Episode 104 - Emily kaye ,The crumbles Part 2

This week on Twisted Britain, we have the second of the Crumbles Murders, Emily Kaye was attaked and murdered by her lover Patrick Mahon

Episode Transcript

(00:36):
Hello, and welcome to Twisted Britaina podcast. I'm true crime in Britain
with a sprinkling the weird in acab and your hosts Sammy, Bob Dail
and me Ali Downey, and weare distance recording tonight. Ali Downey,
how are you distance recording? Youare all the way up in Scotland and
I am all the way down inBournemouth. Indeed, this is our second
the same time we've done this.Yeah, but we managed to get the

(01:00):
I think better this time, sohopefully that'll help with the dipping in and
out audio that we had the lasttime we did this. But you have
you've actually prepared two cases. Yousent one of them to me which I
have read briefly because we were goingto do it as a tiny twisted but
it turns out that it's not tiny, but it's twist. It's not tiny.

(01:21):
It is very twisted, but it'snot tiny, and you're going to
have a wee revamp of it andwe're going to record it when I'm up
next week. Yes, so thiswill be the second part of this series,
so we'll introduce the other one wellas in when we do it.
But yeah, and what have yougot for us this evening alistair? Well,
today I'll be mostly talking about thesecond of the two Crumbles murders,

(01:45):
which took place, both of themin the nineteen twenties in Eastbourne in the
south of England. However, I'llalso quickly cover the early crimes of the
perpetrator because it gives us context.And also this is certainly a case of
a series criminal who repeatedly reoffends throughouthis life, and the progression and the

(02:05):
escalation of his crimes is fairly clearto see with the benefit of the sort
of twenty twenty hindsight that we canview his life with now. And we
talk about that quite often, don'tWe talk about how like actually looking at
it from the from the future ofwhen it happened, so with the hindsight
of looking at it from now thatsometimes it would have been more obvious if

(02:29):
with an overview, If that makessense, Yeah, one hundred percent.
But this is the second of theCrumbles, but not related to the first
Crumble. The only relation to thetwo murders is that they both happened on
the same beach between Eastbourne and PembersleyBay down in England. I would imagine

(02:51):
a lovely beach. Never been.It's a beautiful Shingle beach. Shingles,
is it? Now you'd have tocorrect my geography here, but is it
that kind of Jurassic coast where theyfound all the kind of oh what they
called ammonites and all that kind ofship Exactly, it's very rocky. It's
not the beautiful white sands that we'llsee up in Scotland, on Mora or

(03:12):
on Islah. Do you know oneof those beautiful beaches I've ever been on
and I've definitely showed you the photoswe're on call Oh, yes, Lovely
Island. Yeah. And do youknow what see, if it wasn't for
the fact that it was Scottish temperatures, it could have been the Maldives.
Yeah, but it's not. No, it's not. And it's Baltic up

(03:37):
there, but we're hundreds of milessouth of that. In Eastbourne we called
the Crumble then it's called the CrumblesBeach. Yeah, that's what it's locally
colloquially known as. But I'd liketo say first that this is a truly

(03:57):
horrific crime in every set of theword, and that the disposal of the
victim, Emily K's body in thiscase is both disturbing and also gruesome,
as is often the case in instancesof dismemberment, and I'll obviously keep the
grim details to a bare minimum whereverI can, and I'll ask that we
all remember that this was the lifeof a fairly young woman cut short in

(04:21):
her prime and then treated with acallous lack of empathy that beggars belief.
Sometimes it's mad. We've talked tolike, you know, I had the
June and Devanny case come out recently, and I feel like, I don't
know whether it's because we've gotten moreinto different types of research and different areas

(04:43):
of research, that we've certainly foundones that I don't want to use the
word jovial in any way, butwe've certainly found ones that are more oh
shit than we've talked about previously.We've done some real shockers recently. Is
this an old shit one? Thisis an old shit one our perpetrator?

(05:03):
Will he'll be in He'll be onyour list? Oh good. We've had
a couple of bad bastard added tothe list recently, but this is will
he top the list or I don'tthink he'll top it because we really have
covered some horrendous people, but he'llbe on it. Okay, one day
I'll actually write that list, youknow that. I'll go but I and

(05:24):
you go back through the episodes andwrite the actual twisted Britain bad Bastard list
one day for another day someday.Yeah, yes, indeed, one day
Sunday. You'll post that on theFacebook. One day Sunday, I like
that. Yeah, But today's talebegins, I suppose with the birth in
either eighteen eighty nine or eighteen ninety, We're not sure exactly which of Patrick

(05:48):
Herbert Mahon. He was born inthe Edge Hill area of Liverpool to Irish
parents, and he was educated ina Catholic school and he was actually noted
as being an intelligent boy and anabove average scholar as a child, well
in school. Mhmm. She say, it's something that I'm just thinking about

(06:12):
your your your tea, but poisonerthat. But you've just finished three episodes
on and will have been out bythe time that everybody hears this. Probably
one of the smartest people we've everpossibly ever talked about. Here was a
very clever man and not an evilgenius. As certain documentaries claim. Yes,

(06:36):
alone and above average intelligence human being. Definitely, Yeah, we tend
to. I suppose we found thata few people, like the ones that
aren't passion or circumstance, they tendto have a level of intelligence that is
terrifying. Actually, yeah, thecold calculated ones. I remember the French

(06:58):
killer. Yes, not Claude.No, we don't talk about him anymore
anyway. While in school, Mahonmet a girl named Jesse, and after
school the couple would marry on thesixth of April nineteen ten, and they
would eventually have two children. Mahonwould have been about twenty years old when

(07:23):
he married Jesse, and so farhe had led a crime free life.
Okay, Shortly after his wedding,however, he was arrested for his first
crime, the burglary of the houseof a clergyman. I'm going to ask
you this, assuming you probably don'tknow the answer to it, but are

(07:45):
we sure that he had no crimeor was he just not caught for a
crime. No, we're fairly surethat he he did commit no crimes Before
that. He was in a Catholicschool until the age of eighteen, which
gives you very little opportunity to commitany crime. Yeah, fair enough.
Yeah, but Mahon wasn't prosecuted forthe burglary of that clergyman's house because it

(08:11):
was his first offense and the clergymanin question didn't want to press charges anyway.
But this is, apparently, I'velearned recently a relatively common behavior pattern
in certain types of criminals. Thebeginning of multiple concurrent offenses often coincides with
the start of a long term,committed relationship. I was watching something recently

(08:33):
which touched on it briefly, andit's true for quite a broad spectrum of
offenders. That sort of altering ofthe social dynamic acts as a trigger or
a catalyst for some repeat offenders likeMahon. It's interesting, isn't it Like
commitment changes him essentially. Yeah,and it did, and he would continue

(08:56):
reoffending. In nineteen eleven, Mahonstole one hundred and twenty twenty three pounds
from his employer, and he alsoa banded his wife. It's a lot
of money. I'll get to howmuch money it is in a second.
He also abandoned his wife at thispoint to live briefly on the isle of
Man with another woman. Oh so, he was clearly not a nice guy

(09:16):
at this point. No, hereally wasn't. And this was also the
start of another pattern of behavior formaHorne serial adultery, and it's another pattern
of behavior that he would continue throughouthis life. But he only received a
caution from police for that crime,which I think is insane when you consider

(09:39):
that taking into account average inflation,that would be just under twenty thousand pounds
today. Oh well, good workon working that out. Thank you for
that. So yeah, it's nota small amount of money. It's a
huge amount of money. It wouldhave bought a house or it would it
suddenly would have I mean buy acar now, would probably would have bought

(10:00):
a house or something back in thetime period, almost certainly. Now,
the relationship with this other woman endedroughly when the money ran out, and
surprisingly Mahons' wife, Jesse forgave himand took him back. I'm not going
to no victim blaming here, butI'm going to get a silly mistake.

(10:24):
It was a silly mistake, yes, but it was a silly mistake that
she would continue making throughout her life. Okay, but he moved back in
with her and she actually got hima job at the local dairy, but
this lasted less than a year becausein nineteen twelve, Mahon's sticky fingers this
time lifted sixty pounds from his employer, which is roughly it would be about

(10:50):
nine pounds today. Yeah, justshut ten grands some of that. Yeah.
Yeah. But for this crime,he actually was charged because it was
a second offense. It was,yeah, it was, And he actually
was charged and sentenced and served oneyear in prison. Okay, it was

(11:11):
his third offense, actually, burglingof clergy one hundred and twenty three pounds
from employer, and this was histhird offense. Yeah, so year doesn't
feel like it's enough, to behonest, it's not. When he was
released in nineteen thirteen, he andhis wife moved to Calm to start over,

(11:31):
and it would be here that Jessegave birth to their two children.
She wouldn't get the new life shewanted, however, as Mahon had developed
a gambling habit, which he fedwith more petty crime. Yeah, okay.
The next major escalation in Mahon's crimescame in nineteen sixteen. He was

(11:52):
burgling a house in the town ofChertsey when he was discovered by a servant
girl, attacked the girl with ahammer, hitting her in the head a
total of nine times before he stopped. Fuck that's a raged moment, and
yep it was. Mahon was alsobrought to trial for this crime before mister

(12:16):
Justice Darling. We've heard of JusticeDarling before, we have. We've seen
him quite a few times. Thankyou Darling, Thank you Darling. He
can't be a good blackhead of reference, can you. You really can't.
But yeah, anyway, this wasan attempted murder, obviously. Medical testimony
at the trial revealed that Mahon hadlikely intended to kill the servant and had

(12:41):
she not had such a and Iquote generous head of hair, she would
very likely have died from her injuries. A hair helmet. Yeah. Mahon
would appeal for leniency, stating thathe intended to join the army. However,
the Judge Darling was not in restand he was enjoying that. I

(13:03):
am enjoying, Judge Darling. Hewas sentenced to five years imprisonment, with
Judge Darling stating as he sentenced him, I have come to the conclusion that
you are not only a burglar,not only a coward, but also a
thorough paced hypocrite. Oh like thoroughpaste hypocrites. That's yeah, it's nice

(13:28):
judge, early twentieth century language.I was gonna say, Judges always like,
I know, I slag you foryour flowery language at times alistair,
but like judges take it one beyondyou, even at times they frequently do.
They're very well educated. Usually,well that's true, and we aren't.
So there we are, so afive year sentence. Mahon would serve

(13:52):
three years of this five year sentencebefore being released in April of nineteen nineteen.
When he came out of prison,his wife, Jesse, was now
working as a secretary for an insurancefirm in London, and she managed to
get her husband a job as asalesman with the same company, and the
family moved to the London suburb ofRichmond. A nice area. It's a

(14:16):
lovely area. For the next fewyears, Mahon either kept his criminal activities
to a minimum or at least managednot to get caught. Yeah, they're
two very different things, but theyare. We don't have anything recorded,
but you know, he wasn't chargedwith anything in that time period. By
nineteen twenty two, Mahon had beenpromoted to sales manager, and he was

(14:41):
on the very respectable wage for thetime of around forty two pounds a month.
But are we not talking about that'sthousands of pounds a month relatively,
it's about yeah grand, seven grandat this point a month. Yeah,

(15:05):
I know, it's a decent wage, more than a decent wage. Yeah.
Now. Mahone's new duties frequently tookhim into the city of London to
visit the offices of other insurance firmsthat his firm dealt with, and it
was on just such a visit inAugust of nineteen twenty three when he met
the thirty seven year old Emily Bailbyk Emily was working as a typist and

(15:31):
private secretary for the father actually ofthe author, Ian Hay. She was
smart, pretty single, and maybemost importantly to Mahon, had significant savings
amounting to about five six hundred pounds. Okay, So I mean, I'm

(15:52):
gonna I'm gonna drag you back aminute, because I was just I was
just thinking that there's several cases ofserial killers and things taking a gap so
that that I'm just thinking out loudhere about when you said that we don't
have any recorded crimes for him.So there's a possibility that the new job
filled his brain space almost and sohe didn't have that desire to do something.

(16:15):
So there's a possibility that he didn'tdo that very possible. But this
man seems very driven by money.He's driven by money and adultery, two
of the lovely things in life.Money and adultery. You can bring You
can bring most cases down to moneyor sex. Well, I mean,

(16:37):
I've always said, as you know, to me, it tends to always
boil down to money. Most ofthe cases we talk about are either insurance,
there's insurance involved in it, orthere's theft of something, or there's
lack of money, can of poverty, so that the extremes of cash on

(17:00):
a massive driver, and a lotof the cases we talk about they are
now when we look back on itnow. It's easy to ask what an
intelligent young lady like Emily k couldsee in mahone. But he was certainly
charismatic, and he had a talentfor charming ladies as well as a talent
for lying through his teeth. Heintroduced himself to Emily with a false name,

(17:25):
Derek Patterson, and the pair soonbegan a heated affair, shall we
say a passion They fell in lust. It was certainly passion on Emily's part.
I think actually Emily fell in lovewith mahone completely because she was unperturbed

(17:45):
when she learned that he'd lied abouthis name, and she was almost unperturbed
that he already had a wife andchildren. But she definitely knew about it.
Okay, It makes you wonder,then, why the fake name,
Why the pretense? If he's happyfor her to know the details about his

(18:10):
life, why not the name.The name only lasted I think one or
two weeks according to his account anyway, not that we can be one hundred
percent sure that his account is accurate, obviously, yeah. True. Now,
approximately three months after Mahon and Emilybegan their affair, she discovered,
to her joy that she was pregnant, her joy probably not his, No,

(18:36):
not his joy. In March,however, the same year, she
became ill with influenza, and torecuperate, she traveled to the coastal resort
town of Bournemouth. Right beside whereI am right now. How far from
you? Meters not meters? It'sabout a ten minute bus journey. I

(18:56):
actually did look into the possibility ofrecording this in the same hotel that they
stayed at. Oh, that'd becool, man. Yeah. But then
but then I sprung this recording onyou. So here we are. Well,
it wasn't just that it's turned intoa very boisterous young sports bar.

(19:18):
Now it's not the place for usall. It's not the place for us.
Take some photos though, so wecan post them. I absolutely will.
Yeah, I will take some photosof the building so that people can
have a good look on the Facebook. Now. She was there to recuperate,
obviously, but Mahon soon joined her, and when he joined her,
he presented her with a diamond andsapphire cluster engagement ring, which he'd bought

(19:42):
earlier from a jewelers in Southampton.Okay, so he's gone big biscuits on
this. Then, he has gonebig biscuits. And that night, the
same night he gave her the ring, the pair shared a room at the
Southwestern Hotel, which is where thesports bar is now, and Mahon signed
the register as mister and missus P. H. Mahon. Okay, so

(20:07):
he's committed. He's committed to something, right, Okay. Emily, on
the other hand, was committed.The engagement ring convinced Emily that Mahon was
serious about marrying her, and shetold her friends and family that soon she
would have a wedding date and thatshe and Mahon were planning to emigrate to
South Africa after they'd tied the knot. She left out some details, such

(20:32):
as the fact that their marriage wouldbe bigamous, or the fact that in
February of nineteen twenty four, shewithdrew four hundred and four pounds from her
savings, which was either given directlyto Mahon or was spent on her future
plans with him. I'm doing therough maths based on what you've told us
about inflation, So you know,eighty ninety grand yeah about that? Yeah?

(20:57):
Between yeah? Between yeah, probablybetwe ninety a lot of money,
a lot of money. As themonths slipped by, Mahon began to worry
that his wife would again discover hisinfidelity. He probably worried even more so
than before, since Emily was,as I mentioned, pregnant with his child.

(21:21):
Now he convinced Emily to stay withhim for a number of weeks in
a holiday bungalow that he had rentedwith the money that she'd given him.
Mahon would himself later claim that thiswas supposed to be a love experiment,
a sort of trial run living togetherbefore he left his wife. Jesse.

(21:41):
Okay, so is he telling herthat or himself? He's telling authorities that
He's telling authorities that it was heridea and that it was meant to be
a love experiment living together before heleft his wife. I don't like the
words love experiment. It really hisworks makes me feel a bit ecky.
If I'm being honest, it isand and I think it's bollocks. In

(22:06):
reality, this was a way toget Emily to a secluded and a quiet
place where nobody was likely to seeor hear him while he carried out the
grim task that he was planning.The bungalow they rented was known as Officer's
House and it was located in aspot well out of the way alongside the

(22:26):
shingle beach known as the Crumbles betweenEastbourne and Pevensey Bay, and Mahone had
rented it under the false name ofmister Waller. Okay, so he's I
mean, we already know that he'squite happy to lie about who he is.
But so that's not a surprise thathe's just going to put it under

(22:47):
some fucking no. He's a serialprevaricator. Yeah, my favorite term for
liar. There. I didn't wantto dive into I've already talked about your
flowers, the language the night alkedair. So what was it again? Gives
that again? Prevaricator? Pro varicator? Yeah, okay, I like it.
That's a good word. Yeah.Now. Emily Kay is known to

(23:08):
have traveled to Eastbourne on the seventhof April. She stayed for five days
at the Kenilworth Court Hotel before travelingon to Officer's house on the twelfth of
April, having informed his wife hewas to travel on business. I've just
made quotation marks with my hands forour listeners for several days. Mahon also

(23:33):
traveled to the Bungalow on the weekendof the twelfth to the thirteenth of April.
He told Emily via telegram to meethim at Eastbourne Railway station. Before
traveling to Eastbourne, Mahon is knownto have purchased a ten inch chef's knife
and a hack saw from an ironmonger'slocated close to London Victoria Station. Grim

(23:57):
Tools, Very Grim Tools. Now. Mahon would later claim that on the
fifteenth of April, while that officer'shouse, he and Emily got into an
argument over his reluctance to leave hiswife, Jesse. He stated that Emily
became angry and threw an axe athim before assaulting him. During the ensuing

(24:21):
scuffle, he claimed that Emily fellover a deck chair and hit her head
on the corner of a coal scuttle. According to Mahon, upon failing to
revive her, he only realized towardsdaybreak the next day what a fool he
had been not to attempt to seekmedical assistance. Oops. Yeah, now

(24:45):
this is I think fairly obviously ahuge pack of lies. I was going
to say, like, we alreadyknow he's a liar. Yeah, you've
already you reckon that she was properlyin love with this man. I reckon
she was properly in love with soand we've not seen anything from her before
to give reason for a violent outburst. No, and most of the details

(25:08):
of this story will be disproved byforensic evidence later on. Okay, I
shall allow you to carry on,but I'm going to go with I'm calling
horseshit on this moment. You're notwrong what we do know is that on
the fifteenth of April, Mahon murderedEmily in Officer's house. He covered her

(25:30):
corpse with a fur coat, andthen he went to bed for the night
the next The next day, withEmily's body still lying in Officer's house,
Mahon selt a telegram to another woman, Ethel Duncan, inviting her down to
the Bungalow to spend the Easter weekendwith him. He instructed her to meet

(25:53):
him at the train station on theeighteenth of April two days later. There's
an extra residency available now somebody elseisn't using it anymore. Yeah, I
actually I'm sad on myself for sayingthat. Carry on, she's only just
cold. It's probably a naven fuckingcold man. Now. Over the two

(26:15):
days before Ethel Duncan arrives, Mahonstarts dismembering Emily K's body using the large
knife and the hack saw that he'dpurchased before going to Eastbourne. He first
severed her head and legs and stuffedthe body and the bits into a large
traveling trunk for the time being.Another trunk murder, alistair is another trunk

(26:37):
murder. Yeah, but there's notrains. You can't push your button.
I was gonna say, I don'thave the button here otherwise. Yeah,
okay, but later on there isan opportunity for you to push the button.
How annoyed are you going to be? I'm gonna have to put that
in and post a yeah you willnow. Mahon met Ethel Duncan at the
trade station on the eighteenth. Althoughhe was actually very very late and she

(27:00):
noticed that his wrist was bandaged,he claimed that this was the result of
saving an old lady from falling offa bus. I mean he is a
hero, after all, we knowthat about him. Yeah, we're a
legend. Mahon and Ethel Duncan spentthree days at Officer's house, with Mahon
spending extravagantly insisting that the two dinenightly at lavish restaurants and on one occasion

(27:26):
even visiting the London Palladium. Allthe time, yeah lovely, But all
the time, Emily Kay's body isin the trunk in Officer's house. Fucking
hell. The two parted company onEaster Monday, and Mahon returns to Officer's
house, where he continued to dismemberand dispose of Emily's body. Over the

(27:49):
following week, Emily Kay's body wasextensively dismembered. Her head, feet,
and legs were incinerated in the fireplaceof the bungalow, and on the twenty
second of April. Mahon later pulverizedthese bits into tremendously small fragments. Those
are the words of the forensic examiner, which he claims to have discarded over

(28:15):
the garden wall of Officer's House.But no sections of Emily K's skull were
ever actually recovered. A section ofher jawbone and several of her teeth were
found in a refuse heap, notanywhere near the cottage, no one near
the cottage. Also, the majorityof her uterus and her unborn child were
never found. Oh Man Mahon returnsto the bungalow on the twenty sixth of

(28:40):
April. Because I should point outhe's also popping up to see his wife
every now and again, of course, because he's not an idiot. Riddle,
Sorry, clarify the timeframe we're talkingabout. How long was he in
Officer's House? Four? So hewent down, he went He went down
for a couple of weeks, Isthat right? Yeah, he went down

(29:03):
he rented the cottage for I thinkthree weeks, and in that three week
period is met his second wife tobe and ended her life, and then
invited another woman down and then goneback to the task at hand. Shall
we say of disposing of the body, of dismembering and disposing of the body.

(29:27):
But it was the it was ethelin Officers Cottage, Officers house,
yes, whilst the body was inthe trunk, yes, but without I
don't suppose it would have been decomposingby that. But would she would be

(29:51):
aware? I had no idea apartfrom the bandage on his arm when he
met her at the train station.She had no idea. Sorry, I
like I was listening to you.It's just like that's a lot to process
in a short view. No,I absolutely know. And he's also he's
popping back occasionally to visit his wifeso that she's not suspicious. So Mahon

(30:14):
returns to the bungalow on the twentysixth after visiting his wife to continue this
member in the body. He seversthe arms and the torso into small pieces,
before hacking the torso itself into sections. Some of the sections of her
body were boiled on this day.These portions were bags which Mahon threw out
of the window of a railway carriagewhile he was returning home to his wife

(30:37):
in Richmond. So he took themon a train with him. Yes,
stood, it's like broken int heYes. Now. Mahon was quite prescient
in one respect his concern that hiswife Jesse, might grow suspicious. She
indeed had grown suspicious. I'm notsurprised he's just spent three weeks away with

(31:00):
another woman. Yeah, And onthe thirtieth of April, she personally hired
a detective inspector to investigate Mahon.That officer was Detective Inspector John Beard.
Great name. There's a couple ofgood names coming up, Bob. Now,
while searching the pockets of one ofMahon's suits, Jesse finds a left

(31:23):
luggage ticket dated the twenty eighth ofApril for a bag which had been left
at Waterloo station in SoundBite. Heredo you want me to put it in
here? Y'll put it in post. It's fine. She showed the ticket
to Detective Inspector Beard, and togetherthey both went to the station to investigate

(31:45):
the bag. Okay, they presentedthe ticket to the station staff. They
opened the locked Gladstone bag with thehelp of station staff, and they were
alarmed to find that it contained largebloodstained knife, some blood soaked cloth,

(32:05):
and blood soaked clothing. So Iwas literally about to stop you and say
did they wish they hadn't opened it? Because they just about to find the
bits of a body? But theydidn't find the bits of the body.
They found they knife, Yeah,the knife that he'd used to begin the
dismemberment, and they found the clothesthat she was wearing and the cloth that

(32:29):
he'd used to wrap some of thebody bits in Horrible still still horrible,
I know, I bet they stillthey absolutely regretted finding that bag. Yes,
they would have done. It wasshocking. But John Beard very cleverly
persuaded Jesse to return the tickets toher husband's suit. He then contacted Scotland

(32:51):
Yard to report the discovery. JohnBeard's smart, he is good. Scotland
Yard sent inspector person say, Savage, Percy, we've got John Beard and
Percy Savage. Yeah, I'd listento that podcast. I tell you,
Savage and Beard presents it sounds likea Channel five crime drama. Beard now

(33:20):
Percy Savage extracted a small sample ofcloth from the bag to undergo forensic testing.
The analysis of this small sample revealedthe stains to be human blood.
So he posts two undercover policemen tothe station with instructions to arrest Mahon when
he arrived to collect the bag.Oh so just like, don't go for

(33:42):
him now, but we have towait to prove that he's going to come
to get the bag. Like exactly, great policing. I'm enjoying this,
very good policing. There's also someexcellent forensic work later in this. At
six fifteen pm on the second ofMay, Mahon returned for the bag and
he was immediately arrested by the twoofficers. He was taken first to Kennington

(34:05):
Police Station, where Inspector Savage collectedhim and escorted him to Scotland Yard where
the bag could be opened and properlyinspected, because they had just literally resealed
it and chucked it back in baggageclaim. So I've got to wonder I
was about to make a note ofthis stash yet later, but I'm just
asking just now, if he hadn'tgone back, would there have been a

(34:27):
record of it being him? LikeI presume there was a process to purchasing
the left luggage locker as such,there would there definitely would now, Yeah,
I'm just wondering if he would havebeen just been given a key,
who are you pay your money?I don't know if there would then it's

(34:51):
just an interesting thought, like thereturning to the crime, and we're going
back to that like proof of otherpeople doing things and would have never get
into the mindset or brain space ofthese people because mainly I don't want to.
But could he have walked away atthat moment and never have been found?

(35:12):
Technically I don't think he would neverhave been found because in his case,
his wife had found the ticket.Yeah, okay, fine, yet
so she knew and Beard knew.Yeah, but if his wife hadn't found
that ticket, and he'd been ableto fully dispose of Emily K's body,

(35:34):
it's quite possible he would have gottenaway with murder. Yeah, it's literally
I was just thinking that, likeif he'd burned that ticket on his way
out of the chain station, justset fire to it's gone. No,
would anybody have ever looked in thatlocker for something like obviously at some point
they would have emptied that locker,but by that point he could have been

(35:57):
long, long gone, he couldhave run away with probably. Yeah,
the bag was opened at Scotland Yard. The contents were inspected properly and they
were revealed to be female clothing,a long length of silk, both heavily
blood stained, and the cook's knife, which Mahon had bought before going to

(36:19):
Eastbourne. All of this was heavilystained with blood and body grease and sprinkled
with disinfect him so he'd made anattempt to cover it. Yes, there
was also a canvas racket bag whichhad Emily Kay's initials on it. That's
a bad that's a bad one toleave behind. Like, that's a serious

(36:40):
clue, right there is. WhenInspector Savage asked Mahon at Scotland Yard why
the contents of his bag included aknife and silk and clothing heavily stained with
blood, Mahon stated, I'm veryfond of dogs. I suppose I carried
home some dog meat for our petdogs in that bag. No, No,

(37:07):
Inspector Savage wasn't buying it. Obviously, he already knew from forensic testing
that it was human blood. Andhe pointed out that they already knew the
blood was human and also that nobodywraps dog's meat in silk clothing. Yeah,
fair enough. During the initial questioning, Mahon was incredibly evasive in response

(37:28):
to how the blood stained items cameto be in his possession, but after
several hours of questioning by Percy Savage, Mahon suddenly became silent, remarking,
I'm considering my position. He's saidto have quietly considered for about fifteen minutes
before saying, I suppose you knoweverything already. I'll tell you the truth.

(37:53):
Okay, But he's shut He shothimself and he's realized that he's done
for He knows, he knows theyknow it's blood. He knows that they
could probably follow his trail to Officer'shouse, and we know that they know
that Emily's missing at this point,Yes, it doesn't take a genius to

(38:13):
add all those points together. No, So Mahon then tells Percy Savage his
false version of the events of Emily'sdeath, that she fell on a coal
fell when they were arguing and hither head on a coal scuttles, as
happens all the time it does.Mahan also claimed falsely to have bought the

(38:38):
kitchen's knife after the fifteenth of April. So after Emily's death when he panicked,
he said, and decided to dismemberand dispose of Emily's body. Okay,
so his story as such is she'sdied while we're there, I've shot

(38:59):
my pant and I thought nobody's gonnabelieve me and they get rid of her.
But I also need to get myend away, so I might as
well phone Ethyl. Well, hedidn't mention Ethel, but he claimed he
never told the authorities about her.But he definitely claims that he panicked after

(39:20):
Emily's death, and that was whenhe went out, having decided to dismember
and dispose of her body, tobuy the knife and the hack saw.
Now we know, and the authoritiesknew that he bought the knife and the
saw days before Emily's death, provingpre meditation not just to murder her,
but for the dismemberment and the disposalas well. Yeah, so he we

(39:45):
know by his purchases that he wasThis was not a short term moment,
it was a plan. Yeah,this was premeditated. As Mahon was being
questioned, police were searching Officer's house. Sections of Emily's dismembered body were found
within the traveling trunk engraved with herinitials. Oddly enough, Inspector Savage placed

(40:08):
the trunk in the scullery of theproperty before contacting Scotland Yard Sir Bernard Spillsbury,
another name that the famous forensic pathologistmany times. He arrived in Eastbourne
on the fourth of May to assistin the recovery and in the examination of
the remains. Spillsbury traveled to thebungalow to look at the body and he

(40:34):
found pieces literally everywhere, including somethat had been partially boiled over the fire.
There were organs in biscuit tins,there was body grease and human blood
splashed all over the house. Hewould say later that this was the most
gruesome crime scene he had ever encountered. That is saying something he as a

(40:57):
forensic pathologist at that time frame mightit wouldn't have been his first rodeo seeing
a dead body, and obviously itprobably wasn't his first rodeo seeing quite a
I don't want the brutal, butquite a horrific murder. No, he'd
probably seen a number of mutilations inhis time, but this, even with
that in mind, his task thistime was rather unpleasant. He had to

(41:19):
collect the hundreds upon hundreds of fragmentsand bits of Emily Ky's body, already
several days decomposed, and to thebest of his ability to reconstruct the body,
to prove identity and to ascertain,if possible, the cause of death.
That's a really it's a really grimjigsaw, like based on the fact

(41:46):
that, did you say it wastwo different attempts, two different periods of
dismembering, between taking the head andthe arms and everything off in the first
instance, the boiling of it.It's just that actually makes me feel quite
sick thinking about that. Like obviouslya lot of the shit we talk about

(42:07):
makes me feel quite sick if I'mbeing honest. There's this membering you can
part to one side because we've talkedabout it a lot. The physically going
back and taking the time to stripthe meat from the bone just removes humanity
from it entirely. It's hideous.It's the lack of empathy required to do

(42:30):
that. I find almost unbelievable.Spillsbury found amongst the bits a bruised shoulder
that indicated a sharp blow infricted predeath, so anti mortem anti mortem not
heard that one before. But itmakes perfect sense. Okay, yeah,

(42:52):
the opposite of post mortem, ofcourse it is. But yes, pre
mortem, yeah, exactly pre mortem. However, despite this shoulder, once
the body was assembled, Spillsbury discoveredthat Emily K's head obviously, as I
mentioned, her uterus, a unbornchild, and her entire right leg and
hip were all missing. Oh,since Mahon claimed that Emily had hit her

(43:19):
head without it, Spillsbury could notdefinitively establish a cause of death. Nevertheless,
he found that she could not havedied from hitting her head on the
coal bucket as Mahon claimed, becauseit showed no sign of blood, hair,
or damage. So that this coalscuttle itself the proving point there.

(43:45):
So you don't you don't need thehead to prove the head hasn't been damaged.
Yeah, well in the way thathe claimed, Thank you, that's
what I meant. Yeah. So, Patrick Mahon was formerly charged for the
murder of Emily K on the sixthof May. His trial took place at

(44:09):
the Lose the Sizes on the fifteenthof July nineteen twenty four before Judge mister
Justice Avery another name we've come acrossbefore. We have come across before.
Yeah, and he was actually thesame judge who presided over the previous Crumble
murder trial which you'll cover the killingof Irene Monroe four years before. Mahon

(44:31):
would be defended by J. D. Castles, who was actually also the
man who defended Irene Monroe's killers.Okay, Mahon pled not guilty to murder.
Now. J D. Castles didhis best, given the wealth of
hard evidence against his defendant, buthe was fighting a losing battle from the

(44:52):
start. His closing statement to thejury finished with the words, have you
before you an inhuman monster or aman who is the victim of the most
extraordinary combination of circumstances? Is thisa lemony snicket? Or did he kill

(45:13):
it? No, it's not alemony snicket. It's not a lemony snicket.
The chief prosecutor was Sir Henry CurtisBennett, who did an excellent job
of proving premeditation with the receipts forthe knife and the saw, as well
as establishing the double motive of initialfinancial gain and the subsequent need to silence

(45:37):
Emily after she fell pregnant. Soit's I mean, it's I know,
we said this like twenty minutes ago, but it's literally it's all about the
money, Yes it is. SirBernard Spilsbury's medical testimony was crucial. He
testified on the third day I thinkit was of Mahon's trial. He supported

(46:01):
prosecution's belief that Emily K could nothave sustained any fatal injury from hitting her
head on the coal scuttle. Hedismissed Mahons's claim that Emily's death had been
accidental as preposterous. Spillsbury testified thatthe extensive bruising about one of Emily K's

(46:22):
shoulders led him to suspect that shehad been bludgeoned to death with an axe
handle that was incidentally missing from thebungalow, and which, along with her
skull and uterus, were never found. Spillsbury further stated that, contrary to
Mahons's claim, Emily could not havethrown an axe at him prior to the

(46:45):
two engaging in a scuffle because nowalls, doors or door frames within Officer's
house or any evidence of having beenstruck with an axe, so there was
no impact damage to anything exactly.Spillsbury also proved grimly that human bone could
be nearly completely destroyed by burning andpulverizing. He did this by experimenting on

(47:08):
sheep's heads, performing the exact sameactions that Mahn was suspected of, incinerating
them on a coal fire, andthen pulverizing the severely charged bits into tiny
fragments. It's really interesting that actually, because he's a fantastic scientist, Spillsbury,
I was going to say, likethe ability to follow that level of

(47:35):
what am I trying to say here, to follow that thread all the way
through to go, well, doyou know what, I'm going to give
this a goal and see because whenwe've talked to and I'm sure we've definitely
talked about certainly if I haven't done, I have done in the Dean when
they burn it, there is evidenceleft in a coal fire. But that

(47:58):
I suppose the removal and then thepolarizing of it is the next step to
the post of what I'm looking forfor I crime the disposal, thank you.
Yeah. Whereas now one hundred yearslater you'd probably get a DNA test

(48:19):
off. Yeah, you almost certainlycould. Now it's very difficult to completely
eradicate DNA in today's day and age. Whereas this was a case of its
time where you just go, well, there's no way they're going to find
this out. But Spillsbury's gone challengeaccepted, p I'll watch this, Yeah,

(48:40):
and he proved that it was possible. So the trial concludes on the
nineteenth of July nineteen twenty four.The jury deliberates for forty five minutes before
returning with a verdict of guilty.You shock me, I know. Upon
hearing the verse, Mahone loudly spokeout concerning what he saw as the bitterness

(49:05):
and the unfairness of Justice Avery's biasedhandling of the case. So this this
guy was a cut too. Hewas because in reality, from what I've
read, the trial was conducted incrediblyfairly. And as as we said a
minute ago, I think I'm prettysure we've heard about justice every before.
I have certainly if we if he'dbeen a bad judge, I would have

(49:30):
remembered him better. If it wassomething that I went and ship it's that
guy again. It was certainly notone that jumps to mind them. And
he's well, I mean, he'sfollowed due process in this case, and
he's had evidence presented to him,and I presume at this point he's going
to don a little hat. He'sgoing to don his black cap and he's

(49:52):
going to say, Patrick Herbert Mahon, the jury have arrived at the only
proper conclusion on the evidence that waslaid before them. They have arrived at
that conclusion without knowing anything of yourpast life. There can be no question
that you deliberately designed the death ofthis woman. For that crime, you

(50:14):
must suffer the penalty imposed by thelaw. The sentence of the court upon
you is that you be taken fromthis place to a lawful prison, and
then to a place of execution,and that you there be hanged by the
neck until you be dead, andthat your body be afterwards buried within the
precincts of the prison wherein you shallhave been confined before your execution. And

(50:38):
may the Lord have mercy upon yoursoul skin. To the point al where
we both read out the latter partof that statement by Jorge that I reckon
we can both do it drunk.Yeah, it's true. Now we're getting
to the end. Mahon was hangedfor the murder of bellby k on the

(51:00):
third of September. He went tothe gallows quietly, but protested his innocence
to the very end. Never admittingresponsibility for what he'd done. Bastard he
was. He's top of our list. But there is one, not a

(51:20):
ray of hope, But there's there'sone good thing that came out of this
case. Apart from the obvious emotionaldamage and the grief suffered by her family
and friends, the most notable lastingeffect of the horrible killing of Emily K
was the vast improvement in police forensicprocedures. Sir Bernard Spillsbury was appalled by

(51:45):
the handling of the crime scene atOfficer's house, by the lack of care
in preserving the evidence and the lackof preventing contamination of the scene. As
a direct result of this, Spillsbury, alongside with a doctor Scott Gillett and
Inspector Percy Savage, compiled a listof standard procedures which officers would follow on

(52:09):
any crime scene, which was firstinstigated by the Metropolitan Police and later by
all forces across the country. Theyalso created the first standard forensic kit,
later known as the murder Bag,to be used on all future crime scenes.
Wow, that's really cool. Iwonder how much of that still stands

(52:34):
in modern policing. Just like outof a like the Spillsbury kit. I
wonder how much of that still stillexists. Yeah, I mean imagine a
huge amounts of it will have beenchanged. But the first thing that jumped
to mind when you were talking aboutthere was we talked about cases where they
use the crime scene as like alocal fucking tourist attraction, almost where they

(52:58):
allowed people to go in and outof it, and you're just absolutely smashing
any evidence to bits at that point. Yeah, I bet, I bet
a lot of the bag has beenupgraded. I would also bet that considering
Spillsbury, I bet a lot ofthe procedures are still in force. I
bet a lot of the procedures fornot contaminating crime scenes that he instigated right

(53:23):
back then are still used today.Yes, So remove the technology advances that
the fact that you don't pick thatup like the simple things that we know
about just by having watched enough bloodycrime dramas, any samples taken, use
gloves so you don't contaminate evidence.Not everyone can walk through this scene untethered

(53:45):
like everything has to be. Ibet a lot of that's probably still Spillsbury's.
It would not surprise me. Oneday we'll have to try and get
a cop to come and chat toas aally and just like a probably out
you know, forensic copper or aDII or somebody's there would know if if

(54:09):
a Spillsbury kit is something that theyknow about, or whether it's just us
being very romantic about this moment.It would also be interesting, I think,
to visit a police museum if theyhad, you know, a nineteen
twenties, nineteen thirties Spillsbury kit,well, do you know? Funnily enough,

(54:30):
I looked at when we met upin London last week and I had
a look just in case you guyscouldn't make it up to see what was
in. And the Police Crime Museumthat's in London, it's only opening.
I mean, I don't think it'sopened all the time. I don't think
it's like just a museum that youcan go to, but they have some
of the most horrible things that Imight be wrong, but I think it

(54:52):
might be there where the bucking Hairskin bound book is still on shore of
that so I bet they've got amurder bag. I bet there's a nineteen
twenty eight, nineteen thirties murder bagor or record of in that kind that
would be my guest to where itwould be fascinating. We'll have to do

(55:14):
We'll have to do it. Oneday, we'll make it. Twisted field
Trip, Twisted Field Trip, Twistedpubbed her slash field Trip. Yeah,
so he was, he was sentencedand hanged. I presume, yes he
was not presume I know you've justtold me. Yeah, third of September,

(55:36):
nineteen twenty four, never admitting hisguilt, never did no professor innocence
to the end. Do you knowwhat happened to his wife? Did she
just? Jesse went on, hertwo kids, grew up, She disavowed
her husband after the murder, butshe stuck by him right up until he

(55:58):
was convicted. That's fucking mad init. I mean, it's not the
only case we've heard of partners stickingwith them, whether it male or female.
I mean, it tends to bemale perpetrators and women sticking with them,
because the women we talk about tendto be black widows and poisoners,
and they have killed their partners.But a, yeah, Jesse should have

(56:25):
done one quicker than that. Ifeel, I agree, but I Meaneen
nineteen eleven, nineteen twenty could youdivorce? I don't think so. I'm
not gonna put my I'm not gonnaput my I'm gonna put my name on

(56:45):
the line here in alistair. ButI don't think you, or if you
could, it would have been itwould have to be consensual. And no,
it wouldn't have not even consensually.She couldn't have brought it up.
It would have been a make Yeah, I don't think she could have brought
up That's what I mean. Yeah, which is which is terrible. I

(57:06):
bet she felt fucking lucky it wasn'ther, yes, because it could have
quite easily been her instead of Emily. And not that I'm saying that that
makes it any okay, but no, nothing makes it okay. But I
do think you're right. I thinkif mahonne is the kind of financially motivated,

(57:31):
remorseless person that if he'd found somebodyrich enough, replacing his wife would
not have caused him any moral problemswhatsoever. Yeah, that's kind of what
I was getting, like, shewas easy to remove. But actually he,
based on what you've told me thisevening, he thought he was going

(57:52):
to get away with it and justgo back to his wife and carry on.
Yeah, he did I'd probably doit again a way that he would
have. If he's got away withit, he might have been a serial
killer. Well, well done toour Beard Detective Inspector Beard Detective Inspector Percy

(58:13):
Savage, and Sir Bernard Spillsbury.Beard, Savage and Spillsbury is a podcast
I would listen to. Not thankyou for that, Ali, because it
was fucking it's grim. It's grim. I took the the grimmer of the

(58:36):
two crumbles murders. Yes, youhave, and I'm good to not rewrite,
but I will take the one thatyou've written, and I thank you
for writing that. That was youdidn't have to do that, And I'll
do I'll write it and I'll notrewrite it, but I'll structure it in
a way there where you can stillask me questions even though it's your script.

(58:57):
Yeah, because I think this maybeour fall down in all of this.
People will have already listened to episodeone by the time this one comes
out. If episode one was ship, we will not write each other script
again. Let's just let's go withthat. I think you'll be granted.
If I was you, I wouldput it in bob words one hundred.
Well, I've read it. Itold you this when we met up in
London. I actually listened to it. I used the word Microsoft word reading

(59:23):
to when it reads it to you, and I went, that's cool.
It's about forty odd minutes. Butit's not how I would write it.
But I will go back and Iwill look it up and I will read
it rewrite it for you. Sothank you. Before we sign off this
evening, how Southern England are yougoing to stay with your podcast for the

(59:46):
next week? While I think I'mreally enjoying Southern England and the more local
cases. But we talked about thisin the videos recently with Mike Yeah,
which was a great thing for mebecause he's mildly my inspiration for this.
I've been looking more and more locallyfor the cases, and less nationally and

(01:00:09):
less generally. There's so much historylocally if you just care to look for
it, it's fabulous. The onething I would say is its major podcast
less French, which was for awhile. That's these cases are at least
British. Well that they are.They are ticking all the boxes and that's

(01:00:30):
why I'm not stopping you crack onbecause that is twisted and Britain. So
you're you're hitting literally all the pointsthat we need right now. Thank you
for that, alsis to night.That was. You know, it was
interesting because I found of love forwonderful policing recently, and I think that's

(01:00:51):
been a that was a good onefor that. It was there was some
excellent policing and some fantastic improvement inpolicing and in forensic procedure came about because
of this case. Yeah, yeah, that's cool. Man. Like I
like the fact that, oh,you know, well, I mean,
you know me. I like thefirst fingerprint, the first use of dogs,

(01:01:12):
the first that anything that changes thepolice force to make it better in
society. It's something that I lovebecause you're like, that's a moment.
That's a moment that changed something.It's not just a moment that sadly somebody
loses their life, but like,something's happened positively off the back of a

(01:01:37):
horrible thing. And if we cantake any solace from anything, if positive
comes out of negative, then society'swinning. I suppose I'm not taking away
from Emily's murder in any way,and I don't know, not in any
way, shape or form, butit is It's rare that you can see
a genuine positive change in policing,and this is a definite positive change in

(01:02:01):
policing. Well done police. Areyou clicking something? Maybe stop it.
Put that fucking star hairclip. It'sa star hairclip, bob. And on
that note, I'm going to leaveyou this evening, as I always do,

(01:02:22):
with a thank you, love youbye, sorry, love you bye.
In fact, you know what youshould always finish with a sorry,
love you bye, Thank you verymuch. Alison will beeach against it?
Thanka you view bye? Can youhear yourself? Thanka you Bye.