Destination Discourse

Destination Discourse

Destination Discourse is the essential podcast for DMOs and travel industry professionals who want to stay ahead in destination marketing, stewardship, and management. Hosted by industry experts Stuart Butler and Adam Stoker, each episode delves into the key issues and trends shaping the future of tourism. From cutting-edge innovations to the complex challenges of destination management, we offer thought-provoking insights, honest debates, and practical takeaways. Part love letter to the industry, part therapy session, and part user manual, Destination Discourse is your trusted source for real talk and expert advice. Join us to explore inspiring campaigns, hear from leading voices, and gain the insights you need to elevate your destination strategies.

Episodes

68: Are DMOs Treating Long-Term Assets Like Short-Term Expenses? (Eddie Kirsch)

February 12, 2026 • 58 mins

Stuart Butler and Adam Stoker kick off the episode shaking off post-holiday rust with their signature mix of self-awareness, banter, and big-picture thinking. A deliberately terrible German intro, a mistranslated last name, and a few early laughs set the tone before welcoming Eddie Kirsch from Visit St. Pete Clearwater—a guest who sits at the intersection of storytelling, data, and performance.

The conversation opens with Stu’...

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67: Are Data Hangovers and Zombie Metrics Putting DMOs at Risk? (Emily Zertuche)

February 5, 2026 • 59 mins

It’s the first recording of 2026, and Stuart Butler and Adam Stoker welcome back Emily Zertuche for round three. After a quick (and rusty) start, they dive into a timely question: as agentic AI accelerates, are DMOs’ fragmented data stacks and inconsistent narratives becoming a credibility risk?

Using a Stu’s News example (L’Oréal’s partnership with NVIDIA), the conversation explores how major brands are embedding AI across op...

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66: Are DMOs Forgetting Why People Travel? (Amir Eylon)

January 29, 2026 • 53 mins

Stuart Butler and Adam Stoker are joined by Amir Eylon (Longwoods International) broadcasting from “Snowmageddon Aftermath” in Ohio to talk about what matters beyond the AI headlines. Yes, they still touch AI, including early chatter about ads inside ChatGPT and what that could mean for destinations. But the heart of the conversation is a 2026 reset: get back to basics, remember why people travel, and build marketing (and sta...

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65: What Are the Desties' Predicting for Destination Marketing in 2026?

January 22, 2026 • 60 mins

Stuart and Adam open with a quick Miracle Morning check-in (45 days strong) and a reminder that early wins matter before work even starts. In Stu’s News, they unpack Steve Hill’s optimistic comments about Las Vegas tourism despite recent declines, and debate whether bold confidence is leadership or risk.

Then the main event: predictions for 2026 submitted by “the Desties” (plus a few familiar friends of the show). Themes recur...

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64: Are Adam Stoker’s 2026 Resolutions Right for DMOs?

January 15, 2026 • 55 mins

In this episode of Destination Discourse, Stuart Butler and Adam Stoker dig into Adam’s 2026 resolutions for destination marketers. Rather than rehashing Adam’s full resolutions episode from the Destination Marketing Podcast, the conversation pulls out the most important ideas and stress-tests them through debate, real-world examples, and a healthy dose of humor.

The discussion centers on what DMOs can truly control, how relev...

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63: What Questions Would You Ask a DMO If You Were New to the Industry? (Dustin Rowe)

January 8, 2026 • 48 mins
Stuart and Adam start off completely off the rails, then do something they don’t usually do: hand the keys to their guest. Dustin Rowe, CEO of whatsgood.city, flips the script and asks the questions that a lot of people entering the industry are thinking but rarely get to ask out loud.

This episode turns into a rapid-fire tour through the DMO reality: what the job actually is, why ROI is so hard to prove, how resident s...
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62: What Are Stuart Butler’s Predictions for Destination Marketing in 2026?

January 1, 2026 • 54 mins
Stuart Butler and Adam Stoker kick off 2026 with a New Year’s episode built around Stuart’s “predictions” (not resolutions). They open with optimism (and a little healthy fear) about uncertainty, talk about the industry’s need for more honest conversations, invite listeners to two live appearances in Q1, and then dig into three big predictions for the destination marketing world in 2026: the DMO website won’t “die” this year (...
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61: Has our ability to measure outpaced our ability to explain? (Emily Zertuche)

December 25, 2025 • 60 mins
It’s a festive Destination Discourse that turns into a full-on industry thought exercise. Stuart Butler and Adam Stoker welcome back Emily Zertuche (record-setting past guest) for a Christmas episode that starts with meta-glasses and “Stu’s News” lyrics finally appearing on YouTube… then quickly escalates into a serious conversation about “data hangovers,” measurement overload, and why DMOs struggle to answer the simplest ques...
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60: Will This Announcement Shake Up the DMO Media World? (Zeek Coleman)

December 18, 2025 • 55 mins
Stuart and Adam open with Stu’s News on Australia’s move to restrict social media accounts for users under 16 on certain platforms, sparking a quick sidebar on parenting, addiction-by-design, and whether similar policy could ever happen in the U.S.

Then the episode pivots hard into the main topic: a true “red pill” conversation about paid media transparency in the destination industry.

Zeek Coleman returns with a...
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59: Is The Click Dead? (Diane Charno)

December 11, 2025 • 56 mins
Stuart and Adam kick things off with some lighthearted college sports trash talk before welcoming a very special guest co host, Diane Charno, EVP of Marketing at Visit Myrtle Beach and Stuart’s right hand. Together, the trio dig into one of the most uncomfortable questions in modern destination marketing, whether the almighty click still matters in a zero click, AI driven world, and what DMOs should be measuring instead.
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58: Are DMOs Really Serving Residents?

December 4, 2025 • 55 mins
In this episode of Destination Discourse, Stuart and Adam are together in person in Myrtle Beach for the very first time, recording live from the Grand Strand. Stuart uses the conversation to think out loud about the last few episodes and where DMOs go from here, especially when it comes to who we really exist to serve and how that should shape the future.


This is a reflective, slightly uncomfortable, very real conv...
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57: What Are Adam and Stuart Most Thankful For in 2025?

November 27, 2025 • 46 mins
In this Thanksgiving-week episode, Stuart and Adam shake off a few weeks of heavy, future-of-AI doom-spiraling and intentionally zoom out to focus on perspective, gratitude, and what truly matters in destination marketing. It’s lighter, more reflective, and full of listener shout-outs, industry appreciation, and some familiar banter.

Opening Banter
Stuart kicks things off with an over-the-top Adam introduction that s...
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56: Is This the Beginning of the End for DMOs? (Janette Roush)

November 20, 2025 • 69 mins
Stuart and Adam are joined by Brand USA’s Janette Roush for a provocative exploration of the question no one in tourism wants to ask out loud: what happens to DMOs when AI becomes the primary interface for travel inspiration, planning, and booking?

The conversation pushes past hype and digs into the existential challenge ahead. If AI tools replace the website, the visitor guide, the itinerary builder, and even the dis...
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55: Are DMOs Ready to Teach, Not Just Market? (Kara Franker)

November 13, 2025 • 52 mins
The game has changed, and not just for marketers. In this episode of Destination Discourse, Stuart Butler and Adam Stoker are joined by Kara Franker, CEO of the Florida Keys & Key West, for a candid conversation about how artificial intelligence is forcing DMOs to redefine their purpose.

Kara argues that the future of destination marketing isn’t just about promotion, it’s about education. As AI transforms how travel...
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54: Is It Time for Agencies to Get Paid for How They Think, Not What They Do?

November 6, 2025 • 54 mins
This week on Destination Discourse, Stuart and Adam dive into one of their most candid conversations yet, a real-time therapy session about the changing relationship between DMOs and agencies in the age of AI.

The episode kicks off with Stu’s News and a jaw-dropping update: OpenAI now allows users to shop and pay for products directly inside ChatGPT. No clicks. No websites. Just conversation. Stuart calls it “the moment...
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53: Should Vacation Be Mandatory in Destination Marketing? (Jennifer Walker)

October 30, 2025 • 49 mins
We promote the power of travel—but are we actually taking it ourselves? In this episode, Jennifer Walker from Visit Dallas challenges the tourism industry to practice what it preaches. With burnout on the rise and vacation days left unused, this candid conversation explores whether DMOs are setting the right example when it comes to rest, recovery, and experiencing their own destinations like a visitor.

From mandated ti...
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52: Can Supply Chain Thinking Revolutionize Destination Marketing? (Caleb Sullivan and Tyler Ford)

October 23, 2025 • 49 mins
In this episode of Destination Discourse, we’re joined by returning guest Caleb Sullivan and first-time guest Tyler Ford, an outsider from the automotive world who just might have the fresh perspective the tourism industry needs.

The conversation kicks off with a lively debate about Las Vegas’s new “Five Days of Fabulous” campaign—is it a smart earned media play or a short-sighted brand devaluation? But the real shift h...
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51: Should the 4 I’s Replace the 4 P’s of Marketing? (John Gardner)

October 16, 2025 • 54 mins
In this episode of Destination Discourse, Stuart and Adam sit down with marketing strategist John Gardner to unpack a bold new framework for modern marketers: The Four I’s of Marketing — Intelligence, Individualization, Integration, and Inspiration. As traditional approaches like the Four P’s (Product, Price, Place, Promotion) lose relevance, this conversation explores how DMOs can better serve visitors and stakeholders in an ...
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50: How Have Our Views Changed After 50 Episodes?

October 9, 2025 • 52 mins
It’s the 50th episode of Destination Discourse, and Stuart Butler and Adam Stoker mark the milestone by taking a reflective walk through their biggest learnings and shifts in perspective since launching the show. In a heartfelt, humorous, and occasionally roast-filled conversation, they unpack how their thinking has evolved on three major fronts: the role of paid vs. owned media, the importance of measuring what truly matters,...
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49: How Can DMOs Stand Out in Meetings Marketing? (Joe Heller)

October 2, 2025 • 52 mins
In this episode of Destination Discourse, Stuart and Adam sit down with Joe Heller, CMO of Discover Philadelphia, to tackle one of the biggest challenges facing DMOs today: how to break through the sea of sameness in meetings and conventions marketing.


The conversation explores why traditional advertising often falls flat in the B2B space and how destinations can shift toward disruptive promotions and attention-grab...
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