December 25, 2025 • 45 mins
Artificial intelligence is advancing faster than most coaches are prepared for — and it’s about to wipe out the middle of the coaching industry.
In this powerful Thursday roundtable, Kellan Fluckiger sits down with Robert Twine and Eric Lofholm to confront the uncomfortable truth: systems, scripts, checklists, and processes are becoming obsolete. AI can already do them faster, better, and cheaper.
So what’s left?
Human connection.
This episode explores why the future of coaching belongs to those who can transmit truth, vulnerability, presence, and lived experience — and why anything “performative” is on borrowed time. If you’re a coach, creator, or leader navigating the AI shift, this conversation is not optional.
Key Takeaways
- How AI is reshaping — and disrupting — the coaching industry
- Why systems, processes, and methodologies are becoming commoditized
- The difference between performance and embodiment
- Using AI as a thinking partner without losing human depth
- Accountability, vulnerability, and real relationship as value creators
- Why “human connection” may become more valuable as technology advances
- What new and experienced coaches must do to survive the AI shift
Ready to turn your truth into impact
📣Join the Dream • Build • Write It Webinar — where bold creators transform ideas into movements. Reserve your free seat now at dreambuildwriteit.com
📣 Join sales legend Eric Lofholm saleschampion.com, and connection expert Robert Twine roberttwine.org as they reveal why authentic human connection is the one asset that will always outperform any coaching methodology.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Hello and welcome to thisepisode of your ultimate life, the
podcast created to help youcreate a life of purpose, prosperity
and joy using the skills,gifts and the life experience that
you have. This is our specialThursday edition that is featuring
coaches talking about therising, the development and the growth
(00:21):
of artificial intelligence,we're calling it. It's not actually
intelligent yet, but hey, thatproduct. And so each week on Thursday,
we're having a conversationwith a couple of coaches to talk
about what they think, whatthey're doing with it and what they're
not using and so forth. Andthat's what we're doing today. So,
Robert and Eric, welcome tothe show.
(00:43):
Thanks for having me.
Great to be here, Kellen.
All right, great. So, Robert,you accidentally ended up in my upper
left hand corner. So I amgoing to start it with a question,
although we're not reallygoing to conduct it as a structured
set of questions. And thefirst question I have for you is,
are you using some form of oneof the LLMs AIs in your coaching?
(01:05):
And if you are, how, what doyou, what do you notice with it?
Why are you using it? What'sit doing for you? If. If that's true?
I use AI very limitedly forposts on social media. So I would
say I'm on the spectrum oftesting and not using. I'm just testing
to see a lot of the posts thatI make. I'll write out and then I
(01:29):
put it into AI to see how theycan condense it. Because I have a,
I have a tendency when I startto write something, it ends up being
like 20 pages. And I thinksometimes on social media, sometimes
it's nice to be more concise.So I do, I do appreciate the conciseness
of it. Also use it to generateimages that will go with stories
(01:50):
that I share stories abouttransformation and create images.
However, the way that I'vebeen using it, I found it, it's not
as connecting as what I'd liketo see. And I'm sure there's a way
to use it that would be moreconnecting. I just haven't discovered
that for myself yet. But I douse it and test it.
(02:12):
What does connecting mean?
Well, to connect with. Connectwith somebody, the story help people
connect with what the story ismeant to share. I like to share stories
with people online that canhelp give them an. A vision of transformation
for themselves as apossibility to encourage conversation,
(02:33):
to create conversations withpeople for coaching.
Cool. Eric, what about you?What are you doing with this tool?
I know just from things yousaid before that you're using it.
But I don't know exactly whatand I'm not going to pretend I do.
So tell us what you're doingwith it.
Sure. One of the things thatI'm doing is a lot of the coaching
(02:55):
sessions that I'm doing withpeople. I'm on Zoom and recording
it, getting the transcript andthen providing them the transcript
either put into AI or creatinga custom GPT and putting all of the
session recordings into thereand using that as a, a data, data
(03:18):
point. I'm using video for AIfor landing pages, having a AI clone
of me and I'll have myassistant help me with those videos.
I've created some, I call themAI coaches. I have an AI, excuse
(03:39):
me, an AI manifesting coach.And so it's a, a guided experience
with Chat GPT to enhance thecoaching and I'm providing people.
So those are, those are acouple of initial things that come
to my mind.
Are you, did you create yourown, like I asked Chad GPT and there's
(04:00):
a bunch of others, Grok andClaude and all the others. I use
ChatGPT the most and it soundslike maybe you guys do too, although
you may use other ones. Haveyou created your own custom following
instructions there or did youhire a programmer to do a sort of
walled.
Off version of something withwhat I call the AI manifesting coach?
(04:24):
I built that myself. I hiredan AI guy to train me on how to do
it and so that one I built onmy own.
Either one of you, what, whatdo you find, what do you find most
helpful about using it?Robert, you mentioned a thing that
(04:45):
it doesn't seem to connect aswell as you like. And I'm not. You
told me, but I'm not sure Iunderstand exactly what the that
meant. So you can elaborate ifyou want to and either one of you,
what do you think is really helpful?
I'd love to elaborate. It, Iguess, I guess it means like impressions,
people responding to it.There's not a whole lot of response
(05:06):
when I use it. That's what Imeant by what I was sharing. But
one thing I do love about it,when Eric shared, I do use it for
my Zoom calls because Zoom hasan AI built into it and it's. Sometimes
it's really fun for notes. It,it will, it will take everything
that was shared, the actionsteps, the things that we talked
about and it breaks everythingdown and it, it's really good for
(05:30):
that and I do use it for that.I think it's fun. I like, I Do like
to use it. I just haven'tfound my way to use it that that
is beneficial to grow mycoaching business yet.
Cool. Say that. What, what doyou really like about it, Eric?
I like we started buildingwebsites with Gamma and I'm having
(05:55):
my assistant build thosewebsites so we don't have to go to
an outside source in order tobuild them. We can build them very
quickly. I like that aspect. Ilike using AI as a thinking partner
and it's kind of like, like amastermind that's going to generate
(06:15):
lots of ideas that I hadn'tthought of before. I also like training
my clients on how to use theAI and having, having me be one of
their go to sources fortraining. So it positions me as an
expert in the AI salestraining space. So those are, those
(06:37):
are a couple of examples.
What do you mean? So you'vebeen doing sales training for a long
time and as far as I'mconcerned you're the best that we
have right now and so you'reusing it. There's two questions really.
How do you use it to help yourclients with sales training?
(06:58):
Well, you know, with ourability to record a coaching call,
a salesperson could recordtheir sales presentation and have
it transcribed and then askChatGPT to analyze the sales presentation
for its strengths andweaknesses, make recommendations
(07:19):
on how to make thepresentation better. And so that
idea is probably not intuitivefor most salespeople. So teaching
ideas like that, which in away it may be, you know, creating
competition for myself, but mythought is they're going to, they're
going to go out and learn itsomewhere so they might as well learn
(07:41):
it from me and have meposition be positioned as the expert
that helped them. There's alot that I can do in creating sales
scripts, emails, a simplething like somebody sends you an
email, you can copy the email,put into AI and say, you know, write
a response to this email. Justreal practical tips like that is
(08:04):
something I enjoy teaching my clients.
You said something about usingit as a thinking partner. That's
a phrase that a number ofcoaches that I've interviewed have,
have talked about and I'mcurious what you mean by it. Everybody
means whatever they mean. Howis it a thinking partner for you?
Yeah, so I want to deliver 100speeches next year as an example.
(08:27):
So I could type in a chat andsay, you know, I'd like to deliver
100 speeches. You know, whatideas do you have? What, what lead
sources, what potentialchallenges might I encounter? You
know, do you even think that'sa good idea to have that as a goal
and so I can just see what,what it has to say or if I'm just,
(08:51):
if I'm struggling withsomething, maybe I have a personal
relationship that's not goingthe way that I want. I can type in
and explain. Here's, here'swhat's happening. Here's my story.
What do you think? And it's,it's come up with some really effective
ideas to help me.
Yesterday I spoke to TownsendWardlaw's group called coach's operating
(09:15):
system for an hour and a halfand Townsend wrote the forward for
the book for me and he told astory in there and he retold it on
the, the webinar yesterday andI'm going to share it with you because
of what you just said. He saidthat what really woke him up to this
is he had a, his wife is alsoa coach and anyway they have a great
(09:38):
relationship, et cetera, etcetera. And he said then there was
a situation where they got insome kind of an argument or disagreement
or whatever and it didn't getresolved at night and so they went
to bed and it was negativeenergy. And the way he described
it yesterday on the call wasmore exciting than it is in the forward
but like it was a prettyserious thing. But anyway he got
(09:58):
up the next day and did hisown preparation, morning routine
and whatever, got himselfsquared away and he expected the
energy to be the same in themorning. And his wife was just like
all in good shape. And heasked her name's Luisa. And he said
Luisa, what's, what's goingon? And she said oh, I'm fine. I
used chat GPT and it coachedme through this just fine. And he
(10:22):
said it was like a face palmmoment for him because then he realized,
you know what he said? And hesaid this yesterday. He said well
if you know that can happen,what the frick is going to be left
for coaches? Like what I meanthis worked and here she is and it's
all solved. And you mentionedhaving good ideas and so forth. And
(10:45):
so one of the premise reason Iwrote the book is because I see a
huge change in the coachingindustry and like tons of coaches
that today coach a particularway aren't going to be able to find
clients because you're goingto be able to buy all that stuff
for $29 a month or $79 a monthor some amount of money to buy some
kind of coaching that'sactually quite good. And so to both
(11:08):
of you, what do you thinkabout that kind of thing, what do
you see as changes, if any? Ithink they're going to be pretty
radical.
Sure. Well, I'll, I'llcomment. You know, if you think about
why would somebody hire acoach in the first place, probably
they have a problem that theywant solved or they want help with
(11:32):
it. You know, I'm in the, thesales training space, so I teach
people how to make more moneyand make more sales, create a sales
miracle. And so I don't, Idon't envision that that's, that's
going to change. I'm notenvisioning that. All of a sudden
now that AI is here, peoplewill no longer have sales problems.
(11:53):
And so I'm not anticipatingfor me personally that there's going
to be an issue. I think itjust comes down to a coach's ability
to have a way that they canhelp people, whatever that niche
is. And in the example thatyou just gave with Townsend and his
(12:14):
wife and the, the AI helping,helping them.
You.
Know, is that going to solveall relationship trouble between
husbands and wives? Probablynot, right?
No, probably not. Of course not.
So there's, there's the, the,the tool of, of the AI and how it
can help. But you know, we'veall, all of us on this call and the
(12:39):
people we're coaching havelikely been on the planet for decades.
And so we have decades ofthinking patterns, we have decades
of how we eat. If you're inthe health and wellness coaching
space, we have decades of howwe relate with people. And so, you
know, having AI as a tool, itdoesn't undo decades of thinking.
(13:00):
And so I don't personally havea, a concern for myself. I, I, I
guess it just on a case bycase basis of if people have the
skill set to go out andposition themselves, acquire clients,
having strategies to connectwith people. I also think though
(13:20):
that the clients themselvesare going to be wanting AI to be
a part of the coachingprocess. Like if I'm providing transcripts
that they can put through AIand then they complete their coaching
agreement with me and thenthey go hire their next coach, they're
probably going to want sometype of similar process. So I think
that being able to incorporateAI into the coaching, maybe something
(13:46):
that people regularly startlooking for.
Robert, what do you thinkabout that?
Well, I love, I love whatyou're sharing, Eric. And I, I, I
love the idea of coachingbeing, it's, it's a spiritual experience,
a heart to heart experience.Whenever I'm coaching with people,
(14:06):
it's a There's a level ofconnection that I'm not sure people
can recreate through AI.Maybe. Maybe it can be recreated.
I'm not sure that it's thereyet, maybe someday, but I think there's
a. There's some type of aconnection and transmission that
happens in a deep coaching anda deep connection with another human
(14:29):
being that the further that weget away from that, I feel like is
going to create a massivedistinction for that real human connection,
you know, that real meaningfulhuman connection. And there's part
of me that kind of thinksmaybe like retreats in the woods
(14:49):
and things like that out. Awayfrom AI, away from everything may
become. They may becomeperceived as more valuable. And maybe
that human connection will befor the coaches that really shift
into a practice of, of beingand. And spiritual connection and,
(15:11):
and connecting with otherhumans in that. In that space that
may become even more valuable.
The. In the research that Idid, I took about 11 coaching models
that I am aware of. And Iwasn't trying to be exhaustive, but
(15:32):
many coaching models that havenames and so forth and I and analyze
them with the help ofdifferent LLMs. And I said how. I
asked several questions, butthe important ones where I said,
how. How good? And I realizedit goes out in the Internet and looks
for everything. But I said,how good are these methodologies
at providing the results thatpeople want, the intended outcome?
(15:56):
And it, it came back withquite an interesting spreadsheet,
you know, with all the modelsand how good it is. You know, people
pay money most of the timethey want help with business or finance
or money. But there's alsorelationships and how they feel about
themselves and meaning in lifeand a whole bunch of other things.
(16:17):
And that was interesting. Andthen I asked it, okay, cool. How
vulnerable do you think? And Iwas using a year and a half at the
time because I started inMarch. How vulnerable do you think
these methodologies are givenwhat they do to, to the advances
in AI and what wasinteresting, and it rated them all
(16:40):
low vulnerability, medium andhigh, and told me why and everything
like that. And so the thingthat I see and it. I also ask it
for an income distribution. Isaid today, how much do coaches make?
And it gave me, you know, only50% here, 70%, 80% and gave me an
income breakdown based onpublicly available data. And all
(17:03):
those things put together pluswhat it's going to be able to do
is what led me to theconclusion that I felt it anyway
to start with, but it led meto the conclusion that it's probably
Worse than I thought. And thething that's going to be eviscerated
is anything that has to dowith systems, lists, checklists,
(17:24):
processes, those kinds ofthings can be done faster, better
and in better language thanany human can be. Both of you have.
Robert, you said it directly.And Eric, I think you did this too.
You talk about teaching peopleto sell, but there's. Especially
with selling. And you knowthis because you've been doing this
(17:46):
for forever, especially withthat. There's this other element
that has to know, has not todo with the mechanics of conversation
and sales, but it has to dowith confidence, capability, and,
you know, people's assessmentof their own value and possibility.
And if you look at what willbe left, I. It. It will be more valuable
(18:10):
and it will be more powerful,and it will be only based on the
truth of the human connection.Is what I'm led to conclude by what
I. What I both read and what Ifeel, and nothing, or relatively
nothing to do with. And notsaying that any of the methodologies
(18:31):
are not good, the tools andsystems are okay, but that is all
duplic. Duplicable, if that'sa word. Duplicable by the. By the
increasing intelligence. Andso if, if all that's really left
for us is the truth of humanconnection, what needs to happen
(18:53):
for coaches to stay in business?
Yeah, I think it's a personal.It's really a personal. What's the
word? It's like going on theadventure of really discovering what
we're capable of personallyand really pushing the boundaries
(19:14):
for ourselves or exploringwhere are the boundaries, and continuing
to grow spiritually and learnhow to connect with people in meaningful
ways that really makes adifference in their life. You know,
connect to that. The. Thespirit of possibility and creation
(19:34):
and love and whatever.Whatever that thing is, you know,
that thing that makes us comealive. So I think it's. It's. It's
creating a life where we feelmost alive. And I think that's the
thing that really, reallyconnects with people in a deep way
in my experience, becausethere have been times, of course,
(19:54):
when I haven't felt alive andmy business has struggled because
I've been just going throughthe motions. And the other thing
that I think is, I think it'sexciting to think that people are
going to create all thesethings and they're getting the results,
but the feeling they're notgoing to have the feeling they're
not going to have thatexperience that they want. They're
(20:15):
going to be creating all thisstuff without the actual experience
of feeling alive. And they'regoing to be like, what the hell?
You know, excuse, excuse mylanguage. I'm not sure sure what
the level of language,whatever, but people, you know, exciting
people.
Don't go crazy on me, okay?
Okay, I won't. I want. Okay,yeah, hell's. That's the, that's
the level, whatever. But Ithink people are going to be excited,
(20:37):
excited to connect becausethey're going to create these outcomes
without the feeling. Andthey're going to find the meaning
is really not in the outcomebut in the, in the feeling. It's
like, what do we want? We wantthe feeling, you know, we can have
all these results, but what dowe really want? What do we do anything
for? We want to feel it. Wewant to feel good, we want to feel
(20:58):
alive.
You know, Eric, what goesthrough your mind when you think
about what's really going tobe left when AI gets developed more
than it is?
Yeah, I think that there's abusiness aspect of this. In my business
right now I'm looking at asoftware play and one of the things
(21:23):
I started doing with coachingclients is accountability. And I
created an accountabilityproduct where they're sending me
an end of day report, but I'malso sending them an end of day report.
So I'm accountable to them,they're accountable to me. And it's
giving them an opportunity tolook at what does high performance
(21:46):
look like. Because I'm a veryhigh performing person. And so, you
know, in my background, Iworked for Tony Robbins as an example
and I got a chance to, I had afront row seat at what high performance
looked like and I learned alot from that. And most people probably
have never had a front rowseat to that. So I'm looking at some
software to potentially buildaccountability relationships with
(22:10):
several thousand people. Sothat's, that's a business strategy
where it's not just me workingwith somebody one on one, but bringing
software in as an additionalrevenue stream. I'm doing some work
with some health coaches rightnow and they are representing a health
(22:30):
product line. So it's asupplement product line. It's a lab
testing. AI is at this pointis not doing lab testing and it's.
You can't get supplements fromAI and so.
No, of course not.
They've got an additionalincome stream. You know, you, you
sell somebody on supplementsand if they are taking them and potentially
(22:53):
you've got a customer forlife. And so I think it's interesting
if I was a coach right now andI was looking at, you know, the p.
The picture that you'repainting and seeing, you know, what
are other additional incomestreams that I could bring into my
business that would be, wouldbe in alignment with the way I want
(23:14):
to express myself and thecontribution that I want to make.
So those are a couple thoughts.
You said something reallyinteresting about that accountability
and it, to me at least,because I know you. Interesting.
Some of the folks I'veinterviewed here, I haven't. I know
their names and I know them,but just barely. And you. I know
more. The way you'redescribing the accountability, I
(23:38):
think is what will make thatwork. And that is not them sending
a bunch of accountabilitystuff to you, which is a. So what
deal you sending something tothem represents a level of disclosure,
vulnerability and connectionthat gets to this heart of thing
that isn't duplicable. And soI just, I love that when you said
that. I'm thinking that that'swhy it will work.
(24:02):
The thing about it that'sunique is it's, it's my unique expression
because. Yeah, you know,because you know me personally, you
know what, what a hard workerI am. And a lot of people in sales,
they're just not putting inenough time doing the thing.
Doing the thing. I love it.
(24:22):
And so, you know, I'm doingthe thing. And there are days that
I don't make any sales and Idisclose that the vulnerability within
the, the accountability andthey also get, get a chance to see
my consistency. It's one thingto know me from a zoom, but it's
another thing to see like I'mtalking about how I'm interacting
with my wife or my kids or myfitness or whatnot. And so it's,
(24:46):
it's that it's more aboutrelationship than accountability.
I'm not like, hard on them ifthey're not following through on
what they say they're going todo. It's just more of, of having
that connection. And so Ithink it's, it's interesting to think
about how could I, if I'm acoach, how could I reach instead
(25:09):
of, you know, 20 clients, howcould I reach 200? Leveraging technology,
how could I reach 2,000? Howcould I reach, you know, 20,000?
You know, I think I couldreach thousands and thousands of
people through like a 49amonthsoftware where they have a chance
to have an opportunity tointeract with me personally through
(25:32):
this tool. And so we'll see.Right now I'm doing it on a manual
basis. I'm in the process ofFinding the right technology partner
to help me. But that's an.It's an innovative way of addressing
what you're pointing thecoaches to of just same old, same
old status quo is likely notgoing to get it done.
(25:54):
It's going to be gone. I'm noteven going to likely you're toast.
And if you. Not you, butyou're toast if you can't do that.
But I interrupted you, sofinish up.
Yeah. So I think it's just amatter of, you know, how do we pivot?
You know, Tony Robbins, forexample, when Covid hit, his entire
business model was based on inperson seminars. And like, you can't
(26:17):
meet in person anymore. Sohe's like, okay, we're going to do
Zoom seminars.
And like he jumped on withDean and did a thing. Right?
That's right. And you know,it's unheard of for him. Other people
are doing zoom stuff, but Tonywas doing nothing with zoom and he
completely pivoted. And now,you know, they're putting on these
100,000 plus person Zoomevents. And that was a form of innovation.
(26:41):
And so, you know, if you puton your thinking cap and think, what's
the problem that people haveand how can I really serve them?
You know, with the help of AIor not. It doesn't have to be with
AI, but how do you, how canyou really help people and find a
(27:01):
sustainable business model ordo a product line extension and add
other products into whatyou're, what you're currently selling?
Like the health coaches withthe supplements, me with the software
tool, some other form. Likefor me, it's like a hybrid of the
AI and the coaching. You know,I'm including, now I'm getting ready
(27:26):
to include in these AIcoaches. When you buy my package,
you get four AI coaches withthe package. So it's a bundled solution
of AI with me. And that's whatwe're gonna, we're gonna test out.
So I want to say something toyou guys that you don't know because
you don't know about theresearch. So when I dug into all
these 11 coaching models andit came back and told me what they
(27:47):
did good and what they were,the likely weaknesses were. And,
and it's spot. This isperfect, as you said, that salespeople
don't spend enough time doingthe thing. Right. And so it came
back and said, here's theweaknesses, here's the strengths,
here's how vulnerable theyare. And it was pretty brutal. I
mean, it was, it wasn't tryingto be brutal. It just said what it
(28:08):
thought. Right. So I'veincluded all that analysis in short
form, not in long forms. Itwould take too big space in the book
talking about those. Andhere's what I noticed in the seven
months that I did research andwriting. I noticed the skill, the
language, the analysis and theability of the chat GPT that I was
(28:29):
using doubled and then doubledagain just in that six month period.
Okay, seven months. So everythree months. So if you think about
1, 2, 3, 4, 5 more three monthperiod, that's going to be a 32 fold
increase by the date that Iwas analyzing for, which is Christmas
of next year. Well that's itshould be for any coach that isn't
(28:54):
doing the thing. And I'll tellyou what the thing is in my mind
in coaching in a minutethey're Toast because the 32 fold
increase in your competitor isgoing to wipe you off the map. And
the thing is what I notice youare a diligent ass busting dude.
I know that about you. Andhere's what's going to be left, the
(29:15):
5%. The only people that aregoing to be left are those that are
the truth. They are theembodiment of what they teach because
everybody, if they're not thatpersonally. So when it leaks out
of your eyes, it leaks out ofyour pores. The integrity, the truth.
In other words, you'reobviously the product of the product
and anybody that isn't that istalking about that thing over there.
(29:39):
In other words, it's somethingthey know how to do, but it isn't
them. Anything that's thatthing over there is going to be erased
by AI. What you've describedwith the vulnerability and the fact
that you're open and willingto do that is a demonstration of
what I'm talking about in that5%. I am a product of the product
of all these things and youtalk about that. So anyways, I did
(30:02):
all this research and got allthese numbers and I said give me
the income distribution nowand that was last March and give
me it in you know, 16, 18months, whatever it is Christmas
and it was worse in terms ofwho's making any money and everything.
And because it's going to gutout all that performative stuff about
talking about things overthere. So finally feeling frustrated,
I wrote in there and I saidokay, fine, what can't you do? What
(30:24):
do you suck at? What are yougoing to be horrible at? What are
you going to like completelyfail? I use that kind of language
like as frustrated as I couldpossibly sound. And it gave me an
interesting list of things.And the final one that it gave just
hit me like that, right? Itsaid, I can't bleed. And I thought,
(30:49):
okay, there is the thingbecause that is the connection that
we have lost during COVID Wehave lost with the digitization of
everything and AI. I mean,people. There's already stories about
people getting lost in thereand everything else. That's what's
going to be missing. And bybleed, it meant participate in the
actual human experience at thedepth of. Of truth, because that's
(31:15):
what carries power. And sothat is really what I'm, you know,
thinking about in terms ofwhat will be left is those coaches
that are willing to pivot andstop relying on the system or thing
they learned, which is talkingabout that thing over there, and
only do the things or teachthe things that they are a product
(31:40):
of. The product of. That'swhere they have the power of truth
and will do things that AIcan't do. So that's what I learned
in doing this research. Idon't know. What does that say to
you guys?
It's a. It's sayingexperience. It's like our experience.
And it brings up a funquestion of like, how are new coaches
(32:01):
going to get from here tothere? And it'll be interesting to
see because it was a. It was along journey for me to. And thank
goodness I got connected topeople like you, Kellen, and people
like you, Eric. That helped meto. To really shift my way of being
and showing up because if Ididn't do that, I'd still be strategy
(32:23):
and like, here's what youshould do and here's what you shouldn't
do. And trying to focus on thestrategies and the outside things
as the main point of mycoaching, which is now disappearing.
So it's interesting to thinkwhat's going to happen for these
new coaches that want to stepinto the coaching space.
(32:44):
I have an example for you, butI'm going to wait till Eric comments.
The reason I have one isyesterday on the call with Townsend,
there was a gal there who saidduring the question period, I'm a
brand new coach and I blah,blah, blah, blah and ask that. And
then I said some stuff and sodid Townsend. So I'll tell you in
a minute. But Eric, what doyou think about what I'll. That stuff
I just said?
(33:06):
Yeah, I don't. On thatparticular question, I don't really
have anything else to add to it.
Okay. So what that gal saidwas, I'm a New coach. And she was
a little bit emotional. She.She wasn't emotional because she
was scared. She was emotionalbecause she had the idea that she
had to get letters andcertifications and all that kind
of stuff. And I, you know, Isaid to her, the, the key, and I'm
(33:27):
saying it as reference to thathuman experience, all that's really
left for us to offer is thetruth of our experience. And in teaching,
sales and creating the kindsof things that you do, Eric, you're
already doing that. The truthof your life for the last 30 years
now, is it that many? Okay,the last 30 years, I thought that
(33:49):
it was close to that number.The last 30 years has been that.
And you've become the premierleader in that, in the world in that
field. And so what the girl orthe guy that wants to do that is.
Is this every interaction thatyou have a brand new coach? Yeah.
You can study some stuff, youcan learn some methodologies if you
(34:10):
want. All of them are useful.And in order for them to have power
and be useful, they have to besomething you do. They have to be
in you. Because truth carriesits own power. If I'm talking about
that, even if I say the samewords, it doesn't carry the same
power as from person who hasexperienced those things, whether
(34:33):
it's a process of doingcertain steps or a personal experience.
And so one of the thingsTownsend said was just make sure
every interaction you havewith someone, you lead with love
and you leave them better thanyou found them. You leave them uplifted
and feeling like hope,possibility, that kind of stuff.
And that's how you get yourexperience and go. You can go from
(34:55):
zero to the 5%. Because thething that's missing in the big middle,
mediocre chunk of coachingthat is most coaches is they don't
spend enough time doing thething which is perfecting and growing
themselves instead of thinkingeverybody they talk to. I wonder
if they're hiring me. I wonderif they'll hire me. I need a client
(35:16):
kind of energy.
Yeah. Yeah. Something elseinteresting. If I can share that
I'm thinking about that's.It's pretty exciting. Is sometimes,
you know, this is a story of alocal coffee shop. I went in there
and I got some coffee and Ilike to put sugar in my. Kind of
have a sweet tooth. So I likea lot of sugar in my coffee. And
(35:36):
I said, I'd love some sugar.And they said, we don't have sugar.
And I was like, what, a coffeeshop that doesn't have sugar? What
the Heck is wrong with thisplace? Right? And the place was full.
And I was thinking, you know,if I thought of starting a coffee
shop, I would never think tonot have sugar. I mean, I love sugar
in my coffee, so of course Iwouldn't. I think sometimes, you
(35:59):
know, sometimes there's theselittle different things that we can
just. What we believe in andwhat's true for us is like they had
natural maple syrup that theyuse for the sweetener, and they weren't.
They didn't. They didn't shyaway from creating that. And they
were full of people they like,they led with their heart. They led
what was meaningful to themand what they wanted to offer the
(36:24):
community and the peoplearound them. And they were the busiest
coffee shop in the whole town.So I think there's something in that
for coaches as well to thinkabout. And then also sometimes, you
know, staying the same andthings are changing so fast, leading
from the heart and staying thesame. Sometimes maybe we don't have
(36:47):
to add all these things. Wecan just stay the same. And really,
I mean, like I said, takingpeople out into the woods could be
even more valuable in my heartand eyes of what I'm seeing. So sometimes
I think staying the same andknowing what works, it's like, you
know, when you find what worksfor you and your experience, you
(37:08):
can share that. So it's likeif you. Your heart says pivot, pivot.
If your heart says, hey, thisis working for me, you know, stick
with what's working for you.But it's exciting because it's going
to be exciting to see. I loveit. It's a great. I think it's a
great tool, and I know, Ithink a lot of people are scared
about it, but I think it's agreat, great tool to use when we
(37:32):
use it from the heart.
What do you think, Eric?
Yeah, on that topic, I. Idon't have anything else to add on
that.
So what haven't we talkedabout? Eric, I'll start with you.
What haven't we talked aboutthat you think is important for pivoting,
(37:53):
for coaches to know, for theprofession in general, so that we
use it in a good way and thatit helps us instead of just pulling
out all. I think it's a goodthing. It's going to pull out all
the mediocre stuff. So that'sgreat. But anyway, what haven't you
talked about that you want to.
(38:14):
I think one of the originalpoints that I was making today was
it's. It's really. It's not somuch about, you know, AI or technology,
but what's, what's the resultthat we can produce for people? What's
the transformation that we cancreate for people? And human beings
have problems. And you know,as powerful as this tool is, it's
(38:35):
not going to, you know, changehuman beings from having problems.
One thing that I have latelybeen interested in sharing with people
is I've added in this idea ofa sales miracle into my conversations
and it's helping a human beingcreate a result that's beyond their
(38:57):
current way of thinking. Soone of my clients, his name is Barry,
and Barry had his firsthundred thousand dollar day the other
day. And you know, that was amiracle because it's not how Barry
normally thought. Another oneof my clients, Jerry, this week,
she had a $5,000 week. And Isaid, you know, how many weeks have
(39:17):
you had in Your career of5,000? She goes, None. This is the
first one ever that's a salesmiracle. And so it's, you're it,
it's helping people createsomething that's, that's beyond their
current thinking. So that'ssomething that I'm, I'm excited about
teaching. I'm not concernedabout, you know, AI being able to
(39:42):
produce that result. And Idon't know, maybe it can, I don't
know if it can or can't, butcreating that possibility for people
and, you know, giving thething with, with AI, it's, it's based
on what you're prompting itwith. And so what I'm pointing to
is something that it's, it'sproviding a new way of thinking versus,
(40:04):
you know, the, the promptingof the AI. And so, you know, we'll
see how it all, all unfolds.But look, I guess I'll just wrap
with lead looking at how youcan innovate. How can you innovate?
Because if my softwareaccountability tool hits, it's a
multimillion dollar play,which would be amazing, right? To
(40:27):
help way more people than I'veever helped before and make way more
money than I've ever madebefore. So perhaps somebody that's
listening to this can come upwith some type of innovation that
will allow them to createsomething even greater for themselves.
Maybe not the industry as awhole, but for them as an individual.
Well, I love that and thegrowth. And I'm just pointing one
(40:50):
more time to the essence ofwhat AI isn't, and that is your use
of the word miracle. So AIwouldn't think, AI wouldn't create
those kinds of words unlessyou Prompted it to and told it to
use that kind of language. Andit might, if that's the kind of language
you use, because I've done somany books and stuff like that. I
(41:11):
opened a thread called OneMillion Words and I put all my books
in there and a whole bunch ofpodcasts and everything. And after
a while, Chatty corrected meand said, it's about four and a half
million words. And I said,okay. And so now when it talks, you
know, when I talk, we chat. Itquotes from my own books and it talks
to me like I do. And so youcan train it, which is what you're
(41:33):
saying. And innovation. I lovethat thrust. And your use and thinking
of the word miracledemonstrates to me that kind of connection.
Robert, what do you have tosay for, for a final thought if you
have something you haven't said?
Well, I love what Eric'ssaying because I heard a definition
of what a miracle is once andAmerica was a shift in perception.
(41:56):
So it's anytime we can have ashift in perception to become more
open. And if AI helps peopledo that, that's great. I love it.
I want to say thank you forhaving me on here. This has been
a blast. Thank you, Eric, foreverything you shared. You've opened
my eyes up a lot to, to AI andthinking about ways that I haven't
(42:20):
thought about using it. Sothanks for, for being here too. It's
exciting to see you again.
Yeah, well, thanks, both ofyou. Go ahead.
I want to make one more point,Kellen, before we wrap. And this
idea of the sales miracle,it's a new word for me. I've used
the word before, but not likeintentionally consistently. And that
(42:42):
came out of. I'll give a shoutout to a woman named Sarah Victory
who has a very brilliant mind.And we had a one on one zoom and
she was the one that reallypointed me to articulating the cell's
miracle. It was, it wasn't AI.So if I had gone to AI and said,
you know, give me some booktitles, give me some this, give me
some that, it's different whenanother human being that I'm really
(43:06):
connected to is like Eric, Ifeel really strongly about this sales
miracle thing. And then Istart using it and I start seeing
how people are responding andthen I resonate it, it's. It's highly
unlikely that I would have hada similar experience with Chat GPT
and it came from another humanbeing that landed a point with me.
(43:29):
And so real value got created.And you know, that's what Sarah does.
That's why she's brilliant.And that's where we have that. That
opportunity as coaches topoint somebody to if their marriage
is struggling and to pointthem to the possibility of that they
can pull it back together andthen they act on it. If you go to
ChatGPT, if you. It's possibleyou could get a tip to pull your
(43:53):
marriage back together, but ahuman being that really lands that.
And lands that possibilitylands that miracle opportunity. I
think that's. That's aninteresting idea to consider.
It's fabulous. And it onlycomes from that connection, because
if you hadn't been Had a. Hadan energetic connection or whatever
word you want to substitute inthere with that gal as you were talking
(44:15):
to her, the. The use of thatword wouldn't have mattered. But
because you had that feelingand it was presented and transmitted
in that process, then itlands. And that is the realm of the
5% that will be left. Andthose that cannot create that connection
are going to be lost. Allright, I want to thank both of you
(44:36):
glorious human beings. It'sbeen a minute since I saw all of
you, so bless your hearts andthanks for being here.
You're welcome.
All right, you guys, listen tothis. I want you to go back and listen
a couple of times. These twoguys are both very successful. I've
known them for a while, and Iknow that Eric and his sales work
(44:57):
is the best there is. And theideas that both of them have presented
are really valuable. So if youtake this to heart and explore and
develop your own ability tocreate the only connection that matters,
then you can have a successfulcoaching career, not get washed away
as the tsunami wipes out themiddle of mediocrity, and that will
(45:19):
allow you to move forward andcreate your ultimate life.
Hello and welcome to thisepisode of your ultimate life, the
podcast created to help youcreate a life of purpose, prosperity
and joy using the skills,gifts and the life experience that
you have. This is our specialThursday edition that is featuring
coaches talking about therising, the development and the growth
(00:21):
of artificial intelligence,we're calling it. It's not actually
intelligent yet, but hey, thatproduct. And so each week on Thursday,
we're having a conversationwith a couple of coaches to talk
about what they think, whatthey're doing with it and what they're
not using and so forth. Andthat's what we're doing today. So,
Robert and Eric, welcome tothe show.
(00:43):
Thanks for having me.
Great to be here, Kellen.
All right, great. So, Robert,you accidentally ended up in my upper
left hand corner. So I amgoing to start it with a question,
although we're not reallygoing to conduct it as a structured
set of questions. And thefirst question I have for you is,
are you using some form of oneof the LLMs AIs in your coaching?
(01:05):
And if you are, how, what doyou, what do you notice with it?
Why are you using it? What'sit doing for you? If. If that's true?
I use AI very limitedly forposts on social media. So I would
say I'm on the spectrum oftesting and not using. I'm just testing
to see a lot of the posts thatI make. I'll write out and then I
(01:29):
put it into AI to see how theycan condense it. Because I have a,
I have a tendency when I startto write something, it ends up being
like 20 pages. And I thinksometimes on social media, sometimes
it's nice to be more concise.So I do, I do appreciate the conciseness
of it. Also use it to generateimages that will go with stories
(01:50):
that I share stories abouttransformation and create images.
However, the way that I'vebeen using it, I found it, it's not
as connecting as what I'd liketo see. And I'm sure there's a way
to use it that would be moreconnecting. I just haven't discovered
that for myself yet. But I douse it and test it.
(02:12):
What does connecting mean?
Well, to connect with. Connectwith somebody, the story help people
connect with what the story ismeant to share. I like to share stories
with people online that canhelp give them an. A vision of transformation
for themselves as apossibility to encourage conversation,
(02:33):
to create conversations withpeople for coaching.
Cool. Eric, what about you?What are you doing with this tool?
I know just from things yousaid before that you're using it.
But I don't know exactly whatand I'm not going to pretend I do.
So tell us what you're doingwith it.
Sure. One of the things thatI'm doing is a lot of the coaching
(02:55):
sessions that I'm doing withpeople. I'm on Zoom and recording
it, getting the transcript andthen providing them the transcript
either put into AI or creatinga custom GPT and putting all of the
session recordings into thereand using that as a, a data, data
(03:18):
point. I'm using video for AIfor landing pages, having a AI clone
of me and I'll have myassistant help me with those videos.
I've created some, I call themAI coaches. I have an AI, excuse
(03:39):
me, an AI manifesting coach.And so it's a, a guided experience
with Chat GPT to enhance thecoaching and I'm providing people.
So those are, those are acouple of initial things that come
to my mind.
Are you, did you create yourown, like I asked Chad GPT and there's
(04:00):
a bunch of others, Grok andClaude and all the others. I use
ChatGPT the most and it soundslike maybe you guys do too, although
you may use other ones. Haveyou created your own custom following
instructions there or did youhire a programmer to do a sort of
walled.
Off version of something withwhat I call the AI manifesting coach?
(04:24):
I built that myself. I hiredan AI guy to train me on how to do
it and so that one I built onmy own.
Either one of you, what, whatdo you find, what do you find most
helpful about using it?Robert, you mentioned a thing that
(04:45):
it doesn't seem to connect aswell as you like. And I'm not. You
told me, but I'm not sure Iunderstand exactly what the that
meant. So you can elaborate ifyou want to and either one of you,
what do you think is really helpful?
I'd love to elaborate. It, Iguess, I guess it means like impressions,
people responding to it.There's not a whole lot of response
(05:06):
when I use it. That's what Imeant by what I was sharing. But
one thing I do love about it,when Eric shared, I do use it for
my Zoom calls because Zoom hasan AI built into it and it's. Sometimes
it's really fun for notes. It,it will, it will take everything
that was shared, the actionsteps, the things that we talked
about and it breaks everythingdown and it, it's really good for
(05:30):
that and I do use it for that.I think it's fun. I like, I Do like
to use it. I just haven'tfound my way to use it that that
is beneficial to grow mycoaching business yet.
Cool. Say that. What, what doyou really like about it, Eric?
I like we started buildingwebsites with Gamma and I'm having
(05:55):
my assistant build thosewebsites so we don't have to go to
an outside source in order tobuild them. We can build them very
quickly. I like that aspect. Ilike using AI as a thinking partner
and it's kind of like, like amastermind that's going to generate
(06:15):
lots of ideas that I hadn'tthought of before. I also like training
my clients on how to use theAI and having, having me be one of
their go to sources fortraining. So it positions me as an
expert in the AI salestraining space. So those are, those
(06:37):
are a couple of examples.
What do you mean? So you'vebeen doing sales training for a long
time and as far as I'mconcerned you're the best that we
have right now and so you'reusing it. There's two questions really.
How do you use it to help yourclients with sales training?
(06:58):
Well, you know, with ourability to record a coaching call,
a salesperson could recordtheir sales presentation and have
it transcribed and then askChatGPT to analyze the sales presentation
for its strengths andweaknesses, make recommendations
(07:19):
on how to make thepresentation better. And so that
idea is probably not intuitivefor most salespeople. So teaching
ideas like that, which in away it may be, you know, creating
competition for myself, but mythought is they're going to, they're
going to go out and learn itsomewhere so they might as well learn
(07:41):
it from me and have meposition be positioned as the expert
that helped them. There's alot that I can do in creating sales
scripts, emails, a simplething like somebody sends you an
email, you can copy the email,put into AI and say, you know, write
a response to this email. Justreal practical tips like that is
(08:04):
something I enjoy teaching my clients.
You said something about usingit as a thinking partner. That's
a phrase that a number ofcoaches that I've interviewed have,
have talked about and I'mcurious what you mean by it. Everybody
means whatever they mean. Howis it a thinking partner for you?
Yeah, so I want to deliver 100speeches next year as an example.
(08:27):
So I could type in a chat andsay, you know, I'd like to deliver
100 speeches. You know, whatideas do you have? What, what lead
sources, what potentialchallenges might I encounter? You
know, do you even think that'sa good idea to have that as a goal
and so I can just see what,what it has to say or if I'm just,
(08:51):
if I'm struggling withsomething, maybe I have a personal
relationship that's not goingthe way that I want. I can type in
and explain. Here's, here'swhat's happening. Here's my story.
What do you think? And it's,it's come up with some really effective
ideas to help me.
Yesterday I spoke to TownsendWardlaw's group called coach's operating
(09:15):
system for an hour and a halfand Townsend wrote the forward for
the book for me and he told astory in there and he retold it on
the, the webinar yesterday andI'm going to share it with you because
of what you just said. He saidthat what really woke him up to this
is he had a, his wife is alsoa coach and anyway they have a great
(09:38):
relationship, et cetera, etcetera. And he said then there was
a situation where they got insome kind of an argument or disagreement
or whatever and it didn't getresolved at night and so they went
to bed and it was negativeenergy. And the way he described
it yesterday on the call wasmore exciting than it is in the forward
but like it was a prettyserious thing. But anyway he got
(09:58):
up the next day and did hisown preparation, morning routine
and whatever, got himselfsquared away and he expected the
energy to be the same in themorning. And his wife was just like
all in good shape. And heasked her name's Luisa. And he said
Luisa, what's, what's goingon? And she said oh, I'm fine. I
used chat GPT and it coachedme through this just fine. And he
(10:22):
said it was like a face palmmoment for him because then he realized,
you know what he said? And hesaid this yesterday. He said well
if you know that can happen,what the frick is going to be left
for coaches? Like what I meanthis worked and here she is and it's
all solved. And you mentionedhaving good ideas and so forth. And
(10:45):
so one of the premise reason Iwrote the book is because I see a
huge change in the coachingindustry and like tons of coaches
that today coach a particularway aren't going to be able to find
clients because you're goingto be able to buy all that stuff
for $29 a month or $79 a monthor some amount of money to buy some
kind of coaching that'sactually quite good. And so to both
(11:08):
of you, what do you thinkabout that kind of thing, what do
you see as changes, if any? Ithink they're going to be pretty
radical.
Sure. Well, I'll, I'llcomment. You know, if you think about
why would somebody hire acoach in the first place, probably
they have a problem that theywant solved or they want help with
(11:32):
it. You know, I'm in the, thesales training space, so I teach
people how to make more moneyand make more sales, create a sales
miracle. And so I don't, Idon't envision that that's, that's
going to change. I'm notenvisioning that. All of a sudden
now that AI is here, peoplewill no longer have sales problems.
(11:53):
And so I'm not anticipatingfor me personally that there's going
to be an issue. I think itjust comes down to a coach's ability
to have a way that they canhelp people, whatever that niche
is. And in the example thatyou just gave with Townsend and his
(12:14):
wife and the, the AI helping,helping them.
You.
Know, is that going to solveall relationship trouble between
husbands and wives? Probablynot, right?
No, probably not. Of course not.
So there's, there's the, the,the tool of, of the AI and how it
can help. But you know, we'veall, all of us on this call and the
(12:39):
people we're coaching havelikely been on the planet for decades.
And so we have decades ofthinking patterns, we have decades
of how we eat. If you're inthe health and wellness coaching
space, we have decades of howwe relate with people. And so, you
know, having AI as a tool, itdoesn't undo decades of thinking.
(13:00):
And so I don't personally havea, a concern for myself. I, I, I
guess it just on a case bycase basis of if people have the
skill set to go out andposition themselves, acquire clients,
having strategies to connectwith people. I also think though
(13:20):
that the clients themselvesare going to be wanting AI to be
a part of the coachingprocess. Like if I'm providing transcripts
that they can put through AIand then they complete their coaching
agreement with me and thenthey go hire their next coach, they're
probably going to want sometype of similar process. So I think
that being able to incorporateAI into the coaching, maybe something
(13:46):
that people regularly startlooking for.
Robert, what do you thinkabout that?
Well, I love, I love whatyou're sharing, Eric. And I, I, I
love the idea of coachingbeing, it's, it's a spiritual experience,
a heart to heart experience.Whenever I'm coaching with people,
(14:06):
it's a There's a level ofconnection that I'm not sure people
can recreate through AI.Maybe. Maybe it can be recreated.
I'm not sure that it's thereyet, maybe someday, but I think there's
a. There's some type of aconnection and transmission that
happens in a deep coaching anda deep connection with another human
(14:29):
being that the further that weget away from that, I feel like is
going to create a massivedistinction for that real human connection,
you know, that real meaningfulhuman connection. And there's part
of me that kind of thinksmaybe like retreats in the woods
(14:49):
and things like that out. Awayfrom AI, away from everything may
become. They may becomeperceived as more valuable. And maybe
that human connection will befor the coaches that really shift
into a practice of, of beingand. And spiritual connection and,
(15:11):
and connecting with otherhumans in that. In that space that
may become even more valuable.
The. In the research that Idid, I took about 11 coaching models
that I am aware of. And Iwasn't trying to be exhaustive, but
(15:32):
many coaching models that havenames and so forth and I and analyze
them with the help ofdifferent LLMs. And I said how. I
asked several questions, butthe important ones where I said,
how. How good? And I realizedit goes out in the Internet and looks
for everything. But I said,how good are these methodologies
at providing the results thatpeople want, the intended outcome?
(15:56):
And it, it came back withquite an interesting spreadsheet,
you know, with all the modelsand how good it is. You know, people
pay money most of the timethey want help with business or finance
or money. But there's alsorelationships and how they feel about
themselves and meaning in lifeand a whole bunch of other things.
(16:17):
And that was interesting. Andthen I asked it, okay, cool. How
vulnerable do you think? And Iwas using a year and a half at the
time because I started inMarch. How vulnerable do you think
these methodologies are givenwhat they do to, to the advances
in AI and what wasinteresting, and it rated them all
(16:40):
low vulnerability, medium andhigh, and told me why and everything
like that. And so the thingthat I see and it. I also ask it
for an income distribution. Isaid today, how much do coaches make?
And it gave me, you know, only50% here, 70%, 80% and gave me an
income breakdown based onpublicly available data. And all
(17:03):
those things put together pluswhat it's going to be able to do
is what led me to theconclusion that I felt it anyway
to start with, but it led meto the conclusion that it's probably
Worse than I thought. And thething that's going to be eviscerated
is anything that has to dowith systems, lists, checklists,
(17:24):
processes, those kinds ofthings can be done faster, better
and in better language thanany human can be. Both of you have.
Robert, you said it directly.And Eric, I think you did this too.
You talk about teaching peopleto sell, but there's. Especially
with selling. And you knowthis because you've been doing this
(17:46):
for forever, especially withthat. There's this other element
that has to know, has not todo with the mechanics of conversation
and sales, but it has to dowith confidence, capability, and,
you know, people's assessmentof their own value and possibility.
And if you look at what willbe left, I. It. It will be more valuable
(18:10):
and it will be more powerful,and it will be only based on the
truth of the human connection.Is what I'm led to conclude by what
I. What I both read and what Ifeel, and nothing, or relatively
nothing to do with. And notsaying that any of the methodologies
(18:31):
are not good, the tools andsystems are okay, but that is all
duplic. Duplicable, if that'sa word. Duplicable by the. By the
increasing intelligence. Andso if, if all that's really left
for us is the truth of humanconnection, what needs to happen
(18:53):
for coaches to stay in business?
Yeah, I think it's a personal.It's really a personal. What's the
word? It's like going on theadventure of really discovering what
we're capable of personallyand really pushing the boundaries
(19:14):
for ourselves or exploringwhere are the boundaries, and continuing
to grow spiritually and learnhow to connect with people in meaningful
ways that really makes adifference in their life. You know,
connect to that. The. Thespirit of possibility and creation
(19:34):
and love and whatever.Whatever that thing is, you know,
that thing that makes us comealive. So I think it's. It's. It's
creating a life where we feelmost alive. And I think that's the
thing that really, reallyconnects with people in a deep way
in my experience, becausethere have been times, of course,
(19:54):
when I haven't felt alive andmy business has struggled because
I've been just going throughthe motions. And the other thing
that I think is, I think it'sexciting to think that people are
going to create all thesethings and they're getting the results,
but the feeling they're notgoing to have the feeling they're
not going to have thatexperience that they want. They're
(20:15):
going to be creating all thisstuff without the actual experience
of feeling alive. And they'regoing to be like, what the hell?
You know, excuse, excuse mylanguage. I'm not sure sure what
the level of language,whatever, but people, you know, exciting
people.
Don't go crazy on me, okay?
Okay, I won't. I want. Okay,yeah, hell's. That's the, that's
the level, whatever. But Ithink people are going to be excited,
(20:37):
excited to connect becausethey're going to create these outcomes
without the feeling. Andthey're going to find the meaning
is really not in the outcomebut in the, in the feeling. It's
like, what do we want? We wantthe feeling, you know, we can have
all these results, but what dowe really want? What do we do anything
for? We want to feel it. Wewant to feel good, we want to feel
(20:58):
alive.
You know, Eric, what goesthrough your mind when you think
about what's really going tobe left when AI gets developed more
than it is?
Yeah, I think that there's abusiness aspect of this. In my business
right now I'm looking at asoftware play and one of the things
(21:23):
I started doing with coachingclients is accountability. And I
created an accountabilityproduct where they're sending me
an end of day report, but I'malso sending them an end of day report.
So I'm accountable to them,they're accountable to me. And it's
giving them an opportunity tolook at what does high performance
(21:46):
look like. Because I'm a veryhigh performing person. And so, you
know, in my background, Iworked for Tony Robbins as an example
and I got a chance to, I had afront row seat at what high performance
looked like and I learned alot from that. And most people probably
have never had a front rowseat to that. So I'm looking at some
software to potentially buildaccountability relationships with
(22:10):
several thousand people. Sothat's, that's a business strategy
where it's not just me workingwith somebody one on one, but bringing
software in as an additionalrevenue stream. I'm doing some work
with some health coaches rightnow and they are representing a health
(22:30):
product line. So it's asupplement product line. It's a lab
testing. AI is at this pointis not doing lab testing and it's.
You can't get supplements fromAI and so.
No, of course not.
They've got an additionalincome stream. You know, you, you
sell somebody on supplementsand if they are taking them and potentially
(22:53):
you've got a customer forlife. And so I think it's interesting
if I was a coach right now andI was looking at, you know, the p.
The picture that you'repainting and seeing, you know, what
are other additional incomestreams that I could bring into my
business that would be, wouldbe in alignment with the way I want
(23:14):
to express myself and thecontribution that I want to make.
So those are a couple thoughts.
You said something reallyinteresting about that accountability
and it, to me at least,because I know you. Interesting.
Some of the folks I'veinterviewed here, I haven't. I know
their names and I know them,but just barely. And you. I know
more. The way you'redescribing the accountability, I
(23:38):
think is what will make thatwork. And that is not them sending
a bunch of accountabilitystuff to you, which is a. So what
deal you sending something tothem represents a level of disclosure,
vulnerability and connectionthat gets to this heart of thing
that isn't duplicable. And soI just, I love that when you said
that. I'm thinking that that'swhy it will work.
(24:02):
The thing about it that'sunique is it's, it's my unique expression
because. Yeah, you know,because you know me personally, you
know what, what a hard workerI am. And a lot of people in sales,
they're just not putting inenough time doing the thing.
Doing the thing. I love it.
(24:22):
And so, you know, I'm doingthe thing. And there are days that
I don't make any sales and Idisclose that the vulnerability within
the, the accountability andthey also get, get a chance to see
my consistency. It's one thingto know me from a zoom, but it's
another thing to see like I'mtalking about how I'm interacting
with my wife or my kids or myfitness or whatnot. And so it's,
(24:46):
it's that it's more aboutrelationship than accountability.
I'm not like, hard on them ifthey're not following through on
what they say they're going todo. It's just more of, of having
that connection. And so Ithink it's, it's interesting to think
about how could I, if I'm acoach, how could I reach instead
(25:09):
of, you know, 20 clients, howcould I reach 200? Leveraging technology,
how could I reach 2,000? Howcould I reach, you know, 20,000?
You know, I think I couldreach thousands and thousands of
people through like a 49amonthsoftware where they have a chance
to have an opportunity tointeract with me personally through
(25:32):
this tool. And so we'll see.Right now I'm doing it on a manual
basis. I'm in the process ofFinding the right technology partner
to help me. But that's an.It's an innovative way of addressing
what you're pointing thecoaches to of just same old, same
old status quo is likely notgoing to get it done.
(25:54):
It's going to be gone. I'm noteven going to likely you're toast.
And if you. Not you, butyou're toast if you can't do that.
But I interrupted you, sofinish up.
Yeah. So I think it's just amatter of, you know, how do we pivot?
You know, Tony Robbins, forexample, when Covid hit, his entire
business model was based on inperson seminars. And like, you can't
(26:17):
meet in person anymore. Sohe's like, okay, we're going to do
Zoom seminars.
And like he jumped on withDean and did a thing. Right?
That's right. And you know,it's unheard of for him. Other people
are doing zoom stuff, but Tonywas doing nothing with zoom and he
completely pivoted. And now,you know, they're putting on these
100,000 plus person Zoomevents. And that was a form of innovation.
(26:41):
And so, you know, if you puton your thinking cap and think, what's
the problem that people haveand how can I really serve them?
You know, with the help of AIor not. It doesn't have to be with
AI, but how do you, how canyou really help people and find a
(27:01):
sustainable business model ordo a product line extension and add
other products into whatyou're, what you're currently selling?
Like the health coaches withthe supplements, me with the software
tool, some other form. Likefor me, it's like a hybrid of the
AI and the coaching. You know,I'm including, now I'm getting ready
(27:26):
to include in these AIcoaches. When you buy my package,
you get four AI coaches withthe package. So it's a bundled solution
of AI with me. And that's whatwe're gonna, we're gonna test out.
So I want to say something toyou guys that you don't know because
you don't know about theresearch. So when I dug into all
these 11 coaching models andit came back and told me what they
(27:47):
did good and what they were,the likely weaknesses were. And,
and it's spot. This isperfect, as you said, that salespeople
don't spend enough time doingthe thing. Right. And so it came
back and said, here's theweaknesses, here's the strengths,
here's how vulnerable theyare. And it was pretty brutal. I
mean, it was, it wasn't tryingto be brutal. It just said what it
(28:08):
thought. Right. So I'veincluded all that analysis in short
form, not in long forms. Itwould take too big space in the book
talking about those. Andhere's what I noticed in the seven
months that I did research andwriting. I noticed the skill, the
language, the analysis and theability of the chat GPT that I was
(28:29):
using doubled and then doubledagain just in that six month period.
Okay, seven months. So everythree months. So if you think about
1, 2, 3, 4, 5 more three monthperiod, that's going to be a 32 fold
increase by the date that Iwas analyzing for, which is Christmas
of next year. Well that's itshould be for any coach that isn't
(28:54):
doing the thing. And I'll tellyou what the thing is in my mind
in coaching in a minutethey're Toast because the 32 fold
increase in your competitor isgoing to wipe you off the map. And
the thing is what I notice youare a diligent ass busting dude.
I know that about you. Andhere's what's going to be left, the
(29:15):
5%. The only people that aregoing to be left are those that are
the truth. They are theembodiment of what they teach because
everybody, if they're not thatpersonally. So when it leaks out
of your eyes, it leaks out ofyour pores. The integrity, the truth.
In other words, you'reobviously the product of the product
and anybody that isn't that istalking about that thing over there.
(29:39):
In other words, it's somethingthey know how to do, but it isn't
them. Anything that's thatthing over there is going to be erased
by AI. What you've describedwith the vulnerability and the fact
that you're open and willingto do that is a demonstration of
what I'm talking about in that5%. I am a product of the product
of all these things and youtalk about that. So anyways, I did
(30:02):
all this research and got allthese numbers and I said give me
the income distribution nowand that was last March and give
me it in you know, 16, 18months, whatever it is Christmas
and it was worse in terms ofwho's making any money and everything.
And because it's going to gutout all that performative stuff about
talking about things overthere. So finally feeling frustrated,
I wrote in there and I saidokay, fine, what can't you do? What
(30:24):
do you suck at? What are yougoing to be horrible at? What are
you going to like completelyfail? I use that kind of language
like as frustrated as I couldpossibly sound. And it gave me an
interesting list of things.And the final one that it gave just
hit me like that, right? Itsaid, I can't bleed. And I thought,
(30:49):
okay, there is the thingbecause that is the connection that
we have lost during COVID Wehave lost with the digitization of
everything and AI. I mean,people. There's already stories about
people getting lost in thereand everything else. That's what's
going to be missing. And bybleed, it meant participate in the
actual human experience at thedepth of. Of truth, because that's
(31:15):
what carries power. And sothat is really what I'm, you know,
thinking about in terms ofwhat will be left is those coaches
that are willing to pivot andstop relying on the system or thing
they learned, which is talkingabout that thing over there, and
only do the things or teachthe things that they are a product
(31:40):
of. The product of. That'swhere they have the power of truth
and will do things that AIcan't do. So that's what I learned
in doing this research. Idon't know. What does that say to
you guys?
It's a. It's sayingexperience. It's like our experience.
And it brings up a funquestion of like, how are new coaches
(32:01):
going to get from here tothere? And it'll be interesting to
see because it was a. It was along journey for me to. And thank
goodness I got connected topeople like you, Kellen, and people
like you, Eric. That helped meto. To really shift my way of being
and showing up because if Ididn't do that, I'd still be strategy
(32:23):
and like, here's what youshould do and here's what you shouldn't
do. And trying to focus on thestrategies and the outside things
as the main point of mycoaching, which is now disappearing.
So it's interesting to thinkwhat's going to happen for these
new coaches that want to stepinto the coaching space.
(32:44):
I have an example for you, butI'm going to wait till Eric comments.
The reason I have one isyesterday on the call with Townsend,
there was a gal there who saidduring the question period, I'm a
brand new coach and I blah,blah, blah, blah and ask that. And
then I said some stuff and sodid Townsend. So I'll tell you in
a minute. But Eric, what doyou think about what I'll. That stuff
I just said?
(33:06):
Yeah, I don't. On thatparticular question, I don't really
have anything else to add to it.
Okay. So what that gal saidwas, I'm a New coach. And she was
a little bit emotional. She.She wasn't emotional because she
was scared. She was emotionalbecause she had the idea that she
had to get letters andcertifications and all that kind
of stuff. And I, you know, Isaid to her, the, the key, and I'm
(33:27):
saying it as reference to thathuman experience, all that's really
left for us to offer is thetruth of our experience. And in teaching,
sales and creating the kindsof things that you do, Eric, you're
already doing that. The truthof your life for the last 30 years
now, is it that many? Okay,the last 30 years, I thought that
(33:49):
it was close to that number.The last 30 years has been that.
And you've become the premierleader in that, in the world in that
field. And so what the girl orthe guy that wants to do that is.
Is this every interaction thatyou have a brand new coach? Yeah.
You can study some stuff, youcan learn some methodologies if you
(34:10):
want. All of them are useful.And in order for them to have power
and be useful, they have to besomething you do. They have to be
in you. Because truth carriesits own power. If I'm talking about
that, even if I say the samewords, it doesn't carry the same
power as from person who hasexperienced those things, whether
(34:33):
it's a process of doingcertain steps or a personal experience.
And so one of the thingsTownsend said was just make sure
every interaction you havewith someone, you lead with love
and you leave them better thanyou found them. You leave them uplifted
and feeling like hope,possibility, that kind of stuff.
And that's how you get yourexperience and go. You can go from
(34:55):
zero to the 5%. Because thething that's missing in the big middle,
mediocre chunk of coachingthat is most coaches is they don't
spend enough time doing thething which is perfecting and growing
themselves instead of thinkingeverybody they talk to. I wonder
if they're hiring me. I wonderif they'll hire me. I need a client
(35:16):
kind of energy.
Yeah. Yeah. Something elseinteresting. If I can share that
I'm thinking about that's.It's pretty exciting. Is sometimes,
you know, this is a story of alocal coffee shop. I went in there
and I got some coffee and Ilike to put sugar in my. Kind of
have a sweet tooth. So I likea lot of sugar in my coffee. And
(35:36):
I said, I'd love some sugar.And they said, we don't have sugar.
And I was like, what, a coffeeshop that doesn't have sugar? What
the Heck is wrong with thisplace? Right? And the place was full.
And I was thinking, you know,if I thought of starting a coffee
shop, I would never think tonot have sugar. I mean, I love sugar
in my coffee, so of course Iwouldn't. I think sometimes, you
(35:59):
know, sometimes there's theselittle different things that we can
just. What we believe in andwhat's true for us is like they had
natural maple syrup that theyuse for the sweetener, and they weren't.
They didn't. They didn't shyaway from creating that. And they
were full of people they like,they led with their heart. They led
what was meaningful to themand what they wanted to offer the
(36:24):
community and the peoplearound them. And they were the busiest
coffee shop in the whole town.So I think there's something in that
for coaches as well to thinkabout. And then also sometimes, you
know, staying the same andthings are changing so fast, leading
from the heart and staying thesame. Sometimes maybe we don't have
(36:47):
to add all these things. Wecan just stay the same. And really,
I mean, like I said, takingpeople out into the woods could be
even more valuable in my heartand eyes of what I'm seeing. So sometimes
I think staying the same andknowing what works, it's like, you
know, when you find what worksfor you and your experience, you
(37:08):
can share that. So it's likeif you. Your heart says pivot, pivot.
If your heart says, hey, thisis working for me, you know, stick
with what's working for you.But it's exciting because it's going
to be exciting to see. I loveit. It's a great. I think it's a
great tool, and I know, Ithink a lot of people are scared
about it, but I think it's agreat, great tool to use when we
(37:32):
use it from the heart.
What do you think, Eric?
Yeah, on that topic, I. Idon't have anything else to add on
that.
So what haven't we talkedabout? Eric, I'll start with you.
What haven't we talked aboutthat you think is important for pivoting,
(37:53):
for coaches to know, for theprofession in general, so that we
use it in a good way and thatit helps us instead of just pulling
out all. I think it's a goodthing. It's going to pull out all
the mediocre stuff. So that'sgreat. But anyway, what haven't you
talked about that you want to.
(38:14):
I think one of the originalpoints that I was making today was
it's. It's really. It's not somuch about, you know, AI or technology,
but what's, what's the resultthat we can produce for people? What's
the transformation that we cancreate for people? And human beings
have problems. And you know,as powerful as this tool is, it's
(38:35):
not going to, you know, changehuman beings from having problems.
One thing that I have latelybeen interested in sharing with people
is I've added in this idea ofa sales miracle into my conversations
and it's helping a human beingcreate a result that's beyond their
(38:57):
current way of thinking. Soone of my clients, his name is Barry,
and Barry had his firsthundred thousand dollar day the other
day. And you know, that was amiracle because it's not how Barry
normally thought. Another oneof my clients, Jerry, this week,
she had a $5,000 week. And Isaid, you know, how many weeks have
(39:17):
you had in Your career of5,000? She goes, None. This is the
first one ever that's a salesmiracle. And so it's, you're it,
it's helping people createsomething that's, that's beyond their
current thinking. So that'ssomething that I'm, I'm excited about
teaching. I'm not concernedabout, you know, AI being able to
(39:42):
produce that result. And Idon't know, maybe it can, I don't
know if it can or can't, butcreating that possibility for people
and, you know, giving thething with, with AI, it's, it's based
on what you're prompting itwith. And so what I'm pointing to
is something that it's, it'sproviding a new way of thinking versus,
(40:04):
you know, the, the promptingof the AI. And so, you know, we'll
see how it all, all unfolds.But look, I guess I'll just wrap
with lead looking at how youcan innovate. How can you innovate?
Because if my softwareaccountability tool hits, it's a
multimillion dollar play,which would be amazing, right? To
(40:27):
help way more people than I'veever helped before and make way more
money than I've ever madebefore. So perhaps somebody that's
listening to this can come upwith some type of innovation that
will allow them to createsomething even greater for themselves.
Maybe not the industry as awhole, but for them as an individual.
Well, I love that and thegrowth. And I'm just pointing one
(40:50):
more time to the essence ofwhat AI isn't, and that is your use
of the word miracle. So AIwouldn't think, AI wouldn't create
those kinds of words unlessyou Prompted it to and told it to
use that kind of language. Andit might, if that's the kind of language
you use, because I've done somany books and stuff like that. I
(41:11):
opened a thread called OneMillion Words and I put all my books
in there and a whole bunch ofpodcasts and everything. And after
a while, Chatty corrected meand said, it's about four and a half
million words. And I said,okay. And so now when it talks, you
know, when I talk, we chat. Itquotes from my own books and it talks
to me like I do. And so youcan train it, which is what you're
(41:33):
saying. And innovation. I lovethat thrust. And your use and thinking
of the word miracledemonstrates to me that kind of connection.
Robert, what do you have tosay for, for a final thought if you
have something you haven't said?
Well, I love what Eric'ssaying because I heard a definition
of what a miracle is once andAmerica was a shift in perception.
(41:56):
So it's anytime we can have ashift in perception to become more
open. And if AI helps peopledo that, that's great. I love it.
I want to say thank you forhaving me on here. This has been
a blast. Thank you, Eric, foreverything you shared. You've opened
my eyes up a lot to, to AI andthinking about ways that I haven't
(42:20):
thought about using it. Sothanks for, for being here too. It's
exciting to see you again.
Yeah, well, thanks, both ofyou. Go ahead.
I want to make one more point,Kellen, before we wrap. And this
idea of the sales miracle,it's a new word for me. I've used
the word before, but not likeintentionally consistently. And that
(42:42):
came out of. I'll give a shoutout to a woman named Sarah Victory
who has a very brilliant mind.And we had a one on one zoom and
she was the one that reallypointed me to articulating the cell's
miracle. It was, it wasn't AI.So if I had gone to AI and said,
you know, give me some booktitles, give me some this, give me
some that, it's different whenanother human being that I'm really
(43:06):
connected to is like Eric, Ifeel really strongly about this sales
miracle thing. And then Istart using it and I start seeing
how people are responding andthen I resonate it, it's. It's highly
unlikely that I would have hada similar experience with Chat GPT
and it came from another humanbeing that landed a point with me.
(43:29):
And so real value got created.And you know, that's what Sarah does.
That's why she's brilliant.And that's where we have that. That
opportunity as coaches topoint somebody to if their marriage
is struggling and to pointthem to the possibility of that they
can pull it back together andthen they act on it. If you go to
ChatGPT, if you. It's possibleyou could get a tip to pull your
(43:53):
marriage back together, but ahuman being that really lands that.
And lands that possibilitylands that miracle opportunity. I
think that's. That's aninteresting idea to consider.
It's fabulous. And it onlycomes from that connection, because
if you hadn't been Had a. Hadan energetic connection or whatever
word you want to substitute inthere with that gal as you were talking
(44:15):
to her, the. The use of thatword wouldn't have mattered. But
because you had that feelingand it was presented and transmitted
in that process, then itlands. And that is the realm of the
5% that will be left. Andthose that cannot create that connection
are going to be lost. Allright, I want to thank both of you
(44:36):
glorious human beings. It'sbeen a minute since I saw all of
you, so bless your hearts andthanks for being here.
You're welcome.
All right, you guys, listen tothis. I want you to go back and listen
a couple of times. These twoguys are both very successful. I've
known them for a while, and Iknow that Eric and his sales work
(44:57):
is the best there is. And theideas that both of them have presented
are really valuable. So if youtake this to heart and explore and
develop your own ability tocreate the only connection that matters,
then you can have a successfulcoaching career, not get washed away
as the tsunami wipes out themiddle of mediocrity, and that will
(45:19):
allow you to move forward andcreate your ultimate life.
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The Burden
The Burden is a documentary series that takes listeners into the hidden places where justice is done (and undone). It dives deep into the lives of heroes and villains. And it focuses a spotlight on those who triumph even when the odds are against them. Season 5 - The Burden: Death & Deceit in Alliance On April Fools Day 1999, 26-year-old Yvonne Layne was found murdered in her Alliance, Ohio home. David Thorne, her ex-boyfriend and father of one of her children, was instantly a suspect. Another young man admitted to the murder, and David breathed a sigh of relief, until the confessed murderer fingered David; “He paid me to do it.” David was sentenced to life without parole. Two decades later, Pulitzer winner and podcast host, Maggie Freleng (Bone Valley Season 3: Graves County, Wrongful Conviction, Suave) launched a “live” investigation into David's conviction alongside Jason Baldwin (himself wrongfully convicted as a member of the West Memphis Three). Maggie had come to believe that the entire investigation of David was botched by the tiny local police department, or worse, covered up the real killer. Was Maggie correct? Was David’s claim of innocence credible? In Death and Deceit in Alliance, Maggie recounts the case that launched her career, and ultimately, “broke” her.” The results will shock the listener and reduce Maggie to tears and self-doubt. This is not your typical wrongful conviction story. In fact, it turns the genre on its head. It asks the question: What if our champions are foolish? Season 4 - The Burden: Get the Money and Run “Trying to murder my father, this was the thing that put me on the path.” That’s Joe Loya and that path was bank robbery. Bank, bank, bank, bank, bank. In season 4 of The Burden: Get the Money and Run, we hear from Joe who was once the most prolific bank robber in Southern California, and beyond. He used disguises, body doubles, proxies. He leaped over counters, grabbed the money and ran. Even as the FBI was closing in. It was a showdown between a daring bank robber, and a patient FBI agent. Joe was no ordinary bank robber. He was bright, articulate, charismatic, and driven by a dark rage that he summoned up at will. In seven episodes, Joe tells all: the what, the how… and the why. Including why he tried to murder his father. Season 3 - The Burden: Avenger Miriam Lewin is one of Argentina’s leading journalists today. At 19 years old, she was kidnapped off the streets of Buenos Aires for her political activism and thrown into a concentration camp. Thousands of her fellow inmates were executed, tossed alive from a cargo plane into the ocean. Miriam, along with a handful of others, will survive the camp. Then as a journalist, she will wage a decades long campaign to bring her tormentors to justice. Avenger is about one woman’s triumphant battle against unbelievable odds to survive torture, claim justice for the crimes done against her and others like her, and change the future of her country. Season 2 - The Burden: Empire on Blood Empire on Blood is set in the Bronx, NY, in the early 90s, when two young drug dealers ruled an intersection known as “The Corner on Blood.” The boss, Calvin Buari, lived large. He and a protege swore they would build an empire on blood. Then the relationship frayed and the protege accused Calvin of a double homicide which he claimed he didn’t do. But did he? Award-winning journalist Steve Fishman spent seven years to answer that question. This is the story of one man’s last chance to overturn his life sentence. He may prevail, but someone’s gotta pay. The Burden: Empire on Blood is the director’s cut of the true crime classic which reached #1 on the charts when it was first released half a dozen years ago. Season 1 - The Burden In the 1990s, Detective Louis N. Scarcella was legendary. In a city overrun by violent crime, he cracked the toughest cases and put away the worst criminals. “The Hulk” was his nickname. Then the story changed. Scarcella ran into a group of convicted murderers who all say they are innocent. They turned themselves into jailhouse-lawyers and in prison founded a lway firm. When they realized Scarcella helped put many of them away, they set their sights on taking him down. And with the help of a NY Times reporter they have a chance. For years, Scarcella insisted he did nothing wrong. But that’s all he’d say. Until we tracked Scarcella to a sauna in a Russian bathhouse, where he started to talk..and talk and talk. “The guilty have gone free,” he whispered. And then agreed to take us into the belly of the beast. Welcome to The Burden.