Path of the Pale Rider’s Darkest Issue Yet with special guest Laurie Calcaterra | Zombie Book Club Ep 106 - Zombie Book Club

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:20):
Welcome to Zombie Book Club, the only book club
where the book is a horriblenightmare beyond words.
I'm Dan, and while I'm notdiscussing Path of the Pale
Rider, issue 7, with mytherapist, I'm writing a book
about a nightmare of my ownwhere people escape the undead,
crammed into safe zones wherethey're subjected to abhorrent
living conditions.

Speaker 2 (00:35):
And I'm Leah and I would choose Dan's book's
abhorrent living conditions overwhat happens at the Undead
Retirement Center in Path of thePale Rider.
We release episodes everySunday, so submerge.

Speaker 1 (00:45):
That's a weird word to use instead of subscribe it
is.

Speaker 2 (00:48):
It's the closest one I could think of that kind of
fits with what's going on at theUndead Retirement Center
without giving it away.

Speaker 1 (00:53):
One day we're running out of words we need to say
subscribe one day.
Our guest today needs nointroduction.
Moving on, just kidding, loriCalacaterra is the writer and
creator of Path of the PaleRider comic series hot sauce
witch smasher of innocent fruit,martial artist, zombestie for

(01:18):
life and our first and foreverzombie ween queen and Leah, and
I would commit murder for her.
Sorry, brandon, welcome toZombie Book Club, lori Hi.

Speaker 3 (01:31):
Thanks for having me.

Speaker 1 (01:33):
Thanks for being back that was the best intro.

Speaker 3 (01:35):
I feel like Daenerys from Game of Thrones.
It's like Lori CalcaterraBreaker of Chains, smasher of
Innocent Fruit yeah, smasher ofFruit Maker of innocent fruit
yeah.
Smasher of fruit maker of witch.
Hot sauce of witch.
I love it.
I love it.

Speaker 2 (01:47):
I think it's important to note that the fruit
is innocent and I think it'salso important to note that we
would fictionally commit murderfor Laurie Calcaterra.

Speaker 3 (01:56):
I mean not for real.
Everybody that's listening,that is for legal purposes yes
but for real also.

Speaker 2 (02:03):
Brandon for real, though, if you need people to
disappear we might fictionallymurder you, but not at my
request, possibly.
Yes, yeah, not saying that.

Speaker 3 (02:14):
The just kidding, I'll murder you myself, son.

Speaker 1 (02:17):
I feel like that's the only right way to do it,
like if we did it, that would bewe would be stealing your honor
.
This is true.
Yeah, that's not that's.
If we did it, that would be wewould be stealing your honor.

Speaker 3 (02:29):
This is true.
That's unacceptable.
However, I can do the murderingand you can do the teabagging,
and then that's.

Speaker 1 (02:34):
I mean, I could get some prosthetic ones.
Yeah, leo would have actualteabags.
Yeah, Please.

Speaker 2 (02:49):
Laurie, we have a few rapid fire questions for you,
yeah, and because you did notjoin us at living dead weekend,
unlike brandon starocky, that'sthat's where he's got a point on
you.
Uh, we're gonna ask you hatethis?
We hate it too.
We really wanted you there.
I was very sad, but we askedquestions of people at the
convention based on the books offolks that were there with us

(03:11):
as well.
We're not going to ask youBrandon's question because we
thought that might be offensiveto you, based on Avalon comic
series, but we are going to askyou a question about Joe
Salazar's the Dead Weight.
A question, a theoretical zombieapocalypse question about
Babysitters of the apocalypsefrom courtney constantine and a
theoretical question fromelementary undead by alice v

(03:32):
sullivan.
These are all.
What would you do?
Questions are you ready?
I'm ready.
All right, you are running awayfrom zombies in the apocalypse.
You spot a canoe.
There is room for five people,including yourself, including
yourself.
Including yourself, you havefour people with you.
Oh, I just fucked it up.
I was like then we all go,hooray, yeah it's you and four

(03:54):
people.

Speaker 1 (03:54):
You can pick four people.
That's what Leo was trying tosay Pick who are the four people
you're going to pick for yourto get in the canoe with you to
save them from the apocalypse.

Speaker 3 (04:07):
OK, well, you and dan , oh, of course, and I get to
pick two more.
Yeah, so, of course, joesalazar, do I pick brandon?
I don't know, that is no, I'mbringing my dog.
Perfect.
If my family was there, I wouldtake my family, of course.
But well, they are talking likesound besties they are there,

(04:29):
oh, they are, yeah, oh then Ihave to take my kids and my
husband.

Speaker 1 (04:33):
Sorry, okay, and your dog?
That's the four, my dog so.
Does that fill up the four?
The four slots?
I would think so, maybe.
I mean, I don't know how bigyour family is no, we could
probably fit one more person.

Speaker 3 (04:45):
The children's can be like one space husband takes up
one space it's four people, dog, four living creatures four
living creatures, my family.

Speaker 1 (04:55):
My dog, that's who I would take, okay um, yeah, I
have terrible news for you thecanoe is sinking.

Speaker 2 (05:01):
There's too much weight in it we lied.

Speaker 1 (05:02):
It can only hold three people.
You have to kick somebody out.

Speaker 3 (05:06):
Unfortunately the dog can't come.
Is your dog's name Pancake?
I love my dog.
No, the dog's name is Murphy.
If we get another dog, maybe Iname him Sad Pancake.

Speaker 1 (05:16):
You're going to have to get another dog, I think.

Speaker 3 (05:19):
But can Murphy swim?
Yes, I'm sorry say again CanMurphy swim.
Yes, I'm sorry say again CanMurphy swim, murphy can swim, so
he would just swim with us.

Speaker 2 (05:25):
Yeah, he'd be fun.
He's a.

Speaker 3 (05:26):
Newfie Doodle.
So he's Poodle with Newfie, andNewfies are water dogs.
He's a great swimmer.
In fact, he rescues things fromthe pool that don't need to be
rescued, like pool noodles.
It's great, I mean somebody'sgot to do it.

Speaker 1 (05:41):
Do you think Murphy's going to hold it against you
that you kicked him out of thecanoe?

Speaker 3 (05:48):
No, he'll just follow us.
If you have chicken, it's evenbetter.
If you just take the chicken,he'll come right behind the
canoe.
He will care, not if he getssome chicken.

Speaker 2 (05:58):
Make him rescue the chicken treats.
Sounds like this one worked outexcept for Leah and I and Joe
Salazar.

Speaker 3 (06:05):
I mean, is there another canoe?

Speaker 1 (06:07):
Unfortunately that was the last one Do you guys
know how to swim.

Speaker 3 (06:11):
I do, yes, all right so then Leah can come.
The dog can bring you Dan.
That's his job.

Speaker 2 (06:18):
Okay, on to the next question.
You're left with two children.
You're abandoned.
This woman just hands you hertwo kids.
They Left with two children.
You're abandoned.
Just this woman just hands youher two kids.
They're both under the age offive.
One is two and one is five.
We're all going to die.
We're just going to be five.
It's the beginning of theoutbreak of the zombie
apocalypse.
What do you do?

Speaker 3 (06:33):
We're all going to die.
You just accept that you'regoing to die with them.
I mean, I'm going to try andprotect the kids, but the kids
will probably get us killed.
Let's be honest.
They're noisy, they're slow.
They skin their knee and thencry.
They're scared of everything.
They don't know how to stayquiet.
Right, they'll scream whenthey're scared.
I'll probably go down in afiery battle with a couple

(06:58):
swords in my hand, screaming,trying to save the kids, but
we're all going to die.
It depends on the types ofzombies, of course, but I mean
like I'm assuming that they'retraditional zombies.
Yeah, slow romero zombies.
Okay, well, I'll kill a lot ofthem before we go down, but
we'll probably go down I believein you, I think you can do it I

(07:18):
mean we could, as long as wecould get to some place secure,
like.
I still have the idea of um likeworld war z solution, where
it's like if you hide in theattic or a tree house or
something with like a ladder,yeah you could bring the ladder
up, then we could survive aslong as we could find food.
But if you run out of resourcesthere's not much you can do.

(07:40):
But I would probably die forthose kids, yeah yeah, I knew
you'd be the hero.

Speaker 2 (07:44):
You would uh some of the responses we got including
uh from someone I just postedabout it because it's uh the
episode out today and they werejust instantly like oh, those
kids are just gonna die.
They're like yeah, a lot ofpeople are just oh, people were
saying like I'll put them in acloset and lock the closet I
mean, I want to believe they'reall joking, but I knew you're a

(08:06):
hero at heart, so I'm notsurprised.
That was your answer, yeah.

Speaker 1 (08:10):
Do you treat them like your own children at this
point, Like do you adopt themfully?

Speaker 3 (08:14):
Yes A hundred percent .

Speaker 2 (08:15):
What do you think Brandon said in answer to this
question?

Speaker 3 (08:18):
He would probably put them in the canoe by themselves
and put them out in the riverBye Something themselves and put
them out in the river Bye,something like that.

Speaker 2 (08:24):
We asked him if he would treat them like his own
children.
He was like, absolutely not.

Speaker 1 (08:27):
He did say that he would protect them and keep them
safe.
And then we're like would youtreat them like your own
children?

Speaker 3 (08:33):
He's like no, so he would do the bird box.
He was like okay, so you haveto take care, you have to.
You're the front line, you'rethe scout.
We You're the front line.

Speaker 1 (08:43):
You're the scout.
We'll stay back here.
If a child needs to besacrificed, it's definitely
these two kids.
Over his own kids, it's Nick.

Speaker 2 (08:51):
Now you're the kid.
Last question You're inelementary school English class.
You're like 12 years old.
Zombie apocalypse breaks out inclass.
What does 12-year-old LaurieCalcaterra do?
Hit it with a book.

Speaker 3 (09:06):
I'm still a fighter, I don't care if I'm 12.
You were a fighter at 12?
Yeah, I'm kicking the shit outof whatever that is with
whatever I have.
Handy Books can be weapons,sure Rulers pencils for the eye.

Speaker 2 (09:19):
We're taking it out.
I wonder if there's a creativeway to use.
I used to be obsessed with theelectronic pencil sharpeners.
I wonder if there's a creativeway to use.
I used to be, like, obsessedwith the electronic pencil
sharpeners.
I don't know how you could usethat as a weapon other than like
a blunt force weapon.
Well, you could sharpen, that'sabout it, but I would always
think about putting my pinkyfinger in it, because that was
my interest.

Speaker 1 (09:34):
Sam.

Speaker 3 (09:35):
Sam.

Speaker 1 (09:36):
Yeah, you know what.
You know how they used to havelike pointers.
It was usually like a woodendowel.
Yeah, they'd use it to point atthe chalkboard and then like,
whack your knuckles.
Um, depending on what kind ofschool you want to like, you
could sharpen that in the pencilsharpener and then you got a
pointy stick yes, the problemwith the pointy things.

Speaker 3 (09:56):
They have to be smooth, otherwise they don't
come back out of the body, right?

Speaker 1 (10:01):
I mean that'd be, you can use it once yeah, and then
it's gone for all time and youknow 12, 13 years old, you're
not going to know like you got afire hard.
Yeah uh, wooden spears to makethem work no, you're hitting it
with blunt force yeah it'll workonce you know I make a whole
bunch of them so now we can justsplice in your answers laurie

(10:22):
to the living dead weekendepisode and pretend you were
there.
You see, there we go.
We missed you.
By the way, it would have been.

Speaker 2 (10:29):
It was a great time, but we could only imagine if you
were also a roomie in theundead house.

Speaker 3 (10:41):
Let's get into Path of the Pale Rider.
Oh, let's talk about this.
How are you guys doing, by theway, are we?
Yeah, because when you've readthe sneak peek, because a lot of
people be upset with me over aportion that I gave them.

Speaker 2 (10:58):
Well, I mean, you did leave us on a really fucking
terrible cliffhanger, yes, thatwhich maybe I was a little mad
at first, but since then mybrain has gone wild with all the
potential of what could happennext, because there are so many
things that could happen next,um, but mostly I was like, damn,
I didn't see this coming.
I was impressed.
That's how I felt, yeah, thankyou, like when you when you

(11:20):
described to us wave I think ourvery first interview with you
you talked about about howthere's going to be a part in
issue seven where the noise isso big you don't know how to
visualize it.
Yeah, then I read your scriptand I was like, oh, I get it now
and I am so curious how it'sgoing to get visualized.

Speaker 3 (11:37):
Uh, I think what I'm going to do is build a
soundtrack, oh, and put it on myYouTube channel and QR code it
into the book, because I don'tthink I can put.
I mean, I can put a lot ofwords on the page, but I also
don't want to take away fromwhat's happening to the

(11:58):
characters.
You know what I mean that initself is overwhelming to the
characters.
You know what I mean.
Like, that in itself isoverwhelming, and so I think
that it really does need to besound.

Speaker 2 (12:09):
I want to ask you a question, but I have to try and
ask it in a way that is vague.
The place, the undeadretirement center where this
takes place have you been tothat location before?
No, I have, and it made me cry,so I don't know how.

Speaker 3 (12:29):
I'm going to yeah.

Speaker 2 (12:32):
Well, that's all I'm going to say.
It made me cry just to be there.
So, thinking about that andthen thinking about what this
place is like, well, imaginethat, instead of beautiful, it's
horrible.

Speaker 3 (12:43):
Terrible, yeah, and stinks and is too loud to
comprehend.
Yeah, all of that.
To take that all in and then totry and figure it out, say that
vaguely, try and survive it.
No prep?
Yeah, because nobody knows whatit is, he has no idea where

(13:06):
he's going, and to get throwninto that and see if you can
figure it out let's rewind for amoment for anybody who's a new
listener or possibly new to loriand you're like what on earth
is this?
Yeah, what are they?

Speaker 2 (13:16):
talking about.
Path of the pale rider is astory set in the apocalypse,
following the extraordinaryjourney of jude saint claire as
he tirelessly searches for theanswer to the question why do
the dead no longer die?
Because your tagline for pathof pale rider is death is broken
, right, laurie is broken, yes.
So for listeners who might benew and will be big stands of

(13:36):
you, like us after this episodeand they read your series, uh,
what would be like the top threethings they should know about
path of pale?

Speaker 3 (13:43):
So, first thing you need to know is that when we
mean death is broken, we haveundead, but they are not your
typical Romero zombies and it'snot an infection.
It is.
Your soul does not leave yourbody upon death.
You are decaying, right, butyou're still you.

(14:05):
You're just trapped in yourdecaying body and you lose your
humanity as your brain rots.
It's like having dementia andfast forward with added body
horror.
So that's the first thing.
The second thing you need toknow is that it affects every
living creature on the earthPeople, animals, insects, fish

(14:26):
everything is affected by thisand it makes it a really
challenging environment.
And then the third thing youneed to know about Path of the
Pill Rider is that I take a realworld approach to how people
would react to that.
So you're going to seegovernment, you're going to see

(14:46):
conspiracy theories, you'regoing to see people not agree on
what they think the causes arewhat should happen.
You know, in that situation andwe deal with some some heavy
topics and kids andexistentialism, and all through
the viewpoint of this oneregular guy um, his superpower

(15:08):
is being lucky.
I guess he's got good luck andbad luck, yeah, but eventually
all good luck runs out I knowthis is the.

Speaker 2 (15:16):
This is the line you've been using for issue
seven.
So issues one through six areout.
We've read all of themvoraciously.
Now we've got the kickstarter.
It's out as of this episodecoming out for issue seven and I
what I think everybody is dyinghaha to know is whether or not
jude st claire is going to live.
Will he survive?

Speaker 3 (15:35):
will he survive?
Yeah, will he well he does he?

Speaker 2 (15:38):
have enough luck he will survive in some way right,
either undead or alive.

Speaker 3 (15:42):
But that's the question yes, the question is,
because that is the one thingthat he has stated again and
again that's his biggest fear,because he has seen the people
that he cares about go throughthis right, where they slowly,
where they decay, where theylose their humanity.
He has seen, you know, um, allsorts of things, and so he does

(16:03):
not want that for himself, um,so he will do anything in his
power to not become undead,right and so in it.
This is a situation where it'salmost like do you have a choice
?
You know what happens at thispoint.

Speaker 2 (16:16):
So but also by going to the undead retirement center.
Maybe he's gonna have a familyreunion.
His, his parents are there,yeah, like, will he find them?
I don't know, that would beamazing, that's.
It's gonna be hard, behorrifying actually.
Yeah, depending on where theyare.
Yeah, I've thought a lot aboutthe order of the people who were

(16:38):
put in there first.
It's not a good.

Speaker 3 (16:40):
It's not a good scene for them no, and we'll talk
about like there, I, you, Idon't.
This is the hard part aboutpath is I have gone so deep into
how everything works.
Um, you guys are not gonna seethe mechanics behind how this
place actually functions.
You're gonna see the chaosbehind it because you're seeing
it from jude st claire's pointview.

(17:01):
But I would like to talk to youafter we're done recording
about this place and how it'sbuilt and how it functions and
when things go wrong there.

Speaker 1 (17:12):
Wow.
Perks of the job.

Speaker 2 (17:14):
Yes, yeah, to be a worker Sorry, everyone else To
be a worker at the UndeadRetirement Center.
Can you tell us a little bitabout how, up until issue seven,
the Undead Retirement Center isportrayed in Path of the Pale
Rider and why this is a crucialmoment.

Speaker 3 (17:33):
Okay, so in Path there's a lot of conspiracy
theories and Jude St Clair hasbeen keeping this journal and
he's been documenting all ofthese different thoughts about
you know, is it religion, is italiens, is it government?
And then you start seeing thesevideos and commercials for the
undead retirement community andit's portrayed as white picket
fences and it's a safe place foryou to go once you're undead

(17:57):
and live out your decay phase,where you're not really going to
affect the living You're a partand so if you're concerned
about hurting people, this iswhere you would go if you can
afford.
It is the thing.
And there's multiplecommercials for different ones,
just so you're aware.
So they're broadcasting andthey're very happy to take your
money.
Get your spot in advance, saveyour spot in this community

(18:21):
because it's going to fill up.

Speaker 2 (18:23):
I forgot that they're paying to going to fill up.

Speaker 3 (18:26):
Yeah, it's filling up fast is what I hear yes, it
fills up fast and of coursepeople are decaying, so you
never know how long they'regoing to be there.
I mean, they could be in theirright mind for a while, or not
long, you don't know.

Speaker 1 (18:38):
I feel like you'd be a fool not to exactly.

Speaker 3 (18:41):
It's kind of like get spot, get your spot in line now
, pay us your money in advanceand then you reserve your spot
for this place.
So that's how it's portrayedit's a safe place to go, Sounds
great.

Speaker 2 (18:57):
One of the alternate issue covers has some
advertisements on the front forthe Undead Retirement Center and
one of them says feel the sun,uh-huh.

Speaker 1 (19:14):
Knowing what I know, I just was like that is terrible
, sickening.
Yes, I love it so much.

Speaker 2 (19:17):
Yeah, you are, are you?
I know I said it in ourreaction video to you when we
read this, but you're sick.

Speaker 3 (19:23):
Lori slash, possibly psychic and our latest
Nostradamus it's scary because Ikeep talking about how I wrote
this in 2018, and what's scaryto me is that I, you know, I
worked on the script for twoyears before we even published
anything, and it started tobecome relevant to current

(19:46):
events.
And as we release things,whatever is happening in my
issue is what's happening atthat time we release.
It scares the bejesus out of me.

Speaker 2 (19:59):
You need to stop, and I've been told that by multiple
people, but I you, but then I'dbe sad because I wouldn't get
to read it.
We need to split right.
We need to split timelineswhere this version of you in
this story is like the bettertimeline and we just get to live
it out in the story and not inour reality I was like we should

(20:19):
switch it.

Speaker 3 (20:20):
I'll start writing.
Start writing like this is whatreality needs to be, and maybe
it'll throw down the universe.

Speaker 1 (20:26):
Yeah yeah, like like in, um, like in supernatural,
where the, the, the one guy iswriting, writing books, and it
turns out it's, uh, it's sam anddean's life story, but he has
never met them before.
Um, oh, but is he controllingthe story or is he just seeing,
just watching the show?
You know, yeah.

Speaker 3 (20:48):
That's me.
I'm watching the show in myhead and then things.
That's why I keep saying like Iwant to be wrong and I don't.
I don't want real life tocontinue following my narrative
because it's a bad day.
And then here we are at seven,where I like it's the worst I
could think of, the very worst Ican think of.
And yet here we are at sevenwhere I'm like it's the worst I
could think of, the very worst Ican think of.
And yet here we are.

Speaker 2 (21:08):
And so, since the issue seven is the very worst
you can think of, does it getbetter after issue seven?

Speaker 3 (21:15):
Oh, you know me, it ain't going to get better, it
just changes.
Okay, and I had thisconversation with Gilbert,
because Gilbert was like you'vebeen hyping up issue seven for
so long.
He's like what are people goingto have to look forward to once
we get past that?
And I was like, well, once weget past seven people, if you're

(21:36):
paying attention, you willfigure out the why.
So, and I and I told peoplethis, like jude sinclair has
been on this journey and he'strying to figure out the cause
of it and, if he's able to, toput it back to the way it was.
You know, put the world right.
That's what every hero wants.
Um, and so once we get pastseven, we're going downhill to

(21:57):
the answer.
I do tell you what it is in thefirst arc.
So again, the first arc is 12.
So if you're paying attentionin 8, you could figure it out.
If you're paying attention in 9, if you didn't get it in 8, you
paid attention in 9, there's agood chance that you could
figure it out.
If you don't figure it out by 9, I smack you in the face with

(22:18):
it in the beginning of 10.
Here it is.

Speaker 2 (22:21):
If you weren't paying attention, pull out the rolled
up newspaper and smack it in thenose.
Do I have to figure out theriddles to figure it out, or can
I just like Perfect Because I'mso bad at riddles?

Speaker 3 (22:29):
No, the riddles are fun.
If you want to do them, I'mtelling you things Like.
The people that have beensolving the riddles know what
Dwayne knows.

Speaker 2 (22:41):
Oh shit, yes, Dance I've been telling you to solve
these riddles for like two yearsnow, didn't I?
Well, you didn't tell me theanswer.

Speaker 1 (22:50):
I think I did, but I don't remember.

Speaker 3 (22:52):
Oh, Dwayne is heavily talked about in the riddles,
but there's other things, like Ibuilt a wiki about the undead
resistance and how they areorganized and how they function
and that they have hobo symbolsand that you know how their
hierarchy they have.
Um, their leader is called jet,but the name jet is passed down

(23:13):
like the dreaded pirate robertroberts from um princess bride,
you know it's like.
So they passed down the namejet and then there was a time
period where there was two jetsand they were in contention and
so this whole history behind theundead retirement, or not, the
undead resistance, and there's ahistory of how they fought back
and how they, like theirhackers, and they went into and

(23:36):
they were breaking stuff downand they had, anyway.
So you can find that I havephone numbers that work.
We did figure that one out.
Did you call it great?

Speaker 2 (23:47):
yeah, I was very well pointed that I didn't get a
direct answer from lauriecalcaterra but it was great like
we need to go back and revisitthose things now that we know
more well, I yeah, I wasthinking about this like, once I
get issue seven, I think I'mgonna just dedicate a day to lie
in my hammock and like pourover one through seven and then
do the um choose your ownadventure.

(24:08):
Is there any hints?
And choose your own adventureonce you get to that point there
is.

Speaker 3 (24:12):
I think I did one at the end, but I think it's one of
the same ones.
Like I didn't, I didn't.
It's not.
I don't think it's an originalone.
I just basically gave youanother way to solve one of the
other riddles.

Speaker 2 (24:23):
Why are the undead resisting for those who haven't
read it yet?
What's that about?

Speaker 3 (24:27):
Because they took away all their rights.
It was like well, I mean likeokay.
So when you think about aperson that's going through
let's just keep it real dementia.
They appear normal, they appearfriendly, they could be
friendly and eventually they gothrough this really dehumanizing
process where their brainchanges and they forget things,

(24:51):
they become violent, they canbecome vegetative, they're just
not themselves anymore.
And we have this giantpopulation in Path of the Pill
Rider that is that, and they'rechaotic.
Path of the pill rider that isthat, and they're they're
chaotic.
Um, they start running peopleover with their cars and you
know, they forget stuff andthey're out in traffic and they,

(25:11):
um, they're shooting people.
It's just they're, they're sochaotic and so the government
does what the government doesand they look at the situation.
They say you know what?
We got to start controllingthese people.
So they first they start with acurfew and then they start
stripping away rights.
So you can't vote yeah, okay.

Speaker 1 (25:29):
They love going after that one.

Speaker 3 (25:33):
Right, unless they're all voting for whatever party's
in power.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (25:37):
You can't vote unless you vote the right way.

Speaker 3 (25:39):
Yeah, and then we don't care right.
And then it switches whoever'sin power, whatever.
And then they don't care right,and then it switches whoever's
in power, whatever.
And then they take away, likeyou can't have firearms, you
can't drive, and then they starttaking away the right to own
property, which becomesproblematic, of course, because
where are they supposed to go?
And they create this undead.
They start separating peoplefrom the herd.

(26:00):
So if you're undead in a livingcommunity, it's illegal.
So they start sending youelsewhere.
They disappear you.
They have this whole policeforce, um called the collectors.
That is their sole purpose togo into living communities and
take that individual that'sundead and remove them, and they
don't tell you where they'retaking them.
See what I mean when I'mtalking about current events.

Speaker 1 (26:21):
Yeah, good thing, that would never happen.

Speaker 3 (26:24):
Jesus, it's been happening a lot.
They start resisting.
Of course, where it's like thisis my family.
This is my mom.
I want to take care of her.
It's okay for her to be here.
I want to take care of myliving impaired mom or whatever.
Why are they a threat if they'rejust in the house?
And so it becomes this push andpull between the living and the

(26:47):
undead, and the living will,you know, also be on the side of
the undead as well.
Again, there's my family, it'smy friends.
I don't want them to gosomewhere and never see them
again.
What if it's children?
What if the adult is undead andthe child is alive?
Who's taking care of that child?
The adult can't own property.

(27:08):
Where do they go?
So the undead resistance notonly pushes back against all
these changes and stripping ofrights and disappearing people,
but they also have like anunderground pathway for people
to go to places that are safefor them.

(27:28):
So they have like hobo symbolsthat will tell you like this
this house is sympathetic, youknow, if you're trying to escape
.
Or you know like there's apolice there's police here,
don't go this way.
Or there's a dog, it'll findyou.
And so they start marking theway, way for um, this whole
population to find safety.
Uh, you know, and it's uh in,in the beginning it's the worst

(27:53):
because they're the minority.
But then eventually, by thetime jude st claire is 10 years
and that's where we start thestory, they are the majority.
So things change when theybecome the majority Right,
because that was issue fivewhere Lola was like oh hi,
you're one of us now.

Speaker 2 (28:11):
Yeah, and that's one of the safest, not safest.
The fastest ways to convertsomeone, to make them realize
they should give a shit, is tomake them undead.
Now you care about us becauseyou're on our side, including
Sad Pancake, and I got to say Ilove Sad Pancake when he was
alive.
I love him undead.

Speaker 3 (28:29):
Sad Pancake is the goodest boy, no matter what he
is, and he will play fetch withany arm you want to give him.
And was also not my creation,because Gilbert did it.
You had to follow through.

Speaker 2 (28:44):
Yeah, you had to follow through.

Speaker 1 (28:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (28:46):
You had to follow through.
If Gilbert put some, I meaneverybody else in that family
was going to get on a live.

Speaker 3 (28:50):
Yeah, and I.
And it was just so funnybecause when it, you know, it
was a tough page to draw and heand I had talked about the
sequence of how things happenedand, um, what's the movie?
The piano?
I think it's the piano, or thenazis had lined up a bunch of
men the pianist, thank you andthey were.
They were just going down theline unaliving people and they

(29:13):
got to the last guy and the gunwas out of bullets and so this
german officer was reloading theweapon and the guy just stood
there and waited for him toreload and then shoot him too.
And that was the weird,desperate moment that they're in
, where the kid doesn't.
It was a kid, of course, didn'tknow what to do and just stood

(29:35):
there while she reloaded and offhe went.
But we got to the last paneland I was like don't forget to
shoot the dog and Girl.
Boat was like what?
I was like don't forget toshoot the dog and girl, but was
like I was like you put them inthere.

Speaker 1 (29:49):
I didn't put them in that dog is not in the script,
gilbert constant workenvironment.

Speaker 3 (29:53):
He was like why are lola's words coming out of your
mouth?

Speaker 2 (29:57):
I mean, at the same time, like you've already
established, that, uh, pets inthe undead Western apocalypse
you've created are not immune todeath, and normally, I think
people who listen to thispodcast know that I love animals
and I find it deeplydevastating when they are killed
in movies, tv shows, comicbooks.

(30:17):
But I think what's somethingyou've done that's really
special here is, while there arenot just sad pancake but a
horse, a deer horse named prince, that I still have some small
hope, some part of him, right,yeah, uh, anyways, it's
devastating, but you can't stopreading and, and I think even

(30:39):
the way that that is portrayedand also the way that sad
pancake is portrayed is likeit's sad and it's particularly
gory with prince, but it's it's.
You can keep reading.
It's not like it's going todestroy you to the point where
you never want to watch thisagain and look at it, because
that's happened to me, rightwith other things where the
animal is killed.
I just want to say that for thefolks who might be like I can't

(30:59):
, I can't read this now, you cando it and it's worth it because
it's um, there's so much thathas real life parallels, but
also it just is a world you wantto live in for a while.

Speaker 3 (31:10):
Fictionally, fictionally, walk around and
experience it.
You know what I mean, and onething that I strive to do as a
writer is I don't give anyanswers to these super gray
areas that we wade into withjude st claire, where it's like
our.
Who do you have sympathy with?
Um?
You know, even the, thevillains, like the miguel

(31:32):
blancos and people that and onthe surface appear to be
villains, have a shred of, youknow, have a shred of purpose
behind them, and you couldunderstand that purpose.
And so, again, it just dependson your worldview, um, who
you're going to take sides with,and that's.
You know.
What I like about the story isyou could be anywhere in this,

(31:54):
you know, spectrum of um.
I support the undead, I'magainst the undead, um, you know
, I don't understand miguelblanco or I fully understand
what he's doing.
Um, you could be anywhere inthere, and the story is still
great, it's still great.

Speaker 2 (32:08):
And also characters like Miguel Blanco.
He's morally gray.
For me it's an example of this.
Is not someone who I can justpinpoint and say this is a bad
person or this is a good person.
Same with.

Speaker 3 (32:21):
Jet Right, and that was the point.
And in fact, when I when Iwrite characters and I name them
, I'm usually very specific withhow I name them.
And if you look into eitherhistory of characters or you
know, like how it's where miguelblanco, if you look what he's
wearing, he's wearing all.

(32:42):
And typically when you watch aWestern movie or the black hat
is the bad guy, yeah Right.

Speaker 2 (32:50):
Unless it's.

Speaker 1 (32:50):
Clint Eastwood.

Speaker 3 (32:52):
Unless it's Clint Eastwood.
But like, even with, uh, if youwatched um Westworld, where
it's like he put on the, the guyput on the white hat, he took
it off and he put on the blackhat, it off and he put on the
black hat, you're like, what arethey telling me with that?
You know what I mean, becausethe black hat is the bad guy
right, um, and blanco in spanishactually means white, and so

(33:13):
where does he fall?
And you know what I mean.
Like does that explain hispersonality?
He, he's very black and white.
That character it's what oneway or the highway, and you see
that with him in issue six.
The very first time you see him, he's dealing with the
collector that they picked upfrom the undead retirement

(33:34):
community and he's asking herquestions.
He doesn't get what he wantsfrom her and he kills her, so
spoiler it's pretty early in theepisode, so yeah, I mean, that
was in the, that was in thepreview pages.
That's a teaser.

Speaker 2 (33:47):
I will say that there's a I won't say what the
twist is around him, but Iwasn't expecting what happened
after and I Dwayne Fink'scharacter the person who is
helping to lead Jude St Clair tothe Golden City, where there
should be answers is on thesurface just like sort of a
comedic character.
But then, the more I know, I'mlike who are you, Dwayne Fink?

Speaker 3 (34:12):
Dwayne is one of my favorites to write.
He is this happy-go-luckyalcoholic that has no business
being alive in this apocalypseand somehow has managed to stay
alive.
How you know what I mean, andso you're starting to see behind
the curtain about why he'sstill alive.

(34:32):
Yeah, yeah, there's a lot morewith Dwayne.

Speaker 2 (34:36):
I think we should get into the Kickstarter for a
minute.
Let's talk about it.
Cause I got excited.
It's out now for all of you whoare listening, because this is
the future, for For us it's thepast.
We've traveled to the future,traveled to the future where
it's out, but we did get a sneakpreview before it was out,
thank you, and learned a fewthings about it.
It's releasing July.
It'll be out as of July 18th,so this is coming out a couple

(34:57):
days after that and it's goingon until August 8th or 18th.

Speaker 3 (35:01):
Correct the 8th, the 8th, so it's a three-week
campaign.
Yes, so you better be on itpeople.

Speaker 1 (35:07):
Yeah, run Don't walk.

Speaker 2 (35:09):
Yeah, get back this.
I want to know what's like,what's for the listeners, what's
new about this Kickstarter andwhat traditions are you keeping
going and will we be rippled?
I say that as if I don't know.

Speaker 3 (35:20):
Yes, but I'll tell you more about that.
There is Okay.
So for a while I have beendoing this thing on the campaign
where I release a secret reward, and it's just a reward that
you can back.
It's an item and it will changeevery campaign and it just the

(35:41):
price will change as well, justdepending on what I'm putting
together.
It's what crazy Lori Calcaterrahas thought up this time.
You know what did Lori do?
I played a game with it.
I put it in my video, and sothere is something in the video

(36:09):
that, if you're paying attention, there's a QR code and when you
scan it, it will take you tothis secret reward.
I only can do 10 of them, justbecause they take a long time,
but they are there and no, youdon't have to get it.
Take a long time, but they arethere and no, you don't have to
get it.
And so if you discover it andyou're like that's cool, but I
really want the hot sauce tier,you can do whatever.

(36:30):
You know what I mean.
Um, obviously, you're notforced into any tier.
You do which one fits, what youwant.
Um, so we still have a secretreward.
We still have the custom pops.
Um, the new pop for this one isso freaking funny.
I cannot wait for you guys tosee it.
Um, and then the.
The five available pops are forjimmy um, covered in blister

(36:54):
beetles.
You need to go read issue fiveum what else are?

Speaker 2 (36:59):
beetles are real.

Speaker 3 (37:00):
Yes, blister beetles are a real thing, and they do
live in arizona.
So I feel like the more I findout about these creatures that
live in arizona, it's almostlike living in australia.

Speaker 2 (37:09):
Everything wants to kill you, yeah there's also the
scratch and sniff covers and Iwanted to, okay, so I have.
I know you all can't see this,but last issue uh, issue six for
the kickstarter, there werescratch and sniff stickers and I
have not smelled them, laurie,because I wanted to do our live
reaction with you, okay, andalso to know if any of these are

(37:32):
any of these going to be thescratch and sniff cover smells.

Speaker 3 (37:35):
No, okay, so I'm doing something different with
the scratch and sniff cover.
Okay, I have two scratch andsniff things on this campaign
because I love it and I used tocollect scratch and sniff
stickers as a kid, so that's whywe're doing them Right.
The last campaign, those threewere a stretch goal that we
unlocked, and I just want towarn you, the one that I said
was stinky is not stinky, andone of them that I thought was

(37:58):
normal is stinky.

Speaker 1 (38:00):
Wow so figure that out.
Do you have an olfactory?

Speaker 3 (38:05):
the problem where you're not smelling right um,
because when I ordered thesamples I smelled them all and I
don't know if they were like,because I think sometimes they
print them in advance, they havelike a stockpile and they send
them to you and then when theyactually make the product
they're using like the new batchof scent.
So it's different.

(38:25):
So the zombie one is not stinky, it smells nice.
Either that or I am reallymessed up.

Speaker 2 (38:32):
Well, I'm going to smell it right now.
And then, a fun fact, dan can'tsmell most things, yeah.

Speaker 1 (38:37):
I have a very diminished sense of smell.

Speaker 2 (38:40):
Thank you, army.

Speaker 1 (38:41):
No one knows why.

Speaker 2 (38:42):
How'd you know?
Immediately I thought, yeah,that's correct.

Speaker 1 (38:46):
They said it could be a brain thing.

Speaker 2 (38:48):
Hold on a little ASMR , First time coming out of the
tiny little thing.
Oh, let's hear it.
Okay, I'm gonna scratch.
It's a green zombie.
It says smell me yeah.

Speaker 1 (39:00):
Don't tell me right away, because I want to smell it
too.

Speaker 2 (39:03):
Okay, I'm going to keep my poker face on.
Okay, see if Dan can smell it.

Speaker 1 (39:08):
I mean, I smell something.

Speaker 2 (39:10):
Right, but do you like it?

Speaker 1 (39:11):
I kind of do.
Yeah, I think you're right,that's pleasant.

Speaker 3 (39:13):
Isn't that weird?
Like gingerbread.

Speaker 2 (39:16):
It is durian.
That doesn't make any sense.
It should be gag worthy.

Speaker 3 (39:21):
Stinky, yeah, and I was like I picked it off their
stinky list.
I don't like it and so we don't.

Speaker 2 (39:26):
I don't think you should tell me which one of
these is the bad one.
I'm not going to.
We have beer and we have remindme what is this?
A hot sauce, it's barbecuesauce, barbecue sauce.
So the beer one is Dwayne Finkguzzling some beer, as he would.
I'm going to smell this oneGuzzling some hot sauce.

Speaker 3 (39:42):
I'm also going to take it out.
No, that's Brandon that guzzlesthe hot sauce.

Speaker 2 (39:48):
Okay, I'm scared because I know one of these is
going to be bad.

Speaker 1 (39:51):
I can still smell the zombie.
Okay, smell the zombie, allright.
Oh, look at Dwayne.
I mean, yeah, that smells likebeer.
It smells like the day afterthe party, when it's sitting in
the bottom of the plastic cup.
It's flat, it's stale, there'sbeen bees like dipping down into

(40:11):
it and you're like I got toclean all this up now, but I'm
hung over and you're just likeyeah.

Speaker 2 (40:16):
I didn't love that one, but I don't like beer, so
was that the stinky one?
Are you going to?
Let me just experience thebarbecue sauce.

Speaker 1 (40:27):
Just smell the next one and we'll see what happens.
I mean, I would say the beerone was unpleasant because it
brought back some reallyupsetting feeling memories.

Speaker 2 (40:37):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (40:40):
That's it.
That's gross, so's gross.
So this is.
This is supposed to be barbecuesauce, gun scented.

Speaker 2 (40:45):
I kind of want to like blow that yeah, I don't
know.

Speaker 1 (40:48):
I mean, I smell like it.
It smells like hot sauce it wasbarbecue sauce.

Speaker 2 (40:52):
It does not smell like hot sauce.
It smells.

Speaker 1 (40:54):
Well, then that's wrong like rotten flesh.

Speaker 3 (40:57):
I don't smell that part it's like too pungent where
it gets you in the back of thethroat.
Yeah, like I.

Speaker 2 (41:00):
It's like too pungent where it gets you in the back
of the throat, yeah, like it'slike in my nasal cavities now
I'm smelling like the hints ofpaprika in there.
So none of those smells aregoing to be in the scratch and
sniff covers.

Speaker 3 (41:10):
No, Okay, so we have two scratch and sniff things
that are on this campaign.
One is a stretch goal, justlike this one, but we're doing a
singular sticker.
It is a sad pancake sticker andit will smell like maple syrup
because pancakes, oh my God.
Perfect, so that one willunlock when we hit 5,500.

(41:31):
And again, if you guys areunfamiliar with how Kickstarter
works, we have a goal and thenonce we go past that goal, we
start unlocking new perks, andthose perks go to everybody that
has a physical tier.
If there are physical items,sometimes I have digital rewards
that will go out to everybody,and so I try to make it

(41:53):
experience, and then we all geta bunch of really cool stuff at
the end.
Right, that just came extra,including poker cards.
We're still unlocking pokercards as we continue down this
journey.
Um, the slice and dice is inthere.
I have, uh, I have two foodiestretch goals in there, so one.
I'm really excited about one ofthese yeah we gotta make it I
call it zombie deconstructed,which unlocks at 6500, and I'm

(42:18):
partnering with a family-ownedbusiness here in Texas that they
do candy and they're going toput together an assorted bag of
gummy body parts I cannot waitFor us to consume, so that'll be
fun, and then at $9,000, we'llsee if we can break this one I
will send everybody a bag ofcoffee beans, just enough for

(42:39):
one cup.
But the coffee beans have beenroasted by me, yours truly,
because I do all the things andI roast coffee.
I love coffee.
It's amazing.
So they're called zombiesthat's really cute.
I designed a label for it, soit'll wake you up when you're
feeling a little dead I needthat, especially with monday

(43:00):
coming yeah, and so the otherthing you can do with scratch
and sniff is scentify your cover, and this is an add-on, so this
can go on any cover.
Um, what it basically is is atranslucent sticker that I will
stick on either the front or theback I haven't decided yet of

(43:21):
your issue and so if you decideyou want a variant cover, you
want the Lola and sad pancake,we can still sanctify it.
It's the same scent that'sgoing to go on all of them.
So, or if you want thetraditional Gilbert Perez cover,
we can sanctify that one too.
So it's like, I think, $2.
You can add it on and have asanctified issue, scratch and
sniff issue, it's like I think$2.

Speaker 1 (43:41):
You can add it on and have a scented issue, scratch
and sniff issue, and the scentis called what's that?
I was just going to say when Isaw that as an option.
I'm just like, why, why notGiven the context?

Speaker 3 (43:52):
of the covers.
Yeah, you want to sniff thosecovers, I know, but we're not
doing the stinky.

Speaker 1 (43:54):
Do you want to smell a rotting bear?

Speaker 3 (43:57):
It's not the scent bear, it's not the scent, is
actually called cowboy and it'sa mixture of citrus, bergamot I
think that's how you say thatword bergamot, bergamot, sea
salt, thank you and amberwoodit's actually pretty pleasant.
It kind of reminds you of likecountry roads and this jude, st
claire in a scent.

Speaker 2 (44:17):
I grew up around a lot of cowboys, so I I'm going
to have to get that just to seeif it smells like my dad sort of
Maybe.

Speaker 3 (44:24):
There's no leather in it, though.
I feel like there needed to besome leather.

Speaker 2 (44:29):
Yeah, leather would be a good undertone.

Speaker 3 (44:31):
Yeah, I do have unique items on the campaign, so
there's going to be one mugthat I'm.
I don't make the ceramic mug,but I paint the ceramic mug and
they fire it, so it's made byyours truly.
I will have a rebound book, soI take covers off and I rebind
books to make them look reallyfancy.
There'll be one of those.

(44:52):
I have these sad pancake minifigurines like super tiny sad
pancakes.
There's going to be fouravailable of these this is how
you know.

Speaker 2 (45:02):
I will be sitting there waiting for it to happen
because I have to have that.
In fact, I have an idea for youwhat I think my.
So my nephew's nine turned ninein june.
He loves zombies.
We have bonded over zombies.
I'm currently drawing him,lebron james, as a zombie
because he loves lebron jamessorry, lebron, um, to update,

(45:23):
because I made a painting forhim when he was a baby and he's
like I'm too old for the cuteelephant.
He was a baby, so making zombielebron james, but I was like you
know what my nephew wouldfreaking love a bunch of like of
like undead animals, cutelittle like action figure
animals, like a little undeadjames the bear and undead sad

(45:43):
pancake prince you can make awhole, or you can be like a farm
set I want to set up the littlebarn.
I want all the animals yes,that's what this reminds me of
and that's why I need it.
You ever been?

Speaker 3 (45:56):
to a tractor supply.
Yes, yes, they have all thelittle animals.
Yes, that's what this is.
Yes, my friend, eric um hisname is eric boris, he goes by
the handle zombie 13 umsurprised me with this last last
campaign because we were.
He has a podcast with uh, hisbuddy, dustin, and he, uh, eric,

(46:18):
will make figures.
Their show is called thefreaking figures and so that's.
His thing is like these reallycustomized little figurines, so
he'll buy like the cool ones andthen he'll change them into
something else.
And so this was like a 50 centlittle dog, wow, from the
tractor supply store, and hebought one and he explained to

(46:43):
these people what they were whenhe was doing with it, because
they were like why you buy?
And he was just like I'mturning it into a zombie dog and
I mean like the detail on thisis crazy.
But he's such a busy guy that Idon't think I could ask him to
do like a whole farm.
But that would be cool if wecould do that someday.
Like I can't do this.
This is nuts what he did if youguys can see the amount of

(47:03):
detail.
He built ribs on this tinylittle dog that you can see in
the exit wound.
I don't know if I'll be able toshow you.
Wow, he did the collar and,like you, flip them around.

Speaker 2 (47:14):
There's the bullet hole that is really yeah, I'm
getting one of those I somehowneed to snag.
Is it possible to snag two, oris only one per person?

Speaker 3 (47:24):
I think I put it as one per person.
Right, dan we're gonna go fast.

Speaker 1 (47:27):
I like yeah, what are the chances?
Leah?

Speaker 2 (47:31):
where I'm being selfish.
I need you and I to be readyonline so you can get one for my
nephew and then I get to keepone.

Speaker 3 (47:38):
Sorry, laurie, sorry everybody else, there's gonna be
two available I mean, it'sfirst come, first serve this is
why you're not, you know,they're not cheap just because
they are handmade, but um Idon't think I can get him to do
it again either.
He's so, he's so busy.
The poor guy like, uh, you know, he was just like I'm still
working on him when I get achance he'll have.
And I'm like please don't rush.

(48:00):
And I was like I was just sohappy that he offered to make
more and I knew that was goingto happen.
He sent me this and I wasflabbergasted and of course I do
what I always do and I share itwith the fandom and everybody
was upset that they couldn't getone and I was like, how do you

(48:22):
feel about making more of these?
Because people want this andI'm like I'm afraid someone's
going to show up at my house totake it.

Speaker 2 (48:27):
I'm here for some pancake.

Speaker 3 (48:29):
Well, Joe Salazar and I were talking about how we
should just show up at your door, kidnap me and be like we're
going to a con this weekend.
Get Lori, I'm like, here we goyou don't even have to tie me up
.
Don't tie me up, just come getme.
But yeah, like those peoplewere clamoring like over that,
right In fact.

(48:49):
So the way that Sad Pancake gothis name is the fandom named
Sad Pancake.
I was like name this dog whenit was a picture of the dog
alive and my sadistic ass waslike name this dog and then I'm
going to shoot it.
And there was a comic bookstore in McKinney, texas, which

(49:10):
is close by me, that I used togo to, carpe Diem, and the
owners have this giant dog thatwas called, is called.
He's still around.
His name is Pan, right and soin the fandom which this owner
is in the fandom because hereads path, and so I made a poll
.
I was like name this dog, Ilike muffin pan, and that was me

(49:32):
like we put a bunch of names inthere yeah, right, and the
owner put in since his dog'sname is Pancake, he called it
Sad Pancake and everybody wantedSad Pancake.
So he feels this connection tothis dog.
That's in my story now and sowhen I posted that he was like
that belongs to me and I waslike I only got one.

(49:52):
I was like I love you, butwe're going to fight because I'm
not giving it to you.

Speaker 2 (49:57):
I mean, does he know who he's saying he's going to
fight with?

Speaker 3 (49:59):
Yeah, because I'm not giving it to you.

Speaker 2 (50:01):
I mean, does he know?

Speaker 3 (50:02):
who he's saying he's going to fight with.
Yeah, he does.
Does he have a chance?
No, but he's just like I needthat.
I don't know what I need to do,but I need that.
And I was just like that's whenI was like Eric and he was like
Eric was in that chat and hesaw where the guy was like if I
can't have that, I'm upset, blah, blah.
And he was like I'll make yousome more.
He was like I'll make you five.
He's like we'll give one tothis guy he's like and then the

(50:24):
rest you can put on like yourkickstarter.
And I was like I love you.
Thank you so much you know.

Speaker 2 (50:29):
Yeah, it's very, very cool and I think it's a
testament to just how muchcommunity you've built.
Like, path of Pale Rider is notjust a great comic series, it's
a great comic series, but it'salso a full community.
It is a lot of creative peoplethat are obsessed with this
story, for good reason, andbecause you make it an immersive
experience, not just throughkickstarters, but when you're in
reading it.
You have all of the things thatpeople can interact with.

Speaker 3 (50:51):
So, right, it's the riddles, the videos, the qr
codes there's, there's a ton,and I mean like I have fun with
the marketing.
So, um, where I I did a wholenother series of deep thoughts
by duane fink that are justduane fink isms, which are super
funny.
Um, we always do the um, grimquestions.

(51:12):
So it's asking people likeagain, like posing a question
about this world, and how, whatdecisions you would make.
Would you eat the cheeseburgerthat still moved?
Or you know, where do you,where do you send the undead
child?
You know, what do you do withthem?
Um, so stuff like that.
And uh, we just we have fun wehave fun with it.

Speaker 2 (51:31):
Um, I have a very important question for you.
This is one I've been sittingwith for a while.
What do you think jude'sabsolute worst moment so far has
been?
From issues one through six,one through six.
What would you think jude'sabsolute worst moment so far has
been from issues one throughsix, one through six.
What would you say is the worstthing that jude's been through?

Speaker 3 (51:45):
I would say his parents, um, his, just the way
that that whole thing went down.
Where is I'm going to spoilsome things, people?
But I mean, go read the book.
I'm not telling you everythingnow there's so much I'm going to
spoil some things.
And so, as things start tohappen and they're watching
everything kind of play down onthe TV, I felt like this was a

(52:07):
very COVID, surreal moment,because it's like you're
watching things happen and thenall of a sudden all those bad
things come home.
So his mom unexpectedly passedand they're trying to hide her
in the house.
She is deaf, that's how theycommunicate.
You know, jude is a coda childof deaf adult and can sign, but

(52:28):
he is fully hearing, and so ishis dad.
But they she knows that if theycome pick her up that they're
not gonna.
Not everybody knows how to usesign language, so she would be
lost, she would be isolated inher own, you know, unfortunately
, disability, and so, um, theyhide her in the house.
So them, you know, searchingthe house for her and she forgot

(52:52):
that.
They she was supposed to behiding because she's losing it
yeah she's losing it.
Yeah, and that issue.
You see her waving at themirror saying jude, I'm waving
at this person.
Who is this?
You know?
I keep asking their name andthey won't answer.
They just keep waving at me.
She's in the bathroom lookingin the mirror.
Um, and then, of course, whenthey find her, and then his, his

(53:14):
dad's ultimate sacrifice, thathe's like you're never gonna be
alone, we're always gonna betogether, and he ends his own
heartbeat in a manner and thenhe goes with her and but I mean,
jude, jude needed that kind ofpush out the door.
Um, he needed a reason, heneeded something to fight for.

(53:35):
You know, because, if he'sgonna put, he was already
interested in the why.
But now you know, between hisown fears and then the situation
with his parents, now he hasmotivation to go figure it out
and see if he can put thingsback to the way it was before.
You don't know, we'll see if hecan you know, but yeah, figure

(53:57):
it out.

Speaker 2 (53:58):
Can you go back?
Well, you can't undo the death,right, but at least people
could be at peace.
And something I was thinkingabout, because the golden city,
uh, is something that I'm, youknow, very curious.
What's that gonna be?
And I'd like to know issueeight.
I'd like to know is there anyconnection to wizard of oz?
No, okay, in the slightest.

(54:18):
Okay, so the golden city makesme feel better there's no wizard
hiding behind a big wall nowhich is weird.

Speaker 3 (54:26):
I never thought about that, but I did do that
anthology.
That's a wizard of oz spinoff.
I don't know if you knew that,but I wrote for big dog inc.
Last year.
They had their, they do, um,they call it an, an anthology
that they do every year fortheir anniversary and they pick
different writers.
There's only three stories init, so Tom Hutchinson is the

(54:48):
main guy at Big Dog Inc and thenhe'll pick two other writers
and I got to write in his Wizardof.
It's actually called the Legendof Oz and what he did is he
took the Wizard of Oz story andretold it as a Western Nice and
it's fabulous, right, and thenhe let me write a spinoff in
that world, which was somethingelse, and so that never really

(55:11):
made that connection.
That the Golden City is kind oflike the Emerald City I'm more
leaning into, like El Dorado,the city of gold and the
fountain of youth.

Speaker 2 (55:23):
Are we so we're going to see golden city and issue
eight, maybe.
Yes, yes, spoiler.
Is it, though, cause we don'tknow what it is yet?

Speaker 3 (55:34):
Not yet, I was like you have no idea.
And now you don't trust me whenit comes to these things, Cause
I'm like we're going to go onthe untied retirement community.

Speaker 1 (55:50):
It's fine.
Yeah, it is not.
You know that's on.

Speaker 3 (55:51):
I wonder um is smash mouth right is is it is all that
glitter gold?
Wait, is that smash mouth?

Speaker 1 (55:55):
I thought there was led zeppelin that might have
been led zeppelin too, but smashmouth in the uh, in the classic
all-star, which foretells thefuture of mankind and all of the
political, social turmoil thatsuch an event would have.
If you pay attention to thelyrics, um yes, they suggest

(56:17):
that not all that glitters isgold sometimes it's lies, lies.

Speaker 3 (56:20):
Lies are very shiny, so.

Speaker 1 (56:22):
I'm wondering Golden City.

Speaker 3 (56:23):
And they look great until you find out what's behind
that lie, and then it's not sogreat anymore.

Speaker 1 (56:28):
Yeah, is it a golden city or is it spray paint?

Speaker 3 (56:31):
I'm not telling you what it is.
I'm actually playing with thename of this place, but you'll
have to wait and see.
Ooh.

Speaker 2 (56:37):
I have a new conspiracy theory.
I don't think it's going tohappen, though this is my latest
.
We're going to meet Death andhe's going to be riding Prince.
Oh yeah, unlikely since thelast parts we saw of Prince.

Speaker 1 (56:53):
I'm sticking with my prediction We'll be a headless
horse instead of a headlesshorseman.
I'm sticking with my predictionthat Death is on vacation.

Speaker 3 (57:00):
Death is on vacation.

Speaker 1 (57:01):
That's on vacation death is in cabo death was like.

Speaker 3 (57:06):
Forget you all.

Speaker 1 (57:07):
I've worked too hard I'm I'm tired of this I'm not,
I'm not staying, I mean they'redefinitely underappreciated.

Speaker 2 (57:15):
Yeah, you probably need a raise.
This is that's what this isprobably need a raise.

Speaker 1 (57:25):
This is that's what this is.
Death needs a vacation.
Is death part of a union?
Can you tell us?

Speaker 3 (57:27):
that?
Oh, that would be great.
What if there was a union ofangels?
Yeah, spiritual, spiritualcreatures, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (57:34):
Death death ushers, I'm making it up now.
Angel, angels of death.
Yeah, that's a thing, yeah it'son strike.

Speaker 1 (57:43):
Yeah, the AOD 914.
They're going on strike.

Speaker 2 (57:48):
Angel of Death.

Speaker 3 (57:50):
And that's the chapter of the union.
Ah, I got it.

Speaker 2 (57:54):
Thank you, we haven't talked to you this episode with
the team.
You are the creator, the sickwonderful to this episode with
the team.
Um, you are the, the creator,the, the sick wonderful mind
that you have, lori, and thiswouldn't be possible with some
other folks, and I'm curious ifyou could tell us a little bit
about who they are and whatbehind the scenes has looked
like for creating issue sevenwith Rachel, matt and Gilbert.

Speaker 3 (58:15):
Yes.
So I love, I love, love, lovethem all and I have to tell you
they're they're turning outpages for issue seven and
they're on their A game.
I'm blown away by some of thethings and I mean like you've
read the script but seeing ithappen is something different

(58:38):
and I'm I'm like I just can't.
I can't even use words.
I'm blown away.
So, for those who are notfamiliar, gilbert Perez is the
penciler and inker.
So in the comic book process youhave people that wear different
hats and they do differenttasks.
You know, to put this wholething together, we work as a
team.
So it starts with Gilbert.
Well, I write the script.
Right, he reads the script, hestarts putting the panels

(59:00):
together on the page, which Ithink is the hardest part,
because he's visualizing thecrazy things that are in my head
and has to not only make itlook good, but it has to flow,
there has to be energy to it.
He's always doing somethinginteresting with the panels,
because the paneling is part ofthe story.

(59:21):
And then, once he gets thepencils done, he goes back and
he inks and then it goes to MattChambers.
Matt Chambers is our colorist.
So Gilbert came on at issuefive.
Previous to him, I had anartist named Marco DeFio, who
was also very talented, and he Ithink I have an eye for this,

(59:43):
where I hire an artist because Iknow that they're great they
start doing path and then theystart to get recognition.

Speaker 1 (59:50):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (59:51):
And that's what happened with Marco is.
He got so busy that I was likewe're gonna do path and he was
like these are all the things onmy plate and we weren't lining
up with the schedule, so we madethe decision to part ways.
We're still good friends.
I'm actually going to be set upright next to him at a
Comic-Con in August.
That's cool, so you can see thetwo of us together a lot of

(01:00:11):
times if you're here in theDallas-Fort Worth area.
So Gilbert came on at issuefive and he had read the script
and was just like this is whatI've been looking for.
I wanted action, I wantedintrigue, I wanted a you know a
longer, you know running umcomic, and because he's done
some one shots for chartercomics and does amazing work, um

(01:00:32):
, and so he kind of like he washome.
This was home for him, and nowhe's starting to get busy too
and I'm like you can't leave me,I'm going to shackle you too.
I'm going to just duct tape youto a chair.
Your wife can come visit you.
Great, originally produced inblack and white.

(01:01:02):
Issue two uh, we were able todo color.
We got a little more money on.
The kickstarter was able tofund some color work.
Marco did it, but what I Ifound out is like marco will
have to pencil ink and then whenhe gets all the way through the
inking process, he starts overat the beginning and has the
color and it just is a long timeto have one person do all three
of those steps, and so I waslike we're going to bring out a

(01:01:22):
colorist just so we can go alittle quicker.
So Matt came out at issue numberthree.
He did go back and color issuenumber one when we released the
trade paperback.
Issue two is always, and willalways be, have the colors from
Marco DeFio.
So Matt has done issue one,three, four, five, six and now
seven.
And so Matt's hilarious, he hasa dark sense.

(01:01:45):
They all have a dark sense ofhumor, like I do.
I think that's why we get alongso well.
It's just, you can't color someof the things that I have here
without being like, yeah, thisis badass, because if he was
grossed out I don't think youwould have doing it.
Um, but he's incredible.
He is turning out pages that,um, the color really tells the

(01:02:06):
story in some of the stuff thatis happening to jude, uh, as he
has this just cockamamie plan tobreak in right and he's
injecting things into his bodywhich has a physical response,
and um, matt is able to capturethat I'm trying not to say hi
all of my thoughts and feelingsabout what I know.
I know, don't say it, I'm notand then of course it comes to

(01:02:28):
me.
I letter the book and thenrachel, uh bullock, is our
editor, and she is not only oureditor, she is a super fan and
so she is very much into thestory and she understands the
characters.
And so when we do because a lotof times I'm so into the
project and I'm marketing anddoing interviews and they're
turning in art and I'm okayingit we go forward and she's like

(01:02:50):
do you know that you left off umjude st claire's watch on pages
4, 7, 12, 18, and we and we'relike you have to go back and fix
it.
So she catches all that littlestuff.
She makes sure that I'm notcreating loopholes by accident

(01:03:10):
and stuff like that, and sheloves it.
She's like where's more pages?
So even as it's being created,she's very much involved, which
is not typical for an editor.
Usually it's like you turn in afinished project.
They go through it and theytell you what needs to be
changed.
You go back and make thechanges.
They maybe look at it one moretime and then that's it.
You pay them and they're done.

(01:03:32):
But Rachel is immersed in thisworld as well.
Yeah, yeah.
So I can't say enough about thisteam.
They blow me away every episode, every issue that we put out,
and we have fun, we have a blast, we're throwing memes at each
other in the chat group andpages go up and we're all.

(01:03:52):
I put stuff in there like tellme what you think and critique
this and maybe we can tweak.
And it's always about this andmaybe we can tweak.
And, um, it's always aboutmaking the issue the best
version of itself, which I love,because a lot of times with
people, writers, creatives,there's, there can be ego
involved.
I've seen it.
Um, and that ego is left at thedoor when we sit down, the four

(01:04:16):
of us, and discuss like, how dowe make this the most
incredible issue that we're ableto do?

Speaker 2 (01:04:21):
so they're, they're awesome I actually wish I follow
all of their social mediasplease, yeah, we'll put them in
the show notes.
Definitely, we should tag themin this episode on instagram if
they're all there.

Speaker 1 (01:04:31):
Definitely, yeah, that's that's such an important
part of the process too, becauseI do think that a lot of times
when you you read or seesomething that just doesn't
really hit like it's supposed to, a lot of times it's because
the person has a big ego aboutit and they think that all of
their ideas are the best ideas.
And being able to work with aneditor and realize that you

(01:04:55):
don't always have all the bestideas is the only way that you
make something really good.

Speaker 3 (01:05:01):
That's the only way that creatives get better is to
actively critique their own work, and again it's like you have
to.
You have to lose that ego.
You also have to go find peers,like you can't have people
critique you that are way aheadof you or way below you.
You need to find people thatare on that of you or way below
you.
You need to find people thatare on that same level or just

(01:05:23):
above you to be like okay, lookat this and how can I make it
better?
Because if you get too high,they're like this is crap, and
if you get too low, sometimesthey can't put into words or
they can't verbalize what tohelp you do better, because they
haven't done it themselves.
And so it's an importantprocess, though, because

(01:05:43):
otherwise you're stagnant.
You just stay there.
You make it better.

Speaker 2 (01:05:47):
I just instantly wanted to murder whoever would
call Path of Pale Rider crap.
I just was like that's not,it's happened.
Well, fuck them.

Speaker 1 (01:05:54):
Yeah, they're obviously wrong I feel about
that.

Speaker 3 (01:05:58):
I mean like again it's like zombies aren't
everybody's cup of tea.

Speaker 2 (01:06:01):
Yeah, it's true you can be humble, I can say I would
.
Fictionally, I'll write somefanfic in which people who don't
understand Path of the PaleRider have horrible undeaths.

Speaker 3 (01:06:14):
I appreciate that I mean, but it's just the nature
of the game if you're going tobe a creative and you put
yourself out there and someonemight say something that they
don't like it, or it was notpolished enough in areas which
could be true.
When I first started lettering,I lettered issue one and I had

(01:06:34):
no idea what I was doing None,Okay.
And I was like I'll put wordsin a bubble and it's great.
No, Broke all the rules.
And someone was like you breaka lot of rules when you letter.
And I was like there's rules.

Speaker 2 (01:06:49):
Yeah, what are the rules?

Speaker 1 (01:06:50):
Yeah, I'm a rebel, I'm a renegade, exactly, and
they were like oh, lori.
Not in a good way, though.

Speaker 3 (01:06:56):
Right.
But I mean because I wasoffering to letter for them and
they were like we're looking fora letter.
I'm like I letter, so I threwmy hat in the ring and he was
like unfortunately we can't, youknow, we can't hire you because
you break too many rules.
And I was.
That's why I was like back up,where do I find these rules, you
know, and so, but again, it'slike I still have that drive to

(01:07:16):
do better.
Every time I do a book, I wantmy lettering to do better.
Every time I do a book, I wantmy lettering to get better.
I want it to be the sfx, to bemore explosive and emotional and
connect, and you know what Imean.
You have to have that response.

Speaker 2 (01:07:29):
Um, and if lettering is like the job, that, um, if
you do it well, nobody noticesyou yeah but if you do it wrong,
everybody's like this sucks, soit's like every job I've ever
had if I'm the best in the world, nobody notices, but if I screw
up, I hear about it endlessly Ihave a basic question that I've

(01:07:50):
wondered about letteringactually, which is like when
they're drawing, you know whengilbert is doing the penciling,
are they penciling in where thewords are going to go, or like,
how do you figure that out?

Speaker 3 (01:08:00):
okay, so it's predetermined, because that
would stress me out he'll leaveroom based on how much dialogue
is in the script.
And so he and I came up withthis process because, again in
the beginning he was, um, he haddone some one shots, but um, he
hadn't done path.
And I'm like you're not leavingme enough room to get at

(01:08:22):
everything I'm trying to say.
And so we had this processwhere he would pencil and then I
would go put the bubbles overwhere the pencils were.
So I'm like, hey, just shiftthis slightly down.
Or when you read comics, it'slike the first bubble should be
in the top left corner and thenthe reading direction goes to
the right and then to the bottom, into the next panel.

(01:08:43):
And so sometimes you know he'snot a letterer.
So I'm like you did the twocharacters that are in the panel
but switch them you know what Imean?
Like because jude talks first,to put jude on the left so I can
have that bubble on the left,because then you're not supposed
to cross the tails over eachother and you're not supposed to
cover, you know, certain art.
Obviously the art is beautiful.
You don't want to cover the artwith the bubbles.

(01:09:05):
That's stupid.
Why are we drawing art?
just have, just have a bunch ofbubbles, yeah, yeah just have a
bunch of bubbles, like if it'sjust, I'm just gonna bubble the
whole thing.
What are we doing?

Speaker 1 (01:09:15):
why not just make a story?
That's just all words.

Speaker 3 (01:09:18):
I gotta say, though it's called novels right.

Speaker 2 (01:09:21):
Just reading your script was enough for me to be
like holy, yeah.
I don't even know what to putafter that word.
Holy, holy crap, holy gapingholes, I don't know.
That sounded inappropriate andnot what I meant, and it will
make sense when you read issue 7.
Should we just take that out?
Probably.

Speaker 3 (01:09:40):
That's awesome.
Holy gaping holes, everybody.
Oh, okay, well, and here'ssomething that's interesting
about the script that I gave you.
Typical episodes that I writeare about 14, 15 pages of script
.
Oh, Because there's dialogueand there's action and there's
description.
The issue seven is seven pagesof script seven.

(01:10:04):
It is half, um, because it'sall action and there's there
really isn't that much dialogue,and so all the issue six was a
lot of dialogue for us, right,because typically we have a good
balance.
But I was like there's a lot ofdialogue in six because it
establishes seven, right, yeah,the seven is like there's hardly

(01:10:24):
any back and forth, there isjust action, and so, um, I don't
know if that says anythingabout what's coming, but it's
it's a visual experience it'shuge and gaping and horrifying,
and just it's.
It'll probably make you cry itwill definitely make you cry um,

(01:10:45):
you're I.
If I've done my job right, youwill throw your book at the end
and then can't wait.

Speaker 1 (01:10:51):
For if you wait, and then you'll sniff the cover and
then sniff the back.

Speaker 3 (01:10:55):
Go pick it up and sniff and be like it was, like
cowboy um, that's like thesoothing part, right?
Let's see what else are we onthe campaign hot sauce.
We can still get hot sauce.
Oh, I bought something.
I know the listeners can't seethis, but you guys know that
we've been doing the woodencovers right.
Yeah, issue five, um, issue six.
And then I actually went to thelaser engraver and I printed

(01:11:17):
the issues seven ones already oh, that's a great one.

Speaker 2 (01:11:22):
yeah, I think these came out fabulous.
Yeah, there's a few covers.
Yeah, I think these are reallycool.
It came out fabulous.
Yeah, there's a few covers Iwant from issue seven, but the
original cover is very beautiful.
I would put that on as like a16 by 20 poster on my wall
immediately.
It's gorgeous Wow.

Speaker 3 (01:11:37):
There's a lot of great art and I had so many
artists that were clamoring tobe a part of this issue,
specifically because I've beentalking about how big it is and
you know um two of them that Ihired this campaign that were
really gung ho about becomingpart of the team.
Um, I made him read all all theissues and I was like there is

(01:11:58):
no way I can let you do a coverfor seven without reading the
story.
Yeah, because you have tounderstand what's coming,
because some of them, um, likewilliam russell, does a lot of
covers.
Uh, we barter back and forth.
In fact, we have a specialre-release of issue one with the
william russell cover that's onthis campaign.

(01:12:19):
Um, but he's never read thestory, which funny.
But he seems to understand thevibe of it and so he does some
really incredible work.
But it's pretty, but it's notthe extra meaning that that
propaganda one is, I mean, likethat's the difference, and so
there's hidden meaning in mostof them.

Speaker 2 (01:12:40):
Yeah, you can see it a lot like with just a little
preview that we've gotten.
Lori, is there something wehaven't asked you yet that
you're like?
We got to talk about this forissue seven?

Speaker 3 (01:12:50):
I just want to say that I spent a lot.
Oh, there is something big Iforgot to talk about, but I
spent a lot of time on thiscampaign.
And then I hope people, whenthey go to the campaign to spend
some time, look around, go tothe campaign to spend some time,
look around.
Because you know and I fallinto this too, because I back a
lot of Kickstarters where I'mlike I want this cover, okay,
great bye, and I just back itand I'm out and I miss some of

(01:13:14):
the really cool stuff that thesecreators are doing and my
campaigns are not typical ofwhat you're going to find on
Kickstarters.
They're way out there, yeah, um, so there's a lot of
opportunity for things.
Um, don't miss out.
Go look around.

Speaker 1 (01:13:32):
You know what I mean what I love about your campaigns
is how well all of the merch uhfits with the theme of what
you're doing, like the, the wood, the wood covers, perfection,
like for anything else would bekind of dumb.
Like if we're doing batman andthey're like here's some wood
covers for batman, it's likethat doesn't make any sense, but
for your uh western zombieapocalypse story, it's, it's

(01:13:57):
perfect.
And also, uh, wood you can alsoscratch and sniff hot sauce
also.

Speaker 2 (01:14:03):
Perfect, because you can't taste.

Speaker 3 (01:14:06):
Yeah, yeah the hot sauce is there.
There's five flavors, there's anew one isn't there, there's,
there's.
Well, I did the fourth flavorlast campaign.
You guys got one, yes, of thelimited and it.
That one was special because itwas the jackfruit that we
collectively murdered on thepodcast.

Speaker 1 (01:14:24):
The innocent jackfruit.

Speaker 3 (01:14:25):
The innocent jackfruit that I put googly eyes
on and stuck it full ofsparklers and lit it on fire
before I used the two-handed axeand chopped it to bits.
So there was some left that Iwas able to make hot sauce out
of.
It was really good, to thepoint where I was like, damn it,
I'm going to have to make moreof this, you're going to have to

(01:14:46):
get more of those.

Speaker 1 (01:14:47):
What I love about the hot sauce especially is that
like I expect it to destroy me,but it's.
It's actually just really good.
I think it doesn't.

Speaker 3 (01:14:56):
It's not it doesn't hurt you, except for the new one
.
Oh, because the hot heads areout there and you'll see them.
I'll post pictures of hot sauceand they'll say stuff, you got
anything hotter?
And I was like I'm concernedfor you.
Do you have taste buds?
And usually their answer is no.

Speaker 1 (01:15:21):
So the new sauce is actually called what?
Pure capsaicin.

Speaker 3 (01:15:24):
It is Carolina Reaper sauce.
Oh my God, actually called whatpure capsaicin it.
It is carolina reaper sauce ohmy god, it is carolina reaper.
And uh, red bell pepper withsome garlic and onions.
White vinegar um, I think I useuh lemon juice and some salt in
there.
Still delicious, but it is sohot you can't feel feelings I
love how it has two peppers.

Speaker 1 (01:15:42):
One of them is the hottest pepper, the other is the
mildest pepper yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:15:47):
Well, I needed a pepper to like fill the space.
Yeah, right, because you can't.
If I had just carolina reapersauce in there, you would die,
it feels dangerous to even make,have you ever gotten any in
your eye.

Speaker 2 (01:15:58):
Have you ever gotten any like hot sauce in your eye
in the making of all of these?

Speaker 3 (01:16:02):
no, no, I am.
I wear gloves.
Sometimes I'll wear a mask.
Because it is that hot, myhouse will smell like pepper
spray.
Don't chase me, masher, and youspray them.
It smells like that in my house, wow.
So the Carolina Reaper is veryhot.
I call it Reaper's Regret.

Speaker 2 (01:16:22):
That one's super hot.
I like that because, of thedeath.
Where is death?
Does death have regrets?
Does the Reaper have regretsright now?
They do if they ate this hotsauce.

Speaker 3 (01:16:33):
I don't know man you might wish you were dead.

Speaker 1 (01:16:36):
Is that what happened to death?
Is it what?
Did death eat this hot sauce?

Speaker 3 (01:16:42):
And then died.
Death of death by hot sauce.
Death, this hot sauce, and thendie death.
Death by death of death by hotsauce.
Yeah, that's my hot saucethat's the reason you guys you
heard it here um hot sauce brokedeath.
That's it.
Someone experimented withpeppers.
They are too hot for existenceand broke humanity and life, as
we know it.

Speaker 1 (01:17:01):
The grim reaper, has been been in the bathroom for 10
years.

Speaker 3 (01:17:04):
It's the afterburn.

Speaker 1 (01:17:08):
It's like, guys, I'm coming out soon.
I'm sorry I can't come outright now.

Speaker 3 (01:17:15):
So there is five flavors.
The tier, the bestseller, isthe three pack and so you can
get a sampler with an issueseven.
That is a reward tier.
But if you want, like again, Imake it super easy where you can
customize your own reward tier.
If you're like I really wantthe t-shirt, you know, or I

(01:17:36):
really want the custom pop orthe wooden cover, you can add
hot sauce onto those and theycome in either single bottle, a
three pack, or you can get aflight of hot sauce, should you
choose to get all five.
So I make things easy.
You can add on T-shirts, youcan add on swag.
I have so much swag at thispoint where, if you can't choose
, you can see like hey, lori,here's 10 bucks, surprise me,

(01:17:58):
and you get a swag bag I put inwhatever I feel like For Leah
and Dan dan, I'd have to be likewhat don't you have?

Speaker 2 (01:18:13):
I'll put that in there.

Speaker 3 (01:18:14):
A couple things, yeah , yeah, yeah I know the funko
pops are one of a kind so I knowI can't ask for my special.
I can't swag bag those.
They're too expensive yeahthat's true too.

Speaker 2 (01:18:19):
That's those are serious investments cost a lot
to make.

Speaker 3 (01:18:23):
Everyone is custom made, but they're super
exclusive.
I only produce them for theKickstarter.
You might find me with someextra wooden covers at a
Comic-Con and I'll sell themthere, but you will never find a
custom pop at a Comic-Con.
I just know it's only thepeople that order them through
the campaign.
Usually there's three,sometimes four people that will

(01:18:44):
order those, and so I'll make upto five on the campaign.
Usually there's three,sometimes four people that will
order those, and so I'll make upto five on the campaign.
But I mean, if two people orderthem, you get a one of two.
It's amazing.
I don't make any more.
Yeah, so it just depends on howpopular they are, yeah you got
to get them when you can.
Yeah, you have to.
There is one thing I want tomention.
I'm doing some collaborationthis time around, so I'm

(01:19:04):
partnering with two othercreators.
We're all launching ourcampaigns the same night, wow.
And so I have this really funnymeme on there under
collaboration with Vince McMahon.
You know the meme where he'slike excited, then he's super
excited, he's so excited, andthen his eyes are glowing red
because he's that excited, andthen his eyes are glowing red
because he's that excited.
So if you back some of theseother campaigns physically and

(01:19:29):
my campaign, you will get extragoodies.
That's the only way to get them.
So there's some sticker options, and the one I'm doing with his
name is Ed Davis.
He has this series called Imm,called immortal era, which is
basically like they're very weare very similar in how we think
.
In his world, death is alsobroken, but people also don't

(01:19:53):
age and their bodies don't die.
But it's just, it's terrible,the people are terrible, and so
I actually made a meme where youknow that the two guys, they're
two big muscular arms, they'relike high-fiving.
Yeah, it's like potpr, thepredator arrow.
Yeah, yeah, is it a handshake?

Speaker 1 (01:20:09):
it was like you know, they're really it's like the
worst way, dylan.
Is it what dylan and uh andarnold schwarzenegger from?
Predator?

Speaker 3 (01:20:19):
that's it, yeah, from predator yeah, it's a very
beginning.
They yeah they do.

Speaker 1 (01:20:25):
They do the handshake and flex their muscles that's
it.

Speaker 3 (01:20:28):
Yeah, that's the meme , and so it's like potpr,
immortal era, the two worst waysto ever be immortal.
So we have a double-sided metaltrading card, so his image and
then my image on the two sidesof the metal card, and then then
the other campaign is calledProduce Cats.

Speaker 2 (01:20:47):
I'm looking at them right now.

Speaker 3 (01:20:50):
My friend Sarah White is an artist and she draws cats
as vegetables and fruit.

Speaker 1 (01:20:55):
Oh, my God.

Speaker 3 (01:20:56):
And I think it's hilarious.
So we don't really have a lotof crossover, I guess, but I
just love it.
Have a lot of crossover, Iguess, but I just love it.
And so she did a rotten avocadocat because of path of the pale
rider I'm zooming in to try andget a look at it right now, oh,
my god, it's awesome, um, andit's like totally disgruntled

(01:21:18):
and it's green like a zombie andit's the bruised avocado.
But so she would send, you know,like you would get, the dino
nugget sticker and then theavocado cat from her, and then
if you back all three, you justget all three, and it's like
that's the only way to get thisspecific merch is to do both
campaigns.

Speaker 1 (01:21:38):
So yeah, I think that's really super smart and
I'm really curious to see howthat goes for you.

Speaker 3 (01:21:44):
Sometimes it works great, sometimes it doesn't,
because I've done crosspromotion before.
But when we're doing this much,we had to limit it to the
physical tiers only because whenEd has 150 backers and I have
150 backers and we let peoplethat will do digital as well, it

(01:22:04):
gets really messy to try andfigure out how many people are
getting these and then who sendsit and who.
You know what I mean, like whopays for the cross promotion
stuff, and um, it just getsmessy.
So that's what we just had tolimit it to the physical backers
this time.
So, but his series is reallygood.
I read his series too.
There's no zombies in it.
I know, know, this is a zombiebook club podcast, but if you

(01:22:27):
want to find something else withlike existentialism and messed
up ethics and human, you knowhumanity.
His series is really good.

Speaker 2 (01:22:36):
This might shock you, Lori.
We don't just read zombiethings.
I do.

Speaker 3 (01:22:41):
I figured you guys didn't, but it's a zombie book
club podcast on the show we doonly zombie things, but maybe
one day we'll break that trend,because I do love apocalypse
stuff.

Speaker 2 (01:22:51):
Period, yeah, yeah I do too.

Speaker 3 (01:22:54):
Um, like it doesn't have to have zombies.
Give me soylent green, give mestorm piercer, give me the road.
You know a boy and his dog.
Um book of ey, like I love allthe things.
Apocalypse I'm currentlyreading.
Um the handmaid's tale.
Oh it's rough, but I'm readingit because I need to yeah, I
read that book.

Speaker 2 (01:23:14):
That's a margaret.
A canadian author.
God, I always give my canadiansshout outs um, long before the
the show came out and it wasvery disturbing.
Then the show came out, and itwas very disturbing.
Then the show came out and Ihad to stop watching because it
was too much.

Speaker 3 (01:23:26):
I can't watch that.
I can't.
The fact that you wrote thebook in 1985 is another one
where I'm like how did you tapinto that?
Maybe her and I are both seeingthe same pattern?

Speaker 2 (01:23:40):
The sad thing is that the things that you are
describing and the things thatshe describes are things that
have happened and will happenagain.

Speaker 1 (01:23:47):
I think a lot of us in this space, we do see the
patterns and that's why we'redrawn to it.
I think that's like some people, they're just like oh, I love
the zombie apocalypse becauseyou know you get together with
your friends and you hit theroad with your Mad Max truck and
shoot zombies and you hit theroad with your Mad Max truck and
shoot zombies.
But I think there's a hugeamount of us that are.

(01:24:07):
You know, we see theapocalyptic genre and we're like
our brain wants to know what todo when this happens, because
it's happening tomorrow For somepeople right now.
And my brain knows that I needto be prepared, so I need to
read as many books as I can.
Yeah, or at least like whatwould happen.
What would I do if thishappened?

Speaker 3 (01:24:24):
My brain knows that I need to be prepared, so I need
to read as many books as I can,yeah, or at least like what
would happen, what would happen,what would I do if this
happened?
What would I do if thishappened, you know?
So I read all the books and Iexperienced all the apocalypses,
so I can be like what would Ido if I was living in this world
, specifically, yeah, yeah, mybrain just thinks that way, my
brain is that way.
I don't know about you, dan,but like I will sit in a

(01:24:45):
restaurant and be like where'sall the exits?
Well, for a different reason,but yeah, but that's how my
brain works.
You know what I mean Like and Ithink I mentioned that to
someone once and they were likeyou do that all the time.
That sounds exhausting, and Iwas like my brain automatically
does it.
Like my brain is like ifthere's an active shooter
situation, this is what I woulddo at the grocery store.

(01:25:06):
This is what I would do at thisrestaurant.
This is what I would do ifwe're at a park my brain
automatically goes there.

Speaker 1 (01:25:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:25:14):
That sounds like a lot.
But also there have to bepeople like that out there,
because I know that in thosesituations I wouldn't have any
reaction time at all.
I would be a deer in headlightsfor sure.
I would be useless and I'veaccepted that about myself.

Speaker 3 (01:25:28):
My kids are that way.

Speaker 2 (01:25:29):
Oh, no yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:25:31):
Yeah, my kids are that way.
And again, I just think itcomes down to how many things
have you put your, how muchstress have you been through?

Speaker 1 (01:25:39):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:25:40):
It's stress inoculation, right, yeah,
because and this is, I get thisfrom martial arts because I
can't I can do a disarm on aknife if we're going slow, but
if that knife is real, itchanges the stakes and can I
still do the disarm?
You know what?
I mean, or you know, when it'smultiple opponent, when I know
that it's safe.
You are what you practice, andso if you've been in the

(01:26:02):
stressful situations, you willreact better than if you've
never been in that situation.
So I'm scared for my kids too,where I'm just like I don't know
what they would do if they justdeer in the hemlights.
I'm sorry.

Speaker 2 (01:26:15):
They got you.
I guess that's a lot ofpressure, though, as a mom, all
I know is that in this dark,dark world and I could be
talking about the real one, or Icould be talking about Path of
Pale Rider the thing that iskeeping me going is Sad Pancake
figurine, which I will begetting my hands on Two of them,
right?

Speaker 1 (01:26:31):
I mean, I feel like maybe that's a little selfish.

Speaker 2 (01:26:33):
I'm going to take it because I guess the selfish
thing is I'm not willing to giveit to my nephew, is that?

Speaker 1 (01:26:39):
terrible.

Speaker 2 (01:26:41):
He won't appreciate it like I will.
You know, when he comes tovisit, he can play with it.
He won't.
He won't understand theworkmanship behind it and the
story and everything else.
So, and for that reason, I'mgoing to leave that other one
for someone who will.
I think that's the nice thingto do, it's the right thing, it
is.

Speaker 1 (01:26:54):
So if you end up getting one, it's from my
benevolence.

Speaker 2 (01:26:57):
Oh.

Speaker 3 (01:26:58):
Ah, that's hilarious.
What did you say, Dan?
I missed it.

Speaker 1 (01:27:02):
I said, I'll be getting that one for myself.

Speaker 3 (01:27:04):
Oh, okay, he's like forget it, I'm getting it, we're
still going to get two.
Perfect, we're going to get twoChristmas gifts to myself.

Speaker 2 (01:27:10):
Well, lori, it is always a pleasure to have you on
Zany Book Club.
You know that we definitelystan you, as we've previously
established, and everybody,please go back.
Seven Kickstarter If you havenot read Path of the Pale Rider
yet, the time is now.
This is like the moment to beable to binge from one through
seven.
What an incredible experienceis like a first time read.

(01:27:32):
Yeah, yeah, that's a lot.

Speaker 3 (01:27:33):
I'm always jealous of the people that find us in in
the reveal that is happening inthis issue is huge, so you want
to do it.
I do have many catch up tiersthough for people that if it's a
little bit out of your pricerange because getting all seven
issues could be, you know it'spricier it's $65, I think, for

(01:27:54):
the catch up tier.
So if you want to get startedbut can't afford the all seven,
I have a.
I have like a four pack whereyou can just read the first four
and then maybe when we releaseeight or all of them are always
available on my website as soonas they are published.
You can get them from mywebsite and get caught up before
we do the next one.
So there's options out there.
But if you can read seven, ifyou can binge read one for seven

(01:28:16):
, we are all jealous becauseit's an incredible ride to go on
all at once.

Speaker 2 (01:28:22):
Yeah, let us please, please, send us a DM.
If you do that, I want to hearyour like real reaction.
And, yeah, I'll share it withLori as well.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:28:31):
I need to do a binge of a binge rate of my own,
because I need to re-catch up.

Speaker 2 (01:28:35):
Yes, we we should absolutely do that before issue
seven yeah, and you need to likeit.

Speaker 3 (01:28:41):
I feel like it doesn't matter which issue we're
on.
You should go back and reread,because you'll forget things and
you'll see characters show backup and, in fact, in this first
four-page preview that I put onthe Kickstarter, there are
returning characters that, ifyou pay attention, they were in
issue one.

Speaker 1 (01:28:59):
Oh, I'm just saying yeah, okay, I definitely have to
go back, because that's blowingmy mind now um, all of them
there is crazy.

Speaker 3 (01:29:10):
All of those wait, what, who, where?
All right, you'll have to go.
Look, you'll have to talk aboutit.
We'll talk about it after theshow.
But if you look at the previewpages, there is people there
from issue one that the factthat they are there is very
upsetting.

Speaker 2 (01:29:25):
Oh, fuck, yes, Okay, I guess that's what I'm going to
do with my afternoon.

Speaker 1 (01:29:30):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:29:31):
Sorry, dogs, you're not getting the WALK.
I promise Kidding I will.
I will give you that he's oneof them looking at me with deep
disdain for making that joke.

Speaker 3 (01:29:42):
I do.
I do want to say for everybodylistening, I really appreciate
you guys.
Zombie Book Club podcast is oneof the best.
I love coming on this show.
I like connecting with readers.
I will answer questions.
If you show up in my DMs andyou follow my social media,
you're all welcome in our groupsand everywhere that we are,

(01:30:04):
because it's a wild ride and weshould experience it all
together and that, unfortunately, with the way Hollywood is,
you're not getting new stories.
You're getting recycled,rehashed, reboot, prequel,
sequel, whatever, and so storieslike mine that are original and
are compelling and you getsucked in you can only find

(01:30:25):
those here in indie comics forreal indie anything.
Indie movies.
That's where all the creativesare right now, because of what
hollywood is, yeah, so thank youfor your support.

Speaker 2 (01:30:36):
We couldn't do it without you well, we couldn't do
this without you and, honestly,at this point, I do this so
that I get to have the secretconversation after the podcast
and be like tell me everything.
Although folks actually Laurieis very good at keeping
something secret I don'tactually always get the spoiler
we get more questions is what weget.

Speaker 1 (01:30:57):
Yeah, well, thanks everybody for joining the zombie
book club with our specialguest, except for Brandon.
Except for Brandon, who we willtalk about later.

Speaker 3 (01:31:10):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:31:11):
Yeah, brandon, if you would like to support this
podcast, you could leave areview or a rating.
I think Brandon could also dothis.
No exclusion for Brandon.

Speaker 2 (01:31:26):
Brandon has to give us five stars, though, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:31:29):
Or you could send us a voicemail at 614-699-0006.
There's three zeros there.
You know you could send us avoicemail up to three minutes.
Tell us who you think you'regoing to see in issue seven from
the first episode, the firstissue of Path of the pale rider
let us know, give us yourpredictions of what the undead

(01:31:50):
retirement center is.

Speaker 2 (01:31:51):
I cannot wait.
I know, laura, you've gotten alot of them uh.

Speaker 1 (01:31:54):
You can follow us on on instagram at zombie book club
podcast or join the.
Uh, our discord.
For.
Uh, it changed.
Leah changed it.
It says our discord.
Commune of lovable weirdos.
Uh, the brain munchercollective.
You almost threw me off, leahwell, the next line's different
too.
It's just for laurie um alllinks are in the description

(01:32:16):
right next to your complimentarybrochure for the undead
retirement center.
We've got a brochure.
The end is nigh and death isbroken.

Speaker 2 (01:32:27):
Yeah, get the Kickstarter, because money
doesn't matter in the apocalypse.

Speaker 1 (01:32:31):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:32:31):
But your entertainment really does.

Speaker 1 (01:32:33):
Yeah, Spend that money while it's still worth
something.
Bye-bye everyone.

Speaker 2 (01:32:39):
Thanks again, laurie.
Bye-bye everybody, bye-bye, bye, bye.

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Path of the Pale Rider’s Darkest Issue Yet with special guest Laurie Calcaterra | Zombie Book Club Ep 106

Episode Transcript

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Path of the Pale Rider’s Darkest Issue Yet with special guest Laurie Calcaterra | Zombie Book Club Ep 106