AI Is Making 71% of Workers Less Productive: The Truth About Tech Burnout + Why You Need $1.6M to Retire
We're tackling tackle two major workplace challenges:
- AI & Burnout: We expose alarming new research that shows a massive disconnect between executives and workers when it comes to AI. While 96% of leaders are betting big on AI to boost productivity, 71% of employees report it's actually making them less productive and more stressed. We unpack five hidden digital stressors that are burning out today's workforce and share real solutions for managing the tech overwhelm. Plus, find out why Gen Z – our most tech-savvy generation – is actually the most anxious about AI's impact.
- The Retirement Crisis: Brace yourself: we reveal why the average American now needs $1.6M to retire comfortably – and that number keeps climbing for younger generations. We break down exactly how much each generation needs to save (Gen Z, you might want to sit down for this), and count down the surprising best states for retirement in 2024. Is traditional retirement even realistic anymore? We get honest about what retirement might actually look like for millennials and beyond, plus share practical strategies for planning your financial future - like moving to Delaware.
Whether you're drowning in AI tools or wondering if you'll ever be able to retire, we've got the data, the insights, and the real talk you need to hear.
Disclaimer: This podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be considered professional advice. We are not responsible for any losses, damages, or liabilities that may arise from the use of this podcast. The views expressed in this podcast may not be those of the host or the management.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
tech for everybody is a double-edged sword it's an
enabler for all of us, but it'salso it's an enabler of burnout
for everybody, but it's also asolution to a lot of our
workplace problems.
According to the Calm app.
You know the Calm app, thewell-being app, calm C-A-L-M
Calm Sorry for my new new accentto everybody.
(00:25):
You need to calm down, calmwhat up?
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Well, it's the last week of October, I know, can you
believe?
Speaker 1 (00:52):
it no, no, november 1st this Friday, yeah, yeah.
How did that happen?
I'm still in denial.
I'm still going out without acoat.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
If you didn't look at a calendar, what month would
you say it would be?
August, august yeah, me too, Iwas calendar.
What month would you say itwould be?
Speaker 1 (01:09):
August, August.
Yeah, me too.
I'm like.
I feel like we're still back inAugust.
Yeah, I know my mental mindsetis August, but I very much know
we are on the cusp of Novemberit will be February before you
know it.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
It will be Just holidays yada election.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
Yeah, once November 1st happens, I feel like you
find yourself January 1, likewhat just happened.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
Yeah, and especially this year with the election,
it's going to be likeUnbelievable.
Anything fun this weekend.
Anything fun, yes, okay.
Speaker 1 (01:38):
Fun fact for you.
Fun fact what I get for livingin an old place on the East
Coast.
Fun fact the first witch trialsthat happened in the US
happened in Connecticut BeforeSalem.
They happened in OldWethersfield, connecticut, and
the first witch hanging happeneddown the street from my house.
(02:00):
Creepy, creepy fact.
Yeah, I don't know if that's afun fact, it's really a creepy
fact.
Fun fact A woman was hangingfrom my house.
Creepy, creepy fact.
Yeah, I don't know if that's afun fact, it's really a creepy
fact.
A woman was hanging, no, spookytimes yeah I only learned that
be super nerdy.
Uh, professor from yukon came tospeak at our local library
about the witch trials and whatthat was really about which, by
the way, nothing's changed,folks.
(02:21):
It was about women owningproperty and men wanting to
obtain it to get ready forhalloween, we watched halloween
town.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
Have you ever watched this movie?
Halloween town?
Yes, but a long time ago.
That movie is so bad it is, mel.
You and I could literallyrecreate the whole movie and it
would be better.
It is so bad.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
It's like your productions that you do for your
parents when you're like hey,look at our show.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
I want to go back and watch it again because I'm like
this was beeping awful, like sobad.
I don't understand and I feellike there was this time in the
90s where movies and televisionjust sucked ass was so bad did
wait.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
Do you have a favorite halloween movie?
Speaker 2 (03:09):
I always like the charlie browns, although even
the charlie brown one I'm likeyeah what's your favorite
halloween?
Speaker 1 (03:15):
I have the most obscure halloween movie that no
one ever knows what the hell I'mtalking about.
What is it?
It's from the 80s.
Did you ever see the movie themonster?
Speaker 2 (03:26):
squad no one's seen that movie.
Mel no one's seen that moviehow has nobody seen this movie?
Speaker 1 (03:31):
I swear it is so funny.
Do yourself a favor if you wantto laugh.
It's like goonies meetshalloween the monster.
Search for it.
You will not regret it.
It's bad, but it's funny.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
We're back with new headlines, Mel.
What are you talking about?
Speaker 1 (03:48):
today.
I am talking about an articleout of the BBC that asks the
question will AI make burnout?
Speaker 2 (03:57):
Yes, Okay, I don't have any idea what the answer to
that is.
That's awesome, okay.
And I'm talking about the costof retirement.
The American dream now costs ahefty $4.4 million.
Retirement is the biggest chunkof that.
So I want to talk aboutretirement, and I want to talk
(04:17):
about some of the best states toretire in and some things that
every generation needs to thinkabout as it relates to
retirement.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
It sounds like none of us are retiring with that
number.
But okay, Okie dokie, All right.
So this headline came out ofthe BBC by tech reporter Mary
Lou Costa, and my personalthoughts here to this question
in the headline is it dependsfolks.
(04:47):
So, just like with all techright.
So here's the what the articleis starting to highlight some of
the pain points that companies,both small and large, are
experiencing while they'retesting the use of AI for
efficiencies.
It's also highlighting theabsolute explosion of tools in
the marketplace right now,leading with AI in all of their
(05:09):
products leaving most feelingabsolutely overwhelmed by the
number of options and how tokeep up, and research was
conducted by Upwork.
They surveyed 2,500 knowledgeworkers in the US, uk, australia
, canada, and it showed that 96%of top executives expect the
(05:32):
use of AI tools to increasetheir company's overall
productivity.
81% of those execs say theyhave increased demands on their
workers to use AI over this pastyear.
Have increased demands on theirworkers to use AI over this
past year.
Yet 71% of employees are sayingthat AI tools have actually
decreased their productivity andadded to their workload.
(05:53):
47% of employees using AI saythey have no idea how to achieve
the productivity gains theiremployers are even expecting of
them.
What do you think about that?
This is like a bad marriage.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
He just doesn't understand.
I just need a gift once in awhile.
That's what this is like a badmarriage.
Anyway, yes, go ahead.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
Newsflash.
This is a communication problem.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Your employer is from Mars, you are from Venus.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
As a result, 61% of people believe that using AI
will increase their chances ofexperiencing burnout, and this
number rose to 87% of peoplewhen they polled those under 25
years old.
That's the young and that'syour group of people who are
like quick to adopt right.
So when you think, when youtake the difference there and
(06:47):
the 87% of that audience isnervous and seeing that they
think it's going to cause moreburnout for them, there's a
problem.
We have a problem, and thatsurvey was conducted by Resume.
Now they did a study ofAmericans and they pulled that
number for the under 25 group ofAmericans and they pulled that
(07:07):
number for the under 25 group.
They also referenced a studyconducted by Asana, the platform
Asana, the workload managementplatform.
They did a survey for 9,615knowledge workers in Australia,
france, germany, japan, uk andthe US and they found that
employees use today, someemployees use six to 15
(07:28):
different applications in theworkplace alone.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Just applications, not even AI applications, just
applications in general.
Yeah, that seems like they'renormal.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
Yes, absolutely.
That seems about average, right, like when you think about I
was like counting all of theapps I use, I'm like, yeah,
probably yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
Like you think about your internet, your benefits,
Word, Tableau, whatever.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
All the stuff you're doing.
15% of people that use thenumber of apps within that range
say, of course they're missingmessages, notifications, because
of the sheer number of toolsthey're using to manage their
workload.
And then for the workers who areusing 16 or more applications
in the day to day, 23% of themsay as a result, they're less
(08:10):
efficient and their retentionspan is drastically reduced
because of it.
I believe it because you'relike where the hell did I put
this?
What's going on?
How do I use this?
What am I using it for?
And I worked in digital when Idid digital and we're talking
about tech stack and we alwayshave the message that it's less
about the technology that youuse, what are you using it for?
You don't have to adopt everyshiny new tool, including AI,
(08:34):
folks, right?
Let's be thoughtful about it.
So why does this matter?
Workers are overwhelmed.
So I know the title of thearticle was Will AI Cause
Burnout?
But it's not just about AI,right, it's about all of tech,
and AI is just piling on to theexisting tech stack.
This is a challenge, becausetech for everybody is a
(08:56):
double-edged sword it's anenabler for all of us, but it's
also it's an enabler of burnoutfor everybody, but it's also a
solution to a lot of ourworkplace problems, according to
the Calm app.
You know the Calm app, thewell-being app, calm C-A-L-M
Calm Sorry for my new.
English accent to everybody.
You need to calm down, calmCalm.
(09:18):
It's up there with idea.
Sorry, idea, the R.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
Idea.
Speaker 1 (09:24):
Oh, my God, no R that I add every single time.
So, according to Calm and their2024 Voice of the Workplace
report, technology iscontributing to employee burnout
, and AI is only part of thestory.
They surveyed 4,000 workers inthe US, uk, germany and India
and they found that nearly halfof employees feel threatened by
(09:46):
the emergence of AI, especiallywith many companies announcing
the replacement of roles withAI-driven opportunities.
We've seen that in theheadlines recently.
45% of survey respondents worryAI is going to take over their
jobs and 53% have experiencedanxiousness or nervousness by
the rapid pace of techdevelopments within their
(10:06):
workplace and we talked aboutthis with Ashley Goodall.
Like this whole blender life inthe blender so AI is just like
adding more to life in theblender.
Gen Z are the most anxiousabout.
AI them, saying it makes themanxious.
(10:27):
Frequently, everyday, workplaceproductivity technologies are
contributing to stress andburnout.
Employees recognize thebenefits of these tools, but
they're also noting that, as aresult, they feel more pressure
to be quote unquote on.
So this is with all of tech.
58% of respondents notedthey're always connected or
(10:47):
available for work.
Now, 46% are often workingoutside of working hours and one
out of three workers are ofteninterrupted by devices and apps
while they're trying to work.
So there's this constantinterruption and there's no flow
state happening and innovationand work good work happens when
you have a flow state.
We've talked about this.
Speaker 2 (11:10):
Yeah, the other thing that I get nervous about,
because what you're talkingabout, too, is a very typical
work environment where you'realways on, where people might be
pinging you after hours.
On the weekends, people mightbe rewarded for going the extra
mile or burning the midnight oilto get something done.
And I just read a study comingout of Australia talking about
work addiction, and there arecertain people that are
(11:33):
literally addicted to work, andthey get addicted to work
because of the culture thatthey're in.
Speaker 1 (11:38):
They're rewarded for it.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
They're rewarded for it.
If you are in a culture thatrewards the always on that's the
key thing your people willbecome work addicted, ie, and
then get burnout.
It's not good.
Speaker 1 (11:50):
It's not good, and you and I talked about burnout.
Speaker 2 (11:52):
We can't get away from it.
Speaker 1 (11:53):
All the time we can't get away from it.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
It keeps getting worse.
What did they say that?
Speaker 1 (11:56):
everyone is operating at least like a level five of
burnout at all times at thispoint.
So it's just getting worse andI think something to me that's
really poignant here is peopleare looking at AI.
It's going to solve all theirproblems, and I just remember
working in when I focus solelyon HR tech and the purpose of
the technology we bring in.
(12:17):
There's this impatience as iffolks are going to miss out on
something if they don'timmediately act.
And I think there's some valuein slowing down and being really
thoughtful about how youimplement the technology, but it
feels like right now it's nope,just throw AI at it, it's going
to fix all our problems andyou're going to wake up with a
(12:38):
massive, a bigger problem in afew years by taking that
approach.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
So it's I think one of the reasons why some of us,
who are either elder millennialsor Gen X boomers, aren't as
freaked out about AI also isbecause we've seen so many
fricking implementations of thelatest and greatest thing of
everything and to your very goodpoint, when you are very clear
(13:03):
about what do you really want toaccomplish.
What do you need to do here?
What do you really need to do?
What is the process that ismost simple?
What is the great data in,great data out?
Have you cleaned up your housebefore the technology even goes
in?
I think so much of the timeit's all the same shit.
Different day we experiencedthis with HCMs coming in.
(13:25):
I can't tell you the amount oftimes I've been on a call about
yeah, like LXPs, lmss, workday,sap, oracle, where they're like
oh, yeah, it's going to solveeverything.
Speaker 1 (13:38):
You have a data hygiene issue.
Garbage in, garbage out yeah,huge data hygiene issues.
Also, a change managementcomponent they're not thinking
about the impacts to people, thetraining that's needed.
There's so many elements thatneed to go into it and we talked
about this with one of ourguests, dwayne Blomstrom.
If you're not following her onLinkedIn, folks, you absolutely
should.
She's just the smartest personand she talks about the concept
(14:02):
of human debt and the rise ofhuman debt in the workplace.
That continues to happen and iffor folks who may have missed
that episode, please go back andcheck it but the high level
gist of it here is, human debtis when we ignore people needs,
when we're creating system,process and policies in the
workplace and we're not thinkingabout them at all during the
implementation of these things.
Speaker 2 (14:21):
I will tell you happening right now.
In my entire career and I'vedone a ton of implementations as
part of whatever work rightthere was only one time, one
time in one company that we werereally thoughtful about.
What is the employee experiencegoing from this tech to this
tech One time.
Most time it's just peopledon't care, we're just going to
(14:44):
add another one and they'regoing to have to throw it on all
these disparate systems.
Speaker 1 (14:47):
Yeah, and then you have what I used to call the
Franken tool.
We just have one massive Frankentool now.
Yeah, fascinatingImplementation of tech is a
major contributor to human debtin the workplace because they're
doing it without people in mind.
We see it in the headlinesright now.
We hear it anecdotally frompeople talking about it, and I
(15:08):
love to.
I am a huge proponent of tech,but thoughtful tech and let's be
thoughtful, jason.
I did a little more research onthis.
Jason Thatcher, who's aprofessor of org leadership and
information analytics at LeedsSchool of Business.
He co-authored a study that waspublished in June of 2024.
And I have links to that studythat we can share in the show
(15:29):
notes, which examined the impactof digital stressors in the
workplace and how they compoundand escalate over time.
He was interviewed by KatieMarquardt Hill at the University
of Colorado, boulder, and heshared five ways digital stress
leads to burnout in theworkplace and how it impacts
employees' mental health andtheir productivity.
(15:50):
Do you want to hear the five?
Yes, I do.
Techno overload, which is thepiling on of stress due to
constant emails, notificationsand alerts.
Techno, really Techno.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Everything's techno.
Speaker 1 (16:04):
I know Techno invasion.
This is the pressure to alwaysbe on and available, so never
detaching from work, the workaddiction you just referenced.
Yeah, techno complexity, sodifficulty mastering software
and information systems at work,making employees feel
inadequate and stressed.
So, when you think of somethinglike AI and folks not feeling
(16:25):
prepared and they're not gettingthe training that they need to
understand not just how to useit, but how to use it for your
workplace, what's okay, what'snot okay, all of the things,
that's it.
Or feeling like, oh, now I'minadequate, can't, I can't
perform because there's thisproductivity expectation that no
one's communicated to me.
Techno insecurity employeesfearing that their job is going
(16:46):
to be made redundant or they'llbe replaced by a colleague with
better tech skills.
Job is going to be maderedundant or they'll be replaced
by a colleague with better techskills.
And then the last is technouncertainty.
So the constant change that wetalked about with Ashley right,
constant state of change.
The problem with change due totechnological advancement means
employees feel stress andpressure to continually adapt to
(17:07):
new systems and tools.
They don't have the time,they're just constantly just
learn it, just figure it out.
Yeah, so these are the five bigdigital stressors happening for
folks.
A company called Flare HR pulledtogether a list of some burnout
statistics from several surveys.
Consolidated.
They scraped the internet forall the big stats and we'll link
to that.
(17:27):
And here were some soberingfindings as it relates to the
impact of burnout, which we'vetalked about before.
But just reminding folks, yourdigital impacts are causing
burnout and here's why you needto be concerned if you're an
organization leader or execmaking decisions.
77% of people are experiencingsome level of burnout at their
(17:49):
current job.
I'm sure that number is higher.
That's just who's been surveyed.
Job turnover due to burnoutaffects 40% of employees,
greatly impacting retention 40%.
Speaker 2 (18:02):
That's expensive, yep .
Speaker 1 (18:04):
I'm getting to the money.
Getting to the money Workplacestress inflicts, on average, an
annual cost of $300 billion tothe US economy.
So if you think throwing alittle AI into the mix isn't
having an impact, it likely is,and those are some real numbers
folks.
So what can you do?
(18:24):
Professor Thatcher notedthere's no one-size-fits-all
solution here.
He said you have to look atevery technology as a bundle.
A tool may be designed to helpthe company address one problem,
but think about the otherunintended problems you might be
creating.
Cheers to that.
He recommended a few approacheshere.
(18:44):
One conduct regular assessmentsaround digital stressors so you
understand, identify and managethose stressors for your people
.
So surveys, one-on-ones.
Have the conversations.
Focus on implementing policiesand boundaries around
after-hours communications orexpectations on responsiveness
(19:05):
during the workday.
Hello, we are all used to theTeams pings from hell that
happen.
Hello, we are all used to theteam's pings from hell that
happen.
Three training to help employeeswith their digital literacy,
but also training around settingboundaries with work and your
personal life.
And I'm covering things for alldigital because I think, to
answer the question to thisarticle, ai is just compounding
on top of all the other tech.
(19:25):
So this is just a reminder.
Leadership modeling so forevery leader, exec, people,
manager, model the way.
Establish psychological safetyhere around expectations and
practices to put people at ease,to reduce some of the stressors
that they're feeling.
Attentiveness you need to beeven more attentive right now as
(19:46):
a leader and checking in withyour team and understanding the
signs of stress and burnout,especially if you're
implementing AI initiatives andit's unclear what that means for
your people.
And the last is aroundflexibility, which this aligns
with recommendations from theCalm app as well.
They were more specific about arecommendation with AI.
(20:07):
They noted with the add-on ofAI.
Transparency is critical heremaking sure leaders and orgs
that you're communicatingproactively about AI and the why
, the when and the how the orgintends to adopt it, along with
the impact it's going to haveand the opportunities that it
will present for your employeesso they can make their own
(20:28):
informed decisions.
And we talk about this all thetime transparency and
empowerment.
So double down on that rightnow, especially if you're trying
to implement AI and you don'twant it to impact your org.
I'm going to close it withProfessor Thatcher's last quote,
which was focus on the wholeperson, the whole job and the
set of stressors thattechnologies introduce, and work
(20:51):
with your employees to findways to manage that.
That's the key word folks, thewith that.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
That's the key word, folks the with, let's talk,
retirement.
So I was just farting around onthe internet and Visual
Capitalist came out with howmuch the American dream costs
right now and I was shocked.
When you think about theAmerican dream, what is the
American dream?
What is it?
It's like the house right.
Speaker 1 (21:18):
The house.
Okay, what we've been told.
Speaker 2 (21:20):
What we've been told.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
That you have job security.
You have a house, the whitepicket fence, the 2.5 kids and a
dog.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Yeah, they're looking at a couple of things too.
If you had to pay for collegetuition, if you had to pay for
retirement, that kind of stuff.
But 4.4 million is the average,which is a big enough number
and I'll link to that in theshow notes.
It's big 4.4, like you need tohave that 4.4, as in by the time
it's all said and done, youwill have spent $4.4 million
(21:52):
over the course of your lifetime.
Okay, I can see that Okay, it'sstill a hefty chunk of change.
The biggest number in that isretirement.
Right now, if you're set toretire, you're going to need to
have almost $1.6 million.
$1.6 million, I'm thinking thatmost people don't have $1.6
(22:15):
million to retire on.
For instance, you are Gen X, ieyou are currently somewhere
between 44 to 59.
You're going to need about $2million and you're probably
going to need anywhere from 20to 30 years of savings.
Millennials again, you're 28 to43 year olds $2.5 million
because you're going to needprobably closer to 30 plus years
(22:37):
because people are livinglonger.
Gen Z is almost going to needabout $3 million and they need
to be looking at 35 plus yearsof retirement.
I share that, becauseretirement is one of these
things.
A lot of people don't startreally thinking about it until
they're like, oh shit, I need tostart thinking about it.
But right now, if you're set toretire, in order to retire
(22:58):
decently, that's on averageyou're going to need that one
six.
Where you live has a prettydistinct advantage, or not, on
your retirement.
So, mel, where do you think arethe best states to retire?
Speaker 1 (23:12):
I am going to assume Delaware, texas, new Hampshire.
I don't know why New Hampshirealways gets thrown in there.
Maybe down South I used tothink Florida but their property
insurance is like through theroof now.
What are they?
I'm curious If you did.
Speaker 2 (23:32):
I think it's fascinating what you chose when
people actually retire Florida.
A huge percent go to Florida.
Your Arizonas were snowboarding.
South Carolina, texas and NorthCarolina, and you're totally
right.
Right after that it's all thenice warm weather.
It's Georgia, alabama,tennessee, nevada, kentucky.
Okay, those are the top 10.
(23:54):
The best states to retire,though, it's not just about
weather.
It shouldn't be just aboutweather.
So Bankrate did this study andthey looked at all 50 states and
they were judging it by fivekey metrics Affordability, which
again when you're living off ofa fixed income is a big deal.
Affordability being 40% oftheir waiting.
Wellbeing being 25%, healthcare, access to hospitals and all
that good jazz.
20%.
(24:14):
Weather only being 10%.
And crime being 5%.
Their top pick, mel, you hitthe nail on the head it's
Delaware.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
Yeah, I like I know it's a small state, so don't
everyone move there at once.
Speaker 2 (24:30):
Yeah, massive tax advantage as well.
Somewhat moderate climate.
Proximity to great healthcaresystems Close to DC.
Baltimore, like you're closethat to a lot, yeah yeah,
delaware, right after that WestVirginia, which I was kind of
surprised by actually, um,interesting, yeah, you don't
really hear about, especiallylike a tax advantage state.
(24:50):
You don't really hear about it.
But it's the cost of livingfactor with West Virginia yeah.
Georgia and South Carolina.
They share the list of wherepeople are already going, and
the fifth, missouri, again, costof living.
Interesting, yeah, yeah, kindof fascinating.
A couple things I want peopleto keep in mind when they think
about retirement.
I talk about retirement a lotwith do you guys have these
(25:12):
conversations about retirementwe do now.
Yeah, we talk about it.
Do you guys have?
Yeah, before we had endo, jeffand I were talking with our
financial planner and we try tolive pretty conservatively.
We try to live on one of oursalaries.
That's one.
So not living above our meansor below.
We're living below our means.
That's one.
(25:32):
We've been maxing out our 401ksand saving and doing all the
things you should be doing.
We meet with our financialplanner and I'm getting super
cocky.
I want to know when we canretire and I'm thinking he's
going to be like 55.
Like we cause we've doneeverything right.
We get on the phone with him.
He's 72.
Speaker 1 (25:50):
What?
Yes, listen, life's too shortfolks.
I'm not doing that.
I actually don't thinkretirement's in the cards for
anybody who isn't a boomer.
I don't think it's realisticfor anyone anymore.
Because when you think aboutthe high stress situations in
(26:10):
work today and all the things wehear, are you willing to I
don't know be in thatenvironment until you're in your
70s, and what's your quality oflife?
Is that when you want to startreally living?
I don't know.
Be in that environment untilyou're in your seventies, and
what's your quality of life?
Is that when you want to startreally living?
I don't know.
I just think it's now.
It's like you have to buildyour own story.
Speaker 2 (26:27):
I think you're absolutely right.
I think retirement is going tolook a little different.
It might be that you areworking through my retirement
light.
Speaker 1 (26:34):
I think it's retirement light.
I think it's retirement light,or what.
Speaker 2 (26:37):
Or what they call multi-phase retirement, where
you're either phasing out,you're going part-time, you're
doing something that looks moreportfolio, yeah, all things my
dad's still teaching andeverything else.
Speaker 1 (26:47):
Yeah, I mean it's enriching to do some kinds of
work.
I think, though, where thingsthat break my heart when you see
somebody who's working a reallyphysical job and they're in
their 80s and 90s, and you'rejust like what, the hell man?
Can we support our elderlybetter than this?
Yes, so they don't have to dothis, yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
There are some considerations, though, to think
about retirement.
Again, they're trends going up.
We know millennials, gen Z, genAlpha they are going to live
longer.
Right now, the adjustedlifespan is probably going to be
to 120.
So when you think about thatfrom a retirement perspective,
if you retire at 75 and theaverage life that's like 40
(27:36):
years.
Think about that, though.
So the idea that everybody'sgoing to retire at 55 and then
drop dead at 75 is no longer thecase.
You have to be able to preparefor longer lifespans personally,
and also organizations need tostart preparing for this as well
, and we're already starting tosee this.
People being able to take onpart-time or gigs and portfolio
(27:57):
all this good jazz, but thinkingabout that, you probably will
be living longer.
Prepare for that.
That's number one.
Two, obviously, is the taxdiversification as well.
There's a whole host of otherways that you can manage your
retirement.
I would look into it, justbecause stuff might happen.
Not official advice, but youwant to diversify your portfolio
is the name of the game.
(28:17):
The last one here is healthcareplanning.
Healthcare costs are going tocontinue to go up, and thinking
about where you're going to live, how you're going to live and
what kind of preventative thingsyou can be doing now, like, for
instance.
This is the stupidest thing onthe face of the planet, but
listening to the Hubermanpodcast which I know he's kind
of I'm so bummed, but it was agood episode.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
it was a good episode you need to find a new expert.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
He's canceled there are two things that came up
around longevity, and one of thethings they were talking about
is really heavy weight lifting,but also jumping like jumping
rope, jumping up and down, youjump up on things.
All that is part of health careplanning.
Honestly, what you want to dois be able to protect your brain
and protect your body from afall.
Those are your two biggestissues.
(29:02):
Protect yourself.
What can you be doing now tomake sure that your last quarter
of life, you're having a goodtime and think about moving to
Delaware, friends?
Speaker 1 (29:17):
Hey friends, this episode of your Work Friends was
hosted by Francesca Ranieri andmyself, mel Plett this episode
was produced and edited by MelPlett and myself, Francesca
Ranieri.
Our theme music is by Pink Zebraand you can follow us over on
all of our social mediaplatforms Instagram, tiktok,
(29:37):
youtube and, if you're soinclined, join us over on
LinkedIn in our large andgrowing community, and you can
email us atfriendatyourworkfriendscom or
visit us on yourworkfriendscomAlso.
Folks, please like, subscribeand leave a review.
If you enjoyed this episode,and if you really enjoyed it,
please share with a work friendor two.
tech for everybody is a double-edged sword it's an
enabler for all of us, but it'salso it's an enabler of burnout
for everybody, but it's also asolution to a lot of our
workplace problems.
According to the Calm app.
You know the Calm app, thewell-being app, calm C-A-L-M
Calm Sorry for my new new accentto everybody.
(00:25):
You need to calm down, calmwhat up?
Speaker 2 (00:47):
Well, it's the last week of October, I know, can you
believe?
Speaker 1 (00:52):
it no, no, november 1st this Friday, yeah, yeah.
How did that happen?
I'm still in denial.
I'm still going out without acoat.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
If you didn't look at a calendar, what month would
you say it would be?
August, august yeah, me too, Iwas calendar.
What month would you say itwould be?
Speaker 1 (01:09):
August, August.
Yeah, me too.
I'm like.
I feel like we're still back inAugust.
Yeah, I know my mental mindsetis August, but I very much know
we are on the cusp of Novemberit will be February before you
know it.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
It will be Just holidays yada election.
Speaker 1 (01:23):
Yeah, once November 1st happens, I feel like you
find yourself January 1, likewhat just happened.
Speaker 2 (01:29):
Yeah, and especially this year with the election,
it's going to be likeUnbelievable.
Anything fun this weekend.
Anything fun, yes, okay.
Speaker 1 (01:38):
Fun fact for you.
Fun fact what I get for livingin an old place on the East
Coast.
Fun fact the first witch trialsthat happened in the US
happened in Connecticut BeforeSalem.
They happened in OldWethersfield, connecticut, and
the first witch hanging happeneddown the street from my house.
(02:00):
Creepy, creepy fact.
Yeah, I don't know if that's afun fact, it's really a creepy
fact.
Fun fact A woman was hangingfrom my house.
Creepy, creepy fact.
Yeah, I don't know if that's afun fact, it's really a creepy
fact.
A woman was hanging, no, spookytimes yeah I only learned that
be super nerdy.
Uh, professor from yukon came tospeak at our local library
about the witch trials and whatthat was really about which, by
the way, nothing's changed,folks.
(02:21):
It was about women owningproperty and men wanting to
obtain it to get ready forhalloween, we watched halloween
town.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
Have you ever watched this movie?
Halloween town?
Yes, but a long time ago.
That movie is so bad it is, mel.
You and I could literallyrecreate the whole movie and it
would be better.
It is so bad.
Speaker 1 (02:46):
It's like your productions that you do for your
parents when you're like hey,look at our show.
Speaker 2 (02:51):
I want to go back and watch it again because I'm like
this was beeping awful, like sobad.
I don't understand and I feellike there was this time in the
90s where movies and televisionjust sucked ass was so bad did
wait.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
Do you have a favorite halloween movie?
Speaker 2 (03:09):
I always like the charlie browns, although even
the charlie brown one I'm likeyeah what's your favorite
halloween?
Speaker 1 (03:15):
I have the most obscure halloween movie that no
one ever knows what the hell I'mtalking about.
What is it?
It's from the 80s.
Did you ever see the movie themonster?
Speaker 2 (03:26):
squad no one's seen that movie.
Mel no one's seen that moviehow has nobody seen this movie?
Speaker 1 (03:31):
I swear it is so funny.
Do yourself a favor if you wantto laugh.
It's like goonies meetshalloween the monster.
Search for it.
You will not regret it.
It's bad, but it's funny.
Speaker 2 (03:46):
We're back with new headlines, Mel.
What are you talking about?
Speaker 1 (03:48):
today.
I am talking about an articleout of the BBC that asks the
question will AI make burnout?
Speaker 2 (03:57):
Yes, Okay, I don't have any idea what the answer to
that is.
That's awesome, okay.
And I'm talking about the costof retirement.
The American dream now costs ahefty $4.4 million.
Retirement is the biggest chunkof that.
So I want to talk aboutretirement, and I want to talk
(04:17):
about some of the best states toretire in and some things that
every generation needs to thinkabout as it relates to
retirement.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
It sounds like none of us are retiring with that
number.
But okay, Okie dokie, All right.
So this headline came out ofthe BBC by tech reporter Mary
Lou Costa, and my personalthoughts here to this question
in the headline is it dependsfolks.
(04:47):
So, just like with all techright.
So here's the what the articleis starting to highlight some of
the pain points that companies,both small and large, are
experiencing while they'retesting the use of AI for
efficiencies.
It's also highlighting theabsolute explosion of tools in
the marketplace right now,leading with AI in all of their
(05:09):
products leaving most feelingabsolutely overwhelmed by the
number of options and how tokeep up, and research was
conducted by Upwork.
They surveyed 2,500 knowledgeworkers in the US, uk, australia
, canada, and it showed that 96%of top executives expect the
(05:32):
use of AI tools to increasetheir company's overall
productivity.
81% of those execs say theyhave increased demands on their
workers to use AI over this pastyear.
Have increased demands on theirworkers to use AI over this
past year.
Yet 71% of employees are sayingthat AI tools have actually
decreased their productivity andadded to their workload.
(05:53):
47% of employees using AI saythey have no idea how to achieve
the productivity gains theiremployers are even expecting of
them.
What do you think about that?
This is like a bad marriage.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
He just doesn't understand.
I just need a gift once in awhile.
That's what this is like a badmarriage.
Anyway, yes, go ahead.
Speaker 1 (06:14):
Newsflash.
This is a communication problem.
Speaker 2 (06:20):
Your employer is from Mars, you are from Venus.
Speaker 1 (06:23):
As a result, 61% of people believe that using AI
will increase their chances ofexperiencing burnout, and this
number rose to 87% of peoplewhen they polled those under 25
years old.
That's the young and that'syour group of people who are
like quick to adopt right.
So when you think, when youtake the difference there and
(06:47):
the 87% of that audience isnervous and seeing that they
think it's going to cause moreburnout for them, there's a
problem.
We have a problem, and thatsurvey was conducted by Resume.
Now they did a study ofAmericans and they pulled that
number for the under 25 group ofAmericans and they pulled that
(07:07):
number for the under 25 group.
They also referenced a studyconducted by Asana, the platform
Asana, the workload managementplatform.
They did a survey for 9,615knowledge workers in Australia,
france, germany, japan, uk andthe US and they found that
employees use today, someemployees use six to 15
(07:28):
different applications in theworkplace alone.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Just applications, not even AI applications, just
applications in general.
Yeah, that seems like they'renormal.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
Yes, absolutely.
That seems about average, right, like when you think about I
was like counting all of theapps I use, I'm like, yeah,
probably yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
Like you think about your internet, your benefits,
Word, Tableau, whatever.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
All the stuff you're doing.
15% of people that use thenumber of apps within that range
say, of course they're missingmessages, notifications, because
of the sheer number of toolsthey're using to manage their
workload.
And then for the workers who areusing 16 or more applications
in the day to day, 23% of themsay as a result, they're less
(08:10):
efficient and their retentionspan is drastically reduced
because of it.
I believe it because you'relike where the hell did I put
this?
What's going on?
How do I use this?
What am I using it for?
And I worked in digital when Idid digital and we're talking
about tech stack and we alwayshave the message that it's less
about the technology that youuse, what are you using it for?
You don't have to adopt everyshiny new tool, including AI,
(08:34):
folks, right?
Let's be thoughtful about it.
So why does this matter?
Workers are overwhelmed.
So I know the title of thearticle was Will AI Cause
Burnout?
But it's not just about AI,right, it's about all of tech,
and AI is just piling on to theexisting tech stack.
This is a challenge, becausetech for everybody is a
(08:56):
double-edged sword it's anenabler for all of us, but it's
also it's an enabler of burnoutfor everybody, but it's also a
solution to a lot of ourworkplace problems, according to
the Calm app.
You know the Calm app, thewell-being app, calm C-A-L-M
Calm Sorry for my new.
English accent to everybody.
You need to calm down, calmCalm.
(09:18):
It's up there with idea.
Sorry, idea, the R.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
Idea.
Speaker 1 (09:24):
Oh, my God, no R that I add every single time.
So, according to Calm and their2024 Voice of the Workplace
report, technology iscontributing to employee burnout
, and AI is only part of thestory.
They surveyed 4,000 workers inthe US, uk, germany and India
and they found that nearly halfof employees feel threatened by
(09:46):
the emergence of AI, especiallywith many companies announcing
the replacement of roles withAI-driven opportunities.
We've seen that in theheadlines recently.
45% of survey respondents worryAI is going to take over their
jobs and 53% have experiencedanxiousness or nervousness by
the rapid pace of techdevelopments within their
(10:06):
workplace and we talked aboutthis with Ashley Goodall.
Like this whole blender life inthe blender so AI is just like
adding more to life in theblender.
Gen Z are the most anxiousabout.
AI them, saying it makes themanxious.
(10:27):
Frequently, everyday, workplaceproductivity technologies are
contributing to stress andburnout.
Employees recognize thebenefits of these tools, but
they're also noting that, as aresult, they feel more pressure
to be quote unquote on.
So this is with all of tech.
58% of respondents notedthey're always connected or
(10:47):
available for work.
Now, 46% are often workingoutside of working hours and one
out of three workers are ofteninterrupted by devices and apps
while they're trying to work.
So there's this constantinterruption and there's no flow
state happening and innovationand work good work happens when
you have a flow state.
We've talked about this.
Speaker 2 (11:10):
Yeah, the other thing that I get nervous about,
because what you're talkingabout, too, is a very typical
work environment where you'realways on, where people might be
pinging you after hours.
On the weekends, people mightbe rewarded for going the extra
mile or burning the midnight oilto get something done.
And I just read a study comingout of Australia talking about
work addiction, and there arecertain people that are
(11:33):
literally addicted to work, andthey get addicted to work
because of the culture thatthey're in.
Speaker 1 (11:38):
They're rewarded for it.
Speaker 2 (11:39):
They're rewarded for it.
If you are in a culture thatrewards the always on that's the
key thing your people willbecome work addicted, ie, and
then get burnout.
It's not good.
Speaker 1 (11:50):
It's not good, and you and I talked about burnout.
Speaker 2 (11:52):
We can't get away from it.
Speaker 1 (11:53):
All the time we can't get away from it.
Speaker 2 (11:55):
It keeps getting worse.
What did they say that?
Speaker 1 (11:56):
everyone is operating at least like a level five of
burnout at all times at thispoint.
So it's just getting worse andI think something to me that's
really poignant here is peopleare looking at AI.
It's going to solve all theirproblems, and I just remember
working in when I focus solelyon HR tech and the purpose of
the technology we bring in.
(12:17):
There's this impatience as iffolks are going to miss out on
something if they don'timmediately act.
And I think there's some valuein slowing down and being really
thoughtful about how youimplement the technology, but it
feels like right now it's nope,just throw AI at it, it's going
to fix all our problems andyou're going to wake up with a
(12:38):
massive, a bigger problem in afew years by taking that
approach.
Speaker 2 (12:42):
So it's I think one of the reasons why some of us,
who are either elder millennialsor Gen X boomers, aren't as
freaked out about AI also isbecause we've seen so many
fricking implementations of thelatest and greatest thing of
everything and to your very goodpoint, when you are very clear
(13:03):
about what do you really want toaccomplish.
What do you need to do here?
What do you really need to do?
What is the process that ismost simple?
What is the great data in,great data out?
Have you cleaned up your housebefore the technology even goes
in?
I think so much of the timeit's all the same shit.
Different day we experiencedthis with HCMs coming in.
(13:25):
I can't tell you the amount oftimes I've been on a call about
yeah, like LXPs, lmss, workday,sap, oracle, where they're like
oh, yeah, it's going to solveeverything.
Speaker 1 (13:38):
You have a data hygiene issue.
Garbage in, garbage out yeah,huge data hygiene issues.
Also, a change managementcomponent they're not thinking
about the impacts to people, thetraining that's needed.
There's so many elements thatneed to go into it and we talked
about this with one of ourguests, dwayne Blomstrom.
If you're not following her onLinkedIn, folks, you absolutely
should.
She's just the smartest personand she talks about the concept
(14:02):
of human debt and the rise ofhuman debt in the workplace.
That continues to happen and iffor folks who may have missed
that episode, please go back andcheck it but the high level
gist of it here is, human debtis when we ignore people needs,
when we're creating system,process and policies in the
workplace and we're not thinkingabout them at all during the
implementation of these things.
Speaker 2 (14:21):
I will tell you happening right now.
In my entire career and I'vedone a ton of implementations as
part of whatever work rightthere was only one time, one
time in one company that we werereally thoughtful about.
What is the employee experiencegoing from this tech to this
tech One time.
Most time it's just peopledon't care, we're just going to
(14:44):
add another one and they'regoing to have to throw it on all
these disparate systems.
Speaker 1 (14:47):
Yeah, and then you have what I used to call the
Franken tool.
We just have one massive Frankentool now.
Yeah, fascinatingImplementation of tech is a
major contributor to human debtin the workplace because they're
doing it without people in mind.
We see it in the headlinesright now.
We hear it anecdotally frompeople talking about it, and I
(15:08):
love to.
I am a huge proponent of tech,but thoughtful tech and let's be
thoughtful, jason.
I did a little more research onthis.
Jason Thatcher, who's aprofessor of org leadership and
information analytics at LeedsSchool of Business.
He co-authored a study that waspublished in June of 2024.
And I have links to that studythat we can share in the show
(15:29):
notes, which examined the impactof digital stressors in the
workplace and how they compoundand escalate over time.
He was interviewed by KatieMarquardt Hill at the University
of Colorado, boulder, and heshared five ways digital stress
leads to burnout in theworkplace and how it impacts
employees' mental health andtheir productivity.
(15:50):
Do you want to hear the five?
Yes, I do.
Techno overload, which is thepiling on of stress due to
constant emails, notificationsand alerts.
Techno, really Techno.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Everything's techno.
Speaker 1 (16:04):
I know Techno invasion.
This is the pressure to alwaysbe on and available, so never
detaching from work, the workaddiction you just referenced.
Yeah, techno complexity, sodifficulty mastering software
and information systems at work,making employees feel
inadequate and stressed.
So, when you think of somethinglike AI and folks not feeling
(16:25):
prepared and they're not gettingthe training that they need to
understand not just how to useit, but how to use it for your
workplace, what's okay, what'snot okay, all of the things,
that's it.
Or feeling like, oh, now I'minadequate, can't, I can't
perform because there's thisproductivity expectation that no
one's communicated to me.
Techno insecurity employeesfearing that their job is going
(16:46):
to be made redundant or they'llbe replaced by a colleague with
better tech skills.
Job is going to be maderedundant or they'll be replaced
by a colleague with better techskills.
And then the last is technouncertainty.
So the constant change that wetalked about with Ashley right,
constant state of change.
The problem with change due totechnological advancement means
employees feel stress andpressure to continually adapt to
(17:07):
new systems and tools.
They don't have the time,they're just constantly just
learn it, just figure it out.
Yeah, so these are the five bigdigital stressors happening for
folks.
A company called Flare HR pulledtogether a list of some burnout
statistics from several surveys.
Consolidated.
They scraped the internet forall the big stats and we'll link
to that.
(17:27):
And here were some soberingfindings as it relates to the
impact of burnout, which we'vetalked about before.
But just reminding folks, yourdigital impacts are causing
burnout and here's why you needto be concerned if you're an
organization leader or execmaking decisions.
77% of people are experiencingsome level of burnout at their
(17:49):
current job.
I'm sure that number is higher.
That's just who's been surveyed.
Job turnover due to burnoutaffects 40% of employees,
greatly impacting retention 40%.
Speaker 2 (18:02):
That's expensive, yep .
Speaker 1 (18:04):
I'm getting to the money.
Getting to the money Workplacestress inflicts, on average, an
annual cost of $300 billion tothe US economy.
So if you think throwing alittle AI into the mix isn't
having an impact, it likely is,and those are some real numbers
folks.
So what can you do?
(18:24):
Professor Thatcher notedthere's no one-size-fits-all
solution here.
He said you have to look atevery technology as a bundle.
A tool may be designed to helpthe company address one problem,
but think about the otherunintended problems you might be
creating.
Cheers to that.
He recommended a few approacheshere.
(18:44):
One conduct regular assessmentsaround digital stressors so you
understand, identify and managethose stressors for your people
.
So surveys, one-on-ones.
Have the conversations.
Focus on implementing policiesand boundaries around
after-hours communications orexpectations on responsiveness
(19:05):
during the workday.
Hello, we are all used to theTeams pings from hell that
happen.
Hello, we are all used to theteam's pings from hell that
happen.
Three training to help employeeswith their digital literacy,
but also training around settingboundaries with work and your
personal life.
And I'm covering things for alldigital because I think, to
answer the question to thisarticle, ai is just compounding
on top of all the other tech.
(19:25):
So this is just a reminder.
Leadership modeling so forevery leader, exec, people,
manager, model the way.
Establish psychological safetyhere around expectations and
practices to put people at ease,to reduce some of the stressors
that they're feeling.
Attentiveness you need to beeven more attentive right now as
(19:46):
a leader and checking in withyour team and understanding the
signs of stress and burnout,especially if you're
implementing AI initiatives andit's unclear what that means for
your people.
And the last is aroundflexibility, which this aligns
with recommendations from theCalm app as well.
They were more specific about arecommendation with AI.
(20:07):
They noted with the add-on ofAI.
Transparency is critical heremaking sure leaders and orgs
that you're communicatingproactively about AI and the why
, the when and the how the orgintends to adopt it, along with
the impact it's going to haveand the opportunities that it
will present for your employeesso they can make their own
(20:28):
informed decisions.
And we talk about this all thetime transparency and
empowerment.
So double down on that rightnow, especially if you're trying
to implement AI and you don'twant it to impact your org.
I'm going to close it withProfessor Thatcher's last quote,
which was focus on the wholeperson, the whole job and the
set of stressors thattechnologies introduce, and work
(20:51):
with your employees to findways to manage that.
That's the key word folks, thewith that.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
That's the key word, folks the with, let's talk,
retirement.
So I was just farting around onthe internet and Visual
Capitalist came out with howmuch the American dream costs
right now and I was shocked.
When you think about theAmerican dream, what is the
American dream?
What is it?
It's like the house right.
Speaker 1 (21:18):
The house.
Okay, what we've been told.
Speaker 2 (21:20):
What we've been told.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
That you have job security.
You have a house, the whitepicket fence, the 2.5 kids and a
dog.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
Yeah, they're looking at a couple of things too.
If you had to pay for collegetuition, if you had to pay for
retirement, that kind of stuff.
But 4.4 million is the average,which is a big enough number
and I'll link to that in theshow notes.
It's big 4.4, like you need tohave that 4.4, as in by the time
it's all said and done, youwill have spent $4.4 million
(21:52):
over the course of your lifetime.
Okay, I can see that Okay, it'sstill a hefty chunk of change.
The biggest number in that isretirement.
Right now, if you're set toretire, you're going to need to
have almost $1.6 million.
$1.6 million, I'm thinking thatmost people don't have $1.6
(22:15):
million to retire on.
For instance, you are Gen X, ieyou are currently somewhere
between 44 to 59.
You're going to need about $2million and you're probably
going to need anywhere from 20to 30 years of savings.
Millennials again, you're 28 to43 year olds $2.5 million
because you're going to needprobably closer to 30 plus years
(22:37):
because people are livinglonger.
Gen Z is almost going to needabout $3 million and they need
to be looking at 35 plus yearsof retirement.
I share that, becauseretirement is one of these
things.
A lot of people don't startreally thinking about it until
they're like, oh shit, I need tostart thinking about it.
But right now, if you're set toretire, in order to retire
(22:58):
decently, that's on averageyou're going to need that one
six.
Where you live has a prettydistinct advantage, or not, on
your retirement.
So, mel, where do you think arethe best states to retire?
Speaker 1 (23:12):
I am going to assume Delaware, texas, new Hampshire.
I don't know why New Hampshirealways gets thrown in there.
Maybe down South I used tothink Florida but their property
insurance is like through theroof now.
What are they?
I'm curious If you did.
Speaker 2 (23:32):
I think it's fascinating what you chose when
people actually retire Florida.
A huge percent go to Florida.
Your Arizonas were snowboarding.
South Carolina, texas and NorthCarolina, and you're totally
right.
Right after that it's all thenice warm weather.
It's Georgia, alabama,tennessee, nevada, kentucky.
Okay, those are the top 10.
(23:54):
The best states to retire,though, it's not just about
weather.
It shouldn't be just aboutweather.
So Bankrate did this study andthey looked at all 50 states and
they were judging it by fivekey metrics Affordability, which
again when you're living off ofa fixed income is a big deal.
Affordability being 40% oftheir waiting.
Wellbeing being 25%, healthcare, access to hospitals and all
that good jazz.
20%.
(24:14):
Weather only being 10%.
And crime being 5%.
Their top pick, mel, you hitthe nail on the head it's
Delaware.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
Yeah, I like I know it's a small state, so don't
everyone move there at once.
Speaker 2 (24:30):
Yeah, massive tax advantage as well.
Somewhat moderate climate.
Proximity to great healthcaresystems Close to DC.
Baltimore, like you're closethat to a lot, yeah yeah,
delaware, right after that WestVirginia, which I was kind of
surprised by actually, um,interesting, yeah, you don't
really hear about, especiallylike a tax advantage state.
(24:50):
You don't really hear about it.
But it's the cost of livingfactor with West Virginia yeah.
Georgia and South Carolina.
They share the list of wherepeople are already going, and
the fifth, missouri, again, costof living.
Interesting, yeah, yeah, kindof fascinating.
A couple things I want peopleto keep in mind when they think
about retirement.
I talk about retirement a lotwith do you guys have these
(25:12):
conversations about retirementwe do now.
Yeah, we talk about it.
Do you guys have?
Yeah, before we had endo, jeffand I were talking with our
financial planner and we try tolive pretty conservatively.
We try to live on one of oursalaries.
That's one.
So not living above our meansor below.
We're living below our means.
That's one.
(25:32):
We've been maxing out our 401ksand saving and doing all the
things you should be doing.
We meet with our financialplanner and I'm getting super
cocky.
I want to know when we canretire and I'm thinking he's
going to be like 55.
Like we cause we've doneeverything right.
We get on the phone with him.
He's 72.
Speaker 1 (25:50):
What?
Yes, listen, life's too shortfolks.
I'm not doing that.
I actually don't thinkretirement's in the cards for
anybody who isn't a boomer.
I don't think it's realisticfor anyone anymore.
Because when you think aboutthe high stress situations in
(26:10):
work today and all the things wehear, are you willing to I
don't know be in thatenvironment until you're in your
70s, and what's your quality oflife?
Is that when you want to startreally living?
I don't know.
Be in that environment untilyou're in your seventies, and
what's your quality of life?
Is that when you want to startreally living?
I don't know.
I just think it's now.
It's like you have to buildyour own story.
Speaker 2 (26:27):
I think you're absolutely right.
I think retirement is going tolook a little different.
It might be that you areworking through my retirement
light.
Speaker 1 (26:34):
I think it's retirement light.
I think it's retirement light,or what.
Speaker 2 (26:37):
Or what they call multi-phase retirement, where
you're either phasing out,you're going part-time, you're
doing something that looks moreportfolio, yeah, all things my
dad's still teaching andeverything else.
Speaker 1 (26:47):
Yeah, I mean it's enriching to do some kinds of
work.
I think, though, where thingsthat break my heart when you see
somebody who's working a reallyphysical job and they're in
their 80s and 90s, and you'rejust like what, the hell man?
Can we support our elderlybetter than this?
Yes, so they don't have to dothis, yeah.
Speaker 2 (27:08):
There are some considerations, though, to think
about retirement.
Again, they're trends going up.
We know millennials, gen Z, genAlpha they are going to live
longer.
Right now, the adjustedlifespan is probably going to be
to 120.
So when you think about thatfrom a retirement perspective,
if you retire at 75 and theaverage life that's like 40
(27:36):
years.
Think about that, though.
So the idea that everybody'sgoing to retire at 55 and then
drop dead at 75 is no longer thecase.
You have to be able to preparefor longer lifespans personally,
and also organizations need tostart preparing for this as well
, and we're already starting tosee this.
People being able to take onpart-time or gigs and portfolio
(27:57):
all this good jazz, but thinkingabout that, you probably will
be living longer.
Prepare for that.
That's number one.
Two, obviously, is the taxdiversification as well.
There's a whole host of otherways that you can manage your
retirement.
I would look into it, justbecause stuff might happen.
Not official advice, but youwant to diversify your portfolio
is the name of the game.
(28:17):
The last one here is healthcareplanning.
Healthcare costs are going tocontinue to go up, and thinking
about where you're going to live, how you're going to live and
what kind of preventative thingsyou can be doing now, like, for
instance.
This is the stupidest thing onthe face of the planet, but
listening to the Hubermanpodcast which I know he's kind
of I'm so bummed, but it was agood episode.
Speaker 1 (28:39):
it was a good episode you need to find a new expert.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
He's canceled there are two things that came up
around longevity, and one of thethings they were talking about
is really heavy weight lifting,but also jumping like jumping
rope, jumping up and down, youjump up on things.
All that is part of health careplanning.
Honestly, what you want to dois be able to protect your brain
and protect your body from afall.
Those are your two biggestissues.
(29:02):
Protect yourself.
What can you be doing now tomake sure that your last quarter
of life, you're having a goodtime and think about moving to
Delaware, friends?
Speaker 1 (29:17):
Hey friends, this episode of your Work Friends was
hosted by Francesca Ranieri andmyself, mel Plett this episode
was produced and edited by MelPlett and myself, Francesca
Ranieri.
Our theme music is by Pink Zebraand you can follow us over on
all of our social mediaplatforms Instagram, tiktok,
(29:37):
youtube and, if you're soinclined, join us over on
LinkedIn in our large andgrowing community, and you can
email us atfriendatyourworkfriendscom or
visit us on yourworkfriendscomAlso.
Folks, please like, subscribeand leave a review.
If you enjoyed this episode,and if you really enjoyed it,
please share with a work friendor two.
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