.
Right.
And even though it's like, faraway from it, You feel that all
over.
And so I feel like we maybeunderstand that in the context
(15:44):
of the church, Like maybeintellectually, but I don't
think we always allow that tothen.
Pervade like our friendships,which artists, a microcosm of
that, right?
Like your small group or, youknow, your closest Christian
friends who you're.
You know, sharing like Biblestudy with, or that you pray
with.
Like those also have to be thepeople that we are accountable
(16:06):
with.
I think not maybe everyone thatyou do those other practices
with, but at least someonebecause otherwise we're acting
like.
that part of our spiritualityisn't connected to the rest of
the body.
And it is like, I just don'tthink there's any way around it.
Do you see it that way too, asinterconnected?
Um, how do you think that.
(16:27):
Impacts the idea of needing topractice confession in our
friendships.
Meghan (16:32):
Well, I think it's almost just how we're talking
about the other episodes of wecan't help but share out of the
overflow of what we consume, andthat's kind of with our sin.
I mean, you might not think it'saffecting anybody but it, it is,
like you said, like you can'tcut off your toe and your whole
body not, not feel it.
Now, of course we can have Awhole big conversation of
(16:52):
Simpsons are more, Outwardlyeffective and maybe some of your
inner things.
Sure.
But eventually That's all gonnaseep out.
And yeah.
So I think that there's reallyno way around it.
And it's, I know for me, sharingthat is hard.
Like, it, it makes me feel veryvulnerable.
And where I start, where theenemy starts to speak into my
mind is if you share where yourheart is, where you're
(17:14):
struggling, people are gonnaleave and walk away and, you
know, and so, yeah.
And so for me it's really.
I know that's the enemy one tokeep me in darkness.
and you might have a totallydifferent lie that the enemy's
thrown at you with why you maybedon't want to share that, but
like, that's not from God.
Cuz God wants us to go into thelight and that is confession and
(17:34):
that is speaking out that hardthing.
And yeah, truth is they mightwalk away.
They might be like, whoa, too.
much.
but what if they don't?
And what if they come close andthen they get to share where
they're at, and then you get topoint each other back to Christ
and work, work through it, youknow, together.
And so, Yeah.
It is, I feel like it's, it's apart of friendship.
Our culture is very much like,you're amazing.
(17:55):
You're doing great.
keep going.
You know, instead of, Yeah.
Sometimes you're not in this,you know, and And so it's hard.
Kimber (18:03):
And I feel like it's a good thing to remember then is
the boundary context of wherethis happens because.
Like you said there, thecultural way to navigate
friendship is just, is either byjust straight encouraging.
Like you're amazing.
Just like affirmation,affirmation, affirmation, which
is great.
(18:23):
We should affirm each other.
That's so important.
But the cultural way is to sayoh, when you're not crushing it,
when I'm not going to affirmyou.
Then I leave.
Like I drop you if you're notserving me essentially, or like
meeting my needs.
And there's a definite happymedium there.
(18:46):
Like there's, there's a sweetspot, right?
Like on either end of theextreme, we don't need to just
like, Affirm each otherconstantly, especially when
there's something that like,you've talked about it before,
like a way that a friend seesthat we could really use some
room for growth and they try tobe loving and how they bring
that to us.
But then also that side of like,where does that fear of
rejection come from?
(19:07):
Well, it probably comes from thefact that sometimes that's what
people do.
Like sometimes people just dropyou, you know?
And if they find out somethingor if you share something that
doesn't feel like it meets theirnarrative.
And so.
Um, within.
Like Christian relationshipsthough, we have a middle ground
where it's like, we can infer,affirm and encourage.
(19:28):
Right.
But we can also, rebuke and,encourage confession and like
walk with people through that.
Because I think it's a matter ofsource it's like, because
community is coming as a sourcefrom the Lord, not from just are
my needs being met.
That's why we can sit insometimes that not happy medium,
but that uncomfortable middlewith our people.
(19:50):
And so the reality is that wedon't sit in that.
Safe space.
everyone.
Right.
Like, you know, if we try tobring confession into our small
group or something and you know,someone doesn't receive it well
like that, that is a risk thatwe take.
And so how do you feel like wenavigate knowing what the
(20:12):
boundaries are for when we sharethis kind of thing or when we
invite confession?
Um, how can we go about justlike, okay.
If I, if I know that this issomething that is important to
my deepest, closest friendships.
how do I know which ones thatapplies to where I should share
this?
What the context is?
Meghan (20:30):
Yeah.
Well, I think the first thing todo is to talk to God about it
and pray about who it is thatyou need to maybe, open up and
share with, because maybe itdoesn't need to be, Three or
closest friends, maybe this isonly something that you feel
like one person needs.
So praying about it, and I, Ireally do feel like God's gonna
put that person on your heart oflike, this is who I need to open
up to, um, about it.
(20:51):
And then, and then maybe callinghim or meeting up with them and
saying, Hey, I got, I gottashare something with you That's
just really heavy on my heart.
Do you think we could gettogether and, and to talk about
it?
And, um, And I think that That'sgonna be the way to start it, is
prayer and, and asking God andconfessing to God first too.
Um, and this might be on theflip side, where maybe you're
(21:14):
seeing something in somebodythat you feel like maybe you
need to speak into.
Again, I'd say pray about it andthen like, Hey, you know,
there's something I wanna talkto you about and get that.
conversation going.
the thing is that we're, we'reall sinners.
Not one of us is.
Is sitting in the, the seat ofvictory in this yet.
Um, and so that reminder of weare all on a level playing field
(21:37):
here and we all need God's graceand I wanna be able to extend
grace just as much as I wantpeople to give it to me.
And there's a, there was a quotethat I love that.
it's like this Puritan pastor,he, I wrote it down cuz I loved
it.
And it said, till sin be bitter,Christ will not be sweet.
And so there is this like levelof this sin.
(21:58):
It has gotta me, it has gottabreak me in a way of, a grief in
a morning, of breaking God'sheart of what it, maybe it's
affected in my life and others'lives.
And then when that happens, whenthere's that breaking, like
that's a good thing is, but, andnot in a shame based of like,
I'm worthless, but now Christ,that grace can just get poured
(22:19):
into me.
And then that chasm, that ofspace that we have with God is
now just been bridged becausehis death on the cross took that
away in that moment.
And so, but it has to, it has tobreak us, I think, first.
Kimber (22:34):
Yeah, because, I mean, that's the idea that.
friends listening may or may nothave heard of, but this idea of
like cheap grace, you know, thatif like, if we haven't been, I
think the other phrase that getsthrown out is like he who has
been forgiven much, like lovesmuch, you know?
And it's this idea of like, ifwe haven't been forgiven of
much, because we think that.
(22:54):
we're pretty great.
Like we got it all together.
then her view of God's grace isjust so, I think.
And so it's, yeah, it's not outof shame, but it's out of just
like, it expands your view ofhow kind and good God is.
And I think the same can applyin our friendships because if,
if we think like, oh, I'm apretty good friend.
(23:16):
Like, I mean, we might be apretty good friend.
That's true.
And it's not like we need to bedown on ourselves.
Like, oh, I'm terrible.
I'm the worst, you know, that's,not what I'm saying here, but.
rather just a sober view of mysin does impact my friendships.
it breaks relationships aroundme.
Like when I am selfishlymotivated in my friendships
(23:37):
that.
Cracks our relationship.
When I say unkind things, evenif like, oh, I meant it jokingly
or what, like that breaks myrelationships.
And if I act like it, doesn't.
Then it's just going to keepfracturing.
Right.
Whereas if I have a sober viewof how my sin impacts my
relationships, Then I have anopportunity to confess that,
(24:01):
which deepens your friendships.
And repent as in trying to dobetter by the power of the holy
spirit walk closer and closer toChrist.
And so I feel like it's, it'sjust that, like you're saying
that awareness of the chasm,because the chasm exists either
way.
It's just whether or not.
We acknowledge
Meghan (24:20):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yep, yep.
And it's not even just ouroutward maybe sin that we have
a, we are gonna sin against eachother too, like, being able to
go to your friend and confess, Iprobably hurt you, or I need to
apologize for this, or viceversa, is so important because
we are, we're gonna hurt eachother's feelings.
(24:40):
We're gonna say the wrong thing,we're gonna do the wrong thing.
That's just life with a bunch ofsinners.
we're gonna, we're gonna, like,it's gonna happen.
And then I know I alwaysreference Jenny Allen, but
sorry, but she says, um, youknow, she's awesome.
Sorry.
Um, but she says, you know, I, Iwill disappoint you.
You will disappoint me, but Godwill never disappoint us.
(25:01):
And that's such a good reminderof, again, like that triangle of
there's gonna be times where I'mgonna disappoint you.
That's just inevitable.
You're gonna disappoint me.
But when we have God as a centerof our friendship, that's where
we get to confess and repent andreally deepens our friendship
when we can go to one anotherand our brokenness and be like,
I messed up and I was wrong.
(25:22):
Um, and will you forgive me?
And that's pretty much all yougotta say, you know, is just to
do that.
Kimber (25:28):
Yeah, because it's, again, that like restoration
because at least I know for me,sometimes I'm unaware of it.
Um, And that's an opportunity tolike, receive.
You know, rebuke from a friendand I in a good way, which is,
which is really hard.
But sometimes I am aware of itand I'm like, Ooh, I said that
(25:49):
and I hope she didn't take thatwrong or whatever.
You know, I say to myself, and alot of times I will just not say
anything and I'll stew on that.
And, you know, worry, wonder ifit hurt her feelings, whatever.
but man confession doesn't bringa wider gap to our friendships.
I don't think, I think it,builds that bridge.
Like you're saying it bringsrestoration because it just, it
(26:13):
like when you received that froma friend, at least in my
experience, it doesn't make melike, think they're terrible.
I already was aware of it.
it it was hurtful, right?
Like.
I think we're seeing sometimesif we confess something that
then suddenly someone's aware ofit, but, and I guess with
personal sin, they might nothave been aware of it, but if
it's like relational, They'reprobably very well aware of it.
(26:36):
And so it's just going to bringrestoration.
I don't think it's going to harmthe relationship.
Like we
Meghan (26:42):
no.
Kimber (26:42):
think it might.
Meghan (26:43):
Yes.
No, I think that it's such atangible picture of what Christ
has done for us.
When we get to practice thatwithin community of restoration,
of repentance and confession, itreally is that way that we get
to see what Christ did for us tobe able to give that to somebody
else and vice versa.
That I get to experience gracethe way God's given me grace
(27:05):
over and over and over again tobe able to do that for a friend
to receive that.
Grace when I've messed up.
And to give it when they need ittoo.
Yeah.
there's just, that does bringabout such a friendship,
intimacy.
Um, I know that some of myclosest friends are the ones
that we've had, we've had issue,we've had things we've had to
work through, but it's broughtus closer to God.
It's brought us closer to eachother because we've worked
(27:26):
through
Kimber (27:27):
Yeah.
Meghan (27:27):
things.
Kimber (27:28):
Yeah.
The other thing that I feel likeconfession can do, is it like,
just makes me more aware of mytendencies to sin in my
friendships.
Like.
I think of this one situationwhere I said something to a
friend that was, um, just out ofsome bitterness that really
didn't have much to do with her.
And I kind of realized thatafter the fact.
(27:49):
And so I ended up texting herlike, Hey, I think I said that
out of a lot of bitterness, thatwas not directed at you.
I'm sorry I responded that wayor something like that.
And now, like, I think I'm awareof that.
Tendency and so I can guardagainst it.
And so I think that's the otherthing about confession is the
speaking out of sin is sopowerful.
(28:11):
even if we know it in our head,there's something about speaking
it out that not only bringsfreedom, I think to us, but can
also bring awareness of atendency in our lives.
To sin in a certain way, andwhich can then invite us to
Meghan (28:24):
Mm-hmm.
Kimber (28:25):
against that.
Meghan (28:26):
And maybe sometimes like, you know, like you said,
like you said something out of.
That wasn't directed at her, butit was coming outta that deeper
route of, I had some bitternessturning and again, like it's
gonna come out somehow and ourfriends, our family are going to
get some of that.
And even though it wasn't like apersonal thing towards her,
again, it's going like, Ooh,Yeah.
(28:47):
I actually, there's, I've gotsomething happening that had
nothing to do with you and Itook it out on you and I'm so
sorry, but I've got somebitterness like.
Of a different, you know, and sothat can be even a good, when
those things happen of like,what's actually happening here,
here in my heart, that, youknow, it's like that whole like
anger.
Anger is a secondary emotion.
So what is that, what'shappening underneath here?
(29:10):
That's really the, the sin,like, yes.
Angry, you know?
Anyway, so,
Kimber (29:14):
Yeah, I totally get that.
Meghan (29:15):
at that.
Kimber (29:16):
It makes me think of how like marriage always gets talked
about as like a crucible, right?
Like, you know, within marriage,you.
Realize.
Some sin in your life.
Like, you know, it, it's aprocess that can guide us to
holiness if we allow it to.
And I think that's true for allclose relationships in our
(29:38):
lives, you know, and like, Ourfriendships.
Aren't going to accomplish thatin the same way that a marriage
relationship does.
But especially when we'retalking about like our closest
people, it's an opportunity tobe made more holy through the
like, Rubbing up of your sinagainst each other, you know,
because when that happens, then.
You have the opportunity to seeit more clearly?
(30:01):
I think.
And so I think it really canlike eliminate some areas like
you're saying of, oh, I was notaware of this issue, but because
I was being honest in myfriendship, you know, and I, I
was reflecting on it orwhatever.
I have been made aware.
Of this, this way that the Lordwants to grow me.
Meghan (30:19):
Yeah, absolutely.
Kimber (30:21):
Um, well, let's kind of wrap up with your challenge,
Megan.
Um, this series friendslistening, we have then ending
with a challenge just to helptake the stuff we're talking
about and turn it into practicalaction.
In our lives with the people inyour life, because one thing to
talk to like, or not talk to,but hear me and Megan talk about
this.
And, we hope that you're noddingalong as you're listening in
(30:43):
your car while you're doingdishes or whatever.
but I feel like the process isincomplete unless you take those
conversations to your closefriends, to your circles, to
your hikes or coffee dates orwherever and make these real in
your life.
And so Megan's challenges havebeen just so way to help us do
that.
So what do you think in, inregard to like confession,
(31:06):
repentance?
Just being grieved by sin thatwe see happening in our
friendships.
Meghan (31:11):
So, um, it's gonna be kind of going back to the first
episode and then bringing intothis, but the first one is to
Process with God first of.
Maybe if there's something likewhen you're listening to this
podcast that's kind of stirredin your heart of like, A sin or
something that you're strugglingwith that you feel like it needs
to be brought out.
Like bring that to God first.
Practice that, and then bepraying about who you can take
(31:34):
that to and take It to somebody.
So the challenge this week is,after you've, you've prayed in
process with God, bring somebodyinto this and it could be like,
Hey friend, I really need totalk to you about something.
Shoot a text.
Can we.
Meet up this week.
It could be a phone call if it'syou know, someone that maybe
doesn't live in your town, butbring somebody into that and ask
(31:55):
them to like, pray with you andto repent of that and how they
can point you closer to Christthrough that.
And, you know, that's a reallybig challenge.
it's it's a heavy one.
Kimber (32:05):
it's a hard thing,
Meghan (32:06):
it's a very hard thing, but, um, I promise you that.
The hardest part is gonna bejust taking that breath and that
first word.
Just, just keep plowing throughit and do it, um, and know that
what's gonna come out of that isso sweet and so precious.
It's gonna bring you closer toChrist.
It's gonna bring you closer toyour friend.
(32:27):
and yeah, beautiful things aregonna grow out of just that,
that death that you're puttingaway.
Kimber (32:32):
Hm, because the truth is that like the enemy doesn't want
us to.
Confess in our friendshipsbecause he knows that it brings
us deeper.
He knows that through Jesus, wehave freedom when we confess and
receive his grace.
Meghan (32:45):
And I know when you're praying, when you're doing this,
like the enemy, the last thinghe wants you to do is speak into
this and speak it out tosomebody.
And so just know that that'swhat's gonna happen and know
what the lies of the enemy arelike.
God doesn't want you to keep itin the dark.
He doesn't want you to feelshame.
He doesn't want you to feelfear.
Um, so when those lies come knowthat that is a lie that's not
(33:06):
from Christ.
Christ wants you to bring it outinto the light and know that
there's grace waiting for you.
There's peace and so when that'shappening, like just rebuke the
enemy in that moment like thatis not from God.
Kimber (33:18):
Um, I love that.
And I love that you started thischallenge too, with the reminder
to take it to God first and prayabout who is this person that I
can bring this to, because Ithink so often that voice, like
you were saying of like, oh, isthis person I'm going to receive
this well is really loud.
but I think that it can, like ifwe take it to the Lord first,
that is an opportunity for himto say like kind of point us to
(33:41):
who this could be in our lives.
If we're not sure in some peoplelistening, they probably know.
Know who their people are.
And.
who they're, they would go towith this kind of thing.
And it's more of a, okay, do Ihave the courage to actually say
it?
Um, and some people you may belike, I don't know who this
would be for me.
And so if that's you, I thinkthat starting with prayer is
such a good reminder
Meghan (34:03):
Yes.
Yes.
Yeah.
He'll bring something to someoneto mind for you.
Kimber (34:07):
Yeah.
I love that.
Well, Megan, thanks so much fortalking with me today,
especially about a toughsubject, but one that I think is
it's so good.
Because again, if we're, ifwe're not thinking about it,
we're definitely not probablypracticing it.
So I love that we got somechance to think and talk about
it today so that we can startputting this into action.
Meghan (34:28):
Yeah.
This was so good.
Thank you.
Kimber (34:29):
Awesome.
Well, we'll talk to you later.
Friends, go be the friend youneed.
Bye.
Friends.
I'm so glad you could join meand Megan on the show this week.
It's never fun to confess in,let alone to friends, but I
really believe this is apractice that will deepen your
relationships.
(34:50):
Like no other.
We think confessing sin willbreak relationships.
But the truth is that our sin isalready breaking the
relationship.
And when we acknowledge it,we've made the first move toward
repenting and pursuing growthand restoration.
It's hurting us either way, butwhen we get it exposed to the
light of the Lord's healing, wewill share a new kind of depth
in that relationship because ofthat honesty.
(35:12):
If you're loving this series sofar, would you tell a friend
about the podcast this week?
Just shoot her a DM with a postfrom social or texts her an
episode link and.
I ask if she listen so that youguys can talk about it the next
time you hang out.
This is a great way to jumpstartthese conversations.
We're praying the series sparksin your friendships this summer,
as you're out doing all thatsummer fun.
(35:32):
I pray, many fruitful, hearthearts, accompany your hikes and
lake days and campfires.
And speaking of, I know how busysummer can get some, make sure
that you subscribe to thepodcast wherever you listen, so
that you don't miss an episode.
You can also sign up to be partof my newsletter crew so that
you get a weekly previewdirectly to your email inbox of
what will be on the podcast thatweek.
(35:52):
Just visit your sisterkimber.com and subscribe there.
Friends.
Thank you so much for spendingpart of your day with us until
next time.
It's your sister Kimber.
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