March 7, 2025 • 38 mins
In this International Women’s Day Special of Tech Talks, Laura Jane Welsh at theICEway hosts two inspiring trailblazers in cruise technology: Paulette Haedo, Chief Information Officer at Azamara Cruises, and Andrea Ortiz, Director of Business Systems Solutions at Virgin Voyages.
This episode is dedicated to showcasing the inspiring women leading technological innovation in the cruise industry—driving change at the helm of major cruise players. Paulette and Andrea share their journeys into the cruise IT space, discussing the challenges they’ve faced and the opportunities they’ve embraced as women in technology.
Discover the key tech innovations shaping the future of cruise technology through their expert insights.
Plus, these influential leaders share advice on breaking barriers, fostering innovation, and paving the way for the next generation of tech professionals. Tune in for invaluable perspectives on leadership, career growth, and thriving in a traditionally male-dominated field, this International Women's Day!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
>> Laura Jane (00:03):
Hello and welcome to the Women in
Cruise Tech Talk Podcast.
I am Laura Jane and I'm thrilled to be
hosting this special episode in celebration of
International Women's Day. This podcast is
dedicated to showcasing the inspiring women who
are leading technology in the cruise industry,
(00:23):
breaking barriers, driving innovation
and paving the way for the next generation of
tech professionals. Today, we are
honoured to have not just one, but two
incredible guests who are driving technology in the
cruise sector. Joining us is Paulette
Haydo, CIO at Azamara, and Andrea
(00:43):
Ortiz, Director of Business System Solutions
at Virgin Voyages. Both of them bring
extensive expertise in IT leadership,
digital transformation and the evolution of
cruise technology. And, today they'll share
their insights on leadership, challenges,
innovation and the future of cruise
IT Palette. And Andrea, welcome to
(01:06):
the podcast. Thank you.
>> Paulette Haydo (01:08):
Very excited.
>> Andrea Ortiz (01:09):
Thank you. Happy to be here.
>> Laura Jane (01:15):
So, before we dive in, I'd love to get each
of you to introduce yourselves and share a little bit about
your role and what brought you into the cruise IT
industry. Palette, let's start with you. What
can you tell us about your role at Azamara? What are your
key responsibilities and how does your
work impact the cruise experience?
>> Andrea Ortiz (01:35):
I have been in the cruise industry for
over 35 years now. I started my career in
IT and have continued here, at Azamara.
I'm responsible for, as CIO
for all of the aspects within technology,
including obviously shoreside
and shipboard, and ensuring that we're
(01:55):
aligning with the business to support
what their goals are and, you know, all
of the aspects of it. So data,
cybersecurity, making sure that our systems, both,
again, ship and shore integrations,
bringing in new technology. Here at
Azamara, it's a new leadership team that took over
in May of this year. And so
(02:17):
we are in the process of assessing
what needs to be done, putting our strategies
together and then moving forward to
evolve.
>> Laura Jane (02:27):
Brilliant. That's fascinating, especially with how
technology is driving such major changes in guest
experiences and operations. Andrea, over
to you. You're leading business System Solutions at Virgin
Voyages. What does that entail and what excites you the most
about your work?
>> Paulette Haydo (02:42):
Yeah, so I like to start from the beginning of my
career in the cruise industry. I say I was kind
of born into it. It's in my DNA. So my parents,
when I was younger, had a travel agency and,
like, right when the cruise industry was booming, we
would go on family vacation. So something that's always been
in my blood. And, as I went through my
(03:03):
college career, I was one of the first
classes in My university to be a part of like
a pilot where we went on a, almost a study abroad on a cruise
ship partnering with Disney Cruise Line. So that was like
kind of the real kickoff to my
professional career, career within the cruise industry. And
then I went to work for Disney Cruise Line for
(03:23):
almost six years until I transitioned over to Virgin
Voyages and I've been here for almost seven years now.
So almost 14 years in the industry. But I count
my younger years, kind of like watching my parents doing
it, which was really exciting. As far as what I do at
Virgin Voyages, I am the
liaison between our technology partners and our
operational stakeholders making sure,
(03:45):
similar to what Paula said, that all of our business
initiatives are aligned and we can support them
in implementation, testing
anything that and everything that our partners need to be
able to drive successful business. And
we call our guest sailors and make sure the sailor experience is
supported technology wise, but also that we're supporting
the operational teams the best of our abilities,
(04:07):
using technology to support that.
>> Laura Jane (04:09):
Brilliant. It's amazing to hear how both of you have been in the
industry for so long and you're shaping the cruise
technology in different but equally impactful ways.
So Andrea was mentioning, she's obviously had
experience in the cruise industry from pretty much the get
go. Paula, I'd love to go back to the beginning
for you. What first drew you to a career in tech and how
(04:31):
did you end up in the cruise industry specifically?
>> Andrea Ortiz (04:34):
So I, like Andrea, I say I was born into the United
nations, we have family from
everywhere in my family family. And so early on I
learned about different obviously countries
and so I knew very early on that I wanted to
travel and I knew that obviously
my parents are first generation immigrants,
(04:55):
and so from, from Spain
and I learned about
geography, wanted to
know more about it and knew that I was going to have to
work in a place that was going to be
able to afford travelling. and
luckily I have been able to pretty much see the world
because of it. I'm going to
(05:17):
say technology chose me, not that I chose
technology.
I started off in operations
and loved it. I actually started off as a travel
agent and had an opportunity. Saw an
ad in the paper for Royal Caribbean, was bringing
in house their air ticketing and needed a
qualifying person and that's really how I got started in
(05:39):
cruise, learned everything. I
was at the cutting edge of technology
if you will. It was just starting, it was
just beginning. So I'm one of those people that could
manage manually. So being at that cutting
edge, being Innately curious and wanting
to know how things ticked, I think just
(06:00):
obviously was just a natural course.
I began my IT and my discipline
is in project management, programme management.
And so that's how I got involved in
technology. But like I said, I think it chose me. Not
necessarily that I made a conscious decision to
go into the IT arena.
>> Laura Jane (06:20):
And Andrea, what would you say was kind of the
defining moment in your, in your career?
Obviously you started out knowing what you wanted to go into.
Is there a moment that really sticks out to you as a
pivotal moment for you?
>> Paulette Haydo (06:33):
Yeah, it's funny, Paula and I, not by
coincidence, have very similar, defining
moments. I also did not say, hey, you know what? Today I really
think I want to be in technology. It was one of those things
where there was an operational need. And
obviously as different generations,
as we move forward, technology is like,
(06:54):
you have to know it, right? And you either understand it
or you don't. And I think what really helped
me really feel like this is something I
can move forward with is seeing the different partnerships we
have across the world offshore, working with teams
here. And I really like, really, really
enjoy the collaborative spirit and being able
to work together to move forward and
(07:16):
really making sure that we're supporting the business that,
your front end call centre agents,
or your travel agents, they don't really
understand what it takes to get one button to click right.
And it really like to me is a big puzzle that I really
enjoy. And working with all the different technology
partners along with our business is what really
triggered me to say, hey, this is something I want to continue moving
(07:39):
forward with and continue with those
partnerships.
>> Laura Jane (07:42):
It's so inspiring to see how both of your
journeys have kind of followed sort of similar paths
and led you to these leadership positions.
Now that we've covered how you got here, let's
talk about some of the obstacles and lessons that you
learned along the way. Ah, we all know that working
in tech, especially in leadership, comes with its own
challenges. But as a woman in Cruise
(08:05):
it, those challenges can sometimes be even more
complex. Paulette, I'd love to start with you.
What are some of the biggest challenges you faced in your career and
how did you navigate them?
>> Andrea Ortiz (08:16):
So IT and maritime as a whole is
a very male dominated
industry. And I started
obviously my career, like I said,
early on, where it was all male
dominated. What that discipline taught me
was, and I want to say the biggest challenge was not being
taken seriously. What I
(08:37):
did was I learned very early on that I had
to work smarter, that I
had to make relationships that I had to
build credibility
within the area because it was so male
dominated. And here you are at that time
I was in my early 20s, trying
to, again like I said, it chose me. It wasn't that I
(09:00):
chose it, but I knew that if I wanted to move into
that, in that direction that I
needed to understand what it was going to
take for me to be taken seriously.
And so one of the I think
mistakes women make early on, I
think it's much better now, was that women
thought that they had to be and act like a
(09:21):
man. And I knew early on that
was not going to be the case for me. I was fortunate enough
that I grew up in a very woman dominated
family and so I saw the
way that they, even though that they were not
professionals but I saw how they just
challenged on and forged forward
(09:41):
in it. And so I got the lessons from that.
Networking was very important,
asking questions from them to the point where I would
say what is it and how do you need to see this work and information?
And I think that moving into project management really gave
me that opportunity because I love having the
reins of things, bringing people together
(10:02):
to make sure that we're working on a common
goal in order to be able to meet
those goals. And so I was always very
comfortable working with males
and learning to navigate it. And
Disney, because I was part of the Disney Cruise Line launch
team, taught me that because Disney
was also very male dominated as
(10:25):
part of their organisation and being
a minority
female, you had to learn it. And Disney, let me
tell you, taught me that. Probably the biggest learnings I
received was there on how to be able to navigate
that world.
>> Laura Jane (10:41):
Such an amazing insight and some really
valuable takeaways. Andrea, what about you? Have you
faced similar challenges? Has your experience been any
different?
>> Paulette Haydo (10:50):
I think my experience is a bit different because
in my career growth I've been really fortunate to be
supported by strong female leadership, both at
Disney Cruise Line and Virgin Voyages. So I never felt
the challenges of not being supported
as a woman. it was there and I think that really
moulded me to how I operate and
manage, moving up in my career.
(11:13):
I would say the only time I really felt a
challenge per se is when sometimes we're
travelling or working with partners from other parts of the world
where in their culture, they still
more patriarch than matriarch and you
really have to make the stand
and show that you are a part of
the leadership team. sometimes you'll be in meetings
(11:36):
and they'll look straight at the only man in the room. Even though
I might have higher titles, not that titles matter to
me, but you know, it's just one of those things, they're just looking right there.
So you really have to just make a stand, make your voice
heard and make sure that the things
that you're saying are valuable, that give you the credibility
that no matter what your gender is. Because we're also
(11:56):
moving into a world where genders are fluid. There are
many different colours of genders now. Right. Which is
beautiful and everyone should be supported. It really should be about
what you say, your experience and your
expertise, not your gender. But I
feel very, very, very fortunate to have
grown in a time period in companies
where it didn't really
(12:18):
feel like it was just a male
driven type of industry.
I never felt that personally. But again, moving
forward with other countries and
maybe talking with other partners, that
it's all the male leadership, that's where you really, really have
to just stick to your guns. And if you have to say
(12:38):
the same thing three times for them to get it, then you have to say three times.
But I think it's also really important, these challenges to
have a good support system. also been very fortunate
that I have very strong peers that
ah, are male, that will defer to me.
And that's really important that you make that
network so the other people see that
they're not within that kind of like
(13:01):
internal dialogue, that you are here for a
reason.
>> Laura Jane (13:04):
Definitely. I think that's such a great point. Obviously in
this industry we're working internationally
across different cultures and that definitely
brings a different aspect to the conversation
where maybe when you're travelling you're not getting the same experience
that you're necessarily having at home. Now let's
talk about leadership. Both of you are
leading IT initiatives at major cruise
(13:27):
lines. What advice would you give
to women aspiring to step into leadership
roles in tech?
>> Andrea Ortiz (13:34):
So I'm gonna allude to what I was
saying, previous. So you need to develop
both your technical and strategic thinking
skills. You have to stay
informed with emerging technology. So that's
where I go back to. That's where you have to be innately
curious. I've always been a person that
gets bored very easily and I always want
(13:56):
to challenge myself, which is a double edged sword, I will
tell you. Because you're always looking
for that next thing or that next challenge
and trying to stay with
what is happening. And in today's world,
technology changes so quickly that it
is difficult. So making sure that you have a
(14:16):
way of being able to do that, whether
it's you assign a team to research and development
and staying up on that, but you yourself,
that can inform you, but you yourself have to be able to do
that. I think understanding how
it integrates with business objectives,
I will say that I think what made me
successful in my career is having
(14:38):
that operational understanding and from.
In different businesses. Because I started in
operations, I moved into marketing when
the Internet was that thing coming up. And again, I've been
very fortunate that I have been,
at the very beginning of where things are evolving
and emerging and looking at it and saying,
(14:58):
ooh, this is the direction that I want to move in. So having
the understanding of marketing, and
then within it, there's very different verticals within
it. So one of the things I'm going to
say at the very beginning that held me back was
like, you know, I'm not a developer, I'm not technical, I'm not
technical. And like Andrea, I've had some great
(15:19):
leaders and her and I have had some of the same leaders.
And so having those great leaders
that continuously guide
you in that direction, what
held me back was me thinking, I'm not a developer, and nor did
I have any desire to be a developer. But
I did get to early in my career was a
business analyst. In the days where you sat next
(15:42):
to your developer and you guys developed it,
you tested it while they were developing and so you
learned. And so I did not realise and I had those
leaders tell me, stop saying you're not technical, you
are. Is just again, the different
variations within the technology. So
understanding each one of those verticals is going to be
important and knowing what
(16:05):
you want to move forward in which
one of those verticals do you want to be a specialist? Do you want to
be a generalist? I, think for the way that
career evolution is working now, we're now
in that area where people want generalists.
But understanding, because I've always seen
what we do in it is the
(16:25):
business are my clients. That's who we are
there to support. That's what we're there to do. The
other philosophy I've always had is it should be a
utility. When do you talk about your water and
electricity? Only when it's not working.
Other than that it should be a silent in the
background working the way it needs
(16:46):
to work. So I think it's pivotal for people
to understand how the business work,
why things are so important. Living the day in
the life of. So you can actually
feel and, and live their
challenges. Because I think that makes you more
empathetic and more understanding to
what you need to do in order to support and continue
(17:08):
to move. Also building that
relationship of. I've also seen it as
consultant. A, consultant too. So if the business is
having challenges, I always say, tell me
the what, why and when. We'll come up with the how
together. System agnostic. Because
I think people get, get very pigeonholed
(17:28):
into this is the solution. And
not necessarily so. Being able to step back and
taking the time to look at that, building
strong networks. I think we already spoke about
mentorship, I think is equally as important. I
didn't have mentors until late in my career. It
wasn't really a thing, when I was, you know, in
(17:48):
my 20s and 30s in those years.
And so I say I was fortunate enough to have
both male and female again. I go back to what
Andrea say. I think gender should be secondary. I
don't think we should call that out. I think
that people should be, again, skilled.
Learn what you need to learn, learn how to navigate
it. Because it does exist. We're not going to sit here and say that it
(18:11):
doesn't. It does stand your ground like
Andrea said. But you have to build that
credibility. And that starts with that
networking, making sure that you are
meeting the expectations that they have for you, that
you're constantly building results. And
that's how you build that and how you get there. I,
also think confidence, confidence is key.
(18:33):
So when you go into a room, I tell everyone on my
team, but specifically my females, you have a
voice at that table. I don't care if you're the only
female there. You sit at that table, you
express your views. There are no stupid
questions and there are no stupid ideas. They just may not
be ready at that particular moment in time. And
(18:53):
so you have to be confident. You have to build that within
yourself to know, you know what, hey,
everybody did not. Was not born with all this
information. They've had to be
learned. And so make sure that you lend a helping
hand as well to those that are coming up and make sure
you're there for them. And I think that's part of
that confidence that, oh, you know what? I will share whatever it is
(19:15):
I know with whomever wants to learn it and
know it and not hold that back because
your secret sauce, no one's going to take that away from
you. And sometimes I think people think that
that's a security away. Well, if I know it and not
share it, I think that does the complete
opposite. So being confident in
(19:35):
that and knowing that what you have to say, even if
it's something that someone else knows or has
experienced, you should not hold back from
asking or stating your
opinion.
>> Laura Jane (19:47):
That's such a great takeaway. Especially what you mentioned about
confidence and adaptability. I think this industry,
you know, having that innate curiosity and adaptability
is, is so important. And, Andrea, what are
your thoughts? What's helped you grow as a leader?
>> Paulette Haydo (20:01):
Yeah, and agree with everything Paulette says. But on top
of that, I want to go back to the statement she said about
going into the room and having to talk like the man. I don't
think we need to talk like a man. The reason that we're
successful is because we don't.
We, we naturally
are inclined to ask more. So some of the details,
ask more collaborative questions ask, eventually make
(20:23):
us more successful. So what I would tell,
some of my younger women that are coming in
industry and it's really relevant to me right now because I have some
really young, women on my team right now that I took straight out
of college, like, you know, very focused on technology,
but they need to work on the professional skills. Right.
So first thing I tell them is be brave, go with your
gut. You know, it, it's in your head. You just have to make
(20:46):
sure that your heart is falling. Right? So be brave, go with your
gut. If you maybe misspoke, you come back and follow
up. Right. This is how we learn. We learn by failure and by
mistakes. But the most important part of that is
overcoming it and following up and making sure
it's acknowledged and shared for the future. Right. then
the other, I think, important thing with leadership growth,
(21:06):
especially in this industry and technology, is the devil
is in the details. Sometimes we do overlook that,
and I've seen many times where
something would go into production and
that one little detail that overlook brings down the
whole, you know, implementation. We have to roll
back. And a lot of times when this happened too, I've
had younger team members of mine, female team or
(21:29):
say, oh, I kind of saw that, but I wasn't sure what to say.
Say it. Don't be afraid, just say it. You know, but it
goes with that confidence. But they can only grow
confidence by the community around them. Right. so
working on that, the kind of opposite of the devil
in the details is just remember also what the end goal
is. I've also seen where there's been implementations and
(21:49):
we over engineered the solution and then
the person who actually uses it every day, your check
in agent, your guest services on the ship, they're
like, oh, I didn't really need that. Like I really
need this. The thing that we said wasn't so
important. So that's what's really important with working with
your partners and understanding the
operations and see how that translates into
(22:12):
the code. Right. for your technology
partners. And then I think at the end of the day it's just
really, really important what we're doing right now. Share our
experiences, make yourself vulnerable. I
try to make sure that my team understands that like I
didn't get here overnight. I learned through trial and
error and just being resilient, making
sure that when we have those
(22:34):
learning lessons we actually take those opportunities to
continue to move forward and document, to
share. Because if we're not sharing, we're not caring.
That was cheesy, but it's true.
>> Laura Jane (22:46):
That's brilliant. Honestly, I think that for me
as someone that's coming up in tech and
still kind of at the beginning of my career, that
advice is so invaluable. So thank you so much for
that. I did want to touch on
the future of cruise technology.
Obviously we've mentioned the cruise industry is
constantly evolving. Technology is constantly evolving.
(23:09):
What are some of the most exciting innovations
that you guys are seeing in cruise IT at the
moment?
>> Paulette Haydo (23:15):
So I think it's innovative, also controversial.
You'll hear a lot about AI, AI and data.
>> Laura Jane (23:21):
Yeah.
>> Paulette Haydo (23:22):
And I have very strong opinions on it. It's a great
tool like any other tool, but any other tools only
as good as what's being fed to it. And I see
a lot now in the industry where
it's being sold as the end all, be all without the full
understanding that there is a lot of work
that has to be put in behind the scenes to make it work.
(23:42):
So again anything that involves
automation involves a
lot of lead time to get to that point of the automation.
So to me that's one of the
you know, big trends that are going on.
aside from that I've seen even in my
generation now I'm feeling like I'm
(24:03):
behind the times is you know the social media,
it's really, really exploded
and I feel like it's eventually
going to get to a tipping point because I have already seen now
with some of my younger team, members that ah,
they're actually like anti social media. So it's going to
be interesting to see how much more that is used
as a tool for marketing or
(24:25):
communications versus the other type of outlets
or channels that we have. So those are my two perfect.
>> Laura Jane (24:31):
And Paulette, what about you? What are you keeping
your eye on?
>> Andrea Ortiz (24:35):
I agree with Andrea. Obviously one of the m
biggest emergent technologies is AI. I think there is
a place for it. we have a few things that
are already, we are piloting. but it's not
everything and it won't solve everything.
and so I think people have to be very careful
and do their research, attend
(24:55):
webinars, join up with, you know,
the leaders in the industry that are looking at
it. But you have to really do your due diligence.
because I think that's the biggest thing that people are pushing now that
everybody is trying to get into. But you have to be
very careful and judicious on what it
is that you're going to and how you're going to implement.
(25:16):
I think another one we touched upon. So
I see that things are moving towards obviously user
centric. Everything is based on that customer
journey. Everything that we're doing has to lead
up to making it smoother and better.
for our guests, if you will,
for those end products. I think data driven
decision making is a must. There is so
(25:38):
much data and there are so many metrics out there
ensuring that you've got a really good strategy for
that. Because the decisions that you make and
the things that you're looking and your strategies that you're putting
together should be based on that. So they're
not subjective. That you can try to be as
objective as you can with what changes
and where you're actually going to
(26:01):
be spending your money. Right. So the company
and investing in what needs to be invested
in and making sure that you're looking at
the right things. I also think
having diverse because I want to say the cruise industry
in general was probably one of those first industries that was very
diverse, whether it was gender diversity
(26:21):
or just cultural diversity. Because obviously
when you look at the shipboard you've got so many different
cultures and things that you need to know
and understand how to deal with and manage.
And so I think part of that
diversity and hearing from your front end
users who are going to tell you what
(26:42):
challenges they're facing. You also have an
opportunity of being able to have a
broader audience and have them involved in
your product design and what it is so that it resonates
right with, with everyone in any, all over the
globe. Because our industry is
global.
Within what we need to do there. And I'm going
(27:02):
to say this and I know that it may have some, but I think women
are great collaborators. I think
women are great at ah, bringing people
together, working on a solution.
It's not just about self and
ego, it's really about doing the
right thing and making sure that we're introducing the
(27:22):
right solutions.
>> Laura Jane (27:23):
Yeah, definitely. I couldn't agree
more. Before we wrap up,
I have one final question. Obviously
we have touched on the importance of
networking and mentorship in both of your
career journeys for women who
don't potentially have access to that
(27:43):
formal mentorship. I know not just in
the cruise industry but in tech broadly, we
still are seeing a lot of that male dominated field.
So for those women who don't have access to those networks or
those forms, formal mentorships, how would you advise is
the best way for them to find support?
>> Paulette Haydo (28:01):
Yeah, so I know that there is, I mean
obviously the first kind of tool is
online classes. Right. There's tonnes of
different online classes if you're looking to
increase your skills, whether it's in technology
or just professional speaking.
Right. So that would be my first kind
of recommendation going back to social media.
(28:23):
I mean there's a lot of audiobooks and things
like that that someone could take on their own to listen
to. But aside from that it's, it's
trying to attend any local
woman community events. I live by
Fort Lauderdale by the beach and they have like a once a week women's beach
walk. Right. It's not specific to technology but you never know, you might
meet somebody there who's also a woman professional who you're
(28:46):
going for a walk and you have these conversations. Right.
So always kind of reach out to local communities if
you don't have like in the industry that type of
support. But I think for me until I got more
m involved it was also leaning on
toward, towards your family and friends. you know
they, they're your first support system, they're your
(29:07):
first community and making sure that they're along in the journey with
you. Be vocal about what you're trying to do. No
one, I always tell my team or even my family, I'm like,
I can't read your mind, I don't know what you're trying to do.
Let's have a conversation, let's sit and talk and make sure that
it's open dialogue because that eventually would translate
to the conversations you're going to have professionally when you
are in the industry and you're having these meetings because you
(29:30):
have to learn the give and take of A,
conversation, it's almost like negotiation, but
not officially, but it can be depending on what
project you're on. So to me, those are really the first
kind of three foundational
tools that somebody could use, if they're looking to go into
industry. I also say if you're in
university, there's could be
(29:52):
internships, so don't be shy, Try, try some
internships, try community outreach, as
well. I, know especially in the cruise industry,
there's a lot of community events around the
environment, which, is really big. A lot of beach cleanups if
you're by the beach or maybe, you know, depending on the
various ports. I know that there's a lot of different activities
that happen, within the communities as well. So I
(30:14):
think that's how you start building your network. But don't be
shy, like, just reach out, have a conversation.
For those who know me and Paula personally, they know we're not shy
and I know that doesn't come naturally to everybody. So it
only takes practise though. And you never know.
That one interaction I can think back in
my career, professionally, personally, that sometimes that one
(30:35):
interaction, that one conversation that you didn't think was really
important, pivotal is important, pivotal to somebody else. And
it can just kick off a whole
new, career path for you. You just
have to make sure that you're following up and just be
brave. That's all I can say.
>> Andrea Ortiz (30:52):
Same. I wish I would have known about
mentorship early on in my career. I think I
would have been able to, navigate it much better.
As Andrea says, you start with your family. Who in your
family can give you that guidance? I think
people should have more than one mentor.
I think people should look for
(31:12):
those things that you like in someone
that you want to learn from, because not one person is going to
have everything. if someone, the way
they speak, the way you see them, presenting
the way you see them, right. how they carry
themselves, ask them. And,
most people will be honoured that you ask that you
saw something in them that you want their help
(31:35):
with or their guidance. And when they
say yes, come prepared.
What is it that you want? What are the challenges you're facing?
What is it? Make use of that time. Because I will
say they probably won't have a whole lot of time they can
dedicate to it. But you probably need 15 or
30 minutes, you know, every two weeks or a month, depending
(31:55):
on how many you're. You're going to have and what is it that you're when
you're younger in it, you're going to need more of that
guidance. Part of it is going to be what you need to
learn in that profession. But as Andrea said, most of it is
general. Most of it is going to be that emotional
intelligence. how do you communicate, how do
you make sure you get that information? How do you show
(32:16):
up and get people to notice you?
Because I will say in today's industry, it's a
collaborative of leaders that actually see something in
someone and say that person. And they're
only going to want to dedicate and, give of their
time to someone that they see those traits in.
So as Andrea says, if you're shy
(32:36):
and you're that person that doesn't really want to
ask, you need to work on getting over
that. I think also there's
so much online that you can follow some
great leaders, out there, and women
that are in CIO roles, women that are
in CEO roles, women that have just
(32:56):
are taking on larger industries, that
are on YouTube, hear them, because most of them
do share how they came about.
you have to ask, listen, I
always tell people, I will ask anything. You have the right to
say no. You know, and if you say no,
then I, then I start right back where I, where I went.
(33:17):
But don't be discouraged by that. There may be someone
that you ask and they just don't have that time right now. You know,
they're mentoring already maybe five or six people.
And don't get discouraged by that. You know, go
to someone else. I also think there's a lot of
leadership coaching, professional leadership
coaching out there. I have benefited from
(33:37):
that. That I think, is when you're more in your career
and you can afford, depending on what your trajectory
is and where you want to move into,
because that is very, very helpful. They do
assessments. You can probably find some of those assessments free
online as well, on where and what
area you need to develop in order to move
forward and understand if you're looking
(33:59):
at that forward trajectory, understand what are those pillars?
I had a leader of mine, that told me there's
about seven to ten pillars that leaders look for.
And are you addressing all of them
and how are you going about it so that you're prepared
and you're ready when there is an opportunity, because
there's not always an opportunity. And so making
sure that you are aligned and that you're ready
(34:22):
for them and don't wait to get
promoted. Everyone always says this, you need
to be acting as in already performing
in that role that you're looking to go. So always
strive for what's the next.
>> Paulette Haydo (34:35):
But also let your leader know you want to be.
>> Andrea Ortiz (34:37):
Exactly. You need to, you know that.
>> Paulette Haydo (34:39):
You need a voice.
>> Andrea Ortiz (34:40):
People are human like you. You, they can't read your minds. As
Andrea said, if we don't know what the problem is, you can't solve
it. So just say it, no matter how small you think, or
insignificant if you think it is.
And I'm going to give you a, recommendation on a resource.
There is a book that's called what got you here won't get you there.
Absolutely fabulous. So there are again,
(35:01):
resources out there that will help you. I will tell
you, no one is going to drive your
career. You need to drive your
career and you need to be very, upfront
with and, truthful with yourself. What is
it that you want to do? Do you want to take that on?
Being a leader of people is like being a
parent. You become secondary because
(35:24):
everything that you should be doing is
to move those folks over,
get them to where they want to be, even if that means leaving
you at some point or doing those things.
It's really a selfless, act. So
understanding. Why do you want to do that?
Because it does take a lot of
involvement. It's not easy
(35:47):
by any means. It's not easy to manage
folks and help them get to where they want. So it needs to be
something that is innately, in your
nature, that that's what you want to do and be able to
share because their success is yours, is your
success. The other thing I want to mention is
what Andrea, said in, in reference to
failure. Listen, you need to be in a culture.
(36:09):
You need to adopt a culture that failure is going to
happen. It's what you do with that failure.
It's how you learn from it and how quickly
you course correct and move forward with it.
because no one is perfect. And
the biggest learnings I think I've gotten are from
those mistakes and from those things and being
(36:29):
able to look back and say, hey, this didn't
work. Why didn't it? And then again,
learning from that and avoiding and avoiding those. But
everything is a learning and teaching moment. So take those
opportunities. Don't let it get you down. We're all human
and it will, it will impact you. But you need to recover
quickly and move forward and be that person
(36:50):
that supports and say, especially for young, for
younger, people coming in, into
is just say it's okay, but just learn from
it and then keep moving forward.
>> Laura Jane (37:01):
Yeah, no, thank you so much, both
of you, with some absolutely brilliant pieces of
advice there, I think, for everyone, not just young
females coming in, but for anyone starting their career
in any industry at all.
it's been such a pleasure speaking with both of you.
I know I found it so informative as I'm speaking, still
(37:21):
in the early stages of my career, and it's been such an
honour to hear about your experiences. So thank
you so much for sharing your experiences and
insights.
That's a wrap on, this special International
Women's Day of episode of the Cruise Tech
Talk podcast. Thank you to Paulette Haydo and
(37:41):
Andrea Ortiz for joining us. If you enjoyed
this episode, be sure to subscribe, subscribe, share and
join in the conversation on LinkedIn.
Until next time, thank you so much for listening.
Hello and welcome to the Women in
Cruise Tech Talk Podcast.
I am Laura Jane and I'm thrilled to be
hosting this special episode in celebration of
International Women's Day. This podcast is
dedicated to showcasing the inspiring women who
are leading technology in the cruise industry,
(00:23):
breaking barriers, driving innovation
and paving the way for the next generation of
tech professionals. Today, we are
honoured to have not just one, but two
incredible guests who are driving technology in the
cruise sector. Joining us is Paulette
Haydo, CIO at Azamara, and Andrea
(00:43):
Ortiz, Director of Business System Solutions
at Virgin Voyages. Both of them bring
extensive expertise in IT leadership,
digital transformation and the evolution of
cruise technology. And, today they'll share
their insights on leadership, challenges,
innovation and the future of cruise
IT Palette. And Andrea, welcome to
(01:06):
the podcast. Thank you.
>> Paulette Haydo (01:08):
Very excited.
>> Andrea Ortiz (01:09):
Thank you. Happy to be here.
>> Laura Jane (01:15):
So, before we dive in, I'd love to get each
of you to introduce yourselves and share a little bit about
your role and what brought you into the cruise IT
industry. Palette, let's start with you. What
can you tell us about your role at Azamara? What are your
key responsibilities and how does your
work impact the cruise experience?
>> Andrea Ortiz (01:35):
I have been in the cruise industry for
over 35 years now. I started my career in
IT and have continued here, at Azamara.
I'm responsible for, as CIO
for all of the aspects within technology,
including obviously shoreside
and shipboard, and ensuring that we're
(01:55):
aligning with the business to support
what their goals are and, you know, all
of the aspects of it. So data,
cybersecurity, making sure that our systems, both,
again, ship and shore integrations,
bringing in new technology. Here at
Azamara, it's a new leadership team that took over
in May of this year. And so
(02:17):
we are in the process of assessing
what needs to be done, putting our strategies
together and then moving forward to
evolve.
>> Laura Jane (02:27):
Brilliant. That's fascinating, especially with how
technology is driving such major changes in guest
experiences and operations. Andrea, over
to you. You're leading business System Solutions at Virgin
Voyages. What does that entail and what excites you the most
about your work?
>> Paulette Haydo (02:42):
Yeah, so I like to start from the beginning of my
career in the cruise industry. I say I was kind
of born into it. It's in my DNA. So my parents,
when I was younger, had a travel agency and,
like, right when the cruise industry was booming, we
would go on family vacation. So something that's always been
in my blood. And, as I went through my
(03:03):
college career, I was one of the first
classes in My university to be a part of like
a pilot where we went on a, almost a study abroad on a cruise
ship partnering with Disney Cruise Line. So that was like
kind of the real kickoff to my
professional career, career within the cruise industry. And
then I went to work for Disney Cruise Line for
(03:23):
almost six years until I transitioned over to Virgin
Voyages and I've been here for almost seven years now.
So almost 14 years in the industry. But I count
my younger years, kind of like watching my parents doing
it, which was really exciting. As far as what I do at
Virgin Voyages, I am the
liaison between our technology partners and our
operational stakeholders making sure,
(03:45):
similar to what Paula said, that all of our business
initiatives are aligned and we can support them
in implementation, testing
anything that and everything that our partners need to be
able to drive successful business. And
we call our guest sailors and make sure the sailor experience is
supported technology wise, but also that we're supporting
the operational teams the best of our abilities,
(04:07):
using technology to support that.
>> Laura Jane (04:09):
Brilliant. It's amazing to hear how both of you have been in the
industry for so long and you're shaping the cruise
technology in different but equally impactful ways.
So Andrea was mentioning, she's obviously had
experience in the cruise industry from pretty much the get
go. Paula, I'd love to go back to the beginning
for you. What first drew you to a career in tech and how
(04:31):
did you end up in the cruise industry specifically?
>> Andrea Ortiz (04:34):
So I, like Andrea, I say I was born into the United
nations, we have family from
everywhere in my family family. And so early on I
learned about different obviously countries
and so I knew very early on that I wanted to
travel and I knew that obviously
my parents are first generation immigrants,
(04:55):
and so from, from Spain
and I learned about
geography, wanted to
know more about it and knew that I was going to have to
work in a place that was going to be
able to afford travelling. and
luckily I have been able to pretty much see the world
because of it. I'm going to
(05:17):
say technology chose me, not that I chose
technology.
I started off in operations
and loved it. I actually started off as a travel
agent and had an opportunity. Saw an
ad in the paper for Royal Caribbean, was bringing
in house their air ticketing and needed a
qualifying person and that's really how I got started in
(05:39):
cruise, learned everything. I
was at the cutting edge of technology
if you will. It was just starting, it was
just beginning. So I'm one of those people that could
manage manually. So being at that cutting
edge, being Innately curious and wanting
to know how things ticked, I think just
(06:00):
obviously was just a natural course.
I began my IT and my discipline
is in project management, programme management.
And so that's how I got involved in
technology. But like I said, I think it chose me. Not
necessarily that I made a conscious decision to
go into the IT arena.
>> Laura Jane (06:20):
And Andrea, what would you say was kind of the
defining moment in your, in your career?
Obviously you started out knowing what you wanted to go into.
Is there a moment that really sticks out to you as a
pivotal moment for you?
>> Paulette Haydo (06:33):
Yeah, it's funny, Paula and I, not by
coincidence, have very similar, defining
moments. I also did not say, hey, you know what? Today I really
think I want to be in technology. It was one of those things
where there was an operational need. And
obviously as different generations,
as we move forward, technology is like,
(06:54):
you have to know it, right? And you either understand it
or you don't. And I think what really helped
me really feel like this is something I
can move forward with is seeing the different partnerships we
have across the world offshore, working with teams
here. And I really like, really, really
enjoy the collaborative spirit and being able
to work together to move forward and
(07:16):
really making sure that we're supporting the business that,
your front end call centre agents,
or your travel agents, they don't really
understand what it takes to get one button to click right.
And it really like to me is a big puzzle that I really
enjoy. And working with all the different technology
partners along with our business is what really
triggered me to say, hey, this is something I want to continue moving
(07:39):
forward with and continue with those
partnerships.
>> Laura Jane (07:42):
It's so inspiring to see how both of your
journeys have kind of followed sort of similar paths
and led you to these leadership positions.
Now that we've covered how you got here, let's
talk about some of the obstacles and lessons that you
learned along the way. Ah, we all know that working
in tech, especially in leadership, comes with its own
challenges. But as a woman in Cruise
(08:05):
it, those challenges can sometimes be even more
complex. Paulette, I'd love to start with you.
What are some of the biggest challenges you faced in your career and
how did you navigate them?
>> Andrea Ortiz (08:16):
So IT and maritime as a whole is
a very male dominated
industry. And I started
obviously my career, like I said,
early on, where it was all male
dominated. What that discipline taught me
was, and I want to say the biggest challenge was not being
taken seriously. What I
(08:37):
did was I learned very early on that I had
to work smarter, that I
had to make relationships that I had to
build credibility
within the area because it was so male
dominated. And here you are at that time
I was in my early 20s, trying
to, again like I said, it chose me. It wasn't that I
(09:00):
chose it, but I knew that if I wanted to move into
that, in that direction that I
needed to understand what it was going to
take for me to be taken seriously.
And so one of the I think
mistakes women make early on, I
think it's much better now, was that women
thought that they had to be and act like a
(09:21):
man. And I knew early on that
was not going to be the case for me. I was fortunate enough
that I grew up in a very woman dominated
family and so I saw the
way that they, even though that they were not
professionals but I saw how they just
challenged on and forged forward
(09:41):
in it. And so I got the lessons from that.
Networking was very important,
asking questions from them to the point where I would
say what is it and how do you need to see this work and information?
And I think that moving into project management really gave
me that opportunity because I love having the
reins of things, bringing people together
(10:02):
to make sure that we're working on a common
goal in order to be able to meet
those goals. And so I was always very
comfortable working with males
and learning to navigate it. And
Disney, because I was part of the Disney Cruise Line launch
team, taught me that because Disney
was also very male dominated as
(10:25):
part of their organisation and being
a minority
female, you had to learn it. And Disney, let me
tell you, taught me that. Probably the biggest learnings I
received was there on how to be able to navigate
that world.
>> Laura Jane (10:41):
Such an amazing insight and some really
valuable takeaways. Andrea, what about you? Have you
faced similar challenges? Has your experience been any
different?
>> Paulette Haydo (10:50):
I think my experience is a bit different because
in my career growth I've been really fortunate to be
supported by strong female leadership, both at
Disney Cruise Line and Virgin Voyages. So I never felt
the challenges of not being supported
as a woman. it was there and I think that really
moulded me to how I operate and
manage, moving up in my career.
(11:13):
I would say the only time I really felt a
challenge per se is when sometimes we're
travelling or working with partners from other parts of the world
where in their culture, they still
more patriarch than matriarch and you
really have to make the stand
and show that you are a part of
the leadership team. sometimes you'll be in meetings
(11:36):
and they'll look straight at the only man in the room. Even though
I might have higher titles, not that titles matter to
me, but you know, it's just one of those things, they're just looking right there.
So you really have to just make a stand, make your voice
heard and make sure that the things
that you're saying are valuable, that give you the credibility
that no matter what your gender is. Because we're also
(11:56):
moving into a world where genders are fluid. There are
many different colours of genders now. Right. Which is
beautiful and everyone should be supported. It really should be about
what you say, your experience and your
expertise, not your gender. But I
feel very, very, very fortunate to have
grown in a time period in companies
where it didn't really
(12:18):
feel like it was just a male
driven type of industry.
I never felt that personally. But again, moving
forward with other countries and
maybe talking with other partners, that
it's all the male leadership, that's where you really, really have
to just stick to your guns. And if you have to say
(12:38):
the same thing three times for them to get it, then you have to say three times.
But I think it's also really important, these challenges to
have a good support system. also been very fortunate
that I have very strong peers that
ah, are male, that will defer to me.
And that's really important that you make that
network so the other people see that
they're not within that kind of like
(13:01):
internal dialogue, that you are here for a
reason.
>> Laura Jane (13:04):
Definitely. I think that's such a great point. Obviously in
this industry we're working internationally
across different cultures and that definitely
brings a different aspect to the conversation
where maybe when you're travelling you're not getting the same experience
that you're necessarily having at home. Now let's
talk about leadership. Both of you are
leading IT initiatives at major cruise
(13:27):
lines. What advice would you give
to women aspiring to step into leadership
roles in tech?
>> Andrea Ortiz (13:34):
So I'm gonna allude to what I was
saying, previous. So you need to develop
both your technical and strategic thinking
skills. You have to stay
informed with emerging technology. So that's
where I go back to. That's where you have to be innately
curious. I've always been a person that
gets bored very easily and I always want
(13:56):
to challenge myself, which is a double edged sword, I will
tell you. Because you're always looking
for that next thing or that next challenge
and trying to stay with
what is happening. And in today's world,
technology changes so quickly that it
is difficult. So making sure that you have a
(14:16):
way of being able to do that, whether
it's you assign a team to research and development
and staying up on that, but you yourself,
that can inform you, but you yourself have to be able to do
that. I think understanding how
it integrates with business objectives,
I will say that I think what made me
successful in my career is having
(14:38):
that operational understanding and from.
In different businesses. Because I started in
operations, I moved into marketing when
the Internet was that thing coming up. And again, I've been
very fortunate that I have been,
at the very beginning of where things are evolving
and emerging and looking at it and saying,
(14:58):
ooh, this is the direction that I want to move in. So having
the understanding of marketing, and
then within it, there's very different verticals within
it. So one of the things I'm going to
say at the very beginning that held me back was
like, you know, I'm not a developer, I'm not technical, I'm not
technical. And like Andrea, I've had some great
(15:19):
leaders and her and I have had some of the same leaders.
And so having those great leaders
that continuously guide
you in that direction, what
held me back was me thinking, I'm not a developer, and nor did
I have any desire to be a developer. But
I did get to early in my career was a
business analyst. In the days where you sat next
(15:42):
to your developer and you guys developed it,
you tested it while they were developing and so you
learned. And so I did not realise and I had those
leaders tell me, stop saying you're not technical, you
are. Is just again, the different
variations within the technology. So
understanding each one of those verticals is going to be
important and knowing what
(16:05):
you want to move forward in which
one of those verticals do you want to be a specialist? Do you want to
be a generalist? I, think for the way that
career evolution is working now, we're now
in that area where people want generalists.
But understanding, because I've always seen
what we do in it is the
(16:25):
business are my clients. That's who we are
there to support. That's what we're there to do. The
other philosophy I've always had is it should be a
utility. When do you talk about your water and
electricity? Only when it's not working.
Other than that it should be a silent in the
background working the way it needs
(16:46):
to work. So I think it's pivotal for people
to understand how the business work,
why things are so important. Living the day in
the life of. So you can actually
feel and, and live their
challenges. Because I think that makes you more
empathetic and more understanding to
what you need to do in order to support and continue
(17:08):
to move. Also building that
relationship of. I've also seen it as
consultant. A, consultant too. So if the business is
having challenges, I always say, tell me
the what, why and when. We'll come up with the how
together. System agnostic. Because
I think people get, get very pigeonholed
(17:28):
into this is the solution. And
not necessarily so. Being able to step back and
taking the time to look at that, building
strong networks. I think we already spoke about
mentorship, I think is equally as important. I
didn't have mentors until late in my career. It
wasn't really a thing, when I was, you know, in
(17:48):
my 20s and 30s in those years.
And so I say I was fortunate enough to have
both male and female again. I go back to what
Andrea say. I think gender should be secondary. I
don't think we should call that out. I think
that people should be, again, skilled.
Learn what you need to learn, learn how to navigate
it. Because it does exist. We're not going to sit here and say that it
(18:11):
doesn't. It does stand your ground like
Andrea said. But you have to build that
credibility. And that starts with that
networking, making sure that you are
meeting the expectations that they have for you, that
you're constantly building results. And
that's how you build that and how you get there. I,
also think confidence, confidence is key.
(18:33):
So when you go into a room, I tell everyone on my
team, but specifically my females, you have a
voice at that table. I don't care if you're the only
female there. You sit at that table, you
express your views. There are no stupid
questions and there are no stupid ideas. They just may not
be ready at that particular moment in time. And
(18:53):
so you have to be confident. You have to build that within
yourself to know, you know what, hey,
everybody did not. Was not born with all this
information. They've had to be
learned. And so make sure that you lend a helping
hand as well to those that are coming up and make sure
you're there for them. And I think that's part of
that confidence that, oh, you know what? I will share whatever it is
(19:15):
I know with whomever wants to learn it and
know it and not hold that back because
your secret sauce, no one's going to take that away from
you. And sometimes I think people think that
that's a security away. Well, if I know it and not
share it, I think that does the complete
opposite. So being confident in
(19:35):
that and knowing that what you have to say, even if
it's something that someone else knows or has
experienced, you should not hold back from
asking or stating your
opinion.
>> Laura Jane (19:47):
That's such a great takeaway. Especially what you mentioned about
confidence and adaptability. I think this industry,
you know, having that innate curiosity and adaptability
is, is so important. And, Andrea, what are
your thoughts? What's helped you grow as a leader?
>> Paulette Haydo (20:01):
Yeah, and agree with everything Paulette says. But on top
of that, I want to go back to the statement she said about
going into the room and having to talk like the man. I don't
think we need to talk like a man. The reason that we're
successful is because we don't.
We, we naturally
are inclined to ask more. So some of the details,
ask more collaborative questions ask, eventually make
(20:23):
us more successful. So what I would tell,
some of my younger women that are coming in
industry and it's really relevant to me right now because I have some
really young, women on my team right now that I took straight out
of college, like, you know, very focused on technology,
but they need to work on the professional skills. Right.
So first thing I tell them is be brave, go with your
gut. You know, it, it's in your head. You just have to make
(20:46):
sure that your heart is falling. Right? So be brave, go with your
gut. If you maybe misspoke, you come back and follow
up. Right. This is how we learn. We learn by failure and by
mistakes. But the most important part of that is
overcoming it and following up and making sure
it's acknowledged and shared for the future. Right. then
the other, I think, important thing with leadership growth,
(21:06):
especially in this industry and technology, is the devil
is in the details. Sometimes we do overlook that,
and I've seen many times where
something would go into production and
that one little detail that overlook brings down the
whole, you know, implementation. We have to roll
back. And a lot of times when this happened too, I've
had younger team members of mine, female team or
(21:29):
say, oh, I kind of saw that, but I wasn't sure what to say.
Say it. Don't be afraid, just say it. You know, but it
goes with that confidence. But they can only grow
confidence by the community around them. Right. so
working on that, the kind of opposite of the devil
in the details is just remember also what the end goal
is. I've also seen where there's been implementations and
(21:49):
we over engineered the solution and then
the person who actually uses it every day, your check
in agent, your guest services on the ship, they're
like, oh, I didn't really need that. Like I really
need this. The thing that we said wasn't so
important. So that's what's really important with working with
your partners and understanding the
operations and see how that translates into
(22:12):
the code. Right. for your technology
partners. And then I think at the end of the day it's just
really, really important what we're doing right now. Share our
experiences, make yourself vulnerable. I
try to make sure that my team understands that like I
didn't get here overnight. I learned through trial and
error and just being resilient, making
sure that when we have those
(22:34):
learning lessons we actually take those opportunities to
continue to move forward and document, to
share. Because if we're not sharing, we're not caring.
That was cheesy, but it's true.
>> Laura Jane (22:46):
That's brilliant. Honestly, I think that for me
as someone that's coming up in tech and
still kind of at the beginning of my career, that
advice is so invaluable. So thank you so much for
that. I did want to touch on
the future of cruise technology.
Obviously we've mentioned the cruise industry is
constantly evolving. Technology is constantly evolving.
(23:09):
What are some of the most exciting innovations
that you guys are seeing in cruise IT at the
moment?
>> Paulette Haydo (23:15):
So I think it's innovative, also controversial.
You'll hear a lot about AI, AI and data.
>> Laura Jane (23:21):
Yeah.
>> Paulette Haydo (23:22):
And I have very strong opinions on it. It's a great
tool like any other tool, but any other tools only
as good as what's being fed to it. And I see
a lot now in the industry where
it's being sold as the end all, be all without the full
understanding that there is a lot of work
that has to be put in behind the scenes to make it work.
(23:42):
So again anything that involves
automation involves a
lot of lead time to get to that point of the automation.
So to me that's one of the
you know, big trends that are going on.
aside from that I've seen even in my
generation now I'm feeling like I'm
(24:03):
behind the times is you know the social media,
it's really, really exploded
and I feel like it's eventually
going to get to a tipping point because I have already seen now
with some of my younger team, members that ah,
they're actually like anti social media. So it's going to
be interesting to see how much more that is used
as a tool for marketing or
(24:25):
communications versus the other type of outlets
or channels that we have. So those are my two perfect.
>> Laura Jane (24:31):
And Paulette, what about you? What are you keeping
your eye on?
>> Andrea Ortiz (24:35):
I agree with Andrea. Obviously one of the m
biggest emergent technologies is AI. I think there is
a place for it. we have a few things that
are already, we are piloting. but it's not
everything and it won't solve everything.
and so I think people have to be very careful
and do their research, attend
(24:55):
webinars, join up with, you know,
the leaders in the industry that are looking at
it. But you have to really do your due diligence.
because I think that's the biggest thing that people are pushing now that
everybody is trying to get into. But you have to be
very careful and judicious on what it
is that you're going to and how you're going to implement.
(25:16):
I think another one we touched upon. So
I see that things are moving towards obviously user
centric. Everything is based on that customer
journey. Everything that we're doing has to lead
up to making it smoother and better.
for our guests, if you will,
for those end products. I think data driven
decision making is a must. There is so
(25:38):
much data and there are so many metrics out there
ensuring that you've got a really good strategy for
that. Because the decisions that you make and
the things that you're looking and your strategies that you're putting
together should be based on that. So they're
not subjective. That you can try to be as
objective as you can with what changes
and where you're actually going to
(26:01):
be spending your money. Right. So the company
and investing in what needs to be invested
in and making sure that you're looking at
the right things. I also think
having diverse because I want to say the cruise industry
in general was probably one of those first industries that was very
diverse, whether it was gender diversity
(26:21):
or just cultural diversity. Because obviously
when you look at the shipboard you've got so many different
cultures and things that you need to know
and understand how to deal with and manage.
And so I think part of that
diversity and hearing from your front end
users who are going to tell you what
(26:42):
challenges they're facing. You also have an
opportunity of being able to have a
broader audience and have them involved in
your product design and what it is so that it resonates
right with, with everyone in any, all over the
globe. Because our industry is
global.
Within what we need to do there. And I'm going
(27:02):
to say this and I know that it may have some, but I think women
are great collaborators. I think
women are great at ah, bringing people
together, working on a solution.
It's not just about self and
ego, it's really about doing the
right thing and making sure that we're introducing the
(27:22):
right solutions.
>> Laura Jane (27:23):
Yeah, definitely. I couldn't agree
more. Before we wrap up,
I have one final question. Obviously
we have touched on the importance of
networking and mentorship in both of your
career journeys for women who
don't potentially have access to that
(27:43):
formal mentorship. I know not just in
the cruise industry but in tech broadly, we
still are seeing a lot of that male dominated field.
So for those women who don't have access to those networks or
those forms, formal mentorships, how would you advise is
the best way for them to find support?
>> Paulette Haydo (28:01):
Yeah, so I know that there is, I mean
obviously the first kind of tool is
online classes. Right. There's tonnes of
different online classes if you're looking to
increase your skills, whether it's in technology
or just professional speaking.
Right. So that would be my first kind
of recommendation going back to social media.
(28:23):
I mean there's a lot of audiobooks and things
like that that someone could take on their own to listen
to. But aside from that it's, it's
trying to attend any local
woman community events. I live by
Fort Lauderdale by the beach and they have like a once a week women's beach
walk. Right. It's not specific to technology but you never know, you might
meet somebody there who's also a woman professional who you're
(28:46):
going for a walk and you have these conversations. Right.
So always kind of reach out to local communities if
you don't have like in the industry that type of
support. But I think for me until I got more
m involved it was also leaning on
toward, towards your family and friends. you know
they, they're your first support system, they're your
(29:07):
first community and making sure that they're along in the journey with
you. Be vocal about what you're trying to do. No
one, I always tell my team or even my family, I'm like,
I can't read your mind, I don't know what you're trying to do.
Let's have a conversation, let's sit and talk and make sure that
it's open dialogue because that eventually would translate
to the conversations you're going to have professionally when you
are in the industry and you're having these meetings because you
(29:30):
have to learn the give and take of A,
conversation, it's almost like negotiation, but
not officially, but it can be depending on what
project you're on. So to me, those are really the first
kind of three foundational
tools that somebody could use, if they're looking to go into
industry. I also say if you're in
university, there's could be
(29:52):
internships, so don't be shy, Try, try some
internships, try community outreach, as
well. I, know especially in the cruise industry,
there's a lot of community events around the
environment, which, is really big. A lot of beach cleanups if
you're by the beach or maybe, you know, depending on the
various ports. I know that there's a lot of different activities
that happen, within the communities as well. So I
(30:14):
think that's how you start building your network. But don't be
shy, like, just reach out, have a conversation.
For those who know me and Paula personally, they know we're not shy
and I know that doesn't come naturally to everybody. So it
only takes practise though. And you never know.
That one interaction I can think back in
my career, professionally, personally, that sometimes that one
(30:35):
interaction, that one conversation that you didn't think was really
important, pivotal is important, pivotal to somebody else. And
it can just kick off a whole
new, career path for you. You just
have to make sure that you're following up and just be
brave. That's all I can say.
>> Andrea Ortiz (30:52):
Same. I wish I would have known about
mentorship early on in my career. I think I
would have been able to, navigate it much better.
As Andrea says, you start with your family. Who in your
family can give you that guidance? I think
people should have more than one mentor.
I think people should look for
(31:12):
those things that you like in someone
that you want to learn from, because not one person is going to
have everything. if someone, the way
they speak, the way you see them, presenting
the way you see them, right. how they carry
themselves, ask them. And,
most people will be honoured that you ask that you
saw something in them that you want their help
(31:35):
with or their guidance. And when they
say yes, come prepared.
What is it that you want? What are the challenges you're facing?
What is it? Make use of that time. Because I will
say they probably won't have a whole lot of time they can
dedicate to it. But you probably need 15 or
30 minutes, you know, every two weeks or a month, depending
(31:55):
on how many you're. You're going to have and what is it that you're when
you're younger in it, you're going to need more of that
guidance. Part of it is going to be what you need to
learn in that profession. But as Andrea said, most of it is
general. Most of it is going to be that emotional
intelligence. how do you communicate, how do
you make sure you get that information? How do you show
(32:16):
up and get people to notice you?
Because I will say in today's industry, it's a
collaborative of leaders that actually see something in
someone and say that person. And they're
only going to want to dedicate and, give of their
time to someone that they see those traits in.
So as Andrea says, if you're shy
(32:36):
and you're that person that doesn't really want to
ask, you need to work on getting over
that. I think also there's
so much online that you can follow some
great leaders, out there, and women
that are in CIO roles, women that are
in CEO roles, women that have just
(32:56):
are taking on larger industries, that
are on YouTube, hear them, because most of them
do share how they came about.
you have to ask, listen, I
always tell people, I will ask anything. You have the right to
say no. You know, and if you say no,
then I, then I start right back where I, where I went.
(33:17):
But don't be discouraged by that. There may be someone
that you ask and they just don't have that time right now. You know,
they're mentoring already maybe five or six people.
And don't get discouraged by that. You know, go
to someone else. I also think there's a lot of
leadership coaching, professional leadership
coaching out there. I have benefited from
(33:37):
that. That I think, is when you're more in your career
and you can afford, depending on what your trajectory
is and where you want to move into,
because that is very, very helpful. They do
assessments. You can probably find some of those assessments free
online as well, on where and what
area you need to develop in order to move
forward and understand if you're looking
(33:59):
at that forward trajectory, understand what are those pillars?
I had a leader of mine, that told me there's
about seven to ten pillars that leaders look for.
And are you addressing all of them
and how are you going about it so that you're prepared
and you're ready when there is an opportunity, because
there's not always an opportunity. And so making
sure that you are aligned and that you're ready
(34:22):
for them and don't wait to get
promoted. Everyone always says this, you need
to be acting as in already performing
in that role that you're looking to go. So always
strive for what's the next.
>> Paulette Haydo (34:35):
But also let your leader know you want to be.
>> Andrea Ortiz (34:37):
Exactly. You need to, you know that.
>> Paulette Haydo (34:39):
You need a voice.
>> Andrea Ortiz (34:40):
People are human like you. You, they can't read your minds. As
Andrea said, if we don't know what the problem is, you can't solve
it. So just say it, no matter how small you think, or
insignificant if you think it is.
And I'm going to give you a, recommendation on a resource.
There is a book that's called what got you here won't get you there.
Absolutely fabulous. So there are again,
(35:01):
resources out there that will help you. I will tell
you, no one is going to drive your
career. You need to drive your
career and you need to be very, upfront
with and, truthful with yourself. What is
it that you want to do? Do you want to take that on?
Being a leader of people is like being a
parent. You become secondary because
(35:24):
everything that you should be doing is
to move those folks over,
get them to where they want to be, even if that means leaving
you at some point or doing those things.
It's really a selfless, act. So
understanding. Why do you want to do that?
Because it does take a lot of
involvement. It's not easy
(35:47):
by any means. It's not easy to manage
folks and help them get to where they want. So it needs to be
something that is innately, in your
nature, that that's what you want to do and be able to
share because their success is yours, is your
success. The other thing I want to mention is
what Andrea, said in, in reference to
failure. Listen, you need to be in a culture.
(36:09):
You need to adopt a culture that failure is going to
happen. It's what you do with that failure.
It's how you learn from it and how quickly
you course correct and move forward with it.
because no one is perfect. And
the biggest learnings I think I've gotten are from
those mistakes and from those things and being
(36:29):
able to look back and say, hey, this didn't
work. Why didn't it? And then again,
learning from that and avoiding and avoiding those. But
everything is a learning and teaching moment. So take those
opportunities. Don't let it get you down. We're all human
and it will, it will impact you. But you need to recover
quickly and move forward and be that person
(36:50):
that supports and say, especially for young, for
younger, people coming in, into
is just say it's okay, but just learn from
it and then keep moving forward.
>> Laura Jane (37:01):
Yeah, no, thank you so much, both
of you, with some absolutely brilliant pieces of
advice there, I think, for everyone, not just young
females coming in, but for anyone starting their career
in any industry at all.
it's been such a pleasure speaking with both of you.
I know I found it so informative as I'm speaking, still
(37:21):
in the early stages of my career, and it's been such an
honour to hear about your experiences. So thank
you so much for sharing your experiences and
insights.
That's a wrap on, this special International
Women's Day of episode of the Cruise Tech
Talk podcast. Thank you to Paulette Haydo and
(37:41):
Andrea Ortiz for joining us. If you enjoyed
this episode, be sure to subscribe, subscribe, share and
join in the conversation on LinkedIn.
Until next time, thank you so much for listening.
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