May 19, 2025 • 63 mins
Some men think marriage means control, a game of blackmail sealed with secrets. Mark-Eric Ponsati thought he’d silenced his wife for good. But some things refuse to stay buried. Even in death, they’d come back to haunt him.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Sword and Scale contains adult themes and violence, and is
not intended for all audiences.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Listener discretion is advised.
Speaker 3 (00:15):
My children. Oh my god.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
This one was produced by one of our longtime producers,
Miss barber Way. This season twelve, episode two ninety four
of Sword and Scale, a show that reveals that the
worst monsters are real.
Speaker 4 (01:00):
Mm hm.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
It's Thursday night, nine fifty eight pm.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
Oh my god, Oh my god, what's on?
Speaker 5 (01:51):
You?
Speaker 4 (01:51):
Give me your address?
Speaker 3 (01:54):
My one free two nine North Jamaica Way. Gilbert is all.
Speaker 4 (02:01):
Right, one three to nine North Jamaica, Ja.
Speaker 3 (02:04):
Maakeaway. We have children house. I just saw my wife.
Speaker 4 (02:08):
I think she's What happened? Oh no, no, I don't
know if are you breathing?
Speaker 2 (02:15):
No?
Speaker 6 (02:18):
Okay, hold on, hold on, hold on, limbs.
Speaker 4 (02:21):
Gets you over to.
Speaker 5 (02:22):
Fire hold on.
Speaker 3 (02:23):
Oh my goodness.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
In a tan two story house adorned with palm trees
and cacti, thirty six year old Mark Eric Pinsatti crouch
next to his unresponsive wife, thirty three year old Sherry Pensatti.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
Okay, and there are children in the house. I think
I just found my wife. She's not breathing, she's I
believe she's she's in the bathroom and there's water and
soap everywhere, and there's blood I think. Okay, there's there's
a big and medoma. Oh my god, my shoulder, my shoulder.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
Mark was hysterical. He kept repeating that he and Sherry's
children were home. He didn't know what happened. All he
saw was wet bathroom and his beautiful wife lying naked
and a mess of blood and liq with soap.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
To be fair, take a deep breath from me. Okay, okay,
I need to have a clear understanding of exactly what's
going on.
Speaker 5 (03:17):
I have Okay, I.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
Find my wife. Okay, sorry, okay's I mean?
Speaker 5 (03:23):
I mean?
Speaker 3 (03:24):
Okay, okay, all right, I understand, sir. I'm okay, okay, okay.
My my wife is on the bathroom floor unresponsive. Look,
I'm empty certified. I am in the military. Okay, I'm
I'm a soldier, so I am used to this. But
my wife and okay, she's unresponsive. Okay, can you do
(03:47):
your firt CPR? Okay? How old is your wife? My
wife was thirty three. O God, I'm telling you you're
not dreaming. No, there's no moments, there's no call, there's
no function.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
What the fuck Mark was a certified EMT and a
military man, but to see this much blood pooling around
the woman he shared his life with was unbearable.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
Was she underwater or how did this happen to? You know?
We were taking a bath early in the day as
I left during the backup, I went through sleep and
I woke up and she wasn't next to me, so
she for her I think the bath and her legs
were in the way. It was really pale and no way.
Speaker 7 (04:30):
Say you're on the fucking floor.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
Okay, all right, so my spending as you're with her earlier,
you guys were only baths. You went to take a
nap and then you came back, and she is not
responsible to you, all right, I mean, hiver, let's get
her flat on her back. What she's in her back?
She's in her back. She'sn't okay because a big im
over her fucking head. I think she's Oh my god,
I think she slipped. I know she hit a fucking corner.
(04:56):
Oh my god, Oh my god, she fucking slipped and
fell O mother sucker. Fill Okay, let's let's all CPR. Okay,
your knee instructions, Okay, isn't she'll hang in the house. However,
please don't fucking traumatize them. Okay, I don't know how
(05:18):
to deal with this with them. I don't Why don't
see traumatized.
Speaker 8 (05:23):
There?
Speaker 3 (05:24):
Maybe have them leave the room and then you can
start sleeping. Sleep, We're all sleep.
Speaker 5 (05:30):
Okay, okay.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Six year old Maddie and her baby brother, eighteen year
old Max, were asleep in their bedroom stay in the hall.
Mark continued to cry and struggle as he talked to
nine one one.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
Give me a favorite. Get the heel of your hand
in the center of her chest. Put your other hand
on top of the let's start CPR. Okay, sir, she's purple,
she's fucking I'm telling you, I know what you guys
look like. I'm gonna again stand more a veteran.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
Okay, okay, all she's gone, sir, Market scene death over sees.
You've sure the dispatcher that Sherry was long gone.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
I'll tell you what. Let me get your name and
do me a favorite. Step outside so that you can
talk to the medics. Okay, oh yeah, okay, all right, sir,
let me get your name. Don't go with fucking tireds glaring. Okay,
I don't want to make kids to beat fucking trauma site. Okay, okay,
what is your name? Mark Ericson said, oh my god, okay,
may I may I talk to two of three six, four, five, seven,
(06:26):
eight eight? Yes, may I cover her with it? She's naked,
and may I cover her. Let's not do that. Let's
let's medics get there. My child like, okay, why you
sit there in bed?
Speaker 2 (06:37):
Right? No?
Speaker 8 (06:39):
No, no ah right?
Speaker 3 (06:42):
I thought you said they were in bed, so let's
say there in bed. I'm gonna yes, they're dead, they're perfect, okay,
so do me a favorite. I'm losing it. I'm sorry,
I'm losing it. I understand like a deep breast. Yeah,
go ahead, go go outside. I gotta talk to the medics. Okay,
go outside. Okay, I'm going to god. Okay, perfect. They're
almost un scene for you.
Speaker 4 (07:00):
Okay, bo tight fires on their way off. Okay, we're
arriving unseen.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
Okay, sir, do you see them the police officers.
Speaker 1 (07:10):
Mark ran outside the front door to meet the officers
as they quietly pulled up the short driveway. He was
in a frenzy as he explained what happened and pointed
towards the upstairs master bathroom. The police rushed inside. Mark
made sure his children were still asleep and begged the
first responders to be quiet. He was terrified of traumatizing
(07:33):
the kids. Officer Mike Bishop was one of the first
on the scene. He found Sherry in the bathroom and
immediately bent down and started doing chest compressions. The knees
of his pants soon became wet with crimson SuDS. After
twenty compressions, he got up and let the EMTs take over.
Cherry was rushed to a nearby hospital, where doctors assured
(07:56):
Mark that she was in good hands they would do
their best to save her life. Mark called Sherry's aunt
and uncle to come pick up the kids before he
went to the police station. With his head buried in
his hands. Mark sat across from the detective in his
cargo shorts and flip flops as his leg bounced up
(08:18):
and down.
Speaker 6 (08:19):
Well he wept, this is a digital recorder, you might
if I writ while we're talking.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
That way, I can don't have to take such so
many notes.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
Mark nodded and also allowed the police to search his home.
He said he wanted all the help they could get.
He wanted to know why this happened to his wife.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
Why don't we start with.
Speaker 6 (08:43):
A general history of your family and what's going going
on in your life and.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
Stuff like that. Okay, I'm married, and I met my
wife in Wisconsin when I was attending law school.
Speaker 1 (08:57):
Mark and Sherry had met on a dating app back
in two thousand and eight when Mark was finishing with
his legal degree at University of Wisconsin Madison.
Speaker 8 (09:05):
Ever since, we've been together through the military. I'm an
AJRIGE advocate in Wyber Army. We went to live in
Hawaii together. Our daughter was born there.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
She was born at the same time as the Nami
was hitting the island, so the whole time there was
like the alarm was going on as he had contractions
and stuff. So born in an Army hospital, Yeah, Jamesey
far of the Army Medical Center, the Being Palace.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
The Ponsards had lived all over the US, Alabama, Wisconsin, Hawaii, Georgia.
This was due to Mark's career in the Army and
his higher education pursuits.
Speaker 8 (09:55):
So I was with the twenty Fifthentry Infantry Division and
then they employed with cab Compedy of Adrian Brigade to Ganahear.
Speaker 6 (10:05):
And what my wife stuck with me was that pretty
pretty pretty soon after the baby was born that you went,
you were deployed.
Speaker 2 (10:14):
That's tough. So Maddie was fourteen months old. I deployed
for seven months. It felt a lot longer. Anyways, very
strong experience that my wife was there throughout.
Speaker 8 (10:33):
I came back and anyways, we worked together and trying
to buy a house in Hawaii didn't work out.
Speaker 2 (10:39):
Moved to the different place. Anyways, we traveled. We went
to the Big Islands with my cousin from Spain. I
came to visit.
Speaker 8 (10:49):
We went to Japan, where my daughter was treated like
a start the little blood girl and stuff. I mean,
the Japanese are such cute people and stuff. And then
it was an approach by associal aviations a penticopters, so
it was approached by a Sikorski attorney. Well offered me
(11:09):
a job in civilian so I went to reserves and
then we moved to Connecticut.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
When we were there for about a year and a half,
working fifteen months to.
Speaker 9 (11:20):
A civilian legal first Horski and right, so still in
a reserve correct right, so I worked with a cyber
warfare command Fort Hamilton in Brooklyn, I assume or and Officer.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
Mccaptain and was just likes for major.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
All the while, Mark was thriving in his army career
and working his way up to Major. Jerry had gotten
her degree in social work and was pursuing her own
talents and income. Jerry had even published a children's book
and was working on a second for her publisher. They
were flourishing, but after a few months in Arizona, Ark
(12:00):
lost his job.
Speaker 8 (12:02):
Yeah, and then for the remainder of the year, I've
been unemployed in the civilian side.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
So I've been za this year.
Speaker 10 (12:09):
This year, sir, and I was.
Speaker 2 (12:12):
Just offered a job in Kentucky. Great job, super happy. Finally,
after all these.
Speaker 8 (12:19):
Months, my wife really stepped up. I mean she was
the breadwinner. Anyways, we found out home together. We like,
we've got new furniture for Max because his furniture is
got spride up.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
He saw your son son, how is he? Eighteen months?
Eighteen months.
Speaker 1 (12:44):
Mark and Cherry had a role reversal when he was
unemployed and she stepped it up as the family's primary earner.
Mark told the detective that he was proud of his
wife for doing that. He was grateful and embraced his
role as the man.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
Anyways, everything's been going to freak. I've been select for
major BDZ below the zone.
Speaker 8 (13:08):
I'm ranked really high, I think among men. You know,
I haven't had the appraisal yet. Everything I'll do really well.
She's been like super supportive, like moving to Kentucky. She
likes the job she is she has here, but she's
been supportive, like she knows we have to pay off
dark debts and everything like, it's very positive and strong
and it's a good school.
Speaker 2 (13:30):
For Maddie and Mac is starting to talk. He said,
it was more exact to my wife was aborted.
Speaker 10 (13:38):
The way of a routine and stuff like.
Speaker 8 (13:40):
It's beautiful anyways, and so I'm just that's SU's happening
right now where we are.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
And uh, my wife was a she was what's what's
the word. Anyways, she was ready to have a third child, essentially.
Speaker 1 (14:00):
Even though Sherry liked Arizona and her job there, Mark
had been offered a new position in Kentucky and it
made sense to move. Jerry had posted on her Facebook
page just before her death.
Speaker 11 (14:14):
We've been in Arizona for a year now, so I
guess what time it is time for another cross country move.
Never a dull moment.
Speaker 1 (14:24):
Mark said Sherry had been ovulating and they were trying
to have another baby. According to him, things were looking up.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
And yesterday she had a headache. And so she has
heart issues, she has envision issues. She had a piercing headache.
Speaker 8 (14:42):
Anyways, So yeah, so yesterday she wasn't feeling too good.
And then.
Speaker 2 (14:56):
I mean juicing, you know, the juicer, liquid.
Speaker 8 (15:00):
Dye and whatever the Australian do you know, like amliall
that stuff, you know, And so she's been any healthy,
I mean, making any breakfast and the family and flossing
for my daughter and my son is starting to talk,
and everything's going so so well.
Speaker 1 (15:17):
Mark just couldn't understand why it all had to fall apart.
Now things were just perfect.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
I do need to know what happened to night so
I can understand what I see at the house.
Speaker 12 (15:28):
Okay, So we'll go on into that, all right, Okay,
so we'll folks him tonight. So she came home at
like five point fifteen.
Speaker 1 (15:40):
Mark explained that after Sherry got home from work, he
cooked the family a healthy dinner, watched some movies, put
the kids to bed, and then decided to spend some
quality time together and we were trying.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
To have like a romantic night, like a together night,
and so I drew a bath for us, and so, uh,
you know, so I was in there and I was
putting uh thispo Tito and the music on on my
cell phone.
Speaker 13 (16:10):
And so.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
Anyways, by the time my you know, my wife came,
she was uh, pretty excited. I guess sort were laughing
or whatever.
Speaker 8 (16:20):
Then she put her clothes and other clothes downstairs from
in the wash, came back upstairs, and then we kind
of hung.
Speaker 10 (16:29):
Out in the bathtub and cut.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
Her nails, her toe nails, like, washed her hair.
Speaker 8 (16:36):
And I was kind of massaging her and stuff. And
we just had beautiful evening, just a very i don't know,
like a positive evening. It wasn't necessarily going through sex or.
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Anything like that either. It was sort of just to
be happy, you know.
Speaker 8 (16:54):
The past eight months was really stressful, a difficult with
the bills, with everything. Now I have a job and
the house we like, we just bought a bedroom set
for Max. Like everything is coming together. Everything's so underful.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
As romantic as it was, Mark soon needed to get
out of the tub.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
He gets warm you know, I'm those two hot in bathtubs,
and so she likes to stay longer. So I got
out and I went to bed essentially, and I take
sleeping pills and the rise of Pan for anxiety. I've
had to do this since my deployment, and so anyway,
so I slept, and where he take the sleep simply
(17:37):
simply sleep. So it's a really cool around. Yeah, I
think three of those. I'm trying to lower my amounts.
I used to take four. Lately i've been taking three.
I'm trying to weave myself off.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
Mark took his anti depressant and then three of his
over the counter sleep meds, a diaphen hydromine based medication. Basically,
it's like taking a handful of allergy medication like Bendrul.
You know how much I love Benadrul. It can make
you really sleepy, knock you out for the whole day.
It was around this time that the detective got a
(18:10):
phone call and he excused himself and left the room.
When he returned, he had some bad news for Mark.
Speaker 6 (18:18):
I never want to be the person to have to
tell somebody this, that's your your wife has passed away.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
WHOA I'm going to have the officer outside the.
Speaker 6 (18:40):
Room called counselor would you be able to talk to a.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
Counselor would that be helpful?
Speaker 5 (18:47):
You man?
Speaker 2 (18:48):
All right?
Speaker 6 (18:49):
I talking about Oh, I want somebody here that has
some good resources for you, Okay, So I'm going to
have him come and you can you can do what
you want.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
After Mark calmed down and stopped crying, the detective made
sure to get one thing straight.
Speaker 6 (19:07):
I want to make sure you fully understand any news
and there anytime, anytime there is a a serious injury,
we're there and you're you're a lawyer, So I assume
that you understand all.
Speaker 2 (19:20):
That you're You're here voluntarily, so for me to ask.
Speaker 6 (19:24):
You questions about what happened tonight, I'm just trying to
get enough information to determine.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
What's going on tay about you. So I don't want
you to feel like, okay, suspect.
Speaker 6 (19:35):
Well, you're not a suspect. You're You're the only source
of information I have. If you were a suspect, i'd grieved, Miranda.
Speaker 2 (19:44):
I would take you in there. I see that kind
of thing.
Speaker 1 (19:45):
You free to leave you all that I want to Okay,
Mark was the only source of information, and being a
lawyer himself, the cops knew you wouldn't be talking with
them unless he had nothing to do with this. I mean,
why would he unless he's an idiot. Of course, everyone
was just trying to understand the mysterious way that Sherry
(20:08):
had died. Mark may have been the only one the
cops knew to talk to, but as news of her
untimely death spread throughout her friends and family, others would
come forward and the investigation would change from an accidental
death to something much much worse. Lawyer and Army Major
(21:00):
Mark Eric Pinsati had found his wife, Sherry Pinsati, dead
on their bathroom floor from what appeared to be an
accidental fall out of the top. The couple's young children
were still sleeping down the hall when Mark called nine
one one in hysterical tears. Now he found himself alone
and terrified us to what the future would hold for
(21:23):
his family. Mark told the police that he had a
happy marriage. He had just received a new job offer
in Kentucky, so the family was preparing to pack up
and move yet again. They were trying for a third
baby and enjoying every day as it came. Very Hallmark,
you know, but now suddenly Sherry was dead and the
(21:47):
police had to figure out what happened on the night
in question. Despite his emotions, Mark composed himself and continued
speaking with the detective.
Speaker 8 (21:56):
Woke up that, which is surprising is usually anything that
filled his UF I'd wake up later at one o'clock
maybe or something two o'clock.
Speaker 14 (22:04):
It's a kind of a pattern, got a cycle, and
this time it.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
Was something different, like I kind of woke up. Which
bed were you in upstairs?
Speaker 14 (22:14):
And uh, I was gonna listening and I could hear
the TV still playing downstairs, and uh said there was
still like bathroom and something like sh she still in
the bathroom. So I was gonna tell her to come over.
And I tried to open the door and I couldn't.
Something was blocking in and I pushed and I had
(22:36):
fucking you see your fire feet.
Speaker 3 (22:42):
In your feet are like really.
Speaker 10 (22:44):
White, and uh, and so I called out for her,
the fuck Sherry, And finally I pushed.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
I had to push quite a bit, and it was
like pushing her body like the door, like her legs
were on the sideways.
Speaker 1 (23:05):
Mark said he was groggy from the sleep medication, but
after he saw his wife's cold white feet on the
floor is adrenaline.
Speaker 2 (23:13):
Kicked him and then I noticed her head. It looked
fucked up.
Speaker 7 (23:17):
It looked there was blood and she had like a
montes and stuff, and I.
Speaker 2 (23:23):
Recognized that with injury. Was she faced down, her on
her back, she ba and was her head towards the door,
feet towards the door. The feet were sward the door.
The feet were blocking. The legs of feet were thin.
So I moved, so I don't know, he said, I
did push her, So I'm the shore how she was
originally like we're thinking, said you saw him with Thomas
(23:46):
where we're Yeah.
Speaker 7 (23:47):
It was the first thing I noticed with the blood
on that fucking corner. Damn, in the fucking corner. I
thought about it several times with Maddie and stuff. She
always makes everything so wet, you know. It was to
the towels in the ground and stuff and slipping and
stuff in that fucking corner, like I put like a
corner of the sink or the corner of.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
The like between the shower and the bathtop. There was
a really dangerous freaking.
Speaker 10 (24:11):
Corner right there.
Speaker 1 (24:13):
Mark said, there was a sharp, dangerous corner between the
bathtub and the sink. When they bathed the kids in
the bathtub, you would put towels down to cover it.
He was convinced that Sherry had hit her head on that.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
And it was blood all over that fucking day.
Speaker 7 (24:34):
And uh, anyways, I prinked out, that's what you call
her a and uh and I slipped. It was like slippery.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
You went in though you went out and yeah, yeah, yeah,
I went in there. And were you wearing you clothes
or were you nigs? Or I was? I think I
was wearing these clothes. I wasn't wearing these clothes.
Speaker 8 (24:56):
And I did the MCBR certify and stuff, you know,
so I did the observed listening and that stuff. It
didn't look at the face colors, discoloration, there was the patches.
And I got.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
And she had her and she didn't look good, and uh,
I freaked out. I noticed the lungs weren't moving. I
immediately called Name one one.
Speaker 1 (25:18):
Mark was an army major, a trained d MT, and
a lawyer. If anyone would be useful in this situation,
it was him. Mark said he didn't remember much after
he got on the phone with nine one one. His
memory was just a blur of chaos.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
I remember the rest. Honestly, it only to do like
mouth to mouth. But I knew that was not It
was too far for that. I could tell like it
was blood and like it was purple and stuff. So
did you ever do the mouth mouth? Noir?
Speaker 1 (25:54):
Now, let me ask you a question. If your wife,
the mother of your children, was lying unresponsive on the floor,
cold white, you know, don't you think you would maybe, oh,
I don't know, attempt maybe possibly to save her life somehow.
(26:22):
I mean, am I the only one who would actually
do that? I don't think so, right, But apparently Mark
is one of the other types.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
But did you ever do any compressions? Okay, so you
just you just evaluate. They did and they did touch
a toucher. I did touch her. You've been through the
same military tree exactly, So I did the arteries and
all that stuff, like the legs. So you touched her
pulse look listening for you, her writing and stuff like that.
I mean it looked like she fucking slipping that in
(26:54):
son of its corner. And then noticed water and soap
and all that stuff, and then the carpet.
Speaker 6 (27:00):
Was all So was the bathtub overflowing or was it
just from like getting out the water flashing.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
Yeah, I know, so there was no water.
Speaker 6 (27:08):
You didn't have to turn the water on.
Speaker 1 (27:10):
No, no, no, no, So the top was not overflowing.
Mark did not do chess compressions or try CPR on
his wife. Mark's theory was that Sherry got out of
the bath, slipped, fell and hit her head. This was
all feeling a little off. Mark had painted a picture
(27:31):
of a happy marriage and a family life, but Jerry's
best friend Danielle had something different to say about Mark.
Danielle actually refers to Mark as Eric. He went by
Mark Eric professionally, but sometimes just Eric to his family
and friends.
Speaker 4 (27:50):
Her husband Eric. How do I say? It looks really
great on paper. So he's a lawyer, he's charming, he's
felt light, he's looking, he likes to cook.
Speaker 15 (28:02):
All of these different things seems were good in our
beginning of their relationship, but then.
Speaker 4 (28:08):
Things kind of took a turn. So there's some information.
He lived, he was in the military, he was stationed
in Alabama. They're in Hawaii, then they were in Connecticut
and then Arizona.
Speaker 1 (28:21):
Danielle's tail lined up with Marx, but she knew some
much darker things.
Speaker 4 (28:29):
There's some things that have happened in the past. He
has very mentally unstable, so he's that had a lot
of instability regarding suicide. I know this was more in Connecticut.
He thought treatment. He was on medications. There was times
(28:51):
where he would just take a dose of medicine and
not be able to wake up, or he'd find him
with the kids running all over the place to be
out of it.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
And there was more.
Speaker 4 (29:03):
I guess what we labeled him as and I don't know.
He could see a psychiatrist as a sex addict. So
he was constantly looking at porn.
Speaker 15 (29:14):
He had been always.
Speaker 4 (29:16):
Doing porn websites, porn, porn, porn. He had a job
where he traveled a lot. He was in Turkey at
one point he had solicited prostitutes there and she was
pregnant with her second son, so she I remember when
he came back she found.
Speaker 5 (29:34):
Out about this. I think be on his phone and.
Speaker 4 (29:37):
Computer and she had gone into the doctor and had
all kinds of STD testing to make sure that you know,
she was pregnant and things like that. He also has
had issues maintaining the job, so I think something happened
in the military where he was also walked in on
looking at pornography and things like that. But anyways, please.
Speaker 15 (30:00):
Let me have your question or anything breaking it in.
Speaker 1 (30:04):
You can say that again, Danielle was like a floodgate
of information, and the detective was dumbfounded by this cd
side of Mark that couldn't have been further from the composed,
kind and well spoken man he consoled at this very
same police station. Danielle said that Mark's porn and cheating
(30:25):
loomed all throughout the time Sherry was pregnant with their
second child. Then things hit a breaking point while they
were in Connecticut.
Speaker 4 (30:34):
I do know Sherry does have evidence, and I don't
know where it is, of some child pornography. There was
one time she walked in on him. This is in Connecticut,
by the way. This is probably in the last three years.
She walked in on him masturbating to a five or
(30:55):
six year old girl getting angily raped.
Speaker 1 (31:00):
After catching Mark in the act with violent child porn,
Cherry had had enough.
Speaker 4 (31:08):
She left him. Her uncle Joe, who has the kids
right now. He came to Connecticut to get her out
of there, and he left when she was at He
was at home, and he drove her and she came here.
Her goal was was to leave him, and she didn't
(31:28):
have any money. And when she came here, he pretty
much put all the you know, I mean, he controlled
the money. He did not get her any money. She
stayed at her mother's house. I had to help out
as much as possible. I invited her to my house, groceries,
you know, things like that.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
Danielle tried her best to help Sherry get out of
her marriage, but Cherry wanted to make it work. She
had no money and leaving Mark wasn't financially viable right
then and there.
Speaker 4 (32:01):
Yeah, so things were worse. I know, I'm Connecticut. When
he went back, they had agreed Eric was going to
seek help. They sought help. Sherry was not religious, but
he said, well, let's, you know, to go talk to
a priest. And so they were kind of doing some
type of marital counseling with the priest in Connecticut. And
Eric also was getting on med He had seen a psychiatrist.
(32:24):
They wanted to have him go to a treatment center.
He didn't want to, and I know the priest. I
remember being surprised because the priest told Sherry to leave him,
and I was surprised at that.
Speaker 16 (32:37):
I was race Catholic because I thought almost like resort
type stuff exactly being a Catholic herself, and he all
figured things were really grim if a priest had agreed
that Sherry should leave Mark, and.
Speaker 4 (32:52):
So that was that, and then things just kind of
got worse. Max was born, and that's kind of ensued.
Speaker 1 (33:02):
After Max was born and Mark was seeking help, the
family relocated to Arizona, where things didn't really get much better.
The family was dwindling their savings, and between Mark's high
student loan payments and cost of living, they were drowning
in debt. When they moved from Connecticut to Arizona, they
(33:23):
had to take out a loan of forty five thousand
dollars for closing costs, which put an even bigger strain
on their marriage.
Speaker 4 (33:31):
So he's had higher up jobs, an unfortunately authority figures haven't.
Speaker 13 (33:39):
It's been it's been a bit.
Speaker 4 (33:41):
Full issues with him because he's really lasted a job
a year for less. He's often fired from job. The
recent one who was fired in Arizona, he's gone on
a point for nine months and shares did not work
until the last three months, so they've been living off
of savings. He found money from someone in Florida. I
(34:06):
do know because she concided in me about everything, so
I know they were really in financial ruins. She and
I have this centraccess and he said they were probably
about one hundred and forty thousand dollars set.
Speaker 1 (34:21):
Then Cherry got a job, which felt like a glimmer
of hope, but it only made Mark worse.
Speaker 4 (34:28):
Cherry got a job four months ago.
Speaker 5 (34:30):
It's her first job.
Speaker 4 (34:31):
All that from being you know, a stay at home mom.
Eric has always been very controlling. They got into a
lot of fights about cleaning, earning his shirts. That was
her job to iron his shirt if he was going
to go anywhere. She had to pack at bay. She
had to wake up in the morning and you know,
make him a bo you know that kind of thing.
And so since he lost his job, I know he's
(34:52):
working out a lot. That was his thing, go to
the gym and less waits. You both set a lot
and he really did his own thing. Now since Harry
was working. For the first two months he was working,
I feel like she was working for about ninety days.
For the first two months he was home with the
kids by himself, and then Maddie, who was sixth started
(35:13):
school about a month ago, and so that was a
huge change. Sarry would go to work. She was very
worried for her safetyavorite children.
Speaker 15 (35:21):
She confided in me that Mac.
Speaker 4 (35:24):
Her youngest son, who is almost twenty months, has fallen
down the stairs a couple times.
Speaker 1 (35:30):
Because Eric was on the computers the whole time with
his oldest daughter in first grade and just baby Max
to take care of, Mark started slipping back into his
old online addictions. Mark was a negligent, resentful father who
did not want to be at home with his kids
while his wife earned money for the family.
Speaker 15 (35:52):
I believe it was.
Speaker 4 (35:53):
About a month ago she took him Max, maybe two months.
Speaker 15 (35:57):
Took in Max for his eighteen ninety month appointment, and
Eric went to the doctor and Maddie, the daughter, had
told the doctor that Max fell.
Speaker 4 (36:07):
Down the stairs two times. And I don't know what
the doctor was asking questions or anything, but she.
Speaker 15 (36:16):
Got very angry and said in from the doctor, Maddie.
Speaker 4 (36:20):
You get over there, I'm going to spells you. And
that was something interesting because I had never heard Harry
ever say anything about that, and I asked, Harry, did
he ever thank Maddie. She said no, not that she's
aware of. And then the doctor appintment was done. He
was waiting in line to you know, her paperwork, and
he lost it in the doctor's office. He you know,
(36:42):
heard on the paperwork, walked out from the door. It
was like this big ordeal.
Speaker 1 (36:47):
Danielle said that Mark had really been going downhill since
Sherry became the breadwinner, and his emotions were off the charts.
Speaker 4 (36:57):
I want to say it was maybe forty six weeks ago.
They had gone somewhere in Arizona, maybe for a hike
or something, and he had lost it in the car over.
Speaker 3 (37:06):
I don't recall.
Speaker 4 (37:07):
He took her phone. He said he's going to throw
it out. His were screaming in the background, was stopping
the car. It was a very you know traumatic, you know,
something had happened. The thing about Eric was that he
could turn his mood.
Speaker 15 (37:24):
Like that, and so Sherry was kind of eggs, like
sitting on eggshells.
Speaker 5 (37:30):
I know.
Speaker 4 (37:30):
He you know, punched a wall, you know, a hole
in the wall in their house in Connecticut, that kind
of thing. He was very hot tempered.
Speaker 1 (37:40):
Mark was an angry, emotional guy and Sherry felt stuck.
But to the outside world on social media, the couple
were very active and presented only the very best parts
of their family life. Jerry would post pictures of their
hiking trips to the Grand Canyon. She'd boast in videos
(38:01):
about her daughter going off to school, and she'd give
her friends updates on the forts that kids would build
when it was too hot to play outside. Mark did
the same. He showed off being promoted to major and
had recently posted a picture of a meal a civilian
bought him at a fancy restaurant after she thanked him
(38:23):
for a service. Thank you, ma'am, he wrote, I feel
humbled and grateful to the world. Sherry and Mark looked
like a happy, loving family of four, but inside they
were bubbling over with secrets that all stemmed from Mark's
disgusting porn habit.
Speaker 4 (38:43):
She had found a picture of a girl or something
a woman on his phone and asked him about it,
and he said, oh, she's from some pornography website.
Speaker 15 (38:53):
And so she said to him, for show me, show
me the website, and he couldn't, and he got very
very upset about that.
Speaker 4 (39:02):
And she told him that she was there for the kids,
and that she really wanted nothing to do with him sexually,
and that he could do whatever he wanted, that he
was there for the kids, and he like that completely
blew up. Now I don't that was the only time
(39:23):
we talked about that.
Speaker 15 (39:23):
I don't know anything about that.
Speaker 1 (39:26):
But what Danielle did know was that Mark's issues with
violence and sexual perversion all stemmed from one person, his
dad was.
Speaker 4 (39:37):
She told me about how he was in and he
was in prison, used to have a lot of money,
and Eric had told Sherry that he had introduced Eric's
pornography when he was seven or eight years old. Your
dad has always tried to get mail or or bright
things like that. I don't know anything more than that.
Speaker 1 (39:54):
Oh, and the reason his porn peddling dad was in prison,
it was no big deal, just for you know, killing
someone in a fit of rage.
Speaker 4 (40:03):
So yourth's dad was in prison for killing a man
in It was a Dutch It was a Dutch tourist
over road.
Speaker 1 (40:13):
Rate just chew on this for a second. Things in
Arizona were bad, but then Mark got a job offer
in Kentucky and the family was set to move again.
Remember Sherry had written on her Facebook page just four
days before.
Speaker 11 (40:27):
Her death, We've been in Arizona for a year now,
so I guess what time it is time for another
cross country move.
Speaker 1 (40:37):
Never a dull moment, hints of resentment hung in her
post and behind closed doors. She told Mark she was
sick of the instability in her family. But she agreed
to go to Kentucky because of one reason.
Speaker 4 (40:53):
And Kentucky came up, and she wasn't little about it,
but the main things I was always trying to be
positive with her that she's going to be closer to Wisconsin.
Her main dream was she wanted to get back to Wisconsin.
Speaker 15 (41:05):
She had family and friends here.
Speaker 4 (41:07):
She wanted to kind of down on life for her family,
and she was only going to be a couple hours away.
Eight hours away now I know this. Last week she
texted me and said, oh my gosh, Eric got a
call from a job in Oshcosh.
Speaker 5 (41:23):
Oshcosh is an hour and.
Speaker 4 (41:25):
A half away from her parents' help. Okay, And I said,
oh my goodness, Wow, that's excellent. But she said at
that point that Eric said absolutely not that he had
already signed the contract for this new job in Kentucky.
Speaker 1 (41:39):
The idea of moving to Oshkosh, Wisconsin, was a dream
come true for Sherry. Finally, she would be closer to
her family and friends. The possibility of leaving Mark was
in bloom, but he stomped out that dream. Of course
he did. If Sherry was closer to the safety of
her family and friends, then and she would surely leave him.
(42:02):
Mark may have been sick, but he was not stupid.
But Danielle and Sherry talked every day like best friends do.
Cherry had an exit strategy, and she told Danielle everything, and.
Speaker 4 (42:15):
Her plan was that she wanted to leave in a
couple of years. She was very fearful for her children.
She was fearful to leave the house and have fifty
to fifty custody.
Speaker 15 (42:25):
And have him taking care of the kids when he
couldn't even.
Speaker 4 (42:29):
Take care of himself in that regard.
Speaker 17 (42:31):
So no discussion with her about having more children.
Speaker 4 (42:36):
Absolutely not. She said, the thought of us her child
sounds really great to me if I had a different
like if I was with someone else.
Speaker 1 (42:45):
Danielle had spilled the tea, as they say, and boy
was it potent. Mark had put up an excellent front
for the police. He'd come across as believable, kind and caring.
But that if you haven't guessed it already, it was
all a lie. Even Cherry's mother, who knew less than Danielle,
(43:07):
knew that Mark had made unthinkable threats to his daughter.
Speaker 15 (43:11):
Well, Serry and.
Speaker 13 (43:12):
Erica had issues with her marriage ongoing for I would
say probably the last three years and last year last March,
she asked me, couldn't covers it, and I did, and
when I got there, she said that things aren't going well,
(43:33):
if they weren't getting along, that she wanted to come
back to Wisconsin. She told me.
Speaker 1 (43:45):
Jerry's mom broke down into inaudible sobs.
Speaker 6 (43:49):
Try to relax, and that way I can clearly understand
what you're saying.
Speaker 4 (43:54):
It sounded like you said that she had concerns that
he was going to kill her.
Speaker 13 (43:58):
Basely, she told me that he had kill her.
Speaker 1 (44:06):
But Jerry wasn't ready to leave Mark yet. She made
a point of repeating that over and over. She stayed
with him for one reason and one reason only.
Speaker 15 (44:17):
She never said that she was.
Speaker 4 (44:18):
Looking to divorce Eric right now. She never said anything
like that to me, but I remember her saying, I
would say, in the last month, she said something about
my kids are legal residents of Arizona. And that's when
you know she had said something about, well, you know,
I might stay work my job a little bit, Maddie's
started school and whatever, and then you know that's all
(44:40):
I know.
Speaker 3 (44:41):
So she wanted a more stable life for the kids.
Speaker 4 (44:44):
As far as Jerry, yes, any absolutely, And what I
can tell you the only reason, and she told me
was over and again the only reason why she never
left her was because her children.
Speaker 2 (44:57):
And it wasn't because her children.
Speaker 4 (44:58):
She would have been a long time ago. She was
the gus mob no her complained, just did everything. And
even though her life at home was horrible with her
husband and all that, you know, she was definitely the
rock for her children.
Speaker 1 (45:16):
Meanwhile, the detectives had an autopsy performed on Sherry's body
and began examining the scene in a new light. Detective
Bishop noticed many physical pieces of evidence that did not
line up with Mark's story. Mark was now their prime suspect,
and he was going to have to face the truth.
(45:38):
Maybe Mark had been able to keep Sherry physically away
from her friends and family, maybe he was able to
make sure she held a brave face to the world,
but he couldn't stop her from confiding in the people
that she loved and revealing all of his dirty, disgusting secrets.
(46:27):
After speaking with Sherry Ponsatti's best friends and other family members,
Mara Copa County detectives now realize that the image Mark
painted himself as it was a far cry from reality.
Mark was a porn addicted, violent, angry, jobless man, in
debt and on the brink of losing his sanity. I
(46:48):
think that describes most men these days, actually, but I'll
leave it at that. Anyway, Sherry had caught him with
child porn, and that's a crime that she should have
definitely turned him in for, but she didn't. Jerry had
plans to go. She had to think of herself, and
the couple was in a.
Speaker 18 (47:08):
Ton of debt.
Speaker 1 (47:09):
She had to be strategic. Jerry's aunt and uncle had
taken the Pinsati's children after she died, and they had
overheard Mark on the phone telling a different story than
the one he told detectives.
Speaker 5 (47:23):
I thought that he told the coroner that they had
been watching Netflix downstairs, that she hadn't come back, and
I think he used the word to the corner that
he was brought maybe.
Speaker 4 (47:37):
Frustrated and annoyed. I'm pretty sure he used the word annoyed.
Speaker 5 (47:40):
So he went to look for her and she wasn't
in the.
Speaker 1 (47:44):
Bedroom, and Jerry's brother confirmed that all the things Danielle
had said about Mark were true. He also revealed a
little more.
Speaker 17 (47:53):
She was afraid where that literally told her that if
she also a divorced against him, that he would kill
her family.
Speaker 16 (48:03):
And that's something she told you, He said, yes, Or
did she tell your mother and your mother told you no.
Speaker 17 (48:11):
She told me that directly, And she told me that
if anything ever happened to her, I guess she died unexpectedly,
that we should suspect.
Speaker 3 (48:20):
That Eric was the cause.
Speaker 1 (48:23):
Armed with this new information, Detective Bishop began to examine
the scene differently and came up with a new theory
about how Sherry died.
Speaker 19 (48:31):
I believe she was killed in the bathroom of her home.
I believe that she received multiple injuries to her upper
back and neck and head through a physical altercation. Also,
her nose and upper lip were injured. I believe she's
(48:53):
come to those injuries and her body was staged in
the master bathroom for police to find. Well, my theory,
and if the prosecutors are okay with me giving my theory,
is that the linear injuries on her back and upper
(49:13):
neck and head will probably a result of being forcefully
thrown against the tile ledge at the back of the
bathroom bath doug or other. The blood that was visible
to me on that night was diluted with water and
appeared to me like a maybe a head that was
(49:36):
already bloody, had.
Speaker 2 (49:39):
Been placed there.
Speaker 1 (49:40):
Detective Bishop believed that Mark killed Sherry in the tub,
using the sharp edge of the tile between the tub
and shower to repeatedly bludge in her head and back
until she bled out. Remember, Mark kept saying he thought
that corner was dangerous. He relentlessly repeatd that he was
(50:01):
sure Sherry slipped and hit her head on that tile.
Speaker 19 (50:05):
I found out later that not only had he pushed
the thought or tried to convey clearly the dangerous situation
in the bathroom with the ledge, and how he had
pointed it out before, and he knew that this ledge
was going to hurt somebody at some point, he passed
that along to other people as long as me. I
(50:27):
felt like when I found out that this was included
in his conversations to almost everybody, that.
Speaker 2 (50:34):
That was an indicator that.
Speaker 20 (50:37):
There was more to the story than this slip and
fall that he had portrayed to me. If she had
slipped and hit her head on that ledge, the ledge
would have caused the bleeding to start, but her head
would already be gone. It would be down on the floor.
So that's why I would expect more blood on the
floor than I was. I wouldn't even expect to see
much or any blood on the the ledge itself.
Speaker 1 (51:02):
Jerry's blood was telling a new story. Not only did
luminol testing reveal that more blood had been cleaned up,
but it had also been moved around. This sick fuck
moved around his wife's blood to stage the scene.
Speaker 19 (51:21):
There was a lot of blood that just wasn't at
the scene, and I didn't notice that.
Speaker 2 (51:25):
And I did make that statement in my first, first
or second.
Speaker 19 (51:32):
Supplement to the case, is that there was just not
enough blood on the floor to account the stains and
for the injuries. But I wasn't fully aware of the
injuries at that point. You have to understand that I
never saw the body until the autopsy, and that was
after the fact, Okay, So I gained more information and
(51:52):
more suspicion and more knowledge about her injuries after the fact.
That let me know that this top where there was
no blood visible should be checked or blood that isn't visible,
and that's what Lumanols used to do, or loose start
or whatever chemical she used that used to see the
(52:15):
blood where there is no.
Speaker 2 (52:16):
Bason of blood.
Speaker 1 (52:18):
The autopsy showed that Sherry had injuries to her head
and back, which would not have been possible if she
just slipped. She had bruising on her spine consistent with
violent shaking and strangulation could not be ruled out. She
had multiple blunt force injuries to the back of her head,
up her neck and back that would have been one
(52:40):
violent thrashing and repeating fall. And there were other physical
details that Detective Bishop noticed were suspicious.
Speaker 19 (52:50):
I found it odd that two people took the bath
and their clothes were downstairs in the washer.
Speaker 1 (52:57):
Mar could plan this all out very well, and he
was using his legal training to cover his tracks, feeding
the same believable story about Sherry slipping on some soap
due to her own negligence, blaming the victim they call it.
I don't think people like it these days anyway. Here's
(53:17):
Sherry's brother describing what Mark told him after she died.
Speaker 17 (53:22):
And he told me he told me, you know when
it happened. And basically, like he said that Sherry had
a history of the house is when not putting things backs,
like for example, you know, when she'd cook, she'd leave
the cooking oil out and not put the cap on
it and things like that. And there's really particular about
(53:42):
that kind of stuff. And he said, you'd always nag
at her about it, which I can totally see that.
And he said that Cherry would do it so often
that eventually he sought an egging at her. And he said,
one of the things that she would do is in
the bathroom she would put a cap on like the
bubble back and stuff. She gives the kids a bubble bath, right,
and and honestly, I could I totally believe that she.
Speaker 18 (54:06):
I can see her doing that because I mean, I'm
delivered too. And he thinks that she she can put
a tap on the bubble bath and somehow it got
skipped over when she was in the bathroom and when
she went to get out of a shower, you know,
the ground was completely soap.
Speaker 17 (54:22):
And soap and she slid it.
Speaker 1 (54:25):
Mark even told this story to his six year old child,
believe it or not. Who then relayed it back almost
verbatim to the police psychologist.
Speaker 2 (54:45):
She did.
Speaker 4 (55:00):
You wood on our hands?
Speaker 2 (55:08):
Did you?
Speaker 1 (55:17):
Detective Bishop believed that there was no way the soap
could have landed the way it did if Sherry slipped
on it. Mark's story was good, but gravity is way better.
Speaker 17 (55:29):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (55:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 19 (55:29):
The the soap especially was odd because the soap container
was found in a tipped over.
Speaker 2 (55:38):
Position on the floor.
Speaker 19 (55:40):
And if you think you probably got the gist from
our experiment that if you if you knocked over a
bottle of soap, the soap would be emanating from the
area where the container is. The officers that were first
on scene and from my recollection there was visible blue
(56:05):
soap on top of the back mat and throughout the
scene that I don't believe it would have been possible
for the soap to emanate from the area where the
bottle was on top of the to get up onto the.
Speaker 17 (56:26):
Back mat.
Speaker 19 (56:27):
And I don't think that the amount of soap that
was missing is physically possible from turning that container over.
So if you knock over a container blue soap, it's
only going to drain to the area where the lip
of the spout is. It won't drain the inch and
a half two inches below that spout because gravity won't
(56:52):
allow it to float upwards and out of the bottom.
Speaker 1 (56:56):
Marked his best to cover all those tracks. He had
a careful, he thought out plan, like some demented version
of Gone Girl. But even with his law degree, military background,
EMT training, and perfectionism or autism, Mark could not get
one over on the detectives. They were too thorough, and
(57:18):
only a week after Sherry's death, Mark was arrested for murder.
His bail was set at one million dollars. When it
came time to pull Mark in front of a jury
of his peers, he stuck to his story. He took
the stand and added some more elaborate details about how
he tried to save her life before he called nine
(57:40):
to one one. He said that is EMT training kicked
in and he did try to give her mouth to mouth,
but there was so much blood and you know, he
just couldn't.
Speaker 2 (57:50):
You know.
Speaker 1 (57:52):
It's just some people are so stupid, and they think
you're stupid too. They think they can get away with
things because they think you're just as stupid as they are.
He even said that he thought about getting a turkey
baster to suck the blood out. He said this on
the stand.
Speaker 19 (58:09):
I swear.
Speaker 1 (58:10):
He also tried to justify the injuries to her face
by saying he slept and fell on her, but he
didn't admit that to the police. He never said that
until that moment, so he claimed that was why he
refused to try CPR or chest compressions when the dispatcher
asked him to. He claimed that he felt like a
bull in a china shop after his fall, and that
(58:33):
he would only make things worse. I mean, his wife
was dead, but he would only make things worse.
Speaker 9 (58:39):
That's what he said.
Speaker 2 (58:42):
I'm suck please, Oh my god, her father.
Speaker 5 (58:50):
Her brother.
Speaker 1 (58:53):
Ullo mark Eric Pinzatti presented well to the world. He
was handsome, fit, accomplished, and successful. On social media, he
bragged about his career advances and his happy family. But
(59:16):
behind closed doors, he was a porn obsessed cheater and
a pedophile who slept with prostitutes and threatened his wife.
He masturbated the child porn and he was such a
negligent dad that he let his baby fall down the
stairs multiple times under his watch. What a piece of shit.
(59:40):
He knew that Sherry was going to leave him. I mean,
why wouldn't she leave him. I'm sure that he thought
that if he were Sherry, he would leave him too.
But he was afraid of this and he wanted control
over the situation. Mark had to control his wife like
he couldn't control his own life. What he did I
didn't have control over was the people in her life
(01:00:02):
and who she chose to share her secrets to, and
his disgusting secrets too as well. They knew everything. Jerry
may have been sickened by her husband's perversions, but she
wasn't too embarrassed about it to let everyone around her
know who was actually hiding behind Mark's smile. So when
(01:00:25):
his perfect little murder plan was missing a few important pieces,
the humiliating confessions Cherry had made about her husband became
the most powerful AMMO for cops. Now, Mark Pinsatti will
be in prison until September seventh, twenty forty two. He
(01:00:46):
received the maximum sentence for second degree murder. When he
gets out, his daughter will be thirty one and his
son will be twenty six. I'm sure they will want
nothing to do with him. It will be alone, left
to sync deeper into his porn addiction and drown in
(01:01:07):
his own loneliness. But I think there's a better way
to end this story. There's a lesson to be learned here,
perhaps a little safety PSA. If you can hear my
voice right now and you're thinking that maybe some of
your traits are similar to Marx, maybe rethink your life,
(01:01:32):
maybe rethink a lot of things. We're putting out a
lot of free episodes right now, but that's going to
(01:01:53):
stop soon, and they're all going to be behind a paywall,
so you might as well join now Sword and Scale
dot com. It's called plus Arts at ten bucks a month,
sword and Scale dot Com
Sword and Scale contains adult themes and violence, and is
not intended for all audiences.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
Listener discretion is advised.
Speaker 3 (00:15):
My children. Oh my god.
Speaker 1 (00:27):
This one was produced by one of our longtime producers,
Miss barber Way. This season twelve, episode two ninety four
of Sword and Scale, a show that reveals that the
worst monsters are real.
Speaker 4 (01:00):
Mm hm.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
It's Thursday night, nine fifty eight pm.
Speaker 3 (01:43):
Oh my god, Oh my god, what's on?
Speaker 5 (01:51):
You?
Speaker 4 (01:51):
Give me your address?
Speaker 3 (01:54):
My one free two nine North Jamaica Way. Gilbert is all.
Speaker 4 (02:01):
Right, one three to nine North Jamaica, Ja.
Speaker 3 (02:04):
Maakeaway. We have children house. I just saw my wife.
Speaker 4 (02:08):
I think she's What happened? Oh no, no, I don't
know if are you breathing?
Speaker 2 (02:15):
No?
Speaker 6 (02:18):
Okay, hold on, hold on, hold on, limbs.
Speaker 4 (02:21):
Gets you over to.
Speaker 5 (02:22):
Fire hold on.
Speaker 3 (02:23):
Oh my goodness.
Speaker 1 (02:25):
In a tan two story house adorned with palm trees
and cacti, thirty six year old Mark Eric Pinsatti crouch
next to his unresponsive wife, thirty three year old Sherry Pensatti.
Speaker 3 (02:37):
Okay, and there are children in the house. I think
I just found my wife. She's not breathing, she's I
believe she's she's in the bathroom and there's water and
soap everywhere, and there's blood I think. Okay, there's there's
a big and medoma. Oh my god, my shoulder, my shoulder.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
Mark was hysterical. He kept repeating that he and Sherry's
children were home. He didn't know what happened. All he
saw was wet bathroom and his beautiful wife lying naked
and a mess of blood and liq with soap.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
To be fair, take a deep breath from me. Okay, okay,
I need to have a clear understanding of exactly what's
going on.
Speaker 5 (03:17):
I have Okay, I.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
Find my wife. Okay, sorry, okay's I mean?
Speaker 5 (03:23):
I mean?
Speaker 3 (03:24):
Okay, okay, all right, I understand, sir. I'm okay, okay, okay.
My my wife is on the bathroom floor unresponsive. Look,
I'm empty certified. I am in the military. Okay, I'm
I'm a soldier, so I am used to this. But
my wife and okay, she's unresponsive. Okay, can you do
(03:47):
your firt CPR? Okay? How old is your wife? My
wife was thirty three. O God, I'm telling you you're
not dreaming. No, there's no moments, there's no call, there's
no function.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
What the fuck Mark was a certified EMT and a
military man, but to see this much blood pooling around
the woman he shared his life with was unbearable.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
Was she underwater or how did this happen to? You know?
We were taking a bath early in the day as
I left during the backup, I went through sleep and
I woke up and she wasn't next to me, so
she for her I think the bath and her legs
were in the way. It was really pale and no way.
Speaker 7 (04:30):
Say you're on the fucking floor.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
Okay, all right, so my spending as you're with her earlier,
you guys were only baths. You went to take a
nap and then you came back, and she is not
responsible to you, all right, I mean, hiver, let's get
her flat on her back. What she's in her back?
She's in her back. She'sn't okay because a big im
over her fucking head. I think she's Oh my god,
I think she slipped. I know she hit a fucking corner.
(04:56):
Oh my god, Oh my god, she fucking slipped and
fell O mother sucker. Fill Okay, let's let's all CPR. Okay,
your knee instructions, Okay, isn't she'll hang in the house. However,
please don't fucking traumatize them. Okay, I don't know how
(05:18):
to deal with this with them. I don't Why don't
see traumatized.
Speaker 8 (05:23):
There?
Speaker 3 (05:24):
Maybe have them leave the room and then you can
start sleeping. Sleep, We're all sleep.
Speaker 5 (05:30):
Okay, okay.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Six year old Maddie and her baby brother, eighteen year
old Max, were asleep in their bedroom stay in the hall.
Mark continued to cry and struggle as he talked to
nine one one.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
Give me a favorite. Get the heel of your hand
in the center of her chest. Put your other hand
on top of the let's start CPR. Okay, sir, she's purple,
she's fucking I'm telling you, I know what you guys
look like. I'm gonna again stand more a veteran.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
Okay, okay, all she's gone, sir, Market scene death over sees.
You've sure the dispatcher that Sherry was long gone.
Speaker 3 (06:05):
I'll tell you what. Let me get your name and
do me a favorite. Step outside so that you can
talk to the medics. Okay, oh yeah, okay, all right, sir,
let me get your name. Don't go with fucking tireds glaring. Okay,
I don't want to make kids to beat fucking trauma site. Okay, okay,
what is your name? Mark Ericson said, oh my god, okay,
may I may I talk to two of three six, four, five, seven,
(06:26):
eight eight? Yes, may I cover her with it? She's naked,
and may I cover her. Let's not do that. Let's
let's medics get there. My child like, okay, why you
sit there in bed?
Speaker 2 (06:37):
Right? No?
Speaker 8 (06:39):
No, no ah right?
Speaker 3 (06:42):
I thought you said they were in bed, so let's
say there in bed. I'm gonna yes, they're dead, they're perfect, okay,
so do me a favorite. I'm losing it. I'm sorry,
I'm losing it. I understand like a deep breast. Yeah,
go ahead, go go outside. I gotta talk to the medics. Okay,
go outside. Okay, I'm going to god. Okay, perfect. They're
almost un scene for you.
Speaker 4 (07:00):
Okay, bo tight fires on their way off. Okay, we're
arriving unseen.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
Okay, sir, do you see them the police officers.
Speaker 1 (07:10):
Mark ran outside the front door to meet the officers
as they quietly pulled up the short driveway. He was
in a frenzy as he explained what happened and pointed
towards the upstairs master bathroom. The police rushed inside. Mark
made sure his children were still asleep and begged the
first responders to be quiet. He was terrified of traumatizing
(07:33):
the kids. Officer Mike Bishop was one of the first
on the scene. He found Sherry in the bathroom and
immediately bent down and started doing chest compressions. The knees
of his pants soon became wet with crimson SuDS. After
twenty compressions, he got up and let the EMTs take over.
Cherry was rushed to a nearby hospital, where doctors assured
(07:56):
Mark that she was in good hands they would do
their best to save her life. Mark called Sherry's aunt
and uncle to come pick up the kids before he
went to the police station. With his head buried in
his hands. Mark sat across from the detective in his
cargo shorts and flip flops as his leg bounced up
(08:18):
and down.
Speaker 6 (08:19):
Well he wept, this is a digital recorder, you might
if I writ while we're talking.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
That way, I can don't have to take such so
many notes.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
Mark nodded and also allowed the police to search his home.
He said he wanted all the help they could get.
He wanted to know why this happened to his wife.
Speaker 2 (08:40):
Why don't we start with.
Speaker 6 (08:43):
A general history of your family and what's going going
on in your life and.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
Stuff like that. Okay, I'm married, and I met my
wife in Wisconsin when I was attending law school.
Speaker 1 (08:57):
Mark and Sherry had met on a dating app back
in two thousand and eight when Mark was finishing with
his legal degree at University of Wisconsin Madison.
Speaker 8 (09:05):
Ever since, we've been together through the military. I'm an
AJRIGE advocate in Wyber Army. We went to live in
Hawaii together. Our daughter was born there.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
She was born at the same time as the Nami
was hitting the island, so the whole time there was
like the alarm was going on as he had contractions
and stuff. So born in an Army hospital, Yeah, Jamesey
far of the Army Medical Center, the Being Palace.
Speaker 1 (09:42):
The Ponsards had lived all over the US, Alabama, Wisconsin, Hawaii, Georgia.
This was due to Mark's career in the Army and
his higher education pursuits.
Speaker 8 (09:55):
So I was with the twenty Fifthentry Infantry Division and
then they employed with cab Compedy of Adrian Brigade to Ganahear.
Speaker 6 (10:05):
And what my wife stuck with me was that pretty
pretty pretty soon after the baby was born that you went,
you were deployed.
Speaker 2 (10:14):
That's tough. So Maddie was fourteen months old. I deployed
for seven months. It felt a lot longer. Anyways, very
strong experience that my wife was there throughout.
Speaker 8 (10:33):
I came back and anyways, we worked together and trying
to buy a house in Hawaii didn't work out.
Speaker 2 (10:39):
Moved to the different place. Anyways, we traveled. We went
to the Big Islands with my cousin from Spain. I
came to visit.
Speaker 8 (10:49):
We went to Japan, where my daughter was treated like
a start the little blood girl and stuff. I mean,
the Japanese are such cute people and stuff. And then
it was an approach by associal aviations a penticopters, so
it was approached by a Sikorski attorney. Well offered me
(11:09):
a job in civilian so I went to reserves and
then we moved to Connecticut.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
When we were there for about a year and a half,
working fifteen months to.
Speaker 9 (11:20):
A civilian legal first Horski and right, so still in
a reserve correct right, so I worked with a cyber
warfare command Fort Hamilton in Brooklyn, I assume or and Officer.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
Mccaptain and was just likes for major.
Speaker 1 (11:37):
All the while, Mark was thriving in his army career
and working his way up to Major. Jerry had gotten
her degree in social work and was pursuing her own
talents and income. Jerry had even published a children's book
and was working on a second for her publisher. They
were flourishing, but after a few months in Arizona, Ark
(12:00):
lost his job.
Speaker 8 (12:02):
Yeah, and then for the remainder of the year, I've
been unemployed in the civilian side.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
So I've been za this year.
Speaker 10 (12:09):
This year, sir, and I was.
Speaker 2 (12:12):
Just offered a job in Kentucky. Great job, super happy. Finally,
after all these.
Speaker 8 (12:19):
Months, my wife really stepped up. I mean she was
the breadwinner. Anyways, we found out home together. We like,
we've got new furniture for Max because his furniture is
got spride up.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
He saw your son son, how is he? Eighteen months?
Eighteen months.
Speaker 1 (12:44):
Mark and Cherry had a role reversal when he was
unemployed and she stepped it up as the family's primary earner.
Mark told the detective that he was proud of his
wife for doing that. He was grateful and embraced his
role as the man.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
Anyways, everything's been going to freak. I've been select for
major BDZ below the zone.
Speaker 8 (13:08):
I'm ranked really high, I think among men. You know,
I haven't had the appraisal yet. Everything I'll do really well.
She's been like super supportive, like moving to Kentucky. She
likes the job she is she has here, but she's
been supportive, like she knows we have to pay off
dark debts and everything like, it's very positive and strong
and it's a good school.
Speaker 2 (13:30):
For Maddie and Mac is starting to talk. He said,
it was more exact to my wife was aborted.
Speaker 10 (13:38):
The way of a routine and stuff like.
Speaker 8 (13:40):
It's beautiful anyways, and so I'm just that's SU's happening
right now where we are.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
And uh, my wife was a she was what's what's
the word. Anyways, she was ready to have a third child, essentially.
Speaker 1 (14:00):
Even though Sherry liked Arizona and her job there, Mark
had been offered a new position in Kentucky and it
made sense to move. Jerry had posted on her Facebook
page just before her death.
Speaker 11 (14:14):
We've been in Arizona for a year now, so I
guess what time it is time for another cross country move.
Never a dull moment.
Speaker 1 (14:24):
Mark said Sherry had been ovulating and they were trying
to have another baby. According to him, things were looking up.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
And yesterday she had a headache. And so she has
heart issues, she has envision issues. She had a piercing headache.
Speaker 8 (14:42):
Anyways, So yeah, so yesterday she wasn't feeling too good.
And then.
Speaker 2 (14:56):
I mean juicing, you know, the juicer, liquid.
Speaker 8 (15:00):
Dye and whatever the Australian do you know, like amliall
that stuff, you know, And so she's been any healthy,
I mean, making any breakfast and the family and flossing
for my daughter and my son is starting to talk,
and everything's going so so well.
Speaker 1 (15:17):
Mark just couldn't understand why it all had to fall apart.
Now things were just perfect.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
I do need to know what happened to night so
I can understand what I see at the house.
Speaker 12 (15:28):
Okay, So we'll go on into that, all right, Okay,
so we'll folks him tonight. So she came home at
like five point fifteen.
Speaker 1 (15:40):
Mark explained that after Sherry got home from work, he
cooked the family a healthy dinner, watched some movies, put
the kids to bed, and then decided to spend some
quality time together and we were trying.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
To have like a romantic night, like a together night,
and so I drew a bath for us, and so, uh,
you know, so I was in there and I was
putting uh thispo Tito and the music on on my
cell phone.
Speaker 13 (16:10):
And so.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
Anyways, by the time my you know, my wife came,
she was uh, pretty excited. I guess sort were laughing
or whatever.
Speaker 8 (16:20):
Then she put her clothes and other clothes downstairs from
in the wash, came back upstairs, and then we kind
of hung.
Speaker 10 (16:29):
Out in the bathtub and cut.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
Her nails, her toe nails, like, washed her hair.
Speaker 8 (16:36):
And I was kind of massaging her and stuff. And
we just had beautiful evening, just a very i don't know,
like a positive evening. It wasn't necessarily going through sex or.
Speaker 2 (16:49):
Anything like that either. It was sort of just to
be happy, you know.
Speaker 8 (16:54):
The past eight months was really stressful, a difficult with
the bills, with everything. Now I have a job and
the house we like, we just bought a bedroom set
for Max. Like everything is coming together. Everything's so underful.
Speaker 1 (17:07):
As romantic as it was, Mark soon needed to get
out of the tub.
Speaker 2 (17:11):
He gets warm you know, I'm those two hot in bathtubs,
and so she likes to stay longer. So I got
out and I went to bed essentially, and I take
sleeping pills and the rise of Pan for anxiety. I've
had to do this since my deployment, and so anyway,
so I slept, and where he take the sleep simply
(17:37):
simply sleep. So it's a really cool around. Yeah, I
think three of those. I'm trying to lower my amounts.
I used to take four. Lately i've been taking three.
I'm trying to weave myself off.
Speaker 1 (17:49):
Mark took his anti depressant and then three of his
over the counter sleep meds, a diaphen hydromine based medication. Basically,
it's like taking a handful of allergy medication like Bendrul.
You know how much I love Benadrul. It can make
you really sleepy, knock you out for the whole day.
It was around this time that the detective got a
(18:10):
phone call and he excused himself and left the room.
When he returned, he had some bad news for Mark.
Speaker 6 (18:18):
I never want to be the person to have to
tell somebody this, that's your your wife has passed away.
Speaker 2 (18:37):
WHOA I'm going to have the officer outside the.
Speaker 6 (18:40):
Room called counselor would you be able to talk to a.
Speaker 2 (18:43):
Counselor would that be helpful?
Speaker 5 (18:47):
You man?
Speaker 2 (18:48):
All right?
Speaker 6 (18:49):
I talking about Oh, I want somebody here that has
some good resources for you, Okay, So I'm going to
have him come and you can you can do what
you want.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
After Mark calmed down and stopped crying, the detective made
sure to get one thing straight.
Speaker 6 (19:07):
I want to make sure you fully understand any news
and there anytime, anytime there is a a serious injury,
we're there and you're you're a lawyer, So I assume
that you understand all.
Speaker 2 (19:20):
That you're You're here voluntarily, so for me to ask.
Speaker 6 (19:24):
You questions about what happened tonight, I'm just trying to
get enough information to determine.
Speaker 2 (19:29):
What's going on tay about you. So I don't want
you to feel like, okay, suspect.
Speaker 6 (19:35):
Well, you're not a suspect. You're You're the only source
of information I have. If you were a suspect, i'd grieved, Miranda.
Speaker 2 (19:44):
I would take you in there. I see that kind
of thing.
Speaker 1 (19:45):
You free to leave you all that I want to Okay,
Mark was the only source of information, and being a
lawyer himself, the cops knew you wouldn't be talking with
them unless he had nothing to do with this. I mean,
why would he unless he's an idiot. Of course, everyone
was just trying to understand the mysterious way that Sherry
(20:08):
had died. Mark may have been the only one the
cops knew to talk to, but as news of her
untimely death spread throughout her friends and family, others would
come forward and the investigation would change from an accidental
death to something much much worse. Lawyer and Army Major
(21:00):
Mark Eric Pinsati had found his wife, Sherry Pinsati, dead
on their bathroom floor from what appeared to be an
accidental fall out of the top. The couple's young children
were still sleeping down the hall when Mark called nine
one one in hysterical tears. Now he found himself alone
and terrified us to what the future would hold for
(21:23):
his family. Mark told the police that he had a
happy marriage. He had just received a new job offer
in Kentucky, so the family was preparing to pack up
and move yet again. They were trying for a third
baby and enjoying every day as it came. Very Hallmark,
you know, but now suddenly Sherry was dead and the
(21:47):
police had to figure out what happened on the night
in question. Despite his emotions, Mark composed himself and continued
speaking with the detective.
Speaker 8 (21:56):
Woke up that, which is surprising is usually anything that
filled his UF I'd wake up later at one o'clock
maybe or something two o'clock.
Speaker 14 (22:04):
It's a kind of a pattern, got a cycle, and
this time it.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
Was something different, like I kind of woke up. Which
bed were you in upstairs?
Speaker 14 (22:14):
And uh, I was gonna listening and I could hear
the TV still playing downstairs, and uh said there was
still like bathroom and something like sh she still in
the bathroom. So I was gonna tell her to come over.
And I tried to open the door and I couldn't.
Something was blocking in and I pushed and I had
(22:36):
fucking you see your fire feet.
Speaker 3 (22:42):
In your feet are like really.
Speaker 10 (22:44):
White, and uh, and so I called out for her,
the fuck Sherry, And finally I pushed.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
I had to push quite a bit, and it was
like pushing her body like the door, like her legs
were on the sideways.
Speaker 1 (23:05):
Mark said he was groggy from the sleep medication, but
after he saw his wife's cold white feet on the
floor is adrenaline.
Speaker 2 (23:13):
Kicked him and then I noticed her head. It looked
fucked up.
Speaker 7 (23:17):
It looked there was blood and she had like a
montes and stuff, and I.
Speaker 2 (23:23):
Recognized that with injury. Was she faced down, her on
her back, she ba and was her head towards the door,
feet towards the door. The feet were sward the door.
The feet were blocking. The legs of feet were thin.
So I moved, so I don't know, he said, I
did push her, So I'm the shore how she was
originally like we're thinking, said you saw him with Thomas
(23:46):
where we're Yeah.
Speaker 7 (23:47):
It was the first thing I noticed with the blood
on that fucking corner. Damn, in the fucking corner. I
thought about it several times with Maddie and stuff. She
always makes everything so wet, you know. It was to
the towels in the ground and stuff and slipping and
stuff in that fucking corner, like I put like a
corner of the sink or the corner of.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
The like between the shower and the bathtop. There was
a really dangerous freaking.
Speaker 10 (24:11):
Corner right there.
Speaker 1 (24:13):
Mark said, there was a sharp, dangerous corner between the
bathtub and the sink. When they bathed the kids in
the bathtub, you would put towels down to cover it.
He was convinced that Sherry had hit her head on that.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
And it was blood all over that fucking day.
Speaker 7 (24:34):
And uh, anyways, I prinked out, that's what you call
her a and uh and I slipped. It was like slippery.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
You went in though you went out and yeah, yeah, yeah,
I went in there. And were you wearing you clothes
or were you nigs? Or I was? I think I
was wearing these clothes. I wasn't wearing these clothes.
Speaker 8 (24:56):
And I did the MCBR certify and stuff, you know,
so I did the observed listening and that stuff. It
didn't look at the face colors, discoloration, there was the patches.
And I got.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
And she had her and she didn't look good, and uh,
I freaked out. I noticed the lungs weren't moving. I
immediately called Name one one.
Speaker 1 (25:18):
Mark was an army major, a trained d MT, and
a lawyer. If anyone would be useful in this situation,
it was him. Mark said he didn't remember much after
he got on the phone with nine one one. His
memory was just a blur of chaos.
Speaker 2 (25:35):
I remember the rest. Honestly, it only to do like
mouth to mouth. But I knew that was not It
was too far for that. I could tell like it
was blood and like it was purple and stuff. So
did you ever do the mouth mouth? Noir?
Speaker 1 (25:54):
Now, let me ask you a question. If your wife,
the mother of your children, was lying unresponsive on the floor,
cold white, you know, don't you think you would maybe, oh,
I don't know, attempt maybe possibly to save her life somehow.
(26:22):
I mean, am I the only one who would actually
do that? I don't think so, right, But apparently Mark
is one of the other types.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
But did you ever do any compressions? Okay, so you
just you just evaluate. They did and they did touch
a toucher. I did touch her. You've been through the
same military tree exactly, So I did the arteries and
all that stuff, like the legs. So you touched her
pulse look listening for you, her writing and stuff like that.
I mean it looked like she fucking slipping that in
(26:54):
son of its corner. And then noticed water and soap
and all that stuff, and then the carpet.
Speaker 6 (27:00):
Was all So was the bathtub overflowing or was it
just from like getting out the water flashing.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
Yeah, I know, so there was no water.
Speaker 6 (27:08):
You didn't have to turn the water on.
Speaker 1 (27:10):
No, no, no, no, So the top was not overflowing.
Mark did not do chess compressions or try CPR on
his wife. Mark's theory was that Sherry got out of
the bath, slipped, fell and hit her head. This was
all feeling a little off. Mark had painted a picture
(27:31):
of a happy marriage and a family life, but Jerry's
best friend Danielle had something different to say about Mark.
Danielle actually refers to Mark as Eric. He went by
Mark Eric professionally, but sometimes just Eric to his family
and friends.
Speaker 4 (27:50):
Her husband Eric. How do I say? It looks really
great on paper. So he's a lawyer, he's charming, he's
felt light, he's looking, he likes to cook.
Speaker 15 (28:02):
All of these different things seems were good in our
beginning of their relationship, but then.
Speaker 4 (28:08):
Things kind of took a turn. So there's some information.
He lived, he was in the military, he was stationed
in Alabama. They're in Hawaii, then they were in Connecticut
and then Arizona.
Speaker 1 (28:21):
Danielle's tail lined up with Marx, but she knew some
much darker things.
Speaker 4 (28:29):
There's some things that have happened in the past. He
has very mentally unstable, so he's that had a lot
of instability regarding suicide. I know this was more in Connecticut.
He thought treatment. He was on medications. There was times
(28:51):
where he would just take a dose of medicine and
not be able to wake up, or he'd find him
with the kids running all over the place to be
out of it.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
And there was more.
Speaker 4 (29:03):
I guess what we labeled him as and I don't know.
He could see a psychiatrist as a sex addict. So
he was constantly looking at porn.
Speaker 15 (29:14):
He had been always.
Speaker 4 (29:16):
Doing porn websites, porn, porn, porn. He had a job
where he traveled a lot. He was in Turkey at
one point he had solicited prostitutes there and she was
pregnant with her second son, so she I remember when
he came back she found.
Speaker 5 (29:34):
Out about this. I think be on his phone and.
Speaker 4 (29:37):
Computer and she had gone into the doctor and had
all kinds of STD testing to make sure that you know,
she was pregnant and things like that. He also has
had issues maintaining the job, so I think something happened
in the military where he was also walked in on
looking at pornography and things like that. But anyways, please.
Speaker 15 (30:00):
Let me have your question or anything breaking it in.
Speaker 1 (30:04):
You can say that again, Danielle was like a floodgate
of information, and the detective was dumbfounded by this cd
side of Mark that couldn't have been further from the composed,
kind and well spoken man he consoled at this very
same police station. Danielle said that Mark's porn and cheating
(30:25):
loomed all throughout the time Sherry was pregnant with their
second child. Then things hit a breaking point while they
were in Connecticut.
Speaker 4 (30:34):
I do know Sherry does have evidence, and I don't
know where it is, of some child pornography. There was
one time she walked in on him. This is in Connecticut,
by the way. This is probably in the last three years.
She walked in on him masturbating to a five or
(30:55):
six year old girl getting angily raped.
Speaker 1 (31:00):
After catching Mark in the act with violent child porn,
Cherry had had enough.
Speaker 4 (31:08):
She left him. Her uncle Joe, who has the kids
right now. He came to Connecticut to get her out
of there, and he left when she was at He
was at home, and he drove her and she came here.
Her goal was was to leave him, and she didn't
(31:28):
have any money. And when she came here, he pretty
much put all the you know, I mean, he controlled
the money. He did not get her any money. She
stayed at her mother's house. I had to help out
as much as possible. I invited her to my house, groceries,
you know, things like that.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
Danielle tried her best to help Sherry get out of
her marriage, but Cherry wanted to make it work. She
had no money and leaving Mark wasn't financially viable right
then and there.
Speaker 4 (32:01):
Yeah, so things were worse. I know, I'm Connecticut. When
he went back, they had agreed Eric was going to
seek help. They sought help. Sherry was not religious, but
he said, well, let's, you know, to go talk to
a priest. And so they were kind of doing some
type of marital counseling with the priest in Connecticut. And
Eric also was getting on med He had seen a psychiatrist.
(32:24):
They wanted to have him go to a treatment center.
He didn't want to, and I know the priest. I
remember being surprised because the priest told Sherry to leave him,
and I was surprised at that.
Speaker 16 (32:37):
I was race Catholic because I thought almost like resort
type stuff exactly being a Catholic herself, and he all
figured things were really grim if a priest had agreed
that Sherry should leave Mark, and.
Speaker 4 (32:52):
So that was that, and then things just kind of
got worse. Max was born, and that's kind of ensued.
Speaker 1 (33:02):
After Max was born and Mark was seeking help, the
family relocated to Arizona, where things didn't really get much better.
The family was dwindling their savings, and between Mark's high
student loan payments and cost of living, they were drowning
in debt. When they moved from Connecticut to Arizona, they
(33:23):
had to take out a loan of forty five thousand
dollars for closing costs, which put an even bigger strain
on their marriage.
Speaker 4 (33:31):
So he's had higher up jobs, an unfortunately authority figures haven't.
Speaker 13 (33:39):
It's been it's been a bit.
Speaker 4 (33:41):
Full issues with him because he's really lasted a job
a year for less. He's often fired from job. The
recent one who was fired in Arizona, he's gone on
a point for nine months and shares did not work
until the last three months, so they've been living off
of savings. He found money from someone in Florida. I
(34:06):
do know because she concided in me about everything, so
I know they were really in financial ruins. She and
I have this centraccess and he said they were probably
about one hundred and forty thousand dollars set.
Speaker 1 (34:21):
Then Cherry got a job, which felt like a glimmer
of hope, but it only made Mark worse.
Speaker 4 (34:28):
Cherry got a job four months ago.
Speaker 5 (34:30):
It's her first job.
Speaker 4 (34:31):
All that from being you know, a stay at home mom.
Eric has always been very controlling. They got into a
lot of fights about cleaning, earning his shirts. That was
her job to iron his shirt if he was going
to go anywhere. She had to pack at bay. She
had to wake up in the morning and you know,
make him a bo you know that kind of thing.
And so since he lost his job, I know he's
(34:52):
working out a lot. That was his thing, go to
the gym and less waits. You both set a lot
and he really did his own thing. Now since Harry
was working. For the first two months he was working,
I feel like she was working for about ninety days.
For the first two months he was home with the
kids by himself, and then Maddie, who was sixth started
(35:13):
school about a month ago, and so that was a
huge change. Sarry would go to work. She was very
worried for her safetyavorite children.
Speaker 15 (35:21):
She confided in me that Mac.
Speaker 4 (35:24):
Her youngest son, who is almost twenty months, has fallen
down the stairs a couple times.
Speaker 1 (35:30):
Because Eric was on the computers the whole time with
his oldest daughter in first grade and just baby Max
to take care of, Mark started slipping back into his
old online addictions. Mark was a negligent, resentful father who
did not want to be at home with his kids
while his wife earned money for the family.
Speaker 15 (35:52):
I believe it was.
Speaker 4 (35:53):
About a month ago she took him Max, maybe two months.
Speaker 15 (35:57):
Took in Max for his eighteen ninety month appointment, and
Eric went to the doctor and Maddie, the daughter, had
told the doctor that Max fell.
Speaker 4 (36:07):
Down the stairs two times. And I don't know what
the doctor was asking questions or anything, but she.
Speaker 15 (36:16):
Got very angry and said in from the doctor, Maddie.
Speaker 4 (36:20):
You get over there, I'm going to spells you. And
that was something interesting because I had never heard Harry
ever say anything about that, and I asked, Harry, did
he ever thank Maddie. She said no, not that she's
aware of. And then the doctor appintment was done. He
was waiting in line to you know, her paperwork, and
he lost it in the doctor's office. He you know,
(36:42):
heard on the paperwork, walked out from the door. It
was like this big ordeal.
Speaker 1 (36:47):
Danielle said that Mark had really been going downhill since
Sherry became the breadwinner, and his emotions were off the charts.
Speaker 4 (36:57):
I want to say it was maybe forty six weeks ago.
They had gone somewhere in Arizona, maybe for a hike
or something, and he had lost it in the car over.
Speaker 3 (37:06):
I don't recall.
Speaker 4 (37:07):
He took her phone. He said he's going to throw
it out. His were screaming in the background, was stopping
the car. It was a very you know traumatic, you know,
something had happened. The thing about Eric was that he
could turn his mood.
Speaker 15 (37:24):
Like that, and so Sherry was kind of eggs, like
sitting on eggshells.
Speaker 5 (37:30):
I know.
Speaker 4 (37:30):
He you know, punched a wall, you know, a hole
in the wall in their house in Connecticut, that kind
of thing. He was very hot tempered.
Speaker 1 (37:40):
Mark was an angry, emotional guy and Sherry felt stuck.
But to the outside world on social media, the couple
were very active and presented only the very best parts
of their family life. Jerry would post pictures of their
hiking trips to the Grand Canyon. She'd boast in videos
(38:01):
about her daughter going off to school, and she'd give
her friends updates on the forts that kids would build
when it was too hot to play outside. Mark did
the same. He showed off being promoted to major and
had recently posted a picture of a meal a civilian
bought him at a fancy restaurant after she thanked him
(38:23):
for a service. Thank you, ma'am, he wrote, I feel
humbled and grateful to the world. Sherry and Mark looked
like a happy, loving family of four, but inside they
were bubbling over with secrets that all stemmed from Mark's
disgusting porn habit.
Speaker 4 (38:43):
She had found a picture of a girl or something
a woman on his phone and asked him about it,
and he said, oh, she's from some pornography website.
Speaker 15 (38:53):
And so she said to him, for show me, show
me the website, and he couldn't, and he got very
very upset about that.
Speaker 4 (39:02):
And she told him that she was there for the kids,
and that she really wanted nothing to do with him sexually,
and that he could do whatever he wanted, that he
was there for the kids, and he like that completely
blew up. Now I don't that was the only time
(39:23):
we talked about that.
Speaker 15 (39:23):
I don't know anything about that.
Speaker 1 (39:26):
But what Danielle did know was that Mark's issues with
violence and sexual perversion all stemmed from one person, his
dad was.
Speaker 4 (39:37):
She told me about how he was in and he
was in prison, used to have a lot of money,
and Eric had told Sherry that he had introduced Eric's
pornography when he was seven or eight years old. Your
dad has always tried to get mail or or bright
things like that. I don't know anything more than that.
Speaker 1 (39:54):
Oh, and the reason his porn peddling dad was in prison,
it was no big deal, just for you know, killing
someone in a fit of rage.
Speaker 4 (40:03):
So yourth's dad was in prison for killing a man
in It was a Dutch It was a Dutch tourist
over road.
Speaker 1 (40:13):
Rate just chew on this for a second. Things in
Arizona were bad, but then Mark got a job offer
in Kentucky and the family was set to move again.
Remember Sherry had written on her Facebook page just four
days before.
Speaker 11 (40:27):
Her death, We've been in Arizona for a year now,
so I guess what time it is time for another
cross country move.
Speaker 1 (40:37):
Never a dull moment, hints of resentment hung in her
post and behind closed doors. She told Mark she was
sick of the instability in her family. But she agreed
to go to Kentucky because of one reason.
Speaker 4 (40:53):
And Kentucky came up, and she wasn't little about it,
but the main things I was always trying to be
positive with her that she's going to be closer to Wisconsin.
Her main dream was she wanted to get back to Wisconsin.
Speaker 15 (41:05):
She had family and friends here.
Speaker 4 (41:07):
She wanted to kind of down on life for her family,
and she was only going to be a couple hours away.
Eight hours away now I know this. Last week she
texted me and said, oh my gosh, Eric got a
call from a job in Oshcosh.
Speaker 5 (41:23):
Oshcosh is an hour and.
Speaker 4 (41:25):
A half away from her parents' help. Okay, And I said,
oh my goodness, Wow, that's excellent. But she said at
that point that Eric said absolutely not that he had
already signed the contract for this new job in Kentucky.
Speaker 1 (41:39):
The idea of moving to Oshkosh, Wisconsin, was a dream
come true for Sherry. Finally, she would be closer to
her family and friends. The possibility of leaving Mark was
in bloom, but he stomped out that dream. Of course
he did. If Sherry was closer to the safety of
her family and friends, then and she would surely leave him.
(42:02):
Mark may have been sick, but he was not stupid.
But Danielle and Sherry talked every day like best friends do.
Cherry had an exit strategy, and she told Danielle everything, and.
Speaker 4 (42:15):
Her plan was that she wanted to leave in a
couple of years. She was very fearful for her children.
She was fearful to leave the house and have fifty
to fifty custody.
Speaker 15 (42:25):
And have him taking care of the kids when he
couldn't even.
Speaker 4 (42:29):
Take care of himself in that regard.
Speaker 17 (42:31):
So no discussion with her about having more children.
Speaker 4 (42:36):
Absolutely not. She said, the thought of us her child
sounds really great to me if I had a different
like if I was with someone else.
Speaker 1 (42:45):
Danielle had spilled the tea, as they say, and boy
was it potent. Mark had put up an excellent front
for the police. He'd come across as believable, kind and caring.
But that if you haven't guessed it already, it was
all a lie. Even Cherry's mother, who knew less than Danielle,
(43:07):
knew that Mark had made unthinkable threats to his daughter.
Speaker 15 (43:11):
Well, Serry and.
Speaker 13 (43:12):
Erica had issues with her marriage ongoing for I would
say probably the last three years and last year last March,
she asked me, couldn't covers it, and I did, and
when I got there, she said that things aren't going well,
(43:33):
if they weren't getting along, that she wanted to come
back to Wisconsin. She told me.
Speaker 1 (43:45):
Jerry's mom broke down into inaudible sobs.
Speaker 6 (43:49):
Try to relax, and that way I can clearly understand
what you're saying.
Speaker 4 (43:54):
It sounded like you said that she had concerns that
he was going to kill her.
Speaker 13 (43:58):
Basely, she told me that he had kill her.
Speaker 1 (44:06):
But Jerry wasn't ready to leave Mark yet. She made
a point of repeating that over and over. She stayed
with him for one reason and one reason only.
Speaker 15 (44:17):
She never said that she was.
Speaker 4 (44:18):
Looking to divorce Eric right now. She never said anything
like that to me, but I remember her saying, I
would say, in the last month, she said something about
my kids are legal residents of Arizona. And that's when
you know she had said something about, well, you know,
I might stay work my job a little bit, Maddie's
started school and whatever, and then you know that's all
(44:40):
I know.
Speaker 3 (44:41):
So she wanted a more stable life for the kids.
Speaker 4 (44:44):
As far as Jerry, yes, any absolutely, And what I
can tell you the only reason, and she told me
was over and again the only reason why she never
left her was because her children.
Speaker 2 (44:57):
And it wasn't because her children.
Speaker 4 (44:58):
She would have been a long time ago. She was
the gus mob no her complained, just did everything. And
even though her life at home was horrible with her
husband and all that, you know, she was definitely the
rock for her children.
Speaker 1 (45:16):
Meanwhile, the detectives had an autopsy performed on Sherry's body
and began examining the scene in a new light. Detective
Bishop noticed many physical pieces of evidence that did not
line up with Mark's story. Mark was now their prime suspect,
and he was going to have to face the truth.
(45:38):
Maybe Mark had been able to keep Sherry physically away
from her friends and family, maybe he was able to
make sure she held a brave face to the world,
but he couldn't stop her from confiding in the people
that she loved and revealing all of his dirty, disgusting secrets.
(46:27):
After speaking with Sherry Ponsatti's best friends and other family members,
Mara Copa County detectives now realize that the image Mark
painted himself as it was a far cry from reality.
Mark was a porn addicted, violent, angry, jobless man, in
debt and on the brink of losing his sanity. I
(46:48):
think that describes most men these days, actually, but I'll
leave it at that. Anyway, Sherry had caught him with
child porn, and that's a crime that she should have
definitely turned him in for, but she didn't. Jerry had
plans to go. She had to think of herself, and
the couple was in a.
Speaker 18 (47:08):
Ton of debt.
Speaker 1 (47:09):
She had to be strategic. Jerry's aunt and uncle had
taken the Pinsati's children after she died, and they had
overheard Mark on the phone telling a different story than
the one he told detectives.
Speaker 5 (47:23):
I thought that he told the coroner that they had
been watching Netflix downstairs, that she hadn't come back, and
I think he used the word to the corner that
he was brought maybe.
Speaker 4 (47:37):
Frustrated and annoyed. I'm pretty sure he used the word annoyed.
Speaker 5 (47:40):
So he went to look for her and she wasn't
in the.
Speaker 1 (47:44):
Bedroom, and Jerry's brother confirmed that all the things Danielle
had said about Mark were true. He also revealed a
little more.
Speaker 17 (47:53):
She was afraid where that literally told her that if
she also a divorced against him, that he would kill
her family.
Speaker 16 (48:03):
And that's something she told you, He said, yes, Or
did she tell your mother and your mother told you no.
Speaker 17 (48:11):
She told me that directly, And she told me that
if anything ever happened to her, I guess she died unexpectedly,
that we should suspect.
Speaker 3 (48:20):
That Eric was the cause.
Speaker 1 (48:23):
Armed with this new information, Detective Bishop began to examine
the scene differently and came up with a new theory
about how Sherry died.
Speaker 19 (48:31):
I believe she was killed in the bathroom of her home.
I believe that she received multiple injuries to her upper
back and neck and head through a physical altercation. Also,
her nose and upper lip were injured. I believe she's
(48:53):
come to those injuries and her body was staged in
the master bathroom for police to find. Well, my theory,
and if the prosecutors are okay with me giving my theory,
is that the linear injuries on her back and upper
(49:13):
neck and head will probably a result of being forcefully
thrown against the tile ledge at the back of the
bathroom bath doug or other. The blood that was visible
to me on that night was diluted with water and
appeared to me like a maybe a head that was
(49:36):
already bloody, had.
Speaker 2 (49:39):
Been placed there.
Speaker 1 (49:40):
Detective Bishop believed that Mark killed Sherry in the tub,
using the sharp edge of the tile between the tub
and shower to repeatedly bludge in her head and back
until she bled out. Remember, Mark kept saying he thought
that corner was dangerous. He relentlessly repeatd that he was
(50:01):
sure Sherry slipped and hit her head on that tile.
Speaker 19 (50:05):
I found out later that not only had he pushed
the thought or tried to convey clearly the dangerous situation
in the bathroom with the ledge, and how he had
pointed it out before, and he knew that this ledge
was going to hurt somebody at some point, he passed
that along to other people as long as me. I
(50:27):
felt like when I found out that this was included
in his conversations to almost everybody, that.
Speaker 2 (50:34):
That was an indicator that.
Speaker 20 (50:37):
There was more to the story than this slip and
fall that he had portrayed to me. If she had
slipped and hit her head on that ledge, the ledge
would have caused the bleeding to start, but her head
would already be gone. It would be down on the floor.
So that's why I would expect more blood on the
floor than I was. I wouldn't even expect to see
much or any blood on the the ledge itself.
Speaker 1 (51:02):
Jerry's blood was telling a new story. Not only did
luminol testing reveal that more blood had been cleaned up,
but it had also been moved around. This sick fuck
moved around his wife's blood to stage the scene.
Speaker 19 (51:21):
There was a lot of blood that just wasn't at
the scene, and I didn't notice that.
Speaker 2 (51:25):
And I did make that statement in my first, first
or second.
Speaker 19 (51:32):
Supplement to the case, is that there was just not
enough blood on the floor to account the stains and
for the injuries. But I wasn't fully aware of the
injuries at that point. You have to understand that I
never saw the body until the autopsy, and that was
after the fact, Okay, So I gained more information and
(51:52):
more suspicion and more knowledge about her injuries after the fact.
That let me know that this top where there was
no blood visible should be checked or blood that isn't visible,
and that's what Lumanols used to do, or loose start
or whatever chemical she used that used to see the
(52:15):
blood where there is no.
Speaker 2 (52:16):
Bason of blood.
Speaker 1 (52:18):
The autopsy showed that Sherry had injuries to her head
and back, which would not have been possible if she
just slipped. She had bruising on her spine consistent with
violent shaking and strangulation could not be ruled out. She
had multiple blunt force injuries to the back of her head,
up her neck and back that would have been one
(52:40):
violent thrashing and repeating fall. And there were other physical
details that Detective Bishop noticed were suspicious.
Speaker 19 (52:50):
I found it odd that two people took the bath
and their clothes were downstairs in the washer.
Speaker 1 (52:57):
Mar could plan this all out very well, and he
was using his legal training to cover his tracks, feeding
the same believable story about Sherry slipping on some soap
due to her own negligence, blaming the victim they call it.
I don't think people like it these days anyway. Here's
(53:17):
Sherry's brother describing what Mark told him after she died.
Speaker 17 (53:22):
And he told me he told me, you know when
it happened. And basically, like he said that Sherry had
a history of the house is when not putting things backs,
like for example, you know, when she'd cook, she'd leave
the cooking oil out and not put the cap on
it and things like that. And there's really particular about
(53:42):
that kind of stuff. And he said, you'd always nag
at her about it, which I can totally see that.
And he said that Cherry would do it so often
that eventually he sought an egging at her. And he said,
one of the things that she would do is in
the bathroom she would put a cap on like the
bubble back and stuff. She gives the kids a bubble bath, right,
and and honestly, I could I totally believe that she.
Speaker 18 (54:06):
I can see her doing that because I mean, I'm
delivered too. And he thinks that she she can put
a tap on the bubble bath and somehow it got
skipped over when she was in the bathroom and when
she went to get out of a shower, you know,
the ground was completely soap.
Speaker 17 (54:22):
And soap and she slid it.
Speaker 1 (54:25):
Mark even told this story to his six year old child,
believe it or not. Who then relayed it back almost
verbatim to the police psychologist.
Speaker 2 (54:45):
She did.
Speaker 4 (55:00):
You wood on our hands?
Speaker 2 (55:08):
Did you?
Speaker 1 (55:17):
Detective Bishop believed that there was no way the soap
could have landed the way it did if Sherry slipped
on it. Mark's story was good, but gravity is way better.
Speaker 17 (55:29):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (55:29):
Yeah.
Speaker 19 (55:29):
The the soap especially was odd because the soap container
was found in a tipped over.
Speaker 2 (55:38):
Position on the floor.
Speaker 19 (55:40):
And if you think you probably got the gist from
our experiment that if you if you knocked over a
bottle of soap, the soap would be emanating from the
area where the container is. The officers that were first
on scene and from my recollection there was visible blue
(56:05):
soap on top of the back mat and throughout the
scene that I don't believe it would have been possible
for the soap to emanate from the area where the
bottle was on top of the to get up onto the.
Speaker 17 (56:26):
Back mat.
Speaker 19 (56:27):
And I don't think that the amount of soap that
was missing is physically possible from turning that container over.
So if you knock over a container blue soap, it's
only going to drain to the area where the lip
of the spout is. It won't drain the inch and
a half two inches below that spout because gravity won't
(56:52):
allow it to float upwards and out of the bottom.
Speaker 1 (56:56):
Marked his best to cover all those tracks. He had
a careful, he thought out plan, like some demented version
of Gone Girl. But even with his law degree, military background,
EMT training, and perfectionism or autism, Mark could not get
one over on the detectives. They were too thorough, and
(57:18):
only a week after Sherry's death, Mark was arrested for murder.
His bail was set at one million dollars. When it
came time to pull Mark in front of a jury
of his peers, he stuck to his story. He took
the stand and added some more elaborate details about how
he tried to save her life before he called nine
(57:40):
to one one. He said that is EMT training kicked
in and he did try to give her mouth to mouth,
but there was so much blood and you know, he
just couldn't.
Speaker 2 (57:50):
You know.
Speaker 1 (57:52):
It's just some people are so stupid, and they think
you're stupid too. They think they can get away with
things because they think you're just as stupid as they are.
He even said that he thought about getting a turkey
baster to suck the blood out. He said this on
the stand.
Speaker 19 (58:09):
I swear.
Speaker 1 (58:10):
He also tried to justify the injuries to her face
by saying he slept and fell on her, but he
didn't admit that to the police. He never said that
until that moment, so he claimed that was why he
refused to try CPR or chest compressions when the dispatcher
asked him to. He claimed that he felt like a
bull in a china shop after his fall, and that
(58:33):
he would only make things worse. I mean, his wife
was dead, but he would only make things worse.
Speaker 9 (58:39):
That's what he said.
Speaker 2 (58:42):
I'm suck please, Oh my god, her father.
Speaker 5 (58:50):
Her brother.
Speaker 1 (58:53):
Ullo mark Eric Pinzatti presented well to the world. He
was handsome, fit, accomplished, and successful. On social media, he
bragged about his career advances and his happy family. But
(59:16):
behind closed doors, he was a porn obsessed cheater and
a pedophile who slept with prostitutes and threatened his wife.
He masturbated the child porn and he was such a
negligent dad that he let his baby fall down the
stairs multiple times under his watch. What a piece of shit.
(59:40):
He knew that Sherry was going to leave him. I mean,
why wouldn't she leave him. I'm sure that he thought
that if he were Sherry, he would leave him too.
But he was afraid of this and he wanted control
over the situation. Mark had to control his wife like
he couldn't control his own life. What he did I
didn't have control over was the people in her life
(01:00:02):
and who she chose to share her secrets to, and
his disgusting secrets too as well. They knew everything. Jerry
may have been sickened by her husband's perversions, but she
wasn't too embarrassed about it to let everyone around her
know who was actually hiding behind Mark's smile. So when
(01:00:25):
his perfect little murder plan was missing a few important pieces,
the humiliating confessions Cherry had made about her husband became
the most powerful AMMO for cops. Now, Mark Pinsatti will
be in prison until September seventh, twenty forty two. He
(01:00:46):
received the maximum sentence for second degree murder. When he
gets out, his daughter will be thirty one and his
son will be twenty six. I'm sure they will want
nothing to do with him. It will be alone, left
to sync deeper into his porn addiction and drown in
(01:01:07):
his own loneliness. But I think there's a better way
to end this story. There's a lesson to be learned here,
perhaps a little safety PSA. If you can hear my
voice right now and you're thinking that maybe some of
your traits are similar to Marx, maybe rethink your life,
(01:01:32):
maybe rethink a lot of things. We're putting out a
lot of free episodes right now, but that's going to
(01:01:53):
stop soon, and they're all going to be behind a paywall,
so you might as well join now Sword and Scale
dot com. It's called plus Arts at ten bucks a month,
sword and Scale dot Com
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New Heights with Jason & Travis Kelce
Football’s funniest family duo — Jason Kelce of the Philadelphia Eagles and Travis Kelce of the Kansas City Chiefs — team up to provide next-level access to life in the league as it unfolds. The two brothers and Super Bowl champions drop weekly insights about the weekly slate of games and share their INSIDE perspectives on trending NFL news and sports headlines. They also endlessly rag on each other as brothers do, chat the latest in pop culture and welcome some very popular and well-known friends to chat with them. Check out new episodes every Wednesday. Follow New Heights on the Wondery App, YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to new episodes early and ad-free, and get exclusive content on Wondery+. Join Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts or Spotify. And join our new membership for a unique fan experience by going to the New Heights YouTube channel now!
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!