July 14, 2025 • 44 mins
Who holds the upper hand when choosing a partner? "Your Mental Highness" host Dr Janne Lomasky joins The Debate Team to break down our partnership possibilities, different dating motivations, why couples tend to break down, the challenges of borderline personality, and much, much more!
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
This is pod Popular Podcast for the People, The Great
Love Debates. It's Great Love Debate, Great Love Debate.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
It's a great love to ba.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Hi again, Everyone's Brian Howie. Welcome to The Great Love Debate,
the world's number one dating and relationship podcast since twenty
and fifteen. I'm back here in the very fine studios
of Pod Popular Podcasts for the People. I am at
the one in Boca Raton, Florida. And podcast are supposed
to be evergreen, so you're not really supposed to say
when you are recording them. I'm recording them in the summer.
(00:39):
So I'm here in a Florida summer and pretty much
everywhere you've heard guys, guys who heard me say this
on the podcast before, Summer is the most overrated thing.
There are children running around everywhere, it's hot, there's bugs.
The days are too long. Like, give me some fall,
Give me to the fall, please. Anyway. I lit into
(01:00):
Bill Simmons the day. He is one of the big
players in podcasting. He went to my college and he
was talking about it hit one. A piece of his
advice that he gives new podcasters is to have people
on the podcast that you are comfortable with that, you
have some banter with that, you know a little bit
that you've had on before, versus rolling the device with
somebody random and hoping they're a good guest. So a
(01:22):
lot of these podcasts they do alone because of that,
because I don't like to roll the dice. But today
I'm going with the sure Thing because she's been on
this podcast before. She's very, very smart. She is not
only the host of the Your Mental Highness podcast, I
believe she is your Mental Highness. She is also the
author of To Stay or Not to Stay Doctor j
(01:45):
herself Jane LAMASKI, how are you?
Speaker 2 (01:47):
I'm great, and thank you for that introduction.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
Yeah, I said you normally wear a crown, and you
didn't wear a crown, and you said, you just drove here.
And I imagine you to be like one of those
COVID people who wears masks loan in the car, that
you would wear a crown alone in the car, but
I usually do.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
I just didn't want to come in on your show
and crown it up. Although I don't crown it up.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
Crown it up. So I've heard I've heard something. I've
heard this before and for some reason it resonated with
me the other day, and I think I agree with it,
and not everyone agrees with this, So I want to
get your opinion on this, and then we're gonna get
into some other stuff. So I've heard it said that
men date who they can and marry who they want,
and women marry who they can and date who they want.
(02:34):
Does that make sense? And to phrase it differently, men,
men date, I'm going to say that again. Men date
who they can, women date who they want. Men marry
who they want, and women date who they can, which
means it flips at some point. And I believe, I
believe this is true, and I believe that sometimes that
(02:57):
the women that the men want to date, they can
date them and not necessarily turn them in the husband.
And a lot of times the ones that the guys
probably want to marry, they can't even get a date
with them.
Speaker 2 (03:08):
Well, you totally answered it. You took away my response.
Go ahead, it's wrong, because that is pretty much true.
There are men that go after women that they can't have,
and then they end up actually marrying women that they
do want.
Speaker 1 (03:28):
Right, Well, the ones they can't have they really shouldn't want.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
They don't know that, correct, Because they're not for them
in the first place. But there are men that run
after And I have to tell you because I'm a psychologist,
it's a particular type. It's usually a borderline. Men are
very attracted to borderline personality women, which.
Speaker 1 (03:48):
Is the push to craziest of the crazy. Yeah, I
did a borderline girl ones. There is no path to
fixing that.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
But you're very attracted to that because it's exciting real.
Speaker 1 (03:58):
But then you realize certain things and not to I
know this is your business, so I dont want to say,
like certain things you can medicate, you can't medicate border
You cannot medicate borderline.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
That's not gonna happen, right.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
So maybe I would give her to get And when
I realized it was borderline and somebody told that to
me and then I knew the explanation, it was the
most hopeless feeling. I'm like, this won't get better, this
won't well.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
I don't like to say it won't get better, but I.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
Would like, even narcissism can get better.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Ish I would steer away from both. I would too,
I wouldn't run up to either one of them.
Speaker 1 (04:32):
Borderline is very very specific. Can you explain what borderline
means for the lay paper opening.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Okay, So borderline personality disorder is the type of person
that it's a pervasive pattern of behaviors that is influenced
by manipulation and black and white, up and down, unstable relationships,
fears of abandonman, it's the push and pull. It's come here,
(04:57):
I love you, then pushes them away, I hate you,
get away at the same time.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
Yeah, I mean I remember her.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
I'm sure she's not listening.
Speaker 1 (05:06):
It was over ten years ago. We'd be walking down
the street and she see like some piece of random
like scrap metal or pipe on the ground, and she goes,
do you ever see something like that and just want
to bash somebody's head in? I go no, never, what
are you talking about? And she's like, okay, do you
want to eat here? Like just like it was just
a conversation about killing somebody. Yeah, yeah, I'm like, hey,
what can we go back to the pipe on the
ground and you want to kill someone? Well?
Speaker 2 (05:27):
Their favorite is you're the best, I absolutely love you.
And then if your eyes gaze away for a second,
they'll be like you son of U.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
Yeah, you can say whatever you want on the show.
I agree with you now the men they they might want,
they don't necessarily because I've heard a lot of beautiful
women say like, I can't believe that guy think I
would go out, Like we don't know that you're out
of our league? Like how do we know? Because, as
I've said on the podcast before, we do chase that
(05:55):
rom com mindset where like the idiot, bumbling Adam Sandler
guy like she gross gross gross, and then suddenly they're
in love by the end of the movie. How does
the guy know that the girl's out of the league,
you know, because if he's wealthy, nobody's out of his league.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Well, it's interesting because we're talking mainly about physicality. We're
talking about looks, but that's really not what makes relationships,
that's not what maintains relationships, and that's definitely not for
your future. Yes, it's the attraction. And let me tell you,
there are a lot of very beautiful women that are
(06:30):
with short, chubby guys or I.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
Mean, we all remember, you're old enough to remember Julie
Roberts with Lyle love It.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
How dare you? Did you just say I'm old enough
to remember?
Speaker 1 (06:39):
You're not? But you do remember? Okay, I do that's
a compliment. You're old enough to have this wisdom. Oh right,
looking back, that was bad. You're at least twenty. Do
you remember Julia Roberts and Layle love they do and
people are like, I mean he was talented and famous
and wealthy, and people are like, oh, physically they don't match.
But she saw something quirky in him, and so us
guys who are not in ass are you that cute?
(07:01):
And I'm still super cute it We were like, maybe
not the narcissist. My mother told me I was cute.
I was supposed to think that didn't true. That was
good the we're supposed to know that she doesn't like short,
chubby guys or whatever.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
Like, no, because sometimes we do, and Mile love it
did have a quirk. He was very interesting.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
So what I'm saying we cling to the sometimes we do.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
You guys focus way too much on the esthetics you're
and then you don't want girls to get the botox
or but you want them to get the boobs and
you want well.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
Yeah, and whatever it takes, we don't care. Okay, do
you think guys care if you get the botox? We
care whatever you do to feel good about yourself.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
You're paying for it.
Speaker 1 (07:46):
I don't think the guys care. If you want the boobs,
get the boobs, like I don't think, well, look.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
At how we talked about the boobs. Of course that
you don't care about the boobs. Most men, no, actually
encourage the boobs. We don't have any guys I've had
that offered me boobs, and.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
That's an insult. See, I would take it as insult
if you said I want boobs. I didn't say it, no,
but if you if you and they're like, oh, I'll
get them. If you want them, that's fine. But if
they're like you should get some moobs, I'll pay for them,
that's an insult to me as a woman. And I'm
not a woman, but I would be insulted.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
I think the guys think that it's a gift.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
It means that I don't think what you have is
good enough.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
I have really good boobs. Okay, that's a professional, nice
regular natural boobs.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
So professional and natural are the same.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Well, I thought, because I'm a professional, they're just professionals.
They are nice organic boobs. And I think the guy
that said it one of them that stands out for me.
He was a plastic surgeon, and he said to me,
you have great boobs. Eventually you're just going to need
a little lyft.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
They're in the tires, right, And so it would be
tough to date a plastic surgeon because they'd always be
looking at you like hmm. I could work with that,
you know.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
Or it could be a great thing for women to
say data plass.
Speaker 1 (09:03):
Right and it gets the free stuff. But then that's
not the most romantic thing too, that he's kind of
creating this Frankenstein monster in the way he wants. Or
it can be anything's possible. That's my point, going back
to sort of that mantra of now women though, I
you know, I think when a guy ultimately proposes, he
does so thinking this is the love of my life.
(09:24):
I am so lucky. I want to spend fifty years
with her. That's it. She may say yes for a
hundred different reasons that have nothing to do with that.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
That's fun to be a big.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
Father, which we've been dating a while. It's safe, will
make it work. It's it's so that kind of flips
that he is dating who he can, but eventually the
can is who he wants.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
The can is who he wants.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
Ultimately what he thinks he wanted and could not get
probably didn't work out, wouldn't have worked out, and so
men do kind of find their level on that. I
think it goes the other way if you're the I
think the professional term is hot chick. If you're a
hot chick, you know a lot of times you're like no, no, no,
no no, and then the game of musical chairs kind
(10:10):
of leaves you with a limited amount of seats and
then you're like, Okay, that guy's fine, but it's not
the most not necessarily the love of your life. A
lot of times the woman is still in love with
her college boyfriend that didn't quite work out with because
he was too immature and he was a jerk, and
they're like, this guy is a safe landing place. And
so I do think it kind of flips like that.
Speaker 2 (10:29):
I have to tell you something that is going to
surprise the shit out of you. There are more hot chicks,
as you said.
Speaker 1 (10:38):
The technical term, right, that's the medical term.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
So yeah, that's in my book, my diet, in my
diagnostic manual. But there are more hot chicks that actually
do not get hit on than you would ever imagine. Oh, No,
there's more hot chicks that don't get the guy. And
if you even had hot chicks that have said a
(11:01):
guy has said to a hot chick, M, you're not
marriage material. What about that?
Speaker 1 (11:10):
A little bit that can be that could be the
male insecurity where it's like, you're not marriage material because
I don't trust I could ever keep a woman like you,
like on some level, that's probably flailing, you know. I
as of the recording of this podcast, again, it's not
that evergreen. Jeff Bezos just married Lauren Sanchez. She's journalist
from I know Lauren a little bit from back in
the day. She has been married to three increasingly wealthy
(11:34):
and increasingly successful men. She has worked her way up
the ladder to the richest man in the world and
did so. She's not thirty five, and she has kids
and several divorces and whatever and whatever her skill set
was and whatever. And like I said, I know her
a little bit. She's fine, she's nice, she's smart, she's beautiful,
(11:56):
but she does know how to get what she wants.
Speaker 2 (11:59):
So I'm gonna tell you what Trump's looks and aesthetics
and everything. And that's probably why you have me on
your show. It is psychology. It is what people are
giving off. I have women and men that, let's say,
are very unattractive, but they have this vibe and this
self esteem that I sometimes sit in my office with
(12:19):
my mouth open and they think they are the bomb
dot com. So what do you think of that?
Speaker 1 (12:26):
I think, yeah, I mean the confidence goes a long
long way. You know, Madonna for years convinced the world
that she was like the hottest.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
Thing, and a lot of the world believes.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
Right. We believed her, Yeah, because she thought she was that.
We're like, oh, I guess she is. But if you
saw Madonna, you know, at Whole Foods and she wasn't Madonna,
you wouldn't look twice at her ever.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
But it all comes from what you're giving off, what's
in your mind. You lure people in, not with your
looks maybe for a second, but mainly it's the vibe.
It's what you're giving off and what you think about, right.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
And the challenge for men is they do not get
an opportunity to showcase their vibe. The women instantly are like,
whether it's online or off, the guy can't get the audition,
the job interview.
Speaker 2 (13:12):
As I always say, depends on the mom they had.
Speaker 1 (13:15):
What does that mean?
Speaker 2 (13:16):
Mom plays a big influence in that and dad. Actually,
it depends on what they impressed upon that boy. Are
you good enough? Are you handsome enough? Are you capable?
Are you worthy?
Speaker 1 (13:29):
My mom used to tell me that I was very
good looking because I looked just like her. As I
aged and I started to look a little more like
my dad, she came off with that. I'm like, wait,
but you were attracted to dad. She's like, no, I
wanted you to look like me. There you go.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
So mixed messages are mixed messages help with self esteem
and self confidence exactly.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
I want to get into actual couples. I'm going to
flip this a little bit, but we have to pay
for botox and things around here. I'm here with doctor Ja.
We had to take a quick break. We will be
back right after this, and we are back now. You
work with a lot of couples.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
I do do you know.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
From like session one from the I don't know the
forms they fill out? Do you? How is it? How
do you maintain sort of neutrality at it? How do
you maintain like, oh my god, she's such a pain
the ass He shouldn't be with her.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
Well, when I started out, this is a really funny story.
When it's not so funny, but now it's funny. When
I started out and I saw couples in conflict, even
from session one, I would sit in the middle of
them on the couch. Oh and what I didn't anticipate,
And this happened twice, so I said, I'm not going
to do the three times I got a tissue box
(14:45):
thrown to my head oh by one.
Speaker 1 (14:48):
Because I was sitting there.
Speaker 2 (14:49):
I leaned back and they were talking over me, and
for a split second, I just leaned in to listen,
and that's when he threw the tissue box. And he
threw it and it was a full hisssue box. It
kind of did did have sharp corners.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
Can you read body language if it's just them on
the couch and they're both leaning towards the opposite side.
Speaker 2 (15:09):
Absolutely what I love to see. When I know it's
going to be problematic, couples will stack the pillows that
I have on the couch.
Speaker 1 (15:17):
I did that. I went to a couple's counting once
I did that, and I'm like, can we build a
fortress around this? And that was with the borderline girl.
So the fortress was never going to be high enough.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
No, definitely not. And they look to where they're going
to sit. They definitely look to where they're going to sit.
I have this couple that starts actually apart from one another,
and then when I see that he's getting upset and
he really has a temper that can really blow, she
moves in closer and goes to grab his hand to
(15:47):
calm him down.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Do you or it's not your place. Do you encourage
them to hug before and after? Or you can't do that,
you can't force sit weird? Yeah you think it's weird. Yeah,
the middle hug is so calm. It is.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
And I know you like hugs because you tell me
that from the first time, and you're right, it is.
But I want it to come organically for them, So
I'll say things like do you feel ready to show
some sort of intimacy or affection towards your partner, and
then I let them figure out what they want to do,
and they usually do. Someone will grab someone's hand.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
Or but if you're how do you stay? I was
last time you were on the podcast, and I remember
you told me that you were empathetic and I was like,
how can somebody who does that be empathetic or you
would just be exhausted at the end of the day
with all their feelings.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
I am exhausted, I told you.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
I know, And that was your answer, Like, I am
a question answer how do you stay neutral when there's
got to be a part of it you being like
they shouldn't work out. I don't she's terrible or he's
a jerk or whatever, like you kind of got to
know right away, Like, but you can't influence the jury,
so to speak.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
Yeah, what do you do? Well, that's the challenge. That
is a huge challenge. You're absolutely right. What I do
is I always give it back to them. I'll say
something like, so, if you're this type of person and
these are your needs and this is something that it's
a deal breaker for you. And then I look at
him and I said, and if you're now this type
of person, you've grown into this in your needs, how
(17:09):
is this gonna work?
Speaker 1 (17:10):
You?
Speaker 2 (17:11):
Guys? Tell me? So I put it on them without
having to say, this doesn't work.
Speaker 1 (17:15):
A lot of times, I imagine you're dealing with infidelity,
not you would anticipate.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
Actually, no, it's actually not it's communication.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
Well, a lot of times bad communication leads to infidelity.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
It's yeah, it's many of them that I work with now.
It's just it's not being heard, it's not getting enough affection,
it's not getting enough attention, it's not feeling loved. Those
are the big ones.
Speaker 1 (17:42):
Yeah, again, what she ends up because I'm seeking that
somewhere else. You know, I've said before that a woman
doesn't need to be right, but she does need to
be heard. And I learned that probably way too late
in life, and I probably am still learning that now
that you know, your instinct as a man is sometimes
to absolve yourself of any blame and she might just
(18:04):
be venting, ranting or whatever just to get it out,
and you get so defensive as a man, or at
least Brian Christopher Howie, that you're always trying to be
like no like, to either downplay whatever her concern is
or diffuse it somehow by and to her in that moment,
at that second, it is the most important thing. And
she has got to say that, and you have got
(18:25):
to stand there as a man and not just take it,
but be present for it and try and understand that.
That's hard to learn until you get into a room
with you, because a lot of the damage has already
been done and it's not an overnight change, And all
she's going to think about is the one hundred and
five times he didn't listen and wasn't heard. So how
are you able to say, like, oh, I can work
(18:47):
with these two and get them to a place, or
are you trying to I don't know what's the best
thing I do.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
I work with them to try to improve whatever I
possibly can with them. I tell them they have to
do the work as well. I think. I think what
it's about is that men and women are still wired differently.
We don't want to be wired the same way. We
have different hormones, we have different societal expectations, we have
(19:13):
different nurturing and nourishment that we receive, so of course
we're going to be different. We try to make the
other person be like us, and that's not gonna work.
It's understanding, respecting and complimenting one another and being able
to understand that, oh you're different. You're practical. You don't
want a five page text, you just want a sentence,
(19:35):
and I love you for it. But it doesn't always stay.
The knee jerk is oh my god, and then we
stop communicating.
Speaker 1 (19:42):
Yeah, oh, I say you two hundred words and you
just sent me back thumbs up or okay. And sometimes
the person's busy and sometimes the other person has to
interpret things and get back to it later or whatever.
But getting that rhythm down of what breaks up a
lot of couples early who should have probably stayed together.
And then later on a relationship when somebody's like, you
know what I need, you know what I like? You
(20:04):
know that this is kind of the way I want
to communicate, and you're just either not cognizant or you
don't care enough.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
And then here's something interesting. I've been accused of being like,
you're like a guy quote unquote because I would respond okay,
thumbs up.
Speaker 1 (20:18):
Yeah, it's the worst again for somebody like me who's
super needy.
Speaker 2 (20:25):
Right, so you would be like the girl. Yeah, you
would be more like the girl, and I would be
like the guys. So there are people that are like that,
but we still have to appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
And I've changed. You know, you're obviously you know the
stuff here. This is your job, the attachment styles. Uh huh, right,
So I was the what was avoidant and now.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
I've become anxious avoidant?
Speaker 1 (20:46):
What is that one?
Speaker 2 (20:48):
Yeah, I think you're anxious.
Speaker 1 (20:49):
What is it now? What is the opposite? Where you were.
Speaker 2 (20:52):
You just dependent?
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Yeah? Yeah, right, that flipped as I got older.
Speaker 2 (20:57):
I think you think you're more dependent than you are.
Speaker 1 (21:00):
Oh, I'm very like, what is to define dependent?
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Like constantly needing to talk with someone to have their approval?
Speaker 1 (21:08):
Yes, I like not everybody, but I like the one.
I want to keep the ping pong paul going back
and forth forever and from the time I wake up
to the time whoever it is that is the one.
She needs to know that she's the one, and I
kind of want to know that back whereas before it
was probably like I'm scared to I don't want the
(21:29):
pressure of being the one, right, and that there wasn't
like an incident that changed that. I don't think. I
just think you got to a point where I'm like,
it's not working the other way.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
It's maturity. It is, Yes, it's.
Speaker 1 (21:42):
Because well, I don't know, but men don't necessarily change
to that. Men sometimes get worse to that because they
become more entrenched because they've been hurt more. I think
it was like this a way of being avoidant of
any true you know, emotion or attachment in a relationship,
meaning I could get out the door in a minute
when when the borderline cropped up, I think that probably
(22:05):
prevented me from obviously being in healthier relationship. But it
probably was just like it must have been incredibly frustrating.
It must be incredibly frustrating to date somebody like that.
Speaker 2 (22:13):
Well, but as women and men go through thirties, forties, fifties,
then it does change, even for those money.
Speaker 1 (22:21):
Because the men grow up.
Speaker 2 (22:22):
He No, it's not that it's no one really wants
to be alone, and they see it more as they
no doubt. So that's why I'm saying that men will
tend to want to stay and be more dependent right,
and want the woman versus you know.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
It really isn't just he needs somebody to take care
of him or the traditional women all. He really does
want the partnership that she always wants, the thing that
the women always sort of want. It is me and
you and the partner in crime. I think eventually, over
forty forty five you get into that and maybe you
lost that in the marriage that you had once the
kids came around or whatever the reason is. I think
(23:00):
the men really do realize how special having that one
person is. Well, absolutely, and it's the most special thing
you you So right now again, I'm not gonna we're
not gonna tell the date we're recording this, and you're
not gonna say you walked in here and like, oh,
I have this couple coming in and I'm would you
say dreading it?
Speaker 2 (23:16):
Well, I didn't say dreading, But I know that it's
going to be so conflictual. I know, you know, sometimes
I see like ugly stuff, meaning they just treat each
other so poorly, like such crap, and they have children together.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
How do you know that though? Are they doing it
in the session?
Speaker 2 (23:32):
Yes, they're doing it in the session, And of course
I will intervene and I will say, let's be, you know,
treat each other mutual respects. I give the guidelines, I
give the rules. But do people listen when you're in
the heat of it and your emotion's taking over. Oh
heck no. They just let it all out. And this
is about they're going to be divorcing, and this is
about money. So money and sex bring out ugly, angry stuff.
Speaker 1 (23:57):
Why are they talking about money? With you.
Speaker 2 (24:01):
Because they've been talking about it with their lawyers and
it hasn't worked, and they're spending a lot more in
there with their lawyers, and they were hoping that they
can just mediate something real quick with me.
Speaker 1 (24:11):
A voice of reason. Yes, right, exactly, And what is
the sex part.
Speaker 2 (24:15):
The sex part is that he wanted it. She never did,
or when she did, he felt that. It wasn't with affection,
it wasn't with intimacy. It was like, I'm right, I'm
doing you a favor, I'm throwing you a bone. And
it really came down to what I discovered is she
did not really have chemistry for him. A lot of
times women will not admit, like you said, so.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
She can right and hope it kicks in her changes
or who cares, I'll be as kind.
Speaker 2 (24:41):
Of like you know, maybe women more so marry initially
if they're not marrying the ones that they're hot for
or desiring, they rationalize and say, he'll be a good father,
he's got he has a good job. You know, he's
a good man, and then they.
Speaker 1 (25:01):
Hot guy's got a lot of choices.
Speaker 2 (25:03):
Hot guys got a lot of choices, but they're not
always the ones that the hot women want, either if
they're arrogant or.
Speaker 1 (25:10):
Are fighting over merr time.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:13):
Well, the the problem though a lot of these women,
the sweet spot of the guys that the women want
are like between thirty seven and forty five. Those are
the sweet spuffer those men. If they're at all good
looking in there, I'd all have a job. Those guys'
choices is like twenty one to fifty as they have
a giant pool, and so they might not necessarily want
(25:35):
to date some woman who's thirty five or settle down
or like I waited my whole life to get to
this point where the girls I can date who I
want or whatever. It's tough to settle down. And so
the woman who's thirty eight, she's like, I don't want
to go older because I'm not attracted to the older guy,
and so she's in no man's land, waiting, waiting, winning.
Then she's forty three and she should have gone older.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
What's been happening lately is I've had women that are
in their late thirties and they want older guys.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
They really should want older guys. Oh well that's because
I mean again, a huge percentage of this audience is
thirty seven ish's. That's the ones who come to my
live shows. It is what it is, and they get
really mad when I say this, and it's true, and
don't blame the messengers. Doesn't because it doesn't mean it's
not true. If he's forty and you're thirty seven, if
(26:28):
he wants three kids, you're probably too old. And if
he doesn't want three kids, you're probably too young because
you still possibly could have them. So you're kind of
in no man's land, depending on what kind of math
he's doing in his head, because men really are more
realistic on that, and the women tend to chase the outlier, like, oh,
Janet Jackson had a kid at forty eight, Like, realistically,
(26:50):
a guy, if you're thirty seven and you want and
you want a big family, you kind of got to
look at the odds on that if that's something that
he wants, or if he's just like, I already have
two kids by my first wife and I don't want
I don't want any more kids. You're too young. You
can still have a kid, so the men do. The
men are more rational on this stuff than the women.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
Then are less apt to want more kids if they
have kids, already. Women are more apt to have more
kids if they already have kids.
Speaker 1 (27:16):
No, I don't know about that. No, it's true, is it?
Because a lot of women are like, oh my god,
I cannot do this all over again. But then there's
women are like, I missed the smell of babies. Like
there's a lot of different.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
More women that miss the smell of babies. And if
she's got a new husband. I've had four friends, yeah,
when we were all at the same time divorcing. All
four of those girls remarried and all four of them
had like two or three more children.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
Yeah. I mean it's tough. You're mixing the kids, you're
dealing with ex'es, you're doing a lot of stuff.
Speaker 2 (27:42):
But it's more the norm now.
Speaker 1 (27:44):
It is. I'm just going to that age. You know,
if you're in your late thirties and you think a
guy who's you know, fifty two, is like, ew, you're
gonna end up with that guy when you're forty four. Yeah,
it's like Lori Lori Gottlieb, you know, Lori Gottlieb is
good friend of the podcast here. She wrote marry Him
the case for mister right Now, and she was one
(28:06):
of those women who waited, waited, waited, waited, and then
she's like, I turned down ten guys who would have
been great husband. She didn't want the who she can.
She wanted to marry who she wanted and it just
never happened. Yeah, and so she advises women, if like,
you want ten things on this checklist and you can
get seven of them, sign on for that.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
But here, lie is the problem. Many of us do
not know, do not have the guidance. Many of us
don't know that. So she knew that, but my parents
she didn't know that too late.
Speaker 1 (28:37):
So she wrote it in her forties, looking back on
the choices she's made in the thirties because she did
the same experiment. She asked, guys, give me ten things
you want in a woman, and she goes, if I
can give you five of them? And men are like yes,
because men are used to baseball, where like three hundred
ten is successful. The women are like, I want all ten,
and they wait and wait and wait and wait, and
(28:57):
then they get to the marry who they can, and
then the relationship is in everything that possibly could have been.
You know, I don't know. It's hard to you know,
women do they don't necessarily marry for looks, but they
do date for looks. They do.
Speaker 2 (29:14):
I think, both do.
Speaker 1 (29:15):
I think, but men already get that put on their stamp.
Women assume men do, and they probably do. The men
are visual creatures because we don't understand anything beyond that,
because we're very confused. But this idea that the women
are like this very deep thinking pool of people who
look beyond that, at least early on and at least online,
it's bullshit. The women are just as bad.
Speaker 2 (29:34):
But there are more men than I ever realized that
now in their forties. Men from forties on they say
it's it has to be my intellect.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
They have no doubt because we baited all the I
believe that we agreed on. The term was hot chicks.
I was in Los Angeles for a long time, so
there's no shortage of hot chicks, and there's no shortage
of chicks who want to make a living pretending to
be something else. Try dating that.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
So what I say is to make your list. This
is what's important when we realize what it is. So
we get distracted more so by the looks by the
hot chick, by the hot guy. But it's your list.
That's why people are not fulfilled. That's why even if
they get the hot chick or the hot guy, they're
still getting divorced.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
They're still getting divorced.
Speaker 2 (30:23):
So it's because they didn't have their checklist of what
they really want. And as we grow, we realize what
we want more, what values, what characteristics, what similarities. People
think like, oh, we're different, it's great. It's not great.
As you age, you don't want to have conflict and
struggle because you're apt to grow apart you.
Speaker 1 (30:43):
Yeah, you start out wanting to date. You know, the
two D two dimensional image, and then it gets into
three D and then the four D is when you
really have something special because you are going to age
and people get sick, and people gain weight, and people
get stressed. And if you love them and you have
that core, you see them is the most beautiful person
in the world, no matter what, men and women. That's
(31:03):
the goal.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
That's true. What I think, what's come to me more
so than anything, And people don't realize this. This is
so important that attachment styles we talk about we know
ourselves at this point in our lives. If you're past
thirty five, you know you know yourself. But what we
don't realize And someone said it to me and I
(31:25):
was totally floored and pissed off. I was like, how
dare you? And this person said to me, you're not available?
And I said, of course I'm available and they said, no, no, no,
you're not available me. Are we one hundred percent available?
Which means we know what we want and we think
we're doing all right? But are we Are we really
(31:46):
giving it our all? Are we really balancing our work
life and our social life? Are we really investing as
much time to get the girl or get the guy
as we do, let's say, with work in an area
where we're successful.
Speaker 1 (32:00):
And I think it just takes a while. You know,
a lot of you, a lot of yours.
Speaker 2 (32:04):
Yes or no.
Speaker 1 (32:05):
I think we need to do the work and we're
not doing.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
The work right, that's the answer.
Speaker 1 (32:12):
We don't know a lot of you guys listening are
in your twenties. Don't get married in your twenties. You
don't know who you are at twenty eight. You're supposed
to do You're supposed to know who they are, like seriously,
like it is it is a process, and you know
maybe and again you don't want to wait too long.
But guys don't grow up really until their forties, right,
(32:35):
It does take a while and a lot of time.
The women kind of find themselves in their thirties, but
the thirties they are buried in a lot of hormones.
And I mean, yeah, because then it's like I need
to have kids and I need to do this. I
would say the best women I know traditionally are their
forties because they've come out of that. They've come out
of that fog of crazy twenties, maternal thirties and all
(32:59):
that kind of stuff, and they really have sort of Okay,
this is my time and they know that, and a
little bit same for the men. The men are like, Okay,
I know what I'm doing for a career, I know
what I like. I hopefully doing the work, hopefully listening
a little. It's the ones who got married at twenty
three and then suddenly get divorced at forty five. They
go back to being twenty three, Yes, because they feel
(33:22):
like they have to make up for lost time.
Speaker 2 (33:24):
Yes, that is very, very true. But you know it's interesting,
and I said this before. People don't realize that having
similarities in life and having similarities in your wants and
desires is going to be so important to lasting relationships.
For instance, if your man likes porn and you don't,
(33:45):
that's going to become a problem. And I've seen it
over and over and over. Meet a girl who likes
to watch porn.
Speaker 1 (33:51):
Why why isn't the girl the porn? Oh why does
he need Why? If you have the girl, why do
you need por? Maybe I'm the weak guse.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
Some people like it. I'm just saying some people like it.
It doesn't matter. They don't see that, they see it
as different. It's a whole psychological that's a different episode
or like, right, but how do you bring that up
on the first date? Well you must, you have to
start talking about what you want, maybe not the.
Speaker 1 (34:13):
Firstl the dumplings, and how do you feel about porn?
Speaker 2 (34:19):
Well, yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (34:22):
Lay that out there.
Speaker 2 (34:23):
And I just brought up porn because that is something
that I hear people argue with and like have an
issue with. Now. Of course, if it's an addiction, that's
a different thing.
Speaker 1 (34:30):
I believe that the guys like the porn. I can't
speak for the women the porn and the video games
because they feel a sense of control. And I get
what I want out of this, and they're not getting
out of relationship. I really don't think if he is
happy with his wife, he needs the porn. But maybe
I'm wrong.
Speaker 2 (34:44):
I mean a lot of people that would disagree with
I agree.
Speaker 1 (34:47):
With you, and again I this great love to be
but I might be wrong because I don't need the porn.
Speaker 2 (34:51):
Well, it's just part of someone's sexual desires.
Speaker 1 (34:53):
Why would I want to watch other people do and stuff?
Speaker 2 (34:56):
Because for some that's exciting.
Speaker 1 (34:58):
Yeah, make your own porn. I don't.
Speaker 2 (35:00):
I mean, I agree with you, but I'm just telling
you how it is.
Speaker 1 (35:03):
It's I get it.
Speaker 2 (35:04):
And this is a problem that I.
Speaker 1 (35:05):
Hear from people watch porn that has nothing to do
with what anything they want is just to completely altern
everybody outy it's an escape, but.
Speaker 2 (35:13):
Another one it's porn. It's travel. If your spouse that
you're going to marry doesn't like to travel and you
love to travel and you're into travel, you're going to
have a problem. People have actually just grue because of that.
Speaker 1 (35:24):
But I think early on, I think a lot of
people like to travel because they don't have a reason
to stay home. And so sometimes early on they're like,
what do he love to do. Oh my god, I
love to travel. You might not want to travel so
much if home was awesome.
Speaker 2 (35:39):
But let's say these weren't extreme cases. Let's say this
is not a psychological issue.
Speaker 1 (35:43):
You're an adventurous and curious and you want to go
to the Far East. You need to work that out.
A lot of women and a lot of men are like,
if you don't have global entry, I'm I'm not dating you.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
Well that's extreme. See.
Speaker 1 (35:54):
Well, I think it's like, maybe the person doesn't know
that he likes to travel or she likes to travel.
Maybe you haven't had those experience.
Speaker 2 (35:59):
Well, I think that anything in excess excessive, whether there's
porn or whether it's traveler, whether it's shopping, or whether
it's eating meat. Okay, these are the things people argue about. Yeah,
I know, no, you know, I'm a vegan. Let's just
I'm not a vegan. But I'm saying people say I'm
a vegan, and then you have steak and they're like,
I can't bear to see you these.
Speaker 1 (36:18):
Well there's levels of vegan like I can't stand the
look and smell of it. But and then vegan vegans
just there's nothing I want to bite of so it's
not fun. We can't share anything then for instance, that's rough,
But I don't think it's a deal breaker.
Speaker 2 (36:30):
Okay, So if you fall in love with someone else's
for someone's qualities and looks, but they're a vegan, do
you think that's going to be a lasting relationship.
Speaker 1 (36:39):
I think that there could be a health concern that
leads you to have to change your diet ratically good
or bad, and you got to roll with that.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
I've seen that too.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
That happens too, where it's like she was a vegan
and she doesn't get enough protein and then suddenly she's
eating ribs. Like people change, and I think you have
to roll with some of this and you have to
think of what you what you do or don't like.
The longtime producer of this podcast, the two time Emmy
Award winning Kko. She is the very best person in
the world I've ever met at presenting things in a
(37:07):
way of you think you don't like it, you don't know.
And so I love going to Asia. I've been I
don't know a million times because she challenged me one time,
She's like, what are you afraid to fly? Like, why
wouldn't you go like it's amazing. I'm like, I like
to go to Europe. I don't need to go to Seoul.
You like things like that and just presenting things in
(37:27):
a way that are not what is wrong with you? You
don't like it. It's like try it once, try the soy,
try this.
Speaker 2 (37:34):
Yeah, so you need to two people both need to
be like that, open minded that are willing to be
flexible and I'm not rigid.
Speaker 1 (37:41):
He's like, oh, I don't want, you know, to give
the borderline girl credit to put a little bookend on this.
She was crazy. But I used to be religiously watch
New York Giants football every Sunday. I had missed a
game in like twenty six years, like ever. And she goes,
one time, will you skip a game? And I'm like, why,
I like to do it. She's like, there's so many things.
(38:03):
Or I lived in Santa Barbara. It was a sunny Sunday.
She goes, you're just wasting your time in a sports bar.
I'm your girlfriend. Can we do something? And she goes,
one weekend, let me plan something and if you don't
like it, I'll watch football with you. And we went
to some winery and I'm like oh my god, this
was awesome. And she presented in a way that was like,
try it one time and if you like it, then
(38:23):
it's fine. But it wasn't. It didn't turn into an argument.
She knew how to sort of positively coax me out
of my little hole. And so sometimes that's the way
you present it to your partner. Is a lot of
times they think they don't want it, they think they
don't like it, they think they can't do it. And
if it's sort of positively reinforced, of course, like take
my hand, I'm with you and we're going to go
into this end of the pool. I think there's possibilities
(38:45):
before they get to your office. And I don't want
to put you out of business.
Speaker 2 (38:48):
But you'll never put me out of business. But I
think that has to do with first, just hear me out. Yes,
I agree with first. I think people are more apt
to be open and to try something. Now, can we
just talk about people that are set in their ways.
More people are setting their ways than we give credit
to or then.
Speaker 1 (39:08):
They I hear that in South Florida a lot that
the men are the most setting their ways.
Speaker 2 (39:12):
Pool and women are as well.
Speaker 1 (39:14):
I think they're setting what they know.
Speaker 2 (39:16):
They're setting, well, they know a lot. If this is
second time around, they've probably.
Speaker 1 (39:21):
Dated, but they probably second time around they probably dated
what they thought. I still think there's always a path,
there's always a roadmap. That everybody isn't setting their ways.
I just think maybe that's crazy.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
You're saying you're not setting your ways coming from.
Speaker 1 (39:33):
Someone setting my ways and then suddenly a light but
the right person at the right time and the right
way sets something to me and I have been on
the other end of that. I'm like, I know you
think you're setting their ways. Can we just a lot
of times you're banging your head against the wall, and
they really are setting their ways. I don't think people
are setting their ways as they want to believe. People
want to believe they're seting their ways because they're scared
I get outside their comfort zone.
Speaker 2 (39:54):
That I'm going to tell you that more people than
not are getting divorced because of this dissimilarities.
Speaker 1 (40:01):
Yeah, they're like, I'll find somebody who wants to watch
porn with me, and you're saying they should ask that early.
Speaker 2 (40:06):
Well, yeah, and it doesn't have to be porn, but
things that are kind of you're made up of. If
somebody just said to me, from now on the next
this guy who's getting divorced, Actually, then I'm going to
see the next person that I'm going to marry. She
has to like really enjoy banter. She has to get
my sarcasms. Won't be some well, a lot of women
(40:27):
don't want that.
Speaker 1 (40:29):
I thought, with very strong accents, and I would be
afraid that. I'm like, she's never gonna get my jokes.
What do you mean accents not Boston accents, like they're
from the Eastern Europe or Latin America, And I'm like,
I think that the language barrier on the joke would
be different.
Speaker 2 (40:44):
I definitely agree. So the accents would be a problem,
But it's it's about he wants banter. He wants someone
who's likes to do exercise or is an active person
like events. So what I'm saying like, if you're not
with the same more similar type person and you're going
to go for a jog in the morning, and your
other person's.
Speaker 1 (41:03):
Going to be like, oh my god, I love live music.
But maybe if everything's better at home, you don't need life,
you don't need this.
Speaker 2 (41:08):
To make So if someone is going to say to me,
I take a run every day on the beach, and
I'm not a runner on the beach, and it's going
to like change up our lifestyle. Or a guy I
dated for years and he was a golfer, he was
an avid golfer. I did not play golf ever except
for like.
Speaker 1 (41:21):
Just see that tells me early on just five hours
a day you're spending without me exactly. Yeah, But so
you're saying that you don't believe people grow apart. You're
saying that they weren't that close to begin with and
they just didn't recognize it.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
That's absolutely right, very good.
Speaker 1 (41:35):
You can use that. I'm a frash here you go. Wow,
all right, tell everybody where they can find you.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
Oh, you can find me at doctor Jane Lamaski dot com.
You can find me at doctor j Loomaski at gmail
dot com. I'm in book ratone. You can call my
office if you'd like to talk with me, get an appointment,
get more information. Five six one seven seven seven twenty one.
That's my office number. You can text it as well.
Speaker 1 (41:59):
Wow, you just gave it a fun number. Good for you,
But I did.
Speaker 2 (42:01):
Because my office number. Okay, yeah, even though everyone has
my cell phone number. Anyway. I know you guys have
my cell phone number because you call me all the time.
But that's okay, try call the office instead. And I'm
on social media.
Speaker 1 (42:11):
We call you because we like your podcast.
Speaker 2 (42:13):
So what is your Oh, and my podcast your mental Highness.
And I have a new website, your Mental Highness dot com,
so you can see all of my shows on that
as well. And of course Spotify and YouTube and Apple
Podcasts and Amazon.
Speaker 1 (42:29):
I'm on all do you have your Mental Highness at Gmail?
Speaker 2 (42:32):
I have your Mental Highness at gmail dot com.
Speaker 1 (42:34):
You should yeah, yes, so you put all your shows
on YouTube?
Speaker 2 (42:37):
Huh no, because you told me not to?
Speaker 1 (42:39):
Yeah, tell me you tell me a great, great love
audience out there. I know you guys are always like,
we want video and we want I probably should do
some more. When I started podcasting back in the days,
and especially in Los Angeles, the appeal for women, especially
famous women that I had a lot of them on
back in the day was no cameras right, No cameras right.
(43:02):
They loved that. Now the world is camera.
Speaker 2 (43:04):
You, so they want video.
Speaker 1 (43:07):
Want video? Okay. So and again, if you want to
find doctor j if you're driving on ninety five on
the East Coast and you see a blonde wearing a
crown in her car, It's a.
Speaker 2 (43:17):
Good chance that would be me, that would be her.
Speaker 1 (43:20):
Thank you, you were awesome. Yeah. As far as us like, share, follow,
please review this podcast and your mental highness. After five
hundred and something shows of this show, your reviews still
meet a lot in the podcasting ecosystem. Shoot us an
email Great Love Debate at gmail dot com. I've got questions, thoughts, comments,
or you want us to pass on some information to
doctor J. Because, as always at the Great Love Debate,
(43:45):
we never stop making love. See you next time the
Great Love Debate. It's the Great Love Debate, the Great
Love Debate. It's a great love to be
This is pod Popular Podcast for the People, The Great
Love Debates. It's Great Love Debate, Great Love Debate.
Speaker 2 (00:16):
It's a great love to ba.
Speaker 1 (00:18):
Hi again, Everyone's Brian Howie. Welcome to The Great Love Debate,
the world's number one dating and relationship podcast since twenty
and fifteen. I'm back here in the very fine studios
of Pod Popular Podcasts for the People. I am at
the one in Boca Raton, Florida. And podcast are supposed
to be evergreen, so you're not really supposed to say
when you are recording them. I'm recording them in the summer.
(00:39):
So I'm here in a Florida summer and pretty much
everywhere you've heard guys, guys who heard me say this
on the podcast before, Summer is the most overrated thing.
There are children running around everywhere, it's hot, there's bugs.
The days are too long. Like, give me some fall,
Give me to the fall, please. Anyway. I lit into
(01:00):
Bill Simmons the day. He is one of the big
players in podcasting. He went to my college and he
was talking about it hit one. A piece of his
advice that he gives new podcasters is to have people
on the podcast that you are comfortable with that, you
have some banter with that, you know a little bit
that you've had on before, versus rolling the device with
somebody random and hoping they're a good guest. So a
(01:22):
lot of these podcasts they do alone because of that,
because I don't like to roll the dice. But today
I'm going with the sure Thing because she's been on
this podcast before. She's very, very smart. She is not
only the host of the Your Mental Highness podcast, I
believe she is your Mental Highness. She is also the
author of To Stay or Not to Stay Doctor j
(01:45):
herself Jane LAMASKI, how are you?
Speaker 2 (01:47):
I'm great, and thank you for that introduction.
Speaker 1 (01:50):
Yeah, I said you normally wear a crown, and you
didn't wear a crown, and you said, you just drove here.
And I imagine you to be like one of those
COVID people who wears masks loan in the car, that
you would wear a crown alone in the car, but
I usually do.
Speaker 2 (02:03):
I just didn't want to come in on your show
and crown it up. Although I don't crown it up.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
Crown it up. So I've heard I've heard something. I've
heard this before and for some reason it resonated with
me the other day, and I think I agree with it,
and not everyone agrees with this, So I want to
get your opinion on this, and then we're gonna get
into some other stuff. So I've heard it said that
men date who they can and marry who they want,
and women marry who they can and date who they want.
(02:34):
Does that make sense? And to phrase it differently, men,
men date, I'm going to say that again. Men date
who they can, women date who they want. Men marry
who they want, and women date who they can, which
means it flips at some point. And I believe, I
believe this is true, and I believe that sometimes that
(02:57):
the women that the men want to date, they can
date them and not necessarily turn them in the husband.
And a lot of times the ones that the guys
probably want to marry, they can't even get a date
with them.
Speaker 2 (03:08):
Well, you totally answered it. You took away my response.
Go ahead, it's wrong, because that is pretty much true.
There are men that go after women that they can't have,
and then they end up actually marrying women that they
do want.
Speaker 1 (03:28):
Right, Well, the ones they can't have they really shouldn't want.
Speaker 2 (03:32):
They don't know that, correct, Because they're not for them
in the first place. But there are men that run
after And I have to tell you because I'm a psychologist,
it's a particular type. It's usually a borderline. Men are
very attracted to borderline personality women, which.
Speaker 1 (03:48):
Is the push to craziest of the crazy. Yeah, I
did a borderline girl ones. There is no path to
fixing that.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
But you're very attracted to that because it's exciting real.
Speaker 1 (03:58):
But then you realize certain things and not to I
know this is your business, so I dont want to say,
like certain things you can medicate, you can't medicate border
You cannot medicate borderline.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
That's not gonna happen, right.
Speaker 1 (04:11):
So maybe I would give her to get And when
I realized it was borderline and somebody told that to
me and then I knew the explanation, it was the
most hopeless feeling. I'm like, this won't get better, this
won't well.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
I don't like to say it won't get better, but I.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
Would like, even narcissism can get better.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Ish I would steer away from both. I would too,
I wouldn't run up to either one of them.
Speaker 1 (04:32):
Borderline is very very specific. Can you explain what borderline
means for the lay paper opening.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Okay, So borderline personality disorder is the type of person
that it's a pervasive pattern of behaviors that is influenced
by manipulation and black and white, up and down, unstable relationships,
fears of abandonman, it's the push and pull. It's come here,
(04:57):
I love you, then pushes them away, I hate you,
get away at the same time.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
Yeah, I mean I remember her.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
I'm sure she's not listening.
Speaker 1 (05:06):
It was over ten years ago. We'd be walking down
the street and she see like some piece of random
like scrap metal or pipe on the ground, and she goes,
do you ever see something like that and just want
to bash somebody's head in? I go no, never, what
are you talking about? And she's like, okay, do you
want to eat here? Like just like it was just
a conversation about killing somebody. Yeah, yeah, I'm like, hey,
what can we go back to the pipe on the
ground and you want to kill someone? Well?
Speaker 2 (05:27):
Their favorite is you're the best, I absolutely love you.
And then if your eyes gaze away for a second,
they'll be like you son of U.
Speaker 1 (05:34):
Yeah, you can say whatever you want on the show.
I agree with you now the men they they might want,
they don't necessarily because I've heard a lot of beautiful
women say like, I can't believe that guy think I
would go out, Like we don't know that you're out
of our league? Like how do we know? Because, as
I've said on the podcast before, we do chase that
(05:55):
rom com mindset where like the idiot, bumbling Adam Sandler
guy like she gross gross gross, and then suddenly they're
in love by the end of the movie. How does
the guy know that the girl's out of the league,
you know, because if he's wealthy, nobody's out of his league.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
Well, it's interesting because we're talking mainly about physicality. We're
talking about looks, but that's really not what makes relationships,
that's not what maintains relationships, and that's definitely not for
your future. Yes, it's the attraction. And let me tell you,
there are a lot of very beautiful women that are
(06:30):
with short, chubby guys or I.
Speaker 1 (06:32):
Mean, we all remember, you're old enough to remember Julie
Roberts with Lyle love It.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
How dare you? Did you just say I'm old enough
to remember?
Speaker 1 (06:39):
You're not? But you do remember? Okay, I do that's
a compliment. You're old enough to have this wisdom. Oh right,
looking back, that was bad. You're at least twenty. Do
you remember Julia Roberts and Layle love they do and
people are like, I mean he was talented and famous
and wealthy, and people are like, oh, physically they don't match.
But she saw something quirky in him, and so us
guys who are not in ass are you that cute?
(07:01):
And I'm still super cute it We were like, maybe
not the narcissist. My mother told me I was cute.
I was supposed to think that didn't true. That was
good the we're supposed to know that she doesn't like short,
chubby guys or whatever.
Speaker 2 (07:19):
Like, no, because sometimes we do, and Mile love it
did have a quirk. He was very interesting.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
So what I'm saying we cling to the sometimes we do.
Speaker 2 (07:27):
You guys focus way too much on the esthetics you're
and then you don't want girls to get the botox
or but you want them to get the boobs and
you want well.
Speaker 1 (07:37):
Yeah, and whatever it takes, we don't care. Okay, do
you think guys care if you get the botox? We
care whatever you do to feel good about yourself.
Speaker 2 (07:44):
You're paying for it.
Speaker 1 (07:46):
I don't think the guys care. If you want the boobs,
get the boobs, like I don't think, well, look.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
At how we talked about the boobs. Of course that
you don't care about the boobs. Most men, no, actually
encourage the boobs. We don't have any guys I've had
that offered me boobs, and.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
That's an insult. See, I would take it as insult
if you said I want boobs. I didn't say it, no,
but if you if you and they're like, oh, I'll
get them. If you want them, that's fine. But if
they're like you should get some moobs, I'll pay for them,
that's an insult to me as a woman. And I'm
not a woman, but I would be insulted.
Speaker 2 (08:19):
I think the guys think that it's a gift.
Speaker 1 (08:23):
It means that I don't think what you have is
good enough.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
I have really good boobs. Okay, that's a professional, nice
regular natural boobs.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
So professional and natural are the same.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
Well, I thought, because I'm a professional, they're just professionals.
They are nice organic boobs. And I think the guy
that said it one of them that stands out for me.
He was a plastic surgeon, and he said to me,
you have great boobs. Eventually you're just going to need
a little lyft.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
They're in the tires, right, And so it would be
tough to date a plastic surgeon because they'd always be
looking at you like hmm. I could work with that,
you know.
Speaker 2 (09:01):
Or it could be a great thing for women to
say data plass.
Speaker 1 (09:03):
Right and it gets the free stuff. But then that's
not the most romantic thing too, that he's kind of
creating this Frankenstein monster in the way he wants. Or
it can be anything's possible. That's my point, going back
to sort of that mantra of now women though, I
you know, I think when a guy ultimately proposes, he
does so thinking this is the love of my life.
(09:24):
I am so lucky. I want to spend fifty years
with her. That's it. She may say yes for a
hundred different reasons that have nothing to do with that.
Speaker 2 (09:31):
That's fun to be a big.
Speaker 1 (09:33):
Father, which we've been dating a while. It's safe, will
make it work. It's it's so that kind of flips
that he is dating who he can, but eventually the
can is who he wants.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
The can is who he wants.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
Ultimately what he thinks he wanted and could not get
probably didn't work out, wouldn't have worked out, and so
men do kind of find their level on that. I
think it goes the other way if you're the I
think the professional term is hot chick. If you're a
hot chick, you know a lot of times you're like no, no, no,
no no, and then the game of musical chairs kind
(10:10):
of leaves you with a limited amount of seats and
then you're like, Okay, that guy's fine, but it's not
the most not necessarily the love of your life. A
lot of times the woman is still in love with
her college boyfriend that didn't quite work out with because
he was too immature and he was a jerk, and
they're like, this guy is a safe landing place. And
so I do think it kind of flips like that.
Speaker 2 (10:29):
I have to tell you something that is going to
surprise the shit out of you. There are more hot chicks,
as you said.
Speaker 1 (10:38):
The technical term, right, that's the medical term.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
So yeah, that's in my book, my diet, in my
diagnostic manual. But there are more hot chicks that actually
do not get hit on than you would ever imagine. Oh, No,
there's more hot chicks that don't get the guy. And
if you even had hot chicks that have said a
(11:01):
guy has said to a hot chick, M, you're not
marriage material. What about that?
Speaker 1 (11:10):
A little bit that can be that could be the
male insecurity where it's like, you're not marriage material because
I don't trust I could ever keep a woman like you,
like on some level, that's probably flailing, you know. I
as of the recording of this podcast, again, it's not
that evergreen. Jeff Bezos just married Lauren Sanchez. She's journalist
from I know Lauren a little bit from back in
the day. She has been married to three increasingly wealthy
(11:34):
and increasingly successful men. She has worked her way up
the ladder to the richest man in the world and
did so. She's not thirty five, and she has kids
and several divorces and whatever and whatever her skill set
was and whatever. And like I said, I know her
a little bit. She's fine, she's nice, she's smart, she's beautiful,
(11:56):
but she does know how to get what she wants.
Speaker 2 (11:59):
So I'm gonna tell you what Trump's looks and aesthetics
and everything. And that's probably why you have me on
your show. It is psychology. It is what people are
giving off. I have women and men that, let's say,
are very unattractive, but they have this vibe and this
self esteem that I sometimes sit in my office with
(12:19):
my mouth open and they think they are the bomb
dot com. So what do you think of that?
Speaker 1 (12:26):
I think, yeah, I mean the confidence goes a long
long way. You know, Madonna for years convinced the world
that she was like the hottest.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
Thing, and a lot of the world believes.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
Right. We believed her, Yeah, because she thought she was that.
We're like, oh, I guess she is. But if you
saw Madonna, you know, at Whole Foods and she wasn't Madonna,
you wouldn't look twice at her ever.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
But it all comes from what you're giving off, what's
in your mind. You lure people in, not with your
looks maybe for a second, but mainly it's the vibe.
It's what you're giving off and what you think about, right.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
And the challenge for men is they do not get
an opportunity to showcase their vibe. The women instantly are like,
whether it's online or off, the guy can't get the audition,
the job interview.
Speaker 2 (13:12):
As I always say, depends on the mom they had.
Speaker 1 (13:15):
What does that mean?
Speaker 2 (13:16):
Mom plays a big influence in that and dad. Actually,
it depends on what they impressed upon that boy. Are
you good enough? Are you handsome enough? Are you capable?
Are you worthy?
Speaker 1 (13:29):
My mom used to tell me that I was very
good looking because I looked just like her. As I
aged and I started to look a little more like
my dad, she came off with that. I'm like, wait,
but you were attracted to dad. She's like, no, I
wanted you to look like me. There you go.
Speaker 2 (13:42):
So mixed messages are mixed messages help with self esteem
and self confidence exactly.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
I want to get into actual couples. I'm going to
flip this a little bit, but we have to pay
for botox and things around here. I'm here with doctor Ja.
We had to take a quick break. We will be
back right after this, and we are back now. You
work with a lot of couples.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
I do do you know.
Speaker 1 (14:10):
From like session one from the I don't know the
forms they fill out? Do you? How is it? How
do you maintain sort of neutrality at it? How do
you maintain like, oh my god, she's such a pain
the ass He shouldn't be with her.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
Well, when I started out, this is a really funny story.
When it's not so funny, but now it's funny. When
I started out and I saw couples in conflict, even
from session one, I would sit in the middle of
them on the couch. Oh and what I didn't anticipate,
And this happened twice, so I said, I'm not going
to do the three times I got a tissue box
(14:45):
thrown to my head oh by one.
Speaker 1 (14:48):
Because I was sitting there.
Speaker 2 (14:49):
I leaned back and they were talking over me, and
for a split second, I just leaned in to listen,
and that's when he threw the tissue box. And he
threw it and it was a full hisssue box. It
kind of did did have sharp corners.
Speaker 1 (15:04):
Can you read body language if it's just them on
the couch and they're both leaning towards the opposite side.
Speaker 2 (15:09):
Absolutely what I love to see. When I know it's
going to be problematic, couples will stack the pillows that
I have on the couch.
Speaker 1 (15:17):
I did that. I went to a couple's counting once
I did that, and I'm like, can we build a
fortress around this? And that was with the borderline girl.
So the fortress was never going to be high enough.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
No, definitely not. And they look to where they're going
to sit. They definitely look to where they're going to sit.
I have this couple that starts actually apart from one another,
and then when I see that he's getting upset and
he really has a temper that can really blow, she
moves in closer and goes to grab his hand to
(15:47):
calm him down.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Do you or it's not your place. Do you encourage
them to hug before and after? Or you can't do that,
you can't force sit weird? Yeah you think it's weird. Yeah,
the middle hug is so calm. It is.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
And I know you like hugs because you tell me
that from the first time, and you're right, it is.
But I want it to come organically for them, So
I'll say things like do you feel ready to show
some sort of intimacy or affection towards your partner, and
then I let them figure out what they want to do,
and they usually do. Someone will grab someone's hand.
Speaker 1 (16:18):
Or but if you're how do you stay? I was
last time you were on the podcast, and I remember
you told me that you were empathetic and I was like,
how can somebody who does that be empathetic or you
would just be exhausted at the end of the day
with all their feelings.
Speaker 2 (16:29):
I am exhausted, I told you.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
I know, And that was your answer, Like, I am
a question answer how do you stay neutral when there's
got to be a part of it you being like
they shouldn't work out. I don't she's terrible or he's
a jerk or whatever, like you kind of got to
know right away, Like, but you can't influence the jury,
so to speak.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
Yeah, what do you do? Well, that's the challenge. That
is a huge challenge. You're absolutely right. What I do
is I always give it back to them. I'll say
something like, so, if you're this type of person and
these are your needs and this is something that it's
a deal breaker for you. And then I look at
him and I said, and if you're now this type
of person, you've grown into this in your needs, how
(17:09):
is this gonna work?
Speaker 1 (17:10):
You?
Speaker 2 (17:11):
Guys? Tell me? So I put it on them without
having to say, this doesn't work.
Speaker 1 (17:15):
A lot of times, I imagine you're dealing with infidelity,
not you would anticipate.
Speaker 2 (17:22):
Actually, no, it's actually not it's communication.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
Well, a lot of times bad communication leads to infidelity.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
It's yeah, it's many of them that I work with now.
It's just it's not being heard, it's not getting enough affection,
it's not getting enough attention, it's not feeling loved. Those
are the big ones.
Speaker 1 (17:42):
Yeah, again, what she ends up because I'm seeking that
somewhere else. You know, I've said before that a woman
doesn't need to be right, but she does need to
be heard. And I learned that probably way too late
in life, and I probably am still learning that now
that you know, your instinct as a man is sometimes
to absolve yourself of any blame and she might just
(18:04):
be venting, ranting or whatever just to get it out,
and you get so defensive as a man, or at
least Brian Christopher Howie, that you're always trying to be
like no like, to either downplay whatever her concern is
or diffuse it somehow by and to her in that moment,
at that second, it is the most important thing. And
she has got to say that, and you have got
(18:25):
to stand there as a man and not just take it,
but be present for it and try and understand that.
That's hard to learn until you get into a room
with you, because a lot of the damage has already
been done and it's not an overnight change, And all
she's going to think about is the one hundred and
five times he didn't listen and wasn't heard. So how
are you able to say, like, oh, I can work
(18:47):
with these two and get them to a place, or
are you trying to I don't know what's the best
thing I do.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
I work with them to try to improve whatever I
possibly can with them. I tell them they have to
do the work as well. I think. I think what
it's about is that men and women are still wired differently.
We don't want to be wired the same way. We
have different hormones, we have different societal expectations, we have
(19:13):
different nurturing and nourishment that we receive, so of course
we're going to be different. We try to make the
other person be like us, and that's not gonna work.
It's understanding, respecting and complimenting one another and being able
to understand that, oh you're different. You're practical. You don't
want a five page text, you just want a sentence,
(19:35):
and I love you for it. But it doesn't always stay.
The knee jerk is oh my god, and then we
stop communicating.
Speaker 1 (19:42):
Yeah, oh, I say you two hundred words and you
just sent me back thumbs up or okay. And sometimes
the person's busy and sometimes the other person has to
interpret things and get back to it later or whatever.
But getting that rhythm down of what breaks up a
lot of couples early who should have probably stayed together.
And then later on a relationship when somebody's like, you
know what I need, you know what I like? You
(20:04):
know that this is kind of the way I want
to communicate, and you're just either not cognizant or you
don't care enough.
Speaker 2 (20:10):
And then here's something interesting. I've been accused of being like,
you're like a guy quote unquote because I would respond okay,
thumbs up.
Speaker 1 (20:18):
Yeah, it's the worst again for somebody like me who's
super needy.
Speaker 2 (20:25):
Right, so you would be like the girl. Yeah, you
would be more like the girl, and I would be
like the guys. So there are people that are like that,
but we still have to appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
And I've changed. You know, you're obviously you know the
stuff here. This is your job, the attachment styles. Uh huh, right,
So I was the what was avoidant and now.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
I've become anxious avoidant?
Speaker 1 (20:46):
What is that one?
Speaker 2 (20:48):
Yeah, I think you're anxious.
Speaker 1 (20:49):
What is it now? What is the opposite? Where you were.
Speaker 2 (20:52):
You just dependent?
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Yeah? Yeah, right, that flipped as I got older.
Speaker 2 (20:57):
I think you think you're more dependent than you are.
Speaker 1 (21:00):
Oh, I'm very like, what is to define dependent?
Speaker 2 (21:03):
Like constantly needing to talk with someone to have their approval?
Speaker 1 (21:08):
Yes, I like not everybody, but I like the one.
I want to keep the ping pong paul going back
and forth forever and from the time I wake up
to the time whoever it is that is the one.
She needs to know that she's the one, and I
kind of want to know that back whereas before it
was probably like I'm scared to I don't want the
(21:29):
pressure of being the one, right, and that there wasn't
like an incident that changed that. I don't think. I
just think you got to a point where I'm like,
it's not working the other way.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
It's maturity. It is, Yes, it's.
Speaker 1 (21:42):
Because well, I don't know, but men don't necessarily change
to that. Men sometimes get worse to that because they
become more entrenched because they've been hurt more. I think
it was like this a way of being avoidant of
any true you know, emotion or attachment in a relationship,
meaning I could get out the door in a minute
when when the borderline cropped up, I think that probably
(22:05):
prevented me from obviously being in healthier relationship. But it
probably was just like it must have been incredibly frustrating.
It must be incredibly frustrating to date somebody like that.
Speaker 2 (22:13):
Well, but as women and men go through thirties, forties, fifties,
then it does change, even for those money.
Speaker 1 (22:21):
Because the men grow up.
Speaker 2 (22:22):
He No, it's not that it's no one really wants
to be alone, and they see it more as they
no doubt. So that's why I'm saying that men will
tend to want to stay and be more dependent right,
and want the woman versus you know.
Speaker 1 (22:38):
It really isn't just he needs somebody to take care
of him or the traditional women all. He really does
want the partnership that she always wants, the thing that
the women always sort of want. It is me and
you and the partner in crime. I think eventually, over
forty forty five you get into that and maybe you
lost that in the marriage that you had once the
kids came around or whatever the reason is. I think
(23:00):
the men really do realize how special having that one
person is. Well, absolutely, and it's the most special thing
you you So right now again, I'm not gonna we're
not gonna tell the date we're recording this, and you're
not gonna say you walked in here and like, oh,
I have this couple coming in and I'm would you
say dreading it?
Speaker 2 (23:16):
Well, I didn't say dreading, But I know that it's
going to be so conflictual. I know, you know, sometimes
I see like ugly stuff, meaning they just treat each
other so poorly, like such crap, and they have children together.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
How do you know that though? Are they doing it
in the session?
Speaker 2 (23:32):
Yes, they're doing it in the session, And of course
I will intervene and I will say, let's be, you know,
treat each other mutual respects. I give the guidelines, I
give the rules. But do people listen when you're in
the heat of it and your emotion's taking over. Oh
heck no. They just let it all out. And this
is about they're going to be divorcing, and this is
about money. So money and sex bring out ugly, angry stuff.
Speaker 1 (23:57):
Why are they talking about money? With you.
Speaker 2 (24:01):
Because they've been talking about it with their lawyers and
it hasn't worked, and they're spending a lot more in
there with their lawyers, and they were hoping that they
can just mediate something real quick with me.
Speaker 1 (24:11):
A voice of reason. Yes, right, exactly, And what is
the sex part.
Speaker 2 (24:15):
The sex part is that he wanted it. She never did,
or when she did, he felt that. It wasn't with affection,
it wasn't with intimacy. It was like, I'm right, I'm
doing you a favor, I'm throwing you a bone. And
it really came down to what I discovered is she
did not really have chemistry for him. A lot of
times women will not admit, like you said, so.
Speaker 1 (24:37):
She can right and hope it kicks in her changes
or who cares, I'll be as kind.
Speaker 2 (24:41):
Of like you know, maybe women more so marry initially
if they're not marrying the ones that they're hot for
or desiring, they rationalize and say, he'll be a good father,
he's got he has a good job. You know, he's
a good man, and then they.
Speaker 1 (25:01):
Hot guy's got a lot of choices.
Speaker 2 (25:03):
Hot guys got a lot of choices, but they're not
always the ones that the hot women want, either if
they're arrogant or.
Speaker 1 (25:10):
Are fighting over merr time.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (25:13):
Well, the the problem though a lot of these women,
the sweet spot of the guys that the women want
are like between thirty seven and forty five. Those are
the sweet spuffer those men. If they're at all good
looking in there, I'd all have a job. Those guys'
choices is like twenty one to fifty as they have
a giant pool, and so they might not necessarily want
(25:35):
to date some woman who's thirty five or settle down
or like I waited my whole life to get to
this point where the girls I can date who I
want or whatever. It's tough to settle down. And so
the woman who's thirty eight, she's like, I don't want
to go older because I'm not attracted to the older guy,
and so she's in no man's land, waiting, waiting, winning.
Then she's forty three and she should have gone older.
Speaker 2 (25:55):
What's been happening lately is I've had women that are
in their late thirties and they want older guys.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
They really should want older guys. Oh well that's because
I mean again, a huge percentage of this audience is
thirty seven ish's. That's the ones who come to my
live shows. It is what it is, and they get
really mad when I say this, and it's true, and
don't blame the messengers. Doesn't because it doesn't mean it's
not true. If he's forty and you're thirty seven, if
(26:28):
he wants three kids, you're probably too old. And if
he doesn't want three kids, you're probably too young because
you still possibly could have them. So you're kind of
in no man's land, depending on what kind of math
he's doing in his head, because men really are more
realistic on that, and the women tend to chase the outlier, like, oh,
Janet Jackson had a kid at forty eight, Like, realistically,
(26:50):
a guy, if you're thirty seven and you want and
you want a big family, you kind of got to
look at the odds on that if that's something that
he wants, or if he's just like, I already have
two kids by my first wife and I don't want
I don't want any more kids. You're too young. You
can still have a kid, so the men do. The
men are more rational on this stuff than the women.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
Then are less apt to want more kids if they
have kids, already. Women are more apt to have more
kids if they already have kids.
Speaker 1 (27:16):
No, I don't know about that. No, it's true, is it?
Because a lot of women are like, oh my god,
I cannot do this all over again. But then there's
women are like, I missed the smell of babies. Like
there's a lot of different.
Speaker 2 (27:25):
More women that miss the smell of babies. And if
she's got a new husband. I've had four friends, yeah,
when we were all at the same time divorcing. All
four of those girls remarried and all four of them
had like two or three more children.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
Yeah. I mean it's tough. You're mixing the kids, you're
dealing with ex'es, you're doing a lot of stuff.
Speaker 2 (27:42):
But it's more the norm now.
Speaker 1 (27:44):
It is. I'm just going to that age. You know,
if you're in your late thirties and you think a
guy who's you know, fifty two, is like, ew, you're
gonna end up with that guy when you're forty four. Yeah,
it's like Lori Lori Gottlieb, you know, Lori Gottlieb is
good friend of the podcast here. She wrote marry Him
the case for mister right Now, and she was one
(28:06):
of those women who waited, waited, waited, waited, and then
she's like, I turned down ten guys who would have
been great husband. She didn't want the who she can.
She wanted to marry who she wanted and it just
never happened. Yeah, and so she advises women, if like,
you want ten things on this checklist and you can
get seven of them, sign on for that.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
But here, lie is the problem. Many of us do
not know, do not have the guidance. Many of us
don't know that. So she knew that, but my parents
she didn't know that too late.
Speaker 1 (28:37):
So she wrote it in her forties, looking back on
the choices she's made in the thirties because she did
the same experiment. She asked, guys, give me ten things
you want in a woman, and she goes, if I
can give you five of them? And men are like yes,
because men are used to baseball, where like three hundred
ten is successful. The women are like, I want all ten,
and they wait and wait and wait and wait, and
(28:57):
then they get to the marry who they can, and
then the relationship is in everything that possibly could have been.
You know, I don't know. It's hard to you know,
women do they don't necessarily marry for looks, but they
do date for looks. They do.
Speaker 2 (29:14):
I think, both do.
Speaker 1 (29:15):
I think, but men already get that put on their stamp.
Women assume men do, and they probably do. The men
are visual creatures because we don't understand anything beyond that,
because we're very confused. But this idea that the women
are like this very deep thinking pool of people who
look beyond that, at least early on and at least online,
it's bullshit. The women are just as bad.
Speaker 2 (29:34):
But there are more men than I ever realized that
now in their forties. Men from forties on they say
it's it has to be my intellect.
Speaker 1 (29:46):
They have no doubt because we baited all the I
believe that we agreed on. The term was hot chicks.
I was in Los Angeles for a long time, so
there's no shortage of hot chicks, and there's no shortage
of chicks who want to make a living pretending to
be something else. Try dating that.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
So what I say is to make your list. This
is what's important when we realize what it is. So
we get distracted more so by the looks by the
hot chick, by the hot guy. But it's your list.
That's why people are not fulfilled. That's why even if
they get the hot chick or the hot guy, they're
still getting divorced.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
They're still getting divorced.
Speaker 2 (30:23):
So it's because they didn't have their checklist of what
they really want. And as we grow, we realize what
we want more, what values, what characteristics, what similarities. People
think like, oh, we're different, it's great. It's not great.
As you age, you don't want to have conflict and
struggle because you're apt to grow apart you.
Speaker 1 (30:43):
Yeah, you start out wanting to date. You know, the
two D two dimensional image, and then it gets into
three D and then the four D is when you
really have something special because you are going to age
and people get sick, and people gain weight, and people
get stressed. And if you love them and you have
that core, you see them is the most beautiful person
in the world, no matter what, men and women. That's
(31:03):
the goal.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
That's true. What I think, what's come to me more
so than anything, And people don't realize this. This is
so important that attachment styles we talk about we know
ourselves at this point in our lives. If you're past
thirty five, you know you know yourself. But what we
don't realize And someone said it to me and I
(31:25):
was totally floored and pissed off. I was like, how
dare you? And this person said to me, you're not available?
And I said, of course I'm available and they said, no, no, no,
you're not available me. Are we one hundred percent available?
Which means we know what we want and we think
we're doing all right? But are we Are we really
(31:46):
giving it our all? Are we really balancing our work
life and our social life? Are we really investing as
much time to get the girl or get the guy
as we do, let's say, with work in an area
where we're successful.
Speaker 1 (32:00):
And I think it just takes a while. You know,
a lot of you, a lot of yours.
Speaker 2 (32:04):
Yes or no.
Speaker 1 (32:05):
I think we need to do the work and we're
not doing.
Speaker 2 (32:09):
The work right, that's the answer.
Speaker 1 (32:12):
We don't know a lot of you guys listening are
in your twenties. Don't get married in your twenties. You
don't know who you are at twenty eight. You're supposed
to do You're supposed to know who they are, like seriously,
like it is it is a process, and you know
maybe and again you don't want to wait too long.
But guys don't grow up really until their forties, right,
(32:35):
It does take a while and a lot of time.
The women kind of find themselves in their thirties, but
the thirties they are buried in a lot of hormones.
And I mean, yeah, because then it's like I need
to have kids and I need to do this. I
would say the best women I know traditionally are their
forties because they've come out of that. They've come out
of that fog of crazy twenties, maternal thirties and all
(32:59):
that kind of stuff, and they really have sort of Okay,
this is my time and they know that, and a
little bit same for the men. The men are like, Okay,
I know what I'm doing for a career, I know
what I like. I hopefully doing the work, hopefully listening
a little. It's the ones who got married at twenty
three and then suddenly get divorced at forty five. They
go back to being twenty three, Yes, because they feel
(33:22):
like they have to make up for lost time.
Speaker 2 (33:24):
Yes, that is very, very true. But you know it's interesting,
and I said this before. People don't realize that having
similarities in life and having similarities in your wants and
desires is going to be so important to lasting relationships.
For instance, if your man likes porn and you don't,
(33:45):
that's going to become a problem. And I've seen it
over and over and over. Meet a girl who likes
to watch porn.
Speaker 1 (33:51):
Why why isn't the girl the porn? Oh why does
he need Why? If you have the girl, why do
you need por? Maybe I'm the weak guse.
Speaker 2 (33:58):
Some people like it. I'm just saying some people like it.
It doesn't matter. They don't see that, they see it
as different. It's a whole psychological that's a different episode
or like, right, but how do you bring that up
on the first date? Well you must, you have to
start talking about what you want, maybe not the.
Speaker 1 (34:13):
Firstl the dumplings, and how do you feel about porn?
Speaker 2 (34:19):
Well, yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (34:22):
Lay that out there.
Speaker 2 (34:23):
And I just brought up porn because that is something
that I hear people argue with and like have an
issue with. Now. Of course, if it's an addiction, that's
a different thing.
Speaker 1 (34:30):
I believe that the guys like the porn. I can't
speak for the women the porn and the video games
because they feel a sense of control. And I get
what I want out of this, and they're not getting
out of relationship. I really don't think if he is
happy with his wife, he needs the porn. But maybe
I'm wrong.
Speaker 2 (34:44):
I mean a lot of people that would disagree with
I agree.
Speaker 1 (34:47):
With you, and again I this great love to be
but I might be wrong because I don't need the porn.
Speaker 2 (34:51):
Well, it's just part of someone's sexual desires.
Speaker 1 (34:53):
Why would I want to watch other people do and stuff?
Speaker 2 (34:56):
Because for some that's exciting.
Speaker 1 (34:58):
Yeah, make your own porn. I don't.
Speaker 2 (35:00):
I mean, I agree with you, but I'm just telling
you how it is.
Speaker 1 (35:03):
It's I get it.
Speaker 2 (35:04):
And this is a problem that I.
Speaker 1 (35:05):
Hear from people watch porn that has nothing to do
with what anything they want is just to completely altern
everybody outy it's an escape, but.
Speaker 2 (35:13):
Another one it's porn. It's travel. If your spouse that
you're going to marry doesn't like to travel and you
love to travel and you're into travel, you're going to
have a problem. People have actually just grue because of that.
Speaker 1 (35:24):
But I think early on, I think a lot of
people like to travel because they don't have a reason
to stay home. And so sometimes early on they're like,
what do he love to do. Oh my god, I
love to travel. You might not want to travel so
much if home was awesome.
Speaker 2 (35:39):
But let's say these weren't extreme cases. Let's say this
is not a psychological issue.
Speaker 1 (35:43):
You're an adventurous and curious and you want to go
to the Far East. You need to work that out.
A lot of women and a lot of men are like,
if you don't have global entry, I'm I'm not dating you.
Speaker 2 (35:53):
Well that's extreme. See.
Speaker 1 (35:54):
Well, I think it's like, maybe the person doesn't know
that he likes to travel or she likes to travel.
Maybe you haven't had those experience.
Speaker 2 (35:59):
Well, I think that anything in excess excessive, whether there's
porn or whether it's traveler, whether it's shopping, or whether
it's eating meat. Okay, these are the things people argue about. Yeah,
I know, no, you know, I'm a vegan. Let's just
I'm not a vegan. But I'm saying people say I'm
a vegan, and then you have steak and they're like,
I can't bear to see you these.
Speaker 1 (36:18):
Well there's levels of vegan like I can't stand the
look and smell of it. But and then vegan vegans
just there's nothing I want to bite of so it's
not fun. We can't share anything then for instance, that's rough,
But I don't think it's a deal breaker.
Speaker 2 (36:30):
Okay, So if you fall in love with someone else's
for someone's qualities and looks, but they're a vegan, do
you think that's going to be a lasting relationship.
Speaker 1 (36:39):
I think that there could be a health concern that
leads you to have to change your diet ratically good
or bad, and you got to roll with that.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
I've seen that too.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
That happens too, where it's like she was a vegan
and she doesn't get enough protein and then suddenly she's
eating ribs. Like people change, and I think you have
to roll with some of this and you have to
think of what you what you do or don't like.
The longtime producer of this podcast, the two time Emmy
Award winning Kko. She is the very best person in
the world I've ever met at presenting things in a
(37:07):
way of you think you don't like it, you don't know.
And so I love going to Asia. I've been I
don't know a million times because she challenged me one time,
She's like, what are you afraid to fly? Like, why
wouldn't you go like it's amazing. I'm like, I like
to go to Europe. I don't need to go to Seoul.
You like things like that and just presenting things in
(37:27):
a way that are not what is wrong with you? You
don't like it. It's like try it once, try the soy,
try this.
Speaker 2 (37:34):
Yeah, so you need to two people both need to
be like that, open minded that are willing to be
flexible and I'm not rigid.
Speaker 1 (37:41):
He's like, oh, I don't want, you know, to give
the borderline girl credit to put a little bookend on this.
She was crazy. But I used to be religiously watch
New York Giants football every Sunday. I had missed a
game in like twenty six years, like ever. And she goes,
one time, will you skip a game? And I'm like, why,
I like to do it. She's like, there's so many things.
(38:03):
Or I lived in Santa Barbara. It was a sunny Sunday.
She goes, you're just wasting your time in a sports bar.
I'm your girlfriend. Can we do something? And she goes,
one weekend, let me plan something and if you don't
like it, I'll watch football with you. And we went
to some winery and I'm like oh my god, this
was awesome. And she presented in a way that was like,
try it one time and if you like it, then
(38:23):
it's fine. But it wasn't. It didn't turn into an argument.
She knew how to sort of positively coax me out
of my little hole. And so sometimes that's the way
you present it to your partner. Is a lot of
times they think they don't want it, they think they
don't like it, they think they can't do it. And
if it's sort of positively reinforced, of course, like take
my hand, I'm with you and we're going to go
into this end of the pool. I think there's possibilities
(38:45):
before they get to your office. And I don't want
to put you out of business.
Speaker 2 (38:48):
But you'll never put me out of business. But I
think that has to do with first, just hear me out. Yes,
I agree with first. I think people are more apt
to be open and to try something. Now, can we
just talk about people that are set in their ways.
More people are setting their ways than we give credit
to or then.
Speaker 1 (39:08):
They I hear that in South Florida a lot that
the men are the most setting their ways.
Speaker 2 (39:12):
Pool and women are as well.
Speaker 1 (39:14):
I think they're setting what they know.
Speaker 2 (39:16):
They're setting, well, they know a lot. If this is
second time around, they've probably.
Speaker 1 (39:21):
Dated, but they probably second time around they probably dated
what they thought. I still think there's always a path,
there's always a roadmap. That everybody isn't setting their ways.
I just think maybe that's crazy.
Speaker 2 (39:31):
You're saying you're not setting your ways coming from.
Speaker 1 (39:33):
Someone setting my ways and then suddenly a light but
the right person at the right time and the right
way sets something to me and I have been on
the other end of that. I'm like, I know you
think you're setting their ways. Can we just a lot
of times you're banging your head against the wall, and
they really are setting their ways. I don't think people
are setting their ways as they want to believe. People
want to believe they're seting their ways because they're scared
I get outside their comfort zone.
Speaker 2 (39:54):
That I'm going to tell you that more people than
not are getting divorced because of this dissimilarities.
Speaker 1 (40:01):
Yeah, they're like, I'll find somebody who wants to watch
porn with me, and you're saying they should ask that early.
Speaker 2 (40:06):
Well, yeah, and it doesn't have to be porn, but
things that are kind of you're made up of. If
somebody just said to me, from now on the next
this guy who's getting divorced, Actually, then I'm going to
see the next person that I'm going to marry. She
has to like really enjoy banter. She has to get
my sarcasms. Won't be some well, a lot of women
(40:27):
don't want that.
Speaker 1 (40:29):
I thought, with very strong accents, and I would be
afraid that. I'm like, she's never gonna get my jokes.
What do you mean accents not Boston accents, like they're
from the Eastern Europe or Latin America, And I'm like,
I think that the language barrier on the joke would
be different.
Speaker 2 (40:44):
I definitely agree. So the accents would be a problem,
But it's it's about he wants banter. He wants someone
who's likes to do exercise or is an active person
like events. So what I'm saying like, if you're not
with the same more similar type person and you're going
to go for a jog in the morning, and your
other person's.
Speaker 1 (41:03):
Going to be like, oh my god, I love live music.
But maybe if everything's better at home, you don't need life,
you don't need this.
Speaker 2 (41:08):
To make So if someone is going to say to me,
I take a run every day on the beach, and
I'm not a runner on the beach, and it's going
to like change up our lifestyle. Or a guy I
dated for years and he was a golfer, he was
an avid golfer. I did not play golf ever except
for like.
Speaker 1 (41:21):
Just see that tells me early on just five hours
a day you're spending without me exactly. Yeah, But so
you're saying that you don't believe people grow apart. You're
saying that they weren't that close to begin with and
they just didn't recognize it.
Speaker 2 (41:33):
That's absolutely right, very good.
Speaker 1 (41:35):
You can use that. I'm a frash here you go. Wow,
all right, tell everybody where they can find you.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
Oh, you can find me at doctor Jane Lamaski dot com.
You can find me at doctor j Loomaski at gmail
dot com. I'm in book ratone. You can call my
office if you'd like to talk with me, get an appointment,
get more information. Five six one seven seven seven twenty one.
That's my office number. You can text it as well.
Speaker 1 (41:59):
Wow, you just gave it a fun number. Good for you,
But I did.
Speaker 2 (42:01):
Because my office number. Okay, yeah, even though everyone has
my cell phone number. Anyway. I know you guys have
my cell phone number because you call me all the time.
But that's okay, try call the office instead. And I'm
on social media.
Speaker 1 (42:11):
We call you because we like your podcast.
Speaker 2 (42:13):
So what is your Oh, and my podcast your mental Highness.
And I have a new website, your Mental Highness dot com,
so you can see all of my shows on that
as well. And of course Spotify and YouTube and Apple
Podcasts and Amazon.
Speaker 1 (42:29):
I'm on all do you have your Mental Highness at Gmail?
Speaker 2 (42:32):
I have your Mental Highness at gmail dot com.
Speaker 1 (42:34):
You should yeah, yes, so you put all your shows
on YouTube?
Speaker 2 (42:37):
Huh no, because you told me not to?
Speaker 1 (42:39):
Yeah, tell me you tell me a great, great love
audience out there. I know you guys are always like,
we want video and we want I probably should do
some more. When I started podcasting back in the days,
and especially in Los Angeles, the appeal for women, especially
famous women that I had a lot of them on
back in the day was no cameras right, No cameras right.
(43:02):
They loved that. Now the world is camera.
Speaker 2 (43:04):
You, so they want video.
Speaker 1 (43:07):
Want video? Okay. So and again, if you want to
find doctor j if you're driving on ninety five on
the East Coast and you see a blonde wearing a
crown in her car, It's a.
Speaker 2 (43:17):
Good chance that would be me, that would be her.
Speaker 1 (43:20):
Thank you, you were awesome. Yeah. As far as us like, share, follow,
please review this podcast and your mental highness. After five
hundred and something shows of this show, your reviews still
meet a lot in the podcasting ecosystem. Shoot us an
email Great Love Debate at gmail dot com. I've got questions, thoughts, comments,
or you want us to pass on some information to
doctor J. Because, as always at the Great Love Debate,
(43:45):
we never stop making love. See you next time the
Great Love Debate. It's the Great Love Debate, the Great
Love Debate. It's a great love to be
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