December 9, 2024 • 22 mins
Growing up with a narcissistic mother can feel like navigating a maze of manipulation and emotional chaos. Ever wonder how the image of a "perfect mom" can clash so deeply with reality? In this episode, I share snippets from my own personal journey of growing up with the "perfect" narcissistic mother.
We'll dive into how societal perceptions of motherhood often mask harmful behaviors, the pressure to maintain appearances, and the lasting emotional impact. From public praise to private criticism, I’ll explore the struggle to find independence amidst constant judgment and the manipulative claims of martyrdom.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Torie Wiksell (00:14):
Welcome to You're Not Crazy, a podcast for the
adult children of parents withborderline and narcissistic
personality disorders.
I'm your host, tori Wixel, atherapist and coach with over a
decade of experience in themental health field.
Now let's jump in.
Hi guys, welcome back to thisepisode of You're Not Crazy.
(00:36):
I am so excited to be back andtalking with you guys this week.
This is just such a weird timeof year, isn't it?
Between Thanksgiving and theend of the year.
It's just so bizarre for somany reasons, but I feel like my
days are blurring together andmy brain is somehow still
(00:57):
functioning, but I also have tosay my toddler's been in this
weird sleep regression thingstage, so I think that's just
complicating my overall sense ofreality.
So, anyways, that's a littlesnippet into my world, but today
I thought we would talk aboutsomething that is not talked
(01:19):
about enough at all, and that isthis idea of the perfect mother
when we're talking aboutnarcissistic moms.
There are so many clientscoaching and therapy clients
that I've worked with throughoutthe years who have narcissistic
mothers, who have talked inlength with me about how it's so
(01:42):
hard for them to accept thatreality, even though they know
it to be true because they havethis idea of their mom as a
perfect mom, someone who alwayswanted to be a mother, whose
sole purpose or primary passionin life was to be a mom, and
(02:03):
this is something that is echoedby many narcissistic mothers.
There is this very societallyapproved idea that women who are
moms are selfless and wonderfuland warm and loving and et
(02:24):
cetera, et, etc.
And narcissistic mothers tendto really gravitate towards
playing this role, and it's notbecause they actually want to be
good mothers, it's not becausethey actually are good mothers.
It's because of the externalbenefits that this role provides
for them in their life.
The problem is, it can be soconfusing and it can be so
(02:50):
complicated when you grew upwith a mom like this, because it
is very hard to blend this ideaof so many people outside of
your immediate family, maybeeven within your immediate
family, validating andcommenting on your mom being
this perfect mother, trying toallow yourself the space to
(03:14):
accept the reality of yourchildhood and your life with
your mom, which involved a lotof emotional abuse and perhaps
even physical abuse.
I think it's a really, reallyimportant topic to cover and I
know I've talked a little bitabout my own journey of
initially believing that my momhad borderline personality
(03:34):
disorder, coming into thisrealization that actually she
much more likely hadnarcissistic personality
disorder and my mom wasdefinitely one of those perfect
moms.
Right Throughout my entire lifethere was this perceived image
of my mom as the perfect mom,and so you know, speaking from
(03:56):
my own personal perspective too,it was a lot harder for me to
accept the reality that my momactually meets criteria for
narcissistic personalitydisorder.
That that actually represents alot of my relationship and
experiences with her throughoutmy lifetime.
(04:16):
It's been a challenge for me aswell to really be able to hold
space for this idea that to somany people she presented
herself as this perfect mother,but to me there was so much
dysfunction and abuse happeningwithin our own relationship.
So let's talk about reallycommon ways in which
(04:39):
narcissistic moms portraythemselves to be the perfect mom
, and when they are anarcissistic mom portraying
themselves to be the perfect mom, what are some things that they
do that enable them to protectthat image?
So the first thing I want totalk about is having this
obsession on presentingthemselves as the perfect mom,
(05:04):
having this obsession aroundtheir appearance of being the
perfect mom, really wantingothers looking at your family to
say, perhaps you have theperfect family.
But even if that's not whatother people say about your
family, really making sure thatthey say that your mom is the
perfect mom, that could bereally getting really involved
in your family.
Really making sure that theysay that your mom is the perfect
(05:25):
mom.
That could be really gettingreally involved in your
activities in school, reallymaking sure that you are doing
the things that a perfect momwould have their child do, so
that your mom can continue tohave this image of the mom who
(05:46):
handles it with ease.
As I'm saying this, I justremember I'm not sure how many
of you saw that Sherry Papinidocumentary, but that is
literally what like wasscreaming at the top of my mind
when I was watching thatdocumentary was wow, that sounds
like a narcissistic mom thatthey were describing this
perfect mom.
That sounds like a narcissisticmom that they were describing
this perfect mom.
No one's the perfect mom.
Good moms are not the perfectmom.
(06:08):
Good moms have moments wherethey're great moms and they have
moments that they're not proudof.
Perfect does not exist.
There is no one in this worldwho doesn't have emotions.
There is no one who doesn't getfrustrated at times with other
(06:28):
people, including their children.
To pretend that you are aperfect mother is a huge red
flag.
It's huge because there is noone who has the patience of a
saint.
There are people who shove downtheir feelings until they
explode.
There are people who, behindclosed doors, are monsters and
(06:51):
to the public, seem lovely andwonderful, but there are not
people who are just so perfectthat nothing ever upsets them,
ever.
And whenever I see a storyabout anyone like that, I think
scary, scary, scary red flag.
So with that being said, let'scontinue.
Other things that are reallycommon with perfect moms who are
(07:16):
actually narcissistic moms arethings like conditional love,
like being very transactional inwhen and how they will show
affection and approval to theirchildren.
They are often willing tofreely give and withdraw love in
(07:39):
order to get their child, tomanipulate their child to do
what they want.
Being really self-centered,prioritizing their own needs,
desires and image over theirkid's well-being.
So this could be things likewanting to have their child
excel in sports, even thoughtheir child is not interested in
(08:00):
sports and instead is reallyinterested in art or music.
It could be really shifting thefocus to what they want.
Oftentimes people say thingslike, oh that parent's living
vicariously through their child.
That is kind of what we'retalking about here.
So another thing narcissisticmoms often do is that they lack
(08:25):
an ability to connect or comforttheir child.
And their ability to connectand comfort their child is
really limited and oftentimes ismore about continuing this
appearance of being the perfectmom than it is to actually
provide comfort to their child,and their children's emotions
(08:48):
are often seen as a directinsult to the mom.
It is something that ismanipulative in the mom's
perception.
The mom is not able to help,model or co-regulate their kid's
emotions because she doesn'thave that ability to do so for
(09:10):
herself.
She's not self-aware enough tounderstand what it feels like to
be disappointed and to enlaxthe emotional intelligence to
help herself or other peoplecope with that in a healthy way.
And so something that comes upfor me in my childhood is I'm
not sure how many of you haveseen that movie oh my gosh, why
(09:33):
is it slipping my mind?
A League of their Own, my mom.
Whenever I would cry as a kidand I mean like a young kid like
this, definitely from the timeI was like five on up, maybe
earlier, but from what I canremember, any time I would cry,
she would say there's no cryingin baseball, which is kind of a
(09:54):
crazy thing to say to a fiveyear old.
When they're hurt and cryingit's not great.
And I think that just shows youhow emotionally detached and
unavailable she was, that herresponse to me being in any
level of emotional or physicalpain was to try to shut it down.
(10:15):
Okay, next is having reallyunrealistic expectations for
their children.
So if you're the best, thatmeans she's the best, right.
If she's the best, thentherefore you should be the best
.
There's a lot of story timegoing on on my end today, but
I'm going to tell you anotherlittle tidbit story.
When my sister and I weregrowing up, we were both in.
(10:38):
When my sister and I weregrowing up, we were both in.
They used to call it GATE backin the day.
I don't know what they call itnow, but GATE stood for Gifted
and Talented Education.
I don't really know what theyoffered us as part of that.
It's not like we were in aseparate class or anything, but
essentially it's something thatyou tested into and that was
something really positive for mymom and she really liked the
(10:59):
fact that we were both engagedOne thing that she did not like
is that as kids I would you know, as a young child in elementary
school, I wouldn't benecessarily thinking about
projects that I had to do, orhomework, or bigger book reports
or art projects or things likethat I, like many kids out there
(11:22):
, would sometimes have a momentwhere the night before something
was due, I would panic becauseI would suddenly realize that it
was due the next day and I hadnot done it, and no one in my
family neither of my parentsreally, I guess paid attention
to that type of thing.
So I would become really anxiousand upset and realize that I
(11:44):
had to go to school the next dayand I didn't have this project.
And what would happen is,instead of my parents saying
it's OK, like we'll talk to yourteacher, moving forward, this
is how we can kind of keep trackof these things a bit better,
instead of coaching me throughhow to effectively handle the
(12:06):
situation, what would happen ismy dad would kind of just like
shrug and say okay, and then mymom would stay up all night and
do the best presentation ever ina way that looked like I did it
, and so I cannot even tell youthe amount of projects that I
had as a young kid that I didn'tdo Science projects.
(12:31):
I never thought of the ideafrom Book reports.
There's so many things.
And the reason being she wouldget mad at me.
I mean mad Like she was notlike pleased doing this.
This was like I was going to bepunished for this flaw, this
(12:51):
failure of mine, for a long time.
And so buckle up, bunny,because it's going to be a rough
couple of days here.
Funny, because it's going to bea rough couple of days here.
She did it because it wouldcompletely destroy her image of
being the perfect mom with thesmartest kids if I didn't have
the best projects done on timeall the time.
(13:14):
That is what I'm talking aboutwhen I'm talking about
narcissistic moms.
That's not a normal response,it's just not so moving on, if
you could relate to that, I'm sosorry.
That's really not a pleasantway to grow up as a child.
Let's see what's next.
I'm looking at a little outlinethat I wrote up before we
(13:35):
started, because I tend toramble and I'm trying to stay
more on topic.
But I'm sorry, I'm just arambler, what can I say?
So another really common traitof perfect moms who are actually
narcissistic mothers is thatthey love to play the you.
(13:56):
I have done everything in mylife to give you the life that
you have.
I have sacrificed, I have givenyou everything.
This is something that is socommon with narcissistic moms.
And the reality is like you'rethe one that decided to become a
(14:18):
parent.
That is your job to sacrificefor your child.
It's my job as a parent tosacrifice for my child.
She doesn't owe me anything,and the decisions that I make
are ones that I'm responsiblefor.
She doesn't owe me for memaking those decisions, but
(14:39):
narcissistic moms love to usethat and throw that back in your
face, and they love, love, loveto be seen as this martyr who
has done so much and sacrificedso much for their children, and
they use that oftentimes as away to try to guilt trip you.
(15:01):
I've done this for you.
It's the least you can do forme.
Okay, I'm going to talk abouttwo more and then we'll wrap
this episode up.
So the next one is thatnarcissistic moms are often very
unhappy with their childrenbeing independent.
They want a certain level ofdependence on them, and in a
(15:23):
very unique way.
So it's not so much that thisnarcissistic mom wants their
child to be dependent on them sothat they can take care of them
.
It's that they want them toshare the same thoughts,
feelings and beliefs that themom has.
They do not want them to haveindependent thoughts, beliefs or
(15:46):
values that conflict in any way, shape or form from what the
narcissistic mom thinks,believes and values.
They don't need their child tohave any sort of opinion that
differs from them, and so theyreally discourage and often
(16:06):
penalize or punish independence.
Going back, I told you, today isstory time with my own mom, but
hopefully me sharing some ofthese little tidbits helps you.
You know, recognize that if youexperience this too, you are
certainly not alone, and I knowI laugh often through this
podcast over not funny things.
I do that in my life too.
That's a coping skill that I'vedeveloped throughout the years
(16:29):
and it is also reflective of mejust having been able to put
some emotional distance betweenmyself and a lot of these things
Like, yes, they are horrible,they're sad, they're traumatic
and awful, and I've talked a lotabout them in my own personal
therapy.
I've talked a lot about themwith people I trust, my friends,
(16:50):
my husband.
I think sometimes just beingable to talk more openly about
these things, once we've had theopportunity to process them,
can be really helpful.
So I hope that you do find ithelpful me sharing some of these
little nuggets from my own life.
So going back to narcissisticmoms not wanting their children
(17:14):
to have views that areindependent of their own, my mom
used to love to say whenever Iwould have my own thoughts and
opinions that differ from hersIf I say, go right, you'll go
left, tori, whatever I say,you'll do the opposite.
And it was like no, not really.
(17:37):
Just, you know, sometimes Iagree and sometimes I disagree,
but that is a perfectrepresentation of that filter in
which she viewed me.
So the last one I'm going totalk about is when narcissistic
moms perfect moms publiclypraise and fawn over their
children, but behind closeddoors are super critical and
(17:58):
harsh to their kids.
So this is really really common.
Behind closed doors, thingslook very different than they do
publicly.
This was something that Iexperienced throughout my life.
One thing my mom would love todo is she would always show up
(18:19):
to any of my activities orperformances.
She was really involved in themand oftentimes she would get
very angry with me about what Idon't know, but this happened a
lot where she would get really,really frustrated.
She would get really, reallyangry with me and something that
(18:39):
I did on the way really upsether.
And, mind you, growing up I wasan honor student.
I got good grades for the mostpart.
I almost failed AP calculus butit's AP calculus and that's a
different story for a differentday.
But I wasn't getting in trouble.
So to say, I was overall, apretty easy kid and it wasn't
(19:01):
about me, it was about her.
And so she had this greatability.
From the time she was my GirlScout leader growing up to the
time she would show up at thefootball games which I was
cheering at in high school.
She would forward facing, bethis loving, supportive person
(19:24):
as soon as we would get in thecar after Girl Scouts, she would
lose it At the football games.
She would pull me aside to aplace where no one could see or
hear us and scream at me andthen leave and I was supposed to
go back and continue cheering.
These are not normal behaviors.
(19:45):
These are not things she everapologized for.
These are not things that Ibelieve that she felt badly for
at all.
I think she felt extremelyentitled to express her
frustration towards me in thisway, and I think that she had
zero ability to care about howtraumatic that experience or
(20:07):
those experiences were for me.
So you know, now that a storytime for today has completed,
please let me know your thoughtson this episode.
Let me know if you enjoyhearing little tidbits about my
own personal journey or if you'dlike me to keep it a little
more textbook.
I am happy to receive thefeedback any which way, but
(20:30):
essentially, what I want you toknow is that you are not crazy
that growing up in relationshipslike these are so layered and
so complicated and people thatdon't grow up like this don't
understand, they don't get it,because in what world would
someone that didn't grow up in adynamic like this think that
(20:50):
these things were happening?
It's just so bizarre, it's sostrange and it's so perplexing
to understand this dynamicunless you've lived it.
And if you've lived it, then I'msure that you, unfortunately,
can relate to a lot of what I'veexperienced throughout my life,
(21:12):
and it's probably, you know,similar in a lot of respects to
what you've experienced as well.
That's why I'm so grateful tohave this podcast.
I'm so grateful to all of youwho write in and share your
thoughts and stories with me.
I just think it's been such apositive influence on my own
life, my own healing journey,and I'm so happy to hear that
(21:35):
it's been such a positiveinfluence on so many of your
lives as well.
So please, please, please, keepthose DMs on Instagram coming,
keep the emails coming and, onthat note, I'll see you soon.
Welcome to You're Not Crazy, a podcast for the
adult children of parents withborderline and narcissistic
personality disorders.
I'm your host, tori Wixel, atherapist and coach with over a
decade of experience in themental health field.
Now let's jump in.
Hi guys, welcome back to thisepisode of You're Not Crazy.
(00:36):
I am so excited to be back andtalking with you guys this week.
This is just such a weird timeof year, isn't it?
Between Thanksgiving and theend of the year.
It's just so bizarre for somany reasons, but I feel like my
days are blurring together andmy brain is somehow still
(00:57):
functioning, but I also have tosay my toddler's been in this
weird sleep regression thingstage, so I think that's just
complicating my overall sense ofreality.
So, anyways, that's a littlesnippet into my world, but today
I thought we would talk aboutsomething that is not talked
(01:19):
about enough at all, and that isthis idea of the perfect mother
when we're talking aboutnarcissistic moms.
There are so many clientscoaching and therapy clients
that I've worked with throughoutthe years who have narcissistic
mothers, who have talked inlength with me about how it's so
(01:42):
hard for them to accept thatreality, even though they know
it to be true because they havethis idea of their mom as a
perfect mom, someone who alwayswanted to be a mother, whose
sole purpose or primary passionin life was to be a mom, and
(02:03):
this is something that is echoedby many narcissistic mothers.
There is this very societallyapproved idea that women who are
moms are selfless and wonderfuland warm and loving and et
(02:24):
cetera, et, etc.
And narcissistic mothers tendto really gravitate towards
playing this role, and it's notbecause they actually want to be
good mothers, it's not becausethey actually are good mothers.
It's because of the externalbenefits that this role provides
for them in their life.
The problem is, it can be soconfusing and it can be so
(02:50):
complicated when you grew upwith a mom like this, because it
is very hard to blend this ideaof so many people outside of
your immediate family, maybeeven within your immediate
family, validating andcommenting on your mom being
this perfect mother, trying toallow yourself the space to
(03:14):
accept the reality of yourchildhood and your life with
your mom, which involved a lotof emotional abuse and perhaps
even physical abuse.
I think it's a really, reallyimportant topic to cover and I
know I've talked a little bitabout my own journey of
initially believing that my momhad borderline personality
(03:34):
disorder, coming into thisrealization that actually she
much more likely hadnarcissistic personality
disorder and my mom wasdefinitely one of those perfect
moms.
Right Throughout my entire lifethere was this perceived image
of my mom as the perfect mom,and so you know, speaking from
(03:56):
my own personal perspective too,it was a lot harder for me to
accept the reality that my momactually meets criteria for
narcissistic personalitydisorder.
That that actually represents alot of my relationship and
experiences with her throughoutmy lifetime.
(04:16):
It's been a challenge for me aswell to really be able to hold
space for this idea that to somany people she presented
herself as this perfect mother,but to me there was so much
dysfunction and abuse happeningwithin our own relationship.
So let's talk about reallycommon ways in which
(04:39):
narcissistic moms portraythemselves to be the perfect mom
, and when they are anarcissistic mom portraying
themselves to be the perfect mom, what are some things that they
do that enable them to protectthat image?
So the first thing I want totalk about is having this
obsession on presentingthemselves as the perfect mom,
(05:04):
having this obsession aroundtheir appearance of being the
perfect mom, really wantingothers looking at your family to
say, perhaps you have theperfect family.
But even if that's not whatother people say about your
family, really making sure thatthey say that your mom is the
perfect mom, that could bereally getting really involved
in your family.
Really making sure that theysay that your mom is the perfect
(05:25):
mom.
That could be really gettingreally involved in your
activities in school, reallymaking sure that you are doing
the things that a perfect momwould have their child do, so
that your mom can continue tohave this image of the mom who
(05:46):
handles it with ease.
As I'm saying this, I justremember I'm not sure how many
of you saw that Sherry Papinidocumentary, but that is
literally what like wasscreaming at the top of my mind
when I was watching thatdocumentary was wow, that sounds
like a narcissistic mom thatthey were describing this
perfect mom.
That sounds like a narcissisticmom that they were describing
this perfect mom.
No one's the perfect mom.
Good moms are not the perfectmom.
(06:08):
Good moms have moments wherethey're great moms and they have
moments that they're not proudof.
Perfect does not exist.
There is no one in this worldwho doesn't have emotions.
There is no one who doesn't getfrustrated at times with other
(06:28):
people, including their children.
To pretend that you are aperfect mother is a huge red
flag.
It's huge because there is noone who has the patience of a
saint.
There are people who shove downtheir feelings until they
explode.
There are people who, behindclosed doors, are monsters and
(06:51):
to the public, seem lovely andwonderful, but there are not
people who are just so perfectthat nothing ever upsets them,
ever.
And whenever I see a storyabout anyone like that, I think
scary, scary, scary red flag.
So with that being said, let'scontinue.
Other things that are reallycommon with perfect moms who are
(07:16):
actually narcissistic moms arethings like conditional love,
like being very transactional inwhen and how they will show
affection and approval to theirchildren.
They are often willing tofreely give and withdraw love in
(07:39):
order to get their child, tomanipulate their child to do
what they want.
Being really self-centered,prioritizing their own needs,
desires and image over theirkid's well-being.
So this could be things likewanting to have their child
excel in sports, even thoughtheir child is not interested in
(08:00):
sports and instead is reallyinterested in art or music.
It could be really shifting thefocus to what they want.
Oftentimes people say thingslike, oh that parent's living
vicariously through their child.
That is kind of what we'retalking about here.
So another thing narcissisticmoms often do is that they lack
(08:25):
an ability to connect or comforttheir child.
And their ability to connectand comfort their child is
really limited and oftentimes ismore about continuing this
appearance of being the perfectmom than it is to actually
provide comfort to their child,and their children's emotions
(08:48):
are often seen as a directinsult to the mom.
It is something that ismanipulative in the mom's
perception.
The mom is not able to help,model or co-regulate their kid's
emotions because she doesn'thave that ability to do so for
(09:10):
herself.
She's not self-aware enough tounderstand what it feels like to
be disappointed and to enlaxthe emotional intelligence to
help herself or other peoplecope with that in a healthy way.
And so something that comes upfor me in my childhood is I'm
not sure how many of you haveseen that movie oh my gosh, why
(09:33):
is it slipping my mind?
A League of their Own, my mom.
Whenever I would cry as a kidand I mean like a young kid like
this, definitely from the timeI was like five on up, maybe
earlier, but from what I canremember, any time I would cry,
she would say there's no cryingin baseball, which is kind of a
(09:54):
crazy thing to say to a fiveyear old.
When they're hurt and cryingit's not great.
And I think that just shows youhow emotionally detached and
unavailable she was, that herresponse to me being in any
level of emotional or physicalpain was to try to shut it down.
(10:15):
Okay, next is having reallyunrealistic expectations for
their children.
So if you're the best, thatmeans she's the best, right.
If she's the best, thentherefore you should be the best
.
There's a lot of story timegoing on on my end today, but
I'm going to tell you anotherlittle tidbit story.
When my sister and I weregrowing up, we were both in.
(10:38):
When my sister and I weregrowing up, we were both in.
They used to call it GATE backin the day.
I don't know what they call itnow, but GATE stood for Gifted
and Talented Education.
I don't really know what theyoffered us as part of that.
It's not like we were in aseparate class or anything, but
essentially it's something thatyou tested into and that was
something really positive for mymom and she really liked the
(10:59):
fact that we were both engagedOne thing that she did not like
is that as kids I would you know, as a young child in elementary
school, I wouldn't benecessarily thinking about
projects that I had to do, orhomework, or bigger book reports
or art projects or things likethat I, like many kids out there
(11:22):
, would sometimes have a momentwhere the night before something
was due, I would panic becauseI would suddenly realize that it
was due the next day and I hadnot done it, and no one in my
family neither of my parentsreally, I guess paid attention
to that type of thing.
So I would become really anxiousand upset and realize that I
(11:44):
had to go to school the next dayand I didn't have this project.
And what would happen is,instead of my parents saying
it's OK, like we'll talk to yourteacher, moving forward, this
is how we can kind of keep trackof these things a bit better,
instead of coaching me throughhow to effectively handle the
(12:06):
situation, what would happen ismy dad would kind of just like
shrug and say okay, and then mymom would stay up all night and
do the best presentation ever ina way that looked like I did it
, and so I cannot even tell youthe amount of projects that I
had as a young kid that I didn'tdo Science projects.
(12:31):
I never thought of the ideafrom Book reports.
There's so many things.
And the reason being she wouldget mad at me.
I mean mad Like she was notlike pleased doing this.
This was like I was going to bepunished for this flaw, this
(12:51):
failure of mine, for a long time.
And so buckle up, bunny,because it's going to be a rough
couple of days here.
Funny, because it's going to bea rough couple of days here.
She did it because it wouldcompletely destroy her image of
being the perfect mom with thesmartest kids if I didn't have
the best projects done on timeall the time.
(13:14):
That is what I'm talking aboutwhen I'm talking about
narcissistic moms.
That's not a normal response,it's just not so moving on, if
you could relate to that, I'm sosorry.
That's really not a pleasantway to grow up as a child.
Let's see what's next.
I'm looking at a little outlinethat I wrote up before we
(13:35):
started, because I tend toramble and I'm trying to stay
more on topic.
But I'm sorry, I'm just arambler, what can I say?
So another really common traitof perfect moms who are actually
narcissistic mothers is thatthey love to play the you.
(13:56):
I have done everything in mylife to give you the life that
you have.
I have sacrificed, I have givenyou everything.
This is something that is socommon with narcissistic moms.
And the reality is like you'rethe one that decided to become a
(14:18):
parent.
That is your job to sacrificefor your child.
It's my job as a parent tosacrifice for my child.
She doesn't owe me anything,and the decisions that I make
are ones that I'm responsiblefor.
She doesn't owe me for memaking those decisions, but
(14:39):
narcissistic moms love to usethat and throw that back in your
face, and they love, love, loveto be seen as this martyr who
has done so much and sacrificedso much for their children, and
they use that oftentimes as away to try to guilt trip you.
(15:01):
I've done this for you.
It's the least you can do forme.
Okay, I'm going to talk abouttwo more and then we'll wrap
this episode up.
So the next one is thatnarcissistic moms are often very
unhappy with their childrenbeing independent.
They want a certain level ofdependence on them, and in a
(15:23):
very unique way.
So it's not so much that thisnarcissistic mom wants their
child to be dependent on them sothat they can take care of them
.
It's that they want them toshare the same thoughts,
feelings and beliefs that themom has.
They do not want them to haveindependent thoughts, beliefs or
(15:46):
values that conflict in any way, shape or form from what the
narcissistic mom thinks,believes and values.
They don't need their child tohave any sort of opinion that
differs from them, and so theyreally discourage and often
(16:06):
penalize or punish independence.
Going back, I told you, today isstory time with my own mom, but
hopefully me sharing some ofthese little tidbits helps you.
You know, recognize that if youexperience this too, you are
certainly not alone, and I knowI laugh often through this
podcast over not funny things.
I do that in my life too.
That's a coping skill that I'vedeveloped throughout the years
(16:29):
and it is also reflective of mejust having been able to put
some emotional distance betweenmyself and a lot of these things
Like, yes, they are horrible,they're sad, they're traumatic
and awful, and I've talked a lotabout them in my own personal
therapy.
I've talked a lot about themwith people I trust, my friends,
(16:50):
my husband.
I think sometimes just beingable to talk more openly about
these things, once we've had theopportunity to process them,
can be really helpful.
So I hope that you do find ithelpful me sharing some of these
little nuggets from my own life.
So going back to narcissisticmoms not wanting their children
(17:14):
to have views that areindependent of their own, my mom
used to love to say whenever Iwould have my own thoughts and
opinions that differ from hersIf I say, go right, you'll go
left, tori, whatever I say,you'll do the opposite.
And it was like no, not really.
(17:37):
Just, you know, sometimes Iagree and sometimes I disagree,
but that is a perfectrepresentation of that filter in
which she viewed me.
So the last one I'm going totalk about is when narcissistic
moms perfect moms publiclypraise and fawn over their
children, but behind closeddoors are super critical and
(17:58):
harsh to their kids.
So this is really really common.
Behind closed doors, thingslook very different than they do
publicly.
This was something that Iexperienced throughout my life.
One thing my mom would love todo is she would always show up
(18:19):
to any of my activities orperformances.
She was really involved in themand oftentimes she would get
very angry with me about what Idon't know, but this happened a
lot where she would get really,really frustrated.
She would get really, reallyangry with me and something that
(18:39):
I did on the way really upsether.
And, mind you, growing up I wasan honor student.
I got good grades for the mostpart.
I almost failed AP calculus butit's AP calculus and that's a
different story for a differentday.
But I wasn't getting in trouble.
So to say, I was overall, apretty easy kid and it wasn't
(19:01):
about me, it was about her.
And so she had this greatability.
From the time she was my GirlScout leader growing up to the
time she would show up at thefootball games which I was
cheering at in high school.
She would forward facing, bethis loving, supportive person
(19:24):
as soon as we would get in thecar after Girl Scouts, she would
lose it At the football games.
She would pull me aside to aplace where no one could see or
hear us and scream at me andthen leave and I was supposed to
go back and continue cheering.
These are not normal behaviors.
(19:45):
These are not things she everapologized for.
These are not things that Ibelieve that she felt badly for
at all.
I think she felt extremelyentitled to express her
frustration towards me in thisway, and I think that she had
zero ability to care about howtraumatic that experience or
(20:07):
those experiences were for me.
So you know, now that a storytime for today has completed,
please let me know your thoughtson this episode.
Let me know if you enjoyhearing little tidbits about my
own personal journey or if you'dlike me to keep it a little
more textbook.
I am happy to receive thefeedback any which way, but
(20:30):
essentially, what I want you toknow is that you are not crazy
that growing up in relationshipslike these are so layered and
so complicated and people thatdon't grow up like this don't
understand, they don't get it,because in what world would
someone that didn't grow up in adynamic like this think that
(20:50):
these things were happening?
It's just so bizarre, it's sostrange and it's so perplexing
to understand this dynamicunless you've lived it.
And if you've lived it, then I'msure that you, unfortunately,
can relate to a lot of what I'veexperienced throughout my life,
(21:12):
and it's probably, you know,similar in a lot of respects to
what you've experienced as well.
That's why I'm so grateful tohave this podcast.
I'm so grateful to all of youwho write in and share your
thoughts and stories with me.
I just think it's been such apositive influence on my own
life, my own healing journey,and I'm so happy to hear that
(21:35):
it's been such a positiveinfluence on so many of your
lives as well.
So please, please, please, keepthose DMs on Instagram coming,
keep the emails coming and, onthat note, I'll see you soon.
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